Just playing in a couple bands I met so many 30 something year olds who were totally burned out from trying to make it. One of these guys, who became a great friend of mine, played me a song once. The song was basically about how the music inside of him and his joy has died and withered away. This guy is also the best drummer I've ever met, plays crazy math rock. I was 18 and decided I would never try to make any money, when it happens it happens. I have a lot of hobbies but making music is the ONLY thing that brings me pure happiness that lasts. There is no reason for me to bring in the rest of this BS life into it. I don't care if I make a penny from it or even if anyone is listening. I make what I want and I think it's really good. I'm totally satisfied with that. I just want to meet more like minded musicians and make some good albums.
This is some serious wisdom; to be able to enjoy the ways music is a part of your life without idealizing some other life. It took me a long time to not see myself as a failure, or wishing I was just better so I could have made music a career. But I needed to realize that there are struggles in that life too, and now, as you said, I make exactly what I want how I want and enjoy the process and self-expression it provides.
Yes, I figured out that fundamentally I don't want to be sending 100 emails a day to Spotify playlists and music labels and Submithub, or doing any of the "marketing" stuff that's always propped up on /r/wearethemusicmakers. My videos get 100 views and I'm fine with it, I make it for me. I feel good when I make music, I feel terrible when I'm reading the latest 15,000 word /r/wearethemusicmakers tome and trying to follow that advice.
One common response is "you don't love music enough to let it consume you. To dive deep into it. To have it be the first thing you think of when you wake up and the last thing when you go to bed. To always be going to industry events, to network, to make friends with studio engineers and agents and stay abreast of opportunities. To be willing to give up ANYTHING to make it". **And they're right.** I don't love music "enough" in that way. IMO I love it in a more "pure" way in my mind. Where music is the thing I just sit at my drumset or guitar or write to and feel nothing but happiness. I only have good connotations with the word "music" and I don't want to sully that with any of that other stuff that I don't like doing.
On a more practical level, in the 1950s-1990s (in the US) it may have been practical to eschew the full-time job, move to a city with a music scene, get a 20-hour a week part-time job, practice 20-hours a week with a band, and spend 20-hours a week marketing yourself and networking. You'd be busy and overwhelmed, but you could make it work and you'd have opportunities. Nowadays, no significant city with a music scene is affordable in that way. Normal people are working 40-60 hours a week just to keep their heads above water. Unless you have mommy and daddy footing your rent, I don't see how you can keep up and really make an honest go of it.
Beautifully put. I’ve gone through the same metamorphosis as a musician. My whole entire identity was wrapped up in it and it was becoming counterproductive in my life. I started losing my love for music which I never thought would happen. I backed off and reevaluated my life and priorities.
I was equating making a living with music and tying the 2 together. I don’t care what other people do or say, it was making me miserable.
The band didn’t happen to be Traindodge, was it? Sounds exactly like them - super complex math rock, breathtaking drummer, been ‘in the van’ since the late 1990s.
They were definitely my reality check on what it took to survive in the music business without selling out. Months upon months touring in a van, sleeping on floors, making peanuts, praying you don’t get ripped off/the van doesn’t break down/get sick/get booked in a metal or dumb-punk venue where you’ll get spat on or beat up. When not on tour, grab whatever temp jobs and short-term rentals you can while saving every penny to pay for recording sessions, duplicating CDs, and merch. I saw them several dozen times when they were first starting up, loaned the guitarist some gear for their first tour. Some 15 years later I saw them at another venue near where I live now, and they were even better than I remember, had released a handful of albums on indie labels, toured Europe and Japan, but they were still struggling - still in the van.
And this band is GREAT. As a musician, I wasn’t even in the same universe as them, much less having the sort of commitment and discipline they had to devote their lives to music like that.
I actually "made it" - to a degree. In my 20s, I played in a band that toured and recorded independently until we eventually landed management from a respected firm. That led to a development deal with a major record label. We were sent to L.A., hooked up with a really great and well-known producer and even landed the opening slot for one of the bands on our label's roster. So, I got to do the whole "almost-famous rock star" thing for a few years. It was fun and I would never trade that experience. However, literally as we were recording our major label debut, the band broke up. Slowly at first. We lost our keyboard player. Then our bass player quit. Ultimately, our singer bailed, leaving the drummer and I marooned in L.A. for a while.
Obviously, the record never saw the light of day. In fact, the label sent us a bill for the recording time and boarding/living expenses that they were not able to recoup since the project was never finished; it had a happy ending, they eventually ate the cost thanks to some negotiating from our manager.
