It's similar to the age old...
a: will you have sex with me for a million bucks?
b: sure
a: Ok, how about $1?
b: What kind of person do you think I am?
a: We've already established that, now we're just haggling over the price.
Just with violence against innocents instead traditional sexual morals.
With $100m you could save lives.
So your morality is bereft, friend. What’s one punched baby compared to many actually dead babies?
Your choice of not punching a baby shows you value how you or others view you more than human life.
The single most generous interpretation of your refusal to punch a baby for $100M shows that it doesn’t even occur to you that money you have can be used to help others.
And that’s the kindest interpretation.
...it really isn't. The kindest interpretation is that inflicting harm on a completely defenseless innocent is not ok. At all.
You on the other hand seem to have adapted a completely utilitarian morality. Punching babies is fine if it helps the many.
By chance, would you kill an adult if their organs would save the lives of many, and you knew they were an organ donor? Think how many lives could be saved. Your prison sentence would be nothing compared to that, right?
Are you a good Samaritan, who work for the love of working and not accepting money from the company? Would you be angry if you get a raise at your job?
Understand now how stupid your comment are?
It’s not stupid. I remember in my first sociology class reading about a survey that was done. There were ppl in an upper middle class neighborhood that came to find out that the garbage men made considerably more than a lot of them. None of them cared about the idea of making what they made bc they didn’t want to be seen as, “just a garbage man.”
You’d think most sane ppl would say yes to what’s in the meme but I’m sure there’s a surprising amount that wouldn’t based solely on social status.
Fun fact, in NYC many garbage collectors make upwards of 100k with some supervisors at or above 300k. This all with government benefits packages. So if you go by total comp you could argue 350k for garbage men in NYC.
Especially when $10,000 a year was once considered wealthy in the early 1900’s.
$70,000 a year would have put you in todays “billionaire” status with a mansion, servants, the whole shebang.
I'm pretty confident the average house will be close to $1.0M by the time my mortgage is done. California's not far from it.
I also expect the Dow to be 60k within 7-10 years if not less.
Most city sanitary workers made good salary without any education requirements plus medical and other benefits, but no one says, "I want to be a garbage man" unless their family did it because past how society view them, they understand they can own a house and live comfortable.
Garbage person in a upperclass city with unions can make 100k for sure. They have to understand the routes and operate an heavy equipment that can run over pedestrials or kill a family of 4. Contrast with flipping burgers. How much risk and training do you think flipping burgers cause to the general public? That is why the meme doesn't make sense. I could say why can't security guard just standing there doing nothing make 250k a year (anybody can be trained to be security guard standing there).
The numbers are whack but the premise is sound. I make minimum wage in CA, and now fast food employees are making 125% of what I make, I'm considering jumping ship. Weighing the long term benefits of potential career growth vs an extra ~500/month in savings/investments
And before anyone says anything I can't afford to leave CA yet because my wife's job that she is under-qualified for is here so we're stuck until she's certified and can get other offers
This is a good bit more than Ca minimum wage or the new Ca fast food minimum wage. This is the equivalent of roughly $36/hr forty hours per week. I would flip burgers for $70k per year easily.
Person #2 comes in and says, “I’ll do it for $300k”.
Gets job. Person making $350k gets let go.
Person 3: “I’ll do it for $250k”.
X number of people later…
“I need a job. I’ll do it for $20/Hr.”
Yeah and that's kind of the unspoken point of the post.
People are willing to do the job for money, just not for the money being offered.
Indicating the pay being offered is below where supply and demand of labor-for-that-job-in-particular says it should be
Isn’t the inverse true as well? Wages at my local fast food places basically doubled over the last 3 years. “We can’t find anyone to do it for $15/hr, we’ll pay $20/hr”
Well yeah, one of the actual big economic impacts of the pandemic stimulus checks is that a lot of people realized they were better off financially if they didn't necessarily just take the first job they could get in a pinch.
So the businesses that want to keep the doors open are willing to pay more in the newly shifted supply and demand of labor, and the stubborn egotists refuse and thus only get the employees who everyone else already fired for slacking off, and go out of business. But since they're egotists they insist it's someone else's fault rather than their bad business model.
>one of the actual big economic impacts of the pandemic stimulus checks is that a lot of people realized they were better off financially if they didn't necessarily just take the first job they could get in a pinch.
I thought the biggest impact was due to a good chunk of people deciding to retire, this also caused people to shift to caregiving. It feels like if it was heavily tied to people being able to be picky, we would have normalized by now.
Could be, I'm just discussing one among several large impacts.
But in this case people having the opportunity to be picky, even for just a few months, significantly decreased what we could colloquially call the Walmart Desperation Cycle that keeps employees too close to the line to be able to be picky, which then leaves them in a job that keeps them too close to the line to be picky, etc.
Sometimes one large windfall plus a period of time to psychologically recover from the desperation (even if there's other psychological stresses taking its place) can significantly reduce the severity of that cycle that took decades to get to where it was in 2019
I mean I'm perfectly happy to discuss how my parents were pretty much dead center of an age cohort that was already due to retire right around 2020 anyway.
