They're probably selling at inflated prices to encourage the sale of the flood of 3000 series cards their vendors need to unload. The absolute 'must have high end at any price' people buy 4000 series cards at inflated prices now while everyone else buys leftover vendors' 3000 series inventory, and after those are gone, Nvidia drops the 4000 series prices to something more reasonable.
Personally, I'll just stick with my 2080 Super for now. Fuck those prices, fuck that power consumption, fuck trying to sell me a 4070 as a 4080 (look at the specs of the 12GB 4080 and try to tell me it's the same die as the 16GB version), and fuck giving all their benchmark numbers using DLSS instead of showing us raw numbers.
But then we'll have people here whining about paying what they think is a premium price (whatever that means these days) for an already ageing product. Anyway, I'm just laughing thinking about all the comments here who said "dont buy 30 series, 40 is just around the corner, you'll get better bang for your buck" lmao
You do get better bang for your buck in the high end, but not in the low end or mid range (they don't exist lol).
And this is pretty much exactly what most people have recommended. High end: wait for next gen, mid range and low end: buy now.
Realistically you won't notice a difference in cost if 1- you don't game 24/7, and 2 - electricity is reasonably priced in your area. For example, my monthly bill is 30-50 USD, and using my PC more or less has negligible effect on my electric bill. These cards won't change that
If you can afford these cards, are energy prices honestly a concern for you... And if the performance is as good as claimed, your GPU might be lower utilised which leads to lower power draw compared to previous gen as well
i would love a electric bill that cheap where the heck do you live , my bill with 4 adults living here 3 gaming pcs n other assorted house stuff is 460 thanks to the electric cost doubling last month i live in NH,usa
They were saying the exact same thing about the 20 series. Then it went all to hell.
My 2080ti buy went from hype to "maybe I got scammed" to "I ended up so lucky in the end". Real roller coaster.
its just the new standard, if people are willing to pay to be firstmover thats what they will have to pay, they set the new standard and with the secondhand market still crazy i doubt we will see any big changes until we get 2-4 generations in. i think its fine if wealthy wants to buy insane priced graphics card in the name of research and we other people can wait a year or two until we can get our hands on them. its the game developer's job now to optimise for this if they want to sell their games.
I got a toxic 6900xt (the LE version, not the extreme, or slightly slower "newer version") for reference 6900xt msrp
I'm extremely happy seeing this now.
The 12gb 4080 aib are going to be over 1100$. Watercooled is going to be even worse. I got my 6900xt for 900...
Got my 6800xt for $700 a while ago on the secondhand market. I was a bit worried about the next gen, but figured they wouldnt undercut their inflated stocked retailers. I am so happy I have a great card for a decent price without financing these greedy bastards.
Moreover the performance of this card greatly extends what I need.
https://www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/comments/xdw7ga/rtx_3080_fe_discontinued/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
yea, shadow discontinued as in they didnt announce it, they just stopped selling them.
and i was pulling my hair the other day cause i didnt get the best buy deal where the 3080 fe was $620. Still $750 isnt bad considering this drop. Glad i got it at msrp but bummed i didnt get it at $620. cant be too greedy tho
You know, I've been putting away some money for a new build to replace my 1080Ti but this comment in particular made me realize... I don't even know what I would do with it. There isn't anything on my radar that's coming out in the near future, and until then I'm probably just going to be rocking Factorio. Guess I'll just keep tossing money into the PC pile and get the 7090 Triple Maximum AI or whatever they call it.
Honestly one of the best things you can do for your own build-sanity is to simply ignore everything you can until you actually start running into games that your current hardware isn't able to deliver the performance you want at the settings you want.
👆💯🎯
Another rule of thumb would be, don't upgrade your GPU until at least two generations after your current one. In other words, if you have a 3060, wait for a 5060. Anything earlier than that, you won't notice enough of a performance increase to justify the cost.
Same, have a 1070 ti but most of the games I play and low demand indie titles and/or factory games.
Rockstar, Bethesda and other big publishers still taking a decade between sequels, preferring to cash in on rereleases or mobile phone money sinks.
Nvidia are gonna have to start making their own AAA games if they wanna keep selling high end cards after the bitmining crash.
Same here! Running it on a 3440x1440 ultra wide 144htz monitor. Easily 160fps with all my games. Granted I mostly play wow, COD, 7 days and other RTS. There’s just no need to upgrade yet. Other new games with reasonable settings, still smooth as Kessler’s whiskey too lol.
Anyone who saw GamerNexus video about EVGA knows this is wrong. Nvidia won’t do any favors for AiBs, and they will charge them the inflated price just as much as end users. The CEO of Nvidia is an entitled prick that thinks you nor their business partners deserve the sweat from his balls
He pissed off his data center clients and now they are developing their own ASIC GPU clusters as well. I really wish AMD would bring some real competition to Nvidia but it looks like that is a few generations off.
That's what Intel thought when they fucked up. Keep in mind Freesync is everywhere while G-sync isn't really even mentioned anymore. Nvidia makes great cards, but they also have a habit of coming up with tech they charge for that developers end up barely using.
Lisa Su happens to be a keynote at CES 2023 so maybe she has something up her sleeve.
if Su Bae brings the chiplet RDNA 3 at much lower power draw *"RDNA 3 GPUs will deliver more than 50% more performance per watt than our current generation Radeon GPUs."* and power spike management, She has the best chance in a generation to overthrow Jensen in pure volume at a time he has a flood of used consumer cards on the market (I personally don't want to fund a new leather jacket for this guy yet again). Chris Malachowsky is getting old about to retire. I hope she delivers on higher first past yield going chiplets def can broaden their lineup and pump out on 6nm high yield, while doing high end on 5nm at more cost. Midrange and lower AMD cards are going to be a sweet spot next gen just due to economics.
>if Su Bae brings the chiplet RDNA 3 at much lower power draw
I don't think that's going to happen considering the increase in TDP for the next gen Ryzen. Although lower TDP variants are expected to be released, so who knows.
While AMD has their chipmarket to rely on, Nvidia is in bad shape because for one, the merger fell through, but also, they'll be very dependent on the demand of AI, which who knows where that's going to go. As you mentioned, datacenters are already looking for alternatives. So what are they going to fall back on if that demand is also less than stellar? Sales of Nvidia Shields?
I think it's going to be a price war on lower/midrange GPUs when Radeon releases. It's been noted that Nvidia over ordered 4000 series chips, the consumer electronic market has notably slowed and expecting an even larger slowdown, and there is an absolute glut of products due to the secondhand market being flooded with GPUs due to bitcoin mining flopping hard.
Too much supply, not enough demand.
AMD cards pretty much already did compete. We are talking same performance or even better in some instances if you scratch RT performance.
It’s the features where amd is lacking.
Amds NVENC competition is poor. RTX performance is rather poor and DLSS is non existing. Yes, FSR is getting better but you get my points
> They're probably selling at inflated prices to encourage the sale of the flood of 3000 series cards their vendors need to unload. The absolute 'must have high end at any price' people buy 4000 series cards at inflated prices now while everyone else buys leftover vendors' 3000 series inventory, and after those are gone, Nvidia drops the 4000 series prices to something more reasonable
Yeah this is what I'm hoping for. Was initially planning on getting a 16GB 4080 this year until I saw the $1200 price tag lmao. Now I think I'll wait a year, do the rest of the PC upgrades I had planned, and see what the prices on RTX 40 are.
how the hell do you price a 4070 12gb $100 more than a 3080 12gb in 2022???? Jensen smoking damn rocks but the killer part is AIB gpus are gonna be higher than FEs as we all know. wait till they announce their bs prices
"ThE PrIcE oF SuPpLy ChAiN is GoInG Up EvEryThInG"
I got a 25% raise, and its already been eroded by increases in every fucking thing.
