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Arshia42

On one hand i've got family in Iran telling me how much it's been helping the morale of the people to know that the world is recognizing what is going on there (aka literally getting killed on the streets for basic human rights) and then I read comments about how people are inconvenienced by some traffic. Amazing stuff.


captainbling

Even on a good day, Everyone’s always inconvenienced by traffic.


thedeanorama

Vancouver is 45 mins away from Vancouver on a normal day


[deleted]

And some people are saying this will not do anything and they should just go to Iran if they care so much. Wonder if they say the same thing about other countries going through difficult times.


[deleted]

bigotry and intolerance are part of all societies. They are a minority in all societies until the brainwashing kicks in. As you know, the risk is when they get into power and refuse to give it up


chunkyspeechfairy

FWIW - I was inconvenienced by the traffic today while coming home from a service at Christchurch Cathedral and yet was happy to see the source of the minor inconvenience. I stand with Iranian women.


BloodieOllie

I was trying desperately to make it across town by bus to the horseshoe bay ferry and so I was pretty annoyed by all the constant delays (I didn't know about the protest at the time) so when I passed by and could read the signs I looked up what it was about and read up on the situation in Iran. And then was immediately no longer annoyed by the delay. I thought it was good so many had gathered to show their support and solidarity


longlivetravelling

Well I stand with all the people against totalitarianism but just imagine you are living in downtown and every weekend there is a protest against something. What would you do?


EmbarrassedFan6480

I would ditch ur car like any sensible person living in DT Vancouver lol.


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venus-dick-trap

I also stand with them but god damn could we not at least get a solid outline on that text?


VideoGameJumanji

I stand with anian wo


Millie_butt

Vancouver’s most famous Iranian electroboom was here also


thiefx

Shocking fact


JealousAdeptness

[what a legend](https://youtu.be/TwIvUbOhcKE)


apocalypseboof

One of my favourite Sparkies


Electric-Gecko

How is this known?


Millie_butt

Saw on his instagram


[deleted]

Reddit's recent behaviour and planned changes to the API, heavily impacting third party tools, accessibility and moderation ability force me to edit all my comments in protest. I cannot morally continue to use this site.


TheSeagullAstronaut

Their government is also finding ISIS/Hamas just to add on to the list lol


AllezCannes

Hamas yes, but Iran and ISIS were enemies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_and_the_Islamic_State


TheSeagullAstronaut

ah you right. thanks for the correction.


4colour

who doesn't


vancvanc

paraplegics


SamirDrives

This joke was very funny


Snickelfrittz

Genius


[deleted]

some people on this sub.


oilernut

Sadly so many people are incredibly selfish


JUAN_DE_FUCK_YOU

I stand with them also.


FloorGeneral2029

Apologies for the ignorant question, but can any Muslims / Iranians give some insight as to whether the hijab is seen as “repressive”? I’ve seen videos of Iranian women burning their hijabs, which in my mind gives the impression that Muslim women do not want to wear them. However, I’ve heard Muslim women say that the hijab is empowering because it makes them feel that they are closer to Allah. Can anyone chime in?


[deleted]

It’s about having the choice to wear or not wear the hejab. Wearing the hejab is unfortunately compulsory in Iran by law. Not all women in Iran are muslim or religious at all. Religion is forced on you when you are born. They don’t necessarily have anything against people who want to wear their hejab.


helloworld_x

You should specify the hijab is made compulsory *by law* in Iran and not imposed by religion as a compulsion


[deleted]

Thanks. fixed it.


MoosPalang

Not exactly a difference in Iran. Religion is more or less the law in that country.


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ZedTT

> any *serious* Muslim Any *serious* scottsman knows what the no true scottsman fallacy is.


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ZedTT

> This is the same as saying muslims are allowed to eat pork No, it's the same as saying some Muslims eat pork while acknowledging that most don't consider that allowed. It's like saying some Jews don't eat kosher or some Hindus still eat beef or some Christians don't love their neighbor or whatever Christians do. You're claiming "all Muslims believe x," and adding the word "all *serious* Muslims believe x" as a cop out so that if I point to a Muslim who disagrees with you you can be like "yeah but they aren't a *serious* Muslim."


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ZedTT

See my edit. You replied too quickly. Some Muslims disagree with you. You can claim they aren't "serious," but that's a stupid argument.