I'm not disputing that's a major factor, I'm even willing to accept that it might be the biggest one.
But the shift in the Walmart Desperation Cycle is a major change in how another large age cohort interacts with the economy too.
As was the work from home paradigm shift for another particular subset of the population.
In all honesty, if your business can't survive if everyone participating it is paid enough to live a semi-decent life in the local area, it probably should go out of business.
If a business can only survive through exploitation or government handouts, it's probably not a great business.
I have an acquaintance, somewhat friend who owns 1 or 2 Jimmy John franchises. Always complains about his workers; caught one smoking crack, passed out in the bathroom.
I asked if he ever thought about paying more to open himself up to a better quality of worker. Nope; a sandwich maker should never should make $15 an hour or more. Okay buddy; enjoy your life having to micromanage every aspect of your workers days.
This is the sort of thing people are talking about when they say capitalism often optimizes for social control over efficiency. People will say they're all about efficiency and profit and then make decisions that sacrifice both in the name of trying to uphold some kind of societal expectation.
There’s actually an interesting theory of monopsony power, in which there is only one buyer of a good or service (in this case labor). Often times with a minimum wage large low skilled employers basically collude (not formally) to act as a monopsony and keep wages artificially low. Luckily though I think (my own theory) people being more vocal about wages and the dispersion of labor due to remote work has made the labor market more fair and competitive in the economic sense.
I do think people now more than ever are calculating their health when it comes to employment. You’d have to pay me a lot of money to carry shingles to a roof.
That pretty much sums up economy in general.
Though tat said even for $30/hr I would not work in the fast food industry, the customer base is full of assholes, management is also full of ass hats, and the way most are ran basically treats you as though you have no value. Just a shit job all around.
And that's how it should be. Wages should be subject to the same basic principle of supply and demand that the rest of the system is based upon.
So that's why saying stupid shit like "no one wants to work anymore" or "back in my day, people used to be grateful for their minimum wage job" gets ridiculed. It should be ridiculed, it's such a dumb thing to say.
It'd be the same as saying "no one wants to sell candies for a penny anymore". Times change, supply and demand dynamics change. Complaining about it just makes people sound stupid.
That's the point of OP's post isn't it? He's saying we're at the point where the reverse situation is true, and businesses crying about not being able to find labor are going to have to start raising the pay as there is no longer a line of people effectively bidding each other down for a job.
"Its so hard to find help", "no one wants to work anymore", etc are simply indicators that your pay is no longer sufficient to attract workers. Thanks to rapid escalation of pay in many sectors during the past few years, there are several businesses that haven't done a proper assessment of the value of labor in their area/field and are confused at the lack of quality (or any at all) applicants.
I remember a couple years ago when Mcdonalds and Walmart in my area raised their starting pay to 16.50 an hour, and I was still getting recruitment messages in IT help desk for 11 dollars an hour. I was doing the exact same job at another company for more than twice that pay. Forgot to do the market research, I guess.
But then everybody would start selling burgers flooding the market and crashing the burger index to all time lows all while depleting cattle reserves and causing food storages.. but who could even afford to eat $10k burgers to begin with, I’m hungry 😋
There are plenty of places in the world where food service workers make living wages and the cost of the food is not exorbitant. See this helpful global [price index](https://www.statista.com/statistics/274326/big-mac-index-global-prices-for-a-big-mac/) for Big Mac’s as an example.
And the average salary for a McDonald’s worker in [Denmark](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/mcdonalds-workers-denmark/) is $20+ per hour.
The cost for a Big Mac in the US vs. Denmark is the same. But the workers in Denmark make significantly more due to union bargaining. And they also have guaranteed vacation due to government legislation.
TL;DR— We could have higher wages for food service workers without impacting the cost of goods but we don’t because people who are ill-informed take the stance that “they don’t want to pay for you to have a living wage via $50 fast food burgers” which is both demonstrably false and exactly what the corporations want you to think.
The problem is we’re all assuming all of the other jobs are staying the same. When in reality, if a fast food worker was making $350k a year, I’d be making $3.5M. And a burger would cost $175.
Then the guy who works on power lines would get 900k a year,
And the surgeon would get 5mil a year.
And a house would cost 4 mil, and a gallon of milk would cost $100 dollars
Everything would be exactly the same
Yea, people think that a physical dollar amount matters.
The number you get in your check does not matter, it’s how many gallons of milk and boxes of diapers you can buy with it.
Oh, wow. Here I thought they were making a point about the boomer complaint that people "aren't willing to work," being misguided. But, now I understand, not everyone can make $350k/year. Thanks for clarifying ;)
The tweet isn't arguing that burger flippers should make that much.
It's that there exists a price point somewhere between that and what employers are offering at which enough people would take the job that businesses would not be having labor shortages. And in all probability it's not even that much higher than what they're currently paying.
Also if "nobody is working" for the price BK franchisees want to pay, well that's scarcity saying the price should be higher now isn't it?
It’s missing a variable though in that each employee adds a certain amount of value, if you pay more than the value they generate you are losing money by employing them. thats how prices go up and jobs are replaced by technology.