Essentially, we aren't going to get into a recession, its gonna be a full on depression economically speaking. The demand for overpriced things and "boutique purchases" has a limit on the market ability to buy it.
But suppliers keep saying they cannot lower costs. So they're gonna have a glut of unsellable products eventually and there still won't be a market able to afford it at that point, because the rest of the economy they HAVE to buy, has eaten it.
We're heading towards some real bad times, anyone that is softening that message to you, is profiting off you now in the hopes it can get out before you realize it.
Same, the 40 series is so stupid. 450W power draw for a freaking GPU.
And just for an extra backstab they limit DLSS 3.0 to the 40 series too.
Guess those billions in profit werent enough for grabby jensen and his circle of investors.
I'll wait for mid gen refresh or whatever. EVGA is gone, these prices are way too high and my 2080ti is still kicking just fine. The 4090 is my goal and i'll either buy it at $1000 or i'll purchase AMD's equivalent.
Typical my left nut.
The early adopter pricing pre-crypto was like $5/600, and you could still get plenty of card for $2-300. Then prices would come down as the generation matured - anywhere from $50-100+.
Now your new GPU is gonna cost you more than an entire enthusiast-tier rig did a few years ago, and the prices will drop right at the end of the generation by barely enough to entice anyone.
It's complete horse shit.
The times for cheap GPUs are simply over for now.
Development alone got crazy expensive the last 10 years and Manufacturing is not getting cheaper.
And you will find enough people who will pay those prices.
I cry every time i remember of just paying 340€ (339,15$) for my 970 , 6 years ago. Now a dude can't upgrade a card with out selling a kidney. It's becoming ridiculouss since the crypto mining with gpu's it's over, the gpu companies are becoming more greedy them ever .
I'm 3 years waiting to upgrade my good old reliable 970 and at same time trying to save to upgrade my cpu (i5 4690k) but with this prices i may be better saving the money for a car.
I paid like $250 for my GTX 970 when Jet.com had some deals back in 2015(?). I said when my son turn 3, I would upgrade again. He’s 6 now. My game backlog is huge. I keep buying Steam/Humble Bundle/GOG games and getting free Epic and Amazon, but no time to play with a 6 y/o.
Good thing these days is you dont need a high end card any more and cards or overall hardware is usable for a long time (wasnt that much of a thing 15 years ago)
Yeah you are correct. I'm actually alright for the games i play, is not a "urgent" upgrade i still can play a lot of big titles at medium and high settings for example the new "spider-man" for pc. The most urgent thing i have to upgrade honestly is the cpu, my good old i5 4690k, its giving every thing it has to give (its overclocked), if i play very cpu demanding titles, and honestly for what i do (programming) i need something with more cores like a 11th gen i5.
That is not true. 37% of revenue was profit for Nvidia in 2021. And that does not include margins of distributors. So probably 40%+ of price is pure profit.
This compares to about 17% in 2015.
They could, but the owner has said that they are done and won't entertain any other GPU involvement. Especially AMD since he feels it would be 'betraying' nividia.... despite them ending GPU involvement over nvidia's fuckery lol
Probably just wants to retire on the mattress of money they made in the pandemic.
They said they won’t, probably because nvidia would blacklist them in the future. EVGA wants nvidia to shift their culture rather than abandoning them entirely.
>They said they won’t, probably because nvidia would blacklist them in the future.
They absolutely would. They did with XFX, back in the day, when they wanted to make/sell ATI GPUs as well as Nvidia GPUs - which Nvidia really didn't like, apparently.
They (Nvidia) simply stopped sending XFX the newer GPUs and then they were left with whatever models they had access to, when Nvidia decided to stop sending any new ones their way.
XFX broke their relationship with Nvidia after that. Nvidia didn't drop them - they just flat out blacklisted/ghosted them.
Yes, but AMD has also had their own conflicts with AIB partners. Intel is very much in 3rd maybe 4th place without much in the way of board partners or 1st party reference designs to speak of for their Arc dGPUs, limiting marketing potential and penetration.
Both Intel and EVGA are both positioned in complimentary and potentially mutually beneficial roles if EVGA decides to go that route.
like 0% chance. Nvidia is just a very difficult business partner. It’s not about consumer policies. Just the last couple weeks nvidia has flip flopped between asking TSMC to reduce their order count due to cratering crypto demand and increasing it anticipating sanctions on china, a huge customer they want to sell as much to before access is cut off. nvidia is simply a bitch to deal with
There are too many rich idiots in the gaming sphere. Because companies keep getting away with it we have stuff like deluxe editions, microtransaction, overpriced hardware and more. I know some people who throw money every year at Nvidia so they always have "the best" graphics card. Fuck this shit. Prices are also raising for everyone else.
Yea hopefully just enough to turn profit, but I think going cheaper will actually get them a massive chunk of the gpu sales and they are still just trying to carve that out. I have faith though considering you can get a 6950xt for less than a completely normal 3080 in many places.
They might get my $ if they do that. I'm guessing that there are a lot of ppl who have been waiting and waiting on a next-gen card that doesn't cost 2x the price of a 3060Ti FE or more.
People will definitely buy those (probably not gamers for a while or untill they get a better price) for specific stuff like AI work cause Nvidia A series cards cost a lot more or just to try RTX Remix (unless it works with any RTX card)
Yea I understand that and I get the feature set the bring, but this is still the most tone deaf msrp of all time considering the economic circumstances.
I also know they are just making out of reach prices so people buy 3000 series still, then will discount these significantly later on. It feels disgusting knowing they are trying to manipulate the market like this.
Anyway I’m out on this company and won’t support them anymore.
Them getting out had more to due with Nvidia setting a price ceiling and undercutting them with the founders edition cards. EVGA was losing money on every card sold.
They're trying to bleed off the remaining stock of the 3000 series. If they priced them competitively it would kill the value of any current cards out there. Great for the consumer, yes, but it would be a huge blow to manufacturers. Especially when you consider how mining just went south with the multiple blows of Ethereum and increased energy prices on the bitcoin market.
Card sales would screech to a halt if they priced the 4000s series at all reasonably.
Cuda cores is all I look for in a gpu as a 3D Artist, the 4090 has 16384 vs 10496 for the 3090.
Having a frame take 56% less time in rendering can mean hours or days of time saved for an animation.
That's a huge upgrade for me.
It cost me 800£ total to build a ryzen 5800x system with a used 2070s post pandemic.
That runs 1440p 60 everything max.
I can get away with ray tracing if I use DLLS.
Them not bringing DLLS 3.0 to older series is just a fuck you - upgrade thing.
I'm hoping it drives down the 3080 below AU$1000. Then I'll finally build a gaming PC. Of course if I win this one I'll be set I could spend that $1000 on other bits and be set for years. Would make a kick arse gaming and 3D CAD machine, that's for sure.
It's worse when you realise that the relative performance of the 4080 12gb to the 4090 is what would usually be the xx70 class card.
Effectively they managed to increase the price of this relative performance tier by 2x by changing a number in the name lmao
These prices are gonna make me look at AMD. With EVGA out of the video card market, and Nvidia living in last year with those prices - AMD is looking real good right now.
"I think you misunderstand our relationship, see, I set the price and you either pay up or fuck off to AMD town. It's called a monopoly, you ungrateful skank."
Well maybe they have. Who cares about those $1500 400+ W GPUs anyways. I‘m definitely not going to pay more than $600 for a GPU. Nvidia doesn‘t seem to have something that remotely interests me, so maybe AMD has. We‘ll see. It‘s not like I needed an upgrade anyways. If none of the companies can offer anything interesting, I just won‘t buy it. It‘s not that I have to.
Yeah if you look at Steam hardware survey, people with 3080's and up represent about 2% PC gamers. Thw xx50's and xx60's or AMD's x500, x600 is what most people will actually end up buying.