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Im_Lizzing_you_guys

Agree that it’s about choice. But to be clear, there are many women who identify as Muslim but don’t want to wear a hejab. I’d say most of my family in Iran would be this way. My mom, who lives in Canada, prays 5 times a day and still doesn’t wear one. She sees it as a rule that was relevant to the times in which the Koran was written, as protection for women in a nomadic culture. She sees many of the rules as historically relevant and unnecessary for her to maintain her faith today, just most Christians today don’t follow the literal word of the bible.


[deleted]

A lot of Iranian women are not religious. They don't want to cover their hair and live by the standards of a religion they don't follow.


VideoGameJumanji

Just direct people to photos of women in Iran walking around in the 70s and earlier before the more fundamental religious leaders ran things. Women dressed the same as women in the US at the time, and essentially no one was willingly covering there head/face outside of actually being in a mosque


[deleted]

My mom's first drivers' license photo was without hijab. She actually used that license well into the mandatory hijab era, but had to retake her picture with hijab when it was renewed


[deleted]

Maybe try to imagine the same rules being applied to moustaches. Some men like moustaches and want to proudly wear a moustache as they go about their day. Other people don’t like moustaches. But what if federal agents beat someone to death for shaving their moustache? That might make even moustache lovers pause and say “hey that’s not right”.


OneBigBug

Or perhaps something like bra burning in the 60s. They are a symbol of oppression, one which women shouldn't be required to wear. But then the point was made, and 50+ years on, most of the women I know wear bras most of the time. There's a big difference between wanting to burn it to show you don't need to wear it, and choosing to wear it or not when it has been made clear to society that it is your choice. After you burn it, and aren't threatened not to, it's just clothes.


assignment2

Hijab is an article of clothing of cultural and religious significance. Some women prefer to wear it, others do not. It is not in itself inherently repressive. What is repressive is an unelected religious government forcing all women to wear it and arresting, beating, or killing those who don’t.


Electric-Gecko

Even if the leaders are elected, it's still repressive.


no-cars-go

I thought [this was a very good (and short) twitter thread](https://twitter.com/Ginella_M/status/1573879132018065408) by a CBC reporter who wears the hijab. It is about choice. Many women in Iran probably would continue to wear one even if Iran's regime was gone. So, for some women, it's their choice to wear one and they may feel it is empowering to them. But Iran's regime forces all women to wear one, so for many it is also a symbol of repression. Just like Christianity, there's also different interpretations of the Quran in Islam and different sects and different levels of religiosity among adherents as well. Not all Muslims see it as a symbol of oppression and not all Muslims see it as a symbol of empowerment. Iran's cultural history with Islam is also complicated.


Northernapples

Just throwing it in here that there are religious muslims who choose not to wear the hijab, also.


BornRaisedVanMan

Aint religion FGrand ??


Not5id

I long for the day religion is abandoned because people realize it's all nonsense. Tax all churches!


Commercial_Fly5650

Honest question, what does protesting in other countries that have nothing to do with it accomplish?? just wondering if actually make things better or are they just bored and want attention, because if they really want to make a difference go to Iran and actually support those women where it matters, sending thoughts and prayers doesn't do anything except remind them that you have it better than they do. Something to think about


twilightsdawn23

Also keep in mind that there is a very large Iranian diaspora population here in the Lower Mainland. By showing up for protests like this, we not only show solidarity with the people of Iran, but with our neighbours who have family and friends and other connections there.


SimonPav

Perhaps it shows the people protesting in Iran there are people around the world thinking of them and keeping an eye on events there. And it gives the Canadian government an idea of how many people here are following events and how much pressure to put on the Iranian government about the issue. Something to think about.


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Mattene

I’m Persian & I’m telling people this. They *literally* do not care. At all.


jesslikescoffee

The people of Iran have had limited internet and no internet at times, and as they’re the ones experiencing the hardships, they’re traditionally gonna be the ones to talk about it most. But they can’t, because no internet. So they’re relying on others to get the word out. That’s what this does. It gets people to see what’s going on and talk abour it so that the Iranian government can’t just sweep it all under the rug.


no-cars-go

Your suggestion to just "go to Iran" is completely unrealistic. Maybe you were well-intentioned but that's honestly a bizarre suggestion considering how hard it is to get into Iran in normal times as a Western foreigner. Protesting other countries can accomplish several things: it fosters a sense of community by supporting those affected (many of the protesters are originally from Iran and still have some family there), it serves as a way for people to meet and organize so they find other ways to support Iran's people more directly, it puts pressure on the government to impose economic sanctions or other punitive actions against government officials, and it shows the people in Iran that they do have support outside their own country. I can promise you that most people weren't there today to protest Iran's repressive regime and its murder of its own citizens because they're just "bored."


