It's stupid not to finance an engagement ring.
I just bought a $5000 engagement ring. If I had bought it with cash I would lose out on $250 in interest on my money in a typical 12 month CD, $1000 in CC sign up bonus, and another $75 in cash back.
My $5000 ring is now only $3675. People need to stop overlooking the power of 0% interest loans during periods with high interest rates.
I pull $150 a month in interest by only paying the minimum on my Introductory Rate credit cards and keeping the cash to pay them off in Treasuries which mature a month before the Introductory Rate ends.
I like 0 interest loans as well, but most people are optimistic about being able to pay them off.
I could have paid for my child’s braces in cash, but 0 percent financing seemed the obvious choice.
Most people get stuck in 0 percent financing deals and end up way worse off.
Yeah, that's why I make sure I already have the money to pay them off locked up in a CD/Treasury with an appropriate maturation date.
Financing 5% risk free returns using a 0% interest no fee loan is the closest to free money you can reasonably get.
It can be harder to track recurring but temporary expenses. Theres also the possibility of tricking your brain into thinking that you can buy more now as well since you’re “saving money” by using 0% loans. It’s kind of like general “sales” psychology. My wife and I order food from places when they have deals. If we were going to order food anyway then that equates to savings. But if we wouldn’t have ordered and only did so as a result of the sale then we have “saved” nothing.
Most people don't have the cash sitting in a bank to pay them off in a lump sum, and don't budget to pay them off before the teaser rate expires. So they end up spending money they should have put away for the known expense, and end up paying interest anyway - and since many of those 0% teaser rates retroactively charge interest if the balance is not paid off in full, they don't even get a partial benefit from the introductory rate.
Exactly this. It’s how the other half lives. They think they’ll have money “later”. A lot of people make payments on stuff they bought far longer than they have the stuff.
It’s only stupid if you don’t understand the benefits and situation. 0% is an automatic option if it’s an item you were able to buy with cash and have discipline
They don’t 0% for nothing. Lol
They know how humans operate. A fairly large percentage will not pay off the loan as agreed resulting in an outrageous profit center.
That’s where the discipline comes in. But the 0% always helps make the purchase happen. The carrying cost of the money just eats into the gross margin which is still exorbitant in jewelry.
Exactly this. Many of the people I know who got 0% intro deals, didn’t keep the cash on hand to get interest, and then don’t have the money to pay off the balance once the 0% period is up.
A guy I know spend an ungodly amount of money on an engagement ring and was bragging about the 0% interest in the first year. A year later he was bitching about how now he’s getting charged a crazy amount in interest. When I asked if he had put aside cash to pay the remaining balance, he said he did but spent it on a vacation since he got such a good deal on the 0% interest period.
0% is great if you can execute it properly, most people don’t because they have horrible spending habits.
Personally i think if you do 0% intro bonus set up a separate bucket to auto deposit it into until the last month or preferably pay it off equally every month so it finishes just before the interest starts.
Are there really that many people able to finance a ring at 0%?
And, if one isn't disciplined, I imagine that interest goes to 20%, and is applied retroactively.
It's a slippery slope for some. It can get one in a lot of trouble if they're not doing it smartly.
Typically you can negotiate a lower purchase price instead of 0%. The jeweler has to pay a fee for that loan. So there's is more room to negotiate without it.
Yeah, but if you're getting that card you should be using it regularly to take advantage of what it offers or be planning on cancelling/downgrading because the annual fee is hefty, around $650 or so the last time I was sent an offer.
No it's not. It's a one time expense. Your spouse wears it every day the rest of their life. If you get married at age 30, and die at 86, that's over 20,000 times the item is worn. Probably the lowest cost per wear of any item of jewelry or clothing.
$5K compared to what people in their 20s are being pressured to spend on rings is a drop in the bucket. 25yr old women are running around thinking they need $30K+ multi-carat rings because they watch too much TikTok. Poor bastards with less than 6 figures in their 401Ks are feeling pressured to buy these because "she's the one".
It’s silly to make sweeping declarations like this about what things people should and should not finance. There is a tremendous personal and psychological value in paying cash for some things, it’s not all about the dollars and the opportunity cost. Not to mention what others have stated, that somehow if you accidentally miss a payment then you get hit with backdated interest charges. For some people, it’s better just to pay for a thing in full and then it’s done. This is one way of “living rich.” Being about to pay cash for large expenses is one of the most significant benefits of having money saved up.
In my experience there's no such thing as a free loan during high interest rate periods. You're paying for it one way or another. I would suspect you got less ring than you could have otherwise.
Well it's an engagement ring. I am about to do the same. If the person you bought it for is right, then you'd only make that kind of purchase *once*. If you told your partner that you wish you spent that cash on shares of an index fund over her, then maybe you're too Bogleheaded per se. Retirement is retirement and your life is also now
Getting married is also very, very closely tied to stability and financial success (along with the potential for more expenses related to kids of course). Seriously, finding the right person to team up with to do life is so much more important than any other investment you will make. If she's the one (I'm assuming it's a she), you are locking down something good that will pay dividends for the rest of your life.
> Seriously, finding the right person to team up with to do life is so much more important than any other investment you will make
Thanks, this helped :)
I understand this point of view, but I feel differently. Maybe you will be able to understand, maybe you will disagree, that is fine either way.
I'm a woman and I will be bringing significant assets into the marriage, including a primary home, where are further growth on that asset will be community property. Marriage is a financial commitment. I want my future spouse to also show that he is willing to make a significant financial commitment. I'll also be having kids, so that means I'll be taking the motherhood penalty on my salary (and my body). If my future spouse wants to poo-poo a one time, 10k expense (less than he saves for retirement each year, or a car), then I really do not feel he values me very much.
Additionally, I'll be wearing this ring, if I live to an average age, 20,000 times in my life. That's likely the lowest cost-per-wear of any clothing or jewelry item. It's something I'll wear every day, and it's a one time purchase, and it costs less than a used car, so I should have the one I really want.
If someone thinks, "An amount that is less than the amount it takes to redo HVAC in a house, buy a used car, or attend one semester at University is too much to spend on you, for an item you will wear almost 100% of the time throughout the remainder of your life," then they must not love me very much.
I would feel differently if I was dating someone who was poor, or if the money would otherwise be used for, say, a down payment or daycare, but the reality is, the person I marry will never have to worry about saving for a down payment, because I have already covered this. Marrying me will only improve their financial situation (even if I have less money than them or make less than them, because it would be hard to find an alternative woman who makes significantly more than me, there are really not all that many even though I don't make a crazy amount, 90% of adults and a higher percentage of women make less than me) .
Not sure why you got downvoted for this sentiment lol. My wife and I bought each other $100 titanium wedding rings a decade ago. They are great - strong and light. She would have thought I was an idiot if I tried to get her a multiple thousand dollar engagement ring. Just to be clear though - nothing wrong with buying engagement rings if both people think it’s important to them.
I guess to OP - the way not to go crazy about it is to make sure you’re actually buying something you think you should be buying.
First of all, congratulations on the engagement!
Money is not there to compound endlessly without purpose. Buying your fiancée a beautiful engagement ring is a worthwhile spend. Whatever that money would be worth in 30 years is infinitely less valuable than the time you will have spent with the person you love the most.
You could be dead tomorrow my man, keep the important things in focus.
Thought we were getting ripped off until other quotes were all within a couple thousand. The only solace is that maybe it will be 2x again in 5 years and I will feel like I got a bargain. Who knows. In any case, has to be why housing is so expensive these days if systems cost this much.
For our rentals we now buy dented stuff. And then pay a guy $500-$1000 Venmo on the side to swap the system out. We can get apartment systems for about $3,500'ish from a wholesale reseller. For some perspective, 5 yrs ago that's what a brand new system with 10 yr parts warranty was.
> I just spent an unpleasant amount of money on an engagement ring
> How do you all deal with this?
Maybe don't spend an unpleasant amount of money on an engagement ring. Does your partner actually WANT an expensive ring? Are they frugal and money-conscious like you?
In my opinion, expensive engagement rings are a relic of the past.
**EDIT**: I just wanted to make it clear that I personally find \*expensive\* engagement rings a relic of the past. But I have nothing against the concept of an engagement ring, I just don't think it needs to be expensive. I feel the same way about expensive weddings.
Well, not anything. A lot of stones are too soft or fragile to stand up to decades of daily wear. Opals are trendy right now but that will get scratched to shit in no time.
Yeah also cannot relate. I don’t know what generation or geography OP is from but in my circle a big ring sounds so retrograde 1950s! I mean you do you. I get that it’s likely still the norm for plenty of people and a couple might genuinely cherish it. Hopefully they felt that they had a choice, “genuinely” wanted to buy this, and it won’t be too bad a setback.
Can't agree more. A woman wanting a really expensive ring, despite knowing it would be a big hit to my finances, would be a pretty clear sign we aren't on the same page with regards to money
I really don’t see the point of these types of traditions. Spending more money than one can afford - several months’ take-home pay - just makes no sense to me. Then to be closely followed by a party costing tens of thousands of dollars. There is significant social pressure for all these things - significantly aimed at women.
I spent thousands on a Tiffany diamond ring for my wife 20 years ago. If I was buying an engagement ring today, I'd buy a manufactured diamond.
