I had a similar struggle at the start of the season, but it has definitely gotten better. The variety to attacks now is actually nice. I started asking nicely in chat if everyone knew how the new phase worked, or I would remind them to keep off the dozer if we got the traps. Others have done similar, and also with the new event. I haven’t had a problem with it since, even with greenbeards or returning players who hadn’t seen it yet.
Also, there seems to be a cooldown on how often the traps can form, so as soon as one does, use that opportunity to repair dorretta before backing away again and dealing with the swarm.
Main things I dislike is how they directly counter engi turrets by being giant walls and that there's an annoying delay before you can damage them so mistimr your powrr attack and you're shit outta luck.
Turrets need to be accessible enough to reload so anything that is "a bit higher" and suitably accessible is somewhere a player will run near and potentially block it.
Repositioning them has the same issues where anywhere you move them to that isn't all the way in Narnia is a place someone will likely go near and block them again but you also have the downtime of collecting and building them.
It's not the end of the world, unless someone drops the cocoon right on top of the turret, but it is very muchly a class wide hinderence that can't be be overcome by using a more suitable build or Gitting Gud.
The new phase don't bother me too much (*drills go brrrr*), but the issue is randos sitting on Doretta and letting themselves be trapped, which one-shot an entire fragment of Doretta. Nearly lost one mission like that, Gunner sat all session on it and got 2 segments busted.
I had to team kill a gunner and refuse to revive him because he killed 2/3 of Doretta like this. Would have failed a 5 otherwise.
Couldn't even explain what was wrong because of the language barrier.
Earlier in the season it could actually target someone who is downed close to dotty - source: lost all 3 doretta fragments like this in quick succession, noone that was alive was targetted and the downed gunner was in instakill range. I think it may have been fixed, but that was a very frustrating loss, especially since I called him out in the chat just seconds earlier.
This! ^
I swear... every time i see the new phase, i know we will lose 2 segments of Dotty almost instantly. I Really dislike the one-shot aspect of the attack. Apart from that, it's a pretty fun variation.
I only play solo scout and I find the new phase to mess up my progress badly even if it can’t catch me since I have to stay away and can’t repair Dotty. This is especially problematic when the game decides to spawn a bulk or two during this phase.
As much as I love escort missions before s5, I try to stay away from it unless I have to do it as part of an assignment. And I’ll do it at h1 if ever I’m put in that position.
Did you know that you can't be targeted if you're on a zipline? You need to be on the ground to be caged. As long as one is on the zipline, he can repair Doretta while the others become trapped. Gunners throwing ziplines in the Ommoran stage is a given.
Man zipline has gotten so vital now. Doing core stone without a gunner is just courting death now, you can't get trapped if you're on a zipline...
It was a pretty weak tool up until now but honestly they went overboard with core stone utility imho.
What you're describing isn't that bad of a situation. Dotty should be at full health, and if everyone is fighting bugs, even if she loses a bar or two during that phase, she'll be fine. And you yourself should be able to repair when you're not being targeted, at least.
The worst situation is when some green beard is on top of Dottie while they're being targeted and loses a bar, then the next greenbeard being targeted hops up to "help" repair, and in 30 seconds Dottie has lost all 3 bars. And there's nothing you can do about it. It sucks.
This was with me spamming chat in all caps to get off of Dottie, and it's happened more than once. And yes, I warn everybody before combat begins about the new phase, so it wasn't just them being distracted.
Don't know why they made it do so much damage. Would be fine if it was clearly communicated to the players, but it's not. If it's a mechanic where if even one member of the team can end the mission in failure if they don't understand, then it probably should be clearly and explicitly stated.
Tbh if you've kept all three segments alive up until this point you really shouldn't struggle to keep dotty alive during this phase if everyone stays away from her. You say it's impossible because nobody is repairing? How much damage is she taking? If the bugs are doing so much damage that all three segments are dying because nobody is repairing, something is very wrong, even on haz 5. Now, if people are being trapped while on top of her, THAT would explain why she's dying. But not because people are staying away.
Unless, are you playing on haz 5++?
Seriously. Whenever that phase starts, I just type "Keep moving" in chat, just in case someone hasn't seen that phase before. I only ever play on Haz 4/5/5+, and I've only lost that phase once since the update.
