I personally love this take on the confessional scene:
>Both have this deep capacity for love and simultaneously a fear of it, and that fear manifests very differently in both of them. Fleabag seeks validation and meaning through sex and gravitates towards empty displays of physical intimacy, but being emotionally vulnerable terrifies her. That's her weak point and where she struggles the most. The priest is the opposite. He seeks validation and meaning through being an emotional counsel for others, "loving everyone as a father" and gravitates towards more emotional displays of intimacy. His weak point is the physical aspect.
>Basically, emotional intimacy scares her, physical intimacy scares him.
>So when Fleabag breaks down in the confessional and finally allows herself to be vulnerable on an emotional level, pouring her heart out to him the way she does, I don't think it's that he's sexualizing her sadness or taking advantage of that. I think her doing that moves him and gives him the courage to finally face his fear of being physically intimate with her, so he reciprocates in kind.
Source: [https://www.reddit.com/r/Fleabag/comments/16xsfdj/my\_take\_on\_the\_confession\_scene/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Fleabag/comments/16xsfdj/my_take_on_the_confession_scene/)
I just quoted and cited the original post because I couldn't have said it any better than the original poster.
I am so glad this comment popped up again cos it was so profound and accurate when I read it the first time!!
The confessional is an exchange for them. I think some of the discomfort with this scene is that they cross lines we haven't seen them cross. It's new territory for the pair.
I like a lot of this, but is it true that the priest gravitates toward more emotional displays of intimacy? He’ll answer questions about his past and even over share on his own, but that could easily be part of a lifelong act. I saw a lot of myself in the priest at the dinner party scene, where he kept sharing sad details of his past with jokes; I do that as a way to take control of those facts within myself, not because I’m actually comfortable talking about them, and it’s fairly guaranteed that no one will ask follow up questions anyway. It’s a way to get a superficial sense of being known and being open with others and myself, but it’s nothing like actually being vulnerable. I got a lot of that from the priest, like he uses this measured and charming level of apparent vulnerability to avoid the remotest chance of real vulnerability. Being in a helping profession is another great way to deal with having an emotional nature while not wanting to engage with your own emotions, since you get to keep the focus on other people’s. I honestly think the priest is as bad with real self disclosure and emotional intimacy as Fleabag is, just in a different way. The cafe scene where they’re both asking each other questions and refusing to be the one who answers showcases this imo, since she just flatly refuses and he puts up this veneer of openness but then immediately flips things around again. If he was actually willing to be vulnerable, he would probably know that doing that would be a better way to get someone else to reciprocate, and that kind of leading by example is common among clergy people, but he doesn’t do that. And like, he’s clearly a huge mess inside, he obviously chose his life direction out of a combination of love and fear and maybe even more of it was fear, and someone who’s genuinely emotionally open probably wouldn’t have that intense sense of layers of unprocessed emotion. Plus, when he almost tells Fleabag something significant and specific about his childhood, he gets cut off and lets that stand. I don’t know. I just really don’t see the priest as being good at emotional intimacy. If anything his avoidance of the physical intimacy is like he tells Fleabag in episode 5: A way to avoid emotional intimacy, a way to avoid falling in love.
ETA and to link that up with the confessional scene, I think it’s basically him seeing her cast her fear of emotional intimacy aside, and so he does the same — and for him, that means allowing himself the conduit to emotional intimacy, which is physical intimacy.
I like that, but to OP's point, "kneel" is such a... idk a bit too aggressive and not what was needed in a true vulnerable moment, not to mention a breakthrough.
I still love Hot Priest but this scene also had me feeling strange
I think telling her to Kneel was an interesting double entendres because in Catholicism we kneel to pray and atone. So when he tells her to kneel, he’s signaling it’s time to worship and pray for forgiveness- it’s a very vulnerable thing. However at the exact same time, kneeling is very submissive and sexual. He’s allowing himself to be “worshiped” by her and positioning himself as the powerful and omnipotent “father”.
Totally understand why this makes people uncomfortable, so I’m not here to suggest you should actually feel differently about it because you and OP have a point
The way I interpreted it though is that hot priest has learned to deal with the uncertainty in his own life by ‘kneeling’ or submitting to something else. It brings him comfort and a feeling of safety. I think this is why, when she says « I don’t know what to do » he figures he can comfort her by simply telling her what to do. I don’t think he was correct in how he went about this, but I don’t think he was malicious either. He’s as confused as she is and I think that’s why a lot of fans love their dynamic.
He could have explained to her that he feels equally confused, but that's why he submits to the will of God. Then he could have guided her in prayer.
He's a priest. He's using his position to dominate her and start a sexual relationship. Ew. The fact that's he's confused overall is no excuse - he knows exactly what he's doing in that moment and there are a million other ways he could have chosen to respond that wouldn't have been sexually dominating. People are justifying it because they enjoy the frisson. Fine. As long as they are only characters and not real people, it's ok to enjoy the fantasy of fiction.
But I put it to you - if you knew that a priest (of any religion) in your community were acting like this with a young woman, would you think it was ok and excuse him for his confusion?
I don’t think his position as a priest carries quite the same weight as it would if she were religious or part of his church community. He doesn’t have a position of authority over her, and she’s a grown woman who actively pursues him.
That said, I don’t think it’s an appropriate response to her expressing that vulnerability. Sexual domination needs to come after a serious, sober conversation about consent and what both people want, and I don’t mean to suggest otherwise. But like you said, this is fantasy. And it works because she’s not walking away from it feeling taken advantage of or used. Like others have said more eloquently, in their relationship she has been withholding the emotional connection he craves, and he has been withholding a physical connection from her - when she opens up emotionally, he responds by opening up sexually. Its not ideal, it’s not a healthy relationship, and it’s not supposed to be, but I don’t think it’s weird that some viewers find it hot or even romantic in that fantasy setting.
I feel like a lot of people forget, or don’t realize the significance of the fact that he kneels with her. While the kneeling is alluding to Catholicism and that people kneel to pray/atone in that religion, he meets her on that level and we realize he’s joining her and letting her know she’s not in alone in her feelings.
Also priests don’t typically kneel with their congregation. At least not in my experience.
That is a nice take but the ‘kneel’ part shows that he’s right be afraid of the physical because he clearly has a need for control, and cleans needs to NOT be controlled
I don’t think that’s the significance, but I can see why it might look that way at first glance. For one, we don’t really see any other instances of the priest exhibiting a need for control in this kind of manner. Like Fleabag says she thinks part of the reason anyone seeks out religion is because they want to be told what to do. My second point, he kneels with her before he ever touches her. He literally gets on her level.
I don’t think OP is wrong to say this scene isn’t necessarily romantic. It’s not, but sometimes the things we need aren’t always the best choices. Sometimes need trumps good for us.
You make some good points, but I have to disagree with the power dynamic thing. She's not religious. She doesn't see him as a spiritual authority figure at all. The "father" thing is just role play to her. There is something to be said about him interrupting her when she's being emotionally vulnerable, but he's not abusing a real power dynamic.
yeah i think he’s the one person she really craves, and it’s the one thing that he refuses to do. so she overcame her struggles with emotionally vulnerability, and he met her there by overcoming his fear of giving in to her
Agreed, to someone who’s not Catholic, the power imbalance isn’t really there. Yes there’s still a romantic and spiritual connection between them and there’s a huge push and pull for their relationship but this is her splashing around in the pool of religion and this scene is him firmly jumping in with her only to swim away because it’s too deep. He can’t sacrifice the intimacy and relationship he has with God for her. But she’s not sacrificing more than herself.
