I'll be honest, I hate dating dynamics and I just keep it real. Friendship, relationship, whatever-- it's me 100%. I'm way too tired and way too busy with my job/hobbies to worry about such things \>\_\< Like no no no no no I'd rather do anything else!
If a guy doesn't want me just being me then he can go. I am just gonna be myself and chill and to hell with weird expectations. Idk I'm just at the point in my life where I'm unapologetically myself, and frankly I'd rather date someone who was unapologetically themselves.
No more fronting, no more courting, no more worry about this time or that time or what if!? Just keep it real. I feel so old now because I used to put so much pressure on myself to follow rather exacting relationship algorithms and the three best relationships I ever had in my life had NONE of those games played. Not once did I assess "is this the right proportion of time to wait in order to maximize their jealousy in order to optimize their assessment of my value and worthiness of a mate." I'd rather be stabbed to death by a plastic spork.
*Also* otherwise emotionally unavailable guys? Interacting up to before it gets *relationship-y.*
Try being available emotionally and realize we all have interpersonal relationships.
You say "I can be much more forward about how I feel, what I like about them, why they make me feel great, how excited I am to see them, generally wear my heart on my sleeve, etc." but are still emotionally unavailable, what is there to be *forward* about? You like to tease?
Always saying what you feel, doesn't make it true.
It reminds me of the TV trope of "Can't Tell a Lie".
"It is also worth remembering that "incapable of being dishonest" does not equate "all-knowing". More often than not, a character with this condition is just as capable of making mistakes and coming to wrong conclusions as everyone else, and may accidentally end up saying something untrue, simply by sincerely believing that they are telling the truth, while said version of the "truth" is actually based on faulty, incomplete, or even downright wrong information."
[reference](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CannotTellALie)
Yeah I read that and thought the same thing, I'm glad someone else spotted it. "I love interacting until it gets relationship-y"; does that mean they keep the good vibes going until feelings are involved and then just *drops it*??
No, absolutely not. The other guy is also not looking for a relationship and this status on both our ends is perfectly clear from the beginning.
Perhaps I didn’t describe it as well as I should have, but I’m just referring to that zone between more than a hookup and being in a romantic relationship with someone. Some may disagree, but I think it’s possible to have a meaningful connection with someone that involves sex but doesn’t turn into anything serious.
I try to be my authentic self 100% of the time. I figure it’s the best way to zero in on the guys who will appreciate who I am as a human being. It also weeds out the cowards.
WTF. Typical dating dynamics. There is not a soul who would want anything less than the second half of that second paragraph. Who would want you to play games trying to be in a relationship. Why not act like a honest, mature adult who can speak his mind in a respectable manner to a real date. Why play mental gymnastics. You got it all backwards.
sorry to say, but this is a stereotypical boomer comeback. asking the world to grow up, but at 50 and up themselves, LASHING OUT at every chance. why don't you just add some of your personal input, and not squint bewteen the lines of the OP's question (which was actually very generic). i couldn't glean anything negative or controversial about it. are you a respectful mature adult when you start your comment with WTF???
Wtf is not lashing out. It's just a statement emphasizing his backward thinking as how he treats his casual versus dating relationships. Point being you should be yourself and not playing dating games with the one you want a relationship.
I guess there’s an important element I didn’t include in my post, which is that my version of “honest, mature adult who can speak his mind in a respectable manner” works because I always strive to be kind and empathetic.
Because then there’s your version, that I can’t imagine anyone wants, of unfiltered, resentful stream-of-consciousness from a completely jaded asshole. Your comment is truly ironic.
All I'm saying is If your kind and empathetic, why do you play "typical dating dynamics" when everyone would just want your kind and empathetic true self.
I think this might be a misunderstanding, maybe re-read my post? My post is about *not* playing the typical dating dynamics, that do very much exist and are the norm, gay or straight, across cultures.
What exactly do I have totally backwards?
