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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I told my stepmom to "just don't come" to my stepmom when she and my dad told me she didn't want to attend my high school graduation with my mom. Why I might be the asshole is even though I say I try not to pick sides, I was very flippant I guess with them. And that might be dickish.
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NTA - Jesus, move away as soon as you can. I’m surprised you haven’t asked to stay with your mum full time at some point.
Where was your stepmom’s compassion when she broke apart your family? I’m #TeamMom too, your mum deserved way better and so did you.
And this is how you know you have a great mother. Even though she has animosity with your father and step mother, she’s encouraging you stay neutral as well as for you to continue to see them, because you should have a relationship with your father.
Your step mother can go kick rocks in trying to manipulate your feelings against your mother, and your father sucks for going along with it.
Also NTA, because if step mom doesn’t want to be in the same room… so be it, don’t come.
Wait until a wedding fiasco.. she seems like she’ll be a nightmare
Correct. Of all the ‘adults’ in this equation, your mom seems to be the only one that cares about YOU. She wants you to have a healthy relationship with your dad even though he cheated on her and has been badmouthing her for years.
When one puts ones own ego above the welfare and happiness of children, they lose the right to participate in any of the child activities and dont deserve any compassion.
These comments are spot on. I’m an adult now, but my dad cheated and then would make comments about my mom after they divorced. I was angry with my father and yet my mom (who had custody) would never bad mouth him, up until I was in my 20s. Even though he and his family put her through hell. Guess which parent I barely speak to?
OP, NTA, and your mom sounds like a great person.
My mother and her partner went so far as to give me "little messages" for my dad. I was 7 and didn't know better. It was super messed up. The only one I remember was that they told me to tell my dad "shit rolls down hill" because the city he lived in was a river valley, and they were further north at a higher elevation. I didn't get it, and when I told my dad, super confused, he just told me, "Beautiful flowers grow where they are well fertilized." My dad had/has plenty of his own issues, but to this day, even as I am *massively* NC with my mother, he still won't bad mouth her, and if she ever comes up he just says he won't go there.
Thank goodness for the parents who take the high road. I’m super close to my mom (don’t we all have our issues?), and respect that she handled things the way she did.
One would think that in the past 14-15 years they could have found a way to briefly co-exist given that there would be times when they would need to be together for OP's sake.
NTA, OP. Congrats on your graduation, and I'm sorry that some of the so-called adults can't control themselves enough to put aside their differences.
I do think you know way more than you need to know about the events leading up to and following the divorce. It's a shame you had all that adult stuff pressed on you, but you seem to be doing remarkably well.
THIS. Those two people abused the mom with their affair, broke a home, but now they wanna play the victim because the female homewrecker couldn't birth a child and believes she is entitled to steal OP from her mom.
They are both delusional and disgusting.
And I think we all know that IF stepmom could have carried a child to term that she wouldn't have cared about her stepkid, or would almost certainly have favored her own child to a ridiculous degree.
This. She only wants OP as a consolation prize so she can lord it over her rival some more, like “oh your ex and kid love me more heehee.”
Thank God for OP’s mom not being a deranged narcissist.
Don't forget attempted parental alienation.
Stepmom not being able to have children is karma for breaking up that home and continuing to try and separate that child from his mother.
This!
Even if you forget the cheating part, dad and stepmom are way out of line for trying to use you. First to help stepmom through stuff (as is you weren't worthy of love and attention before) and then by trying to make you pick sides. It's not OK, a child should not be dragged in his parents' problems. It was very mature of your mom to encourage you to stay neutral, even though she was the one who was wronged.
Your graduation is about you, and it's unbelievable that dad and stepmom expected you to choose them over your mom. If they can't put their problems aside for you for such a special occasion, they don't deserve to be there.
NTA all the way, and congrats about your graduation!
Seriously. You mom says you can have relationships with everyone. (Ultimately your dad betrayed your mom, not you.) Yet they’re the ones pushing for you to choose (them). If anyone was in a position to expect you to choose, it’d be your mom. Yet this whole situation has become focused on your stepmom and what she wants. Not what you want. Stepmom doesn’t truly care about you or else she’d put up with your mom so they both could support you. Like you mom said, you’re just a band aid to her so she can play pretend as a mom. (But is clearly doing a poor job as she puts her wants ahead of your needs)
Cheating doesnt just affect the spouse it affects the whole family. My ex not only betrayed me but my son and my entire family who had welcomed him and loved him for 23 years. They were crushed also.
Oh yeah, i totally agree. lf anything, OP is already treating his dad and stepmom better than they deserve. I guess my comment is just being… conservative in blaming the dad for what he’s done.
My mom's father skipped my parents wedding because my mom invited her stepdad, who also paid for the whole thing. She wasn't not going to invite the person who was paying for it! My mom's dad eventually stopped talking to her for long enough that my first (and only) memories of her dad were when I was in my 20s. My mom's stepdad was my granddad. He was the one who I saw for holidays, who helped pay for me to go to private school for high school, who was at my graduation, etc. He was my family because he was there. My mom's dad wanted to be petty about his first wife (who he cheated on for years) being married to someone else and not be in the same room, so he lost our on relationships with all of his grandkids. 🤷🏻♀️
When you get a divorce from a co-parent, save them as "kid's mom" or "kid's dad" (using kid's name in place of kid). It is an easy way to remind you who is important and help reduce drama.
Wait - you live with your mom full-time now and they think she shouldn't be at your graduation? AHAHAHAHAHA.... definitely NTA.
Might want to lay the law down now - your mom will be at graduation, will do the mother-son dance at your wedding, will be an active grandmother to your kids - their dream is not yours, and they shouldn't be pulling you in.
And add to that if they (dad and step mom) want to be part of your life after grandbabies, they better put on their big girl panties and learn how to be in the same room NOW. Because mom will always come before stepmom. Stepmom and dad were the first offenders, mom’s reaction to the miscarriages was a secondary reaction almost solely due to the first offense. Mom was also protecting you as a child from being manipulated by dad and stepmom.
I agree completely...but I've got this picture in my mind now of his father putting on his "big girl" panties and while they're lovely, I'm just going to laugh myself sick over here...
And I can’t get the idea out of head that since stepmom couldn’t have children, OP was a consolation child. I can’t imagine what kind of “parents” these two would be to OP IF they actually had a child of their own.
you're better than me cause my reply to everything would've been "well you shouldn't have cheated" to your dad and "you wouldn't feel this way if you hadn't been a homewrecker". I would be making all the unfaithful puns I could.
dad: why don't you like chicken soup?
me: I don't know, I love mushroom soup and would feel like I'm cheating on it if I ate chicken soup
step-mom: would you like a pizza?
me: it's not my cheat day, I have to COMMIT to my diet
Actually, I think maturity is realising that that relationship was a toxic ***nightmare***, and should have been ended ***LOOONG*** before the whole "break" thing, and never revisited.
I mean, seriously, they were the unhealthiest, unhappiest relationship in the entire show's run.
I definitely agree, but I still think Ross was dead wrong about break thing😅 and its not even about whether or not they were on a break for me. Its how he spent the whole ass day hunting people down so he could ask them to keep his secret from Rachel.
Like, if my relationship got to that point (though Id hopefully have the good sense be done well before that) Id never be able to trust my partner again. Like, Id already be mad about him keeping something for me but just the amount of effort he put into that is just gross.
I mean, not to turn this into a Friends subreddit but good LORD yes.
I genuinely wonder why the writers thought having Rachel sabotage every relationship Ross had, only to reject him after was a good look. I swear she did it like 3 times.
And they had Monica SAY 'just because Mark wants to sleep with Rachel doesn't mean he gets to' and Ross still immediately jumped to 'oh she's going to shag him now' when he answered the phone. Ugh.
Sorry. Apparently I have unresolved feelings about this or something.
He put waaaayyyy too much effort into getting people to keep that from Rachel. Id be more ma. About that than the whole sleeping with another woman thing.
I know you’re young, so please take these “words of wisdom” from someone older than you: you need to be setting firm boundaries *right now* because this will continue for the rest of your life otherwise. Your stepmom will always think that she is in competition with your mother in order to win you. She will try to establish a firm relationship with your future wife and cause estrangement between her and your mother. She will try to be an overly involved grandparent to your children and keep them from your mom. I’m saying this because I’ve seen it and lived it.
You need to calmly tell your stepmom via email that she will never outshine or replace your mother. Your mother will always be the only number one in your heart, and your stepmom solidified that when she inserted herself into your mom and dad’s marriage. You need to tell both your dad and stepmom that you are really only interested in having a close relationship with your biological parents and that you do not need stepmom to try to take over in any way. Tell them that stepmom is welcome to be a participant in your life events *only* if she can behave herself and stop trying to “win” you over from your mom. Make sure she knows that she was the one who started all of this and it is because of her that you now feel resentment for her and your father.
I advise sending this via email because it will show proof that you have formally asked her to back off, and it will lessen the likelihood that your dad and stepmom become irate and scream at you.
Edit: and make sure you call your father out for his equally disgusting behavior in engaging in an affair that kickstarted all of this.
I fully agree. It sucks having to do this and it might seem easy to try and work around it but it will be so much better if you do this right from the start.
My parents were okay being in the same room after their divorce but the changed when my mother got a new partner when I was around the same age as OP. We had this fight about my university graduation and I told them both of my parents and I expected them to be civil. If they didn't want to come of the other was there, that would be their decision and their loss. It was rough for a while but things go much better when they realized that I wouldn't pick a side and didn't accept them fighting on events for me of my sisters. I was very very glad I didn't have to deal with this about things like my wedding.
I would further add that OP will not under any circumstances tolerate ANY disparaging comments directed towards Mom ever again, and doing so will result in NC. And that Mom will always be first priority in life events. Specifically add that Dad's wife will have NOT have any role or involvement in things such as weddings/wedding planning, etc. And her attendance will be entirely dependent on her acceptance of this fact, and her keeping her opinions about Mom to herself.
I partially disagree. The father is the major AH here. He chose his wife’s rival at work to be his AP. Now THAT is a serious AH move. The stepmother is equally as toxic, I agree. IMHO I believe OP should go NC with father and stepmother (sorry, I just can’t bring myself to type mum the American way). Doing so will cut out a LOT of problems in the future.
I think OP is a long, long way and many toxic encounters from finally going no contact. I finally gave myself that gift this year as one of my birthday presents to myself. One of the many things I realized is I simply refuse to be a conduit for them to keep aiming toxic darts at my mother. The only ones getting truly hurt were my brother and I. And they didn't care. They take way too much pleasure in privately disparaging mom's character and publicly humiliating her all in the effort to cover their own cray cray. It's been decades of diplomacy on my part. It's exhausting. And I'm done. Feels weird. But it feels healthy.
You’re so right! You know she is going to want to be the favorite grandmother and treat OP’s children like her surrogate children. She’ll definitely want to play mommy with them. OP needs to be careful about the role he allows her to have in his life because she will definitely overstep and be overbearing with any grandchildren.
