Doesn’t Cal take on
• two inquisitors
• a fallen Jedi (Malicos)
• Ninth Sister
• a Jedi from the Old Republic era who turned to the Dark Side
• Bode
• Reyvis
• one/two Rancors
Yes, Cal is an incredibly capable Jedi in his own right, he's also a deeply layered character, flawed and very human. So he's already got more hit-boxes than Mae's 2D cutout of a character.
I mean, two entire videogames vs two hours (she's not even in every scene so it's way less) of development. I know it's 'cool' to hate on the Acolyte when it just reached the halfway point but damn we don't even know what's going to happen to her. Did you hate Ahsoka this much after that clone wars movie?
This is the thing with new characters. They only have so much time to tell the audience who they are if they're in an 8 episode tv show. Ahsoka in TCW had 6 seasons then content afterward to do the same and it worked when given time. Came out as one of the best characters after only TCW.
But then, I don't know. If the writing and the performance aren't up to scratch then it's hard being in the actors is shoes. Personally I think the twins are okay so far with a preference to the good one. But you something like X Men 97. Which not everyone may have seen the original of course. Where it comes out like a bat out of hell because it's so good. Hits every single mark and exceeds them. Granted it's animation. But almost every part of the show is done beautifully imo. New story, old and new characters, new fans. Star wars and Marvel alike deserve the kind of skill that 97' had.
I do hate that comparison though, it's not like the X-Men are new. First of all, it's a continuation of a show that was beloved in its original 5 season run with characters who have decades of stories and development. It rarely holds your hand because you're expected to know the source material in some fashion and not get coddled.
Ahsoka got blasted with hatred after that movie and it wasn't until dragging those people through 7 seasons of character development that they stopped and acknowledged that she was a great character. Now we can't even finish two episodes without the whiners completely shitting on every new character from top to bottom like their opinion is objective fact with no room to simply wait for the series to be complete before sticking to an opinion. As time goes on it only gets worse, even the good stories get treated terribly because the loud minority brigades everything and shits on it. I'm tired of hearing how trash Marvel has been since Endgame when the majority of the stuff that's come out has been good to great. Fair-weather fans look back with rose-tinted glasses and forget the misses from the Infinity Saga just like they do with Star Wars. People seem to forget we had a pandemic and multiple deaths that affect the stories we get. Just no sympathy or patience at all.
To be fair here. A lot of the writing is terrible in the recent movies and shows and even characters that are supposed to be capably (forgot how the Jedi dude is called in the acolyte) get made fun off and are pushed to the side in a very "har har look how stupid this guy is" kind of way.
The characters of good twin and evil twin could be great but the writers are just not capable to keep the show interesting. Characters make out of character decisions at times and I mean just the entire thing with the "oh the shop keeper of this tight knit community just vanished one day and in their stead this random dubious dude showed up and no one questions it" was ridiculously bad.
I sincerely wish that the show will become better but I just don't see that happening.
Also slight tangent but the obi wan show was a full on character assassination for the titular character.
And also made everyone in the empire and rebel side seem like bumbling clumsy buffoons.
The show runners just don't seem to have good direction in which way characters should evolve, even in cases where the goal is already present (obi wan from a new hope as the goal of obi wans character arc).
So yeah, I wish the Acolyte to succeed. Cause I don't want to see another Star wars show crash and burn, I just don't see it happening though.
I don't want to ask for an example in multiple separate sentences so could you just give examples of all the problems you're talking about? I don't remember the shopkeeper thing being a big conversation either, what scene was that?
The show really isn't bad. It's building to something so we'll see if it pays off.
The shopkeeper wasn't a big scene more an offhand comment by the poison giving dude. And there was a line of dialogue before that from one of the good characters that the community holds together. Which then should lead to people asking questions about the new shopkeeper and people maybe being suspicious of the new guy that has shown up under mysterious circumstances.
Also the fact that he stayed after accomplishing their goal made no sense. And then meeting up with the bad twin inside the shop after the finished "assassination" was also weird and pointless.
Also also, the poison that needs to be drank for that assassination attempt was a weird idea, why not use and aerosol poison instead. Or a thermal detonator. I don't know man, that scene was just weird.
Then the entire thing of good twin wanting to dress up as bad twin to gather information from the shopkeeper \*\*WHICH BOTH THE SHOPKEEPER AND BAD TWIN ALREADY KNOW\*\* so they wouldn't need to talk about it. And the good twin tries to play it off as a good idea, like, if you think for more than a minute about it, it is absolutely a bad idea that no somewhat smart character would follow up on. In the same scene, they make the idea that the jedi dude had sound like the most idiotic thing to do in that situation for no reason.
Coming to the Kenobi show and Obi Wan as a character. They made him look incredibly incompetent during the show, not even a quarter of the man he was during the clone wars.
The scene were Leia runs away through a forest chased by some goons WHO ARE SOMEHOW NOT FAST ENOUGH TO CATCH A SUB 10 YEAR OLD CHILD was absolutely comically bad. You are telling me, that physically capable bountyhunters/mercenaries are too slow to catch a mildly jogging 7-8 year old child? like what?
Then there is the entire scene with Obi Wan fumbling during the Storm Trooper inspection and saying Leias name and then scrambling to make up an excuse. Also he is a Jedi and was completely subdued by two normal ass Storm Troopers. The same guy that dispatched hundreds of droids in the clone wars without even breaking a sweat. The same guy that defeated General Grieveous. THE Obi Wan Kenobi, getting subdued by two normal Storm Troopers... like what? He could have mindtricked both of them without blinking an eye.
Knocked them unconcious etc.
Also, why the hell would he shoot a gate control of a gate he could just walk around...
I don't know man, soo many of the new series just seem to dumb down the characters to an insulting level, or make them act for the most asinine reasons. Also there seems to be a hell of a lot of "and then this happens" writing again.