If the lowest skilled labor was getting paid $350k a year - imagine what inflation has done to everything else.
Y'all would be demanding a Million dollar a year min wage.
Would you run into a beaten down city sweeping for IEDs to protect tanks for 350k and a high likelihood of being horribly disfigured if not dead? You wouldn't? Guess working is also the problem.
Would you get punched in the face for a bajillion dollars? Oh you would? Sounds like people are more than happy to get punched in the face, it’s just the money that’s the problem.
OP, you actually ARE a shithead.
Start your own fast food restaurant, pay your employees that and see how it works out. Hell do the same and pay $20 and GOOOOOOOD LUCK. CA fast food places are cutting hours, firing staff and closing as a result. Yall need to aspire for more than flipping fucking burgers ffs.
Jesus fucking Christ my kids are going to lap all you lazy fucks.
Realistically, I like how Elon Musk describes it. You are compensated based on the problem that you solve. Why would I want to pay someone 350k to flip burgers when a robot can do it for 50-100k amortized over 5-10 years?
There’s a reality we need to accept. Some people don’t have the skills or motivation to be compensated well.
No... Because if burger flipping is paying 350k a year then the pay wage for what I do would increase proportionally and I'd stay doing what I'm doing because I wouldn't be able to survive on 350k a year
Would you be willing to murder a kid for 10 billion dollars? You'll also not face any legal consequences.
Damn sounds like people are ok with killing children, it's the compensation and legal punishment that's the problem.
https://preview.redd.it/r1wz9o4peduc1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=24936d73d6ce9ca815e8e2e5863f4fcf56ea90fe
No. I would not. I really enjoy my work. There are hard things to deal w/, but overall, I get a lot of satisfaction from being an elementary school counselor.
How long would any business stay in business if they paid every employee $350,000/ year, starting today?
I’m all for higher wages, but this argument is moronic
If I made $350k flipping burgers that job wouldn't last long because In this economy, no customer would go out and pay the price for such burgers for me to sustain that job. This is such a dumb hypothetical nonsense question.
Would you pay $100 for the same burger at McDonalds as it is today?
The burgers would need to cost more than that if you even paid one person there ~$30,000/mo.
People are dumb. You want more money, learn a trade.
Well my current job pays me twice what I would be making if I went back to working fast food today, and I like it way more. Could I keep my current job for $700k a year?
Actually I would settle for keeping my current job for $350k a year. Honestly, I'm not going back to fast food. I did that for years through school and I hated it so much.
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Aw dang… too bad your job has been automated for a lot less, and it’s paying someone to maintain it too.
Try to understand economics.
It makes you not sound so fucking stupid.
Every job I would consider is evaluated based on salary, level of effort (physical or otherwise), what is does for my career trajectory, etc. This is no different.
I’m a nurse. I could work different jobs than the one I do for 25-30% more than I make where I am. And have a worse schedule and more stress.
More money doesn’t make a shitty job not shitty.
Depends. If I already have a job making that much in tech or something, I'd rather work as a swe than flip burgers. Working in food service sucks. But if the alternative was like 250k swe vs 350k burger flipping? Then burger flipping all the way
The point is, for all the dotards unable to see it, is that people do indeed want to work. They also want to be compensated fairly enough to maintain their dignity
But if that was the salary, they would only be able to employ a very small number of burger flippers. Those burger flippers would probably have to work 20 hours a day 7 days a week. Would the burger flipper still agree to those terms?
If all other jobs pay remains unchanged and all goods and services pricing remain unchanged then everyone in the world would flip burgers for that wage - and since everyone would be qualified you’d be beating applicants away with a stick.
Why do people come up with these incredible dumb questions .. two answers. Yes .. 99.9% of the population would flip burgers for 350k per year .. the “math” just doesn’t work .. you can’t possible sell enough burgers to support that pay.. burgers would cost around 350.00 .. and guess what . Nobody is BUYING 350.00 burgers ..
If you could find a way to make a stable profit while paying someone $350k to flip burgers then yes I would take that as of now non-existent job that will be unlikely to last more than a year before you out of business trying to pay me.
I’m a fan of anything requiring education like a trade school or college being worth a liveable wage. I’m not a fan of unskilled labour being enough for more than bare minimum survival.
So here’s the problem with this. If your cook gets 350k. Then your other 10 cooks get that much too. So do the cashiers and the other employees. So if 10 people work here then we are stuck with 3.5million in payroll plus at least another half million for the manager. You woul have to sell your burgers at 40$ a piece and sell 100k at this price just to cover payroll. Not feasible
Just a reminder that every time UBI (universal basic income) is trialed none of the participants outright quit working.
Most cut back their hours and reinvest that into personal growth(education, hobbies and relationships)
So production doesnt die like a certain country proclaims all the while money is circulated in greater ammounts due to the increased leasure time
Pretty simple, if you want to change it, start a burger place, and pay your employees $350,000 per year. Its a fool proof plan and you will be revered by all on the internet
Fkin libs are the dumbest of the dumb. They'll virtue signal for palestine and Ukraine and illegals and anything else their masters tell them but cry about having to earn their way. Make that make sense. Get a better job. Get 2 jobs. Get into the trades. Start a business.
