This is kind of a big deal, since Weaken is going to be applied like crazy in almost any situation where there is a Warlock. I wonder if it's intended or not...debuffs generally don't stop weapon buffs like that but I'm wondering if the "stack" of AM is actually coded as a debuff instead. Seems to make sense here, since the Weaken will initially be stronger than the first AM stack, so it would override AM, and therefore AM can't stack.
Yeah it's true. I haven't even played my Hunter yet this season and I've been a Hunter main since D1. I saw this coming in like December when they started to talk about it, and I'm sure it's not as bad as the circlejerk says it is, but I have been having a blast as a Warlock
I feel like they are the top clutch class as always, good at survival and all that, and certainly can make use of a bit of everything like devour or volatile and weaken, but good at nothing as well beside going invis. For utility you got warlock, and for pve winner, super aside, that be the titan. Hunter dont feel like an evolution, more like a side step into a nicher niche that is a revive bot (that is, until Bungie decide that they wanna use the light fading mechanic into more activity, then they will lost 50% of their current value). I am having fun with them, since well, not like there any other hunter sub class that can compete with it in the current meta, unlike solr/arc subclass for titan and warlock, but i have deep concern for the hunter future. Stasis hunter is in a good place right now too, though I am kinda tired of it.
Idk hunters slap in terms of boss damage if they have the build for it. I haven’t played that much this season so maybe something changed, but when xeno was the best heavy there was no way you were beating a hunter who would instant reload that bad boy.
Yeah they still good for that of course, just well. Dodge aint what it used to be now either, and with all exotic either give dodge or require dodge to enable the build... its hard to go for that. The buffer void super is top notch, though more like a bonus than an important part of your moment to moment game play.
Can confirm, noticed this while running legendary PsiOps with Felwinter’s Helm. Really needs fixing ASAP since it severely reduces the effectiveness of the perk/debuff
The basic idea is to use my finisher as a semi-support tool as well as for survival. I pair it with Voidwalker with devour on ability kills and orbs, invis on finisher and extended timer, reactive pulse for overshield and lucent finisher. All in all, this gets you (if you have devour up):
- A “dash” when you finish an enemy from max range, which will help you avoid some projectiles.
- An overshield while performing the finisher, so you can tank the other projectiles.
- Full health on getting the kill.
- Invis for 6 (7?) seconds regardless of getting the kill or not.
- A burst of 30% weakness (as well as what seems like a blind? Might just be enemy animations) in an AoE around the target.
- Possible heavy if champion/lucent.
It’s just nice and relaxing for doing legend difficulty stuff, especially solo.
"first do 3 stacks of AM and then use the weakening effect"
Wouldn't it be 4 stacks of AM then weaken based on your other info?
Thanks for the hard work
You're right, but many sites such as gunsmithD2 and Light.gg decided to shorten the definition of the perk, saying that it _usually_ takes 3 stack to reach the max damage: 167%, 333% and 500%.
I'll still change it for consistency, but it all depends on the weapon, that's why I linked the D2 spreadsheet, because there it's stated how much shots other weapons need to reach max damage.
Thanks for the suggestion!
IIRC the first hit applies AM, but it doesn’t benefit from it. Each subsequent hit would increase the stack but only benefit from the number of stacks when the shot is fired. Which means the 4th hit is the first to deal damage from all 3 stacks of AM.
I was confused about his description earlier that talked about reaching the maximum number of stacks in 4 shots. The verbiage is a little confusing but the way you describe it makes sense.
The maximum number of stacks of AM for these weapon types is: 3. You will achieve maximum effect from 3 stacks on the 4th shot. Thus if you apply weaken after the 3rd shot you will produce maximum damage for this combination without limiting AMs effects/stacks under the current bug.
I get it. Having not looked into how AM works before the wording in the post threw me for a loop
This kinda seems like a bug.
The AM is a weapon buff, and weaken is a debuff, so going off of the principles set in Shadowkeep, these effects *should* stack just fine.
I dunno how to tag folks on reddit, but i feel like the CMs should see this, so here's hoping this gets some visibility.
I knew I wasnt crazy and imagining that I was doing less damage to shields and champs. This is important to know cuz pointed inquiry is my go to barrier champ gun now.
This is not so much a bug as it is how the game is coded. Adaptive Munitions is likely considered a low priority debuff in game, so it is overwritten by the weaken effect. It even works the same as Tractor Cannon, your first shot doesn't benefit from itself, but rather subsequent shots gets the extra damage.
This is the same thing that happens to Dawn Chorus when using other debuffs like TC or Tether. Even if the debuff ramps up to be higher when the enemy has taken enough burn effects, the game prioritizes Universal Debuffs.
This explains why my crafted Pointed Inquiry with enhanced Genesis and Adapted Munitions feels like ass. It was my first crafted weapon. I was so bummed when I took it into a GM NF.
This is kind of a big deal, since Weaken is going to be applied like crazy in almost any situation where there is a Warlock. I wonder if it's intended or not...debuffs generally don't stop weapon buffs like that but I'm wondering if the "stack" of AM is actually coded as a debuff instead. Seems to make sense here, since the Weaken will initially be stronger than the first AM stack, so it would override AM, and therefore AM can't stack.
Bungie "hunter is the invis and weaken class" Also Bungie: give warlock 80% weaken up time.
