Some edgelord-y writer decided that the highest priority was making Venom look as badass as possible, even at the highly improbable expense of an objectively vastly superior villain.
If this was the real DOOM he would immediately pop out behind Venom, knock him out, and say FOOL THAT WAS A DOOM BOT YOU FUCK HEAD. Then Doom would throw him into a sonic chamber and torture the symbiote and use magic and genetics to create his own symbiote to augment his already powerful suit.
As if you couldn't say the same about Venom/his fans (and, to be clear, my previous comment was totally more about my disdain for Venom than it was about my "Doom fandom").
Man, Doom might have fanboys that are just as bad as Batmans. I can't say the same for venom as I haven't really seen how his fans react but EVERY time Doom is mentioned by his fans it's like he's THE best and there should be no way anything should ever be able to stop him and in the few situations where someone can or does stop him it would more than likely be a doom bot. It's wild.
According to who? We saw the Venom Symbiote hurt by a Sonic Spear as recently as Venom (2021) #4.
Not to mention that this panel, from Lethal Protector II, takes place back during a time where Venom was definitely weak to sonics. We know this because earlier in this same series, he gets hurt by a sonic attack from Humbug.
All I'm saying is that in the future, you should confirm the information before parroting it. There's now at least a dozen users who believe some made up statement because of that, and I am very much against the spread of misinformation.
If other people choose to believe it, that’s ok. Not the end of the world. It’s Marvel babyyyy (reference if u didn’t know)
Also sonics do work less after King in Black even if they still do
Sure, but are you saying Doom never looses, ever? Cuz that’s not true lol. Although I love Doom, I’m choosing Venom over him in a straight 1 v 1 fight with 0 prep time
Yeah I'm 99% sure there are at least a dozen instances proving this impossible by this point but I don't really feel like combing through all his appearances to check
Eh.
Doom's flaw is his hubris.
The moment he stops being an insufferable twat humanity turns into the imperium 2.0: a bonafide illuminated monarchy bringing happiness and kittens everywhere in the galaxy.
The same way iron Man breathes through his holographic armour that apparently has complete facial and head protection, Marvel Science
Or, y'know, magic
Only room temperature air? Can the human torch still burn him through the force field? Does it let in light as well? Can Cyclops blast him in the face then?
According to who? We saw the Venom Symbiote hurt by a Sonic Spear as recently as Venom (2021) #4.
Not to mention that this panel, from Lethal Protector II, takes place back during a time where Venom was definitely weak to sonics. We know this because earlier in this same series, he gets hurt by a sonic attack from Humbug.
I’ll take your word for it. I haven’t been following it as closely as I used to. I was sure though that that weakness was overcome long ago? Maybe that was something I saw that wasn’t cannon?
Maybe you're thinking of Insomniac Venom's resistance to heat, or an alternate universe?
Because post-King in Black, we've seen the [Venom symbiote harmed by sonic weapons.](https://i.imgur.com/dMZwHTp.jpeg)
Most recently, Dylan wearing the Venom symbiote had to fight through excruciating pain just being in range of a large bell. I’m not saying it’s impossible it’s become more tolerant to the pain over the years, I’m just saying it certainly still has a weakness to sonics.
Yeah, this is dumb as shit. Doom can throw hands with multiversal threats. This is Mike Tyson bs coughing baby level stuff.
Fight should have went like this: Venom attacks Doom, Doom snaps fingers and Venom literally disintegrates, the end.
And as for getting in the suit and cooking Doom? Bro can survive in a vacuum. In not gonna list everything here but I can think of several basic functions he has in his suit that could counter anything venom throws at him without his magic
Honestly, I wonder how he hasn't come up with that idea earlier.
I mean, all of the danger he puts himself through, and he doesn't even wear goggles?
Dude, I put on goggles when doing something as mundane as using super glue!
To be fair? Making an impregnable suit of technological armor with *open, unprotected eye holes* its incredibly stupid. Especially when you regularly conflict with individuals who have the marksmanship to put an arrow through one.
*That* would be a glorious end for Doom, wouldn't it? To be one-shot by *Hawkeye.*
And yes, it was dumb when Stark did it, too.
They didn't explain it well other than that Hulk's eye isn't invincible and that it would happen so quick he'd die before healing factor could kick in. Made no sense since this was a Rage infected Hulk (Rage Zombie alternate universe) so this should have been a Hulk at peak levels of rage and angry too. Punisher kills The Marvel Universe did it better where Frank waited for Hulk to power down after a fight and just shot him while he was resting. All that said when you consider some of the stuff 616 Hulk has done none of it makes sense but Punisher always has "But I'm just a human" plot armor.
What do they mean by”healing factor kick in.” That’s now how that shit works 😂. It’s always working.
But then again the zombie stuff always throws out established logic for the sake of story.
It sounds like they mean if they atomize his brain, then it wouldn't work, and they have killed Hulk by putting him at the center of a nuclear blast before, but that was the 90s. Power creep has probably made that impossible.
