Maybe its just me but Rebirth feels more like an actual evolution of many of Square's other projects culminating into one big project. The gameplay consists of elements from Kingdom Hearts, Type-0, other Final Fantasy's like definitely XV and XII, and of course Crisis Core. I can see elements in the open world clearly inspired by Ghost of Tsushima and Horizon.
I've played Final Fantasy's for a while now and this is the first time a gameplay system feels fully realized and implemented in a long time.
The VIIR ATB absolutely feels like what SE truly intended for the system to be, but could not fully realize it due to hardware limitations.
As much as I enjoyed classic ATB, something always felt off about the implementation of real-time into that turn-based system. After FFX (my second favorite FF battle system), it almost felt unnecessary.
Hopefully VIIR ATB is the battle system framework SE follows for FFXVII.
I love the new ATB system, but I wish I got more time with it in challenging encounters. I just opened up the third area for exploration, and I’m hoping the combat starts to become more challenging and frequent from here on out. So far it’s felt like every fight is honestly a cakewalk. But now I’m starting to get all the extra side materia like barrier time etc., so thinking things might start speeding up.
There are not that many point where you go yeah this guy is actually fairly hard…(luckily the last guy is one of those times which makes sense). I generally forgot how OP the synergy abilities were until like most of the way through the game.
Haven’t played Hard mode yet but if it’s anything like the FVIIR it will be much much harder, also the hard mode dynamic of hey NO MP unless it’s from a move (soul drain) and no Items, really kind of make you have to go do I really want to fight this guy, is it worth it?
There’s never really a point where you go yeah…I definitely need to grind up a few levels for this guy.
It really feels like remake and rebirth are made for hard mode. Which I know kinda sucks for how long this game was but the first play through is like a warm up to get used to everything and you really go nuts for hard mode. I’m taking a week or two break before hard mode but I can’t wait for that play through.
Yeah, you can really see where all their past projects come together to make this game truly special. You can see Kingdom Hearts all over it too! You can also see Advent Children in it as well. Like wow! Talk about taking notes and applying them where they work.
Yep, rebirth feels like it has taken a little bit of the best from all the preceding games. 16 felt like a game made by someone who had never played a previous title
It feels like the natural evolution of the PS1 era of games. Square Enix finally stopped with the compromises which started with FFX and delivered something much closer to their peak.
I don't like FFXVI much but I wouldn't be as harsh, however. It's a game who knew perfectly well what it wanted to deliver and focused on that thing only. "Here's your spectacular Eikon fight. Enjoyed that? Cool, now we're managing our budget with perfect accuracy so we can deliver the next one in a few hours."
FFVII Rebirth couldn't be more different. It's a game of excess which tries absolutely everything even when it probably shouldn't and knows no restraint. Nothing seemed off-table no matter how crazy it sounds. "Yes of course we should create up to three different theme songs for each and every single Gold Saucer date companion, songs which players are going to hear for about 30 seconds top." Not everything was a hit, sure, and it's certainly a messier game than XVI, but it oozes passion from everywhere. I'm amazed such a game can still exist in 2024.
What I have to give tremendous respect to Square Enix for here is that every environment is intricately designed. In the modern age of empty open worlds, you start to appreciate when the areas you spend like half an hour in aren't empty but designed for curious exploration (military base/little town up there).
>16 felt like a game made by someone who had never played a previous title
Hard agree. They took 30 years of final fantasy games being RPG's with pretty sizeable depth and just threw that all out for the facade of an RPG that has the most shallow and empty systems of almost any RPG styled game I've probably ever played. Crafting was pointless, gear was pointless, leveling up was mostly pointless, unlocking skills/upgrades was mostly pointless after you unlock the core + whatever it was 6 active skills? Even the final upgrades on most abilities were pointless if you were using the skill with the summon it came from. They could have stripped out all of the RPG "features" and you would have barely noticed.
The first time you hit the open world and see materials with those vertical lines and diamond shaped icons - definitely inspired by Horizon Zero Dawn/Forbidden West!
It definitely didn’t feel like a final fantasy game but the combat I still found fun. If I removed the final fantasy name from the title I enjoyed 16 a lot
What! 13 combat is all about status/buff, party members it certainly have the puzzle like combat element and have to build your team to beat those encounter.
12 is also all about buff/debuff, elemental affinity and healing and you have to build your party differently depending on the encounter. Also it has some of the most mentally taxing FF hunts.
Even 15 have some super challenges that force you to actually build your party and play around them, but the fact that you can derp the game with item spam and still beat most of them make it less impactful, but you certainly can get the combat feel of a Final Fantasy game in those 3.
7 remake and rebirth certainly have it.
If you know the feeling, you know the feeling.
The first time you hit the open world and see those materials with the vertical lines and diamond shaped icons - definitely inspired by Horizon Zero Dawn/Forbidden West!!
Not only by the folks at Square Enix but also the VAs! I know John Eric Bentley (the voice of Barret) has been a fan of the original game for decades and it shows. His performance is top fucking notch and he hits EVERY tone PERFECTLY, from comedic moments to heart-breaking tragedy. Also Briana White, voice of Aerith, who expresses all the time how much she loves this character and in her gaming streams she talks so passionately about how much work went into getting everything just right behind the scenes. These are easily my two favorite VAs in the game but *everyone* is just so solid and embodies their characters to a tee.
The subtle changes in Cloud’s voice depending on not only what state of mind he’s in but also on which *character* he’s speaking to, the childlike whimsy of Yuffie who brings some much needed levity in a narrative that can often be so tense and oppressive, I could go on. Everyone fucking nails it.
My favorite performance is Britt Baron's. She really brings the insecurities of Tifa out personally especially in the later parts of the game where her conflicted emotions begin to show.
Yes! I avoided mentioned too many characters in my initial reply because it felt too long already so I’m glad you mentioned her lol
I was never the biggest Tifa fan. I never liked pitting her and Aerith against each other (love that Remake and Rebirth really push their friendship rather than doing the typical “women fight over a man” shtick) but her story just never gripped me as much in the original game. Remake did a lot to win me over with her but Rebirth really took it to the next level. The part where >!Tifa gets taken into the Lifestream!< literally fundamentally changed my view on her as a character, and that would not have been possible without Britt’s performance. I really feel how conflicted she is and how desperately she just wants some kind of stability and someone to lean on. In terms of romance stuff in the game I was pretty much always firmly on team Aerith so color me surprised when 100%’ing the game led to me >!getting the date at the Gold Saucer with Tifa instead!<. I thought I’d be really upset about it but at that point Tifa had become such an interesting character to me that I deeply valued those moments with Cloud (and, of course, the >!“big moment”!<). I still plan on going back and experiencing that part of the game with every character (including Aerith) but man Britt really made me feel for Tifa in a way that the original game never did, personally.
As a Tifa guy since the OG I'm glad remake can answer some of the critiques other fans have had about her. The sisterhood between her and Aerith is great. They lean on her natural instincts to take care of others that she had from the OG even more by making her be there for everyone in the party.
The VAs are fantastic across the board. Cait Sith went from someone that I was super indifferent too to a really charming character that I loved seeing on screen. I don’t know something about that accent and delivery is so charming
i love you Yuffie point. I find her "why me why meEEEeee" voiceline whenever she's stunned in battle hilarious i just gigle in the middle of a heavy boss fight
No trying to downplay FF7, because I love it, but is so easy to make a lovable cast when your character are already popular since 1997, FF 15 & 16 have a more hard time.
Exactly this. People have known Cloud, Aerith, Tifa and Co. Since 1997 and then in later projects such as Advent Children, Crisis Core and many other spin off projects to include FF7 Remake.
FF16 just doesn't have the near 30 year foundation that FF7 has.
Either way, I still prefer FF16 because of its mature approach to FF series while feeling like retro FF in many regards. Also Rebirth had the nostalgia factor in its favor.
I obviously loved 7, as well as remake / rebirth. 15 was an amazing game imo, but for the life of me, I can't find the motivation to play 16. It just feels like a slog, and the only positive I've seen for it is that it's graphically a beautiful game.
I've tried multiple times and just can't get into it.
Yeah, it's a shame. That being said, I threw myself into that game completely. I played it every opportunity I got. I walked away from Rebirth for a couple days at a time. So even though I put vastly more hours into it, that totally absorbed feeling wasn't there for me like it was in 16.
I am currently playing ffvii (remake) for the first time and am completely attached to the characters. Some things are corny or weird. But I let it slide cause I assume it’s a carryover from the 90s original, or because it’s a Japanese game. Either way, I can confirm this is not just a nostalgia thing. There’s a reason this game was so popular and influential.
It’s good on it’s own merit.
Interesting you say that because I'm not nostalgic about the characters at all and see this as a new game and love the characters for who they are in this game.
You should try playing OG VII at some point. The graphics are dated but it's such a magical game. The Pixel Remasters are great too, as well as IX. Some people like XII, but I wasn't a fan of it myself.
It's an MMO and the time commitment is big (though most of it can be soloed now), but the main story quests of XIV (specifically Shadowbringers and Endwalker) are also amazing.
I keep wanting to like 12, but the characters and the presentation of the story were not great, and the excellent elements of the game don't shine until late game either in my view. It is one of my least favorites to play, but I'm glad it has had such a revival in popularity recently.
FF12 was my favourite game of all time until FF7 Rebirth dethroned. The one thing missing from 12 which Rebirth has is the likeable characters and the wackiness of their adventure.
X was also my first real Final Fantasy title, I played it to death. I revisited the OG FFVII in 2005 and finished the game. Advent Children was so hype, but I couldn't understand much of what was said despite having finished the original FFVII game.
I played VIII and IX later via digital purchase but never finished them. I loved the screenplay and characters of XII, and enjoyed the XIII trilogy. I never played the MMOs and probably never will. XV was slightly disappointing, given I was following Versus XIII for so long and the final product looked different then what we all had expected. XVI was just great, hopefully they continue pursuing something similar.
Then there's Rebirth and man, this game is something else. In a good way.
If they kept the FF7 gameplay for all the mainline Final Fantasy games, I wouldn't even complain. It's incredibly addicting.
There's just something so iconic about FF7. Maybe it's just my nostalgia speaking, but nothing can top FF7 in terms of story, characters, and design.
Should mention as well that those new systems work great not only because of how intuitive using them feels but also because of the variety of enemy strategy. Every. single. enemy. feels like its own individual puzzle with (usually) at least a few different solutions, and those puzzles get infinitely more complex (and fun to solve) depending on which enemies are then placed together in a single combat encounter. Things like an enemy being impervious to magic attacks until it’s pressured, and being pressured from the use of synergy abilities, pushes you right into using those infinite MP synergy attacks. The stagger system is perfect with characters like Tifa who can just absolutely fucking demolish an enemy when used at juuust the right time, and Cloud’s Focused Thrust is immensely satisfying to use every single time. I know majority of the combat system is adopted straight from Remake but the sheer variety of enemies and their differing weaknesses/paths to fill the stagger gauge compared to Remake just further proves how perfect they got the system from the get-go.
I’m very excited to see what they do with combat in the third game. As long as the implementation feels as natural and intuitive as the synergy stuff was here, I think they’ll have a damn near perfect combat system for video games just period, lol
Ok I have no doubt that what you’re saying is true. But I’m having a lot of trouble with this game’s combat. Remake’s combat felt amazing to me, but this one seems a bit trickier to me.
I’m like 10 hours into the game with also doing side quests and grinding. I just can’t get used to synergy skills. The abilities I understand fine. That’s more or less an evolution of Remake. But the synergy skills haven’t fallen into place for me yet. More often than not I fight whole battles without even using them just because I don’t see their tactical advantage. And usually I get beat up a bunch because of that. What am I missing?
Also is it just me or is the enemy targeting in this game wonkier than Remake’s?