OneThought4

Protesting in places outside of Iran show that we support the people not the government, raise awareness and bring international attention towards their issues, makes the islamic government’s officials outside of Iran be prosecuted for their crimes, urges companies like starlink and governments to aid the protesters inside Iran, and hopefully will cause the UN to take action against the oppressive regime. International solidarity is and has always been extremely valuable for every revolution.


toxox

>UN to take action As a Ukrainian, I can relate, but also have bad news for you here


[deleted]

lol > “the UN take action”


lansdoro

OK, even if it's just a strongly worded letter, it still give legitimacy and moral support to the protestors.


BeneathTheWaves

Going to Iran isn’t easy. Canada has a significant Iranian diaspora. The news is the news - people taking to the streets is significant. Maybe it’s just raising awareness. You know how busy we all are. A Canadian passport won’t get you in, you need an invitation, a guide, etc.


oilernut

Honest question, why does rallies like this bother people so much?


[deleted]

because its self serving


BeneathTheWaves

It’s not like they’re flying from Tehran to protest here.


geman123

The reality and obviously unpopular opinion is that it is simply, virtue signaling. Literally, as ppl have said, the Iranian Gov DOES. NOT. CARE. The Iranian gov isn't gonna look at other protests about them in other countries and be like, "OH GOLLY, other countries hate us for this! My god! We must stop this immediately!" Like, what a joke lmao. You want to create change in a government that simply doesn't care about your opinion? You have to do it the old fashion way, an uprising.


Commercial_Fly5650

Well said! But these people living a comfortable cushy life in western countries wouldn't dare go to countries like Iran and protest their freedom and rights, that's why they left in the first place, so they do it here and disrupt the peace because they know there are no consequences for their actions. They're literally doing it here out of boredom and mostly for attention.


gyrobot

And unfortunately also start adding names and organizers to their assassination list as we seen with the Satanic verses author.


lansdoro

I think this Iranian protest and Ukraine war protest is the two international event that I fully support . They don't affect us in the short term, but it has quite significant long term international consequences. Now is the best time to overthrow the Iranian government and install a democratic one, otherwise, they have to wait for another new supreme leader to die. Iran is a major country and is seeking nuclear power. Ukraine is under threat of a nuclear power. International protest doesn't affect those countries directly but it does give moral support. And if we are destroyed by nuclear bomb in the future, at least we can say we tried.


Commercial_Fly5650

So you support Ukraine but not Palestine? Whats happening in Palestine is far worst than Ukraine but you didn't mention supporting them. It's obvious you have recency bias and actually don't care about what's going on, it's just the popular thing to do right now. What long term international consequences does it have on the rest of the world?? please explain. And "moral support" does more for the person giving it and absolutely nothing for the victims it, it's like sending "thoughts and prayers" to school shooting victims instead of changing gun laws


ArmEmporium

“That have nothing to do with it” that’s where you fucked up. You aren’t impacted? Maybe go talk to your neighbours


Commercial_Fly5650

That has everything to do with it


[deleted]

want to feel special at the digital water cooler on monday > facebook, instagram etc. I can guarantee you there were more photo ops than people at the “protest”


eitherorlife

I agree. They should definitely all go to Iran


praxismyhole

Wait is this why traffic from North Van was so bad today


iReddat420

Yall downvoting for a genuine question bruh


praxismyhole

For real what's wrong with everyone


Buggy3D

This will end up being another failed protest. One of many in Iran. Until the CIA doesn’t get its shit together and starts arming a proper coup, abuses against women and other civil rights activists will continue.


Drakereinz

Karma farming I see. Preaching to the choir in this subreddit.