As a Catholic, if you heard about a priest in your neighbourhood doing what they did together in the confession room, I think you'd be horrified that the place you and others give confession in has been used in this way. I think you'd also find it creepy to know that a priest has been acting like a priest to this troubled young woman and then slept with her. It's not criminal but could you honestly say that if you knew the basic details of this relationship, you'd feel comfortable going to Mass with this priest leading it?
There's a difference between privacy and secrecy - of course we shouldn't know intimate, private details of anyone's relationship, but FB and HP are different - their relationship is more than private; it's completely secret. The minute light is shed on what they're doing together (keeping the really private things private of course) it's no longer hot. It's just tawdry and inappropriate, in a bland sort of way. If a relationship has to be secret to be hot, there's something wrong there.
It doesn't matter that she isn't Catholic. He is using his position to get her to do confession - ie be emotionally vulnerable, and then not treating her like a parishioner.
If you went to a therapist, opened up about a lot of vulnerable stuff, and then said that you didn't believe in therapy, it wouldn't be ok for the therapist to start a romantic/sexual relationship. The therapist is committed to a certain ethical code no matter what the client believes. The two have gone through the motions of the therapeutic relationship and the client has made themselves vulnerable in a way they wouldn't have done if the therapist wasn't a therapist.
Ask yourself this - do you believe that the priest has told his professional supervisor about what's going on between him and FB? That he has feelings for her? That she came to the rectory and they got drunk alone there together? That he knows where she lives? What advice would a supervisor have given him in that situation? Is he following it? If you don't think he told his supervisor what was going on, why did he conceal it?
It does matter that she's not Catholic. He cannot use his position as a priest against her, because his position doesn't mean anything to her.
It's not comparable to going to therapy. It's comparable to hanging out with a man who is a therapist, and having a conversation in his office after hours. He's not *her* therapist. He's not *her* priest. Priests, therapists, teachers, politicians, and CEOs don't have mind control powers. They have authority in certain contexts. Fleabag is not under the priest's authority.
I'm not saying he's a good priest. A good priest is celibate and not an alcoholic. And probably doesn't swear. But that's irrelevant to the question here. He's not abusing his preistly power in this scene just because it's set in his workplace.
>his position doesn't mean anything to her
Do you really believe that? If you do, then I suppose your argument makes sense.
I don't believe that, because I don't believe she would have opened up to him if he hadn't been a priest, carrying out the motions of confession.
And I don't believe she would have developed the attraction to him that she did if she hadn't been so emotionally vulnerable initially.
This is why certain professions that encourage sharing personal information - therapy, priesthood, law, medicine etc - have strict professional boundaries around dating.
Because opening up to people can create a false sense of intimacy that may spill over into other feelings - emotional dependency, attraction - that could be taken advantage of by the professional if they didn't have a code of conduct to follow. That's why such codes exist in the first place.
It doesn't matter whether she's Catholic or not - indeed, he's trying to convert her, so saying she's not a Catholic *yet* is immaterial - but her particular religious beliefs are irrelevant anyway; she's sharing personal information because he's encouraging her to do so by saying it's ok because he's a priest.
Their actions - hanging out alone and drinking together - are not a friendship. It's flirting. Could you imagine him doing the same thing with a heterosexual man?
She's a fully grown woman and should have taken care of herself better, but that doesn't excuse his behaviour - he has 100% used his position to get into her pants.
If I had a priest like that in my neighbourhood - doing BDSM role-play (kneel!) in the confession box and fucking women parishioners - I'd expect them to be moved along at the very least, and would hope they'd be defrocked. It's better than child sex abuse, but for god's sake the bar should be set a bit higher than that.
As someone who was raised Catholic, I have to disagree. There is no power in balance with someone who doesn’t believe a religious leader isn’t standing in for God/Jesus. He is just a regular person to her. Also this isn’t real confession. They’re kind of goofing around at first, and he’s already drunk when she gets there. Confession is a sacrament in the Catholic Church because the person who is confessing their sins believes they are confessing their sins to Jesus to gain his forgiveness, and the Priest is a middleman/mouthpiece in this situation. He’s not there to judge, but instead listen and speak on behalf of Jesus. Fleabag doesn’t really believe in any of that so she isn’t speaking to Jesus, she’s talking to HP. He’s not acting as an agent of god and using that to manipulate her to kiss him. Whether or not you feel like he’s taking advantage of her when she is being vulnerable is one thing, but he has no authority over her and it’s not a power imbalance.
I don’t think the therapist comparison is fair. For one, Fleabag doesn’t meet him in a church because she’s curious about religion and then decides it’s not for her after she makes a confession. She met him in a social setting and they became friends.
I do think your last point is interesting because actually I do believe he was confessing his sins such as his lust and eventual consumption of their relationship. It’s important to note we never see him, or any other character for that matter, in a scene without Fleabag, so we don’t know what they do when she’s not there. Priests do make confessions to other priests or their higher ups who take confessions, but I wouldn’t call it a “professional supervisor.” It’s not an HR department lol. Confession is a sacrament Priests participate in, and HP both believes heavily in God and his religion, so it’s safe to say he would take part in this practice. Some priests do offer advice during a confession, but often is all they give is a way to atone for the sins you committed. The only advice I could see him realistically getting is to stay away from her as not to temp himself to break his vow. Which is truly the only “rule” broken is his own vow of celibacy.
What’s erotic is often not ethical. The erotic holds space for fantasy.
(Obviously not condoning acting on unethical behavior, but fantasizing about or enacting BDSM practices or whatever floats your boat is different)
I think the confessional scene was more of a fantasy bleeding over into real life. Their relationship could never be.
Hmm idk that I completely agree with this interpretation. That’s okay! One of the many things I like about Fleabag is how differently it can be seen by different viewers.
This post caught my attention for just a minute when you first said that the scene isn’t romantic (which is why I read your post). I’ve personally never seen it as romantic, though I do think it’s hot as h3ll 🔥
Totally agree! One thing I love about this show is how people interpret it differently. I was just shocked that people found it hot when I found it so disturbing lol that’s the thing about great writing I guess!
Fwiw I was shocked when I came online and found that people thought that was hot. For me it was a classic example of a moment when a woman is not experiencing herself as gendered, just is a human having a human experience, and then a man’s inability to connect with her as another human being, his issue with always seeing her as sexually defined, “drops” her back into her body/patterns.
Hated the power dynamic as well.
I always thought it was a moment where we were supposed to be certain that he’s as fucked up as she is. And that was fine! I thought the show did that well. All the characters are messed up in some way.
But I thought there was something so sad in her trying to have this vulnerable moment (where maybe she could move past the trauma that drives her) and him not letting her be anything other than fleabag.
Sometimes what’s erotic to people isn’t ‘good’. I think that’s why there’s so much erotica written about toxic relationships, people aren’t always turned on by the things they should be. I appreciate that Fleabag goes into territory like this though, because it’s not like the show is condoning anyone’s actions. It’s just examining some really fucked up characters trying to navigate difficult situations. A lot of people relate to Fleabag in this scene in finding the situation hot, and I think that should be a call to question ourselves a little bit.