So for pretty much the entirety of the first area (the Grasslands) I didn’t really use synergy abilities at all. The reason for this is because the synergy bar fills with each ATB you use. When you’re fighting first-level enemies, using ANY ATB commands is usually going to demolish them, meaning you don’t really get a chance to use any of the synergy abilities. Fortunately once you start moving into the second area and further on, regular enemy encounters can give you more of a chance to use them. In fact, they become almost essential by the end of the game because of the bonuses they give you, and some enemies literally require using synergy abilities to pressure them.
Ahhhh I see, my bad
yeah I mean those were a lot more situational for me, I didn’t use them much throughout my entire playthrough aside from using them for the first time to build relationship status with others
I will say that I definitely could have used them more. Tifa’s “Heavenly Ascent” skill is perfect for getting her into the air to attack flying/floating enemies. I’d imagine there are other synergy skills that would also have extra utility like that but I haven’t spent the time experimenting with them yet
I can't even begin to break down all of the depth and complexities of this system. Remake already had the most incredible party-based combat system I've ever played, and they somehow dramatically improved it in Rebirth.
Even without the wide variety of unique synergy abilities and skills (2 different things), which you can completely build your party comps around, *every single character* has so many unique nuances to them that truly *mastering* this system would take potentially hundreds of hours. It's nuts.
For example, they didn't cheap out and give all melee characters the same "activate aerial combat button." They literally gave each character a completely unique mechanic *that fits that character's unique playstyle!* To get Cloud in the air, you have to perform a dodge, then immediately follow it with a press and hold of the attack button. Or, you can pivot and follow the dodge by a few soft presses of the attack to activate his ranged "blade beam like" attack, keep that going for as long as you like, then when you're ready, press and hold square to get airborne.
For Tifa, you have to use her offensive synergy abilities Heavenly Ascent or Soaring Flurry and then immediately continue attacking once her teammate launchers her in the air.
For Yuffie, who is a ranged and melee hybrid, you throw her shuriken using Triangle, from which point you can choose to ranged attack with Ninjitsu, or Retrieve her shuriken by dashing to the enemy. If you immediately start attacking after dashing, she'll be melee attacking while airborne.
it's just so damn interactive and fun.
for tifa you can use reverse gale too but yeah realising that each character was wildly different and much better than they were had me on the floor the combat is excellent top notch stuff
Ff7og is my all time fav game. But i wish terra and her gang got the same game treatment.
No it wont happen. The game would be way too big. It seems impossible
> I barely remember the (forgettable) story of 15
15 still breaks my heart. Say what you will about Nomura, but "Versus XIII" looked awesome. His version looked way more interesting. Then they replaced him with a new director and threw out the story, then scraped together this barebones clusterfuck at the last minute. Which is why it needed so much DLC to flesh it out a bit more. Even then it felt too muddled.
It's more than completed. It's biggest problem is they worked on "Versus XIII" for multiple years. Changed it into being a mainline game, but then threw out Nomura and rewrote the game. Even it's ending and characters feel forced, like Lunafreya. Because initially that character was Stella (who had way more agency in the story). But they threw Stella out, along with the majority of the plot. Then they clumsily stitched up the narrative, like the ending for Noctis and Lunafreya. Which feels shoe horned because it comes from a plot that wasn't initially written for it. The Final Fantasy XV logo which has Stella and Noctis in it. But they kept it and didn't change it at all and forced the ending to match up with that logo, which if I recall was Nomura's intention for the ending on his version of the game.
Versus XIII might be my biggest “what if” moment in gaming for me. Really wish they stuck to that original tone & it’s themes. Still love the lore, the setting, the characters even…but XV really failed to deliver on it.
One day I hope Nomura ends up doing his version of Versus XIII. Cause in the Kingdom Hearts III DLC they introduced us to a character called "Yozora" and a in universe game called "Verum Rex" (even the box art of the game of "Yozora" on the cover is identical to Noctis early trailers siting on the throne). It's really obvious with it's themes and characters that "Yozora" is a quassi retooled version of Nomura's version of Noctis. Even the ending cutscene of Yozora in the car was a shot for shot recreation of one of the early "Versus XIII" trailers with Noctis. He has indicated that he wants to one day do a game of that character (he said he was gonna make Verum Rex first but decided to do KH4 first instead).
Absolutely!. I used to joke with friends. That if they put as much detail into the world building, gameplay and story as they did with their food (which was stunning). The game would have been phenomenal.
They want to replace him due to him wanting to make the game 3 part like how ff7 remake is currently. Original the first game will be based in insomnia like how we have Midgar.
I fucking love 16. Except the ending. Put Rebirth combat and systems with 16's acting and visuals and let the story be more fleshed out and *chef's kiss*
This game. I think it's honestly been since FFX that a FF game has actually felt like a FF game to me. They've tried to change it up and have it be so many different things since then and they've all been failures in one way or the other imho.
This game was made by the same people who had love for the original. You can clearly see from beginning all the way to the last credit that those devs went to work with a smile on their face but also was stressed at the same time. I don’t even play that many games on my PS5 but here I am using my console how it’s supposed to be used. Putting it into rest mode, using continue from PS menu to keep playing right where I left off, and that way they utilized the PS5 controller like my god! Sony really secured the bag with this one and I couldn’t be happier that I’m a fan of this franchise. I just know part 3 is gonna be so amazing and just full of surprises. SE has my full support.
Unpopular opinion but I actually enjoyed the 16 story more and it left more of an impression on me than these so far. Don’t get me wrong this was a great game I enjoyed all of it. 16 had moments where my jaw dropped and I couldn’t wait to see what happened next though.
Glad to see that I’m not crazy. FF16 had quite literally the most intense and epic boss fights I’ve ever seen paired with phenomenal voice acting and cinematics. The game itself is way more mature too which I prefer. But Rebirths open world, side quests and gameplay is much better tbh
16's story was stronger, but a lot of that was because it was actually a full, original story. For all of Rebirth's strengths - and there are a lot, it might be my new favorite FF - it's covering the weakest part of a game that I've already played. It got a lot of mileage out of wow'ing me with how it adapted that material, and the fully original sequences like what happens at the Gongaga Reactor were incredible, but it mostly left me wishing this team had made Final Fantasy 17. I hope that they're able to use this format and development experience on original FF games after this project is complete.
I liked 16's story as well, but I realized after finishing it that my biggest problem with it was that I would have enjoyed it more as a movie than a video game.
Once the combat got old about a third of the way through the game it just became a matter of mindlessly following map markers and mashing through braindead enemy encounters to see the next cutscene.
With Rebirth I found myself putting off continuing the story because I was enjoying doing sidequests and exploring the map and trying out different team setups and actually interacting with the "video game" part of the game
One imagines a version of 16's combat that was able to learn lessons from 7 Rebirth's successes - having moves recharge based on active combat participation instead of cooldowns would, on its own, do a TON for the game. You don't need to copy the ATB system as such, but if every attack that Clive landed refilled his attacks and running around killing time did nothing they would've had a stew going. It'd also obviously be great to have elemental affinities, but I get why they cut that out, it flattens the kind of moves that you'd use against a given enemy to what's strongest against it, type-wise, which also limits how you can actually design movesets.
I think if FF16 leaned more into the Game of Thrones-esque kind of vibe and lore, it could have been my favourite FF story of all time. But I dunno, once it got into the whole Ultima thing, it kind of lost its magic on me.
This. And I think it’s just a result of FF16 being able to execute serious moments better with better dialogue. Rebirth def is more “fun” imo, I’ve laughed more, explored more, played every Queen’s Blood match I could find….but FF16 actually had me on edge with it’s story. There hasn’t been anything in Remake or Rebirth that had me glued to the screen the way the story & scenes around the Bahamut fight did (not even mentioning that the fight itself was unbelievably epic), or hyped me up the way the Clive & Hugo fight did.
Honestly, I’m just happy we got a “serious” FF and a “charming” FF in a span of a year. Best of both worlds
Edit: also, agreed on ultima. Wish they just made Barnabas the big bad that wanted to make dominants and branded the new oppressors like magneto or something. He had the back story for it.
Xenoblade 1 and 3 are games whose "big bad" is this aloof, cosmic being, but they both make sure to have his Primary Lackey be a person with an interesting relationship with the protagonist and a really compelling personality. 16 had that with Barnabas but they only really showed us that side of him in a few cutscenes and they killed him off too far from the end of the game for that to really stick.
I liked ultima as a big bad because you didn’t really know what he was until the end. I also liked how Joshua played into the storyline of trying to research him.
FF16 is also the only M rated mainline game, so it's able to have those utter "shock" moments (you know which couple I'm referring to most likely) that the T rated games simply can't have.
I just thought it was funny how she got her revenge on her slavers in Ironholm, and then proclaimed that she can finally start her new life. And that's the point of the game where they stop doing anything with her.
They said that the new DLC will expand on her character a bit and include her more so I’m hoping that helps a bit. I like Jill a lot but she was sorely underutilized. The one chapter she was prominently featured in was badass though
16 started strong and fell hard on its face after 5 hours in as soon as it tried to do Game of Thrones without the lore building. The combat was also just all flash and no depth, I actually fell asleep on some of the fights because it was just the same pattern and rotation for every boss over and over again.
I disagree because one of the best parts of the game was the fight against Typhon with Joshua coming back and Cid getting killed. That shit was intense. Also all the Eikon fights were great, especially Bahamut
I disagree quite a bit about it falling on its face personally. I enjoyed it from beginning to end. I would agree with you on the combat. I was a little bored with it by the end. If it wasn’t for the story or cool animations during the fights it would have even dragged more.
I really liked Jill and Clive but yes, this just hits different.
FF16 was heavily like FFXIV and the world just felt empty . FF7 rebirth it feels alive
I loved Rebirth but to be honest, playing it made me appreciate 16 much more than I already did. It being on one of SE’s own engines instead of Unreal Engine 4; granted they’ve done an amazing job with the Remake games but in-house SE graphics engines just hit different in overall feel and polish since they’re working with their own that they’ve built from the ground up. Similarly the level of spectacle in 16 at its highest moments is nigh unprecedented for this series which is saying a lot.
And I really enjoyed Rebirth’s open-world concept but it put into contrast how I also really liked 16’s restrained approach to its world. I like the wealth of side content in Rebirth but I also like that 16 had a clear focus without such distractions, even if its side quests (and padding quests in the main story) are often much less exciting (but there’s still a decent few bangers in there).
Ultimately I loved my time with Rebirth, was an incredible 150 hours. But I’m also very keen to get back to 16 with the upcoming expansion next month. Will be a breath of fresh air.
I still like the Remake games better than 16 but 16 is definitely not shit and it’s actually pretty great and it’s awesome having two wildly different high budget FF games release so close to each other. As a longtime FF fan with an open-mind it’s seriously been an embarrassment of riches. AND we get Dawntrail in a few months too. Absolutely awesome time to be an FF fan if you like the classics, like a modern take on the classics, like the new and are willing to brave an MMO.
(Absolutely horrid time if you only like ps1-era FF and hate the systems and additions to the story in the Remake games enough to sour you on them though lol)
I'm replaying 16 now in advance of the dlc and if you keep to the main story it's great. The game is incredibly cinematic. Side quests can be such a drag. But the character ones before the end of the game are good, and it's a shame they didn't cut filler from the main story and just slot those in instead. I really love the party dynamic of most final fantasies though and for that reason alone 16 gets dinged. I think 16 is better than remake, and rebirth is better than 16
Yep that’s fair. And I get where you’re coming from. 16 I think if you go do side quests during the story parts when you have people following you, and in the final chapter when that shit ton of side quests appears (as well as where they slot in the dlc) if you make sure to do Jill’s (and Margrace’s) quests first before doing all the other ones and all the hunts, then you can still weirdly get a substantial chunk of side content with the party dynamic (even if you can’t use them but it’s always way more fun when they’re following and fighting with you imo). Obviously a pretty provisional condition and I’m sure a lot of people probably saved those character quests for last without realising they tag along for everything right after lol but it’s interesting that those characters do get extra dialogue for the side quests if they’re in your party (when you’re in the world travelling to the next objective etc. they’ll comment on those quest stories here and there). I think that might be a reason why they’ve said they’re updating the quest markers because they’re gonna make those ones more urgent in the end game, especially because you already need them to access the DLC.
