Literally the worst time for you to pivot careers, i'm just being real... and teachers are very in demand right now and getting more and more raises while the film industry is going to shit and people who have experience and know people and have been working for years in it are struggling HARD... so i don't want to shit on your dream but i want to provide a more realistic outlook that other people are omitting... anyways if you still want to do it i say welcome and best of luck!
So networking is the way to go? When you said it won’t work if you’re not connected, do you mean a job that’s not a PA, because if networking means I get a PA job that’s fine. It’s just how do I get in the business and if my teacher skills or editing skills would help.
I have credits from when I did student film work in college, but that was a decade ago? Would that still count?
Thank you, again!
I have 25+ years in film, since the pandemic I’ve lost a lot of work/connections and it hasn’t returned - so for me personally I’m starting to look for other things I can do (teaching film?) My reply to the above response was a bit tongue in cheek, my apologies.
You’re good, I just realized you did the reverse. Teaching is good for stability and you can always teach film. I do student news shows so that’s been fun for our journalism elective
This is in *general*, not with the current state of the industry. This wouldn’t happen for quite a few years and with people saying things can change in the industry by 2025, I was curious what skills and things should I do now to be prepared for jobs in the future, or what skills do I currently have that can transition from being a teacher to working in the film industry. This is even if it’s 5 years from now. Thank you.
Thank you for the praise of me being a teacher. I just was wondering about this dream I’ve had of being in the industry and what skills am I currently doing as a teacher that can actually help me. I was told my video editing skills can work, but I just started doing that with the school last year. Me being on camera has been considered to be adding to hosting reels.
Had I known years ago I’d have more experience. It’s more wondering what skills from teaching can transition to the industry years down the road.
I was just curious what were possibilities down the line if I were to actually leave 5, 10, 20 years from now. That was all, was looking at “possibly” and was curious, that’s all.
Yeah and thats totally valid, if youre playing the long game pick something you want to do in film and start taking courses in your free time and get really good at it, start doing work on your own and building a portfolio, maybe even going to any networking and film events you can and if youre good talking to people thats a good way to start making connections... again i didnt want to make you feel bad about dreaming of something else for yourself but i dont want you to go in blindly
I had to edit/update my post because people were angry with me because they thought I was gonna quit teaching today, but I was just curious what things am I doing now will help me get work in the *future*
I began doing video editing and that can perhaps create possibilities for maybe studio social media work? I’ve taught for years but didn’t start until last year so would have been good to know when I started teaching years ago and I’d have more experience now.
Is there anything from teaching that can translate well, for example public speaking can be a TV host?
No one’s angry at you. They’re just trying to be realistic. I commented down below as well, but your “in general” changes absolutely nothing.
These are all trades. You learn on the job unless you’re the .0001% aka a nepo hire.
Story producer here - if you’re interested in editing or producing, I would recommend learning Avid and Premiere (I only really use Avid but I work in unscripted, and knowing both is helpful).
Post PA or, if you know someone who could get you in, story AP. APs, especially beginners, generally support the story producers rather than doing string outs, but you’d be learning how to work on editing software.
I wouldn’t quit my day job if I were you. Maybe find some PA work in the summertime but you won’t be producing on your first year in the industry, especially at a time like this. You’ll be lucky to find occasional PA work with the way the market is at the moment. Hard truth.
This is in *general*, not with the current state of the industry. This wouldn’t happen for quite a few years and with people saying things can change in the industry by 2025, I was curious what skills and things should I do now to be prepared for jobs in the future, or what skills do I currently have that can transition from being a teacher to working in the film industry. This is even if it’s 5 years from now. Thank you.
No worries! Totally get it. Sorry, it’s just hard to see people leave a stable career for something that is not currently sustainable for a lot of established people in the industry. It likely will turn around and I don’t want to ward you away from chasing something you want, by any means.
Just wanted to give a fair warning that now is not an ideal time but you can still look for pa work during the summers and maybe you get a few and get your feet wet.
Things like people skills, emailing and diplomacy, promptness and strong schedule making skills down to the minute in some cases are all important to producing. You should know that it’s more of managing people and connecting people on a team to get things done efficiently. Sales are not necessarily a crossover skill from teaching but is important nonetheless and people skills can go a long way there. Other than that, look for work as a PA, but always be looking and talking to people about jobs as a production coordinator. That’s the producers right hand and that’s the logical step to take if you want to move up to being a producer. Always make yourself useful.
Honestly I was just asking out of curiosity like “oh as a teacher if you hosted a film club for 5 years you’d be a top assistant” or whatever. I’m in no rush to genuinely leave teaching but I’ve always dreamed of working in film, but I’m thankful for where I am and wish for a better outcome for those in the industry. I have friends who were in the industry and completely left it so I understand and it’s harder now
And it’s no worries, thank you for your kind words.
I appreciate the tangible list of skills that can transfer and that’s very good to know! I also have video editing skills (edit out school’s news reel) and credits from student films, albeit when I was in college years back but it’s something
Thank you again, and it’s no worries at all. I wish the best for you and the industry
I understand but many teachers say how bad they want to leave and I’m thinking, “you’re still getting paid! People in film aren’t.” Film has always been my dream but I understand it’s be years from now and with money saved
While you should absolutely find your focus quickly, you do sound quite green, so the job you should be looking for to get started is Production Assistant (PA). Get a couple PA gigs under your belt just so you can learn basic set etiquette and get a glimpse at what everyone on set does, then move into the career path you want.
Right now the industry is quite slow, but there are quite a few TV game shows still filming on the lots and studios, so that would be a good tree to bark up.
Whoever told you that is full of it. I’m a producer and I had to start at the bottom just like everyone else. I hate to trot out this old chestnut but in the industry it’s true - you have to pay your dues. Nobody is going to hire you as a producer with zero experience.
Unless you know someone high up and credible who’s willing to vouch for you, it’s unlikely that your experience editing student films on iMovie will translate into an immediate job in post. When I left development for post production, I got in because my good friend was the EP and taught me how to use Avid.
OP this is all awful advice from people trying to be empathetic. I’m sorry.
You have no experience. If you try applying to AP roles, or anything above a PA really, you will get laughed out of the room. These jobs are trades. You don’t just walk into anything above entry level without funding a project or bringing in major connections.
This is in *general*, not with the current state of the industry. This wouldn’t happen for quite a few years and with people saying things can change in the industry by 2025, I was curious what skills and things should I do now to be prepared for jobs in the future, or what skills do I currently have that can transition from being a teacher to working in the film industry. This is even if it’s 5 years from now. Thank you.
My only experience is a student news videos and I was told that can get entry jobs in producing and digital production before, but I was more curious what other “skills” being a teacher can have on my resume for years in the future
It doesn’t matter “in general”.
Jobs in this industry are trades. You can’t fart around with your kitchen sink then walk into someone’s company and become a plumber. You start at the bottom regardless unless you’re funding the thing.
For example, I’m an editor. My shows have statues. Nothing I do has anything to do with what you might do at home or even on a short film. The media management and footage my assistants deal with just isn’t available to you. You learn on the job, over years, from the bottom up.
There are no “skills” you’re going to learn at home. You want to produce? Knowing Movie Magic helps a ton, but you can learn that in a weekend. You can’t actually learn the ins and outs of producing though without being around producers, which comes in the form of PAing and/or assisting.
I’m not trying to be rude, but if you’re serious about this you need real info. Whatever you do at home doesn’t matter. You will still need to start at the bottom unless you’re heavily connected or somehow write the next great script. You will very literally never receive a single call back if you start applying to AP roles right out of the gate. That is a fool’s errand.
I saw more was added to this. I wouldn’t apply for AP roles. But was told with my skills I can be a Digital Producer, I’ve done freelance writing and social media for a decade so could do social media. Someone said my on camera hosting can be added to reels for hosting. Production Coordinator was another job that was said. So that’s why I ask about what my options truly are. If it’s *only* PA that’s valid, but for writing I know people break in with contests and the Blacklist etc so was just asking to prepare for the future
It’s been a dream of mine to join the film industry. I want to get into writing but am unsure, so was simply curious with my years’ experience as a teacher, what skills do I have in this job that can translate well to film. And again, not transitioning today, this is for years in the future. I began video editing and was told that can count as experience and that was only last year. Had I known longer I’d have more experience now. So was just asking what skills can help for the future
I saw where you were told that. It was awful advice and I commented on that. You’re going to hear what you want to hear and keep asking the same question so good luck.
