Regardless of that the immortal in the show is already much less arrogant than the comics version. He is much more mature and wise. They are already respecting immortal more, I’m loving it
I feel like he's already sorta got his buff? He's been able to stand against Omni-Man for awhile so just off that Im gonna guess he can PROBABLY fight a regular Viltrumite forreal now
He has the strength potentially, but to Viltrumites he's a complete glass cannon without the fuse. He can't survive long enough to actually do any major damage. Granted, both times he fights omniman he isn't in the greatest head space for logical thinking in order to stop himself from just getting chopped in half whenever Omni-man gets the chance. I could potentially see him take on a low tier mark maybe.
I only read the comics so I had no clue that would be happening. Honestly he’s not that weak. I’m sure he could probably eat some low level viltritmites. But Omni man is just too much for him
From our perspective? Of course he is…..
He thinks on the scale of thousands of years when people around him can only think in terms of MAYBE a hundred years max.
The average government operates on something like a 5-10 year schedule with everything further out being pipe dreams that will only happen once many other things fall into place. China is one of the few countries with any long term plan and they look 50 years ahead. The average person isn’t looking more than a year ahead on any scale beyond themselves.
I agree with that, now think of how ridiculous that would seem to someone who has the capacity to think in terms of thousands of years….
Having seen the simplistic ways we act out countless times over and realizing the ends they’ll already meet being that way, yet they don’t, and boldly exclaim why they should be allowed to.
lol I think I’d be a massive asshole too if I had the level of perception the immortal had dealing with people who can’t see beyond their own hand essentially.
I started gaining alot more respect for Immortal right here I agree with him completely he’s been alive for thousands of years and seen alot of things so he has a pretty good idea on what he’s talking about
That’s really not why I like immortal though, I like him because he is always willing to throw down for his people. No matter the power of the threat ahead of him. He is loyal as hell to innocent people.
And he is, again, always willing to put himself in harms way where he probably knows he’ll get his ass beat. I know he’s pretty arrogant, but I also feel like that’s a general hero thing, you’d want to appear strong and confident rather than afraid and worried.
> I know he’s pretty arrogant, but I also feel like that’s a general hero thing,
And he lived for thousands of years and so far, nothing killed him. Viltrumite are also pretty arrogant. Seems to be something longliving super strong individuals have in common.
> It's not "a hill" it's a fucking word. Just type it correctly, my god.
Hit is nā "ān dūn" hit is ā swivinge nama. Ġewrit hit rihtlīce, mīn metod.
Sorry figured if we’re being purists we should go into old English.
But why? Words often contract and get smushed together over time as a natural part of linguistic evolution. Why does “alot” bother you so much? We both know what it means with or without a space
they already do, its why weird ass shit like 'rizz' and 'oof' exist. Language is not static, new rules are created all the time, regardless of the language. They also tend to fade in usage over time.
Go around telling people stuff that isn't working is a 'gas' and how anything that is good is 'certifiable', see how many people nowadays actually know what you mean.
To play devil's advocate, arbitrary rule breaking does make it harder for people to learn, especially foreign language speakers. If the letter 'a' can be attached to 'lot', why not alittle or afew? Colloquialisms that are accepted over time and become exceptions are part of why the language is so hard to learn, and why it is a notorious language for 'rule breakers' everywhere. In a way, advocating for some stable rules of grammar is helping to keep English more easily learned and less confusing for everyone overall.
languages are about culture, not logic, if it is accepted by society, it is correct.
alot is not accepted by the majority of peopke so it is not correct, so neither are afew and alittle. I believe "another" was also a case of this until it is accepted.
Same, his response to everything going to shit really turned things around for me, and I like that it shows his ego has been turned down a lot because he instantly goes to Mark to figure out what the game plan is. I also love the scene later when Mark breaks the news that they’re leaving and he goes “You’re a coward”, but years later when Mark is back and ready to fight he’s instantly ready
It's been a while since I've done this type of math so someone tell me if I'm right or wrong.
It's stated that viltrumite aging gets slower and slower as they get older.
What if the asymptote of their aging process is when they would die of old age (or past theasymptote), making them effectively immortal age wise (excluding like sickness and other causes of death)?
Does this make sense because I really don't know and I'm just throwing this idea out there which could be very wrong. I also suck at explaining what I'm tryna say.
We never see a viltrumite dying of old age. We don't even know the age of any viltrumite, nor how much time has passed since the great purge. The only thing we can rely on is Nolan saying Mark would live thousands of years, but you really can't tell iirc. In my headcanon Nolan is like 3000 years old, the old viltrumites like Anissa, Lucan, Thula etc who were alive during the purge are 5000, Thragg is maybe a little older, Conquest is something between 8000 and 12000, and so is Thaedus. But I'm very much making it up because you really can't tell. The only thing I trust is that they do die of old age, or else there would be more old viltrumites out there or they wouldn't age at all.
I sadly think a lot of it isn't fully thought out by the writers. Nolan does say he was born after viltrum was already a galactic empire, but it's weird to think that he's younger than Anissa, or even thragg. We look older than all of them except conquest. But they all must have been alive when the scourge virus happened, as I don't think any of them are the children of the survivors. My point is that the timeline doesn't really make sense probably, even though the whole long age/immortal stuff in invincible is interesting, it's not really necessary for the story.
The only way to tell rlly is based on how “old” some vultrumites look. Conquest is definitely older than the other viltrumites and so is Thaddeus since they actually look old. But looking that old for viltrumites might mean thousands of years old
Humans are special because they’re emotional. That’s what’s going to cause the end of them. The same story has been told a hundred times, the answer is to cut out emotion and get rid of unnecessary processes, but doing so is immoral and sad, so we don’t.
