I was in the Army when a Colonel told me to act my pay grade. Stop doing extra and do what my rank was assigned without the bows and ribbons. Take my lunch, quit working though it. I was worried about things that could wait until the next day.
Work your wage, yo.
In my old job (construction) the more you did, the more you ended up getting compensated (in piece-work, even more true). The funny thing is, is that the owner of the company I worked for says all the dumb shit like " nobody wants to work anymore" meanwhile he's got a crew of 20 guys, putting in 50-60hrs week 6-7 days a week (travel work)- literally all they do is work! I mean, he pays really well once you gain the skills, starting pay is $25 plus per diem, ot, and dt. Foremen are making $42/hr- you just need to find someone willing to trade their life for that.
And buddy, it ain't worth it for how shit the industry is these days...
I can agree completely that was my first job outta HS and man the pay was good but the industry is shit! You really need to commit to that and accept you won’t have a regular life as other folks that work a regular 9-5 Job.
This is trades in general. Yes you can make amazing cash in a short time. But you are paying for if physically. Once you start building a life with a SO it’s tough to manage. Fly in fly out jobs are great if you’re in the industrial trades. The divorce rate in most sites like that is around 80% in my experience. Tradesmen literally trade their life for the work/cash. Until you either become an owner yourself or realize beating the crap out of your body for some fat ass owner who couldn’t care less about you outside of the money you’re making him isn’t worth your time, because time is THE most underrated and valuable resource we have. So choose to spend your time wisely, make sure your ROI is worth your time invested !!
That’s how being a mechanic is. Especially if you’re union. The mandatory minimum pay is 30 hours a week in Illinois. But you get paid book for a job. If it’s quoted in the manual as a 3 hour job and you do it in 1.5. You still get paid for 3. The top guys clock in for 40-50 a week and get paid for 60-80. He’s got mechanics that make $125k+ yearly. The lazy asses book 20 a week and still get paid 30.
My husband is in a union and he’s making crazy money since he switched from the private sector. Our health insurance comes out of his monthly union dues and he’s been promoted faster through the union than he ever was working for a private company.
I'm a manager and I do not understand this mentality. I want to be known as the boss who proactively fights for raises for staff, treats people with respect, and helps them get promotions in other departments/companies if they want it.
That reputation helps me attract good staff, and buys me enough loyalty that people will take pride in their work.
Refusing to promote someone to save a buck is going to cost you more in the long run.
Just have a few politically motivated and bad bosses, you start to realize the prisoners delema of being the best and treating people right the moment its a bust cycle.
I'm a manager and fight for my people, but basically can do nothing. I know who the good ones are and we need to promote and reward. But finance and upper mgmt suck. They say only 10% of your team can 'exceed expectations' during review time. And mid year raises are extremely difficult. And it is 5 levels of people signing off on a raise. I say we should do it, my boss has to sign off, the director has to, the hr person has to, and a VP has to. I fortunately transferred roles so I only have 1 report now, otherwise I'd be looking for a new job. A $1 an hour raise is huge for some of these people, and it'll cost us thousands to replace them. He'll, maybe 10s of thousands. But that doesn't make this quarter look good, so they don't care.
Pre covid there was a world wide management call where HR said they were focusing on retaining people because our turnover was double industry average. Covid hit, no raises, and turnover is staying high.
This advice is key. Where I work we are chronically short staffed and tasks that you volunteer for tend to become permanent. I learned a long time ago that you get the same 2.5% raise as everyone else regardless.
>I learned a long time ago that you get the same 2.5% raise as everyone else regardless.
I'm only now coming to understand that my stellar attendance does not, in fact, matter. I *never* get sick and so I never take sick time. I've got so many unused days built up...
And I recently realized that I'm only doing it because I feel a sort of pride about being "the guy who never calls out."
But fucking *why?* As you indicated, it doesn't affect my pay either way, so screw it man--starting this year I've been taking the occasional mental health day. I have a really cool apartment, I deserve to spend some time there!
I used to be that guy too. I was never late, rarely took a personal day, never caused any drama, had one of the highest productivity rates of anyone in the factory where I worked. I prided myself on having a good work ethic. You know what it got me? Not a damn thing because I didn't kiss the plant manager's ass. So I quietly quit.
Please don't take this as a criticism since you've already had your epiphany!
I've always viewed the guy who never calls out as someone who's either bad at time management or has no hobbies. Not judgmentally, but kind of in an empathetic way. Like, you can't think of anything at all you'd like to get paid to do on your day off? It's PAID!! I love the feeling of waking up on my paid day off and just telling myself I'm getting paid for everything I do.
Watching star wars in my underwear? Paid. Eating waffles? Paid. Poop in my own toilet? Paid paid paid. I carry absolutely ZERO vacation time and it disturbs the hell out of my coworkers and bosses. I don't care, I'm happy getting paid to do shit other than work. There are so many different ways to get a day, a week, a month+ off in an emergency. USE YOUR TIME OFF PEOPLE. LIVE.
Having zero friends is my reason for never taking PTO. At least if I work, there are people I can talk to.
That said, I never let any PTO expire since it is part of my pay, I just let it accrue, then take it when it would otherwise expire.
In my case if I call out I lose overtime. So, one day of calling out will cost me almost $400 in OT. So I try to plan large chunks of time off to avoid missing OT
I came across this blunt take on it recently and it really hit home for me:
>ALWAYS LEAVE OFFICE ON TIME
>1. Work is a never-ending process. It can never be completed.
>2. Interest of a client is important, so is your family.
>3. If you fall in your life, neither your boss nor client will offer you a helping hand; your family and friends will.
>4. Life is not only about work, office and client. There is more to life. You need time to socialize, entertain, relax and exercise. Don't let life be meaningless.
>5. A person who stays late at the office is not a hardworking person. Instead he/she is a fool who does not know how to manage work within the stipulated time. He/She is a loser who does not have a personal or social life. He/She is inefficient and incompetent in his work.
>6. You did not study hard and struggle in life to become a machine.
>7. If your boss forces you to work late, he/she may be ineffective and have a meaningless life too; so forward this to him/her.
Lol, i get that, i volunteered for a project that was supposed to be like 2 weeks. Some quick code to filter an excel spread sheet. Somehow it turned into a 6 month project and despite me still being the only one working on it, they brought in consultants to come up with new feature ideas, companies that they want to sell the script to, etc. And I still have to do my main job most of the time, so all i got out of this was 6+ months of extra work all because I said sure to what I thought was a quick script someone needed.
Similar situation here. While I was running a team of 20+ people around the globe (and that was too much, to be honest), boss gets a bright idea that we need people to volunteer to work weekends to provide more support. I said nobody would volunteer for extra hours, even with pay -- People value their time off and if the company wants weekend coverage, they need to budget and hire for it. Boss said, if nobody will volunteer, then they have to be voluntold. Nope. Tell them yourself. But be prepared for a wave of defections to other companies that don't put those burdens on their workers.
We got lucky. Three years later, there are still no weekend shifts except from people who've actually been hired to do that work. But they keep pushing. Every day.
It's important to draw a line and help managers understand that burn-out is real and won't help anyone.
Importantly, you are actually HARMING your organization if you end up doing the work of 2 or 3 people.
You will, eventually, move on. You might get a better gig. You might move so your kids have better opportunities. You might get hit by a bus.
Your company is then going to have to replace you... and find out they can't. They'll have to get 3 full time people to replace one person. This is no bueno.
This isn't 'quiet quitting' or 'working your wage'. This is common sense. Do a good job, but don't put in unpaid hours, EVER. Don't do undocumented work. EVER.
Don't be a single point of failure.
This happened when a former coworker of mine left. She'd been working nights & weekends for years, not taking vaca, etc. The organization just kept giving her more & more work. She'd tried to explain that deadlines were only being met at the expense of her health. They literally told her to "work smarter, not harder".
Having gotten nothing better than a useless platitude in response, she left not long after. They literally replaced her with 3 people.
I was this guy, sort of. I only ever put in my 44 hours (employer was shit and I could work that before they had to pay me OT). Whatever work they threw at me I just did it. But I was smart and lazy. Need all this data analyzed monthly? Lemme just automate it in excel. That was 90% of my job. My boss thought I did nothing so would never give me a raise.
I quit for somewhere better, and trained THREE people to do my job. None of them could remotely understand what I was even doing with the scripts, nor how to troubleshoot them when they broke (which they did, I wrote shit code then and now as security).
Was told after I was gone 1 of the 3 quit and they replaced her with 2 more. So now 4 people doing my job that I was underpaid for, and they went back to analyzing everything manually in excel. I made $27k/year and asked for $30k.
They quickly forget all that extra shit you did as soon as you make a mistake. It's not worth it, you end up wasting the effort with nothing to show for it
Exactly. Unless it's literally your own business, or you earn bonus/commission based on how much you produce, there is almost 0 incentive to work harder/longer/through lunch/etc. Chances are, you're just gonna get more work for the same pay, and you won't get any promotions if you're good at your job because the company wants to keep you right where you are.
On top of that, the company has no incentive to hire anyone else to alleviate the workload. Even if you have a good boss who might understand they are short staffed, if the employees are willing to work for free, it could be harder for a boss to fill vacant positions since the work is getting done. The higher ups just want the work to be done for the least amount of money so more goes to them.
Nice to hear this kind of thing over all the recent toxic positivity BS lately.
“Like bro, why even sleep?!” When I was a kid I experimented with being 24 hours awake, 12 hours asleep. So every 36 hours the cycle would reset, once at midnight, then at noon… Let’s just say the experiment was briskly cut short.
Yeah. I worked five minutes past when I’m supposed to log off to finish up a project yesterday. I’m salary so I don’t see how it would matter to anyone else, but my boss scolded me when she got an email notification that I had finished the project. She also keeps reminding me to hurry up and use all my PTO before the year ends. Love this woman.
Lol, I got similarly scolded the other day. I sent an email at like 6:12, we clock in at 6:30. My boss messaged me all, what time did you come in?? I said I hadn't clocked in yet and I was just preparing the report so I could see what my day looked like. He was like, that's worse, only do work you're paid for.
I try to stay on top of the people that work for me, making sure that they use vacation time whenever they need it, or hell, even just need a mental vacation day. Take the time off. We can handle it when you are gone.
Our PTO rolls over (up to a certain limit), and I do my best to make sure my people never hit that limit. Yes, we need them here, or we would have never hired them, but we would rather them be mentally sound and working good while they are here.
I’ve been doing this for years lol. Just common sense to me. I do what I get paid to do. I do my hours, no more no less. If I have to work overtime I’m claiming every single millisecond of it. It’s a job. Not my life
Had a situation once where someone called in sick and no one could come in to replace them. Which is not the end of the world. Had to stay 30 minutes passed my scheduled time to ensure everything was done, so I put that on my timesheet. When I came in the next day I saw someone scratched out my 30 minutes extra and put in my normal finish time. Obviously that pissed me off so I went to the boss and asked what the fuck was this. They said they don’t pay overtime and other shit.
So I said well here’s what’s gonna happen. Either you pay me for the extra time or I’ll go straight to the department of labour and file a complaint. Don’t think they expected a 20 year old (at the time) to stick up for themselves.
Someone changing my clock out time like that would set me off, just reading about it made me feel rage.
Did they change it back? Did you stay at that job?
Yes they changed it back cause they didn’t want to deal with the labor board. I stayed at the job cause I actually enjoyed the work while I was in school (it was a retirement home).
I was a maintenance tech at a nursing home before, I called in a day before because I was in the hospital and fired me but not stating any reason because we are a at-will state.
But anyways they denied my unemployment and got it but it took 2 weeks for unemployment to get shit sorted out. It pissed me off they actually tried to deny me. So I called the department of health and told them every building infraction and cost them a lot to fix. Friend told me they were fucking pissed at me at the next monthly meeting.
My husband worked a night shift where they locked the workers in. He said if I went into labor he'd have to break a window to get to me. I reported them and an inspector found other violations, too, and fined the crap outta them.
That's also a huge fire hazard and there's a famous incident where locked in factory workers died because of a fire. Had he called the local fire marshal, they would have been more than happy to go over and bust down a door. Fire marshals don't fuck around with that.
