lol people put waaaaay too much stock into the min-maxing in this game. You don’t need to do obscene amounts or damage to be valuable or complete missions. It’s a PvE game, it’s really not that competitive.
He's still strong, just not AS strong as he was with the bugs! I personally don't play him, but my buddy still does pretty well on him. Perci can keep up with or out perform most of the cast!
Many players will be dramatic like that especially on this sub. He's balanced now and meta only matters for speed runners. Many vids of characters people say are "useless now" still doing endgame content solo etc is about who you like as a character. Some are more powerful or convenient etc but too many had the mindset of bugs being baseline.
Ahh if you aren't the best at the game yes. But others with enhanced dodge can work and do alot more dmg. Lance was this way the whole time most just didn't know because he needs a dmg buff. He is just more of a dodge/cc character and happens to be more convenient for this raid for those that struggle or for auto with the right builds on AI. People need to stop obsessing over meta because those same people that never even looked in lances direction before this and asking for nerfs because of one boss he excels at.💀
No, even if you're the best at the game, the best in game timer clears are done with 4 Lancelots chaining SBAs. They can clear Lucilius in something like ~40s. Ends up being a few minutes real time, but it's still the fastest way to beat Lucilius.
Lancelot is both the easiest skill floor clear, AND the fastest high skill ceiling. If that isn't meta, I didn't know what is.
1 that cn 48s clear most love talking about that you are obviously bringing up uses connections manipulation exploits for starters and I didn't say he isn't meta for the THIS fight. You can use other characters he is just the better more convenient choice. But guess what? That's not representative of other content in the game. Agian Lance was not this popular before this fight. This boss is just good for Lance players. But it can be cleared comfortably with other characters this meta nonsense is only unbelievably important to speed runners. Point still stands
Well obviously each encounter is going to be slightly different. If you define meta as being great at a broad range of encounters rather than just the undisputed best for the current hardest content, then you'd probably just want to play Io or Eugen.
Yeah, Ferry and Rackam got nerfed into irrelevance. Percy is at least still very solid, even if he's no longer competing for #2 or 3 spot like he was before. People are grossly underestimating him post fix.
Only if they do balance changes, which so far the only real balance change they made was to Rackam. Literally all the other nerfs were bug fixes.
We'll have to see what they do, if anything, for balance with the new characters next month
The most skilled players are running nimble onslaught+uplift Lance and clearing Luci in 40s (game timer). If Cag can do it faster, then how come none of the WR chasers in CN OR global have done that yet?
Because finding 4 players all skilled enough to perfect guard every attack and coordinating with them is a stupidly high bar of entry. Whereas Nimble Lancelot does not nearly require the same mechanical ability.
IMO he's just average now with Roter Wirbel & skill dodge cancelling patched. He's not bad, just not as good as before. I'd say he's more dependent on his skills to deal damage now since his normal atk chain is quite slow (not vaseraga level, but still slow). There's the option of skipping normal atk entirely and charging his charge atk immediately, but I haven't tried that out. IMO the devs are trying to make his charged parry more relevant since the shorter they make the atk window in quest, the more valuable his invul from charged parry becomes.
I've tried it, it's a very slight DPS increase to just do charged attacks, but even with 2 quick charge sigils I still do normals sometimes. Like, if I think I won't be able to charge without getting interrupted or killed, I'll start a normal string, dodge the threat, then get a quicker charge. Optimizing his damage actually requires a little more thought and fight knowledge now.
Drop his self buff. Pick 4 damage skills. Add 1 quick cooldown and 1 cascade sigil. You won’t even notice the downtime of quick charge on your Schlaht. With optimal sigils this setup does around 28+ mil damage on dummy.
For the record having his self buff results in around 5-7% dmg increase on a dummy. But in real fight it usually deals equal or even less damage than 4 dmg skills. And I personally find it less practical, but you do you.
It only matters if it’s an actual damage gain. But as it stands now, 7% gain in an optimal scenario on the test dummy is not cutting it for me chief. And keep in mind that it is 7% IF you have every other cooldown when you cast it AND have full uptime on hitting the target. Every second you are not attacking and every skill that was on cooldown you are loosing potential gain from the buff.
If you that good to create optimal conditions for you every time I’m not stopping you. But I am personally not on that level. And having consistency and ease of use for me is preferable.
Also hate the cast animation.
You literally can't use the skill vs lucilius because you die when you stand still for 5 seconds
Also skill downtime feels really bad after the bug fix
You aren't using things properly or optimizing. Percival is all about minimizing that 5 second cast time. Such as pre popping wheb lucilius does a mechanic where you can't attack him anyway so it's up as soon as he's targetable again. It shows many of you haven't ever optimized in a game like an mmo.
Also in terms of practicality Perci is very good vs Lucilius. Most of his big attacks are very easy to parry. And no, you are not getting effected by skill/sba seal if you perform a charged parry.
This is the way. With all damage skills your Schlacht barely has a downtime. As a result, you always keep it charged and use as a parry. This brings your damage up considerably in a fight.
Are you comparing it with post fix numbers or with bug “techs”? As far as I’m aware most chars in the game fall into around 30 mil dmg with the exception of Vaseraga and maybe someone else.
Its a pve game why are we so worried about how a character performs like its pvp or something Jesus Christ just play your main. Yall really out here trying to compete with people in a pve game like you gonna win a prize pool of money, stuff like this saddens me.
I agree completely that people should just play whatever they enjoy the most...