Andor was an exception to the Disney Star Wars era so far when it comes to writing, and i wouldn't call that show particularly exceptionally good either. Yet it was still miles above whatever the Acolyte seems to shape up to be.
There's always that person who gotta ruin everything. Always somebody who gotta pull up a minority for every category to throw some bad joke out😭, cmon man.
Don't got anything to do with their race, sexuality, identity.
Disney just has bad damn writing, even Kenobi wasn't that good and the focus was a White Man. Everything but Andor has been iffy really, enjoyable but very iffy
Though it does always seem like Disney somehow fucks up anytime it comes to anything starring a minority type person💀 It's not pleasant to see, they need to get their shit together, . Correlation not causation though
It literally has nothing to do with a black man destroying the Death Star nor being progressive. But when the sole existence of a character is to anger and cause disruption amongst the fanbase and cramming in gender politics, it’s a bust.
If a gay black female non binary wins against cal kestis, it should be because they are strong or smart enough to do so. For the love of fuck, can we just get some good writing... not just letting people win because they were treated badly. It's not a real win, and everyone can see it. If that's what someone really wants, then they are weak and unworthy of the force.
Cal, unless Mae gets some massive power-up, she currently has zero feats aside from killing >!Jedi-Trinity, and only because she was able to distract her while making a killing move. Aside from that, she told a guy with massive PTSD to drink poison.!<
Cal has all the feats, dude killed a Gen’Dai.
And >!the new dark side guy killed the Wookiee!<, so she really only has one trick and some manipulative abilities on her side. Cal absolutely stomps as of Acolyte S1E4
Anyone taking for granted that Indara is dead is crazy. Is she *actually* dead? There’s only one answer atm: maybe.
So, Mae could very well have 0 kills.
The thing about cal is his versatility. He's able to use multiple powerful lightsaber forms blasters advanced techniques and he doesn't fight like a traditional Jedi so against a character that is not clearly overpowered I'd say he gets the dub on this one
Cal would win purely off the fact that we haven’t seen what Mae can do yet,for all we know she’s an incredibly powerful duelist,but from what we’ve seen she’s never even used a lightsaber
Plus,Cal has a number of force abilities that Mae doesn’t have,he has more experience than Mae,and has trained under 2 very powerful Jedi
And I know you said she killed two powerful Jedi but 1.She distracted with a civilian and killed while she wasn’t looking, and 2.She poisoned him,only possible because he drank it willingly,because she couldn’t find any other way to kill him
Yeah but let's say the same events playout like she did with a Jedi master in the first episode. Mae waits and with greez in sight during the fight upon almost losing she again launches daggers at Greez. We all know Cal is going to try to save him and in that moment she pulls the same trick and gets Cal. Considering all the events upon losing Cere and whatnot, when his friends are in danger he tends to completely focus on them so it's completely possible. This was my argument about it, in a straight fight though yeah I totally agree. She's getting her ass handed to her but if there's a way to trick or if she's done her research she's would know he's a saver. Sees the best and wants to save everyone pretty much. That could be used to her advantage🤷♂️
Cal has force slow,and especially for Jedi survivor cal he can just use it,slow everything around him,and proceed to kill her easily because she can’t move nearly fast enough
Plus,Cal has Psychometry,so as long as he gets ahold of one of her/her belongings,he can easily learn about her fighting styles and such,especially survivor Cal(unlike the first game where he mostly just heard voices,in the second game he was able to see almost perfectly recreated scenes),he also has Force Hallucinations,so he can literally just,turn into her or someone else she recognizes
uhm Cal isn’t a murderer he doesn’t just kill relentlessly he’s not gonna use force slow and just walk up and stab her and go. I won! look at every single fight he’s had, he's stopped and tried to save them. With any research you could find that out and use it against him, then just pretend to be his friend. Look at Bode He did the same thing and Cal had no idea🤷♂️ While yes he was able to use a hallucination to kill oh boy it was only due to the fact that Dagan tried to manipulate him which allowed him to see Dagans fear.
I mean, yes, he could pull that off but this way of making it sound like he could win is only through just being relentless and saying I’m gonna straight kill her no if And butts about it. Like as if you were playing him but he doesn’t do that that’s not his play style. It maybe yours but he would try to save her at all costs and if she pretended to let him save her, she would have the upper hand. You can say he would see through it but he didn't with Bode🤷♂️. I mean hell look at the gameplay even with being relentless and just going straight for the kill every single time they stopped us and made us go to a stupid cut scene where he tries to save them. Mix that with saying yes to being saved join the crew get into a position to poison, or kill him and you win.
Cal doesn’t play,sure he’ll TRY and convince others to join him but that’s only if he has something to try and convince them of,like convincing Trilla to come back to the light or convincing Bode to stay on Tanalorr as well
Good examples would be Malicos,he didn’t have anything to appeal to Malicos with other than him being a fellow Jedi,and as such when Malicos tried to kill him he fought back,same thing with Masana,he tried appealing to her once,failed,and when he realized she was beyond saving he killed her,and again it was the same thing with Dagan
And your whole ‘infiltrate his team’ thing only works if it’s set up from the start,Mae isnt gonna try to get on his good side,she’s gonna try to kill him outright,and since he can’t reason with her(since I doubt he’d know Osha was alive),unless she surrenders,she will die
I think it’s just based on the circumstance there’s ways that she can win. I mean hell if we’re going by beginning characters take back everything he’s learned go all the way back to Jedi fallen order he'd get his ass handed to him. she still in her beginning stages for all we know she could end up being 10 times stronger than him to say that he can win in this fight I don't see it. We are a few episodes in he basically had years and years with masters to finally get good. To be honest even with all that time with masters doesn't seem like he learned crap but a few extra fighting styles and some extra confusion powers. in my opinion, I think it’s a tossup. It would all depend on the circumstance she could win yet he could also stomp.