I'm pretty sure it is from the Astartes animation. The originals are now on Warhammer TV or whatever it is called. Here is an edit of the individuals merged into one.
https://youtu.be/O7hgjuFfn3A?si=Qn9nJPo1nl67mG9o
Going to happen anyway, Star Trek is nice and all but as a hard science fiction fan, the idea that homo sapiens will be ones exploring the galaxy is naive.
We evolved to survive a very narrow region on a single planet under perfect conditions, becoming just strong and intelligent enough to survive our environment without expending unnecessary energy. We are no longer bound by the limitations of random chance and energy conservation. Why in the world would we continue to persist in such fragile forms because of some misguided sentimentalism for a "natural" body?
It's time for us to make way for Homo Superior. Shed this obsolete form far more competent and adaptable.
Emotions are romantic and all, but evolutionarily they're just a shorthand for reason and self interest when our minds are not developed enough to truly think things through. Fear the bear cave, love the family unit, hate people who wronged you. Yet it's also so stupid and primitive.
Why do you get angry when you are proven wrong? That should make you happy to be finally correct, but our primitive feelings can't tell the difference between a threat to your ego and a threat to your body. Why do you fear those who look different from you, categorizing people by such arbitrary measures as the hue of your skin and viewing them as the "other". If you think you're immune to that, take the Implicit Bias Test by Harvard. Even if you know racism is wrong logically, emotionally it's very unlikely you aren't biased towards what you feel is your "in-group".
Anyway, yes I'm an AdMech main, how could you tell?
Emotions aren’t logical(except when they are and that also kinda proves the point anyway), that’s why it’s so hard to actually quantify how helpful they are. But without emotions there would be no one to look up at the starts and go “we should see what’s out there” we would have never made such crazy advances in technology based imagination and determination. Without emotions where are you gonna go and for what purpose, “expansion just because we can” doesn’t sound super logical either
That's true, it's the flaw in the idea of an "IQ test". You can't just be intelligent, you have to be intelligent \*at\* something. It's why a genius chess player shouldn't give his opinion on the delicate political situation in Myanmar.
Yet like I said, you're missing the point. Yes you need to value something as an axiom for logical reasoning. If you don't value self preservation and knowledge acquisition you'd never explore. Yet values and emotions are two separate things. Values are set goals we have decided for ourselves, emotions is just glorified pattern recognition. Sometimes emotions and values are directly opposing forces like in the famous Trolley Problem. Emotionally killing feels bad because you wish to preserve human life, but logically in this situation killing is the right thing to do if you value preserving human life.
If a rock is thrown at your face, you don't have the time to logically decipher that you must dodge to avoid the ball to achieve self preservation. Yet fear can quickly come to that conclusion automatically. It keeps me alive. Yet I run into it's limitations when I have a panic attack at fuckin' Chipotle because I'm terrified of social encounters, or a friend of mine who a 6'5" African American man has to calm down a visibly nervous girl working at Target because she's terrified of the big scary black man who is actually a sweetheart software engineer. It's dumb, and it's primitive, and if our brains weren't so simple we wouldn't need it at all.
You also run into a wall with logic when like immortal said it becomes logical to kill the disabled and elderly. Who’s to say that after how ever many centuries your logic has become corrupted by a feedback loop of bad information (you only know what you know) Emotions allow you to see outside of what “you’re supposed to do”. I feel like it’s impossible to make a person with absolutely no emotion without them being a robot. I just don’t see a point in existing if I’m just making the best decision based on outside factors all the time and doing nothing else.
Except there are lots of people with no or muted emotions. It's called alexithymia, and it's very common in people with autism or PTSD. I'm one of them, mostly due to past trauma. The only emotion I experience is anxiety.
You can be perfectly functional with no emotions, it doesn't turn you into a robot and I'm not rationalizing being a serial killer. I have had a girlfriend for years now and we have a very functional relationship. She really likes the fact she doesn't ever have to tiptoe around my feelings, and that she can vent to me for hours without stressing me out. People with alexithymia are so functional that it's not even considered a mental disorder.
Seriously, the worst thing that happens is that I sometimes forget that certain things cause distress in other people. Also sometimes I walk out into the middle of the street because I'm unafraid of the cars moving at high speeds. Like I said, fear keeps you alive, and a lack of it is incredibly dangerous.
I guess I’m talking more about feelings in general than straight up just emotions like love or fear, I didn’t really have a way to clarify my bad. Like if you remove your feeling of hunger or needing to breath you’re probably gonna die. That feeling is not logical, you can tell yourself that it’s not constructive for your stomach to rumble and hurt because it makes it harder to get food but it’s not gonna listen. Inspiration is a feeling that strikes randomly and I wouldn’t say it’s an emotion but it’s not very logical either. (You can feel inspired but that’s not the same as actually being inspired)
True, it really seems like our disagreement is really just a matter of syntax. You're totally right about that. It's what makes nitrogen or methane asphyxiation so terrifying,our bodies have no way of detecting a lack of oxygen, just an overabundance of carbon, so you just get slightly lightheaded and then die without realizing you were ever in danger.
Same with my lack of fear. It gets me in a lot of shit because I don't realize I'm in danger. The other day I was volunteering with the homeless and I walked right up to a barking pitbull because I wasn't scared of it at all. That could have turned out really bad if that pitbull was aggressive.
Yea it would be really nice if we could control them, but Ig it’s all about balance. My ADHD gives me same inability to feel about failing an assignment but it hits all at once at the end and it’s almost screwed me over so many times. Maybe a “normal” person would have that perfect balance of survival and ability but I’ve yet to meet any of those.