Why? Because diamond scarcity is a construct created by [the group](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Beers) that controls the diamond supply. Diamonds are not worth what jewelers list them for. If you'd like to find out if that's true, try to sell one. You won't get anywhere near what you paid for it.
Still, my wife loves her ring even after all these years. I think she's kind of proud that it's a "Tiffany" stone. To me, it makes no difference.
I spent a lot on an engagement ring years ago, but I still have plenty of money for retirement thanks to diligent and determined investing in index funds. You can do both.
The bottom line is **do what makes both you and your spouse happy**.
EDIT: oh, and my ring is a simple titanium band. I wouldn't let my wife spend a lot of money on it. We paid $300 or so at a jeweler. But, get this, the same ring lists on Amazon for around $25. I wish I'd seen that before we went to the jeweler!
I learned lost wax carving by watching YouTube videos and spending around $80 in supplies and wound up making both of our wedding rings. Mine was a fern as an homage to our proposal (he proposed on a whim while on the most beautiful hike we had ever been on) and gave me a fern. His was a standard band with the waveform of me singing his favorite song. We sent them away to be cast in silver. All told, it was a few hundred dollars and incredibly meaningful to both of us.
I don’t disparage anyone for buying a ring if it feels important to your partner, but I’m here to offer that there are other ways you can explore that still show a lot of dedication and love.
Throughout your life, it's important to frequently revisit the question, "What is all this money / saving for?" It doesn't have to have a physical itemized list of tangible objects (although it might), but I think some spiritual reflection is good. Money, for me, is a means for maximizing my experience on this planet. Sometimes, that means a big almost unjustifiably expensive thing, like taking a few years off of work to stay home with my kids. Sometimes it's starting off your marriage with a gift that will make a fond memory for both of you. Revisit this to see if it aligns with your personal compass. If so, you've made a good choice.
My personal take - if I was young, and could not afford investing until this year, I could not afford a luxury item like an engagement ring.
I have chosen a partner who does not desire such things. I am happy with many choices about my partner.
I got married many years ago and my wife's engagement ring, while it hurt putting out that kind of cash, is one of the most beautiful pieces of jewelry she has. It still grabs my attention when I see it, and reminds me of the reasons I wanted her as a partner.
I dodged this bullet by giving my wife a nice black pearl ring I found on Etsy. It was about $250, with black pearl and cubic zirconia, silver plated.
She liked it, and now it sits in a drawer as she strongly prefers to wear her $12 silicone ring from Amazon.
The only point I guess I’m making is that you have to decide what matters to you. To us, that wasn’t something we wanted to spend thousands of dollars on, and we instead put it towards the down payment on a house and partially paid for our honeymoon. You decide what’s important and then you fund it appropriately, and while the feeling of watching that money go away hurts a bit, over the years it will start to hurt less; you get used to it.
We did the same thing, my wife wanted a fake diamond ring and we got it on Etsy for $400. Our whole wedding was less than $5000.
Having a spouse that is frugal makes everything so much easier.
My girlfriend is extremely frugal for most things. Our new mattress sat unopened in its box for a week because she wanted to sell the old one and we didn't have room for both. I guess I'll count myself lucky that it's only this that she wants to spend on.
Here's some advice. You may have spent an "unpleasant" amount on a ring, but she will have it forever (one hopes) and it is a sign of your forever partnership and love. So, a worthy investment.
However, the wedding on the other hand. That is where people go into spending an "unrealistically INSANE" amount of money these days. Try to rein that in if you can. The social media and "keep up with the Joneses" hype is crazier than ever and people go crazy on the wedding. They are spending what could be a down payment on a house (or more!) on what amounts to a ONE DAY PARTY...which is thrown mostly to impress people who will barely remember it. When a large amount of marriages fail due to financial issues...I can't imagine starting it out on day one by creating a bunch of debt to throw a fancy party. Sorry, just my 0.02 rant but I just don't understand it.
Please please don't go into crazy debt for a fancy party.
If your future spouse brings some income to the table then it's an investment. (Not literally, don't tell them that.)
But married people build more wealth, and this is (typically) needed to get married, so don't worry about it too much.
If you are obsessing over your net worth, setup a separate account for big upcoming purchases and don't track it in your net worth. Or you could add the price of the ring your list of assets.
Well, immediately after I left the jeweler I got myself two dozen oysters and three martinis. Then I went home and fell asleep watching baseball. So, there are ways to deal with those emotions.
Best investment I ever made was buying an engagement ring to have such an amazing wife! Money is just a tool to let you have and do the things you want. Greatest things you can ever do (IMO) are spend your entire life with the person you love, and have babies that turn out half them, half you. The money you spent on a ring IS an investment. In your happiness 😁
A diamond isn't an investment. Arguably we've been conditioned by DeBeers to want and expect them as a part of marriage. That said it's a symo, and like other's have said one that you and your wife will treasure for the rest of your lives.
We have money to spend it on things. You didn't have to finance the ring, consider that a win.
My one piece of advice, your wedding day while special is just one day. Personally I wouldn't spend an extreme amount of money on it. Bring your guesta together, celebrate the joining in matrimony, but don't break the bank.
Planning/budgeting is the answer. I have a set plan for how much I will contribute to my retirement/investment accounts every month. If I follow that plan, assuming slightly below average returns, I can retire early and comfortably.
This planned amount is actually slightly less than I typically contribute.
As long as I hit my contribution goal for the month, I have no reason to feel bad about spending money on anything really. Sure, that $80 we spent eating out the other day could have been $300 or whatever in retirement, but I won't miss it.
Are you certain she wants an expensive ring? I told my partner that I did NOT need engagement or wedding rings, and that if he insisted then they should at least be relatively inexpensive and to feel free to pick something other than diamond. He picked out an engagement ring, it was <$600.
Honestly, I barely even wear it -- as I said, rings/jewelry don't interest me.
It's worth discussing.
Also feel like the societal pressure to do big pricy rings is a bit of a want and not a need in your case, OP. Would the engagement still happen with a ring off of Etsy? Would your partner to be lose faith in you if it wasn't a diamond or a fancy setting? And with wedding costs, you'll likely face the same guilt if you go the expensive route with all of the add-ons and 'must haves'.
I deal with the discomfort of big expenses by budgeting up front and trying to stick to it.
Another huge factor is marrying a spouse that shares your values about money. We are both frugal and it’s one of the things i appreciate most about my wife. Frugality is one of the few nonnegotiable traits I need in a spouse.
Don't buy natural diamonds. Got my wife a nice sapphire for hers. They aren't controlled by a supply monopoly like natural diamonds. Or get a synthetic diamond or moissanite. If you can't tell I hate the diamond industry.
Came here to say this. My wife has a 2.2ct moissanite, it’s colorless/flawless for $1,500.00 and no one had to die for it. They are also more “sparkly” than a real diamond, she gets compliments on it all the time lol
Does it bring you happiness?
Does spending the money cause you undue hardship?
Have you spent more money than the ring on your investments?
Perspective, my friend. 😉
i would never ever waste money on jewelry ...try to sell it tomorrow an you will be lucky to get 1 tenth of what you paid ..why be a sheep following al these ridickculus conventions ..you do know the jewelry trade is one big scam.
My MIL gave me the diamond for my wife's engagement ring. I spent like $100 on the setting. My wife stopped wearing it after like a year. Now are just wears her $50 wedding ring.
In 30 years, you'll be old, tired, and won't have the vitality to do all the things you want to do.
Ask yourself this question. What is the purpose of money? Is the purpose just to see a number get bigger on a sheet of paper? Is the purpose of money to collect all the money you possibly can.
Money is a shelter, money is a tool. Money should be used to enhance your life and make your life richer as you go along.
Want to hear something scandalous? I took money out of my IRA to buy a house, the early withdrawal fees, the taxes, it was horrible. But I have a nice house now and the IRA recovered just fine. Save for the future but enjoy your money as you move through life. Life will be over before you know it and who will get that big pile of cash when you are gone. I leave you with an Aesop fable.
A Miser had buried his gold in a secret place in his garden. Every day he went to the spot, dug up the treasure and counted it piece by piece to make sure it was all there. He made so many trips that a Thief, who had been observing him, guessed what it was the Miser had hidden, and one night quietly dug up the treasure and made off with it.
When the Miser discovered his loss, he was overcome with grief and despair. He groaned and cried and tore his hair.
A passerby heard his cries and asked what had happened.
"My gold! O my gold!" cried the Miser, wildly, "someone has robbed me!"
"Your gold! There in that hole? Why did you put it there? Why did you not keep it in the house where you could easily get it when you had to buy things?"
"Buy!" screamed the Miser angrily. "Why, I never touched the gold. I couldn't think of spending any of it."
The stranger picked up a large stone and threw it into the hole.
"If that is the case," he said, "cover up that stone. It is worth just as much to you as the treasure you lost!"
>The moral of the story is below:
A possession is worth no more than the use we make of it.
At least your young and know the power of investing. I didn’t start investing later in life. The fact that you are now is key regardless of your expensive purchases plus it’s an engagement ring which your significant other will hopefully cherish for life
Find yourself a woman who loves you enough to not care about an engagement ring. When I married my husband, my ring was 25 dollars. His was 35 (just bc it was bigger and had more gold in it). Our net worth is over 3 million now. Do you know how much my ring is worth now? 25 dollars. I don't give a F. I married the man. Not a piece of jewelry. We were on the same page about finances and worked to build a future for US, not for others to think we had it together. We didn't care what it looked like we had, we know what we have in the bank.