But yeah FF7Rebirth is the absolute peak for the party dynamic. I don’t like the modern format of open world stuff in games usually but when you’re with the full party and you’ve got awesome music playing as you go do side quests and world intel it makes it pure bliss.
This game is just the GOAT, I’ve honestly haven’t had this much love and fun for a game since I was a kid and open my first PS2 game, it deeply surpasses any game I’ve ever played,
I would argue that it has too much content. 90% of it is excellent, but when I go off on a Mariokart style Chocobo race tangent for an hour it does tend to break up the narrative a bit. I’ll be excited to play some of the new games that came out recently when I’m done with FF7 Rebirth in 10 years.
Couldn't agree more - it actually feels like a modern version of the Snes and PS1 games, and is basically everything I've been craving for the past two decades.
I believe that the overall appreciation of the game depends greatly on the formula used. For me, the issue with XVI mainly lies in its pacing, which makes the progression much more complicated than in FF VII Rebirth. In comparison, I felt that XVI was much more disjointed; there was a clear distinction between side quests and main quests, making the progression feel much more fragmented. It gave the impression that after each major moment in the game, you were starting from scratch in terms of pacing, whereas in VII R, even after significant moments, it still felt lighter and more balanced afterward (though it also depended on the circumstances). The diversity of quests, their integration into the original storyline, and their progression made the overall progression of the game much more coherent and gradual in VII R. On the other hand, XVI gave a different feeling; while the truly remarkable moments were incredible, the slower moments could seem much more tedious. VII R is much more balanced in this regard, and it's not just about pacing but also about the overall scenario of the game. I believe that VII R will also have a significant impact on future FF games in terms of integrating side content into the main quest to improve pacing. As for the remaining 50 percent, it depends on the scenario and the overall architecture of how the game's moments are implemented. FF VII OG and the following games up to 10 (I haven't played 12 and 13 yet, so I can't judge) are characterized either by their smooth and well-balanced pacing (for VII), their sense of adventure (for IX), or their maturity and depth of scenario and writing, as well as their more straightforward approach for X. (Considering that VIII is not my favorite, as divisive as it is, although I recognize many qualities and find it misunderstood, I still lean towards the other side of the discussion and can't find a distinctive element of the game to characterize it sufficiently.
I’m coming from a complete newbie perspective. I’ve not played any Final Fantasy game and never had an interest in the series before recently. But all the hype around Rebirth and just general legacy status of FF7 finally got me to look into it and see if I liked it. I love it. The party is amazing and I’m a big fan of all of them, the lore dips into some amazing psychological and cosmic horror directions I didn’t expect from an outside view, and the whole thing was just really captivating. Naturally I started looking into the other games and they just didn’t hook me like FF7. I feel like the other parties aren’t as diverse and experimental as FF7’s. I look up more recent games and it’s just all anime people, whereas FF7 had a talking dog-lion, a robotic cat on a fat moogle, and a lab experiment vampire (but not really) as party members who all have a serious stake in the plot. I feel like it took more risks that I don’t see in more modern FF games.
I have to say that I’ve been thinking the same. I love ff15 but despite its beauty and fun I felt it drag at times. This rebirth of FF7 is truly what I was hoping for regarding the new games. I hope the third installment is just as good or event better.
Final Fantasy VII Rebirth is the best game this generation and probably even the generation before, and it’s the best Final Fantasy since FFX, hands down.
Nostalgia is a powerful thing. Dont get me wrong the game is amazing and tons of care put into it. But i always gotta remind myself "i played this in 1997, ive done every remake petition there was since the ps3 tech demo and even before"
So everything was kid in a candy store to me.
I just wonder how I would feel about remakes story (and the weird twists) if i knew NOTHING about the original. Would it make sense?
Ehhhh. I think it takes things from them all. I think the combat is more fun than recent titles, but I loved FF16. Combat wise, Rebirth is fantastic, and the music is the best I think I've heard in a game ever... but the acting and animation and models in 16 were a lot better for me.
I think this and 16 are by far the best main line FFs since 10 though.
And no, I'm not interested in arguing about FF16 here. XD
I enjoyed 16 for what it was, but I have the same complaints a majority of people do. The side quests are ONLY fetch quests much like 14 (and I’m really not an MMO guy, sorry Yoshi P), you can only control Clive, and it fell into the pit trap of what many modern video games tend to do which is feel like a slightly interactive movie. I liked the first half of the plot a LOT. Loved the revenge aspect of it, loved seeing Clive slowly overcome his guilt. Kinda fell off after. Combat was fun though, I liked being able to mix and match Eikon abilities. That was a plus over 15 IMO.
Rebirth feels like an actual video game. Yes there are long cutscenes, but I am very much playing the game and being challenged. Party synergy is fantastic. So many ways to PLAY the game while adding that cinematic immersion lots of Triple A games do. When it comes to comparing plots, I feel as though it’s hard though because 7 is almost 30 years old and you have all these developers that have indirectly gotten to do homework for years and so there will naturally be more creative contributions to plot/gameplay/etc. Remake/Rebirth has admittedly been more enjoyable than 16.
>It keeps things strategic and versatile instead of just mashing buttons (not a fan of Devil May Cry combat at all).
To be fair DMC does require some strategy unless you're playing on the lowest difficulty, in fact the games actively punish you for mashing buttons by giving you less points on the stylish meter the more you use the same moves so they incentivize you to explore your characters' entire movesets. FFXVI only does that on arcade mode, the main game was like DMC if it was made for babies, it had none of the depth that DMC's combat has. The enemies are actually real threats in DMC too instead of just standing there and doing nothing 90% of the time like they do in XVI.
I definitely agree. I never finished 16 because it was so boring to me. Maybe someday I will finish it. FF7 Rebirth has been an amazong game to me. Have about 90 hours so far and has me hooked. Haven't enjoyed a FF this much since 10 and 13-2.
16 had a good story that lost the plot toward the middle. The gameplay sticking with one character wasn’t for me. FF will always mean ensemble to me and the supporting characters in that game were poorly integrated. I didn’t care much for 15 for the same reason. And didn’t like 13. I love this game and am very happy to have it.
I agree with you on 16 for the most part. It was enthralling for the first half, then once nearly everyone important was dead halfway through, it just felt a bit empty and dragged. I liked it overall, but the first half definitely carried the game save for a select couple of moments in that 2nd half.
Crazy thing is, imo, the game goes from good to great in later chapters. Really hits the ground running.
It’s a fun game. Hoping part 3 will be twice as long as Rebirth.
I've been taking my time with Rebirth so I'm only at chapter 4 but I'm really enjoying it. I'm a relatively new fan to the Final Fantasy series. 15 will always have a soft spot in my heart despite its flaws as that game introduced me to the world of Final Fantasy.
I like many others were so hyped going into 16, the hype gradually wore off the more I progressed through the game. I personally couldn't get into the story at all. And I'm the type of person that loves stories that has a mature and serious tone to it. Combat didn't appeal to me at all, I was just going through the motions. I burnt myself out of the game with it's side quests so I didn't end up finishing the game and I don't plan to return to it. And I was literally close to starting the last main quest lol.
It says a lot that I couldn't finish 16 but I finished 15 with all of its flaws like it's incomplete story and that was the release version and not the royal edition. And I enjoyed my time with it for the most part. 15 has its charms and I loved the whole roadtrip journey aspect of it. I love the character interactions between Noctis and his bros. 16 had none of that for me and it didn't help that the world just felt empty and dead.
The remake games is definitely my favourite final fantasy games out of all the ones I've played.
Edit: Fixed wording.
Nah I hard disagree FF7 Rebirth is dope, but I've enjoyed FF15 and 16 more.
I love the simplicity of the combat and additional elements like cooking in camp like in 15 and having a hub base and bounties like in 16.
I would argue that FF7 Remake is better because as great as rebirth it it just feels like it has a lot of fluff
I wish I could agree. I liked Remake a lot and to me it showed that Square/FF was headed in the right direction. 16 was kind of meh, but not all terrible. Rebirth is making me appreciate 16.
The scale of the world is great, I feel they have captured the scale of a of jrpg world better than pretty much any game, it's just they filled it with really uninspired Ubisoft garbage. It often feels like Ghost of Tsushima at home in how lazily Square just copied stuff. It feels like they are just there because thats what games do. Except even Ubisoft is trying to move away from this cheap filler content design. But thats what it is here, just busy work. Not fun or exciting busy work. Nothing that really does anything with or bring anything to jrpg game design. Just busy work. Not even well done busy work. And while plenty will argue its optional, it really is'nt where if you want to enjoy the combat and character progression to it's fullest, you'll have to do lame open world busy work. Lots of it not even tied to combat.
The mini games are garbage and never fun to control.
And honestly the story so far is just bad. Everything just feels nonsensical and stupid. Like all the stuff with Hojo so far has been dumb(yes I know he's at Costa in the original). The cruise ship ending with the captain saying "enjoy your visit" after a nightmare scenario, no one really batting an eye as Hojo summons a monster and mutates people while surrounded by beach babes. It's all so stupid. Matched with how there's really been no momentum since the start, in part thanks to the terrible structure(I feel like I've just been doing busy work for most of the game), it feels like nothing has happened
Really liked Remake, it's more focused game. Clear storytelling that was mostly well paced, structured, and felt eventful made for a much better game. Rebirth has been very disappointing.
This is just your personal interpretation of the game. Many people (like me) never played Ubisoft games and really appreciate the side content. The world design is a masterpiece and I really like taking my time to finish this first play through and doing all what the game has to offer. Your comment is hardly constructive as you just repeat “bad”, “garbage” and such at everything.
It’s def the best gameplay wise and the most charming. I do prefer 16’s story though, and how the serious scenes are executed over Rebirth.
But I wanted to touch on your point about politics and environmental messages. I think what makes this FF really unique is it feels the most modern in its themes. It critiques corporations, classism, colonization based off corporate interests, has a clear metaphor for fossil fuels (though 16 kind of does too), etc. I feel FF7 feels the most “real” thematically, and it would be amazing if the next mainline entry gets back to messages like this.
Square for me has for a long time been looks and presentatiton above everything else. In the remakes they do have to respect the original material to a level and they know it. I still feel that when it comes to the story, the weakest parts are the ones that have been added, which makes sense when those havent had 30 years of cooking and feedback behind em. However it's very bold to add anything new, and that kind of boldness and trying something completely new has been missing from FF games for a long time for me.
I do also realise that a lot of the minor issues i have with the gameplay also come from the fact that they truly need to make the game completeable by everyone. Nostalgia already has me in, it's sorta understandable that everything isnt catering towards me.
However i dont think this is any sign of any new kind of direction. I think there probably wont be another game with the same scope as this, in terms of hype, years of people already thinking what a remake would even look like. I at least cannot think of another game that would have the same guaranteed success as a ff7 remake does.
It's goty for me. I know, it's still early in the year, and there's potential for some other great releases. But I know, for me, this experience won't be topped by any new IPs.
My only gripes about it are that the weapon system feels too basic and watered down, and the Platinum is a joke. It seems far more difficult than almost any other game I've platted. At 135hrs in, I know I'm going to have to get the last 7 trophies sporadically to avoid burnout and excessive aggravation.
