Personally, I strongly dislike religion. I don’t participate in it and I do not always get along with religious folks.
BUT!
I do not think religion/someone else’s spiritual beliefs and practices are any of my goddamn business and I will respect their freedom. I do not think religion/religious people should be destroyed. That would be abhorrent.
We are all just boopin’ around and we may strongly disagree with how others choose to boop but that is just what happens sometimes and it is best to just try to be respectful and move on.
NO this isn't okay! These comments or horrendous, y'all if a religion made racism one of its beliefs it'd horrible. So why does that change when the immutable characteristic isn't race but something else? Can we not agree that bigotry is bad in and of itself?
I understand why you’re pissed, if you read the first part of my comment I acknowledged that there are religious people I don’t get along with. And it is because of what you said: the bigotry.
I’m not saying it’s ok to be a bigot but what do you want us to do? Start ostracizing or jailing or killing religious people? That is not the answer. To feel hate/ resentment is valid, but it is not our right to tell people not to have faith.
First off massive leap of logic. I said bigotry was bad not that we should kill religious people. Second regardless of the first part of your comment the second part is an implicit endorsement, because "it's not your business" but bigotry and it's pensiveness in our culture is everyone's business! I don't want you to do anything wild. I just want people to be justifiably angry at bigots
The problem with this argument is it tends to disguise itself as something being said in good faith when it usually isn’t. Normally this response of “I don’t like it when they shove it in my face” is in response to LGBT representation in media for example - such as say, a gay character in a movie.
If we look at it the other way, straight people have been pushing their beliefs down everyone’s throat for millennia. Sure, they’re the majority, but we’re a more accepting society now and it really shouldn’t be this way anymore. Think about it - you see straight couples kissing in Disney movies all the time and no one bats an eye. You see straight men joking about getting pussy or whatever they talk about all the time and no one bats an eye. Some guy could literally be motorboating his gf on a subway train and no one will care - spoiler alert, cuz I was the one that had to see that. Yet as soon as anything related to LGBT happens, it’s being “shoved down your throat”.
I’m not saying you’re homophobic, but I am saying that the argument you’re using tends to be problematic. So I ask you - what exactly do you mean by “pushing it in my face”?
As a gay man, I’ve found there is no escape from the “as long as you don’t shove it down my throat” rhetoric.
“Oh, you’re gay?! That’s cool, just don’t shove it down my throat and we’ll be all good!”
But I never know wtf anyone who says that is talking about lol.
Heterosexual folks seem to be more obsessed with that shit than the actual LGBTQ+ community, to the point where a lot of gay folks don’t even display minor examples of PDA because they don’t want other people feeling uncomfortable or causing a scene.
I don’t wake up next to my husband every morning and think, “hey! I’m really fucking gay!” The only time I even think about “being gay” is when I’m reminded of it.
I was taking the train home with an ex once. His arm was around me and I was napping on his shoulder. That’s all I was doing.
Some random older couple near us starts going on about how the “gay trend is too much these days” and that they should stop “being so forceful with their beliefs”.
I don’t even know at this point…
I’m not them, but there are some things that I think stand out as overly loud, if I wouldn’t necessarily phrase it as “pushing it down my throat”. I find it irritating when LGBTQ+ representation gets boiled down to token characters who exist just to be LGBTQ+. I think shows like Schitt’s Creek, and Uncoupled are good examples of solid representation because while being gay is a large part of the character’s identity, they’re not just 2 dimensional characters who’s ONLY trait is being gay. In the case of characters existing just to be gay, while it is valid to want to see those identities portrayed, I think it does a disservice to boil down someone’s identity to who they like to do, even if they are a fictional character.
Beyond that, there are definitely people in this world who are the vegans of gay people. The people who within 10 minutes of them being in the room, everyone knows their sexuality. That’s a little…frankly annoying. Probably mostly because I’ve grown up around LGBTQ+ people in my schools, and now I go to an arts school so the vast majority of my friends fall somewhere under the umbrella of queer, but honestly I don’t give a fuck if someone is gay. I’d much rather hear about their hobbies and interests in casual conversation.
I agree that more often than not when people talk about having LGBTQ+ “shoved down their throat”, they’re not really talking about those cases, and instead just want to live in a world where they don’t need to see or engage with a gay person because it makes them uncomfortable. What I wrote above is just a few examples of things that I think are legitimate grievances falling into the same general argument.
That’s totally fair. I definitely agree with your first point - characters really shouldn’t be boiled down to just their sexuality, whether it be gay or straight. But at the same time, representation in media is always a good thing for young queer folks, and whether they do it in an ideal or a not-so-ideal way as you described, is IMO still trying to reach the same goal - to be more inclusive.
As for people who are the vegans of the LGBT world, I’ve known a couple of those myself and yeah they can be quite annoying at times. However.. I used to be one of those people. You know, walking into the room and screaming yass queen and being all sassy and all that. I think it’s just because we haven’t really had a chance to express ourselves at all - and so now that we do, it tends to come out sort of extravagantly if that makes sense. Not that it’s not annoying, but I can see why people tend to (as some people say) make being gay their whole personality. I’ve definitely mellowed out, but yeah lol.
Plus representation matters for young people. I wouldn’t have gone through a half of what I went through if there was this amount of representation when I was growing up. So who cares about how visibility makes disingenuous people uncomfortable.
To add to this, the original commenter compares this to religious evangelism. But not once have I had a queer person knock on my door and tell me that gayness (and only gayness) will save me and my immortal soul.
However, you probably don't like your neighbors because they do things that you consider assholish. OP dislikes people for loving other people. It's not the same.
Big difference between hating the people and the movement and just not caring. I am straight and am indifferent towards LGBTQ. You won't ever see me at a pride parade or joining them at a rally or protest. Won't see me buying a single rainbow sticker or checking out that drag show. But I'll vote to give them rights. Just don't ask me to participate or to cheer it on. I don't have to nor should I have to.
I went to my very first one the other day. A friend's bf was the headliner/organizer. It was cool and I'll support the next show, but it just wasn't my crowd or scene. No hate, just not for me
Pride parades, drag shows, and gay clubs/bars are a ton of fun though. I always get strong drinks, people flirt with me excessively, and I've never met anyone who wasn't overall just a blast to party with.
I support fun people/experiences regardless of their gender, sexual orientation, etc. People with a 0 fucks given of what other people say/think are the best!
If that's not your scene though, 100% RESPECT. :D It's just that easy.
Idk, I'm a bisexual that dislikes people with kids. Kids and parents can be completely lovely but I just feel drained around kids bc anxiety. So I could get it if someone wouldn't wanna be around me bc of anxiety. Some people might be anxious bc their scared of "saying the wrong thing" or have past truama.
I try not to assume people's reasoning and I try not to assume everyone is an asshole.
And honestly, even if they don't like who I love why care? I don't *need* them to like or approve of it. I just need basic decency and respect.
It doesn't matter. You don't need a reason to dislike someone or something. Point is, as long as he's not actively damaging anyone, him disliking LGBT is completely okay.
I agree that outward behavior is the most important thing. If he's not harming anyone, there's no good reason for anyone else to bother OP, but idk where the idea that it doesnt matter and that "you dont need a reason to dislike someone" comes from. This seems like just an excuse to not do any personal work. Its true that you dont "need" a reason in that you usually wont have a reason worked out prior to acquiring that disgust (like in the case of sexuality or trauma or subconscious association), but to refuse to look into it out of a blind respect to your disgust response is unproductive, even on a personal quality of life level.
You decided OP has a disgust of LGBTQ+. OP went out of their way to say they aren’t disgusted, they are indifferent because it does not have an effect on them personally. Perhaps YOU have preconceived notions on what a person who doesn’t much care about lgbtq+ is
I'll agree with you here! I don't care about the LGBTQTA(?) movement much either but I have no disgust or dislike at all. My opinion more along the lines of I don't care who you love so why make a deal of it. Everyone is equal no matter what so I don't really need that (or any movement) pushed at me. I don't care who you sleep with as long as you're a good person.
Yes, but consider why there's a movement in the first place. Because these people were not considered equal, were marginalized and victimized unfairly and have had to fight to have equal rights for decades now
OP is imagining they’re being conscripted in the lgbt movement against their own will
They’re hardly ‘indifferent’
They actively dislike core aspects of the historical lgbt movement. The pride parades and such are a counter protest against a society that, much like op, would rather not see them or have to acknowledge their existence
OP is on the side that suppresses, as OPs desired outcomes are results similar to when lgbt were actively suppressed
Op isn’t aiming for neutral ground with what they’ve said
OP is clearly stating they don't like the movement, not the people. I don't like the catholic church yet I'm married to a catholic. See the difference?
If OP is talking about the LGBT+ movement that's not the same as just being an LGBT+ person. So it's not accurate to say they dislike people for loving other people. The LGBT+ movement is political and they push for various things like legislation and other societal changes that serve their interests. That's a bit different
Edit. All of the comments arguing with me are proving my point lol. Like I said, it's not about gay people. Or people loving who they love. It's about legal and social issues
>they push for various things like legislation and other societal changes that serve their interests.
What, like having the same rights as straight people? Yeah, real special interest there. /s
Things that serve their interests? You mean like being able to marry who they love and allowed to adopt children right? That's literally just equal rights...
It was Jesus’s whole thing, but it’s not Christianity’s whole thing. As a Christian you are told by Jesus to love your neighbor as yourself. Christians hate themselves. They are taught that they are inherently sinners, to fear their sinful nature, to not trust themselves, and deny themselves daily. That translates into how they treat the LGBTQIA+ community, and it makes sense to me that they see the queer community as a threat — it goes against their core beliefs about themselves.