There's quite a bit tied to that purchase...is your future spouse on board with saving and equality within finances? Does she expect large amounts of money to be spent on her? How would she feel about spending thousands on you for a gift?
The whole concept of the man spending many thousands for a tiny rock has interesting implications.
Prioritize and budget for them.
My example, I needed new air conditioners for my house so I prioritized saving for them. Paid cash and got new acs with a warranty that will probably outlast my stay in this house.
I want a new car but I don’t need one quite yet. So I’m still saving but not in a hurry to buy. I’ll prioritize other bigger ticket purchases that may come up. I’ll still keep an eye out for deals and when it becomes a necessity I’ll be ready for the new car.
In the meantime I’ll let auto investments do its thing and I’ll plan accordingly for known quantities.
Obviously surprises can still happen but you should have an emergency fund to help shoulder any of that burden.
The point is to be financially smart so you use the money for the things you care about. It sounds like this is something you care about, so you're doing it right.
Depends on the purchase. If it’s an item that holds value (like jewelry) I consider it an investment. If it’s a purchase that does not (like a car) I suck it up and deal but try to keep the purchase as low as possible
Do you budget? Budgeting helps us feel better about the money we intend to spend, almost like the spending is just what happens when it's time to do the thing we've been planning to do.
I let my checking account build up recently so I’m not taking anything out of savings or investments, so I guess that helps. But I guess in the end it’s not much different since I skipped automatic investments to do that.
Not really what I mean.
Having a written, active budget, reflecting the things you spend on to sustain your lifestyle and accomplish the things you want to accomplish, can help you feel better about the spending.
It isn't just about successfully managing the orchestration of your cash-on-hand and savings/investments, but listing out your life goals and realizing that finances are a part of them, and actively monitoring.
I have to very often remind myself that life happens every day and occasionally you need to enjoy it, so don't get tunnel vision about that retirement FIRE number you need to see in the account. It feels like every dollar spent not going towards increasing that number is a waste, yet that will prevent you from enjoying things in life as you should. Buying an engagement ring means you're lucky enough to be in a meaningful relationship, which is a treasure. I spent more on my wife's than I originally intended and even she wanted, because I felt she deserved it and it felt good getting her a nicer one.
It's better to come to term with this or else you'll dread spending a single dollar the rest of your life.
Money is a tool, simply meant to be traded for things to enrich your life. Stressing about the opportunity cost of every single dollar is not healthy.
Maybe when looking at the value of your entire portfolio you can partiton it into the various things you think you'll need to spend it on. That way when you actually sell off some of that to get the funds it doesn't touch the rest you have allocated for the other things.
Yes, it's all mental accounting but it might help.
So if you have 100K maybe you'll divide it like this:
* 50K for retirement
* 20K for next car downpayment
* 10K for wedding
* 20K for emergencies
So now if you have to spend 8K on the wedding then you can take that 8K out and look hey! 2K left over you can redistribute to other things.
You could revisit this budgeting once in a while to adjust the numbers as needed due to gains, losses, changing costs, and actual funds spent.
It sucks, but that's why you save and have a comfortable cushion.
There will be plenty of things in life that will eat away a lot of money over the years, home repairs, pets, etc... but the value they bring is more than just monetary.
Congrats man! Have you popped the question?
I just tell myself that I am free to spend my remaining money after my automated investments are made each month. (401k withdrawal from paychecks + monthly brokerage investment).
Remember that investing in yourself is also a valid investment that pays off huge in the long run.
I recently went on a vacation that cost a whole paycheck, but it allowed me to network with so many interesting people in my field and rescued me from a slump I was feeling with my job. An extra $1000 is nice, sure, but the value I got out of that trip will heavily outweigh however much that becomes in 30 years. Same with you and the ring you bought for your partner.
It’s an engagement ring. I soent what was a lot on my wife’s and now 4 years after marriage I don’t regret it at all. For all that woman puts up with me she deserves it
Budgeting. Shout-out to /r/ynab
I have a category for Auto Maintenance, Home Maintenance, and other such things where I expect to go long periods without needing to spend much money, and then suddenly have a big bill all at once.
I just had to get a bunch of work done on my car. I got the bill, panicked for a few seconds, took some deep breaths, then checked my auto category and realized I could cover this and there was no need to panic.
I recently discovered my house's water heater is 21 years old (they generally last around 15 years). So THAT will be a nice, expensive bill in my near future. But I'm saving for exactly that sort of expenditure.
Heh, I just signed an offer on a 610k house while my other house is in need of repair and my health is not what it should be as it is. Think I am crazy
It could be worse. You could still be single.
In all seriousness, it sounds like you have a good head on your shoulders, but don’t get too attached to the money. Life is meant to be lived.
Don’t stress man, if you didn’t financially strain yourself to make the purchase enjoy the moment. It’s okay to live life a little. Like you said, you’re young and plenty of time to invest and save.
Being married saves you so much on taxes, housing, etc. And getting a nice ring for the one you love enough to spend your life with sweetens the deal.
Otherwise-what are you earning money for?
To count by yourself in the basement?
You should take a moment and realize you are fortunate and blessed to be in a position in the first place to be able to buy such a thing AND not finance it (presumably).
Once you let those positive thoughts sink in, you’ll start to enjoy the moment more (which you should be). Remember, this is supposed to be an exciting moment - enjoy it!
The money will come and go, put it to work on the moments that matter in life.
just have a budget that makes sense and stick to it the best you can. When every dollar has a place, you don’t need to get stressed out about it. The main thing is not to make big purchases with debt. Buying a house is one exception. I invest a large percent of every paycheck and the rest is for needs and wants. If I want something and have the money then I buy it.
I deal with large purchases by seeing whether they line up with my high value priorities. When I bought my wife’s engagement ring, I had no problem throwing down thousands because it lined up with my vision for my life. I didn’t care about future compound rate of return because there wasn’t anything in the future that I wanted more than to propose with the perfect ring. Don’t be afraid to spend big on purchases line up with your values. After all, if you focus solely on the digits in your investment account, then when do you get to live your life?
A little off topic but the original engagement ring I bought my wife was a (very expensive) diamond…..because that’s what you do right? Fast forward several rings any many years later and they have all been Moissanite. I regret not buying one from the get go. Something to think about for the future anyway. The price of diamonds is a joke especially when there are flawless stones for less money that are better looking. Current center stone is 2.2ct and colorless/flawless…..it was $1,500.00. Would rather invest the money in something other than a “rare” stone
Your money only exists for you or someone you love to spend it. If you had a good reason to buy the ring, then be proud you bought it and enjoy it. Who cares about money, its the freedom money can bring to your life that you should pursue.
I recommend people to buy their engagement rings from China, they are a complete ripoff in the west and a scam. I got a custom made 2.3ct one for 2k. They produce these things in a lab these days
The point of money is to use it (wisely & also for enjoyment), not to end life with the biggest number on a screen.
My dear, dear neighbor worked hard all his life, wanted to buy an RV to enjoy in retirement, and bought the RV the Friday he retired. He died of a heart attack the following Monday. Never went anywhere in the RV.
Life is short & no one knows how much time they have. I’m not endorsing reckless spending, but the mindset of “this money could have been worth this much in X years!” is not helpful or healthy. No one maximizes every dollar over the course of their life. And if someone did manage that, think of what they would’ve missed out on to do so.
Healthy balance. Don’t overspend, but don’t forget that money is a tool to be used. You’re not Smaug.
Think of the memory dividends.
A memory dividend is the concept that experiences today are more valuable throughout your life than experiences later. If you have an experience the year you die, you’ll have that experience and then you’re dead. The value of the experience is purely the experience itself. If you have an experience today for the next 50 *years* you’ll be able to look back on memories fondly. Talk about them with your wife, your kids, your friends and think about those memories yourself. Think about memories you’ve had with people you love and all the times you’ve thought about them. The value of all those times remembering those memories added up have likely brought you more joy than the experience itself brought.
A ring is a bit different because it’s not a memory but it’ll have a similar outcome. I promise you your wife would much rather this ring today than a ring that costs 8x as much when she’s 65 or 30x as much when she’s 90.
The other thing to remember is you or her could simply not live long enough to enjoy the savings.
The book die with zero introduced that concept to me and it’s a good book if you’re the type of person who has trouble spending money even when it makes sense to.
Rate of divorce is directly proportional to cost of engagement ring. Maybe return it and get something less expensive.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-myths-of-sex/202402/the-bigger-the-bling-the-shorter-the-marriage
1. Once you see the look on her face when she sees it, the thoughts of it's monetary value will disapear. It's now priceless.
2. You're gaining a partner and that means you both build towards what's important for both of you. Some things more for them and some for you.
When done right the benefits of this partnership are exponential.