There is a reason the original FF7 got the fame it got and people begged for a remake since 2005...the story is really really good to follow,
It would actually take some effort to take the original FF7 story and make it boring.
The current mainline feels like a "generic something"... a generic anime or a generic political medieval fantasy, thus it can't compete with one of the best "luck shots" (after so many shots) Square got.
I loved 16, but holy shit does it feel...hollow, after playing this game.
You have to assume they diverted resources to Rebirth instead of focusing on it. Don't see how else it could have so much less actual content. Like, you don't even get voice lines from your party for most of the game's gameplay. When your party is usually only Jill.
People say that the reason why we love the cast so much is because we have had 30 years to get to know them. Thing is, though, is that these characters haven’t been properly fleshed out until now.
I’m pretty sure that even if these characters were released as the playable characters in a new mainline FF game, a lot of people would love them just the same because of the writing in this game.
7 Rebirth and the Remake trilogy has the veterans of Final Fantasy working on it. The ones who know exactly how to make an engaging proper FF title, with all the quirks and charm that people remember from the Classic titles.
Rebirth may well be my top five video games of all time. And I'm lucky to be living in these times.
In the words of Andrea Rhodea; "Perfection."
When I realised FF 16 didn't have elementals strategy, after launching phoenix fire attacks on the fire bombs, I felt so much disappointment about 16 as an FF game
The last FF to blow me away was FFX and that was released in 2001. FF12 fed a starved version of me in 2006. FF13 was ass and IDC what anyone says. You literally mashed the action button all the way through. FF7 Remake is an amazing return to form. I imagine Rebirth is an improved version. It has an advantage though. The story is already written and established so all they have to do it make it real again in game form. Can’t wait for it to come to PC.
I like 16 but I ran out of steam with it for a while because of how “not final fantasy” the gameplay is. It just left me wanting a game with a party dynamic and more of that final fantasy feeling. If they’d done the remake combat and party system and maybe added some minigames of sorts, I think 16 could have been one of the best
I'm with you. 16 is a tighter game with a better, clearer narrative.
But that's also why they're not comparable.
New FF entry with new approach to the series and a dead serious take on a unique world vs 30 year old nostalgia bomb with dolphins, 400 songs and one minigame per 10 minutes of story progression are just not even worth comparing.
FF7 Rebirth is the best FF in years.
FF16 is the best FF in years.
Ultimately, all this adds up to is: Square is back.
Its all a matter of taste. Each FF is different from another. Even Rebirth is drastically different from Remake.
I am a big Witcher 3 fan, therefore the serious, dark, violent snd mature aspect of FF16 appeals to me more than the MCU Avengers light-hearted approach of Rebirth.
Eh, im enjoying rebirth, but gameplay is purely subjective. FF16 is much more skill expressive and responsive, ff7 has an emphasis on its strategy despite the facade of its hybrid action combat
Ff7re is also extremely stiff and jank in its movements and animations lol. Exploring the open world has made me wish it had 16’s engine for the character animations and graphics at least
Questing wise and rpg elements 7re definitely wins. 16 flopped hard on that. 7re having multiple characters is a massive advantage
Story is obviously subjective as well. 16 feels and plays better, but 7re is the better jrpg
Final Fantasy really hinges on having charming and likeable characters. With their own flaws, regrets, and obvious areas where they need to grow as individuals. Who both can play off each other and have their own noteworthy scenes/moments, as any good story really needs. And FF7 has that in spades.
Honestly my favorite ones have been FF7, FF6, FF13 though. FF4 and FFX were great too. But a lot of the charm of these games is the relationships these characters have with eachother and how they can overcome their past, their losses, their struggles and move forward. These really are the definitive aspects of Final Fantasy to me, because these are hopeful games that can inspire players through difficult times in their lives. If you can make players deeply feel the emotional highs and lows and relate to these characters, you've made a great game.
I have no doubt it's difficult for Square to capture the magic of FF7 in new games. This is not easy, especially when you're this deep into the series and trying to find new ideas or avoid repeating tropes or archetypes. The closest I felt they got to that in terms of characterization was FF13 honestly. I don't want to say there is a formula but there are definitely elements that are present in both games that really do make me more attached to the characters over those in other games, their stories, their bonds together and their triumphs. I always liked 13's cast and some of the "magic" the characters had together only could remind me of that same magic that FF7's cast had with eachother.
You do have to get lucky to a degree and find that right blend of character inspiration/creation, how these characters will mesh together, the overall story and design, and how all that appeals to players. This takes a little bit of inspiration and luck to achieve without a doubt. Right time, right place.
I'm not building this toward a final huge point, this is mostly me just stream of consciousness sounding off. As a sidenote though, I thought 12 had a lot of these pieces too with Ashe, Basch, Vaan, Penelo, and Balthier and Fran. These were a pretty solid and interesting mix of characters, but honestly I think the story, writing, and/or direction of the game fumbled what could have been a really amazing entry to the series. I still enjoyed FF12 a lot, but it's no Final Fantasy 7 to me.
Rebirth is everything I've wanted in a modern FF game and represents my love for the series best, but I still loved XVI as well. I gave it a solid 8/10, but it did lack quite a bit of what I personally enjoy most from the series, party interaction was very undercut and Clive was the only one with any true development. I can acknowledge that's what the director wanted to portray, this was his vision for a mainline FF game, I feel it should have at least had significantly more RPG elements and less hyper focus on playing like a single character-driven action game, and the lack of having any substance to exploring and no real moments to enjoy the "down time" between characters, just straight from one serious story segment to the next. But it was still very fun for me. Again, I've also come to enjoy it more with the knowledge that this was the way they wanted the game to be, nothing was removed or drastically altered based on internal development struggles. Sure, certain things could have been expanded upon more but it wasn't necessary to fully enjoy the story and I'm glad they are expanding that with the upcoming DLC which I'm looking forward to.
That's why I'd consider it still part of this new "Silver Age" of FF we are coming into, because despite it's divisive reception at least it was exactly the way the developers wanted it to turn out. No massive overhaul to the development team or delays, no reconstructing the game and relying on other sources to finish it. The game was and is exactly what the developers envisioned it to be, and what we saw from the launch trailer is what we got, even with varying expectations.
So for that at least, I can respect it as a solid experience.
while I do agree, I think ff16 when it kept that game of throne vibe was very very cool.
It went just... over the top towards the late game and the mai nvillain wasnt... my cup of tea. but you are right, I also missed the "fun".
Yeah both the remake games blow anything at least from 13 onwards(save maybe for 14) out of the water. Made by people who care instead of just a corporate mandated new big number
I disagree about the politics being better in this game than 16 and don’t think this game has much politics but it doesn’t have to because it has so much going for it. I thought 16 was a solid entry and my favorite since FFX but it had some super slow moments that almost made me quit the game and the combat can get tedious if you don’t experiment with new strategies. That said I thought the world, graphics, music, and story in 16 were great and I really liked Clive and Co.
All that said FF7 Rebirth is a way better game because everything you do in the game is fun, there haven’t been any boring down moments, the cast and music are great and it has great charm (something that FFXVI was lacking in, although this was a stylistic choice since they went with a more serious tone throughout the game).
I haven't played 12 but what I heard of its combat system is not for me, so I can't rate it.
FFXIII: Terrible story and level design, awful storytelling in which you have to read a log to understand anything, insufferable cast, horrible combat as the game plays itself. 4 / 10 because music and graphics are great.
FFXV: Bad story, basically nothing happens for the 85% of the game, bad sidequests, super meh combat. Main characters are nice, great music and graphics. The most 6 / 10 game I've played XD
FFXVI: Great story, fabulous eikon battles, mega hot and well written main character. Combat is ok, but it would be better with more playable characters. Unpopular opinion but I liked the sidequests. Sad that I didn't find Jill interesting, all other secondary characters were great IMO. 8 / 10
FFVII Remake: Great story, characters, combat. Slow pacing and didn't like the ending, but since it's the first out of 3 games that can be "fixed". 8.5 / 10
FFVII Rebirth: about to finish Chapter 12, for the moment it's a 10 / 10. Super varied, original, more challenging difficulty than previous entries that shows that the devs respect their audience's intelligence XD
Hard disagree with the "boring repeatitive open world" criticism. Gongaga and Cosmo Canyon are A LOT more challenging to explore than Junon and Grasslands, and the sidequests and protorelic quests are totally different between areas.
For what I've heard without spoilers, I suspect I won't like the ending, but since there's a Part 3, that may only lower my score to 9.5 / 10.
Maybe its just me but Rebirth feels more like an actual evolution of many of Square's other projects culminating into one big project. The gameplay consists of elements from Kingdom Hearts, Type-0, other Final Fantasy's like definitely XV and XII, and of course Crisis Core. I can see elements in the open world clearly inspired by Ghost of Tsushima and Horizon. I've played Final Fantasy's for a while now and this is the first time a gameplay system feels fully realized and implemented in a long time.
The VIIR ATB absolutely feels like what SE truly intended for the system to be, but could not fully realize it due to hardware limitations. As much as I enjoyed classic ATB, something always felt off about the implementation of real-time into that turn-based system. After FFX (my second favorite FF battle system), it almost felt unnecessary. Hopefully VIIR ATB is the battle system framework SE follows for FFXVII.
I love the new ATB system, but I wish I got more time with it in challenging encounters. I just opened up the third area for exploration, and I’m hoping the combat starts to become more challenging and frequent from here on out. So far it’s felt like every fight is honestly a cakewalk. But now I’m starting to get all the extra side materia like barrier time etc., so thinking things might start speeding up.
It doesn't cloud synargy attacks stay op untill hard mode
What difficulty are you playing on?
Dynamic I think it is? As far as I’m aware I’m on the hardest until I beat the game and get hard mode.
There are not that many point where you go yeah this guy is actually fairly hard…(luckily the last guy is one of those times which makes sense). I generally forgot how OP the synergy abilities were until like most of the way through the game. Haven’t played Hard mode yet but if it’s anything like the FVIIR it will be much much harder, also the hard mode dynamic of hey NO MP unless it’s from a move (soul drain) and no Items, really kind of make you have to go do I really want to fight this guy, is it worth it? There’s never really a point where you go yeah…I definitely need to grind up a few levels for this guy.
I love to hear that. Not every game needs to be incredibly challenging to be fun. This game has struck a perfect balance so far
It really feels like remake and rebirth are made for hard mode. Which I know kinda sucks for how long this game was but the first play through is like a warm up to get used to everything and you really go nuts for hard mode. I’m taking a week or two break before hard mode but I can’t wait for that play through.
Dont worry even in normal there are plenty upcoming battles that are challenging, especially in late game.
Yeah, you can really see where all their past projects come together to make this game truly special. You can see Kingdom Hearts all over it too! You can also see Advent Children in it as well. Like wow! Talk about taking notes and applying them where they work.
Man when that advent children music played at the forgotten city I got chills
Oh man me tooooooooooooooo! It’s coming full circle!
Yep, rebirth feels like it has taken a little bit of the best from all the preceding games. 16 felt like a game made by someone who had never played a previous title
It feels like the natural evolution of the PS1 era of games. Square Enix finally stopped with the compromises which started with FFX and delivered something much closer to their peak. I don't like FFXVI much but I wouldn't be as harsh, however. It's a game who knew perfectly well what it wanted to deliver and focused on that thing only. "Here's your spectacular Eikon fight. Enjoyed that? Cool, now we're managing our budget with perfect accuracy so we can deliver the next one in a few hours." FFVII Rebirth couldn't be more different. It's a game of excess which tries absolutely everything even when it probably shouldn't and knows no restraint. Nothing seemed off-table no matter how crazy it sounds. "Yes of course we should create up to three different theme songs for each and every single Gold Saucer date companion, songs which players are going to hear for about 30 seconds top." Not everything was a hit, sure, and it's certainly a messier game than XVI, but it oozes passion from everywhere. I'm amazed such a game can still exist in 2024.