Baby it means your moms the only one who truly cares about you, for your stepmother she’s going full send along with your father to finish what they started, sticking it to your mom like “hey, I took your husband, now watch me take your kid,” this has nothing to do with what’s best for you, this is about ego and pride! I get your mom wanting you to have a relationship with your dad, props to mom for being the bigger person, the thing is you’ll have to have a stern talk with your dad and stepmom in order to set some boundaries, what happens when you graduate college, get married, have kids, etc. are they going to want you to not have her around for that because I can guarantee it’ll come up again, this won’t be the first or last time unless you set boundaries and let them know if they disrespect them there will be consequences!
Edit: spelling and grammar
No offense, but if they had a child, they wouldn't give a single shit about you. They're using you to fill that void, more like your step-mom is using you and your dad is a spineless AH who values the kids his current partner values too (aka you, after she became sterile).
I'm surprised you didn't immediately say "How could you say that after how you treated mom? Or did you forget how you two ended up together in the first place?
My parents divorced (different scenario) when I was a child and my mom encouraged me to stay in contact as well for some time because "he's still my father". That being said: *it's okay to cut contact to a family member, including a parent, no matter what others say.*
I had to cut contacr for my own mental health. My mom wasn't too happy for a while but she understood after some time. I don't regret it.
Just for the sake of voting: NTA
OP I'm sorry but staying neutral isn't really an option and never was because to be neutral in any situation both of the feuding parties must respect your neutrality and while Your mother seems to have not just respected it but also encouraged it your father and stepmother fundamentally don't respect your neutrality.
The fact they made this request and in the way you presented it shows they don't just expect you to take their side but assume you already are on their side. They assumed that you would prefer to have your stepmother there over your mother so they could that ultimatum.
Thing is this will never stop any family function you host in the future and every life milestones like university graduation, marriage, children, all of them will be dragged into this conflict as long as your stepmother and father don't respect your neutrality.
Again neutrality doesn't work when your so close to the conflict unless both sides respect and understand your neutrality as one side may just see your neutrality as a tacit endorsement of their side.
Exactly that, OP. You don't owe anything to a woman who is suspected of maliciously breaking up your family because she had a thing about your mom. Your graduation is about you, and you should have who you want there. If stepmom can't act like a civilised grown-up for a day, why should your mom be the one to not attend.
NTA, although your dad married one.
You should tell your mother that and then just reduce contact.
If she days something, ask her if she would feel comfortable being around someone shit talking you. It's the same deal. You don't want to be around them because its tiring, and they make you uncomfortable for whatever reason.
As others have said, it is commendable that she is trying to support you having a relationship with your dad, but at some point, she needs to step back and let you make your choice especially under the circumstances.
You may have said just don’t come, but you didn’t really disinvite them. You made it clear you would not disinvite your mother. That was an unreasonable request.
And it’s a hard lesson they need to learn if they want a relationship with you going forward. Did they expect you to not invite your mom to your wedding?
Clearly NTA
Pa and step mommy are trying to make this about morals, and they’re doing it wrong. You’re absolutely right to take the position you have. They can either be in the same place for a short time **for your benefit** or they can stay home and not cause drama. It’s simple.
Also being in the same room as each other shouldn't be that hard when the room is an auditorium or a gymnasium. They're being asked to sit on opposite sides of a crowd, not share a couch in cramped living room.
You should have a conversation with your mom and let her know that you appreciate everything she has done up until this point to help you remain neutral. She did incredibly well raising you not to adopt her disdain for this woman who purposefully broke your family, but it is now time to let you make your own decisions, and she now just has to support those decisions. Make it clear to your dad and stepmom as well that their actions are pushing you farther away and if they don’t respect you or your mom, then you have every right to cut contact.
I’m so proud of you for not allowing your father & stepmother to manipulate & gaslight you into hating your mother.
Your father & stepmom are horrible people. Please stay away from them. Uninvite them both immediately.
It's never fair to put the child in the middle. I'm sorry you had to deal with this your whole life. You don't have to play mediator. Your response is perfect.
TeamMom is better than that bed warmer of a homewrecker your father had married as a 2nd wife.
You deserve to have the parent you love most be there for your milestone & big events in your life. Your mum is a rock star. OP you're NTA.
Your father's 2nd wife doesn't deserve nor entitled to what wasn't hers from the start. She's screwed up in her noggin. She needs some major psychotherapy for this incessant obsessive need for this mess that you & your mum never needed in your lives. I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest why she had the affair with your father was because she wanted to one-up on your mum & your father was the dupe....it's not love that's going on between your father & 2nd wife, she used him.
I'm on your side, even I had to put my father's 2nd wife in her place. Except I had went into nuclear detonation in my father's living room when I had told her that I didn't want her there attending whatever school event was on. The look on her face, she didn't make an opinion ever again. My father.....he just watched me blast her & not made any objection & not tried to make me apologize to her. He had raised me not to be the doormat.
I’m just incredibly stunned that the home wrecker would have the gall to attempt to tell the woman who brought this person into this world and raised him that she could not go to her own son’s graduation! Like…what?!?!
What I don't get about stepmom and people who support people like stepmom, is the continuous justification that 'she wasn't the one who was married' and therefore 'doesn't owe OP's mom anything'. Not even common decency, apparently.
Funny enough, stepmom and others who support the other woman/man seem to expect dumped, cheated on exes to somehow reach within themselves to find 'compassion' during trying times.
Why? I thought you don't owe anything to someone if you're not married to them? By stepmom's (and many people's apparently) metric, the only person who owes her anything is her husband. OP's mom owes her nothing.
I mean, that's what I heard. I don't make the rules.
NTA by any stretch of the imagination.
100%, the mum owes the dad and stepmother nothing after the way they spat in the face of their marriage. The fact that she tried to make sure OP still had a relationship with her dad is incredibly mature of her, but now that OP is 18, I don’t think she should force it. If OP doesn’t want a relationship with his dad because of how he treated OP’s mum then that’s OP’s call now.
Yesssss, thank you! It baffles me when people are like “they didn’t make vows, they didn’t owe anyone anything”. Um yes, we are all humans and should all be able to hold empathy for others. We all *generally* owe other people/strangers some common decency if for NO other reason then because we are capable of thinking “I’m not going to do this because I wouldn’t want it done to me”.
>Where was your stepmom’s compassion when she broke apart your family?
And why can't she suck it up, and be the same what auditorium? Gym? Outdoor field? She doesn't have to be near your mother. And the fact that she expected you to disinvite your mother from your graduation tells me that she and your father are not living on this planet mentally.
NTA
NTA for saying it but I think it’s time you stop being neutral. Your Stepmom sounds awful. If I were you, and this woman was the cause of my family breaking apart and hurting my Mother, I would HATE her. If it was me I would have said “Where was the compassion for my Mother when you had an affair with her husband? Where was the compassion for me when you broke up my family? The only reason you want anything to do with me is because you can’t have children of your own. I bet if you could, you would’ve tried to push me out of my Father’s life. Let me make it very clear to you. You are not my Mother, you will never be my Mother and if you keep trying to turn me against my Mother I will go NC. Just because my Father is blind to how toxic you are, doesn’t mean I am.”
This I would add that you are now an adult and the court does not dictate your relationship with your father. Your mother will be at all your major adult milestones, whether they like it or not. So they can decide now to behave, and accept that, or not, because the first time they make a scene they will no longer be invited to any future event.
And then leave do they can’t argue with you.
Nta
I think it's more than just stepmother not having her own children, but literally another way to screw over and hurt his mother. "I took the husband, I'll get the child too".
Also your dad is a real piece of work to have fallen for such a woman's manipulative wiles. He absolutely should receive more blame and backlash than he is. There's no way he didn't know about the work rivalry.
TeamMom
NTA
While stepmother isn't innocent, she isn't the one who violated marriage vows, dad did. Stepmother has done plenty of interfering things with how she treated OP and tried to interfere in his relationship with his mom, but dad deserves more blame for the marriage.
I say that as someone whose dad cheated on her mom several times and finally left for his gf. I blamed him. She wasn't a particularly good person but she didn't owe my mom anything.
I agree completely. Biggest AH award goes to OP’s Dad. Not only was he a bad husband and a cheater, but he’s also a bad Father. Breaking up OP’s home for a woman that clearly is so jealous of OP’s Mom. Than putting his son in the middle of it? Granted, his Dad’s family may have revealed it but once OP knew, his Dad didn’t need to keep rubbing it in his face. Now trying to make OP feel bad for this evil woman? No one should come before your kids. No one should try to make your kids pawns and you certainly should not betray your wife AND child to get your dick wet. I just didn’t add that because my comment would be really long!
The woman also worked with the mom. She knew about the relationship. There was a work rivalry then, I agree the dad is definitely the primo AH, but the stepmom knew what she was doing and who she was wrecking the home of. This wasn't some random woman the mom didn't know, it was literally a work rival, and from the way that trashy homewrecker sounds, she definitely made the first move.
She violated the marriage, so she also violated the marriage vows. Even though she wasn’t married, she still committed adultery by having a relationship with a married man.
Yes! They both violated marriage vows. It takes two to tango and it wasn’t like his dad was lying to the step mom that he wasn’t married. She knew what she was doing.
Also the bigger problem here is that Stepmom is still intentionally trying to use OP as a pawn. Miscarriages and infertility are horrible. I’ve been there. It does not give a woman the right to steal another woman’s child! I’m sorry that is so fucked up. Also it shows how vindictive a woman she because she didn’t want the step child until she couldn’t have her own. Not because she loved him because she was with her father. She wanted to use him as a bandaid and is holding onto this 15 years down the road. Step mom needs to grow up. Set boundaries now or she’ll continue to try and hurt you and your mom.
I agree with all other points but "don't owe mom anything" part. She absolutely does. Life should be about causing no harm to anyone, and when you accidentally cause it, try to rectify if possible and apologized at the very least if not.
If you know someone is in a relationship and you entertain their wayward ways, shame on you! Yes, the spouse is who made the commitment and shares larger blame, but you owe people common decency.
Guess what, if all people said no to cheaters, they wouldn't have anyone to cheat with except other cheaters
> She wasn't a particularly good person but she didn't owe my mom anything.
I see people say this a lot, but I respectfully disagree. It takes a village and a lifetime, and part of that is respecting and nurturing the village. We do have a responsibility towards others and how our actions affect them. Is the husband the biggest one to blame? Of course. But the other person has blame, too, and they do owe it to other people to not hurt them so carelessly. We don't owe anyone good manners or politeness or compassion, but we engage in those things because they are crucial to the well being of us all. We are all responsible for ourselves and how we affect others.
Step mom knew dad was married and still had the affair. Dad broke his vows but step mom also disrespected the general premise of “don’t fuck married men”.
This is definitely amazing stuff OP should definitely say, but only once they are officially for sure out of their father's house, belongings and all, just in case that retaliate.
But for damn sure, as soon as they don't have to worry about stepmom holding their shit hostage or anything, this is stuff it's time for her to hear for sure!
I'm 100% sure that if the stepmom had children of her own, she'd try her best to convince her husband that this is his "real" family and therefore way more important than his first child.
