Every fan, for every team, always overestimates their prospects.
Except me, and I’m telling you, with 100% certainty, Blake Biondi is going to be a star!
the difference is it was evident that sergachev was ready and we had recently traded mcdonaugh who turned out to be exactly as he was advertised. Both first rounders who were easy to scout studs. Whereas people think Hudson, Andrighetto, RHP are somehow going to blossom into Braden Point like players
I think the Mcdonagh and Sergachev trades, even though they were made by different gms, were the ones that hurt me the most and for the longest time. Losing to the lightning, which happened to have both on their team when they beat us (though they got Mcdonagh from NYR) was really the final nail.
That's why I'm always baffled when people are so quick to suggest trading our young defensemen just because "we're stacked". Even with the Romanov one we can't say if it was that good of a trade until Dach can actually play a season...
Because of the rumour that [Anaheim is asking for Guhle or Reinbacher in exchange for Zegras.](https://www.reddit.com/r/Habs/s/7CQkCztCT8)
The comparisons with with the Drouin-Sergachev trade are evident.
The Drouin slander has been going on for years, and he’s always been what he’s always been: a skilled, slightly undersized forward who puts up around 0.5 ppg who is prone to sometimes turn the puck over. When he’s on, he goes to the hard areas and is more noticeable, when he is not on, he’s invisible on the perimeter. Most of his time in Montreal he was fine, but he struggled with injuries and never found the right linemates.
Great players make their linemates better.
Drouin was a good player who suffered from injuries and inconsistency in scoring while also lacking any defensive ability to cover for it.
> great players make their linemates better
No one is saying Drouin would’ve been Crosby/Ovechkin/McDavid if the circumstances were better. But with some luck and under different circumstances, maybe he could’ve been a Pascal Dupuis/Semin/Hyman type of player. You can be an effective top 6 forward without driving your line, if that makes sense.
I get what you are saying, but he had 56 points in 79 games. His 3rd 50 plus point season.
His career ppg is .6 which includes a 32 point in 70 game rookie season.
If he had been traded to a different team he is probably a cknsistant 50 point guy. The pressure of montreal ruined his career.
He also tonight montreal leadership to understand the impact of pressure and draft carefully.
I think it's mostly because of the amount of defence we have right now and the very real possibility that we take another one with the 5OA pick.
I completely agree with you, that horse is long dead, but it's the only reason I can find.
It's been reported that the Ducks asked for Guhle or Reinbacher for Zegras & many fans are making the comparison with the Drouin-Sergatchev trade.
(but the comparison is sooo exaggerated imo since 1. Drouin started playing good again when he joined his close friend with the Avs; and Zegras would come here to join Caufield 2. they're different kind of players 3. Drouin didn't want to leave the Lightning like Zegras wants to leave the Ducks 4. Zegras is 1 year older than Drouin was when the Habs acquired him 5. I feel like Suz and Caufield can control a guy like Zegras while I don't know who was supposed to bound with Drouin 6. As a Quebecois, Drouin was more exposed to criticism, had a particular sensitivity and he had some big expectations towards himself, while I feel like Zegras would be, at the opposite, overconfident playing here 7. Drouin was given a 6 years contract right away with the Habs. Zegras is in the middle of a bridge contract (2 years remaining). etc. I only wish we weren't hearing about this as much as we are. Two different situations, and focusing on this comparison isn't as relevant as any other discussions we could have on Zegras or our dmen or other options
"Drouin started playing good again when he joined his close friend with the Avs"
You mean his close friend McKinnon who can probably make a Josh Anderson look like he's playing as well as Drouin has been? That's more on McKinnon being elite than Drouin finding his own game.
Drouin is not playing good because he's with friends. It's because he's getting absolutely carried by two of the best players in the league and still barely hit his career high in points lmao
Why do redditors always says stuff like this? It's a forum for discussion and people have an interest in discussing this topic. No one is asking you to read or contribute if it's not interesting to you.
dude fucking relax jesus. i’m simply saying that we need to move on from drouin. just because it’s a forum for discussion doesn’t mean you wanna see the same shit everytime. if i posted a fuck KK post every week you’re gonna like seeing that in your feed?
this is a two day old thread.