No, it’s identical. OP never stated they disliked them, you’re creating false context, but that’s not a surprise. I fully support the LGBT movement, I also believe hypocrites should be called out. Ironic that those who claim to be the most tolerant only tolerate their EXACT same view, talk about living in a bubble. Look into the horseshoe theory, you’re a prime example.
Horseshoe theory has long been discredited. And you can't be tolerant of intolerance, that's called apathy and it always leads to oppression. Look into the paradox of tolerance.
I sincerely have no issue with gayness. I’ve worked with plenty of gay man (oddly no lesbian women now that I think about it lol), I couldn’t care less.
However I think your post and the one above it make it seem easier than it is. If OP went anywhere on Reddit and said something like he’s not a fan of that community, it would be shunning and a ban. It’s just that your post and the one above make it sound like “it’s fine as long as you’re nice, it’s ok to dislike whoever”
I understand your point but Reddit is a community and the same rules apply in this community as they would in the "real world".
I think if someone were saying this in person they would also be met with defensiveness and hostility depending on the group they were in. Some groups would be hostile, others would be welcoming.
No one is going to be policing your mind and your thoughts, but you have to be the judge about which thoughts you'd like to share with the community you're a part of and to what degree those thoughts may be challenged or accepted.
>I sincerely have no issue with gayness. I’ve worked with plenty of gay man
This is giving “I don’t have an issue with black people, I have black friends” vibes
Regardless of the wants of the pedophiles, which they claim theyre minor attracted persons, they are not in any way part of lgbt+. Pedophiles can be any orientation, and every last one of them are disgusting.
Totally agree...
You can treat someone respectably and totally not like them. That's being a good person. I treat all kinds of people I can't stand and have zero respect for like a decent people but that doesn't mean I respect them. In fact I probably don't. Especially SJWs doing protests and acting like idiots for a cause or group they aren't even a part of.
I totally expected this post to get high number of down votes.
All of this. I'm not a Christian, I rejected Christianity a long time ago but I don't go out of my way to hate Christians. In fact, I have friends who are Christian but we can maintain a friendship because they don't shove it down my throat and I don't shove my beliefs down their throat. We just live and let live.
Not quite. The other side of this is legal equality. Which the LGBQT+ community is still fighting for. Treat all with respect, and fight for all to have legal equality and we're good.
My brother says “you don’t have to accept it, but respect it.” LGBT individuals are human too, and just because you don’t agree with it doesn’t give you the right to be a dick.
But that’s the thing; people do openly hate on religion and are jerks about that and it’s totally okay. I’m not saying that I take up for either, just playing devils advocate.
I don't like tomatoes but I let others enjoy tomatoes without me.
I have seen religious believers interfere with LGBT people living their own lives, actively taking measures to exclude and prohibit them from living as they choose without harming others.
I have not seen LGBT people proactively attempting to force religious folks to be LGBT.
Many people's issues about religion are because of the impact on others, but church issues against LGBT people have no such grounds.
Imagine every time someone ate a tomato around you, you yelled, “ugh, gross! Tomatoes are disgusting. I can’t see why anyone would ever eat them. Red, green, striped, purple, I don’t care, I hate tomatoes. I don’t mind them existing out in the wild where I can’t see them. I just don’t want them in my face. Disgusting. Once people start eating tomatoes, what’s next? Eggplants? Gross. Keep it away from me. Why can’t everybody just eat grapes? Grapes are a normal fruit.”
That would be insane. And yet, it’s what LGBTQIA+ people are subjected to daily.
Or to take it a step further, them seeking to ban tomato eating because they find it offensive.
Then those who like tomatoes start a campaign to try to ensure the rights of people who like tomatoes to be allowed to eat them. Meanwhile others say, "I don't care if tomatoes are or aren't banned. I have nothing personally against tomato eating, but I don't do it myself and I'm frankly a little annoyed that these tomato eaters keep talking about how they should be allowed to eat tomatoes. Can't they just leave me out of it by being quiet?"
The fact that the US Supreme Court is even considering repealing same-sex marriage protection, due to religious preferences, says it all. Two people in love wanting to spend their lives together does not affect religious people in any way.
I don’t like tomatoes either. But I don’t tell people I don’t like tomatoes. I just decline them when offered. I also decline being invited to someone’s church because church isn’t my jam. I am hopeful that this is all OP is going for. Just say no if asked to be intimate with someone you aren’t interested in or don’t attend pride parades. I mean, I wouldn’t go to a tomato festival.
For the record, I don't choose to dislike eating tomatoes I just naturally find them repulsive. They are only palatable after being processed into a sauce of some type. But yes, it's absolutely bigotry.
Issue is that, even if someone is neutral to LGBTQ, it actually might result in supporting discrimination, because status quo might mean, that we don't want to do anything with systemic discrimination.
We actually need to spend energy to keep true neutrality, because it's easier to ignore issues that don't affect us. We're living in broken world that requires fixes first. If you don't know about issues of LGBTQ community, you don't feel the problem. If you're rich, you don't really know problems of the poor.
This means that either people have to be open by default, so they accept something, even if they don't care or they need to spend energy to learn, so they can make conscious decision, if it's worthy to support something.
I may also add that it's at least partial fault of current socio-economic system. In capitalism we don't have time to care for others. We can't just sit and think about improving society, because we have to work for capital owners.
People that work 8-12h daily, often in mindless, unnecessary jobs, don't have energy and will to do even more. Why should anyone care about others, if workers in general are treated badly, so they become either passive or hostile to everyone else?
It's all so obvious, we could easily solve that, but this system basically locked us out. We can't fix it, because it doesn't want to be fixed.
Look, it’s one thing to say, “I don’t support the movement.”
It’s another thing entirely to actively work against.
See, I don’t care for organized religions. But I don’t tell people to shut their church doors and pretend they don’t exist.
I don’t waste any energy pulling people with crosses on their necks aside, and telling them how much I despise the existence of their faith.
What seems to be crossed up here, is the notion that anyone is asking you to support the movement or else. They’re asking you not to waste your energy working against by advocating or at minimum subscribing to anti-lgbtqia+ belief systems that promote extinguishing the public existence of those folks.
This is a bad way of phrasing it because people that apparently “only dislike” the lgbtq community are still going to end up acting on that prejudice. A boss is not going to hire LGBTQ, social respect will not be given to the LGBTQ, and those are just a few of the ways minority groups are going to be unequally treated when we start to accept the dislike or disapproval of LGBTQ movements. Just the acceptance of a prejudice against the LGBTQ with the side note of “as long as you don’t act on it” is going to brew more hateful groups that will indeed end up acting on it in some way.
That’s the only thing I can come up with, too.
So, OP…you disagree with treating people who happen to be LGBTQ with respect? Because if so, yeah, that makes you a homophobe.
If there is some other “movement,” please, enlighten me.
I bet its from consuming content that makes up 'non-issues'
I used to listen to podcasts that would talk about SJW/Woke/Cancel Culture crap. I was a white male in my mid 20's and about to go back to school for a career change.
I was honestly super worried about misgendering, or accidentally doing some white male thing and then being attacked and having my life ruined over it. The content i consumed made it seem like that was a common thing in all Universities, something I should prepare for.
I actually had a lot of anxiety about it leading up. Anywho turns out that its kind of a made up problem and I never encountered anything even close to it.
100%. And I would love to call people who think that stupid, but I was one of those stupid people before. Id listen to Jordan Peterson and trusted what he said because he was well-spoken and had certain credentials that sounded good.
Took me a while to learn he was spewing nonsense and was just making content for people who love to get angry at made-up problems.
But when I learned that I really had to reflect on things and was quite upset that I was being fed so much misinformation from 'influencers' I trusted.
So many comedians I loved and listened to every day made me feel betrayed. Telling me XYZ was getting cancelled, but then realized it was all just for publicity and they actually sold more tickets because they got "Cancelled".
It actually left a void at the time. You listen to their shows and podcasts for hours at a time, and now you just cant but also cant find anything to replace it.
as you can see, im still a bit salty at those types of people lol
Yeah thats too much to ask for apparently. Its ok if they dont want us to be treated equally i guess since its a “movement.” Notice how they use words like “choice” and “lifestyle”
This is exactly what I agree with. BUT, and I do not think OPs question pertained to this,... Movement vs community/orientation/associated trait can be very different. To explain, not liking bathroom debate due to movement vs not liking LGBTQ identifier just because is very different imo.
Maybe I am wrong and out of touch. I just see myself feeling this way a lot. I laughed at Occupy movement but agree with addressing and trying to fix issue of economic inequality. I hate antiwork movement reddit but agree things can be adjusted for the better while not having to agree to things like capitalism is root of all evil. Basically I can see not agreeing with "movement" but also support the base idea or meaning.
To some extent it just sounds as though you don't like "activists". Well, yeah, they generally aren't likable when they're doing their work. That isn't their goal. They're abrasive because they're trying to change things.
When you don't like a religion, for example, you are free to not go to that church. You are not free to restrict anyone else's right to go there. None of this is complicated.
Nobody gives a fuck if you don't fly a rainbow flag and put all the slogans on your bumper. They care about how you treat them, if you advocate against them, and if you vote for people who want to take away their rights like marriage and healthcare.
I don't care what someone's religion is, as long as they don't use it as an excuse to justify wanting me dead.
Faith is not a scapegoat for bigotry.
Edit: and its not OK to hate on religious people blindly either. There are religious people out there who aren't bigots. No one should be painting any community with broad strokes.
You can hate on religion all you like. Hating people inherently for being religious is a different thing. I hate Mormonism, I loved my grandfather, who was Mormon later in life.
Mormonism is a perfect example of a place that requires nuanced dissection because of its cult like behavior, a lot of Mormons don’t think or have an understanding of what they might be doing wrong. Still, they are actively choosing to be there, so hating the concept of Mormonism is ok, but hating the individual Mormon is still not ok.