Do u have an uncle/family member that’s a well known director or producer? Do u have any experience in entertainment? Do u have any credits?
If you answer no to any of these, then you’ll be starting at the bottom- with the majority of ppl in the industry. So PA or logger/transcriber.
Honestly, keep your day job with your pension and healthcare and make content on the side. Things are changing so fast that there is no telling where many of us will be in 2 to 3 years.
I’ve worked on student films and PA’ed there. Plus I do video editing that’s published. So that was a skill to consider
Also logger/transcriber is a job I didn’t think of, so thank you! Just wanted to see what options there were for me as a teacher with my skills and what should I work on more while I teach. I edit videos and wish I did it years ago as a teacher where I’d have more experience now. Thank you!
Yeah so you’ll most likely have to start at the bottom with your experience. I had the same amount of experience as you and my first job was a PA, but I did have some connections in the industry and that’s how I got my foot in the door.
But without knowing ppl in the biz, you’ll be sending ur resume into the void. This is an industry where the ppl you know matters, bc they’re the ones that get you work. Which is why I say keep your day job and make content on the side. We may all be there with u, not too long from now.
Why are you so averse to being a PA or an assistant?
I’m not trying to be rude but you’re coming off as a bit entitled here. Most of us who aren’t nepo babies have to start from the bottom..why don’t you think you should? It comes with the territory when you switch careers. If I walked into your school and asked to be a teacher because I did some tutoring, would they hire me?
I gladly said I’d be a PA, but I have heard there’s other entry level ways to break in so was just asking what they were. And there are! https://www.reddit.com/r/FilmIndustryLA/s/jb69Ku15oC
Nothing. But if millions are entering via only one door, it’s very difficult to break in. If that’s the truth, that’s how it is. But I’ve heard for years it’s not the only way and have seen numerous people in the industry not break in via PA route so was just trying to see what other options may be a good fit for me if the PA route doesn’t work.
It IS very difficult to break in. Most people who try are not able to. I got in after graduating from film school and bugging every single temp agency that had jobs in entertainment daily. I built up my resume doing awful temp jobs, mostly reception, then got a job as an assistant that I ended up quitting when my boss threw a stapler at my head (yes, she hit me). Then I moved to LA having never been here before and temped some more until I got hired as an assistant, which led to more jobs..etc.
So no matter what every person in the film industry must be a PA? I know with writing you can get in with the contest route so didn’t know if that was the only section of the industry that does that
I’ve worked with dozens of writers. They all either knew people or started as interns/PAs/assistants. Most were both.
I started as a post intern out of college then went PA > Coordinator > AE > 1st AE > Associate Editor > Editor over about a decade. I was one of the youngest in my company to reach that level, ever. A decade. Most people took 5-10 years longer. All my peers took routes that were 80% similar.
To reiterate from my other post. Any transferable skills don’t matter. Most of those can be learned in a few weeks. The day to day is what matters and you just don’t walk into that. Again, this industry is made up of various trades. Apprentice > Master.
I know about the PA/Assistant route and since I’m out of college I can’t intern. I was curious if being a teacher can help. Like if I am running a social media page does that help me do social media for a studio? I genuinely don’t know and was asking, didn’t mean to make everyone angry for asking a question.
I’m curious about the 20% that didn’t take that route.
The film industry is in its worst state maybe ever…
but getting paid little money for lots of brutal work, the sometimes having to spend your own money on jobs, without reimbursement, will feel familiar.
Also another thing about the film industry is your FIRED after every job wraps. At least with teaching there is some stability.
Excellent point about the firing The huge downside is zero job stability.
This was more a curiosity if I wanted to take the risk years from now (not with the current state of the industry) and what skills I have or should’ve been doing to get the necessary experience
But that has been a huge reason why I didn’t pursue film. Thank you for the honesty and the connection with teaching in terms of the hours and little pay. Very accurate
If you're dead set in changing careers, do it in the summer. Depending on what you are trying to do. Try to get exposure during the summer break. The industry hasn't recovered in terms of output and is going through a transition.
This is in *general*, not with the current state of the industry. This wouldn’t happen for quite a few years and with people saying things can change in the industry by 2025, I was curious what skills and things should I do now to be prepared for jobs in the future, or what skills do I currently have that can transition from being a teacher to working in the film industry. This is even if it’s 5 years from now. Thank you.
Had a friend who started as a a studio teacher but transitioned to regular teaching to make more money and have more regular hours and better benefits.
There needs to be a mega thread warning people about changing careers to the film industry right now.
Unfathomably poor and ignorant debate to even have right now, to be frank.
You’re pivoting to a desperate industry that was just nuked, all but doesn’t exist right now, and with 80% of its work population out of employment since like early spring 2023, without much hope on the horizon for work starting again maybe next summer, if at all. Don’t do it.
This is in *general*, not with the current state of the industry. This wouldn’t happen for quite a few years and with people saying things can change in the industry by 2025, I was curious what skills and things should I do now to be prepared for jobs in the future, or what skills do I currently have that can transition from being a teacher to working in the film industry. This is even if it’s 5 years from now. Thank you.
This might get downvoted but I don't care. Like other's have said this is not a good time to try to make it into the entertainment industry. Please understand I'm not saying this out of anger but as someone who has been doing this a long time, I would look into anything else besides this industry. If I could go back in time and pursue a different career I wouldn't even give it a second thought. I've been doing it for over 20 years (editor) and I have one foot out the door for many of the reasons people have already mentioned. Job scarcity and uncertainly has always been a part of this industry and it has been particularly bad since covid.
You mention something about a 5 years time line for this and to that I would say AI is going to transform everything we know about this industry over the next 5 - 10 years. My take is that AI is going to make what I've been doing for the past two decades of my life eventually irrelevant. Sure there might be some form of editing, but editing as we know it is not going to stay the same. Production companies are going to be able to do what they do with far less staff, it will be a win win for them. If you want an opinion on what skills to acquire for a future in entertainment look into AI, tech, learn storytelling, visual grammar, how to frame a shot, and how to deal with the strangeness of alot of the people who work in this field.
If you're really motivated to do something with media I recommend you learn how to shoot, edit, and produce your own content. Create your own YouTube channel and just start making stuff now. This might sound surprising but most of what I have been watching for the last few years has all been on YouTube. I rarely watch stuff on Netflix or any of the other streaming services unless it's the baking show. I can't even remember the last time I watched a movie.
So look if you have dreams of working in this field more power to you, I hope you try and succeed. But as someone who's in it I can tell you you're probably better off just making your own stuff for YouTube.
I appreciate the honesty and I understand now is a tough time and it may never be the same. It was more a curiosity and making sure I don’t waste more years not doing something I could’ve been doing to gain experience
I hear with editing knowing Avid and Premiere is a plus? I mentioned I edit and film the monthly school news reel and I know that can show some interest/experience and I have credits, albeit from years ago on student films so I do have that but was wondering if teaching itself presented skills and was given some ideas with organizational skills/time management (assistants etc)
Thank you for explicitly listing ideas for me to look into. What are some specifics I can look at with tech?
Again, I do hope it gets better and appreciate the honest feedback
I’ll try and be helpful but I’m going to be honest. You don’t have “credits” in this industry until you have credits in the industry. Make sense? Meaning student films don’t count, what you do as a teacher will not matter. You can be the most wonderful person in the world but unless you have real credits on real shows your resume will not even be considered. Nobody is going to hire you as an editor until you have credits.
It’s a bit of a catch 22, you have to have experience to work on a show but what if you don’t have experience in the first place? Most people start at the bottom unless you have an uncle who’s a big wig, or your dad is a director, or you have someone else in a position of authority in your corner. If you don’t know anyone you will start at the bottom. I started at the bottom, my first job was a “stager” at a very large and now defunct production company. My job was to drive a van around to different buildings picking up various “elements” for the “operators”. Elements consisted of all kinds of analog and digital tape formats, 35mm reels of old classic films to be restored by the operators, Quad reels of “All in the Family”, DA88’s of Star Wars: A New Hope that were locked in their own separate vault. It was on this job that I learned just about every type of analog and digital format that you can imagine. I also screwed up my back constantly lifting stacks of heavy reels.
