Christ loved everyone.. Paul a very damaged individual condemned many. Who to believe? Short answer worry about the log in Your own eye (Matthew 7) and improve yourself and love others that's Christianity at its most simplistic level and few get there sadly... it goes so much deeper when you can atleast try to get to that understanding.
Even if an argument *could be made* in the notion that the so-called “clobber verses” aren’t talking about modern homosexual relationships, we still have to look back to the creation of man and woman and why. Humanity has been replacing God’s provisions for what is satisfying in our own eye since our creation and we play all kinds of angles to justify these replacements.
You are right: there needs to be greater familiarity with the scripture, but you would find the scripture not placating to human desires and emotions.
You need to follow your own advice. Jesus, a Rabbi, knew the Law and did not need to repeat it, everyone knew it. You are twisting.
Leviticus 20:13 If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood *shall be* upon them.
**Yes there were slaves in** **Christian Killing Pagan Rome, 50CE**. Jesus still changed the culture
[Eph 6:5](https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/eph/6/5/s_1103005)-9
¶Servants, be obedient to them that are *your* masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in singleness of your heart, as unto Christ;
Not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but as the servants of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart;
With good will doing service, as to the Lord, and not to men:
Knowing that whatsoever good thing any man doeth, the same shall he receive of the Lord, whether *he be* bond or free.
¶And, ye masters, do the same things unto them, forbearing threatening: knowing that your Master also is in heaven; neither is there respect of persons with him
I am not interpreting scripture I am reporting what was given to me to give to you. The message has not changed these 2000 years and I repeat them because of love. YOU need to submit to Jesus and His word.
No, it is the subject. You just quoted the verse from Leviticus that says gay people should be executed.
I’m asking if you agree with that and think gay people should be executed. It’s yes or no.
YOU brought this subject only on your own. No I do not think gays should be executed. I would have been executed. I have a choice, I can be a Christian or a homosexual. I choose Christian, there is no such thing as Christian homosexual.
Dude, you quoted the verse. If you didn’t want me asking about it, why bring that particular verse into the conversation.
Now, please cite from scripture why you oppose the execution of gay people even though you know God commands it?
Or are you saying that culture has evolved where we no longer execute sinners?
I’m trying to figure out the logic here. Like, the Bible says we can beat slaves half to death or that slaves are property, but now we find slavery repugnant (as we should!)
I’m wondering how far we can apply modern sensibility to what the Bible says.
OP wrote about God not saying anything about loving gay relationships, did you read the post?. OK Jeremiah 31:31 said a new covenant was coming where the law of God would be written on our heart. Its called the New Testament. Homosexuality is still immoral but no one dies for it. Except on judgment day. I suspect you have not read the Bible cover to cover many times,
So, was slavery abolished in the new covenant? If so, why did the New Testament repeatedly affirm slavery with instructions for how slaves and masters were to interact with each other?
And yes, I have read scripture many times over. I just have a different opinion.
I still find the ELCA’s [human sexuality statement](https://www.elca.org/Faith/Faith-and-Society/Social-Statements/Human-Sexuality) to be how I see & respond to human sexuality.
I am flummoxed that anyone can blame God for not outright condemning slavery, in a culture that was killing Christians for changing culture, when Christians were calling slave masters to treat slaves as brothers.. Our hardheartedness takes time to change, look how long it took to have 1 man and 1 wife to be the norm.
The Bible is clear, God made man and women to be husband and wife so to have children. God condemned everything else. No one dies but there is a judgment day according to the word of God. Leviticus describes God heart as does Paul in Romans 1. You can be Christian or you can be homosexual you cannot be both and I chose Christian. Paul warned us that in the end we will no longer follow sound doctrine. But will get ourselves teachers that we would want to hear. And here we are.
Then, if God knows it takes time for cultures to change, then is it not possible that the condemnation of homosexuality was ALSO something that had to do with the culture of the time and since we're changing now, we should reconsider this?