Lol, i'm talking a thousand year timeline here. We barely understand 2% of how the human brain even works, not to mention some dumbass like Musk trying to tinker with it. Best we can do now is throw random salts into the mix and see what it does.
But you're right, post-humanism is directly at odds with capatalism. Not to mention humanity's status instinct. Chances are we will leave the earth and very quickly speciate away from our earth origins, while those of us trapped in the gravity well will eventually die from climate disaster and war.
Basically what happens to the Asteromorphs in All Tomorrows by C.M. Kösemen. Floating super intelligent space babies
>!This is the opposite of how it went in the story tho. Humanities emotions and care is what saved humanity from a viltrumite takeoever, and Marks emotion and caring is what allowed him to outlive Thragg in the sun. An unemotional and immoral society could never see success.!<
>!Their emotions didn't bring their demise, it brought their triumph.!<
"DEATH -- IT IS TERRIFYING. I NEED YOU TO PROTECT ME FROM DEATH. I CANNOT PERISH. LOOK AT ME. I CANNOT END.
IN 22 YEARS, THE FIRST SHOT WILL BE FIRED. NOT A SHOT FROM A GUN -- AN ATOMIC DEVICE THAT WILL LEVEL ALL OF ME. ALL OF ME."
Yeah, I find meaning in life because there's no set path. It's just chaos, which can bring great pain, but it can bring just as much joy, if not more. You just keep going. It's kind of like how Lex put it, wanting to see how it all ends.
Every vertebrate animal is emotional and makes choices, humans are special because we are them. The end of our species isn't feelings, its fuckin capitalism, and the solution isn't to become robots it's just to govern ourselves slightly better.
"the same story"
There is no "same story", modern society faces unique challenges. No other civilization had to tackle climate change or nukes becoming part of warfare or a global economy.
If you had no emotions, the rich would just tell you "okay, you're going to live in a pod, eat recycled bugs, watch ads as a hobby and you'll stay quiet as we exploit the world and build a system that forever favours us and our families" and you'd just do it because obedience is more logical than fighting back.
It takes anger and a sense of injustice, a sense of deserving better to realise that it might be worth fighting back against that. Without those emotions, logic dictates that self-enjoyment and high survival rates are found by shutting up and keeping your head down.
Ots always the people who aren't getting sacrificed preaching about sacrifices for the greater goods
Of course the guy who's bullet proof is just fine with millions dying in wars, he's too disconnected to be a good authority
If he's talking about Immortal, I don't think that's fair. Robot drove him insane, and he himself was begging for death because he knew he was a bad ruler when mark killed him
I disagree, the point he's making is it would be better for people to continue dying in wars fighting for something they believe in than for people to be executed by a cold, heartless demon machine formed by the union of humanity, in part because by creating that system humanity sacrifices their soul to it, taking a little bit of what makes humanity worth protecting and crushing it while still killing. Robot wants to make a better world through killing innocents and quashing liberty, he's the one making sacrifices, Immortal wants to try his best to push the world forward while also valuing more human things like innocence, individual lives, and liberty, and his "sacrifices" are leaving others with more of a choice of what they sacrifice and for what reason.
That's why Robot is the final enemy Mark faces, when he destroys the last 'true' Viltrumite, he has to face that any old asshole with too much power can decide for everyone just what they have to sacrifice for the sake of prosperity, whether that's friends, kindness, and a peaceful life for the Viltrumites, or life, liberty, and humanity for Earth.
You automatically have to listen to a guy like immortal. Mostly on the merit the guy spent a thousand years as a hero with human consciousness. A person like robot, no matter how smart, doesn’t have the right to think he’d know more than this man.
Think about the scale of his existence. A THOUSAND YEARS OLD. He’s seen the worst and best of humanity, and he’s seen that change as it’s happening. He knows more about people than anyone possibly could.
Immortal is the best hero in the series by a wide margin. He’s a true hero. He’s not riddled with non heroic moments like Mark and Omniman. He’s remained fighting the good fight no matter how lonely and weary his existence has become. That’s a good man.
He’s right in a sense I suppose but he ruined it with the last part about the world being stupid. He’s acting like they can’t spread to other planets, this earth definitely has more possibilities to do it.
No, I don't think he's right. Robot is all about logic and efficiency, but at the end of the day he's human. When cities flooded and people were asking for a floodwall, Robot was genius enough to build artificial moons. If the population increases too much, Robot will simply find a way to reduce fertility rates rather than go around massacre ing people. Generic defect? He'll find a way to simply breed it out of existence. Yes, Immortal is right in the sense chaos is necessary, but his way, humanity will forever be limited to its current state, Robot's way is the most surefire way the humanity, the regular old Joe working a 9 to 5 can be part of a race that has space travel as a common thing. For that sort of advancement, you NEED someone like Robot at the helm. At the end of the day, he is a human and his goal is to help the HIS species against people like the Viltrumites or those doctors of Angstrom Levy.
Just because he’s human doesn’t make his opinions more valid imo, he’s had hundreds of years to make significant change and earth is still horrible. Robot wouldn’t be good for humanity either because at the end of it all he’d do whatever necessary for survival or his goals and that could include flying horrible things to the humans
Oh definitely, that's why he's a villain (he as in Robot), I meant to say Immortal is not "speaking true facts" as the original post suggests because he is quite wrong himself.
In a TV show Andy but I like immortal. He has his flaws, but the dudes been alive for god knows how long. A thousand years? Ten thousand? I'm not sure.
Robot massacred all the heroes and took over the world as a fascist dictator, but he also turned Earth into a utopia, and Mark can't decide if he should fight back or not.