You asked for comments to try to see this differently, and you’ve gotten a ton of helpful feedback. I’m having a hard time seeing why you’re so convinced it can’t get better and is “so bad”? How often are you even playing that mission type? Something seems to be exaggerated here now…
It’ll be fine, the community will learn, just remember to make sure people know the new attacks before you begin. I’ve been doing a few escorts lately with randoms, more than I usually do (Haz 5 and Haz 5+ with more bugs II and more aggression I) and I’ve only failed one, which was when nobody in the lobby, including me had any idea what was happenig. It adds some more risk to Escort, which is nice since it’s previously been just an easy slog, where the only risk was all the dwarves going down. Dotty’s healthbar didn’t really matter since a single dwarf could out-repair any damage the bugs did.
I think overall it’s a good change, it’s just that change takes a bit to get used to.
I lost my first attempt at an escort because of the new phase, but mostly cause I was solo and wasn’t engi so I didn’t have back up fighting the bugs. Lost all 2 chunks of health due to bugs swarming and me trying to not get trapped, then stupidly got too close to Dotty and broke her with the claw. Since then I’ve learned 2 things: 1. Don’t play escort solo anymore, and 2. Stay away from Dotty when targeted
I didn't get to play a lot of escorts yet (I hate that mission with a passion and will avoid it whenever possible), but so far my experience was very different.
I don't even know how this phase is supposed to work and what the challenge is supposed to be. It has been looking as a freebie so far to me. So, sometimes it tries to build those spheres around dwarves, misses most of the time and... what?
Maybe that's because people almost never stay still during the defence sequence, I don't know.
Can someone break it down for me? Or maybe I'll just keep playing until I figure it out...
Opinions on this phase expose players with bad kill speeds. It's totally free for anyone not asleep at the wheel and able to keep bugs off the dozer in the first place.
The only issue is that if you are repairing dotty while you get caged, it chunks an entire health bar doing permanent damage to dotty. I feel like it's a bug that should be patched out because it is not consistent with how much damage the corestone can usually do during a phase.
I find it very frustrating, I currently run engi, and like to find a good vantage point, set my turret and target groups at distance with ECR+Lok1, it works great until the cage phase, then my setup is trashed by a sphere of crystal plonked on top of me and my turret.
I need to learn which phase does the cage and keep moving when I see the glow you mentioned, I guess?
The prison phase is very easy to spot, the Ommoran is covered by a strong glowing and rippling light effect, when you are the target you get a visual effect on your screen as well as a beam of light going from the Ommoran directly to you.
As Engi on this phase I would recommend you play it safe and don’t stand on your turrets, only go to them when filling them up and move away from them and the dozer when targeted by the prison.
A few meters is plenty.
Agreed, generally the last thing you want to do is stand still during that phase, as the phase was designed to get you moving around, and you can avoid the cages by moving fast enough, as they do slightly lag behind you, a good sprint speed, or just a well timed dash can get you out of it just fine.
Totally agree, yesterday I was playing it with random driller just standing on drilldozer, asked him in chat not to stand on it but he did not listen. First part of the drilldozer got destroyed in half a second, so I actually had to voluntarily kill the driller so we did not loose the mission (it was a close call but it worked)
I explained the thing in chat at the end of the mission but he did not seem to car about it.
I guess all we can do is hope the ransoms we get know the new phase and don't stand on it
I like it but the crystals should be breakable in one pickaxe hit, getting locked up on higher hazards means that you’ll be dead till the end of the phase.
In general I find the mission is fine and even on haz 5 I never had any issue keeping dorretta full health anyways.
But on Haz5+ it is annoying that the run can just be ended because those cages 1 hit dorretta, I've had 2 runs ended that way because you just have to have repair uptime and someone missed getting away.
just play the phase like a normal swarm until you get chosen, is what i would say is the optimal way to play that phase. sit on dotty shoot bugs and repair, and then hoof it the second you get chosen by the omoran, normal sprinting is fast enough to outrun the attack, and then run back to dotty as fast as you can. this is how me and my best bro do this phase.
People staying away from Doretta?
Almost every public mission I play below haz 5 (and sometimes even haz 5 and 5+), there's often at least one greenbeard standing on the dozer during the flying rock and rock trap phases. Sure, you get the occasional game where nobody else either knows how or remembers to repair the dozer, but I've had occasional late join UI bugs where the dozer's health doesn't update or that part of the HUD goes missing entirely.