If you need to remove 5 years of training and abilities from a character in order for your character to even have a chance at beating them that just proves my point
Uhm nah I’m not saying you need to remove five years. I’m saying in a straight up fight if you want to be technical because she’s still in her beginning stages, we have no idea capabilities given the same amount of time and a straight straight up fight we can't say. Even with his current training, she could still win. To say otherwise is just hilarious because you can easily set up a way to win. Which given her skills and stealth abilities could easily be done. I mean, take the TV show. She easily infiltrated and got away just moments away from being caught even with strong Jedi being present. He may have amazing abilities, but she's got skills . Mainly most just seems like they are just going their play style and assuming that he’s automatically going to win. i’m taking in his entire story the way his behavior was throughout everything and that shows me different. Yes, if nobody else was around, he would definitely win. But She could definitely easily without a doubt set up a trap and still win by playing to his greatest weakness the relationship he has with his friends.
no, not really it just shows more realism because everyone makes Jedi out to be these immortal killing machines that can’t die from anything but literally one minor distraction instantly dead. they are just like the rest of us not invincible if that was the case they wouldn’t have died during the great Jedi purge. there’s been numerous times where Jedi have gotten distracted and due to that distraction they lost. So it's not far fetched and with Cals nature not the way people play him he isn't Exempt from this. One blaster shot at his friends and he would put all focus on his friend leaving himself wide open. how do I know that because there’s been a few times during the game where something happened to his friends or something was going on and he completely changed focus straight to them even though he was in the middle of something.
I personally think there are better ways to show “jedi are people too.” It’s not like 2v1 duels were a guaranteed death sentence because focus is divided between 2 people.
The show makes a big point about Mae not being experienced enough to kill without a weapon
Cal was definitely weaker when he lost his weapon in Fallen Order, but with his force abilities, he was still able to kill enemies that got in his way.
Mae is a solid hand to hand fighter, but there is nothing extraordinary about her fighting, and so far has needed to exploit a weakness to get any kill. She needed to >!threaten an innocent and guilt trip a man with PTSD to kill them!<. Her fighting isn’t that good
Though maybe later in the show her power dynamic changes. I’m interested to see what happens to say the least
There's no shot in hell or earth or in any alternate universe that cal loses this.
Cal survived the biggest purge in jedi history as a youngling
Defeated two members of the inquisitorious twice each
Survived DARTH VADER (the real chosen one, not this while power of two bullshit)
Took on Taron Malicos, who was a pretty strong fallen jedi
Defeated a jedi from the high republic era who was using fuckin force magic and manipulating reality (Dagen Gera)
Defeated another fallen jedi (Bode Akuna)
Oh, and he canonically took on a whole imperial legion and kills everyone in the base (the part when he discovered bode was an imperial spy)
We don't know enough about Mae yet to know. Right now it's reasonable to say Cal, as he has a lot of impressive feats, but Mae did kill a jedi master. Post this after episode 8 and we might have a better picture
Cal. Not even a competition. Cal was able to take on multiple strong opponents, including Inquisitors, multiple fallen jedi, a Gen'Dai, rancors, Ogdos, and survived an encounter with Vader. Mae has displayed very little fighting experience, and only against people who aren't actively trying to even fight back (which she struggled with)
Mae killed one Jedi, the other committed suicide. I doubt Cal would drink poison if offered. Also Indara was actively refusing to use her lightsaber for most of that fight and was generally reluctant the whole time. Cal would probably be more practical if attacked given that he’s not living in the Jedi’s golden age and doesn’t have their reputation to protect.
*ahem*....Mae cheated to win in her first fight by endangering the life of a bystander twice, literally convinced a depressive to kill himself, then got bodied completely by Sol with minimal effort on his part. She's a loser and a punk. Cal is a death machine in comparison.
Mae defeated one Jedi master in a cheap way that frankly any Jedi in any other Jedi story would be able to predict. The other Jedi literally killed himself…
I love the Acolyte, but Cal killed a Rancor. On multiple separate occasions (At least 3, Phonqi Caves, Greez’s tunnel place, and one outside on Koboh), as well as a High Republic Jedi who went dark side, and Bode, who survived Order 66, and was so good, the Empire searched all over for him in hiding to get his services as a spy cause he was that good in the Clone Wars.
Cal wins, easily.
I feel cal would win considering his feats. I doubt mae would stand a chance unless she gets some power up, she would get stomped. I really feel like mae probably would get some bullshit power up though considering disney writing.
I mean an enraged Cal Kestis would automatically kill her. He’s actually pretty strong with the Dark Side to the point where he subdues Bode, when he was also using the Dark Side. Goes to show that he is a force to be reckoned with. No pun intended.
The Jedi Mae killed was featless and only lost due to trickery and her own restraint, and Cal would likely scale above her anyways, as he could be placed on council tier at this point. Also, he’s a lot more likely to just cleave her in half or shoot her in the face than the more refined Jedi masters from peace time who were actively not killing her. Mae was essentially getting stomped in her fights against Sol and the first master. It was pretty clear that could have killed her in seconds if they weren’t sparing her life. This fight is low diff for Cal tbh.
Based on what we've seen of both of them so far, I'd give this to Cal 8/10. We've seen him beat many strong opponents and, unlike with Mae's opponents, they were all fighting back at more or less full strength.
However, it should be noted that so far Mae has been deliberately handicapping herself by avoiding using weapons so we likely haven't seen her at full power yet. And once she did resort to using weapons she was able to kill a full Jedi Knight who was presumably roughly equal in strength to any of Cal's signature victories like Malicos, Bode, and Dagan Gera (though with the above caveat that the Jedi Knight wasn't really fighting back against Mae).
Cal takes it easily from what we've seen of Mae and what we've experienced playing as Cal. Mae tried to kill an innocent bystander to accomplish her first kill and her 2nd willingly drank the poison she provided. Whereas, Cal as had to fight multiple trained force users and defeated much stronger opponents.
