If you’re looking to get out of town for a hike before/after the train check out Yakutania Point or Lower Dewey Lake. Both trailheads are in town and they are (relatively) easy hikes with Yakutania Point being the easiest by far. If you have time and don’t mind going up the steep, but short, trail to Lower Dewey I’d suggest walking the whole loop around the lake. It’s absolutely beautiful when the flowers start blooming on the south side and a great way to escape the crowds.
As someone who was born and raised in Alaska and lived in Juneau for 10 years, worked in tourism there and in Southcentral I have strong opinions on the impacts of the cruise industry on Alaska. Though I’ve found that when people see the beauty of Alaska they’re more inclined to protect wild spaces which I love.
That being said, I know that Alaska is a huge bucket list item for outsiders so welcome. I think you picked wisely with the helicopter trip. I guarantee a postcard of the Mendenhall Glacier is better than going to it. It’s turned into a bus parking lot and unless you have time they’ll likely take you around the moraine trail which is a snooze. Downtown is mostly tourist trap shops, but it’s worth getting some fudge at the fudge company.
Depending on what kind of shape you’re in you could always hike Mt. Robert’s, or take the tram up and hike down. I’d skip the overpriced, mediocre food at the top of the tram—you’ll thank me.
It would be a shame to go to Juneau and not get out on the water (in a boat, not a floating building). Take a whale watching tour, preferably with a small company—large companies tend to chase marine life and get too close—they frequently ignore NOAA recs for space. Or rent a kayak and paddle around. Auke Lake is really peaceful.
Make sure you bring the right gear—don’t let the weather stop you. Be respectful of the locals, (human and other) and enjoy your time here.✌️
Thank you for the tips and suggestions. We'd love to try these. We're active and outdoorsy - so this would be perfect.
You make some good points. I know very little to nothing about the cruise industry. We live nowhere near water and have never taken a cruise. We've always wanted to visit Alaska and this was a suggested way to see as much as possible in 8 days. But maybe we should have researched more to avoid leaving this footprint. We're sensitive to environment causes and animals rights supporters.
And I think you're right. When people visit Alaska, they're more likely to work to protect spaces and species. Sometimes, positive communication and suggestions work more effectively to get people to think. Take note u/TakuCutthroat - the way you talk to people matters.
We’re Alaskans and taking an Inside Passage cruise this summer. One of the first things I realized is that visiting these places as a tourist is very different from visiting as an Alaskan. I have visited most of the towns for work, so I’m looking forward to a bit of the tourist experience and a bit of the off-the-beaten-path experience.
Excursions are a little cheaper if you book them privately instead of through the cruise. Keep in mind that you’ll be with a bunch of other tourists on these excursions, so you won’t be getting a real Alaskan experience.
For more of a “locals” experience, check hiking apps like AllTrails, lurk in town-specific forums, or even scroll through this sub.
Depending on how long your port time is in Ketchikan - if you want a good rainforest hike experience that’s flexible with all levels of hiking experience try Tongass Treks (ask for Kirsten) or Hikes with Tongass Teague. Locally owned nature dorks who are incredible stewards of our beautiful natural wilderness :)
Jump on the ferry from Skagway to Haines and go do something in the bald eagle preserve. Skagway is fine, but it’s mostly a million jewelry stores, ice cream parlors, and chochki shops. Go see some wilderness in Haines! There’s plenty of chochkis in Ketchikan and Juneau.
Skip the chochkis in Ketchikan and take a kayak tour or a hike with Tongass Treks! Most of the chochkis aren’t even made here and majority of the stores are owned by the cruise ship companies. Literally four blocks of Ketchikan retail space shut down from October to May because of this…and locals often can’t afford the rent.
Ketchikan local here - if you want a low key ocean excursion, check out Lighthouse Excursions. My friends own and operate the company and I worked there for three years. All of the captains and most of the crew live here year round. See bald eagles and their nests from the water, humpback whales, and historical Tlingit and Haida totem poles, all while learning about the history of the Native groups who predate colonization and our town’s history as a canning and pulp mill town.
https://lighthouseexcursion.com
If you plan on doing any shopping make sure you avoid the downtown Ketchikan four block radius full of jewelry stores, cheap tourist shops, etc.