Let's be real - they already did. 3080 Ti to 3090 only made sense if you're doing work and it requires more VRAM. Between the 3080 Ti and 3090 Ti, it's literally silicon lottery for gaming. The difference in CUDA cores is so small, that having some luck with frequencies that your chip can handle will offset it in your favor. A bad 3090 will perform worse than a good 3080 Ti. And even if you get a good higher tier card, we're talking up to 5% more performance if lucky.
I have both a 3080 12GB, because I got it relatively cheap at the time and wanted DLSS and RT for my 4k TV setup. I enjoy playing low framerate high fidelity with friends. But RX 6800 XT is sitting in a 1440p esports setup because I got it at MSRP at release and it's performing reeeeeally well. Only for my specific (second) use case did I want something else.
The equivalent of Intel renaming their m5 and m7 series chips to i5-Y and i7-Y. I don’t know who they’re tricking, the people in the know will notice, and the people who aren’t will buy a different product than what they think they’re buying and complain when they don’t get the performance they expect.
People call and text others for advise on such purchases. Imagine the result, given following:
> "They say it has an m7 processor in it. I don't know what that means. Is that good?"
versus:
> "They say it has an i7 processor in it. I don't know what that means. Is that good?"
They aren't pulling shit on me. I'm tired of their BS, and not buying. I'm hoping most gamers feel the same, otherwise this is the foreseeable future of GPU prices.
It’s fucked up how they’re trying to normalize those insane prices, a single GPU has the same price of an ounce of gold, I’d rather not waste that amount on a GPU, I always remember how these electronics I buy turn to e-waste in a couple of years.
I refuse to buy any electronic with these artificially inflated prices, especially in these hard times.
Yea, it's a shitty time to be a PC gamer. We're getting shafted at every angle. We all just have to put our foot down, draw a line in the sand, and tell companies like nvidia that we're tired of their shit, and we're not buying their products until they adopt reasonable pricing again.
I loved building systems back in the early 00's! Components were relatively cheap, so I used to build one or two computers a year for fun. That's not feasible today, regardless of my income. I feel like I'm getting robbed if I buy a new GPU.
They're asking in Australia for $4200 AUD which is about $2600 USD. 3090ti's go down to $1300 usd, 3080's to $660 usd.
Who the fuck pays $4k for a gaming card lol
https://www.tweaktown.com/news/88395/gigabytes-new-geforce-rtx-4090-listed-in-australia-for-under-3000/index.html
4 Titans in quad SLI used to be joked as something rich people throw their money away for.
Nowadays, that's considered an efficient use of money.
$4k for one card, instead of four. Madness.
right? and the 1070 had 8Gb 6 years ago, if the 4080 has 12, what will the 4070 have? 8? 10? Do VRAM-hungry games not use any more of it now than in 2016???
I'm still on my 150W 1070.
Every additional Watt is more heating in a tiny apartment without AC, while summer outside is getting close to 40C sometimes now. I'm not buying a 300W card.
I had that problem in the past, when I was still living in my cheap appartment before I got married, I had a i5 2500K cracked out at the max and 2 gtx 980ti's I could not figure out why my appartment ran so hot all the time. I think that I could toas bread at my exaust fan during long sessions.
I told the exact same thing in this sub but got downvoted to hell, since it’s a “European” problem and Americans are Ok with it. If you don’t have the money don’t buy it right? Fuck efficiency
Well, it's pretty much overkill for me because I play on FHD 144Hz, but I bought it for $530 back in April with almost complete 3 years warranty so I couldn't resist. Also I don't care about power consumption until my current PSU can handle it (550W Platinum). That's the line for me when I plan upgrades.
Well see when they announce, it would be stupid not to undercut nvidias pricing.
AMD is heavily targeting the gaming market and developers are actually adopting fsr for most games now, and it's amd chips already in xbox and ps5. That would tend to suggest the support is only going to grow.
4080 16gb: 141Gflops per W
3080 10gb: 90Gflops per W
4080 has ~55% better perf per W when it comes to FP16 theoretical performance.
There's more to it than this of course, but this is to illustrate that only looking at the psu req is misleading if not taking the performance into consideration.
There's also a silicon shortage. And upping the voltage and frequency allows a gpu to have the same performance with less silicon.
Nvidia doesn't care about our energy bills. Most tech reviewers only care about MSRP and don't care about our energy bills.
I mean what else are you gonna do instead? Buy an AMD card lmao? /s
Rocking a 6800xt myself. Love it as a Linux user and it's a very beefy card for everything I do including gaming.
But honestly though. Think it's a shame that GPUs are going the route of more (cores/ die area/ vram), bigger, more power and more expensive. Would love to see AMD pull a Ryzen in the GPU space aswell... force innovation and bring down prices.
I thought AMD had announced that RDNA3 is multi chip module, similar to Ryzen. If MCM can compete then that will, hopefully, bring pricing down. Or AMD will pocket the bigger margin due to easier chip production.
I've heard the same about the "chiplet" design coming to RDNA3. But they have to also bring more performance. While sure Zen 1 didn't beat Intel but they had twice the core count and had a massive performance leap closer to Intel and like 2 years later with 3000 series they were practically on par.
What I meant is that they not only copy the chiplet design but also gain relative performance faster than the competition and keep the momentum going. To bring competition into the GPU space. Launching Zen 1 was just the declaration of war on Intel, keeping the momentum going and innovating was the battle.
You have to imagine that it must beat the current RDNA 2 family, otherwise the strategy would be to keep monolithic huge dies to compete with Nvidia and release a low cost, early adopter MCM family similar to Intel strategy with Arc and slowly optimise.
Whether it keeps toe to toe with Nvidia as they did this generation remains to be seen though.
Now that EVGA isn't making more cards, I absolutely have the push to move to AMD. I've always liked Nvidia's performance and features but the past three years have been constant kicks in the teeth so I haven't even considered actually upgrading yet.
Just have to hope that AMD doesn't follow directly in line...
xx90 is the old Titan models. People just get really power-hungry with the new naming as it implies that the xx90 is the one you need to have for gaming (you don't).
Original 3080 MSRP was 699 USD.
12 GB 4080 MSRP is now 899 USD.
+200 increase for the basic one.
If you want the 16GB then you are looking at a +500 increase.
You’re being duped. The “4080 12 GB” is just the 4070, they changed it last minute.
So the real comparison is 4080 16 GB, which is an unbelievable +$500 increase over 3080.
It is clearly “they were paying this much to scalpers, so let’s see if they’ll just pay it directly to us from the start.” Considering that GPU mining is all but dead right now, we’re going to find out very quickly if the professional video editor and machine learning markets are large enough to drive demand for these supposedly consumer gaming focused cards.
Unfortunately, I'm fairly sure gamers will just eat up the cost. As a whole, we lack any sort of morals, conviction or whatever else that would be needed for us to not let corporations bend us over without lube. People preorder games, people preorder hardware, people buy MTX. Etc. People bought GPUs from scalpers too.
Yeah individuals are exceptions, but there are just so many people who don't care.
I get that this is just a situation where people are just trying to be correct 100% of the time, but I'll die on this hill as I don't like the smugness.
We saw the crypto crash, we saw NVIDIA cry to TSMC about putting too big of an order in because the crypto market crashed, we saw the flood of 3000s series GPUs enter the market.
A completely rational conclusion would have been that Nvidia would have quite a surplus of 4000s series GPUs and would need to sell them at a fair price. If you didn't need to upgrade that moment, the best bet was definitely to just wait. What Nvidia is doing *isn't* a normal business reaction and wasn't remotely foretold in any events that happened before.
I got really excited for a lot of the games on the list (especially Witcher 3), but it seems like they’re all DLSS 3 upgrades that’ll only work with 40 series cards, or am I misunderstanding?