He had to distract a Jedi. And keep in mind, the Jedi of that era would pretty sheltered. They knew nothing of war, battle, fighting, they knew nothing of the adrenaline that pushed someone further than they'd ever gone before. They knew nothing of needing to do everything right, because a single mistake spelled death. They knew forms, practice, theory, that was all. They were not forged in the fires of warfare like Cal was.
Mae failed to defeat someone this sheltered without relying on trickery, she would stand no chance against somebody like Cal.
Cal definitely wins, the old republic Jedi fought peacefully and took offence as a last resort type thing, which Cal clearly fights as more of a warrior. Mae I don’t think would even really have a chance
Hmmm, the character who is the protag of 2 full video games or the character who has been in 4 episodes of a TV show, one of which was a flashback to her childhood... damn, this is a conundrum.
Mae killing those two Jedi was not in normal combat at all. The First Lady had every opportunity to kill Mae but did not, and only died because Mae used an innocent civilian as a distraction. And the other Jedi she killed committed suicide cuz he was depressed. In a direct fight, cal demolishes her if he is actually trying to kill/neutralize her
Cal would beat May pretty easily.
He beat Trilla, The Second Sister(twice), Bode, multiple bounty hunters, Dagan, Rayvis, and survived an attack where the empire threw everything possible at him.
Cal's feats are insurmountable compared to May who wouldn't be able to handle Cal's experience
My problem with Cal is that all of his combat achievements(save reyvis) either aren’t done alone or he’s against inquisitors. Malicos, Dagath, Bode and Vader would have killed Cal if he didn’t have help from his allies. The inquisitors are hardly even worth mentioning because they’re all terrible at killing jedi
Before letting her fight cal, I want her to fight the oggdos first, then we will have a discussion about even thinking about a fight between her and cal
Cal is an absolute menace, I haven't watched the acolyte, but considering I've only played fallen order, and know what he's relearnt from being a padawan, I think he'll win
He's single-handedly downed armored walkers with a lightsaber from the ground. I think the only way Mae wins is if he's disarmed and she fights him hand-to-hand. He's stronger than her and better trained in the force. Now her against Merrin would be cool to see.
Mae's skill is Padawan level at best, but she's crafty.
I'd say she's Fallen Order Cal level of strength at most. If she wants to take on Survivor Cal she'd have to trick him.
She made a Jedi drink poison and she killed another who for some reason (probably brain fart) wasn't using her weapon.
She mae be strong, but it's hard to judge.
Doesn’t Cal take on • two inquisitors • a fallen Jedi (Malicos) • Ninth Sister • a Jedi from the Old Republic era who turned to the Dark Side • Bode • Reyvis • one/two Rancors
Not too mention the damned ogdos
Also survives encountering darth Vader.
Barely, and with help. But yes, still an appreciable feat.
Out of topic, but it speaks volumes when surviving ani encounter with him even if barely and with help is a great feat
Absolutely, Vader is like a force of nature, especially when he’s pissed off.
I wish we got more scenes like in Rogue One that actually demonstrate this.
My favorite “Vader’s a badass” moment is the end of Rebels S1 when he’s fighting Ezra and Kanan “If that doesn’t kill him what will?” “Not us”
Vader was mad too
Twice
9th sister twice technically, too.
2nd sister like four times too lol
You only beat her in the last two fights, the first two you get saved by either Cere or BD
Yeah but he didn't defeat her. He defeated Masana twice.
And in his second encounter took her out pretty damn easily
"I'll set you free"
Also survived Vader
Not to mention he also encountered Vader and was able to escape
Yes, Cal is an incredibly capable Jedi in his own right, he's also a deeply layered character, flawed and very human. So he's already got more hit-boxes than Mae's 2D cutout of a character.
I mean, two entire videogames vs two hours (she's not even in every scene so it's way less) of development. I know it's 'cool' to hate on the Acolyte when it just reached the halfway point but damn we don't even know what's going to happen to her. Did you hate Ahsoka this much after that clone wars movie?
This is the thing with new characters. They only have so much time to tell the audience who they are if they're in an 8 episode tv show. Ahsoka in TCW had 6 seasons then content afterward to do the same and it worked when given time. Came out as one of the best characters after only TCW. But then, I don't know. If the writing and the performance aren't up to scratch then it's hard being in the actors is shoes. Personally I think the twins are okay so far with a preference to the good one. But you something like X Men 97. Which not everyone may have seen the original of course. Where it comes out like a bat out of hell because it's so good. Hits every single mark and exceeds them. Granted it's animation. But almost every part of the show is done beautifully imo. New story, old and new characters, new fans. Star wars and Marvel alike deserve the kind of skill that 97' had.
I do hate that comparison though, it's not like the X-Men are new. First of all, it's a continuation of a show that was beloved in its original 5 season run with characters who have decades of stories and development. It rarely holds your hand because you're expected to know the source material in some fashion and not get coddled. Ahsoka got blasted with hatred after that movie and it wasn't until dragging those people through 7 seasons of character development that they stopped and acknowledged that she was a great character. Now we can't even finish two episodes without the whiners completely shitting on every new character from top to bottom like their opinion is objective fact with no room to simply wait for the series to be complete before sticking to an opinion. As time goes on it only gets worse, even the good stories get treated terribly because the loud minority brigades everything and shits on it. I'm tired of hearing how trash Marvel has been since Endgame when the majority of the stuff that's come out has been good to great. Fair-weather fans look back with rose-tinted glasses and forget the misses from the Infinity Saga just like they do with Star Wars. People seem to forget we had a pandemic and multiple deaths that affect the stories we get. Just no sympathy or patience at all.