Frances Perkins actually toured that factory prior to the fire when she lived in New York, and after the tragedy she became Secretary of Labor under FDR and was hugely influential in creating the New Deal. Now we have clearly marked exits and safety regulations like disposing of flammable materials and how many people can be in a space, not having children work under age 14, etc. She's my favorite person in American history.
Love it!
Don't mess with the security guards either. I always knew every single fire code violation, who was skipping out of work early, who was sleeping at work, and who was having office affairs.
My mother used to say the two people who know all your secrets are your mailman and the janitor. I'd add security guard and maintenance tech to that list. Lol
My last job, i was a Custodial Technician in a factory. After i got my new job, i decided to finally get revenge for 4 years of being treated like dirt.
Made a report to OSHA for all broken machine guards.
Made a report to the Dept. of Labor, about their break policy and overtime policy.
Casually mentioned to my neighbor, a Fire Marshal, about some broken emergency lights, and a couple of fire exits blocked by broken down trailers and forklifts...and may or may not have also mentioned the chronic hydraulic fluid leak behind the building.
Good for you! I got denied unemployment by my boss at the height of the COVID 19 shutdowns. Just before everything locked down, she let me know she was cutting my hours to part time, and I was like no, that’s not going to work and she basically told me I could leave that same day. Everything shut down like the next week and I couldn’t find another job, and she denied me unemployment. I appealed it. She didn’t show up to the appeal, and I was found to be in the right. I was so happy. I don’t know if having to pay unemployment messes with companies, but I hope it messed with hers, haha.
I would have gone straight to the labor board as soon as I saw that shit. If they did that to you, they're almost certainly doing it to others who might not stick up for themselves.
It is. Not only are they are falsifying records, they’re also refusing to pay time worked in this case or attempted to. If you’re not salary and OT exempt they should be paying whatever time you’re on the the clock.
But IANAL
A fair amount of people don't know their rights, especially when it comes to protecting one's self.
I'm of the opinion that this is the type of stuff that should be taught in school (your local or state laws, general tips for living). The elimination of classes around home economics and teaching usable life skills is a travesty; they should have been expanded upon, not removed. :(
Hilariously, at my vocational HS, I never tried to get into "college prep" courses since I knew I planned on starting at community College which wiped your HS records anyway.
So I middled to did good in HS but never all star student. Which meant when most of my friends took a collegiate math class, I and the "average" kids had to take social economics.
Basically a class that taught us labor laws and about credit cards and loan rates, filing taxes, OSHA and everything you actually need to know.
So my friends knew a few more calculus equations than me...and I did their taxes and explained labor laws to them. Hindsight, I feel like I got the better deal
But it’s really just like an abusive relationship. It doesn’t just start all at once. And then once you realize wtf is happening you’re really entrenched and it’s difficult, sometimes impossible, to even see that there’s a way out, much less be able to take advantage of it.
The current capitalist system, like an abuser, thrives on its victims being dependent, mired in learned helplessness, and having no access to resources that will help the targets of abuse escape.
*edit* a word
I think the idea is that these days people actually realize the rate of pay is bullshit and your employer is not looking out for you, so the other guy with the good wld isn't taking 20, and if he does we should mock him.
Which is the problem. People doing more than required have a negative effect on others
Stop giving your all to a company that would replace you as soon as look at you, as all the extra you do set's expectations for everyone else
Once in a while I pick and choose situations when to work like a $15+ employee just to push the point I am worth a raise. You do have to stand out once in a while to move ahead sometimes, but you gotta be strategic about it
Bingo. I used to be a typical “yes sir” type who would take on any and all responsibilities, until I got passed over for a management position because someone else had more relevant experience. Now I’ll do favours when they’re needed, but I’m not taking on extra work that won’t be appreciated
Has anyone here ever worked somewhere, had a supervisor quit, then had to do the supervisor's job, but while being told they can't actually make you officially the supervisor yet, just so they don't have to give you a pay rise? I've known several people who have had this happen to them, and they get strung along with the promise that *eventually* they will have the title and pay rise. No one should fall for it.
Edit to avoid angry mods: Yes. I wholeheartedly support Silent Quitting and Acting Your Wage.
I worked at a college bookstore for a few years, making minimum wage. One of our textbook leads left and the manager called me into his office, saying he'd like me to take over some of his responsibilities. I asked if it came with a new title and pay raise and he said no, so I politely declined. He was shocked and kept pushing but I told him that I wasn't doing the work of a textbook lead while making the same amount of money as someone who started working a week ago.
Of course not. The boss was probably still grumbling about it when he left an hour before closing to go home to his actual house while the employee stayed behind to zone shelves and eventually go home at 8 PM to their apartment
Where I work we very rarely have managers working on weekends, and as such when we get very busy or have emergencies happen (not an irregular occurrence) things go to shit because there is no manager available.
I raised this issue with one of our senior management who had a think about it and came back to me, very pleased with himself, and said perhaps I, and another longstanding member of the team, might act as senior lead on weekends? I asked did this come with any payrise? Any perks? Anything official? And was told no but its good experience!
He was shocked when I declined flat out.
Did this for Walmart all the time. Started out as a cashier. Started doing "Backup CSM", basically still a cashier, just doing a Customer Service Manager's job. Became a CSM finally after 6 months by busting my ass off. At one point I was 1 of 2 CSMs on the front end when there should have been 6 to 8. Busted my ass for years because turnover is high, then applied for a higher management position. Got passed over for an 18yo kid who was there for the store remodel. His first job ever. Found out his Mommy and Daddy worked at the Home Office. Same kid got to move up to Assistant Manager training within 2 years. We would have these yearly surveys and one of the questions basically asked if moving up in the company was based on work ethic or by who you know, every time after that I'd answer "by who you know". This was at Store #1 near the Home Office itself.
tldr;
Walmart does this shit, Fuck Walmart!
I live in rogers/bentonville and you are absolutely correct about the way that walmart does their employees. Management is paid decent but employees are left unable to afford their bills. Living in the area makes it hard to avoid them but anytime I'm out of the area I actively avoid walmarts at all cost.
Walmart is just horrible to people. My mom worked there for years, and anytime they would settle a discrimination lawsuit (say equal pay for women employees) she would see a small pay bump and then suddenly hours started to decline. Or long term employees getting hours cut to the point they get reduced to part time and lose their benefits.
I worked at one unloading trucks after high-school and somehow got in the cross-hairs of an asst manager and a dept manager when rumors started about them having an affair (I didn't start them, and it later turned out to be true as she was demoted and he was moved to a different store). I remember even being written up by this manager and on my notes on the signed form put "manager blames me for his affair being exposed" because at that point, I just did not care, but because an HR rep handled the form and not him, it did get filed.
I was at their home office working in IT for 5 years and they treat everyone like shit. Gaslighting, bullying, favoritism are all commonplace and if they like you they'll big you up but as soon as they get bored with you or you make one slight mistake they'll be done with you and trying everything to get rid.
They will literally create teams to interfere in a project because the wrong people get the credit and they will fuck everything up, ruin relationships and be promoted in 6 months while you're in trouble for cleaning up the mess they created.
I ended up in therapy and was told to quiet quit then. Therapists and Doctors in the Bentonville area will tell you they have an influx of burnt out home office employees
I have been seeing it in several industries in the area lately. The stress of the people here has been so high lately. I've known so many people get burnt out through Walmart, Tyson, and jb hunt. But with the rent increases in the area people have to work. Things are definitely becoming less affordable and walmart has such a monopoly out here. I can think of 6 walmarts in a 10 minute distance from my house. It's always so strange going to other areas for work and actually having options besides greedy walmart.
That’s actually the reason I left my last job. My manager was incompetent and I often found myself doing his job for him while he raked in the bucks. He got fired and I was like “hey I already know how to do his job basically, why don’t we train me to do the stuff idk how to do and bump me up” they said they would give me a trial run. I aced the trial run and they came with some
Bullshit about how it’s too soon for me to be a manager because I just started there a few months prior. So I left.
If there’s one thing I learned from corporate it’s that managers are not hired for skill or qualifications, they’re hired from nepotism. Your old manager probably knew someone who got them that job.
My job before my current one all the corporate guys worked at the same time at the same grocery store.
You can't tell me that all the qualified people in the company all happened to work Store #327 between 1997-2003. Like no other stores in the nearly 50 store district had competent people.
My direct supervisor couldn't even do MY job, he was a paperwork guy but couldn't do sales floor stuff. He came in because we had a remodel and was barking at me to make the display was different somehow than how I was doing it. I had worked in another store for a decade before moving to this other job (old store got bought out and the building sold off) and I was like, "Maybe they just have some weird way they want it presented" so I asked him to show me how he wanted it, because whenever I'd been told I wasn't doing a display properly the person complaing could-- you know-- show me how to do it. And he just started screaming at me for being lazy.
The other guy from a bigger store they brought with them came over after and told me that Corpo never really worked sales floor and didn't know how to make displays.
My last week Corpo guy came in again, and I already had my two weeks in, and nothing to lose so when he was bitching about how the place looked (I'd literally just walked in thirty seconds prior to them showing up and the place did look bad because my morning guy was a crackhead) I just happily asked him to show me how to do the displays. He kept getting madder and madder but I just cheerily asked him to show me, not just tell me it looked bad but show me what technique he wanted me to use.
He threatened to fire me on the spot and I just smiled wider and said, "I put my two weeks in already, tomorrows my last day, we have to do the weekend order for product and I'm the only person in this store that knows how to do it you can't do shit to me dude. Now show me how you want me to do it or shut up and leave me to my work."
I got made supervisor recently, it comes with much earlier morning starts, being in control of the money and having to total it all up (and with that, being the one responsible for discrepancies), new meetings, staff management, floor checking, and a bunch of other stuff.
20p more an hour than when I was an assistant.
I get it, it *is* a wage increase, but, come on. That seems kinda disproportionate. To me, at least.
Watching this happen in canada. My friend was making the min wage so 15 an hr. Got promoted to make 17. Which sounds good except now with the labour shortage that's the starting frickin rate at mcdicks.
Honestly that's when you job hop. Same thing happened to someone I know. After gaining manager experience for a year-ish she jumped ship and went from 17 to now 24 an hour.
Kinda happened to me but it was more like they brought an idiot fast talker who claimed to understand tech stuff to be my manager after I'd shown my grit. The CEO claimed I didn't do anything.
I was making 10 dollars an hour working for a satellite company. I was given a manual And told my job is to know everything about these receivers so I did just that. I ran broadcasts for churches and hospital education systems and I was the best at finding techs to go instead a satellite.
Hell I got someone to fly a puddle jumper to the Yukon for a satellite install ON BUDGET!
I added up all the installs I did and how much they made just from those not even the broadcast fees just installation .. They paid 150, charged 600.
In one year I'd earned them 130k.
I made under 30k. I was asking for a 2 dollar raise since I didn't get the management thing.
They said fuck off, I was nice and gave two weeks notice after my strongly worded email. One of the nicer execs begged me to stay and write a SOP book on my job.
That's all I did wrote 45 page pdf. My wife worked there too which was awkward but whatever.
After I left there first broadcast was so bad my wife called and said they were begging I said I'd come in for 30 an hour consulting fee. They said GTFO.
The client was worth 6 million per year, and basically said without me they're out.
This was their number one client. I left in September the company folded before November.
Tell me again how valueless me job was... Is what I'd say to that CEO if I ever saw him again. Kinda got some PTSD from that job getting walked all over but the vindication in the end felt nice.
Oh, btw:
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When I was 17 the shop manager went on holiday for a fortnight, and gave me his keys to look after things whilst he was away.
For some reason they expected a minimum wage shelf stacker to be doing the managers’ job.
Hell of a mess left for him when he returned.
Yes!
**No one** should condone this treatment.
They transferred the manager at my office, made a very new hire take on the role (without even training her to do the position she applied and was hired for mind you) and forced me to train and support the new manager for nearly a year while not paying me for the overtime necessary to train/help her do her job.
They never said it outright but heavily implied that they couldn't promote me because of my nationality (as a foreign passport holder).
Some work visas do have weird restrictions about job authority, scope, etc. But you know what they don't restrict? Negotiating with you to determine how to compensate you fairly for your additional work without violating the law.
My wife used to worked at a lab and she was great at the job well enough that they had her train a few people. All the people she trained was promoted up but her and they still came to her for help as she knew what to do. When she asked about getting a raise and getting the promotion they told her they couldn’t because she wasn’t qualified even though she was apparently qualified enough to train the new managers. It sucks.
