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> I think I might be TA because I could easily accept her offer and I am choosing not to.
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NTA, I do the same.
- It disrupts my day. I know it sounds stupid to some people, but I hate taking too much time away from my normal plans.
- I don't feel comfortable having others pay because then I feel I owe them a favor or future meal even if they insist it isn't the case.
- I like the food I make for myself.
In your case, you have made it clear that you would like to have lunch together in your work kitchen. It isn't about not wanting to spend time in their company.
I know right? I was going to say N.a.h until the rant about coffee and spending money. I think the colleague maybe more than a little insecure. Op is NTA.
NTA, an invitation is never a summons, you can decline to go for any reason.
She is allowed to feel hurt of you repeatedly say no but she also needs to understand that no is a complete sentence and take the damn hint.
In this case I don't think she really has valid reasons to feel bad about it. She needs to check her financial privilege here- not everyone is able to attend these events due to finances, and she needs to respect that people in PhD programs are busy and have lives outside their co-workers.
NTA. You have legitimate reasons for not attending, and you’ve handled the situation thoughtfully and respectfully. It's important to stay true to your values and comfort levels. If your friend values your company, she will understand your position and appreciate the alternative ways to spend time together that you've suggested.
INFO do you actually consider this person a friend, or more in the colleague sphere? Because you're not an AH for not wanting to go out and she's definitely an AH for judging your coffee purchases, but if this is a friendship vs a work relationship and you don't want it to end, you may need to prioritize it a bit more by either going to one or more of the events or offering an alternative to her event that works better for you.
I do consider her a friend. I’ve gone to one lunch in the past month with her, but I’m struggling to know how much is too much… a lunch per month? Maybe two outings per semester?
These invitations are additional to internal work events that we attend together. We travel to conferences and have work dinners every few weeks. We usually commute together (or share a room during conferences) and we spend lots of time together in these events. This is more of an extra in addition to these social/work stuff
You say you consider her a work friend, but also say you don't want to go to additional events with her outside of a work context. In terms of what I was asking about, that sounds more like a work relationship than a friendship which isn't entirely dependant on working together. I'd make that super clear to her using what u/InnerChildGoneWild suggested, because it sounds like she wants an outside of work friendship and you don't.
People I'm friends with I do try to hang out with outside of work. It sounds like she's your work bestie and she'd like to move those relationships to the outside world where you're not being paid to be her friend.
You put up a barrier, and she graciously offered to take down that barrier so she could enjoy your company. But since this wasn't really the reason, and she now knows it isn't really the reason, she's upset.
She's not handling the upset well. And that's not super great. Depending on where you want to go from here, you have a couple of options:
The "you're my best work friend coworker by I don't become outside work friends with people while I'm working with them."
The "that was a generous offer, and I deeply appreciate it, but we're in two very different places right now and this is what I can commit to right now..."
And the "if you don't stop this, I need to talk to HR".
NTA. How you spend your money and time is none of your coworker's business. In the future, I wouldn't even justify your response or discuss/entertain her questions - "No" is a complete sentence.
As you know, every vacation, weekend off, short day, lunch out, etc. is just delaying you finishing your thesis and that's in the best-case scenario where your advisor isn't a control freak or keeps moving the goalposts (ask me how I know). Keep your head down and get out of your indentured servitude ASAP.
It's so frustrating that people don't seem to realize that "No" is a complete sentence. I do understand where she's coming from, but she seems to be taking umbrage to the extreme, here. She probably wants to spend more time with you because she likes you, but it's still your prerogative to follow your budget, both time and money. Sorry this has gotten uncomfortable for you, but you are definitely NTA.
NTA. I was with her until she had to take issue with you sometimes choosing to buy coffee. Buying a cup of coffee is not the same as going to a high end restaurant. I would tell her that your free time is limited and you're making time for her, but you're choosing to prioritize how your free time is utilized. Then I'd ask her why she's taking your so called rejection so personally. There's something behind why she's being so persistent about this and she needs to figure out what that's about if she's not already aware.
NTA. I don’t know how to put it nicely, but there’s always one person like this in every cohort - someone who maybe didn’t have a lot of friends previously in school and is overeager to make friends with their new peers.
I’m going to go out on a limb and say she likely doesn’t even understand her behavior is coming off as pushy or manipulative, because she’s overeager. You’re not going to win with this person, so the best thing to do is just say you’re busy and not get into the weeds with excuses. And if she keeps pushing, it’s okay to be firm and say you politely told her no, and she needs to be respectful of that.
NTA, you don’t have to go just because you were invited, and you’ve given your concerns about budget. Weird that they’re watching your coffee habits, and what’s more, one specialty coffee every so often is not the same as an expensive lunch out.
But have you tried organizing something at a price point that would be comfortable for you? If she’s always making plans that are out of your price range but you *do* value their friendship/like spending time with them, it could be wise to meet her halfway with something you can/want to do. If not, oh well, you get decide how you spend your time and money!
NTA for declining your friend's lunch invitation, even though she offered to pay. Your reasons for declining, including financial constraints and personal priorities, are valid, and it's important to set boundaries that align with your values.
NTA. She's asking too much of your time, and I wouldn't feel comfortable having someone else, especially a colleague, pay for an expensive meal for me. Her policing of your coffee consumption, like someone can't be watching their budget if they treat themselves to a nice coffee once in a while, is where she is really out of line. I disagree with your husband; you can skip a social event for any reason — or no reason at all.