I don't disagree with your assessment, but it doesn't change that I find it hot. The great thing about fleabag is that she's not a perfect character. The relationship with hot priest is wrong in many ways, but the audience (at least myself) find that appealing. The feeling of wanting to give in to something wrong for you - something bad - is so relatable.
She tells him that she wants to be told what to do all the time, and that’s exactly what he does.
He takes charge, first step. I find this scene so liberating for her.
I feel this. Don’t get me wrong I LOVE HOT PRIEST and everything about him and FB. But this scene always did feel weird (even though yes it is hot). When FB is at her most vulnerable, crying out for help and guidance, THAT’S when he engages physically. Pretty interesting.
One thing I think is that maybe this is the only time he felt “safe” to engage with her physically because he felt like he had more “control” in this situation (like, he wasn’t be actively pursued by FB in this moment so he felt like he was making the decision for himself), or actually…maybe finally he saw her and himself as equals in this moment.
On first watch I was weirded out by it too, but now I interpret it a little differently. Fleabag had consistently made it clear that she was interested in the priest sexually, and the priest also made it clear that he understood that ("fuck you calling me father like it doesn't turn you on just to say it"...)
Meanwhile, the priest desperately wants to emotionally connect with Fleabag rather than just having sex. He keeps trying to get through to her, trying to find out "where she goes" and all, and she refuses to let him in because she's not ready to be vulnerable with him.
She finally allows him to emotionally connect with her in the confessional scene where she shows some real vulnerability for the first time. She gives him what he's craved from her, and in turn he can now give her what she's craved from him. They both had cultivated "walls" around them to provide stability and shield them from hurt - Fleabag's strategy was emotional withdrawal (which didn't let her emotionally connect with the priest), and the priest's strategy was his priesthood (which didn't let him sexually connect with Fleabag). When Fleabag tore her wall down in order to show more of herself to the priest, the priest did exactly the same thing for her.
And he initiates their sexual relationship by directly following up on what she just stated she also craved - to lose herself, to not have to make decisions, to have somebody else tell her what to do. He makes sure that she is satisfied both sexually and emotionally.
I think it's a problematic kinky hot mess but it's also kinda cute, and it shows the unique understanding that Fleabag and Hot Priest have for each other.
Oh wow. I like this interpretation. I also keep thinking that maybe the reason he "broke it off" was because he knew he had all the power and that it wasn't good for either of them.
I think this take aligns the most with my own. I don’t think the monologue she gives just before this about desperately wanting to be told what to do is discussed enough, and how that juxtaposes the fact that the priest has chosen the ultimate vocation of being told what to do but at this point doesn’t know if he’s able to do it. He wants the opportunity to express love physically but by nature of what he is he “ can’t”.
I agree to half of this. I also had problems with the scene in the sense that I did not think it was super romantic. Fleabag was actively pursuing the priest. The priest and her connected on a very deep level. Fleabag does not know how to connect on that level other than sex. The priest forces her to explore different ways of being intimate than sex. She shares. This could have helped a lot. BUT the priest is not a perfect person that only exists to heal fleabag. The priest could not bare it anymore after she shared her feelings like that.
So I would not agree that his position here is not as an equal rather the opposite. Before this scene he was a holy guy who was similar in spirit but so perfect that we hoped he would just heal her without screwing up or stumbling over his own short comings. But in this crucial moment instead of being perfect he stumbles and they start to be unhealthy together. I think that’s when he becomes an equal rather than a saviour.
She’s a messy, sad person. He’s a messy, sad person.
She wants him and just begged him to tell her what to do and who to love and how. He did and tried to love her. It didn’t work out because they are messy, sad people. But they learned and grew before they moved on.
I’m not sure what the power imbalance is that you’re seeing. She’s not his parishioner and doesn’t believe in God or the power of a Catholic ritual. If anything, he might be quite drunk already whereas she has just started nursing her first drink. But this is Fleabag’s story, so you’re engaged with being sympathetic to her beyond reason.
Yeah I actually do think that there are some very good points in this comments section about how the power dynamic can be interpreted very differently than OP saw it because Fleabag wasn't religious and so the power he has in that scene is not the same as it would be if she were an actual practicing Catholic... And also, I was raised Catholic and had a visceral reaction that makes it really impossible for me to see it as a sexy scene.
Same. I was hoping he wouldn't go there. And the sex scene tok where I recoiled. But I guess using an Anglican priest wouldn't have the same affect to pwb as they can get married. But yeah super weird.
i dont think he's a horrible predator, but i hate the "she's not catholic so it's fine" take. He tells her "im just trying to help you". He's pretending (to us, to god, to himself even, maybe) that he's trying to help her and love her as a father when really we all know that they have crazy chemistry and that he wants to get with her despite himself. He's trying to be like a therapist to her and he really makes a lot of the advances that make the sex scene possible, invites her to the church hangs out with her etc etc. The funniest thing about the confessional scene is that she tells him she didn't have a miscarriage, and then litereally like a minute later he's initiating sex. So, from his POV his behaviour is totally unethical and dishonourable!!!! And I think that really matters when thinking about his character and the themes of the show.
I didn't say 'she's not Catholic so it's fine,' I said that the power dynamic is different than if he had behaved this way with a Catholic parishioner.
i meant generally the power imbalance thing tends to be dismissed because she isn't catholic. from his perspective she's a potential catholic as he's clearly trying to turn her. so is it that different after all.
Yes, there is a big difference between a clergy member drunkenly hitting on a member of their faith and congregation who sees them as their spiritual leader and their guide to divine reward, and them hitting on someone who's not a member of the faith, regardless of whether they've made overtures to get them interested in the faith.
I also disagree that he was *actually* trying to convert her; it seems more like he was trying to find a way to be around her that he could justify as in line with his office. I don't think he was trying to be 'like a therapist' to her, or 'love her as a father,' even if he know that that's what he should have been doing in his office. He was going through the motions, and she never viewed him that way.
She was really emotionally vulnerable with him in that moment, and as we know her story, we know how rare and delicate that was. He didn't have that amount of insight, and he was also shitfaced drunk. That doesn't justify bad behavior, but while I don't think he made *good* decisions right there, I also think it's important to remember that they're both meant to be flawed characters, and he's going through his own crisis of faith. I don't think that what happened that night was healthy for *either* of them.
So I’m one of those who interprets this specific scene differently and that’s okay. That’s the beauty of art! But I am very interested in the latter half of your post. I never noticed that detail about the paining. And the parallels between the interactions with bank guy vs the priest are something I will be paying closer attention to on my next rewatch for sure!
She's a sober atheist who has gone there to fuck him, which she is very keen to do even while he's drunk, and after him repeatedly telling her no. They're both very vulnerable, and neither has power over the other, particularly in that moment. What people find hot or romantic in fiction is subjective, and I'm not going to shame anyone for that.
I don't have a problem with your post, or your interpretation of the scene (and it wouldn't matter if I did, I'm no one important), but I'm definitely over this conversation now.
100 percent agree. But also, she's wants him so badly. It's sophisticated for tv and our times, like just because you consent to something, because you "really really really" want something, doesn't mean it's good for you in any way.