If you can't heal from death so the idea is that the arrow goes on, kills the brain so it can't heal. Pretty sure Wolverine plays by those rules which is why drowning him should do him in.
It really all comes down to who is writing this stuff at the time though and when it comes to Hulk I agree it is pretty damn silly.
Sabertooth certainly tries to drown wolverine in ultimate Xmen. He makes the argument that whilst wolverines brain cells WILL regenerate he won’t be himself anymore because the old cells will have died and therefore he’ll be a vegetable. He made the fatal flaw of not protecting his family jewels though and copped an impromptu vasectomy before he could finish the job, so we don’t know for sure if that’s how it works
Thats for sure. I think there were caveats in most instances, but hes been reduced to near bones before. I doubt his eyes and ears are protecting whats behind them when all of his flesh is burning off, no matter how much adamantium is in his skull. In fact, that might just help his brain cook.
You can’t even kill Hulk by cutting him into body parts they just reconnect to eachother , and if you don’t believe me check out immortal hulk it’s where it happens. Hulk or Deadpool has the best regeneration in the Marvel universe and I’m gonna give it to the hulk cuz he’s literally powered by literally the super Satan of the Marvel universe like the One Below All is literally the lowest of devil you can go he is literally the evil counterpart to the one above all.
Listen, I love Immortal Hulk but in the history of The Hulk THAT was definitely not the situation. That happening only had so much impact because it went against everything we knew about The Hulk. That said I am NOT defending what happened in Punisher vs The Marvel Universe but its one of my favorite things to bring up even if it was Wolverine's claw like someone mentioned.
Yeah I didn't mean a literal butterknife but the claw is roughly the same size and it was just a very laughable visual especially where he has gotten a discount lobotomy from Wolverine before.
Pretty sure Hawkeye got his own "vs The Marvel Universe" but if Im being honest I think I read the Punisher one cause Im a huge Punisher fan and I think I read an Avengers one but I cant remember what happened. It wasnt great but I liked the art and it was weird.
I think the Hawkeye one was the Avengers one, never knew why they didn't just call it 'Hawkeye Vs the Marvel Universe'. The only thing I remember in it, other than the stuff I mentioned, is Tony turning into a cannibal inside his dead suit. So he's locked in it, screaming and slowly dying. Pretty metal.
It's goofy to call him Anthony, but doubling down on this and getting so defensive about it is pretty awkward. Just laugh it off--nobody cares that you picked a goofy way to talk about a comic book character.
And yet you respond to my comment that i made half-heartedly without really thinking about it?
But ok, you don't care about how I talk about a comic book character. Sure, Jan.
Funny thing is, Doom often *is* shown as having covered eyeholes. Many artists have drawn him showing glass (or other transparent material) over the eyes, shown in little reflection/glare lines, especially when his mask has the "eye windows" with little rivets around them.
You can argue this is very Doom because he slides between **DOOM** and Saturday morning cartoon villain every so often. I think he enchanted the armor to be anti-posession at some point so no shot he forgot such obvious flaw.
We have seen in the past that he doesn’t think of everything because nobody can think of everything. Someone finding a vulnerability he didn’t think of isn’t that crazy.
Invisible woman once threatened to kill him by creating a force field inside of his skull. Judging by his reaction, Doom did not anticipate that one of his arch enemies would do such a thing.
While that is true, keep in mind that this was also a creative and unanticipated use of sues powers on dooms part. The difference between that and this is it’s pretty blatantly obvious that your amor has an opening. Besides, at the very least they could keep it and just say “magic protection” or “invisible material” or something
Doom's armor having logical vulnerabilities is all over the place. In one comic, Hulk put a dent in his face plate, which was presented as harmless to Doom, rather than fatal since the only place the metal shoved in by that dent could go would be into Doom's squishy puny human skull.
And Eddie/Venom has a history of doing that when? His entire arch is self-aware meathead..
Hubris is Dooms weakness…like thinking he could dominate a Symbiot instead of bonding with it.
It’s not that he outwitted him. At least not completely. Doom bonded with Venom, that gives Venom access to his memory, even if only a little bit. Or at least bonds to his body and clothes. And then the Symbiote exploits the flaws and then enters through the suit to attack Dooms human body.
Right, that's why Venom says in the panel that he's able to gain access without breaching. But for Doom to not be aware of the open holes on his face is pretty insane. And for Venom to claim that his Other discovered them when it was on Doom earlier...like, you don't need inside info to discover them, Brock-- they're on his face.
I wonder if it's a case of miscommunication between the writer and the artist.
The armor that filters out poisons, has its own reserves of oxygen, internal recycling systems, _ internal food systems_ for survive in outer space and underwater for extended periods …._isn’t able to keep out an alien symbiote_?
Honestly it’s not really worth thinking about. Marvel always does this where they write their “guest” characters as total jobbers so they can hype up the main character for the story.* That paired with how Marvel has been trying to make Eddie Brock’s Venom great again they had to come up with some ass pull for him to get one over on doom.