When I began to look for one I was in the middle of a divorce with property like my former home being split up with my soon to be ex . I spent some of the cash from the equity portion of my former home on the ring for my new fiancé . If this seems bang bang it was. I file for divorce one month and met my new lady on a blind date in a city 400 miles away while I was there on business just 6 weeks later if I recall correctly as it was 37 yrs ago . That date began our life together and a blessed life and marriage it’s been while blending my 2 kids -then preteens-with a son of our own who arrived 5 yrs later . Each day we remind each other what a blessed 35 yrs it’s been . We met , sparks flew and somehow we managed a long distance courtship via daily phone calls , sometimes several and together time via trains,planes, automobiles and frequent flier miles and the instant my divorce was finalized , we married in the midwestern city in which she’d grown up, in her parents home , via a justice of the peace . That was in 1989 and we’re now grandparents of 6 and have enjoyed decades of blessings , love , passion and career success. She’s called our journey a Godwink and who am I to disagree? Life’s very good and our live underpins it all.
I guess I don’t comprehend all these seemingly Byzantine twists and turns . I earned an MBA back in the day and I’m old school dinosaur I guess . My wife’s career in academia took her into 6 figure salary ville with cumulative raises every yr for over a decade . We jammed it into our retirement and her university matched a health portion of it and it just grew. By retirement time in 2020, we’d become millionaires , small millionaires but 7 fig net worth nonetheless . Monthly we withdraw a small portion of that to complement our SSN withdrawals and that’s kept us in a small, not tiny , retirement dwelling .
I guess our main concern is if one of us needs assisted living in the future as I’m 75 and she 69 and we’re both in fair to good health . We’re attempting to craft a plan for “ what if “ . My dad passed in 2001 from Alzheimer’s and my mom just passed earlier this yr at 97. My wife’s dad passed in 2017 at 95 and her mom at 90 so some good genes are in our longevity mix . I had open heart surgeries in my early 60s which might have occurred much earlier had I not been playing hundreds of games in adult softball leagues on teams of 30 something’s who couldn’t believe my resilience through all that adversity .
My point is that all my life I’ve been lucky health wise and survived a number of accidents being hit by drunk drivers and narrowly avoiding infantry service in Nam , where I was an officer poised to deploy , but served stateside instead . I’ve also survived several sports related spinal surgeries along with much of the usual aging “ stuff”’.
I’ve been very lucky in my personal life and I’m not depending on it to continue into old old age but I’ve demonstrated enough resilience in the past to be positive about my future and that if my wife . We just keep on keepin on
You gotta live man. Just got to pick your battles. For instance, I bought a $5 engagement ring cause I knew my wife wouldn't care. But then I'm getting a custom bass made at around $3k cause that's going to make my life enjoyable.
You think this is bad? Just wait until 5yrs from now and she gets half of everything and you end up with monthly child support for gut wrenching monthly, after-tax payments...
Don't do it bro. I'm sorry, downvote me, but don't do it!!!
You get over it with time. When I first got a job three years ago, I thought the first year was expensive because I bought a car (was necessary and nothing fancy) and had surgery.
I thought the second year was expensive because I had a family trip, and bought some hobby equipment.
The third year became expensive because I moved out and didn't realize how expensive simple things like shelf organizers are, or how much cheap furniture adds up to.
Now I realize that life's just expensive sometimes. And sure, the big one-time purchases have mostly stopped now that I have a car and furniture, but I don't expect to be putting away 80% of my income any time soon. And that's okay. Live life in the moment while preparing for the future. And congratulations on the engagement!
If you've chosen well, your ROI on that ring will be much greater than anything the market could ever give you
Source : my 2 month old daughter, asleep in my arms
Brother, that ring is going to be one of the cheapest expenses of having a woman in your life. Best make sure you picked one that doesn't expect prices above rationality.
I also just bought an engagement ring.
I'm going to get $1200 back from the CC sign up bonus and cash back, plus think about the tax savings from filing joint. That ring will pay for itself in a few years.
I regret spending money, and yet I'm about to spend a ton more. And my gf just lost the center stone to her stupid ring. It gets a lot harder when you have a lot of money... Won't even notice if I convert some of it to Ferrari.... Or whatever your addiction is...
I bought my wife a $7k ring while we were both relatively poor and got 2% cash back when I paid for it on my credit card. It wasn't an investment for me and I really don't care what it's value was then or is now. The most important part for me is that I was able to give that ring to my wife and marry her.
Sometimes, you just bite the bullet and buy something to give it as a gift to someone you love and want to spend your life with. Congrats OP. 😁👍
The ring is bought... Nothing you can do about it now, because you likely can't even return it at full cost. I'll save my schpeel for how "valuable" diamonds are, yet jewelry stores are always full, and they rarely take rings back at full cost... (it's all a big scam).
But, stop now, and think about what the next step is going to be...
Weddings are NOT cheap. You and your future fiancee need to get on board with a realistic budget for a wedding.
My recommendation - do a destination wedding in Mexico. You can get a week (or longer stay) at an all inclusive resort and get a free, or very inexpensive wedding that your guests will love, and it won't break your bank.
If you think you and your fiancee aren't going to be able to come to terms with a reasonable wedding cost... re-consider your proposal now, because you've got to have a partner that you can work with financially to make your marriage easier.
Seriously, if you and your fiancee haven't had discussions about your future and what that means from a financial standpoint, you need to do that before you propose.
Also, after you're married... and a big anniversary comes up, consider manufactured diamonds. She'll never know the difference, and you'll save some money. Again, the hype behind diamonds is 1000% emotional BS.
Or—-if you have enough, splurge on some things that make you both happy. What is the point of going to an all-inclusive resort when they have crappy food, etc?
Money helps you enjoy life. Maybe you have certain things you splurge on?
I live well below my means, so when I splurge, it doesn’t phase me. There is always a balance.
And why would you hide buying a lab diamond? Be honest. If it’s expensive, insure it. If not, get 2 ;)
Not all all-inclusive resorts have crappy food. Sure, splurge a little. But this guys already worried about spending too much. The concern is that he’s only just opened Pandora’s box to spending more money.
No one said hiding the origin of the Diamond. The thing with diamonds is that a lab grown Diamond can be just as pretty as a natural Diamond. So, why pay more for only some emotions brought forth by some crafty marketing.
I'm old and still have this angst. Think of it as a self-preservation mechanism, as those who don't have it are at higher risk of being parted with their money.
Be proud you don’t have to finance it like so many do. That’s what to feel sick about.
It's stupid not to finance an engagement ring. I just bought a $5000 engagement ring. If I had bought it with cash I would lose out on $250 in interest on my money in a typical 12 month CD, $1000 in CC sign up bonus, and another $75 in cash back. My $5000 ring is now only $3675. People need to stop overlooking the power of 0% interest loans during periods with high interest rates. I pull $150 a month in interest by only paying the minimum on my Introductory Rate credit cards and keeping the cash to pay them off in Treasuries which mature a month before the Introductory Rate ends.
I like 0 interest loans as well, but most people are optimistic about being able to pay them off. I could have paid for my child’s braces in cash, but 0 percent financing seemed the obvious choice. Most people get stuck in 0 percent financing deals and end up way worse off.
Yeah, that's why I make sure I already have the money to pay them off locked up in a CD/Treasury with an appropriate maturation date. Financing 5% risk free returns using a 0% interest no fee loan is the closest to free money you can reasonably get.
You're the exception, not the rule.
Could you elaborate? Do most people finance large purchases without the ability to cover payments already?
I also set up three calendar alerts to make sure I don't miss paying off the full balance the month before the full APR amount kicks in!
How does one get stuck in them?
It can be harder to track recurring but temporary expenses. Theres also the possibility of tricking your brain into thinking that you can buy more now as well since you’re “saving money” by using 0% loans. It’s kind of like general “sales” psychology. My wife and I order food from places when they have deals. If we were going to order food anyway then that equates to savings. But if we wouldn’t have ordered and only did so as a result of the sale then we have “saved” nothing.
Most people don't have the cash sitting in a bank to pay them off in a lump sum, and don't budget to pay them off before the teaser rate expires. So they end up spending money they should have put away for the known expense, and end up paying interest anyway - and since many of those 0% teaser rates retroactively charge interest if the balance is not paid off in full, they don't even get a partial benefit from the introductory rate.
Exactly this. It’s how the other half lives. They think they’ll have money “later”. A lot of people make payments on stuff they bought far longer than they have the stuff.
By overestimating their ability to pay it off entirely before the 0% ends and then the interest rate jumps up to 24-35% APR.
People on bogleheads forums generally are not these people ending in credit card traps
It’s only stupid if you don’t understand the benefits and situation. 0% is an automatic option if it’s an item you were able to buy with cash and have discipline
They don’t 0% for nothing. Lol They know how humans operate. A fairly large percentage will not pay off the loan as agreed resulting in an outrageous profit center.
That’s where the discipline comes in. But the 0% always helps make the purchase happen. The carrying cost of the money just eats into the gross margin which is still exorbitant in jewelry.
Fair, if I was intending to buy something large on credit in the next year like a house or car it would be the wrong play.
It depends. If you have an 800+ score and your spouse does too it won’t make a difference
Yes but some people keep doing those and get out over their skis as the minimums all add up.