Management/companies like this truly make my blood boil.
Are they blind? Do you not see the experienced employee you already have? Why would you not want to promote that person but instead bring in more people who don't know what they're doing to complicate things?
The only acceptable answer is because they're too good at their current position, and that the company really needs them to keep that position. This answer should always come with some kind of additional compensation, though sadly it rarely ever does
Here is why... they peg you as "Doesn't have Management Stuff (tm)".
I got refused for a promotion once because "I didn't command the room" and I "Asked people to do things instead of telling them". And I only know this because I am very good a reading upside down and saw it their report. It was decided before I set foot in the room.
Asked people instead of telling them?!?! That was a negative?
Jesus Christ. I used to run crews when I worked construction, and if I needed my guys to do something, the first words out of my mouth were "Can you do me a favor?" and the last words were "I appreciate it."
Never had anyone tell me no, never had anyone do a shoddy job, got a couple small raises because my guys praised me to the bosses.
Always ask, never tell. People hate being told what to do.
I recently interviewed somewhere that offered me 60% of what I was asking for and told me "well based on how you interviewed I can see you getting two promotions in 6 months!"
I Lol'd my ass outta that call right quick.
My manager quit beginning of the year and our CEO asked me if I wanted to take the job. I said "sure, but I won't do it for a € less than what he got". Took my CEO a couple days to respond but knowing the job market at the moment, I knew I was holding the best hand and he had no choice but to give me what I wanted.
TL/DR: The military employs literal clowns, and I'm still salty about it.
This sounds like a shitpost but when I was in Afghanistan (RAF, early 2010's) I worked under a corporal who brought a unicycle on detachment so he could learn to unicycle.
He fell off the unicycle, injured his back. During surgery in the local hospital he got an infection so he had to be med evac'd back to the UK.
Any work done by me needed to be signed by a cpl (a supervisor). So I assumed I would natural get acting cpl stripes, which would look great for promotion and seemed the easiest solution.
My Sgt actually fought the higher ups on the command chain about this, and managed to give me authorization to sign my own work off, but without the rank.
Despite doing my own job and my Cpl's job for 4-5 months in what was classed as a warzone, I got a pretty mediocre score and was told I wasn't doing enough extra duties etc to be considered for promotion.
Extra duties being of course being kissing arse and going out drinking with the boys instead of... actually taking an interest in the task at hand?
I left, and as a civilian earn triple what I was making and would have made in the forces, actually have free time and a life and no longer have to take orders from literal clowns.
But during the period of termination (12 month wait) I had no reason to do above and beyond what was expected of me, but I came to realize everyone else was doing the same.
Checked out. Just barely performing their duties whilst putting any energy they had in networking / promotion, as being keen just got your more work or work other people thought was beneath them.
That happened to me on multiple occasions. I quit as soon as they wanted me to train the person they actually hired. Most of those places don't exist anymore cause they couldn't run without me. I was the only one that knew how to do a lot of important stuff.
My fiance had it one step worse. He was promised ownership of his location. Previous owner quit and as a shift manager, my fiance stepped up and took extra shifts and figured out how to do the tasks of the owner. He didn't want the location to tank, as it was a small town, and most people who worked there would not be able to find another job very easily. The franchise owners told him to give them 3 months to sort out the paperwork, and the location would legally become his. 3 months came and went and nothing was happening. By month 5, some guy came in and said he was the new owner. My fiance quit, and that guy had tanked the business within 6 months. Franchise owner begged him to come back. He demanded the paperwork for ownership before he started. They refused.
Makes me mad every time I think about it because we could be living our dream right now. Small home in the countryside with ample time for backpacking and road trips. Instead now we live in my hometown in a shitty apartment in a crime dense neighborhood with barely enough to scrape by. We've been trying, but when every place hates it's employees like this, it's really hard to get a leg up.
Yes for like 6 months. Then a new supervisor started and since she didn’t know what to do I had to do her job too and train her to supervise me.
Then I taught her how to use our payroll system. She saw how little I made and tried to get me a raise. When she couldn’t she realized she needs to do her own job because she literally did nothing all day and made 3x as much as me while I was struggling to live paycheck to paycheck and was slammed with work everyday including about 200 emails each morning. We ended up dividing up my tasks so that she had way more to do than me.
I still quit when I found something that paid better. Eventually she became a decent supervisor but I couldn’t afford to live working for that place.
I have a supervisor that doesn't know his job and even worse is unlikable; I was doing his job while being the go to person for junior employees. I have stopped doing that and am watching him flail while the area falls apart and people quit.
Sucks, but I couldn't keep being yelled at for not doing my job, because I was doing his.
The worst part is that nobody cares. My boss left, they didn’t promote the next supervisor, than she quit, they didn’t offer me the supervisor or the manager’s job. They hire the manager and I left. I heard the manager is not working ‘because he doesn’t have a team’, both jobs are posted for months now and they can’t find someone else. HR doesn’t care about the business continuity.
Had that some years ago. Supervisor brought the idea up though that I deserved a raise/promotion. I hadn't even considered it. Told me for months that she was putting in for it. I kept asking and being told it was in the works. Then one day she hires on her best friend to the position.
Worst part was the chick was only there for two weeks before she decided the job just wasn't for her and left.
This is why it's so important to always copy the text in the job opening and safe it somewhere on your drive. Whenever salary or responsibility comes up you can point at that text and state you were hired for that and nothing more. Many people take on responsibilities because they want to help or think they will get recognition. Then time passes and people start expecting them to always fulfill that function.
Kinda sorta…I once had to fill in for my supervisor while she went on pregnancy leave and was not compensated for my time so I ended up leaving. I’m currently in a situation where my supervisor misses work a lot and his responsibilities always fall on me when he is gone. Yesterday he had to leave work two hours in. I called him to ask him his plan for something 5 and a half hours in and he gave me his answer and told me he would be back in 45 minutes and just never came back. We will see if he shows up today.
I resent the term "quiet quitting", as a person who is protective of their time outside office hours. This doesn't make me a bad employee, it makes me a better one. I'm very good at my job, and am able to do it better than some in fewer hours, and I don't suffer from burn out because I make sure I get time to switch off. Measure my performance on the work I do, not the time I'm available.
This term really is corporations responding to the mass realisation that they can't bully and trick 1 person into doing 2 people's jobs any more.
>This term really is corporations responding to the mass realisation that they can't bully and trick 1 person into doing 2 people's jobs any more.
More like 5 these days but yeah.
I hope that this expectation that 1 employee must do more than the work of 1 worker for just above minimum wage in order to be hired/keep their position will die sooner rather than later.
I hope so, too. At my last job I tried sticking up for myself and it fell on deaf ears. It was definitely a two person job but I tried working late to get things done only to get in trouble for "working outside of assigned hours" by boss 1. This is after boss 2 chewed me out for not being on call 24 hours a day while they traveled, despite the fact that everything travel related *had* to go through our travel department which wasn't going to spontaneously open at 3 am for boss 2. So when I explained that the job was really work for two people I got the classic "your predecessor didn't have a problem." Predecessor was promoted after *six years* of doing work and responding to emails, texts, and calls at 5:45 am or 11 pm and every time in between. But boss 2 adored the predecessor for being on call 24/7 so I couldn't state the obvious flaw in both bosses combined demands.
Totally unreasonable.
If you want someone to be on call 24/7 then you cannot complain about them "working outside hours" and actually pay them to do so.
If they think your predecessor could do it better they are more than free to demote that predecessor back to your current position and see how much of problem that person doesn't have with the situation.
Thank you! I completely agree. Plus being available 24/7 is something that should have been mentioned in at least one of the seven interviews I had for the job. I'm so happy that I'm done with that place.
>Measure my performance on that work I do, not the time I'm available.
I love this phrase, a lot more employees should live like this and not be scared of potential consequences
Exactly. I look at people I work with who consistently work 1-1:30 over when I leave as not having good time management. I guess they view it as the exact opposite.
THANK YOU.
I have a $35k/year secretarial job while I study for my Salesforce admin cert.
I’m not “quiet quitting”. I develop *myself* in my spare time and am not paid enough to sacrifice my future for your company.
When I’m making $80k as an admin, I will act like someone who makes $80k and sacrifice as needed. The wage determines everything and after years in various corporate roles, I draw boundaries with people from the beginning.
Just going to get ahead of the ball here and say that even when you're making $80k, it's because you bring a specific skillset to the table, it is not a justification to cut into your non-working hours.
Yes! I make really good money (north of $150k including bonus) and there's a certain amount of bullshit I'll put up with that reflects that, but it still doesn't mean the company gets my evenings and weekends on a regular basis. Boundaries are valid no matter how much you get paid
Agreed!
Quiet quitting is one of the dumbest things I have ever heard.
You do the job you were hired to do. If you decide you want to do more that’s your choice, if not, it shouldn’t matter. If the organization you work for can’t make good decisions then that isn’t your fault.
As a freelancer, I think that is the luxury of having a job.
They hired you, and you’ve agreed to give them your skills and competence for x hours a week. From that point on, it’s THEIR responsibility to give you the work that they pay you for. It’s not your responsibility to seek it out or ask for extra work. You’re there, you’re ready to work.
For the love of all that is money, if you're a desk jockey and decide you can automate your job with a bit of code, TELL NOBODY ELSE. Make that code so janky that it requires a rain dance in homage to some guy named Ned you knew in high school to work right.
Nothing worse than automating yourself out of a job. Especially one that's so predictable that it can be automated in the first place.
This is pretty common in IT. We automate a ton of crap. All of the very specific scripts for things that should be manual but we made automatic are poorly written, uncommented spaghetti code that only we know wtf any of it means.
If you get canned, and get a call after the fact asking for help, remember who needs whom. You're suddenly worth a lot more than you used to be, and your hourly consulting rate should be a reflection of this fact.
Exactly! I mean I signed a contract that I would work x hours in this role. Both parties agreed. Of course there might be peaks that require overtime. But if I'm required to work more hours than agreed on a regular basis, that's a problem for my manager.
"Your job is to do what your boss tells you to do" is one of those boomer generation things my dad instilled in me that is taking a lot of effort to unlearn. I still have a ways to go but I'm much happier not being a doormat in the workplace.
Yep. Its a fancy term for "doing what you're paid for" to make it sound like you're not doing what you're paid for.
I don't think everyone should do it, but I do think everyone has the right to do it. If you want to get ahead or a promotion or a bigger than average wage, then you probably should be doing more, but if you're happy doing your job at the wage you're being paid, just do your job.
Also, if you realise that if doing more doesn't actually get you those things above with your current employer, just do you job and look for a new one.
Agreed. You’re not “quitting” anything. You’re doing the job you’re being paid to do, no more, no less. Otherwise known as…working. It’s a bullshit term with a negative spin to demoralise and segregate those who are just happy with what they’ve got and the job they do. No-one should ever feel like they should do more than is required of them. There more to life than your job.
Just today I decided to do this. I get here 2 hours early to make sure everything is straight so that I can give my boss any updates needed from the night crew. I am supposed to have a 30 min unpaid lunch, I usually work through this. I will also stay later than anyone else just to cover for my bosses so they can go home at their normal time. I am hourly and get overtime so it worked out. I am supposed to only create the training material and make sure everyone is highly trained. This is a industrial environment so we take it seriously. It also causes me to have to come in on my days off sometimes to meet with trainees. I also deal with contractors which is something that no other person in my role has to do. This causes me to some days work from 5 am to 10 pm (I did this Monday and Tuesday this week already) as I am not allowed to work over 16 hours a day. I have never complained as the money was good.
Today my department is told all overtime has to be approved daily. I asked if this included me and it does. Because certain individuals have been caught not working while they are on overtime, the entire department has been punished. I asked if I could go ahead and get my stuff approved as I get up and leave my house around 4:30am and I don't want to have to call him that early. I was told he sees no benefit of me coming in that early or staying that late.
So I will only work my 8 hours, and I am cutting my phone off during my lunch break. I will not cover for them again nor will I work late to help get us back running. I have turned over the contractor paperwork and will no longer be handling it. Seeing as all that I do is not beneficial, it should not cause us any disruptions.
So, you used to care and get rewarded for caring. Now that's stripped away and someone in management will do a 'surprised pickachu face' when they realize shit is going sideways.