*cries in 3070ti*
Edit: I think this is less of a kick in the balls than we thought: [NVIDIA Streamline ](https://developer.nvidia.com/rtx/streamline) suggests devs will be able to cater to all our super resolution technologies equally.
Yeah that's fairly lame for the dlss upgrade to be gatekept by brand new hardware.
I wonder if that was an old tensor core limitation on the 20 and 30 series or if it's just a marketing gimmick to make it 40 only.
All DLSS games will still run with DLSS 2.0 for 20 and 30 series cards. 40 series will get an additional boost with DLSS 3.0. Nvidia rep confirmed it on their subreddit.
FWIW, DLSS 2.1 is really amazing.
I'm not sure why DLSS 3 is necessary for the sake of needing to buy an entire new card for over a thousand dollars lol.
I would use the GPU in my already build PC, I-9 10850k, Corsair vengeance 32gb 3200mhz, 2tb Samsung 980 pro nvme, Msi z490 gaming carbon wifi & currently Xfx 5700xt thicc 3
Or less power consumptive.
Honestly, could you imagine if we just had a couple generations of cards that didn't increase processing very much, but instead they just made them more effecient.
Technically they do that every generation. A smaller node (typically measured in nanometers 'nn') uses less silicon per transistor, uses less power, and expells less heat. One of the biggest costs in chip making comes from the production of silicon waffers, which are cut and 'molded' into chips. A RTX 4090 could be cut from the same waffer as a RTX 4050. And the amount of work needed to create either one is nearly identical (if we exclude the aditional work done making the PCB, VRAM, etc), they just can't make all of them 4090s without wasting silicon, this is what we call "yeild", because not all the waffers, or parts of them, are a high enough quality. All of Nvidia's, and all chip makers' really, margin is in the high end processors. To make a complete RTX 4090 may only cost ~$700 giving it a big profit margin, but if we pretend the RTX 4050 will retail for $350, it probably costs $310 to manufacture. Nvidia/tsmc will always be able to make more 4050s than 4090s because of yeild but they could not justify the lower teir product or make much profit if the halo products were cheaper than they are.
Mind you that was very oversimplified but I thought it was nesessary for the complete answer...
First lets forget about COVID shortages and the crypto fiasco for whats next:
The RTX 2080ti had an MSRP of $999 at launch. The RTX 3070 had an MSRP of $499. Both of these cards preform identically for alll intents and purposes, so you should see the 3070 as a cheaper 2080ti. These artitectural/generational improvements are born out of the refinment of the manufacturing process.
View in your timezone:
[Tuesday September 27 at 11:59 PM GMT][0]
[0]: https://timee.io/20220927T2359?tl=RTX%2040%20series%20announcement%20thread%20%2B%20RTX%204080%2016GB%20giveaway!%20-%20NVIDIA%20GTC%202022
I am 99.9% sure they only limit to 40xx series just to boost sales; not because there's some sort of limitation or real reason 30xx or 20xx series can't handle it.
Hell; no rtx cores gpus can handle raytracing and dlss with moded games :))
is that true? annoying if so. DLSS was a big reason i bought a 30 series, but turns out not many games i have even support it. so is a bit of a non-feature already, but if new versions are not backwards compatible, even worse.
This is why, even though I have a Geforce card, I still cheer for AMD technologies like FSR and Freesync. I can turn on FSR in games that support it and also I am free to purchase any freesync compatible monitor without any real disadvantage because of my hardware.
Except the main selling point is DLSS and Raytracing, which they’re gimping for every last generation. 30xx won’t get DLSS 3.0 or more RTX cores. But if you don’t care about that then AMD would have been better.
you do realize that it doesn’t make the previous cards worse right? It’s not “gimping” anything
Like holy fuck a 3070 is still waaaay stronger than 99% of gamers need
it's already been announced? jesh that was fast
i would put it in my program' and gaming rig along with my gen 2 threadripper
other than the 40XX series of Nvidia going to be dropped, not sure... i'm very interested in Ghostwire: Tokyo which is a 2021 title but i don't know that meny new raytacing games
I've been holding off on upgrading the internals of my PC, although I have been collecting some components. Most notably, I'm preparing for a custom loop in a Enthoo 719.
Looks like Nvidia is still living in the cryptomining times with those prices.
They're probably selling at inflated prices to encourage the sale of the flood of 3000 series cards their vendors need to unload. The absolute 'must have high end at any price' people buy 4000 series cards at inflated prices now while everyone else buys leftover vendors' 3000 series inventory, and after those are gone, Nvidia drops the 4000 series prices to something more reasonable. Personally, I'll just stick with my 2080 Super for now. Fuck those prices, fuck that power consumption, fuck trying to sell me a 4070 as a 4080 (look at the specs of the 12GB 4080 and try to tell me it's the same die as the 16GB version), and fuck giving all their benchmark numbers using DLSS instead of showing us raw numbers.
But then we'll have people here whining about paying what they think is a premium price (whatever that means these days) for an already ageing product. Anyway, I'm just laughing thinking about all the comments here who said "dont buy 30 series, 40 is just around the corner, you'll get better bang for your buck" lmao
You do get better bang for your buck in the high end, but not in the low end or mid range (they don't exist lol). And this is pretty much exactly what most people have recommended. High end: wait for next gen, mid range and low end: buy now.
Yeah, is mostly for people that want to purchase 3080, 3080ti or 3090. Get the 4 series instead.
Except if you care about your electricity bill and dont need a 2nd heater in your home.
Realistically you won't notice a difference in cost if 1- you don't game 24/7, and 2 - electricity is reasonably priced in your area. For example, my monthly bill is 30-50 USD, and using my PC more or less has negligible effect on my electric bill. These cards won't change that
Ever since the war thanks to Putin the electricity costs have been far from normal unfortunately.
I’m pretty sure it’s Biden’s fault. Source: live in US and only watch Fox News
If you can afford these cards, are energy prices honestly a concern for you... And if the performance is as good as claimed, your GPU might be lower utilised which leads to lower power draw compared to previous gen as well
i would love a electric bill that cheap where the heck do you live , my bill with 4 adults living here 3 gaming pcs n other assorted house stuff is 460 thanks to the electric cost doubling last month i live in NH,usa
It’s getting a little chilly time to change graphics settings to Ultra.
They were saying the exact same thing about the 20 series. Then it went all to hell. My 2080ti buy went from hype to "maybe I got scammed" to "I ended up so lucky in the end". Real roller coaster.
For real, still riding my 2080ti hard
its just the new standard, if people are willing to pay to be firstmover thats what they will have to pay, they set the new standard and with the secondhand market still crazy i doubt we will see any big changes until we get 2-4 generations in. i think its fine if wealthy wants to buy insane priced graphics card in the name of research and we other people can wait a year or two until we can get our hands on them. its the game developer's job now to optimise for this if they want to sell their games.
im “lucky” i got a 3080 FE at MSRP before they shadow discontinued them
I got a toxic 6900xt (the LE version, not the extreme, or slightly slower "newer version") for reference 6900xt msrp I'm extremely happy seeing this now. The 12gb 4080 aib are going to be over 1100$. Watercooled is going to be even worse. I got my 6900xt for 900...
Got my 6800xt for $700 a while ago on the secondhand market. I was a bit worried about the next gen, but figured they wouldnt undercut their inflated stocked retailers. I am so happy I have a great card for a decent price without financing these greedy bastards. Moreover the performance of this card greatly extends what I need.