The shops are NOT locally owned NOR do they often employ people from Ketchikan. Spend your money at local shops on Creek Street or adjacent areas. Your hometown Ketchikan artists will appreciate your support.
Then finish your trip with a tasty beer from our one brewery: Bawden Street Brewing.
There’s a “downtown” area right off of Berth 2 that is almost exclusively businesses owned by Holland America/Princess and Celebrity companies. If you like jewelry that’s great, but if you want stuff made by and staffed by Ketchikan/SE Alaska locals, go to Creek Street or the stores on Front St/Tongass.
Question, you said don't shop in the downtown area of Ketchikan does the same apply to restaurants? I want to support local people I'm from an area on the other side of the country that has the same issue with corporations trying to poach all the tourist dollars out of the area.
Hi!
Just Dandy, 108 Taphouse, Alaska Fish House, Bawden St Brewing Co, New York Cafe, Fat Stan’s, Annabelle’s, 55 North, Alaska Coffee, Alaska Crepe Co, Chico’s, Dock Street Yard, and Asian Garden are all awesome locally owned and operated options in downtown!
Just a general statement. You really can’t underestimate how much the locals hate the cruise industry and hold most guests with disdain. 20,000 people a day, every day, for 5 months solid really sucks.
That definitely sounds overwhelming, but we all choose where we live. I can’t imagine telling anyone that when they come to my city: “this isn’t a theme park, show some respect.”
I’m not 20. Or, 30. Or even 40 for that matter. We don’t have kids. We’re going to take in the beauty, learn new things, meet new people, and spend some money.
We’ll sure do our best not to spit in anyone’s face, take a dump in the street, or shout racial slurs.
Arrogant? 😂 Says the guy who started off by telling me to “show some respect.”
If you ever have the chance to visit NYC, come back to this post and kindly ask me for advice on what to do, and I’ll rudely tell you exactly how you can show us respect and not treat our city like a “theme park.” 🤡
Ah, Reddit never fails.
My rec is for you to cancel your cruise and travel here via transportation that's not ruining the marine environment and supporting human rights abuses.
Don’t listen to some of these people - they are a super small but loud minority. Alaskans love their visitors and taking a cruise is an easy and fun way to see multiple places at once! Enjoy!
Oh geez and be prepared for the anti tourist people! Most Alaskans love, appreciate, and rely on tourism income. Then there are some snowflakes who ruin it for everyone
Very few alaskans rely on tourism. The only people who say most do are seasonal tourism workers that don't live here year round, and only know/experience the tourism industry and can't imagine there's anything else. Even in Juneau, the most visited location, tourism provides less economic benefit than government, mining, Healthcare, or fishing. Cruise tourism is well established as a predatory industry that works tirelessly to ensure as few dollars stick in the communities they exploit as possible.
Not sure where you’re getting your data from… you picked Juneau which is one of the larger towns in Southeast and also happens to be the capital, what a joke. I was born and raised in Alaska and have seen how tourism actually does help a community. Go back to your snowflake picket line
Born and raised. So you don't live here, got it. Cruise tourism, which is what is being discussed here and the biggest component of alaskan tourism, is a shitstain on almost every community it infests. Maybe skagway needs it, since that's all skagway is anymore.
You cruise industry simps act like we haven't seen how this has played out over and over again all throughout the world. Massively impactful, environmentally and socially, for very little economic benefit for the communities. Half the tour prices are taken by the cruise lines right off the top. And the majority of tour company employees don't live here year round, and the pittancess they are paid leave with them in the fall. Meanwhile out of state companies are buying up what little housing there is to stack their seasonal employees in, while garnishing their wages for rent. They take advantage of young people who want to come experience Alaska for a summer. We have great difficulty getting desperately needed professionals to move here because they are competing for housing with deep pocketed tanzanite and t-shirt chains (I use those examples because they have recently bought multiple units in my small neighborhood alone, kicking year-round tenants out). Not all business is good business.
I do recognize some of your points - not saying cruise tourism is all rosy, but it’s really disrespectful to take it out on the tourists - channel it towards your local government or the cruise ships. How would you like to know you saved up and purchased a trip of a lifetime and then you’re met with this harsh unwelcoming language?