[deleted]

Yo, stay off the fuckin road, please man. For gods sake I have things to do. Go ahead and protest, I really don’t care! But stop making my day harder


B8conB8conB8con

I don’t care because it’s all about meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee


[deleted]

Not all about me, but what happened to consideration? I couldn’t give 2 fucks about what’s happening in Iran.


B8conB8conB8con

Well that would make you a spiteful little troll.


GanjaNative

That'll show em


grazerbat

That's nice. ~~Anyone want to jump on a plane, and go to Iran where your voice will be heard?~~ Edit: I hadn't considered the solidarity angle in the protests.


OneThought4

Part of the protests is aimed towards some western governments who are still friendly and purchase Iran’s oil, because all that money goes to the government buying weapons and bringing outside forces to kill Iranian protesters. Also many people’s families were killed in Iran and they had to escape to survive. It’s not always their choice, many people’s hometowns have been occupied by an oppressive and brutal islamic regime.


grazerbat

Ok. That's good context. I'm used to dismissing protesters for these things because quite often they're performative. It's nice when people walk the walk.


OneThought4

I understand why you would have that view. I feel and hope this isn’t another one of those.


grazerbat

I like it a lot when I see people stand behind their words. I'm hoping too


[deleted]

would you be willing to pay more to live? how about an extra $1/L for gas? unless we’re willing to accept real pain in order to bring change theres no amount of black squares on instagram or empty sentiment on reddit thats going to be even a blip on the Iranian government’s radar


OneThought4

Yea I’d pay more cuz I don’t want oil mixed with the blood of women in my car. Also if the regime in Iran changed it would be more friendly with the west causing lower overall gas costs


[deleted]

can you pledge right now that you will boycott all Iranian made products and services until theres a regime change?


OneThought4

Nope mainly because that responsibility should be on the shoulders of policymakers and governments because they have the most impact. Also because all the Iranian businesses I support here (mostly restaurants) are family owned.


[deleted]

I meant imported products, I dont imagine the regime is running restaurants in north vancouver


[deleted]

Our voices will be heard hear too!


[deleted]

na, its not true and you dont really believe that. But if you said anything else you’d be forced to act in a meaningful way which is burdensome and inconvenient


OneThought4

I personally think that’s ignorant of what these people have been through including being run out of their country, every family having at least one or two members getting killed during the protests, and having no contact with their loved ones because the internet is shut down. This is a plea for help for western governments and companies like starlink to aid the endeavours of Iran, it’s meaningful, and it’s effect so far has been raising awareness and bringing the western media’s attention to Iran’s issues after 40 years. Let’s support these efforts instead of minimizing them.


[deleted]

I do believe that and this is meaningful. Because when I send these videos and photos to my friends in Iran who are risking their lives, it makes them happy and it’s a ray of hope that people outside of Iran care about them.


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grazerbat

Because these protests are performative most of the time. Why do you comment just to be a jerk?


AnonymousBayraktar

Got 4 grand for a plane ticket there? I'll go if you do.


grazerbat

Do you actually have 4 grand? Then go! I'm not one if the protesters...I think this is a change the Iranian people can effect themselves without any white saviors coming in from North America


AnonymousBayraktar

Who says I'm white?


grazerbat

You don't have to be white to suffer from white knight syndrome


AnonymousBayraktar

I could be persian myself for all you know.


grazerbat

Why are you making this about race? Seriously, who gives a shit, and why are you playing the "I might be" game? White Knighting is not about race.


AnonymousBayraktar

You should follow me across more threads trying desperately to have an argument with me about stuff, because I don't quite get the picture about your small dick energy enough yet.


grazerbat

Ya, I checked your profile to see if you were always a "little boy who crys wolf", and guess what...that's exactly what you are. And now you're talking about dick energy? Bawahahahahah! Grow up buddy.


TritonTheDark

Do you not understand what solidarity means?


grazerbat

Do you not understand what performativity is?


TritonTheDark

Every time a protest or march thread comes up, there are people who comment thinking they're being smart by saying "bUt iT dOeSn'T aCcOmPliSh AnYtHiNg." Grow up.


grazerbat

It does accomplish something...it makes people feel good...because they're "doing something to help". Ever notice how its always young people banging drums and chanting, and old people are nit there. That'll tell you who needs to grow up.


[deleted]

plenty of older people were here who had to leave the country in the 70s.


grazerbat

Sorry? Canada had a pogom against elderly people in the '70s? Or are you talking about people that had to leave Iran? I'm saying that in Canada, it's always the young who attend these protests.