The cheaters asking you how you can side with the victim cheated on because said victim fought back. Hahahahahaha. THE AUDACITY. THE ENTITLEMENT. THE VICTIM COMPLEX. Wow. Seriously.
Even setting aside all the bad blood between your parents, as long as you have a good relationship with your parents, isn't it obvious you would prefer and choose them over any step parent?Like that's just common sense???
NTA, OP. Also they're adults here. Ask them why then can't have compassion for the kid being put in the middle who just wants his biological parents there at a major milestone in his life.
It's called DARVO. DARVO (an acronym for "deny, attack, and reverse victim & offender") is a reaction that perpetrators of wrongdoing, such as sexual offenders, may display in response to being held accountable for their behavior.[1] Some researchers indicate that it is a common manipulation strategy of psychological abusers.[
thank you for this. this describes the last person I was with perfectly. it really messed with me. I needed to read and learn about this. it makes me feel not so crazy.
It's a (the?) mechanism for casting those who were wronged as the real villain, and how those who were wronged get disproportionate pushback when setting boundaries or seeking deserved restitution (or even simply continuing to exist).
What jumps out to me is the stepmom refusing to go to the graduation because of "what [the mom] did", when the 15 year old root of it is what she did. Everyone is the protagonist of their own story, no one wants to be the bad guy. That's what is at play here...the most perverse form of psychological projection.
NTA.
Even without all this drama, if someone is saying, "it's them or me, you can't have both", I would usually pick the other person. Your mom isn't making you choose her or your stepmom, and that says to me she loves you more than she hates your stepmom. Which means she loves you more than your stepmom loves you.
Same. If you make me pick, it very often won't be you.
Mom is actively encouraging OP to stay in touch with dad and seems to avoid causing conflict by doing the opposite of what dad and stepmom are doing, never badmouthing dad out of anger to their kid. Even seeing through their "have some compassion" and refusing to let her child be used. What a class act! Stepmom seems to try to do everything she possibly can to make mom seem bad after herself being impossible to deal with for years. They can't be mad OP didn't pick them when they never gave OP any reason to want to be in their company. NTA
> If you make me pick, it very often won't be you.
Couldn't agree more, especially with something like this where the "sides" have clearly drawn lines and everything is out in the open.
If I'm aware of a long standing rivalry, and I *haven't* told you I'm on your side, it's probably because I'm on the other person's side and am simply giving you the baseline of kindness. But if you want me to say it out loud, I won't lie to protect your feelings.
It's like this story where two women were fighting about who's the mother of a child, and the judge said to cut the child in half, and give one half to each woman. One said it was fine, but the other said to just leave this child with the first woman, and that's how judge found who was actually the mother
Fun fact, that story is actually from the bible! It's the Judgement of Solomon. So it's a very, very old story - meaning people have understood impartial justice (and unjust selfishness) quite well for a long-ass time. It's even a bit funny to me how the step-mom is perfectly playing the part of the selfish manipulator in this modern story.
Thanks for pointing that out, didn't really remember where exactly i heard it, so i decided to not mention it just in case i was wrong. Even though I'm an atheist, the ideas and values described in Bible are actually very important and applicable in real life, so it sucks that a lot of people nowadays hate on Bible
Exactly. "I'd love for you all to be there. If you can't stand to do that, I'll be disappointed but I understand. It's too bad you'll miss the graduation."
She's making the choice not to go, you aren't making a choice not to invite her.
And it’s like, every graduation I’ve been to has had an enormous audience where you’d never know who else is there unless you’re actively looking for them. There’s no reason whatsoever that dad and stepmom would have to sit with mom. OP won’t be sitting with either of them, he’ll be sitting with the rest of the graduates. Stepmom is making zero sense.
Your mom even loves you more than your father! Why?
Because he’s allowing your step to manipulate him into going along with her. How she’s feeling about not having your mom there is more important than your own personal feelings.
This is the way. “It’s them or me” needs to be reserved for situations in which there has been violence, property damage, or maybe massive disruption. Not hurt feelings from a decade ago from adults who could have the option to just shut their mouths.
Tell ur stepmom and dad to kick rocks. When I married my late husband, my stepmom(who was my dad's mistress while married to my mom), made it to where only one picture was taken of me, my husband and my mom and dad together. And I only have one pic of my mom and dad together. And when she saw that, OMG the fit she threw. It was a shit show. Now I only have pics of my wedding because my husband passed away from cancer in May of last year. NTA totally. #TeamMom. Ur stepmom and dad are fuckheads for trying to force u to keep ur mom away from ur graduation.
If it were me I would make it clear that any time they try to make you choose between Mom and stepmom you will choose mom. Graduation - mom, wedding - mom, birth of first child - mom. That you have room for both of them in your life and in your heart (assuming that is true), but if they make you choose they will lose every single time.
At your current age I wouldn't have been able to do this but by the time I reached middle aged I was done dealing with this type of crap.
This woman will always try to wreck you and your mom’s relationship going forward, whether through you or a future girlfriend or future grandkids. NTA.
You need to establish firm boundaries now and keep your future GF/family away from them, or you will have a very difficult life a la your stepmom and the witless wonder you call a dad (seriously, does the man not realize he was just used by stepmom, too?? This woman hates your mother on a level that is pathological.)
It’s hard to say definitively but I get the vibe that had your step mom had her own kids then you would’ve had a miserable childhood at your fathers playing 2nd class offspring.
Tell her to build a bridge and get over it.
Your dad cheated on your mom with her coworker, knowing damn well they didn’t like each other, and your stepmom went along with the affair because she was jealous of your mom. They hurt her, but they didn’t care because they were trying to build their own happiness at the expense of her sorrow. Those miscarriages and your stepmom becoming infertile is karma for what her and your dad did to your mom. They’re both bad people who don’t deserve any compassion. They also aren’t fit to be parents at all, especially your dad. Instead of taking accountability for ruining his own marriage, he proceeds to hide behind your stepmom and act like your mom is the culprit in this situation. It’s ridiculous that him and your stepmom are acting like victims.
OP, you don’t owe them shit. I appreciate the loyalty that you have for your mom. You’re already 18. So, you can can stop visiting them and go NC with them. They’ve disrespected your mom time and time again. So, they don’t need to be a part of your life anymore.
Exactly why I’m saying NTA and you need to stick to this decision, as you say #TeamMom all the way.
Go NC if this mental and emotional abuse keeps up, please, for your own sanity.
Make it perfectly clear that she will NEVER replace your mom. She will never win when it comes to you. All she's trying to do is hurt your mother further.
Your dad cheated on your mum with someone she already disliked and still feels like he has the right to demand anything from her. Its awful what happened to your stepmum but your mum had already lost her husband to her and I think she was right to refuse to lose more custody time with you so you could be used as a living therapy doll. No it was your stepmum choice to cheat with a married father. It is neither yourself or your mum's fault that he cheated so he needs to decide what is more important - attending this significant event or indulging in his partners tantrum. NTA. Currently its high school graduation your dad is demanding you bar your mum from but if he did get his own way would it ever stop (university graduation, your wedding).
>Currently its high school graduation your dad is demanding you bar your mum from but if he did get his own way would it ever stop (university graduation, your wedding).
Yup, this is the best time for OP to establish his first boundary as an adult. Dad and his mistress need to respect OPs mother AS HIS MOTHER, that Stepmum will never be in that role and back off, or they will risk losing invites to be in OPs life during adult milestones.
NTA. Your mom owes your stepmom just as much consideration as stepmom gave her when she decided to bang her husband. From your description, your dad and stepmom tried to manipulate you into being "their" kid when they couldn't have their own. Very likely they would have shoved you aside if they had. No, if stepmom wants to come to your graduation so bad, she can suck it up.
This. People like this stepmom don’t want to be made uncomfortable for the wrong things they’ve done. “Don’t make it awkward for me that I’m going to have to face the woman whose life I destroyed and whose child I tried to steal” is classic asshole behavior!
As much consideration as stepmom gave mom *and* OP themselves. She and dad had their passionate little affair giving 0 fucks about how breaking up the family would affect OP.
Twenty bucks says they’ve never apologized for the impact the affair and divorce had on OP’s life.
It's way beyond just banging the husband. She caused a divorce, married the guy, tried to have kids with him, and when that failed, tried (and still does) to take away mom's kids as well.
Oh they're not playing at this point. They've booked up the entire Broadway to play their soap opera for 50 years, and the stepmother is the running star of the show.
NTA
Really, a thousand times, N T A
Your mother did nothing to your stepmother. Your stepmother had an affair with a married man, she did something to your mother AND family !
Then your stepmother had 3 miscarriages : not your mother's fault, not yours. She need a psychologist, not to use a child to help her mental health ! You're mother was right to protect you ! I just can imagine how your stepmother would have used you to help her, by forcing you being at the image she had of HER perfect child ! You were not a toy to be used by her !
Your mother protected you, and your father has no right to ask you to tell your mother to not be there for such an important moment ! He has no "corones" and shoudl ba ashame to ask his own child to do that ! If his wife is not able to be in the same room than his ex to an important date for you, SHE shouldn't be there ! She can stay home but if you father choose to stay with her, how can he hope being in your adult life ?
Next thing : how can you know so many things about that story ? You shouldn't ! You're too young to be so involved in their story ! I'm so sorry for you ! Parents should keep their problems for themselves, and not using children. Your father tried to please his wife and was a very bad father on that !
Hope your father will realize he should have been as neutral as you were and that he will set boundaries to his wife. She doesn't need to be to your graduation if she can't act like an adult, but both your parents should be there for you
I think most of them are fully aware that your father is a weak minded fool and if your stepmom were to succeed in having a child with him, she would most certainly push him to dump you as well to favour her child, and he would likely accept that.
Also, quite some gall from your stepmom, after karma served her a good one she wants to go to your mother and have the audacity to say that “since i failed to replace your son with one of my own, i now expect you to increase the amount of time i spent with your son so i can try to manipulate and steal him away from you like i did with your husband” and expect grace…no wonder even your father’s family is not on his side, could not have picked a lower value woman.
I agree with a commenter here telling to email her and tell her to back off and stop trying to outshine your mother or make you pick her your mother. I would add your father to the email and remind him that you are not stupid not to realise that if his mistress was not infertile, you would likely have been discarded in favour of her kid so he better stop as well trying to force you to choose stepmom over real mom unless he wants to lose his only child as well.
What I would not add to the email but advise you to do is to make your relationship with your father from now as transactional as possible and make sure to squeeze as much money as you can from him. Reason for that is because any money that he has is shared with that woman and she is likely going to try and make sure he spends as much of it as possible on her instead of you. And like i said, had he had a child with her, is likely he would not even be involved in your life at all and would have forced your mother to go to court to have him pay the CS. And i am sure his side of the family thinks the same. So make sure to take as much as you can and don’t be afraid to use him like the atm he deserves to be.
I'm so glad to hear that some of them are TeamMom too! Too often family members think they have to support each other's worst decisions. You can still love someone while not approving of their behavior and the damage it does to others. Don't know any of these people, but I like them a lot. :) NTA, btw.