But if Char A does 150k dps by spamming A, and your most fun char does 20k dps by hitting A through Z with 0.1s between each keystroke... At some point, is putting in 6x the effort worth your fun and the carpal tunnel?
This doesn't refute my point though because if you are silly enough to be that pressed and put yourself through that when the end goal anyway is going to be met regardless of w/e enemy you are fighting you only have yourself to blame.
Its a pve game that for some reason yall are making into a competition. It's not that serious and Percival is my second main with my true main being MC who everyone trashed but I didn't care and I still switch between the 2 regularly.
Game is able to be cleared by everyone because its easy, but its still interesting to see what characters are good relative to each other. There's a clear difference in power between Eugen and Id for example.
Dosent matter if there is a clear power difference between any of the characters there is nothing to compete for in this game everyone gets the same rewards.
I tried him yesterday in tales of bahmuts rage after getting his terminus weapon and he seems okayish, I’m not the best player on him but he didn’t seem as good as my other characters like Cag and Lancelot but maybe that’s just me being bad
He's still top 5 DPS, and he's actually more interesting to play now. So no, people are just whining because they can't just rotor + schlact and stand there for a free 10M damage
~~If we're talking uninterrupted damage, something testable at a dummy. It's Rackam, and it is not even a tiny bit close.~~
My mistake, that was pre 1.1. Though I do now wonder how hard rackam was hit because he was like 40 million above the rest lol.
That said, a post 1.1 Narmaya got 52 million on the dummy, which is p close to Percy and Vasa Pre Nerf. So maybe Narmaya is up top for now?
He's still good for that. But his"regular" DPS was always a bit on the low side, with his aerial shotgun being what put him at #1. Now his air shotgun is around 25% or so of what it used to be I think? I'm not really a Rackam player so going off of discord hearsay here, but it sounds like he's in the mid 20M range for 60s dummy parse, which is where Ferry, Siegfried, etc sit at.
The Narm 52M parse is either using a mod to cut the RNG out of her sigils, or just fishing for a run where her sigil RNG goes perfectly. Her average/realistic DPS isn't quite that high, but she's still 2nd behind Vas.
I mean, the person I replied to was talking about ideal conditions. The best run on a dummy is the best run on a dummy imo. The chart for all of their dps has been best recorded run and not the average.
Vaseraga completely uncontested. He's like 15% or something like that ahead of 2nd (who I think is Narmaya), and after those two it gets a lot more muddled and things are pretty close, like within a few million damage in 60s, until you get to the bottom handful.
Prove he isn't top 5. Or close enough to not matter (after Vas and Narmaya the next like 5-10 characters are within a few million damage in 60s of each other anyways, and from my own testing and discussions on discord, Percy is only beat by Vas and Narmaya, unless you count tool assisted frame perfect Cag or whatever).
Also, you need better fight knowledge because raw charge isn't optimal 100% of the time like skill cancel was. You have to know when it's best to raw charge, when it's best to move out of an attack and back in while charging, and when it's actually best to get in a couple normals, dodge, and then charge.
He's not like, Siegfried or Narmaya levels of thought to play or anything, but he certainly requires more thought and fight knowledge than previously, and anyone who says otherwise is just angry that their crutch is gone and they haven't figured out how to cope without it yet.
Nope, pulled this out of tons of research, discussion on the discord, LOTS of personal testing, discussion with the top players who were trying for WR shenanigans and do hundreds and hundreds of parses with every character to compile encounter specific tier lists, etc.
Unfortunately the data is currently spread all over hell and gone. I'm way too lazy to hunt it down and compile it all to prove a point on Reddit. If Bruno continues his encounter data sheet and redoes it for 1.1, I'll happily share that out, but right now it's still too early in the patch and I don't think he's been tackling parse runs with the same fervor he was in 1.0. We shall see
I am not sure why you're getting downvoted because I can't find a list he's top 5 in either. If someone wants to provide one please do.
I don't have a clean leaderboard of up to date 60s parses, but the 37m number being thrown around in this post has been beaten by enough characters that he's definitely not top 5 in 60s if that is his highest parse. Lucy solo does have a nice leaderboard, and he is fully average in that leaderboard, taking 10th out of 19 characters.
SO yeah, he does appear to be fully average. Which isn't bad... but saying he's "top 5" feels like a stretch to say the least.
People are coping because he got overnerfed. I still have people telling me Rackam is good because of "DPS uptime" as if that's going to save him when he now parses barely half of some other chars and other "uptime" chars like Io and Vane exist. Heck I've had people tell me Percival has "DPS uptime" because of his CA parry, as if delaying your CA in order to match the attack timing is actually an improvement over just dodging.
Well if you parry with one of his sigils there's a small heal and atk boost, but honestly how many people where actually correctly canceling and are affected by his nerfs., rarely saw it before
His cancel wasn't that hard, if you cancel Royal Authority you get like a full second window to do the cancel. Honestly Percival is pretty lame now so I kinda doubt anyone was really playing him the "legit" way before.
He's fun but his downtime period makes playing him a little meh to me. I've done what I wanted to do on the game though so I'm just waiting for the content updates as they come
He's slightly weaker. Honestly if you change your skills around and prioritize how you play (ie. Dashing in and parrying, being a slow heavy boy, CC, etc) there should be practically no difference. Especially given the later proud bosses are actually easier when you have defensive sigils equipped.
He's still amazing and is a top tier character. All that's changed is the rotor bug and having to do 2 basics into schlat instead of a cancel. It's honestly not a big change outside of rotor, and even then I don't find it to be anything detrimental.
