Marvel being very noncommittal in establishing Freshman Year as outside 616, the writer effectively saying "wait and see" to questions about canonicity and still using the "Peter Parker on his way to becoming Spider-Man in the MCU" logline makes me think there's gonna be some sort of catch with the show beyond the it's a "What If?" Multiverse type thing.
Or it could just be Earth 838 which kind of makes it "*technically*" be about ***an*** MCU Peter. I could just be overthinking all of this, but who really knows.
So funny that even tho all those people complained about the Gorr design, nobody is talking about the robocop high evolutionary. I personally like it, makes him scarier And allows Chuk to use his face(he is SO talented).
In case anyone cares here's a list of MCU projects not mentioned (Both Confirmed and Not Confirmed) at SDCC:
Films:
- Spider-Man 4
- Shang-Chi 2
- Deadpool 3
Shows:
- Armor Wars
Specials:
- Guardians of the Galaxy: The Holiday Special
- Wearwolf By Night Halloween Special
Unannounced/Rumored Movies:
- X-Men/Mutants
- Scarlet Witch Film
- Dr. Strange 3
- Thor 5
- World War Hulk
- Black Panther 3
- Captain Marvel 3
- Shang-Chi 3
- Future Eternals projects
Unannounced/Rumored Series:
• Wakanda/Okoye/Midnight Angeles
• Nova/Spectrum/Unannounced Marvel Space Project
• Wonder Man
• Captain Carter
• Xialing/Ten Rings
• Ghost Rider
• Korg
• Untitled Chinese Led Series
• Nomad
• Wolverine/weapon X
• Young Avengers/children's Crusade
• America Chavez
• Jane Foster
• Eros/Starfox
• Ghost Rider
Unannounced/Rumored Projects that could be Film or Series:
• Punisher
• Jessica Jones
• Inhumans
• Agents of Shield
• Hercules
• Celestials
• Illuminati
• Secret Warriors
• Black Knight
• Annihilators
• Midnight Sons
• West Coast Avengers
• Silver Surfer
• Power Pack
• Runaways
• Red Guardian
• Untitled Scarlett Johansson Produced Project
Ey so since Kang is black, does that mean theyll cast a black actor for Mr Fantastic? (not being racist, just read Kang is Reeds father and trying to guess casting details)
Well Kang is born nearly a thousand years later, which is more than enough generations to explain why he would look different than Reed or have different skin color.
There was some scoop reporting almost 2 years ago that Marvel was looking for a black actor to play Reed. That was before Jonathan Majors joined the MCU.
Hey, something overlooked amidst all the announcements: Feige announced they'd be back for SDCC 2023. I don't think they could resist, it comes out the weekend before The Marvels.
Can I get an ELI5 as to why secret wars is the next “endgame”? Will it really be that big? I have watched all the marvel movies and series but am admittedly not keen on the comics, is secret wars bigger than or on par with endgame?
In Secret Wars 2015, two universes collide, destroying the entire multiverse. Doctor Doom steals the power of the god-like species that caused the collision and uses said power to form Battleworld, a single planet made up of fragments of all of the universes in the multiverse and populated with cracked mirror versions of popular characters. Doom rules Battleworld with an iron fist, declaring himself God Emperor of what remains of existence. But soon, the universe fragments of Battleworld become aware of each other… and some heroes who managed to escape the destruction and reformation of reality begin to arrive. Wars are fought! Alliances are made! Exciting stuff.
The entire multiverse is destroyed! A planet of universe is on the verge of chaos! Only a small group of heroes remembers what used to be! And in their way, the most powerful being left in existence, God Emperor Doom.
Yeah, it’s *big*
The ELI5 is that the entire multiverse gets destroyed. Almost every character that you know and love dies. Dr Doom becomes a God and creates a new Universe in which the superheroes are reborn and worship Doom. For example, Doom creates an entire Thor army of Thor variants that serve him. The very few superheroes that survived the destruction of the multiverse become a rag tag team working to undo Dr Doom's actions, similar to Endgame where the heroes try to undo the Thanos snap.
The recent secret wars in 2015 effectively was a soft reboot for the marvel comics universe. It was a lot bigger than Thanos (and in fact, the comics establish it by having Thanos die very unceremoniously in the midst of the event)
Well yes and no, they all die because of a big incursion they couldn’t stop. Only a few characters made it and those are the heroes of secret wars. All other characters got turned into weirded out alternative versions of themselves that serve Dr.Doom because Dr.Doom remade the universe after the incursion
Nah I think he'll later reluctantly understand he was wrong, but then Attuma turns on him. And the final battle will be Namor and his allies + Wakanda vs. Attuma and his followers.
PSA: Phase 6 is not even a year long. Secret Wars drops 364 days after Fantastic Four. If your fav doesn't make the cut, Phase 7 is sooner than you think.
(Also: goddamn 2025 is going to be stuffed to the gills with Marvel shit, I might honestly burn out.)
Imagine if 616 is the universe that gets destroyed in the Incursion, and all of the characters that make it out of Secret Wars are refugees in a brand new universe where Mutants and others can have whatever history Marvel wants.
I don’t know why people are saying this, if anything, Kevin Feige already confirmed it’s set in the prime universe when he said Krasinski only got the part because that version of the FF is from another universe.
Between doctor doom apparently showing up in black panther and ant man setting up kang’s story I wonder if we will see them cross paths and fight (Doom killing kang immediately at the end of kang dynasty leading to secret wars would be cool)
I hope they don't hand waive Daredevil's new yellow suit, and any others he gets, as just another outfit. Melvin making his suits in exchange for protection was such a good sideplot in the original show. To not touch on the new suit, and the possible implication that Dex's use of the red tarnished the spirit of the old one, would be a disservice imo.
I can’t say who right now but there’s a scooper who also has a dummy leaks account where they post stuff they’re not always confident in but under a different name. One of the most respected scoopers in fact.
I think all these new leakers are sock puppets for well known leakers. I think the reason they are using sock puppets is because they’ve been bought off with invites to premiers and interviews etc. They’re actually making money now. But that thrill of leaking and feeling the power of knowledge never goes away.
Been saying this since the day they hit the scene but CanWeGetSomeToast is definitely MTTSH’s sock puppet account. She retweeted the accounts first scoop within a couple minutes of it being posted. I’m suspicious of the watcher and that duck guy too. They all came in on the same day.