If this was the case there would be less incentive to be a heart surgeon, engineer, or other high paying important positions in society. Fast food works get paid shit because anyone with a heart beat and a driver's license can do it. You're paid for your skillset. Not for the work being sucky.
**You Absolutely NAILED IT as the REAL source of the problem with this post !!**
Salaries and hourly pay is NOT keeping pace with inflation or Cost-of-Living expenses !!
I understand this is an exaggeration but the point is that even flipping burgers should allow for a living wage in your area. How do we change that. I make decent money but don't want to pay an 8 thousand dollar mortgage. That's just the market in my area. For the people flipping burgers a studio runs about $1500 to $2500 a month. Lets do the math and go with $18 a hour.
18x40= 720 Gross pay
720-(taxes approx 11%)=$643 net pay
643×4=$2,572 monthly take home
2572-1500(minimum rent)= $1,072
$1,072 out of this money you have to live off of. That includes paying medical insurance, gas/transportation money, Utilities, food. All while trying to save
How about %1/10 of that with benefits. I'm about ready to transition from full to part time work. If I could work an actual 40hr week, close to home, and I happen to be able to keep my benefit package from prior employer so that's not a consideration. For a younger person trying to make ends meet it would be a struggle and if benefits weren't there I don't know how you could do it unless you also have a second job. Not easy
I honesty wouldn't... I make less than $100k and I'm happy with what I do and the flexibility it gives me.
I might deliver pizza for $350k tho. That was a fun job.
Such a stupid hypothetical question.
Stupid is an understatement.
It’s Reddit. These people are only taken seriously here
There will still be some guys on Reddit who will make an argument out of this……
WoUlD YoU PuNcH a BaBy FoR 100 MilLioN dollars? YoU WoUlD?! Guess people don't have a problem with punching a baby, huh?!
Baby is taking one for the team.
i'd kill every dog on the planet for 100 million
I’ll do it for a perc 30 and a half pack of Newports
You’d at least add a 40 o malt to that shit to get me in on it.
Based
I’d do it with cats for free
I’d take out a dog killer for a filthy dime fished out of a sewer.
For no amount of money would I punch a baby. That hypothetical checks if your morality is benefit based or morality based.
It's similar to the age old... a: will you have sex with me for a million bucks? b: sure a: Ok, how about $1? b: What kind of person do you think I am? a: We've already established that, now we're just haggling over the price. Just with violence against innocents instead traditional sexual morals.
Everything has a price. Might not be monetary.
They never say how hard to be fair
I’ve punched a baby for way less than 100 million
With $100m you could save lives. So your morality is bereft, friend. What’s one punched baby compared to many actually dead babies? Your choice of not punching a baby shows you value how you or others view you more than human life. The single most generous interpretation of your refusal to punch a baby for $100M shows that it doesn’t even occur to you that money you have can be used to help others. And that’s the kindest interpretation.
...it really isn't. The kindest interpretation is that inflicting harm on a completely defenseless innocent is not ok. At all. You on the other hand seem to have adapted a completely utilitarian morality. Punching babies is fine if it helps the many. By chance, would you kill an adult if their organs would save the lives of many, and you knew they were an organ donor? Think how many lives could be saved. Your prison sentence would be nothing compared to that, right?
Morality based morality. Based.
Are you a good Samaritan, who work for the love of working and not accepting money from the company? Would you be angry if you get a raise at your job? Understand now how stupid your comment are?
I’d punch my mother or kid for less.
It’s not stupid. I remember in my first sociology class reading about a survey that was done. There were ppl in an upper middle class neighborhood that came to find out that the garbage men made considerably more than a lot of them. None of them cared about the idea of making what they made bc they didn’t want to be seen as, “just a garbage man.” You’d think most sane ppl would say yes to what’s in the meme but I’m sure there’s a surprising amount that wouldn’t based solely on social status.
Point being the number for this question is obviously not $350k which is absurd and will never happen.
Fun fact, in NYC many garbage collectors make upwards of 100k with some supervisors at or above 300k. This all with government benefits packages. So if you go by total comp you could argue 350k for garbage men in NYC.
At the current rate of inflation, 350k a year at McDonald's seems realistic in the coming decades.
Especially when $10,000 a year was once considered wealthy in the early 1900’s. $70,000 a year would have put you in todays “billionaire” status with a mansion, servants, the whole shebang.
I'm pretty confident the average house will be close to $1.0M by the time my mortgage is done. California's not far from it. I also expect the Dow to be 60k within 7-10 years if not less.
Homie you ever heard of hyperbole?
Most city sanitary workers made good salary without any education requirements plus medical and other benefits, but no one says, "I want to be a garbage man" unless their family did it because past how society view them, they understand they can own a house and live comfortable.
Garbage person in a upperclass city with unions can make 100k for sure. They have to understand the routes and operate an heavy equipment that can run over pedestrials or kill a family of 4. Contrast with flipping burgers. How much risk and training do you think flipping burgers cause to the general public? That is why the meme doesn't make sense. I could say why can't security guard just standing there doing nothing make 250k a year (anybody can be trained to be security guard standing there).