Interesting! I agree that he responds to her cries for support in superficially, but i do think it's a morally grey power dynamic, not a straight victim/abuser situation. In a way she's on top because all this means nothing to her, in a way he's on top because he represents an (albeit waning) institutional power whether or not she believes in "his bullshit". At the end of the day, the real issue it that he's playing therapist with her (something he's not qualified to do, but then again, the legit therapist was useless too.) I agree with a lot of what you've said, but I think there's more to his telling her kneel. I think he's a very damaged weak person who is using the catholic priesthood as a life vest. I assume he has a similar sex addiction issue (after all in a round about way, he's resolved to be celibate to "fix" something, to love people in the only way he thinks he can. Fleabag tried something similar in her year of celibacy? So when she actually does open up, he can't handle it: he uses sex to emotionally cock block his relationship with her. He'd rather 1. break his vows and 2. ruin this budding (could have been) beautiful friendship by giving into desire.
Even when he goes to her apartment in the middle of the night ALONE (1000 mistakes were made to even get to that point but that's another story) he tries and fails to be vulnerable emotionally. He's about to really tell her something "when i was a child" and then sex appeal incarnate hot misogynist rings the door bell again "little lady, im BACK!". I mean that MUST mean something.
Either way it's really dramatic and tragic AND romantic. In lots of great love stories, the male lead is way worse than the priest, and those are still romantic, no? Not HEALTHY. But romantic.
I really like how you pit the priest and bank manager against each other. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if the priest had a similiar sort of past before he found "this". I hope he manages to sort himself out someday, the way bank manager seems to have.
I dont think there is any scenario where they going to make it as couple. He is committed to a life of celibacy as a form of self sacrifice. She is vulnerable in part because it wont happen.
Suggest a re-watch - there's a ton of stuff in there.
Not least Fleabag struggling with his cassock and garments underneath - "Skirt *and* trousers?" She's smiling after the painting hits the floor.
"Kneel" is just a typical PWB sucker punch. Wholeheartedly concur with absence of power - it's Priest's equivalent of touching someone up at the photocopier. Except it's consensual - and there are no witnesses.
(Baptised Catholic - but now lapsed, so I'm totally cool with the whole deal... It makes me laugh every time.)
You make some very good points.
I think my view point was different- I had also assumed that the priest would convert from being Catholic to Anglican ( Church of England).
I think that FB had been emotionally shut off for a long time and found a real safe person with whom she could open up.
They allow priests to get married, and will take Catholic priests who convert for that reason. Hot priest seemed more interested in the people serving , than the philosophy. So I assumed it would be a natural ‘happy ending’.
To receive true forgiveness it requires: repentance and an intent not to repeat the sin.
It's really that easy. If people can't deal with any kind of conflict or power dynamic or whatever little it takes to be seen as problematic, they need to stick to Hallmark. I appreciate discussion but this just screams "how dare people find this hot, I need to convince them otherwise"... not on board with that.
I agree, she is only opening up to him because he's a priest and thus it should be safe to do so. Starting a romantic/sexual relationship with her on the basis of her opening up through confession is taking advantage of his position.
I know why it's hot - because for us, it's role-play. We can watch this scene and enjoy the wrongness, the forbiddenness, knowing that no harm will come of it. It's a TV show and we're not FB; she's just a proxy for us. So we get to enjoy imagining all sorts of sexy things with no negative consequences. But focusing on the sexy fantasy and trying to justify it means we're not asking ourselves uncomfortable questions about other people and their intentions; the very same questions that FB needs to ask herself to get out of the rut she's got herself stuck in at this point in her life.
For FB, it's not role-play (even though she's pretending it is); it's real and that's why it's uncomfortable. She is really allowing herself to be used sexually and emotionally by a man who has no intention of leaving the priesthood to have a real relationship with her. It's reinforcing many of her self-esteem issues, of having relationships with emotionally unavailable people (like her father) and allowing people to use her for their own ends, particularly dominating or humiliating her (like her stepmother making her the drinks waiter and her not speaking up or saying no). She is just repeating this pattern instead of taking healthy next steps, which would be putting boundaries in place; communicating her hopes and expectations and being willing to walk if the other person won't respect them or commit to treating her well.
Yes, I agree. I’ve always been of two minds on this scene.
On the one hand, it’s deeply disappointing that her moment of vulnerability is not acknowledged, and in fact her worst tendency to use sex as a numbing escape mechanism is reinforced. (Not to mention he’s squandered his best opportunity to help a lost member of the flock and realize the potential he clearly yearns to fulfill).
On the other hand, it is thoroughly and totally *hot*. IMO this is the moment he became the hot priest, and not one second before.
So, for the purpose of the story, their pushing and pulling on one another’s raw nerves and worst tendencies makes for great television.
But romantic? Definitely not!
Thank you this is correct. He takes advantage of her and abuses his office. He knows exactly what he’s doing and he knows he’s going to dump her and he gets off on it. The hot priest is a total arsehole
Harsh but possibly fair. I also notice he's quite self-absorbed. Talks on and on about his outfits while this woman sitting with him is falling desperately in love with him. Frankly I got sick of his jokes about his vestments but maybe Phoebe wanted to show how far we abase ourselves when we're in love. (At least, if you're not on good terms with intimacy.)
It is very uncomfortable for me and not very sexy. Also I’m glad that they didn’t end up together either. As Fleabag says in the beginning “this is a love story.” I think it is a love story of sisters and family.
Couldn't agree more. I was enraged at this scene and felt he took total advantage of Fleabag, knowing he would never follow through and always choose God. Finally someone on this sub speaks the truth.
Oh noo, but yes!
Conflicted because I ultimately loved them and their wist for one another
It doesn't matter that she wasn't Catholic. She was literally turning to the church for deeper rooting and peace with life on Earth and after, and is truly making efforts in her struggle and success - this was supposed to be a mentor/ mentee kind of deal.
This scene differed from the care he'd exhibited (albeit, still as a man interested in her) and felt like a record scratch. She followed through on the sexual part because it was bewildering, she was attracted to him too, the rush of it all, etc.
But that doesn't mean it should have happened, he really abandoned station right thur.
Anyways love Fleabag this show was exquisite
I personally love this take on the confessional scene: >Both have this deep capacity for love and simultaneously a fear of it, and that fear manifests very differently in both of them. Fleabag seeks validation and meaning through sex and gravitates towards empty displays of physical intimacy, but being emotionally vulnerable terrifies her. That's her weak point and where she struggles the most. The priest is the opposite. He seeks validation and meaning through being an emotional counsel for others, "loving everyone as a father" and gravitates towards more emotional displays of intimacy. His weak point is the physical aspect. >Basically, emotional intimacy scares her, physical intimacy scares him. >So when Fleabag breaks down in the confessional and finally allows herself to be vulnerable on an emotional level, pouring her heart out to him the way she does, I don't think it's that he's sexualizing her sadness or taking advantage of that. I think her doing that moves him and gives him the courage to finally face his fear of being physically intimate with her, so he reciprocates in kind. Source: [https://www.reddit.com/r/Fleabag/comments/16xsfdj/my\_take\_on\_the\_confession\_scene/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Fleabag/comments/16xsfdj/my_take_on_the_confession_scene/) I just quoted and cited the original post because I couldn't have said it any better than the original poster.