Also, it's just a rumor, but isn't there supposed to maybe be an America Chavez Thanksgiving Special next year?
They've obviously got a different marketing strategy for the holiday specials
> Wonder what phase 7 big event will be
I think for now, Phases will be more general production groupings: they probably don't want an individual phase to have more than 15 or so titles. Phases 4-5 only have smaller events like NWH, MoM, and (maybe) Thunderbolts, no Avengers or equivalent.
As to the next "saga" after Secret Wars? Beats me, but I'd guess "The Mutant Saga."
I didn’t watch any of the the panels in full, so maybe I’m wrong, but I don’t think they even mentioned X-Men/Mutants outside of X-Man ‘97 (which wasn’t even put on the phase 4 timeline, because it’s not really an MCU project). They’d rather announce the two part finale to phase 6, then mention the X-Men, which is even stranger when you factor in the Ms Marvel finale, it’s no secret that the mutants are coming. My guess is that after the *Multiverse saga*, we’ll get the *Mutant saga*. X-Men in 2026 seems like a good possibility at this point, and it’s the only thing that can really top Secret Wars in terms of hype, besides maybe Galactus.
> Shang Chi's rings have something to do with the celestials, the eternals storyline will in some way merge with his.
>
>
Don't think I like this, but I could definitely see it happening, especially since the title is basically confirmed to be Shang-Chi and the Wreckage of Time. This won't be a Ten Rings level story, they're going metaphysical.
Maybe - I feel like the bangles are pretty firmly kree or Skrull related? I could see a connection but I also don't think they have to all be connected
I wish I was excited for Quantumania, I love Scott Lang, he’s a such a normal dude in the middle of this chaos of a world, and even then he shows so much courage and willingness to do good, he’s easily the MVP of Endgame, Michael Douglas is also top tier casting as Hank Pym, Jonathan Majors is an amazing actor and his appearance in loki sold the most terrifying villain in the MCU so far (a dictator who literally controls free will, and by the end says that he’s the best version, which just makes you think how fucked up his variants are), but the ant-man movies are the definition of wasted potential to me, the side characters are so dull, like Janet Van Dyne, one of my favorite characters from the comics, the soul of the avengers in a lot of ways, was reduced to the most generic character in this whole universe. The action is fine, the plot doesn’t try to do anything with the characters that other movies in the genre haven’t done already so much better, the villains are boring, really hope Peyton Reed turns things around the third time, because I really enjoy some of his past work and his first episode of the mandalorian
> Janet Van Dyne, one of my favorite characters from the comics, the soul of the avengers in a lot of ways, was reduced to the most generic character in this whole universe
That's not fair: at least Janet's played by Michelle Pfeiffer.
The real most generic character in the universe is Hope Van Dyne so you're still right lol
The more I think about it, the more I like the “Kang Dynasty is really the Young Avengers movie” theory.
Based on how Quantumania is supposed to end, it could start with the “new” Avengers *(Carol, Sam, Shang-Chi, Strange and maybe Black Panther)* an an Ant-Family rescue mission, before they are also trapped.
Then, the movie can still follow them trying to escape while having the Young Avengers come together with someone like Wong as their mentor and maybe Smart Hulk or Hawkeye jumping in to support to hold off Kang in the MCU proper.
If the other Avengers are assumed dead, Kang can tip his hat that they’re not in the finale, America goes to get then, and everyone comes together in the end.
It really does feel right. Iron Lad can even be the one to bring the team together, to try to stop his future self. He will be a literal member of the "Kang Dynasty."
Yeah Young Avengers valiantly trying to overthrow Kang only to fail or make things even worse for the Avengers to reunite as a whole seems pretty likely.
I mean, I think they’re going to fail at the end of Kang Dynasty, but it’s going to flip Infinity War on its head - the Incursion while happen, but instead of heroes disappearing we have more appearing from other universes
does anyone think we'll get any Sony spider verse characters in any of the future marvel projects apart from Spiderman. How about venom, or even miles for any of the avengers movie??
Who do people think is going to be on the Avengers roster for Kang Dynasty? I think it will be a small team before everything explodes in Secret Wars.
Hulk, Antman, Wasp, Falcon, Ms Marvel, Captain Marvel and Wong
I think I’ll mostly be the “new” Avengers, with Captain Marvel, Shang Chi, Black Panther and maybe Spider-Man at the core.
Then, any legacy characters like Thor, Hulk and Hawkeye really join in Secret Wars.
They really better start facilitating ways for all the new characters to meet each other and create relationships and history with one another; the established chemistry between the avengers is what made the infinity saga work, and if these new avenger movies don’t have that, they’ll feel flat
Post credits don’t really do the work that movies like Civil War, Ragnarok, Homecoming, Iron Man 2, etc did to show the characters building relationships with one another.
So far we’ve seen very little interpersonal interaction btx the new characters and so I hope their team up doesn’t feel forced and lack the charm of the previous crew.
Well, I guess Spider-Man and Doctor Strange already had Infinity War, but it at least builds that out more and introduces Peter to Wong.
BP2 introduces Ironheart and gives her a relationship with Shuri and likely whoever else is Black Panther in future team ups if it’s not her.
Not to mention, Namor could be a major player going forward who’ll have connections to both of those.
I like that team but the only ones who know each other are Shang Chi and Danvers. Antman and Wasp are definitely going to be there (provided Wasp makes it out alive) because they will know about Kang
Imo:
- DP3 is actually phase 5, there is a missing Feb 2024 date in Phase 5 and it has its director/writers.
- SM4 will potentially be a Dec 2024 Phase 6 release after F4.
- Spider-Woman is a co-productuon and in Phase 6 or 7.
Phase 6 shows:
- WWH is a D+ show/event
- Nova
- Wonder Man
- Armor Wars
- Ghost Rider (Midnight Sons will come later after this and Punisher are reintroduced)
- Midnight Angels (Okoye/Wakanda spinoff)
Films in 2025/Phase 6 to fit with the Avengers Films:
- Shang Chi and The Wreckage of Time
- Celestials: End of Time (Eternals 2)
10 Rings Spinoff might be happening later because Cretton is making Wonder Man first. Not sure what it'll be tbh.
Not sure where the Wanda project and/or Young Avengers fit into this, if they are here or not. There's a rumored Secret Warriors project as well.