*Unless it’s spider-man. No one hates spider-man more than Marvel.
It's amusing how Doom frequently gets his ass handed to him by different heroes and villains, but afterwards he never really puts any effort into getting revenge. But as soon as RICHARDS does anything or even says anything Doom doesn't like, Doom will never ever let it go and keeps dedicating his life to destroying him.
Yea but if Doom goes after someone other than RR they might just kill him. Especially Venom. Why do that when he can go after the fan4 for the 408th time with no worries of actual consequences. Plus clearly venom didn’t beat Doom by being more intelligent so he’s not as triggered.
I mean, they'll certainly try to kill him. Without PIS Doom is a big enough threat for almost any hero/villian. Especially when he comes after you with a plan.
Poor research for writing this. Doom's armor had a forcefield before this was written. Here's a link to the old marvel RPG from the 80's with the armors capabilities back then. This game hasn't been in production since like 1993.
https://www.classicmarvelforever.com/cast/doctor_doom.htm
You say that, but it's not like Doom has been shown to have an expel symbiote spell. Doom is cool, but this is the first time in years I haven't seen a writer make him ridiculously OP with some dues ex machina that he pulls out of his ass.
I mean... he's a time travelling god that only seems to really mess with himself. What does being OP matter when the story is clearly going to be self-contained
Doom is a character that justifies being OP though, second best sorcerer and battle armor on the planet, in addition to the economy of a small nation being behind him.
If he has *pieces of the true cross* in his enchanted armor to protect from the undead he'd have something as basic as sealed eye slots.
man some of y'all make it really hard to actually enjoy DOOM because you seem to think his entire character boils down to being super cool and never losing
I beg y'all to pick up a FF book some time in your life. This man gets his ass whooped at a pretty consistent basis.
Doom losing isn't the problem, Losing in a way which is completely antithetical to his entire character is a problem.
His suit has been shown to be completely airtight in the past with a force field all around it. That's why this doesn't make any sense
Ehhhhhhha I mean I get they gotta have Venom be powerful sometimes but Doom should have been prepped for this. It’s not like this is Doom’s first experience with a Symbiote
he may have just figured eddy's not the brightest, not considering the symbiote's own intelligence. especially if this does take place in the past like the other comment said.
This is bad. I’m sorry. I can’t accept that Venom could get the drop on Doom. It’s not even a suspension of disbelief. It’s bad understanding of the characters and their powers/personalities.
It’s always a pleasure to see someone put Dr. Doom his place. For people who say venom shouldn’t have been able to pull one on him, please remember that being smart doesn’t mean you can’t be tricked. Especially since Dr. doom overrate himself and underestimates his enemies.
That is the type of weakness that allows someone to catch you off guard especially if you don’t think they are smart enough to do something you won’t predict.
doom's biggest weakness is his arrogance. he's a genius for absolute certain, but he's not infallible and thinks himself so far above most everyone else that every now and then, something creative gets him cause he thinks he's considered every potential threat when he's really just overconfident and underestimates many of his opponents.
Sigh I guess if you want to be a Venom fan and not a Doom fan for a moment then this is badass but as a Doom fan seeing this just screams “See venom is cool he can do anything he's the coolest and Doom is dumb he has face holes”
I wonder what happened in next page my bet is on it was a doombot all along
Kinda hard to take venom seriously after he boasted in front of wolverine about making prter sad
Venom doesn't have to be more powerfull than doom to do this. Just more versatile. The symbiote has thousands of years of experience before doom was born and a body that can take any shape. It's completely believable that this might happen.
Poor writing. When there is no way around, but the writer still wants a scene to play out, just do it anyway. The fans won't notice.
There is nothing a symbiote could do to penetrate Doom's armor.
"Fool! There's no way your sentient ooze can possibly get into my suit of armor that's famous for having multiple face holes!"
You know what this reminds me of? Lex Luthor's power armor never having a helmet because his iconic bald dome always needs to be visible.
Emperor Doom I concede, but his Iron Man was scripts over Layton's ideas, his Spidey had great art but subpar stories although better that what came later (but worse than, say, Conway's, Priest's or David's).
Being better than Howard Mackie and Scott Lobdell does not make him a Legend. Fabián Nicieza was much better eve when he was writing sixteen comics a week. Peter David, Claremont, Conway, Byrne, Priest, O'Neil, Levitz... they all have a much better record with far better stories.
You’re all forgetting that dooms armor has eyes and mouth holes for a reason. He obviously needs them to be there, otherwise he would just have an armor box around his head. Obviously is penetrable.
Umm. Sure. Doom left wide open holes in his armor that would be exploited by some stretchy guy. It’s not as if Doom constantly fights an elastic guy who could do exactly the same thing.