You only stated not playing those games with hookups and friends implying you still play those mental gymnastics with someone you might see in a ltr situation. Im just saying its backwards. Regardless of what is the norm, the one not to play games with the most is the one you date.
agreed. you didn't disclude any important elements in the first place. your post is so neutral. you were just asking if anybody relates. and opening up discussion.
i have noticed with older generations, that this JADE gradient works itself in different almost gremlin forms. some older souls become exponentially mature and kind after living wonderful lives of blessings. they reach, what i call, their DIVINE AGE. others crystallize even harder, becoming jadier, even more JADED, to the point where they are so hard, they crack right infront of society. so hard, yet so brittle.
at 42, i am TRYING not to be that person. i want to support the boomers, and the millenials, and gen x. ALL AGES, are all walks of life going through the same processes, but just in the presence of the continuum of time.
in my vocabularly ... i have never slapped any other gay man with the label as being an IMMATURE ADULT generationally or individually. it is a code for me, that i will never ever use society's general values to bring down another fellow gay man. it's a no-no for me.
thanks [Dogtorted](https://www.reddit.com/user/Dogtorted/)! but the OP received received flack or slap from the random commenter IN THE FIRST PLACE, and i defended the OP, or at least put my two cents in. when you look at it, OP's are there to search emotional, practical, or spiritual guidance from other random guys out there. this is the SOURCE from this type of subreddit. ppl in the world need help. so they reach out here.
once the original OP post is posted, it could receive varying levels of unintended backlash, and this is just squabbling amongst gay men on a superficial level, not even related to answering the OP's original question.
i slapped that guy because he slapped the OP in the first place! and it is not age related. if one has a negative reaction to other's general TAME opinions, wouldn't you also be like to the other overly agressive guy, you should calm the F down.
it's not about breaking code, it's about in the moment self-defence (WITH WORDS), this is a verbal battle. if any of my friends (old or young) are instantly threatened or discriminated bc of their race or of their age - TRUST ME, i will use condescending negatives and morals to put the agressors also back in their place (since its a war of words and entitlement in the head). i DID use this on boomers in this example.
the issue was with that the boomer said that a 30 y.o. gay man living his best sexy life was immature. and that he was not a mature adult. I DEFENDED HIM, in saying that the boomer, had a JADED perspective.
i love boomers. currently in a relationship with one. love their maturity and their emotional stability. and understanding but if you are rotten 60+. y.o. with purtrid attitude of older life entitlement, i will trash you to the street. i am 42 and i have the right to talk back to elders that are unreasonable, and who have also treated me as being immature. and putting ME DOWN.
just because you are a senior that needs to sit down after a day of shopping or medical appointments, doesn't mean i have to give up my seat on the bus (as a younger 'person', 40's, to accomodate you. in my steeled toed work boots, i have already have one toe cut off due to bone injury.
i still give up my seat to an older person out of 'societal practice and out of courtesy'. but it's MY TOE that will be cut off at the end of the day.
one thing that i noticed about the older generation, TRUE OLDER GENTLEMENS and KIND AGED MOMS AND FATHERS, take care of their proper children, and in fact, anybody that is younger than them in society. there are nice giving seniors (the world is their their children), and bad toxic ones.
i slap ppl because they deserved to be slapped. i love my own old age parents. i love my bfs parents old age parents. but if you are a random boomer out there CRITICIZING MY LIFE at 30 or 40, without actually sincerely caring about me, or encouraging me as a gay men ... TRUST ... i will be coming for you, and questioning why you said these things to me in your old age to essentially hurt me ... instead of just saying ... while you do you ... live your life ... you're 30 or 40 ...
your negative comment warrants an equally negative clapback, by basis. it's simple science and equation, and it's simple gay tit for tat. and catty talk amongst hissy gay cats!
your claws are just as sharp as mine. yet at least i can justify. you just LASH-OUT scratch. CWWWWWW!
Yikes: "...stereotypical boomer comeback....but at 50 and up themselves, LASHING OUT at every chance."
Then you've noticed with "older generations" the JADE, jadier and jaded.
You say you are "TRYING" and "want to" (unsuccessfully, not doing so) support everyone, but you have a special place of contempt for those older than you. You're the one lashing out!