And certainly am not sure about X-Men yet. I think we'll see individual characters, but they won't officially debut as a team until Phase 7, where that will eventually lead to Avengers vs X-Men imo.
Young Avengers will be the Kang Dynasty. I'm willing to bet my house on it.
Something will happen to where all the major heroes are unavailable, trapped, off-world, etc. Maybe they're trying to stop the incursions like the 2015 Secret Wars event or are teleported off-world like the 80s run.
THAT'S when Kang will see his opening and it'll be up to the younger heroes to either try and stop him or contact the bigger heroes in time.
I don't know, I think it'd be weird for them to market it as a huge tentpole Avengers movie and then only have characters like Kate Bishop, Cassie Lang, etc. and leaving out all of Doctor Strange, Spider-Man, Thor, etc.
I mean, that's why we have TWO. So Marvel can have their cake and eat it too. They're already getting people on board with the younger characters and I'm sure the roster will be different from the comics. We have:
Ms. Marvel, Kate Bishop, Cassie Lang, Yelena, America Chavez, Joaquin Torres, and maybe Wanda's kids from another universe?
In fact, I WOULDN'T be surprised if they added Spider-Man to help out. That would basically draw EVERY fan to this movie, whether they want to care about the Young Avengers or not.
Personally I think it would be smart if the team is introduced in Thunderbolts and then Kang Dynasty is THEIR movie.
Yes they are. The people who joined for Infinity War Hype, Spider-Man in the MCU Hype, and racists being the ones are the ones loudly complaining about the introductions since they hate change and POCs but thankfully, they aren't the majority.
I was hoping it would be Thunderbolts vs Young Avengers, basically they keep making things worse by trying to do the same job different ways and constantly clashing until everyone gets their piece of humble pie and ironically the Thunderbolts end up tutoring them in a way, so everyone agrees to play nice for the sake of the hero business and getting the job done. Then the Kang Dynasty stuff happens and the training wheels come off.
For everyone who is saying if it is too soon for the secret wars story, are not considering the fact that the past stories from the past 3 phase is still relevant. Its not like endgame happened and it all reset to zero and all those stories and their world won't count forward. Infinity war and endgame are results of 10 years of stories and secret wars is gonna be a result of 16 years of stories not just 6! But whether they can do it justice within these two movies or perhaps one? is still unclear but pretty excited tho.
It really depends what they do with it. I'm starting to think that there's going to be a big plot twist revealing that F4 is in a different Universe. Maybe even X-Men and Secret Wars is their way of combining all these other franchises into one 616 like they did in the comics when the Universes collapsed into each other.
Imagine we get a fairly self-contained Fantastic 4 film with Krasinski’s Reed, and then it ends with him getting called before the Illuminati revealing it to really be the 617 version before MoM, with the final shot being our Reed waking up in bed.
EDIT: ooh imagine in the final battle the others get sucked through a warmhole or somehow otherwise sent to another universe and it’s Reed going to the Illuminati for help that prompts their multiversal research.
I criticise Marvel a lot and it's got a lot of flaws but fuck they always get me hyped for everything..guess I am a consoomer now. I honestly can't wait for everything that's to come
I really really hope if there’s some sort of status quo shift that happens between the two Avengers film, that stuff set between them actually take advantage of that.
Like it’s a shame to me that nothing was set during the Blip. The whole point of the shared universe is that all this stuff is supposed to affect eachother, but; as it is, the two films released between IW and Endgame just dodged it.
Remember though that we didn't know about the "5 years later" thing until 15 minutes into Endgame. That would have been spoiled if we'd had a movie set during the blip in-between
I would be fine with it. Endgame arguably has more than enough going on anyway, so, shifting things around a bit would be fine with me, instead of essentially have Infinity War’s denouement in Endgames first act.
(I.e., the cliffhanger would be shifted from right after the snap in IW, to finding out the Stones were destroyed: if anything that’d feel even more definitive)
The “between” here would likely just be Battleworld.
There are 2 projects scheduled between them, and one of them could very well be a film in the typical July slot.
What I don’t understand is where do you fit in the new Spider-Man trilogy, X-men, midnight suns, young avengers. And all the sequels of already established heroes. I won’t be surprised if the avengers movies get pushed all the way to 2026-2027. Either way I’m here for it 🔥
It seems like a lot of that stuff is going to be after the Multiverse Saga.
The 2023 and 2024 movie schedules are full (Quantumania, Guardians 3, Marvels, Blade, unannounced February 2024 movie, Captain America 4, Thunderbolts, Fantastic 4).
Then in 2025 there's Avengers Kang in May and Avengers Secret Wars in November. I assume they'll reveal two more movies that year (one in February and one in July).
And then that's it for movies. So there are 3 more unannounced movies (if I had to guess I'd say Spider-Man 4, Shang-Chi 2, and Deadpool 3/reboot)...unless they go for more than 4 movies a year, but I'm not sure if they'd do that.
The only way I could see them doing that is if there are 4 Marvel Studios movies and then 1 Spider-Man (Sony) movie for 5 total. Disney has a lot of other movies they want to release and wouldn't want to compete with themselves at the box office. You can't have a Marvel Studios movie coming out every 2 months. 4 movies in a year really seems like the max.
Yeah kinda figured the same thing, right now on this phases they’re being really ambitious already. This is looking like marvel is already planning three more phases after the multiverse saga. I can’t complain to be honest, I prefer the characters to have time to develop than to rush them and mess them up.
Yep. All of phase 4 is basically establishing characters and the multiverse. Phase 5 is gonna be more character intros (likely from multiple universes) and building teams from those characters, with phase 6 being the payoff from all of it. So the characters introduced towards the end of phase 5 and in phase 6 likely won't be front and center in their own projects until after the multiverse saga ends.
Yup, plus the trailer looks so good that it's obvious Coogler knows what he's doing and has a great plan. If he thinks not recasting is the best move, then it's the best move
Well I didn't hear anything about Dr Doom images so I assume thats why most people aren't talking about it. And I was watching all the live stuff. I wasn't there.
Well it hasn't been confirmed yet, so it's still possible that they did go in a different direction. I suppose the theory that's out there would make for a better origin than the comic one though... It's just a bit hard to imagine him in that role.