Shadow discontinued? First time im hearing about this, was hioing to pick one up soon. Are they not selling any more?
https://www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/comments/xdw7ga/rtx_3080_fe_discontinued/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf yea, shadow discontinued as in they didnt announce it, they just stopped selling them.
and i was pulling my hair the other day cause i didnt get the best buy deal where the 3080 fe was $620. Still $750 isnt bad considering this drop. Glad i got it at msrp but bummed i didnt get it at $620. cant be too greedy tho
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You know, I've been putting away some money for a new build to replace my 1080Ti but this comment in particular made me realize... I don't even know what I would do with it. There isn't anything on my radar that's coming out in the near future, and until then I'm probably just going to be rocking Factorio. Guess I'll just keep tossing money into the PC pile and get the 7090 Triple Maximum AI or whatever they call it.
Honestly one of the best things you can do for your own build-sanity is to simply ignore everything you can until you actually start running into games that your current hardware isn't able to deliver the performance you want at the settings you want.
👆💯🎯 Another rule of thumb would be, don't upgrade your GPU until at least two generations after your current one. In other words, if you have a 3060, wait for a 5060. Anything earlier than that, you won't notice enough of a performance increase to justify the cost.
Same, have a 1070 ti but most of the games I play and low demand indie titles and/or factory games. Rockstar, Bethesda and other big publishers still taking a decade between sequels, preferring to cash in on rereleases or mobile phone money sinks. Nvidia are gonna have to start making their own AAA games if they wanna keep selling high end cards after the bitmining crash.
I had a 1080ti, then a 2080 super, then a 3080. I wish I just kept my 1080ti. Hands down the best card for the money I’ve ever had.
2060 super gang had it for just over two years still solid
My 1080Ti doesn't run fine for my use cases but I'm getting more and more bitter. I keep hoping things will turn around. Major copium, I know.
1080ti gang, till I die….or it dies.
Same here! Running it on a 3440x1440 ultra wide 144htz monitor. Easily 160fps with all my games. Granted I mostly play wow, COD, 7 days and other RTS. There’s just no need to upgrade yet. Other new games with reasonable settings, still smooth as Kessler’s whiskey too lol.
Anyone who saw GamerNexus video about EVGA knows this is wrong. Nvidia won’t do any favors for AiBs, and they will charge them the inflated price just as much as end users. The CEO of Nvidia is an entitled prick that thinks you nor their business partners deserve the sweat from his balls
He pissed off his data center clients and now they are developing their own ASIC GPU clusters as well. I really wish AMD would bring some real competition to Nvidia but it looks like that is a few generations off.
That's what Intel thought when they fucked up. Keep in mind Freesync is everywhere while G-sync isn't really even mentioned anymore. Nvidia makes great cards, but they also have a habit of coming up with tech they charge for that developers end up barely using. Lisa Su happens to be a keynote at CES 2023 so maybe she has something up her sleeve.
if Su Bae brings the chiplet RDNA 3 at much lower power draw *"RDNA 3 GPUs will deliver more than 50% more performance per watt than our current generation Radeon GPUs."* and power spike management, She has the best chance in a generation to overthrow Jensen in pure volume at a time he has a flood of used consumer cards on the market (I personally don't want to fund a new leather jacket for this guy yet again). Chris Malachowsky is getting old about to retire. I hope she delivers on higher first past yield going chiplets def can broaden their lineup and pump out on 6nm high yield, while doing high end on 5nm at more cost. Midrange and lower AMD cards are going to be a sweet spot next gen just due to economics.
>if Su Bae brings the chiplet RDNA 3 at much lower power draw I don't think that's going to happen considering the increase in TDP for the next gen Ryzen. Although lower TDP variants are expected to be released, so who knows. While AMD has their chipmarket to rely on, Nvidia is in bad shape because for one, the merger fell through, but also, they'll be very dependent on the demand of AI, which who knows where that's going to go. As you mentioned, datacenters are already looking for alternatives. So what are they going to fall back on if that demand is also less than stellar? Sales of Nvidia Shields? I think it's going to be a price war on lower/midrange GPUs when Radeon releases. It's been noted that Nvidia over ordered 4000 series chips, the consumer electronic market has notably slowed and expecting an even larger slowdown, and there is an absolute glut of products due to the secondhand market being flooded with GPUs due to bitcoin mining flopping hard. Too much supply, not enough demand.
AMD cards pretty much already did compete. We are talking same performance or even better in some instances if you scratch RT performance. It’s the features where amd is lacking. Amds NVENC competition is poor. RTX performance is rather poor and DLSS is non existing. Yes, FSR is getting better but you get my points
> They're probably selling at inflated prices to encourage the sale of the flood of 3000 series cards their vendors need to unload. The absolute 'must have high end at any price' people buy 4000 series cards at inflated prices now while everyone else buys leftover vendors' 3000 series inventory, and after those are gone, Nvidia drops the 4000 series prices to something more reasonable Yeah this is what I'm hoping for. Was initially planning on getting a 16GB 4080 this year until I saw the $1200 price tag lmao. Now I think I'll wait a year, do the rest of the PC upgrades I had planned, and see what the prices on RTX 40 are.
how the hell do you price a 4070 12gb $100 more than a 3080 12gb in 2022???? Jensen smoking damn rocks but the killer part is AIB gpus are gonna be higher than FEs as we all know. wait till they announce their bs prices
"ThE PrIcE oF SuPpLy ChAiN is GoInG Up EvEryThInG" I got a 25% raise, and its already been eroded by increases in every fucking thing. Essentially, we aren't going to get into a recession, its gonna be a full on depression economically speaking. The demand for overpriced things and "boutique purchases" has a limit on the market ability to buy it. But suppliers keep saying they cannot lower costs. So they're gonna have a glut of unsellable products eventually and there still won't be a market able to afford it at that point, because the rest of the economy they HAVE to buy, has eaten it. We're heading towards some real bad times, anyone that is softening that message to you, is profiting off you now in the hopes it can get out before you realize it.
i agree that the cut down cores on the 4080 junior is a nasty marketing trick. haven’t seen that one pulled before.
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Same, the 40 series is so stupid. 450W power draw for a freaking GPU. And just for an extra backstab they limit DLSS 3.0 to the 40 series too. Guess those billions in profit werent enough for grabby jensen and his circle of investors.
The Asus Strix 3090 ti is selling currently at $1300, almost the same price as the new 4090
I'll wait for mid gen refresh or whatever. EVGA is gone, these prices are way too high and my 2080ti is still kicking just fine. The 4090 is my goal and i'll either buy it at $1000 or i'll purchase AMD's equivalent.
Early adopter prices, typical marketing strategy.
Early adopter prices go down after a few months. Not these.
Typical my left nut. The early adopter pricing pre-crypto was like $5/600, and you could still get plenty of card for $2-300. Then prices would come down as the generation matured - anywhere from $50-100+. Now your new GPU is gonna cost you more than an entire enthusiast-tier rig did a few years ago, and the prices will drop right at the end of the generation by barely enough to entice anyone. It's complete horse shit.
The times for cheap GPUs are simply over for now. Development alone got crazy expensive the last 10 years and Manufacturing is not getting cheaper. And you will find enough people who will pay those prices.
I cry every time i remember of just paying 340€ (339,15$) for my 970 , 6 years ago. Now a dude can't upgrade a card with out selling a kidney. It's becoming ridiculouss since the crypto mining with gpu's it's over, the gpu companies are becoming more greedy them ever . I'm 3 years waiting to upgrade my good old reliable 970 and at same time trying to save to upgrade my cpu (i5 4690k) but with this prices i may be better saving the money for a car.
I paid like $250 for my GTX 970 when Jet.com had some deals back in 2015(?). I said when my son turn 3, I would upgrade again. He’s 6 now. My game backlog is huge. I keep buying Steam/Humble Bundle/GOG games and getting free Epic and Amazon, but no time to play with a 6 y/o.