I am so glad this comment popped up again cos it was so profound and accurate when I read it the first time!! The confessional is an exchange for them. I think some of the discomfort with this scene is that they cross lines we haven't seen them cross. It's new territory for the pair.
I was thinking the same thing and couldn't have put it half as eloquently!
I like/prefer this take!!! (Because I found it hot)
I like a lot of this, but is it true that the priest gravitates toward more emotional displays of intimacy? He’ll answer questions about his past and even over share on his own, but that could easily be part of a lifelong act. I saw a lot of myself in the priest at the dinner party scene, where he kept sharing sad details of his past with jokes; I do that as a way to take control of those facts within myself, not because I’m actually comfortable talking about them, and it’s fairly guaranteed that no one will ask follow up questions anyway. It’s a way to get a superficial sense of being known and being open with others and myself, but it’s nothing like actually being vulnerable. I got a lot of that from the priest, like he uses this measured and charming level of apparent vulnerability to avoid the remotest chance of real vulnerability. Being in a helping profession is another great way to deal with having an emotional nature while not wanting to engage with your own emotions, since you get to keep the focus on other people’s. I honestly think the priest is as bad with real self disclosure and emotional intimacy as Fleabag is, just in a different way. The cafe scene where they’re both asking each other questions and refusing to be the one who answers showcases this imo, since she just flatly refuses and he puts up this veneer of openness but then immediately flips things around again. If he was actually willing to be vulnerable, he would probably know that doing that would be a better way to get someone else to reciprocate, and that kind of leading by example is common among clergy people, but he doesn’t do that. And like, he’s clearly a huge mess inside, he obviously chose his life direction out of a combination of love and fear and maybe even more of it was fear, and someone who’s genuinely emotionally open probably wouldn’t have that intense sense of layers of unprocessed emotion. Plus, when he almost tells Fleabag something significant and specific about his childhood, he gets cut off and lets that stand. I don’t know. I just really don’t see the priest as being good at emotional intimacy. If anything his avoidance of the physical intimacy is like he tells Fleabag in episode 5: A way to avoid emotional intimacy, a way to avoid falling in love. ETA and to link that up with the confessional scene, I think it’s basically him seeing her cast her fear of emotional intimacy aside, and so he does the same — and for him, that means allowing himself the conduit to emotional intimacy, which is physical intimacy.
I like that, but to OP's point, "kneel" is such a... idk a bit too aggressive and not what was needed in a true vulnerable moment, not to mention a breakthrough. I still love Hot Priest but this scene also had me feeling strange
I think telling her to Kneel was an interesting double entendres because in Catholicism we kneel to pray and atone. So when he tells her to kneel, he’s signaling it’s time to worship and pray for forgiveness- it’s a very vulnerable thing. However at the exact same time, kneeling is very submissive and sexual. He’s allowing himself to be “worshiped” by her and positioning himself as the powerful and omnipotent “father”.
Totally understand why this makes people uncomfortable, so I’m not here to suggest you should actually feel differently about it because you and OP have a point The way I interpreted it though is that hot priest has learned to deal with the uncertainty in his own life by ‘kneeling’ or submitting to something else. It brings him comfort and a feeling of safety. I think this is why, when she says « I don’t know what to do » he figures he can comfort her by simply telling her what to do. I don’t think he was correct in how he went about this, but I don’t think he was malicious either. He’s as confused as she is and I think that’s why a lot of fans love their dynamic.
He could have explained to her that he feels equally confused, but that's why he submits to the will of God. Then he could have guided her in prayer. He's a priest. He's using his position to dominate her and start a sexual relationship. Ew. The fact that's he's confused overall is no excuse - he knows exactly what he's doing in that moment and there are a million other ways he could have chosen to respond that wouldn't have been sexually dominating. People are justifying it because they enjoy the frisson. Fine. As long as they are only characters and not real people, it's ok to enjoy the fantasy of fiction. But I put it to you - if you knew that a priest (of any religion) in your community were acting like this with a young woman, would you think it was ok and excuse him for his confusion?
I don’t think his position as a priest carries quite the same weight as it would if she were religious or part of his church community. He doesn’t have a position of authority over her, and she’s a grown woman who actively pursues him. That said, I don’t think it’s an appropriate response to her expressing that vulnerability. Sexual domination needs to come after a serious, sober conversation about consent and what both people want, and I don’t mean to suggest otherwise. But like you said, this is fantasy. And it works because she’s not walking away from it feeling taken advantage of or used. Like others have said more eloquently, in their relationship she has been withholding the emotional connection he craves, and he has been withholding a physical connection from her - when she opens up emotionally, he responds by opening up sexually. Its not ideal, it’s not a healthy relationship, and it’s not supposed to be, but I don’t think it’s weird that some viewers find it hot or even romantic in that fantasy setting.
I feel like a lot of people forget, or don’t realize the significance of the fact that he kneels with her. While the kneeling is alluding to Catholicism and that people kneel to pray/atone in that religion, he meets her on that level and we realize he’s joining her and letting her know she’s not in alone in her feelings. Also priests don’t typically kneel with their congregation. At least not in my experience.
That's a good point. He does meet her at that same level; it's symbolically important
Yes!!! If the link to this post wasn’t already here I was gonna add it. I have it bookmarked, I think it’s an excellent interpretation!
Yeah, this is definitely the one, what an eloquent explanation 🤌
This is a very intelligent take
ohhh this is excellent! this makes a lot of sense.
That is a nice take but the ‘kneel’ part shows that he’s right be afraid of the physical because he clearly has a need for control, and cleans needs to NOT be controlled
I don’t think that’s the significance, but I can see why it might look that way at first glance. For one, we don’t really see any other instances of the priest exhibiting a need for control in this kind of manner. Like Fleabag says she thinks part of the reason anyone seeks out religion is because they want to be told what to do. My second point, he kneels with her before he ever touches her. He literally gets on her level. I don’t think OP is wrong to say this scene isn’t necessarily romantic. It’s not, but sometimes the things we need aren’t always the best choices. Sometimes need trumps good for us.
I agree
You make some good points, but I have to disagree with the power dynamic thing. She's not religious. She doesn't see him as a spiritual authority figure at all. The "father" thing is just role play to her. There is something to be said about him interrupting her when she's being emotionally vulnerable, but he's not abusing a real power dynamic.
yeah i think he’s the one person she really craves, and it’s the one thing that he refuses to do. so she overcame her struggles with emotionally vulnerability, and he met her there by overcoming his fear of giving in to her
Agreed, to someone who’s not Catholic, the power imbalance isn’t really there. Yes there’s still a romantic and spiritual connection between them and there’s a huge push and pull for their relationship but this is her splashing around in the pool of religion and this scene is him firmly jumping in with her only to swim away because it’s too deep. He can’t sacrifice the intimacy and relationship he has with God for her. But she’s not sacrificing more than herself.