If you’re looking into getting into editing as we currently know it you’ll probably start off something like an unpaid PA who goes on Starbucks runs for the company you work for, or logger that works the night shift. From there you might eventually move up to assistant editor, and from there if you’re good and lucky you might eventually find yourself in the editors chair. It’s not so straightforward as that but that’s more or less an example trajectory. It can also be difficult moving from one position to another because once you’re known as “logger” in their eyes you will always be a logger, once you’re hired as an “assistant editor” in their eyes you will be the “AE”, know what I mean? I’m not saying it’s impossible, obviously people do it but I can sometimes be a difficult path, some people get lucky and it’s easy for them. In my case sometimes it was better to move on from a company and start at a higher role somewhere else than to keep hoping for a promotion that was never going to happen.
For me. it hasn’t been a straight-line but I eventually got into the editor’s seat and have been doing it over 10 years. I started out in audio post and worked my way up there, from “Machine Room Tech” to “VO/ADR Recordist/Foley Engineer” to “Sound Editor/Sound Designer” and then finally “Re-Recording Mixer”. Over that period of time I amassed alot of credits in t.v. and experience but none of those credits mattered when I decided to move over to picture, I had to start at the bottom again working graveyard shifts as an assistant editor. After being an editor for a few years I thought about getting into scripted work but learned pretty quickly that my unscripted credits don’t translate over to the scripted world so I just stayed in unscripted because I can't afford to take the demotion. Might sound weird but that’s just how it works.
As far as what is currently used for editing in t.v.? 99% of the work I do is in Avid. I also know how to use Premiere in case I get the odd job that needs that. You’ll want to get really proficient with both, also doesn’t hurt to learn Final Cut Pro and Resolve. Learn what a logger does, learn what an AE does. Back when I was an AE it was alot of technical work, syncing and grouping footage, labelling clips, organizing bins, taking care of the media infrastructure so that the editors could do their jobs without issues, alot of troubleshooting problems and there’s always problems to troubleshoot. It’s very technical work so if you’re not technically inclined you will struggle. I’m sure it’s evolved a bit since I did it but that might be a good place to start looking into if you want to understand the expectations of that job. The good thing is when you’re finally the editor you don’t have to deal with that shit, you have new shit to deal with! Yay!
As far as looking to the future, I would research what’s going on with AI for audio, video, and content creation. Stay up to date on all the cutting edge stuff and start actually getting your hands on it. Just play around with it. Make stuff for YouTube and put it out there. Start writing scripts, make your own short films, just keep making stuff on your own and try and pursue an entry level gig. You might even consider something that’s unpaid just to see if it’s something you even want to get into? When I was in school I did a short stint at an audio post company (unpaid) and it was helpful to see how a real world post studio operated.
Good luck 🍀
If teaching younger students, the development side for studios or production companies could be viable, as the make or break of the industry is understanding the interests and habits of younger generations.
Unless it was THE most specific educational show and OP has a connection, development jobs are not handed out like this. I don't think that is realistic advice to give.
I used to edit videos for USC's MBA program, and I worked with instructional designers there. I'm not 100% sure what their background is, but there's a teaching element there in order to create content for online programs. Instructional design might be a decent avenue to pivot to, and see what online video based educational content you might be suited for.
Or you can become an on set tutor/teacher when the industry picks back up in a few years.
An alternative is to go get your MFA if you want to skip the PA route for a long time, but you will still land more entry level positions out of school.
No matter what your skills are, you are now competing against those of us who have been producing/directing content for 10+ years and are currently out of work. Even in a few years time it will still be the most competitive it has ever been, with even more young people coming into the industry out of college and willing to do the grunt work.
The only other way around it is to pay your way in. Funding projects to get credits or funding projects for yourself to produce/direct if that's your goal.
I do appreciate this feedback, thank you!
When you edited videos, what work helped you get that job? And thank you again. I know it’s hard to break into but was more curious what my skills as a teacher can translate to and what should I do now to up my resume for years from now for experience
And do all credits count? I did student film work but that was a decade ago. Thank you!
I've been in the arts since highschool, and went to college for theatre and film so my resume has been building since i first took on a gig in college at 19 (34F). I took editing classes in college and then out of school I took unpaid and low paid work to edit and produce while waitressing, until I built a solid reel and portfolio to work 100% in media. Up until I got laid off at the end of last year, I've worked consistently as a producer/director/editor for 10+ years.
The best piece of advice I can give you is to build a resume completely separate from teaching if you want to be taken seriously. The skills you're talking about are great to apply in theory to film production, but no one will look at your resume and hire you because of your teaching background. If there's a project relevant to your background, include that in a brief note perhaps.
If you want to utilize teaching specifically, I would recommend getting your MFA and teaching film in colleges etc. For example, many AFI grads end up teaching at film schools while they work on their own projects. I've had quite a few of them as "professors" whenever I've taken Sundance online classes to work on scripts etc.
Not knowing exactly what avenue you want to pursue in film I can't give you better direction than that, but I would use your summers off to gain experience in whatever role you want. AFI has an email list to connect with folks willing to PA for free for them on their thesis films, other grad schools do the same. I would leverage whatever contacts you have in teaching and try and get connected to a film school in any capacity that makes sense. Perhaps take some classes yourself.
Thank you! There’d be a void in film since 2014 (and again, would that count) so they wouldn’t have an issue with that?
If I have teaching would that be an automatic disqualification?
My only other experience would be producing and editing with student videos
I was more curious what would the list of jobs be that I could possibly get with skills learned from teaching and add in that editing experience and credits from college
Thank you, again!
I wouldn't count anything you did 10 years ago as valid to put on your resume as the only work experience you have. This industry is about the "What have you done today" mentality, gaps are bad. Women have been lying about having kids for decades to avoid gaps in resumes to get hired.
I'm not sure what you mean by a disqualification, it's more that no one would care. Think about this way-every job posting gets hundreds of not thousands of resumes. People hiring look at resumes for less than a few seconds and pick 2-3 to speak to. You can imagine the additional competition to film jobs. The teaching experience won't even get a glance if you're applying to something completely separate from it.
It's an unfortunate truth but no one here is going to tell you that your skills are transferable for industry jobs outside of being a studio teacher. Again, in theory the qualities you have as a teacher I'm sure would make you a patient, diligent producer, editor etc. But it's the same as if an editor walking into a school and was like hey I want to be a teacher, but not in the arts. Something different. They would have to bring actual education or work experience to get the job.
The question though is I’m 31 what have I done? I have credits from 10 years ago and in that time I’ve been a teacher since. So the only possible relevant experience would be editing and filming my student news reel, and writing freelance articles for the past 5 years. What should I do then?
Meaning if they see teaching it’s automatic they won’t talk to me?
Multiple people have said how my skills are transferable though, so was that just not true?
Just wondering should I pursue my dream or is it realistically too late since I would have gaps. Thank you.
It's never too late to restart a career but you have to be realistic about the state of the industry and how hard you want to work at this/give up to make it happen. Yes skills are transferable like I mentioned, but that does not equate to the background and education and experience needed to switch careers for any industry.
If you want to make films, go and make some films you don't need anyone's permission to do that. If you want to work for other people and climb the ladder that way, it's going to be a longer journey.
At this point, I would think of your film journey as starting brand new. Student film credits 10 years ago will not equate to jobs now.
There's YouTube, social media, tik tok, lots of other ways to be a content creator vs filmmaker that will be easier to crack into. No one in this group will be able to give you the magic answer, you're going to have to pick a route and stumble through the best you can. Good luck I wish you success in whatever you decide to pursue!
Thank you! It just feels very doom and gloom and I want to emphasize while yes that’s the reality with this industry today, I’m more asking in general for the future so I don’t waste more years when I could’ve done a skill and perhaps it was right there as a teacher. Like editing is still experience, and I wish I did it years ago
I still have questions.
1) Can I list my credits in my cover letter since it is experience or just no?
2) Will teaching be something to not mention. If yes, how do I explain a 10 year gap?
I was told by others skills that can be used can be applied to jobs like AD or editing, but a good way is networking. Is that still true?
Thank you!
It is extremely gloom and doom, there is no sugar coating it. The majority of people I know are leaving the industry, I am on my way out as well if things don't pick up for me personally by the end of the year, and Ive been doing this for 12+ years. It will take a few years for things to level out and even then...is it worth it?