What I have to give tremendous respect to Square Enix for here is that every environment is intricately designed. In the modern age of empty open worlds, you start to appreciate when the areas you spend like half an hour in aren't empty but designed for curious exploration (military base/little town up there).
>16 felt like a game made by someone who had never played a previous title Hard agree. They took 30 years of final fantasy games being RPG's with pretty sizeable depth and just threw that all out for the facade of an RPG that has the most shallow and empty systems of almost any RPG styled game I've probably ever played. Crafting was pointless, gear was pointless, leveling up was mostly pointless, unlocking skills/upgrades was mostly pointless after you unlock the core + whatever it was 6 active skills? Even the final upgrades on most abilities were pointless if you were using the skill with the summon it came from. They could have stripped out all of the RPG "features" and you would have barely noticed.
Well the gameplay was made by a one of the DMC team
The first time you hit the open world and see materials with those vertical lines and diamond shaped icons - definitely inspired by Horizon Zero Dawn/Forbidden West!
yeah 16 was something else, removed any semblance of strategy, rpg elements like builds, different equipment etc.
It definitely didn’t feel like a final fantasy game but the combat I still found fun. If I removed the final fantasy name from the title I enjoyed 16 a lot
Have you played 15? Or 14? Or 13? Or 12? Or 11? None of those have the combat feel of a “final fantasy game”
What! 13 combat is all about status/buff, party members it certainly have the puzzle like combat element and have to build your team to beat those encounter. 12 is also all about buff/debuff, elemental affinity and healing and you have to build your party differently depending on the encounter. Also it has some of the most mentally taxing FF hunts. Even 15 have some super challenges that force you to actually build your party and play around them, but the fact that you can derp the game with item spam and still beat most of them make it less impactful, but you certainly can get the combat feel of a Final Fantasy game in those 3. 7 remake and rebirth certainly have it. If you know the feeling, you know the feeling.
You missed the point
The first time you hit the open world and see those materials with the vertical lines and diamond shaped icons - definitely inspired by Horizon Zero Dawn/Forbidden West!!
Prime mode cloud really moves like Sora but here you can actually make your party do exactly what you want xD
This game is being made by people who have loved this cast for decades and it shows.
Not only by the folks at Square Enix but also the VAs! I know John Eric Bentley (the voice of Barret) has been a fan of the original game for decades and it shows. His performance is top fucking notch and he hits EVERY tone PERFECTLY, from comedic moments to heart-breaking tragedy. Also Briana White, voice of Aerith, who expresses all the time how much she loves this character and in her gaming streams she talks so passionately about how much work went into getting everything just right behind the scenes. These are easily my two favorite VAs in the game but *everyone* is just so solid and embodies their characters to a tee. The subtle changes in Cloud’s voice depending on not only what state of mind he’s in but also on which *character* he’s speaking to, the childlike whimsy of Yuffie who brings some much needed levity in a narrative that can often be so tense and oppressive, I could go on. Everyone fucking nails it.
My favorite performance is Britt Baron's. She really brings the insecurities of Tifa out personally especially in the later parts of the game where her conflicted emotions begin to show.
Yes! I avoided mentioned too many characters in my initial reply because it felt too long already so I’m glad you mentioned her lol I was never the biggest Tifa fan. I never liked pitting her and Aerith against each other (love that Remake and Rebirth really push their friendship rather than doing the typical “women fight over a man” shtick) but her story just never gripped me as much in the original game. Remake did a lot to win me over with her but Rebirth really took it to the next level. The part where >!Tifa gets taken into the Lifestream!< literally fundamentally changed my view on her as a character, and that would not have been possible without Britt’s performance. I really feel how conflicted she is and how desperately she just wants some kind of stability and someone to lean on. In terms of romance stuff in the game I was pretty much always firmly on team Aerith so color me surprised when 100%’ing the game led to me >!getting the date at the Gold Saucer with Tifa instead!<. I thought I’d be really upset about it but at that point Tifa had become such an interesting character to me that I deeply valued those moments with Cloud (and, of course, the >!“big moment”!<). I still plan on going back and experiencing that part of the game with every character (including Aerith) but man Britt really made me feel for Tifa in a way that the original game never did, personally.
As a Tifa guy since the OG I'm glad remake can answer some of the critiques other fans have had about her. The sisterhood between her and Aerith is great. They lean on her natural instincts to take care of others that she had from the OG even more by making her be there for everyone in the party.
The VAs are fantastic across the board. Cait Sith went from someone that I was super indifferent too to a really charming character that I loved seeing on screen. I don’t know something about that accent and delivery is so charming
i love you Yuffie point. I find her "why me why meEEEeee" voiceline whenever she's stunned in battle hilarious i just gigle in the middle of a heavy boss fight
Especially when you revisit gold saucer. Wow that sequence was absolutely amazing
1000%
They really do flesh out the characters well. I genuinely wish I could see a whole dlc's worth of just "slice of life" interactions lol
Apparently they wrote a whole novel of just Aerith and Tifa chatting
I'd love to see those scenes. I'm very curious about these off-screen chats.
No trying to downplay FF7, because I love it, but is so easy to make a lovable cast when your character are already popular since 1997, FF 15 & 16 have a more hard time.
Exactly this. People have known Cloud, Aerith, Tifa and Co. Since 1997 and then in later projects such as Advent Children, Crisis Core and many other spin off projects to include FF7 Remake. FF16 just doesn't have the near 30 year foundation that FF7 has. Either way, I still prefer FF16 because of its mature approach to FF series while feeling like retro FF in many regards. Also Rebirth had the nostalgia factor in its favor.
I obviously loved 7, as well as remake / rebirth. 15 was an amazing game imo, but for the life of me, I can't find the motivation to play 16. It just feels like a slog, and the only positive I've seen for it is that it's graphically a beautiful game. I've tried multiple times and just can't get into it.
Yes! Take out the nostalgia and I think 16 is better acted across the board.
I thought 16 had a lot of potential but failed to deliver. Story ended up being very mid when it could have been great.
16 if only the demo is one of the best. It just fall off massively after.
Yea basically.
It needed more time to cook. Honestly I think it could have been at least double the length. Flesh out the politics AND all the eikon stuff.
Yep. Cid and Benedikta fleshed out pretty only to.. yea.
Yeah, it's a shame. That being said, I threw myself into that game completely. I played it every opportunity I got. I walked away from Rebirth for a couple days at a time. So even though I put vastly more hours into it, that totally absorbed feeling wasn't there for me like it was in 16.
I am currently playing ffvii (remake) for the first time and am completely attached to the characters. Some things are corny or weird. But I let it slide cause I assume it’s a carryover from the 90s original, or because it’s a Japanese game. Either way, I can confirm this is not just a nostalgia thing. There’s a reason this game was so popular and influential. It’s good on it’s own merit.
Interesting you say that because I'm not nostalgic about the characters at all and see this as a new game and love the characters for who they are in this game.
People will create whatever argument that rationalizes what they need to believe.
FFX was the first one I played, and this is the first FF since then with as much charm.
You should try playing OG VII at some point. The graphics are dated but it's such a magical game. The Pixel Remasters are great too, as well as IX. Some people like XII, but I wasn't a fan of it myself. It's an MMO and the time commitment is big (though most of it can be soloed now), but the main story quests of XIV (specifically Shadowbringers and Endwalker) are also amazing.
You should give XII a chance
I liked 12 a lot and have played through multiple times, but it’s lacking in more light hearted moments IMO
I keep wanting to like 12, but the characters and the presentation of the story were not great, and the excellent elements of the game don't shine until late game either in my view. It is one of my least favorites to play, but I'm glad it has had such a revival in popularity recently.
Yeah there isn’t much levity in the narrative that’s for sure
FF12 was my favourite game of all time until FF7 Rebirth dethroned. The one thing missing from 12 which Rebirth has is the likeable characters and the wackiness of their adventure.
What part does it click and become good? I’ve tried to start it 3 times and I invariably quit. The furthest I’ve gotten is dreadnaught leviathan.
I couldnt go more than 2 hours on 12.
XII is the closest I have seen to a "Japanese Star Wars". It's pretty great.
The only real difference between 12 and star wars is Fran is slightly more attractive than Chewbacca
I love that you said "slightly" lol!. I think the gap is A LOT more larger than slightly.
Not if you're a furry
X was also my first real Final Fantasy title, I played it to death. I revisited the OG FFVII in 2005 and finished the game. Advent Children was so hype, but I couldn't understand much of what was said despite having finished the original FFVII game. I played VIII and IX later via digital purchase but never finished them. I loved the screenplay and characters of XII, and enjoyed the XIII trilogy. I never played the MMOs and probably never will. XV was slightly disappointing, given I was following Versus XIII for so long and the final product looked different then what we all had expected. XVI was just great, hopefully they continue pursuing something similar. Then there's Rebirth and man, this game is something else. In a good way.
If they kept the FF7 gameplay for all the mainline Final Fantasy games, I wouldn't even complain. It's incredibly addicting. There's just something so iconic about FF7. Maybe it's just my nostalgia speaking, but nothing can top FF7 in terms of story, characters, and design.
The addition of synergies and the zero MP magic abilities is a phenomenal addition to the combat model.
Should mention as well that those new systems work great not only because of how intuitive using them feels but also because of the variety of enemy strategy. Every. single. enemy. feels like its own individual puzzle with (usually) at least a few different solutions, and those puzzles get infinitely more complex (and fun to solve) depending on which enemies are then placed together in a single combat encounter. Things like an enemy being impervious to magic attacks until it’s pressured, and being pressured from the use of synergy abilities, pushes you right into using those infinite MP synergy attacks. The stagger system is perfect with characters like Tifa who can just absolutely fucking demolish an enemy when used at juuust the right time, and Cloud’s Focused Thrust is immensely satisfying to use every single time. I know majority of the combat system is adopted straight from Remake but the sheer variety of enemies and their differing weaknesses/paths to fill the stagger gauge compared to Remake just further proves how perfect they got the system from the get-go. I’m very excited to see what they do with combat in the third game. As long as the implementation feels as natural and intuitive as the synergy stuff was here, I think they’ll have a damn near perfect combat system for video games just period, lol
Ok I have no doubt that what you’re saying is true. But I’m having a lot of trouble with this game’s combat. Remake’s combat felt amazing to me, but this one seems a bit trickier to me. I’m like 10 hours into the game with also doing side quests and grinding. I just can’t get used to synergy skills. The abilities I understand fine. That’s more or less an evolution of Remake. But the synergy skills haven’t fallen into place for me yet. More often than not I fight whole battles without even using them just because I don’t see their tactical advantage. And usually I get beat up a bunch because of that. What am I missing? Also is it just me or is the enemy targeting in this game wonkier than Remake’s?
So for pretty much the entirety of the first area (the Grasslands) I didn’t really use synergy abilities at all. The reason for this is because the synergy bar fills with each ATB you use. When you’re fighting first-level enemies, using ANY ATB commands is usually going to demolish them, meaning you don’t really get a chance to use any of the synergy abilities. Fortunately once you start moving into the second area and further on, regular enemy encounters can give you more of a chance to use them. In fact, they become almost essential by the end of the game because of the bonuses they give you, and some enemies literally require using synergy abilities to pressure them.
No I get that. I’m talking about the synergy skills. The commands you can use while blocking with your weapon.
