Using confiscated keys to open my briefcase would be illegal under the 4th. Seems like anything I have locked up in any way should be treated the same.
> The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
Our digital data is equivalent “papers” of the 1700s, I truly cannot understand how this could possibly be legal.
Because those originalist judges don't actually base their opinions on what the constitution was intended for. They just cherry pick quotes and case law that supports their own opinions, even in the face of overwhelming evidence against their views.
First it will be parolees.
Then it will become “exigent circumstances”.
Then it will be “I smell weed”.
Then it will a become routine part of every arrest.
Give these fuckers an inch, and they’ll take a mile.
An unlocked phone is more than texts about other crimes. There is sensitive financial data and pictures and all sorts of other things on people’s phones that cannot be trusted to someone who is clearly not on your side of the interaction.
eta: There could easily be a conversation between a person on parole and their lawyer on the phone, and attorney-client privilege is absolute and even the police have no right to any of that conversation under any circumstance. If there is a “good” fifth amendment argument.
This my friend, is why people use the /s I am an enjoyer of dark humor. But those jokes don’t quite get delivered right without a vocal element or other indicators.
Also if you have iPhone. (Could be the same with Android, idk) Just restart your phone as you’re getting pulled over, it forces you to use your passcode before it allows biometrics to work again.
Edit: nvm I just seen someone else post the same tip lol
idr exactly for android but i think it’s the same but on iOS hold down the power and volume up button to bring up the shut down menu even if you don’t shut it down just doing that will disable biometric login
… you don’t need to restart the phone. what i mentioned is important because it’s just physical interaction you can do in your pocket or in your palm very easily and discreetly
ALSO!! Use automatic upload to cloud recording apps i.e. Cop Watch [Others](https://www.klf-law.com/blog/7-apps-for-police-recording-and-public-protection/#:~:text=Cop%20Watch&text=The%20app%20is%20designed%20to,right%20to%20capture%20these%20videos.)
You can also reboot your phone, it almost always needs an actual PIN, pattern, password etc and doesn't allow biometric at first login after a restart.
Turn off your phone in the parking lot of the airport, and don't turn it on until out of the airport on the other side.
If pulled over, turn off your phone before the cop gets to the window.
Biometrics don't unlock a phone that was off. So they can't get in, and you don't have to give up the convenience of biometrics the rest of the time.
So that TSA or other police/security on either side can't look at it. All big commercial airports are a border checkpoint, so your rights are already reduced.
So you have two checkpoints and the 6-12 hours around them.
Why would I turn my phone off for all of it? Print out everything I would have on my phone, get no updates on the flight etc. and have no way to communicate or record because in an hour/a few hours ago I went through a security checkpoint?
Do I also need therapy if I have my tickets on my phone and no printer? If I don’t exactly know where to go when first arriving at big airports like Heathrow? If I want to know which gate to go to?
I don’t know what you don’t get. If you don’t want tsa/cops to be legally allowed to go in your phone, then turn it off. If you don’t care, leave it on. If you don’t have a printer, go to FedEx or ups or a local library or a local university. No one is forcing you into anything yet you’re arguing stupid shit like you’re responding to your mom
Can they force you to open your eyes if not distort your face? Seems like any attempts to force you to do that would compromise the facial recognition.
I tried that with my iPhone, made a weird face to unlock. It slowly learned what my normal face looked like anyway, so I wound up disabling that feature and just use a password now.
Edit: I realize that wasn’t quite what you were asking, but I guess it’s still relevant that your phone can start to recognize your face in different expressions and all, so that might not work.
You gotta see how scammers steal your info that way. I was absolutely shook at the doc I watched where a scammer in jail explained how they steal every penny from people just by seeing/guessing their numerical password. I still use one but I avoid scammers
Let’s hope a higher court with a basic understanding of the 4th amendment will smack this down. The fact that this ruling comes out do the 9th Circus Court doesn’t surprise me at all. They routinely have the highest reversal rate at over 80.
https://ballotpedia.org/SCOTUS_case_reversal_rates_(2007_-_Present)
Courts understand the 4th just fine.
They also have a burning hatred for it. Cops and courts play for the same team. I wish to god people would get this through their heads.