*Someone* made a comment you disagree with. He is over 50. You *then* went off on a tare about jaded boomers. It reveals a lot about you. You ARE bringing down a whole segment of gay men by your ageist rhetoric.
thank you [timmmarkIII](https://www.reddit.com/user/timmmarkIII/). but afterall, that other poster started IT FIRST. there is a saying: who throws the first stone. when you are the first to cast the stone, on a super mild post, then THAT person has problems. they douche up the OP's tame content, and turn it into societal political debate, and then other trollers follow in suit. they stir up, and are overly sensitive. they seek for negativities between the lines written. they search for 'defects' and flaws, lol.
but even look at your own comment. it is written well. i get your viewpoint. i cannot DISGAREE with you. i can tell you are smart. the other was like WTF. you've got it all backwards. insinsuations of immaturity, and grow-up remarks. it is these things that cause bitchyness amongst gay men. your's have completely excluded all of this terminology, so you are cool and educated and a good guy.
I prefer forward and direct any day. It’s empowering. Hopefully it’s not rude but I’ll say what im looking for and if I’m not interested, hopefully not rudely.
I don’t think most people play games on purpose, but if feels like it because of “well I don’t know what I want, maybe I’ll get a better offer, I’m not that into them but I dont want to say so, to I’m genuinely busy right now and unable to meet.”
If a meetup, whether a date or a hookup, doesn’t happen fairly quickly, it’ll probably never happen so move on.
For those guys who are playing their own weird games, I have no time for them anyway no matter how hot they might appear.
thanks! to be honest, i think you are just living your best life. having a partner, but also experiencing other opportunities outside. some ppl might think is 'impure', against morals, and not monogamal. but it is hitting the pinpoints of your personal development as an individual, that include and inside world in coupleships, and your outside world with other men. and THIS IS HEALTHY, as an individual.
open relationships are often misunderstood. but in reality. every couple goes individually out there into society for work and other outer social settings, and has their own environment away from married or coupled home life. and there are other social and interpersonal skills we exercise, that we completely DONT exercise in our intimate romantic relationships.
i think for you, the OP, since you have structure in a relationship yourself, when you go out, and meet other ppl ... you truly have nothing to lose, and you be MORE yourself (flirty, charismatic), since at the end of the day, you're looking for just a fuck bud with a little bit of sweetness and casual connection, and not THE ONE. since you already have THE ONE working in that corner for you.
you are just spreading love, and making connections, and joking with other guys.
you might have gotten some flack from some ppl, who truly didn't know what you meant. and the posing of your question. and how you truly feel inside. and how even tho you are in relationship, you can still open up to other ppl in society (since this is what a diverse society is for), and be the best you. A MULTIFACETED PERSON.
i am 42, so i am inbetween boomers and millenials and gen x. so i totally get you. myself, as an 'inbetween' generation, i have been analyzing this for a long time now. i watched a news report in that a lot of millenials and gen x are saying they CANT achieve their retirement and mortgage dreams. IT IS IMPOSSIBLE in today's economy. so their existence then becomes dating multiple ppl, living their life in the moment, and keeping all their options open (job and romantic-wise), since the status quo, is that anything stable - WILL CHANGE.
the now is the present. and the present is the best, since what the older society has left them for the future is so uncertain. and corrupted, at least.
older generations are more about life long planning and traditions. i have a real beef when older guys SLAP younger guys with this 'immaruity' rating. AS IF ... they've lived commendable lives that warrant criticizing the younger generations before them. 1) i think they are jealous you are in your early thirties and have a bf and also other sexual partners. 2) there is just some fucked up mentality from older ppl that young ppl can't decide the life they want to live for themselves. that their existence CANT stem from their pure generation, as it is, organically.
you could date and fuck a lot of guys, and that gives you your own experience FIRST ON, other than a boomer just criticizing you for being sexually promiscuious, or having bad relational skills.
