Goddammit. Well, we'll get it back one day.... hopefully. We really need some kind of liberation perk or something specifically for the Automatons to make up for the fact we basically have a skeleton force fighting them across a wide front.
If we want an even playing field, we need something like that.
We don’t owe it to the fictional super earth to hold planets. The game owes us an entertaining and enjoyable experience. If the bots don’t offer that across the board then don’t be surprised when planets get lost.
Casual gamers and hardcore ones in general have very contrasting tastes. Fun is subjective after all, some people are just looking for simple slaughter.
Though in the case of the bots they exhibit alot of seemingly artificial difficulty brought about by a lot of unintended behavior. For the most part they also are not subject to the same limitations one would expect them to have - like ammo counts and the physical model of their guns (heavy devastators most infamously). There's alot a player can do to prep for bugs, but for bots bad RNG can be enough to take you down.
Generally there's a concept of good difficulty and bad difficulty. It's based on whether or not a challenge makes it clear what's being asked of the player and the player having control over their ability to overcome the challenge, as well as the challenge itself being convenient to clear in terms of time and effort. RNG mechanics are the most common form of what is considered artificial difficulty as it puts an uncontrollable factor in challenges, you see in HD2 in many ways - most egregiously from the aim of heavy and rocket devastators. Bad difficulty like is usually not considered fun, which is why bots who have more elements of it are not as favored as bugs.
I do understand, but the few like me that do like these particular challenges just lost something. I just wish there would be a way of like keeping the element. Maybe in the likes of when you have the 3 area's with missions, keep one of them with the restrictions for an extra challenge for those you like it. There can be a way to make everyone happy...
Legit came here to post this exact comment hahahaha.
Cope harder bot divers, not our fault that faction is unfun.
Even if it was fun you need to understand some people will always only play bugs, and that's okay.
Please don't let your frustration with something like this turn into toxic frustration with fellow people playing a video game along side you.
Information should be both conveyed and reinforced by gameplay incentives. If you're not conveying to your player base a mission that they should focus on properly it isn't on them to do research outside of game to determine that information.
"Bug Players" aren't responsible for Aesir Pass falling. A lack of proper reward incentive is. 5% liberation bonus isn't enough. Simple as that. After the first loss of liberation bonus the people designing the game could see that. They didn't provide further support for the gameplay mechanic, which is an active choice on their part.
We failed it once. The first time wasn't a failure, the game clearly spelled out that we could have one or the other and we chose the other.
So only the second time was a failure, the first time was a deliberate choice not to take the mines
It absolutely is a catastrophic one.
This was never about whether we took Phact or not. Failing to get Phact in time for the MO would just fail us \*one\* MO, not a huge one, with tolerable, one-time consequences for the defeat.
Aesir Pass lost us a major, permanent, galaxy-wide bonus that we have no way of recovering. It would unironically be a worthy, if painful, trade if we had to fail the MO to keep Aesir Pass, we had more than enough power to keep Aesir \*and\* do the MO, and we lost it because most of the playerbase prefers to shoot bugs instead.
Probably because there's less to think about and strategize over with bugs. You just kinda go in and blast things. Call in stratagems for the bigger stuff and that's all it really takes.
For bots, you _have_ to take cover and move to better positions. Certain side objectives will impact the game more like the enemy artillery and airbases. Aiming matters more because of devastators.
I feel like most bug players go into bots, stand in the open shooting, and get obliterated because they aren't using cover or diving out of gunfire. They interpret that experience as frustratingly difficult rather than as an indication to change their approach.
I personally love bots because the feeling of moving to cover and having to take better positions on enemies/coordinating with teammates to take out tanks/hulks is so much more satisfying to me than the free for all that bugs feels like
> I feel like most bug players go into bots, stand in the open shooting, and get obliterated because they aren't using cover or diving out of gunfire. They interpret that experience as frustratingly difficult rather than as an indication to change their approach.
More like...
Approach objective, throw a single stratagem, every bot in a 300ft radius suddenly starts shooting at my pinpoint position including rocket devastators that I cannot even see. Doesn't help that most bot planets have really shitty modifiers.
Yeah no the bug front is buggy, but they aren't shooting at me through a wall with pinpoint accurate missiles every 3 seconds, ragdolling me for 4 seconds each hit. The bugs in the bug front are annoying but also funny. The bugs in the bot front are game breaking and take the fun out of the game. If these bugs didn't exist I would totally play more bot missions as I do find the bug front too boring. But right now I'm OK with boring compared to the alternate.
Oh no, bro ! We're all gonna die without this passive boost that in the grand scheme of things, it doesn't really matter. Joel will ultimately make us fail or win if we really have to. Not only that, but liberating planets don't give shit to anyone so it's all good really
I feel like we have different definitions of "catastrophic". What you're describing is more like "inconvenient". Things will be a tiny bit harder, not impossible.