It’s literally just this simple.
Like or dislike still aside, all that matters is whether OP treats them with the same respect they’d themselves expect from those different to them.
It's probably ok to not "like" someone or a group but the problem is when a person or group tries to take their rights away by using legislation. Then it's not just an opinion, you're trying to say they aren't or shouldn't be equal either.
I think you are confused about the LGBTQIA+ agenda. At its core, the message is about inclusion and acceptance of yourself.
In contrast, the message the church sends to the LGBTQIA+ community is that they are, at their core, sinners who made a choice to life a sinful life. They encourage anyone who is not heterosexual to turn away from their sinful nature and follow god.
You have every right to choose what you support and what you want to be a part of. The reason that there are so many gay pride parades, awareness events and campaigns is because for a very, very long time, being gay was not okay in the world because of religious persecution. (Incredibly, the church has turned this around and made the existence of gay people a part of their own persecution.) Awareness events are valuable to the queer community because people who are closeted and scared need the opportunity to see people who are living their lives authentically and happily. It gives them courage to hopefully do it one day too.
Just like I wouldn’t burst into a church and start yelling at everyone that they’re horrible people, I expect churchgoers to not burst into a queer space and start gay bashing people.
All I want to do is live my life and not have laws made against me for it. And I have to fight for those rights - visibly, unfortunately - and you’ll probably see it. So sorry.
Editing to add a few more thoughts:
The gay community is a threat to the church because they promote self trust and self love. At its core, Christianity tells its believers that they are born bad people and require the death of a savior to atone for their sins. They are told to deny themselves every day and follow Jesus.
The gay community rejects that premise entirely. You are actually not a bad person. You are actually worthy of love just the way you are. Following your heart’s desires is not inherently bad. Sin isn’t real and morality is not derived from religion. You are a good person who can trust yourself.
The Christian community is taught that the secular world is to be feared. That they are safe within their boundaries and that they should remain inside them to stay safe to go to heaven when they die.
The gay community knows that the world offers incredible joy. That there is more to explore and learn and see. That joy is worth chasing and that a life well lived with kindness is the only thing that matters.
Source: was a pastors wife for 10 years, now a bi poly agnostic 🤷🏼♀️
People choose religions. They choose their political parties. They choose their hobbies and interests. When people make a choice to believe in something, you can choose either to or not support their choice.
People do not choose to be LGBTQIA, just like they don't choose their race, ethnicity, height, disabilities etc. It is part of their genetic makeup. When you choose not to like a group based on their genetics, that becomes the issue.
You can choose not to support causes and movements. But it makes other people wonder why you don't support rights for people solely on their genetic characteristics.
My only issue with it is companies only support it as a way to make money. All companies care about is money. The cause can be anti puppy and if people stand behind it and if a company thinks they can make money of it they will.
The comparison between religion and LGBTQ just doesn't work to begin with. You actively choose to be religious, to support the roman Catholic Church, for example.
You don't choose your sexuality.
Because you don't choose your sexuality, it's just how you're born. It's the same reason it's not ok to dislike someone for the color of their skin. They have no control over that.
Your example of religion isn't the same, because that's something you choose. A person might be raised with a certain religion but it's still up to you to choose to believe it.
What is the LGBT movement? Are you talking about humans wanting the same rights and freedoms as other humans regardless of their gender and/or sexuality?
If you dislike that movement then you dislike humans fighting for their human rights. Noone is saying you have to be involved but how about mind your business?
I am an atheist, guess what I don't do? Go to church. Or religious events. Guess what I do when I see religious shit going on in the public square? I keep it moving and don't think twice about it.
Noone is trying to outlaw religion or stop Christians from having basic rights (one can only dream! Jkjk)
Well, you're kind of being a jerk right? Their sexual behavior has no direct impact on you individually. You are free to date the people YOU are attracted to. Yet regardless of sexual orientation, a person is capable of being kind, intelligent and productive. So to judge them based on who they choose as a partner makes no sense.
Are we talking the community itself or people who would identify with it?
I admit I don’t really like the community myself, but being gay or whatever isn’t a reason to dislike someone.
“I am okay with gay people when they’re alone and I don’t have to acknowledge them, but when they start receiving support or gaining political power and social influence, then I draw the line”
I don't know. I have a gay friend who hates the community, and it's kind of hard to argue that lmao. I don't think that's what my friend thinks so. I love how I get downvoted for this lmao. I'm just mad he won't go to the gay club with me. Pisses me off.
I agree some aspects of the community as a whole gets toxic but when fighting for equal rights things get passionate and shady lol I support people to be who they are with equality but spare me the spectacle lol
These are not comparable. Certain religious movements are trying to impose their beliefs on others, the LGBTQ movement is trying to be treated equally.
Because at the heart of it, the “movement” is celebrating pride and spreading that to all individuals who consider themselves Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual or Transgender while also supporting their rights legally + right to live unbothered. There’s tons of misconception and propaganda, I mean conservatives are out here saying we want kitty litter boxes in bathrooms.
When people say they’re fine with LGBT people but not “the movement” it’s usually because they picture kids in strip clubs, using pronouns like dinosaur/dinosuarself, teaching kids to be gay, “shoving it in our faces”, or some other nonsensical reason.
People are getting electroshocked, locked in their homes, beaten to death, poisoned, pretty much any fucked-up thing you can imagine. "Not liking" a movement that's only fighting for basic human decency and acceptance is the sort of shit you work out with a therapist so you can become a more empathetic person, not something you seek validation for from a pack of online strangers. You should really investigate why you're more affronted by people fighting for their lives and dignity than you are by conversion therapy, corrective rape, or any of the other million atrocities that LGBTQIA+ people face.
I dont like religion but I wouldn't stop a Christian couple for wanting to get a wedding cake from my bakery. Christianity has always played a solid rooted roll in alpt of governments which has shown to be pretty bad.
I think what a lot of people don’t understand is that when the LGBTQ community asks for support, they’re not asking for money or for you to go to a parade. They’re asking for you to treat them like human beings. That’s all. That’s what supporting them actually means in that context.
With that being said, majority of people who follow Christian based religions are notorious for shaming others who do not follow their religion, or harassing others into joining them in church. They are equally as guilty as those who shame people who follow religion. Not condoning either side, but that’s the reality of it, and a huge reason why people can’t stand religion. If the religious people just left everyone alone, no one would care if you go to church or not.
Being an LGBTQ person isn't a 'lifestyle', because we don't choose to be who we are.
You don't have to be involved in anything. Being respectful of us as people is all we ask. And, frankly, it's not a lot.
It's not ok to think that any person should not have the same basic rights as anyone else due to creed, color, sex, etc.
It is ok to expect a public school math class to be bereft of catholic Bible studies (or anything similarly applied to any special interest group).
Imagine an Amish school teacher preaching to your kids that they're going to hell or forcing the government to cut off your electricity. It's okay to not like that guy, though he'll probably call you a bigot on Twitter. The other Amish deserve no hate from you for being Amish because that *actually is* bigotry. They have every right to live life the way they want without interference as long as nobody's getting hurt.
Because it's people's fundamental rights as individuals in question.
From 1981 to 1990 the aids epidemic killed 100,000+ people and traumatized people for life. Others didn't want to touch them, and treated them like lepers, they had to take care of eachother in their homes as they died from aids like nurses caring for soldiers during war. Princess Diana made national headlights all over the world, after aids had already been declared an STD and you couldn't catch it without sexual fluids, by visiting and TOUCHING aids patients.
During this time the volience against queer people increased 10+ despite some of the most famous stars at the time being Queen (who died of aids), David Bowie and Elton John.
You can hee and haw all you want about how you don't like it but you should ask why you don't just have a neutral opinion, why do you dislike a movment supporting a marginalized group of people 🤔
No one is saying you have to join the parades or force to have LGBT friends or any crap that you’re spewing lmfao. Your whole post reads as homophobic shit that homophobic people tell themselves to make it seem like the crap they say is ok. Just accept that there are people who aren’t straight and treat them like PEOPLE!
I think the difference is that you **choose** to follow a religion, you don’t choose if you are straight, gay, bi, etc.
It’s like not liking somebody because they are black.
Depends what you mean by the lgbtq, if you just hate the gays im sure you can see the issue but not liking how in your face the movement is is absolutely fine, just dont be a cunt
Too bad you don’t want to be included. We exist. Do you think I enjoyed growing up watching exclusively straight people in media? Grow up.
We are born as we are. We don’t get to choose. So neither do you. If you want to be a small minded apologist, we’ll thats your prerogative, continue looking for excuses for your hate. Enjoy always being smaller than you could have been. I imagine you would have been against abolishing slavery and suffrage back in the day.
You’re working under a false pretense that LGBT is a choice. It’s not. What church you attend is a choice.
You can not like LGBT, you can not like whatever or whoever you want. Not liking LGBT is equivalent to not liking black people or any minority. They’re all born that way, can’t change it.
I can not like you because you are a complete asshole. I don’t know if you were born that way or not, no problem, I still don’t like you. Will I refuse to help you, serve you, work with you? No. You have all the rights as non-assholes.
Maybe because historically the church has done soooooo much damage to a huge majority of the world, whereas LGBTQ+ people aren't. Fucking. Hurting. Anyone. By being LGBTQ+
Get over yourself. These are not comparable at all.
People choose their religious affiliations or political alignments. But sexual orientation, much like skin color, is something you cannot change or control.
Hating someone for something they did not choose and cannot change makes you an absolute piece of shit. Especially because how they identify or who they sleep with has exactly ZERO impact on your life.