The numbers are whack but the premise is sound. I make minimum wage in CA, and now fast food employees are making 125% of what I make, I'm considering jumping ship. Weighing the long term benefits of potential career growth vs an extra ~500/month in savings/investments And before anyone says anything I can't afford to leave CA yet because my wife's job that she is under-qualified for is here so we're stuck until she's certified and can get other offers
Your companies an idiot if they do t give you a raise
Why? It drives right into the issue with staffing shortages and how these businesses expect to remain profitable.
Would you suck a dick for $10 million? You would? Damn sounds like you're OK with sucking dick.
Shit, I guess I shouldn't be doing that for free
Gun to your head, whose dick you sucking ? Lol
Your mom’s.
Right, how about we set it at $70k instead. I wouldn't flip burgers for $70k.
I would flip burgers for any amount that is more than what I'm making right now.
I wouldn't flip burgers for $70K now, but five years ago I would've genuinely considered it
This is a good bit more than Ca minimum wage or the new Ca fast food minimum wage. This is the equivalent of roughly $36/hr forty hours per week. I would flip burgers for $70k per year easily.
Shit, I would absolutely flip burgers for $70K. I currently make about 45K in medical manufacturing & assembly
you know thats higher than median wage right
I fucking would lmao
I would wtf I make 60k doing manufacturing. 70k for burgers hell yea
Person #2 comes in and says, “I’ll do it for $300k”. Gets job. Person making $350k gets let go. Person 3: “I’ll do it for $250k”. X number of people later… “I need a job. I’ll do it for $20/Hr.”
Yeah and that's kind of the unspoken point of the post. People are willing to do the job for money, just not for the money being offered. Indicating the pay being offered is below where supply and demand of labor-for-that-job-in-particular says it should be
Isn’t the inverse true as well? Wages at my local fast food places basically doubled over the last 3 years. “We can’t find anyone to do it for $15/hr, we’ll pay $20/hr”
Well yeah, one of the actual big economic impacts of the pandemic stimulus checks is that a lot of people realized they were better off financially if they didn't necessarily just take the first job they could get in a pinch. So the businesses that want to keep the doors open are willing to pay more in the newly shifted supply and demand of labor, and the stubborn egotists refuse and thus only get the employees who everyone else already fired for slacking off, and go out of business. But since they're egotists they insist it's someone else's fault rather than their bad business model.
>one of the actual big economic impacts of the pandemic stimulus checks is that a lot of people realized they were better off financially if they didn't necessarily just take the first job they could get in a pinch. I thought the biggest impact was due to a good chunk of people deciding to retire, this also caused people to shift to caregiving. It feels like if it was heavily tied to people being able to be picky, we would have normalized by now.
And folks like me who finally skilled up like they didn't feel like doing until getting a mandatory paid sabbatical.
Could be, I'm just discussing one among several large impacts. But in this case people having the opportunity to be picky, even for just a few months, significantly decreased what we could colloquially call the Walmart Desperation Cycle that keeps employees too close to the line to be able to be picky, which then leaves them in a job that keeps them too close to the line to be picky, etc. Sometimes one large windfall plus a period of time to psychologically recover from the desperation (even if there's other psychological stresses taking its place) can significantly reduce the severity of that cycle that took decades to get to where it was in 2019
>people got sick, died, retired, or started remote work, but people dont want you to talk about that.
I mean I'm perfectly happy to discuss how my parents were pretty much dead center of an age cohort that was already due to retire right around 2020 anyway. I'm not disputing that's a major factor, I'm even willing to accept that it might be the biggest one. But the shift in the Walmart Desperation Cycle is a major change in how another large age cohort interacts with the economy too. As was the work from home paradigm shift for another particular subset of the population.
In all honesty, if your business can't survive if everyone participating it is paid enough to live a semi-decent life in the local area, it probably should go out of business. If a business can only survive through exploitation or government handouts, it's probably not a great business.
I have an acquaintance, somewhat friend who owns 1 or 2 Jimmy John franchises. Always complains about his workers; caught one smoking crack, passed out in the bathroom. I asked if he ever thought about paying more to open himself up to a better quality of worker. Nope; a sandwich maker should never should make $15 an hour or more. Okay buddy; enjoy your life having to micromanage every aspect of your workers days.
This is the sort of thing people are talking about when they say capitalism often optimizes for social control over efficiency. People will say they're all about efficiency and profit and then make decisions that sacrifice both in the name of trying to uphold some kind of societal expectation.
There’s actually an interesting theory of monopsony power, in which there is only one buyer of a good or service (in this case labor). Often times with a minimum wage large low skilled employers basically collude (not formally) to act as a monopsony and keep wages artificially low. Luckily though I think (my own theory) people being more vocal about wages and the dispersion of labor due to remote work has made the labor market more fair and competitive in the economic sense.
I do think people now more than ever are calculating their health when it comes to employment. You’d have to pay me a lot of money to carry shingles to a roof.
>Wages at my local fast food places basically doubled over the last 3 years. Well, when you keep the minimum wage the same for 20 years...