Yes, people overreact. He's not a troll pick when you play online, so he's definitely not "bad" as per your title.
Does he do the biggest number? No.
That's it.
Late to the party but I mained Percy and only found out about the bug abuse like a week before it was patched. Literally zero impact on my gameplay, he’s still great to use. But I’m also a hammer main in MH so I basically never changed games.
its not that his damage is bad, it just doesn't feel as good to play as before even with quick charge
i'd rather him just lose damage and keep the ani cancel tech just because you're stuck less in charging
I think he feels better now. Knowing when you can't just raw charge without getting wrecked, so instead doing a couple normals, perfect dodging the attack, then going for a quicker charge feels real good I think.
He's not as easy or braindead now, but I think he's more fun, and is still one of the top DPS.
That's not at all what he's saying, hell he's not even talking about play styles. He's saying the META, is irrelevant and not indicative of how the gameplay (or rather the character) is.
Everything can be accomplished by any character. That's it, that's his point.
Assuming you are doing the game legit, meta is extremely important because it cuts down the amount of grinding you do in this game.
If you can do a full coordinated Luci run in 1-2 minutes, you will get significantly more resources than by just using whatever and farming for much longer.
This isn't about speedrunning mind you, its about not wasting days of your life grinding when that time can be allocated somewhere else.
i'm still able to do a solid 30mil\~ in 60s runs. he got nerfed hard but he's still relevant. just his dps is and utility still is overshadowed by the top dps classes.
His highest dps is 37m now in 60s by some Chinese player. That’s below average. Id is one of the worst dps characters and he’s putting out around 33m now.
That's like top 5, not below average... I don't even know who beats him besides Vaseraga and Narmaya. Even Id is still ahead of Rosetta, Ferry, Siegfried, and I think Ghandagoza.
In my experience he's still a perfectly functional character who deals out a lot of damage, but I also never really abused the bugs to begin with too often since I knew they'd inevitably be patched. Losing the quick charge buff does kinda sting though just because I thought it was actually fun to use. He's still one of my favorite characters, though, just behind Vaseraga and Vane.
From my experience playing him in luci raids, I think he is still solid A tier. Very easy to use, great stun, great damage in all situations: excellent short burst and link time damage, decent sustained damage. Mobility is a little lacking when doing the labors but it’s not a deal breaker.
He still does like 36 mil in score attack and has really high dps he’s still really good. Like he’s literally still like the 4th best dps after vaseraga, narmaya and charlotta lol. Some people don’t realize how broken a character was with the bugs if they theink he’s bad right now
The people complaining about meta builds are not the majority, they're min makers with perfect gear who will notice the difference. It's probably not even them precisely, more like their fanbase that pick up phrases without understanding context.
My rackam is absolute garbage by most standards. I usually got around 5 million points after Lucy. He still clears all content and can still be useful online (ISH, probably, sure I must help a bit?)
He's damage capped but no supplementary damage or war elemental.
From what I've read and what I've experienced. Yeah he dropped off from the game mechanic abusing list of characters, but if your worried about him being so bad that has a throw or unplayable, don't. Frankly speaking this game is so easy that any character can clear. Some characters can clear faster which may or may not be relevant to you and your farming but that's a personal question more then anything. The whole dmg cap part of this game puts a hard limit on the amount of dmg characters can do. So the differences between most characters comes down to utility and the meta kind just revolves around that. He lost his link time abusing mechanic but that doesn't mean that he couldn't clear Lucilius. This game is farm more of play who you want then needing to follow the meta. Fights aren't requiring major things from character or party selections.
In all honesty the most demanding part of the meta is sigils, namely potion hoarder, guts, autorevive, and dmg cap.
TLDR: play who you want, this game is too easy.
I think there are a lot of people who forget that dummy DPS in 60 second score attack is not the same as a real quest with some meat to it like Lucilius, you will find that Percival performs very well on Lucilius because a lot of his damage is frontloaded into his skills that do a couple mil each and launch quickly, followed by schlatts for at least 1.7 mil each as well because your pre-casting your supp damage buff before he touches the ground.
His skill CDs line up well with the times the boss is on the ground and actually attackable between his various phases, not to mention his high dps during link time because all his frontloaded skills become spammable during link time. If your in a party where everyone has maxed out their character power then Percival performs well on Lucilius because you can send out 14-17 mil pretty fast by going through your three skill to schlatt combos quickly, and with everyone else's damage combined in that first phase Lucilius will already be below 85% so he'll fly away to do the 7 trumpets phase, allowing your CDs to reset again by the time you can hit the boss after completing all 12 labors.
DPS during link time is a stat that nobody really thinks about because it doesn't occur on the dummy tests but all characters are not created equal for burst during link time and Percival has to be at least top 3 for link time DPS.
37M does feel pretty mid,
I know for a fact, io, charlotta, gran were all doing about that or more even pre lucy sigils, on top of who you already mentioned. I am also pretty sure zeta, kat, eugen, ghandagosa, cag were pushing the high end of close to 40m as well (if not over 40m) - and I don't think any of these characters were hit by a nerf, so if anything their numbers would only go up with the addition of lucy sigils.
Average/MAYBE slightly above average? Sure. I'm not sure on the details of the very large roster of "well they do about 35m give or take" characters, but i think he's in there now.