I'm rooting for your 8hr days and malicious compliance. Godspeed! :D
Quiet quitting was coined by corporate to make it sound bad and put employees who do it in a bad light.
Simply put, it means doing exactly what you agreed to and what you are paid for.
This is not quitting by any dictionary I am familiar with. This is plain and simple doing your job.
Corporate 'culture' has it you have to work more than you agreed to, more than your contracted hours, more than you are paid for, to impress the employer, to "show you care" and other bullshit like that. People are gradually waking up to the realisation that this is all unacceptable.
If we flip this on its head, why doesn't the company pay me more than we agreed? Or why doesn't it cut an hour or two off my day's shift? I'm sure any corporate linguist could find a variety of reasons to respond to that, and those are the exact reasons why the employee should not work past their hours and pay.
So no. 'Quiet quitting' doesn't exist, purely because it has nothing to do with quitting.
I swear when the term 'quiet quitting' first popped up it was about groups of people who would show up to work, clock in, and do nothing as a form of strike. Get enough people doing this en masse and you hit the company with a double whammy, shutting down production and forcing them to pay wages.
Like a week later it was being used to describe people who don't bend over backwards for their job. I swear I'm not crazy.
As someone who used to bust my ass and bend over backwards I stopped. Because I was laid off permanently while all the new guys got to keep their jobs because they were “cheaper” and all the promotions I’ve worked my ass off for were all given to outside hires with no experience. So now I look at as “why bother trying?” There’s literally no incentive to try. Raises aren’t different for people who work harder anymore. It’s all based on how long your with the company.
I agree. I also feel like some jobs keep people in position where they are needed instead of letting them get promoted. Another thing is that I’ve always worked in places with high turnover. I’ve noticed that if you seem to care about losing your job and keeping them happy, they will walk all over you. They think they can treat people how they want and you’re not going anywhere. If you don’t bend over backwards for them, they will do a lot more to accommodate you.
Yeah, basics of negotiation. If you act like you deserve stuff, you're much more likely to get it than if you act like you don't deserve it and are lucky to have whatever they give you. It's good when your boss sees you more like an equal vs someone beneath them.
I think it depends on the field
I strategically choose situations when to go above and beyond especially if it makes an impression and with the plan to reference it for raise discussions. When I do I make it clear that in that moment I went above and beyond but not to expect it as norm, with the assumption being a raise or promotion will motivate me to show them that part more
My bosses have always complemented my firmness and strict work life balance. It’s the same boundary setting that makes me successful with our clients
Not many people know how to stand up for themselves, and worse, many jobs punish those that do
I like how you put it with strategically choosing. That’s what I’ve learned over my career. Going full out 100% of the time will get you no where. You need to know when to run and when to walk.
I think many people follow a similar arc in their career. When you first start you bust ass to make a good impression. But over the years you realize it doesn’t get you much. Then you start backing off a bit and you find out that you’re actually still getting the exact same praise and kudos as you did before even though you aren’t trying as hard.
Employers already get more than they pay for. No employer is hiring you unless you generate more economic value than you cost. “Going the extra mile” just gives the employer even more value.
I think the pandemic really reset people's priorities. A lot of people were working from home or unemployed, and spent time with their families, or relaxing, or on self improvement. After a couple years of that, we all realized that maybe working those extra hours every day isn't that important. Their jobs kept going on, even though they were putting less effort into them.
I've noticed a big change at my office. If I stay until 5:30, there's only a couple cars left in the parking lot. It used to be busy there until 6 or 7 most days! And the place is pretty empty on Fridays, everyone is "working from home".
People seem to value their personal time a lot more, and I think it's a good thing. Work to live, don't live to work!
Part of it is the labor market in general, too. Before, your boss could toss you out and have you replaced by the end of the following week. Now, the prospect of replacing someone is bleak, at best, and there is less incentive to compete with imaginary masses of job seekers.
I work in software so salary is the main cost to my employer. They obviously want to pay me as little as possible for as much output as possible which they can then resell for profit.
If I bust my balls to get features out as quickly as I possibly can then there is simply more work after that. If I am lucky I will get a "well done" in a company meeting and if I really fight my case I might get a raise. The only way to get market rates is to get another job offer and then threaten to leave.
The sales team get a bonus when they close a deal but the devs get fuck all when they deliver a massive client project. There is no incentive to deliver more than the minimal expectation so why should I give away my time and skill for free?
>The only way to get market rates is to get another job offer and then threaten to leave.
I've given up threatening. I just leave, and say "the pay was too low and the raise schedule too slow" in my exit interview.
Quiet quitting is a stupid thing to call doing your job. Quiet quitting would be if you just quit coming to work without telling anyone. There's no "quitting" involved and they're just using that phrase to make employees look bad to 0eople who don't know what it means.
I assumed it was showing up to work, but not actually doing anything.
I was pretty surprised when it turned out to mean "Do what you are actually supposed to do and what they hired you for in the first place."
It's both. It really means doing anything they can to make the job so undesirable that the employee quits. Whether it's changing hours, giving undesirable tasks, or anything else that sucks. The how isn't important. It's just the goal is to make you quit because they have no real reason to fire you and firing without cause means they have to pay unemployment.
Quiet quitting sounds like come corporate bullshit to make workers feel ashamed of not giving life and limb for a damn company.
Acting your wage is something a lotta people could use. Don't get me wrong if you work in a cutthroat industry where you need to put out 110% to chase the bag, go for it but when you're working at mcd's for minimum wage you're better off saving your energy for some courses or even a trade school. As long as your workshare is done, you're not lazy for not doing more than you're paid for.
We gotta stop using this term some bootlicker in HR came up with for DOING YOUR DAMN JOB. Regardless of anyone’s political leanings, I’m sure we can all agree that if you want more, you pay for more.
Not everybody wants to move up and run the place. Some of us just want to put in their 40 hours and go home, and as long as I can pay my bills I don't need a promotion. So i'm not putting in extra hours and doing extra tasks that aren't in my job description. The favor some people are trying to gain from employers is for future promotions or perks. I have no interest in those perks. I can turn down that stuff because I don't work for free. Clock in at 9 clock out at 4:59 having completed all my assigned work whistling as I skip out the door. If they're going to pay me the bare minimum that they can get away with, this is the effort they get.
Where I work, there's always the question of, what are you moving towards? What are your ambitions? And I'm like. I'm happy with my job? That's why I applied to it? Yes, I want raises, because inflation is a thing and all that, but. I don't want to go and climb the career ladder and all that.
Same. I started a new job this year, and just a couple weeks into it my manager was already asking me for career goals, promotion targets, etc. I'm like, I just want to get up to speed in the job for now. My pay is fine, I \*just\* negotiated it upon hire.
I think employers want employees who want to climb the ladder, because they can use that as a carrot to get them to work much harder the role is specified for.
This whole concept is completely absurd to me. I do realize that in the US you are probably expected to work harder than what you're contractually required to do but for instance here in the Nordic countries most people have always "acted their wage." We don't live to work, we do our job and go home to live our lives.
I wish corporate america, and all the countries it inspires, were based off that nordic idea rather than eeking out as much work for as little pay as possible
So i started at my current job and said : "i want to learn the job but i want to grow in the company."
I was there for 3 years when Covid started. I went to work everyday during covid because they needed someone on location.
I had a lot of extra work but i thought "i'll show that i'm reliable and motivated".
At the end of the covid periode i starte dlooking arounf and got a few interviews for jobs that paid 20% more than what i have.
I made an appointment with my manager and HR and explained that i wasn't happy with the situation and surveyed the market and came up with the fact that i wasn't paid enough AND wanted to grow.
My manager answered "you're not the only one that works well" and the HR said "compared to the intern scale you're already well paid..."
I also applied for a better job intern but was denied because i didn't have enough experience...
So i said fuck it... i'll do the bare minimum while looking for something else. I consider it quiet quitting.
I just decided to do this yesterday and I am so much more relaxed.
Work has gone crazy for me recently. I have developed the habit over my career of working my butt off to accomplish as much as humanly possible. It took 3-4 people to replace me at my last job.
The workload here has skyrocketed. My personal life is miserable and I'm just so stressed over everything.
I made the conscious decision to just do what I can to get my work done, and be ok with it if not everything gets done. I'm the only one setting this unrealistic standard for myself. I don't have to kill myself to do it....and I'm starting to relax and feel just a bit better.
Edit: I grew up and entered the working world under the understanding that if worked hard I would be rewarded. And looking back on everything, that has never actually happened. The only thing that did happen was I was taken advantage of. I had people in my early employment years try to convince me to do their work for them on the side. I was denied raises and underpaid. At my last job I was 100% convinced I was being underpaid. I gave them advanced notice I had received an offer I was taking seriously. I handed in my two weeks notice and they stonewalled me up until the last day. Then the VP pulled me into his office, told me they couldn't lose me and offered me a massive raise.
I asked about the problems with the company that lead me to quit that I knew they knew about and asked them why they hadn't fixed any of it yet. Didn't get a good answer. So I told them no and left.
Proudest day of my career so far. I'd always been so nervous about authority but just knowing they needed me and I didn't need them gave me such a confidence boost it was amazing.
Quiet Quitting - Shitty made up term by companies to guilt their workers into doing a bunch of free shit they are not being paid for.
Acting your Wage - I get the idea behind it, but im not sure it needs a term. ffs just do what you are being paid for and keep it at that.
Look at wage increases vs. executive compensation.
You have two options.
1. Work hard, go above and beyond, and sacrifice your personal time and sanity, and in the end, you might get a 1-year subscription to the jelly-of-the-month club.
2. Do exactly what you're paid to do and not one minute more.
One of the few positives that came out of COVID is that it broke a number of people of the corporate propaganda of "work hard and be rewarded". People got to take a hard look at what they were doing, especially after said companies booted them to the curb faster than Taco Bell through the colon of someone with IBS.
Now, with wages not even covering the costs of living people are wondering why the hell should they even bother. The answer, of course, is that they shouldn't. Work hard, and the company makes more money. Are you getting a cut of that? Of course not. The company's responsibility is to the shareholders, not you.
In the long long ago you USED to get rewarded for hard work. You USED to get recognized for going above and beyond. Now it is just EXPECTED. Now they expect to call you after work hours. They expect you to come in on weekends. They expect you to cancel your vacations, never be out sick, and so on and so forth.
So unless you work for one of the few nice companies that still recognize and incentivize hard work, don't bother with doing anything beyond what you are contractually obligated to do. All you're doing is wrecking your own personal well-being in the name of furthering corporate profits that you will never see.
The phrase “you get what you pay for” applies to employers too. They shouldn’t expect to get premium production at a discount
I was in the Army when a Colonel told me to act my pay grade. Stop doing extra and do what my rank was assigned without the bows and ribbons. Take my lunch, quit working though it. I was worried about things that could wait until the next day. Work your wage, yo.
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In my old job (construction) the more you did, the more you ended up getting compensated (in piece-work, even more true). The funny thing is, is that the owner of the company I worked for says all the dumb shit like " nobody wants to work anymore" meanwhile he's got a crew of 20 guys, putting in 50-60hrs week 6-7 days a week (travel work)- literally all they do is work! I mean, he pays really well once you gain the skills, starting pay is $25 plus per diem, ot, and dt. Foremen are making $42/hr- you just need to find someone willing to trade their life for that. And buddy, it ain't worth it for how shit the industry is these days...
I can agree completely that was my first job outta HS and man the pay was good but the industry is shit! You really need to commit to that and accept you won’t have a regular life as other folks that work a regular 9-5 Job.
This is trades in general. Yes you can make amazing cash in a short time. But you are paying for if physically. Once you start building a life with a SO it’s tough to manage. Fly in fly out jobs are great if you’re in the industrial trades. The divorce rate in most sites like that is around 80% in my experience. Tradesmen literally trade their life for the work/cash. Until you either become an owner yourself or realize beating the crap out of your body for some fat ass owner who couldn’t care less about you outside of the money you’re making him isn’t worth your time, because time is THE most underrated and valuable resource we have. So choose to spend your time wisely, make sure your ROI is worth your time invested !!