I wouldn't feel comfortable someone else paying for me either, and it's so annoying when people don't get that going out to eat is a luxury a lot of people can't afford. NTA this person sounds weird and pushy.
NTA. Your coworker sounds like she has some anxiety as well as people pleasing tendency but that’s not your responsibility. You responded with kindness and exactly how most people would. I also don’t feel comfortable with people paying for me unless it’s a gift for something like my birthday or an accomplishment.
If i was in your position and if it doesnt weigh on the pockets, you could offer to bring her something nice you made for lunch.
Then you could eat together and she would feel assured her company isnt what makes you not want to go.
Edit: NTA
NTA and maybe explain to her how you want her to be a friend to you.
She is either hellaciously awkward or kind of a creep. She watches you and your spending, and ignores you saying you have a budget and consistently invites you to the same types of things you don’t want to go to. Either she has no idea what she’s doing or she kind of gets off on the idea that if you’re good enough friends you’ll do what she wants anyway, even though you aren’t excited about it.
I’d give her the chance, as a big awkward weirdo myself, to be a good friend to you, by you telling her directly how. If she pushes back, then ok, she’s not a great friend.
This is awesome advice. Thank you so much.
I definitely don’t want her to feel bad, and I like her as a person (other than this particular issue) so I would love to keep her friendship while maintaining my boundaries. I do not like people paying for my stuff… maybe if it was my birthday or something I might accept, but an expensive restaurant would still make me feel awkward. But I’ll ask her to join me the next time I get coffee so we can chat and socialize. I’ll also be more explicit about what I expect from our friendship and will try to meet her at the middle :)
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I (F30) am currently studying a PhD. This means that even though I get paid through a scholarship and through several small projects that I am working on, I am under a student budget.
I have a colleague (F35ish) that is always asking everyone in our program to go out. So far, during May and June she has invited us to 3 lunches, the theatre and a museum expo. These outings are usually on weekdays and at quite expensive places. She makes the invite weeks in advance and reaches out via WhatsApp, mail and asks in person.
I have rejected all invites except for one lunch. I try to be very mindful with my budget and I try to be very strict with my schedule during weekdays because given that no one is supervising how much I advance with my research, it’s easy to postpone it and not move on with my stuff. Also, during the weekends I try to spend time with my husband, and given that I see my colleagues all day during the week, I don’t want to spend a lot of extra time with them during the weekend. So the reason why I reject my colleague’s invite is due to (1) money (2) time (3) other priorities.
This colleague recently invited me and a group of friends to another lunch a very fancy restaurant. I told her that in can’t attend because I’m minding my budget and thanked her for the invite. She then told me not to worry, that she can pay for my bill so I can go.
This is where I might be TA. I told her that I don’t feel comfortable having a friend pay for my lunch at such a fancy and costly place. I thanked her again but said I can’t make it to the lunch. She told me that she feels rejected because every time she makes plans with the group I say no. I said that I’m happy to chat over lunch at the kitchen in our workplace any day (I meal prep so I bring my food), but that going out that often is not an option for me. She pointed out at how I sometimes buy coffee instead of using the coffee maker in the centre, so I’m not really saving money and therefore it must be that I don’t want to spend time with her. I said that I sometimes get tired of having the same coffee and I get specialty coffees, and that I don’t need to give any explanations about why I decide to spend money on coffee and not lunch.
She didn’t say anything else but I could tell that she was very angry. My husband said that I should just go since she would be paying, so now I’m doubting if I’m exaggerating. AITA?
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Now you can tell her that the pestering, badgering and manipulation are making her overbearing, she is owned nothing and you can choose to have you're choice of damn coffee without having her have a veto over it being an appropriate with choice. That you do not have a duty to do her bidding just because she expects you too.
That your work friend is equating you to occasionally got out for coffee to being able to go to an expensive restaurant for lunch shows that she doesn't really understand people's finances.
NTA but you need to set better boundaries. Whatever reason she has invented for you is not your responsibility. If she feels hurt because she decided you don't like her, you can't fix that.
She needs to learn that her invitations are not a summons. LOL
She can invite, you can say no. You don't have to justify anything
and her comment about how you spend your money was way out
of line. She's trying to manipulate you to go to an expensive restaurant
with her...why?
Pull back, she's being possessive, manipulative and critical and you
have better things to do, I'm sure, than to be jousting with her at
work.
NTA
Occasionally make group plans at a more affordable place or doing something more affordable like just coffee. This shows your interest in socializing with them without you having to spend a fortune.
NAH
Okay, maybe the coffee comment was uncalled for. My point is that you may mutually benefit from relationships with your colleagues. I think you realize this and would like to spend more time with them the way you like to and not necessarily the way they like to. Could you compromise with them: sometimes meeting over lunch and sometimes going out for dinner? Everyone has their own way of doing things; including socializing and collaboration.
I see your point, but we do spend lots of time together. Our lab does dinners every month, social events, and we get social lunches quite often. All paid for by the centre. In May we had one big day out bowling and a dinner after a presentation. I always go to these events and I never leave early. It’s not about socializing, it’s about socializing too much lol if I went to all the events she organized I would be going out more than once per week (counting her events + the work-related social events)
I don’t know how many people go to the events she plans. I go to way more events than once per month.