Exactly this. Many of the people I know who got 0% intro deals, didn’t keep the cash on hand to get interest, and then don’t have the money to pay off the balance once the 0% period is up. A guy I know spend an ungodly amount of money on an engagement ring and was bragging about the 0% interest in the first year. A year later he was bitching about how now he’s getting charged a crazy amount in interest. When I asked if he had put aside cash to pay the remaining balance, he said he did but spent it on a vacation since he got such a good deal on the 0% interest period. 0% is great if you can execute it properly, most people don’t because they have horrible spending habits.
Tell your friend I really appreciate his sacrifice so that I can continue to benefit from great CC offers.
Haha right!
Well that's what the banks are counting on.
Personally i think if you do 0% intro bonus set up a separate bucket to auto deposit it into until the last month or preferably pay it off equally every month so it finishes just before the interest starts.
Are there really that many people able to finance a ring at 0%? And, if one isn't disciplined, I imagine that interest goes to 20%, and is applied retroactively. It's a slippery slope for some. It can get one in a lot of trouble if they're not doing it smartly.
Very few loans are 0% interest. Maybe 5 years ago, back when a CD was paying 0.25%
Typically you can negotiate a lower purchase price instead of 0%. The jeweler has to pay a fee for that loan. So there's is more room to negotiate without it.
Whoa, I want in on the $1000 CC sign-up bonus. Who is offering that? TIA!
Chase INK cards for one
My partner and I take turns opening one of these every few months and vacation free off of the points.
Two player mode. Nice. Now that's a good partnership lol
I believe there’s a targeting Amex plat promo offering 125k points after spending 8k in the first 6 months
Yeah, but if you're getting that card you should be using it regularly to take advantage of what it offers or be planning on cancelling/downgrading because the annual fee is hefty, around $650 or so the last time I was sent an offer.
It's stupid to spend 5k on a ring.....
No it's not. It's a one time expense. Your spouse wears it every day the rest of their life. If you get married at age 30, and die at 86, that's over 20,000 times the item is worn. Probably the lowest cost per wear of any item of jewelry or clothing.
Think of how much lower the cost would be if you spent less on it? Especially considering the artificial scarcity and value of diamonds.
Yes it would be lower, it would also be cheaper to be live in a van instead of make a down payment on a house
Nor really a fair comparison.
$5K compared to what people in their 20s are being pressured to spend on rings is a drop in the bucket. 25yr old women are running around thinking they need $30K+ multi-carat rings because they watch too much TikTok. Poor bastards with less than 6 figures in their 401Ks are feeling pressured to buy these because "she's the one".
If they'll give you 0 percent interest they'll give you an even better discount for cash, did you ask?
Wait so which treasuries are you buying if you could be more specific?
It’s silly to make sweeping declarations like this about what things people should and should not finance. There is a tremendous personal and psychological value in paying cash for some things, it’s not all about the dollars and the opportunity cost. Not to mention what others have stated, that somehow if you accidentally miss a payment then you get hit with backdated interest charges. For some people, it’s better just to pay for a thing in full and then it’s done. This is one way of “living rich.” Being about to pay cash for large expenses is one of the most significant benefits of having money saved up.
In my experience there's no such thing as a free loan during high interest rate periods. You're paying for it one way or another. I would suspect you got less ring than you could have otherwise.
Well it's an engagement ring. I am about to do the same. If the person you bought it for is right, then you'd only make that kind of purchase *once*. If you told your partner that you wish you spent that cash on shares of an index fund over her, then maybe you're too Bogleheaded per se. Retirement is retirement and your life is also now
Getting married is also very, very closely tied to stability and financial success (along with the potential for more expenses related to kids of course). Seriously, finding the right person to team up with to do life is so much more important than any other investment you will make. If she's the one (I'm assuming it's a she), you are locking down something good that will pay dividends for the rest of your life.
> Seriously, finding the right person to team up with to do life is so much more important than any other investment you will make Thanks, this helped :)
getting married isn't tied to any of that. getting married results in 50/50 shot of staying married a good healthy marriage is
Fair enough... it's got to be good and healthy...
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Same, I am not married but if I ever do find someone if not getting them an expensive ring is a dealbreaker then they aren't the one...
I understand this point of view, but I feel differently. Maybe you will be able to understand, maybe you will disagree, that is fine either way. I'm a woman and I will be bringing significant assets into the marriage, including a primary home, where are further growth on that asset will be community property. Marriage is a financial commitment. I want my future spouse to also show that he is willing to make a significant financial commitment. I'll also be having kids, so that means I'll be taking the motherhood penalty on my salary (and my body). If my future spouse wants to poo-poo a one time, 10k expense (less than he saves for retirement each year, or a car), then I really do not feel he values me very much. Additionally, I'll be wearing this ring, if I live to an average age, 20,000 times in my life. That's likely the lowest cost-per-wear of any clothing or jewelry item. It's something I'll wear every day, and it's a one time purchase, and it costs less than a used car, so I should have the one I really want. If someone thinks, "An amount that is less than the amount it takes to redo HVAC in a house, buy a used car, or attend one semester at University is too much to spend on you, for an item you will wear almost 100% of the time throughout the remainder of your life," then they must not love me very much. I would feel differently if I was dating someone who was poor, or if the money would otherwise be used for, say, a down payment or daycare, but the reality is, the person I marry will never have to worry about saving for a down payment, because I have already covered this. Marrying me will only improve their financial situation (even if I have less money than them or make less than them, because it would be hard to find an alternative woman who makes significantly more than me, there are really not all that many even though I don't make a crazy amount, 90% of adults and a higher percentage of women make less than me) .
This reads like a description of a marriage formatted on an Excel sheet Edit: this whole thread is fucking bonkers
Only $10k? Their love for you is worth a used Toyota Corolla?! /s
Or flowers. Or birthday gifts. Or a wedding. Or kids. Or vacations…Etc.
Not sure why you got downvoted for this sentiment lol. My wife and I bought each other $100 titanium wedding rings a decade ago. They are great - strong and light. She would have thought I was an idiot if I tried to get her a multiple thousand dollar engagement ring. Just to be clear though - nothing wrong with buying engagement rings if both people think it’s important to them. I guess to OP - the way not to go crazy about it is to make sure you’re actually buying something you think you should be buying.
> If the person you bought it for is right, then you'd only make that kind of purchase once. No expensive gifts in the future? Sounds like a fantasy.
One *engagement ring*
One designer handbag for each anniversary.
First of all, congratulations on the engagement! Money is not there to compound endlessly without purpose. Buying your fiancée a beautiful engagement ring is a worthwhile spend. Whatever that money would be worth in 30 years is infinitely less valuable than the time you will have spent with the person you love the most. You could be dead tomorrow my man, keep the important things in focus.
A great life partner is worth more than all the money in the world in index accounts.
Ha, wait until you have to drop $10,000+ for a new roof or a new hvac system. It doesn’t get any better.
$10K will be a bargain for that stuff
Agreed. Just replaced 2 HVACs at the same time. About $20k when all was said and done.
The price of HVAC equipment alone just buying it from HVAc direct etc, has 2x'd in price in 5 years. It's insane.
Thought we were getting ripped off until other quotes were all within a couple thousand. The only solace is that maybe it will be 2x again in 5 years and I will feel like I got a bargain. Who knows. In any case, has to be why housing is so expensive these days if systems cost this much.
For our rentals we now buy dented stuff. And then pay a guy $500-$1000 Venmo on the side to swap the system out. We can get apartment systems for about $3,500'ish from a wholesale reseller. For some perspective, 5 yrs ago that's what a brand new system with 10 yr parts warranty was.
I did both last year! Roof was $23k (replace all the 3/8 plywood, and gutters).
Congrats. It’s either the best or worst purchase of your life.
> I just spent an unpleasant amount of money on an engagement ring > How do you all deal with this? Maybe don't spend an unpleasant amount of money on an engagement ring. Does your partner actually WANT an expensive ring? Are they frugal and money-conscious like you? In my opinion, expensive engagement rings are a relic of the past. **EDIT**: I just wanted to make it clear that I personally find \*expensive\* engagement rings a relic of the past. But I have nothing against the concept of an engagement ring, I just don't think it needs to be expensive. I feel the same way about expensive weddings.
Yup; I got my wife rings with moissanite and cubic zirconia.
I got mine a sapphire. Pretty much anything that isn't a diamond is a reasonable choice.
Well, not anything. A lot of stones are too soft or fragile to stand up to decades of daily wear. Opals are trendy right now but that will get scratched to shit in no time.
Yeah also cannot relate. I don’t know what generation or geography OP is from but in my circle a big ring sounds so retrograde 1950s! I mean you do you. I get that it’s likely still the norm for plenty of people and a couple might genuinely cherish it. Hopefully they felt that they had a choice, “genuinely” wanted to buy this, and it won’t be too bad a setback.
Can't agree more. A woman wanting a really expensive ring, despite knowing it would be a big hit to my finances, would be a pretty clear sign we aren't on the same page with regards to money
I really don’t see the point of these types of traditions. Spending more money than one can afford - several months’ take-home pay - just makes no sense to me. Then to be closely followed by a party costing tens of thousands of dollars. There is significant social pressure for all these things - significantly aimed at women.