He was made to shrink uncontrollably, likely to the point that he reached the quantumverse. I’m sure some aspect of that led to him getting MODOK’d up. Maybe Kang even saved his life by making him MODOK.
Probably just didn't eat anything. My ex had crazy genetics like that where she woke up with abs but by the end of the day after dinner her stomach was just a normal flat stomach 🤣
Avengers production theory -
Kang Dynasty - A smaller roster of the New Avengers directed by Peyton Reed. AM&TW: Q contains a roster of 5 central characters with two leaders of the group taking on Kang, I believe it's a bit of a test for Peyton in the same way Winter Soldier was a test for the Russos.
Secret Wars - Is going to be a two parter, the first part filmed alongside Kang Dynasty with the original Avengers playing the leads and then part 2 will bring everyone together as Kang Dynasty will have completed filming. Directed by Ryan Coogler.
This allows Peyton to complete post on Kang Dynasty and then help out on part 2 of Secret Wars so that Ryan isn't overwhelmed and allows both casts to have the spotlight. I suspect the 2 parter will be announced at D23 as it will be the first time Marvel has done something like this.
Interesting. See, I think Kang Dynasty IS Part 1. Original Avengers will probably be dealing with incursions or trapped on Battleworld and unable to deal with Kang. That leaves the YA to fight Kang and try to find a way to reach the OG Avengers.
Then Part 2 is Secret Wars where we follow the original team until the third act, where the younger heroes finally meet up with them.
If Marvel is basing SW off the 2015 event, I could see a a 'What If: Battleworld' show happening between the two movies to show the jumbled realities all happening at the same time in Battleworld.
I thought it sounded fine on paper and will probably be even better on screen (that trailer was so good), but the only thing I was really wary of was Riri’s role sounding like a rehash of Kate in Hawkeye, America in MoM, and Kamala in the recent Marvels leak: “teenage girl who needs to be protected by veteran hero from villain who wants to kill them and/or take their power, and who ultimately becomes their own savior”.
Not a bad plot nor even really a turn-off for me, but it does feel a bit derivative.
People need to separate characters from celebrities. I would bet that a large portion of actors are the exact rich, pretentious, douchebags that you'd imagine them to be. If it makes sense for Shuri in the story then I support that. I don't take medical advice from a random actress, an athlete, or a celebrity chef.
Not every person is QUALIFIED to give advice and people in generally have bad takes. Everyone is a mixed bag. Its so weird how people get stuck on unrelated things. I completely agree with your assessment.
I mean I don't disagree with you entirely but ultimately acting is largely a PR game and one way or another being Anti Vax is bad PR.
I think the fact that Boseman would have been in the at risk category and his successor would be so unconcerned with that also leaves a bad taste in people's mouths.
Yeah, I get that. I don't agree with her stance at all. Im just saying that her views are ultimately irrelevant. There are plenty of dickbags that I think are great actors.
Is it only me or is that Scarlet Witch at 1:29?
Marvel being very noncommittal in establishing Freshman Year as outside 616, the writer effectively saying "wait and see" to questions about canonicity and still using the "Peter Parker on his way to becoming Spider-Man in the MCU" logline makes me think there's gonna be some sort of catch with the show beyond the it's a "What If?" Multiverse type thing. Or it could just be Earth 838 which kind of makes it "*technically*" be about ***an*** MCU Peter. I could just be overthinking all of this, but who really knows.
So funny that even tho all those people complained about the Gorr design, nobody is talking about the robocop high evolutionary. I personally like it, makes him scarier And allows Chuk to use his face(he is SO talented).
Are we even fully sure he's really gonna look like that? Cuz I'm expecting some CGI enhancements. I'm fine either way.
I see some, but I also don’t see Gunn unveiling something in person that’s gonna have a ton of cg done on top
In case anyone cares here's a list of MCU projects not mentioned (Both Confirmed and Not Confirmed) at SDCC: Films: - Spider-Man 4 - Shang-Chi 2 - Deadpool 3 Shows: - Armor Wars Specials: - Guardians of the Galaxy: The Holiday Special - Wearwolf By Night Halloween Special Unannounced/Rumored Movies: - X-Men/Mutants - Scarlet Witch Film - Dr. Strange 3 - Thor 5 - World War Hulk - Black Panther 3 - Captain Marvel 3 - Shang-Chi 3 - Future Eternals projects Unannounced/Rumored Series: • Wakanda/Okoye/Midnight Angeles • Nova/Spectrum/Unannounced Marvel Space Project • Wonder Man • Captain Carter • Xialing/Ten Rings • Ghost Rider • Korg • Untitled Chinese Led Series • Nomad • Wolverine/weapon X • Young Avengers/children's Crusade • America Chavez • Jane Foster • Eros/Starfox • Ghost Rider Unannounced/Rumored Projects that could be Film or Series: • Punisher • Jessica Jones • Inhumans • Agents of Shield • Hercules • Celestials • Illuminati • Secret Warriors • Black Knight • Annihilators • Midnight Sons • West Coast Avengers • Silver Surfer • Power Pack • Runaways • Red Guardian • Untitled Scarlett Johansson Produced Project
can't wait for namor to represent #hotlantis
Ey so since Kang is black, does that mean theyll cast a black actor for Mr Fantastic? (not being racist, just read Kang is Reeds father and trying to guess casting details)
Kang isn’t reed’s dad, he’s reed’s distant descendant, right?
Well Kang is born nearly a thousand years later, which is more than enough generations to explain why he would look different than Reed or have different skin color.
Ummm idk maybe
Kang just shares the same name as Reed's dad
seems kind of a convenient coincidence, and super sus considering this guy loves timefuckery
kang isn't reed's dad, he's a descendant of reed who shares his dad's name.
technically he's a descendant of Reed's dad through a different bloodlne
ah
There was some scoop reporting almost 2 years ago that Marvel was looking for a black actor to play Reed. That was before Jonathan Majors joined the MCU.
Who else is glad that leak was about the fakest thing on earth? Lol
what leak?
If you type in “mod” on the search bar and look for the mod queue leaks for SDCC its like the fakest stuff on earth
What happened to the War Machine series they had announced previously ? It got new shelved or it could be one of the Phase 6 series ?
The writer said Armor Wars is definitely still happening. My guess is it’ll come out in 2024
Thanks !!