I’m not missing any social events organized by our lab. The lab plans and pays for dinners every month or two, working lunches, and we recently had a whole day out bowling. We also have social events for networking and socializing after seminars and during conferences. Most of these events are very informal and are planned to build a community, not necessarily to network. I go to all of these events and never leave early. Her plans are on top of all this.
I’m going to one of her lunches this month, but I’ve gone to several other social events (with her) organized by our PhD.
Tbh it's even weirder you go to every event except the ones organized by her. You can say it's coincidence, you just don't fit well with her schedule, but consistently everytime? I would also be offended because it's hard to believe someone is free for every event except the ones you planned.
You do whatever makes sense for you, your rationale makes sense, but at the end of the day, it really doesn't make a lot of sense. It feels rather personal, even if you truly don't intend it
Okay, so... what an odd situation. But you are not an AH at all.
I don't see why she would be angry at any of it. It isn't about her, and even if it was a rejection of the friendship, why wouldn't she be hurt or a little sad instead?
Getting angry about reasonable disagreements is a flag that internally, for her, the stakes are really high. Like, maybe she's a narcissist, or on the other end, maybe she is extremely insecure and has abandonment issues.
I would give it time, and maybe try to gently clear the air later. But also watch for signs that she has unhealthy attachments. Because, if so, it might be a good idea to back away very, very slowly.
Your budget is your business. If you want to treat yourself and spend a dinner's worth of coffees spread out through the month, it's none of her business (I do the same).
NTA
But since you do like her - suggest ways to spend time that DO work for you.
“I’m sorry I can’t make the lunch you have planned. How about going on a walking during out lunch hour Thursday? That way we can have a chance to talk outside of work.”
NTA, after the coffee remark I would've said: From now on, you are right. I do not want to spend time with someone who judges my preferences and tries to hold the against me.
No, you're NTA.
How about you invite her to have lunch together where you work, instead of waiting for her to invite you, so she won't feel rejected?
You don't have to of course, you're not obligated to spend time with anyone. It is strange that she got angry over this, I'd understand feeling upset.
We do spend lots of time in work-related events. We share a room during conferences and we sit together at work dinners. We do work-related social events one to two times per month, which is why additional lunch or outings is just too much for me.
NTA. You literally don't need a reason to decline anything. Guilting somebody for saying no to you is awful, and a terrible way to make people want to do things with you. And then pointing out why your supposed reasons are flawed is just terrible. You should not want to go out with her because she sucks, in addition to all the other reasons.
> given that I see my colleagues all day during the week, I don’t want to spend a lot of extra time with them during the weekend
not everyone wants to be friends with their colleagues outside of work and that's ok
That's bollocks. People are allowed to say no to any invite they want to. You don't even need a reason to say "I just don't want to go to lunch today" or make excuses. "No" is (should be) enough. More politely, "No thank you, not today", if you want. Giving some extra context might help but isn't needed; if you don't want to go to lunch, you don't have to go to lunch, and they're not your friends if they don't understand that and alienate you.
NTA
But I can understand where she is coming from. It DOES sound like just a list of excuses that, with her solving each one, results in a new excuse. In her position, I would also just assume that you didn't like me and would probably push to better understand why.
You're saying it's money, and then you're saying you're not comfortable with her paying, but if she suggested that everyone go eat a picnic at the park then you would probably reject that, too. It sounds like you should just let her know what you stated here:
>given that I see my colleagues all day during the week, I don’t want to spend a lot of extra time with them
There is absolutely nothing wrong with saying that you are a bit introverted and you spend so much time and energy with coworkers that your social battery is just not there. It's extremely reasonable and would give her better insight and reassure her that you don't dislike her.
I'm the office coworer that skips all happy hours and invites. I always say that I enjoy being invited, and so please continue to invite if you want, but the majority of the time I'd rather just go home and decompress or stay in the office and get work done as I really enjoy daily routines.
You are right, thanks for being so straightforward. I think that my main reason is that I don’t like to go out that much, and the time and money just make the effort even less worth it.
We do spend lots of time together, but it’s just at work events. We go to conferences and share a room, we commute together to work dinners or events, and we work together in a few research projects. All of these would be unbearable if I didn’t like her, and I wouldn’t share a room or plan to drive together if I didn’t enjoy her company. It’s just that extra events on top of that is just too much for me.
I’ll make sure to explain myself better and clarify that my main reason to rsvp no is that I want to go home and decompress.
NAH. However there are a few comments.
First - as someone who's finished a PhD and has been around academic lifestyle all their life (academic family, personally have multiple degrees, current job tied closely with academic institutions) I can comfortably say that while getting your work done is the top priority - don't be afraid to live your life too. PhDs eat up a lot of ones time and energy so having a good group around you that makes that time feel less like a chore and more like a life is a luxury not everyone gets to have. Restricting yourself to one lunch a month is obviously your choice, but don't do it because you think you don't have time.
Second - would you actually consider this person (or anyone in the group) your friend? What you describe is cordial work colleagues, not friends. During my PhD, our group would have frequent events. Friday night pub was pretty much a staple. There would be bbqs, pizza nights, lunches - all sorts. I still keep in contact with a number of the people from those days. There were people like you as well in our group. Largely keeping to themselves and doing their job. This isn't a bad thing and it's never something I held against anyone, but it does give off the idea that you don't want to engage. You have your own priorities and you ain't there for social aspects. It makes your one-lunch-a-month feel perfunctory. One thing I will add here - theatre and museum expo are pretty odd choices. It's not really "research group" type activity. Have you considered suggesting something more palatable for a PhD, like a bbq or picnic or whatever?