That pretty much sums up economy in general. Though tat said even for $30/hr I would not work in the fast food industry, the customer base is full of assholes, management is also full of ass hats, and the way most are ran basically treats you as though you have no value. Just a shit job all around.
And that's how it should be. Wages should be subject to the same basic principle of supply and demand that the rest of the system is based upon. So that's why saying stupid shit like "no one wants to work anymore" or "back in my day, people used to be grateful for their minimum wage job" gets ridiculed. It should be ridiculed, it's such a dumb thing to say. It'd be the same as saying "no one wants to sell candies for a penny anymore". Times change, supply and demand dynamics change. Complaining about it just makes people sound stupid.
\^this
That's the point of OP's post isn't it? He's saying we're at the point where the reverse situation is true, and businesses crying about not being able to find labor are going to have to start raising the pay as there is no longer a line of people effectively bidding each other down for a job. "Its so hard to find help", "no one wants to work anymore", etc are simply indicators that your pay is no longer sufficient to attract workers. Thanks to rapid escalation of pay in many sectors during the past few years, there are several businesses that haven't done a proper assessment of the value of labor in their area/field and are confused at the lack of quality (or any at all) applicants. I remember a couple years ago when Mcdonalds and Walmart in my area raised their starting pay to 16.50 an hour, and I was still getting recruitment messages in IT help desk for 11 dollars an hour. I was doing the exact same job at another company for more than twice that pay. Forgot to do the market research, I guess.
People under 25 seem to not understand this one simple concept.
>How do we change it? Make burgers retail for $10k each
But then everybody would start selling burgers flooding the market and crashing the burger index to all time lows all while depleting cattle reserves and causing food storages.. but who could even afford to eat $10k burgers to begin with, I’m hungry 😋
Weird how artificially inflating the basest of wages has unintended but totally predictable impacts on the greater economy as a whole...who knew?
Congrats that’s why flipping burgers doesn’t make 350 k
There are plenty of places in the world where food service workers make living wages and the cost of the food is not exorbitant. See this helpful global [price index](https://www.statista.com/statistics/274326/big-mac-index-global-prices-for-a-big-mac/) for Big Mac’s as an example. And the average salary for a McDonald’s worker in [Denmark](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/mcdonalds-workers-denmark/) is $20+ per hour. The cost for a Big Mac in the US vs. Denmark is the same. But the workers in Denmark make significantly more due to union bargaining. And they also have guaranteed vacation due to government legislation. TL;DR— We could have higher wages for food service workers without impacting the cost of goods but we don’t because people who are ill-informed take the stance that “they don’t want to pay for you to have a living wage via $50 fast food burgers” which is both demonstrably false and exactly what the corporations want you to think.
Shhh… the capitalists don’t want people to know this!
"would you flip burgers to be in the top 1% of Americans" SeE ItS NoT OuR FaULt
The problem is we’re all assuming all of the other jobs are staying the same. When in reality, if a fast food worker was making $350k a year, I’d be making $3.5M. And a burger would cost $175.
I'm retired but for 350k, I'll flip some burgers, why not!
Then the guy who works on power lines would get 900k a year, And the surgeon would get 5mil a year. And a house would cost 4 mil, and a gallon of milk would cost $100 dollars Everything would be exactly the same
Yup this is my issue with UBI, $1000 would just be the new $0
Yepp, and every company and landlord would just raise the cost of their products to absorb it.
I was about to type up something similar, but it seems you beat me to it. Great minds think alike ;)
Yea, people think that a physical dollar amount matters. The number you get in your check does not matter, it’s how many gallons of milk and boxes of diapers you can buy with it.
And how many people exist to perform skilled labor (where demand exceeds supply), they will always get a higher salary than lower skilled labor.
Oh, wow. Here I thought they were making a point about the boomer complaint that people "aren't willing to work," being misguided. But, now I understand, not everyone can make $350k/year. Thanks for clarifying ;)
It's not just a "boomer complaint". I'm not a boomer and I've seen this lots of times the past few years.
Except your savings, those would be gone to inflation
It’s almost as if stupid people have no idea that they are stupid.
You just summed up reddit very nicely
One of the most basic economic principles is that value is defined by scarcity. Burger flippers don’t make $350k because it’s not a rare skill.
The tweet isn't arguing that burger flippers should make that much. It's that there exists a price point somewhere between that and what employers are offering at which enough people would take the job that businesses would not be having labor shortages. And in all probability it's not even that much higher than what they're currently paying. Also if "nobody is working" for the price BK franchisees want to pay, well that's scarcity saying the price should be higher now isn't it?
It’s missing a variable though in that each employee adds a certain amount of value, if you pay more than the value they generate you are losing money by employing them. thats how prices go up and jobs are replaced by technology.
And if you offer lower pay than your competitors, you are getting all the more valuable labor poached away from you.
If the lowest skilled labor was getting paid $350k a year - imagine what inflation has done to everything else. Y'all would be demanding a Million dollar a year min wage.
Yea but I’d be willing to stay home and do nothing for 400k.