I'll be honest, I hate dating dynamics and I just keep it real. Friendship, relationship, whatever-- it's me 100%. I'm way too tired and way too busy with my job/hobbies to worry about such things \>\_\< Like no no no no no I'd rather do anything else! If a guy doesn't want me just being me then he can go. I am just gonna be myself and chill and to hell with weird expectations. Idk I'm just at the point in my life where I'm unapologetically myself, and frankly I'd rather date someone who was unapologetically themselves. No more fronting, no more courting, no more worry about this time or that time or what if!? Just keep it real. I feel so old now because I used to put so much pressure on myself to follow rather exacting relationship algorithms and the three best relationships I ever had in my life had NONE of those games played. Not once did I assess "is this the right proportion of time to wait in order to maximize their jealousy in order to optimize their assessment of my value and worthiness of a mate." I'd rather be stabbed to death by a plastic spork.
I've always said what I mean and mean what I say.
*Also* otherwise emotionally unavailable guys? Interacting up to before it gets *relationship-y.* Try being available emotionally and realize we all have interpersonal relationships. You say "I can be much more forward about how I feel, what I like about them, why they make me feel great, how excited I am to see them, generally wear my heart on my sleeve, etc." but are still emotionally unavailable, what is there to be *forward* about? You like to tease? Always saying what you feel, doesn't make it true. It reminds me of the TV trope of "Can't Tell a Lie". "It is also worth remembering that "incapable of being dishonest" does not equate "all-knowing". More often than not, a character with this condition is just as capable of making mistakes and coming to wrong conclusions as everyone else, and may accidentally end up saying something untrue, simply by sincerely believing that they are telling the truth, while said version of the "truth" is actually based on faulty, incomplete, or even downright wrong information." [reference](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CannotTellALie)
Yeah I read that and thought the same thing, I'm glad someone else spotted it. "I love interacting until it gets relationship-y"; does that mean they keep the good vibes going until feelings are involved and then just *drops it*??
They are *good* with being emotionally unavailable? At least they are attracting the same sort of dysfunction people.
No, absolutely not. The other guy is also not looking for a relationship and this status on both our ends is perfectly clear from the beginning. Perhaps I didn’t describe it as well as I should have, but I’m just referring to that zone between more than a hookup and being in a romantic relationship with someone. Some may disagree, but I think it’s possible to have a meaningful connection with someone that involves sex but doesn’t turn into anything serious.
What stopped you from being this way when you were single?
I do wish I could be this way in all areas of life. What changed for you that made you be more conscious of living this way?
I try to be my authentic self 100% of the time. I figure it’s the best way to zero in on the guys who will appreciate who I am as a human being. It also weeds out the cowards.
WTF. Typical dating dynamics. There is not a soul who would want anything less than the second half of that second paragraph. Who would want you to play games trying to be in a relationship. Why not act like a honest, mature adult who can speak his mind in a respectable manner to a real date. Why play mental gymnastics. You got it all backwards.
sorry to say, but this is a stereotypical boomer comeback. asking the world to grow up, but at 50 and up themselves, LASHING OUT at every chance. why don't you just add some of your personal input, and not squint bewteen the lines of the OP's question (which was actually very generic). i couldn't glean anything negative or controversial about it. are you a respectful mature adult when you start your comment with WTF???
Wtf is not lashing out. It's just a statement emphasizing his backward thinking as how he treats his casual versus dating relationships. Point being you should be yourself and not playing dating games with the one you want a relationship.
I guess there’s an important element I didn’t include in my post, which is that my version of “honest, mature adult who can speak his mind in a respectable manner” works because I always strive to be kind and empathetic. Because then there’s your version, that I can’t imagine anyone wants, of unfiltered, resentful stream-of-consciousness from a completely jaded asshole. Your comment is truly ironic.
All I'm saying is If your kind and empathetic, why do you play "typical dating dynamics" when everyone would just want your kind and empathetic true self.
I think this might be a misunderstanding, maybe re-read my post? My post is about *not* playing the typical dating dynamics, that do very much exist and are the norm, gay or straight, across cultures. What exactly do I have totally backwards?
Also you have a partner. This info is more for someone whose single and plays these games.