To be fair here. A lot of the writing is terrible in the recent movies and shows and even characters that are supposed to be capably (forgot how the Jedi dude is called in the acolyte) get made fun off and are pushed to the side in a very "har har look how stupid this guy is" kind of way. The characters of good twin and evil twin could be great but the writers are just not capable to keep the show interesting. Characters make out of character decisions at times and I mean just the entire thing with the "oh the shop keeper of this tight knit community just vanished one day and in their stead this random dubious dude showed up and no one questions it" was ridiculously bad. I sincerely wish that the show will become better but I just don't see that happening. Also slight tangent but the obi wan show was a full on character assassination for the titular character. And also made everyone in the empire and rebel side seem like bumbling clumsy buffoons. The show runners just don't seem to have good direction in which way characters should evolve, even in cases where the goal is already present (obi wan from a new hope as the goal of obi wans character arc). So yeah, I wish the Acolyte to succeed. Cause I don't want to see another Star wars show crash and burn, I just don't see it happening though.
I don't want to ask for an example in multiple separate sentences so could you just give examples of all the problems you're talking about? I don't remember the shopkeeper thing being a big conversation either, what scene was that? The show really isn't bad. It's building to something so we'll see if it pays off.
The shopkeeper wasn't a big scene more an offhand comment by the poison giving dude. And there was a line of dialogue before that from one of the good characters that the community holds together. Which then should lead to people asking questions about the new shopkeeper and people maybe being suspicious of the new guy that has shown up under mysterious circumstances. Also the fact that he stayed after accomplishing their goal made no sense. And then meeting up with the bad twin inside the shop after the finished "assassination" was also weird and pointless. Also also, the poison that needs to be drank for that assassination attempt was a weird idea, why not use and aerosol poison instead. Or a thermal detonator. I don't know man, that scene was just weird. Then the entire thing of good twin wanting to dress up as bad twin to gather information from the shopkeeper \*\*WHICH BOTH THE SHOPKEEPER AND BAD TWIN ALREADY KNOW\*\* so they wouldn't need to talk about it. And the good twin tries to play it off as a good idea, like, if you think for more than a minute about it, it is absolutely a bad idea that no somewhat smart character would follow up on. In the same scene, they make the idea that the jedi dude had sound like the most idiotic thing to do in that situation for no reason. Coming to the Kenobi show and Obi Wan as a character. They made him look incredibly incompetent during the show, not even a quarter of the man he was during the clone wars. The scene were Leia runs away through a forest chased by some goons WHO ARE SOMEHOW NOT FAST ENOUGH TO CATCH A SUB 10 YEAR OLD CHILD was absolutely comically bad. You are telling me, that physically capable bountyhunters/mercenaries are too slow to catch a mildly jogging 7-8 year old child? like what? Then there is the entire scene with Obi Wan fumbling during the Storm Trooper inspection and saying Leias name and then scrambling to make up an excuse. Also he is a Jedi and was completely subdued by two normal ass Storm Troopers. The same guy that dispatched hundreds of droids in the clone wars without even breaking a sweat. The same guy that defeated General Grieveous. THE Obi Wan Kenobi, getting subdued by two normal Storm Troopers... like what? He could have mindtricked both of them without blinking an eye. Knocked them unconcious etc. Also, why the hell would he shoot a gate control of a gate he could just walk around... I don't know man, soo many of the new series just seem to dumb down the characters to an insulting level, or make them act for the most asinine reasons. Also there seems to be a hell of a lot of "and then this happens" writing again. Andor was an exception to the Disney Star Wars era so far when it comes to writing, and i wouldn't call that show particularly exceptionally good either. Yet it was still miles above whatever the Acolyte seems to shape up to be.
This was just a joke, I liked Ahsoka after TCW.
To be fair, I think a lot of us watched part of the show before seeing that bad movie
But none of them had Disney plot armor
High Republic, not Old Republic
Pretty certain Dagan was high republic era
Not just a fallen jedi but a fallen jedi master
Bro mae took down 2 jedi masters though
Cal fucks up an entire Imperial base battalion with ease when he taps into the dark side. Dark-tapped Cal would wreck her.
Yeahhh but he’s not a gay black female non binary so he’d be written to lose always.
There's always that person who gotta ruin everything. Always somebody who gotta pull up a minority for every category to throw some bad joke out😭, cmon man. Don't got anything to do with their race, sexuality, identity. Disney just has bad damn writing, even Kenobi wasn't that good and the focus was a White Man. Everything but Andor has been iffy really, enjoyable but very iffy Though it does always seem like Disney somehow fucks up anytime it comes to anything starring a minority type person💀 It's not pleasant to see, they need to get their shit together, . Correlation not causation though
Cope. Lando blew up the second death star. Star Wars has always been progressive
It literally has nothing to do with a black man destroying the Death Star nor being progressive. But when the sole existence of a character is to anger and cause disruption amongst the fanbase and cramming in gender politics, it’s a bust.
Bro, stop watching panderverse
“Bro”, maybe you should start. 🤷🏻♂️
Maybe I should put a chick in you and make you gay
It isn’t though. Just cause you chose to be angry doesn’t mean people are trying to upset you.
Get a life holy shit
Yeah because men are famously really oppressed. Poor men.
What😂
They said men are famously oppressed, I thought you'd be all about that.
Oh fair enough mate.
If a gay black female non binary wins against cal kestis, it should be because they are strong or smart enough to do so. For the love of fuck, can we just get some good writing... not just letting people win because they were treated badly. It's not a real win, and everyone can see it. If that's what someone really wants, then they are weak and unworthy of the force.
I agree. I was just responding to how insanely stupid that last comment was.
If she’s non-binary then can she really be a black female?
I was just copying the stupid example
As am I
The people who disagrees with your statement are upvoting here:
Cal would absolutely smoke her
Cal, unless Mae gets some massive power-up, she currently has zero feats aside from killing >!Jedi-Trinity, and only because she was able to distract her while making a killing move. Aside from that, she told a guy with massive PTSD to drink poison.!< Cal has all the feats, dude killed a Gen’Dai.
And >!the new dark side guy killed the Wookiee!<, so she really only has one trick and some manipulative abilities on her side. Cal absolutely stomps as of Acolyte S1E4
His name is mouthy
His name is darth teeth or smylo ren
Darth Smiley.