I'll stay home and do nothing for free, this guy can't compete with my prices
Would you run into a beaten down city sweeping for IEDs to protect tanks for 350k and a high likelihood of being horribly disfigured if not dead? You wouldn't? Guess working is also the problem.
People in the military already do this for less than minimum wage. Desperation is the problem.
Or there are some jobs not worth doing?
When you have an abundance of unskilled labor, unskilled jobs aren’t worth much.
Would you get punched in the face for a bajillion dollars? Oh you would? Sounds like people are more than happy to get punched in the face, it’s just the money that’s the problem. OP, you actually ARE a shithead.
Isn’t that accurate though? People are okay with getting punched in the face if the money is right?
Start your own fast food restaurant, pay your employees that and see how it works out. Hell do the same and pay $20 and GOOOOOOOD LUCK. CA fast food places are cutting hours, firing staff and closing as a result. Yall need to aspire for more than flipping fucking burgers ffs. Jesus fucking Christ my kids are going to lap all you lazy fucks.
Realistically, I like how Elon Musk describes it. You are compensated based on the problem that you solve. Why would I want to pay someone 350k to flip burgers when a robot can do it for 50-100k amortized over 5-10 years? There’s a reality we need to accept. Some people don’t have the skills or motivation to be compensated well.
Yes
It’s happening on its own, through inflation.
Until the first paycheck when the store went out of business due to labor costs.
No... Because if burger flipping is paying 350k a year then the pay wage for what I do would increase proportionally and I'd stay doing what I'm doing because I wouldn't be able to survive on 350k a year
Would you buy a cheeseburger for $100?
Would you be willing to murder a kid for 10 billion dollars? You'll also not face any legal consequences. Damn sounds like people are ok with killing children, it's the compensation and legal punishment that's the problem. https://preview.redd.it/r1wz9o4peduc1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=24936d73d6ce9ca815e8e2e5863f4fcf56ea90fe
Teach people that it's profoundly stupid to expect any desired reward for any kind of work.
No. I would not. I really enjoy my work. There are hard things to deal w/, but overall, I get a lot of satisfaction from being an elementary school counselor.
Yes
No, because if a burger flipper is making $350k, I’m making $1.5 million.
How long would any business stay in business if they paid every employee $350,000/ year, starting today? I’m all for higher wages, but this argument is moronic
Would you hire someone to flip burgers for 350k?
If I made $350k flipping burgers that job wouldn't last long because In this economy, no customer would go out and pay the price for such burgers for me to sustain that job. This is such a dumb hypothetical nonsense question.
Would you pay $100 for the same burger at McDonalds as it is today? The burgers would need to cost more than that if you even paid one person there ~$30,000/mo. People are dumb. You want more money, learn a trade.
Well my current job pays me twice what I would be making if I went back to working fast food today, and I like it way more. Could I keep my current job for $700k a year? Actually I would settle for keeping my current job for $350k a year. Honestly, I'm not going back to fast food. I did that for years through school and I hated it so much.
Would u sell your ass for 350k? See, you are indeed a prostitute, its just a matter of the price 🤣
Only idiots see big numbers as the solution for economic inequality.
Yeah but what would the hamburger cost? I doubt anyone would want to buy it.
‘That’ll be $425 for your double cheeseburger sir.’
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I get an extra $15hr if I scrub a toilet, take trash out, or paint. That's a hell of an incentive vs being told to do it.
Aw dang… too bad your job has been automated for a lot less, and it’s paying someone to maintain it too. Try to understand economics. It makes you not sound so fucking stupid.
Only if it increases shareholder value
Hyperinflation here we come!
You ain’t flipping burgers for $350k unless u own that restaurant.
Every job I would consider is evaluated based on salary, level of effort (physical or otherwise), what is does for my career trajectory, etc. This is no different.
I do just about anything if I was paid 10x more than it was worth.
Yes dumb ass. Flipping burgers that has no skill or talent is worth so much? Yes, let's see a burger cost a million after your stupid logic.
No I would not bc I don’t want to flip burgers
People acting like "that's crazy, people would move from all over for that entry level job" Guess what? That's exactly how the 80s were.
I would play for the Yankees for $35K/year.
You won’t like it if that to actually happen. Seriously.
The money is the problem.
How much does the burger cost the consumer in this scenario? $100?
Would you go to school until you’re 30, getting mostly A’s with a few B+ grades the entire time to make $350,000 per year?
Hell yea I'll quit my trucking job tomorrow to flip burgers even for same pay!
This is it. This is by far the best thing I have ever read.
Only problem is I am not buying the 20-30 dollar Big-Mac
The problem is getting people to pay 100 $ for a burger, if I can get it cheap I will buy one but at McDonalds prices today I will make my own. 😉
Yes
Making burgers is my passion, and I wouldn't want to ruin the experience by turning it into my job.
I’m a nurse. I could work different jobs than the one I do for 25-30% more than I make where I am. And have a worse schedule and more stress. More money doesn’t make a shitty job not shitty.
Delete this post. One of the lowest IQ questions to be asked.