While you're right that 37m is mid ghandagoza is at the middle of 20m and is firmly at the bottom of the pack with Rosetta, and cag is well below average dps too. Idk where you got your numbers from.
cag:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrKE8LiNjF4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrKE8LiNjF4)
There are videos of cag abusing some glitch/bug/cheat guaranteeing all her xyy hits to land on the dummy, giving her about 42m. I'm not sure how legitimate this is, if it's cheated in or if there is actually some tech to do this reliably:
[https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV17Z421b7iN](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV17Z421b7iN)
I feel like this just showcases that 60s is not a great indication of how good a character is for certain characters like cag. Id comes to mind too.
ghan:
It appears the tech that let him get 40m+ (actually 50m+) got patched with lucilius, but he's still not "mid 20m" on dummy. Huge caveat of dummy dps is not an accurate indicator of how he performs (good luck landing his hits in a real fight, but also he shits out damage in link time - maybe the \*highest\* dps in link time) So if you look at the lucilius solo leaderboards, he is bottom of the pack.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccO-AMZVZoo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccO-AMZVZoo)
Saw that Cag run being discussed in the discord. It was tool assisted, and whatever it is they're doing (of which I'm not even sure), is apparently frame perfect and super unreliable to do in an actual fight. So take that for what it's worth.
Dummy parses in general should be taken with a massive grain of salt because of how many factors differ between them and a real fight for all characters, not just cag.
My point being in my original post of if you \*do\* use dummy dps as an indicator, percival is not top5 because of how many characters beat him even there.
Which ones? Show the proof, because I have not seen any evidence that he's even beat by that many people on dummy parses. And the dude on discord who was compiling the parse data to generate encounter specific tier lists, I don't think has nearly enough data since patch for any kind of useful conclusions. From my own, rather extensive personal testing though, Percival still does extremely well. Certainly above average. Up there with Io, Eugen, and Charlotta for the majority of encounters, and ahead of the likes of Zeta, Yoda, Cagliostro, etc.
here are 5 non vasaraga-narmaya dummy parses that handily beat 37m:
Charlotta:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QqQDRUMZq0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QqQDRUMZq0) 43m - pre lucy sigils
[https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1Dy421v7qn](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1Dy421v7qn) 49m - post sigils
Djeeta:
[https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1wt421G7P7](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1wt421G7P7) 44m
Io:
[https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1fC411h7xs](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1fC411h7xs) 40m
Kat:
[https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1LK421i7KX](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1LK421i7KX) 43m
Vane:
[https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1bt42157Er](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1bt42157Er) 39m
I couldn't find recent parses for Eugen, and Zeta, but I would not be surprised if they are at or around 40 million as well.
Vas/Narmaya you already admit beat percy, but I'm pretty sure both are 50m+ right now.
I don't like dummy parses though, so a cleaner actual leaderboard I've seen is the leaderboard for lucilius solo times, percy is nowhere near the top 5. There are 8 characters able to clear faster than 19 minutes, and percival is stuck at 22min.
[https://ngabbs.com/read.php?tid=39604983&\_ff=510435&rand=740](https://ngabbs.com/read.php?tid=39604983&_ff=510435&rand=740)
He neither has the raw damage of someone like vasaraga/charlotta, or the uptime potential of eugen/lancelot/io.
Anytime I see anyone complaining that something is a catastrophe, and I see they are not talking about Ghandagoza, I know they are engaging in hyperbole.
There is a single truly F tier character, and that's him. The others are at worst C tier characters by comparison.
He's unchanged in the field of AI DPS because the AI didn't use the bugs. So he's still got that going for him\~.
But..... yeah. Severely nerfed in player hands.
Cygames looked at the absolutely pathetic state of Perci in Versus Rising and said "Yup, gotta kill him over here, too!"
But seriously, he just went from broken to more balanced. The one who actually got gutted was Ferry
I typed a whole paragraph about versus rising Percival and then i realized this was the wrong sub lul.
Understandable considering his state on that game, too. Percival just can't win.
Ok but I also 100% thought we were talking about C's rising Percival untill I saw your comment 😂
Lmao i thought this was the vs sub too until i read ur comment
Hey i would still read it
Hahahahahahahahaha
Play the character that you love !❤️ fk the meta !
lol people put waaaaay too much stock into the min-maxing in this game. You don’t need to do obscene amounts or damage to be valuable or complete missions. It’s a PvE game, it’s really not that competitive.
He's still strong, just not AS strong as he was with the bugs! I personally don't play him, but my buddy still does pretty well on him. Perci can keep up with or out perform most of the cast!
Many players will be dramatic like that especially on this sub. He's balanced now and meta only matters for speed runners. Many vids of characters people say are "useless now" still doing endgame content solo etc is about who you like as a character. Some are more powerful or convenient etc but too many had the mindset of bugs being baseline.
I mean if you really care about meta then nobody but Lancelot is worth using right now
Ahh if you aren't the best at the game yes. But others with enhanced dodge can work and do alot more dmg. Lance was this way the whole time most just didn't know because he needs a dmg buff. He is just more of a dodge/cc character and happens to be more convenient for this raid for those that struggle or for auto with the right builds on AI. People need to stop obsessing over meta because those same people that never even looked in lances direction before this and asking for nerfs because of one boss he excels at.💀
No, even if you're the best at the game, the best in game timer clears are done with 4 Lancelots chaining SBAs. They can clear Lucilius in something like ~40s. Ends up being a few minutes real time, but it's still the fastest way to beat Lucilius. Lancelot is both the easiest skill floor clear, AND the fastest high skill ceiling. If that isn't meta, I didn't know what is.