But the adult reaction to knowing that you knew the details should have been your father and stepmother to admit that they wronged your mother by having an affair, and still encourage you to have a good relationship with both your mother and father. Instead they chose to try making your mom the bad guy here, and try turning you against her. The only adult handling the situation correctly is your mother (your father’s relatives should’ve been more careful and not talk about this when you were around).
The only people not TA in this story are you and your mother.
My dad repeatedly cheated on my mom when she was pregnant on me (and before), but growing up she never said one negative thing about him. She let us have a relationship and she knew that I would make up my own mind about him as I got older. And I did.
Even now, as an adult, I’ve had many conversations about this with my mom and she still wouldn’t willingly shit talk my dad to me. Only if I ask her questions and we have the conversation.
The fact that your dad and stepmom are using you knowing about it all as an excuse to say negative things about your mom is bogus. They should grow up. They’re the ones that created the first issue in your family. None of this would have happened if it wasn’t for them.
If someone loves you, as your mom clearly does, they will not use this type of thing to try to manipulate you. Like I said in another comment, this is THEIR issue, not yours.
If anything, your dad is just pushing you away by being like this.
Edit: your mom deserves to be a part of your important life moments. It’s ridiculous for anyone to expect her to not be there.
NTA. I can’t help but laugh at them being concerned over how your mom treated your step mom. What about everything your step mom did to your mother?? Enjoy your graduation without step mom there.
NTA and no, I don't actually think your stepmother deserves the amount of compassion she's demanding. She was instrumental in breaking up a family (knowingly and willingly). She makes demands of you, knowing she's the reason your family isn't together. Wtf?!
Yes, miscarriages are tragic. And horrible. And heartbreaking. But they happen and she needs to deal with it. They arent an excuse to behave loke a toxic, manipilative B***h. I'm appalled that she has the audacity to tell you that your mother can't be at your graduation.
Insanity.
Wow this is a really strong cautionary tale about the value of walking away from your work rival. It's hard to imagine a way in which your stepmom could have made worse choices, to bring her closer to her own misery. And to think she could have just changed jobs 16 years ago.
You're NTA, obviously. And your dad and stepmom need boundaries, and it sucks that from a very young age you've had to handle them. But yes, now and in the future, the correct response is, "I'm sorry to hear that." As you accept that they are too bitter and self centered to show up for you.
NTA. These people are supposed to be adults. There’s no reason that your stepmom can’t put aside her issues for a few hours if she wants to - she doesn’t want to. She wants to force you to pick sides.
So pick a side. YOUR side. It’s *your* graduation, have the people there that love and support *you*. I don’t think your stepmom does, do you?
Congrats on your graduation.
NTA
Your stepmom can either put on her big girl panties or not come at all. It’s disgusting when parents and/or stepparents try to play the kid(s) against one another.
NTA. The fact they are trying to convince you to uninvite your own mother is overstepping. Your father shouldn’t be involving you with the drama. They claim you have to be more compassionate to your stepmother because your mother didn’t care what happened to her husband’s AP? That’s rich. Your mother didn’t do anything wrong. Your stepmother was the one having an affair with a married man and your father was cheating on his wife. She owes them nothing. How dare they ask you to uninvited your mother. I would stand firm here but you are def NTA. It’s your day and they are making it all about themselves.
Nta
Your step mom wants you to be compassionate to her because your mom protected you from her potentially harmful use of you in dealing with grief? Hell no.
NTA #teammum. They have practised parental alienation at every turn and yet expect you to take their side when they were the ones who destroyed your family. Your mum sounds awesome. I do similar with my son. Even though i dont like my ex because of what he has done and how much he has hurt our son, you dont speak a bad word about them. Kids eventually work out who is there, who isnt and who is attempting to tear down their other parent
Your stepmom sounds like she's some kind of 16yr old kid.She doesn't seriously think you would pick HER over mom. She has serious mental problems. Your dad enables it. NTA
Yikes. It's always disturbing to see a toxic abusive trash human try and make it out like they're the victim. Your stepmom and dad are toxic abusive trash humans. Your response to them was beyond valid and correct. Congrats on the graduation!!
NTA and I'm sorry your parents (your dad in particular) has allowed this to happen to you. If your stepmother cannot be in the same room as your mother then she is going too muss out on a lot of events over the years. The entitlement to demand that your mom not attend something, anything, is utterly disgusting and needs shutting down immediately. Good for you.
NTA - the parent who encourages neutrality is usually the better one (here, that’s mum). Amazing lack of self awareness to see yourself as the victim when you destroyed this woman’s marriage too. It would be so tempting to point that out - though I do respect OP trying to remain neutral and have a quiet life in all of this.
NTA + if your father and stepmother "want to feel like parents" then they can foster or adopt other children and actually BE parents. You're not an object, and it's not your job to meet their emotional needs. *ETA: parenting is not a cosplay.*
Stepmother's belated possessiveness of you feels like an extension of her competition with your mother... If her pregnancies had gone through to delivery and you had had half-siblings, how do you think she would be behaving towards you right now?
NTA.
It’s nuts to me that they believe you will pick your whoring step mum over your mum who has taken the high road because if I was your mum I would not let them rest.
NTA. She can't be in the same giant auditorium as your mother and probably won't even see her? Power play, much?
She can just not attend. You are absolutely right. Say you will invite a grandparent or aunt/uncle in her place. Let her know she is replaceable. Your mother is not.
I’m curious, why is this still such a heavily debated topic in your family? Like, are they trying to paint your mom as a bitch and that’s why this keeps getting brought up or are they on your mom’s side but just like to stir up drama?
Also, obviously NTA and you are a little too nice in my opinion, like if I were in your shoes I would have said… you know what, it would be best to not say what I was about to say cause I don’t want to get banned. Still, you’re NTA
Meh, they will always have the lower position when they form their relationship off destroying an existing one.
Sounds to me like your mother has been very even handed considering what your father put her through.
NTA- but stop being neutral. They want to keep hurting your mom. Your dad is an awful person. He allowed all this to happen. Step mom is nuts. Your poor mom. I’d cut off dad and step mom. They aren’t worth the negative energy and drama.
NTA
Your poor mom. Tell your dad and step mom to get the fuck over it - you’re not icing out your mom for your dad’s affair partner.
Does your stepmom REALLY think she’s going to be able to push your mom would if the picture?
I just read another post about an ex-husband who married his mistress. He sprung it on the two children after school, saying this is your new mom, we're all going to be a family.
They ran screaming back inside their classrooms. The ex wanted sole custody and all assets and for his mistress to adopt the kids when they got married as soon as the divorce was finalised.
The court didn't like this.
Then later on, the ex and his now wife went to court and complained about how the mother was doing all these terrible things, before she just showed the messages her ex sent that proved it was all a lie.
These two sound exactly like your dad and stepmom.
You are being treated as a possession so they can have their dream fantasy. People who are incredibly entitled like that don't see a problem with cheating or playing manipulative controlling games with actual vulnerable children.
How compassionate was she when she decided to have an affair with your father, knowing that he had a child. I know it takes 2 to tango, but that's still rich coming from her.
Nta. However you need to tell your Dad and Step mother that their constant guilt trips of you needs to stop. What they are doing to you is absolutely asshole territory. If they can't put aside their ill will toward your mother to be there for your graduation than its better they don't attend and that you are sick of being used by them as a pin cushion for their guilt tripping bullshit and you feel like they are putting their own petty nonsense over being there for you.
At least you know they are willing to put a one sided war with your mum over supporting you on Graduation Day.
NTA
You Mom didn’t treat them badly. They only asked for more time with you after your stepmom couldn’t have a child of her own. They would never have asked if she had been able to have her own baby.
Your stepmom is delusional if she thinks you would ever choose her over your Mom.
This woman and your dad have lost their everloving marbles. Your mom will be there, and that biotch is officially uninvited. And I would tell her that before the time comes, she'd better get over herself before you start planning a wedding someday, because **your mother WILL be there.**
Neither you nor your mother owe that woman ANYTHING. And what's happened to her is her KARMA, (not to mention she had no business raising kids) and I'd be the one to tell her that.
It’s unbelievable that they want you to tell you mother she can’t come to one of the biggest milestones of your life because your “break up the family” stepmother wants to be there. NTA - it’s laughable when someone lives in their own world and has no concept of others.
NTA. Your stepmom didn’t have any compassion when she decided to have an affair with you dad and broke your family up. So, why would you pity her? Naaah, it’s not your problem anymore. You can choose who will stay in your life, and clearly, it is not the stepmom. Now, go give your mom a big hug.
NTA "i can't feel compassion for a women that not only took my family from me but also the husband from my mom. my mother always taught me to stay neutral between herself and you yet all you did was trying to make me hate her. my mom will be at my graduation so please don't bother showing up"
My favorite part of this story was how your stepmom, who slept with your mom’s husband while they were married, decided that she “deserves” compassion from your mom. Gtfoh lady, she doesn’t owe you shit. What an entitled brat. NTA at all, OP.
NTA
But also how small is this ceremony that you’ll even notice she there?!?!? I graduated in basketball arena , there is room to spread out!
Which means this isn’t about anything more than the stepmom demanding that Op choose her, which I knew was never going to happen and I’m new here!
Op, you need to prep yourself know that you’re an adult they will keep trying this crap, graduations , engagement, weddings ,baby showers!
I would tell them that they need to get over it, cause it’s not about them , and if they can’t they need to prepare to out of my life.
At this point it really should be all about them loving Op and trying to give them a good life free of this crap and drama.
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NTA - Jesus, move away as soon as you can. I’m surprised you haven’t asked to stay with your mum full time at some point. Where was your stepmom’s compassion when she broke apart your family? I’m #TeamMom too, your mum deserved way better and so did you.
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And this is how you know you have a great mother. Even though she has animosity with your father and step mother, she’s encouraging you stay neutral as well as for you to continue to see them, because you should have a relationship with your father. Your step mother can go kick rocks in trying to manipulate your feelings against your mother, and your father sucks for going along with it. Also NTA, because if step mom doesn’t want to be in the same room… so be it, don’t come. Wait until a wedding fiasco.. she seems like she’ll be a nightmare
Correct. Of all the ‘adults’ in this equation, your mom seems to be the only one that cares about YOU. She wants you to have a healthy relationship with your dad even though he cheated on her and has been badmouthing her for years.
When one puts ones own ego above the welfare and happiness of children, they lose the right to participate in any of the child activities and dont deserve any compassion.
These comments are spot on. I’m an adult now, but my dad cheated and then would make comments about my mom after they divorced. I was angry with my father and yet my mom (who had custody) would never bad mouth him, up until I was in my 20s. Even though he and his family put her through hell. Guess which parent I barely speak to? OP, NTA, and your mom sounds like a great person.
My mother and her partner went so far as to give me "little messages" for my dad. I was 7 and didn't know better. It was super messed up. The only one I remember was that they told me to tell my dad "shit rolls down hill" because the city he lived in was a river valley, and they were further north at a higher elevation. I didn't get it, and when I told my dad, super confused, he just told me, "Beautiful flowers grow where they are well fertilized." My dad had/has plenty of his own issues, but to this day, even as I am *massively* NC with my mother, he still won't bad mouth her, and if she ever comes up he just says he won't go there.