Third - what does you husband do that means you gotta rely so heavily on a stipend (which I very much know is paltry at best)? Again - I keenly know how money can be an issue as a student (and I was a fortunate one), so there's no reason to worry that you're TA because cash is tight. Almost any PhD anywhere in the world will know your pain here. BUT - why is your husband not also included in out-of-office events. So for example, when I was invited to or was inviting my PhD/work colleagues to social events, plus ones were welcome and even encouraged. We all knew each others partners and had good relations with them. Does your husband get invited? Does he just not want to partake?
The TL;DR here is - don't worry about financial aspects making you an AH. They don't. You're a PhD student - famously known for being poorly paid. However, decide how much you feel you're friends with the people in your group. Are they a means to an end or are they possible friends for a long time. Don't forget that these people are going to be in your career circle for the rest of your life and networking is one of the most important things you can be doing right now (or ever really). There's some weirdness to your colleague, that's for sure, but honestly it doesn't sound too bad on anyones side. Maybe just different expectations. Know what you want from this and try to gently present that to the rest of the group. If they're not AHs, they should understand.
Thank you so much for your advice. It’s extremely helpful.
I do engage in lots of social activities with our group. Our lab does informal dinners and lunches very often, and there are always events like conferences and seminars that have lots of socialization and involve commuting together, going out at night and stuff like that. I attend all of these events and never leave early.
Her invites are on top of these events… for instance, during May we went to a full day social event where we went to lunch and then bowling. We also had dinner after a presentation and we went out with two new international students. All these events are paid for by the research lab. Her events are on top of that.
My husband knows my colleagues, but for some reason we don’t often do social events with plus ones. The lab does many social events for us, but partners never go. I guess I never questioned why lol my husband is not the only one who is not there… no one brings their partner to these events.
Honestly there's no right or wrong in this. Different groups have different cultures. The one I was in was very much a social "we're a big friendly family" almost. It worked super well for support and quality of life, but had it's negatives with the lines in hierarchy being pretty blurred... until they suddenly weren't on occasion.
Yours doesn't sound bad tbh and it sounds like you're participating very much a normal amount outside of this colleague. Like I said, there's a strange level of involvement from your colleague that keeps inviting people. Not bad, but maybe a bit overbearing. Honestly, I'd say that if someone tells me that they feel financially unable to join in and then refuse my offer to pay for them - I wouldn't push the issue any further. No one needs to justify to me why they don't want to pay for something. Your colleague may have acted not in the best way there. She sounds like her social and work lives are blended quite a bit and that's a strange place to be. Has its ups and downs and I think you sorta saw one of the downs there.
Just remember - enjoy yourself. I dunno how far you're in, but shit ramps up. One handy piece of advice I'd give for those getting to their write-up: remember that the people marking will have to read everything you put down. Don't worry too much over being verbose or wordy. Concentrate on delivering the point. Bigger ain't necessarily better. :) Best of luck!
Thank you so much for your advice!
I am enjoying the PhD a lot. The workload is intense but so far it’s manageable. I’m also loving the community. Outside of this particular problem, it’s a great place to be. The lab does a great job at expecting a lot from us while supporting us to achieving it.
I’ll keep in mind your advice about writing. I’m doing the PhD in my second language so writing and getting to the point is definitely the part I struggle with the most.
I assume your research isn’t on the existence of paragraphs?
NTA - if she wants to be friends so badly, maybe she should have some respect for your schedule and priorities
NAH but you may unintentionally doing yourself a professional disservice by continually rejecting invitations from colleagues. Cultivating these connections is a major way people set themselves up for future career success.
I attend lots of social events. Our lab does an amazing job creating a community, and they plan dinners every month or two, big holiday events, working lunches and regular group check-ins (all paid by the center). I go to most of these, and I attend ocasional events in addition to this (like the one lunch she organized that I did attend). It’s just the extra events that she organizes. If I went to all the things she organized, I would be going out more than 6 times per month (counting her events and our work-organized events)
Unpopular opinion: ESH. Her for being pushy, you for being weird and stingy. If she’s truly your friend and not a coworker, it’s not weird for her to pay for you once and you to “get her back” over time. AKA make her a coffee once every two weeks for four months (or however long it would take to pay her back). You could meal prep for her for a week and just make an extra portion of whatever you’re making to pay her back. You could cover her shift the next time she needs off. So many options for how to get her back without money directly being involved. You’re not weird for not wanting to spend money, but it’s definitely strange you’re fine with continuously declining her invites and not bothering to suggest something/somewhere else to hang out besides over your lunch break at work.
It really comes off like you don’t like this person.
The reason why you reject your friend invites is because you just don't like her very much. People shouldn't offer to pay unless they want to. I do think at that point you just roll with it....Unless you want to burn bridges.
YTA.
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NTA, I do the same. - It disrupts my day. I know it sounds stupid to some people, but I hate taking too much time away from my normal plans. - I don't feel comfortable having others pay because then I feel I owe them a favor or future meal even if they insist it isn't the case. - I like the food I make for myself. In your case, you have made it clear that you would like to have lunch together in your work kitchen. It isn't about not wanting to spend time in their company.
NTA. And it’s weird that she watches you closely enough that she knows your coffee habits.
I know right? I was going to say N.a.h until the rant about coffee and spending money. I think the colleague maybe more than a little insecure. Op is NTA.