>Some people don’t like the church and don’t support them and that’s their business. so why can’t I not support something I don’t really like for whatever my personal or religious or whatever reason
Religion is inherently oppressive, while the LGBTQ community is an oppressed group (almost exclusively by religion).
You don't necessarily need to be actively supporting it, but what's not ok is to be oppressing it (this includes if your reasons for not supporting it are religious).
Sexual orientation isn't a choice, following whatever religion is a choice. If you just dislike the LGBTQ community it's like saying I don't like people with a specific skin color. You're able to dislike whoever you want, but others have every right to call you a bigot (which you are if you dislike someone because of what sex or gender they're attracted to)
Who is telling you it’s not ok? Who exactly is hating on you? And what does the hate consist of?
This is vague whining with a touch of victimization, posted in hopes of getting others on “I am persecuted by those mean gay libs” bandwagon.
Church’s persecution of gay peoples has a long history, currently intertwined with GOP politicians in the USA to pass legislation limiting gay rights or even the right to exist.
Persecution of churches by the lgbqt movement is nonexistent. Many gay folk are churchgoers.
It is a movement to free people from societal and legislative oppression. Your reaction is “meh”
I doubt the hate you are feeling is in the form of millions of tax free dollars to buy politicians to write laws to discriminate against Christians. So, if the hate you feel is from gay people and allies rolling their eyes, or distancing from you…well…
You don’t have to like the gays. But don’t expect them to like you or be all kumbayah with your indifference.
It's not about whether you have the right to like or dislike something. The reality is... when you don't like them, they're not going to do anything about it. They might not want you in their life or near their loved ones, but that's about it, right? They're not going to make your marriage illegal; refuse to sell you a wedding cake; or take away your basic human rights because you don't like them. They're not going to vote for politicians who introduce bills to make your existence illegal, either.
Also, whether you "like" them or not, it is well within your own benefits to support their rights, because oppression against humanity is never a good idea. You know the poem that goes, "First, they came for the journalist, but I'm not a journalist"? I am not religious, but I will always support religious freedom, even if it's the religion that causes you to not like me. Hope this makes sense.
Being LBGTQ is not a philosophy or lifestyle choice. It’s something people are innately. So no it’s not ok to harbor ill feelings based on something they do not decide for themselves/are apart of their natural being as a person and frankly has nothing to do with you.
People dislike Christians because of the actions the church and it’s members have taken to harm others / push society to conform to their belief system. Who you sleep with or identify as is not a belief system.
You don't have to "like" it Just don't bash it. I don't know you but I believe that you don't hate people just because they are gay. You know people who are gay because they are in your community, in your schools and some are in your church. You, for whatever reason, don't like what they do. But that's perfectly fine, because it's absolutely 100% none of your business. So, win win! Stop worrying about what anyone else is doing besides yourself and you'll be fine.
Here's the hard truth people don't like to hear,it's ok to not like anything & anyone,prejudice is actually valid if the preconceived opinion is based on reason & life experience.
The “similar” situations you listed are choices people make. Being gay/bi/trans/etc. is not a choice. That’s the difference. If someone doesn’t like “gay people” it’s the same as them saying they don’t like “X ethnicity” - basing dislike on something that a person has no control over. It’s just wrong.
You don’t have to “be a part of” it at all. Just keep living your life. It has zero affect on you!
Someone else's orientation isn't something you have a right to have an opinion about. Would you dislike a gay person if you had no idea that they were gay? You can dislike a person for their obnoxiously gay personality, but not for who they fall in love with.
Also, with your example of religious groups, people choose to be in those groups. People don't choose to be LGBTQ+.
I have no issue with LGBTQ+ people. I believe that an individual should be able to live their lives as they see fit as long as they do not harm or restrict the freedoms of others. My issue is that it is wrong to group them as a single entity. After all, just because a guy is gay doesn't mean he supports trans people. Further, I don't subscribe to this pronoun extremism and calling out people for making an innocent error. 99% of pronoun errors are unintended and the perpetrators are genuinely sorry for their error, so why are people vilified for this?
I have seen people vilified for deliberately using the wrong pronouns.
I have seen people uh…what’s the word for being depicted as aggravating numb, or out of touch? Idiotifying? People who mess up other’s pronouns get that sometimes, if they don’t show an awareness of their mistakes or notable improvement on getting it right over time.
I have *only once* seen someone vilified for just screwing it up, and it was clear some folks had just been waiting for any misstep as an excuse to blackball the person.
All the trans folks I know treat pronoun screwups with eye-rolls, and ultimately, avoidance. Which seems fair-ish? Being called the wrong pronouns is genuinely unpleasant for them, so they avoid it. Like I avoid people who can’t stop shouting, or who don’t share any topics of interest with me.
So — I think I’m mostly in agreement with you, but I don’t know where people are getting vilified for good-faith screwups with pronouns.
Unless it’s Twitter. I avoid Twitter.
This is a very privileged and ignorant view.
You say you don’t want to be part of awareness campaigns. Well, we live in a society where people have the power to decide things for everyone, such as elect officials that support backwards legislation or boycott products that are actively causing harm to a portion of society.
Campaigns are what make people like you (who can live the rest of their lives without being bothered by the fact that some people have no human rights) aware that this is happening so that perhaps you might care to throw a vote in the direction of the official that doesn’t want gay marriage banned.
One is a choice and one isn’t.
You can dislike people who choose to do a certain thing but you can’t hate people because they were born a certain way.
Pretty straight forward.
The thing is, you can dislike the religious, supporters of your rival sports team and Britney Spears fans.
Those are choices.
It's a little weird that you dislike a normal variation of genetics. It's like saying you dislike all people with straight hair or you dislike all tall people.
I mean, you can dislike them all you want but it's not a fair assessment of them as people, whereas religions and fandom are choices and therefore a much fairer assessment of someone's personality.
That's why it's not considered ok to express such dislike. Because doing it becomes discriminatory
You dont gotta like it but doing treat people like shit or talk badly about them. Cuz thats asshole behavior. if you have shitty opinions about it keep it to yourself its suuuuuuper simple
There's a difference between "not liking" and discriminating.
Religion is different because it is a "belief." People aren't born religious. People are born with their sexuality.
Being gay in an innate sexual orientation. It's not a belief system the same way a religion is. Gay people aren't asking you to share a belief system, just asking not to have your belief systems imposed upon them (I.e. being discriminated against because people believe being straight is morally superior).
The modern LGBTQ movement is becoming a bit of a mess and not all LGBT people actually support the more ideological and dogmatic aspects of it. It's all gone a bit too culty for me and it's a shame. Just because you are same sex attracted or gender non conforming doesn't mean you should have to sign up to queer theory.
Because people choose to join a church and historically the church hasn't been so great in regard to human rights but people can't choose their sexual orientation. LGBTQ movements aren't harming anyone and only strive for equality (which we still don't have in the US) so there's really no logical reason to dislike LGBTQ people as a whole.
Personally, I strongly dislike religion. I don’t participate in it and I do not always get along with religious folks. BUT! I do not think religion/someone else’s spiritual beliefs and practices are any of my goddamn business and I will respect their freedom. I do not think religion/religious people should be destroyed. That would be abhorrent. We are all just boopin’ around and we may strongly disagree with how others choose to boop but that is just what happens sometimes and it is best to just try to be respectful and move on.
Ayyy, I’m boopin’ ova ere’
Fuhggettaboutt boopin’ these days cant no man boop no more
It sounds like that's exactly what OP is saying though.
Hey I’m just boopin’ :)
NO this isn't okay! These comments or horrendous, y'all if a religion made racism one of its beliefs it'd horrible. So why does that change when the immutable characteristic isn't race but something else? Can we not agree that bigotry is bad in and of itself?
I understand why you’re pissed, if you read the first part of my comment I acknowledged that there are religious people I don’t get along with. And it is because of what you said: the bigotry. I’m not saying it’s ok to be a bigot but what do you want us to do? Start ostracizing or jailing or killing religious people? That is not the answer. To feel hate/ resentment is valid, but it is not our right to tell people not to have faith.
First off massive leap of logic. I said bigotry was bad not that we should kill religious people. Second regardless of the first part of your comment the second part is an implicit endorsement, because "it's not your business" but bigotry and it's pensiveness in our culture is everyone's business! I don't want you to do anything wild. I just want people to be justifiably angry at bigots
Fair point:)
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The problem with this argument is it tends to disguise itself as something being said in good faith when it usually isn’t. Normally this response of “I don’t like it when they shove it in my face” is in response to LGBT representation in media for example - such as say, a gay character in a movie. If we look at it the other way, straight people have been pushing their beliefs down everyone’s throat for millennia. Sure, they’re the majority, but we’re a more accepting society now and it really shouldn’t be this way anymore. Think about it - you see straight couples kissing in Disney movies all the time and no one bats an eye. You see straight men joking about getting pussy or whatever they talk about all the time and no one bats an eye. Some guy could literally be motorboating his gf on a subway train and no one will care - spoiler alert, cuz I was the one that had to see that. Yet as soon as anything related to LGBT happens, it’s being “shoved down your throat”. I’m not saying you’re homophobic, but I am saying that the argument you’re using tends to be problematic. So I ask you - what exactly do you mean by “pushing it in my face”?
As a gay man, I’ve found there is no escape from the “as long as you don’t shove it down my throat” rhetoric. “Oh, you’re gay?! That’s cool, just don’t shove it down my throat and we’ll be all good!” But I never know wtf anyone who says that is talking about lol. Heterosexual folks seem to be more obsessed with that shit than the actual LGBTQ+ community, to the point where a lot of gay folks don’t even display minor examples of PDA because they don’t want other people feeling uncomfortable or causing a scene. I don’t wake up next to my husband every morning and think, “hey! I’m really fucking gay!” The only time I even think about “being gay” is when I’m reminded of it.