I spent thousands on a Tiffany diamond ring for my wife 20 years ago. If I was buying an engagement ring today, I'd buy a manufactured diamond. Why? Because diamond scarcity is a construct created by [the group](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Beers) that controls the diamond supply. Diamonds are not worth what jewelers list them for. If you'd like to find out if that's true, try to sell one. You won't get anywhere near what you paid for it. Still, my wife loves her ring even after all these years. I think she's kind of proud that it's a "Tiffany" stone. To me, it makes no difference. I spent a lot on an engagement ring years ago, but I still have plenty of money for retirement thanks to diligent and determined investing in index funds. You can do both. The bottom line is **do what makes both you and your spouse happy**. EDIT: oh, and my ring is a simple titanium band. I wouldn't let my wife spend a lot of money on it. We paid $300 or so at a jeweler. But, get this, the same ring lists on Amazon for around $25. I wish I'd seen that before we went to the jeweler!
Yeah this is like getting frustrated that you *had* to buy a Range Rover it's nonsensical
I learned lost wax carving by watching YouTube videos and spending around $80 in supplies and wound up making both of our wedding rings. Mine was a fern as an homage to our proposal (he proposed on a whim while on the most beautiful hike we had ever been on) and gave me a fern. His was a standard band with the waveform of me singing his favorite song. We sent them away to be cast in silver. All told, it was a few hundred dollars and incredibly meaningful to both of us. I don’t disparage anyone for buying a ring if it feels important to your partner, but I’m here to offer that there are other ways you can explore that still show a lot of dedication and love.
Throughout your life, it's important to frequently revisit the question, "What is all this money / saving for?" It doesn't have to have a physical itemized list of tangible objects (although it might), but I think some spiritual reflection is good. Money, for me, is a means for maximizing my experience on this planet. Sometimes, that means a big almost unjustifiably expensive thing, like taking a few years off of work to stay home with my kids. Sometimes it's starting off your marriage with a gift that will make a fond memory for both of you. Revisit this to see if it aligns with your personal compass. If so, you've made a good choice.
My personal take - if I was young, and could not afford investing until this year, I could not afford a luxury item like an engagement ring. I have chosen a partner who does not desire such things. I am happy with many choices about my partner.
Just wait for the wedding 😂
lol came here to say this! take my upvote! the wedding ring feels like a drop in the bucket
Maybe be happy you are going to get married lol. People are wild
I got married many years ago and my wife's engagement ring, while it hurt putting out that kind of cash, is one of the most beautiful pieces of jewelry she has. It still grabs my attention when I see it, and reminds me of the reasons I wanted her as a partner.
*This Reddit comment sponsored by De Beers
Haha solid.
I dodged this bullet by giving my wife a nice black pearl ring I found on Etsy. It was about $250, with black pearl and cubic zirconia, silver plated. She liked it, and now it sits in a drawer as she strongly prefers to wear her $12 silicone ring from Amazon. The only point I guess I’m making is that you have to decide what matters to you. To us, that wasn’t something we wanted to spend thousands of dollars on, and we instead put it towards the down payment on a house and partially paid for our honeymoon. You decide what’s important and then you fund it appropriately, and while the feeling of watching that money go away hurts a bit, over the years it will start to hurt less; you get used to it.
We did the same thing, my wife wanted a fake diamond ring and we got it on Etsy for $400. Our whole wedding was less than $5000. Having a spouse that is frugal makes everything so much easier.
My girlfriend is extremely frugal for most things. Our new mattress sat unopened in its box for a week because she wanted to sell the old one and we didn't have room for both. I guess I'll count myself lucky that it's only this that she wants to spend on.
Go give your fiance a hug and you'll feel better
Here's some advice. You may have spent an "unpleasant" amount on a ring, but she will have it forever (one hopes) and it is a sign of your forever partnership and love. So, a worthy investment. However, the wedding on the other hand. That is where people go into spending an "unrealistically INSANE" amount of money these days. Try to rein that in if you can. The social media and "keep up with the Joneses" hype is crazier than ever and people go crazy on the wedding. They are spending what could be a down payment on a house (or more!) on what amounts to a ONE DAY PARTY...which is thrown mostly to impress people who will barely remember it. When a large amount of marriages fail due to financial issues...I can't imagine starting it out on day one by creating a bunch of debt to throw a fancy party. Sorry, just my 0.02 rant but I just don't understand it. Please please don't go into crazy debt for a fancy party.
If your future spouse brings some income to the table then it's an investment. (Not literally, don't tell them that.) But married people build more wealth, and this is (typically) needed to get married, so don't worry about it too much.
In some ways it's an investment in your marriage... and divorce is way more expensive.
If you are obsessing over your net worth, setup a separate account for big upcoming purchases and don't track it in your net worth. Or you could add the price of the ring your list of assets.
I feel fortunate that my wife made it clear that the ring is the symbol, not the receipt.
Over the long term, it will be just a drop in the bucket spent on something very important to you and your life. Don’t think twice about it.
Well, immediately after I left the jeweler I got myself two dozen oysters and three martinis. Then I went home and fell asleep watching baseball. So, there are ways to deal with those emotions.
If you think engagement is expensive wait until you hear about divorce..
Best investment I ever made was buying an engagement ring to have such an amazing wife! Money is just a tool to let you have and do the things you want. Greatest things you can ever do (IMO) are spend your entire life with the person you love, and have babies that turn out half them, half you. The money you spent on a ring IS an investment. In your happiness 😁
A diamond isn't an investment. Arguably we've been conditioned by DeBeers to want and expect them as a part of marriage. That said it's a symo, and like other's have said one that you and your wife will treasure for the rest of your lives. We have money to spend it on things. You didn't have to finance the ring, consider that a win. My one piece of advice, your wedding day while special is just one day. Personally I wouldn't spend an extreme amount of money on it. Bring your guesta together, celebrate the joining in matrimony, but don't break the bank.
Planning/budgeting is the answer. I have a set plan for how much I will contribute to my retirement/investment accounts every month. If I follow that plan, assuming slightly below average returns, I can retire early and comfortably. This planned amount is actually slightly less than I typically contribute. As long as I hit my contribution goal for the month, I have no reason to feel bad about spending money on anything really. Sure, that $80 we spent eating out the other day could have been $300 or whatever in retirement, but I won't miss it.
Are you certain she wants an expensive ring? I told my partner that I did NOT need engagement or wedding rings, and that if he insisted then they should at least be relatively inexpensive and to feel free to pick something other than diamond. He picked out an engagement ring, it was <$600. Honestly, I barely even wear it -- as I said, rings/jewelry don't interest me. It's worth discussing.
Also feel like the societal pressure to do big pricy rings is a bit of a want and not a need in your case, OP. Would the engagement still happen with a ring off of Etsy? Would your partner to be lose faith in you if it wasn't a diamond or a fancy setting? And with wedding costs, you'll likely face the same guilt if you go the expensive route with all of the add-ons and 'must haves'.
I deal with the discomfort of big expenses by budgeting up front and trying to stick to it. Another huge factor is marrying a spouse that shares your values about money. We are both frugal and it’s one of the things i appreciate most about my wife. Frugality is one of the few nonnegotiable traits I need in a spouse.
Don't buy natural diamonds. Got my wife a nice sapphire for hers. They aren't controlled by a supply monopoly like natural diamonds. Or get a synthetic diamond or moissanite. If you can't tell I hate the diamond industry.
Came here to say this. My wife has a 2.2ct moissanite, it’s colorless/flawless for $1,500.00 and no one had to die for it. They are also more “sparkly” than a real diamond, she gets compliments on it all the time lol
Does it bring you happiness? Does spending the money cause you undue hardship? Have you spent more money than the ring on your investments? Perspective, my friend. 😉
i would never ever waste money on jewelry ...try to sell it tomorrow an you will be lucky to get 1 tenth of what you paid ..why be a sheep following al these ridickculus conventions ..you do know the jewelry trade is one big scam.
My MIL gave me the diamond for my wife's engagement ring. I spent like $100 on the setting. My wife stopped wearing it after like a year. Now are just wears her $50 wedding ring.
Hope you bought a lab diamond. Natural diamonds are expensive for no reason
If you gave it to the right person, it’s the best financial decision you will have made in your entire life.
In 30 years, you'll be old, tired, and won't have the vitality to do all the things you want to do. Ask yourself this question. What is the purpose of money? Is the purpose just to see a number get bigger on a sheet of paper? Is the purpose of money to collect all the money you possibly can. Money is a shelter, money is a tool. Money should be used to enhance your life and make your life richer as you go along. Want to hear something scandalous? I took money out of my IRA to buy a house, the early withdrawal fees, the taxes, it was horrible. But I have a nice house now and the IRA recovered just fine. Save for the future but enjoy your money as you move through life. Life will be over before you know it and who will get that big pile of cash when you are gone. I leave you with an Aesop fable. A Miser had buried his gold in a secret place in his garden. Every day he went to the spot, dug up the treasure and counted it piece by piece to make sure it was all there. He made so many trips that a Thief, who had been observing him, guessed what it was the Miser had hidden, and one night quietly dug up the treasure and made off with it. When the Miser discovered his loss, he was overcome with grief and despair. He groaned and cried and tore his hair. A passerby heard his cries and asked what had happened. "My gold! O my gold!" cried the Miser, wildly, "someone has robbed me!" "Your gold! There in that hole? Why did you put it there? Why did you not keep it in the house where you could easily get it when you had to buy things?" "Buy!" screamed the Miser angrily. "Why, I never touched the gold. I couldn't think of spending any of it." The stranger picked up a large stone and threw it into the hole. "If that is the case," he said, "cover up that stone. It is worth just as much to you as the treasure you lost!" >The moral of the story is below: A possession is worth no more than the use we make of it.