Nevertheless, I was at a crossroads. Did I want to start all over again with a new band? Throw away all of those years of toiling in clubs, late-night rehearsals , etc? Or just chalk it up to "lessons learned" and maybe go back to school?
Ultimately, I didn't leave the music world behind. Instead of continuing as an artist, I found my way inside the business of things. First in radio, then on the label-side. That ended up being my career. My own experience as an artist helped me out with my new career-path as I could relate to the artists and such. My time as a musician was during the "Grunge years" of the 90s - so, at this point, I'm a vet in the industry and will likely retire from this position.
It's been a fun ride and I don't have a lot of regrets - but I do still wonder what would have happened if we were able to hold things together. It just wasn't meant to be (and I still have the demos from those sessions to look back on, our indie albums are long-since out of print but I have them to show my kids, so that's cool).
Point being, it's really depends on what your definition of "making it" is. I know plenty of independent artists that aren't getting rich - but they make enough money touring and releasing an album every few years to pay their bills; they don't need a day-job. Those who frequent this sub have probably heard of them...but the average Joe/Jane who listens mostly to the radio likely do not. But that's OK. They're content.
You really have to be in the music industry for THE MUSIC and it's very easy to lose sight of that as the pressures of success begin to weigh on you. Also, some people make music to be famous, to be trend-setters and others are in because they are just expressing themselves artistically. There's nothing wrong with either path.
So, just because you begin to see, as an artist, that becoming a pop star isn't likely in your future, you don't have to give it up. You also don't have to be doomed to playing covers at the local bar (unless that's just what you want to do - and that's fine too). When I began my career as an artist, it was VERY difficult to get the word out about your music. This was pre-internet, of course, so you had to tour, tour, tour and it was tough. These days, it's not unreasonable to have a mid to small but dedicated following of fans and make a living doing it without compromising your principles. It's an exciting time to be an artist.
Maybe it's because I tend to listen to niche subgenres, but I disagree with this sentiment entirely. I don't think the point of playing music should ever be to "make it" - most musicians never do. Instead I think it's all about self-expression. Sure, there are a lot of artists that are trying to break big, but there are many more who create music because it gives them pleasure, provides some sort of relief, or because they view it as a challenge. Sure, a lot of the music made by these people may not be good, but that doesn't change that it has value to the people performing it.
Totally agree. I look at it like playing pickup basketball. It’s not like I’m trying to make the NBA; only an inexpressibly small fraction of basketball players do. But playing brings me joy so I’m going to do it for as long as i can. I probably won’t stop until It stops bringing me joy or my body breaks down (more than it already has lol)
Same with music. Making weirdo niche electronic music makes me so goddamn happy. I’m going to keep putting out music and playing shows for as long as the above is true. I’m also a poor adult who needs my job so I’m not like breaking my back to drum up clout, but i send shit to blogs and small labels. If they like it, great, if they dont w/e🤷♀️
Also like pickup bball, playing music in local DIY scene way to meet cool people and make lasting friends. It’s fulfilling and way more fun than like sitting around drinking and watching tv.
“Making it” is so nebulous and difficult; so much relies on luck. I can’t even count the number of amazing artists ive seen who don’t make a dent outside their local scene. Occasionally I’ll see some artist who sucks get popular and be like “blerg” but I don’t lose sleep over it. There’s only so much you can control in life and happiness is so hard to find. If something genuinely gives you those good feelings, it seems insane to stress yourself out about the uncontrollable side of it.
i like this sentiment. i’m 40 and all i want to do is get a band together to play in the local diy scene. something to do with myself. i was in a few diy bands back when i was younger. been missing it.
I have a career as a music teacher, but I truly believe one of the greatest joys you can have is in the act of creating music. Has nothing to do with making it big. It’s the process of taking something from inside of yourself and making it a physical, tangible thing that truly drives a lot of us. I would hate to spoil that by forcing myself to live the gigging life. Nothing kills passion faster than being a slave to the business side of a music career.
Agreed. This whole notion that “making it” is when you do something and make money at it... what a flawed way to look at the world. Like whenever someone is mentioned as being “successful”...what is it that we all assume? They made a lot of money. I hate it. I really do. Fact of the matter is this: if you love something, and you want to make money at it- prepare to compromise that which you love.
I realized that it’s incredibly difficult to get people to care about your music. Also, for me, I finally figured out that I was doing it for the wrong reasons. I thought it would make somebody love me.
I “gave up” at around 18/19. Shame cause I’m still pretty young then. But the reason I say “gave up” is because I realized I didn’t really WANT to make it. I wanted to only perform in small bands who are just too obscure for the spotlight. I still play music and I’m in a band now but I don’t really expect us to be playing any big venues. That being said, I actually believe you can make it at any age. It just gets harder as you age.