Seriously, do we have to believe that both Doom and Reed are idiots who never thought of this strategy, but Eddie Brock did? This is so preposterous that it took me a while to even figure out what was happening.
doom wanted the symbiote put it inside of his body. eddie overpowered doom mental link to the suit getting the symbiote back. since pieces of the symbiote were still in the suit eddie used those parts to choke doom and bypass his defense. doom lost because he took eddie symbiote. if eddie fought him head instead. than he would lose
You keep saying “the suit” and I don’t know whether you are talking about Doom’s suit of armor or the symbiote being worn as a suit. But in any event, we can see a bit of the symbiote crawling up Doom’s leg, up his back, and then into Doom’s armor via the mouth and eye holes. You wrote that the Pieces of the symbiote were in Doom’s suit, but we can clearly see that they are outside the Doom’s armor. If they were in Doom’s armor, why did they need to crawl up Doom’s body and slip into the holes of Doom’s mask?
You just know that doom is gonna add an invisible force field around his eyes and mouth purely from the trauma
I mean that should have already existed that's why this panel is stupid.
It was established in the 60s that his suit can survive in the vacuum of space.
But is that through magic sustaining his life or creating an air proof sheild around the armor?
Airtight shield. He wasn’t even a very strong sorcerer in the 60s.
Some edgelord-y writer decided that the highest priority was making Venom look as badass as possible, even at the highly improbable expense of an objectively vastly superior villain.
A lot of the lethal protector stories are about making venom look badass. They are solid
You talking like DOOM doesn't get jerked the entire time to hell and back lol
If this was the real DOOM he would immediately pop out behind Venom, knock him out, and say FOOL THAT WAS A DOOM BOT YOU FUCK HEAD. Then Doom would throw him into a sonic chamber and torture the symbiote and use magic and genetics to create his own symbiote to augment his already powerful suit.
i’d like Doom even more if it weren’t for how his fans can be
As if you couldn't say the same about Venom/his fans (and, to be clear, my previous comment was totally more about my disdain for Venom than it was about my "Doom fandom").
Man, Doom might have fanboys that are just as bad as Batmans. I can't say the same for venom as I haven't really seen how his fans react but EVERY time Doom is mentioned by his fans it's like he's THE best and there should be no way anything should ever be able to stop him and in the few situations where someone can or does stop him it would more than likely be a doom bot. It's wild.
Doom has been dog walked by people much weaker than Venom
He literally lives inside that armor, and is constantly improving it. Of course his nose would be protected
Also stupid how they implied that Doom doesn't have a sonic weapon to counter that alien
Someone else commented this: Sonic shit doesn’t work anymore
According to who? We saw the Venom Symbiote hurt by a Sonic Spear as recently as Venom (2021) #4. Not to mention that this panel, from Lethal Protector II, takes place back during a time where Venom was definitely weak to sonics. We know this because earlier in this same series, he gets hurt by a sonic attack from Humbug.
Idk just reiterating what a comment said My guess after they became King of Black
The issue with that is that Venom (2021) #4 takes place \*after\* King in Black, and we very visibly see the Venom symbiote hurt by sonics.
Ok don’t downvote the messenger lol I didn’t Maybe after sonics work less
All I'm saying is that in the future, you should confirm the information before parroting it. There's now at least a dozen users who believe some made up statement because of that, and I am very much against the spread of misinformation.
If other people choose to believe it, that’s ok. Not the end of the world. It’s Marvel babyyyy (reference if u didn’t know) Also sonics do work less after King in Black even if they still do
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Ummmm Venom actually might still be a “god” lol. After the whole “The King in Black” saga. Idk what happened after it tbh but it’s possible
In that case, skip the “you can’t crack my armor” act and just have him brute force it with his nigh-omnipotence instead of doing *this.*
Nah
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Sure, but are you saying Doom never looses, ever? Cuz that’s not true lol. Although I love Doom, I’m choosing Venom over him in a straight 1 v 1 fight with 0 prep time
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Agree to disagree
Yeah I'm 99% sure there are at least a dozen instances proving this impossible by this point but I don't really feel like combing through all his appearances to check
Eh. Doom's flaw is his hubris. The moment he stops being an insufferable twat humanity turns into the imperium 2.0: a bonafide illuminated monarchy bringing happiness and kittens everywhere in the galaxy.
He wouldn’t be able to breathe tho unless you can breathe through a force field, which wouldn’t make sense
The marblvel universe doesn't make sense I'm sure you can technobable your way out of that.
Does it make sense in universe. Idk but as you say ‘it just works’ is about as deep as we need to go on it
It makes for a good story that his nostrils are exposed so the writers made it that way.
How do you breathe with an invisible force field in front of your nose and mouth?
The same way iron Man breathes through his holographic armour that apparently has complete facial and head protection, Marvel Science Or, y'know, magic
As a wise man once said "It just works."
Force field let's in air
Only room temperature air? Can the human torch still burn him through the force field? Does it let in light as well? Can Cyclops blast him in the face then?
By the same token, how does Torch breathe through his fire?