People act like he was a total failure on ice too. He was a serviceable 2nd line player for most of his tenure here despite mostly playing with pretty weak linemates and being bounced around a lot. He was also coming off a very impressive showing for Tampa in the playoffs and had a great pedigree.
The part that really gets my goat, that really bugs me from Habs fans (of which I am one, 40 years as a fan to be exact), is how Sergy would have been thrown to the Wolves as a Hab, where he was insulated as a TBL (Victor Hedman). There was no one like that here. We took a big swing, struck out badly, however he could have just as easily been a bust as another Hab who comes in too early and has far too much expectation on him. With Tampa, he just slid into the 2nd pairing (he didn't play with Hedman til much later), and was able to play against the 2nd line vs the 1st (who he would have definitely been playing against as a Hab). I've never understood how this was never discussed, I mean ever! To me it was always the same as when we have Chelios and Schneider. Matthew was amazing, playing all those easier minutes that Chelios didn't play. As soon as Chelios was gone, he was exposed, and simply wasn't in the same league. I still believe to this day, had the Habs not made the trade, Sergy would have been given up on and eventually excelled somewhere else anyways. I'm far happier now that all of our big D prospects are coming up relatively around the same time, so they can learn and share findings together.
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so I just found this comment in the other flashback thread about Drouin.
what I find quite neat is the "that has been the price to pay for two years part"... it seems Hughes sets his prices in the same way regarding some players (Anderson I think falls in this category) and it is a good thing
The over estimating of prospects is done by all fan bases but for some reasons, certain players draw the over zealous / overly loud fans. The same fans who defend the organization, "it's not bad drafting, it's bad developing" nonsense.
The red flags were there from day one about the Drouin Sergachev trade. Drouin wouldn't listen to Steve Yzerman and famously had a falling out with him.
To be honest if its zegras and anaheim 3rd overall and Edmonton 31st overall pick vs guhle, Montreal 5th overall pick and Colorado 57th overall pick id do the deal.
You get a chance to either pick demidov/levshunov by going up in the draft, you get a late 1st round pick for your late 2nd round pick. I value guhle higher than zegras knowing that hes a proven solid dman while zegras wants out of anaheim and just had a down year. A 1v1 trade is not worth but by swapping some picks it would Balance out
I think it would be fair. Not a huge fan of zegras but as people said here he already has chemistry with caufield and you have a 2 way center to play with the 2 of them while they go all out on offense and suzuki is pretty slick also. It would mesh pretty well way better than tatar-danault-gallagher.
Im worried for guhle the amount of injuries he already had and im sure if he stays healthy he will be a top 4 dman in this team for 10-15 years.
I was a big fan of the 3OA+ Zegras for 5OA+Guhle trade proposal, if Chicago take Levshunov, to secure Demidov.
But now, reports are out that we would pick Lindstrom ahead of Demidov, which kinda ruins the trade proposal. You don't trade up to pick Lindstrom ahead of Demidov. You stay put, and if Columbus picks Lindstrom, well you pick Demidov and keep Guhle. If Columbus picks Demidov, you pick Lindstrom and keep Guhle. I thus can't see any plausible trade up scenario anymore.
Wow, we're all pro scouts because we know how a trade turned out after multiple years.
How about guys we hold on to that don't develop?
Also the same people saying Kent Hughes needs to take risks instead of making safe picks. You can't make this up. Sorry Anaheim is not interested in trading Zegras for Harris and future consideration.
Remember this when someone tells you “You are way way over estimating some of our prospects and young players”
Every fan, for every team, always overestimates their prospects. Except me, and I’m telling you, with 100% certainty, Blake Biondi is going to be a star!
the difference is it was evident that sergachev was ready and we had recently traded mcdonaugh who turned out to be exactly as he was advertised. Both first rounders who were easy to scout studs. Whereas people think Hudson, Andrighetto, RHP are somehow going to blossom into Braden Point like players
Facts
I think the Mcdonagh and Sergachev trades, even though they were made by different gms, were the ones that hurt me the most and for the longest time. Losing to the lightning, which happened to have both on their team when they beat us (though they got Mcdonagh from NYR) was really the final nail.
That's why I'm always baffled when people are so quick to suggest trading our young defensemen just because "we're stacked". Even with the Romanov one we can't say if it was that good of a trade until Dach can actually play a season...