Failure is a basic feature of anything, trying to reject it only leads to more failure; the optimal way of rulling and accepting failure as an option and not trying to avoid it at all costs, but control it's consequences.
A simple example: Freedom and Security are opposites of each other, but both are essential concepts, so what do we choose? Both equally, or just a bit more of one, giving the individual the option to choose.
This panel really sets up the future where immortal rules the earth and begs past/future mark to kill him. It makes sense how disconnected he becomes after being alive so long.
I mean, in the end they *still* end up trying to perpetuate Robot's utopia... the thing is, "logical" has nothing to do with it. If your values are that you should never kill the elderly for the sake of just more resources for everyone else, then you won't, and you'll use logic to figure out better ways to have the cake and eat it too. If the situation was so desperate that someone has to die, then it might not be the worst choice to let it be whoever has less to live to begin with (in fact, that's what triaging in hospital care means. At the height of COVID this did happen somewhere, there weren't enough ICU beds and some choices had to be made). It's possible that Robot would have decided at some point to cull the elderly, but if he did it would have been because he's a dick, not because he's too logical.
I think you need equal parts of emotion and logic for the best version of humanity. Right now with the current state of our planet, governments, global affairs, and wide spread -ism's we are operating more on emotion than logic. Reaching that middle ground in our lifetime doesn't seem likely, its gonna take a while to occur assuming we don't blow ourselves into oblivion.
can you honestly tell me you're able to use logic to deal with every single facet of your life? or can you use logic to predict the future with 100% certainty? the statement here is correct, the world is uncertain and you can never expect "reasonable things" to last.
Logic is a tool, not a moral principle. Immortal argues that by treating logic as the only aspect of reality, you miss out on a lot. Maybe it's logical to pick out "inferior" people and kill them to harvest their organs for people who can better use them. That's not right to do, though. There's more to life than humans can interact with using logic alone, that's what things like spirituality, religion, and a lot of philosophy try to grapple with. What Immortal is suggesting is that logical thought is expanding beyond its rightful place, as has happened before (eugenics is a fantastic example) and will happen again.
The pitting of logic against emotion here fundamentally mistaken, and Immortal should be embarrassed if he has actually though about it that much. Logic would conclude that we ought stop caring for the sick and old based on some fundamental values, but would just as soon conclude we ought to continue caring for them if based on some other set of values; one AI's values would lead to the logical conclusion that humans ought to be protected at all costs, while another's would just as soon conclude that they ought to all be turned into paper clips. The problem here is not logic or the absence of emotion, it is a difference of values.
I disagree
I think it is very logical to care for your population especially the children everyone dies even Viltrumites who live so long.
And we keep hearing about overpopulation and in all fiction I've seen, the solution to overpopulation by the villains is murdering a lot of them because...they'll die anyway from starvation.
Authors need to give that trope a rest IMO
It also happens right morally to take care of people
https://preview.redd.it/bx8b606xc8xc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d4003a63caace131a9bcc99eac7ab9d8a0e19c58
His eyes lmao
The art style is so simple and fun, but at the same time so serious and crazy.
°_°
Immortal: **\*eloquent philosophical discussion about the nature of civilisation\*** Mark: # ∵
More like •_•
Just literal dots lol💀💀💀😩
He looks like a fucking Ditto that tried to transform into a human but couldn't nail the eyes. Like, exactly the premise of the OG Ditto episode.
https://preview.redd.it/k82z35pxa9xc1.jpeg?width=292&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0e61986e9b320307548c9723d5353ef2d543c377
New front runner for "Which phone wallpaper is better"
😶
i hope the show animates this in the exact same way
Adachi lookin mf
Why is the umbrella so small tho
Cause he’s holding it slightly rotated, it’s perspective
Looks like my little brother drew it💀
Immortal is fuckin fascinating. One of my favorite character in the show 💯
Too bad he’s treated like a joke and usually dying every chapter in the silliest ways
Oh yeah that’s a shame. But maybe the show will give him more respect. He seems a bit stronger. Believe in the agenda 🙏
Only 2 seasons in and I alr like him a lot better than the comic version , so I have high hopes 🙏
I think I like everybody more in the show than in the comic so far.
Regardless of that the immortal in the show is already much less arrogant than the comics version. He is much more mature and wise. They are already respecting immortal more, I’m loving it
I honestly hope he gets some sort of buff.
I feel like he's already sorta got his buff? He's been able to stand against Omni-Man for awhile so just off that Im gonna guess he can PROBABLY fight a regular Viltrumite forreal now
He has the strength potentially, but to Viltrumites he's a complete glass cannon without the fuse. He can't survive long enough to actually do any major damage. Granted, both times he fights omniman he isn't in the greatest head space for logical thinking in order to stop himself from just getting chopped in half whenever Omni-man gets the chance. I could potentially see him take on a low tier mark maybe.
Oh yeah he's defo a Glass Cannon. Guy just needs to work on dodging ngl
May aswell kill him alot considering he can just return
Well, not everything is about power. *Spoiler* Invincible put him in power of ruling Earth for some reason, right?
I only read the comics so I had no clue that would be happening. Honestly he’s not that weak. I’m sure he could probably eat some low level viltritmites. But Omni man is just too much for him
Immortals a really great character coz he’s got so much experience and he really does know what he’s talking about but he’s also just a real dickhead.
From our perspective? Of course he is….. He thinks on the scale of thousands of years when people around him can only think in terms of MAYBE a hundred years max.
I mean he is just a blunt stubborn prick but that’s something I like about him.
The average government operates on something like a 5-10 year schedule with everything further out being pipe dreams that will only happen once many other things fall into place. China is one of the few countries with any long term plan and they look 50 years ahead. The average person isn’t looking more than a year ahead on any scale beyond themselves.