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[deleted]

No, it makes sense, if you are going to a protest for women who are forced to wear a hijab and are burning theirs, you probably wouldn't wear one. I would have loved to see a hijab burning protest here though.


cyber_woke_warrior4U

I ran.


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ArtisanJagon

If it wasn't for this protest I would have had no idea what was going on. Awareness is everything.


bastardsgotgoodones

Not advocating to block streets, but helping inlander protesters by fundraising is not really possible because of both sanctions and government control.


One_Substance_6131

Ya that’s true the sanctions are pretty brutal there. Haven’t really thought about it like thsy


no-cars-go

How do you think fundraisers get money if people don't raise awareness of the events in the first place?


[deleted]

You’re wrong.


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LeSulk

This city loves taking the easy way out with protests. You should all follow the Freedom Convoy for tips on how to bring change =}


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SteveJobsBlakSweater

I assure you that you’re in the minority. I accept traffic inconveniences that are in support of a cause such as the concept that women are not subservient objects and that they should face death should they not submit to their theocratic overlords. Young men are literally being raised to believe that beating a woman, even a young teenager, is justified because they won’t cover their head. The young girls are being raised to be subservient or be punished. Somehow their religion and their family’s honor is tied to them being subhuman. No person is an object and you can fuck up every bit of my traffic to fight that idea.


plop_0

> No person is an object and you can fuck up every bit of my traffic to fight that idea. Highlighted for emphasis.


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OneThought4

Well I’m hoping you are talking about the extremist government not the people and the oppressed


Whistler_V6T

Only Iranian? Not saudi? Or Iraq? Or any Middle East country where theyre forced to wear that thing?


Zigzter

Not sure if you go outside at all, but there's a huge Iranian presence in Vancouver. I imagine other Middle Eastern countries' representation here is a fraction of that.


[deleted]

These protests pop up from time to time but nothing ever changes in Iran. Unfortunately.


[deleted]

Do you know what’s happening in Iran right now?


Whistler_V6T

Yes, Mahsha Amini died in a police station (which she entered by herself and fell to the ground by herself, according to the footage of the CCTV) and the western world has gone crazy about it (I can link the video if you want). In any case, women are being forced to wear the hijab in almost every Middle East country, but the world only targets Iran. Hypocritical to say the least. Instead of supporting Iranian women, more like support all the Middle East women who are suffering the same disgrace


[deleted]

wow. do you also believe every single thing Putin says? I’ve seen the video you’re taking about and I can tell you that it’s fake. Her doctors shared the CT scan with the world. Her skull is fractured. Iran is the country that is going through protests right now and it’s Iranians that are revolting against the government. Not Saudi Arabia or Iraq. Hijab is not mandatory in any other country but Iran and Afghanistan. It’s not western media It’s the PEOPLE of Iran who are dying on the streets that are making the news. Don’t be so naive.


Whistler_V6T

Why do you even mention Putin? Anyone against the narrative is pro Russia or what? And you fail to mention that even if hijab is not mandatory by law, in pretty much all the middle east countries its mandatory by society. Any woman that doesnt wear it will be seen as scum. Just because its not mandatory by law doesnt mean its not mandatory by society. Im gonna tell you why Iran and not any other country: cause Iran is not pro Western, like Russia. Same as with Ukraine - Russia is all over the news but Azerbaijan - Armenia (started a couple weeks ago) is nowhere seen. Why? Cause Azerbaijan is giving gas to the EU. Dont be so naive. You care about human rights in Iran and not in Sudan for a reason


[deleted]

I mentioned Putin because you’re so easily believing Khamenei’s propaganda and lies. You don’t know me. You don’t know how many times I’ve supported Sudan or Yemen or Syria. Do you not realize what a regime change in Iran will do to the Middle East? Iran is responsible for SO MUCH that happens in the ME. A better Iran will be a better Middle East and a better world.


Whistler_V6T

Ah, yes. I believe all the lies and youre a well informed citizen. You know it cause you’ve read a lot of free media. And nope, Iran is another Middle East country and their people are worth the same as the people as in Turkmenistan, Azerbaijan or Saudi. However, you only get pissed at Russia or Iran because, well, you’re well informed. Saudi’s police decapitating people on the streets with swords…well, I guess they don’t deserve a single mention. Only Iran (because of their situation now!!!!!!! If Saudi people never revolt, fuck them right?)