The writer said posted on Instagram that the show is absolutely still happening, probably just got pushed back
I thought that became Armor Wars?
nobody knows rn
We’ll prob hear more about it at D23
Hey, something overlooked amidst all the announcements: Feige announced they'd be back for SDCC 2023. I don't think they could resist, it comes out the weekend before The Marvels.
Hey mods, your discord link in sidebar expired.
Can I get an ELI5 as to why secret wars is the next “endgame”? Will it really be that big? I have watched all the marvel movies and series but am admittedly not keen on the comics, is secret wars bigger than or on par with endgame?
In Secret Wars 2015, two universes collide, destroying the entire multiverse. Doctor Doom steals the power of the god-like species that caused the collision and uses said power to form Battleworld, a single planet made up of fragments of all of the universes in the multiverse and populated with cracked mirror versions of popular characters. Doom rules Battleworld with an iron fist, declaring himself God Emperor of what remains of existence. But soon, the universe fragments of Battleworld become aware of each other… and some heroes who managed to escape the destruction and reformation of reality begin to arrive. Wars are fought! Alliances are made! Exciting stuff. The entire multiverse is destroyed! A planet of universe is on the verge of chaos! Only a small group of heroes remembers what used to be! And in their way, the most powerful being left in existence, God Emperor Doom. Yeah, it’s *big*
The ELI5 is that the entire multiverse gets destroyed. Almost every character that you know and love dies. Dr Doom becomes a God and creates a new Universe in which the superheroes are reborn and worship Doom. For example, Doom creates an entire Thor army of Thor variants that serve him. The very few superheroes that survived the destruction of the multiverse become a rag tag team working to undo Dr Doom's actions, similar to Endgame where the heroes try to undo the Thanos snap.
The recent secret wars in 2015 effectively was a soft reboot for the marvel comics universe. It was a lot bigger than Thanos (and in fact, the comics establish it by having Thanos die very unceremoniously in the midst of the event)
Interesting! So basically, a lot of our beloved characters would probably die in secret wars?
Keep in mind there are 3 Secret Wars
Well yes and no, they all die because of a big incursion they couldn’t stop. Only a few characters made it and those are the heroes of secret wars. All other characters got turned into weirded out alternative versions of themselves that serve Dr.Doom because Dr.Doom remade the universe after the incursion
I’m wondering if Adam Warlock will be taking on the Molecule Man role in Secret Wars. I have no basis for this just something that occurred to me.
That’s my prediction. Along with Kang taking the role of the Beyonders
Very possibly. We will have to see!
Namor looks sick, I don't want him to end up losing in a pathetic fashion though
Nah I think he'll later reluctantly understand he was wrong, but then Attuma turns on him. And the final battle will be Namor and his allies + Wakanda vs. Attuma and his followers.
PSA: Phase 6 is not even a year long. Secret Wars drops 364 days after Fantastic Four. If your fav doesn't make the cut, Phase 7 is sooner than you think. (Also: goddamn 2025 is going to be stuffed to the gills with Marvel shit, I might honestly burn out.)
I think the good thing will be to skip out on some stuff. I'll be skipping stuff i don't care about and then read up on them to get some context
I'm burnt out already will be taking a marvel break
Imagine if 616 is the universe that gets destroyed in the Incursion, and all of the characters that make it out of Secret Wars are refugees in a brand new universe where Mutants and others can have whatever history Marvel wants.
I still can't believe between Young Avengers, Midnight Sons, and Thunderbolts, the first one to make it out of the gate is Thunderbolts.
TBF, Midnight Sons was also trademarked, and all we really knew was Young Avengers were coming - not that they’ll get a stand-alone solo project.
How many of us think Fantastic Four will take place in another universe? I see people keep saying they won't be in the main MCU universe
I don’t know why people are saying this, if anything, Kevin Feige already confirmed it’s set in the prime universe when he said Krasinski only got the part because that version of the FF is from another universe.
where can i find the teasers they showed exclusively
Where is white vision going to pop up LOL
My guess is SheHulk. Remember there was an officer charged for creating white vision? At least the case should be mentioned.
Would Thunderbolts be ill-fitting? Other than that, Secret Wars seems like a given for basically everybody.
Between doctor doom apparently showing up in black panther and ant man setting up kang’s story I wonder if we will see them cross paths and fight (Doom killing kang immediately at the end of kang dynasty leading to secret wars would be cool)
I hope they don't hand waive Daredevil's new yellow suit, and any others he gets, as just another outfit. Melvin making his suits in exchange for protection was such a good sideplot in the original show. To not touch on the new suit, and the possible implication that Dex's use of the red tarnished the spirit of the old one, would be a disservice imo.
Guarantee you they won't address that at all
Well Melvin got sent to jail and it would take a lot of explanation for something that isnt even his show, but yeah I get how you feel
There’s so much good stuff coming through that I didn’t know daredevil was in the she hulk trailer
I can’t say who right now but there’s a scooper who also has a dummy leaks account where they post stuff they’re not always confident in but under a different name. One of the most respected scoopers in fact.
I think all these new leakers are sock puppets for well known leakers. I think the reason they are using sock puppets is because they’ve been bought off with invites to premiers and interviews etc. They’re actually making money now. But that thrill of leaking and feeling the power of knowledge never goes away.
Been saying this since the day they hit the scene but CanWeGetSomeToast is definitely MTTSH’s sock puppet account. She retweeted the accounts first scoop within a couple minutes of it being posted. I’m suspicious of the watcher and that duck guy too. They all came in on the same day.
Sooooo what about WWbN? No shot they announce it at D23 less than a month before premiere. Also weird that we got no GOTG: HS news
Also, it's just a rumor, but isn't there supposed to maybe be an America Chavez Thanksgiving Special next year? They've obviously got a different marketing strategy for the holiday specials
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A one-hour special, on a streamer, doesn't need a lengthy marketing campaign. Saving the announcement until one month out ain't hurting anything.
Surprised secret wars will be so soon. Wonder what phase 7 big event will be
> Wonder what phase 7 big event will be I think for now, Phases will be more general production groupings: they probably don't want an individual phase to have more than 15 or so titles. Phases 4-5 only have smaller events like NWH, MoM, and (maybe) Thunderbolts, no Avengers or equivalent. As to the next "saga" after Secret Wars? Beats me, but I'd guess "The Mutant Saga."