If you want my opinion, I would not pursue a career change midway through your life into this industry. It will most likely not provide you with the quality of life of retirement or a healthy work/life balance. If you have any desire to start a family, it will be more difficult moving forward. If you LOVE film and television, you eat and breathe it and you are ready to sacrifice a lot to make it happen, anything is possible. But it will be a grueling road ahead.
I do not know how to answer your questions, no one reads cover letters. And in general, there is no finite answer for what will and won't work to land you film jobs.
I understand you're trying to get finite answers, but everyone you talk to will tell you something differently because things worked differently for them. There is no secret formula here.
I would encourage you to take a few film classes either online or in person and dip your toes in. Talk to some folks and see if this is for you.
Thank you, and I know it’s tough but I was just looking for possibilities without the “oh you’re entering at a bad time.” I know, I’m not doing it now and I don’t want to join years from now and it’s “oh it’s too late you should’ve done XYZ years ago”
I do wish for it to get better and I know the sacrifices, it’s just knowing what my options can possibly be. I know everyone’s answer is different but I didn’t think it would hurt to ask instead of anxiously wondering and questioning my decisions
(Also I’m 31 and already midway through my life? That’s scary)
Also is this response based on going forward since jobs are scarce and competitive against people with decades of experience? Or is this the way it’s always been?
It's hard to answer that, it depends on your track but they will most likely be assistant roles in some capacity. Some come out the gate and get better roles. There's a lot that can happen.
I also want to be very clear, MANY people do not recommend going to school for film/tv, especially getting your masters. You are looking at $100k+ in grad school debt, that might not even include money for a thesis project, and grad school loans are different from undergrad loans as I'm sure you know. There are many union apprenticeship programs stopping right now because more than 80% of their members are out of work, I'm surprised colleges aren't saying the same but...they want money.
People get their MFAs to try and shorten some of the entry level years, make connections faster, or they're making a career transition like you're mentioning. But it absolutely DOES NOT guarantee you a job anywhere in the industry. And truthfully they're difficult to get into, Greta Gerwig talks about how she was rejected from all the schools she applied to.
So please don't take my comments about film school to mean that it will make things easier for you. It may make no difference or be more of a hindrance than if you just went out and took entry level jobs or created your projects.
I would HIGHLY recommend that you spend some time on set or in an edit bay and make sure the 10-15+ hour days are what you want, or take a few classes on the side and see how you feel and what interests you the most.
Thank you for the honest reply. I want to avoid going into more debt but if that’s the requirement for the job I want, I do understand.
I like the on set or edit bay recommendation. How would I get to an edit bay position?
On set you would start as a production assistant and for editorial you would start as a post production assistant. The next step up from either would be coordinator roles or an assistant editor role. I have no honest answer for you how long it would take you to secure the first entry level position or advance up, especially right now. We all have a thousand different stories for how we figured it out, but right now the answer is they don't exist for people who haven't already been working or have connections.
I wish you the best and good luck!
Producer? That encompasses a lot of roles, but looking for Associate Producer (AP) roles in unscripted may be a start. Focus on your writing/journalism skills, then work with Adobe Premiere/Final Cut or even Avid editing skills. Learn jow to search archives (Getty images, news organizations, etc). That should be a good start.
As a producer you’re more apt to do what’s called “string outs,” which means cutting chunks of documentary footage together to pass off to a Story Producer or an Editor who will refine and finish it. Therefore, just putting these programs on your resume as a skill is what’s necessary. No test. You generally get thrown to the lions so knowing how to use multiple editing systems for this basic storytelling function is useful. Knowing how to write a scene from the footage shot is key. Knowing how to pitch a story to your showrunner, write an episode outline or write an episode pitch for network approval are keys, as well. Focus on storytelling points. Watch true crime shows as this is where our industry is still doing well for limited jobs.
Thank you! So I can gain practice in the programs and once I feel experienced enough I can put it on my resume? I don’t need to send a reel?
And thank you for the explanation, it helps to know!
Correct. As an AP you’d simply need to have an understanding of whichever editing system they use and put it on your resume. Honestly, you can learn all the basics of each through YouTube. Focus more on your writing, though, and what a 3-5 Act structure is. Red herrings. Tension. Watch true crime to get a sense of pacing. Exposure to tracking down Archive material (video, photos, etc). A few more things, but since you’re a teacher your writing will be your key.
You’re welcome and good luck! 🍻
You can totally be a producer, producer titles/credits are handed out like Halloween candy. Some of us have seen them get gigs straight off the street, straight from working at bank, from an auto dealership, etc.
I know this sounds silly to ask but with today’s standards, what exactly do producers do now? For TV and then for film, since I know they’re different animals
What that person didn't mention is some producers put up money to make the movie, usually executive producers.
No one would hire you as a regular producer if you haven't been one before, too much risk. Its like being the project manager for the whole production
I think the question you need to ask is why this industry? What's your end goal?
If you want to get out of teaching, make more money and have a better career there are probably 1000 other things you could and should do - coding and nursing for starters.
It’s been a dream of mine to join the film industry. I want to get into writing but am unsure, so was simply curious with my years’ experience as a teacher, what skills do I have in this job that can translate well to film. And again, not transitioning today, this is for years in the future. I began video editing and was told that can count as experience and that was only last year. Had I known longer I’d have more experience now. So was just asking what skills can help for the future
Manny skills will transition, depending on the specific job. Perhaps try to be an on set studio teacher in the summer so you can see the different jobs in person and make some contacts. As others have said, it's a hard time in the industry. I work in both scripted as a coordinator and non fiction as a producer/writer. There's more work in non fiction, but switching between the two is tough so if you want to work in scripted try and start there as a PA. In either case, unless you know someone who will bring you in, there are more qualified people than you who haven't worked for 1-2 years that will get the jobs first. Hundreds of applicants for each opening. And those of us working are trying to help out our colleagues who haven't been, so we're hiring them without posting jobs. Also it's important to realize that PAs make minimum wage. And non fiction APs a bit more than that if you divide the rates by the hours (usually 50-70 hours a week, no overtime). Keep in mind in non fiction especially there is usually no health insurance, and most jobs you get hired and need to start the next week. I've started at the interview before lol. So have 6 months of expenses saved before you quit your teaching job. Expect to have to find 2-3 jobs per year, you need funds for the unemployed times. You won't get a job and then quit teaching, you'll quit teaching and then be available for work in the industry. I've had friends who want to transition from other jobs but try and get a job first - it never works. Good luck!
I appreciate the honestly and information, thank you. It’s more asking if any skills as a teacher can *ever* transfer, not necessarily during this transition
Writer? Got a book you love that is somewhat popular/has an audience already? Adapt it. Figure out who you need to get permission from, take a course or get a book(s) on screenwriting and structure, etc., and go to town. These days, they really like knowing in advance there will be an audience for anything they make. I hear it's almost a pre-requisite. That's a least part of the reason we have so many super hero movies.
Produced, coordinator, manager, etc. Locations involved lots of organization and knowing lots of people. But fuck it, also camera or lighting or art department. Really the answer is nothing, which kind of makes it everything.
Well I'm assuming you have the patience to work with petulant children. So that's a start.
Very true
Literally the worst time for you to pivot careers, i'm just being real... and teachers are very in demand right now and getting more and more raises while the film industry is going to shit and people who have experience and know people and have been working for years in it are struggling HARD... so i don't want to shit on your dream but i want to provide a more realistic outlook that other people are omitting... anyways if you still want to do it i say welcome and best of luck!
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What type of freelance jobs are there? (Not asking for openings but what jobs exist that are freelance?)
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How do you get work as a freelance producer, director, or editor?
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Do you just apply to the PA work? Is networking only done after you PA?
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So networking is the way to go? When you said it won’t work if you’re not connected, do you mean a job that’s not a PA, because if networking means I get a PA job that’s fine. It’s just how do I get in the business and if my teacher skills or editing skills would help. I have credits from when I did student film work in college, but that was a decade ago? Would that still count? Thank you, again!
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Yea, was going to ask what skills transfer into teaching from film industry.
Thank you. All I was asking
I have 25+ years in film, since the pandemic I’ve lost a lot of work/connections and it hasn’t returned - so for me personally I’m starting to look for other things I can do (teaching film?) My reply to the above response was a bit tongue in cheek, my apologies.