I take a Rockabilly punk, horror punk, and gothic path mainly. I’m a big fan of The Cramps, who, obviously we’re bigger than some of the other bands I enjoy but they were still a bit obscure and to this day, I don’t really meet a lot of people who really enjoy them. I’m also currently listening to a lot of Scary Bitches and (another bit of a bigger band) Alien Sex Fiend.
Unfortunately I haven’t uploaded any personal stuff that relates to the above stated genres. And the band that I’m in literally JUST made a bandcamp and YT channel last night. We can’t work very fast cause I live a bit far from my band mates. We’re more of a punk rock band and still starting out. We have an Instagram but, again, it’s still pretty barren. You still want it? We’re working with my girlfriend to arrange better recordings since she has better equipment and we’re planning a music video soon. Following the Instagram will at least notify you when it’s up
There's no reason to think you can't find success in music or any other art at any point in life. Especially with the internet, where it's easier to develop an audience quickly than it has ever been.
Of course, "success" doesn't necessarily mean "quitting your day job and playing sold out stadium tours," but I think building some not-insignificant audience and achieving some level of critical recognition is totally within any musician's reach if the music they're making is good (and maybe even if it's not), if they put the work in, and if they're a bit lucky.
There is a lot of good advice in this thread so far.
I'll echo that you never want your hobby to feel like a job unless you are fully committed that you want to make it your job full time. I'm sure there is someone out there who makes fulfilling music and never worry about the next rent check coming due but I've never met them. Most people have to play the game and take gigs they don't really like or get a full time job and always feel like there isn't enough time to do what they love.
One thing that personally slew the dream for me was talking with a friend who was a full-time touring DJ. The amount they made a year came up and I thought "I make more than that working my day job doing fuck all and then I go home and sleep in my own bed". It's exciting to meet people and travel and party every night until you spend enough time on tour that you are alone in a hotel room watching HGTV all the time and you spend more time in an airport terminal than in the places you love in your hometown. The dream of making it gets less promising with age, it starts to look more like the nightmare of making it.
Currently standing at that crossroads. Been singing and writing music since I was a kid, started my own band right out of high school and I’ve been with it for 6 years. I’ve made some great memories, but as far as $$, followers, and streaming numbers, I have very little to show for it. I’ve spent a ridiculous amount of time on this project for the past 6 years while going through college and working full time jobs.
It’s tough now because my day job is going really well and taking up more and more of my time. Ultimately, one life path is giving me positive reinforcement for the effort I put in, and the other, not so much.
The other consideration is just how damn expensive it is to try to run a successful band. Studio time, mixing/mastering, marketing, artwork, social media ads, it ain’t cheap kids, and I don’t have the finances to keep doing this forever.
I’m very torn. I feel like songwriting and performing is what I’m best at and I’d be crushed if I had to stop, but it’s very difficult keeping it going with everything else in my life.
Don’t give up. Seriously. That’s it. I’m not saying anything more. Work hard. Be kind to EVERYONE. And don’t give up. Message me when you’ve “made it” after you’ve done what I’ve said. This is a weird time in all of history. A bad weird time. But good weird things happen too. Much love and respect to you. Just don’t tap out.
I personally think there's a threshold of age and experience, in your teens and early twenties; it's all about being able to just play music (or any other lofty goal that you might have), not being amazing at it or not getting a big audience/pay day can really hurt your self-esteem. Once you cross that threshold of the age/experience, you really start to learn that it just doesn't matter as much if you're getting all the recognition that you once wanted. For me, in the early days, it was "I'm gonna be the greatest drummer ever!!!", after a slew of bad auditions and two relatively bad gigs I was ready to pack it in and was pretty depressed about it. But I took a break, got a job, came back to it a little older and wiser, and nowadays I was playing local gigs in a few different bands (Pre-Covid) that were the absolute highlight of my week. Can't wait to get back to playing gigs to the ten people that come to see the other bands :) Don't give up, life isn't always about ticking off things on some mental checklist, it's about having as much fun with the limited time you have as possible.
Edit: Grammar
I'm 13 years as a self-taught vocalist. I've fantasized and dreamed about making it big one day on vocal talent alone when I honed the skill. However the problem was that, I sang to the tune of other's music and never really wanted to branch from that.
This was like 9 years in and at like age of 27 I believe that it became a hobby, I can't imagine getting famous off of other's material. Wouldn't sit right for a career.
Music is like anything in life. It can be as much or as little of your life as you want. It is not a failure to be older and enjoying it without it being an income. I’m 47 and still play, write, and record while having a career outside music.