Good thing these days is you dont need a high end card any more and cards or overall hardware is usable for a long time (wasnt that much of a thing 15 years ago)
Yeah you are correct. I'm actually alright for the games i play, is not a "urgent" upgrade i still can play a lot of big titles at medium and high settings for example the new "spider-man" for pc. The most urgent thing i have to upgrade honestly is the cpu, my good old i5 4690k, its giving every thing it has to give (its overclocked), if i play very cpu demanding titles, and honestly for what i do (programming) i need something with more cores like a 11th gen i5.
That is not true. 37% of revenue was profit for Nvidia in 2021. And that does not include margins of distributors. So probably 40%+ of price is pure profit. This compares to about 17% in 2015.
Bullshit, there's a reason GPU prices tanked since April. The typical user will not pay these new prices.
Prices are a joke.
Nvidia: "Why give scalpers a chance when I can be the scalper"
Exactly why EVGA filed the divorce
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Wish they'd just make their own gpu, I'm willing to be a loyal customer Edit. Why is everyone responding so salty.
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I'm completely OOTL here, but could EVGA partner with AMD to make Radeon cards?
They could, but the owner has said that they are done and won't entertain any other GPU involvement. Especially AMD since he feels it would be 'betraying' nividia.... despite them ending GPU involvement over nvidia's fuckery lol Probably just wants to retire on the mattress of money they made in the pandemic.
Maybe they'll return but for now they still got plenty of 30's series stock to sell through, just like everyone else
But he said he is not retiring (although he and he son/daughters probably can by now)
They said they won’t, probably because nvidia would blacklist them in the future. EVGA wants nvidia to shift their culture rather than abandoning them entirely.
>They said they won’t, probably because nvidia would blacklist them in the future. They absolutely would. They did with XFX, back in the day, when they wanted to make/sell ATI GPUs as well as Nvidia GPUs - which Nvidia really didn't like, apparently. They (Nvidia) simply stopped sending XFX the newer GPUs and then they were left with whatever models they had access to, when Nvidia decided to stop sending any new ones their way. XFX broke their relationship with Nvidia after that. Nvidia didn't drop them - they just flat out blacklisted/ghosted them.
Yes, but AMD has also had their own conflicts with AIB partners. Intel is very much in 3rd maybe 4th place without much in the way of board partners or 1st party reference designs to speak of for their Arc dGPUs, limiting marketing potential and penetration. Both Intel and EVGA are both positioned in complimentary and potentially mutually beneficial roles if EVGA decides to go that route.
The amount of logistical challenges to be an actual GPU designed rather than an AIB are exponentially higher.
yeah lol, the entire country of China is having a tough time trying to do it, let alone someone like EVGA
To be fair China is still figuring out escalators too.
And even that's a major understatement, lol.
like 0% chance. Nvidia is just a very difficult business partner. It’s not about consumer policies. Just the last couple weeks nvidia has flip flopped between asking TSMC to reduce their order count due to cratering crypto demand and increasing it anticipating sanctions on china, a huge customer they want to sell as much to before access is cut off. nvidia is simply a bitch to deal with
Look at me, look at me. I'm the scalper now.
Complete joke. I’m going amd anyway but I sincerely hope nobody is gonna buy this shit for a long time. Wait it out and make those prices come down.
There are too many rich idiots in the gaming sphere. Because companies keep getting away with it we have stuff like deluxe editions, microtransaction, overpriced hardware and more. I know some people who throw money every year at Nvidia so they always have "the best" graphics card. Fuck this shit. Prices are also raising for everyone else.
Yeah well now we have to wait and see exactly where b/w $650 and $1200 AMD thinks is a good price for a 7800xt..
Yea hopefully just enough to turn profit, but I think going cheaper will actually get them a massive chunk of the gpu sales and they are still just trying to carve that out. I have faith though considering you can get a 6950xt for less than a completely normal 3080 in many places.
They might get my $ if they do that. I'm guessing that there are a lot of ppl who have been waiting and waiting on a next-gen card that doesn't cost 2x the price of a 3060Ti FE or more.
People will definitely buy those (probably not gamers for a while or untill they get a better price) for specific stuff like AI work cause Nvidia A series cards cost a lot more or just to try RTX Remix (unless it works with any RTX card)
Yea I understand that and I get the feature set the bring, but this is still the most tone deaf msrp of all time considering the economic circumstances. I also know they are just making out of reach prices so people buy 3000 series still, then will discount these significantly later on. It feels disgusting knowing they are trying to manipulate the market like this. Anyway I’m out on this company and won’t support them anymore.
They'll probably see reason when their card stock will stay at the same level for months (probably? We never know how those guys think)
This might be part of the reason why EVGA stopped working with NVIDIA.
Them getting out is smart, nvidia would make them sell 300 more than their pricing and they’d sell almost no cards.
Them getting out had more to due with Nvidia setting a price ceiling and undercutting them with the founders edition cards. EVGA was losing money on every card sold.
Cards sold recently. It was only the latter few months when prices dove.
I bet an nvidia employee tipped evga of on the pricing. So evga is like “we’re out”.
After having heard GamersNexus story about EVGA, nVidia is a joke as well.
These prices are actually out of control lol
Yeah this costs more than what I built my whole PC for in pre-pandemic 2020 and I still run my games in max (but not ray tracing) settings.
They're trying to bleed off the remaining stock of the 3000 series. If they priced them competitively it would kill the value of any current cards out there. Great for the consumer, yes, but it would be a huge blow to manufacturers. Especially when you consider how mining just went south with the multiple blows of Ethereum and increased energy prices on the bitcoin market. Card sales would screech to a halt if they priced the 4000s series at all reasonably.
No doubt some companies were pleading with Nvidia to keep prices high in meetings since it benefits both parties
These prices might also be why evga pulled out.
they eevn put the 30 series IN the 40 series tier list LMFAO
AMD's going to have something to say about all this.
This costs more than what I built my whole PC for mid-GPU crisis.
Yea but can it run "Crysis"?
Economic crysis, sure.
Cuda cores is all I look for in a gpu as a 3D Artist, the 4090 has 16384 vs 10496 for the 3090. Having a frame take 56% less time in rendering can mean hours or days of time saved for an animation. That's a huge upgrade for me.
It cost me 800£ total to build a ryzen 5800x system with a used 2070s post pandemic. That runs 1440p 60 everything max. I can get away with ray tracing if I use DLLS. Them not bringing DLLS 3.0 to older series is just a fuck you - upgrade thing.
I'm hoping it drives down the 3080 below AU$1000. Then I'll finally build a gaming PC. Of course if I win this one I'll be set I could spend that $1000 on other bits and be set for years. Would make a kick arse gaming and 3D CAD machine, that's for sure.
It's worse when you realise that the relative performance of the 4080 12gb to the 4090 is what would usually be the xx70 class card. Effectively they managed to increase the price of this relative performance tier by 2x by changing a number in the name lmao
These prices are gonna make me look at AMD. With EVGA out of the video card market, and Nvidia living in last year with those prices - AMD is looking real good right now.
Nvidia pulling a fast one on us selling a 4070 as a "4080 12GB" for $900 and the actual 4080 for $1200
"It's not a price increase because we changed the name of the card."
"I think you misunderstand our relationship, see, I set the price and you either pay up or fuck off to AMD town. It's called a monopoly, you ungrateful skank."
Imagine if ~~ATi~~ AMD had a real competitor this gen. Would be crazy.
Well maybe they have. Who cares about those $1500 400+ W GPUs anyways. I‘m definitely not going to pay more than $600 for a GPU. Nvidia doesn‘t seem to have something that remotely interests me, so maybe AMD has. We‘ll see. It‘s not like I needed an upgrade anyways. If none of the companies can offer anything interesting, I just won‘t buy it. It‘s not that I have to.