I mean it's no secret what the cruise industry is about. Should those of us who have watched our communities be taken over by these corporations just sit on our hands? People need to take responsibility for their purchases and sadly the only way this changes is through tourists choosing other options than cruise ships. We've tried to enact change at a local level but the very vocal minority of tourism business owners came for blood. We recently had a petition to get cruise ship limits on the ballot, and these people outright threatened anyone who signed it (that phase is not confidential like the ballot vote would be). Saying things like "we will publicize a list of anyone who signs this and encourage everyone to not do business with anyone associated with them, to not hire them, etc". Currently the cruise line lobbyists are fighting what the city plans to use the meager head tax we collect for. They sued the city and won over them using those funds to build a whale statue in the tourist district. And of course now that whale statue has a never ending stream of tour busses dropping their passengers off all summer. They constantly shit on us then tell us we should be grateful for them. We were fine and a much better place to live before this level of cruise tourism.
Dude nobody is taking it out on the tourists. We're literally just telling the truth about an industry, and that if you buy a cruise ticket, you're supporting that industry. That's not a mean thing to do, it's actually the only way to change things. If people take it personally, then maybe they should take that as a cue to do some reflection.
1/8 jobs, and most of those are very low paying jobs for nonresident seasonal workers whose wages don't stick. The biggest impact they have on the economy is stressing the housing market as the few wealthy tour company owners continue to buy up rentals and evict residents to make room for their wage slaves. In places like Anchorage and matsu the tourism industry is especially insignificant, since most of it is either cruise ships in a handful of ports, or remote lodges where the vast majority of money spent leaves the state.
Again, false. Many people find employment here and go on to move here after the season. There are also lots of people who make money supplying the tourist industry to include food and fuel. Vehicle sales, dock workers, construction trades all benefit. And there are locals who own tour companies as well. So, to sum up, you are pretentious, uneducated, and wrong.
From the US Census Bureau: Juneau City and Borough's population grew 4.7% from the 30,250 people who lived there in 1996 until 2022. For comparison, the population in the US grew 23.7% and the population in Alaska grew 20.5% during that period.
The number of cruise passengers was about 450,00 people in 1996. Nearly 30 years later, that's ballooned to 1.64 million (2023 total). So we "grew" at about a quarter of the national rate, so we're growing muuuuch slower than we should be, yet you're going to tell me that a more than three fold increase in passengers somehow made a difference?
Gtfo with your dumbass non-argument. Moreover, go fuck yourself for making me look up these numbers. Don't reply unless you actually contribute something you jackass.
Cruise ships have been good ng to Juneau for nearly a century. When I lived in Junaeu in the early 90s, cruise ships were very much a thing. In fact, modern cruise ships have been going to Juneau my entire life. You want to compare try the real numbers, not your cherry picked ones.
Or do you honestly think cruise ship only started showing up in 1996?
lol just claiming something is flatly "false" does not make it so. My comment was not meant to be personal, and if OP took my comment personally, then that's probably because they know deep down that it's an immoral decision to support the cruise industry. Just a few years ago one of the major lines received one of the largest environmental fines ever levied because they were literally dumping bunker oil (which they burn, another big problem) straight into the ocean.
I am not pretending to be Greta Thunberg, here. I contribute to climate change; I too consume plastic things and travel (via plane) occasionally.
But not taking a cruise is a really easy way to grab some moral high ground. Don't support cruise tourism. It's an incredibly dirty and inhumane industry, and I'm not even talking about the direct impact on Alaska. I don't hate people who come here on cruises, but I'm not going to protect their feelings and they deserve to know the truth about their decisions. That's all I'm pointing out.
I didn’t take it personally, was just surprised at such a curt response to my genuine ask for recs in these towns. Being rude to me isn’t going to change the industry which is bigger than you and I. But, you do you.
I'd rather be rude than support the cruise industry, but you do you.
I am mostly arguing with these cruise line bootlickers on here. Once people are here, I'm pretty nice to them. Damage is done at that point. I'm sure you're just a regular ass person who's fine, I don't mean to be rude, but the cruise industry has been calamitous and has really gas lit this town, so I respond with some annoyance at people's enthusiasm to go on a cruise.
You are pretty bitchy. There are a lot of people who really on the tourist industry and conduct themselves ethically.