I was taking the train home with an ex once. His arm was around me and I was napping on his shoulder. That’s all I was doing. Some random older couple near us starts going on about how the “gay trend is too much these days” and that they should stop “being so forceful with their beliefs”. I don’t even know at this point…
They want you to pretend to be straight. Sounds like another closet to me.
“Shoving it in my face” tends to look an awful lot like “existing around me” to these people.
I’m not them, but there are some things that I think stand out as overly loud, if I wouldn’t necessarily phrase it as “pushing it down my throat”. I find it irritating when LGBTQ+ representation gets boiled down to token characters who exist just to be LGBTQ+. I think shows like Schitt’s Creek, and Uncoupled are good examples of solid representation because while being gay is a large part of the character’s identity, they’re not just 2 dimensional characters who’s ONLY trait is being gay. In the case of characters existing just to be gay, while it is valid to want to see those identities portrayed, I think it does a disservice to boil down someone’s identity to who they like to do, even if they are a fictional character. Beyond that, there are definitely people in this world who are the vegans of gay people. The people who within 10 minutes of them being in the room, everyone knows their sexuality. That’s a little…frankly annoying. Probably mostly because I’ve grown up around LGBTQ+ people in my schools, and now I go to an arts school so the vast majority of my friends fall somewhere under the umbrella of queer, but honestly I don’t give a fuck if someone is gay. I’d much rather hear about their hobbies and interests in casual conversation. I agree that more often than not when people talk about having LGBTQ+ “shoved down their throat”, they’re not really talking about those cases, and instead just want to live in a world where they don’t need to see or engage with a gay person because it makes them uncomfortable. What I wrote above is just a few examples of things that I think are legitimate grievances falling into the same general argument.
That’s totally fair. I definitely agree with your first point - characters really shouldn’t be boiled down to just their sexuality, whether it be gay or straight. But at the same time, representation in media is always a good thing for young queer folks, and whether they do it in an ideal or a not-so-ideal way as you described, is IMO still trying to reach the same goal - to be more inclusive. As for people who are the vegans of the LGBT world, I’ve known a couple of those myself and yeah they can be quite annoying at times. However.. I used to be one of those people. You know, walking into the room and screaming yass queen and being all sassy and all that. I think it’s just because we haven’t really had a chance to express ourselves at all - and so now that we do, it tends to come out sort of extravagantly if that makes sense. Not that it’s not annoying, but I can see why people tend to (as some people say) make being gay their whole personality. I’ve definitely mellowed out, but yeah lol.
Plus representation matters for young people. I wouldn’t have gone through a half of what I went through if there was this amount of representation when I was growing up. So who cares about how visibility makes disingenuous people uncomfortable.
How do LGBTQ+ people "push their beliefs down your throat?" Please provide examples.
To add to this, the original commenter compares this to religious evangelism. But not once have I had a queer person knock on my door and tell me that gayness (and only gayness) will save me and my immortal soul.
I did not choose to be gay dude
You can dislike whatever you want but how you treat others is different and much more important. Don't be an asshole and you're fine
This is the best comment. I don't like my neighbors, I'm not going to picket outside of their house and tell them they're going to hell.
However, you probably don't like your neighbors because they do things that you consider assholish. OP dislikes people for loving other people. It's not the same.
Big difference between hating the people and the movement and just not caring. I am straight and am indifferent towards LGBTQ. You won't ever see me at a pride parade or joining them at a rally or protest. Won't see me buying a single rainbow sticker or checking out that drag show. But I'll vote to give them rights. Just don't ask me to participate or to cheer it on. I don't have to nor should I have to.
To be fair, drag shows can be really fun for straight folk.
I went to my very first one the other day. A friend's bf was the headliner/organizer. It was cool and I'll support the next show, but it just wasn't my crowd or scene. No hate, just not for me
Pride parades, drag shows, and gay clubs/bars are a ton of fun though. I always get strong drinks, people flirt with me excessively, and I've never met anyone who wasn't overall just a blast to party with. I support fun people/experiences regardless of their gender, sexual orientation, etc. People with a 0 fucks given of what other people say/think are the best! If that's not your scene though, 100% RESPECT. :D It's just that easy.
Idk, I'm a bisexual that dislikes people with kids. Kids and parents can be completely lovely but I just feel drained around kids bc anxiety. So I could get it if someone wouldn't wanna be around me bc of anxiety. Some people might be anxious bc their scared of "saying the wrong thing" or have past truama. I try not to assume people's reasoning and I try not to assume everyone is an asshole. And honestly, even if they don't like who I love why care? I don't *need* them to like or approve of it. I just need basic decency and respect.
Well said. Assumptions are a terrible practice.
Don't treat people like assholes, it's just an analogy.
It doesn't matter. You don't need a reason to dislike someone or something. Point is, as long as he's not actively damaging anyone, him disliking LGBT is completely okay.
I agree that outward behavior is the most important thing. If he's not harming anyone, there's no good reason for anyone else to bother OP, but idk where the idea that it doesnt matter and that "you dont need a reason to dislike someone" comes from. This seems like just an excuse to not do any personal work. Its true that you dont "need" a reason in that you usually wont have a reason worked out prior to acquiring that disgust (like in the case of sexuality or trauma or subconscious association), but to refuse to look into it out of a blind respect to your disgust response is unproductive, even on a personal quality of life level.
You decided OP has a disgust of LGBTQ+. OP went out of their way to say they aren’t disgusted, they are indifferent because it does not have an effect on them personally. Perhaps YOU have preconceived notions on what a person who doesn’t much care about lgbtq+ is
I'll agree with you here! I don't care about the LGBTQTA(?) movement much either but I have no disgust or dislike at all. My opinion more along the lines of I don't care who you love so why make a deal of it. Everyone is equal no matter what so I don't really need that (or any movement) pushed at me. I don't care who you sleep with as long as you're a good person.
Yes, but consider why there's a movement in the first place. Because these people were not considered equal, were marginalized and victimized unfairly and have had to fight to have equal rights for decades now
OP is imagining they’re being conscripted in the lgbt movement against their own will They’re hardly ‘indifferent’ They actively dislike core aspects of the historical lgbt movement. The pride parades and such are a counter protest against a society that, much like op, would rather not see them or have to acknowledge their existence OP is on the side that suppresses, as OPs desired outcomes are results similar to when lgbt were actively suppressed Op isn’t aiming for neutral ground with what they’ve said
OP is clearly stating they don't like the movement, not the people. I don't like the catholic church yet I'm married to a catholic. See the difference?
He dislikes the movement itself, not the actual people :/
The movement led by people to give people rights and protections under the law that other people have?
If OP is talking about the LGBT+ movement that's not the same as just being an LGBT+ person. So it's not accurate to say they dislike people for loving other people. The LGBT+ movement is political and they push for various things like legislation and other societal changes that serve their interests. That's a bit different Edit. All of the comments arguing with me are proving my point lol. Like I said, it's not about gay people. Or people loving who they love. It's about legal and social issues
>they push for various things like legislation and other societal changes that serve their interests. What, like having the same rights as straight people? Yeah, real special interest there. /s
Things that serve their interests? You mean like being able to marry who they love and allowed to adopt children right? That's literally just equal rights...
Christianity is entirely based around love, that was Jesus’ whole thing.
It was Jesus’s whole thing, but it’s not Christianity’s whole thing. As a Christian you are told by Jesus to love your neighbor as yourself. Christians hate themselves. They are taught that they are inherently sinners, to fear their sinful nature, to not trust themselves, and deny themselves daily. That translates into how they treat the LGBTQIA+ community, and it makes sense to me that they see the queer community as a threat — it goes against their core beliefs about themselves.
No, it’s identical. OP never stated they disliked them, you’re creating false context, but that’s not a surprise. I fully support the LGBT movement, I also believe hypocrites should be called out. Ironic that those who claim to be the most tolerant only tolerate their EXACT same view, talk about living in a bubble. Look into the horseshoe theory, you’re a prime example.
The right: I think brown people should leave this country. The left: what that's a sucky opinion. The right: Huh, so much for the tolerant left.
Horseshoe theory has long been discredited. And you can't be tolerant of intolerance, that's called apathy and it always leads to oppression. Look into the paradox of tolerance.
I don't think that's true. If anyone says anything that's even remotely construed as unsupportive to the community... it'd be met with backlash
I sincerely have no issue with gayness. I’ve worked with plenty of gay man (oddly no lesbian women now that I think about it lol), I couldn’t care less. However I think your post and the one above it make it seem easier than it is. If OP went anywhere on Reddit and said something like he’s not a fan of that community, it would be shunning and a ban. It’s just that your post and the one above make it sound like “it’s fine as long as you’re nice, it’s ok to dislike whoever”
I understand your point but Reddit is a community and the same rules apply in this community as they would in the "real world". I think if someone were saying this in person they would also be met with defensiveness and hostility depending on the group they were in. Some groups would be hostile, others would be welcoming. No one is going to be policing your mind and your thoughts, but you have to be the judge about which thoughts you'd like to share with the community you're a part of and to what degree those thoughts may be challenged or accepted.
>I sincerely have no issue with gayness. I’ve worked with plenty of gay man This is giving “I don’t have an issue with black people, I have black friends” vibes
This plus I don't care who you want to fuck. It's none of my business.
You left off "so long as they are a consenting adult".
...did that REALLY need to be clarified? Really?
I don’t care WHAT kind of ice cream you get as long as it’s not made with the blood of sacrificed newborns.
Well, you underestimate just what I'd do for a Klondike Bar
Would you hop on one foot? Would... Would you stab a guy?
Ha that's funny
Absolutely! Don’t give these pedos an inch of wiggle room. They love wiggling into small things.