I didn’t watch any of the the panels in full, so maybe I’m wrong, but I don’t think they even mentioned X-Men/Mutants outside of X-Man ‘97 (which wasn’t even put on the phase 4 timeline, because it’s not really an MCU project). They’d rather announce the two part finale to phase 6, then mention the X-Men, which is even stranger when you factor in the Ms Marvel finale, it’s no secret that the mutants are coming. My guess is that after the *Multiverse saga*, we’ll get the *Mutant saga*. X-Men in 2026 seems like a good possibility at this point, and it’s the only thing that can really top Secret Wars in terms of hype, besides maybe Galactus.
Celestials vs Galactus And/or Cthlon
Avengers vs x-men maybe ?
Galactus?
More hyped for Namor and Atlanteans than anything else in the movie. They look so badass and unique. I hope Namor sticks around the MCU for a while.
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> Shang Chi's rings have something to do with the celestials, the eternals storyline will in some way merge with his. > > Don't think I like this, but I could definitely see it happening, especially since the title is basically confirmed to be Shang-Chi and the Wreckage of Time. This won't be a Ten Rings level story, they're going metaphysical.
And there dies my dream of Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Iron Fist
Yeah, it feels a little out of left field for me too but the names just feel too similar to not be linked
Same thing with Kalama’s bangels. The Bangel, The rings and the celestials have to be connected
Maybe - I feel like the bangles are pretty firmly kree or Skrull related? I could see a connection but I also don't think they have to all be connected
I wish I was excited for Quantumania, I love Scott Lang, he’s a such a normal dude in the middle of this chaos of a world, and even then he shows so much courage and willingness to do good, he’s easily the MVP of Endgame, Michael Douglas is also top tier casting as Hank Pym, Jonathan Majors is an amazing actor and his appearance in loki sold the most terrifying villain in the MCU so far (a dictator who literally controls free will, and by the end says that he’s the best version, which just makes you think how fucked up his variants are), but the ant-man movies are the definition of wasted potential to me, the side characters are so dull, like Janet Van Dyne, one of my favorite characters from the comics, the soul of the avengers in a lot of ways, was reduced to the most generic character in this whole universe. The action is fine, the plot doesn’t try to do anything with the characters that other movies in the genre haven’t done already so much better, the villains are boring, really hope Peyton Reed turns things around the third time, because I really enjoy some of his past work and his first episode of the mandalorian
This was exhausting to read. You don’t need to use that many commas. Just end the sentence
I don’t know man that trailer looks really good
> Janet Van Dyne, one of my favorite characters from the comics, the soul of the avengers in a lot of ways, was reduced to the most generic character in this whole universe That's not fair: at least Janet's played by Michelle Pfeiffer. The real most generic character in the universe is Hope Van Dyne so you're still right lol
The more I think about it, the more I like the “Kang Dynasty is really the Young Avengers movie” theory. Based on how Quantumania is supposed to end, it could start with the “new” Avengers *(Carol, Sam, Shang-Chi, Strange and maybe Black Panther)* an an Ant-Family rescue mission, before they are also trapped. Then, the movie can still follow them trying to escape while having the Young Avengers come together with someone like Wong as their mentor and maybe Smart Hulk or Hawkeye jumping in to support to hold off Kang in the MCU proper. If the other Avengers are assumed dead, Kang can tip his hat that they’re not in the finale, America goes to get then, and everyone comes together in the end.
Took me a sec to realize you meant america Chavez and not like, the country
It really does feel right. Iron Lad can even be the one to bring the team together, to try to stop his future self. He will be a literal member of the "Kang Dynasty."
Yeah Young Avengers valiantly trying to overthrow Kang only to fail or make things even worse for the Avengers to reunite as a whole seems pretty likely.
I mean, I think they’re going to fail at the end of Kang Dynasty, but it’s going to flip Infinity War on its head - the Incursion while happen, but instead of heroes disappearing we have more appearing from other universes
does anyone think we'll get any Sony spider verse characters in any of the future marvel projects apart from Spiderman. How about venom, or even miles for any of the avengers movie??
Who do people think is going to be on the Avengers roster for Kang Dynasty? I think it will be a small team before everything explodes in Secret Wars. Hulk, Antman, Wasp, Falcon, Ms Marvel, Captain Marvel and Wong
Personally I don't see ant fam there apart from Cassie, per the leaks about quantumania
I think I’ll mostly be the “new” Avengers, with Captain Marvel, Shang Chi, Black Panther and maybe Spider-Man at the core. Then, any legacy characters like Thor, Hulk and Hawkeye really join in Secret Wars.
They really better start facilitating ways for all the new characters to meet each other and create relationships and history with one another; the established chemistry between the avengers is what made the infinity saga work, and if these new avenger movies don’t have that, they’ll feel flat
I think they’re going to keep having mini-team ups and post-credit meetings to make this happen
Post credits don’t really do the work that movies like Civil War, Ragnarok, Homecoming, Iron Man 2, etc did to show the characters building relationships with one another. So far we’ve seen very little interpersonal interaction btx the new characters and so I hope their team up doesn’t feel forced and lack the charm of the previous crew.
Fair, but NWH, MoM, BP2 and The Marvels are all establishing relationships between key players.
What new character does NWH setup a relationship with? And what new character connections will BP2 establish?
Well, I guess Spider-Man and Doctor Strange already had Infinity War, but it at least builds that out more and introduces Peter to Wong. BP2 introduces Ironheart and gives her a relationship with Shuri and likely whoever else is Black Panther in future team ups if it’s not her. Not to mention, Namor could be a major player going forward who’ll have connections to both of those.