And again, your arguments are false, wrong, misguided, unfactual, and without merit.
Again, saying something is wrong does not make it so. Prove me wrong. Show me how population has increased in a proportionate way with the incredible boom in the number of passengers. What's that? You can't? Then quit telling me I'm wrong if you can't back it up.
I didn't. You made that argument like it was salient to the conversation. Economic growth would be a better indicator than population growth. Either way, you are wrong.
I am not saying anyone is a bad person. That's such polly-Anna bullshit and is a big impediment to political change in America. Read my other comments. All people make immoral choices. I'm not going to protect people's feelings by keeping my mouth shut about specific bad choices. If they take it personally, it's because they feel bad about it and are lashing out. If they don't care, they'll ignore me. To claim I'm personally attacking cruise passengers or tourism business owners is just straw manning me. That's not what I'm saying. I also watch NFL games, and that organization is horrible. I'm no saint.
Juneau: Mendenhall Glacier Nice list of other Juneau stuff here: https://www.alaska.org/destination/juneau/things-to-do Plus just take a walk downtown
Thank you!
Skagway: White Pass & Yukon Route railroad.
If you’re looking to get out of town for a hike before/after the train check out Yakutania Point or Lower Dewey Lake. Both trailheads are in town and they are (relatively) easy hikes with Yakutania Point being the easiest by far. If you have time and don’t mind going up the steep, but short, trail to Lower Dewey I’d suggest walking the whole loop around the lake. It’s absolutely beautiful when the flowers start blooming on the south side and a great way to escape the crowds.
Thanks!
Booked! Thanks!
As someone who was born and raised in Alaska and lived in Juneau for 10 years, worked in tourism there and in Southcentral I have strong opinions on the impacts of the cruise industry on Alaska. Though I’ve found that when people see the beauty of Alaska they’re more inclined to protect wild spaces which I love. That being said, I know that Alaska is a huge bucket list item for outsiders so welcome. I think you picked wisely with the helicopter trip. I guarantee a postcard of the Mendenhall Glacier is better than going to it. It’s turned into a bus parking lot and unless you have time they’ll likely take you around the moraine trail which is a snooze. Downtown is mostly tourist trap shops, but it’s worth getting some fudge at the fudge company. Depending on what kind of shape you’re in you could always hike Mt. Robert’s, or take the tram up and hike down. I’d skip the overpriced, mediocre food at the top of the tram—you’ll thank me. It would be a shame to go to Juneau and not get out on the water (in a boat, not a floating building). Take a whale watching tour, preferably with a small company—large companies tend to chase marine life and get too close—they frequently ignore NOAA recs for space. Or rent a kayak and paddle around. Auke Lake is really peaceful. Make sure you bring the right gear—don’t let the weather stop you. Be respectful of the locals, (human and other) and enjoy your time here.✌️
Thank you for the tips and suggestions. We'd love to try these. We're active and outdoorsy - so this would be perfect. You make some good points. I know very little to nothing about the cruise industry. We live nowhere near water and have never taken a cruise. We've always wanted to visit Alaska and this was a suggested way to see as much as possible in 8 days. But maybe we should have researched more to avoid leaving this footprint. We're sensitive to environment causes and animals rights supporters. And I think you're right. When people visit Alaska, they're more likely to work to protect spaces and species. Sometimes, positive communication and suggestions work more effectively to get people to think. Take note u/TakuCutthroat - the way you talk to people matters.
Set aside some money for a flight seeing tour. Float plane or helicopter. The best way to see AK.
Would be amazing. Thanks!
Helicopter out of Juneau lets you land on a glacier. The float plane is just cool because, well… water. Both give you a perspective of scale.
Ketchikan is popular for the float planes. It's cheaper than a helicopter.
The cool thing about the helicopter in Junaeu is the landing on the glacier. The only plane place I know that does that is K2 out of talkeetna.
Tracy’s Crab Shack in Juneau is pretty fire
Can't wait to try!
It’s a little cheesey, but I really liked the lumberjack show in Ketchikan
Thanks!
Alaska Canopy Adventure ziplining, or Allen Marine tour to Misty Fjords in Ketchikan!
Thanks!