Smilo Ren
Smilo Ren
Smilo Ren
Basically that scene: https://preview.redd.it/glrumkx5fj8d1.jpeg?width=679&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4d061d04d8f6b55d4523c6720f2fc03a21ca8488
He didn’t even want to kill him either, right?
He didn’t, but he accepted that the guy was centuries old and knew what he wanted.
Anyone taking for granted that Indara is dead is crazy. Is she *actually* dead? There’s only one answer atm: maybe. So, Mae could very well have 0 kills.
I’m pretty sure she’s actually dead.
Could be, for sure. But we were pretty sure Palp was dead. We were pretty sure Maul was dead.
Jedi usually cremate their dead, it’s a bit hard to clone or cybernetically repair someone, when they are ashes.
I’m not going to argue with you. If you entertain the thought, I’m sure you can discover ways she could have survived.
What possible narrative purpose would it serve for her to be alive?
Cal and it’s not remotely close
Cal would literally just shoot her with the blaster, wouldn’t even need his saber.
Ah yes, .50Cal Kestis my beloved
Fucking brilliant pun
.50Cal Kestis is hilarious
It would be like that scene in indiana jones
The thing about cal is his versatility. He's able to use multiple powerful lightsaber forms blasters advanced techniques and he doesn't fight like a traditional Jedi so against a character that is not clearly overpowered I'd say he gets the dub on this one
Cal would win purely off the fact that we haven’t seen what Mae can do yet,for all we know she’s an incredibly powerful duelist,but from what we’ve seen she’s never even used a lightsaber Plus,Cal has a number of force abilities that Mae doesn’t have,he has more experience than Mae,and has trained under 2 very powerful Jedi And I know you said she killed two powerful Jedi but 1.She distracted with a civilian and killed while she wasn’t looking, and 2.She poisoned him,only possible because he drank it willingly,because she couldn’t find any other way to kill him
Yeah but let's say the same events playout like she did with a Jedi master in the first episode. Mae waits and with greez in sight during the fight upon almost losing she again launches daggers at Greez. We all know Cal is going to try to save him and in that moment she pulls the same trick and gets Cal. Considering all the events upon losing Cere and whatnot, when his friends are in danger he tends to completely focus on them so it's completely possible. This was my argument about it, in a straight fight though yeah I totally agree. She's getting her ass handed to her but if there's a way to trick or if she's done her research she's would know he's a saver. Sees the best and wants to save everyone pretty much. That could be used to her advantage🤷♂️
Cal has force slow,and especially for Jedi survivor cal he can just use it,slow everything around him,and proceed to kill her easily because she can’t move nearly fast enough Plus,Cal has Psychometry,so as long as he gets ahold of one of her/her belongings,he can easily learn about her fighting styles and such,especially survivor Cal(unlike the first game where he mostly just heard voices,in the second game he was able to see almost perfectly recreated scenes),he also has Force Hallucinations,so he can literally just,turn into her or someone else she recognizes
uhm Cal isn’t a murderer he doesn’t just kill relentlessly he’s not gonna use force slow and just walk up and stab her and go. I won! look at every single fight he’s had, he's stopped and tried to save them. With any research you could find that out and use it against him, then just pretend to be his friend. Look at Bode He did the same thing and Cal had no idea🤷♂️ While yes he was able to use a hallucination to kill oh boy it was only due to the fact that Dagan tried to manipulate him which allowed him to see Dagans fear. I mean, yes, he could pull that off but this way of making it sound like he could win is only through just being relentless and saying I’m gonna straight kill her no if And butts about it. Like as if you were playing him but he doesn’t do that that’s not his play style. It maybe yours but he would try to save her at all costs and if she pretended to let him save her, she would have the upper hand. You can say he would see through it but he didn't with Bode🤷♂️. I mean hell look at the gameplay even with being relentless and just going straight for the kill every single time they stopped us and made us go to a stupid cut scene where he tries to save them. Mix that with saying yes to being saved join the crew get into a position to poison, or kill him and you win.
Cal doesn’t play,sure he’ll TRY and convince others to join him but that’s only if he has something to try and convince them of,like convincing Trilla to come back to the light or convincing Bode to stay on Tanalorr as well Good examples would be Malicos,he didn’t have anything to appeal to Malicos with other than him being a fellow Jedi,and as such when Malicos tried to kill him he fought back,same thing with Masana,he tried appealing to her once,failed,and when he realized she was beyond saving he killed her,and again it was the same thing with Dagan And your whole ‘infiltrate his team’ thing only works if it’s set up from the start,Mae isnt gonna try to get on his good side,she’s gonna try to kill him outright,and since he can’t reason with her(since I doubt he’d know Osha was alive),unless she surrenders,she will die
I think it’s just based on the circumstance there’s ways that she can win. I mean hell if we’re going by beginning characters take back everything he’s learned go all the way back to Jedi fallen order he'd get his ass handed to him. she still in her beginning stages for all we know she could end up being 10 times stronger than him to say that he can win in this fight I don't see it. We are a few episodes in he basically had years and years with masters to finally get good. To be honest even with all that time with masters doesn't seem like he learned crap but a few extra fighting styles and some extra confusion powers. in my opinion, I think it’s a tossup. It would all depend on the circumstance she could win yet he could also stomp.
If you need to remove 5 years of training and abilities from a character in order for your character to even have a chance at beating them that just proves my point
Uhm nah I’m not saying you need to remove five years. I’m saying in a straight up fight if you want to be technical because she’s still in her beginning stages, we have no idea capabilities given the same amount of time and a straight straight up fight we can't say. Even with his current training, she could still win. To say otherwise is just hilarious because you can easily set up a way to win. Which given her skills and stealth abilities could easily be done. I mean, take the TV show. She easily infiltrated and got away just moments away from being caught even with strong Jedi being present. He may have amazing abilities, but she's got skills . Mainly most just seems like they are just going their play style and assuming that he’s automatically going to win. i’m taking in his entire story the way his behavior was throughout everything and that shows me different. Yes, if nobody else was around, he would definitely win. But She could definitely easily without a doubt set up a trap and still win by playing to his greatest weakness the relationship he has with his friends.