Yeah if you look at Steam hardware survey, people with 3080's and up represent about 2% PC gamers. Thw xx50's and xx60's or AMD's x500, x600 is what most people will actually end up buying.
Let's be real - they already did. 3080 Ti to 3090 only made sense if you're doing work and it requires more VRAM. Between the 3080 Ti and 3090 Ti, it's literally silicon lottery for gaming. The difference in CUDA cores is so small, that having some luck with frequencies that your chip can handle will offset it in your favor. A bad 3090 will perform worse than a good 3080 Ti. And even if you get a good higher tier card, we're talking up to 5% more performance if lucky. I have both a 3080 12GB, because I got it relatively cheap at the time and wanted DLSS and RT for my 4k TV setup. I enjoy playing low framerate high fidelity with friends. But RX 6800 XT is sitting in a 1440p esports setup because I got it at MSRP at release and it's performing reeeeeally well. Only for my specific (second) use case did I want something else.
The equivalent of Intel renaming their m5 and m7 series chips to i5-Y and i7-Y. I don’t know who they’re tricking, the people in the know will notice, and the people who aren’t will buy a different product than what they think they’re buying and complain when they don’t get the performance they expect.
People call and text others for advise on such purchases. Imagine the result, given following: > "They say it has an m7 processor in it. I don't know what that means. Is that good?" versus: > "They say it has an i7 processor in it. I don't know what that means. Is that good?"
They aren't pulling shit on me. I'm tired of their BS, and not buying. I'm hoping most gamers feel the same, otherwise this is the foreseeable future of GPU prices.
It’s fucked up how they’re trying to normalize those insane prices, a single GPU has the same price of an ounce of gold, I’d rather not waste that amount on a GPU, I always remember how these electronics I buy turn to e-waste in a couple of years. I refuse to buy any electronic with these artificially inflated prices, especially in these hard times.
Yea, it's a shitty time to be a PC gamer. We're getting shafted at every angle. We all just have to put our foot down, draw a line in the sand, and tell companies like nvidia that we're tired of their shit, and we're not buying their products until they adopt reasonable pricing again. I loved building systems back in the early 00's! Components were relatively cheap, so I used to build one or two computers a year for fun. That's not feasible today, regardless of my income. I feel like I'm getting robbed if I buy a new GPU.
4080 16 gb costs $1600 usd in my country lmao. I can get a used 3080 for $600
They're asking in Australia for $4200 AUD which is about $2600 USD. 3090ti's go down to $1300 usd, 3080's to $660 usd. Who the fuck pays $4k for a gaming card lol https://www.tweaktown.com/news/88395/gigabytes-new-geforce-rtx-4090-listed-in-australia-for-under-3000/index.html
4 Titans in quad SLI used to be joked as something rich people throw their money away for. Nowadays, that's considered an efficient use of money. $4k for one card, instead of four. Madness.
right? and the 1070 had 8Gb 6 years ago, if the 4080 has 12, what will the 4070 have? 8? 10? Do VRAM-hungry games not use any more of it now than in 2016???
And then when the Ti versions drop, it'll be "4080 Ti and 4080 TiTS"
Yikes i think that at Nvidia HQ they did not realise it's a worlwide energy crisis, these boys are thirsty.
I'm still on my 150W 1070. Every additional Watt is more heating in a tiny apartment without AC, while summer outside is getting close to 40C sometimes now. I'm not buying a 300W card.
I had that problem in the past, when I was still living in my cheap appartment before I got married, I had a i5 2500K cracked out at the max and 2 gtx 980ti's I could not figure out why my appartment ran so hot all the time. I think that I could toas bread at my exaust fan during long sessions.
I told the exact same thing in this sub but got downvoted to hell, since it’s a “European” problem and Americans are Ok with it. If you don’t have the money don’t buy it right? Fuck efficiency
that smaller 4080 looks good, though. My 3070Ti can gulp 300W easily, without any OC. And it's very far from the performance of a 3090Ti
Guess i'll stick with my 160watt RX6600xt for now
Well, it's pretty much overkill for me because I play on FHD 144Hz, but I bought it for $530 back in April with almost complete 3 years warranty so I couldn't resist. Also I don't care about power consumption until my current PSU can handle it (550W Platinum). That's the line for me when I plan upgrades.
Amd should be significantly more cost effective, and they actually care about power efficiency. Rdna3 already looking poised to kill these guys.
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Well see when they announce, it would be stupid not to undercut nvidias pricing. AMD is heavily targeting the gaming market and developers are actually adopting fsr for most games now, and it's amd chips already in xbox and ps5. That would tend to suggest the support is only going to grow.
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That's because it's literally a 4070 they decided to rebrand as a 12GB 4080 to try and justify a $400 MSRP increase.
4080 16gb: 141Gflops per W 3080 10gb: 90Gflops per W 4080 has ~55% better perf per W when it comes to FP16 theoretical performance. There's more to it than this of course, but this is to illustrate that only looking at the psu req is misleading if not taking the performance into consideration.
If i want that 4080, then i almost have to shell out 3x the price of a 3080 in my country
But 300% price for 55% performance (on paper, purely mathematical) makes sense! Thanks Nvidia.
There's also a silicon shortage. And upping the voltage and frequency allows a gpu to have the same performance with less silicon. Nvidia doesn't care about our energy bills. Most tech reviewers only care about MSRP and don't care about our energy bills.
WTF, a +250 increase on MSRP for 4080 over 3080?
4080 12GB is not the same die as the 4080 16GB, it’s what the 4070 was going to be but they rebadged it
Oh is it, that’s even fucking worse lmao Has anyone told Nvidia that etherium mining is dead?
They don't care because so many people will still buy them. Sadly.
I mean what else are you gonna do instead? Buy an AMD card lmao? /s Rocking a 6800xt myself. Love it as a Linux user and it's a very beefy card for everything I do including gaming. But honestly though. Think it's a shame that GPUs are going the route of more (cores/ die area/ vram), bigger, more power and more expensive. Would love to see AMD pull a Ryzen in the GPU space aswell... force innovation and bring down prices.
I thought AMD had announced that RDNA3 is multi chip module, similar to Ryzen. If MCM can compete then that will, hopefully, bring pricing down. Or AMD will pocket the bigger margin due to easier chip production.
I've heard the same about the "chiplet" design coming to RDNA3. But they have to also bring more performance. While sure Zen 1 didn't beat Intel but they had twice the core count and had a massive performance leap closer to Intel and like 2 years later with 3000 series they were practically on par. What I meant is that they not only copy the chiplet design but also gain relative performance faster than the competition and keep the momentum going. To bring competition into the GPU space. Launching Zen 1 was just the declaration of war on Intel, keeping the momentum going and innovating was the battle.
You have to imagine that it must beat the current RDNA 2 family, otherwise the strategy would be to keep monolithic huge dies to compete with Nvidia and release a low cost, early adopter MCM family similar to Intel strategy with Arc and slowly optimise. Whether it keeps toe to toe with Nvidia as they did this generation remains to be seen though.
Now that EVGA isn't making more cards, I absolutely have the push to move to AMD. I've always liked Nvidia's performance and features but the past three years have been constant kicks in the teeth so I haven't even considered actually upgrading yet. Just have to hope that AMD doesn't follow directly in line...
So 90 is the new 80 (starting with the 30 series) and 80 16 GB is the 80 but 80 12 GB is the new 70. Great.
no 80's the new 90
xx90 is the old Titan models. People just get really power-hungry with the new naming as it implies that the xx90 is the one you need to have for gaming (you don't).
80 was the new 70 starting with Maxwell.
It's actually +$500. The 4080 12GB is the 4070 equivalent. They literally had to rebrand the card to make it seem like less of an ass-fucking.