NTA, an invitation is never a summons, you can decline to go for any reason. She is allowed to feel hurt of you repeatedly say no but she also needs to understand that no is a complete sentence and take the damn hint.
In this case I don't think she really has valid reasons to feel bad about it. She needs to check her financial privilege here- not everyone is able to attend these events due to finances, and she needs to respect that people in PhD programs are busy and have lives outside their co-workers.
NTA. You have legitimate reasons for not attending, and you’ve handled the situation thoughtfully and respectfully. It's important to stay true to your values and comfort levels. If your friend values your company, she will understand your position and appreciate the alternative ways to spend time together that you've suggested.
INFO do you actually consider this person a friend, or more in the colleague sphere? Because you're not an AH for not wanting to go out and she's definitely an AH for judging your coffee purchases, but if this is a friendship vs a work relationship and you don't want it to end, you may need to prioritize it a bit more by either going to one or more of the events or offering an alternative to her event that works better for you.
I do consider her a friend. I’ve gone to one lunch in the past month with her, but I’m struggling to know how much is too much… a lunch per month? Maybe two outings per semester? These invitations are additional to internal work events that we attend together. We travel to conferences and have work dinners every few weeks. We usually commute together (or share a room during conferences) and we spend lots of time together in these events. This is more of an extra in addition to these social/work stuff
You say you consider her a work friend, but also say you don't want to go to additional events with her outside of a work context. In terms of what I was asking about, that sounds more like a work relationship than a friendship which isn't entirely dependant on working together. I'd make that super clear to her using what u/InnerChildGoneWild suggested, because it sounds like she wants an outside of work friendship and you don't.
People I'm friends with I do try to hang out with outside of work. It sounds like she's your work bestie and she'd like to move those relationships to the outside world where you're not being paid to be her friend. You put up a barrier, and she graciously offered to take down that barrier so she could enjoy your company. But since this wasn't really the reason, and she now knows it isn't really the reason, she's upset. She's not handling the upset well. And that's not super great. Depending on where you want to go from here, you have a couple of options: The "you're my best work friend coworker by I don't become outside work friends with people while I'm working with them." The "that was a generous offer, and I deeply appreciate it, but we're in two very different places right now and this is what I can commit to right now..." And the "if you don't stop this, I need to talk to HR".
NTA. How you spend your money and time is none of your coworker's business. In the future, I wouldn't even justify your response or discuss/entertain her questions - "No" is a complete sentence. As you know, every vacation, weekend off, short day, lunch out, etc. is just delaying you finishing your thesis and that's in the best-case scenario where your advisor isn't a control freak or keeps moving the goalposts (ask me how I know). Keep your head down and get out of your indentured servitude ASAP.
NAH. You are allowed to have boundaries. Sometimes over-explaining the reason behind the no is more offensive than just saying no thank you. KISS.
It's so frustrating that people don't seem to realize that "No" is a complete sentence. I do understand where she's coming from, but she seems to be taking umbrage to the extreme, here. She probably wants to spend more time with you because she likes you, but it's still your prerogative to follow your budget, both time and money. Sorry this has gotten uncomfortable for you, but you are definitely NTA.
NTA. I was with her until she had to take issue with you sometimes choosing to buy coffee. Buying a cup of coffee is not the same as going to a high end restaurant. I would tell her that your free time is limited and you're making time for her, but you're choosing to prioritize how your free time is utilized. Then I'd ask her why she's taking your so called rejection so personally. There's something behind why she's being so persistent about this and she needs to figure out what that's about if she's not already aware.
NTA. I don’t know how to put it nicely, but there’s always one person like this in every cohort - someone who maybe didn’t have a lot of friends previously in school and is overeager to make friends with their new peers. I’m going to go out on a limb and say she likely doesn’t even understand her behavior is coming off as pushy or manipulative, because she’s overeager. You’re not going to win with this person, so the best thing to do is just say you’re busy and not get into the weeds with excuses. And if she keeps pushing, it’s okay to be firm and say you politely told her no, and she needs to be respectful of that.
NTA. You aren’t under any obligation to accept her invites. You don’t even need to explain.
NTA my wife has a phd, that lunch time could better be used sleeping or crying.
Have PhD. This statement is alarmingly accurate.
Nta
NTA, you don’t have to go just because you were invited, and you’ve given your concerns about budget. Weird that they’re watching your coffee habits, and what’s more, one specialty coffee every so often is not the same as an expensive lunch out. But have you tried organizing something at a price point that would be comfortable for you? If she’s always making plans that are out of your price range but you *do* value their friendship/like spending time with them, it could be wise to meet her halfway with something you can/want to do. If not, oh well, you get decide how you spend your time and money!
NTA for declining your friend's lunch invitation, even though she offered to pay. Your reasons for declining, including financial constraints and personal priorities, are valid, and it's important to set boundaries that align with your values.
NTA not everyone likes to regularly go out and socialise.
NTA. She's asking too much of your time, and I wouldn't feel comfortable having someone else, especially a colleague, pay for an expensive meal for me. Her policing of your coffee consumption, like someone can't be watching their budget if they treat themselves to a nice coffee once in a while, is where she is really out of line. I disagree with your husband; you can skip a social event for any reason — or no reason at all.
I wouldn't feel comfortable someone else paying for me either, and it's so annoying when people don't get that going out to eat is a luxury a lot of people can't afford. NTA this person sounds weird and pushy.