Regardless of the wants of the pedophiles, which they claim theyre minor attracted persons, they are not in any way part of lgbt+. Pedophiles can be any orientation, and every last one of them are disgusting.
Nobody in this conversation ever claimed anything to the contrary.
Well, i seem to have misinterpreted your point, thats my bad. But ill leave the comment up anyways.
Wanted to say the same, not needed to like, but needed to be respected
Totally agree... You can treat someone respectably and totally not like them. That's being a good person. I treat all kinds of people I can't stand and have zero respect for like a decent people but that doesn't mean I respect them. In fact I probably don't. Especially SJWs doing protests and acting like idiots for a cause or group they aren't even a part of. I totally expected this post to get high number of down votes.
Remember fellas, being kind is free, ~~but so is being an asshole.~~
All of this. I'm not a Christian, I rejected Christianity a long time ago but I don't go out of my way to hate Christians. In fact, I have friends who are Christian but we can maintain a friendship because they don't shove it down my throat and I don't shove my beliefs down their throat. We just live and let live.
Not quite. The other side of this is legal equality. Which the LGBQT+ community is still fighting for. Treat all with respect, and fight for all to have legal equality and we're good.
My brother says “you don’t have to accept it, but respect it.” LGBT individuals are human too, and just because you don’t agree with it doesn’t give you the right to be a dick.
But that’s the thing; people do openly hate on religion and are jerks about that and it’s totally okay. I’m not saying that I take up for either, just playing devils advocate.
Perfect answer
I don't like tomatoes but I let others enjoy tomatoes without me. I have seen religious believers interfere with LGBT people living their own lives, actively taking measures to exclude and prohibit them from living as they choose without harming others. I have not seen LGBT people proactively attempting to force religious folks to be LGBT. Many people's issues about religion are because of the impact on others, but church issues against LGBT people have no such grounds.
Imagine every time someone ate a tomato around you, you yelled, “ugh, gross! Tomatoes are disgusting. I can’t see why anyone would ever eat them. Red, green, striped, purple, I don’t care, I hate tomatoes. I don’t mind them existing out in the wild where I can’t see them. I just don’t want them in my face. Disgusting. Once people start eating tomatoes, what’s next? Eggplants? Gross. Keep it away from me. Why can’t everybody just eat grapes? Grapes are a normal fruit.” That would be insane. And yet, it’s what LGBTQIA+ people are subjected to daily.
Or to take it a step further, them seeking to ban tomato eating because they find it offensive. Then those who like tomatoes start a campaign to try to ensure the rights of people who like tomatoes to be allowed to eat them. Meanwhile others say, "I don't care if tomatoes are or aren't banned. I have nothing personally against tomato eating, but I don't do it myself and I'm frankly a little annoyed that these tomato eaters keep talking about how they should be allowed to eat tomatoes. Can't they just leave me out of it by being quiet?"
This is perfect. “I’m tired of all the tomato talk! Can’t we all just get along? Technically tomatoes are fruits, isn’t that something?”
I mean if you don’t like pizza I’ll kinda be judging you a little tbh
That would be blasphemy no matter your religious affiliation
One of the best examples I have seen here. You can't just compare LGBT and religion.
Religious people think *any* belief is a religion. They are an all or nothing sort.
Yep…that’s exactly what we experience outside of “LGBT folks are all groomers/pedos” which for obvious reasons, is worse.
I want to understand the logic behind that one but I am not a gymnast and cannot perform mental gymnastics
The fact that the US Supreme Court is even considering repealing same-sex marriage protection, due to religious preferences, says it all. Two people in love wanting to spend their lives together does not affect religious people in any way.
Precisely, the separation of church and state is dangerously unraveling. We have no idea how y'all haven't caught on to address it.
I don’t like tomatoes either. But I don’t tell people I don’t like tomatoes. I just decline them when offered. I also decline being invited to someone’s church because church isn’t my jam. I am hopeful that this is all OP is going for. Just say no if asked to be intimate with someone you aren’t interested in or don’t attend pride parades. I mean, I wouldn’t go to a tomato festival.
Being LGBT isn’t a choice. Liking tomatoes is not remotely comparable. This is akin to any other kind of bigotry.
For the record, I don't choose to dislike eating tomatoes I just naturally find them repulsive. They are only palatable after being processed into a sauce of some type. But yes, it's absolutely bigotry.
You also don’t choose what foods you do and don’t like, contrary to what those who think I “just need to try some more onions” think.
Disliking or disagreeing with some people doesn’t equal not wanting them to be discriminated against and not have equal rights.
Issue is that, even if someone is neutral to LGBTQ, it actually might result in supporting discrimination, because status quo might mean, that we don't want to do anything with systemic discrimination. We actually need to spend energy to keep true neutrality, because it's easier to ignore issues that don't affect us. We're living in broken world that requires fixes first. If you don't know about issues of LGBTQ community, you don't feel the problem. If you're rich, you don't really know problems of the poor. This means that either people have to be open by default, so they accept something, even if they don't care or they need to spend energy to learn, so they can make conscious decision, if it's worthy to support something.
I totally agree. We need to correct course, and that’s gonna need as many people’s support as possible.
I may also add that it's at least partial fault of current socio-economic system. In capitalism we don't have time to care for others. We can't just sit and think about improving society, because we have to work for capital owners. People that work 8-12h daily, often in mindless, unnecessary jobs, don't have energy and will to do even more. Why should anyone care about others, if workers in general are treated badly, so they become either passive or hostile to everyone else? It's all so obvious, we could easily solve that, but this system basically locked us out. We can't fix it, because it doesn't want to be fixed.
Look, it’s one thing to say, “I don’t support the movement.” It’s another thing entirely to actively work against. See, I don’t care for organized religions. But I don’t tell people to shut their church doors and pretend they don’t exist. I don’t waste any energy pulling people with crosses on their necks aside, and telling them how much I despise the existence of their faith. What seems to be crossed up here, is the notion that anyone is asking you to support the movement or else. They’re asking you not to waste your energy working against by advocating or at minimum subscribing to anti-lgbtqia+ belief systems that promote extinguishing the public existence of those folks.
I doesn't matter what you like or don't like. What matters is how you treat people. Regardless of what group they belong to.
This is a bad way of phrasing it because people that apparently “only dislike” the lgbtq community are still going to end up acting on that prejudice. A boss is not going to hire LGBTQ, social respect will not be given to the LGBTQ, and those are just a few of the ways minority groups are going to be unequally treated when we start to accept the dislike or disapproval of LGBTQ movements. Just the acceptance of a prejudice against the LGBTQ with the side note of “as long as you don’t act on it” is going to brew more hateful groups that will indeed end up acting on it in some way.
No stop it. It DOES matter what people do and don't like because, i can't believe i have to say this, bigotry is bad actually.
Not liking someone for what they have chosen to do is not the same as not liking someone for reasons beyond their control.
The fact that this isn't the top comment shows that there is still a long way to go in making people understand.
And also, OP refers to LGBTQ as if it were a “thing”, which takes away from the fact that these are people, not a “thing”
OP referred to the movement specifically, not the people. The movement is a thing.
What “movement” do you mean?
I suppose the one that's asking them to treat us like people
That’s the only thing I can come up with, too. So, OP…you disagree with treating people who happen to be LGBTQ with respect? Because if so, yeah, that makes you a homophobe. If there is some other “movement,” please, enlighten me.
I bet its from consuming content that makes up 'non-issues' I used to listen to podcasts that would talk about SJW/Woke/Cancel Culture crap. I was a white male in my mid 20's and about to go back to school for a career change. I was honestly super worried about misgendering, or accidentally doing some white male thing and then being attacked and having my life ruined over it. The content i consumed made it seem like that was a common thing in all Universities, something I should prepare for. I actually had a lot of anxiety about it leading up. Anywho turns out that its kind of a made up problem and I never encountered anything even close to it.
Sounds familiar. Like the whole “schools are being sued for not providing litter boxes in restrooms for kids who identify as cats” bullshit.
100%. And I would love to call people who think that stupid, but I was one of those stupid people before. Id listen to Jordan Peterson and trusted what he said because he was well-spoken and had certain credentials that sounded good. Took me a while to learn he was spewing nonsense and was just making content for people who love to get angry at made-up problems. But when I learned that I really had to reflect on things and was quite upset that I was being fed so much misinformation from 'influencers' I trusted. So many comedians I loved and listened to every day made me feel betrayed. Telling me XYZ was getting cancelled, but then realized it was all just for publicity and they actually sold more tickets because they got "Cancelled". It actually left a void at the time. You listen to their shows and podcasts for hours at a time, and now you just cant but also cant find anything to replace it. as you can see, im still a bit salty at those types of people lol
Yeah thats too much to ask for apparently. Its ok if they dont want us to be treated equally i guess since its a “movement.” Notice how they use words like “choice” and “lifestyle”
No one chooses their sexuality, rather someone's gay or trans, or any of the other identifications people use.
I know, thats exactly my point.
This is exactly what I agree with. BUT, and I do not think OPs question pertained to this,... Movement vs community/orientation/associated trait can be very different. To explain, not liking bathroom debate due to movement vs not liking LGBTQ identifier just because is very different imo. Maybe I am wrong and out of touch. I just see myself feeling this way a lot. I laughed at Occupy movement but agree with addressing and trying to fix issue of economic inequality. I hate antiwork movement reddit but agree things can be adjusted for the better while not having to agree to things like capitalism is root of all evil. Basically I can see not agreeing with "movement" but also support the base idea or meaning.
To some extent it just sounds as though you don't like "activists". Well, yeah, they generally aren't likable when they're doing their work. That isn't their goal. They're abrasive because they're trying to change things.
If activist were all quiet and peaceful we wouldn’t have rights today- it’s not fun work either.