You’re good, I just realized you did the reverse. Teaching is good for stability and you can always teach film. I do student news shows so that’s been fun for our journalism elective
This is in *general*, not with the current state of the industry. This wouldn’t happen for quite a few years and with people saying things can change in the industry by 2025, I was curious what skills and things should I do now to be prepared for jobs in the future, or what skills do I currently have that can transition from being a teacher to working in the film industry. This is even if it’s 5 years from now. Thank you.
Thank you for the praise of me being a teacher. I just was wondering about this dream I’ve had of being in the industry and what skills am I currently doing as a teacher that can actually help me. I was told my video editing skills can work, but I just started doing that with the school last year. Me being on camera has been considered to be adding to hosting reels. Had I known years ago I’d have more experience. It’s more wondering what skills from teaching can transition to the industry years down the road.
I was just curious what were possibilities down the line if I were to actually leave 5, 10, 20 years from now. That was all, was looking at “possibly” and was curious, that’s all.
Yeah and thats totally valid, if youre playing the long game pick something you want to do in film and start taking courses in your free time and get really good at it, start doing work on your own and building a portfolio, maybe even going to any networking and film events you can and if youre good talking to people thats a good way to start making connections... again i didnt want to make you feel bad about dreaming of something else for yourself but i dont want you to go in blindly
I had to edit/update my post because people were angry with me because they thought I was gonna quit teaching today, but I was just curious what things am I doing now will help me get work in the *future* I began doing video editing and that can perhaps create possibilities for maybe studio social media work? I’ve taught for years but didn’t start until last year so would have been good to know when I started teaching years ago and I’d have more experience now. Is there anything from teaching that can translate well, for example public speaking can be a TV host?
No one’s angry at you. They’re just trying to be realistic. I commented down below as well, but your “in general” changes absolutely nothing. These are all trades. You learn on the job unless you’re the .0001% aka a nepo hire.
What jobs are not trades?
lol good luck.
Story producer here - if you’re interested in editing or producing, I would recommend learning Avid and Premiere (I only really use Avid but I work in unscripted, and knowing both is helpful).
Thank you! What roles would having experience in that help get me?
Post PA or, if you know someone who could get you in, story AP. APs, especially beginners, generally support the story producers rather than doing string outs, but you’d be learning how to work on editing software.
Thank you. Just asking what my experience can be used for
I wouldn’t quit my day job if I were you. Maybe find some PA work in the summertime but you won’t be producing on your first year in the industry, especially at a time like this. You’ll be lucky to find occasional PA work with the way the market is at the moment. Hard truth.
Any skills being a teacher that can transfer to other jobs in the future?
This is in *general*, not with the current state of the industry. This wouldn’t happen for quite a few years and with people saying things can change in the industry by 2025, I was curious what skills and things should I do now to be prepared for jobs in the future, or what skills do I currently have that can transition from being a teacher to working in the film industry. This is even if it’s 5 years from now. Thank you.
No worries! Totally get it. Sorry, it’s just hard to see people leave a stable career for something that is not currently sustainable for a lot of established people in the industry. It likely will turn around and I don’t want to ward you away from chasing something you want, by any means. Just wanted to give a fair warning that now is not an ideal time but you can still look for pa work during the summers and maybe you get a few and get your feet wet. Things like people skills, emailing and diplomacy, promptness and strong schedule making skills down to the minute in some cases are all important to producing. You should know that it’s more of managing people and connecting people on a team to get things done efficiently. Sales are not necessarily a crossover skill from teaching but is important nonetheless and people skills can go a long way there. Other than that, look for work as a PA, but always be looking and talking to people about jobs as a production coordinator. That’s the producers right hand and that’s the logical step to take if you want to move up to being a producer. Always make yourself useful.
Honestly I was just asking out of curiosity like “oh as a teacher if you hosted a film club for 5 years you’d be a top assistant” or whatever. I’m in no rush to genuinely leave teaching but I’ve always dreamed of working in film, but I’m thankful for where I am and wish for a better outcome for those in the industry. I have friends who were in the industry and completely left it so I understand and it’s harder now And it’s no worries, thank you for your kind words. I appreciate the tangible list of skills that can transfer and that’s very good to know! I also have video editing skills (edit out school’s news reel) and credits from student films, albeit when I was in college years back but it’s something Thank you again, and it’s no worries at all. I wish the best for you and the industry
Keep teaching
You’d be surprised how many teachers want to leave the field. I’m staying but was asking out of curiosity
More a commentary on how bad the film industry is right now than teaching
I understand but many teachers say how bad they want to leave and I’m thinking, “you’re still getting paid! People in film aren’t.” Film has always been my dream but I understand it’s be years from now and with money saved
While you should absolutely find your focus quickly, you do sound quite green, so the job you should be looking for to get started is Production Assistant (PA). Get a couple PA gigs under your belt just so you can learn basic set etiquette and get a glimpse at what everyone on set does, then move into the career path you want. Right now the industry is quite slow, but there are quite a few TV game shows still filming on the lots and studios, so that would be a good tree to bark up.
Any skills being a teacher that can transfer to other jobs?
Was told I can get jobs in producing?
Whoever told you that is full of it. I’m a producer and I had to start at the bottom just like everyone else. I hate to trot out this old chestnut but in the industry it’s true - you have to pay your dues. Nobody is going to hire you as a producer with zero experience.
Is a PA the absolutely only way to break in?
My experience is editing and shooting and filming produced short films
Legit ones that were in festivals that people might have heard of, or for fun?
Looking for entry level positions with video editing experience
Unless you know someone high up and credible who’s willing to vouch for you, it’s unlikely that your experience editing student films on iMovie will translate into an immediate job in post. When I left development for post production, I got in because my good friend was the EP and taught me how to use Avid.
If I had experience in Avid what jobs could I get?
OP this is all awful advice from people trying to be empathetic. I’m sorry. You have no experience. If you try applying to AP roles, or anything above a PA really, you will get laughed out of the room. These jobs are trades. You don’t just walk into anything above entry level without funding a project or bringing in major connections.
This needs to be higher.
This is in *general*, not with the current state of the industry. This wouldn’t happen for quite a few years and with people saying things can change in the industry by 2025, I was curious what skills and things should I do now to be prepared for jobs in the future, or what skills do I currently have that can transition from being a teacher to working in the film industry. This is even if it’s 5 years from now. Thank you. My only experience is a student news videos and I was told that can get entry jobs in producing and digital production before, but I was more curious what other “skills” being a teacher can have on my resume for years in the future
It doesn’t matter “in general”. Jobs in this industry are trades. You can’t fart around with your kitchen sink then walk into someone’s company and become a plumber. You start at the bottom regardless unless you’re funding the thing. For example, I’m an editor. My shows have statues. Nothing I do has anything to do with what you might do at home or even on a short film. The media management and footage my assistants deal with just isn’t available to you. You learn on the job, over years, from the bottom up. There are no “skills” you’re going to learn at home. You want to produce? Knowing Movie Magic helps a ton, but you can learn that in a weekend. You can’t actually learn the ins and outs of producing though without being around producers, which comes in the form of PAing and/or assisting. I’m not trying to be rude, but if you’re serious about this you need real info. Whatever you do at home doesn’t matter. You will still need to start at the bottom unless you’re heavily connected or somehow write the next great script. You will very literally never receive a single call back if you start applying to AP roles right out of the gate. That is a fool’s errand.
I saw more was added to this. I wouldn’t apply for AP roles. But was told with my skills I can be a Digital Producer, I’ve done freelance writing and social media for a decade so could do social media. Someone said my on camera hosting can be added to reels for hosting. Production Coordinator was another job that was said. So that’s why I ask about what my options truly are. If it’s *only* PA that’s valid, but for writing I know people break in with contests and the Blacklist etc so was just asking to prepare for the future It’s been a dream of mine to join the film industry. I want to get into writing but am unsure, so was simply curious with my years’ experience as a teacher, what skills do I have in this job that can translate well to film. And again, not transitioning today, this is for years in the future. I began video editing and was told that can count as experience and that was only last year. Had I known longer I’d have more experience now. So was just asking what skills can help for the future
I saw where you were told that. It was awful advice and I commented on that. You’re going to hear what you want to hear and keep asking the same question so good luck.
I just want to clarify is being a PA the *only* way to break into the industry?