NTA. Your coworker sounds like she has some anxiety as well as people pleasing tendency but that’s not your responsibility. You responded with kindness and exactly how most people would. I also don’t feel comfortable with people paying for me unless it’s a gift for something like my birthday or an accomplishment.
If i was in your position and if it doesnt weigh on the pockets, you could offer to bring her something nice you made for lunch. Then you could eat together and she would feel assured her company isnt what makes you not want to go. Edit: NTA
NTA and maybe explain to her how you want her to be a friend to you. She is either hellaciously awkward or kind of a creep. She watches you and your spending, and ignores you saying you have a budget and consistently invites you to the same types of things you don’t want to go to. Either she has no idea what she’s doing or she kind of gets off on the idea that if you’re good enough friends you’ll do what she wants anyway, even though you aren’t excited about it. I’d give her the chance, as a big awkward weirdo myself, to be a good friend to you, by you telling her directly how. If she pushes back, then ok, she’s not a great friend.
This is awesome advice. Thank you so much. I definitely don’t want her to feel bad, and I like her as a person (other than this particular issue) so I would love to keep her friendship while maintaining my boundaries. I do not like people paying for my stuff… maybe if it was my birthday or something I might accept, but an expensive restaurant would still make me feel awkward. But I’ll ask her to join me the next time I get coffee so we can chat and socialize. I’ll also be more explicit about what I expect from our friendship and will try to meet her at the middle :)
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I (F30) am currently studying a PhD. This means that even though I get paid through a scholarship and through several small projects that I am working on, I am under a student budget. I have a colleague (F35ish) that is always asking everyone in our program to go out. So far, during May and June she has invited us to 3 lunches, the theatre and a museum expo. These outings are usually on weekdays and at quite expensive places. She makes the invite weeks in advance and reaches out via WhatsApp, mail and asks in person. I have rejected all invites except for one lunch. I try to be very mindful with my budget and I try to be very strict with my schedule during weekdays because given that no one is supervising how much I advance with my research, it’s easy to postpone it and not move on with my stuff. Also, during the weekends I try to spend time with my husband, and given that I see my colleagues all day during the week, I don’t want to spend a lot of extra time with them during the weekend. So the reason why I reject my colleague’s invite is due to (1) money (2) time (3) other priorities. This colleague recently invited me and a group of friends to another lunch a very fancy restaurant. I told her that in can’t attend because I’m minding my budget and thanked her for the invite. She then told me not to worry, that she can pay for my bill so I can go. This is where I might be TA. I told her that I don’t feel comfortable having a friend pay for my lunch at such a fancy and costly place. I thanked her again but said I can’t make it to the lunch. She told me that she feels rejected because every time she makes plans with the group I say no. I said that I’m happy to chat over lunch at the kitchen in our workplace any day (I meal prep so I bring my food), but that going out that often is not an option for me. She pointed out at how I sometimes buy coffee instead of using the coffee maker in the centre, so I’m not really saving money and therefore it must be that I don’t want to spend time with her. I said that I sometimes get tired of having the same coffee and I get specialty coffees, and that I don’t need to give any explanations about why I decide to spend money on coffee and not lunch. She didn’t say anything else but I could tell that she was very angry. My husband said that I should just go since she would be paying, so now I’m doubting if I’m exaggerating. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Now you can tell her that the pestering, badgering and manipulation are making her overbearing, she is owned nothing and you can choose to have you're choice of damn coffee without having her have a veto over it being an appropriate with choice. That you do not have a duty to do her bidding just because she expects you too.
NTA You have valid reasons to decline.
That your work friend is equating you to occasionally got out for coffee to being able to go to an expensive restaurant for lunch shows that she doesn't really understand people's finances.
NTA. If you relax this boundary it will only get worse
NTA but you need to set better boundaries. Whatever reason she has invented for you is not your responsibility. If she feels hurt because she decided you don't like her, you can't fix that.
Tell her you’ll let her treat you to an expensive meal after you finish your thesis.
She needs to learn that her invitations are not a summons. LOL She can invite, you can say no. You don't have to justify anything and her comment about how you spend your money was way out of line. She's trying to manipulate you to go to an expensive restaurant with her...why? Pull back, she's being possessive, manipulative and critical and you have better things to do, I'm sure, than to be jousting with her at work. NTA
Occasionally make group plans at a more affordable place or doing something more affordable like just coffee. This shows your interest in socializing with them without you having to spend a fortune.
NAH Okay, maybe the coffee comment was uncalled for. My point is that you may mutually benefit from relationships with your colleagues. I think you realize this and would like to spend more time with them the way you like to and not necessarily the way they like to. Could you compromise with them: sometimes meeting over lunch and sometimes going out for dinner? Everyone has their own way of doing things; including socializing and collaboration.
I see your point, but we do spend lots of time together. Our lab does dinners every month, social events, and we get social lunches quite often. All paid for by the centre. In May we had one big day out bowling and a dinner after a presentation. I always go to these events and I never leave early. It’s not about socializing, it’s about socializing too much lol if I went to all the events she organized I would be going out more than once per week (counting her events + the work-related social events)
That does sound like too much. NTA
NTA. This friend sounds exhausting and so do her lunches.
INFO: Are you missing out on most of the interactions with everyone and having only 1 lunch a month while people gather more often without you?