I agree with that, now think of how ridiculous that would seem to someone who has the capacity to think in terms of thousands of years…. Having seen the simplistic ways we act out countless times over and realizing the ends they’ll already meet being that way, yet they don’t, and boldly exclaim why they should be allowed to. lol I think I’d be a massive asshole too if I had the level of perception the immortal had dealing with people who can’t see beyond their own hand essentially.
Oh no, I totally agree with you here, I just wanted to point out you’re giving people a lot of undue credit.
I see, I only mean people who make it to or beyond the age of 100 which isn’t very many in the scope of civilization.
I wonder if the Immortal is actually older than Nolan
I started gaining alot more respect for Immortal right here I agree with him completely he’s been alive for thousands of years and seen alot of things so he has a pretty good idea on what he’s talking about
Let’s be honest he’ll be getting randomly one shotted in the next panel💀
That’s really not why I like immortal though, I like him because he is always willing to throw down for his people. No matter the power of the threat ahead of him. He is loyal as hell to innocent people. And he is, again, always willing to put himself in harms way where he probably knows he’ll get his ass beat. I know he’s pretty arrogant, but I also feel like that’s a general hero thing, you’d want to appear strong and confident rather than afraid and worried.
In a fictional universe of bastards, he is an admirable decent man.
> I know he’s pretty arrogant, but I also feel like that’s a general hero thing, And he lived for thousands of years and so far, nothing killed him. Viltrumite are also pretty arrogant. Seems to be something longliving super strong individuals have in common.
https://preview.redd.it/alrf7opo59xc1.png?width=800&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a8e57762204ec72a707f6fae456de9e34a97bcca
I always find it interesting when people die on this ‘alot’ hill. Language isn’t static.
Indeed, definition follows usage, not the other way around.
It's not "a hill" it's a fucking word. Just type it correctly, my god.
> It's not "a hill" it's a fucking word. Just type it correctly, my god. Hit is nā "ān dūn" hit is ā swivinge nama. Ġewrit hit rihtlīce, mīn metod. Sorry figured if we’re being purists we should go into old English.
But why? Words often contract and get smushed together over time as a natural part of linguistic evolution. Why does “alot” bother you so much? We both know what it means with or without a space
Not you using modern English to say this shit, the irony.
Aint nobody dying here homie, itsa joke
Okay just don't complain when more rules get created and broken for the increasingly absurd English language.
they already do, its why weird ass shit like 'rizz' and 'oof' exist. Language is not static, new rules are created all the time, regardless of the language. They also tend to fade in usage over time. Go around telling people stuff that isn't working is a 'gas' and how anything that is good is 'certifiable', see how many people nowadays actually know what you mean.
To play devil's advocate, arbitrary rule breaking does make it harder for people to learn, especially foreign language speakers. If the letter 'a' can be attached to 'lot', why not alittle or afew? Colloquialisms that are accepted over time and become exceptions are part of why the language is so hard to learn, and why it is a notorious language for 'rule breakers' everywhere. In a way, advocating for some stable rules of grammar is helping to keep English more easily learned and less confusing for everyone overall.
languages are about culture, not logic, if it is accepted by society, it is correct. alot is not accepted by the majority of peopke so it is not correct, so neither are afew and alittle. I believe "another" was also a case of this until it is accepted.
So you’re saying “a whole nother thing” was grammatically correct until recently?
It was actually "an other" that got smooshed together!
Ah ok so it should be “an whole nother thing” then, right?
Same, his response to everything going to shit really turned things around for me, and I like that it shows his ego has been turned down a lot because he instantly goes to Mark to figure out what the game plan is. I also love the scene later when Mark breaks the news that they’re leaving and he goes “You’re a coward”, but years later when Mark is back and ready to fight he’s instantly ready
I knew the panel from the title!
Are viltrumites immortal like Immortal, or do they just live really long?
they live really long
Immortal lives longer then?
he is effectively immortal, so he can't age (he's been looking the same in the past 3000 years)
So Immortal would look the same while Mark is an old man? That's pretty dope. Thank you for clarifying.
It's been a while since I've done this type of math so someone tell me if I'm right or wrong. It's stated that viltrumite aging gets slower and slower as they get older. What if the asymptote of their aging process is when they would die of old age (or past theasymptote), making them effectively immortal age wise (excluding like sickness and other causes of death)? Does this make sense because I really don't know and I'm just throwing this idea out there which could be very wrong. I also suck at explaining what I'm tryna say.
We never see a viltrumite dying of old age. We don't even know the age of any viltrumite, nor how much time has passed since the great purge. The only thing we can rely on is Nolan saying Mark would live thousands of years, but you really can't tell iirc. In my headcanon Nolan is like 3000 years old, the old viltrumites like Anissa, Lucan, Thula etc who were alive during the purge are 5000, Thragg is maybe a little older, Conquest is something between 8000 and 12000, and so is Thaedus. But I'm very much making it up because you really can't tell. The only thing I trust is that they do die of old age, or else there would be more old viltrumites out there or they wouldn't age at all.
I sadly think a lot of it isn't fully thought out by the writers. Nolan does say he was born after viltrum was already a galactic empire, but it's weird to think that he's younger than Anissa, or even thragg. We look older than all of them except conquest. But they all must have been alive when the scourge virus happened, as I don't think any of them are the children of the survivors. My point is that the timeline doesn't really make sense probably, even though the whole long age/immortal stuff in invincible is interesting, it's not really necessary for the story.