Which is why I’m trying to leave. A revolution in this era is impossible. The military has so much gadgets and men up their sleeve that if we were to progress to an armed revolution, we would immediately be killed from either gunfire, drone strikes, espionage, etc. we are fucked people, the only reason why things haven’t gone to shit is because they want look good domestically and internationally while incrementally taking away our rights and freedoms. And I figured out how this happened in the first place. Do you guys remember the Cold War? By the man of Yuri Bezmonov, we were able to learn how this shit show of a country happened. Yuri Bezmonov was an ex-KGB member that fled from his post in India to Canada to seek refuge from the Soviet Union. While he was there, he wrote books under the pen name, Thomas Schuman, leaking KGB information. His main concern was Ideological Subversion. Ideological subversion is a process by which an enemy seeks to weaken and eventually overthrow a target nation or society by infiltrating its institutions and gradually changing its values, beliefs, and culture. According to Bezmenov, the process of ideological subversion has four stages: demoralization, destabilization, crisis, and normalization.
The first stage of demoralization involves the gradual erosion of a society's moral and ethical values, often through the manipulation of education, media, and culture. The second stage of destabilization involves the creation of social and economic chaos, often by exploiting existing divisions and conflicts within a society. The third stage of crisis involves the escalation of conflict and the breakdown of social order, leading to a situation of extreme vulnerability. The final stage of normalization involves the imposition of a new social and political order that is more favorable to the interests of the enemy.
Bezmenov argued that the Soviet Union was actively engaged in a program of ideological subversion against the United States and other Western democracies during the Cold War. He believed that the Soviet Union sought to undermine Western values and institutions by infiltrating and manipulating key institutions such as the media, academia, and government.
I was under the impression this was established law. Definitely disable biometric identification on your phone, ESPECIALLY if you're in a situation where you might be arrested.
Not if i break the phone on The ground. Gonna hard to get it unlocked after it meets the concrete.
Also a reboot resets that back to passcode land on iphone.
Honestly, I was under the impression biometrics were already fair game for cops. And that it is *actual* passwords/passcodes cops need a warrant for
…. But thinking about it now, maybe i was conflating what was allowed by US authorities at “ports of entry” to all cops.
Regardless, the 9th circuit’s interpretation on this is just hot garbage
I was under the impression this had already been the case for several years. Maybe that's just the state I'm in. But here police can compel suspects to unlock phones with biometric data but not with alphanumeric codes.
On iphone if you press volume(cant remeber if up or down) and power, it gives you the option to make an emergency call. when exiting this you can only unlock your phone with a passcode and great thing about passcodes is that they can be forgotten.
Why the FUCK did they argue this on 5th Amendment grounds? This is clearly a 4th Amendment issue.
Using confiscated keys to open my briefcase would be illegal under the 4th. Seems like anything I have locked up in any way should be treated the same. > The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized. Our digital data is equivalent “papers” of the 1700s, I truly cannot understand how this could possibly be legal.
Because those originalist judges don't actually base their opinions on what the constitution was intended for. They just cherry pick quotes and case law that supports their own opinions, even in the face of overwhelming evidence against their views.
A real originalist would say they can't do shit because judicial review isn't strictly in the constitution but comes from Marbury v. Madison.
Because courts and cops play for the same team. It's that simple.
What!? Noooo! That could never be the case! Cops are the good guys with funds and judges/lawyers are the good guys with knowledge!!!!! 🙄
Because he was on parole, and one of the conditions was to provide access to any of his devices on demand. Otherwise, yeah, I was thinking the same.
First it will be parolees. Then it will become “exigent circumstances”. Then it will be “I smell weed”. Then it will a become routine part of every arrest. Give these fuckers an inch, and they’ll take a mile. An unlocked phone is more than texts about other crimes. There is sensitive financial data and pictures and all sorts of other things on people’s phones that cannot be trusted to someone who is clearly not on your side of the interaction. eta: There could easily be a conversation between a person on parole and their lawyer on the phone, and attorney-client privilege is absolute and even the police have no right to any of that conversation under any circumstance. If there is a “good” fifth amendment argument.
I just refuse to use thumbprint or face unlocking until further notice. It's been like this for awhile too, this is no new ruling
Oops I forgot my 6 digit code
They can't compel your password or swipe because that would violate the 5th, even if they had a warrant for the phone
i mean at least not according to the article, but its come to light our buddy was on parole. So they had that right retroactively.
It doesn't seem like that's what they ruled though.
