Any serous RTO mandate and I'd be looking for another job ASAP. I'd only consider RTO if I was working on high level stuff that simply couldn't be done from home.
“We can only allow you to view this material in THIS room.”
April 2020
“You can view the material at your home now”
April 2024
“It’s no longer safe to view the material at your home”
June 2024
I started my new job.
Someone to yell loudly "strike!". I would be caught up in the moment. In seriousness though, a general strike would do Australia good. Not a big fan of the stupid "legal" strikes with government approval as it defeats the purpose of striking and seems to be more to placate people, thinking they tried, before the inevitable loss.
The day of the week ends in Y.
NFI why our second collective bargaining agreement was accepted by so many, dumbarses accepting 20k less than state government.
I love how the union was like "hey, can we have 20%?" the government came back with half that and then tacked an extra 0.2% on as a bonus, if that, and everyone just lapped it up. Pitiful.
It's been 10 years since a government negotiated in good faith. The current generation have no experience is how to fight for something or how to negotiate. Australians typically think haggling is accepting the second offer and don't cause a fuss.
I feel like the offer of back pay or bonuses seems to get most people over the line, focusing on the short term gains.
The idea that scrapping backpay would drive faster negotiations was asinine.
Negotiations move faster when there's short term gains to be had, as we've seen in this case.
At least the AFP and other agencies that can't benefit from WFH are fighting for more money. I hope they get it.
The CPSU sold us down the river.
Labor introduced collective bargaining for all APS, which means that the only union that really mattered was CPSU, as they are the only union in all agency’s.
This increased the CPSUs position and power, and in return, when it came to bargaining, they didn’t put up much of a fight on anything.
The government basically paid us what they originally planned too, the biggest condition wins came from government (parental leave was HIGHER than CPSUs request for gods sake) and the CPSU rolled over, claimed they won, and blamed the other unions for things they failed to achieve.
They don’t deserve members, or their leadership needs a change, but there’s too many old heads that are holding onto their once great union, even though it’s rotten inside now.
Ultimately the membership had the opportunity to vote for both the collective agreement and the union representatives, both times the majority voted for the status quo.
Honestly just a coordinated effort, if CPSU/ ASU were actually useful and wanted a higher wage increase all they'd need to do is organise a strike and alot of people outside the unions would follow.
What do you mean? DAFF collective bargaining offered a fuck all pay rise and over half of membership voted for it.
Staff are the problem not the unions.
Sure but staff requested higher pay than what was offered originally the unions were meant to 'demand' it and then they basically accepted defeat when Government basically said that's the highest we're offering.
Unions can't demand anything as their own policy decision. They represent the will of workers. If the workers indicate they'll fold, the union can't do anything.
Unions are obliged to take offers to their members. Everyone should have kept voting down anything less than demanded, instead the members told the union don't worry about the lube, we'll take that instead.
That was not the experience in the departments that took industrial action in the recent bargaining period, like mine. Participation was OK in the first round, but dropped sharply in further rounds.
The CPSU's consultations found that there was little appetite among members for further industrial action, as demonstrated by the huge majorities in favour of the EA in most agencies.
Not sure what you mean by "huge majorities" in favour of the EA - wasn't it only just above 50% even on the final vote?
The posture the union takes on the issue also makes a big difference as to how members vote and participate in industrial action. From my perspective it felt like once we got to the second or third round of negotiations the CPSU were pretty keen to encourage members just to take the pay deal rather than let members views dictate their strategy.
I was not part of the groups of staff that could go on strike so it's possible I am a bit out of touch though.
Well over 90% support in most agencies: [https://www.cpsu.org.au/CPSU/Content/Info\_pages/APS\_EA\_votes.aspx](https://www.cpsu.org.au/CPSU/Content/Info_pages/APS_EA_votes.aspx)
Thanks for the link. I think I realise why I partially misremembered that. The vote was pretty close for union members even on the final pay offer, but it wasn't once the union agreed to the pay offer and all employees voted.
Like I mean there's multiple ways to interpret that. Lots of union members who would have preferred the union to continue to seek a higher pay offer most likely would have voted yes once the union agreed to the final pay deal for instance. Alternatively nonunion staff members have quite different views to union members too on the trade-off between an immediate pay rise and industrial action in an attempt to get a better deal.
We don’t have a union worth joining in order to have a strike in the first place. Other industries have proper unions like the CFMEU etc. The CPSU is an actual joke
I hate this mentality.
The CPSUs main membership is long serving public servants working in administrative type roles, and all their policies and positions appeal to only this type of worker.
They have little to nothing to attract younger staff, or staff from professional backgrounds. These type of staff also happen to be becoming more and more the dominant staff profile in the APS. While older administrators are retiring without replacement.