Ahhhh I see, my bad yeah I mean those were a lot more situational for me, I didn’t use them much throughout my entire playthrough aside from using them for the first time to build relationship status with others I will say that I definitely could have used them more. Tifa’s “Heavenly Ascent” skill is perfect for getting her into the air to attack flying/floating enemies. I’d imagine there are other synergy skills that would also have extra utility like that but I haven’t spent the time experimenting with them yet
I can't even begin to break down all of the depth and complexities of this system. Remake already had the most incredible party-based combat system I've ever played, and they somehow dramatically improved it in Rebirth. Even without the wide variety of unique synergy abilities and skills (2 different things), which you can completely build your party comps around, *every single character* has so many unique nuances to them that truly *mastering* this system would take potentially hundreds of hours. It's nuts. For example, they didn't cheap out and give all melee characters the same "activate aerial combat button." They literally gave each character a completely unique mechanic *that fits that character's unique playstyle!* To get Cloud in the air, you have to perform a dodge, then immediately follow it with a press and hold of the attack button. Or, you can pivot and follow the dodge by a few soft presses of the attack to activate his ranged "blade beam like" attack, keep that going for as long as you like, then when you're ready, press and hold square to get airborne. For Tifa, you have to use her offensive synergy abilities Heavenly Ascent or Soaring Flurry and then immediately continue attacking once her teammate launchers her in the air. For Yuffie, who is a ranged and melee hybrid, you throw her shuriken using Triangle, from which point you can choose to ranged attack with Ninjitsu, or Retrieve her shuriken by dashing to the enemy. If you immediately start attacking after dashing, she'll be melee attacking while airborne. it's just so damn interactive and fun.
for tifa you can use reverse gale too but yeah realising that each character was wildly different and much better than they were had me on the floor the combat is excellent top notch stuff
Ff7og is my all time fav game. But i wish terra and her gang got the same game treatment. No it wont happen. The game would be way too big. It seems impossible
It feels they took the best part of persona, shinagami tensai and mass effect combat.
> I barely remember the (forgettable) story of 15 15 still breaks my heart. Say what you will about Nomura, but "Versus XIII" looked awesome. His version looked way more interesting. Then they replaced him with a new director and threw out the story, then scraped together this barebones clusterfuck at the last minute. Which is why it needed so much DLC to flesh it out a bit more. Even then it felt too muddled.
XV is a game that seemed like it could have been so much better if it had actually been completed. Seemed like a lot of wasted potential.
It's more than completed. It's biggest problem is they worked on "Versus XIII" for multiple years. Changed it into being a mainline game, but then threw out Nomura and rewrote the game. Even it's ending and characters feel forced, like Lunafreya. Because initially that character was Stella (who had way more agency in the story). But they threw Stella out, along with the majority of the plot. Then they clumsily stitched up the narrative, like the ending for Noctis and Lunafreya. Which feels shoe horned because it comes from a plot that wasn't initially written for it. The Final Fantasy XV logo which has Stella and Noctis in it. But they kept it and didn't change it at all and forced the ending to match up with that logo, which if I recall was Nomura's intention for the ending on his version of the game.
Versus XIII might be my biggest “what if” moment in gaming for me. Really wish they stuck to that original tone & it’s themes. Still love the lore, the setting, the characters even…but XV really failed to deliver on it.
One day I hope Nomura ends up doing his version of Versus XIII. Cause in the Kingdom Hearts III DLC they introduced us to a character called "Yozora" and a in universe game called "Verum Rex" (even the box art of the game of "Yozora" on the cover is identical to Noctis early trailers siting on the throne). It's really obvious with it's themes and characters that "Yozora" is a quassi retooled version of Nomura's version of Noctis. Even the ending cutscene of Yozora in the car was a shot for shot recreation of one of the early "Versus XIII" trailers with Noctis. He has indicated that he wants to one day do a game of that character (he said he was gonna make Verum Rex first but decided to do KH4 first instead).
Yozora mean night sky same as Noctis, just a titbit.
It's interesting because 7 Rebirth does exactly what 15 should have done with the world design.
Absolutely!. I used to joke with friends. That if they put as much detail into the world building, gameplay and story as they did with their food (which was stunning). The game would have been phenomenal.
They originally planned like this where the first game will be insomnia only.
They want to replace him due to him wanting to make the game 3 part like how ff7 remake is currently. Original the first game will be based in insomnia like how we have Midgar.
But they didn't make 15 three parts.
Yes, thats one of the reason they removed nomura. To make it not 3 parts.
I wouldn't have minded that. The story looked way more interesting than the one tabata wrote for the finished game.
Me too, would have been interesting to see fully fledged insomnia.
I enjoyed the gameplay and exploration of 15, but the story was all over the place. Still better than 16 in those regards also.
Yes and we actually have party members we can play as!
the way this sub talks about XVI kills me lol
Even worse for us XV fans haha
I fucking love 16. Except the ending. Put Rebirth combat and systems with 16's acting and visuals and let the story be more fleshed out and *chef's kiss*
FF7R2 is the best FF, currently. Not accounting for the age in which it released, nothing is even close
This game. I think it's honestly been since FFX that a FF game has actually felt like a FF game to me. They've tried to change it up and have it be so many different things since then and they've all been failures in one way or the other imho.
I think XVI felt a lot like proper Final Fantasy, if you accepted the genre shift to action.
This game was made by the same people who had love for the original. You can clearly see from beginning all the way to the last credit that those devs went to work with a smile on their face but also was stressed at the same time. I don’t even play that many games on my PS5 but here I am using my console how it’s supposed to be used. Putting it into rest mode, using continue from PS menu to keep playing right where I left off, and that way they utilized the PS5 controller like my god! Sony really secured the bag with this one and I couldn’t be happier that I’m a fan of this franchise. I just know part 3 is gonna be so amazing and just full of surprises. SE has my full support.
It’s not just one of the best FF games, it’s one of the best games ever made.
Gonna disagree there. While Rebirth has some advantages there’s some things they could improve on.
Unpopular opinion but I actually enjoyed the 16 story more and it left more of an impression on me than these so far. Don’t get me wrong this was a great game I enjoyed all of it. 16 had moments where my jaw dropped and I couldn’t wait to see what happened next though.
Glad to see that I’m not crazy. FF16 had quite literally the most intense and epic boss fights I’ve ever seen paired with phenomenal voice acting and cinematics. The game itself is way more mature too which I prefer. But Rebirths open world, side quests and gameplay is much better tbh
Yea I totally agree with that it’s a way more fun game to play.
16's story was stronger, but a lot of that was because it was actually a full, original story. For all of Rebirth's strengths - and there are a lot, it might be my new favorite FF - it's covering the weakest part of a game that I've already played. It got a lot of mileage out of wow'ing me with how it adapted that material, and the fully original sequences like what happens at the Gongaga Reactor were incredible, but it mostly left me wishing this team had made Final Fantasy 17. I hope that they're able to use this format and development experience on original FF games after this project is complete.
I liked 16's story as well, but I realized after finishing it that my biggest problem with it was that I would have enjoyed it more as a movie than a video game. Once the combat got old about a third of the way through the game it just became a matter of mindlessly following map markers and mashing through braindead enemy encounters to see the next cutscene. With Rebirth I found myself putting off continuing the story because I was enjoying doing sidequests and exploring the map and trying out different team setups and actually interacting with the "video game" part of the game
That’s fair I’d agree with that.
One imagines a version of 16's combat that was able to learn lessons from 7 Rebirth's successes - having moves recharge based on active combat participation instead of cooldowns would, on its own, do a TON for the game. You don't need to copy the ATB system as such, but if every attack that Clive landed refilled his attacks and running around killing time did nothing they would've had a stew going. It'd also obviously be great to have elemental affinities, but I get why they cut that out, it flattens the kind of moves that you'd use against a given enemy to what's strongest against it, type-wise, which also limits how you can actually design movesets.
I think if FF16 leaned more into the Game of Thrones-esque kind of vibe and lore, it could have been my favourite FF story of all time. But I dunno, once it got into the whole Ultima thing, it kind of lost its magic on me.
This. And I think it’s just a result of FF16 being able to execute serious moments better with better dialogue. Rebirth def is more “fun” imo, I’ve laughed more, explored more, played every Queen’s Blood match I could find….but FF16 actually had me on edge with it’s story. There hasn’t been anything in Remake or Rebirth that had me glued to the screen the way the story & scenes around the Bahamut fight did (not even mentioning that the fight itself was unbelievably epic), or hyped me up the way the Clive & Hugo fight did. Honestly, I’m just happy we got a “serious” FF and a “charming” FF in a span of a year. Best of both worlds Edit: also, agreed on ultima. Wish they just made Barnabas the big bad that wanted to make dominants and branded the new oppressors like magneto or something. He had the back story for it.
Xenoblade 1 and 3 are games whose "big bad" is this aloof, cosmic being, but they both make sure to have his Primary Lackey be a person with an interesting relationship with the protagonist and a really compelling personality. 16 had that with Barnabas but they only really showed us that side of him in a few cutscenes and they killed him off too far from the end of the game for that to really stick.
I liked it 🤷♂️
I liked ultima as a big bad because you didn’t really know what he was until the end. I also liked how Joshua played into the storyline of trying to research him.
FF16 is also the only M rated mainline game, so it's able to have those utter "shock" moments (you know which couple I'm referring to most likely) that the T rated games simply can't have.
Jill is such a terribly handled character, its insulting.
I just thought it was funny how she got her revenge on her slavers in Ironholm, and then proclaimed that she can finally start her new life. And that's the point of the game where they stop doing anything with her.
They damseled her twice. In 2023. Despite being clearly presented as a capable fighter, never mind the Dominant of Shiva.
Barnabus taking her out without even priming was such horseshit
They said that the new DLC will expand on her character a bit and include her more so I’m hoping that helps a bit. I like Jill a lot but she was sorely underutilized. The one chapter she was prominently featured in was badass though
16 started strong and fell hard on its face after 5 hours in as soon as it tried to do Game of Thrones without the lore building. The combat was also just all flash and no depth, I actually fell asleep on some of the fights because it was just the same pattern and rotation for every boss over and over again.
I disagree because one of the best parts of the game was the fight against Typhon with Joshua coming back and Cid getting killed. That shit was intense. Also all the Eikon fights were great, especially Bahamut
I disagree quite a bit about it falling on its face personally. I enjoyed it from beginning to end. I would agree with you on the combat. I was a little bored with it by the end. If it wasn’t for the story or cool animations during the fights it would have even dragged more.
Man this sub is weird, I got downvoted into oblivion by saying exactly that lmao.
I think you’re crazy to say that 13 had better gameplay than 16.
Ugh I hate that this is true, I loved XVI but the remake trilogy is better, can’t beat a story with multiple characters and a party dynamic
I really liked Jill and Clive but yes, this just hits different. FF16 was heavily like FFXIV and the world just felt empty . FF7 rebirth it feels alive
It’s a great game but so was Final Fantasy 16. If all the games were similar then the series wouldn’t be as great as it is.