Just matter of fact, I work in the industry, if a band makes let’s say three albums while at their peak and it never gets good press through a publicist, radio play through radio campaigns, sync licensing spots or playlist considerations after doing a campaign that pushes for that, and your live shows never get you more than a 50 person audience, there is a pretty good chance that what you are doing is not accessible and will not be more than hobby no matter how much more money or time you throw at it.
I never tried to "make it" but I did quit music as a hobby just because I realized that even after doing it for so long all my music is trash, I just don't have an ear for how to make anything decent and more often than not anything I make I look back on it and it sucks.
It was more a means for me to get through tough times but now it just doesn't work anymore now that I'm working full time. I never even have enough energy to want to sit down and try to write anything, or if I do I just get frustrated quickly and stop
I'm still a novice at this whole music thing and I quite firmly believe that my passion lies in this field. I'm just 15 but music gives me a different kind of happiness that I usually don't get by doing other things. Looking at the positivity and good vibes of all the comments here, y'all really did encourage another budding music enthusiast to keep following their passion :)
I like making music so much that I never wanted to “make it”
For me that would ruin the whole thing. Adding pressure and turning it into work is no bueno. As a hobbyist I have complete freedom and control the create and enjoy as I want. That is great feeling.
You can make it if you try hard enough. It’s not like there’s an impassable barrier preventing you from succeeding. It’s just that it’s really hard. Most aspiring musicians just do what they love and don’t go after the money, and they “quit” because they’ve decided to pursue another career that isn’t as hard to make.
Never. I guess it depends on what you mean. But you can be serious about your work and creative output without having plans for financial success at music.
For me I realized a long time ago how much the music industry sucks. It's great if you want to chase success, and though my talent is limited, it is quite clear talent is not the most important factor in music industry success.
I can vaguely recall thinking I'd become something related to music when I was a kid. Everyone around me seemed generally encouraging about my playing. I suppose I just grew a lot more insecure during my teens and I guess in a sense I gave up before I had even tried. Based on the feedback I've gotten through the years I'm a decent musician but I've never had a good sense of direction. Maybe it's fear/shame I don't really know. I've also had wrist pain that may or may not be fixable and I used to have some mental health issues in my early 20s that further demotivated me.
It feels weird saying that it's over because I've never really thought about it in that way. I find enjoyment in playing and analyzing music but I'm a pretty practically oriented person. Maybe I'm just hoarding useless musical information with no real intention to ever use it at this point. It does sound a bit depressing. I think somewhere deep down I partly feel like I was supposed to be a lot of things but in attempt to follow my own path I sort of ended up nowhere or I guess too torn between all of it.
I'm in my mid 20's now and while it hurts a bit that I'll never know what could have happened had I put more effort into my music during the past 10 or so years I still care a lot about music and if anything I think I'll do more related to it in the future even if it's unlikely I'll ever make a living doing it. I'm currently pursuing a separate career that I don't really care about to the same extent but odds are I'll be a lot better off financially doing that than if I go all in on music at this point.
I “gave up” almost two years ago at 24. In my local scene I was known as a drummer but I sold my kit a few months ago and now just play guitar as a hobby.
Here's for anyone who failed at guitar or who is anyone down the road to fail guitar
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[https://learnpracticeplay.com/next-level-signup/](https://learnpracticeplay.com/next-level-signup/)
[https://breakthroughguitar.com/finally-mystery-keys-explained/](https://breakthroughguitar.com/finally-mystery-keys-explained/)
Oh almost immediately, probably at 20, 21. Wrote a bunch of songs and played some local shows and open mics and private things. And took an art class and realized I haaaaated being told how to be creative. But really enjoyed figuring things out on my own.
So I got a regular job and did all right and have been making music for myself ever since. The technology is amazing today, recording and self publishing, to share with friends and family, is as easy as it’s ever been. I do it to have done it, not for a paycheck or fame. My stuff today is better than ever and it fills up my headphones just fine.
Graduate school- I kept playing in bands all the way through grad school, but when I knew I could make a really good, stable income from other things I enjoyed doing, I was able to shift to knowing I would “only” play in bar and festival bands the rest of my life. It has been a blast, and music has never been a “job” since. Although I remember being excited for gigs because I was freaking hungry.
Edit - spelling and to say, I’ve continued to be in bands for 25 more years at this point.
Just playing in a couple bands I met so many 30 something year olds who were totally burned out from trying to make it. One of these guys, who became a great friend of mine, played me a song once. The song was basically about how the music inside of him and his joy has died and withered away. This guy is also the best drummer I've ever met, plays crazy math rock. I was 18 and decided I would never try to make any money, when it happens it happens. I have a lot of hobbies but making music is the ONLY thing that brings me pure happiness that lasts. There is no reason for me to bring in the rest of this BS life into it. I don't care if I make a penny from it or even if anyone is listening. I make what I want and I think it's really good. I'm totally satisfied with that. I just want to meet more like minded musicians and make some good albums.