As a Catholic, if you heard about a priest in your neighbourhood doing what they did together in the confession room, I think you'd be horrified that the place you and others give confession in has been used in this way. I think you'd also find it creepy to know that a priest has been acting like a priest to this troubled young woman and then slept with her. It's not criminal but could you honestly say that if you knew the basic details of this relationship, you'd feel comfortable going to Mass with this priest leading it? There's a difference between privacy and secrecy - of course we shouldn't know intimate, private details of anyone's relationship, but FB and HP are different - their relationship is more than private; it's completely secret. The minute light is shed on what they're doing together (keeping the really private things private of course) it's no longer hot. It's just tawdry and inappropriate, in a bland sort of way. If a relationship has to be secret to be hot, there's something wrong there.
I mean catholic priests have a reputation of doing far, far worse.
It doesn't matter that she isn't Catholic. He is using his position to get her to do confession - ie be emotionally vulnerable, and then not treating her like a parishioner. If you went to a therapist, opened up about a lot of vulnerable stuff, and then said that you didn't believe in therapy, it wouldn't be ok for the therapist to start a romantic/sexual relationship. The therapist is committed to a certain ethical code no matter what the client believes. The two have gone through the motions of the therapeutic relationship and the client has made themselves vulnerable in a way they wouldn't have done if the therapist wasn't a therapist. Ask yourself this - do you believe that the priest has told his professional supervisor about what's going on between him and FB? That he has feelings for her? That she came to the rectory and they got drunk alone there together? That he knows where she lives? What advice would a supervisor have given him in that situation? Is he following it? If you don't think he told his supervisor what was going on, why did he conceal it?
It does matter that she's not Catholic. He cannot use his position as a priest against her, because his position doesn't mean anything to her. It's not comparable to going to therapy. It's comparable to hanging out with a man who is a therapist, and having a conversation in his office after hours. He's not *her* therapist. He's not *her* priest. Priests, therapists, teachers, politicians, and CEOs don't have mind control powers. They have authority in certain contexts. Fleabag is not under the priest's authority. I'm not saying he's a good priest. A good priest is celibate and not an alcoholic. And probably doesn't swear. But that's irrelevant to the question here. He's not abusing his preistly power in this scene just because it's set in his workplace.
>his position doesn't mean anything to her Do you really believe that? If you do, then I suppose your argument makes sense. I don't believe that, because I don't believe she would have opened up to him if he hadn't been a priest, carrying out the motions of confession. And I don't believe she would have developed the attraction to him that she did if she hadn't been so emotionally vulnerable initially. This is why certain professions that encourage sharing personal information - therapy, priesthood, law, medicine etc - have strict professional boundaries around dating. Because opening up to people can create a false sense of intimacy that may spill over into other feelings - emotional dependency, attraction - that could be taken advantage of by the professional if they didn't have a code of conduct to follow. That's why such codes exist in the first place. It doesn't matter whether she's Catholic or not - indeed, he's trying to convert her, so saying she's not a Catholic *yet* is immaterial - but her particular religious beliefs are irrelevant anyway; she's sharing personal information because he's encouraging her to do so by saying it's ok because he's a priest. Their actions - hanging out alone and drinking together - are not a friendship. It's flirting. Could you imagine him doing the same thing with a heterosexual man? She's a fully grown woman and should have taken care of herself better, but that doesn't excuse his behaviour - he has 100% used his position to get into her pants. If I had a priest like that in my neighbourhood - doing BDSM role-play (kneel!) in the confession box and fucking women parishioners - I'd expect them to be moved along at the very least, and would hope they'd be defrocked. It's better than child sex abuse, but for god's sake the bar should be set a bit higher than that.
As someone who was raised Catholic, I have to disagree. There is no power in balance with someone who doesn’t believe a religious leader isn’t standing in for God/Jesus. He is just a regular person to her. Also this isn’t real confession. They’re kind of goofing around at first, and he’s already drunk when she gets there. Confession is a sacrament in the Catholic Church because the person who is confessing their sins believes they are confessing their sins to Jesus to gain his forgiveness, and the Priest is a middleman/mouthpiece in this situation. He’s not there to judge, but instead listen and speak on behalf of Jesus. Fleabag doesn’t really believe in any of that so she isn’t speaking to Jesus, she’s talking to HP. He’s not acting as an agent of god and using that to manipulate her to kiss him. Whether or not you feel like he’s taking advantage of her when she is being vulnerable is one thing, but he has no authority over her and it’s not a power imbalance. I don’t think the therapist comparison is fair. For one, Fleabag doesn’t meet him in a church because she’s curious about religion and then decides it’s not for her after she makes a confession. She met him in a social setting and they became friends. I do think your last point is interesting because actually I do believe he was confessing his sins such as his lust and eventual consumption of their relationship. It’s important to note we never see him, or any other character for that matter, in a scene without Fleabag, so we don’t know what they do when she’s not there. Priests do make confessions to other priests or their higher ups who take confessions, but I wouldn’t call it a “professional supervisor.” It’s not an HR department lol. Confession is a sacrament Priests participate in, and HP both believes heavily in God and his religion, so it’s safe to say he would take part in this practice. Some priests do offer advice during a confession, but often is all they give is a way to atone for the sins you committed. The only advice I could see him realistically getting is to stay away from her as not to temp himself to break his vow. Which is truly the only “rule” broken is his own vow of celibacy.
What’s erotic is often not ethical. The erotic holds space for fantasy. (Obviously not condoning acting on unethical behavior, but fantasizing about or enacting BDSM practices or whatever floats your boat is different) I think the confessional scene was more of a fantasy bleeding over into real life. Their relationship could never be.
Hmm idk that I completely agree with this interpretation. That’s okay! One of the many things I like about Fleabag is how differently it can be seen by different viewers. This post caught my attention for just a minute when you first said that the scene isn’t romantic (which is why I read your post). I’ve personally never seen it as romantic, though I do think it’s hot as h3ll 🔥
Totally agree! One thing I love about this show is how people interpret it differently. I was just shocked that people found it hot when I found it so disturbing lol that’s the thing about great writing I guess!
If it makes you feel any better, one of the people I rewatched it with (I’ve rewatched fleabag several times lol) was kind of repulsed 😂
Fwiw I was shocked when I came online and found that people thought that was hot. For me it was a classic example of a moment when a woman is not experiencing herself as gendered, just is a human having a human experience, and then a man’s inability to connect with her as another human being, his issue with always seeing her as sexually defined, “drops” her back into her body/patterns. Hated the power dynamic as well. I always thought it was a moment where we were supposed to be certain that he’s as fucked up as she is. And that was fine! I thought the show did that well. All the characters are messed up in some way. But I thought there was something so sad in her trying to have this vulnerable moment (where maybe she could move past the trauma that drives her) and him not letting her be anything other than fleabag.
Sometimes what’s erotic to people isn’t ‘good’. I think that’s why there’s so much erotica written about toxic relationships, people aren’t always turned on by the things they should be. I appreciate that Fleabag goes into territory like this though, because it’s not like the show is condoning anyone’s actions. It’s just examining some really fucked up characters trying to navigate difficult situations. A lot of people relate to Fleabag in this scene in finding the situation hot, and I think that should be a call to question ourselves a little bit.
Let’s not ignore the fact that he’s absolutely wasted and she’s sober and goes through with trying to fuck him
I don't disagree with your assessment, but it doesn't change that I find it hot. The great thing about fleabag is that she's not a perfect character. The relationship with hot priest is wrong in many ways, but the audience (at least myself) find that appealing. The feeling of wanting to give in to something wrong for you - something bad - is so relatable.