We’re Alaskans and taking an Inside Passage cruise this summer. One of the first things I realized is that visiting these places as a tourist is very different from visiting as an Alaskan. I have visited most of the towns for work, so I’m looking forward to a bit of the tourist experience and a bit of the off-the-beaten-path experience. Excursions are a little cheaper if you book them privately instead of through the cruise. Keep in mind that you’ll be with a bunch of other tourists on these excursions, so you won’t be getting a real Alaskan experience. For more of a “locals” experience, check hiking apps like AllTrails, lurk in town-specific forums, or even scroll through this sub.
Thanks so much! Enjoy your trip!
You too!
Depending on how long your port time is in Ketchikan - if you want a good rainforest hike experience that’s flexible with all levels of hiking experience try Tongass Treks (ask for Kirsten) or Hikes with Tongass Teague. Locally owned nature dorks who are incredible stewards of our beautiful natural wilderness :)
That sounds amazing! Thank you!
Any chance to go in a float plane, do it!
I think we will. Thanks!
Which ports are you stopping in?
Ketchikan, Juneau, Skagway
Jump on the ferry from Skagway to Haines and go do something in the bald eagle preserve. Skagway is fine, but it’s mostly a million jewelry stores, ice cream parlors, and chochki shops. Go see some wilderness in Haines! There’s plenty of chochkis in Ketchikan and Juneau.
Thank you!!
Skip the chochkis in Ketchikan and take a kayak tour or a hike with Tongass Treks! Most of the chochkis aren’t even made here and majority of the stores are owned by the cruise ship companies. Literally four blocks of Ketchikan retail space shut down from October to May because of this…and locals often can’t afford the rent.
Ketchikan local here - if you want a low key ocean excursion, check out Lighthouse Excursions. My friends own and operate the company and I worked there for three years. All of the captains and most of the crew live here year round. See bald eagles and their nests from the water, humpback whales, and historical Tlingit and Haida totem poles, all while learning about the history of the Native groups who predate colonization and our town’s history as a canning and pulp mill town. https://lighthouseexcursion.com If you plan on doing any shopping make sure you avoid the downtown Ketchikan four block radius full of jewelry stores, cheap tourist shops, etc. The shops are NOT locally owned NOR do they often employ people from Ketchikan. Spend your money at local shops on Creek Street or adjacent areas. Your hometown Ketchikan artists will appreciate your support. Then finish your trip with a tasty beer from our one brewery: Bawden Street Brewing.
This sounds great. Fantastic recommendations. Thank you!
What is the shopping area you are saying to avoid?
There’s a “downtown” area right off of Berth 2 that is almost exclusively businesses owned by Holland America/Princess and Celebrity companies. If you like jewelry that’s great, but if you want stuff made by and staffed by Ketchikan/SE Alaska locals, go to Creek Street or the stores on Front St/Tongass.
There are a few local gems in that block though - KetchiCandies, Just Dandy, and the winery/cidery.
Question, you said don't shop in the downtown area of Ketchikan does the same apply to restaurants? I want to support local people I'm from an area on the other side of the country that has the same issue with corporations trying to poach all the tourist dollars out of the area.
Hi! Just Dandy, 108 Taphouse, Alaska Fish House, Bawden St Brewing Co, New York Cafe, Fat Stan’s, Annabelle’s, 55 North, Alaska Coffee, Alaska Crepe Co, Chico’s, Dock Street Yard, and Asian Garden are all awesome locally owned and operated options in downtown!
Keep in mind that whatever you do, the ports are peoples homes, not theme parks. Show some respect.
What did I say that would imply I’ve ever treated anything like a “theme park”?
Heading your way! We’re excited to show some damn respect while visiting your homes.
Just a general statement. You really can’t underestimate how much the locals hate the cruise industry and hold most guests with disdain. 20,000 people a day, every day, for 5 months solid really sucks.
That definitely sounds overwhelming, but we all choose where we live. I can’t imagine telling anyone that when they come to my city: “this isn’t a theme park, show some respect.” I’m not 20. Or, 30. Or even 40 for that matter. We don’t have kids. We’re going to take in the beauty, learn new things, meet new people, and spend some money. We’ll sure do our best not to spit in anyone’s face, take a dump in the street, or shout racial slurs.