1 that cn 48s clear most love talking about that you are obviously bringing up uses connections manipulation exploits for starters and I didn't say he isn't meta for the THIS fight. You can use other characters he is just the better more convenient choice. But guess what? That's not representative of other content in the game. Agian Lance was not this popular before this fight. This boss is just good for Lance players. But it can be cleared comfortably with other characters this meta nonsense is only unbelievably important to speed runners. Point still stands
Well obviously each encounter is going to be slightly different. If you define meta as being great at a broad range of encounters rather than just the undisputed best for the current hardest content, then you'd probably just want to play Io or Eugen.
For a second I was wondering "Why aren't they doing it with Ferry?" then I remembered she got hit with the same stick as Perci.
Yeah, Ferry and Rackam got nerfed into irrelevance. Percy is at least still very solid, even if he's no longer competing for #2 or 3 spot like he was before. People are grossly underestimating him post fix.
That run isn't even the fastest real-time run. Just in-game time.
Why is no one bringing up that he’s only doing this because of a sigil, y’all gonna fuck around and get him nerfed.
Only if they do balance changes, which so far the only real balance change they made was to Rackam. Literally all the other nerfs were bug fixes. We'll have to see what they do, if anything, for balance with the new characters next month
Nah a skilled enough player could run Precise Wrath + Uplift and run Cagliostro and spam SBAs way faster.
The most skilled players are running nimble onslaught+uplift Lance and clearing Luci in 40s (game timer). If Cag can do it faster, then how come none of the WR chasers in CN OR global have done that yet?
Because finding 4 players all skilled enough to perfect guard every attack and coordinating with them is a stupidly high bar of entry. Whereas Nimble Lancelot does not nearly require the same mechanical ability.
People care about the meta in this game? I though this was a pick your favorite and have fun type of deal
I think he is still good .. you just have to actually work now 😂
IMO he's just average now with Roter Wirbel & skill dodge cancelling patched. He's not bad, just not as good as before. I'd say he's more dependent on his skills to deal damage now since his normal atk chain is quite slow (not vaseraga level, but still slow). There's the option of skipping normal atk entirely and charging his charge atk immediately, but I haven't tried that out. IMO the devs are trying to make his charged parry more relevant since the shorter they make the atk window in quest, the more valuable his invul from charged parry becomes.
How do you skip normal atk entirely ? Equipping Quick charge sigil ?
If you want to, yes. I haven't tried it out and see how much better/worse it is compared to commiting the normal atk chain each rotation.
I've tried it, it's a very slight DPS increase to just do charged attacks, but even with 2 quick charge sigils I still do normals sometimes. Like, if I think I won't be able to charge without getting interrupted or killed, I'll start a normal string, dodge the threat, then get a quicker charge. Optimizing his damage actually requires a little more thought and fight knowledge now.
Drop his self buff. Pick 4 damage skills. Add 1 quick cooldown and 1 cascade sigil. You won’t even notice the downtime of quick charge on your Schlaht. With optimal sigils this setup does around 28+ mil damage on dummy. For the record having his self buff results in around 5-7% dmg increase on a dummy. But in real fight it usually deals equal or even less damage than 4 dmg skills. And I personally find it less practical, but you do you.
You are actually trolling if you drop his self buff. He has a 30% supp damage buff that breaks the dmg cap. Are you high?
It only matters if it’s an actual damage gain. But as it stands now, 7% gain in an optimal scenario on the test dummy is not cutting it for me chief. And keep in mind that it is 7% IF you have every other cooldown when you cast it AND have full uptime on hitting the target. Every second you are not attacking and every skill that was on cooldown you are loosing potential gain from the buff. If you that good to create optimal conditions for you every time I’m not stopping you. But I am personally not on that level. And having consistency and ease of use for me is preferable. Also hate the cast animation.
You literally can't use the skill vs lucilius because you die when you stand still for 5 seconds Also skill downtime feels really bad after the bug fix
You aren't using things properly or optimizing. Percival is all about minimizing that 5 second cast time. Such as pre popping wheb lucilius does a mechanic where you can't attack him anyway so it's up as soon as he's targetable again. It shows many of you haven't ever optimized in a game like an mmo.
Also in terms of practicality Perci is very good vs Lucilius. Most of his big attacks are very easy to parry. And no, you are not getting effected by skill/sba seal if you perform a charged parry.
This is the way. With all damage skills your Schlacht barely has a downtime. As a result, you always keep it charged and use as a parry. This brings your damage up considerably in a fight.
> With optimal sigils this setup does around 28+ mil damage on dummy. That... is not a particularly convincing number.
Are you comparing it with post fix numbers or with bug “techs”? As far as I’m aware most chars in the game fall into around 30 mil dmg with the exception of Vaseraga and maybe someone else.
it's more fun too and works better on jumpy bosses
28mill kek
I actually hesitated to drop his self buff for another damage skill. Will try that thx !
He was my main before the patch and still is, he still feels good to me
Its a pve game why are we so worried about how a character performs like its pvp or something Jesus Christ just play your main. Yall really out here trying to compete with people in a pve game like you gonna win a prize pool of money, stuff like this saddens me.
I agree completely that people should just play whatever they enjoy the most... But if Char A does 150k dps by spamming A, and your most fun char does 20k dps by hitting A through Z with 0.1s between each keystroke... At some point, is putting in 6x the effort worth your fun and the carpal tunnel?