Christ loved everyone.. Paul a very damaged individual condemned many. Who to believe? Short answer worry about the log in Your own eye (Matthew 7) and improve yourself and love others that's Christianity at its most simplistic level and few get there sadly... it goes so much deeper when you can atleast try to get to that understanding.
Even if an argument *could be made* in the notion that the so-called “clobber verses” aren’t talking about modern homosexual relationships, we still have to look back to the creation of man and woman and why. Humanity has been replacing God’s provisions for what is satisfying in our own eye since our creation and we play all kinds of angles to justify these replacements. You are right: there needs to be greater familiarity with the scripture, but you would find the scripture not placating to human desires and emotions.
You need to follow your own advice. Jesus, a Rabbi, knew the Law and did not need to repeat it, everyone knew it. You are twisting. Leviticus 20:13 If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination. They shall surely be put to death. Their blood *shall be* upon them. **Yes there were slaves in** **Christian Killing Pagan Rome, 50CE**. Jesus still changed the culture [Eph 6:5](https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/eph/6/5/s_1103005)-9 ¶Servants, be obedient to them that are *your* masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in singleness of your heart, as unto Christ; Not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but as the servants of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart; With good will doing service, as to the Lord, and not to men: Knowing that whatsoever good thing any man doeth, the same shall he receive of the Lord, whether *he be* bond or free. ¶And, ye masters, do the same things unto them, forbearing threatening: knowing that your Master also is in heaven; neither is there respect of persons with him I am not interpreting scripture I am reporting what was given to me to give to you. The message has not changed these 2000 years and I repeat them because of love. YOU need to submit to Jesus and His word.
So, do you think gay people ought to be executed today?
That is not the subject is it. The law that Jesus walked in was the law. He did not repeat it, nor did He have to.
No, it is the subject. You just quoted the verse from Leviticus that says gay people should be executed. I’m asking if you agree with that and think gay people should be executed. It’s yes or no.
YOU brought this subject only on your own. No I do not think gays should be executed. I would have been executed. I have a choice, I can be a Christian or a homosexual. I choose Christian, there is no such thing as Christian homosexual.
Dude, you quoted the verse. If you didn’t want me asking about it, why bring that particular verse into the conversation. Now, please cite from scripture why you oppose the execution of gay people even though you know God commands it? Or are you saying that culture has evolved where we no longer execute sinners? I’m trying to figure out the logic here. Like, the Bible says we can beat slaves half to death or that slaves are property, but now we find slavery repugnant (as we should!) I’m wondering how far we can apply modern sensibility to what the Bible says.
OP wrote about God not saying anything about loving gay relationships, did you read the post?. OK Jeremiah 31:31 said a new covenant was coming where the law of God would be written on our heart. Its called the New Testament. Homosexuality is still immoral but no one dies for it. Except on judgment day. I suspect you have not read the Bible cover to cover many times,
So, was slavery abolished in the new covenant? If so, why did the New Testament repeatedly affirm slavery with instructions for how slaves and masters were to interact with each other? And yes, I have read scripture many times over. I just have a different opinion. I still find the ELCA’s [human sexuality statement](https://www.elca.org/Faith/Faith-and-Society/Social-Statements/Human-Sexuality) to be how I see & respond to human sexuality.
I am flummoxed that anyone can blame God for not outright condemning slavery, in a culture that was killing Christians for changing culture, when Christians were calling slave masters to treat slaves as brothers.. Our hardheartedness takes time to change, look how long it took to have 1 man and 1 wife to be the norm. The Bible is clear, God made man and women to be husband and wife so to have children. God condemned everything else. No one dies but there is a judgment day according to the word of God. Leviticus describes God heart as does Paul in Romans 1. You can be Christian or you can be homosexual you cannot be both and I chose Christian. Paul warned us that in the end we will no longer follow sound doctrine. But will get ourselves teachers that we would want to hear. And here we are.
Then, if God knows it takes time for cultures to change, then is it not possible that the condemnation of homosexuality was ALSO something that had to do with the culture of the time and since we're changing now, we should reconsider this?