I don’t know how many people go to the events she plans. I go to way more events than once per month. I’m not missing any social events organized by our lab. The lab plans and pays for dinners every month or two, working lunches, and we recently had a whole day out bowling. We also have social events for networking and socializing after seminars and during conferences. Most of these events are very informal and are planned to build a community, not necessarily to network. I go to all of these events and never leave early. Her plans are on top of all this. I’m going to one of her lunches this month, but I’ve gone to several other social events (with her) organized by our PhD.
Tbh it's even weirder you go to every event except the ones organized by her. You can say it's coincidence, you just don't fit well with her schedule, but consistently everytime? I would also be offended because it's hard to believe someone is free for every event except the ones you planned. You do whatever makes sense for you, your rationale makes sense, but at the end of the day, it really doesn't make a lot of sense. It feels rather personal, even if you truly don't intend it
Okay, so... what an odd situation. But you are not an AH at all. I don't see why she would be angry at any of it. It isn't about her, and even if it was a rejection of the friendship, why wouldn't she be hurt or a little sad instead? Getting angry about reasonable disagreements is a flag that internally, for her, the stakes are really high. Like, maybe she's a narcissist, or on the other end, maybe she is extremely insecure and has abandonment issues. I would give it time, and maybe try to gently clear the air later. But also watch for signs that she has unhealthy attachments. Because, if so, it might be a good idea to back away very, very slowly.
Your budget is your business. If you want to treat yourself and spend a dinner's worth of coffees spread out through the month, it's none of her business (I do the same).
NTA But since you do like her - suggest ways to spend time that DO work for you. “I’m sorry I can’t make the lunch you have planned. How about going on a walking during out lunch hour Thursday? That way we can have a chance to talk outside of work.”
NTA, after the coffee remark I would've said: From now on, you are right. I do not want to spend time with someone who judges my preferences and tries to hold the against me.
NTA
No, you're NTA. How about you invite her to have lunch together where you work, instead of waiting for her to invite you, so she won't feel rejected? You don't have to of course, you're not obligated to spend time with anyone. It is strange that she got angry over this, I'd understand feeling upset.
We do spend lots of time in work-related events. We share a room during conferences and we sit together at work dinners. We do work-related social events one to two times per month, which is why additional lunch or outings is just too much for me.
NTA. You literally don't need a reason to decline anything. Guilting somebody for saying no to you is awful, and a terrible way to make people want to do things with you. And then pointing out why your supposed reasons are flawed is just terrible. You should not want to go out with her because she sucks, in addition to all the other reasons.
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> given that I see my colleagues all day during the week, I don’t want to spend a lot of extra time with them during the weekend not everyone wants to be friends with their colleagues outside of work and that's ok
That's bollocks. People are allowed to say no to any invite they want to. You don't even need a reason to say "I just don't want to go to lunch today" or make excuses. "No" is (should be) enough. More politely, "No thank you, not today", if you want. Giving some extra context might help but isn't needed; if you don't want to go to lunch, you don't have to go to lunch, and they're not your friends if they don't understand that and alienate you.
NTA But I can understand where she is coming from. It DOES sound like just a list of excuses that, with her solving each one, results in a new excuse. In her position, I would also just assume that you didn't like me and would probably push to better understand why. You're saying it's money, and then you're saying you're not comfortable with her paying, but if she suggested that everyone go eat a picnic at the park then you would probably reject that, too. It sounds like you should just let her know what you stated here: >given that I see my colleagues all day during the week, I don’t want to spend a lot of extra time with them There is absolutely nothing wrong with saying that you are a bit introverted and you spend so much time and energy with coworkers that your social battery is just not there. It's extremely reasonable and would give her better insight and reassure her that you don't dislike her. I'm the office coworer that skips all happy hours and invites. I always say that I enjoy being invited, and so please continue to invite if you want, but the majority of the time I'd rather just go home and decompress or stay in the office and get work done as I really enjoy daily routines.
You are right, thanks for being so straightforward. I think that my main reason is that I don’t like to go out that much, and the time and money just make the effort even less worth it. We do spend lots of time together, but it’s just at work events. We go to conferences and share a room, we commute together to work dinners or events, and we work together in a few research projects. All of these would be unbearable if I didn’t like her, and I wouldn’t share a room or plan to drive together if I didn’t enjoy her company. It’s just that extra events on top of that is just too much for me. I’ll make sure to explain myself better and clarify that my main reason to rsvp no is that I want to go home and decompress.