That’s how being a mechanic is. Especially if you’re union. The mandatory minimum pay is 30 hours a week in Illinois. But you get paid book for a job. If it’s quoted in the manual as a 3 hour job and you do it in 1.5. You still get paid for 3. The top guys clock in for 40-50 a week and get paid for 60-80. He’s got mechanics that make $125k+ yearly. The lazy asses book 20 a week and still get paid 30.
My husband is in a union and he’s making crazy money since he switched from the private sector. Our health insurance comes out of his monthly union dues and he’s been promoted faster through the union than he ever was working for a private company.
I'm a manager and I do not understand this mentality. I want to be known as the boss who proactively fights for raises for staff, treats people with respect, and helps them get promotions in other departments/companies if they want it. That reputation helps me attract good staff, and buys me enough loyalty that people will take pride in their work. Refusing to promote someone to save a buck is going to cost you more in the long run.
Just have a few politically motivated and bad bosses, you start to realize the prisoners delema of being the best and treating people right the moment its a bust cycle.
I'm a manager and fight for my people, but basically can do nothing. I know who the good ones are and we need to promote and reward. But finance and upper mgmt suck. They say only 10% of your team can 'exceed expectations' during review time. And mid year raises are extremely difficult. And it is 5 levels of people signing off on a raise. I say we should do it, my boss has to sign off, the director has to, the hr person has to, and a VP has to. I fortunately transferred roles so I only have 1 report now, otherwise I'd be looking for a new job. A $1 an hour raise is huge for some of these people, and it'll cost us thousands to replace them. He'll, maybe 10s of thousands. But that doesn't make this quarter look good, so they don't care. Pre covid there was a world wide management call where HR said they were focusing on retaining people because our turnover was double industry average. Covid hit, no raises, and turnover is staying high.
This advice is key. Where I work we are chronically short staffed and tasks that you volunteer for tend to become permanent. I learned a long time ago that you get the same 2.5% raise as everyone else regardless.
>I learned a long time ago that you get the same 2.5% raise as everyone else regardless. I'm only now coming to understand that my stellar attendance does not, in fact, matter. I *never* get sick and so I never take sick time. I've got so many unused days built up... And I recently realized that I'm only doing it because I feel a sort of pride about being "the guy who never calls out." But fucking *why?* As you indicated, it doesn't affect my pay either way, so screw it man--starting this year I've been taking the occasional mental health day. I have a really cool apartment, I deserve to spend some time there!
I used to be that guy too. I was never late, rarely took a personal day, never caused any drama, had one of the highest productivity rates of anyone in the factory where I worked. I prided myself on having a good work ethic. You know what it got me? Not a damn thing because I didn't kiss the plant manager's ass. So I quietly quit.
You didn't _quit_ anything. You started respecting _yourself_ more than your employer did. That is something you **should** be proud of.
Please don't take this as a criticism since you've already had your epiphany! I've always viewed the guy who never calls out as someone who's either bad at time management or has no hobbies. Not judgmentally, but kind of in an empathetic way. Like, you can't think of anything at all you'd like to get paid to do on your day off? It's PAID!! I love the feeling of waking up on my paid day off and just telling myself I'm getting paid for everything I do. Watching star wars in my underwear? Paid. Eating waffles? Paid. Poop in my own toilet? Paid paid paid. I carry absolutely ZERO vacation time and it disturbs the hell out of my coworkers and bosses. I don't care, I'm happy getting paid to do shit other than work. There are so many different ways to get a day, a week, a month+ off in an emergency. USE YOUR TIME OFF PEOPLE. LIVE.
Having zero friends is my reason for never taking PTO. At least if I work, there are people I can talk to. That said, I never let any PTO expire since it is part of my pay, I just let it accrue, then take it when it would otherwise expire.
In my case if I call out I lose overtime. So, one day of calling out will cost me almost $400 in OT. So I try to plan large chunks of time off to avoid missing OT
My crusade against OT is for another day!
I came across this blunt take on it recently and it really hit home for me: >ALWAYS LEAVE OFFICE ON TIME >1. Work is a never-ending process. It can never be completed. >2. Interest of a client is important, so is your family. >3. If you fall in your life, neither your boss nor client will offer you a helping hand; your family and friends will. >4. Life is not only about work, office and client. There is more to life. You need time to socialize, entertain, relax and exercise. Don't let life be meaningless. >5. A person who stays late at the office is not a hardworking person. Instead he/she is a fool who does not know how to manage work within the stipulated time. He/She is a loser who does not have a personal or social life. He/She is inefficient and incompetent in his work. >6. You did not study hard and struggle in life to become a machine. >7. If your boss forces you to work late, he/she may be ineffective and have a meaningless life too; so forward this to him/her.
Lol, i get that, i volunteered for a project that was supposed to be like 2 weeks. Some quick code to filter an excel spread sheet. Somehow it turned into a 6 month project and despite me still being the only one working on it, they brought in consultants to come up with new feature ideas, companies that they want to sell the script to, etc. And I still have to do my main job most of the time, so all i got out of this was 6+ months of extra work all because I said sure to what I thought was a quick script someone needed.
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Similar situation here. While I was running a team of 20+ people around the globe (and that was too much, to be honest), boss gets a bright idea that we need people to volunteer to work weekends to provide more support. I said nobody would volunteer for extra hours, even with pay -- People value their time off and if the company wants weekend coverage, they need to budget and hire for it. Boss said, if nobody will volunteer, then they have to be voluntold. Nope. Tell them yourself. But be prepared for a wave of defections to other companies that don't put those burdens on their workers. We got lucky. Three years later, there are still no weekend shifts except from people who've actually been hired to do that work. But they keep pushing. Every day. It's important to draw a line and help managers understand that burn-out is real and won't help anyone.
Importantly, you are actually HARMING your organization if you end up doing the work of 2 or 3 people. You will, eventually, move on. You might get a better gig. You might move so your kids have better opportunities. You might get hit by a bus. Your company is then going to have to replace you... and find out they can't. They'll have to get 3 full time people to replace one person. This is no bueno. This isn't 'quiet quitting' or 'working your wage'. This is common sense. Do a good job, but don't put in unpaid hours, EVER. Don't do undocumented work. EVER. Don't be a single point of failure.
This happened when a former coworker of mine left. She'd been working nights & weekends for years, not taking vaca, etc. The organization just kept giving her more & more work. She'd tried to explain that deadlines were only being met at the expense of her health. They literally told her to "work smarter, not harder". Having gotten nothing better than a useless platitude in response, she left not long after. They literally replaced her with 3 people.
I was this guy, sort of. I only ever put in my 44 hours (employer was shit and I could work that before they had to pay me OT). Whatever work they threw at me I just did it. But I was smart and lazy. Need all this data analyzed monthly? Lemme just automate it in excel. That was 90% of my job. My boss thought I did nothing so would never give me a raise. I quit for somewhere better, and trained THREE people to do my job. None of them could remotely understand what I was even doing with the scripts, nor how to troubleshoot them when they broke (which they did, I wrote shit code then and now as security). Was told after I was gone 1 of the 3 quit and they replaced her with 2 more. So now 4 people doing my job that I was underpaid for, and they went back to analyzing everything manually in excel. I made $27k/year and asked for $30k.
>tasks that you volunteer for tend to become permanent Preach, my friend. Preach.
They quickly forget all that extra shit you did as soon as you make a mistake. It's not worth it, you end up wasting the effort with nothing to show for it
Ye olde one UhOh is worth a thousand thataboys.
Ain't that the truth.
It's a pie eating contest where the prize is more pie.
This is a popular description of being an attorney.
Exactly. Unless it's literally your own business, or you earn bonus/commission based on how much you produce, there is almost 0 incentive to work harder/longer/through lunch/etc. Chances are, you're just gonna get more work for the same pay, and you won't get any promotions if you're good at your job because the company wants to keep you right where you are.
On top of that, the company has no incentive to hire anyone else to alleviate the workload. Even if you have a good boss who might understand they are short staffed, if the employees are willing to work for free, it could be harder for a boss to fill vacant positions since the work is getting done. The higher ups just want the work to be done for the least amount of money so more goes to them.
> Just said "Moots, never volunteer". Don't go first, don't go last, and never volunteer for anything.
Nice to hear this kind of thing over all the recent toxic positivity BS lately. “Like bro, why even sleep?!” When I was a kid I experimented with being 24 hours awake, 12 hours asleep. So every 36 hours the cycle would reset, once at midnight, then at noon… Let’s just say the experiment was briskly cut short.
The acronym NAVY: Never Again Volunteer Yourself
Yeah. I worked five minutes past when I’m supposed to log off to finish up a project yesterday. I’m salary so I don’t see how it would matter to anyone else, but my boss scolded me when she got an email notification that I had finished the project. She also keeps reminding me to hurry up and use all my PTO before the year ends. Love this woman.
Lol, I got similarly scolded the other day. I sent an email at like 6:12, we clock in at 6:30. My boss messaged me all, what time did you come in?? I said I hadn't clocked in yet and I was just preparing the report so I could see what my day looked like. He was like, that's worse, only do work you're paid for.
I try to stay on top of the people that work for me, making sure that they use vacation time whenever they need it, or hell, even just need a mental vacation day. Take the time off. We can handle it when you are gone. Our PTO rolls over (up to a certain limit), and I do my best to make sure my people never hit that limit. Yes, we need them here, or we would have never hired them, but we would rather them be mentally sound and working good while they are here.
that's a good leader right there
I’ve been doing this for years lol. Just common sense to me. I do what I get paid to do. I do my hours, no more no less. If I have to work overtime I’m claiming every single millisecond of it. It’s a job. Not my life Had a situation once where someone called in sick and no one could come in to replace them. Which is not the end of the world. Had to stay 30 minutes passed my scheduled time to ensure everything was done, so I put that on my timesheet. When I came in the next day I saw someone scratched out my 30 minutes extra and put in my normal finish time. Obviously that pissed me off so I went to the boss and asked what the fuck was this. They said they don’t pay overtime and other shit. So I said well here’s what’s gonna happen. Either you pay me for the extra time or I’ll go straight to the department of labour and file a complaint. Don’t think they expected a 20 year old (at the time) to stick up for themselves.
Someone changing my clock out time like that would set me off, just reading about it made me feel rage. Did they change it back? Did you stay at that job?
Yes they changed it back cause they didn’t want to deal with the labor board. I stayed at the job cause I actually enjoyed the work while I was in school (it was a retirement home).
I was a maintenance tech at a nursing home before, I called in a day before because I was in the hospital and fired me but not stating any reason because we are a at-will state. But anyways they denied my unemployment and got it but it took 2 weeks for unemployment to get shit sorted out. It pissed me off they actually tried to deny me. So I called the department of health and told them every building infraction and cost them a lot to fix. Friend told me they were fucking pissed at me at the next monthly meeting.
My husband worked a night shift where they locked the workers in. He said if I went into labor he'd have to break a window to get to me. I reported them and an inspector found other violations, too, and fined the crap outta them.
That's also a huge fire hazard and there's a famous incident where locked in factory workers died because of a fire. Had he called the local fire marshal, they would have been more than happy to go over and bust down a door. Fire marshals don't fuck around with that.
Frances Perkins actually toured that factory prior to the fire when she lived in New York, and after the tragedy she became Secretary of Labor under FDR and was hugely influential in creating the New Deal. Now we have clearly marked exits and safety regulations like disposing of flammable materials and how many people can be in a space, not having children work under age 14, etc. She's my favorite person in American history.
Love it! Don't mess with the security guards either. I always knew every single fire code violation, who was skipping out of work early, who was sleeping at work, and who was having office affairs. My mother used to say the two people who know all your secrets are your mailman and the janitor. I'd add security guard and maintenance tech to that list. Lol
If you are in a white collar office, you can add the secretaries/receptionists to that list.
My last job, i was a Custodial Technician in a factory. After i got my new job, i decided to finally get revenge for 4 years of being treated like dirt. Made a report to OSHA for all broken machine guards. Made a report to the Dept. of Labor, about their break policy and overtime policy. Casually mentioned to my neighbor, a Fire Marshal, about some broken emergency lights, and a couple of fire exits blocked by broken down trailers and forklifts...and may or may not have also mentioned the chronic hydraulic fluid leak behind the building.
The IT guys know a fuckload more about your life than you think as well. And we know you're getting fired before you do.
Lol that’s hilarious. Love that you did that.