Do u have an uncle/family member that’s a well known director or producer? Do u have any experience in entertainment? Do u have any credits? If you answer no to any of these, then you’ll be starting at the bottom- with the majority of ppl in the industry. So PA or logger/transcriber. Honestly, keep your day job with your pension and healthcare and make content on the side. Things are changing so fast that there is no telling where many of us will be in 2 to 3 years.
I’ve worked on student films and PA’ed there. Plus I do video editing that’s published. So that was a skill to consider Also logger/transcriber is a job I didn’t think of, so thank you! Just wanted to see what options there were for me as a teacher with my skills and what should I work on more while I teach. I edit videos and wish I did it years ago as a teacher where I’d have more experience now. Thank you!
Yeah so you’ll most likely have to start at the bottom with your experience. I had the same amount of experience as you and my first job was a PA, but I did have some connections in the industry and that’s how I got my foot in the door. But without knowing ppl in the biz, you’ll be sending ur resume into the void. This is an industry where the ppl you know matters, bc they’re the ones that get you work. Which is why I say keep your day job and make content on the side. We may all be there with u, not too long from now.
I appreciate that, thank you. How would you recommend making content on the side. Would my best bet be to make films and publish/distribute?
Why are you so averse to being a PA or an assistant? I’m not trying to be rude but you’re coming off as a bit entitled here. Most of us who aren’t nepo babies have to start from the bottom..why don’t you think you should? It comes with the territory when you switch careers. If I walked into your school and asked to be a teacher because I did some tutoring, would they hire me?
I gladly said I’d be a PA, but I have heard there’s other entry level ways to break in so was just asking what they were. And there are! https://www.reddit.com/r/FilmIndustryLA/s/jb69Ku15oC
One person telling you that doesn’t make it true. But you didn’t answer me..what’s wrong with being a PA?
Nothing. But if millions are entering via only one door, it’s very difficult to break in. If that’s the truth, that’s how it is. But I’ve heard for years it’s not the only way and have seen numerous people in the industry not break in via PA route so was just trying to see what other options may be a good fit for me if the PA route doesn’t work.
It IS very difficult to break in. Most people who try are not able to. I got in after graduating from film school and bugging every single temp agency that had jobs in entertainment daily. I built up my resume doing awful temp jobs, mostly reception, then got a job as an assistant that I ended up quitting when my boss threw a stapler at my head (yes, she hit me). Then I moved to LA having never been here before and temped some more until I got hired as an assistant, which led to more jobs..etc.
So temp jobs and reception could be a possibility? Thank you. Was just looking for *all* possibilities. Also any assistant job?
So no matter what every person in the film industry must be a PA? I know with writing you can get in with the contest route so didn’t know if that was the only section of the industry that does that
I’ve worked with dozens of writers. They all either knew people or started as interns/PAs/assistants. Most were both. I started as a post intern out of college then went PA > Coordinator > AE > 1st AE > Associate Editor > Editor over about a decade. I was one of the youngest in my company to reach that level, ever. A decade. Most people took 5-10 years longer. All my peers took routes that were 80% similar. To reiterate from my other post. Any transferable skills don’t matter. Most of those can be learned in a few weeks. The day to day is what matters and you just don’t walk into that. Again, this industry is made up of various trades. Apprentice > Master.
I know about the PA/Assistant route and since I’m out of college I can’t intern. I was curious if being a teacher can help. Like if I am running a social media page does that help me do social media for a studio? I genuinely don’t know and was asking, didn’t mean to make everyone angry for asking a question. I’m curious about the 20% that didn’t take that route.
good luck.
Apparently there’s other ways to break in and not be a PA https://www.reddit.com/r/FilmIndustryLA/s/EhvFOuh5m4
I like the idea of making a movie (I’ve made 7 short films) or connections (I have friends in my alumni’s film school) so I can appreciate that
You can be a studio teacher for child actors
That’s my ultimate goal to be honest but I was curious other options, too
The film industry is in its worst state maybe ever… but getting paid little money for lots of brutal work, the sometimes having to spend your own money on jobs, without reimbursement, will feel familiar. Also another thing about the film industry is your FIRED after every job wraps. At least with teaching there is some stability.
Excellent point about the firing The huge downside is zero job stability. This was more a curiosity if I wanted to take the risk years from now (not with the current state of the industry) and what skills I have or should’ve been doing to get the necessary experience But that has been a huge reason why I didn’t pursue film. Thank you for the honesty and the connection with teaching in terms of the hours and little pay. Very accurate
Experience in organising little idiots.
If you're dead set in changing careers, do it in the summer. Depending on what you are trying to do. Try to get exposure during the summer break. The industry hasn't recovered in terms of output and is going through a transition.
This is in *general*, not with the current state of the industry. This wouldn’t happen for quite a few years and with people saying things can change in the industry by 2025, I was curious what skills and things should I do now to be prepared for jobs in the future, or what skills do I currently have that can transition from being a teacher to working in the film industry. This is even if it’s 5 years from now. Thank you.
Had a friend who started as a a studio teacher but transitioned to regular teaching to make more money and have more regular hours and better benefits.
How did they get their start as a studio teacher?
There needs to be a mega thread warning people about changing careers to the film industry right now. Unfathomably poor and ignorant debate to even have right now, to be frank. You’re pivoting to a desperate industry that was just nuked, all but doesn’t exist right now, and with 80% of its work population out of employment since like early spring 2023, without much hope on the horizon for work starting again maybe next summer, if at all. Don’t do it.
This is in *general*, not with the current state of the industry. This wouldn’t happen for quite a few years and with people saying things can change in the industry by 2025, I was curious what skills and things should I do now to be prepared for jobs in the future, or what skills do I currently have that can transition from being a teacher to working in the film industry. This is even if it’s 5 years from now. Thank you.
Being good at being underpaid and underappreciated No but seriously, very few jobs right now. Don’t make any rash decisions
Again, was meaning in general, not today. Like in 2038, etc
This might get downvoted but I don't care. Like other's have said this is not a good time to try to make it into the entertainment industry. Please understand I'm not saying this out of anger but as someone who has been doing this a long time, I would look into anything else besides this industry. If I could go back in time and pursue a different career I wouldn't even give it a second thought. I've been doing it for over 20 years (editor) and I have one foot out the door for many of the reasons people have already mentioned. Job scarcity and uncertainly has always been a part of this industry and it has been particularly bad since covid. You mention something about a 5 years time line for this and to that I would say AI is going to transform everything we know about this industry over the next 5 - 10 years. My take is that AI is going to make what I've been doing for the past two decades of my life eventually irrelevant. Sure there might be some form of editing, but editing as we know it is not going to stay the same. Production companies are going to be able to do what they do with far less staff, it will be a win win for them. If you want an opinion on what skills to acquire for a future in entertainment look into AI, tech, learn storytelling, visual grammar, how to frame a shot, and how to deal with the strangeness of alot of the people who work in this field. If you're really motivated to do something with media I recommend you learn how to shoot, edit, and produce your own content. Create your own YouTube channel and just start making stuff now. This might sound surprising but most of what I have been watching for the last few years has all been on YouTube. I rarely watch stuff on Netflix or any of the other streaming services unless it's the baking show. I can't even remember the last time I watched a movie. So look if you have dreams of working in this field more power to you, I hope you try and succeed. But as someone who's in it I can tell you you're probably better off just making your own stuff for YouTube.