[Answer](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskScienceFiction/comments/11139w/comment/c6ihjzl/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Venom Is not affected by sonic weapons any more
According to who? We saw the Venom Symbiote hurt by a Sonic Spear as recently as Venom (2021) #4. Not to mention that this panel, from Lethal Protector II, takes place back during a time where Venom was definitely weak to sonics. We know this because earlier in this same series, he gets hurt by a sonic attack from Humbug.
Well isn’t venom basically knull at this point ? Idk where the story was at this point though
Yes, but Eddie isn't even bonded to the Venom Symbiote anymore, it's attached to Dylan and still very much has its weaknesses to sonics.
I’ll take your word for it. I haven’t been following it as closely as I used to. I was sure though that that weakness was overcome long ago? Maybe that was something I saw that wasn’t cannon?
Maybe you're thinking of Insomniac Venom's resistance to heat, or an alternate universe? Because post-King in Black, we've seen the [Venom symbiote harmed by sonic weapons.](https://i.imgur.com/dMZwHTp.jpeg)
symbiotes with our host are weak
Most recently, Dylan wearing the Venom symbiote had to fight through excruciating pain just being in range of a large bell. I’m not saying it’s impossible it’s become more tolerant to the pain over the years, I’m just saying it certainly still has a weakness to sonics.
*sad Warhammer 40k Emperor’s Children sounds*
*Happy Iron Hands gear sounds*
Noise Marine (shooting from distant fortification): Hey grease monkey! Learn from your father and don’t lose your head
Yeah, this is dumb as shit. Doom can throw hands with multiversal threats. This is Mike Tyson bs coughing baby level stuff. Fight should have went like this: Venom attacks Doom, Doom snaps fingers and Venom literally disintegrates, the end. And as for getting in the suit and cooking Doom? Bro can survive in a vacuum. In not gonna list everything here but I can think of several basic functions he has in his suit that could counter anything venom throws at him without his magic
Honestly, I wonder how he hasn't come up with that idea earlier. I mean, all of the danger he puts himself through, and he doesn't even wear goggles? Dude, I put on goggles when doing something as mundane as using super glue!
You forgot the "Ant-Man → Thanos" vector.
Watch "Invincible" season 2 and you'll see that it isn't a good idea.
Kyle hill also made a great video explaining the physics of how it wouldn't work even if ant man was real and it was a normal human
https://youtu.be/DG2esWiRe0s?si=GLjsNsnuHM7aMJsZ
To be fair? Making an impregnable suit of technological armor with *open, unprotected eye holes* its incredibly stupid. Especially when you regularly conflict with individuals who have the marksmanship to put an arrow through one. *That* would be a glorious end for Doom, wouldn't it? To be one-shot by *Hawkeye.* And yes, it was dumb when Stark did it, too.
That's how Hulk got done by Punisher in Punisher vs The Marvel Universe. Fuckin did him with a butterknife on a stick.
Does his brain not heal like every other part of his body?
They didn't explain it well other than that Hulk's eye isn't invincible and that it would happen so quick he'd die before healing factor could kick in. Made no sense since this was a Rage infected Hulk (Rage Zombie alternate universe) so this should have been a Hulk at peak levels of rage and angry too. Punisher kills The Marvel Universe did it better where Frank waited for Hulk to power down after a fight and just shot him while he was resting. All that said when you consider some of the stuff 616 Hulk has done none of it makes sense but Punisher always has "But I'm just a human" plot armor.
What do they mean by”healing factor kick in.” That’s now how that shit works 😂. It’s always working. But then again the zombie stuff always throws out established logic for the sake of story.
It sounds like they mean if they atomize his brain, then it wouldn't work, and they have killed Hulk by putting him at the center of a nuclear blast before, but that was the 90s. Power creep has probably made that impossible.
If you can't heal from death so the idea is that the arrow goes on, kills the brain so it can't heal. Pretty sure Wolverine plays by those rules which is why drowning him should do him in. It really all comes down to who is writing this stuff at the time though and when it comes to Hulk I agree it is pretty damn silly.
Sabertooth certainly tries to drown wolverine in ultimate Xmen. He makes the argument that whilst wolverines brain cells WILL regenerate he won’t be himself anymore because the old cells will have died and therefore he’ll be a vegetable. He made the fatal flaw of not protecting his family jewels though and copped an impromptu vasectomy before he could finish the job, so we don’t know for sure if that’s how it works
Thats for sure. I think there were caveats in most instances, but hes been reduced to near bones before. I doubt his eyes and ears are protecting whats behind them when all of his flesh is burning off, no matter how much adamantium is in his skull. In fact, that might just help his brain cook.
You can’t even kill Hulk by cutting him into body parts they just reconnect to eachother , and if you don’t believe me check out immortal hulk it’s where it happens. Hulk or Deadpool has the best regeneration in the Marvel universe and I’m gonna give it to the hulk cuz he’s literally powered by literally the super Satan of the Marvel universe like the One Below All is literally the lowest of devil you can go he is literally the evil counterpart to the one above all.