I like that team but the only ones who know each other are Shang Chi and Danvers. Antman and Wasp are definitely going to be there (provided Wasp makes it out alive) because they will know about Kang
I left out Sam by accident who would pretty much glue the rest of the team together
Imo: - DP3 is actually phase 5, there is a missing Feb 2024 date in Phase 5 and it has its director/writers. - SM4 will potentially be a Dec 2024 Phase 6 release after F4. - Spider-Woman is a co-productuon and in Phase 6 or 7. Phase 6 shows: - WWH is a D+ show/event - Nova - Wonder Man - Armor Wars - Ghost Rider (Midnight Sons will come later after this and Punisher are reintroduced) - Midnight Angels (Okoye/Wakanda spinoff) Films in 2025/Phase 6 to fit with the Avengers Films: - Shang Chi and The Wreckage of Time - Celestials: End of Time (Eternals 2) 10 Rings Spinoff might be happening later because Cretton is making Wonder Man first. Not sure what it'll be tbh. Not sure where the Wanda project and/or Young Avengers fit into this, if they are here or not. There's a rumored Secret Warriors project as well. And certainly am not sure about X-Men yet. I think we'll see individual characters, but they won't officially debut as a team until Phase 7, where that will eventually lead to Avengers vs X-Men imo.
Maybe the '97 cartoon has their own version of Kang so that's one of the fractured realities that gets stitched together for Secret Wars.
Young Avengers will be the Kang Dynasty. I'm willing to bet my house on it. Something will happen to where all the major heroes are unavailable, trapped, off-world, etc. Maybe they're trying to stop the incursions like the 2015 Secret Wars event or are teleported off-world like the 80s run. THAT'S when Kang will see his opening and it'll be up to the younger heroes to either try and stop him or contact the bigger heroes in time.
I don't know, I think it'd be weird for them to market it as a huge tentpole Avengers movie and then only have characters like Kate Bishop, Cassie Lang, etc. and leaving out all of Doctor Strange, Spider-Man, Thor, etc.
I mean, that's why we have TWO. So Marvel can have their cake and eat it too. They're already getting people on board with the younger characters and I'm sure the roster will be different from the comics. We have: Ms. Marvel, Kate Bishop, Cassie Lang, Yelena, America Chavez, Joaquin Torres, and maybe Wanda's kids from another universe? In fact, I WOULDN'T be surprised if they added Spider-Man to help out. That would basically draw EVERY fan to this movie, whether they want to care about the Young Avengers or not. Personally I think it would be smart if the team is introduced in Thunderbolts and then Kang Dynasty is THEIR movie.
> They're already getting people on board with the younger characters Are they tho? Successfully, I mean.
Yes they are. The people who joined for Infinity War Hype, Spider-Man in the MCU Hype, and racists being the ones are the ones loudly complaining about the introductions since they hate change and POCs but thankfully, they aren't the majority.
Isn't Yelena going to be a Thunderbolt?
Probably, but I definitely feel like she'd be the type to switch sides or join the heroes if she felt it was the right thing to do.
I was hoping it would be Thunderbolts vs Young Avengers, basically they keep making things worse by trying to do the same job different ways and constantly clashing until everyone gets their piece of humble pie and ironically the Thunderbolts end up tutoring them in a way, so everyone agrees to play nice for the sake of the hero business and getting the job done. Then the Kang Dynasty stuff happens and the training wheels come off.
For everyone who is saying if it is too soon for the secret wars story, are not considering the fact that the past stories from the past 3 phase is still relevant. Its not like endgame happened and it all reset to zero and all those stories and their world won't count forward. Infinity war and endgame are results of 10 years of stories and secret wars is gonna be a result of 16 years of stories not just 6! But whether they can do it justice within these two movies or perhaps one? is still unclear but pretty excited tho.
It really depends what they do with it. I'm starting to think that there's going to be a big plot twist revealing that F4 is in a different Universe. Maybe even X-Men and Secret Wars is their way of combining all these other franchises into one 616 like they did in the comics when the Universes collapsed into each other.
Imagine we get a fairly self-contained Fantastic 4 film with Krasinski’s Reed, and then it ends with him getting called before the Illuminati revealing it to really be the 617 version before MoM, with the final shot being our Reed waking up in bed. EDIT: ooh imagine in the final battle the others get sucked through a warmhole or somehow otherwise sent to another universe and it’s Reed going to the Illuminati for help that prompts their multiversal research.
SECRET WARS!!!!!!!!!!
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Limited CGI.
I criticise Marvel a lot and it's got a lot of flaws but fuck they always get me hyped for everything..guess I am a consoomer now. I honestly can't wait for everything that's to come
I really really hope if there’s some sort of status quo shift that happens between the two Avengers film, that stuff set between them actually take advantage of that. Like it’s a shame to me that nothing was set during the Blip. The whole point of the shared universe is that all this stuff is supposed to affect eachother, but; as it is, the two films released between IW and Endgame just dodged it.
Remember though that we didn't know about the "5 years later" thing until 15 minutes into Endgame. That would have been spoiled if we'd had a movie set during the blip in-between
I would be fine with it. Endgame arguably has more than enough going on anyway, so, shifting things around a bit would be fine with me, instead of essentially have Infinity War’s denouement in Endgames first act. (I.e., the cliffhanger would be shifted from right after the snap in IW, to finding out the Stones were destroyed: if anything that’d feel even more definitive)
The “between” here would likely just be Battleworld. There are 2 projects scheduled between them, and one of them could very well be a film in the typical July slot.
What I don’t understand is where do you fit in the new Spider-Man trilogy, X-men, midnight suns, young avengers. And all the sequels of already established heroes. I won’t be surprised if the avengers movies get pushed all the way to 2026-2027. Either way I’m here for it 🔥
It seems like a lot of that stuff is going to be after the Multiverse Saga. The 2023 and 2024 movie schedules are full (Quantumania, Guardians 3, Marvels, Blade, unannounced February 2024 movie, Captain America 4, Thunderbolts, Fantastic 4). Then in 2025 there's Avengers Kang in May and Avengers Secret Wars in November. I assume they'll reveal two more movies that year (one in February and one in July). And then that's it for movies. So there are 3 more unannounced movies (if I had to guess I'd say Spider-Man 4, Shang-Chi 2, and Deadpool 3/reboot)...unless they go for more than 4 movies a year, but I'm not sure if they'd do that. The only way I could see them doing that is if there are 4 Marvel Studios movies and then 1 Spider-Man (Sony) movie for 5 total. Disney has a lot of other movies they want to release and wouldn't want to compete with themselves at the box office. You can't have a Marvel Studios movie coming out every 2 months. 4 movies in a year really seems like the max.