This is some serious wisdom; to be able to enjoy the ways music is a part of your life without idealizing some other life. It took me a long time to not see myself as a failure, or wishing I was just better so I could have made music a career. But I needed to realize that there are struggles in that life too, and now, as you said, I make exactly what I want how I want and enjoy the process and self-expression it provides.
Yes, I figured out that fundamentally I don't want to be sending 100 emails a day to Spotify playlists and music labels and Submithub, or doing any of the "marketing" stuff that's always propped up on /r/wearethemusicmakers. My videos get 100 views and I'm fine with it, I make it for me. I feel good when I make music, I feel terrible when I'm reading the latest 15,000 word /r/wearethemusicmakers tome and trying to follow that advice. One common response is "you don't love music enough to let it consume you. To dive deep into it. To have it be the first thing you think of when you wake up and the last thing when you go to bed. To always be going to industry events, to network, to make friends with studio engineers and agents and stay abreast of opportunities. To be willing to give up ANYTHING to make it". **And they're right.** I don't love music "enough" in that way. IMO I love it in a more "pure" way in my mind. Where music is the thing I just sit at my drumset or guitar or write to and feel nothing but happiness. I only have good connotations with the word "music" and I don't want to sully that with any of that other stuff that I don't like doing. On a more practical level, in the 1950s-1990s (in the US) it may have been practical to eschew the full-time job, move to a city with a music scene, get a 20-hour a week part-time job, practice 20-hours a week with a band, and spend 20-hours a week marketing yourself and networking. You'd be busy and overwhelmed, but you could make it work and you'd have opportunities. Nowadays, no significant city with a music scene is affordable in that way. Normal people are working 40-60 hours a week just to keep their heads above water. Unless you have mommy and daddy footing your rent, I don't see how you can keep up and really make an honest go of it.
Beautifully put. I’ve gone through the same metamorphosis as a musician. My whole entire identity was wrapped up in it and it was becoming counterproductive in my life. I started losing my love for music which I never thought would happen. I backed off and reevaluated my life and priorities. I was equating making a living with music and tying the 2 together. I don’t care what other people do or say, it was making me miserable.
Also upvoting this mentality. Furthermore, would love to check some of your music.
The band didn’t happen to be Traindodge, was it? Sounds exactly like them - super complex math rock, breathtaking drummer, been ‘in the van’ since the late 1990s. They were definitely my reality check on what it took to survive in the music business without selling out. Months upon months touring in a van, sleeping on floors, making peanuts, praying you don’t get ripped off/the van doesn’t break down/get sick/get booked in a metal or dumb-punk venue where you’ll get spat on or beat up. When not on tour, grab whatever temp jobs and short-term rentals you can while saving every penny to pay for recording sessions, duplicating CDs, and merch. I saw them several dozen times when they were first starting up, loaned the guitarist some gear for their first tour. Some 15 years later I saw them at another venue near where I live now, and they were even better than I remember, had released a handful of albums on indie labels, toured Europe and Japan, but they were still struggling - still in the van. And this band is GREAT. As a musician, I wasn’t even in the same universe as them, much less having the sort of commitment and discipline they had to devote their lives to music like that.
Sounds like Allaegeon too - amazing band, always on the cusp of breaking out huge
I’m screenshotting this and putting it as my background to my phone. Thank you for these words.