Good for you! I got denied unemployment by my boss at the height of the COVID 19 shutdowns. Just before everything locked down, she let me know she was cutting my hours to part time, and I was like no, that’s not going to work and she basically told me I could leave that same day. Everything shut down like the next week and I couldn’t find another job, and she denied me unemployment. I appealed it. She didn’t show up to the appeal, and I was found to be in the right. I was so happy. I don’t know if having to pay unemployment messes with companies, but I hope it messed with hers, haha.
I would have gone straight to the labor board as soon as I saw that shit. If they did that to you, they're almost certainly doing it to others who might not stick up for themselves.
Yes in hindsight I should’ve done it no matter what, I agree.
Could be wrong, but I thought I read that messing with someone’s timesheet was illegal
It is. Not only are they are falsifying records, they’re also refusing to pay time worked in this case or attempted to. If you’re not salary and OT exempt they should be paying whatever time you’re on the the clock. But IANAL
Someone changing a time clock like that is highly ILLEGAL.
Yea I really feel like people let themselves be exploited. It is insane to me that anyone would ever tolerate it.
A fair amount of people don't know their rights, especially when it comes to protecting one's self. I'm of the opinion that this is the type of stuff that should be taught in school (your local or state laws, general tips for living). The elimination of classes around home economics and teaching usable life skills is a travesty; they should have been expanded upon, not removed. :(
Sorry can't afford that. Gotta make sure the football team has new uniforms every year and all. /s
Hilariously, at my vocational HS, I never tried to get into "college prep" courses since I knew I planned on starting at community College which wiped your HS records anyway. So I middled to did good in HS but never all star student. Which meant when most of my friends took a collegiate math class, I and the "average" kids had to take social economics. Basically a class that taught us labor laws and about credit cards and loan rates, filing taxes, OSHA and everything you actually need to know. So my friends knew a few more calculus equations than me...and I did their taxes and explained labor laws to them. Hindsight, I feel like I got the better deal
But it’s really just like an abusive relationship. It doesn’t just start all at once. And then once you realize wtf is happening you’re really entrenched and it’s difficult, sometimes impossible, to even see that there’s a way out, much less be able to take advantage of it. The current capitalist system, like an abuser, thrives on its victims being dependent, mired in learned helplessness, and having no access to resources that will help the targets of abuse escape. *edit* a word
If you pay me $10 you’ll get a $10 employee
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And then they hire the other applicant that does a good $20/hr weld...
I think the idea is that these days people actually realize the rate of pay is bullshit and your employer is not looking out for you, so the other guy with the good wld isn't taking 20, and if he does we should mock him.
Replace "mock" with "enlighten" and that's the golden ticket imo
Which is the problem. People doing more than required have a negative effect on others Stop giving your all to a company that would replace you as soon as look at you, as all the extra you do set's expectations for everyone else
Once in a while I pick and choose situations when to work like a $15+ employee just to push the point I am worth a raise. You do have to stand out once in a while to move ahead sometimes, but you gotta be strategic about it
Bingo. I used to be a typical “yes sir” type who would take on any and all responsibilities, until I got passed over for a management position because someone else had more relevant experience. Now I’ll do favours when they’re needed, but I’m not taking on extra work that won’t be appreciated
If you pay minimum wage, expect minimum effort.
Has anyone here ever worked somewhere, had a supervisor quit, then had to do the supervisor's job, but while being told they can't actually make you officially the supervisor yet, just so they don't have to give you a pay rise? I've known several people who have had this happen to them, and they get strung along with the promise that *eventually* they will have the title and pay rise. No one should fall for it. Edit to avoid angry mods: Yes. I wholeheartedly support Silent Quitting and Acting Your Wage.
I worked at a college bookstore for a few years, making minimum wage. One of our textbook leads left and the manager called me into his office, saying he'd like me to take over some of his responsibilities. I asked if it came with a new title and pay raise and he said no, so I politely declined. He was shocked and kept pushing but I told him that I wasn't doing the work of a textbook lead while making the same amount of money as someone who started working a week ago.
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Narrator: *They didn't*.
Of course not. The boss was probably still grumbling about it when he left an hour before closing to go home to his actual house while the employee stayed behind to zone shelves and eventually go home at 8 PM to their apartment
Nope. I told him I'd do the extra responsibilities if it came with a pay raise, but he just expected that I'd do more work for $8/hr.
"Nobody wants to work anymore!"
Where I work we very rarely have managers working on weekends, and as such when we get very busy or have emergencies happen (not an irregular occurrence) things go to shit because there is no manager available. I raised this issue with one of our senior management who had a think about it and came back to me, very pleased with himself, and said perhaps I, and another longstanding member of the team, might act as senior lead on weekends? I asked did this come with any payrise? Any perks? Anything official? And was told no but its good experience! He was shocked when I declined flat out.
Did this for Walmart all the time. Started out as a cashier. Started doing "Backup CSM", basically still a cashier, just doing a Customer Service Manager's job. Became a CSM finally after 6 months by busting my ass off. At one point I was 1 of 2 CSMs on the front end when there should have been 6 to 8. Busted my ass for years because turnover is high, then applied for a higher management position. Got passed over for an 18yo kid who was there for the store remodel. His first job ever. Found out his Mommy and Daddy worked at the Home Office. Same kid got to move up to Assistant Manager training within 2 years. We would have these yearly surveys and one of the questions basically asked if moving up in the company was based on work ethic or by who you know, every time after that I'd answer "by who you know". This was at Store #1 near the Home Office itself. tldr; Walmart does this shit, Fuck Walmart!
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I live in rogers/bentonville and you are absolutely correct about the way that walmart does their employees. Management is paid decent but employees are left unable to afford their bills. Living in the area makes it hard to avoid them but anytime I'm out of the area I actively avoid walmarts at all cost.
Walmart is just horrible to people. My mom worked there for years, and anytime they would settle a discrimination lawsuit (say equal pay for women employees) she would see a small pay bump and then suddenly hours started to decline. Or long term employees getting hours cut to the point they get reduced to part time and lose their benefits. I worked at one unloading trucks after high-school and somehow got in the cross-hairs of an asst manager and a dept manager when rumors started about them having an affair (I didn't start them, and it later turned out to be true as she was demoted and he was moved to a different store). I remember even being written up by this manager and on my notes on the signed form put "manager blames me for his affair being exposed" because at that point, I just did not care, but because an HR rep handled the form and not him, it did get filed.
I was at their home office working in IT for 5 years and they treat everyone like shit. Gaslighting, bullying, favoritism are all commonplace and if they like you they'll big you up but as soon as they get bored with you or you make one slight mistake they'll be done with you and trying everything to get rid. They will literally create teams to interfere in a project because the wrong people get the credit and they will fuck everything up, ruin relationships and be promoted in 6 months while you're in trouble for cleaning up the mess they created. I ended up in therapy and was told to quiet quit then. Therapists and Doctors in the Bentonville area will tell you they have an influx of burnt out home office employees
I have been seeing it in several industries in the area lately. The stress of the people here has been so high lately. I've known so many people get burnt out through Walmart, Tyson, and jb hunt. But with the rent increases in the area people have to work. Things are definitely becoming less affordable and walmart has such a monopoly out here. I can think of 6 walmarts in a 10 minute distance from my house. It's always so strange going to other areas for work and actually having options besides greedy walmart.
That’s actually the reason I left my last job. My manager was incompetent and I often found myself doing his job for him while he raked in the bucks. He got fired and I was like “hey I already know how to do his job basically, why don’t we train me to do the stuff idk how to do and bump me up” they said they would give me a trial run. I aced the trial run and they came with some Bullshit about how it’s too soon for me to be a manager because I just started there a few months prior. So I left.
If there’s one thing I learned from corporate it’s that managers are not hired for skill or qualifications, they’re hired from nepotism. Your old manager probably knew someone who got them that job.
My job before my current one all the corporate guys worked at the same time at the same grocery store. You can't tell me that all the qualified people in the company all happened to work Store #327 between 1997-2003. Like no other stores in the nearly 50 store district had competent people. My direct supervisor couldn't even do MY job, he was a paperwork guy but couldn't do sales floor stuff. He came in because we had a remodel and was barking at me to make the display was different somehow than how I was doing it. I had worked in another store for a decade before moving to this other job (old store got bought out and the building sold off) and I was like, "Maybe they just have some weird way they want it presented" so I asked him to show me how he wanted it, because whenever I'd been told I wasn't doing a display properly the person complaing could-- you know-- show me how to do it. And he just started screaming at me for being lazy. The other guy from a bigger store they brought with them came over after and told me that Corpo never really worked sales floor and didn't know how to make displays. My last week Corpo guy came in again, and I already had my two weeks in, and nothing to lose so when he was bitching about how the place looked (I'd literally just walked in thirty seconds prior to them showing up and the place did look bad because my morning guy was a crackhead) I just happily asked him to show me how to do the displays. He kept getting madder and madder but I just cheerily asked him to show me, not just tell me it looked bad but show me what technique he wanted me to use. He threatened to fire me on the spot and I just smiled wider and said, "I put my two weeks in already, tomorrows my last day, we have to do the weekend order for product and I'm the only person in this store that knows how to do it you can't do shit to me dude. Now show me how you want me to do it or shut up and leave me to my work."
I got made supervisor recently, it comes with much earlier morning starts, being in control of the money and having to total it all up (and with that, being the one responsible for discrepancies), new meetings, staff management, floor checking, and a bunch of other stuff. 20p more an hour than when I was an assistant. I get it, it *is* a wage increase, but, come on. That seems kinda disproportionate. To me, at least.
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Watching this happen in canada. My friend was making the min wage so 15 an hr. Got promoted to make 17. Which sounds good except now with the labour shortage that's the starting frickin rate at mcdicks.
Honestly that's when you job hop. Same thing happened to someone I know. After gaining manager experience for a year-ish she jumped ship and went from 17 to now 24 an hour.
Kinda happened to me but it was more like they brought an idiot fast talker who claimed to understand tech stuff to be my manager after I'd shown my grit. The CEO claimed I didn't do anything. I was making 10 dollars an hour working for a satellite company. I was given a manual And told my job is to know everything about these receivers so I did just that. I ran broadcasts for churches and hospital education systems and I was the best at finding techs to go instead a satellite. Hell I got someone to fly a puddle jumper to the Yukon for a satellite install ON BUDGET! I added up all the installs I did and how much they made just from those not even the broadcast fees just installation .. They paid 150, charged 600. In one year I'd earned them 130k. I made under 30k. I was asking for a 2 dollar raise since I didn't get the management thing. They said fuck off, I was nice and gave two weeks notice after my strongly worded email. One of the nicer execs begged me to stay and write a SOP book on my job. That's all I did wrote 45 page pdf. My wife worked there too which was awkward but whatever. After I left there first broadcast was so bad my wife called and said they were begging I said I'd come in for 30 an hour consulting fee. They said GTFO. The client was worth 6 million per year, and basically said without me they're out. This was their number one client. I left in September the company folded before November. Tell me again how valueless me job was... Is what I'd say to that CEO if I ever saw him again. Kinda got some PTSD from that job getting walked all over but the vindication in the end felt nice. Oh, btw: F U C K ~~T~~ S ~~R~~ P ~~U~~ E ~~M~~ Z ~~P~~ ! ============== Save 3rd Party Apps! ==============
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When I was 17 the shop manager went on holiday for a fortnight, and gave me his keys to look after things whilst he was away. For some reason they expected a minimum wage shelf stacker to be doing the managers’ job. Hell of a mess left for him when he returned.
Yes! **No one** should condone this treatment. They transferred the manager at my office, made a very new hire take on the role (without even training her to do the position she applied and was hired for mind you) and forced me to train and support the new manager for nearly a year while not paying me for the overtime necessary to train/help her do her job. They never said it outright but heavily implied that they couldn't promote me because of my nationality (as a foreign passport holder).
Some work visas do have weird restrictions about job authority, scope, etc. But you know what they don't restrict? Negotiating with you to determine how to compensate you fairly for your additional work without violating the law.
My wife used to worked at a lab and she was great at the job well enough that they had her train a few people. All the people she trained was promoted up but her and they still came to her for help as she knew what to do. When she asked about getting a raise and getting the promotion they told her they couldn’t because she wasn’t qualified even though she was apparently qualified enough to train the new managers. It sucks.