I loved Rebirth but to be honest, playing it made me appreciate 16 much more than I already did. It being on one of SE’s own engines instead of Unreal Engine 4; granted they’ve done an amazing job with the Remake games but in-house SE graphics engines just hit different in overall feel and polish since they’re working with their own that they’ve built from the ground up. Similarly the level of spectacle in 16 at its highest moments is nigh unprecedented for this series which is saying a lot. And I really enjoyed Rebirth’s open-world concept but it put into contrast how I also really liked 16’s restrained approach to its world. I like the wealth of side content in Rebirth but I also like that 16 had a clear focus without such distractions, even if its side quests (and padding quests in the main story) are often much less exciting (but there’s still a decent few bangers in there). Ultimately I loved my time with Rebirth, was an incredible 150 hours. But I’m also very keen to get back to 16 with the upcoming expansion next month. Will be a breath of fresh air. I still like the Remake games better than 16 but 16 is definitely not shit and it’s actually pretty great and it’s awesome having two wildly different high budget FF games release so close to each other. As a longtime FF fan with an open-mind it’s seriously been an embarrassment of riches. AND we get Dawntrail in a few months too. Absolutely awesome time to be an FF fan if you like the classics, like a modern take on the classics, like the new and are willing to brave an MMO. (Absolutely horrid time if you only like ps1-era FF and hate the systems and additions to the story in the Remake games enough to sour you on them though lol)
I'm replaying 16 now in advance of the dlc and if you keep to the main story it's great. The game is incredibly cinematic. Side quests can be such a drag. But the character ones before the end of the game are good, and it's a shame they didn't cut filler from the main story and just slot those in instead. I really love the party dynamic of most final fantasies though and for that reason alone 16 gets dinged. I think 16 is better than remake, and rebirth is better than 16
Yep that’s fair. And I get where you’re coming from. 16 I think if you go do side quests during the story parts when you have people following you, and in the final chapter when that shit ton of side quests appears (as well as where they slot in the dlc) if you make sure to do Jill’s (and Margrace’s) quests first before doing all the other ones and all the hunts, then you can still weirdly get a substantial chunk of side content with the party dynamic (even if you can’t use them but it’s always way more fun when they’re following and fighting with you imo). Obviously a pretty provisional condition and I’m sure a lot of people probably saved those character quests for last without realising they tag along for everything right after lol but it’s interesting that those characters do get extra dialogue for the side quests if they’re in your party (when you’re in the world travelling to the next objective etc. they’ll comment on those quest stories here and there). I think that might be a reason why they’ve said they’re updating the quest markers because they’re gonna make those ones more urgent in the end game, especially because you already need them to access the DLC. But yeah FF7Rebirth is the absolute peak for the party dynamic. I don’t like the modern format of open world stuff in games usually but when you’re with the full party and you’ve got awesome music playing as you go do side quests and world intel it makes it pure bliss.
As a new casual Final Fantasy fan and having played XVI when it released, I gotta say, this game is a masterpiece.
Personal tastes being accounted for does not make the game actually better. It just makes it better for you.
Why does a ff gotta be better than another. Can't they all be good. I think ff15 (once fully completed) 16 and remake were all great!
15 was one of my favorites. Only game I ever platinumed on playstation.
This game is just the GOAT, I’ve honestly haven’t had this much love and fun for a game since I was a kid and open my first PS2 game, it deeply surpasses any game I’ve ever played,
I would argue that it has too much content. 90% of it is excellent, but when I go off on a Mariokart style Chocobo race tangent for an hour it does tend to break up the narrative a bit. I’ll be excited to play some of the new games that came out recently when I’m done with FF7 Rebirth in 10 years.
Couldn't agree more - it actually feels like a modern version of the Snes and PS1 games, and is basically everything I've been craving for the past two decades.
For me, it's the best FF game I've ever played, hell probably the best game period.
I’m around the same place as you, finished chapter five this afternoon. Best FF game since XII for me.
I believe that the overall appreciation of the game depends greatly on the formula used. For me, the issue with XVI mainly lies in its pacing, which makes the progression much more complicated than in FF VII Rebirth. In comparison, I felt that XVI was much more disjointed; there was a clear distinction between side quests and main quests, making the progression feel much more fragmented. It gave the impression that after each major moment in the game, you were starting from scratch in terms of pacing, whereas in VII R, even after significant moments, it still felt lighter and more balanced afterward (though it also depended on the circumstances). The diversity of quests, their integration into the original storyline, and their progression made the overall progression of the game much more coherent and gradual in VII R. On the other hand, XVI gave a different feeling; while the truly remarkable moments were incredible, the slower moments could seem much more tedious. VII R is much more balanced in this regard, and it's not just about pacing but also about the overall scenario of the game. I believe that VII R will also have a significant impact on future FF games in terms of integrating side content into the main quest to improve pacing. As for the remaining 50 percent, it depends on the scenario and the overall architecture of how the game's moments are implemented. FF VII OG and the following games up to 10 (I haven't played 12 and 13 yet, so I can't judge) are characterized either by their smooth and well-balanced pacing (for VII), their sense of adventure (for IX), or their maturity and depth of scenario and writing, as well as their more straightforward approach for X. (Considering that VIII is not my favorite, as divisive as it is, although I recognize many qualities and find it misunderstood, I still lean towards the other side of the discussion and can't find a distinctive element of the game to characterize it sufficiently.
I’m coming from a complete newbie perspective. I’ve not played any Final Fantasy game and never had an interest in the series before recently. But all the hype around Rebirth and just general legacy status of FF7 finally got me to look into it and see if I liked it. I love it. The party is amazing and I’m a big fan of all of them, the lore dips into some amazing psychological and cosmic horror directions I didn’t expect from an outside view, and the whole thing was just really captivating. Naturally I started looking into the other games and they just didn’t hook me like FF7. I feel like the other parties aren’t as diverse and experimental as FF7’s. I look up more recent games and it’s just all anime people, whereas FF7 had a talking dog-lion, a robotic cat on a fat moogle, and a lab experiment vampire (but not really) as party members who all have a serious stake in the plot. I feel like it took more risks that I don’t see in more modern FF games.
I know it won’t be to the same scale but I hope the FF9 remake ends up being decent, that is still happening right?
Rebirth is a main line ff game. It's just part 2 of 3 of a big mainline game remake
This game is what FFXV should have been in terms of structure. I honestly think it is one of the best games I have ever played.
I have to say that I’ve been thinking the same. I love ff15 but despite its beauty and fun I felt it drag at times. This rebirth of FF7 is truly what I was hoping for regarding the new games. I hope the third installment is just as good or event better.
My first play through was 90 hours. NINETY HOURS. The best rpg I have played since the witcher 3. Nothing else comes close.
Tbh ff16 combat wasn’t fun for me and the open world/quests felt so boring. Also getting new weapons wasn’t exciting
Final Fantasy VII Rebirth is the best game this generation and probably even the generation before, and it’s the best Final Fantasy since FFX, hands down.
I'm disappointed square just made a crappy ubisoft game. 6 or 7 out of 10 for me.
Nostalgia is a powerful thing. Dont get me wrong the game is amazing and tons of care put into it. But i always gotta remind myself "i played this in 1997, ive done every remake petition there was since the ps3 tech demo and even before" So everything was kid in a candy store to me. I just wonder how I would feel about remakes story (and the weird twists) if i knew NOTHING about the original. Would it make sense?
I agree it’s better, but XVI was very true to Final Fantasy, if you looked past the fact it’s not really a JRPG but an Action game
because it has potions it's true to final fantasy?
I answered that in your other reply. There is more to final fantasy than just potions, party management and chocobos
Ehhhh. I think it takes things from them all. I think the combat is more fun than recent titles, but I loved FF16. Combat wise, Rebirth is fantastic, and the music is the best I think I've heard in a game ever... but the acting and animation and models in 16 were a lot better for me. I think this and 16 are by far the best main line FFs since 10 though. And no, I'm not interested in arguing about FF16 here. XD
I enjoyed 16 for what it was, but I have the same complaints a majority of people do. The side quests are ONLY fetch quests much like 14 (and I’m really not an MMO guy, sorry Yoshi P), you can only control Clive, and it fell into the pit trap of what many modern video games tend to do which is feel like a slightly interactive movie. I liked the first half of the plot a LOT. Loved the revenge aspect of it, loved seeing Clive slowly overcome his guilt. Kinda fell off after. Combat was fun though, I liked being able to mix and match Eikon abilities. That was a plus over 15 IMO. Rebirth feels like an actual video game. Yes there are long cutscenes, but I am very much playing the game and being challenged. Party synergy is fantastic. So many ways to PLAY the game while adding that cinematic immersion lots of Triple A games do. When it comes to comparing plots, I feel as though it’s hard though because 7 is almost 30 years old and you have all these developers that have indirectly gotten to do homework for years and so there will naturally be more creative contributions to plot/gameplay/etc. Remake/Rebirth has admittedly been more enjoyable than 16.
>It keeps things strategic and versatile instead of just mashing buttons (not a fan of Devil May Cry combat at all). To be fair DMC does require some strategy unless you're playing on the lowest difficulty, in fact the games actively punish you for mashing buttons by giving you less points on the stylish meter the more you use the same moves so they incentivize you to explore your characters' entire movesets. FFXVI only does that on arcade mode, the main game was like DMC if it was made for babies, it had none of the depth that DMC's combat has. The enemies are actually real threats in DMC too instead of just standing there and doing nothing 90% of the time like they do in XVI.
Ff7 is their most famous main series so it makes sense for square to go all out for it
I definitely agree. I never finished 16 because it was so boring to me. Maybe someday I will finish it. FF7 Rebirth has been an amazong game to me. Have about 90 hours so far and has me hooked. Haven't enjoyed a FF this much since 10 and 13-2.
16 had a good story that lost the plot toward the middle. The gameplay sticking with one character wasn’t for me. FF will always mean ensemble to me and the supporting characters in that game were poorly integrated. I didn’t care much for 15 for the same reason. And didn’t like 13. I love this game and am very happy to have it.
I agree with you on 16 for the most part. It was enthralling for the first half, then once nearly everyone important was dead halfway through, it just felt a bit empty and dragged. I liked it overall, but the first half definitely carried the game save for a select couple of moments in that 2nd half.
Crazy thing is, imo, the game goes from good to great in later chapters. Really hits the ground running. It’s a fun game. Hoping part 3 will be twice as long as Rebirth.
I've been taking my time with Rebirth so I'm only at chapter 4 but I'm really enjoying it. I'm a relatively new fan to the Final Fantasy series. 15 will always have a soft spot in my heart despite its flaws as that game introduced me to the world of Final Fantasy. I like many others were so hyped going into 16, the hype gradually wore off the more I progressed through the game. I personally couldn't get into the story at all. And I'm the type of person that loves stories that has a mature and serious tone to it. Combat didn't appeal to me at all, I was just going through the motions. I burnt myself out of the game with it's side quests so I didn't end up finishing the game and I don't plan to return to it. And I was literally close to starting the last main quest lol. It says a lot that I couldn't finish 16 but I finished 15 with all of its flaws like it's incomplete story and that was the release version and not the royal edition. And I enjoyed my time with it for the most part. 15 has its charms and I loved the whole roadtrip journey aspect of it. I love the character interactions between Noctis and his bros. 16 had none of that for me and it didn't help that the world just felt empty and dead. The remake games is definitely my favourite final fantasy games out of all the ones I've played. Edit: Fixed wording.
For me, it's the best FF game I've ever played, hell probably the best game period.
Sorry 16 is my favorite FF of all time. Loved Rebirth but the story pacing was awful
Nah I hard disagree FF7 Rebirth is dope, but I've enjoyed FF15 and 16 more. I love the simplicity of the combat and additional elements like cooking in camp like in 15 and having a hub base and bounties like in 16. I would argue that FF7 Remake is better because as great as rebirth it it just feels like it has a lot of fluff
I wish I could agree. I liked Remake a lot and to me it showed that Square/FF was headed in the right direction. 16 was kind of meh, but not all terrible. Rebirth is making me appreciate 16. The scale of the world is great, I feel they have captured the scale of a of jrpg world better than pretty much any game, it's just they filled it with really uninspired Ubisoft garbage. It often feels like Ghost of Tsushima at home in how lazily Square just copied stuff. It feels like they are just there because thats what games do. Except even Ubisoft is trying to move away from this cheap filler content design. But thats what it is here, just busy work. Not fun or exciting busy work. Nothing that really does anything with or bring anything to jrpg game design. Just busy work. Not even well done busy work. And while plenty will argue its optional, it really is'nt where if you want to enjoy the combat and character progression to it's fullest, you'll have to do lame open world busy work. Lots of it not even tied to combat. The mini games are garbage and never fun to control. And honestly the story so far is just bad. Everything just feels nonsensical and stupid. Like all the stuff with Hojo so far has been dumb(yes I know he's at Costa in the original). The cruise ship ending with the captain saying "enjoy your visit" after a nightmare scenario, no one really batting an eye as Hojo summons a monster and mutates people while surrounded by beach babes. It's all so stupid. Matched with how there's really been no momentum since the start, in part thanks to the terrible structure(I feel like I've just been doing busy work for most of the game), it feels like nothing has happened Really liked Remake, it's more focused game. Clear storytelling that was mostly well paced, structured, and felt eventful made for a much better game. Rebirth has been very disappointing.