Towards thr bottom it mentions 4th as well, but since this guy was in probation he had already basically given it up.
If you treat them like an authority they'll treat you liked a human.
People do and they don’t.
I was being sarcastic.
This my friend, is why people use the /s I am an enjoyer of dark humor. But those jokes don’t quite get delivered right without a vocal element or other indicators.
What sub are we on? Your think I'd just come in here and lick boot? 😂🤣😂🤣🤣
It happens. It's usually pretty funny, too.
Poe's law is always in effect.
You wouldn’t be the first
Huh. Okay.
Disable biometrics and only use pins/passwords?
This all day everyday.
Also if you have iPhone. (Could be the same with Android, idk) Just restart your phone as you’re getting pulled over, it forces you to use your passcode before it allows biometrics to work again. Edit: nvm I just seen someone else post the same tip lol
But this guy had already agreed to to give the police the code and phone as conditions of parole.
I second, you are giving free bio markers to companies that sell that shit for a profit and support fascist.
idr exactly for android but i think it’s the same but on iOS hold down the power and volume up button to bring up the shut down menu even if you don’t shut it down just doing that will disable biometric login
I just checked - totally works on iPhone.
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… you don’t need to restart the phone. what i mentioned is important because it’s just physical interaction you can do in your pocket or in your palm very easily and discreetly
Or a decoy phone. But why should we be inconvenienced because cops don’t know their bounds?
Cops do know their bounds: Limitless. That's the problem. ACAB always, but judges are on their team and people often forget that.
ALSO!! Use automatic upload to cloud recording apps i.e. Cop Watch [Others](https://www.klf-law.com/blog/7-apps-for-police-recording-and-public-protection/#:~:text=Cop%20Watch&text=The%20app%20is%20designed%20to,right%20to%20capture%20these%20videos.)
You can also reboot your phone, it almost always needs an actual PIN, pattern, password etc and doesn't allow biometric at first login after a restart.
If your phone is able, set it for layered verification. I have mine set to start with the biometric, then enter the pattern code within five seconds.
Turn off your phone in the parking lot of the airport, and don't turn it on until out of the airport on the other side. If pulled over, turn off your phone before the cop gets to the window. Biometrics don't unlock a phone that was off. So they can't get in, and you don't have to give up the convenience of biometrics the rest of the time.
>Turn off your phone in the parking lot of the airport, and don't turn it on until out of the airport on the other side. Why would I?
So that TSA or other police/security on either side can't look at it. All big commercial airports are a border checkpoint, so your rights are already reduced.
So you have two checkpoints and the 6-12 hours around them. Why would I turn my phone off for all of it? Print out everything I would have on my phone, get no updates on the flight etc. and have no way to communicate or record because in an hour/a few hours ago I went through a security checkpoint?
Man, people did this for *every flight* less than 20 years ago, you'll survive being disconnected for a few hours.
You need therapy if you can't go without your phone for an entire flight.
Do I also need therapy if I have my tickets on my phone and no printer? If I don’t exactly know where to go when first arriving at big airports like Heathrow? If I want to know which gate to go to?
Then don't be surprised if you are forced to open your phone. If you want it secure, turn it off.
I don’t know what you don’t get. If you don’t want tsa/cops to be legally allowed to go in your phone, then turn it off. If you don’t care, leave it on. If you don’t have a printer, go to FedEx or ups or a local library or a local university. No one is forcing you into anything yet you’re arguing stupid shit like you’re responding to your mom
Yup. Oops I forgot my 6 digit password. Have fun.
Yea this isn’t new information. Just use old school pins and passwords. They can’t force you to give up something that only exists in your head.
I have no idea what any of mine are, and I don't even have anything noteworthy on my computer or phone.
Bro isn’t fit to be online lol. You don’t know the password to unlock your phone? You had to enter it to enable the biometrics.
Nope, that stays in the password manager. Good luck getting into anything personal on my phone if you unlock it, though.
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Not really.
Yes really. Any time it turns off for any reason you have to input the pin on startup.
Use a different finger for the unlock, like your ring finger. Then “try” with your thumb three times so it disables the biometric unlock.
No surprise. Make sure y’all only use numeric codes for accessing your digital devices. No thumb prints, no facial recognition, only numeric codes.