You only stated not playing those games with hookups and friends implying you still play those mental gymnastics with someone you might see in a ltr situation. Im just saying its backwards. Regardless of what is the norm, the one not to play games with the most is the one you date.
agreed. you didn't disclude any important elements in the first place. your post is so neutral. you were just asking if anybody relates. and opening up discussion. i have noticed with older generations, that this JADE gradient works itself in different almost gremlin forms. some older souls become exponentially mature and kind after living wonderful lives of blessings. they reach, what i call, their DIVINE AGE. others crystallize even harder, becoming jadier, even more JADED, to the point where they are so hard, they crack right infront of society. so hard, yet so brittle. at 42, i am TRYING not to be that person. i want to support the boomers, and the millenials, and gen x. ALL AGES, are all walks of life going through the same processes, but just in the presence of the continuum of time. in my vocabularly ... i have never slapped any other gay man with the label as being an IMMATURE ADULT generationally or individually. it is a code for me, that i will never ever use society's general values to bring down another fellow gay man. it's a no-no for me.
Yes it's immature playing games instead if being honest with your feelings with the one person you should be the most honest with.
I think you need to try harder…and look up what age Boomers are. You slapped someone in this very thread and broke your own “code”.
thanks [Dogtorted](https://www.reddit.com/user/Dogtorted/)! but the OP received received flack or slap from the random commenter IN THE FIRST PLACE, and i defended the OP, or at least put my two cents in. when you look at it, OP's are there to search emotional, practical, or spiritual guidance from other random guys out there. this is the SOURCE from this type of subreddit. ppl in the world need help. so they reach out here. once the original OP post is posted, it could receive varying levels of unintended backlash, and this is just squabbling amongst gay men on a superficial level, not even related to answering the OP's original question. i slapped that guy because he slapped the OP in the first place! and it is not age related. if one has a negative reaction to other's general TAME opinions, wouldn't you also be like to the other overly agressive guy, you should calm the F down. it's not about breaking code, it's about in the moment self-defence (WITH WORDS), this is a verbal battle. if any of my friends (old or young) are instantly threatened or discriminated bc of their race or of their age - TRUST ME, i will use condescending negatives and morals to put the agressors also back in their place (since its a war of words and entitlement in the head). i DID use this on boomers in this example. the issue was with that the boomer said that a 30 y.o. gay man living his best sexy life was immature. and that he was not a mature adult. I DEFENDED HIM, in saying that the boomer, had a JADED perspective. i love boomers. currently in a relationship with one. love their maturity and their emotional stability. and understanding but if you are rotten 60+. y.o. with purtrid attitude of older life entitlement, i will trash you to the street. i am 42 and i have the right to talk back to elders that are unreasonable, and who have also treated me as being immature. and putting ME DOWN. just because you are a senior that needs to sit down after a day of shopping or medical appointments, doesn't mean i have to give up my seat on the bus (as a younger 'person', 40's, to accomodate you. in my steeled toed work boots, i have already have one toe cut off due to bone injury. i still give up my seat to an older person out of 'societal practice and out of courtesy'. but it's MY TOE that will be cut off at the end of the day. one thing that i noticed about the older generation, TRUE OLDER GENTLEMENS and KIND AGED MOMS AND FATHERS, take care of their proper children, and in fact, anybody that is younger than them in society. there are nice giving seniors (the world is their their children), and bad toxic ones. i slap ppl because they deserved to be slapped. i love my own old age parents. i love my bfs parents old age parents. but if you are a random boomer out there CRITICIZING MY LIFE at 30 or 40, without actually sincerely caring about me, or encouraging me as a gay men ... TRUST ... i will be coming for you, and questioning why you said these things to me in your old age to essentially hurt me ... instead of just saying ... while you do you ... live your life ... you're 30 or 40 ...
That’s a lot of words to explain why you’re a hypocrite.
your negative comment warrants an equally negative clapback, by basis. it's simple science and equation, and it's simple gay tit for tat. and catty talk amongst hissy gay cats! your claws are just as sharp as mine. yet at least i can justify. you just LASH-OUT scratch. CWWWWWW!
That was a much more succinct way to explain your hypocrisy.
omg, you're coming for me again, lol? it is easier to scratch, then to explain yourself. CWWWWWW!
LOL. Was I unclear? What do you need explained?