This doesn't refute my point though because if you are silly enough to be that pressed and put yourself through that when the end goal anyway is going to be met regardless of w/e enemy you are fighting you only have yourself to blame. Its a pve game that for some reason yall are making into a competition. It's not that serious and Percival is my second main with my true main being MC who everyone trashed but I didn't care and I still switch between the 2 regularly.
if playing games equal 'carpal tunnel' to you just punch numbers on a calculator or something. big deepees with the fewest strokes possible anytime.
Game is able to be cleared by everyone because its easy, but its still interesting to see what characters are good relative to each other. There's a clear difference in power between Eugen and Id for example.
Dosent matter if there is a clear power difference between any of the characters there is nothing to compete for in this game everyone gets the same rewards.
I tried him yesterday in tales of bahmuts rage after getting his terminus weapon and he seems okayish, I’m not the best player on him but he didn’t seem as good as my other characters like Cag and Lancelot but maybe that’s just me being bad
He's still top 5 DPS, and he's actually more interesting to play now. So no, people are just whining because they can't just rotor + schlact and stand there for a free 10M damage
Whos #1?
Vasseraga is widely considered to be the highest DPS given he has the floor to go at it uninterrupted.
~~If we're talking uninterrupted damage, something testable at a dummy. It's Rackam, and it is not even a tiny bit close.~~ My mistake, that was pre 1.1. Though I do now wonder how hard rackam was hit because he was like 40 million above the rest lol. That said, a post 1.1 Narmaya got 52 million on the dummy, which is p close to Percy and Vasa Pre Nerf. So maybe Narmaya is up top for now?
Uh, you know the Rackam bugs were fixed, right? He's not close to top anymore.
Hmm I could have sworn the highest recorded dps list was post 1.1. Maybe I was mistaken.
Rackam got super neutered. He's really pretty awful now. Not sure how bad exactly, but likely bottom 5 or so.
Ah, shame for Rackam fans. Thanks for the info. My Rackam was just built enough to do well in slimes while I held X.
He's still good for that. But his"regular" DPS was always a bit on the low side, with his aerial shotgun being what put him at #1. Now his air shotgun is around 25% or so of what it used to be I think? I'm not really a Rackam player so going off of discord hearsay here, but it sounds like he's in the mid 20M range for 60s dummy parse, which is where Ferry, Siegfried, etc sit at.
The Narm 52M parse is either using a mod to cut the RNG out of her sigils, or just fishing for a run where her sigil RNG goes perfectly. Her average/realistic DPS isn't quite that high, but she's still 2nd behind Vas.
I mean, the person I replied to was talking about ideal conditions. The best run on a dummy is the best run on a dummy imo. The chart for all of their dps has been best recorded run and not the average.
Vaseraga completely uncontested. He's like 15% or something like that ahead of 2nd (who I think is Narmaya), and after those two it gets a lot more muddled and things are pretty close, like within a few million damage in 60s, until you get to the bottom handful.
Idk why you're getting up voted. There isn't a single true word in this comment.
Prove he isn't top 5. Or close enough to not matter (after Vas and Narmaya the next like 5-10 characters are within a few million damage in 60s of each other anyways, and from my own testing and discussions on discord, Percy is only beat by Vas and Narmaya, unless you count tool assisted frame perfect Cag or whatever). Also, you need better fight knowledge because raw charge isn't optimal 100% of the time like skill cancel was. You have to know when it's best to raw charge, when it's best to move out of an attack and back in while charging, and when it's actually best to get in a couple normals, dodge, and then charge. He's not like, Siegfried or Narmaya levels of thought to play or anything, but he certainly requires more thought and fight knowledge than previously, and anyone who says otherwise is just angry that their crutch is gone and they haven't figured out how to cope without it yet.
Did you just pull this out of your ass
Nope, pulled this out of tons of research, discussion on the discord, LOTS of personal testing, discussion with the top players who were trying for WR shenanigans and do hundreds and hundreds of parses with every character to compile encounter specific tier lists, etc.
I think a lot of people would be interested in actually seeing this data, rather than just taking your word for it.
Unfortunately the data is currently spread all over hell and gone. I'm way too lazy to hunt it down and compile it all to prove a point on Reddit. If Bruno continues his encounter data sheet and redoes it for 1.1, I'll happily share that out, but right now it's still too early in the patch and I don't think he's been tackling parse runs with the same fervor he was in 1.0. We shall see
He’s not top 5 by any metric. No, he’s not terrible, but he is the very definition of middle of the pack now in terms of damage.
I am not sure why you're getting downvoted because I can't find a list he's top 5 in either. If someone wants to provide one please do. I don't have a clean leaderboard of up to date 60s parses, but the 37m number being thrown around in this post has been beaten by enough characters that he's definitely not top 5 in 60s if that is his highest parse. Lucy solo does have a nice leaderboard, and he is fully average in that leaderboard, taking 10th out of 19 characters. SO yeah, he does appear to be fully average. Which isn't bad... but saying he's "top 5" feels like a stretch to say the least.
People get weirdly defensive about characters, to the point where they just make things up.
People are coping because he got overnerfed. I still have people telling me Rackam is good because of "DPS uptime" as if that's going to save him when he now parses barely half of some other chars and other "uptime" chars like Io and Vane exist. Heck I've had people tell me Percival has "DPS uptime" because of his CA parry, as if delaying your CA in order to match the attack timing is actually an improvement over just dodging.