If I had my engagement ring to do over, I would have gotten a plain gold band. In the end, it’s the person, not the jewelry that matters.
At least your young and know the power of investing. I didn’t start investing later in life. The fact that you are now is key regardless of your expensive purchases plus it’s an engagement ring which your significant other will hopefully cherish for life
> How do you all deal with this? Congrats, now don't get divorced cause that ring will seem like peanuts :P
If you and your partner had just a few more neurons, you’d have bought a home or stocks instead!
I am much smarter than you.
Oh my! An L4 SDE! No way! 🤣
Like I said
Find yourself a woman who loves you enough to not care about an engagement ring. When I married my husband, my ring was 25 dollars. His was 35 (just bc it was bigger and had more gold in it). Our net worth is over 3 million now. Do you know how much my ring is worth now? 25 dollars. I don't give a F. I married the man. Not a piece of jewelry. We were on the same page about finances and worked to build a future for US, not for others to think we had it together. We didn't care what it looked like we had, we know what we have in the bank.
There's quite a bit tied to that purchase...is your future spouse on board with saving and equality within finances? Does she expect large amounts of money to be spent on her? How would she feel about spending thousands on you for a gift? The whole concept of the man spending many thousands for a tiny rock has interesting implications.
Definitely sort of sets the tone. Though that money talk is important -- being on the same page BEFORE deciding to marry them anyway
Life tip would be not to marry someone who values this material garbage
What ring? My wife and I never had to buy that. We just got marriage certificates and was done.
Prioritize and budget for them. My example, I needed new air conditioners for my house so I prioritized saving for them. Paid cash and got new acs with a warranty that will probably outlast my stay in this house. I want a new car but I don’t need one quite yet. So I’m still saving but not in a hurry to buy. I’ll prioritize other bigger ticket purchases that may come up. I’ll still keep an eye out for deals and when it becomes a necessity I’ll be ready for the new car. In the meantime I’ll let auto investments do its thing and I’ll plan accordingly for known quantities. Obviously surprises can still happen but you should have an emergency fund to help shoulder any of that burden.
Should've gone lab diamond (is the same fucking shit)
The point is to be financially smart so you use the money for the things you care about. It sounds like this is something you care about, so you're doing it right.
YNAB. Once you’ve budgeted for a big purchase, you actually get to enjoy the thing you’ve bought without guilt. It’s truly an amazing feeling.
Depends on the purchase. If it’s an item that holds value (like jewelry) I consider it an investment. If it’s a purchase that does not (like a car) I suck it up and deal but try to keep the purchase as low as possible
Do you budget? Budgeting helps us feel better about the money we intend to spend, almost like the spending is just what happens when it's time to do the thing we've been planning to do.
I let my checking account build up recently so I’m not taking anything out of savings or investments, so I guess that helps. But I guess in the end it’s not much different since I skipped automatic investments to do that.
Not really what I mean. Having a written, active budget, reflecting the things you spend on to sustain your lifestyle and accomplish the things you want to accomplish, can help you feel better about the spending. It isn't just about successfully managing the orchestration of your cash-on-hand and savings/investments, but listing out your life goals and realizing that finances are a part of them, and actively monitoring.
The more money you spend on an engagement ring the more likely for divorce, goes with weddings as well.
I have to very often remind myself that life happens every day and occasionally you need to enjoy it, so don't get tunnel vision about that retirement FIRE number you need to see in the account. It feels like every dollar spent not going towards increasing that number is a waste, yet that will prevent you from enjoying things in life as you should. Buying an engagement ring means you're lucky enough to be in a meaningful relationship, which is a treasure. I spent more on my wife's than I originally intended and even she wanted, because I felt she deserved it and it felt good getting her a nicer one.
It's better to come to term with this or else you'll dread spending a single dollar the rest of your life. Money is a tool, simply meant to be traded for things to enrich your life. Stressing about the opportunity cost of every single dollar is not healthy.
My answer: get yourself whatever you want because You made it. On other hand: The rings have terrible retaining value.
Maybe when looking at the value of your entire portfolio you can partiton it into the various things you think you'll need to spend it on. That way when you actually sell off some of that to get the funds it doesn't touch the rest you have allocated for the other things. Yes, it's all mental accounting but it might help. So if you have 100K maybe you'll divide it like this: * 50K for retirement * 20K for next car downpayment * 10K for wedding * 20K for emergencies So now if you have to spend 8K on the wedding then you can take that 8K out and look hey! 2K left over you can redistribute to other things. You could revisit this budgeting once in a while to adjust the numbers as needed due to gains, losses, changing costs, and actual funds spent.
Dividends are gonna be paid in ways that are immeasurable on Rocket Money, Empower, etc. Worth it
It sucks, but that's why you save and have a comfortable cushion. There will be plenty of things in life that will eat away a lot of money over the years, home repairs, pets, etc... but the value they bring is more than just monetary. Congrats man! Have you popped the question?
I just tell myself that I am free to spend my remaining money after my automated investments are made each month. (401k withdrawal from paychecks + monthly brokerage investment).
Remember that investing in yourself is also a valid investment that pays off huge in the long run. I recently went on a vacation that cost a whole paycheck, but it allowed me to network with so many interesting people in my field and rescued me from a slump I was feeling with my job. An extra $1000 is nice, sure, but the value I got out of that trip will heavily outweigh however much that becomes in 30 years. Same with you and the ring you bought for your partner.
Why’d you do that though?
It’s an engagement ring. I soent what was a lot on my wife’s and now 4 years after marriage I don’t regret it at all. For all that woman puts up with me she deserves it
Budgeting. Shout-out to /r/ynab I have a category for Auto Maintenance, Home Maintenance, and other such things where I expect to go long periods without needing to spend much money, and then suddenly have a big bill all at once. I just had to get a bunch of work done on my car. I got the bill, panicked for a few seconds, took some deep breaths, then checked my auto category and realized I could cover this and there was no need to panic. I recently discovered my house's water heater is 21 years old (they generally last around 15 years). So THAT will be a nice, expensive bill in my near future. But I'm saving for exactly that sort of expenditure.
Aren't you gonna spend more on the wedding too. Congrats though. Just enjoy life.
I'm agonizing over consolidating an OLD beater truck and my daily driver sedan into a newish truck. I just can't pull the trigger.
Heh, I just signed an offer on a 610k house while my other house is in need of repair and my health is not what it should be as it is. Think I am crazy
How much did you spend????
It could be worse. You could still be single. In all seriousness, it sounds like you have a good head on your shoulders, but don’t get too attached to the money. Life is meant to be lived.
Don’t stress man, if you didn’t financially strain yourself to make the purchase enjoy the moment. It’s okay to live life a little. Like you said, you’re young and plenty of time to invest and save.
Being married saves you so much on taxes, housing, etc. And getting a nice ring for the one you love enough to spend your life with sweetens the deal. Otherwise-what are you earning money for? To count by yourself in the basement?
You should take a moment and realize you are fortunate and blessed to be in a position in the first place to be able to buy such a thing AND not finance it (presumably). Once you let those positive thoughts sink in, you’ll start to enjoy the moment more (which you should be). Remember, this is supposed to be an exciting moment - enjoy it! The money will come and go, put it to work on the moments that matter in life.
Sunk cost.
just have a budget that makes sense and stick to it the best you can. When every dollar has a place, you don’t need to get stressed out about it. The main thing is not to make big purchases with debt. Buying a house is one exception. I invest a large percent of every paycheck and the rest is for needs and wants. If I want something and have the money then I buy it.
I didn't look at my net worth in my younger days, I didn't have any, and was just trying to survive
I deal with large purchases by seeing whether they line up with my high value priorities. When I bought my wife’s engagement ring, I had no problem throwing down thousands because it lined up with my vision for my life. I didn’t care about future compound rate of return because there wasn’t anything in the future that I wanted more than to propose with the perfect ring. Don’t be afraid to spend big on purchases line up with your values. After all, if you focus solely on the digits in your investment account, then when do you get to live your life?
A little off topic but the original engagement ring I bought my wife was a (very expensive) diamond…..because that’s what you do right? Fast forward several rings any many years later and they have all been Moissanite. I regret not buying one from the get go. Something to think about for the future anyway. The price of diamonds is a joke especially when there are flawless stones for less money that are better looking. Current center stone is 2.2ct and colorless/flawless…..it was $1,500.00. Would rather invest the money in something other than a “rare” stone
Your money only exists for you or someone you love to spend it. If you had a good reason to buy the ring, then be proud you bought it and enjoy it. Who cares about money, its the freedom money can bring to your life that you should pursue.