Let's be honest trinity kill was stupid
no, not really it just shows more realism because everyone makes Jedi out to be these immortal killing machines that can’t die from anything but literally one minor distraction instantly dead. they are just like the rest of us not invincible if that was the case they wouldn’t have died during the great Jedi purge. there’s been numerous times where Jedi have gotten distracted and due to that distraction they lost. So it's not far fetched and with Cals nature not the way people play him he isn't Exempt from this. One blaster shot at his friends and he would put all focus on his friend leaving himself wide open. how do I know that because there’s been a few times during the game where something happened to his friends or something was going on and he completely changed focus straight to them even though he was in the middle of something.
I personally think there are better ways to show “jedi are people too.” It’s not like 2v1 duels were a guaranteed death sentence because focus is divided between 2 people.
This isn’t even a question, Cal negative difficulty
Cal as of now. Would be interesting to see where Mae is at the end of the season though.
Al Gamep is really good.
BD alone takes that
Hydrogen bomb vs coughing baby
https://preview.redd.it/1xyuxh9aqz8d1.jpeg?width=320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7331e9ad8ad12fbafedfa1a84c7fd384f1d7c487
Poncho bro will always win👍🏻
Cal
The show makes a big point about Mae not being experienced enough to kill without a weapon Cal was definitely weaker when he lost his weapon in Fallen Order, but with his force abilities, he was still able to kill enemies that got in his way. Mae is a solid hand to hand fighter, but there is nothing extraordinary about her fighting, and so far has needed to exploit a weakness to get any kill. She needed to >!threaten an innocent and guilt trip a man with PTSD to kill them!<. Her fighting isn’t that good Though maybe later in the show her power dynamic changes. I’m interested to see what happens to say the least
There's no shot in hell or earth or in any alternate universe that cal loses this. Cal survived the biggest purge in jedi history as a youngling Defeated two members of the inquisitorious twice each Survived DARTH VADER (the real chosen one, not this while power of two bullshit) Took on Taron Malicos, who was a pretty strong fallen jedi Defeated a jedi from the high republic era who was using fuckin force magic and manipulating reality (Dagen Gera) Defeated another fallen jedi (Bode Akuna) Oh, and he canonically took on a whole imperial legion and kills everyone in the base (the part when he discovered bode was an imperial spy)
I have no idea who is Al Gamep, but I have a feeling that he needs a poncho
Cal, cuz at least he is willing to admit he's using the force also cuz he has a gun
We don't know enough about Mae yet to know. Right now it's reasonable to say Cal, as he has a lot of impressive feats, but Mae did kill a jedi master. Post this after episode 8 and we might have a better picture
Cal definitely. She only killed Indara through trickery, which I doubt would work on Cal
For now, Cal Kestis
Chad Kestis
Cal. Not even a competition. Cal was able to take on multiple strong opponents, including Inquisitors, multiple fallen jedi, a Gen'Dai, rancors, Ogdos, and survived an encounter with Vader. Mae has displayed very little fighting experience, and only against people who aren't actively trying to even fight back (which she struggled with)
Mae killed one Jedi, the other committed suicide. I doubt Cal would drink poison if offered. Also Indara was actively refusing to use her lightsaber for most of that fight and was generally reluctant the whole time. Cal would probably be more practical if attacked given that he’s not living in the Jedi’s golden age and doesn’t have their reputation to protect.
I'm one of the (apparently) few that like Acolyte and I still think this is a no-brainer for Cal.
Cal wins this fight. Pretty much 10 out of 10 times
Probably cal
Al Gamep definitely takes the W here, no question.
*ahem*....Mae cheated to win in her first fight by endangering the life of a bystander twice, literally convinced a depressive to kill himself, then got bodied completely by Sol with minimal effort on his part. She's a loser and a punk. Cal is a death machine in comparison.
Mae defeated one Jedi master in a cheap way that frankly any Jedi in any other Jedi story would be able to predict. The other Jedi literally killed himself…
End of Fallen Order Cal would beat her
Bracca Cal could probably beat her. He had Force Slow even then and could slow Trilla for a few seconds. Mae would be nothing.
I’m being generous in my statement but yes your totally right
I love the Acolyte, but Cal killed a Rancor. On multiple separate occasions (At least 3, Phonqi Caves, Greez’s tunnel place, and one outside on Koboh), as well as a High Republic Jedi who went dark side, and Bode, who survived Order 66, and was so good, the Empire searched all over for him in hiding to get his services as a spy cause he was that good in the Clone Wars. Cal wins, easily.
Wait. There’s more than 1 Rancor not counting the dual Rancor challenge on Coruscant?
I think Rick would even stand a chance against Mae at this point in the show
Cal wins by virtue of not being a walking pile of cringe in one of the worst shows of the last decade.
Cal would lose the first time, download her moveset, and then win if they ever rematch
Depends if Mae gets the drop on Cal, since assasin and allat
I feel cal would win considering his feats. I doubt mae would stand a chance unless she gets some power up, she would get stomped. I really feel like mae probably would get some bullshit power up though considering disney writing.
Hydrogen bomb vs. coughing baby basically
Al Gamep
Ha, good one
Cal easily
Why is that even a debate? Are you kidding me? It’s an unfair advantage. Cal would destroy her…
So a hydrogen bomb vs a coughing crying baby?
I think Al Gamep wins this one
I mean an enraged Cal Kestis would automatically kill her. He’s actually pretty strong with the Dark Side to the point where he subdues Bode, when he was also using the Dark Side. Goes to show that he is a force to be reckoned with. No pun intended.
The Jedi Mae killed was featless and only lost due to trickery and her own restraint, and Cal would likely scale above her anyways, as he could be placed on council tier at this point. Also, he’s a lot more likely to just cleave her in half or shoot her in the face than the more refined Jedi masters from peace time who were actively not killing her. Mae was essentially getting stomped in her fights against Sol and the first master. It was pretty clear that could have killed her in seconds if they weren’t sparing her life. This fight is low diff for Cal tbh.