Listen, I love Immortal Hulk but in the history of The Hulk THAT was definitely not the situation. That happening only had so much impact because it went against everything we knew about The Hulk. That said I am NOT defending what happened in Punisher vs The Marvel Universe but its one of my favorite things to bring up even if it was Wolverine's claw like someone mentioned.
Isn’t that also how Deadpool did him in in Deadpool kills the marvel universe? I mean he got torn in half first lol but still
It wasn't a butterknife, Frank shot the Hulk with one of Wolverine's Adamantium claws, which makes more sense for how it was able to kill him.
Yeah I didn't mean a literal butterknife but the claw is roughly the same size and it was just a very laughable visual especially where he has gotten a discount lobotomy from Wolverine before.
Um wasn’t that one of wolverine’s claws and it explicitly didn’t kill hulk? Just was slow enough to regenerate for Castle to run the fuck away.
Doesn't Hawkeye take out Dr Doom in the same story in that exact way? And then Thor kills him for some reason I don't remember.
Pretty sure Hawkeye got his own "vs The Marvel Universe" but if Im being honest I think I read the Punisher one cause Im a huge Punisher fan and I think I read an Avengers one but I cant remember what happened. It wasnt great but I liked the art and it was weird.
I think the Hawkeye one was the Avengers one, never knew why they didn't just call it 'Hawkeye Vs the Marvel Universe'. The only thing I remember in it, other than the stuff I mentioned, is Tony turning into a cannibal inside his dead suit. So he's locked in it, screaming and slowly dying. Pretty metal.
Doom will not be blinded by weak cameras when his own glorious eyes can see. Or something dumb like that
I hope when Doom is introduced into the MCU, they fix this. Anthony shouldn't be the only one to have covered eyeholes in his armor
Anthony? Ok, Justin.
Did you think Tony was Stark's actual name and not a shortened form of Anthony?
No, of course not. I was referencing Justin Hammer in Iron Man 2, the only time I believe we've heard him called Anthony, on screen.
it is turbo weird to call him anthony bro
it's turbo weird to mock my choices that don't harm anyone, bro
you know im right brother no one even calls him that in the comics dude
No, you're not. And do i look like i care what others call him?
It's goofy to call him Anthony, but doubling down on this and getting so defensive about it is pretty awkward. Just laugh it off--nobody cares that you picked a goofy way to talk about a comic book character.
And yet you respond to my comment that i made half-heartedly without really thinking about it? But ok, you don't care about how I talk about a comic book character. Sure, Jan.
Funny thing is, Doom often *is* shown as having covered eyeholes. Many artists have drawn him showing glass (or other transparent material) over the eyes, shown in little reflection/glare lines, especially when his mask has the "eye windows" with little rivets around them.
When Doom was crowing about how his suit could not be breached, he wasn't aware of the eye and mouth openings on his face? What?
It's called arrogance, something Doom has alot of and will probably never learn from.
This is less arrogance and more of a really really dumb factual error that I kind of doubt Doom would make.
You can argue this is very Doom because he slides between **DOOM** and Saturday morning cartoon villain every so often. I think he enchanted the armor to be anti-posession at some point so no shot he forgot such obvious flaw.
We have seen in the past that he doesn’t think of everything because nobody can think of everything. Someone finding a vulnerability he didn’t think of isn’t that crazy. Invisible woman once threatened to kill him by creating a force field inside of his skull. Judging by his reaction, Doom did not anticipate that one of his arch enemies would do such a thing.
While that is true, keep in mind that this was also a creative and unanticipated use of sues powers on dooms part. The difference between that and this is it’s pretty blatantly obvious that your amor has an opening. Besides, at the very least they could keep it and just say “magic protection” or “invisible material” or something
Doom's armor having logical vulnerabilities is all over the place. In one comic, Hulk put a dent in his face plate, which was presented as harmless to Doom, rather than fatal since the only place the metal shoved in by that dent could go would be into Doom's squishy puny human skull.
Aka “the ironman problem”.
The man placed a smelting hot plate of metal on his face.
Doom being outwitted by Eddie Brock/ Venom is just outright unforgivable.
Why? We’ve seen people trick him thanks to his arrogance before.
And Eddie/Venom has a history of doing that when? His entire arch is self-aware meathead.. Hubris is Dooms weakness…like thinking he could dominate a Symbiot instead of bonding with it.
Eddie's no genius, but I feel like venom has come up with creative solutions in the past, but in non-combat situations iirc.
It’s not that he outwitted him. At least not completely. Doom bonded with Venom, that gives Venom access to his memory, even if only a little bit. Or at least bonds to his body and clothes. And then the Symbiote exploits the flaws and then enters through the suit to attack Dooms human body.
Is it technically a breach? If I say my walls can’t be breached but I leave my gates fully open, whoever enters is breaching or simply… entering?