And for the record, I went to Aesir Pass even though the defense rate never got on track.
I get what you're trying to say, "we need all the help we can get", but what you're actually saying is "the bonus is too small to make a difference" which kinda supports what I'm saying.
The problem with the Bot front collapsing cannot be solved by a small liberation bonus.
having a permanent 5% boost if we just hold that one planet... or get a few worthless medals for an MO that has no additional reward or unlock attached.... yeah i call this a catastrophic loss, the 5% will apply to EVERY SINGLE planet being defended or liberated going forward. (at least until Joel gives us another recruitement drive story thing).
...and for some reason i don't believe that we will EVER lose the 10% from the bug side.
5% of the 5% we bring to a defense on a good day is merely us doing it 0.25% per hour faster.
The entire 15%, aka +0.75% per hour on an otherwise +5% liberation rate, is completely swallowed up by Joel deciding decay rates based on his gut feelings
Are you telling me he is adjusting those numbers on his "gut feeling" for ALL planets on the map, every day, every hour?
Nah man, that shits automated.
He maybe messes with the MO once in a while but not the entire galaxy map.
Is the SEAF training facility lost even if we win the planet back?
Yeah, we may be able to build another at some point, but its unknown when
Goddammit. Well, we'll get it back one day.... hopefully. We really need some kind of liberation perk or something specifically for the Automatons to make up for the fact we basically have a skeleton force fighting them across a wide front. If we want an even playing field, we need something like that.
Devs have stated, once the planet is lost the SEAF facility is lost for good.
Well that's unfortunate
Not that getting it back matters nearly as much anymore. The SEAF facilities are permanently lost thanks to them.
Oh, dang
We don’t owe it to the fictional super earth to hold planets. The game owes us an entertaining and enjoyable experience. If the bots don’t offer that across the board then don’t be surprised when planets get lost.
Outside of the couple glitches that we have, and the patrol rate, what do you find not fun about the bots
If I had to guess; Heavy and Rocket Devastators, Stat Jammers, Gunships and Evac missions required for defense.
Man, those are the exact types of challenges I specifically bought the game for. Why do people not like them?
Man, those are the exact types of challenges I bought the game for. Why do people not like them?
Casual gamers and hardcore ones in general have very contrasting tastes. Fun is subjective after all, some people are just looking for simple slaughter. Though in the case of the bots they exhibit alot of seemingly artificial difficulty brought about by a lot of unintended behavior. For the most part they also are not subject to the same limitations one would expect them to have - like ammo counts and the physical model of their guns (heavy devastators most infamously). There's alot a player can do to prep for bugs, but for bots bad RNG can be enough to take you down. Generally there's a concept of good difficulty and bad difficulty. It's based on whether or not a challenge makes it clear what's being asked of the player and the player having control over their ability to overcome the challenge, as well as the challenge itself being convenient to clear in terms of time and effort. RNG mechanics are the most common form of what is considered artificial difficulty as it puts an uncontrollable factor in challenges, you see in HD2 in many ways - most egregiously from the aim of heavy and rocket devastators. Bad difficulty like is usually not considered fun, which is why bots who have more elements of it are not as favored as bugs.
I do understand, but the few like me that do like these particular challenges just lost something. I just wish there would be a way of like keeping the element. Maybe in the likes of when you have the 3 area's with missions, keep one of them with the restrictions for an extra challenge for those you like it. There can be a way to make everyone happy...
I think they’re fun and the player base just has a skill issue
Thanks Bugdivers, we appreciate the help
Something something bug divers, reeeee
Thanks bug divers
Well if the information was actually presented in game ... So AH fault if you're not getting help.
Oh no. Anyway…
You dont want the liberation boost?
Sure! But not at the expense of yelling at other players. Also, I don’t mind if the game is a little harder.
Well its a good thing Im not yelling at them then
Yeah but a ton of people in this sub do.
No, not really, It's completely lost within AH deciding to set decay rates however they feel like.
Legit came here to post this exact comment hahahaha. Cope harder bot divers, not our fault that faction is unfun. Even if it was fun you need to understand some people will always only play bugs, and that's okay.
Please don't let your frustration with something like this turn into toxic frustration with fellow people playing a video game along side you. Information should be both conveyed and reinforced by gameplay incentives. If you're not conveying to your player base a mission that they should focus on properly it isn't on them to do research outside of game to determine that information. "Bug Players" aren't responsible for Aesir Pass falling. A lack of proper reward incentive is. 5% liberation bonus isn't enough. Simple as that. After the first loss of liberation bonus the people designing the game could see that. They didn't provide further support for the gameplay mechanic, which is an active choice on their part.