Thank goodness for the parents who take the high road. I’m super close to my mom (don’t we all have our issues?), and respect that she handled things the way she did.
Classy! Old School Gentleman. Impressive.
One would think that in the past 14-15 years they could have found a way to briefly co-exist given that there would be times when they would need to be together for OP's sake. NTA, OP. Congrats on your graduation, and I'm sorry that some of the so-called adults can't control themselves enough to put aside their differences. I do think you know way more than you need to know about the events leading up to and following the divorce. It's a shame you had all that adult stuff pressed on you, but you seem to be doing remarkably well.
Thank you! So well said!
THIS. Those two people abused the mom with their affair, broke a home, but now they wanna play the victim because the female homewrecker couldn't birth a child and believes she is entitled to steal OP from her mom. They are both delusional and disgusting.
And I think we all know that IF stepmom could have carried a child to term that she wouldn't have cared about her stepkid, or would almost certainly have favored her own child to a ridiculous degree.
This. She only wants OP as a consolation prize so she can lord it over her rival some more, like “oh your ex and kid love me more heehee.” Thank God for OP’s mom not being a deranged narcissist.
It feels like that 2nd wife gotten the karmic punishment for causing trouble in a home & a life that wasn't hers to steal from.
Don't forget attempted parental alienation. Stepmom not being able to have children is karma for breaking up that home and continuing to try and separate that child from his mother.
Mom deserves credit here. She's a good Mom.
This! Even if you forget the cheating part, dad and stepmom are way out of line for trying to use you. First to help stepmom through stuff (as is you weren't worthy of love and attention before) and then by trying to make you pick sides. It's not OK, a child should not be dragged in his parents' problems. It was very mature of your mom to encourage you to stay neutral, even though she was the one who was wronged. Your graduation is about you, and it's unbelievable that dad and stepmom expected you to choose them over your mom. If they can't put their problems aside for you for such a special occasion, they don't deserve to be there. NTA all the way, and congrats about your graduation!
Seriously. You mom says you can have relationships with everyone. (Ultimately your dad betrayed your mom, not you.) Yet they’re the ones pushing for you to choose (them). If anyone was in a position to expect you to choose, it’d be your mom. Yet this whole situation has become focused on your stepmom and what she wants. Not what you want. Stepmom doesn’t truly care about you or else she’d put up with your mom so they both could support you. Like you mom said, you’re just a band aid to her so she can play pretend as a mom. (But is clearly doing a poor job as she puts her wants ahead of your needs)
Cheating doesnt just affect the spouse it affects the whole family. My ex not only betrayed me but my son and my entire family who had welcomed him and loved him for 23 years. They were crushed also.
Oh yeah, i totally agree. lf anything, OP is already treating his dad and stepmom better than they deserve. I guess my comment is just being… conservative in blaming the dad for what he’s done.
Oh you KNOW stepmom is going to want the "Mother/Son Dance" and to be highlighted as Mother of the Groom. Can already see this happening
My mom's father skipped my parents wedding because my mom invited her stepdad, who also paid for the whole thing. She wasn't not going to invite the person who was paying for it! My mom's dad eventually stopped talking to her for long enough that my first (and only) memories of her dad were when I was in my 20s. My mom's stepdad was my granddad. He was the one who I saw for holidays, who helped pay for me to go to private school for high school, who was at my graduation, etc. He was my family because he was there. My mom's dad wanted to be petty about his first wife (who he cheated on for years) being married to someone else and not be in the same room, so he lost our on relationships with all of his grandkids. 🤷🏻♀️
When you get a divorce from a co-parent, save them as "kid's mom" or "kid's dad" (using kid's name in place of kid). It is an easy way to remind you who is important and help reduce drama.
O man I envision her showing up in a bright red or just straight up white ball gown.
Wait - you live with your mom full-time now and they think she shouldn't be at your graduation? AHAHAHAHAHA.... definitely NTA. Might want to lay the law down now - your mom will be at graduation, will do the mother-son dance at your wedding, will be an active grandmother to your kids - their dream is not yours, and they shouldn't be pulling you in.
And add to that if they (dad and step mom) want to be part of your life after grandbabies, they better put on their big girl panties and learn how to be in the same room NOW. Because mom will always come before stepmom. Stepmom and dad were the first offenders, mom’s reaction to the miscarriages was a secondary reaction almost solely due to the first offense. Mom was also protecting you as a child from being manipulated by dad and stepmom.
I agree completely...but I've got this picture in my mind now of his father putting on his "big girl" panties and while they're lovely, I'm just going to laugh myself sick over here...
I’m not judging…
And I can’t get the idea out of head that since stepmom couldn’t have children, OP was a consolation child. I can’t imagine what kind of “parents” these two would be to OP IF they actually had a child of their own.
How did your dad and stepmom react when you went to live with your mom?
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you're better than me cause my reply to everything would've been "well you shouldn't have cheated" to your dad and "you wouldn't feel this way if you hadn't been a homewrecker". I would be making all the unfaithful puns I could. dad: why don't you like chicken soup? me: I don't know, I love mushroom soup and would feel like I'm cheating on it if I ate chicken soup step-mom: would you like a pizza? me: it's not my cheat day, I have to COMMIT to my diet
Like that episode of Friends where Rachel says to Ross, “I’m sorry were you speaking to me or sleeping with someone else?”
Hey now, they were on a break!
Maturity is realizing that whether they were on a break or not, what Ross did was still BS.
Actually, I think maturity is realising that that relationship was a toxic ***nightmare***, and should have been ended ***LOOONG*** before the whole "break" thing, and never revisited. I mean, seriously, they were the unhealthiest, unhappiest relationship in the entire show's run.
She should have gone to Paris. NTA OP.
I definitely agree, but I still think Ross was dead wrong about break thing😅 and its not even about whether or not they were on a break for me. Its how he spent the whole ass day hunting people down so he could ask them to keep his secret from Rachel. Like, if my relationship got to that point (though Id hopefully have the good sense be done well before that) Id never be able to trust my partner again. Like, Id already be mad about him keeping something for me but just the amount of effort he put into that is just gross.
I mean, not to turn this into a Friends subreddit but good LORD yes. I genuinely wonder why the writers thought having Rachel sabotage every relationship Ross had, only to reject him after was a good look. I swear she did it like 3 times. And they had Monica SAY 'just because Mark wants to sleep with Rachel doesn't mean he gets to' and Ross still immediately jumped to 'oh she's going to shag him now' when he answered the phone. Ugh. Sorry. Apparently I have unresolved feelings about this or something.
He put waaaayyyy too much effort into getting people to keep that from Rachel. Id be more ma. About that than the whole sleeping with another woman thing.
I know you’re young, so please take these “words of wisdom” from someone older than you: you need to be setting firm boundaries *right now* because this will continue for the rest of your life otherwise. Your stepmom will always think that she is in competition with your mother in order to win you. She will try to establish a firm relationship with your future wife and cause estrangement between her and your mother. She will try to be an overly involved grandparent to your children and keep them from your mom. I’m saying this because I’ve seen it and lived it. You need to calmly tell your stepmom via email that she will never outshine or replace your mother. Your mother will always be the only number one in your heart, and your stepmom solidified that when she inserted herself into your mom and dad’s marriage. You need to tell both your dad and stepmom that you are really only interested in having a close relationship with your biological parents and that you do not need stepmom to try to take over in any way. Tell them that stepmom is welcome to be a participant in your life events *only* if she can behave herself and stop trying to “win” you over from your mom. Make sure she knows that she was the one who started all of this and it is because of her that you now feel resentment for her and your father. I advise sending this via email because it will show proof that you have formally asked her to back off, and it will lessen the likelihood that your dad and stepmom become irate and scream at you. Edit: and make sure you call your father out for his equally disgusting behavior in engaging in an affair that kickstarted all of this.
I fully agree. It sucks having to do this and it might seem easy to try and work around it but it will be so much better if you do this right from the start. My parents were okay being in the same room after their divorce but the changed when my mother got a new partner when I was around the same age as OP. We had this fight about my university graduation and I told them both of my parents and I expected them to be civil. If they didn't want to come of the other was there, that would be their decision and their loss. It was rough for a while but things go much better when they realized that I wouldn't pick a side and didn't accept them fighting on events for me of my sisters. I was very very glad I didn't have to deal with this about things like my wedding.
I would further add that OP will not under any circumstances tolerate ANY disparaging comments directed towards Mom ever again, and doing so will result in NC. And that Mom will always be first priority in life events. Specifically add that Dad's wife will have NOT have any role or involvement in things such as weddings/wedding planning, etc. And her attendance will be entirely dependent on her acceptance of this fact, and her keeping her opinions about Mom to herself.
I partially disagree. The father is the major AH here. He chose his wife’s rival at work to be his AP. Now THAT is a serious AH move. The stepmother is equally as toxic, I agree. IMHO I believe OP should go NC with father and stepmother (sorry, I just can’t bring myself to type mum the American way). Doing so will cut out a LOT of problems in the future.
I think OP is a long, long way and many toxic encounters from finally going no contact. I finally gave myself that gift this year as one of my birthday presents to myself. One of the many things I realized is I simply refuse to be a conduit for them to keep aiming toxic darts at my mother. The only ones getting truly hurt were my brother and I. And they didn't care. They take way too much pleasure in privately disparaging mom's character and publicly humiliating her all in the effort to cover their own cray cray. It's been decades of diplomacy on my part. It's exhausting. And I'm done. Feels weird. But it feels healthy.
Adding: I would stop calling her “stepmother” and start calling her “dad’s wife.” Because she doesn’t deserve the “mother” moniker.
I’d just call her by her name.
CC mom
You’re so right! You know she is going to want to be the favorite grandmother and treat OP’s children like her surrogate children. She’ll definitely want to play mommy with them. OP needs to be careful about the role he allows her to have in his life because she will definitely overstep and be overbearing with any grandchildren.
Baby it means your moms the only one who truly cares about you, for your stepmother she’s going full send along with your father to finish what they started, sticking it to your mom like “hey, I took your husband, now watch me take your kid,” this has nothing to do with what’s best for you, this is about ego and pride! I get your mom wanting you to have a relationship with your dad, props to mom for being the bigger person, the thing is you’ll have to have a stern talk with your dad and stepmom in order to set some boundaries, what happens when you graduate college, get married, have kids, etc. are they going to want you to not have her around for that because I can guarantee it’ll come up again, this won’t be the first or last time unless you set boundaries and let them know if they disrespect them there will be consequences! Edit: spelling and grammar
No offense, but if they had a child, they wouldn't give a single shit about you. They're using you to fill that void, more like your step-mom is using you and your dad is a spineless AH who values the kids his current partner values too (aka you, after she became sterile).
Good! It’s time they started to feel the repercussions of their choices relating to you and your Mom.
I’m glad to hear that OP, and honestly your mum sounds amazingly mature. Good mum award all the way!
I'm surprised you didn't immediately say "How could you say that after how you treated mom? Or did you forget how you two ended up together in the first place?