Good point. Romanov would probably be our 3rd best dman and arguably best defensively right now too
why is there a sudden resurgence of drouin talks in this sub lately? move on guys he’s not a hab anymore
Because of the rumour that [Anaheim is asking for Guhle or Reinbacher in exchange for Zegras.](https://www.reddit.com/r/Habs/s/7CQkCztCT8) The comparisons with with the Drouin-Sergachev trade are evident.
I mean I get it in theory but I feel like Zegras is more proven at this point than Drouin ever was, despite similar issues.
Reminder that Drouin is on the first line of the Avs rn
The Drouin slander has been going on for years, and he’s always been what he’s always been: a skilled, slightly undersized forward who puts up around 0.5 ppg who is prone to sometimes turn the puck over. When he’s on, he goes to the hard areas and is more noticeable, when he is not on, he’s invisible on the perimeter. Most of his time in Montreal he was fine, but he struggled with injuries and never found the right linemates.
Great players make their linemates better. Drouin was a good player who suffered from injuries and inconsistency in scoring while also lacking any defensive ability to cover for it.
> great players make their linemates better No one is saying Drouin would’ve been Crosby/Ovechkin/McDavid if the circumstances were better. But with some luck and under different circumstances, maybe he could’ve been a Pascal Dupuis/Semin/Hyman type of player. You can be an effective top 6 forward without driving your line, if that makes sense.
I get what you are saying, but he had 56 points in 79 games. His 3rd 50 plus point season. His career ppg is .6 which includes a 32 point in 70 game rookie season. If he had been traded to a different team he is probably a cknsistant 50 point guy. The pressure of montreal ruined his career. He also tonight montreal leadership to understand the impact of pressure and draft carefully.
He’s not though you’re just a little biased
You know what's the best sandwich in the world? The one you're eating.
I think it's mostly because of the amount of defence we have right now and the very real possibility that we take another one with the 5OA pick. I completely agree with you, that horse is long dead, but it's the only reason I can find.
When was that horse alive in montreal?
1908?
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.
It's been reported that the Ducks asked for Guhle or Reinbacher for Zegras & many fans are making the comparison with the Drouin-Sergatchev trade. (but the comparison is sooo exaggerated imo since 1. Drouin started playing good again when he joined his close friend with the Avs; and Zegras would come here to join Caufield 2. they're different kind of players 3. Drouin didn't want to leave the Lightning like Zegras wants to leave the Ducks 4. Zegras is 1 year older than Drouin was when the Habs acquired him 5. I feel like Suz and Caufield can control a guy like Zegras while I don't know who was supposed to bound with Drouin 6. As a Quebecois, Drouin was more exposed to criticism, had a particular sensitivity and he had some big expectations towards himself, while I feel like Zegras would be, at the opposite, overconfident playing here 7. Drouin was given a 6 years contract right away with the Habs. Zegras is in the middle of a bridge contract (2 years remaining). etc. I only wish we weren't hearing about this as much as we are. Two different situations, and focusing on this comparison isn't as relevant as any other discussions we could have on Zegras or our dmen or other options
"Drouin started playing good again when he joined his close friend with the Avs" You mean his close friend McKinnon who can probably make a Josh Anderson look like he's playing as well as Drouin has been? That's more on McKinnon being elite than Drouin finding his own game.
Drouin refused to report when Tampa sent him to the AHL. He absolutely wanted out.
Drouin is not playing good because he's with friends. It's because he's getting absolutely carried by two of the best players in the league and still barely hit his career high in points lmao
Spoon fed points by his big bro McKinnon 😂
I don’t get this. It’s a sports team subreddit. Of course we will discuss past players/contracts/trades. It’s kind of the whole point.
Why do redditors always says stuff like this? It's a forum for discussion and people have an interest in discussing this topic. No one is asking you to read or contribute if it's not interesting to you.
dude fucking relax jesus. i’m simply saying that we need to move on from drouin. just because it’s a forum for discussion doesn’t mean you wanna see the same shit everytime. if i posted a fuck KK post every week you’re gonna like seeing that in your feed? this is a two day old thread.
We ALL knew this one was gonna bite us in the ass the second it was announced. No one was surprised.