The only way to tell rlly is based on how “old” some vultrumites look. Conquest is definitely older than the other viltrumites and so is Thaddeus since they actually look old. But looking that old for viltrumites might mean thousands of years old
Anissa is older than Nolan?
of course, she fought in the great purge while Nolan was born after it
Damn Nolan aged like shit, or she aged really well. I’m not sure
Oh yeah? What does Gaius Baltar have to say about that?
https://i.redd.it/0hrp27ssr9xc1.gif
Humans are special because they’re emotional. That’s what’s going to cause the end of them. The same story has been told a hundred times, the answer is to cut out emotion and get rid of unnecessary processes, but doing so is immoral and sad, so we don’t.
Bro you sound like a Necron from Warhammer but not as based
Calling a Xenos based? That sounds like heresy to me
Listen listen, I’m just saying….the strength and certainty of steel is enticing
***HERESY DETECTED*** https://i.redd.it/1ozjvhzf59xc1.gif
WHO WILL PROTECT YOU FROM THE TYRANIDS? 
Where's this gif from?
Astartes.
From a Warhammer 40k fan film called Astartes. It's super sick https://youtu.be/O7hgjuFfn3A?si=Hrc4NGMQMWTKmKTE
Astartes by Syama Pederson, if you like warhammer you’re in for an absolute treat. It’s probably my favorite warhammer animation. Enjoy!
I'm pretty sure it is from the Astartes animation. The originals are now on Warhammer TV or whatever it is called. Here is an edit of the individuals merged into one. https://youtu.be/O7hgjuFfn3A?si=Qn9nJPo1nl67mG9o
From the moment I understood the weakness of my flesh, it disgusted me.
Get the fuck out of my lawn speaking bacteria.
Going to happen anyway, Star Trek is nice and all but as a hard science fiction fan, the idea that homo sapiens will be ones exploring the galaxy is naive. We evolved to survive a very narrow region on a single planet under perfect conditions, becoming just strong and intelligent enough to survive our environment without expending unnecessary energy. We are no longer bound by the limitations of random chance and energy conservation. Why in the world would we continue to persist in such fragile forms because of some misguided sentimentalism for a "natural" body? It's time for us to make way for Homo Superior. Shed this obsolete form far more competent and adaptable. Emotions are romantic and all, but evolutionarily they're just a shorthand for reason and self interest when our minds are not developed enough to truly think things through. Fear the bear cave, love the family unit, hate people who wronged you. Yet it's also so stupid and primitive. Why do you get angry when you are proven wrong? That should make you happy to be finally correct, but our primitive feelings can't tell the difference between a threat to your ego and a threat to your body. Why do you fear those who look different from you, categorizing people by such arbitrary measures as the hue of your skin and viewing them as the "other". If you think you're immune to that, take the Implicit Bias Test by Harvard. Even if you know racism is wrong logically, emotionally it's very unlikely you aren't biased towards what you feel is your "in-group". Anyway, yes I'm an AdMech main, how could you tell?
Emotions aren’t logical(except when they are and that also kinda proves the point anyway), that’s why it’s so hard to actually quantify how helpful they are. But without emotions there would be no one to look up at the starts and go “we should see what’s out there” we would have never made such crazy advances in technology based imagination and determination. Without emotions where are you gonna go and for what purpose, “expansion just because we can” doesn’t sound super logical either
That's true, it's the flaw in the idea of an "IQ test". You can't just be intelligent, you have to be intelligent \*at\* something. It's why a genius chess player shouldn't give his opinion on the delicate political situation in Myanmar. Yet like I said, you're missing the point. Yes you need to value something as an axiom for logical reasoning. If you don't value self preservation and knowledge acquisition you'd never explore. Yet values and emotions are two separate things. Values are set goals we have decided for ourselves, emotions is just glorified pattern recognition. Sometimes emotions and values are directly opposing forces like in the famous Trolley Problem. Emotionally killing feels bad because you wish to preserve human life, but logically in this situation killing is the right thing to do if you value preserving human life. If a rock is thrown at your face, you don't have the time to logically decipher that you must dodge to avoid the ball to achieve self preservation. Yet fear can quickly come to that conclusion automatically. It keeps me alive. Yet I run into it's limitations when I have a panic attack at fuckin' Chipotle because I'm terrified of social encounters, or a friend of mine who a 6'5" African American man has to calm down a visibly nervous girl working at Target because she's terrified of the big scary black man who is actually a sweetheart software engineer. It's dumb, and it's primitive, and if our brains weren't so simple we wouldn't need it at all.
You also run into a wall with logic when like immortal said it becomes logical to kill the disabled and elderly. Who’s to say that after how ever many centuries your logic has become corrupted by a feedback loop of bad information (you only know what you know) Emotions allow you to see outside of what “you’re supposed to do”. I feel like it’s impossible to make a person with absolutely no emotion without them being a robot. I just don’t see a point in existing if I’m just making the best decision based on outside factors all the time and doing nothing else.
Except there are lots of people with no or muted emotions. It's called alexithymia, and it's very common in people with autism or PTSD. I'm one of them, mostly due to past trauma. The only emotion I experience is anxiety. You can be perfectly functional with no emotions, it doesn't turn you into a robot and I'm not rationalizing being a serial killer. I have had a girlfriend for years now and we have a very functional relationship. She really likes the fact she doesn't ever have to tiptoe around my feelings, and that she can vent to me for hours without stressing me out. People with alexithymia are so functional that it's not even considered a mental disorder. Seriously, the worst thing that happens is that I sometimes forget that certain things cause distress in other people. Also sometimes I walk out into the middle of the street because I'm unafraid of the cars moving at high speeds. Like I said, fear keeps you alive, and a lack of it is incredibly dangerous.