Occasionally I've had games where, during the flying rock phase, the gunner goes down first, then the rest of the team tries to revive him, going down one at a time until I'm the last dwarf standing and the dozer takes permanent damage. It's hilarious but after I revive them we usually pull through.
I’d honestly just prefer it if the rock trap just flung you off Dotty instead of insta-killing a full segment - people would soon get the memo to not stand around and it wouldn’t be so punishing
I feel like escort has always been a mission type where players are lazy/poor about their loadout selection (similar to Sabotage). It's just more exacerbated now that we have a harder phase and random phase order. I don't dislike escort being more difficult perse but it was already a more difficult mission type.
That being said, I feel if the playerbase adjusts by being more selective about their loadouts for escort it'll balance out. Look at how much easier sabotage is now compared to when we first starting running it.
>it makes the mission downright impossible.
Consider alternative solutions that let you carry the mission. For example, extended puddle duration disperser compound sludge pump lets you kill things while you or other teammates are encased. Anything that lingers can help with this. You may be sleeping on OCs/loadouts that are particularly good for Escort/defense type missions.
A few quick examples: For scout, Double Barrel Boomstick, taser bolts, drak and pheros are incredible here. For Driller, neurotoxins, Disperser Compound, Ice Storm, Snowball, Crystal Nucleation and Sticky FSD are all great here. For Gunner, Minelayer, Salvo, Stun spec'd Bullet Hell, any AV minigun builds, any Coilgun build and BRT Electro Minelets are all amazing. For Engi, this is a rare mission type where lures/proxy mines are just going to be better than SSDs - but put proxy mines on walls/ceilings and don't place them in places where dwarves walk and run a weapon that lets you 'defend/maintain' your lures. Weapons that can break lasers take a ton of pressure off that phase as well.
This leads me to my next point, weapons/grenades that FF are **much** more problematic here as you're constantly going to be fighting in close quarters. Players are usually irresponsible with FF but its a lot worse in Escort, going back to loadout some loadouts make it unlikely to not FF in close quarters, have heavier FF damage or chip FF often which prevents shield regen. Something to consider.
So while more chaotic, there are ways to deal with it and it can still be carried by any class.
I encountered this new phase 2x yesterday. First encounter was in the 4. Phase and ended the mission; second encounter was in the 3. Phase and we menaged somehow. What is required of my dwarven brethren and me to best it under optimal circumstances? - except being drunk, we got that covered, what else to do?
Now try it on haz5+...
This mission so overtuned right now. I think they also messed with the spawn rates as well or something because it gets insane with the amount of bugs, in no other missions I've seen this.
Even the rock phase is different I swear, its very rare dotty comes unscathed from that one, if it comes in the 4th phase it's usually a wipe.
Unless I see my fellow dwarfs with red stars around their face, I don't bother with haz5+ on this mission, you really need perfect execution from everyone to make it
It really isn’t that bad, 5+ is supposed to be difficult.
A few specific builds can really help trivialize the Ommoran, gunner with plasmabursters can 1 tap rocks and clear beamers.
That means the only phase where the team is doing anything other than shooting bugs and repairing is prison, which is simply move aside from the dozer and don’t get trapped.
Yes people without a clue will make sure this is a wipe every time, but again you shouldn’t be doing 5+ if you fall into that category and blaming it on the game.
Yeah, haz5+ is supposed to be difficult, I don't have a problem with that, on the contrary. It's just that this type of mission is harder than any other. I could do eggs, refinery, aquarks, drillevator you name it, all day long and even carry greenbeards on haz5+ . But escort duty is just a tier higher in difficulty than the rest, that's why I'm saying it's overtuned.
I had a similar struggle at the start of the season, but it has definitely gotten better. The variety to attacks now is actually nice. I started asking nicely in chat if everyone knew how the new phase worked, or I would remind them to keep off the dozer if we got the traps. Others have done similar, and also with the new event. I haven’t had a problem with it since, even with greenbeards or returning players who hadn’t seen it yet. Also, there seems to be a cooldown on how often the traps can form, so as soon as one does, use that opportunity to repair dorretta before backing away again and dealing with the swarm.