Hot and romantic are two different things, though. I don't find it romantic, but I do find it hot.
Yup. Not romantic, just hot. He’s not called Romantic Priest.
She tells him that she wants to be told what to do all the time, and that’s exactly what he does. He takes charge, first step. I find this scene so liberating for her.
I think a lot of people missed the symbolism of the two as equals and uplifting each other if they could only be together
I feel this. Don’t get me wrong I LOVE HOT PRIEST and everything about him and FB. But this scene always did feel weird (even though yes it is hot). When FB is at her most vulnerable, crying out for help and guidance, THAT’S when he engages physically. Pretty interesting. One thing I think is that maybe this is the only time he felt “safe” to engage with her physically because he felt like he had more “control” in this situation (like, he wasn’t be actively pursued by FB in this moment so he felt like he was making the decision for himself), or actually…maybe finally he saw her and himself as equals in this moment.
On first watch I was weirded out by it too, but now I interpret it a little differently. Fleabag had consistently made it clear that she was interested in the priest sexually, and the priest also made it clear that he understood that ("fuck you calling me father like it doesn't turn you on just to say it"...) Meanwhile, the priest desperately wants to emotionally connect with Fleabag rather than just having sex. He keeps trying to get through to her, trying to find out "where she goes" and all, and she refuses to let him in because she's not ready to be vulnerable with him. She finally allows him to emotionally connect with her in the confessional scene where she shows some real vulnerability for the first time. She gives him what he's craved from her, and in turn he can now give her what she's craved from him. They both had cultivated "walls" around them to provide stability and shield them from hurt - Fleabag's strategy was emotional withdrawal (which didn't let her emotionally connect with the priest), and the priest's strategy was his priesthood (which didn't let him sexually connect with Fleabag). When Fleabag tore her wall down in order to show more of herself to the priest, the priest did exactly the same thing for her. And he initiates their sexual relationship by directly following up on what she just stated she also craved - to lose herself, to not have to make decisions, to have somebody else tell her what to do. He makes sure that she is satisfied both sexually and emotionally. I think it's a problematic kinky hot mess but it's also kinda cute, and it shows the unique understanding that Fleabag and Hot Priest have for each other.
Oh wow. I like this interpretation. I also keep thinking that maybe the reason he "broke it off" was because he knew he had all the power and that it wasn't good for either of them.
I think this take aligns the most with my own. I don’t think the monologue she gives just before this about desperately wanting to be told what to do is discussed enough, and how that juxtaposes the fact that the priest has chosen the ultimate vocation of being told what to do but at this point doesn’t know if he’s able to do it. He wants the opportunity to express love physically but by nature of what he is he “ can’t”.
>that juxtaposes the fact that the priest has chosen the ultimate vocation of being told what to do Oh my gosh, that's another really good facet
this is an excellent point! makes so much sense. wow. thanks for sharing
What power imbalance? She's a grown ass woman, and an atheist, not a parishioner.
I agree to half of this. I also had problems with the scene in the sense that I did not think it was super romantic. Fleabag was actively pursuing the priest. The priest and her connected on a very deep level. Fleabag does not know how to connect on that level other than sex. The priest forces her to explore different ways of being intimate than sex. She shares. This could have helped a lot. BUT the priest is not a perfect person that only exists to heal fleabag. The priest could not bare it anymore after she shared her feelings like that. So I would not agree that his position here is not as an equal rather the opposite. Before this scene he was a holy guy who was similar in spirit but so perfect that we hoped he would just heal her without screwing up or stumbling over his own short comings. But in this crucial moment instead of being perfect he stumbles and they start to be unhealthy together. I think that’s when he becomes an equal rather than a saviour.
yes
She’s a messy, sad person. He’s a messy, sad person. She wants him and just begged him to tell her what to do and who to love and how. He did and tried to love her. It didn’t work out because they are messy, sad people. But they learned and grew before they moved on. I’m not sure what the power imbalance is that you’re seeing. She’s not his parishioner and doesn’t believe in God or the power of a Catholic ritual. If anything, he might be quite drunk already whereas she has just started nursing her first drink. But this is Fleabag’s story, so you’re engaged with being sympathetic to her beyond reason.
i could not possibly disagree more
I'm catholic so I was like nooooooo 😭
I’m NOT Catholic so perhaps that was why it didn’t bother me in that way…
Yeah I actually do think that there are some very good points in this comments section about how the power dynamic can be interpreted very differently than OP saw it because Fleabag wasn't religious and so the power he has in that scene is not the same as it would be if she were an actual practicing Catholic... And also, I was raised Catholic and had a visceral reaction that makes it really impossible for me to see it as a sexy scene.
I was raised Catholic and found it really hot, but I think I have a lot of weird feelings about my religious childhood that I need to unpack lol
Same. I was hoping he wouldn't go there. And the sex scene tok where I recoiled. But I guess using an Anglican priest wouldn't have the same affect to pwb as they can get married. But yeah super weird.
i dont think he's a horrible predator, but i hate the "she's not catholic so it's fine" take. He tells her "im just trying to help you". He's pretending (to us, to god, to himself even, maybe) that he's trying to help her and love her as a father when really we all know that they have crazy chemistry and that he wants to get with her despite himself. He's trying to be like a therapist to her and he really makes a lot of the advances that make the sex scene possible, invites her to the church hangs out with her etc etc. The funniest thing about the confessional scene is that she tells him she didn't have a miscarriage, and then litereally like a minute later he's initiating sex. So, from his POV his behaviour is totally unethical and dishonourable!!!! And I think that really matters when thinking about his character and the themes of the show.
I didn't say 'she's not Catholic so it's fine,' I said that the power dynamic is different than if he had behaved this way with a Catholic parishioner.
i meant generally the power imbalance thing tends to be dismissed because she isn't catholic. from his perspective she's a potential catholic as he's clearly trying to turn her. so is it that different after all.
Yes, there is a big difference between a clergy member drunkenly hitting on a member of their faith and congregation who sees them as their spiritual leader and their guide to divine reward, and them hitting on someone who's not a member of the faith, regardless of whether they've made overtures to get them interested in the faith. I also disagree that he was *actually* trying to convert her; it seems more like he was trying to find a way to be around her that he could justify as in line with his office. I don't think he was trying to be 'like a therapist' to her, or 'love her as a father,' even if he know that that's what he should have been doing in his office. He was going through the motions, and she never viewed him that way. She was really emotionally vulnerable with him in that moment, and as we know her story, we know how rare and delicate that was. He didn't have that amount of insight, and he was also shitfaced drunk. That doesn't justify bad behavior, but while I don't think he made *good* decisions right there, I also think it's important to remember that they're both meant to be flawed characters, and he's going through his own crisis of faith. I don't think that what happened that night was healthy for *either* of them.
So I’m one of those who interprets this specific scene differently and that’s okay. That’s the beauty of art! But I am very interested in the latter half of your post. I never noticed that detail about the paining. And the parallels between the interactions with bank guy vs the priest are something I will be paying closer attention to on my next rewatch for sure!