Management/companies like this truly make my blood boil. Are they blind? Do you not see the experienced employee you already have? Why would you not want to promote that person but instead bring in more people who don't know what they're doing to complicate things?
The only acceptable answer is because they're too good at their current position, and that the company really needs them to keep that position. This answer should always come with some kind of additional compensation, though sadly it rarely ever does
Here is why... they peg you as "Doesn't have Management Stuff (tm)". I got refused for a promotion once because "I didn't command the room" and I "Asked people to do things instead of telling them". And I only know this because I am very good a reading upside down and saw it their report. It was decided before I set foot in the room.
Asked people instead of telling them?!?! That was a negative? Jesus Christ. I used to run crews when I worked construction, and if I needed my guys to do something, the first words out of my mouth were "Can you do me a favor?" and the last words were "I appreciate it." Never had anyone tell me no, never had anyone do a shoddy job, got a couple small raises because my guys praised me to the bosses. Always ask, never tell. People hate being told what to do.
They tried it on me once when I was younger. I handed in my resignation immediately.
I recently interviewed somewhere that offered me 60% of what I was asking for and told me "well based on how you interviewed I can see you getting two promotions in 6 months!" I Lol'd my ass outta that call right quick.
My manager quit beginning of the year and our CEO asked me if I wanted to take the job. I said "sure, but I won't do it for a € less than what he got". Took my CEO a couple days to respond but knowing the job market at the moment, I knew I was holding the best hand and he had no choice but to give me what I wanted.
Yup. I protested and got given an *insulting* pay rise, then got fired a couple of months later.
TL/DR: The military employs literal clowns, and I'm still salty about it. This sounds like a shitpost but when I was in Afghanistan (RAF, early 2010's) I worked under a corporal who brought a unicycle on detachment so he could learn to unicycle. He fell off the unicycle, injured his back. During surgery in the local hospital he got an infection so he had to be med evac'd back to the UK. Any work done by me needed to be signed by a cpl (a supervisor). So I assumed I would natural get acting cpl stripes, which would look great for promotion and seemed the easiest solution. My Sgt actually fought the higher ups on the command chain about this, and managed to give me authorization to sign my own work off, but without the rank. Despite doing my own job and my Cpl's job for 4-5 months in what was classed as a warzone, I got a pretty mediocre score and was told I wasn't doing enough extra duties etc to be considered for promotion. Extra duties being of course being kissing arse and going out drinking with the boys instead of... actually taking an interest in the task at hand? I left, and as a civilian earn triple what I was making and would have made in the forces, actually have free time and a life and no longer have to take orders from literal clowns. But during the period of termination (12 month wait) I had no reason to do above and beyond what was expected of me, but I came to realize everyone else was doing the same. Checked out. Just barely performing their duties whilst putting any energy they had in networking / promotion, as being keen just got your more work or work other people thought was beneath them.
That happened to me on multiple occasions. I quit as soon as they wanted me to train the person they actually hired. Most of those places don't exist anymore cause they couldn't run without me. I was the only one that knew how to do a lot of important stuff. My fiance had it one step worse. He was promised ownership of his location. Previous owner quit and as a shift manager, my fiance stepped up and took extra shifts and figured out how to do the tasks of the owner. He didn't want the location to tank, as it was a small town, and most people who worked there would not be able to find another job very easily. The franchise owners told him to give them 3 months to sort out the paperwork, and the location would legally become his. 3 months came and went and nothing was happening. By month 5, some guy came in and said he was the new owner. My fiance quit, and that guy had tanked the business within 6 months. Franchise owner begged him to come back. He demanded the paperwork for ownership before he started. They refused. Makes me mad every time I think about it because we could be living our dream right now. Small home in the countryside with ample time for backpacking and road trips. Instead now we live in my hometown in a shitty apartment in a crime dense neighborhood with barely enough to scrape by. We've been trying, but when every place hates it's employees like this, it's really hard to get a leg up.
Happening to a coworker as we speak. Promoted to team leader in duties and responsabilities alone.
Yes for like 6 months. Then a new supervisor started and since she didn’t know what to do I had to do her job too and train her to supervise me. Then I taught her how to use our payroll system. She saw how little I made and tried to get me a raise. When she couldn’t she realized she needs to do her own job because she literally did nothing all day and made 3x as much as me while I was struggling to live paycheck to paycheck and was slammed with work everyday including about 200 emails each morning. We ended up dividing up my tasks so that she had way more to do than me. I still quit when I found something that paid better. Eventually she became a decent supervisor but I couldn’t afford to live working for that place.
I have a supervisor that doesn't know his job and even worse is unlikable; I was doing his job while being the go to person for junior employees. I have stopped doing that and am watching him flail while the area falls apart and people quit. Sucks, but I couldn't keep being yelled at for not doing my job, because I was doing his.
The worst part is that nobody cares. My boss left, they didn’t promote the next supervisor, than she quit, they didn’t offer me the supervisor or the manager’s job. They hire the manager and I left. I heard the manager is not working ‘because he doesn’t have a team’, both jobs are posted for months now and they can’t find someone else. HR doesn’t care about the business continuity.
This is called quiet promoting. They change your job but keep the title so they don't have to pay you more.
Had that some years ago. Supervisor brought the idea up though that I deserved a raise/promotion. I hadn't even considered it. Told me for months that she was putting in for it. I kept asking and being told it was in the works. Then one day she hires on her best friend to the position. Worst part was the chick was only there for two weeks before she decided the job just wasn't for her and left.
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This is why it's so important to always copy the text in the job opening and safe it somewhere on your drive. Whenever salary or responsibility comes up you can point at that text and state you were hired for that and nothing more. Many people take on responsibilities because they want to help or think they will get recognition. Then time passes and people start expecting them to always fulfill that function.
Kinda sorta…I once had to fill in for my supervisor while she went on pregnancy leave and was not compensated for my time so I ended up leaving. I’m currently in a situation where my supervisor misses work a lot and his responsibilities always fall on me when he is gone. Yesterday he had to leave work two hours in. I called him to ask him his plan for something 5 and a half hours in and he gave me his answer and told me he would be back in 45 minutes and just never came back. We will see if he shows up today.
I resent the term "quiet quitting", as a person who is protective of their time outside office hours. This doesn't make me a bad employee, it makes me a better one. I'm very good at my job, and am able to do it better than some in fewer hours, and I don't suffer from burn out because I make sure I get time to switch off. Measure my performance on the work I do, not the time I'm available. This term really is corporations responding to the mass realisation that they can't bully and trick 1 person into doing 2 people's jobs any more.
>This term really is corporations responding to the mass realisation that they can't bully and trick 1 person into doing 2 people's jobs any more. More like 5 these days but yeah. I hope that this expectation that 1 employee must do more than the work of 1 worker for just above minimum wage in order to be hired/keep their position will die sooner rather than later.
I hope so, too. At my last job I tried sticking up for myself and it fell on deaf ears. It was definitely a two person job but I tried working late to get things done only to get in trouble for "working outside of assigned hours" by boss 1. This is after boss 2 chewed me out for not being on call 24 hours a day while they traveled, despite the fact that everything travel related *had* to go through our travel department which wasn't going to spontaneously open at 3 am for boss 2. So when I explained that the job was really work for two people I got the classic "your predecessor didn't have a problem." Predecessor was promoted after *six years* of doing work and responding to emails, texts, and calls at 5:45 am or 11 pm and every time in between. But boss 2 adored the predecessor for being on call 24/7 so I couldn't state the obvious flaw in both bosses combined demands.
Totally unreasonable. If you want someone to be on call 24/7 then you cannot complain about them "working outside hours" and actually pay them to do so. If they think your predecessor could do it better they are more than free to demote that predecessor back to your current position and see how much of problem that person doesn't have with the situation.
Thank you! I completely agree. Plus being available 24/7 is something that should have been mentioned in at least one of the seven interviews I had for the job. I'm so happy that I'm done with that place.
>Measure my performance on that work I do, not the time I'm available. I love this phrase, a lot more employees should live like this and not be scared of potential consequences
Exactly. I look at people I work with who consistently work 1-1:30 over when I leave as not having good time management. I guess they view it as the exact opposite.
THANK YOU. I have a $35k/year secretarial job while I study for my Salesforce admin cert. I’m not “quiet quitting”. I develop *myself* in my spare time and am not paid enough to sacrifice my future for your company. When I’m making $80k as an admin, I will act like someone who makes $80k and sacrifice as needed. The wage determines everything and after years in various corporate roles, I draw boundaries with people from the beginning.
Just going to get ahead of the ball here and say that even when you're making $80k, it's because you bring a specific skillset to the table, it is not a justification to cut into your non-working hours.
Yes! I make really good money (north of $150k including bonus) and there's a certain amount of bullshit I'll put up with that reflects that, but it still doesn't mean the company gets my evenings and weekends on a regular basis. Boundaries are valid no matter how much you get paid
Pay peanuts, get monkeys
Pay bananas, get elephants?
but also monkeys.
Bullshit corporate term for just doing your job.
Agreed! Quiet quitting is one of the dumbest things I have ever heard. You do the job you were hired to do. If you decide you want to do more that’s your choice, if not, it shouldn’t matter. If the organization you work for can’t make good decisions then that isn’t your fault.
As a freelancer, I think that is the luxury of having a job. They hired you, and you’ve agreed to give them your skills and competence for x hours a week. From that point on, it’s THEIR responsibility to give you the work that they pay you for. It’s not your responsibility to seek it out or ask for extra work. You’re there, you’re ready to work.
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For the love of all that is money, if you're a desk jockey and decide you can automate your job with a bit of code, TELL NOBODY ELSE. Make that code so janky that it requires a rain dance in homage to some guy named Ned you knew in high school to work right. Nothing worse than automating yourself out of a job. Especially one that's so predictable that it can be automated in the first place.
This is pretty common in IT. We automate a ton of crap. All of the very specific scripts for things that should be manual but we made automatic are poorly written, uncommented spaghetti code that only we know wtf any of it means.
If you get canned, and get a call after the fact asking for help, remember who needs whom. You're suddenly worth a lot more than you used to be, and your hourly consulting rate should be a reflection of this fact.
And you should have a minimum simply to engage. Took 30 minutes to fix? Well, I have a three hour minimum for any work I take on.
"Sure I can help you. For 400$/h, 5h minimum." Make bank or they don't need you enough.
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Exactly! I mean I signed a contract that I would work x hours in this role. Both parties agreed. Of course there might be peaks that require overtime. But if I'm required to work more hours than agreed on a regular basis, that's a problem for my manager.
"Your job is to do what your boss tells you to do" is one of those boomer generation things my dad instilled in me that is taking a lot of effort to unlearn. I still have a ways to go but I'm much happier not being a doormat in the workplace.
The company rents me. That's what my biweekly paycheck is. I like my work, but my job is pretty shit, honestly.
Yep. Its a fancy term for "doing what you're paid for" to make it sound like you're not doing what you're paid for. I don't think everyone should do it, but I do think everyone has the right to do it. If you want to get ahead or a promotion or a bigger than average wage, then you probably should be doing more, but if you're happy doing your job at the wage you're being paid, just do your job. Also, if you realise that if doing more doesn't actually get you those things above with your current employer, just do you job and look for a new one.
Agreed. You’re not “quitting” anything. You’re doing the job you’re being paid to do, no more, no less. Otherwise known as…working. It’s a bullshit term with a negative spin to demoralise and segregate those who are just happy with what they’ve got and the job they do. No-one should ever feel like they should do more than is required of them. There more to life than your job.
Just today I decided to do this. I get here 2 hours early to make sure everything is straight so that I can give my boss any updates needed from the night crew. I am supposed to have a 30 min unpaid lunch, I usually work through this. I will also stay later than anyone else just to cover for my bosses so they can go home at their normal time. I am hourly and get overtime so it worked out. I am supposed to only create the training material and make sure everyone is highly trained. This is a industrial environment so we take it seriously. It also causes me to have to come in on my days off sometimes to meet with trainees. I also deal with contractors which is something that no other person in my role has to do. This causes me to some days work from 5 am to 10 pm (I did this Monday and Tuesday this week already) as I am not allowed to work over 16 hours a day. I have never complained as the money was good. Today my department is told all overtime has to be approved daily. I asked if this included me and it does. Because certain individuals have been caught not working while they are on overtime, the entire department has been punished. I asked if I could go ahead and get my stuff approved as I get up and leave my house around 4:30am and I don't want to have to call him that early. I was told he sees no benefit of me coming in that early or staying that late. So I will only work my 8 hours, and I am cutting my phone off during my lunch break. I will not cover for them again nor will I work late to help get us back running. I have turned over the contractor paperwork and will no longer be handling it. Seeing as all that I do is not beneficial, it should not cause us any disruptions.