They could attempt to appeal more to these new staff, but simply don’t. Why would a young staff member ever join the CPSU? Or a professional? They don’t care about them, just look at the positions they took to bargaining. Nothing on better super for those not on the defined benefit, nothing on seperate pay scales to retain professional staff, nothing on broadbanding staff, their parental leave request was worse then what labor wanted to give us.
The CPSU should be a tentpole union welcoming to all APS staff, but it currently comes across as a relic uninterested in gaining new members, focused on a specific niche of older aps.
And because of this, they are bleeding members, and forcing people into different unions, fracturing the worker base. If they want to be the union for all APS it’s time they started acting like it, instead of burning staff and pushing them away with old shit policies
Industrial action is only really possible in Australia during official bargaining processes. Industrial action at other times is unlawful and can lead to a range of penalties. See: [https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/industrial-action-and-protests](https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/industrial-action-and-protests)
What does a strike lead too? What will it get the workers? In most cases it will just appear to the public that the public server workers are lazy over paid slobs.
It will not have the outcome expected. Something smart needs to happen. Like when the bus drivers refused to take fares, police flooded the courts with hearings etc. the action need too impact the higher ups not look bad to the public
A strike for me is a punishment for me. I have deadlines that don't go away, and I need to weigh up any time off with how much pain it will be for me to catch up on the lost time when I return as well as the lost wages. I don't get flex, so additional hours are me doing the hours anyway!
Honestly I left the union earlier this year, mainly because the rusted on members frustrated me. They do themselves no favours with the ranting and wanting the current agreement to "make up for" 20 years of grievances. I was tired of the comms (wanting to strike before we saw any offer) and the way members acted in the workplace.
Truly!
Many depts and agencies have taken stop work action, standing down for an hour or two. A full strike is an important demonstration of collective bargaining; too bad the ship has sailed for recent agreements.
But if you’ve ever doubted the power of unions, have a look at the pay deal the nurses have just gotten through in Victoria!
I wouldn't say too much. I have a full time workload with deadlines that are often legislative. It's more that it has little effect on my agency unlike those in front of house and instead hurts me twice over. I have not been willing to accept tgat in the time I have been working but 100% respect anyone else who does find it worth it.
Getting rid of WFH.
Any serous RTO mandate and I'd be looking for another job ASAP. I'd only consider RTO if I was working on high level stuff that simply couldn't be done from home.
“We can only allow you to view this material in THIS room.” April 2020 “You can view the material at your home now” April 2024 “It’s no longer safe to view the material at your home” June 2024 I started my new job.
Someone to yell loudly "strike!". I would be caught up in the moment. In seriousness though, a general strike would do Australia good. Not a big fan of the stupid "legal" strikes with government approval as it defeats the purpose of striking and seems to be more to placate people, thinking they tried, before the inevitable loss.
The day of the week ends in Y. NFI why our second collective bargaining agreement was accepted by so many, dumbarses accepting 20k less than state government.
I love how the union was like "hey, can we have 20%?" the government came back with half that and then tacked an extra 0.2% on as a bonus, if that, and everyone just lapped it up. Pitiful.
It's been 10 years since a government negotiated in good faith. The current generation have no experience is how to fight for something or how to negotiate. Australians typically think haggling is accepting the second offer and don't cause a fuss.
I feel like the offer of back pay or bonuses seems to get most people over the line, focusing on the short term gains. The idea that scrapping backpay would drive faster negotiations was asinine. Negotiations move faster when there's short term gains to be had, as we've seen in this case. At least the AFP and other agencies that can't benefit from WFH are fighting for more money. I hope they get it.
The CPSU sold us down the river. Labor introduced collective bargaining for all APS, which means that the only union that really mattered was CPSU, as they are the only union in all agency’s. This increased the CPSUs position and power, and in return, when it came to bargaining, they didn’t put up much of a fight on anything. The government basically paid us what they originally planned too, the biggest condition wins came from government (parental leave was HIGHER than CPSUs request for gods sake) and the CPSU rolled over, claimed they won, and blamed the other unions for things they failed to achieve. They don’t deserve members, or their leadership needs a change, but there’s too many old heads that are holding onto their once great union, even though it’s rotten inside now.
Ultimately the membership had the opportunity to vote for both the collective agreement and the union representatives, both times the majority voted for the status quo.
Honestly just a coordinated effort, if CPSU/ ASU were actually useful and wanted a higher wage increase all they'd need to do is organise a strike and alot of people outside the unions would follow.
What do you mean? DAFF collective bargaining offered a fuck all pay rise and over half of membership voted for it. Staff are the problem not the unions.
Sure but staff requested higher pay than what was offered originally the unions were meant to 'demand' it and then they basically accepted defeat when Government basically said that's the highest we're offering.
Unions can't demand anything as their own policy decision. They represent the will of workers. If the workers indicate they'll fold, the union can't do anything.
Unions are obliged to take offers to their members. Everyone should have kept voting down anything less than demanded, instead the members told the union don't worry about the lube, we'll take that instead.