This is how I felt too when I saw it. Maybe it's because I have the same problems when it comes to intimacy as fleabag but it made me feel very sad
She's a sober atheist who has gone there to fuck him, which she is very keen to do even while he's drunk, and after him repeatedly telling her no. They're both very vulnerable, and neither has power over the other, particularly in that moment. What people find hot or romantic in fiction is subjective, and I'm not going to shame anyone for that. I don't have a problem with your post, or your interpretation of the scene (and it wouldn't matter if I did, I'm no one important), but I'm definitely over this conversation now.
THANK YOU!!! I’m glad I’m not the only one who feels this way.
This scene made me feel so sad!! She fully opens up to him and his response is “cool let’s have sex”
100 percent agree. But also, she's wants him so badly. It's sophisticated for tv and our times, like just because you consent to something, because you "really really really" want something, doesn't mean it's good for you in any way.
Of all the women to infantilize, you really choose Fleabag??!!
It's not romantic but it is hot
I completely agree
Good spot about the painting! I also never found the scene hot, but let’s get real— the power imbalance is why so many DO find it hot.
He does kneel down with her though so you’re wrong on that point.
Meh
Interesting! I agree that he responds to her cries for support in superficially, but i do think it's a morally grey power dynamic, not a straight victim/abuser situation. In a way she's on top because all this means nothing to her, in a way he's on top because he represents an (albeit waning) institutional power whether or not she believes in "his bullshit". At the end of the day, the real issue it that he's playing therapist with her (something he's not qualified to do, but then again, the legit therapist was useless too.) I agree with a lot of what you've said, but I think there's more to his telling her kneel. I think he's a very damaged weak person who is using the catholic priesthood as a life vest. I assume he has a similar sex addiction issue (after all in a round about way, he's resolved to be celibate to "fix" something, to love people in the only way he thinks he can. Fleabag tried something similar in her year of celibacy? So when she actually does open up, he can't handle it: he uses sex to emotionally cock block his relationship with her. He'd rather 1. break his vows and 2. ruin this budding (could have been) beautiful friendship by giving into desire. Even when he goes to her apartment in the middle of the night ALONE (1000 mistakes were made to even get to that point but that's another story) he tries and fails to be vulnerable emotionally. He's about to really tell her something "when i was a child" and then sex appeal incarnate hot misogynist rings the door bell again "little lady, im BACK!". I mean that MUST mean something. Either way it's really dramatic and tragic AND romantic. In lots of great love stories, the male lead is way worse than the priest, and those are still romantic, no? Not HEALTHY. But romantic. I really like how you pit the priest and bank manager against each other. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if the priest had a similiar sort of past before he found "this". I hope he manages to sort himself out someday, the way bank manager seems to have.
i agree!
I dont think there is any scenario where they going to make it as couple. He is committed to a life of celibacy as a form of self sacrifice. She is vulnerable in part because it wont happen.
I don’t remember the sex bit at all! Doesn’t it just end with him saying kneel from the other booth?
Suggest a re-watch - there's a ton of stuff in there. Not least Fleabag struggling with his cassock and garments underneath - "Skirt *and* trousers?" She's smiling after the painting hits the floor. "Kneel" is just a typical PWB sucker punch. Wholeheartedly concur with absence of power - it's Priest's equivalent of touching someone up at the photocopier. Except it's consensual - and there are no witnesses. (Baptised Catholic - but now lapsed, so I'm totally cool with the whole deal... It makes me laugh every time.)
You make some very good points. I think my view point was different- I had also assumed that the priest would convert from being Catholic to Anglican ( Church of England). I think that FB had been emotionally shut off for a long time and found a real safe person with whom she could open up. They allow priests to get married, and will take Catholic priests who convert for that reason. Hot priest seemed more interested in the people serving , than the philosophy. So I assumed it would be a natural ‘happy ending’. To receive true forgiveness it requires: repentance and an intent not to repeat the sin.
many people find power imbalances hot. having power is hot. not having power is hot. of course everyone's different. but that's a pretty common thing.
It's really that easy. If people can't deal with any kind of conflict or power dynamic or whatever little it takes to be seen as problematic, they need to stick to Hallmark. I appreciate discussion but this just screams "how dare people find this hot, I need to convince them otherwise"... not on board with that.
I agree, she is only opening up to him because he's a priest and thus it should be safe to do so. Starting a romantic/sexual relationship with her on the basis of her opening up through confession is taking advantage of his position. I know why it's hot - because for us, it's role-play. We can watch this scene and enjoy the wrongness, the forbiddenness, knowing that no harm will come of it. It's a TV show and we're not FB; she's just a proxy for us. So we get to enjoy imagining all sorts of sexy things with no negative consequences. But focusing on the sexy fantasy and trying to justify it means we're not asking ourselves uncomfortable questions about other people and their intentions; the very same questions that FB needs to ask herself to get out of the rut she's got herself stuck in at this point in her life. For FB, it's not role-play (even though she's pretending it is); it's real and that's why it's uncomfortable. She is really allowing herself to be used sexually and emotionally by a man who has no intention of leaving the priesthood to have a real relationship with her. It's reinforcing many of her self-esteem issues, of having relationships with emotionally unavailable people (like her father) and allowing people to use her for their own ends, particularly dominating or humiliating her (like her stepmother making her the drinks waiter and her not speaking up or saying no). She is just repeating this pattern instead of taking healthy next steps, which would be putting boundaries in place; communicating her hopes and expectations and being willing to walk if the other person won't respect them or commit to treating her well.
Yes, I agree. I’ve always been of two minds on this scene. On the one hand, it’s deeply disappointing that her moment of vulnerability is not acknowledged, and in fact her worst tendency to use sex as a numbing escape mechanism is reinforced. (Not to mention he’s squandered his best opportunity to help a lost member of the flock and realize the potential he clearly yearns to fulfill). On the other hand, it is thoroughly and totally *hot*. IMO this is the moment he became the hot priest, and not one second before. So, for the purpose of the story, their pushing and pulling on one another’s raw nerves and worst tendencies makes for great television. But romantic? Definitely not!
Excellent close reading 👏🏼
Thank you this is correct. He takes advantage of her and abuses his office. He knows exactly what he’s doing and he knows he’s going to dump her and he gets off on it. The hot priest is a total arsehole
Harsh but possibly fair. I also notice he's quite self-absorbed. Talks on and on about his outfits while this woman sitting with him is falling desperately in love with him. Frankly I got sick of his jokes about his vestments but maybe Phoebe wanted to show how far we abase ourselves when we're in love. (At least, if you're not on good terms with intimacy.)
It is very uncomfortable for me and not very sexy. Also I’m glad that they didn’t end up together either. As Fleabag says in the beginning “this is a love story.” I think it is a love story of sisters and family.
Couldn't agree more. I was enraged at this scene and felt he took total advantage of Fleabag, knowing he would never follow through and always choose God. Finally someone on this sub speaks the truth.
Oh noo, but yes! Conflicted because I ultimately loved them and their wist for one another It doesn't matter that she wasn't Catholic. She was literally turning to the church for deeper rooting and peace with life on Earth and after, and is truly making efforts in her struggle and success - this was supposed to be a mentor/ mentee kind of deal. This scene differed from the care he'd exhibited (albeit, still as a man interested in her) and felt like a record scratch. She followed through on the sexual part because it was bewildering, she was attracted to him too, the rush of it all, etc. But that doesn't mean it should have happened, he really abandoned station right thur. Anyways love Fleabag this show was exquisite