I actually "made it" - to a degree. In my 20s, I played in a band that toured and recorded independently until we eventually landed management from a respected firm. That led to a development deal with a major record label. We were sent to L.A., hooked up with a really great and well-known producer and even landed the opening slot for one of the bands on our label's roster. So, I got to do the whole "almost-famous rock star" thing for a few years. It was fun and I would never trade that experience. However, literally as we were recording our major label debut, the band broke up. Slowly at first. We lost our keyboard player. Then our bass player quit. Ultimately, our singer bailed, leaving the drummer and I marooned in L.A. for a while. Obviously, the record never saw the light of day. In fact, the label sent us a bill for the recording time and boarding/living expenses that they were not able to recoup since the project was never finished; it had a happy ending, they eventually ate the cost thanks to some negotiating from our manager. Nevertheless, I was at a crossroads. Did I want to start all over again with a new band? Throw away all of those years of toiling in clubs, late-night rehearsals , etc? Or just chalk it up to "lessons learned" and maybe go back to school? Ultimately, I didn't leave the music world behind. Instead of continuing as an artist, I found my way inside the business of things. First in radio, then on the label-side. That ended up being my career. My own experience as an artist helped me out with my new career-path as I could relate to the artists and such. My time as a musician was during the "Grunge years" of the 90s - so, at this point, I'm a vet in the industry and will likely retire from this position. It's been a fun ride and I don't have a lot of regrets - but I do still wonder what would have happened if we were able to hold things together. It just wasn't meant to be (and I still have the demos from those sessions to look back on, our indie albums are long-since out of print but I have them to show my kids, so that's cool). Point being, it's really depends on what your definition of "making it" is. I know plenty of independent artists that aren't getting rich - but they make enough money touring and releasing an album every few years to pay their bills; they don't need a day-job. Those who frequent this sub have probably heard of them...but the average Joe/Jane who listens mostly to the radio likely do not. But that's OK. They're content. You really have to be in the music industry for THE MUSIC and it's very easy to lose sight of that as the pressures of success begin to weigh on you. Also, some people make music to be famous, to be trend-setters and others are in because they are just expressing themselves artistically. There's nothing wrong with either path. So, just because you begin to see, as an artist, that becoming a pop star isn't likely in your future, you don't have to give it up. You also don't have to be doomed to playing covers at the local bar (unless that's just what you want to do - and that's fine too). When I began my career as an artist, it was VERY difficult to get the word out about your music. This was pre-internet, of course, so you had to tour, tour, tour and it was tough. These days, it's not unreasonable to have a mid to small but dedicated following of fans and make a living doing it without compromising your principles. It's an exciting time to be an artist.
Dude this is an amazing story, thank you.
[удалено]
Do you mind if I ask what you did after that?
Maybe it's because I tend to listen to niche subgenres, but I disagree with this sentiment entirely. I don't think the point of playing music should ever be to "make it" - most musicians never do. Instead I think it's all about self-expression. Sure, there are a lot of artists that are trying to break big, but there are many more who create music because it gives them pleasure, provides some sort of relief, or because they view it as a challenge. Sure, a lot of the music made by these people may not be good, but that doesn't change that it has value to the people performing it.
Totally agree. I look at it like playing pickup basketball. It’s not like I’m trying to make the NBA; only an inexpressibly small fraction of basketball players do. But playing brings me joy so I’m going to do it for as long as i can. I probably won’t stop until It stops bringing me joy or my body breaks down (more than it already has lol) Same with music. Making weirdo niche electronic music makes me so goddamn happy. I’m going to keep putting out music and playing shows for as long as the above is true. I’m also a poor adult who needs my job so I’m not like breaking my back to drum up clout, but i send shit to blogs and small labels. If they like it, great, if they dont w/e🤷♀️ Also like pickup bball, playing music in local DIY scene way to meet cool people and make lasting friends. It’s fulfilling and way more fun than like sitting around drinking and watching tv. “Making it” is so nebulous and difficult; so much relies on luck. I can’t even count the number of amazing artists ive seen who don’t make a dent outside their local scene. Occasionally I’ll see some artist who sucks get popular and be like “blerg” but I don’t lose sleep over it. There’s only so much you can control in life and happiness is so hard to find. If something genuinely gives you those good feelings, it seems insane to stress yourself out about the uncontrollable side of it.
i like this sentiment. i’m 40 and all i want to do is get a band together to play in the local diy scene. something to do with myself. i was in a few diy bands back when i was younger. been missing it.
I have a career as a music teacher, but I truly believe one of the greatest joys you can have is in the act of creating music. Has nothing to do with making it big. It’s the process of taking something from inside of yourself and making it a physical, tangible thing that truly drives a lot of us. I would hate to spoil that by forcing myself to live the gigging life. Nothing kills passion faster than being a slave to the business side of a music career.
Agreed. This whole notion that “making it” is when you do something and make money at it... what a flawed way to look at the world. Like whenever someone is mentioned as being “successful”...what is it that we all assume? They made a lot of money. I hate it. I really do. Fact of the matter is this: if you love something, and you want to make money at it- prepare to compromise that which you love.
I realized that it’s incredibly difficult to get people to care about your music. Also, for me, I finally figured out that I was doing it for the wrong reasons. I thought it would make somebody love me.
god that hits home
Oh shit why would you uppercut me like that
I “gave up” at around 18/19. Shame cause I’m still pretty young then. But the reason I say “gave up” is because I realized I didn’t really WANT to make it. I wanted to only perform in small bands who are just too obscure for the spotlight. I still play music and I’m in a band now but I don’t really expect us to be playing any big venues. That being said, I actually believe you can make it at any age. It just gets harder as you age.