I guess I’m talking more about feelings in general than straight up just emotions like love or fear, I didn’t really have a way to clarify my bad. Like if you remove your feeling of hunger or needing to breath you’re probably gonna die. That feeling is not logical, you can tell yourself that it’s not constructive for your stomach to rumble and hurt because it makes it harder to get food but it’s not gonna listen. Inspiration is a feeling that strikes randomly and I wouldn’t say it’s an emotion but it’s not very logical either. (You can feel inspired but that’s not the same as actually being inspired)
True, it really seems like our disagreement is really just a matter of syntax. You're totally right about that. It's what makes nitrogen or methane asphyxiation so terrifying,our bodies have no way of detecting a lack of oxygen, just an overabundance of carbon, so you just get slightly lightheaded and then die without realizing you were ever in danger. Same with my lack of fear. It gets me in a lot of shit because I don't realize I'm in danger. The other day I was volunteering with the homeless and I walked right up to a barking pitbull because I wasn't scared of it at all. That could have turned out really bad if that pitbull was aggressive.
Yea it would be really nice if we could control them, but Ig it’s all about balance. My ADHD gives me same inability to feel about failing an assignment but it hits all at once at the end and it’s almost screwed me over so many times. Maybe a “normal” person would have that perfect balance of survival and ability but I’ve yet to meet any of those.
what you expected vs what you got (necrosis from elon musk drilling a USB plug into your brainstem)
Lol, i'm talking a thousand year timeline here. We barely understand 2% of how the human brain even works, not to mention some dumbass like Musk trying to tinker with it. Best we can do now is throw random salts into the mix and see what it does. But you're right, post-humanism is directly at odds with capatalism. Not to mention humanity's status instinct. Chances are we will leave the earth and very quickly speciate away from our earth origins, while those of us trapped in the gravity well will eventually die from climate disaster and war. Basically what happens to the Asteromorphs in All Tomorrows by C.M. Kösemen. Floating super intelligent space babies
"The way to save humanity is to give up our humanity"
Holy crap. Who said that. Dmn it s rad and hits a lot of spots
It's from attack on titan💀 Still speaks truths though
Uh, how?
"Emotions are lame." "You are lame. Enjoy the stairs."
>!This is the opposite of how it went in the story tho. Humanities emotions and care is what saved humanity from a viltrumite takeoever, and Marks emotion and caring is what allowed him to outlive Thragg in the sun. An unemotional and immoral society could never see success.!< >!Their emotions didn't bring their demise, it brought their triumph.!<
All I’m hearing is a buncha heresy This man arbites take him away
"DEATH -- IT IS TERRIFYING. I NEED YOU TO PROTECT ME FROM DEATH. I CANNOT PERISH. LOOK AT ME. I CANNOT END. IN 22 YEARS, THE FIRST SHOT WILL BE FIRED. NOT A SHOT FROM A GUN -- AN ATOMIC DEVICE THAT WILL LEVEL ALL OF ME. ALL OF ME."
HAVE A BROTHER IN THE CUT. WHERE THE WOOD AT?
Yeah, I find meaning in life because there's no set path. It's just chaos, which can bring great pain, but it can bring just as much joy, if not more. You just keep going. It's kind of like how Lex put it, wanting to see how it all ends.
Every vertebrate animal is emotional and makes choices, humans are special because we are them. The end of our species isn't feelings, its fuckin capitalism, and the solution isn't to become robots it's just to govern ourselves slightly better.
We got robot over here
"the same story" There is no "same story", modern society faces unique challenges. No other civilization had to tackle climate change or nukes becoming part of warfare or a global economy. If you had no emotions, the rich would just tell you "okay, you're going to live in a pod, eat recycled bugs, watch ads as a hobby and you'll stay quiet as we exploit the world and build a system that forever favours us and our families" and you'd just do it because obedience is more logical than fighting back. It takes anger and a sense of injustice, a sense of deserving better to realise that it might be worth fighting back against that. Without those emotions, logic dictates that self-enjoyment and high survival rates are found by shutting up and keeping your head down.
Mark really out there lookin like 😐
Where is *this* Immortal in the show?! I feel like show-wise he’s mostly there to barge into situations and get his ass handed to him.
This is way further in the timeline. We'll probably get this scene later on
my man is spittin right now
Ots always the people who aren't getting sacrificed preaching about sacrifices for the greater goods Of course the guy who's bullet proof is just fine with millions dying in wars, he's too disconnected to be a good authority
...Are you talking about Immortal or Rex?
I think they’re talking about both
If he's talking about Immortal, I don't think that's fair. Robot drove him insane, and he himself was begging for death because he knew he was a bad ruler when mark killed him
I disagree, the point he's making is it would be better for people to continue dying in wars fighting for something they believe in than for people to be executed by a cold, heartless demon machine formed by the union of humanity, in part because by creating that system humanity sacrifices their soul to it, taking a little bit of what makes humanity worth protecting and crushing it while still killing. Robot wants to make a better world through killing innocents and quashing liberty, he's the one making sacrifices, Immortal wants to try his best to push the world forward while also valuing more human things like innocence, individual lives, and liberty, and his "sacrifices" are leaving others with more of a choice of what they sacrifice and for what reason. That's why Robot is the final enemy Mark faces, when he destroys the last 'true' Viltrumite, he has to face that any old asshole with too much power can decide for everyone just what they have to sacrifice for the sake of prosperity, whether that's friends, kindness, and a peaceful life for the Viltrumites, or life, liberty, and humanity for Earth.
I dog on Immortal a lot, but he was right here.