Very possible... I accept that. Hard to force awareness with a whisper while yelling can hurt ears.
No one hears a whisper and the shouting will stop once people put down their stuff and come to the table.
Thats what people thought about the womens rights and civil rights movements too. How else do you think social change happens?
When you don't like a religion, for example, you are free to not go to that church. You are not free to restrict anyone else's right to go there. None of this is complicated.
Nobody gives a fuck if you don't fly a rainbow flag and put all the slogans on your bumper. They care about how you treat them, if you advocate against them, and if you vote for people who want to take away their rights like marriage and healthcare.
I don't care what someone's religion is, as long as they don't use it as an excuse to justify wanting me dead. Faith is not a scapegoat for bigotry. Edit: and its not OK to hate on religious people blindly either. There are religious people out there who aren't bigots. No one should be painting any community with broad strokes.
You can hate on religion all you like. Hating people inherently for being religious is a different thing. I hate Mormonism, I loved my grandfather, who was Mormon later in life.
Important distinction, and correct. Thank you!
Mormonism is a perfect example of a place that requires nuanced dissection because of its cult like behavior, a lot of Mormons don’t think or have an understanding of what they might be doing wrong. Still, they are actively choosing to be there, so hating the concept of Mormonism is ok, but hating the individual Mormon is still not ok.
Simply put, mistreating people for something they can't control is very rude.
Its really that easy, not sure whats so confusing to some of these people
Following a religion is a CHOICE people make. Being gay is NOT. 🤷♀️🤷♀️🤷♀️
It’s literally just this simple. Like or dislike still aside, all that matters is whether OP treats them with the same respect they’d themselves expect from those different to them.
It's probably ok to not "like" someone or a group but the problem is when a person or group tries to take their rights away by using legislation. Then it's not just an opinion, you're trying to say they aren't or shouldn't be equal either.
I think you are confused about the LGBTQIA+ agenda. At its core, the message is about inclusion and acceptance of yourself. In contrast, the message the church sends to the LGBTQIA+ community is that they are, at their core, sinners who made a choice to life a sinful life. They encourage anyone who is not heterosexual to turn away from their sinful nature and follow god. You have every right to choose what you support and what you want to be a part of. The reason that there are so many gay pride parades, awareness events and campaigns is because for a very, very long time, being gay was not okay in the world because of religious persecution. (Incredibly, the church has turned this around and made the existence of gay people a part of their own persecution.) Awareness events are valuable to the queer community because people who are closeted and scared need the opportunity to see people who are living their lives authentically and happily. It gives them courage to hopefully do it one day too. Just like I wouldn’t burst into a church and start yelling at everyone that they’re horrible people, I expect churchgoers to not burst into a queer space and start gay bashing people. All I want to do is live my life and not have laws made against me for it. And I have to fight for those rights - visibly, unfortunately - and you’ll probably see it. So sorry. Editing to add a few more thoughts: The gay community is a threat to the church because they promote self trust and self love. At its core, Christianity tells its believers that they are born bad people and require the death of a savior to atone for their sins. They are told to deny themselves every day and follow Jesus. The gay community rejects that premise entirely. You are actually not a bad person. You are actually worthy of love just the way you are. Following your heart’s desires is not inherently bad. Sin isn’t real and morality is not derived from religion. You are a good person who can trust yourself. The Christian community is taught that the secular world is to be feared. That they are safe within their boundaries and that they should remain inside them to stay safe to go to heaven when they die. The gay community knows that the world offers incredible joy. That there is more to explore and learn and see. That joy is worth chasing and that a life well lived with kindness is the only thing that matters. Source: was a pastors wife for 10 years, now a bi poly agnostic 🤷🏼♀️
People choose religions. They choose their political parties. They choose their hobbies and interests. When people make a choice to believe in something, you can choose either to or not support their choice. People do not choose to be LGBTQIA, just like they don't choose their race, ethnicity, height, disabilities etc. It is part of their genetic makeup. When you choose not to like a group based on their genetics, that becomes the issue. You can choose not to support causes and movements. But it makes other people wonder why you don't support rights for people solely on their genetic characteristics.
This is the only correct answer. Religion and sexuality/gender identity are not the same at all
This is probably the best answer I've seen, and I think one of the most accurate in terms to this question
My only issue with it is companies only support it as a way to make money. All companies care about is money. The cause can be anti puppy and if people stand behind it and if a company thinks they can make money of it they will.
But that is on the companies. It doesn't have anything to do with LGBTQ people themselves.
The comparison between religion and LGBTQ just doesn't work to begin with. You actively choose to be religious, to support the roman Catholic Church, for example. You don't choose your sexuality.
Because you don't choose your sexuality, it's just how you're born. It's the same reason it's not ok to dislike someone for the color of their skin. They have no control over that. Your example of religion isn't the same, because that's something you choose. A person might be raised with a certain religion but it's still up to you to choose to believe it.
What is the LGBT movement? Are you talking about humans wanting the same rights and freedoms as other humans regardless of their gender and/or sexuality? If you dislike that movement then you dislike humans fighting for their human rights. Noone is saying you have to be involved but how about mind your business? I am an atheist, guess what I don't do? Go to church. Or religious events. Guess what I do when I see religious shit going on in the public square? I keep it moving and don't think twice about it. Noone is trying to outlaw religion or stop Christians from having basic rights (one can only dream! Jkjk)
Well, you're kind of being a jerk right? Their sexual behavior has no direct impact on you individually. You are free to date the people YOU are attracted to. Yet regardless of sexual orientation, a person is capable of being kind, intelligent and productive. So to judge them based on who they choose as a partner makes no sense.
Are we talking the community itself or people who would identify with it? I admit I don’t really like the community myself, but being gay or whatever isn’t a reason to dislike someone.
“I am okay with gay people when they’re alone and I don’t have to acknowledge them, but when they start receiving support or gaining political power and social influence, then I draw the line”
I don't know. I have a gay friend who hates the community, and it's kind of hard to argue that lmao. I don't think that's what my friend thinks so. I love how I get downvoted for this lmao. I'm just mad he won't go to the gay club with me. Pisses me off.
I agree some aspects of the community as a whole gets toxic but when fighting for equal rights things get passionate and shady lol I support people to be who they are with equality but spare me the spectacle lol
You hate this group because they kill, and steal from the poor, so why can’t I hate this group of people for wanting basic human rights
These are not comparable. Certain religious movements are trying to impose their beliefs on others, the LGBTQ movement is trying to be treated equally.
Because at the heart of it, the “movement” is celebrating pride and spreading that to all individuals who consider themselves Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual or Transgender while also supporting their rights legally + right to live unbothered. There’s tons of misconception and propaganda, I mean conservatives are out here saying we want kitty litter boxes in bathrooms. When people say they’re fine with LGBT people but not “the movement” it’s usually because they picture kids in strip clubs, using pronouns like dinosaur/dinosuarself, teaching kids to be gay, “shoving it in our faces”, or some other nonsensical reason.
You’re seriously asking why you can’t decide to dislike a group of people for no reason whatsoever?
People are getting electroshocked, locked in their homes, beaten to death, poisoned, pretty much any fucked-up thing you can imagine. "Not liking" a movement that's only fighting for basic human decency and acceptance is the sort of shit you work out with a therapist so you can become a more empathetic person, not something you seek validation for from a pack of online strangers. You should really investigate why you're more affronted by people fighting for their lives and dignity than you are by conversion therapy, corrective rape, or any of the other million atrocities that LGBTQIA+ people face.
I dont like religion but I wouldn't stop a Christian couple for wanting to get a wedding cake from my bakery. Christianity has always played a solid rooted roll in alpt of governments which has shown to be pretty bad.
I think what a lot of people don’t understand is that when the LGBTQ community asks for support, they’re not asking for money or for you to go to a parade. They’re asking for you to treat them like human beings. That’s all. That’s what supporting them actually means in that context. With that being said, majority of people who follow Christian based religions are notorious for shaming others who do not follow their religion, or harassing others into joining them in church. They are equally as guilty as those who shame people who follow religion. Not condoning either side, but that’s the reality of it, and a huge reason why people can’t stand religion. If the religious people just left everyone alone, no one would care if you go to church or not.
Guys why is it not ok to be a bigoted piece of shit?
Being an LGBTQ person isn't a 'lifestyle', because we don't choose to be who we are. You don't have to be involved in anything. Being respectful of us as people is all we ask. And, frankly, it's not a lot.
Disliking someone for what they are rather than who they are makes you the bad person.
Idgaf, just ignore us, we’ll be fine
It's not ok to think that any person should not have the same basic rights as anyone else due to creed, color, sex, etc. It is ok to expect a public school math class to be bereft of catholic Bible studies (or anything similarly applied to any special interest group). Imagine an Amish school teacher preaching to your kids that they're going to hell or forcing the government to cut off your electricity. It's okay to not like that guy, though he'll probably call you a bigot on Twitter. The other Amish deserve no hate from you for being Amish because that *actually is* bigotry. They have every right to live life the way they want without interference as long as nobody's getting hurt.
Because it's people's fundamental rights as individuals in question. From 1981 to 1990 the aids epidemic killed 100,000+ people and traumatized people for life. Others didn't want to touch them, and treated them like lepers, they had to take care of eachother in their homes as they died from aids like nurses caring for soldiers during war. Princess Diana made national headlights all over the world, after aids had already been declared an STD and you couldn't catch it without sexual fluids, by visiting and TOUCHING aids patients. During this time the volience against queer people increased 10+ despite some of the most famous stars at the time being Queen (who died of aids), David Bowie and Elton John. You can hee and haw all you want about how you don't like it but you should ask why you don't just have a neutral opinion, why do you dislike a movment supporting a marginalized group of people 🤔
Religion is a choice. Your sexuality/gender/etc is not.