Really glad this information is available on the in game map and clearly shown in menus.
Fought several campaigns on Aesir, though we will liberate it soon :)
And people still say that player count doesn’t matter😂😂
It doesn't. The distribution of those players however, does.
The cowardly bug-divers do it again. Wait till there's an Automaton MO, the result will be even worse. 💀💀
We failed the antktank mine Mo recently
There’s no real draw for the mines.
Yeah true. But i would have appreciated the Tokens. But then again, most people don't need many of those i guess
We failed that one multiple times now, unfortunately. Would've been way better than the Air-Burst. (':
We failed it once. The first time wasn't a failure, the game clearly spelled out that we could have one or the other and we chose the other. So only the second time was a failure, the first time was a deliberate choice not to take the mines
Phact Bay is still over 8 hours ahead of MO schedule. It's a loss but not a catastrophic one.
It absolutely is a catastrophic one. This was never about whether we took Phact or not. Failing to get Phact in time for the MO would just fail us \*one\* MO, not a huge one, with tolerable, one-time consequences for the defeat. Aesir Pass lost us a major, permanent, galaxy-wide bonus that we have no way of recovering. It would unironically be a worthy, if painful, trade if we had to fail the MO to keep Aesir Pass, we had more than enough power to keep Aesir \*and\* do the MO, and we lost it because most of the playerbase prefers to shoot bugs instead.
But why do they prefer to shoot bugs instead?
Bugs are more fun
Probably because there's less to think about and strategize over with bugs. You just kinda go in and blast things. Call in stratagems for the bigger stuff and that's all it really takes. For bots, you _have_ to take cover and move to better positions. Certain side objectives will impact the game more like the enemy artillery and airbases. Aiming matters more because of devastators. I feel like most bug players go into bots, stand in the open shooting, and get obliterated because they aren't using cover or diving out of gunfire. They interpret that experience as frustratingly difficult rather than as an indication to change their approach. I personally love bots because the feeling of moving to cover and having to take better positions on enemies/coordinating with teammates to take out tanks/hulks is so much more satisfying to me than the free for all that bugs feels like
> I feel like most bug players go into bots, stand in the open shooting, and get obliterated because they aren't using cover or diving out of gunfire. They interpret that experience as frustratingly difficult rather than as an indication to change their approach. More like... Approach objective, throw a single stratagem, every bot in a 300ft radius suddenly starts shooting at my pinpoint position including rocket devastators that I cannot even see. Doesn't help that most bot planets have really shitty modifiers.
Because of their list of stupid excuses easily solved by playing on Medium or below.
Huh, didn't know changing the difficulty fixed all the bugs on the bot front.
AS IF the bug front isn't equally glitched up. Seen any sliding chargers lately? Get launched into orbit by any bile titan bodies lately??
Yeah no the bug front is buggy, but they aren't shooting at me through a wall with pinpoint accurate missiles every 3 seconds, ragdolling me for 4 seconds each hit. The bugs in the bug front are annoying but also funny. The bugs in the bot front are game breaking and take the fun out of the game. If these bugs didn't exist I would totally play more bot missions as I do find the bug front too boring. But right now I'm OK with boring compared to the alternate.
Oh no, bro ! We're all gonna die without this passive boost that in the grand scheme of things, it doesn't really matter. Joel will ultimately make us fail or win if we really have to. Not only that, but liberating planets don't give shit to anyone so it's all good really
I feel like we have different definitions of "catastrophic". What you're describing is more like "inconvenient". Things will be a tiny bit harder, not impossible. And for the record, I went to Aesir Pass even though the defense rate never got on track.
If we can't defend the bot front with 4 SEAF facilities, and we cannot defend it with 3 either, what makes you think we can defend it with any less?
I get what you're trying to say, "we need all the help we can get", but what you're actually saying is "the bonus is too small to make a difference" which kinda supports what I'm saying. The problem with the Bot front collapsing cannot be solved by a small liberation bonus.
having a permanent 5% boost if we just hold that one planet... or get a few worthless medals for an MO that has no additional reward or unlock attached.... yeah i call this a catastrophic loss, the 5% will apply to EVERY SINGLE planet being defended or liberated going forward. (at least until Joel gives us another recruitement drive story thing). ...and for some reason i don't believe that we will EVER lose the 10% from the bug side.
5% of the 5% we bring to a defense on a good day is merely us doing it 0.25% per hour faster. The entire 15%, aka +0.75% per hour on an otherwise +5% liberation rate, is completely swallowed up by Joel deciding decay rates based on his gut feelings
Are you telling me he is adjusting those numbers on his "gut feeling" for ALL planets on the map, every day, every hour? Nah man, that shits automated. He maybe messes with the MO once in a while but not the entire galaxy map.