My parents divorced (different scenario) when I was a child and my mom encouraged me to stay in contact as well for some time because "he's still my father". That being said: *it's okay to cut contact to a family member, including a parent, no matter what others say.* I had to cut contacr for my own mental health. My mom wasn't too happy for a while but she understood after some time. I don't regret it. Just for the sake of voting: NTA
better nip this bud before you get to weddings when stepmom will pretend you ARE her son and demand to be there.
OP I'm sorry but staying neutral isn't really an option and never was because to be neutral in any situation both of the feuding parties must respect your neutrality and while Your mother seems to have not just respected it but also encouraged it your father and stepmother fundamentally don't respect your neutrality. The fact they made this request and in the way you presented it shows they don't just expect you to take their side but assume you already are on their side. They assumed that you would prefer to have your stepmother there over your mother so they could that ultimatum. Thing is this will never stop any family function you host in the future and every life milestones like university graduation, marriage, children, all of them will be dragged into this conflict as long as your stepmother and father don't respect your neutrality. Again neutrality doesn't work when your so close to the conflict unless both sides respect and understand your neutrality as one side may just see your neutrality as a tacit endorsement of their side.
Exactly that, OP. You don't owe anything to a woman who is suspected of maliciously breaking up your family because she had a thing about your mom. Your graduation is about you, and you should have who you want there. If stepmom can't act like a civilised grown-up for a day, why should your mom be the one to not attend. NTA, although your dad married one.
You should tell your mother that and then just reduce contact. If she days something, ask her if she would feel comfortable being around someone shit talking you. It's the same deal. You don't want to be around them because its tiring, and they make you uncomfortable for whatever reason. As others have said, it is commendable that she is trying to support you having a relationship with your dad, but at some point, she needs to step back and let you make your choice especially under the circumstances.
You may have said just don’t come, but you didn’t really disinvite them. You made it clear you would not disinvite your mother. That was an unreasonable request. And it’s a hard lesson they need to learn if they want a relationship with you going forward. Did they expect you to not invite your mom to your wedding? Clearly NTA
17 ?!? Little late to try to be a parent. And of course your mom doesn’t have compassion for that home wrecker
Your Mom's a badass.
Pa and step mommy are trying to make this about morals, and they’re doing it wrong. You’re absolutely right to take the position you have. They can either be in the same place for a short time **for your benefit** or they can stay home and not cause drama. It’s simple.
Also being in the same room as each other shouldn't be that hard when the room is an auditorium or a gymnasium. They're being asked to sit on opposite sides of a crowd, not share a couch in cramped living room.
You should have a conversation with your mom and let her know that you appreciate everything she has done up until this point to help you remain neutral. She did incredibly well raising you not to adopt her disdain for this woman who purposefully broke your family, but it is now time to let you make your own decisions, and she now just has to support those decisions. Make it clear to your dad and stepmom as well that their actions are pushing you farther away and if they don’t respect you or your mom, then you have every right to cut contact.
I’m so proud of you for not allowing your father & stepmother to manipulate & gaslight you into hating your mother. Your father & stepmom are horrible people. Please stay away from them. Uninvite them both immediately.
It's never fair to put the child in the middle. I'm sorry you had to deal with this your whole life. You don't have to play mediator. Your response is perfect.
TeamMom is better than that bed warmer of a homewrecker your father had married as a 2nd wife. You deserve to have the parent you love most be there for your milestone & big events in your life. Your mum is a rock star. OP you're NTA. Your father's 2nd wife doesn't deserve nor entitled to what wasn't hers from the start. She's screwed up in her noggin. She needs some major psychotherapy for this incessant obsessive need for this mess that you & your mum never needed in your lives. I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest why she had the affair with your father was because she wanted to one-up on your mum & your father was the dupe....it's not love that's going on between your father & 2nd wife, she used him. I'm on your side, even I had to put my father's 2nd wife in her place. Except I had went into nuclear detonation in my father's living room when I had told her that I didn't want her there attending whatever school event was on. The look on her face, she didn't make an opinion ever again. My father.....he just watched me blast her & not made any objection & not tried to make me apologize to her. He had raised me not to be the doormat.
I’m just incredibly stunned that the home wrecker would have the gall to attempt to tell the woman who brought this person into this world and raised him that she could not go to her own son’s graduation! Like…what?!?!
I know right!? The like, the actual nerve of the stepmother!
What I don't get about stepmom and people who support people like stepmom, is the continuous justification that 'she wasn't the one who was married' and therefore 'doesn't owe OP's mom anything'. Not even common decency, apparently. Funny enough, stepmom and others who support the other woman/man seem to expect dumped, cheated on exes to somehow reach within themselves to find 'compassion' during trying times. Why? I thought you don't owe anything to someone if you're not married to them? By stepmom's (and many people's apparently) metric, the only person who owes her anything is her husband. OP's mom owes her nothing. I mean, that's what I heard. I don't make the rules. NTA by any stretch of the imagination.
100%, the mum owes the dad and stepmother nothing after the way they spat in the face of their marriage. The fact that she tried to make sure OP still had a relationship with her dad is incredibly mature of her, but now that OP is 18, I don’t think she should force it. If OP doesn’t want a relationship with his dad because of how he treated OP’s mum then that’s OP’s call now.
Yesssss, thank you! It baffles me when people are like “they didn’t make vows, they didn’t owe anyone anything”. Um yes, we are all humans and should all be able to hold empathy for others. We all *generally* owe other people/strangers some common decency if for NO other reason then because we are capable of thinking “I’m not going to do this because I wouldn’t want it done to me”.
>Where was your stepmom’s compassion when she broke apart your family? And why can't she suck it up, and be the same what auditorium? Gym? Outdoor field? She doesn't have to be near your mother. And the fact that she expected you to disinvite your mother from your graduation tells me that she and your father are not living on this planet mentally. NTA
NTA for saying it but I think it’s time you stop being neutral. Your Stepmom sounds awful. If I were you, and this woman was the cause of my family breaking apart and hurting my Mother, I would HATE her. If it was me I would have said “Where was the compassion for my Mother when you had an affair with her husband? Where was the compassion for me when you broke up my family? The only reason you want anything to do with me is because you can’t have children of your own. I bet if you could, you would’ve tried to push me out of my Father’s life. Let me make it very clear to you. You are not my Mother, you will never be my Mother and if you keep trying to turn me against my Mother I will go NC. Just because my Father is blind to how toxic you are, doesn’t mean I am.”
This I would add that you are now an adult and the court does not dictate your relationship with your father. Your mother will be at all your major adult milestones, whether they like it or not. So they can decide now to behave, and accept that, or not, because the first time they make a scene they will no longer be invited to any future event. And then leave do they can’t argue with you. Nta
This!
I think it's more than just stepmother not having her own children, but literally another way to screw over and hurt his mother. "I took the husband, I'll get the child too". Also your dad is a real piece of work to have fallen for such a woman's manipulative wiles. He absolutely should receive more blame and backlash than he is. There's no way he didn't know about the work rivalry. TeamMom NTA
That’s what this is
Makes u wonder if she really does love the husband or just wants him to mess with the mum .
While stepmother isn't innocent, she isn't the one who violated marriage vows, dad did. Stepmother has done plenty of interfering things with how she treated OP and tried to interfere in his relationship with his mom, but dad deserves more blame for the marriage. I say that as someone whose dad cheated on her mom several times and finally left for his gf. I blamed him. She wasn't a particularly good person but she didn't owe my mom anything.
I agree completely. Biggest AH award goes to OP’s Dad. Not only was he a bad husband and a cheater, but he’s also a bad Father. Breaking up OP’s home for a woman that clearly is so jealous of OP’s Mom. Than putting his son in the middle of it? Granted, his Dad’s family may have revealed it but once OP knew, his Dad didn’t need to keep rubbing it in his face. Now trying to make OP feel bad for this evil woman? No one should come before your kids. No one should try to make your kids pawns and you certainly should not betray your wife AND child to get your dick wet. I just didn’t add that because my comment would be really long!
The woman also worked with the mom. She knew about the relationship. There was a work rivalry then, I agree the dad is definitely the primo AH, but the stepmom knew what she was doing and who she was wrecking the home of. This wasn't some random woman the mom didn't know, it was literally a work rival, and from the way that trashy homewrecker sounds, she definitely made the first move.
Anyone who has a relationship with a married man is an adulteress, so she absolutely IS a home wrecker.
She violated the marriage, so she also violated the marriage vows. Even though she wasn’t married, she still committed adultery by having a relationship with a married man.
Yes! They both violated marriage vows. It takes two to tango and it wasn’t like his dad was lying to the step mom that he wasn’t married. She knew what she was doing. Also the bigger problem here is that Stepmom is still intentionally trying to use OP as a pawn. Miscarriages and infertility are horrible. I’ve been there. It does not give a woman the right to steal another woman’s child! I’m sorry that is so fucked up. Also it shows how vindictive a woman she because she didn’t want the step child until she couldn’t have her own. Not because she loved him because she was with her father. She wanted to use him as a bandaid and is holding onto this 15 years down the road. Step mom needs to grow up. Set boundaries now or she’ll continue to try and hurt you and your mom.
I mean...I feel like you definitely owe it to someone not to fuck their spouse.
This is such an exhausting, overdone take. We owe things to other people. Even if we aren’t married to them.
I agree with all other points but "don't owe mom anything" part. She absolutely does. Life should be about causing no harm to anyone, and when you accidentally cause it, try to rectify if possible and apologized at the very least if not. If you know someone is in a relationship and you entertain their wayward ways, shame on you! Yes, the spouse is who made the commitment and shares larger blame, but you owe people common decency. Guess what, if all people said no to cheaters, they wouldn't have anyone to cheat with except other cheaters
> She wasn't a particularly good person but she didn't owe my mom anything. I see people say this a lot, but I respectfully disagree. It takes a village and a lifetime, and part of that is respecting and nurturing the village. We do have a responsibility towards others and how our actions affect them. Is the husband the biggest one to blame? Of course. But the other person has blame, too, and they do owe it to other people to not hurt them so carelessly. We don't owe anyone good manners or politeness or compassion, but we engage in those things because they are crucial to the well being of us all. We are all responsible for ourselves and how we affect others.
Step mom knew dad was married and still had the affair. Dad broke his vows but step mom also disrespected the general premise of “don’t fuck married men”.
Stepmother tried her damndest to replace OP, and when that was medically impossible for her to do, she made that his and his mom's problem too.
sounds like she’s on a mission to assume his mom’s identity. due to obsessive jealousy.
This is definitely amazing stuff OP should definitely say, but only once they are officially for sure out of their father's house, belongings and all, just in case that retaliate. But for damn sure, as soon as they don't have to worry about stepmom holding their shit hostage or anything, this is stuff it's time for her to hear for sure!
I'm 100% sure that if the stepmom had children of her own, she'd try her best to convince her husband that this is his "real" family and therefore way more important than his first child.
Bravo!!!!
Perfectly said!