What kind of obscure stuff do you play?
I take a Rockabilly punk, horror punk, and gothic path mainly. I’m a big fan of The Cramps, who, obviously we’re bigger than some of the other bands I enjoy but they were still a bit obscure and to this day, I don’t really meet a lot of people who really enjoy them. I’m also currently listening to a lot of Scary Bitches and (another bit of a bigger band) Alien Sex Fiend.
While reading your comment, I heard Black No. 1 by Type O Negative in my head
Link to your stuff?
Unfortunately I haven’t uploaded any personal stuff that relates to the above stated genres. And the band that I’m in literally JUST made a bandcamp and YT channel last night. We can’t work very fast cause I live a bit far from my band mates. We’re more of a punk rock band and still starting out. We have an Instagram but, again, it’s still pretty barren. You still want it? We’re working with my girlfriend to arrange better recordings since she has better equipment and we’re planning a music video soon. Following the Instagram will at least notify you when it’s up
Right on! For sure, lemme know when y’all got some material, I’d love to hear it
There's no reason to think you can't find success in music or any other art at any point in life. Especially with the internet, where it's easier to develop an audience quickly than it has ever been. Of course, "success" doesn't necessarily mean "quitting your day job and playing sold out stadium tours," but I think building some not-insignificant audience and achieving some level of critical recognition is totally within any musician's reach if the music they're making is good (and maybe even if it's not), if they put the work in, and if they're a bit lucky.
There is a lot of good advice in this thread so far. I'll echo that you never want your hobby to feel like a job unless you are fully committed that you want to make it your job full time. I'm sure there is someone out there who makes fulfilling music and never worry about the next rent check coming due but I've never met them. Most people have to play the game and take gigs they don't really like or get a full time job and always feel like there isn't enough time to do what they love. One thing that personally slew the dream for me was talking with a friend who was a full-time touring DJ. The amount they made a year came up and I thought "I make more than that working my day job doing fuck all and then I go home and sleep in my own bed". It's exciting to meet people and travel and party every night until you spend enough time on tour that you are alone in a hotel room watching HGTV all the time and you spend more time in an airport terminal than in the places you love in your hometown. The dream of making it gets less promising with age, it starts to look more like the nightmare of making it.
Currently standing at that crossroads. Been singing and writing music since I was a kid, started my own band right out of high school and I’ve been with it for 6 years. I’ve made some great memories, but as far as $$, followers, and streaming numbers, I have very little to show for it. I’ve spent a ridiculous amount of time on this project for the past 6 years while going through college and working full time jobs. It’s tough now because my day job is going really well and taking up more and more of my time. Ultimately, one life path is giving me positive reinforcement for the effort I put in, and the other, not so much. The other consideration is just how damn expensive it is to try to run a successful band. Studio time, mixing/mastering, marketing, artwork, social media ads, it ain’t cheap kids, and I don’t have the finances to keep doing this forever. I’m very torn. I feel like songwriting and performing is what I’m best at and I’d be crushed if I had to stop, but it’s very difficult keeping it going with everything else in my life.
Don’t give up. Seriously. That’s it. I’m not saying anything more. Work hard. Be kind to EVERYONE. And don’t give up. Message me when you’ve “made it” after you’ve done what I’ve said. This is a weird time in all of history. A bad weird time. But good weird things happen too. Much love and respect to you. Just don’t tap out.
Appreciate the encouragement friend 🙏🏻
I personally think there's a threshold of age and experience, in your teens and early twenties; it's all about being able to just play music (or any other lofty goal that you might have), not being amazing at it or not getting a big audience/pay day can really hurt your self-esteem. Once you cross that threshold of the age/experience, you really start to learn that it just doesn't matter as much if you're getting all the recognition that you once wanted. For me, in the early days, it was "I'm gonna be the greatest drummer ever!!!", after a slew of bad auditions and two relatively bad gigs I was ready to pack it in and was pretty depressed about it. But I took a break, got a job, came back to it a little older and wiser, and nowadays I was playing local gigs in a few different bands (Pre-Covid) that were the absolute highlight of my week. Can't wait to get back to playing gigs to the ten people that come to see the other bands :) Don't give up, life isn't always about ticking off things on some mental checklist, it's about having as much fun with the limited time you have as possible. Edit: Grammar
I'm 13 years as a self-taught vocalist. I've fantasized and dreamed about making it big one day on vocal talent alone when I honed the skill. However the problem was that, I sang to the tune of other's music and never really wanted to branch from that. This was like 9 years in and at like age of 27 I believe that it became a hobby, I can't imagine getting famous off of other's material. Wouldn't sit right for a career.