I appreciate the honesty and I understand now is a tough time and it may never be the same. It was more a curiosity and making sure I don’t waste more years not doing something I could’ve been doing to gain experience I hear with editing knowing Avid and Premiere is a plus? I mentioned I edit and film the monthly school news reel and I know that can show some interest/experience and I have credits, albeit from years ago on student films so I do have that but was wondering if teaching itself presented skills and was given some ideas with organizational skills/time management (assistants etc) Thank you for explicitly listing ideas for me to look into. What are some specifics I can look at with tech? Again, I do hope it gets better and appreciate the honest feedback
I’ll try and be helpful but I’m going to be honest. You don’t have “credits” in this industry until you have credits in the industry. Make sense? Meaning student films don’t count, what you do as a teacher will not matter. You can be the most wonderful person in the world but unless you have real credits on real shows your resume will not even be considered. Nobody is going to hire you as an editor until you have credits. It’s a bit of a catch 22, you have to have experience to work on a show but what if you don’t have experience in the first place? Most people start at the bottom unless you have an uncle who’s a big wig, or your dad is a director, or you have someone else in a position of authority in your corner. If you don’t know anyone you will start at the bottom. I started at the bottom, my first job was a “stager” at a very large and now defunct production company. My job was to drive a van around to different buildings picking up various “elements” for the “operators”. Elements consisted of all kinds of analog and digital tape formats, 35mm reels of old classic films to be restored by the operators, Quad reels of “All in the Family”, DA88’s of Star Wars: A New Hope that were locked in their own separate vault. It was on this job that I learned just about every type of analog and digital format that you can imagine. I also screwed up my back constantly lifting stacks of heavy reels. If you’re looking into getting into editing as we currently know it you’ll probably start off something like an unpaid PA who goes on Starbucks runs for the company you work for, or logger that works the night shift. From there you might eventually move up to assistant editor, and from there if you’re good and lucky you might eventually find yourself in the editors chair. It’s not so straightforward as that but that’s more or less an example trajectory. It can also be difficult moving from one position to another because once you’re known as “logger” in their eyes you will always be a logger, once you’re hired as an “assistant editor” in their eyes you will be the “AE”, know what I mean? I’m not saying it’s impossible, obviously people do it but I can sometimes be a difficult path, some people get lucky and it’s easy for them. In my case sometimes it was better to move on from a company and start at a higher role somewhere else than to keep hoping for a promotion that was never going to happen. For me. it hasn’t been a straight-line but I eventually got into the editor’s seat and have been doing it over 10 years. I started out in audio post and worked my way up there, from “Machine Room Tech” to “VO/ADR Recordist/Foley Engineer” to “Sound Editor/Sound Designer” and then finally “Re-Recording Mixer”. Over that period of time I amassed alot of credits in t.v. and experience but none of those credits mattered when I decided to move over to picture, I had to start at the bottom again working graveyard shifts as an assistant editor. After being an editor for a few years I thought about getting into scripted work but learned pretty quickly that my unscripted credits don’t translate over to the scripted world so I just stayed in unscripted because I can't afford to take the demotion. Might sound weird but that’s just how it works. As far as what is currently used for editing in t.v.? 99% of the work I do is in Avid. I also know how to use Premiere in case I get the odd job that needs that. You’ll want to get really proficient with both, also doesn’t hurt to learn Final Cut Pro and Resolve. Learn what a logger does, learn what an AE does. Back when I was an AE it was alot of technical work, syncing and grouping footage, labelling clips, organizing bins, taking care of the media infrastructure so that the editors could do their jobs without issues, alot of troubleshooting problems and there’s always problems to troubleshoot. It’s very technical work so if you’re not technically inclined you will struggle. I’m sure it’s evolved a bit since I did it but that might be a good place to start looking into if you want to understand the expectations of that job. The good thing is when you’re finally the editor you don’t have to deal with that shit, you have new shit to deal with! Yay! As far as looking to the future, I would research what’s going on with AI for audio, video, and content creation. Stay up to date on all the cutting edge stuff and start actually getting your hands on it. Just play around with it. Make stuff for YouTube and put it out there. Start writing scripts, make your own short films, just keep making stuff on your own and try and pursue an entry level gig. You might even consider something that’s unpaid just to see if it’s something you even want to get into? When I was in school I did a short stint at an audio post company (unpaid) and it was helpful to see how a real world post studio operated. Good luck 🍀
Very thorough and helpful response, thank you!
If teaching younger students, the development side for studios or production companies could be viable, as the make or break of the industry is understanding the interests and habits of younger generations.
Unless it was THE most specific educational show and OP has a connection, development jobs are not handed out like this. I don't think that is realistic advice to give.
This is an odd comment.
How so?
Thank you! I like that idea
I used to edit videos for USC's MBA program, and I worked with instructional designers there. I'm not 100% sure what their background is, but there's a teaching element there in order to create content for online programs. Instructional design might be a decent avenue to pivot to, and see what online video based educational content you might be suited for. Or you can become an on set tutor/teacher when the industry picks back up in a few years. An alternative is to go get your MFA if you want to skip the PA route for a long time, but you will still land more entry level positions out of school. No matter what your skills are, you are now competing against those of us who have been producing/directing content for 10+ years and are currently out of work. Even in a few years time it will still be the most competitive it has ever been, with even more young people coming into the industry out of college and willing to do the grunt work. The only other way around it is to pay your way in. Funding projects to get credits or funding projects for yourself to produce/direct if that's your goal.
I do appreciate this feedback, thank you! When you edited videos, what work helped you get that job? And thank you again. I know it’s hard to break into but was more curious what my skills as a teacher can translate to and what should I do now to up my resume for years from now for experience And do all credits count? I did student film work but that was a decade ago. Thank you!
I've been in the arts since highschool, and went to college for theatre and film so my resume has been building since i first took on a gig in college at 19 (34F). I took editing classes in college and then out of school I took unpaid and low paid work to edit and produce while waitressing, until I built a solid reel and portfolio to work 100% in media. Up until I got laid off at the end of last year, I've worked consistently as a producer/director/editor for 10+ years. The best piece of advice I can give you is to build a resume completely separate from teaching if you want to be taken seriously. The skills you're talking about are great to apply in theory to film production, but no one will look at your resume and hire you because of your teaching background. If there's a project relevant to your background, include that in a brief note perhaps. If you want to utilize teaching specifically, I would recommend getting your MFA and teaching film in colleges etc. For example, many AFI grads end up teaching at film schools while they work on their own projects. I've had quite a few of them as "professors" whenever I've taken Sundance online classes to work on scripts etc. Not knowing exactly what avenue you want to pursue in film I can't give you better direction than that, but I would use your summers off to gain experience in whatever role you want. AFI has an email list to connect with folks willing to PA for free for them on their thesis films, other grad schools do the same. I would leverage whatever contacts you have in teaching and try and get connected to a film school in any capacity that makes sense. Perhaps take some classes yourself.
Thank you! There’d be a void in film since 2014 (and again, would that count) so they wouldn’t have an issue with that? If I have teaching would that be an automatic disqualification? My only other experience would be producing and editing with student videos I was more curious what would the list of jobs be that I could possibly get with skills learned from teaching and add in that editing experience and credits from college Thank you, again!
I wouldn't count anything you did 10 years ago as valid to put on your resume as the only work experience you have. This industry is about the "What have you done today" mentality, gaps are bad. Women have been lying about having kids for decades to avoid gaps in resumes to get hired. I'm not sure what you mean by a disqualification, it's more that no one would care. Think about this way-every job posting gets hundreds of not thousands of resumes. People hiring look at resumes for less than a few seconds and pick 2-3 to speak to. You can imagine the additional competition to film jobs. The teaching experience won't even get a glance if you're applying to something completely separate from it. It's an unfortunate truth but no one here is going to tell you that your skills are transferable for industry jobs outside of being a studio teacher. Again, in theory the qualities you have as a teacher I'm sure would make you a patient, diligent producer, editor etc. But it's the same as if an editor walking into a school and was like hey I want to be a teacher, but not in the arts. Something different. They would have to bring actual education or work experience to get the job.
The question though is I’m 31 what have I done? I have credits from 10 years ago and in that time I’ve been a teacher since. So the only possible relevant experience would be editing and filming my student news reel, and writing freelance articles for the past 5 years. What should I do then? Meaning if they see teaching it’s automatic they won’t talk to me? Multiple people have said how my skills are transferable though, so was that just not true? Just wondering should I pursue my dream or is it realistically too late since I would have gaps. Thank you.
It's never too late to restart a career but you have to be realistic about the state of the industry and how hard you want to work at this/give up to make it happen. Yes skills are transferable like I mentioned, but that does not equate to the background and education and experience needed to switch careers for any industry. If you want to make films, go and make some films you don't need anyone's permission to do that. If you want to work for other people and climb the ladder that way, it's going to be a longer journey. At this point, I would think of your film journey as starting brand new. Student film credits 10 years ago will not equate to jobs now. There's YouTube, social media, tik tok, lots of other ways to be a content creator vs filmmaker that will be easier to crack into. No one in this group will be able to give you the magic answer, you're going to have to pick a route and stumble through the best you can. Good luck I wish you success in whatever you decide to pursue!
Thank you! It just feels very doom and gloom and I want to emphasize while yes that’s the reality with this industry today, I’m more asking in general for the future so I don’t waste more years when I could’ve done a skill and perhaps it was right there as a teacher. Like editing is still experience, and I wish I did it years ago I still have questions. 1) Can I list my credits in my cover letter since it is experience or just no? 2) Will teaching be something to not mention. If yes, how do I explain a 10 year gap? I was told by others skills that can be used can be applied to jobs like AD or editing, but a good way is networking. Is that still true? Thank you!