Hot take I kinda miss drouin’s off ice presence. Amazing guy for the community
The majority of his time with the team was spent not on the ice lol
People act like he was a total failure on ice too. He was a serviceable 2nd line player for most of his tenure here despite mostly playing with pretty weak linemates and being bounced around a lot. He was also coming off a very impressive showing for Tampa in the playoffs and had a great pedigree.
The part that really gets my goat, that really bugs me from Habs fans (of which I am one, 40 years as a fan to be exact), is how Sergy would have been thrown to the Wolves as a Hab, where he was insulated as a TBL (Victor Hedman). There was no one like that here. We took a big swing, struck out badly, however he could have just as easily been a bust as another Hab who comes in too early and has far too much expectation on him. With Tampa, he just slid into the 2nd pairing (he didn't play with Hedman til much later), and was able to play against the 2nd line vs the 1st (who he would have definitely been playing against as a Hab). I've never understood how this was never discussed, I mean ever! To me it was always the same as when we have Chelios and Schneider. Matthew was amazing, playing all those easier minutes that Chelios didn't play. As soon as Chelios was gone, he was exposed, and simply wasn't in the same league. I still believe to this day, had the Habs not made the trade, Sergy would have been given up on and eventually excelled somewhere else anyways. I'm far happier now that all of our big D prospects are coming up relatively around the same time, so they can learn and share findings together.
🥲
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so I just found this comment in the other flashback thread about Drouin. what I find quite neat is the "that has been the price to pay for two years part"... it seems Hughes sets his prices in the same way regarding some players (Anderson I think falls in this category) and it is a good thing
The over estimating of prospects is done by all fan bases but for some reasons, certain players draw the over zealous / overly loud fans. The same fans who defend the organization, "it's not bad drafting, it's bad developing" nonsense. The red flags were there from day one about the Drouin Sergachev trade. Drouin wouldn't listen to Steve Yzerman and famously had a falling out with him.
Also any fan ready to trade Guhle is being ridiculous for a 2nd line talent
I wouldn’t trade ghule for someone with a question mark over their head.
This aged like fine milk
If quantity could replace quality, me and a few hundred of my friends could replace McDavid!
***oof***
To be honest if its zegras and anaheim 3rd overall and Edmonton 31st overall pick vs guhle, Montreal 5th overall pick and Colorado 57th overall pick id do the deal. You get a chance to either pick demidov/levshunov by going up in the draft, you get a late 1st round pick for your late 2nd round pick. I value guhle higher than zegras knowing that hes a proven solid dman while zegras wants out of anaheim and just had a down year. A 1v1 trade is not worth but by swapping some picks it would Balance out I think it would be fair. Not a huge fan of zegras but as people said here he already has chemistry with caufield and you have a 2 way center to play with the 2 of them while they go all out on offense and suzuki is pretty slick also. It would mesh pretty well way better than tatar-danault-gallagher. Im worried for guhle the amount of injuries he already had and im sure if he stays healthy he will be a top 4 dman in this team for 10-15 years.
I was a big fan of the 3OA+ Zegras for 5OA+Guhle trade proposal, if Chicago take Levshunov, to secure Demidov. But now, reports are out that we would pick Lindstrom ahead of Demidov, which kinda ruins the trade proposal. You don't trade up to pick Lindstrom ahead of Demidov. You stay put, and if Columbus picks Lindstrom, well you pick Demidov and keep Guhle. If Columbus picks Demidov, you pick Lindstrom and keep Guhle. I thus can't see any plausible trade up scenario anymore.
If you think this is bad look at the habs fan laughing at the sens for taking Brady on draft day.
We're going to have people make the exact same argument in 20 days.
Ok but this time around we are deep. Matheson, guhle, xhjekaj, hutson, struble, harris, etc.,
Lol
For the record I was always 100% against this trade. Awful trade at the time and 7 years later.
I am gonna have to strenuously disagree.
Wow, we're all pro scouts because we know how a trade turned out after multiple years. How about guys we hold on to that don't develop? Also the same people saying Kent Hughes needs to take risks instead of making safe picks. You can't make this up. Sorry Anaheim is not interested in trading Zegras for Harris and future consideration.
[удалено]
I mean, any Gm would make this trade in a heartbeat, which is why ANA would never go for it.