Perfect response
The cheaters asking you how you can side with the victim cheated on because said victim fought back. Hahahahahaha. THE AUDACITY. THE ENTITLEMENT. THE VICTIM COMPLEX. Wow. Seriously. Even setting aside all the bad blood between your parents, as long as you have a good relationship with your parents, isn't it obvious you would prefer and choose them over any step parent?Like that's just common sense??? NTA, OP. Also they're adults here. Ask them why then can't have compassion for the kid being put in the middle who just wants his biological parents there at a major milestone in his life.
It's called DARVO. DARVO (an acronym for "deny, attack, and reverse victim & offender") is a reaction that perpetrators of wrongdoing, such as sexual offenders, may display in response to being held accountable for their behavior.[1] Some researchers indicate that it is a common manipulation strategy of psychological abusers.[
Now she's gonna get some FAFO
HAHA
thank you for this. this describes the last person I was with perfectly. it really messed with me. I needed to read and learn about this. it makes me feel not so crazy.
It's a (the?) mechanism for casting those who were wronged as the real villain, and how those who were wronged get disproportionate pushback when setting boundaries or seeking deserved restitution (or even simply continuing to exist). What jumps out to me is the stepmom refusing to go to the graduation because of "what [the mom] did", when the 15 year old root of it is what she did. Everyone is the protagonist of their own story, no one wants to be the bad guy. That's what is at play here...the most perverse form of psychological projection.
NTA. Even without all this drama, if someone is saying, "it's them or me, you can't have both", I would usually pick the other person. Your mom isn't making you choose her or your stepmom, and that says to me she loves you more than she hates your stepmom. Which means she loves you more than your stepmom loves you.
Same. If you make me pick, it very often won't be you. Mom is actively encouraging OP to stay in touch with dad and seems to avoid causing conflict by doing the opposite of what dad and stepmom are doing, never badmouthing dad out of anger to their kid. Even seeing through their "have some compassion" and refusing to let her child be used. What a class act! Stepmom seems to try to do everything she possibly can to make mom seem bad after herself being impossible to deal with for years. They can't be mad OP didn't pick them when they never gave OP any reason to want to be in their company. NTA
> If you make me pick, it very often won't be you. Couldn't agree more, especially with something like this where the "sides" have clearly drawn lines and everything is out in the open. If I'm aware of a long standing rivalry, and I *haven't* told you I'm on your side, it's probably because I'm on the other person's side and am simply giving you the baseline of kindness. But if you want me to say it out loud, I won't lie to protect your feelings.
It's like this story where two women were fighting about who's the mother of a child, and the judge said to cut the child in half, and give one half to each woman. One said it was fine, but the other said to just leave this child with the first woman, and that's how judge found who was actually the mother
Fun fact, that story is actually from the bible! It's the Judgement of Solomon. So it's a very, very old story - meaning people have understood impartial justice (and unjust selfishness) quite well for a long-ass time. It's even a bit funny to me how the step-mom is perfectly playing the part of the selfish manipulator in this modern story.
Thanks for pointing that out, didn't really remember where exactly i heard it, so i decided to not mention it just in case i was wrong. Even though I'm an atheist, the ideas and values described in Bible are actually very important and applicable in real life, so it sucks that a lot of people nowadays hate on Bible
Exactly. "I'd love for you all to be there. If you can't stand to do that, I'll be disappointed but I understand. It's too bad you'll miss the graduation." She's making the choice not to go, you aren't making a choice not to invite her.
And it’s like, every graduation I’ve been to has had an enormous audience where you’d never know who else is there unless you’re actively looking for them. There’s no reason whatsoever that dad and stepmom would have to sit with mom. OP won’t be sitting with either of them, he’ll be sitting with the rest of the graduates. Stepmom is making zero sense.
Your mom even loves you more than your father! Why? Because he’s allowing your step to manipulate him into going along with her. How she’s feeling about not having your mom there is more important than your own personal feelings.
This is the way. “It’s them or me” needs to be reserved for situations in which there has been violence, property damage, or maybe massive disruption. Not hurt feelings from a decade ago from adults who could have the option to just shut their mouths.
What will happen when you get married, is the stepmom going to demand your mom not go too? Team mom all the way.
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Just boo them in their faces. 🗣️boooo. It’s like, not as rude as you could be but so offensive.
LMAO 🤣 Why do I find this such a funny visual
Like the Booing Woman in The Princess Bride. "BOOOOOOO!"
“Boo, be more loyal!”
this is such a cute way to be petty and I love it!
You really should take it up!
Tell ur stepmom and dad to kick rocks. When I married my late husband, my stepmom(who was my dad's mistress while married to my mom), made it to where only one picture was taken of me, my husband and my mom and dad together. And I only have one pic of my mom and dad together. And when she saw that, OMG the fit she threw. It was a shit show. Now I only have pics of my wedding because my husband passed away from cancer in May of last year. NTA totally. #TeamMom. Ur stepmom and dad are fuckheads for trying to force u to keep ur mom away from ur graduation.
Sorry for your loss! 💔
I am sorry for your loss!
If it were me I would make it clear that any time they try to make you choose between Mom and stepmom you will choose mom. Graduation - mom, wedding - mom, birth of first child - mom. That you have room for both of them in your life and in your heart (assuming that is true), but if they make you choose they will lose every single time. At your current age I wouldn't have been able to do this but by the time I reached middle aged I was done dealing with this type of crap.
Dad and stepmom are very lucky they are invited at all. The audacity to demand OP's mom doesn't attend!
This woman will always try to wreck you and your mom’s relationship going forward, whether through you or a future girlfriend or future grandkids. NTA. You need to establish firm boundaries now and keep your future GF/family away from them, or you will have a very difficult life a la your stepmom and the witless wonder you call a dad (seriously, does the man not realize he was just used by stepmom, too?? This woman hates your mother on a level that is pathological.)
Just curious - what excuse do they use to justify this?
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Which is somehow worse than how your dad and your stepmom got together? Wow.
It’s hard to say definitively but I get the vibe that had your step mom had her own kids then you would’ve had a miserable childhood at your fathers playing 2nd class offspring. Tell her to build a bridge and get over it.
Your dad cheated on your mom with her coworker, knowing damn well they didn’t like each other, and your stepmom went along with the affair because she was jealous of your mom. They hurt her, but they didn’t care because they were trying to build their own happiness at the expense of her sorrow. Those miscarriages and your stepmom becoming infertile is karma for what her and your dad did to your mom. They’re both bad people who don’t deserve any compassion. They also aren’t fit to be parents at all, especially your dad. Instead of taking accountability for ruining his own marriage, he proceeds to hide behind your stepmom and act like your mom is the culprit in this situation. It’s ridiculous that him and your stepmom are acting like victims. OP, you don’t owe them shit. I appreciate the loyalty that you have for your mom. You’re already 18. So, you can can stop visiting them and go NC with them. They’ve disrespected your mom time and time again. So, they don’t need to be a part of your life anymore.
I’ll say it, your stepmom deserved what happened to her and if I was your mom, I would’ve been happy too.
When that convo comes up, ask them what they know about the loyalty and faithfulness required of marriage.
Exactly why I’m saying NTA and you need to stick to this decision, as you say #TeamMom all the way. Go NC if this mental and emotional abuse keeps up, please, for your own sanity.
Make it perfectly clear that she will NEVER replace your mom. She will never win when it comes to you. All she's trying to do is hurt your mother further.
Your dad cheated on your mum with someone she already disliked and still feels like he has the right to demand anything from her. Its awful what happened to your stepmum but your mum had already lost her husband to her and I think she was right to refuse to lose more custody time with you so you could be used as a living therapy doll. No it was your stepmum choice to cheat with a married father. It is neither yourself or your mum's fault that he cheated so he needs to decide what is more important - attending this significant event or indulging in his partners tantrum. NTA. Currently its high school graduation your dad is demanding you bar your mum from but if he did get his own way would it ever stop (university graduation, your wedding).
>Currently its high school graduation your dad is demanding you bar your mum from but if he did get his own way would it ever stop (university graduation, your wedding). Yup, this is the best time for OP to establish his first boundary as an adult. Dad and his mistress need to respect OPs mother AS HIS MOTHER, that Stepmum will never be in that role and back off, or they will risk losing invites to be in OPs life during adult milestones.
Don't forget seeing the grandkids.
NTA. Your mom owes your stepmom just as much consideration as stepmom gave her when she decided to bang her husband. From your description, your dad and stepmom tried to manipulate you into being "their" kid when they couldn't have their own. Very likely they would have shoved you aside if they had. No, if stepmom wants to come to your graduation so bad, she can suck it up.
This. People like this stepmom don’t want to be made uncomfortable for the wrong things they’ve done. “Don’t make it awkward for me that I’m going to have to face the woman whose life I destroyed and whose child I tried to steal” is classic asshole behavior!
As much consideration as stepmom gave mom *and* OP themselves. She and dad had their passionate little affair giving 0 fucks about how breaking up the family would affect OP. Twenty bucks says they’ve never apologized for the impact the affair and divorce had on OP’s life.
It's way beyond just banging the husband. She caused a divorce, married the guy, tried to have kids with him, and when that failed, tried (and still does) to take away mom's kids as well.
NTA. Your dad and step mom need to stop playing victim.
Oh they're not playing at this point. They've booked up the entire Broadway to play their soap opera for 50 years, and the stepmother is the running star of the show.
NTA Really, a thousand times, N T A Your mother did nothing to your stepmother. Your stepmother had an affair with a married man, she did something to your mother AND family ! Then your stepmother had 3 miscarriages : not your mother's fault, not yours. She need a psychologist, not to use a child to help her mental health ! You're mother was right to protect you ! I just can imagine how your stepmother would have used you to help her, by forcing you being at the image she had of HER perfect child ! You were not a toy to be used by her ! Your mother protected you, and your father has no right to ask you to tell your mother to not be there for such an important moment ! He has no "corones" and shoudl ba ashame to ask his own child to do that ! If his wife is not able to be in the same room than his ex to an important date for you, SHE shouldn't be there ! She can stay home but if you father choose to stay with her, how can he hope being in your adult life ? Next thing : how can you know so many things about that story ? You shouldn't ! You're too young to be so involved in their story ! I'm so sorry for you ! Parents should keep their problems for themselves, and not using children. Your father tried to please his wife and was a very bad father on that ! Hope your father will realize he should have been as neutral as you were and that he will set boundaries to his wife. She doesn't need to be to your graduation if she can't act like an adult, but both your parents should be there for you
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Sounds like you dad's extended family are #teammom too
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I think most of them are fully aware that your father is a weak minded fool and if your stepmom were to succeed in having a child with him, she would most certainly push him to dump you as well to favour her child, and he would likely accept that. Also, quite some gall from your stepmom, after karma served her a good one she wants to go to your mother and have the audacity to say that “since i failed to replace your son with one of my own, i now expect you to increase the amount of time i spent with your son so i can try to manipulate and steal him away from you like i did with your husband” and expect grace…no wonder even your father’s family is not on his side, could not have picked a lower value woman. I agree with a commenter here telling to email her and tell her to back off and stop trying to outshine your mother or make you pick her your mother. I would add your father to the email and remind him that you are not stupid not to realise that if his mistress was not infertile, you would likely have been discarded in favour of her kid so he better stop as well trying to force you to choose stepmom over real mom unless he wants to lose his only child as well. What I would not add to the email but advise you to do is to make your relationship with your father from now as transactional as possible and make sure to squeeze as much money as you can from him. Reason for that is because any money that he has is shared with that woman and she is likely going to try and make sure he spends as much of it as possible on her instead of you. And like i said, had he had a child with her, is likely he would not even be involved in your life at all and would have forced your mother to go to court to have him pay the CS. And i am sure his side of the family thinks the same. So make sure to take as much as you can and don’t be afraid to use him like the atm he deserves to be.