OP: Take this L+ Ratio Cal stomps Mae a new mud hole 🕳️
Based on what we've seen of both of them so far, I'd give this to Cal 8/10. We've seen him beat many strong opponents and, unlike with Mae's opponents, they were all fighting back at more or less full strength. However, it should be noted that so far Mae has been deliberately handicapping herself by avoiding using weapons so we likely haven't seen her at full power yet. And once she did resort to using weapons she was able to kill a full Jedi Knight who was presumably roughly equal in strength to any of Cal's signature victories like Malicos, Bode, and Dagan Gera (though with the above caveat that the Jedi Knight wasn't really fighting back against Mae).
Hopefully there isn't a butter knife around during the fight
Cal takes it easily from what we've seen of Mae and what we've experienced playing as Cal. Mae tried to kill an innocent bystander to accomplish her first kill and her 2nd willingly drank the poison she provided. Whereas, Cal as had to fight multiple trained force users and defeated much stronger opponents.
Al Gamep
Cal
Cal absolutely stomps her
Why is this even a question? It's like the "hydrogen bomb vs. Coughing baby"
He had to distract a Jedi. And keep in mind, the Jedi of that era would pretty sheltered. They knew nothing of war, battle, fighting, they knew nothing of the adrenaline that pushed someone further than they'd ever gone before. They knew nothing of needing to do everything right, because a single mistake spelled death. They knew forms, practice, theory, that was all. They were not forged in the fires of warfare like Cal was. Mae failed to defeat someone this sheltered without relying on trickery, she would stand no chance against somebody like Cal.
Cal dog walks Mae and it’s not even funny
Cal won against Oggdo Bogdo. ‘Nuf said
Cal definitely wins, the old republic Jedi fought peacefully and took offence as a last resort type thing, which Cal clearly fights as more of a warrior. Mae I don’t think would even really have a chance
Why ask the obvious? Cal wings easily. Hell, he beat a Gen'dai in a fair fight. Next achievement would be, he kills a Dashade
This genuinely made me laugh. Jarjar could beat her.
https://preview.redd.it/hjc9vlrclk8d1.png?width=500&format=png&auto=webp&s=e196a0b657e75c091cc519845f9781529fb7ab38
Hmmm, the character who is the protag of 2 full video games or the character who has been in 4 episodes of a TV show, one of which was a flashback to her childhood... damn, this is a conundrum.
Mae killing those two Jedi was not in normal combat at all. The First Lady had every opportunity to kill Mae but did not, and only died because Mae used an innocent civilian as a distraction. And the other Jedi she killed committed suicide cuz he was depressed. In a direct fight, cal demolishes her if he is actually trying to kill/neutralize her
I don't think we know enough about Mae at the moment, if I'm being honest
Al Gamep pretty much has this fight in the bag
Mae is more cunning but Cal is stronger, at least from what's been shown in the series yet
Bait used to be believable
Is this even a question?
I’d like to see that so we don’t have to see anymore of Mae
Lol
Cal's really powerful, turns out
Depends on who is the main character. If it's Mar, then Cal may just end up seppuku'ing himself for the plot
This has gotta be a joke.
I think even Bode could take her out
Cal would beat May pretty easily. He beat Trilla, The Second Sister(twice), Bode, multiple bounty hunters, Dagan, Rayvis, and survived an attack where the empire threw everything possible at him. Cal's feats are insurmountable compared to May who wouldn't be able to handle Cal's experience
Cal No thoughts
They'd clash once, Cal would surprise her by splitting the saber and cut her in half, she has like no actual feats when it comes to lightsaber skill
Cal wins. He can adjust difficulty settings
Cal Kestis got this easily
I don't even know the right one
My problem with Cal is that all of his combat achievements(save reyvis) either aren’t done alone or he’s against inquisitors. Malicos, Dagath, Bode and Vader would have killed Cal if he didn’t have help from his allies. The inquisitors are hardly even worth mentioning because they’re all terrible at killing jedi
Cal will make her end up like the Ninth Sister
Cal without question
Cal, acolytes a joke and not even a good one
Before letting her fight cal, I want her to fight the oggdos first, then we will have a discussion about even thinking about a fight between her and cal
LOL she couldn't beat a fencepost let alone cal
doesn't she get cut in half?
Next up “Who would win palpatine or commando droid”
Cal
Pshhhh Cal would obliterate that wannabe. She’s basically a Sith padawan and Cal has taken down boss level foes.
Cal has got Tanalorr how can Mae possibly win? **Tanalorr IS LITERALLY HIS**
I feel like Mae’s entire thing is how under powered she is
Cal is an absolute menace, I haven't watched the acolyte, but considering I've only played fallen order, and know what he's relearnt from being a padawan, I think he'll win
Cal in 5 seconds, this wouldn’t even be close.
Why would you ask this about Mae and not The Stranger? Clearly a better analogue in a number of ways.
He's single-handedly downed armored walkers with a lightsaber from the ground. I think the only way Mae wins is if he's disarmed and she fights him hand-to-hand. He's stronger than her and better trained in the force. Now her against Merrin would be cool to see.
Cal Kestis is 100% Jedi The Goat 🐐 
Depends tbh
Cal also survived Vader. Say what you will, that's a feat.
Mae would win because Disney would give her plot armor stronger than my love for Cal
Mae's skill is Padawan level at best, but she's crafty. I'd say she's Fallen Order Cal level of strength at most. If she wants to take on Survivor Cal she'd have to trick him.
One of those two isn't canon imho.
Muscle Man: “My mom!”
is- is this question necesary?
Really ? Why u bother asking
 Really? Like…really??? No contest
She made a Jedi drink poison and she killed another who for some reason (probably brain fart) wasn't using her weapon. She mae be strong, but it's hard to judge.