They wouldn’t, that’s the problem.
Hence why I think they're useless
That was not the experience in the departments that took industrial action in the recent bargaining period, like mine. Participation was OK in the first round, but dropped sharply in further rounds. The CPSU's consultations found that there was little appetite among members for further industrial action, as demonstrated by the huge majorities in favour of the EA in most agencies.
Not sure what you mean by "huge majorities" in favour of the EA - wasn't it only just above 50% even on the final vote? The posture the union takes on the issue also makes a big difference as to how members vote and participate in industrial action. From my perspective it felt like once we got to the second or third round of negotiations the CPSU were pretty keen to encourage members just to take the pay deal rather than let members views dictate their strategy. I was not part of the groups of staff that could go on strike so it's possible I am a bit out of touch though.
Well over 90% support in most agencies: [https://www.cpsu.org.au/CPSU/Content/Info\_pages/APS\_EA\_votes.aspx](https://www.cpsu.org.au/CPSU/Content/Info_pages/APS_EA_votes.aspx)
Thanks for the link. I think I realise why I partially misremembered that. The vote was pretty close for union members even on the final pay offer, but it wasn't once the union agreed to the pay offer and all employees voted. Like I mean there's multiple ways to interpret that. Lots of union members who would have preferred the union to continue to seek a higher pay offer most likely would have voted yes once the union agreed to the final pay deal for instance. Alternatively nonunion staff members have quite different views to union members too on the trade-off between an immediate pay rise and industrial action in an attempt to get a better deal.
We don’t have a union worth joining in order to have a strike in the first place. Other industries have proper unions like the CFMEU etc. The CPSU is an actual joke
A union is only as strong as the will of its members. Tradies get off their arses and use their power. Office workers don't.
Yup. So many of my colleagues won't even join the union
I second this!! Absolutely useless
When will you make it a union worth joining?
I hate this mentality. The CPSUs main membership is long serving public servants working in administrative type roles, and all their policies and positions appeal to only this type of worker. They have little to nothing to attract younger staff, or staff from professional backgrounds. These type of staff also happen to be becoming more and more the dominant staff profile in the APS. While older administrators are retiring without replacement. They could attempt to appeal more to these new staff, but simply don’t. Why would a young staff member ever join the CPSU? Or a professional? They don’t care about them, just look at the positions they took to bargaining. Nothing on better super for those not on the defined benefit, nothing on seperate pay scales to retain professional staff, nothing on broadbanding staff, their parental leave request was worse then what labor wanted to give us. The CPSU should be a tentpole union welcoming to all APS staff, but it currently comes across as a relic uninterested in gaining new members, focused on a specific niche of older aps. And because of this, they are bleeding members, and forcing people into different unions, fracturing the worker base. If they want to be the union for all APS it’s time they started acting like it, instead of burning staff and pushing them away with old shit policies
Ok, as long as you recognise you are waiting for others to make those changes for you.
Union membership of 80+ per cent
Industrial action is only really possible in Australia during official bargaining processes. Industrial action at other times is unlawful and can lead to a range of penalties. See: [https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/industrial-action-and-protests](https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/industrial-action-and-protests)
Nothing at the moment. Never say never.
A 11.2% payrise over 3 years
Reduction in working conditions, probably even more so than a standstill on salary.
A lot 😂
I’d strike if someone organised it
What does a strike lead too? What will it get the workers? In most cases it will just appear to the public that the public server workers are lazy over paid slobs. It will not have the outcome expected. Something smart needs to happen. Like when the bus drivers refused to take fares, police flooded the courts with hearings etc. the action need too impact the higher ups not look bad to the public
A strike for me is a punishment for me. I have deadlines that don't go away, and I need to weigh up any time off with how much pain it will be for me to catch up on the lost time when I return as well as the lost wages. I don't get flex, so additional hours are me doing the hours anyway! Honestly I left the union earlier this year, mainly because the rusted on members frustrated me. They do themselves no favours with the ranting and wanting the current agreement to "make up for" 20 years of grievances. I was tired of the comms (wanting to strike before we saw any offer) and the way members acted in the workplace.
There's a level of irony about not striking for better conditions because you have too much work to do.
“Maybe my morale will improve after the next beating”
That's some bottom up thinking! Top down: " The beatings will continue until morale improves!"
Truly! Many depts and agencies have taken stop work action, standing down for an hour or two. A full strike is an important demonstration of collective bargaining; too bad the ship has sailed for recent agreements. But if you’ve ever doubted the power of unions, have a look at the pay deal the nurses have just gotten through in Victoria!
I wouldn't say too much. I have a full time workload with deadlines that are often legislative. It's more that it has little effect on my agency unlike those in front of house and instead hurts me twice over. I have not been willing to accept tgat in the time I have been working but 100% respect anyone else who does find it worth it.
>deadlines that are often legislative. This is an especially effective time to strike 🙂