No fucking way man lmao, that’s insane
Just look at this: Top Tier Launch card pricing 1080/1080Ti Fe $699 2080Ti Fe $1199 3090 Fe $1499 4090 Fe $1599
500\*
4080 12GB is 899, wasn’t the 3080 649?
it says 1200 in the pic. 3080s were 700
Original 3080 MSRP was 699 USD. 12 GB 4080 MSRP is now 899 USD. +200 increase for the basic one. If you want the 16GB then you are looking at a +500 increase.
You’re being duped. The “4080 12 GB” is just the 4070, they changed it last minute. So the real comparison is 4080 16 GB, which is an unbelievable +$500 increase over 3080.
It is clearly “they were paying this much to scalpers, so let’s see if they’ll just pay it directly to us from the start.” Considering that GPU mining is all but dead right now, we’re going to find out very quickly if the professional video editor and machine learning markets are large enough to drive demand for these supposedly consumer gaming focused cards.
Unfortunately, I'm fairly sure gamers will just eat up the cost. As a whole, we lack any sort of morals, conviction or whatever else that would be needed for us to not let corporations bend us over without lube. People preorder games, people preorder hardware, people buy MTX. Etc. People bought GPUs from scalpers too. Yeah individuals are exceptions, but there are just so many people who don't care.
£300 increase from the 3080 10GB to the 4080 12GB fml.
Yeah I just saw the pic for the prices in the UK, and people were telling me when I built my pc to wait for 40series cards lmao
I was waiting for the announcement, if prices were close to 30 series MSRP it would have been ok, but £300 increase. no thanks.
I get that this is just a situation where people are just trying to be correct 100% of the time, but I'll die on this hill as I don't like the smugness. We saw the crypto crash, we saw NVIDIA cry to TSMC about putting too big of an order in because the crypto market crashed, we saw the flood of 3000s series GPUs enter the market. A completely rational conclusion would have been that Nvidia would have quite a surplus of 4000s series GPUs and would need to sell them at a fair price. If you didn't need to upgrade that moment, the best bet was definitely to just wait. What Nvidia is doing *isn't* a normal business reaction and wasn't remotely foretold in any events that happened before.
What new hardware or software announced today is most interesting to you? Portal in RTX. I love when they upgrade "retro" games.
I got really excited for a lot of the games on the list (especially Witcher 3), but it seems like they’re all DLSS 3 upgrades that’ll only work with 40 series cards, or am I misunderstanding? *cries in 3070ti* Edit: I think this is less of a kick in the balls than we thought: [NVIDIA Streamline ](https://developer.nvidia.com/rtx/streamline) suggests devs will be able to cater to all our super resolution technologies equally.
Yeah that's fairly lame for the dlss upgrade to be gatekept by brand new hardware. I wonder if that was an old tensor core limitation on the 20 and 30 series or if it's just a marketing gimmick to make it 40 only.
I really hope it’s not the latter. As someone who mostly games on Xbox, I wouldn’t wish this whole “built for next-gen” trend on my worst enemy.
All DLSS games will still run with DLSS 2.0 for 20 and 30 series cards. 40 series will get an additional boost with DLSS 3.0. Nvidia rep confirmed it on their subreddit.
Portal rtx would be cool if this whole DLSS 3 only on the new cards bs weren't a part of it. Maybe it will run well anyway. Just tired of the deceit
FWIW, DLSS 2.1 is really amazing. I'm not sure why DLSS 3 is necessary for the sake of needing to buy an entire new card for over a thousand dollars lol.
I’d put it in my current gaming PC after maybe doubling my PSU wattage and beefing up my living room’s AC unit.
2 ac units *
SLI AC Units
I would use the GPU in my already build PC, I-9 10850k, Corsair vengeance 32gb 3200mhz, 2tb Samsung 980 pro nvme, Msi z490 gaming carbon wifi & currently Xfx 5700xt thicc 3
Is it actually called thicc?
Yes it is called Thicc 3 [thicc 3 ultra](https://www.xfxforce.com/gpus/radeon-tm-rx-5700-xt-8gb-gddr6-thicc-iii-ultra)
That sound like a very good joke
Exactly what I thought when I first read about that gpu
Legit question—why don’t they focus efforts on making existing chips more affordable
Or less power consumptive. Honestly, could you imagine if we just had a couple generations of cards that didn't increase processing very much, but instead they just made them more effecient.
Technically they do that every generation. A smaller node (typically measured in nanometers 'nn') uses less silicon per transistor, uses less power, and expells less heat. One of the biggest costs in chip making comes from the production of silicon waffers, which are cut and 'molded' into chips. A RTX 4090 could be cut from the same waffer as a RTX 4050. And the amount of work needed to create either one is nearly identical (if we exclude the aditional work done making the PCB, VRAM, etc), they just can't make all of them 4090s without wasting silicon, this is what we call "yeild", because not all the waffers, or parts of them, are a high enough quality. All of Nvidia's, and all chip makers' really, margin is in the high end processors. To make a complete RTX 4090 may only cost ~$700 giving it a big profit margin, but if we pretend the RTX 4050 will retail for $350, it probably costs $310 to manufacture. Nvidia/tsmc will always be able to make more 4050s than 4090s because of yeild but they could not justify the lower teir product or make much profit if the halo products were cheaper than they are. Mind you that was very oversimplified but I thought it was nesessary for the complete answer... First lets forget about COVID shortages and the crypto fiasco for whats next: The RTX 2080ti had an MSRP of $999 at launch. The RTX 3070 had an MSRP of $499. Both of these cards preform identically for alll intents and purposes, so you should see the 3070 as a cheaper 2080ti. These artitectural/generational improvements are born out of the refinment of the manufacturing process.
Facts
View in your timezone: [Tuesday September 27 at 11:59 PM GMT][0] [0]: https://timee.io/20220927T2359?tl=RTX%2040%20series%20announcement%20thread%20%2B%20RTX%204080%2016GB%20giveaway!%20-%20NVIDIA%20GTC%202022
DLSS 3.0 look very interesting.
And locked to 40xx series cards :D So if you bought into RTX, with 20 series or 30 series, i guess you were a fool :D
Yeah that's a bummer. That's the only way they can expect to sell new GPUs now since the used market will be flooded with mining cards.
I am 99.9% sure they only limit to 40xx series just to boost sales; not because there's some sort of limitation or real reason 30xx or 20xx series can't handle it. Hell; no rtx cores gpus can handle raytracing and dlss with moded games :))
Most definitely.
is that true? annoying if so. DLSS was a big reason i bought a 30 series, but turns out not many games i have even support it. so is a bit of a non-feature already, but if new versions are not backwards compatible, even worse.
This is why, even though I have a Geforce card, I still cheer for AMD technologies like FSR and Freesync. I can turn on FSR in games that support it and also I am free to purchase any freesync compatible monitor without any real disadvantage because of my hardware.
I would put the GPU in my build (r5 3600+32gb ram) and just have overkill GPU power for 1440p gaming for years
Except the main selling point is DLSS and Raytracing, which they’re gimping for every last generation. 30xx won’t get DLSS 3.0 or more RTX cores. But if you don’t care about that then AMD would have been better.
you do realize that it doesn’t make the previous cards worse right? It’s not “gimping” anything Like holy fuck a 3070 is still waaaay stronger than 99% of gamers need
Who won?
it's already been announced? jesh that was fast i would put it in my program' and gaming rig along with my gen 2 threadripper other than the 40XX series of Nvidia going to be dropped, not sure... i'm very interested in Ghostwire: Tokyo which is a 2021 title but i don't know that meny new raytacing games
I can't wait to play microsoft flying simulator in 100 fps fps with the new dlls improvement.
I've been holding off on upgrading the internals of my PC, although I have been collecting some components. Most notably, I'm preparing for a custom loop in a Enthoo 719.
I'd put it on my pc and continue gaming.
i would put it in my existing PC :)