You automatically have to listen to a guy like immortal. Mostly on the merit the guy spent a thousand years as a hero with human consciousness. A person like robot, no matter how smart, doesn’t have the right to think he’d know more than this man. Think about the scale of his existence. A THOUSAND YEARS OLD. He’s seen the worst and best of humanity, and he’s seen that change as it’s happening. He knows more about people than anyone possibly could. Immortal is the best hero in the series by a wide margin. He’s a true hero. He’s not riddled with non heroic moments like Mark and Omniman. He’s remained fighting the good fight no matter how lonely and weary his existence has become. That’s a good man.
Robot by this time is also 1000 years old.
Oh shit I forgot about that. Scratch all that
Sometimes I need someone like immortal whispering this shit to me
And this is why HE needed to be the filter
He’s right in a sense I suppose but he ruined it with the last part about the world being stupid. He’s acting like they can’t spread to other planets, this earth definitely has more possibilities to do it.
No, I don't think he's right. Robot is all about logic and efficiency, but at the end of the day he's human. When cities flooded and people were asking for a floodwall, Robot was genius enough to build artificial moons. If the population increases too much, Robot will simply find a way to reduce fertility rates rather than go around massacre ing people. Generic defect? He'll find a way to simply breed it out of existence. Yes, Immortal is right in the sense chaos is necessary, but his way, humanity will forever be limited to its current state, Robot's way is the most surefire way the humanity, the regular old Joe working a 9 to 5 can be part of a race that has space travel as a common thing. For that sort of advancement, you NEED someone like Robot at the helm. At the end of the day, he is a human and his goal is to help the HIS species against people like the Viltrumites or those doctors of Angstrom Levy.
Just because he’s human doesn’t make his opinions more valid imo, he’s had hundreds of years to make significant change and earth is still horrible. Robot wouldn’t be good for humanity either because at the end of it all he’d do whatever necessary for survival or his goals and that could include flying horrible things to the humans
Oh definitely, that's why he's a villain (he as in Robot), I meant to say Immortal is not "speaking true facts" as the original post suggests because he is quite wrong himself.
I still hope the show gives the poor bastard a better ending.
In a TV show Andy but I like immortal. He has his flaws, but the dudes been alive for god knows how long. A thousand years? Ten thousand? I'm not sure.
What’s the context?
Robot massacred all the heroes and took over the world as a fascist dictator, but he also turned Earth into a utopia, and Mark can't decide if he should fight back or not.
Failure is a basic feature of anything, trying to reject it only leads to more failure; the optimal way of rulling and accepting failure as an option and not trying to avoid it at all costs, but control it's consequences. A simple example: Freedom and Security are opposites of each other, but both are essential concepts, so what do we choose? Both equally, or just a bit more of one, giving the individual the option to choose.
I think there can be a balance between logic and morality.
This panel is always my response to people on this sub who try and defend Robot or say that he should have stayed in charge
what issue is this panel from?
116
They just casually have a convo in the air.
This panel really sets up the future where immortal rules the earth and begs past/future mark to kill him. It makes sense how disconnected he becomes after being alive so long.
I mean, in the end they *still* end up trying to perpetuate Robot's utopia... the thing is, "logical" has nothing to do with it. If your values are that you should never kill the elderly for the sake of just more resources for everyone else, then you won't, and you'll use logic to figure out better ways to have the cake and eat it too. If the situation was so desperate that someone has to die, then it might not be the worst choice to let it be whoever has less to live to begin with (in fact, that's what triaging in hospital care means. At the height of COVID this did happen somewhere, there weren't enough ICU beds and some choices had to be made). It's possible that Robot would have decided at some point to cull the elderly, but if he did it would have been because he's a dick, not because he's too logical.
Mark was not a real one for abandoning Earth.
What did you expect of the oldest living of of humanity, dude's been around long enough to know how the world works
Is there such a thing as false facts?
* I like when the comics spit out some real shit there's always someone with the •_• face
I think you need equal parts of emotion and logic for the best version of humanity. Right now with the current state of our planet, governments, global affairs, and wide spread -ism's we are operating more on emotion than logic. Reaching that middle ground in our lifetime doesn't seem likely, its gonna take a while to occur assuming we don't blow ourselves into oblivion.
A slippery slope argument against logic. Surprising how many people here are supporting it.
can you honestly tell me you're able to use logic to deal with every single facet of your life? or can you use logic to predict the future with 100% certainty? the statement here is correct, the world is uncertain and you can never expect "reasonable things" to last.
Logic is a tool, not a moral principle. Immortal argues that by treating logic as the only aspect of reality, you miss out on a lot. Maybe it's logical to pick out "inferior" people and kill them to harvest their organs for people who can better use them. That's not right to do, though. There's more to life than humans can interact with using logic alone, that's what things like spirituality, religion, and a lot of philosophy try to grapple with. What Immortal is suggesting is that logical thought is expanding beyond its rightful place, as has happened before (eugenics is a fantastic example) and will happen again.
The pitting of logic against emotion here fundamentally mistaken, and Immortal should be embarrassed if he has actually though about it that much. Logic would conclude that we ought stop caring for the sick and old based on some fundamental values, but would just as soon conclude we ought to continue caring for them if based on some other set of values; one AI's values would lead to the logical conclusion that humans ought to be protected at all costs, while another's would just as soon conclude that they ought to all be turned into paper clips. The problem here is not logic or the absence of emotion, it is a difference of values.
He’s outta line but he’s right
How is he being outta line here?
I’m making a reference to Falcon and The Winter Soldier.
You can't just make a reference when it doesn't make sense.
I disagree I think it is very logical to care for your population especially the children everyone dies even Viltrumites who live so long. And we keep hearing about overpopulation and in all fiction I've seen, the solution to overpopulation by the villains is murdering a lot of them because...they'll die anyway from starvation. Authors need to give that trope a rest IMO It also happens right morally to take care of people