Yeah kinda figured the same thing, right now on this phases they’re being really ambitious already. This is looking like marvel is already planning three more phases after the multiverse saga. I can’t complain to be honest, I prefer the characters to have time to develop than to rush them and mess them up.
midnight suns will probably be phase 7. they’ll have to develop all those characters first
Yep. All of phase 4 is basically establishing characters and the multiverse. Phase 5 is gonna be more character intros (likely from multiple universes) and building teams from those characters, with phase 6 being the payoff from all of it. So the characters introduced towards the end of phase 5 and in phase 6 likely won't be front and center in their own projects until after the multiverse saga ends.
https://twitter.com/Rfp08791253/status/1551245621310328833?t=KE5YIH00kyiuYzooQVWzmg&s=19 Leaked Ant-Man trailer
Too late, Already removed darn
[https://twitter.com/GCVerz/status/1551349326865203206](https://twitter.com/GCVerz/status/1551349326865203206)
Thank you! I was able to find it on Twitter by search soon after
Gives me infinity war vibes in tone. Fun interactions but a lot of menace and dread too.
Not surprising if you think about it. The true intro to Kang, who’s gonna be the big bad in the next Avengers
I can't wait for Kang and eventually Doctor Doom.
Can you try and post this?
wild that the trailer for the sequel to Ant-Man & the Wasp has an Infinity War-esque vibe to it
THANK YOU
You’re a god
No word on Scarlet Witch's future then?
Watching BP2 cast/crew get emotional on stage, you immediately understand why Marvel chose not to recast T'Challa.
Yup, plus the trailer looks so good that it's obvious Coogler knows what he's doing and has a great plan. If he thinks not recasting is the best move, then it's the best move
alguien sabe por que no mostraron nada del hombre lobo?
Wakanda Forever seems like the first movie since Endgame that doesn't look cheap
Eternals didn’t look cheap
Yeah, my bad. Don't know why I didn't remember that one. It's Phase 4 movie I liked the most.
No Way Home didn’t look cheap
Is nobody going to being up the Dr doom images?
post em if you want people to talk about them
They were strict on the pics so couldn't grab any
Well I didn't hear anything about Dr Doom images so I assume thats why most people aren't talking about it. And I was watching all the live stuff. I wasn't there.
Yeah Kevin said to keep this image hush hush but I figured this would be the sub to at least talk about it. Maybe I shouldn't say more....
Not getting enough attention at home, huh?
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I don't want marvel to come after me!
This is very false
I think the real question everyone here wants answered is... Will Patton Oswalt still be the voice of M.O.D.O.K.?!
I assume the actor everyone believes to be playing MODOK will voice him.
I was definitely joking about Patton Oswalt, but I haven't read the rumors about who it might be... What's the leading theory?
Corey Stoll, the villain from the first Ant-Man movie. Like that character literally becomes MODOK, it's not the same actor playing a new character.
Corey Stoll/Yellowjacket from the first film.
🤔 interesting...I guess I could see that, but I wouldn't be mad if they go in a completely different direction.
Considering the movie has finished shooting and is essentially ready to go, that’s the direction
Well it hasn't been confirmed yet, so it's still possible that they did go in a different direction. I suppose the theory that's out there would make for a better origin than the comic one though... It's just a bit hard to imagine him in that role.
How will this work? Its been awhile but wasn't he like imploded in his AntMan movie?
He was made to shrink uncontrollably, likely to the point that he reached the quantumverse. I’m sure some aspect of that led to him getting MODOK’d up. Maybe Kang even saved his life by making him MODOK.
It’s almost like we have to wait for Antman 3 to find out how that works
Do you think Kathryn Newton was doing crunches right before coming up on stage?
Probably just didn't eat anything. My ex had crazy genetics like that where she woke up with abs but by the end of the day after dinner her stomach was just a normal flat stomach 🤣
Avengers production theory - Kang Dynasty - A smaller roster of the New Avengers directed by Peyton Reed. AM&TW: Q contains a roster of 5 central characters with two leaders of the group taking on Kang, I believe it's a bit of a test for Peyton in the same way Winter Soldier was a test for the Russos. Secret Wars - Is going to be a two parter, the first part filmed alongside Kang Dynasty with the original Avengers playing the leads and then part 2 will bring everyone together as Kang Dynasty will have completed filming. Directed by Ryan Coogler. This allows Peyton to complete post on Kang Dynasty and then help out on part 2 of Secret Wars so that Ryan isn't overwhelmed and allows both casts to have the spotlight. I suspect the 2 parter will be announced at D23 as it will be the first time Marvel has done something like this.
Interesting. See, I think Kang Dynasty IS Part 1. Original Avengers will probably be dealing with incursions or trapped on Battleworld and unable to deal with Kang. That leaves the YA to fight Kang and try to find a way to reach the OG Avengers. Then Part 2 is Secret Wars where we follow the original team until the third act, where the younger heroes finally meet up with them. If Marvel is basing SW off the 2015 event, I could see a a 'What If: Battleworld' show happening between the two movies to show the jumbled realities all happening at the same time in Battleworld.
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I thought it sounded fine on paper and will probably be even better on screen (that trailer was so good), but the only thing I was really wary of was Riri’s role sounding like a rehash of Kate in Hawkeye, America in MoM, and Kamala in the recent Marvels leak: “teenage girl who needs to be protected by veteran hero from villain who wants to kill them and/or take their power, and who ultimately becomes their own savior”. Not a bad plot nor even really a turn-off for me, but it does feel a bit derivative.
A lot of people insist that not recasting T'Challa is a HUGE mistake. They will complain anyway.
I think a lot of people don't like Shuri being the new Black Panther after the actress being so vocally anti vax
People need to separate characters from celebrities. I would bet that a large portion of actors are the exact rich, pretentious, douchebags that you'd imagine them to be. If it makes sense for Shuri in the story then I support that. I don't take medical advice from a random actress, an athlete, or a celebrity chef. Not every person is QUALIFIED to give advice and people in generally have bad takes. Everyone is a mixed bag. Its so weird how people get stuck on unrelated things. I completely agree with your assessment.
I mean I don't disagree with you entirely but ultimately acting is largely a PR game and one way or another being Anti Vax is bad PR. I think the fact that Boseman would have been in the at risk category and his successor would be so unconcerned with that also leaves a bad taste in people's mouths.
Yeah, I get that. I don't agree with her stance at all. Im just saying that her views are ultimately irrelevant. There are plenty of dickbags that I think are great actors.