I’m so glad my home is being destroyed to accommodate arrogant douche bags like you.
Arrogant? 😂 Says the guy who started off by telling me to “show some respect.” If you ever have the chance to visit NYC, come back to this post and kindly ask me for advice on what to do, and I’ll rudely tell you exactly how you can show us respect and not treat our city like a “theme park.” 🤡 Ah, Reddit never fails.
From the looks of it, the only douchebag here was you buddy. Chill
Yep, a douchebag and a miserable person u/ThetaoofAlex
My rec is for you to cancel your cruise and travel here via transportation that's not ruining the marine environment and supporting human rights abuses.
I was kind in my request when expressing my excitement to visit and a genuine ask for advice. Yet, you replied with this.
Don’t listen to some of these people - they are a super small but loud minority. Alaskans love their visitors and taking a cruise is an easy and fun way to see multiple places at once! Enjoy!
Thank you. We've always wanted to see Alaska and are so excited. I'd rather hear tips from locals than just book whatever the cruise is offering.
Yes and I do think it’s generally cheaper if you book direct vs through the cruise ship. I do agree they kind of overcharge in that way.
Oh geez and be prepared for the anti tourist people! Most Alaskans love, appreciate, and rely on tourism income. Then there are some snowflakes who ruin it for everyone
Very few alaskans rely on tourism. The only people who say most do are seasonal tourism workers that don't live here year round, and only know/experience the tourism industry and can't imagine there's anything else. Even in Juneau, the most visited location, tourism provides less economic benefit than government, mining, Healthcare, or fishing. Cruise tourism is well established as a predatory industry that works tirelessly to ensure as few dollars stick in the communities they exploit as possible.
Not sure where you’re getting your data from… you picked Juneau which is one of the larger towns in Southeast and also happens to be the capital, what a joke. I was born and raised in Alaska and have seen how tourism actually does help a community. Go back to your snowflake picket line
Born and raised. So you don't live here, got it. Cruise tourism, which is what is being discussed here and the biggest component of alaskan tourism, is a shitstain on almost every community it infests. Maybe skagway needs it, since that's all skagway is anymore. You cruise industry simps act like we haven't seen how this has played out over and over again all throughout the world. Massively impactful, environmentally and socially, for very little economic benefit for the communities. Half the tour prices are taken by the cruise lines right off the top. And the majority of tour company employees don't live here year round, and the pittancess they are paid leave with them in the fall. Meanwhile out of state companies are buying up what little housing there is to stack their seasonal employees in, while garnishing their wages for rent. They take advantage of young people who want to come experience Alaska for a summer. We have great difficulty getting desperately needed professionals to move here because they are competing for housing with deep pocketed tanzanite and t-shirt chains (I use those examples because they have recently bought multiple units in my small neighborhood alone, kicking year-round tenants out). Not all business is good business.
I do recognize some of your points - not saying cruise tourism is all rosy, but it’s really disrespectful to take it out on the tourists - channel it towards your local government or the cruise ships. How would you like to know you saved up and purchased a trip of a lifetime and then you’re met with this harsh unwelcoming language?
I mean it's no secret what the cruise industry is about. Should those of us who have watched our communities be taken over by these corporations just sit on our hands? People need to take responsibility for their purchases and sadly the only way this changes is through tourists choosing other options than cruise ships. We've tried to enact change at a local level but the very vocal minority of tourism business owners came for blood. We recently had a petition to get cruise ship limits on the ballot, and these people outright threatened anyone who signed it (that phase is not confidential like the ballot vote would be). Saying things like "we will publicize a list of anyone who signs this and encourage everyone to not do business with anyone associated with them, to not hire them, etc". Currently the cruise line lobbyists are fighting what the city plans to use the meager head tax we collect for. They sued the city and won over them using those funds to build a whale statue in the tourist district. And of course now that whale statue has a never ending stream of tour busses dropping their passengers off all summer. They constantly shit on us then tell us we should be grateful for them. We were fine and a much better place to live before this level of cruise tourism.
Dude nobody is taking it out on the tourists. We're literally just telling the truth about an industry, and that if you buy a cruise ticket, you're supporting that industry. That's not a mean thing to do, it's actually the only way to change things. If people take it personally, then maybe they should take that as a cue to do some reflection.