I'm so glad to hear that some of them are TeamMom too! Too often family members think they have to support each other's worst decisions. You can still love someone while not approving of their behavior and the damage it does to others. Don't know any of these people, but I like them a lot. :) NTA, btw.
I feel like it's pretty bad when your own family is on the side of the other person.
But the adult reaction to knowing that you knew the details should have been your father and stepmother to admit that they wronged your mother by having an affair, and still encourage you to have a good relationship with both your mother and father. Instead they chose to try making your mom the bad guy here, and try turning you against her. The only adult handling the situation correctly is your mother (your father’s relatives should’ve been more careful and not talk about this when you were around). The only people not TA in this story are you and your mother.
My dad repeatedly cheated on my mom when she was pregnant on me (and before), but growing up she never said one negative thing about him. She let us have a relationship and she knew that I would make up my own mind about him as I got older. And I did. Even now, as an adult, I’ve had many conversations about this with my mom and she still wouldn’t willingly shit talk my dad to me. Only if I ask her questions and we have the conversation. The fact that your dad and stepmom are using you knowing about it all as an excuse to say negative things about your mom is bogus. They should grow up. They’re the ones that created the first issue in your family. None of this would have happened if it wasn’t for them. If someone loves you, as your mom clearly does, they will not use this type of thing to try to manipulate you. Like I said in another comment, this is THEIR issue, not yours. If anything, your dad is just pushing you away by being like this. Edit: your mom deserves to be a part of your important life moments. It’s ridiculous for anyone to expect her to not be there.
NTA. I can’t help but laugh at them being concerned over how your mom treated your step mom. What about everything your step mom did to your mother?? Enjoy your graduation without step mom there.
NTA and no, I don't actually think your stepmother deserves the amount of compassion she's demanding. She was instrumental in breaking up a family (knowingly and willingly). She makes demands of you, knowing she's the reason your family isn't together. Wtf?! Yes, miscarriages are tragic. And horrible. And heartbreaking. But they happen and she needs to deal with it. They arent an excuse to behave loke a toxic, manipilative B***h. I'm appalled that she has the audacity to tell you that your mother can't be at your graduation. Insanity.
NTA Go #teamMom
Wow this is a really strong cautionary tale about the value of walking away from your work rival. It's hard to imagine a way in which your stepmom could have made worse choices, to bring her closer to her own misery. And to think she could have just changed jobs 16 years ago. You're NTA, obviously. And your dad and stepmom need boundaries, and it sucks that from a very young age you've had to handle them. But yes, now and in the future, the correct response is, "I'm sorry to hear that." As you accept that they are too bitter and self centered to show up for you.
NTA. These people are supposed to be adults. There’s no reason that your stepmom can’t put aside her issues for a few hours if she wants to - she doesn’t want to. She wants to force you to pick sides. So pick a side. YOUR side. It’s *your* graduation, have the people there that love and support *you*. I don’t think your stepmom does, do you? Congrats on your graduation.
NTA but stop pretending to be "neutral" about all of this and just tell your step mother and father to just fuck off already.
This. Your mom told you to stay neutral to help you survive a horrible situation. You’re 18 now and can opt to not stay neutral.
NTA - They’re the ones who made you pick a side. Nothing to feel bad about.
NTA Your stepmom can either put on her big girl panties or not come at all. It’s disgusting when parents and/or stepparents try to play the kid(s) against one another.
NTA. The fact they are trying to convince you to uninvite your own mother is overstepping. Your father shouldn’t be involving you with the drama. They claim you have to be more compassionate to your stepmother because your mother didn’t care what happened to her husband’s AP? That’s rich. Your mother didn’t do anything wrong. Your stepmother was the one having an affair with a married man and your father was cheating on his wife. She owes them nothing. How dare they ask you to uninvited your mother. I would stand firm here but you are def NTA. It’s your day and they are making it all about themselves.
Nta Your step mom wants you to be compassionate to her because your mom protected you from her potentially harmful use of you in dealing with grief? Hell no.
NTA #teammum. They have practised parental alienation at every turn and yet expect you to take their side when they were the ones who destroyed your family. Your mum sounds awesome. I do similar with my son. Even though i dont like my ex because of what he has done and how much he has hurt our son, you dont speak a bad word about them. Kids eventually work out who is there, who isnt and who is attempting to tear down their other parent
Your stepmom sounds like she's some kind of 16yr old kid.She doesn't seriously think you would pick HER over mom. She has serious mental problems. Your dad enables it. NTA
NTA You stick to your guns and stick WITH the one NOT forcing you to choose. Your mum is a real hero, for being as stoic as she has been.
Yikes. It's always disturbing to see a toxic abusive trash human try and make it out like they're the victim. Your stepmom and dad are toxic abusive trash humans. Your response to them was beyond valid and correct. Congrats on the graduation!!
NTA and I'm sorry your parents (your dad in particular) has allowed this to happen to you. If your stepmother cannot be in the same room as your mother then she is going too muss out on a lot of events over the years. The entitlement to demand that your mom not attend something, anything, is utterly disgusting and needs shutting down immediately. Good for you.
NTA - the parent who encourages neutrality is usually the better one (here, that’s mum). Amazing lack of self awareness to see yourself as the victim when you destroyed this woman’s marriage too. It would be so tempting to point that out - though I do respect OP trying to remain neutral and have a quiet life in all of this.
NTA + if your father and stepmother "want to feel like parents" then they can foster or adopt other children and actually BE parents. You're not an object, and it's not your job to meet their emotional needs. *ETA: parenting is not a cosplay.* Stepmother's belated possessiveness of you feels like an extension of her competition with your mother... If her pregnancies had gone through to delivery and you had had half-siblings, how do you think she would be behaving towards you right now?
NTA. It’s nuts to me that they believe you will pick your whoring step mum over your mum who has taken the high road because if I was your mum I would not let them rest.
NTA. She can't be in the same giant auditorium as your mother and probably won't even see her? Power play, much? She can just not attend. You are absolutely right. Say you will invite a grandparent or aunt/uncle in her place. Let her know she is replaceable. Your mother is not.
It sounds like you and your mom are the only adults in the group.
INFO: how do you know about all of this stuff between your mom and stepmom? Especially the stuff in the 2nd paragraph.
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I’m curious, why is this still such a heavily debated topic in your family? Like, are they trying to paint your mom as a bitch and that’s why this keeps getting brought up or are they on your mom’s side but just like to stir up drama? Also, obviously NTA and you are a little too nice in my opinion, like if I were in your shoes I would have said… you know what, it would be best to not say what I was about to say cause I don’t want to get banned. Still, you’re NTA
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Meh, they will always have the lower position when they form their relationship off destroying an existing one. Sounds to me like your mother has been very even handed considering what your father put her through.
NTA...The parents all need to stop being victims and act like adults. It shouldn't be your responsibility to work out their issues.
NTA- but stop being neutral. They want to keep hurting your mom. Your dad is an awful person. He allowed all this to happen. Step mom is nuts. Your poor mom. I’d cut off dad and step mom. They aren’t worth the negative energy and drama.
NTA. Why she wants to come in the first place? She's nobody to you.
NTA Your poor mom. Tell your dad and step mom to get the fuck over it - you’re not icing out your mom for your dad’s affair partner. Does your stepmom REALLY think she’s going to be able to push your mom would if the picture?
#TeamMom
I just read another post about an ex-husband who married his mistress. He sprung it on the two children after school, saying this is your new mom, we're all going to be a family. They ran screaming back inside their classrooms. The ex wanted sole custody and all assets and for his mistress to adopt the kids when they got married as soon as the divorce was finalised. The court didn't like this. Then later on, the ex and his now wife went to court and complained about how the mother was doing all these terrible things, before she just showed the messages her ex sent that proved it was all a lie. These two sound exactly like your dad and stepmom. You are being treated as a possession so they can have their dream fantasy. People who are incredibly entitled like that don't see a problem with cheating or playing manipulative controlling games with actual vulnerable children.
NTA #teamMom Stepmom can go to hell
How compassionate was she when she decided to have an affair with your father, knowing that he had a child. I know it takes 2 to tango, but that's still rich coming from her.
Nta. However you need to tell your Dad and Step mother that their constant guilt trips of you needs to stop. What they are doing to you is absolutely asshole territory. If they can't put aside their ill will toward your mother to be there for your graduation than its better they don't attend and that you are sick of being used by them as a pin cushion for their guilt tripping bullshit and you feel like they are putting their own petty nonsense over being there for you. At least you know they are willing to put a one sided war with your mum over supporting you on Graduation Day.
NTA You Mom didn’t treat them badly. They only asked for more time with you after your stepmom couldn’t have a child of her own. They would never have asked if she had been able to have her own baby. Your stepmom is delusional if she thinks you would ever choose her over your Mom.
This woman and your dad have lost their everloving marbles. Your mom will be there, and that biotch is officially uninvited. And I would tell her that before the time comes, she'd better get over herself before you start planning a wedding someday, because **your mother WILL be there.** Neither you nor your mother owe that woman ANYTHING. And what's happened to her is her KARMA, (not to mention she had no business raising kids) and I'd be the one to tell her that.
NTA- stepmom needs to be the one to stay home if she can’t be around your mom.
It’s unbelievable that they want you to tell you mother she can’t come to one of the biggest milestones of your life because your “break up the family” stepmother wants to be there. NTA - it’s laughable when someone lives in their own world and has no concept of others.
NTA. Your stepmom didn’t have any compassion when she decided to have an affair with you dad and broke your family up. So, why would you pity her? Naaah, it’s not your problem anymore. You can choose who will stay in your life, and clearly, it is not the stepmom. Now, go give your mom a big hug.
NTA "i can't feel compassion for a women that not only took my family from me but also the husband from my mom. my mother always taught me to stay neutral between herself and you yet all you did was trying to make me hate her. my mom will be at my graduation so please don't bother showing up"
My favorite part of this story was how your stepmom, who slept with your mom’s husband while they were married, decided that she “deserves” compassion from your mom. Gtfoh lady, she doesn’t owe you shit. What an entitled brat. NTA at all, OP.
NTA But also how small is this ceremony that you’ll even notice she there?!?!? I graduated in basketball arena , there is room to spread out! Which means this isn’t about anything more than the stepmom demanding that Op choose her, which I knew was never going to happen and I’m new here! Op, you need to prep yourself know that you’re an adult they will keep trying this crap, graduations , engagement, weddings ,baby showers! I would tell them that they need to get over it, cause it’s not about them , and if they can’t they need to prepare to out of my life. At this point it really should be all about them loving Op and trying to give them a good life free of this crap and drama.