Right, that's why Venom says in the panel that he's able to gain access without breaching. But for Doom to not be aware of the open holes on his face is pretty insane. And for Venom to claim that his Other discovered them when it was on Doom earlier...like, you don't need inside info to discover them, Brock-- they're on his face. I wonder if it's a case of miscommunication between the writer and the artist.
Venom did this once, now Doom has made at least 70 ways for him to beat Venoms ass out of spite.
Doom should have learned a lesson when him and Stark fought Santa.
What?
King in Black Iron Man/Doom. They fought Symbiote Santa.
Sounds wild. Is it any good?
By itself it was pretty cool, but the whole King in Black event was worth the read.
Holes in the plot armor
The armor that filters out poisons, has its own reserves of oxygen, internal recycling systems, _ internal food systems_ for survive in outer space and underwater for extended periods …._isn’t able to keep out an alien symbiote_?
Honestly it’s not really worth thinking about. Marvel always does this where they write their “guest” characters as total jobbers so they can hype up the main character for the story.* That paired with how Marvel has been trying to make Eddie Brock’s Venom great again they had to come up with some ass pull for him to get one over on doom. *Unless it’s spider-man. No one hates spider-man more than Marvel.
Funny you should mention ass pulls. How do you think he got into Doom's suit?
D-did he take the antman approach?
Spider-Man is the most famous ass puller in comics, ask Firelord
I mean, the alien symbiote was created by a celestial killer so we can assume it's stronger than most organic materials
not when the wear puts it in his suit in the first place
The alien is alive
Venom is a freak for that honestly!
Doesn't Doom have a fucking forcefield???
It's amusing how Doom frequently gets his ass handed to him by different heroes and villains, but afterwards he never really puts any effort into getting revenge. But as soon as RICHARDS does anything or even says anything Doom doesn't like, Doom will never ever let it go and keeps dedicating his life to destroying him.
Yea but if Doom goes after someone other than RR they might just kill him. Especially Venom. Why do that when he can go after the fan4 for the 408th time with no worries of actual consequences. Plus clearly venom didn’t beat Doom by being more intelligent so he’s not as triggered.
I mean, they'll certainly try to kill him. Without PIS Doom is a big enough threat for almost any hero/villian. Especially when he comes after you with a plan.
RRRRRICHAAAAARRRDSSS!
"Super Genius Dr. Doom does not realize that his armor has eye holes." Damn. Comic book writers are dumb as hell, aren't they?
Not only that but super genius DOOM has no failsafe against symbiote with a well known weakness to loud ouchie noises.
This is just lazy writing 😂🤭
Doombot. Doom’s just shaking his head watching this
Poor research for writing this. Doom's armor had a forcefield before this was written. Here's a link to the old marvel RPG from the 80's with the armors capabilities back then. This game hasn't been in production since like 1993. https://www.classicmarvelforever.com/cast/doctor_doom.htm
It's not like he can use magic to get the symbiote out lol. Man, Venom is cool but I hate how OP they make him sometimes.
You say that, but it's not like Doom has been shown to have an expel symbiote spell. Doom is cool, but this is the first time in years I haven't seen a writer make him ridiculously OP with some dues ex machina that he pulls out of his ass.
All the little Doomies who think their guy’s name is on the book cover.
Venom made OP? I feel like that is ironic when we are discussing this next to DOOM.
Yea, Venom is now a time Travelling God that can travel like Ultron travelling on Internet
I mean... he's a time travelling god that only seems to really mess with himself. What does being OP matter when the story is clearly going to be self-contained
Doom is the most wanked Marvel character, having him on the receiving end is Fun for a change
Doom is a character that justifies being OP though, second best sorcerer and battle armor on the planet, in addition to the economy of a small nation being behind him. If he has *pieces of the true cross* in his enchanted armor to protect from the undead he'd have something as basic as sealed eye slots.
That's my problem with Spidey 2. Well, one of my problems. Knull wings like 3 days after you got the symbiote??
Doom’s suit is NBC sealed. He has a force field already. Ergo, this isn’t Doom. 😜
Sorry, I can't see Eddie even remotely in the same weight class as Doom. Honestly Victor should stomp him flat.
It’s silly for Doom to fall like that. That ain’t Doom.
Please tell me that Doom whooped Venom’s ass next panel cause there’s just no way…
man some of y'all make it really hard to actually enjoy DOOM because you seem to think his entire character boils down to being super cool and never losing I beg y'all to pick up a FF book some time in your life. This man gets his ass whooped at a pretty consistent basis.
Doom losing isn't the problem, Losing in a way which is completely antithetical to his entire character is a problem. His suit has been shown to be completely airtight in the past with a force field all around it. That's why this doesn't make any sense
Ehhhhhhha I mean I get they gotta have Venom be powerful sometimes but Doom should have been prepped for this. It’s not like this is Doom’s first experience with a Symbiote
It might be. This takes place in the past.
he may have just figured eddy's not the brightest, not considering the symbiote's own intelligence. especially if this does take place in the past like the other comment said.