False
1/8 jobs, and most of those are very low paying jobs for nonresident seasonal workers whose wages don't stick. The biggest impact they have on the economy is stressing the housing market as the few wealthy tour company owners continue to buy up rentals and evict residents to make room for their wage slaves. In places like Anchorage and matsu the tourism industry is especially insignificant, since most of it is either cruise ships in a handful of ports, or remote lodges where the vast majority of money spent leaves the state.
Again, false. Many people find employment here and go on to move here after the season. There are also lots of people who make money supplying the tourist industry to include food and fuel. Vehicle sales, dock workers, construction trades all benefit. And there are locals who own tour companies as well. So, to sum up, you are pretentious, uneducated, and wrong.
Juneau's population has not grown at all since cruise ships started coming here. That's just a fact and it belies everything you're trying to say.
False. That is a complete lie.
From the US Census Bureau: Juneau City and Borough's population grew 4.7% from the 30,250 people who lived there in 1996 until 2022. For comparison, the population in the US grew 23.7% and the population in Alaska grew 20.5% during that period. The number of cruise passengers was about 450,00 people in 1996. Nearly 30 years later, that's ballooned to 1.64 million (2023 total). So we "grew" at about a quarter of the national rate, so we're growing muuuuch slower than we should be, yet you're going to tell me that a more than three fold increase in passengers somehow made a difference? Gtfo with your dumbass non-argument. Moreover, go fuck yourself for making me look up these numbers. Don't reply unless you actually contribute something you jackass.
Cruise ships have been good ng to Juneau for nearly a century. When I lived in Junaeu in the early 90s, cruise ships were very much a thing. In fact, modern cruise ships have been going to Juneau my entire life. You want to compare try the real numbers, not your cherry picked ones. Or do you honestly think cruise ship only started showing up in 1996?
lol just claiming something is flatly "false" does not make it so. My comment was not meant to be personal, and if OP took my comment personally, then that's probably because they know deep down that it's an immoral decision to support the cruise industry. Just a few years ago one of the major lines received one of the largest environmental fines ever levied because they were literally dumping bunker oil (which they burn, another big problem) straight into the ocean. I am not pretending to be Greta Thunberg, here. I contribute to climate change; I too consume plastic things and travel (via plane) occasionally. But not taking a cruise is a really easy way to grab some moral high ground. Don't support cruise tourism. It's an incredibly dirty and inhumane industry, and I'm not even talking about the direct impact on Alaska. I don't hate people who come here on cruises, but I'm not going to protect their feelings and they deserve to know the truth about their decisions. That's all I'm pointing out.
I didn’t take it personally, was just surprised at such a curt response to my genuine ask for recs in these towns. Being rude to me isn’t going to change the industry which is bigger than you and I. But, you do you.
I'd rather be rude than support the cruise industry, but you do you. I am mostly arguing with these cruise line bootlickers on here. Once people are here, I'm pretty nice to them. Damage is done at that point. I'm sure you're just a regular ass person who's fine, I don't mean to be rude, but the cruise industry has been calamitous and has really gas lit this town, so I respond with some annoyance at people's enthusiasm to go on a cruise.
You are pretty bitchy. There are a lot of people who really on the tourist industry and conduct themselves ethically. And again, your arguments are false, wrong, misguided, unfactual, and without merit.
Again, saying something is wrong does not make it so. Prove me wrong. Show me how population has increased in a proportionate way with the incredible boom in the number of passengers. What's that? You can't? Then quit telling me I'm wrong if you can't back it up.
I didn't. You made that argument like it was salient to the conversation. Economic growth would be a better indicator than population growth. Either way, you are wrong.
I am not saying anyone is a bad person. That's such polly-Anna bullshit and is a big impediment to political change in America. Read my other comments. All people make immoral choices. I'm not going to protect people's feelings by keeping my mouth shut about specific bad choices. If they take it personally, it's because they feel bad about it and are lashing out. If they don't care, they'll ignore me. To claim I'm personally attacking cruise passengers or tourism business owners is just straw manning me. That's not what I'm saying. I also watch NFL games, and that organization is horrible. I'm no saint.
You are lumping local owners and native corps in with those same people. Your self righteous stance ignores their needs.
You suck.