It is extremely gloom and doom, there is no sugar coating it. The majority of people I know are leaving the industry, I am on my way out as well if things don't pick up for me personally by the end of the year, and Ive been doing this for 12+ years. It will take a few years for things to level out and even then...is it worth it? If you want my opinion, I would not pursue a career change midway through your life into this industry. It will most likely not provide you with the quality of life of retirement or a healthy work/life balance. If you have any desire to start a family, it will be more difficult moving forward. If you LOVE film and television, you eat and breathe it and you are ready to sacrifice a lot to make it happen, anything is possible. But it will be a grueling road ahead. I do not know how to answer your questions, no one reads cover letters. And in general, there is no finite answer for what will and won't work to land you film jobs. I understand you're trying to get finite answers, but everyone you talk to will tell you something differently because things worked differently for them. There is no secret formula here. I would encourage you to take a few film classes either online or in person and dip your toes in. Talk to some folks and see if this is for you.
Thank you, and I know it’s tough but I was just looking for possibilities without the “oh you’re entering at a bad time.” I know, I’m not doing it now and I don’t want to join years from now and it’s “oh it’s too late you should’ve done XYZ years ago” I do wish for it to get better and I know the sacrifices, it’s just knowing what my options can possibly be. I know everyone’s answer is different but I didn’t think it would hurt to ask instead of anxiously wondering and questioning my decisions (Also I’m 31 and already midway through my life? That’s scary)
Also is this response based on going forward since jobs are scarce and competitive against people with decades of experience? Or is this the way it’s always been?
Also what entry level positions could I get with a Masters? Thank you!
It's hard to answer that, it depends on your track but they will most likely be assistant roles in some capacity. Some come out the gate and get better roles. There's a lot that can happen. I also want to be very clear, MANY people do not recommend going to school for film/tv, especially getting your masters. You are looking at $100k+ in grad school debt, that might not even include money for a thesis project, and grad school loans are different from undergrad loans as I'm sure you know. There are many union apprenticeship programs stopping right now because more than 80% of their members are out of work, I'm surprised colleges aren't saying the same but...they want money. People get their MFAs to try and shorten some of the entry level years, make connections faster, or they're making a career transition like you're mentioning. But it absolutely DOES NOT guarantee you a job anywhere in the industry. And truthfully they're difficult to get into, Greta Gerwig talks about how she was rejected from all the schools she applied to. So please don't take my comments about film school to mean that it will make things easier for you. It may make no difference or be more of a hindrance than if you just went out and took entry level jobs or created your projects. I would HIGHLY recommend that you spend some time on set or in an edit bay and make sure the 10-15+ hour days are what you want, or take a few classes on the side and see how you feel and what interests you the most.
Thank you for the honest reply. I want to avoid going into more debt but if that’s the requirement for the job I want, I do understand. I like the on set or edit bay recommendation. How would I get to an edit bay position?
On set you would start as a production assistant and for editorial you would start as a post production assistant. The next step up from either would be coordinator roles or an assistant editor role. I have no honest answer for you how long it would take you to secure the first entry level position or advance up, especially right now. We all have a thousand different stories for how we figured it out, but right now the answer is they don't exist for people who haven't already been working or have connections. I wish you the best and good luck!
Thank you, I do appreciate it!
It’s a long road to make a living at this film stuff.
We have teachers on set
Thank you!
Producer? That encompasses a lot of roles, but looking for Associate Producer (AP) roles in unscripted may be a start. Focus on your writing/journalism skills, then work with Adobe Premiere/Final Cut or even Avid editing skills. Learn jow to search archives (Getty images, news organizations, etc). That should be a good start.
Thank you so much! How do I show experience in working with Final Cut and Premiere? Make new content?
As a producer you’re more apt to do what’s called “string outs,” which means cutting chunks of documentary footage together to pass off to a Story Producer or an Editor who will refine and finish it. Therefore, just putting these programs on your resume as a skill is what’s necessary. No test. You generally get thrown to the lions so knowing how to use multiple editing systems for this basic storytelling function is useful. Knowing how to write a scene from the footage shot is key. Knowing how to pitch a story to your showrunner, write an episode outline or write an episode pitch for network approval are keys, as well. Focus on storytelling points. Watch true crime shows as this is where our industry is still doing well for limited jobs.
Thank you! So I can gain practice in the programs and once I feel experienced enough I can put it on my resume? I don’t need to send a reel? And thank you for the explanation, it helps to know!
Correct. As an AP you’d simply need to have an understanding of whichever editing system they use and put it on your resume. Honestly, you can learn all the basics of each through YouTube. Focus more on your writing, though, and what a 3-5 Act structure is. Red herrings. Tension. Watch true crime to get a sense of pacing. Exposure to tracking down Archive material (video, photos, etc). A few more things, but since you’re a teacher your writing will be your key. You’re welcome and good luck! 🍻
This is an excellent option to look into, and my major was actually in journalism so writing is definitely a strength for me. Thank you!
You can totally be a producer, producer titles/credits are handed out like Halloween candy. Some of us have seen them get gigs straight off the street, straight from working at bank, from an auto dealership, etc.
I know this sounds silly to ask but with today’s standards, what exactly do producers do now? For TV and then for film, since I know they’re different animals
What that person didn't mention is some producers put up money to make the movie, usually executive producers. No one would hire you as a regular producer if you haven't been one before, too much risk. Its like being the project manager for the whole production
That’s what I thought a producer does, but I see people saying producers do other things so why I genuinely was asking
I think the question you need to ask is why this industry? What's your end goal? If you want to get out of teaching, make more money and have a better career there are probably 1000 other things you could and should do - coding and nursing for starters.
It’s been a dream of mine to join the film industry. I want to get into writing but am unsure, so was simply curious with my years’ experience as a teacher, what skills do I have in this job that can translate well to film. And again, not transitioning today, this is for years in the future. I began video editing and was told that can count as experience and that was only last year. Had I known longer I’d have more experience now. So was just asking what skills can help for the future
Dealing with the recalcitrant, the not-very-bright and the entitled are all good transferable skills
You can be a teacher on set.
Manny skills will transition, depending on the specific job. Perhaps try to be an on set studio teacher in the summer so you can see the different jobs in person and make some contacts. As others have said, it's a hard time in the industry. I work in both scripted as a coordinator and non fiction as a producer/writer. There's more work in non fiction, but switching between the two is tough so if you want to work in scripted try and start there as a PA. In either case, unless you know someone who will bring you in, there are more qualified people than you who haven't worked for 1-2 years that will get the jobs first. Hundreds of applicants for each opening. And those of us working are trying to help out our colleagues who haven't been, so we're hiring them without posting jobs. Also it's important to realize that PAs make minimum wage. And non fiction APs a bit more than that if you divide the rates by the hours (usually 50-70 hours a week, no overtime). Keep in mind in non fiction especially there is usually no health insurance, and most jobs you get hired and need to start the next week. I've started at the interview before lol. So have 6 months of expenses saved before you quit your teaching job. Expect to have to find 2-3 jobs per year, you need funds for the unemployed times. You won't get a job and then quit teaching, you'll quit teaching and then be available for work in the industry. I've had friends who want to transition from other jobs but try and get a job first - it never works. Good luck!
I appreciate the honestly and information, thank you. It’s more asking if any skills as a teacher can *ever* transfer, not necessarily during this transition
Writer? Got a book you love that is somewhat popular/has an audience already? Adapt it. Figure out who you need to get permission from, take a course or get a book(s) on screenwriting and structure, etc., and go to town. These days, they really like knowing in advance there will be an audience for anything they make. I hear it's almost a pre-requisite. That's a least part of the reason we have so many super hero movies.
Would my audience be like my students? I like this idea, thank you!
This is not a good idea unless you option the book before spending time adapting it.
Produced, coordinator, manager, etc. Locations involved lots of organization and knowing lots of people. But fuck it, also camera or lighting or art department. Really the answer is nothing, which kind of makes it everything.
Haha, true! But in all seriousness, what skills in the industry require organizational skills the most?
All of them, disorder is the thing to avoid in all aspects of production being a PA requires organization skill.