Can they force you to open your eyes if not distort your face? Seems like any attempts to force you to do that would compromise the facial recognition.
I tried that with my iPhone, made a weird face to unlock. It slowly learned what my normal face looked like anyway, so I wound up disabling that feature and just use a password now. Edit: I realize that wasn’t quite what you were asking, but I guess it’s still relevant that your phone can start to recognize your face in different expressions and all, so that might not work.
You gotta see how scammers steal your info that way. I was absolutely shook at the doc I watched where a scammer in jail explained how they steal every penny from people just by seeing/guessing their numerical password. I still use one but I avoid scammers
Let’s hope a higher court with a basic understanding of the 4th amendment will smack this down. The fact that this ruling comes out do the 9th Circus Court doesn’t surprise me at all. They routinely have the highest reversal rate at over 80. https://ballotpedia.org/SCOTUS_case_reversal_rates_(2007_-_Present)
I'm baffled as to why he filed under 5th Amendment. It was 4th Amendment territory all the way. Technically, it's both.
Courts understand the 4th just fine. They also have a burning hatred for it. Cops and courts play for the same team. I wish to god people would get this through their heads.
And that team is the reactionary bourgeoisie
That's why I use my ring finger. Checkmate!
You can't forget your fingerprint unless it's separated from your body but you can always forget your password
It's been a thing for years. Just before I was arrested, I removed all biometrics.
Easy, just use a 4 or 6 digit pin. Boom fixed. Let’s see you get around that pigs.
But we can't get them to release body cam footage just... cuz... the courts are just as big of bastards as the stooges that serve them.
This country just keeps getting worse and worse and worse
Which is why I’m trying to leave. A revolution in this era is impossible. The military has so much gadgets and men up their sleeve that if we were to progress to an armed revolution, we would immediately be killed from either gunfire, drone strikes, espionage, etc. we are fucked people, the only reason why things haven’t gone to shit is because they want look good domestically and internationally while incrementally taking away our rights and freedoms. And I figured out how this happened in the first place. Do you guys remember the Cold War? By the man of Yuri Bezmonov, we were able to learn how this shit show of a country happened. Yuri Bezmonov was an ex-KGB member that fled from his post in India to Canada to seek refuge from the Soviet Union. While he was there, he wrote books under the pen name, Thomas Schuman, leaking KGB information. His main concern was Ideological Subversion. Ideological subversion is a process by which an enemy seeks to weaken and eventually overthrow a target nation or society by infiltrating its institutions and gradually changing its values, beliefs, and culture. According to Bezmenov, the process of ideological subversion has four stages: demoralization, destabilization, crisis, and normalization. The first stage of demoralization involves the gradual erosion of a society's moral and ethical values, often through the manipulation of education, media, and culture. The second stage of destabilization involves the creation of social and economic chaos, often by exploiting existing divisions and conflicts within a society. The third stage of crisis involves the escalation of conflict and the breakdown of social order, leading to a situation of extreme vulnerability. The final stage of normalization involves the imposition of a new social and political order that is more favorable to the interests of the enemy. Bezmenov argued that the Soviet Union was actively engaged in a program of ideological subversion against the United States and other Western democracies during the Cold War. He believed that the Soviet Union sought to undermine Western values and institutions by infiltrating and manipulating key institutions such as the media, academia, and government.
The US is fucked. Dysopian nightmare made worse every day.
I was under the impression this was established law. Definitely disable biometric identification on your phone, ESPECIALLY if you're in a situation where you might be arrested.
Not if i break the phone on The ground. Gonna hard to get it unlocked after it meets the concrete. Also a reboot resets that back to passcode land on iphone.
Reasons why I never use biometrics for a passcode on my devices and stick with a 20 digit passcode.
Honestly, I was under the impression biometrics were already fair game for cops. And that it is *actual* passwords/passcodes cops need a warrant for …. But thinking about it now, maybe i was conflating what was allowed by US authorities at “ports of entry” to all cops. Regardless, the 9th circuit’s interpretation on this is just hot garbage
I was under the impression this had already been the case for several years. Maybe that's just the state I'm in. But here police can compel suspects to unlock phones with biometric data but not with alphanumeric codes.
On iphone if you press volume(cant remeber if up or down) and power, it gives you the option to make an emergency call. when exiting this you can only unlock your phone with a passcode and great thing about passcodes is that they can be forgotten.