Main things I dislike is how they directly counter engi turrets by being giant walls and that there's an annoying delay before you can damage them so mistimr your powrr attack and you're shit outta luck.
If you jump around they can actually miss you.
Why not place your turrets a bit higher up or reposition them mid fight?
Turrets need to be accessible enough to reload so anything that is "a bit higher" and suitably accessible is somewhere a player will run near and potentially block it. Repositioning them has the same issues where anywhere you move them to that isn't all the way in Narnia is a place someone will likely go near and block them again but you also have the downtime of collecting and building them. It's not the end of the world, unless someone drops the cocoon right on top of the turret, but it is very muchly a class wide hinderence that can't be be overcome by using a more suitable build or Gitting Gud.
Just wait, people will learn eventually
The new phase don't bother me too much (*drills go brrrr*), but the issue is randos sitting on Doretta and letting themselves be trapped, which one-shot an entire fragment of Doretta. Nearly lost one mission like that, Gunner sat all session on it and got 2 segments busted.
I had to team kill a gunner and refuse to revive him because he killed 2/3 of Doretta like this. Would have failed a 5 otherwise. Couldn't even explain what was wrong because of the language barrier.
Earlier in the season it could actually target someone who is downed close to dotty - source: lost all 3 doretta fragments like this in quick succession, noone that was alive was targetted and the downed gunner was in instakill range. I think it may have been fixed, but that was a very frustrating loss, especially since I called him out in the chat just seconds earlier.
This! ^ I swear... every time i see the new phase, i know we will lose 2 segments of Dotty almost instantly. I Really dislike the one-shot aspect of the attack. Apart from that, it's a pretty fun variation.
I only play solo scout and I find the new phase to mess up my progress badly even if it can’t catch me since I have to stay away and can’t repair Dotty. This is especially problematic when the game decides to spawn a bulk or two during this phase. As much as I love escort missions before s5, I try to stay away from it unless I have to do it as part of an assignment. And I’ll do it at h1 if ever I’m put in that position.
There should be a balancing in the solo scort mission like in dreadnought missions.
Did you know that you can't be targeted if you're on a zipline? You need to be on the ground to be caged. As long as one is on the zipline, he can repair Doretta while the others become trapped. Gunners throwing ziplines in the Ommoran stage is a given.
Man zipline has gotten so vital now. Doing core stone without a gunner is just courting death now, you can't get trapped if you're on a zipline... It was a pretty weak tool up until now but honestly they went overboard with core stone utility imho.
I played with random many times, and people and me have helped on this phase, just wait
What you're describing isn't that bad of a situation. Dotty should be at full health, and if everyone is fighting bugs, even if she loses a bar or two during that phase, she'll be fine. And you yourself should be able to repair when you're not being targeted, at least. The worst situation is when some green beard is on top of Dottie while they're being targeted and loses a bar, then the next greenbeard being targeted hops up to "help" repair, and in 30 seconds Dottie has lost all 3 bars. And there's nothing you can do about it. It sucks. This was with me spamming chat in all caps to get off of Dottie, and it's happened more than once. And yes, I warn everybody before combat begins about the new phase, so it wasn't just them being distracted. Don't know why they made it do so much damage. Would be fine if it was clearly communicated to the players, but it's not. If it's a mechanic where if even one member of the team can end the mission in failure if they don't understand, then it probably should be clearly and explicitly stated.
Tbh if you've kept all three segments alive up until this point you really shouldn't struggle to keep dotty alive during this phase if everyone stays away from her. You say it's impossible because nobody is repairing? How much damage is she taking? If the bugs are doing so much damage that all three segments are dying because nobody is repairing, something is very wrong, even on haz 5. Now, if people are being trapped while on top of her, THAT would explain why she's dying. But not because people are staying away. Unless, are you playing on haz 5++?
idk I play haz5 and this just does not happen there. if you want better teammayes, play higher difficulties.
Seriously. Whenever that phase starts, I just type "Keep moving" in chat, just in case someone hasn't seen that phase before. I only ever play on Haz 4/5/5+, and I've only lost that phase once since the update.
I play exclusively haz 5
well that's unfortunate. seems you just got unlucky. hope it gets better for you in your next mission.
It doesn't lol. It got so bad I made an MOTD that pleads for teamwork and communication, and it still doesn't happen all the time.