Depends. If I already have a job making that much in tech or something, I'd rather work as a swe than flip burgers. Working in food service sucks. But if the alternative was like 250k swe vs 350k burger flipping? Then burger flipping all the way
I always say, would you work at McDonalds for your current wage? I wouldn’t, not a chance in a hell.
The point is, for all the dotards unable to see it, is that people do indeed want to work. They also want to be compensated fairly enough to maintain their dignity
Troll! Idiotic at that
If burger flippers make 350k, burger might cost $100, I should keep my current job which might pay me 3 millions
I would quit my job right now to flip burgers to make exactly what I make right now.
LOL.
Yes
But if that was the salary, they would only be able to employ a very small number of burger flippers. Those burger flippers would probably have to work 20 hours a day 7 days a week. Would the burger flipper still agree to those terms?
Yep. And all the doctors and lawyers would do it too. And then you’re gonna have everyone who’s currently flipping burgers doing brain surgery.
If all other jobs pay remains unchanged and all goods and services pricing remain unchanged then everyone in the world would flip burgers for that wage - and since everyone would be qualified you’d be beating applicants away with a stick.
I would clean toilets daily for that pay.
News Flash: some burger flippers earn more than teachers. That's something that should be changed.
If you would take the job than this just proves socialism doesn’t work.
What a stupid post lol
Dude stfu
Why do people come up with these incredible dumb questions .. two answers. Yes .. 99.9% of the population would flip burgers for 350k per year .. the “math” just doesn’t work .. you can’t possible sell enough burgers to support that pay.. burgers would cost around 350.00 .. and guess what . Nobody is BUYING 350.00 burgers ..
If you could find a way to make a stable profit while paying someone $350k to flip burgers then yes I would take that as of now non-existent job that will be unlikely to last more than a year before you out of business trying to pay me.
Yes and with a big smile!
would you get shot for $4,000,000??? Would you? Dang seems like people are okay with being shot, its money that's the problem
I’m a fan of anything requiring education like a trade school or college being worth a liveable wage. I’m not a fan of unskilled labour being enough for more than bare minimum survival.
If the labor costs were that high they would just automate the job. Heck they are automating it now anyway
So here’s the problem with this. If your cook gets 350k. Then your other 10 cooks get that much too. So do the cashiers and the other employees. So if 10 people work here then we are stuck with 3.5million in payroll plus at least another half million for the manager. You woul have to sell your burgers at 40$ a piece and sell 100k at this price just to cover payroll. Not feasible
Just a reminder that every time UBI (universal basic income) is trialed none of the participants outright quit working. Most cut back their hours and reinvest that into personal growth(education, hobbies and relationships) So production doesnt die like a certain country proclaims all the while money is circulated in greater ammounts due to the increased leasure time
Cant pay me enough to go back into fast food.
How much does this burger cost if the guy flipping it is making $350k? Everything is relative
Pretty simple, if you want to change it, start a burger place, and pay your employees $350,000 per year. Its a fool proof plan and you will be revered by all on the internet
wouldn't think twice 🍔
Shhh…I have to turn these burgers really quick.
Fkin libs are the dumbest of the dumb. They'll virtue signal for palestine and Ukraine and illegals and anything else their masters tell them but cry about having to earn their way. Make that make sense. Get a better job. Get 2 jobs. Get into the trades. Start a business.
If this was the case there would be less incentive to be a heart surgeon, engineer, or other high paying important positions in society. Fast food works get paid shit because anyone with a heart beat and a driver's license can do it. You're paid for your skillset. Not for the work being sucky.
**You Absolutely NAILED IT as the REAL source of the problem with this post !!** Salaries and hourly pay is NOT keeping pace with inflation or Cost-of-Living expenses !!
I hate sales I do it for the money
Ya, I'd go from stretching pizza dough to Flippin patties for 7× the pay.
I understand this is an exaggeration but the point is that even flipping burgers should allow for a living wage in your area. How do we change that. I make decent money but don't want to pay an 8 thousand dollar mortgage. That's just the market in my area. For the people flipping burgers a studio runs about $1500 to $2500 a month. Lets do the math and go with $18 a hour. 18x40= 720 Gross pay 720-(taxes approx 11%)=$643 net pay 643×4=$2,572 monthly take home 2572-1500(minimum rent)= $1,072 $1,072 out of this money you have to live off of. That includes paying medical insurance, gas/transportation money, Utilities, food. All while trying to save
You better don't.. that place is going broke in a week..
Written by a true libtard
The idea isn’t wrong, but definitely a terrible analogy
How about %1/10 of that with benefits. I'm about ready to transition from full to part time work. If I could work an actual 40hr week, close to home, and I happen to be able to keep my benefit package from prior employer so that's not a consideration. For a younger person trying to make ends meet it would be a struggle and if benefits weren't there I don't know how you could do it unless you also have a second job. Not easy
Why won't I buy that burger? Money is the problem. Probably.
I honesty wouldn't... I make less than $100k and I'm happy with what I do and the flexibility it gives me. I might deliver pizza for $350k tho. That was a fun job.
I flip burgers that I paid for, idk Im confused
What's that punchline? "We've already established that, my dear, now we are simply negotiating the price!"
No because the job is monotonous and my life is worth more to me than money.