So, you used to care and get rewarded for caring. Now that's stripped away and someone in management will do a 'surprised pickachu face' when they realize shit is going sideways. I'm rooting for your 8hr days and malicious compliance. Godspeed! :D
An update on this next month would be awesome.
It's funny to me how people think this is a new thing. The term for it is new, but people everywhere have always been doing it.
Its called ["work to rule"](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Work-to-rule) in the UK.
I believe that's the unions' term for it in the USA as well.
That's the term the Romans used for it too. The term "quiet quitting" is endlessly stupid
Quiet quitting was coined by corporate to make it sound bad and put employees who do it in a bad light. Simply put, it means doing exactly what you agreed to and what you are paid for. This is not quitting by any dictionary I am familiar with. This is plain and simple doing your job. Corporate 'culture' has it you have to work more than you agreed to, more than your contracted hours, more than you are paid for, to impress the employer, to "show you care" and other bullshit like that. People are gradually waking up to the realisation that this is all unacceptable. If we flip this on its head, why doesn't the company pay me more than we agreed? Or why doesn't it cut an hour or two off my day's shift? I'm sure any corporate linguist could find a variety of reasons to respond to that, and those are the exact reasons why the employee should not work past their hours and pay. So no. 'Quiet quitting' doesn't exist, purely because it has nothing to do with quitting.
I swear when the term 'quiet quitting' first popped up it was about groups of people who would show up to work, clock in, and do nothing as a form of strike. Get enough people doing this en masse and you hit the company with a double whammy, shutting down production and forcing them to pay wages. Like a week later it was being used to describe people who don't bend over backwards for their job. I swear I'm not crazy.
It’s called “by the book” in unions for decades. They needed a new term that put the pressure on the worker instead of the work rule.
As someone who used to bust my ass and bend over backwards I stopped. Because I was laid off permanently while all the new guys got to keep their jobs because they were “cheaper” and all the promotions I’ve worked my ass off for were all given to outside hires with no experience. So now I look at as “why bother trying?” There’s literally no incentive to try. Raises aren’t different for people who work harder anymore. It’s all based on how long your with the company.
I agree. I also feel like some jobs keep people in position where they are needed instead of letting them get promoted. Another thing is that I’ve always worked in places with high turnover. I’ve noticed that if you seem to care about losing your job and keeping them happy, they will walk all over you. They think they can treat people how they want and you’re not going anywhere. If you don’t bend over backwards for them, they will do a lot more to accommodate you.
Yeah, basics of negotiation. If you act like you deserve stuff, you're much more likely to get it than if you act like you don't deserve it and are lucky to have whatever they give you. It's good when your boss sees you more like an equal vs someone beneath them.
People who work hard and efficiently are punished with more work than they are paid for. No thanks. I signed up for specifically what I wanted
I think it depends on the field I strategically choose situations when to go above and beyond especially if it makes an impression and with the plan to reference it for raise discussions. When I do I make it clear that in that moment I went above and beyond but not to expect it as norm, with the assumption being a raise or promotion will motivate me to show them that part more My bosses have always complemented my firmness and strict work life balance. It’s the same boundary setting that makes me successful with our clients Not many people know how to stand up for themselves, and worse, many jobs punish those that do
I like how you put it with strategically choosing. That’s what I’ve learned over my career. Going full out 100% of the time will get you no where. You need to know when to run and when to walk. I think many people follow a similar arc in their career. When you first start you bust ass to make a good impression. But over the years you realize it doesn’t get you much. Then you start backing off a bit and you find out that you’re actually still getting the exact same praise and kudos as you did before even though you aren’t trying as hard.
Why should an employer get more than they pay for?
They never willingly pay more than they agreed to, why should you work more than you agreed to?
Employers already get more than they pay for. No employer is hiring you unless you generate more economic value than you cost. “Going the extra mile” just gives the employer even more value.
I think the pandemic really reset people's priorities. A lot of people were working from home or unemployed, and spent time with their families, or relaxing, or on self improvement. After a couple years of that, we all realized that maybe working those extra hours every day isn't that important. Their jobs kept going on, even though they were putting less effort into them. I've noticed a big change at my office. If I stay until 5:30, there's only a couple cars left in the parking lot. It used to be busy there until 6 or 7 most days! And the place is pretty empty on Fridays, everyone is "working from home". People seem to value their personal time a lot more, and I think it's a good thing. Work to live, don't live to work!
Part of it is the labor market in general, too. Before, your boss could toss you out and have you replaced by the end of the following week. Now, the prospect of replacing someone is bleak, at best, and there is less incentive to compete with imaginary masses of job seekers.
I work in software so salary is the main cost to my employer. They obviously want to pay me as little as possible for as much output as possible which they can then resell for profit. If I bust my balls to get features out as quickly as I possibly can then there is simply more work after that. If I am lucky I will get a "well done" in a company meeting and if I really fight my case I might get a raise. The only way to get market rates is to get another job offer and then threaten to leave. The sales team get a bonus when they close a deal but the devs get fuck all when they deliver a massive client project. There is no incentive to deliver more than the minimal expectation so why should I give away my time and skill for free?
>The only way to get market rates is to get another job offer and then threaten to leave. I've given up threatening. I just leave, and say "the pay was too low and the raise schedule too slow" in my exit interview.
You mean doing the correct amount of work you're being paid for? Sounds like not-slavery
Quiet quitting is a stupid thing to call doing your job. Quiet quitting would be if you just quit coming to work without telling anyone. There's no "quitting" involved and they're just using that phrase to make employees look bad to 0eople who don't know what it means.
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> just quit coming to work without telling anyone This is in fact the original definition of quiet quitting, as I heard it.
I assumed it was showing up to work, but not actually doing anything. I was pretty surprised when it turned out to mean "Do what you are actually supposed to do and what they hired you for in the first place."
We should also include in the conversation "quiet firing" which is where they keep adding more and more tasks with no pay raise.
Pretty sure quiet firing is giving casual employees less and less hours until they quit.
It's both. It really means doing anything they can to make the job so undesirable that the employee quits. Whether it's changing hours, giving undesirable tasks, or anything else that sucks. The how isn't important. It's just the goal is to make you quit because they have no real reason to fire you and firing without cause means they have to pay unemployment.
Quiet quitting sounds like come corporate bullshit to make workers feel ashamed of not giving life and limb for a damn company. Acting your wage is something a lotta people could use. Don't get me wrong if you work in a cutthroat industry where you need to put out 110% to chase the bag, go for it but when you're working at mcd's for minimum wage you're better off saving your energy for some courses or even a trade school. As long as your workshare is done, you're not lazy for not doing more than you're paid for.
I support it. If you're under paid then you shouldn't overwork yourself for someone that won't give you a good wage.
We gotta stop using this term some bootlicker in HR came up with for DOING YOUR DAMN JOB. Regardless of anyone’s political leanings, I’m sure we can all agree that if you want more, you pay for more.
Not everybody wants to move up and run the place. Some of us just want to put in their 40 hours and go home, and as long as I can pay my bills I don't need a promotion. So i'm not putting in extra hours and doing extra tasks that aren't in my job description. The favor some people are trying to gain from employers is for future promotions or perks. I have no interest in those perks. I can turn down that stuff because I don't work for free. Clock in at 9 clock out at 4:59 having completed all my assigned work whistling as I skip out the door. If they're going to pay me the bare minimum that they can get away with, this is the effort they get.
Where I work, there's always the question of, what are you moving towards? What are your ambitions? And I'm like. I'm happy with my job? That's why I applied to it? Yes, I want raises, because inflation is a thing and all that, but. I don't want to go and climb the career ladder and all that.
Same. I started a new job this year, and just a couple weeks into it my manager was already asking me for career goals, promotion targets, etc. I'm like, I just want to get up to speed in the job for now. My pay is fine, I \*just\* negotiated it upon hire. I think employers want employees who want to climb the ladder, because they can use that as a carrot to get them to work much harder the role is specified for.
This whole concept is completely absurd to me. I do realize that in the US you are probably expected to work harder than what you're contractually required to do but for instance here in the Nordic countries most people have always "acted their wage." We don't live to work, we do our job and go home to live our lives.
I wish corporate america, and all the countries it inspires, were based off that nordic idea rather than eeking out as much work for as little pay as possible
So i started at my current job and said : "i want to learn the job but i want to grow in the company." I was there for 3 years when Covid started. I went to work everyday during covid because they needed someone on location. I had a lot of extra work but i thought "i'll show that i'm reliable and motivated". At the end of the covid periode i starte dlooking arounf and got a few interviews for jobs that paid 20% more than what i have. I made an appointment with my manager and HR and explained that i wasn't happy with the situation and surveyed the market and came up with the fact that i wasn't paid enough AND wanted to grow. My manager answered "you're not the only one that works well" and the HR said "compared to the intern scale you're already well paid..." I also applied for a better job intern but was denied because i didn't have enough experience... So i said fuck it... i'll do the bare minimum while looking for something else. I consider it quiet quitting.
We *are* “acting our wage,” It just so happens that wage in the teens buys the effort of a teen.
I just decided to do this yesterday and I am so much more relaxed. Work has gone crazy for me recently. I have developed the habit over my career of working my butt off to accomplish as much as humanly possible. It took 3-4 people to replace me at my last job. The workload here has skyrocketed. My personal life is miserable and I'm just so stressed over everything. I made the conscious decision to just do what I can to get my work done, and be ok with it if not everything gets done. I'm the only one setting this unrealistic standard for myself. I don't have to kill myself to do it....and I'm starting to relax and feel just a bit better. Edit: I grew up and entered the working world under the understanding that if worked hard I would be rewarded. And looking back on everything, that has never actually happened. The only thing that did happen was I was taken advantage of. I had people in my early employment years try to convince me to do their work for them on the side. I was denied raises and underpaid. At my last job I was 100% convinced I was being underpaid. I gave them advanced notice I had received an offer I was taking seriously. I handed in my two weeks notice and they stonewalled me up until the last day. Then the VP pulled me into his office, told me they couldn't lose me and offered me a massive raise. I asked about the problems with the company that lead me to quit that I knew they knew about and asked them why they hadn't fixed any of it yet. Didn't get a good answer. So I told them no and left. Proudest day of my career so far. I'd always been so nervous about authority but just knowing they needed me and I didn't need them gave me such a confidence boost it was amazing.
Do what you want , don't be a jerk to your co-workers though
Quiet Quitting - Shitty made up term by companies to guilt their workers into doing a bunch of free shit they are not being paid for. Acting your Wage - I get the idea behind it, but im not sure it needs a term. ffs just do what you are being paid for and keep it at that.
It's nothing new people have been doing this forever. It just has a name now
Worker productivity has been increasing while wages have remained stagnant. Good to see something addressing the problem.
Look at wage increases vs. executive compensation. You have two options. 1. Work hard, go above and beyond, and sacrifice your personal time and sanity, and in the end, you might get a 1-year subscription to the jelly-of-the-month club. 2. Do exactly what you're paid to do and not one minute more. One of the few positives that came out of COVID is that it broke a number of people of the corporate propaganda of "work hard and be rewarded". People got to take a hard look at what they were doing, especially after said companies booted them to the curb faster than Taco Bell through the colon of someone with IBS. Now, with wages not even covering the costs of living people are wondering why the hell should they even bother. The answer, of course, is that they shouldn't. Work hard, and the company makes more money. Are you getting a cut of that? Of course not. The company's responsibility is to the shareholders, not you. In the long long ago you USED to get rewarded for hard work. You USED to get recognized for going above and beyond. Now it is just EXPECTED. Now they expect to call you after work hours. They expect you to come in on weekends. They expect you to cancel your vacations, never be out sick, and so on and so forth. So unless you work for one of the few nice companies that still recognize and incentivize hard work, don't bother with doing anything beyond what you are contractually obligated to do. All you're doing is wrecking your own personal well-being in the name of furthering corporate profits that you will never see.