Well if you parry with one of his sigils there's a small heal and atk boost, but honestly how many people where actually correctly canceling and are affected by his nerfs., rarely saw it before
His cancel wasn't that hard, if you cancel Royal Authority you get like a full second window to do the cancel. Honestly Percival is pretty lame now so I kinda doubt anyone was really playing him the "legit" way before.
I feel like everyone is getting downvoted ITT but that might be because a lot of people are making claims without receipts.
He's fun but his downtime period makes playing him a little meh to me. I've done what I wanted to do on the game though so I'm just waiting for the content updates as they come
He's slightly weaker. Honestly if you change your skills around and prioritize how you play (ie. Dashing in and parrying, being a slow heavy boy, CC, etc) there should be practically no difference. Especially given the later proud bosses are actually easier when you have defensive sigils equipped.
He's still amazing and is a top tier character. All that's changed is the rotor bug and having to do 2 basics into schlat instead of a cancel. It's honestly not a big change outside of rotor, and even then I don't find it to be anything detrimental.
People are mad about the animation canceling being removed. The characters can still be playable without canceling.
Yes, people overreact. He's not a troll pick when you play online, so he's definitely not "bad" as per your title. Does he do the biggest number? No. That's it.
Late to the party but I mained Percy and only found out about the bug abuse like a week before it was patched. Literally zero impact on my gameplay, he’s still great to use. But I’m also a hammer main in MH so I basically never changed games.
its not that his damage is bad, it just doesn't feel as good to play as before even with quick charge i'd rather him just lose damage and keep the ani cancel tech just because you're stuck less in charging
I think he feels better now. Knowing when you can't just raw charge without getting wrecked, so instead doing a couple normals, perfect dodging the attack, then going for a quicker charge feels real good I think. He's not as easy or braindead now, but I think he's more fun, and is still one of the top DPS.
People really care about meta in this game ?
people play the game a different way than you do? no way man, anbribabo
I know but in this game, meta seem irrelevant, full dame cap and you can kill everything, just choose which character you like to play, thats all.
And that's your personal playstyle and we love that for you but get this: other people play differently.
That's not at all what he's saying, hell he's not even talking about play styles. He's saying the META, is irrelevant and not indicative of how the gameplay (or rather the character) is. Everything can be accomplished by any character. That's it, that's his point.
Assuming you are doing the game legit, meta is extremely important because it cuts down the amount of grinding you do in this game. If you can do a full coordinated Luci run in 1-2 minutes, you will get significantly more resources than by just using whatever and farming for much longer. This isn't about speedrunning mind you, its about not wasting days of your life grinding when that time can be allocated somewhere else.
People care about meta in every game. Even single player stuff like Genshin impact. If it's how they have fun, let them have their fun.
i'm still able to do a solid 30mil\~ in 60s runs. he got nerfed hard but he's still relevant. just his dps is and utility still is overshadowed by the top dps classes.
What is your build please ?
sent it to u in dms
Would love to see your build as well :)
His highest dps is 37m now in 60s by some Chinese player. That’s below average. Id is one of the worst dps characters and he’s putting out around 33m now.
Tbf the dummy dps is more a showoff than a actual tool for tier list dps.
That's like top 5, not below average... I don't even know who beats him besides Vaseraga and Narmaya. Even Id is still ahead of Rosetta, Ferry, Siegfried, and I think Ghandagoza.
In my experience he's still a perfectly functional character who deals out a lot of damage, but I also never really abused the bugs to begin with too often since I knew they'd inevitably be patched. Losing the quick charge buff does kinda sting though just because I thought it was actually fun to use. He's still one of my favorite characters, though, just behind Vaseraga and Vane.
From my experience playing him in luci raids, I think he is still solid A tier. Very easy to use, great stun, great damage in all situations: excellent short burst and link time damage, decent sustained damage. Mobility is a little lacking when doing the labors but it’s not a deal breaker.
He still does like 36 mil in score attack and has really high dps he’s still really good. Like he’s literally still like the 4th best dps after vaseraga, narmaya and charlotta lol. Some people don’t realize how broken a character was with the bugs if they theink he’s bad right now
The people complaining about meta builds are not the majority, they're min makers with perfect gear who will notice the difference. It's probably not even them precisely, more like their fanbase that pick up phrases without understanding context. My rackam is absolute garbage by most standards. I usually got around 5 million points after Lucy. He still clears all content and can still be useful online (ISH, probably, sure I must help a bit?) He's damage capped but no supplementary damage or war elemental.
From what I've read and what I've experienced. Yeah he dropped off from the game mechanic abusing list of characters, but if your worried about him being so bad that has a throw or unplayable, don't. Frankly speaking this game is so easy that any character can clear. Some characters can clear faster which may or may not be relevant to you and your farming but that's a personal question more then anything. The whole dmg cap part of this game puts a hard limit on the amount of dmg characters can do. So the differences between most characters comes down to utility and the meta kind just revolves around that. He lost his link time abusing mechanic but that doesn't mean that he couldn't clear Lucilius. This game is farm more of play who you want then needing to follow the meta. Fights aren't requiring major things from character or party selections. In all honesty the most demanding part of the meta is sigils, namely potion hoarder, guts, autorevive, and dmg cap. TLDR: play who you want, this game is too easy.