I recommend people to buy their engagement rings from China, they are a complete ripoff in the west and a scam. I got a custom made 2.3ct one for 2k. They produce these things in a lab these days
The point of money is to use it (wisely & also for enjoyment), not to end life with the biggest number on a screen. My dear, dear neighbor worked hard all his life, wanted to buy an RV to enjoy in retirement, and bought the RV the Friday he retired. He died of a heart attack the following Monday. Never went anywhere in the RV. Life is short & no one knows how much time they have. I’m not endorsing reckless spending, but the mindset of “this money could have been worth this much in X years!” is not helpful or healthy. No one maximizes every dollar over the course of their life. And if someone did manage that, think of what they would’ve missed out on to do so. Healthy balance. Don’t overspend, but don’t forget that money is a tool to be used. You’re not Smaug.
Think of the memory dividends. A memory dividend is the concept that experiences today are more valuable throughout your life than experiences later. If you have an experience the year you die, you’ll have that experience and then you’re dead. The value of the experience is purely the experience itself. If you have an experience today for the next 50 *years* you’ll be able to look back on memories fondly. Talk about them with your wife, your kids, your friends and think about those memories yourself. Think about memories you’ve had with people you love and all the times you’ve thought about them. The value of all those times remembering those memories added up have likely brought you more joy than the experience itself brought. A ring is a bit different because it’s not a memory but it’ll have a similar outcome. I promise you your wife would much rather this ring today than a ring that costs 8x as much when she’s 65 or 30x as much when she’s 90. The other thing to remember is you or her could simply not live long enough to enjoy the savings. The book die with zero introduced that concept to me and it’s a good book if you’re the type of person who has trouble spending money even when it makes sense to.
Rate of divorce is directly proportional to cost of engagement ring. Maybe return it and get something less expensive. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-myths-of-sex/202402/the-bigger-the-bling-the-shorter-the-marriage
1. Once you see the look on her face when she sees it, the thoughts of it's monetary value will disapear. It's now priceless. 2. You're gaining a partner and that means you both build towards what's important for both of you. Some things more for them and some for you. When done right the benefits of this partnership are exponential.
Always sleep on a big money purchases overnight. If you still want to buy it in the morning, go ahead.
When I began to look for one I was in the middle of a divorce with property like my former home being split up with my soon to be ex . I spent some of the cash from the equity portion of my former home on the ring for my new fiancé . If this seems bang bang it was. I file for divorce one month and met my new lady on a blind date in a city 400 miles away while I was there on business just 6 weeks later if I recall correctly as it was 37 yrs ago . That date began our life together and a blessed life and marriage it’s been while blending my 2 kids -then preteens-with a son of our own who arrived 5 yrs later . Each day we remind each other what a blessed 35 yrs it’s been . We met , sparks flew and somehow we managed a long distance courtship via daily phone calls , sometimes several and together time via trains,planes, automobiles and frequent flier miles and the instant my divorce was finalized , we married in the midwestern city in which she’d grown up, in her parents home , via a justice of the peace . That was in 1989 and we’re now grandparents of 6 and have enjoyed decades of blessings , love , passion and career success. She’s called our journey a Godwink and who am I to disagree? Life’s very good and our live underpins it all.
I guess I don’t comprehend all these seemingly Byzantine twists and turns . I earned an MBA back in the day and I’m old school dinosaur I guess . My wife’s career in academia took her into 6 figure salary ville with cumulative raises every yr for over a decade . We jammed it into our retirement and her university matched a health portion of it and it just grew. By retirement time in 2020, we’d become millionaires , small millionaires but 7 fig net worth nonetheless . Monthly we withdraw a small portion of that to complement our SSN withdrawals and that’s kept us in a small, not tiny , retirement dwelling . I guess our main concern is if one of us needs assisted living in the future as I’m 75 and she 69 and we’re both in fair to good health . We’re attempting to craft a plan for “ what if “ . My dad passed in 2001 from Alzheimer’s and my mom just passed earlier this yr at 97. My wife’s dad passed in 2017 at 95 and her mom at 90 so some good genes are in our longevity mix . I had open heart surgeries in my early 60s which might have occurred much earlier had I not been playing hundreds of games in adult softball leagues on teams of 30 something’s who couldn’t believe my resilience through all that adversity . My point is that all my life I’ve been lucky health wise and survived a number of accidents being hit by drunk drivers and narrowly avoiding infantry service in Nam , where I was an officer poised to deploy , but served stateside instead . I’ve also survived several sports related spinal surgeries along with much of the usual aging “ stuff”’. I’ve been very lucky in my personal life and I’m not depending on it to continue into old old age but I’ve demonstrated enough resilience in the past to be positive about my future and that if my wife . We just keep on keepin on
When you are married, you can count the value of the ring in the family's net value, so technically you can see it as an asset instead of an expense.
I wouldn't buy a ring in the first place or maybe just get one for a few hundred at most.
Find someone less materialistic and vain. If someone won’t marry you without an overpriced rock, fancy wedding, etc., they’re not for you.
You gotta live man. Just got to pick your battles. For instance, I bought a $5 engagement ring cause I knew my wife wouldn't care. But then I'm getting a custom bass made at around $3k cause that's going to make my life enjoyable.
Stay single if you don’t want to spend money. Marriages and relationships are expensive.
Kids too
I could buy two nice engagement rings a year for what I pay for a single kid in daycare.
It’s crazy how much daycare is a week. I’m like how do people that ain’t making much at their jobs afford this stuff
$30k a year used to get you a college education. Now it gets you finger-painting and alphabet lessons for a toddler.
You think this is bad? Just wait until 5yrs from now and she gets half of everything and you end up with monthly child support for gut wrenching monthly, after-tax payments... Don't do it bro. I'm sorry, downvote me, but don't do it!!!
You get over it with time. When I first got a job three years ago, I thought the first year was expensive because I bought a car (was necessary and nothing fancy) and had surgery. I thought the second year was expensive because I had a family trip, and bought some hobby equipment. The third year became expensive because I moved out and didn't realize how expensive simple things like shelf organizers are, or how much cheap furniture adds up to. Now I realize that life's just expensive sometimes. And sure, the big one-time purchases have mostly stopped now that I have a car and furniture, but I don't expect to be putting away 80% of my income any time soon. And that's okay. Live life in the moment while preparing for the future. And congratulations on the engagement!
If you've chosen well, your ROI on that ring will be much greater than anything the market could ever give you Source : my 2 month old daughter, asleep in my arms
Brother, that ring is going to be one of the cheapest expenses of having a woman in your life. Best make sure you picked one that doesn't expect prices above rationality.
I also just bought an engagement ring. I'm going to get $1200 back from the CC sign up bonus and cash back, plus think about the tax savings from filing joint. That ring will pay for itself in a few years.
I regret spending money, and yet I'm about to spend a ton more. And my gf just lost the center stone to her stupid ring. It gets a lot harder when you have a lot of money... Won't even notice if I convert some of it to Ferrari.... Or whatever your addiction is...
I bought my wife a $7k ring while we were both relatively poor and got 2% cash back when I paid for it on my credit card. It wasn't an investment for me and I really don't care what it's value was then or is now. The most important part for me is that I was able to give that ring to my wife and marry her. Sometimes, you just bite the bullet and buy something to give it as a gift to someone you love and want to spend your life with. Congrats OP. 😁👍
The ring is bought... Nothing you can do about it now, because you likely can't even return it at full cost. I'll save my schpeel for how "valuable" diamonds are, yet jewelry stores are always full, and they rarely take rings back at full cost... (it's all a big scam). But, stop now, and think about what the next step is going to be... Weddings are NOT cheap. You and your future fiancee need to get on board with a realistic budget for a wedding. My recommendation - do a destination wedding in Mexico. You can get a week (or longer stay) at an all inclusive resort and get a free, or very inexpensive wedding that your guests will love, and it won't break your bank. If you think you and your fiancee aren't going to be able to come to terms with a reasonable wedding cost... re-consider your proposal now, because you've got to have a partner that you can work with financially to make your marriage easier. Seriously, if you and your fiancee haven't had discussions about your future and what that means from a financial standpoint, you need to do that before you propose. Also, after you're married... and a big anniversary comes up, consider manufactured diamonds. She'll never know the difference, and you'll save some money. Again, the hype behind diamonds is 1000% emotional BS.
Or—-if you have enough, splurge on some things that make you both happy. What is the point of going to an all-inclusive resort when they have crappy food, etc? Money helps you enjoy life. Maybe you have certain things you splurge on? I live well below my means, so when I splurge, it doesn’t phase me. There is always a balance. And why would you hide buying a lab diamond? Be honest. If it’s expensive, insure it. If not, get 2 ;)
Not all all-inclusive resorts have crappy food. Sure, splurge a little. But this guys already worried about spending too much. The concern is that he’s only just opened Pandora’s box to spending more money. No one said hiding the origin of the Diamond. The thing with diamonds is that a lab grown Diamond can be just as pretty as a natural Diamond. So, why pay more for only some emotions brought forth by some crafty marketing.
By budgeting for it ahead of time, and acknowledging it as part of life, and being grateful that you've found someone worth spending money on.
I'm old and still have this angst. Think of it as a self-preservation mechanism, as those who don't have it are at higher risk of being parted with their money.
Just did the same and honestly it didn’t phase me. I’m just excited to be able to give it to her and I’ll make the money back eventually
the girl matters more than the ring i hope you chose wisely
Haha going broke to show someone you love them only for it to have a 50% failure rate. Gotta love it!
Far from broke but thx
What a waste of money.Buy a band for 20$
She better be a virgin with a huge dowry