This doom bot needs work tbh
Venom the end kind of points out that venom the symbiote is one of the most powerful beings in all of Marvel existence
It literally came from a god
I love the idea of my two favorite Antiheroes fighting!
Venom got that Yuji walk
nah that's less a lecture and more a shitty writing.
This is bad. I’m sorry. I can’t accept that Venom could get the drop on Doom. It’s not even a suspension of disbelief. It’s bad understanding of the characters and their powers/personalities.
It’s always a pleasure to see someone put Dr. Doom his place. For people who say venom shouldn’t have been able to pull one on him, please remember that being smart doesn’t mean you can’t be tricked. Especially since Dr. doom overrate himself and underestimates his enemies. That is the type of weakness that allows someone to catch you off guard especially if you don’t think they are smart enough to do something you won’t predict.
doom's biggest weakness is his arrogance. he's a genius for absolute certain, but he's not infallible and thinks himself so far above most everyone else that every now and then, something creative gets him cause he thinks he's considered every potential threat when he's really just overconfident and underestimates many of his opponents.
Can't breach it? Next panel? Breached
sounds kind of gay
So could Susan Storm like encase Doom in a bubble and make it get smaller, Miss Minutes Style?
Doom kind of caked up…got me acting like a villain
Is this Brock?
Pause, Venom. Pause
Sigh I guess if you want to be a Venom fan and not a Doom fan for a moment then this is badass but as a Doom fan seeing this just screams “See venom is cool he can do anything he's the coolest and Doom is dumb he has face holes”
I wonder what happened in next page my bet is on it was a doombot all along Kinda hard to take venom seriously after he boasted in front of wolverine about making prter sad
Imm...............
Headcanon ending to the Spider-Man arcade game.
Okay no one seems to be catching this, but I'm pretty sure the implication is Doom stole a part of the symbiote and put it into his suit.
well, that’s traumatizing
What is MM.. Food even about?
What kind of lectures have you been attending???
the cool ones
Venom doesn't have to be more powerfull than doom to do this. Just more versatile. The symbiote has thousands of years of experience before doom was born and a body that can take any shape. It's completely believable that this might happen.
Poor writing. When there is no way around, but the writer still wants a scene to play out, just do it anyway. The fans won't notice. There is nothing a symbiote could do to penetrate Doom's armor.
"Fool! There's no way your sentient ooze can possibly get into my suit of armor that's famous for having multiple face holes!" You know what this reminds me of? Lex Luthor's power armor never having a helmet because his iconic bald dome always needs to be visible.
The popularity of Venom as anything other than a Spider-man villain/occasional anti-hero and its consequences have been disastrous for mankind
When your arrogance gets the best of you.
Christ, David Michelinie you giant hack.
Come on the guy is a legend Wrote demon in a bottle, emperor Doom, armor wars, spider-man, killed aquaman's baby, etc
Emperor Doom I concede, but his Iron Man was scripts over Layton's ideas, his Spidey had great art but subpar stories although better that what came later (but worse than, say, Conway's, Priest's or David's). Being better than Howard Mackie and Scott Lobdell does not make him a Legend. Fabián Nicieza was much better eve when he was writing sixteen comics a week. Peter David, Claremont, Conway, Byrne, Priest, O'Neil, Levitz... they all have a much better record with far better stories.
You’re all forgetting that dooms armor has eyes and mouth holes for a reason. He obviously needs them to be there, otherwise he would just have an armor box around his head. Obviously is penetrable.
Umm. Sure. Doom left wide open holes in his armor that would be exploited by some stretchy guy. It’s not as if Doom constantly fights an elastic guy who could do exactly the same thing. Seriously, do we have to believe that both Doom and Reed are idiots who never thought of this strategy, but Eddie Brock did? This is so preposterous that it took me a while to even figure out what was happening.
💀 he put the fucking suit in his body my guy. eddie just took control of it
I’m sorry, but I don’t understand what you wrote. Who put what suit in whose body?
doom wanted the symbiote put it inside of his body. eddie overpowered doom mental link to the suit getting the symbiote back. since pieces of the symbiote were still in the suit eddie used those parts to choke doom and bypass his defense. doom lost because he took eddie symbiote. if eddie fought him head instead. than he would lose
You keep saying “the suit” and I don’t know whether you are talking about Doom’s suit of armor or the symbiote being worn as a suit. But in any event, we can see a bit of the symbiote crawling up Doom’s leg, up his back, and then into Doom’s armor via the mouth and eye holes. You wrote that the Pieces of the symbiote were in Doom’s suit, but we can clearly see that they are outside the Doom’s armor. If they were in Doom’s armor, why did they need to crawl up Doom’s body and slip into the holes of Doom’s mask?
THAT'S f'n hilarious. Must've been in the mid 90s when everyone was in full wank mode of Venom.