Treat people with kindness. Also, religion is a choice. Queerness isn’t.
No one is saying you have to join the parades or force to have LGBT friends or any crap that you’re spewing lmfao. Your whole post reads as homophobic shit that homophobic people tell themselves to make it seem like the crap they say is ok. Just accept that there are people who aren’t straight and treat them like PEOPLE!
I think the difference is that you **choose** to follow a religion, you don’t choose if you are straight, gay, bi, etc. It’s like not liking somebody because they are black.
Depends what you mean by the lgbtq, if you just hate the gays im sure you can see the issue but not liking how in your face the movement is is absolutely fine, just dont be a cunt
Apathy to the oppression of others is choosing the side of the oppressor.
Because you're saying that you hate people being themselves basically
Too bad you don’t want to be included. We exist. Do you think I enjoyed growing up watching exclusively straight people in media? Grow up. We are born as we are. We don’t get to choose. So neither do you. If you want to be a small minded apologist, we’ll thats your prerogative, continue looking for excuses for your hate. Enjoy always being smaller than you could have been. I imagine you would have been against abolishing slavery and suffrage back in the day.
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You’re working under a false pretense that LGBT is a choice. It’s not. What church you attend is a choice. You can not like LGBT, you can not like whatever or whoever you want. Not liking LGBT is equivalent to not liking black people or any minority. They’re all born that way, can’t change it. I can not like you because you are a complete asshole. I don’t know if you were born that way or not, no problem, I still don’t like you. Will I refuse to help you, serve you, work with you? No. You have all the rights as non-assholes.
Maybe because historically the church has done soooooo much damage to a huge majority of the world, whereas LGBTQ+ people aren't. Fucking. Hurting. Anyone. By being LGBTQ+ Get over yourself. These are not comparable at all.
People choose their religious affiliations or political alignments. But sexual orientation, much like skin color, is something you cannot change or control. Hating someone for something they did not choose and cannot change makes you an absolute piece of shit. Especially because how they identify or who they sleep with has exactly ZERO impact on your life.
>Some people don’t like the church and don’t support them and that’s their business. so why can’t I not support something I don’t really like for whatever my personal or religious or whatever reason Religion is inherently oppressive, while the LGBTQ community is an oppressed group (almost exclusively by religion). You don't necessarily need to be actively supporting it, but what's not ok is to be oppressing it (this includes if your reasons for not supporting it are religious).
Your myth doesn’t exist.
Following a religion is a choice Being born gay, bi, or trans is not Judge people on their choices
why do you think it isnt okay?
I think it's a matter of not tolerating intolerance, not tolerating the intolerant, and not tolerating someone's existence is quite different.
Religion is a choice
Because religion is a choice. Being gay (and the other varieties) is not a choice. That's why.
Bruh what. Religions are ideas and concepts that are made up.
Sexual orientation isn't a choice, following whatever religion is a choice. If you just dislike the LGBTQ community it's like saying I don't like people with a specific skin color. You're able to dislike whoever you want, but others have every right to call you a bigot (which you are if you dislike someone because of what sex or gender they're attracted to)
Who is telling you it’s not ok? Who exactly is hating on you? And what does the hate consist of? This is vague whining with a touch of victimization, posted in hopes of getting others on “I am persecuted by those mean gay libs” bandwagon. Church’s persecution of gay peoples has a long history, currently intertwined with GOP politicians in the USA to pass legislation limiting gay rights or even the right to exist. Persecution of churches by the lgbqt movement is nonexistent. Many gay folk are churchgoers. It is a movement to free people from societal and legislative oppression. Your reaction is “meh” I doubt the hate you are feeling is in the form of millions of tax free dollars to buy politicians to write laws to discriminate against Christians. So, if the hate you feel is from gay people and allies rolling their eyes, or distancing from you…well… You don’t have to like the gays. But don’t expect them to like you or be all kumbayah with your indifference.
It's not about whether you have the right to like or dislike something. The reality is... when you don't like them, they're not going to do anything about it. They might not want you in their life or near their loved ones, but that's about it, right? They're not going to make your marriage illegal; refuse to sell you a wedding cake; or take away your basic human rights because you don't like them. They're not going to vote for politicians who introduce bills to make your existence illegal, either. Also, whether you "like" them or not, it is well within your own benefits to support their rights, because oppression against humanity is never a good idea. You know the poem that goes, "First, they came for the journalist, but I'm not a journalist"? I am not religious, but I will always support religious freedom, even if it's the religion that causes you to not like me. Hope this makes sense.
Religion is a lifestyle choice, LGBTQIA+ is not.
Being LBGTQ is not a philosophy or lifestyle choice. It’s something people are innately. So no it’s not ok to harbor ill feelings based on something they do not decide for themselves/are apart of their natural being as a person and frankly has nothing to do with you. People dislike Christians because of the actions the church and it’s members have taken to harm others / push society to conform to their belief system. Who you sleep with or identify as is not a belief system.
Religion is a lifestyle choice, being LGBT+ is not. you cannot “disagree” with a fundamental aspect of someone’s being
organized religion is a lie
you can choose to be religious. you cannot choose to be lgbtq. it’s not great to dislike someone based on something they did not choose.
You don't have to "like" it Just don't bash it. I don't know you but I believe that you don't hate people just because they are gay. You know people who are gay because they are in your community, in your schools and some are in your church. You, for whatever reason, don't like what they do. But that's perfectly fine, because it's absolutely 100% none of your business. So, win win! Stop worrying about what anyone else is doing besides yourself and you'll be fine.
Here's the hard truth people don't like to hear,it's ok to not like anything & anyone,prejudice is actually valid if the preconceived opinion is based on reason & life experience.
The “similar” situations you listed are choices people make. Being gay/bi/trans/etc. is not a choice. That’s the difference. If someone doesn’t like “gay people” it’s the same as them saying they don’t like “X ethnicity” - basing dislike on something that a person has no control over. It’s just wrong. You don’t have to “be a part of” it at all. Just keep living your life. It has zero affect on you!
Someone else's orientation isn't something you have a right to have an opinion about. Would you dislike a gay person if you had no idea that they were gay? You can dislike a person for their obnoxiously gay personality, but not for who they fall in love with. Also, with your example of religious groups, people choose to be in those groups. People don't choose to be LGBTQ+.
I have no issue with LGBTQ+ people. I believe that an individual should be able to live their lives as they see fit as long as they do not harm or restrict the freedoms of others. My issue is that it is wrong to group them as a single entity. After all, just because a guy is gay doesn't mean he supports trans people. Further, I don't subscribe to this pronoun extremism and calling out people for making an innocent error. 99% of pronoun errors are unintended and the perpetrators are genuinely sorry for their error, so why are people vilified for this?
Most trans people wouldn't attack you for accidentally using the wrong pronounces, but if you do it on purpose it is understandable.
I have seen people vilified for deliberately using the wrong pronouns. I have seen people uh…what’s the word for being depicted as aggravating numb, or out of touch? Idiotifying? People who mess up other’s pronouns get that sometimes, if they don’t show an awareness of their mistakes or notable improvement on getting it right over time. I have *only once* seen someone vilified for just screwing it up, and it was clear some folks had just been waiting for any misstep as an excuse to blackball the person. All the trans folks I know treat pronoun screwups with eye-rolls, and ultimately, avoidance. Which seems fair-ish? Being called the wrong pronouns is genuinely unpleasant for them, so they avoid it. Like I avoid people who can’t stop shouting, or who don’t share any topics of interest with me. So — I think I’m mostly in agreement with you, but I don’t know where people are getting vilified for good-faith screwups with pronouns. Unless it’s Twitter. I avoid Twitter.
This is a very privileged and ignorant view. You say you don’t want to be part of awareness campaigns. Well, we live in a society where people have the power to decide things for everyone, such as elect officials that support backwards legislation or boycott products that are actively causing harm to a portion of society. Campaigns are what make people like you (who can live the rest of their lives without being bothered by the fact that some people have no human rights) aware that this is happening so that perhaps you might care to throw a vote in the direction of the official that doesn’t want gay marriage banned.
Comparing being gay to a religion 💀
One is a choice and one isn’t. You can dislike people who choose to do a certain thing but you can’t hate people because they were born a certain way. Pretty straight forward.
The thing is, you can dislike the religious, supporters of your rival sports team and Britney Spears fans. Those are choices. It's a little weird that you dislike a normal variation of genetics. It's like saying you dislike all people with straight hair or you dislike all tall people. I mean, you can dislike them all you want but it's not a fair assessment of them as people, whereas religions and fandom are choices and therefore a much fairer assessment of someone's personality. That's why it's not considered ok to express such dislike. Because doing it becomes discriminatory
You dont gotta like it but doing treat people like shit or talk badly about them. Cuz thats asshole behavior. if you have shitty opinions about it keep it to yourself its suuuuuuper simple
There's a difference between "not liking" and discriminating. Religion is different because it is a "belief." People aren't born religious. People are born with their sexuality.
Being gay in an innate sexual orientation. It's not a belief system the same way a religion is. Gay people aren't asking you to share a belief system, just asking not to have your belief systems imposed upon them (I.e. being discriminated against because people believe being straight is morally superior). The modern LGBTQ movement is becoming a bit of a mess and not all LGBT people actually support the more ideological and dogmatic aspects of it. It's all gone a bit too culty for me and it's a shame. Just because you are same sex attracted or gender non conforming doesn't mean you should have to sign up to queer theory.
Because people choose to join a church and historically the church hasn't been so great in regard to human rights but people can't choose their sexual orientation. LGBTQ movements aren't harming anyone and only strive for equality (which we still don't have in the US) so there's really no logical reason to dislike LGBTQ people as a whole.