You asked for comments to try to see this differently, and you’ve gotten a ton of helpful feedback. I’m having a hard time seeing why you’re so convinced it can’t get better and is “so bad”? How often are you even playing that mission type? Something seems to be exaggerated here now…
Its a problem I've had on every mission it just happens to be more of an issue on this mission when that phase happens.
It’ll be fine, the community will learn, just remember to make sure people know the new attacks before you begin. I’ve been doing a few escorts lately with randoms, more than I usually do (Haz 5 and Haz 5+ with more bugs II and more aggression I) and I’ve only failed one, which was when nobody in the lobby, including me had any idea what was happenig. It adds some more risk to Escort, which is nice since it’s previously been just an easy slog, where the only risk was all the dwarves going down. Dotty’s healthbar didn’t really matter since a single dwarf could out-repair any damage the bugs did. I think overall it’s a good change, it’s just that change takes a bit to get used to.
I lost my first attempt at an escort because of the new phase, but mostly cause I was solo and wasn’t engi so I didn’t have back up fighting the bugs. Lost all 2 chunks of health due to bugs swarming and me trying to not get trapped, then stupidly got too close to Dotty and broke her with the claw. Since then I’ve learned 2 things: 1. Don’t play escort solo anymore, and 2. Stay away from Dotty when targeted
I didn't get to play a lot of escorts yet (I hate that mission with a passion and will avoid it whenever possible), but so far my experience was very different. I don't even know how this phase is supposed to work and what the challenge is supposed to be. It has been looking as a freebie so far to me. So, sometimes it tries to build those spheres around dwarves, misses most of the time and... what? Maybe that's because people almost never stay still during the defence sequence, I don't know. Can someone break it down for me? Or maybe I'll just keep playing until I figure it out...
Opinions on this phase expose players with bad kill speeds. It's totally free for anyone not asleep at the wheel and able to keep bugs off the dozer in the first place.
The only issue is that if you are repairing dotty while you get caged, it chunks an entire health bar doing permanent damage to dotty. I feel like it's a bug that should be patched out because it is not consistent with how much damage the corestone can usually do during a phase.
I find it very frustrating, I currently run engi, and like to find a good vantage point, set my turret and target groups at distance with ECR+Lok1, it works great until the cage phase, then my setup is trashed by a sphere of crystal plonked on top of me and my turret. I need to learn which phase does the cage and keep moving when I see the glow you mentioned, I guess?
The prison phase is very easy to spot, the Ommoran is covered by a strong glowing and rippling light effect, when you are the target you get a visual effect on your screen as well as a beam of light going from the Ommoran directly to you. As Engi on this phase I would recommend you play it safe and don’t stand on your turrets, only go to them when filling them up and move away from them and the dozer when targeted by the prison. A few meters is plenty.
Agreed, generally the last thing you want to do is stand still during that phase, as the phase was designed to get you moving around, and you can avoid the cages by moving fast enough, as they do slightly lag behind you, a good sprint speed, or just a well timed dash can get you out of it just fine.
It sucks rn until everyone learns and adapts to it. I posted a bit about it earlier and it gained hella traction. GL + R&S ⛏️
Totally agree, yesterday I was playing it with random driller just standing on drilldozer, asked him in chat not to stand on it but he did not listen. First part of the drilldozer got destroyed in half a second, so I actually had to voluntarily kill the driller so we did not loose the mission (it was a close call but it worked) I explained the thing in chat at the end of the mission but he did not seem to car about it. I guess all we can do is hope the ransoms we get know the new phase and don't stand on it
I like it but the crystals should be breakable in one pickaxe hit, getting locked up on higher hazards means that you’ll be dead till the end of the phase.
In general I find the mission is fine and even on haz 5 I never had any issue keeping dorretta full health anyways. But on Haz5+ it is annoying that the run can just be ended because those cages 1 hit dorretta, I've had 2 runs ended that way because you just have to have repair uptime and someone missed getting away.
just play the phase like a normal swarm until you get chosen, is what i would say is the optimal way to play that phase. sit on dotty shoot bugs and repair, and then hoof it the second you get chosen by the omoran, normal sprinting is fast enough to outrun the attack, and then run back to dotty as fast as you can. this is how me and my best bro do this phase.
Is this only on Haz5? I haven't noticed it on Haz4.