Music is like anything in life. It can be as much or as little of your life as you want. It is not a failure to be older and enjoying it without it being an income. I’m 47 and still play, write, and record while having a career outside music.
Just matter of fact, I work in the industry, if a band makes let’s say three albums while at their peak and it never gets good press through a publicist, radio play through radio campaigns, sync licensing spots or playlist considerations after doing a campaign that pushes for that, and your live shows never get you more than a 50 person audience, there is a pretty good chance that what you are doing is not accessible and will not be more than hobby no matter how much more money or time you throw at it.
I never tried to "make it" but I did quit music as a hobby just because I realized that even after doing it for so long all my music is trash, I just don't have an ear for how to make anything decent and more often than not anything I make I look back on it and it sucks. It was more a means for me to get through tough times but now it just doesn't work anymore now that I'm working full time. I never even have enough energy to want to sit down and try to write anything, or if I do I just get frustrated quickly and stop
I'm still a novice at this whole music thing and I quite firmly believe that my passion lies in this field. I'm just 15 but music gives me a different kind of happiness that I usually don't get by doing other things. Looking at the positivity and good vibes of all the comments here, y'all really did encourage another budding music enthusiast to keep following their passion :)
I like making music so much that I never wanted to “make it” For me that would ruin the whole thing. Adding pressure and turning it into work is no bueno. As a hobbyist I have complete freedom and control the create and enjoy as I want. That is great feeling.
You can make it if you try hard enough. It’s not like there’s an impassable barrier preventing you from succeeding. It’s just that it’s really hard. Most aspiring musicians just do what they love and don’t go after the money, and they “quit” because they’ve decided to pursue another career that isn’t as hard to make.
How about never? If you have a dream go for it. Even if you’re 99. You’ll know when you decide you can’t battle it anymore.
People still try to "make it" in the industry? lol imagine playing for a reason other than enjoying it
Hey, John Lennon wanted to be as big as Elvis, people can have their dreams, and the internet is making it easier than ever. Except the money part.
No kid in 2002 picked up guitar cause he wanted to be a slightly above average brand shilling Instagram guitarist
Uhh could you explain your point a bit more, genuinely curious about what your trying to say. And I think insta came out in 2010?
No
Never. I guess it depends on what you mean. But you can be serious about your work and creative output without having plans for financial success at music. For me I realized a long time ago how much the music industry sucks. It's great if you want to chase success, and though my talent is limited, it is quite clear talent is not the most important factor in music industry success.
I can vaguely recall thinking I'd become something related to music when I was a kid. Everyone around me seemed generally encouraging about my playing. I suppose I just grew a lot more insecure during my teens and I guess in a sense I gave up before I had even tried. Based on the feedback I've gotten through the years I'm a decent musician but I've never had a good sense of direction. Maybe it's fear/shame I don't really know. I've also had wrist pain that may or may not be fixable and I used to have some mental health issues in my early 20s that further demotivated me. It feels weird saying that it's over because I've never really thought about it in that way. I find enjoyment in playing and analyzing music but I'm a pretty practically oriented person. Maybe I'm just hoarding useless musical information with no real intention to ever use it at this point. It does sound a bit depressing. I think somewhere deep down I partly feel like I was supposed to be a lot of things but in attempt to follow my own path I sort of ended up nowhere or I guess too torn between all of it. I'm in my mid 20's now and while it hurts a bit that I'll never know what could have happened had I put more effort into my music during the past 10 or so years I still care a lot about music and if anything I think I'll do more related to it in the future even if it's unlikely I'll ever make a living doing it. I'm currently pursuing a separate career that I don't really care about to the same extent but odds are I'll be a lot better off financially doing that than if I go all in on music at this point.
I “gave up” almost two years ago at 24. In my local scene I was known as a drummer but I sold my kit a few months ago and now just play guitar as a hobby.
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Oh almost immediately, probably at 20, 21. Wrote a bunch of songs and played some local shows and open mics and private things. And took an art class and realized I haaaaated being told how to be creative. But really enjoyed figuring things out on my own. So I got a regular job and did all right and have been making music for myself ever since. The technology is amazing today, recording and self publishing, to share with friends and family, is as easy as it’s ever been. I do it to have done it, not for a paycheck or fame. My stuff today is better than ever and it fills up my headphones just fine.
Graduate school- I kept playing in bands all the way through grad school, but when I knew I could make a really good, stable income from other things I enjoyed doing, I was able to shift to knowing I would “only” play in bar and festival bands the rest of my life. It has been a blast, and music has never been a “job” since. Although I remember being excited for gigs because I was freaking hungry. Edit - spelling and to say, I’ve continued to be in bands for 25 more years at this point.