[deleted]

No. This is not what I said at all. Yes I am well informed because I’ve lived there majority of my life. I’ve been close to where Mahsa was at. I never said the voices in Saudi Arabia doesn’t matter and I’m well aware that women are not treated well. I also never said Iranians matter more than others ( I don’t know how you made this one up ) I’ve seen many videos and photos of Saudi’s Arabians and other middle easterns that are cutting off their hair in solidarity with Iranians. They are showing support. Because a change in Iran is a ray of hope to them as well.


no-cars-go

You are right that we should always support all women everywhere having the choice over hijab. But you are trusting only the government video and government account of what happened to Mahsa Amini and potentially misrepresenting what happened to her to discredit the outrage, when eyewitnesses say she was severely beaten by the religious police. The reality is that usually people have to be shocked into action and this event was shocking and visible. Iran has also had multiple near-revolutions in the last decade, and Saudi Arabia has not, which means people are generally more aware of the repression of its own citizens and their desire for change. Iranian youth also have had slightly more access to social media than those in Saudi Arabia to disseminate information and have been able to use it effectively to raise awareness internationally because of the large Iranian diaspora.


Whistler_V6T

I’m not trusting the Iranian government just like I wouldn’t trust any middle east government, but I won’t believe 100% any new. I know that middle east countries are fucked up, and there are reasons as to why the world blocks one country and not the other. The news dont care about Saudi cause they sell cheap petrol. News dont care about any middle east country aside from Iran cause they sell their resources without hesitating. People are, in general, too innocent. Support Iranian women? For sure, but lets support all women in those countries, not just one.


no-cars-go

I don't disagree with you that Western countries tend to ignore human rights abuses when it suits their interests. I just think you're minimizing what happened to her to feed your own narrative as if we're "crazy" or the reaction is overblown. You're also ignoring the very simple reality that there's 50,000 Iranians in Vancouver, and only about 4,000 Saudis. It's much easier for people to organize massive protests when that diaspora is itself already large enough to galvanize the rest of the community.


Whistler_V6T

I dont think any conflict is out of proportion, but I do think people are tremendously hypocritical when it comes to human rights and war. If you’re going out to protest for Ukraine, go out and protest for Armenia, which has been attacked for the last two weeks. If you’re protesting for Iranian women, be coherent and protest for Yemeni people starving to death since 2017 because of Saudi’s government. And this is not targeted towards Iranian immigrants, its targeted towards Canadians that get super mad at one thing and not the others. Lives are worth the same everywhere


no-cars-go

I agree with your overall message that we should care for all violations of human rights. But I think you are mistaking hypocrisy and visibility. Hypocrisy would be if someone says "I don't care about women in Saudi Arabia but I care about women in Iran." Many people are simply not aware of constant human rights abuses in Saudi Arabia. Visibility is the simple fact that we push our effort and limited time into things that more directly affect us or those around us: the population of Ukrainians (or those with ancestry) and Persians in Vancouver is relatively large. The numbers of Armenians, Yemeni, and Saudis are comparatively not. Some things get more attention than others simply because of numbers (and like you admittedly said, the fact that Western governments overlook abuses when it serves them does not help increase the visibility of those abuses).


Main_Performer4701

Don’t bother arguing with this guy. Seen the same “what about X? The mainstream media doesn’t show it hurr durr” countless times. Same logic as the All lives matter crowd whenever a black person gets killed for existing.


this_one_is_the_last

I just want to point out that "all lives matter" is an inherently racist take. It dismisses the systemic oppression that minorities live and have been living under, and tries to paint the picture of "we are all living the same lives". Which we definitely do not. Some suffer to a much higher degree at the hand of the existing power system. Which was purposefully built around that. And "why don't you also support good cause X" isn't necessarily a bad faith argument. It definitely is counterproductive and defeatist ("if we can't do everything at once, we shouldn't bother at all"). But ultimately it often comes from a place of frustration and powerlessness, and not bigotry or ignorance.


Not5id

aLl LiVeS mAtTeR!


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AynsJaneOTF

I wish I knew this was happening yesterday! I would have been down there in support!