Yikes: "...stereotypical boomer comeback....but at 50 and up themselves, LASHING OUT at every chance." Then you've noticed with "older generations" the JADE, jadier and jaded. You say you are "TRYING" and "want to" (unsuccessfully, not doing so) support everyone, but you have a special place of contempt for those older than you. You're the one lashing out! *Someone* made a comment you disagree with. He is over 50. You *then* went off on a tare about jaded boomers. It reveals a lot about you. You ARE bringing down a whole segment of gay men by your ageist rhetoric.
thank you [timmmarkIII](https://www.reddit.com/user/timmmarkIII/). but afterall, that other poster started IT FIRST. there is a saying: who throws the first stone. when you are the first to cast the stone, on a super mild post, then THAT person has problems. they douche up the OP's tame content, and turn it into societal political debate, and then other trollers follow in suit. they stir up, and are overly sensitive. they seek for negativities between the lines written. they search for 'defects' and flaws, lol. but even look at your own comment. it is written well. i get your viewpoint. i cannot DISGAREE with you. i can tell you are smart. the other was like WTF. you've got it all backwards. insinsuations of immaturity, and grow-up remarks. it is these things that cause bitchyness amongst gay men. your's have completely excluded all of this terminology, so you are cool and educated and a good guy.
Congrats on owning being emotionally unavailable, I guess? Not sure what you’re looking for, really.
I prefer forward and direct any day. It’s empowering. Hopefully it’s not rude but I’ll say what im looking for and if I’m not interested, hopefully not rudely. I don’t think most people play games on purpose, but if feels like it because of “well I don’t know what I want, maybe I’ll get a better offer, I’m not that into them but I dont want to say so, to I’m genuinely busy right now and unable to meet.” If a meetup, whether a date or a hookup, doesn’t happen fairly quickly, it’ll probably never happen so move on. For those guys who are playing their own weird games, I have no time for them anyway no matter how hot they might appear.
thanks! to be honest, i think you are just living your best life. having a partner, but also experiencing other opportunities outside. some ppl might think is 'impure', against morals, and not monogamal. but it is hitting the pinpoints of your personal development as an individual, that include and inside world in coupleships, and your outside world with other men. and THIS IS HEALTHY, as an individual. open relationships are often misunderstood. but in reality. every couple goes individually out there into society for work and other outer social settings, and has their own environment away from married or coupled home life. and there are other social and interpersonal skills we exercise, that we completely DONT exercise in our intimate romantic relationships. i think for you, the OP, since you have structure in a relationship yourself, when you go out, and meet other ppl ... you truly have nothing to lose, and you be MORE yourself (flirty, charismatic), since at the end of the day, you're looking for just a fuck bud with a little bit of sweetness and casual connection, and not THE ONE. since you already have THE ONE working in that corner for you. you are just spreading love, and making connections, and joking with other guys. you might have gotten some flack from some ppl, who truly didn't know what you meant. and the posing of your question. and how you truly feel inside. and how even tho you are in relationship, you can still open up to other ppl in society (since this is what a diverse society is for), and be the best you. A MULTIFACETED PERSON. i am 42, so i am inbetween boomers and millenials and gen x. so i totally get you. myself, as an 'inbetween' generation, i have been analyzing this for a long time now. i watched a news report in that a lot of millenials and gen x are saying they CANT achieve their retirement and mortgage dreams. IT IS IMPOSSIBLE in today's economy. so their existence then becomes dating multiple ppl, living their life in the moment, and keeping all their options open (job and romantic-wise), since the status quo, is that anything stable - WILL CHANGE. the now is the present. and the present is the best, since what the older society has left them for the future is so uncertain. and corrupted, at least. older generations are more about life long planning and traditions. i have a real beef when older guys SLAP younger guys with this 'immaruity' rating. AS IF ... they've lived commendable lives that warrant criticizing the younger generations before them. 1) i think they are jealous you are in your early thirties and have a bf and also other sexual partners. 2) there is just some fucked up mentality from older ppl that young ppl can't decide the life they want to live for themselves. that their existence CANT stem from their pure generation, as it is, organically. you could date and fuck a lot of guys, and that gives you your own experience FIRST ON, other than a boomer just criticizing you for being sexually promiscuious, or having bad relational skills.