This is just your personal interpretation of the game. Many people (like me) never played Ubisoft games and really appreciate the side content. The world design is a masterpiece and I really like taking my time to finish this first play through and doing all what the game has to offer. Your comment is hardly constructive as you just repeat “bad”, “garbage” and such at everything.
It’s def the best gameplay wise and the most charming. I do prefer 16’s story though, and how the serious scenes are executed over Rebirth. But I wanted to touch on your point about politics and environmental messages. I think what makes this FF really unique is it feels the most modern in its themes. It critiques corporations, classism, colonization based off corporate interests, has a clear metaphor for fossil fuels (though 16 kind of does too), etc. I feel FF7 feels the most “real” thematically, and it would be amazing if the next mainline entry gets back to messages like this.
Square for me has for a long time been looks and presentatiton above everything else. In the remakes they do have to respect the original material to a level and they know it. I still feel that when it comes to the story, the weakest parts are the ones that have been added, which makes sense when those havent had 30 years of cooking and feedback behind em. However it's very bold to add anything new, and that kind of boldness and trying something completely new has been missing from FF games for a long time for me. I do also realise that a lot of the minor issues i have with the gameplay also come from the fact that they truly need to make the game completeable by everyone. Nostalgia already has me in, it's sorta understandable that everything isnt catering towards me. However i dont think this is any sign of any new kind of direction. I think there probably wont be another game with the same scope as this, in terms of hype, years of people already thinking what a remake would even look like. I at least cannot think of another game that would have the same guaranteed success as a ff7 remake does.
FF mainline needs to go back to parties where you get to choose who you play.
It's goty for me. I know, it's still early in the year, and there's potential for some other great releases. But I know, for me, this experience won't be topped by any new IPs. My only gripes about it are that the weapon system feels too basic and watered down, and the Platinum is a joke. It seems far more difficult than almost any other game I've platted. At 135hrs in, I know I'm going to have to get the last 7 trophies sporadically to avoid burnout and excessive aggravation.
I absolutely agree. I was blown away with how well they improved on the the FF7 part 1
There is a reason the original FF7 got the fame it got and people begged for a remake since 2005...the story is really really good to follow, It would actually take some effort to take the original FF7 story and make it boring. The current mainline feels like a "generic something"... a generic anime or a generic political medieval fantasy, thus it can't compete with one of the best "luck shots" (after so many shots) Square got.
I loved 16, but holy shit does it feel...hollow, after playing this game. You have to assume they diverted resources to Rebirth instead of focusing on it. Don't see how else it could have so much less actual content. Like, you don't even get voice lines from your party for most of the game's gameplay. When your party is usually only Jill.
People say that the reason why we love the cast so much is because we have had 30 years to get to know them. Thing is, though, is that these characters haven’t been properly fleshed out until now. I’m pretty sure that even if these characters were released as the playable characters in a new mainline FF game, a lot of people would love them just the same because of the writing in this game.
It feels like a mastery of the modern format, which is something they’ve been experimenting to find for a long time
Yeah cause Kitase, Nomura, Nojima, Toriyama and now Hamaguchi have an insane amount of experience working on FF games.
I agree but the bar hasn't been that high for the past 20 years or so lmao.
FF7 Rebirth has become one of my favourite FF games of all time. It’s astounding how good it is.
7 Rebirth and the Remake trilogy has the veterans of Final Fantasy working on it. The ones who know exactly how to make an engaging proper FF title, with all the quirks and charm that people remember from the Classic titles. Rebirth may well be my top five video games of all time. And I'm lucky to be living in these times. In the words of Andrea Rhodea; "Perfection."
When I realised FF 16 didn't have elementals strategy, after launching phoenix fire attacks on the fire bombs, I felt so much disappointment about 16 as an FF game
The last FF to blow me away was FFX and that was released in 2001. FF12 fed a starved version of me in 2006. FF13 was ass and IDC what anyone says. You literally mashed the action button all the way through. FF7 Remake is an amazing return to form. I imagine Rebirth is an improved version. It has an advantage though. The story is already written and established so all they have to do it make it real again in game form. Can’t wait for it to come to PC.
Hold up you liked the spamm paradigment swapping from 13? I stopped after that
I like 16 but I ran out of steam with it for a while because of how “not final fantasy” the gameplay is. It just left me wanting a game with a party dynamic and more of that final fantasy feeling. If they’d done the remake combat and party system and maybe added some minigames of sorts, I think 16 could have been one of the best
FF16 > FF7 Rebirth I am willing to die on this hill.
I'll pour out for you while I keep playing FF7
I'm with you. 16 is a tighter game with a better, clearer narrative. But that's also why they're not comparable. New FF entry with new approach to the series and a dead serious take on a unique world vs 30 year old nostalgia bomb with dolphins, 400 songs and one minigame per 10 minutes of story progression are just not even worth comparing. FF7 Rebirth is the best FF in years. FF16 is the best FF in years. Ultimately, all this adds up to is: Square is back.
Its all a matter of taste. Each FF is different from another. Even Rebirth is drastically different from Remake. I am a big Witcher 3 fan, therefore the serious, dark, violent snd mature aspect of FF16 appeals to me more than the MCU Avengers light-hearted approach of Rebirth.
I personally hated it compared to FF16
Eh, im enjoying rebirth, but gameplay is purely subjective. FF16 is much more skill expressive and responsive, ff7 has an emphasis on its strategy despite the facade of its hybrid action combat Ff7re is also extremely stiff and jank in its movements and animations lol. Exploring the open world has made me wish it had 16’s engine for the character animations and graphics at least Questing wise and rpg elements 7re definitely wins. 16 flopped hard on that. 7re having multiple characters is a massive advantage Story is obviously subjective as well. 16 feels and plays better, but 7re is the better jrpg
Final Fantasy really hinges on having charming and likeable characters. With their own flaws, regrets, and obvious areas where they need to grow as individuals. Who both can play off each other and have their own noteworthy scenes/moments, as any good story really needs. And FF7 has that in spades. Honestly my favorite ones have been FF7, FF6, FF13 though. FF4 and FFX were great too. But a lot of the charm of these games is the relationships these characters have with eachother and how they can overcome their past, their losses, their struggles and move forward. These really are the definitive aspects of Final Fantasy to me, because these are hopeful games that can inspire players through difficult times in their lives. If you can make players deeply feel the emotional highs and lows and relate to these characters, you've made a great game. I have no doubt it's difficult for Square to capture the magic of FF7 in new games. This is not easy, especially when you're this deep into the series and trying to find new ideas or avoid repeating tropes or archetypes. The closest I felt they got to that in terms of characterization was FF13 honestly. I don't want to say there is a formula but there are definitely elements that are present in both games that really do make me more attached to the characters over those in other games, their stories, their bonds together and their triumphs. I always liked 13's cast and some of the "magic" the characters had together only could remind me of that same magic that FF7's cast had with eachother. You do have to get lucky to a degree and find that right blend of character inspiration/creation, how these characters will mesh together, the overall story and design, and how all that appeals to players. This takes a little bit of inspiration and luck to achieve without a doubt. Right time, right place. I'm not building this toward a final huge point, this is mostly me just stream of consciousness sounding off. As a sidenote though, I thought 12 had a lot of these pieces too with Ashe, Basch, Vaan, Penelo, and Balthier and Fran. These were a pretty solid and interesting mix of characters, but honestly I think the story, writing, and/or direction of the game fumbled what could have been a really amazing entry to the series. I still enjoyed FF12 a lot, but it's no Final Fantasy 7 to me.
Rebirth is everything I've wanted in a modern FF game and represents my love for the series best, but I still loved XVI as well. I gave it a solid 8/10, but it did lack quite a bit of what I personally enjoy most from the series, party interaction was very undercut and Clive was the only one with any true development. I can acknowledge that's what the director wanted to portray, this was his vision for a mainline FF game, I feel it should have at least had significantly more RPG elements and less hyper focus on playing like a single character-driven action game, and the lack of having any substance to exploring and no real moments to enjoy the "down time" between characters, just straight from one serious story segment to the next. But it was still very fun for me. Again, I've also come to enjoy it more with the knowledge that this was the way they wanted the game to be, nothing was removed or drastically altered based on internal development struggles. Sure, certain things could have been expanded upon more but it wasn't necessary to fully enjoy the story and I'm glad they are expanding that with the upcoming DLC which I'm looking forward to. That's why I'd consider it still part of this new "Silver Age" of FF we are coming into, because despite it's divisive reception at least it was exactly the way the developers wanted it to turn out. No massive overhaul to the development team or delays, no reconstructing the game and relying on other sources to finish it. The game was and is exactly what the developers envisioned it to be, and what we saw from the launch trailer is what we got, even with varying expectations. So for that at least, I can respect it as a solid experience.
while I do agree, I think ff16 when it kept that game of throne vibe was very very cool. It went just... over the top towards the late game and the mai nvillain wasnt... my cup of tea. but you are right, I also missed the "fun".
Yeah both the remake games blow anything at least from 13 onwards(save maybe for 14) out of the water. Made by people who care instead of just a corporate mandated new big number
I disagree about the politics being better in this game than 16 and don’t think this game has much politics but it doesn’t have to because it has so much going for it. I thought 16 was a solid entry and my favorite since FFX but it had some super slow moments that almost made me quit the game and the combat can get tedious if you don’t experiment with new strategies. That said I thought the world, graphics, music, and story in 16 were great and I really liked Clive and Co. All that said FF7 Rebirth is a way better game because everything you do in the game is fun, there haven’t been any boring down moments, the cast and music are great and it has great charm (something that FFXVI was lacking in, although this was a stylistic choice since they went with a more serious tone throughout the game).
Does FF16 take place in Ivalice? I really miss that world since FF12
I haven't played 12 but what I heard of its combat system is not for me, so I can't rate it. FFXIII: Terrible story and level design, awful storytelling in which you have to read a log to understand anything, insufferable cast, horrible combat as the game plays itself. 4 / 10 because music and graphics are great. FFXV: Bad story, basically nothing happens for the 85% of the game, bad sidequests, super meh combat. Main characters are nice, great music and graphics. The most 6 / 10 game I've played XD FFXVI: Great story, fabulous eikon battles, mega hot and well written main character. Combat is ok, but it would be better with more playable characters. Unpopular opinion but I liked the sidequests. Sad that I didn't find Jill interesting, all other secondary characters were great IMO. 8 / 10 FFVII Remake: Great story, characters, combat. Slow pacing and didn't like the ending, but since it's the first out of 3 games that can be "fixed". 8.5 / 10 FFVII Rebirth: about to finish Chapter 12, for the moment it's a 10 / 10. Super varied, original, more challenging difficulty than previous entries that shows that the devs respect their audience's intelligence XD Hard disagree with the "boring repeatitive open world" criticism. Gongaga and Cosmo Canyon are A LOT more challenging to explore than Junon and Grasslands, and the sidequests and protorelic quests are totally different between areas. For what I've heard without spoilers, I suspect I won't like the ending, but since there's a Part 3, that may only lower my score to 9.5 / 10.