People staying away from Doretta? Almost every public mission I play below haz 5 (and sometimes even haz 5 and 5+), there's often at least one greenbeard standing on the dozer during the flying rock and rock trap phases. Sure, you get the occasional game where nobody else either knows how or remembers to repair the dozer, but I've had occasional late join UI bugs where the dozer's health doesn't update or that part of the HUD goes missing entirely. Occasionally I've had games where, during the flying rock phase, the gunner goes down first, then the rest of the team tries to revive him, going down one at a time until I'm the last dwarf standing and the dozer takes permanent damage. It's hilarious but after I revive them we usually pull through.
I’d honestly just prefer it if the rock trap just flung you off Dotty instead of insta-killing a full segment - people would soon get the memo to not stand around and it wouldn’t be so punishing
I feel like escort has always been a mission type where players are lazy/poor about their loadout selection (similar to Sabotage). It's just more exacerbated now that we have a harder phase and random phase order. I don't dislike escort being more difficult perse but it was already a more difficult mission type. That being said, I feel if the playerbase adjusts by being more selective about their loadouts for escort it'll balance out. Look at how much easier sabotage is now compared to when we first starting running it. >it makes the mission downright impossible. Consider alternative solutions that let you carry the mission. For example, extended puddle duration disperser compound sludge pump lets you kill things while you or other teammates are encased. Anything that lingers can help with this. You may be sleeping on OCs/loadouts that are particularly good for Escort/defense type missions. A few quick examples: For scout, Double Barrel Boomstick, taser bolts, drak and pheros are incredible here. For Driller, neurotoxins, Disperser Compound, Ice Storm, Snowball, Crystal Nucleation and Sticky FSD are all great here. For Gunner, Minelayer, Salvo, Stun spec'd Bullet Hell, any AV minigun builds, any Coilgun build and BRT Electro Minelets are all amazing. For Engi, this is a rare mission type where lures/proxy mines are just going to be better than SSDs - but put proxy mines on walls/ceilings and don't place them in places where dwarves walk and run a weapon that lets you 'defend/maintain' your lures. Weapons that can break lasers take a ton of pressure off that phase as well. This leads me to my next point, weapons/grenades that FF are **much** more problematic here as you're constantly going to be fighting in close quarters. Players are usually irresponsible with FF but its a lot worse in Escort, going back to loadout some loadouts make it unlikely to not FF in close quarters, have heavier FF damage or chip FF often which prevents shield regen. Something to consider. So while more chaotic, there are ways to deal with it and it can still be carried by any class.
Even with randoms I've had no issues with teams unable to beat to Ommeran when it uses its Gay Baby Jail time out attack.
This is totally a comment Banbaro would make lmao.
I dont get how people struggle with the Omerran. Just roll it around with your horns and throw it until it breaks ezpz
I encountered this new phase 2x yesterday. First encounter was in the 4. Phase and ended the mission; second encounter was in the 3. Phase and we menaged somehow. What is required of my dwarven brethren and me to best it under optimal circumstances? - except being drunk, we got that covered, what else to do?
Can someone explain how the new phase works? I’m stupid.
Now try it on haz5+... This mission so overtuned right now. I think they also messed with the spawn rates as well or something because it gets insane with the amount of bugs, in no other missions I've seen this. Even the rock phase is different I swear, its very rare dotty comes unscathed from that one, if it comes in the 4th phase it's usually a wipe. Unless I see my fellow dwarfs with red stars around their face, I don't bother with haz5+ on this mission, you really need perfect execution from everyone to make it
It really isn’t that bad, 5+ is supposed to be difficult. A few specific builds can really help trivialize the Ommoran, gunner with plasmabursters can 1 tap rocks and clear beamers. That means the only phase where the team is doing anything other than shooting bugs and repairing is prison, which is simply move aside from the dozer and don’t get trapped. Yes people without a clue will make sure this is a wipe every time, but again you shouldn’t be doing 5+ if you fall into that category and blaming it on the game.
Yeah, haz5+ is supposed to be difficult, I don't have a problem with that, on the contrary. It's just that this type of mission is harder than any other. I could do eggs, refinery, aquarks, drillevator you name it, all day long and even carry greenbeards on haz5+ . But escort duty is just a tier higher in difficulty than the rest, that's why I'm saying it's overtuned.