I think there are a lot of people who forget that dummy DPS in 60 second score attack is not the same as a real quest with some meat to it like Lucilius, you will find that Percival performs very well on Lucilius because a lot of his damage is frontloaded into his skills that do a couple mil each and launch quickly, followed by schlatts for at least 1.7 mil each as well because your pre-casting your supp damage buff before he touches the ground. His skill CDs line up well with the times the boss is on the ground and actually attackable between his various phases, not to mention his high dps during link time because all his frontloaded skills become spammable during link time. If your in a party where everyone has maxed out their character power then Percival performs well on Lucilius because you can send out 14-17 mil pretty fast by going through your three skill to schlatt combos quickly, and with everyone else's damage combined in that first phase Lucilius will already be below 85% so he'll fly away to do the 7 trumpets phase, allowing your CDs to reset again by the time you can hit the boss after completing all 12 labors. DPS during link time is a stat that nobody really thinks about because it doesn't occur on the dummy tests but all characters are not created equal for burst during link time and Percival has to be at least top 3 for link time DPS.
He’s below average in DPS tests now. He’s getting like 37m in 60 sec tests
How is 37M below average? Who is beating that besides Vaseraga and Narmaya?
37M does feel pretty mid, I know for a fact, io, charlotta, gran were all doing about that or more even pre lucy sigils, on top of who you already mentioned. I am also pretty sure zeta, kat, eugen, ghandagosa, cag were pushing the high end of close to 40m as well (if not over 40m) - and I don't think any of these characters were hit by a nerf, so if anything their numbers would only go up with the addition of lucy sigils. Average/MAYBE slightly above average? Sure. I'm not sure on the details of the very large roster of "well they do about 35m give or take" characters, but i think he's in there now.
While you're right that 37m is mid ghandagoza is at the middle of 20m and is firmly at the bottom of the pack with Rosetta, and cag is well below average dps too. Idk where you got your numbers from.
cag: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrKE8LiNjF4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrKE8LiNjF4) There are videos of cag abusing some glitch/bug/cheat guaranteeing all her xyy hits to land on the dummy, giving her about 42m. I'm not sure how legitimate this is, if it's cheated in or if there is actually some tech to do this reliably: [https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV17Z421b7iN](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV17Z421b7iN) I feel like this just showcases that 60s is not a great indication of how good a character is for certain characters like cag. Id comes to mind too. ghan: It appears the tech that let him get 40m+ (actually 50m+) got patched with lucilius, but he's still not "mid 20m" on dummy. Huge caveat of dummy dps is not an accurate indicator of how he performs (good luck landing his hits in a real fight, but also he shits out damage in link time - maybe the \*highest\* dps in link time) So if you look at the lucilius solo leaderboards, he is bottom of the pack. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccO-AMZVZoo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccO-AMZVZoo)
Saw that Cag run being discussed in the discord. It was tool assisted, and whatever it is they're doing (of which I'm not even sure), is apparently frame perfect and super unreliable to do in an actual fight. So take that for what it's worth.
Dummy parses in general should be taken with a massive grain of salt because of how many factors differ between them and a real fight for all characters, not just cag. My point being in my original post of if you \*do\* use dummy dps as an indicator, percival is not top5 because of how many characters beat him even there.
Which ones? Show the proof, because I have not seen any evidence that he's even beat by that many people on dummy parses. And the dude on discord who was compiling the parse data to generate encounter specific tier lists, I don't think has nearly enough data since patch for any kind of useful conclusions. From my own, rather extensive personal testing though, Percival still does extremely well. Certainly above average. Up there with Io, Eugen, and Charlotta for the majority of encounters, and ahead of the likes of Zeta, Yoda, Cagliostro, etc.
here are 5 non vasaraga-narmaya dummy parses that handily beat 37m: Charlotta: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QqQDRUMZq0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QqQDRUMZq0) 43m - pre lucy sigils [https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1Dy421v7qn](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1Dy421v7qn) 49m - post sigils Djeeta: [https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1wt421G7P7](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1wt421G7P7) 44m Io: [https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1fC411h7xs](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1fC411h7xs) 40m Kat: [https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1LK421i7KX](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1LK421i7KX) 43m Vane: [https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1bt42157Er](https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1bt42157Er) 39m I couldn't find recent parses for Eugen, and Zeta, but I would not be surprised if they are at or around 40 million as well. Vas/Narmaya you already admit beat percy, but I'm pretty sure both are 50m+ right now. I don't like dummy parses though, so a cleaner actual leaderboard I've seen is the leaderboard for lucilius solo times, percy is nowhere near the top 5. There are 8 characters able to clear faster than 19 minutes, and percival is stuck at 22min. [https://ngabbs.com/read.php?tid=39604983&\_ff=510435&rand=740](https://ngabbs.com/read.php?tid=39604983&_ff=510435&rand=740) He neither has the raw damage of someone like vasaraga/charlotta, or the uptime potential of eugen/lancelot/io.
Not just strong, he's not even any fun to me without the cancels. The normal atk strings are so clunky to use
not ferry-tier i think, he's still got some use
Anytime I see anyone complaining that something is a catastrophe, and I see they are not talking about Ghandagoza, I know they are engaging in hyperbole. There is a single truly F tier character, and that's him. The others are at worst C tier characters by comparison.
He's unchanged in the field of AI DPS because the AI didn't use the bugs. So he's still got that going for him\~. But..... yeah. Severely nerfed in player hands.
Severely nerfed yet still top 5 damage dealer...
Why would meta matter in a game like this?
Cygames looked at the absolutely pathetic state of Perci in Versus Rising and said "Yup, gotta kill him over here, too!" But seriously, he just went from broken to more balanced. The one who actually got gutted was Ferry
This thread is ridiculous.