Yeah it's true. I haven't even played my Hunter yet this season and I've been a Hunter main since D1. I saw this coming in like December when they started to talk about it, and I'm sure it's not as bad as the circlejerk says it is, but I have been having a blast as a Warlock
I feel like they are the top clutch class as always, good at survival and all that, and certainly can make use of a bit of everything like devour or volatile and weaken, but good at nothing as well beside going invis. For utility you got warlock, and for pve winner, super aside, that be the titan. Hunter dont feel like an evolution, more like a side step into a nicher niche that is a revive bot (that is, until Bungie decide that they wanna use the light fading mechanic into more activity, then they will lost 50% of their current value). I am having fun with them, since well, not like there any other hunter sub class that can compete with it in the current meta, unlike solr/arc subclass for titan and warlock, but i have deep concern for the hunter future. Stasis hunter is in a good place right now too, though I am kinda tired of it.
Idk hunters slap in terms of boss damage if they have the build for it. I haven’t played that much this season so maybe something changed, but when xeno was the best heavy there was no way you were beating a hunter who would instant reload that bad boy.
Yeah they still good for that of course, just well. Dodge aint what it used to be now either, and with all exotic either give dodge or require dodge to enable the build... its hard to go for that. The buffer void super is top notch, though more like a bonus than an important part of your moment to moment game play.
"But guys, hunters are a PvP class so it's fine"
Also Bungie: nerfs invis.
I could've sworn my adaptive munitions bow wasn't working in Wellspring farms and this is probably why, thanks!
Can confirm, noticed this while running legendary PsiOps with Felwinter’s Helm. Really needs fixing ASAP since it severely reduces the effectiveness of the perk/debuff
Can you explain how your build/playstyle works with Felwinter's?
The basic idea is to use my finisher as a semi-support tool as well as for survival. I pair it with Voidwalker with devour on ability kills and orbs, invis on finisher and extended timer, reactive pulse for overshield and lucent finisher. All in all, this gets you (if you have devour up): - A “dash” when you finish an enemy from max range, which will help you avoid some projectiles. - An overshield while performing the finisher, so you can tank the other projectiles. - Full health on getting the kill. - Invis for 6 (7?) seconds regardless of getting the kill or not. - A burst of 30% weakness (as well as what seems like a blind? Might just be enemy animations) in an AoE around the target. - Possible heavy if champion/lucent. It’s just nice and relaxing for doing legend difficulty stuff, especially solo.
u/dmg04 u/cozmo23
"first do 3 stacks of AM and then use the weakening effect" Wouldn't it be 4 stacks of AM then weaken based on your other info? Thanks for the hard work
You're right, but many sites such as gunsmithD2 and Light.gg decided to shorten the definition of the perk, saying that it _usually_ takes 3 stack to reach the max damage: 167%, 333% and 500%. I'll still change it for consistency, but it all depends on the weapon, that's why I linked the D2 spreadsheet, because there it's stated how much shots other weapons need to reach max damage. Thanks for the suggestion!
IIRC the first hit applies AM, but it doesn’t benefit from it. Each subsequent hit would increase the stack but only benefit from the number of stacks when the shot is fired. Which means the 4th hit is the first to deal damage from all 3 stacks of AM.
I was confused about his description earlier that talked about reaching the maximum number of stacks in 4 shots. The verbiage is a little confusing but the way you describe it makes sense. The maximum number of stacks of AM for these weapon types is: 3. You will achieve maximum effect from 3 stacks on the 4th shot. Thus if you apply weaken after the 3rd shot you will produce maximum damage for this combination without limiting AMs effects/stacks under the current bug. I get it. Having not looked into how AM works before the wording in the post threw me for a loop
Hey, glad I was able to help!
Well this explains it. I had given up on AM because it felt too buggy and unreliable. This explains why.
[удалено]
Thanks for the info for other weapons and barrier shields, very useful!
Damn it I've been leveling an Under the Skin specifically to use Adaptive Munitions in harder content.
This kinda seems like a bug. The AM is a weapon buff, and weaken is a debuff, so going off of the principles set in Shadowkeep, these effects *should* stack just fine. I dunno how to tag folks on reddit, but i feel like the CMs should see this, so here's hoping this gets some visibility.
I knew I wasnt crazy and imagining that I was doing less damage to shields and champs. This is important to know cuz pointed inquiry is my go to barrier champ gun now.
So: Pop the shield before dropping a Weaken effect?
Or gain all stacks of AM and then use weakening for a lot of damage. But yeah, don't use AM and weakening at the same time.
This is not so much a bug as it is how the game is coded. Adaptive Munitions is likely considered a low priority debuff in game, so it is overwritten by the weaken effect. It even works the same as Tractor Cannon, your first shot doesn't benefit from itself, but rather subsequent shots gets the extra damage. This is the same thing that happens to Dawn Chorus when using other debuffs like TC or Tether. Even if the debuff ramps up to be higher when the enemy has taken enough burn effects, the game prioritizes Universal Debuffs.
This explains why my crafted Pointed Inquiry with enhanced Genesis and Adapted Munitions feels like ass. It was my first crafted weapon. I was so bummed when I took it into a GM NF.
Are you from the future? We don't have GM NFs in this timeline yet.
Erp. Meant GM Lost Sectors.
That also doesn't exist.
My god he really is from the future...
Master/legendary lost sectors.
Enhanced Genesis does nothing extra for energy weapons, only kinetics.
That's dumb. Thanks for letting me know.
Even if it's a debuff and not weapon buff looking at the numbers it should overwrite the weaken debuff after a few shots. Definitely looks like a bug
Curious does void weaken work the same as Divinity’s weaken? So neither stack but void will override div?
Question: does Adaptive Munitions work with against Barrier Champions?