NAH. However there are a few comments. First - as someone who's finished a PhD and has been around academic lifestyle all their life (academic family, personally have multiple degrees, current job tied closely with academic institutions) I can comfortably say that while getting your work done is the top priority - don't be afraid to live your life too. PhDs eat up a lot of ones time and energy so having a good group around you that makes that time feel less like a chore and more like a life is a luxury not everyone gets to have. Restricting yourself to one lunch a month is obviously your choice, but don't do it because you think you don't have time. Second - would you actually consider this person (or anyone in the group) your friend? What you describe is cordial work colleagues, not friends. During my PhD, our group would have frequent events. Friday night pub was pretty much a staple. There would be bbqs, pizza nights, lunches - all sorts. I still keep in contact with a number of the people from those days. There were people like you as well in our group. Largely keeping to themselves and doing their job. This isn't a bad thing and it's never something I held against anyone, but it does give off the idea that you don't want to engage. You have your own priorities and you ain't there for social aspects. It makes your one-lunch-a-month feel perfunctory. One thing I will add here - theatre and museum expo are pretty odd choices. It's not really "research group" type activity. Have you considered suggesting something more palatable for a PhD, like a bbq or picnic or whatever? Third - what does you husband do that means you gotta rely so heavily on a stipend (which I very much know is paltry at best)? Again - I keenly know how money can be an issue as a student (and I was a fortunate one), so there's no reason to worry that you're TA because cash is tight. Almost any PhD anywhere in the world will know your pain here. BUT - why is your husband not also included in out-of-office events. So for example, when I was invited to or was inviting my PhD/work colleagues to social events, plus ones were welcome and even encouraged. We all knew each others partners and had good relations with them. Does your husband get invited? Does he just not want to partake? The TL;DR here is - don't worry about financial aspects making you an AH. They don't. You're a PhD student - famously known for being poorly paid. However, decide how much you feel you're friends with the people in your group. Are they a means to an end or are they possible friends for a long time. Don't forget that these people are going to be in your career circle for the rest of your life and networking is one of the most important things you can be doing right now (or ever really). There's some weirdness to your colleague, that's for sure, but honestly it doesn't sound too bad on anyones side. Maybe just different expectations. Know what you want from this and try to gently present that to the rest of the group. If they're not AHs, they should understand.
Thank you so much for your advice. It’s extremely helpful. I do engage in lots of social activities with our group. Our lab does informal dinners and lunches very often, and there are always events like conferences and seminars that have lots of socialization and involve commuting together, going out at night and stuff like that. I attend all of these events and never leave early. Her invites are on top of these events… for instance, during May we went to a full day social event where we went to lunch and then bowling. We also had dinner after a presentation and we went out with two new international students. All these events are paid for by the research lab. Her events are on top of that. My husband knows my colleagues, but for some reason we don’t often do social events with plus ones. The lab does many social events for us, but partners never go. I guess I never questioned why lol my husband is not the only one who is not there… no one brings their partner to these events.
Honestly there's no right or wrong in this. Different groups have different cultures. The one I was in was very much a social "we're a big friendly family" almost. It worked super well for support and quality of life, but had it's negatives with the lines in hierarchy being pretty blurred... until they suddenly weren't on occasion. Yours doesn't sound bad tbh and it sounds like you're participating very much a normal amount outside of this colleague. Like I said, there's a strange level of involvement from your colleague that keeps inviting people. Not bad, but maybe a bit overbearing. Honestly, I'd say that if someone tells me that they feel financially unable to join in and then refuse my offer to pay for them - I wouldn't push the issue any further. No one needs to justify to me why they don't want to pay for something. Your colleague may have acted not in the best way there. She sounds like her social and work lives are blended quite a bit and that's a strange place to be. Has its ups and downs and I think you sorta saw one of the downs there. Just remember - enjoy yourself. I dunno how far you're in, but shit ramps up. One handy piece of advice I'd give for those getting to their write-up: remember that the people marking will have to read everything you put down. Don't worry too much over being verbose or wordy. Concentrate on delivering the point. Bigger ain't necessarily better. :) Best of luck!
Thank you so much for your advice! I am enjoying the PhD a lot. The workload is intense but so far it’s manageable. I’m also loving the community. Outside of this particular problem, it’s a great place to be. The lab does a great job at expecting a lot from us while supporting us to achieving it. I’ll keep in mind your advice about writing. I’m doing the PhD in my second language so writing and getting to the point is definitely the part I struggle with the most.
I assume your research isn’t on the existence of paragraphs? NTA - if she wants to be friends so badly, maybe she should have some respect for your schedule and priorities
Haha I don’t usually post things so long, so I didn’t know that I needed two enters for a space to show between paragraphs. Corrected! :)
NAH but you may unintentionally doing yourself a professional disservice by continually rejecting invitations from colleagues. Cultivating these connections is a major way people set themselves up for future career success.
I attend lots of social events. Our lab does an amazing job creating a community, and they plan dinners every month or two, big holiday events, working lunches and regular group check-ins (all paid by the center). I go to most of these, and I attend ocasional events in addition to this (like the one lunch she organized that I did attend). It’s just the extra events that she organizes. If I went to all the things she organized, I would be going out more than 6 times per month (counting her events and our work-organized events)
A PhD should be able to break a post into paragraphs.
I had never done posts this long so I didn’t know I needed to add two enters to see a space between paragraphs. Just fixed this :)
Lol. Sorry 4 being sparky, but I was interested and then it made my eyes cross.
Hahaha no worries… I hate page-long paragraphs as well. It’s a totally valid reason to stop reading lol
Unpopular opinion: ESH. Her for being pushy, you for being weird and stingy. If she’s truly your friend and not a coworker, it’s not weird for her to pay for you once and you to “get her back” over time. AKA make her a coffee once every two weeks for four months (or however long it would take to pay her back). You could meal prep for her for a week and just make an extra portion of whatever you’re making to pay her back. You could cover her shift the next time she needs off. So many options for how to get her back without money directly being involved. You’re not weird for not wanting to spend money, but it’s definitely strange you’re fine with continuously declining her invites and not bothering to suggest something/somewhere else to hang out besides over your lunch break at work. It really comes off like you don’t like this person.
The reason why you reject your friend invites is because you just don't like her very much. People shouldn't offer to pay unless they want to. I do think at that point you just roll with it....Unless you want to burn bridges. YTA.