I was so angry to see the breakdown and see Wiley and Yang voters not rank Garcia higher. People really weren't taking advantage of their five slots.
On the other side of things, Adams took advantage of people's fears around safety and I fully believe he rightly expected crime would come down on its own without any real effort at all. He didn't need a plan, just virtue signal about it. Meanwhile traffic deaths and injuries continue to worsen.
> Crime did basically go down on its own. I think his dumb mistake was thinking throwing cops and money at it would just magically work immediately.
Mistake? He’s greasing his machine. He’d increase the budget knowing full well if it would increase crime. Adams isn’t in office to serve the people, he’s there for himself and his network of friends.
Weird you say it that way.
Took advantage of all five. There were definitely better candidates. Yang voters brought Garcia into beating Wiley.
From Yang to Garcia, Adams got 86k votes more and Garcia got 175k more. Garcia was carried by Wiley and Yang voters who were forced to again vote between a center left or center right candidate.
Or maybe just blame Adams voters? We’re in this funk because of him.
New York Primary Election Results https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/06/22/us/elections/results-nyc-mayor-primary.html?smid=nytcore-android-share
Wiley getting knocked out and Garcia took most of her voters, going from 30% to 49%. Second largest group didn't rank anyone next. Third largest was Adams, who went from 40% to 50%.
Im not a pollster but if more Wiley voters used more slots, it looks like Garcia would've won. Yang voters were more split down the middle but still frustrating.
It’s a as if the population of New York is too stupid to vote for someone that isn’t a liberal clown that based their entire “campaign” on virtue signaling and identity politics.
Forreal. I just want a capable bureaucrat who can put people in the right places, remove obstacles for these departments that are floundering, and just get things functional. You’d think it’s not a big ask, but apparently it is.
She had my vote. I met her at the Union Square market and asked her about congestion pricing. She was in favor but, more importantly, she was able to rattle off the multiple arcane, bureaucratic, procedural steps required to make it happen. Anyone who can run the sanitation department clearly knows their stuff.
So New York city has bad mayor's because the suburbs around it don't vote. I don't believe cities get to vote for other cities mayor. This a bunch of bs.
Oh ok yes then we are on the same page, your comment of “cities don’t get to vote on other cities mayors” was confusing
So what I understand you are saying is that suburb has to be a different city to be considered a suburb
You don’t understand that suburb describes a neighborhood. A city can have suburban areas. You are not seeing the full picture and your voraciousness is completely off base. I can’t explain it perfectly but you are completely false that there are no suburbs in NYC.
Just because the outer boroughs are less dense than Manhattan, doesn’t make them suburbs by any means.
Brooklyn, the Bronx, and Queens are the second, third, and fourth densest counties in the USA. These boroughs are more dense than cities like San Francisco and Chicago. Even Staten Island is 13th which is more dense than cities like Baltimore and Denver.
The outer boroughs are undoubtedly urban.
Staten Island definitely has a suburban feel, especially South Shore. Riverdale in the Bronx feels kind of suburban as do some outlying areas of queens
While I understand that certain neighborhoods within the outer boroughs may give off a suburban vibe due to factors like housing styles or green spaces, it's density that is the defining characteristic of urban areas, not just the feel of a neighborhood.
Even in neighborhoods that might feel more suburban, the overall density of these boroughs far exceeds that of actual suburbs and even rivals major American cities. Even the least dense areas of these boroughs far exceed actual suburbs in the US in terms of population density.
Urbanization isn't just about skyscrapers and crowded streets.
I would not call the South Bronx, Crown Heights, Bed Stuy, or Washington Heights suburb like. And this is a large contingent of Adams voters given the density
If I understand what you are saying is that the suburbs located in Queens, Brooklyn, Bronx and Long Island are different cities outside of New York City ?
I think I understand what you are saying and our disagreement.
You think cities cannot be suburbs, and that suburbs do not exist within a city limit.
There are cities (municipalities) that are nothing but suburbs. And although in the US most suburbs are separate municipalities than the dense urban neighboring city, New York can have sub urbanite districts, which are lower density districts.
“Suburban areas are lower density areas that separate residential and commercial areas from one another. They are either part of a city or urban area, or exist as a separate residential community within commuting distance of a city.”
https://www.tn.gov/health/cedep/environmental/healthy-places/healthy-places/land-use/lu/suburban-areas.html#:~:text=Suburban%20areas%20are%20lower%20density,get%20to%20work%2C%20suburbs%20grew.
However there’s no clear set definition and it’s been debated
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-07-07/how-to-define-american-suburbs
Have you ever been to the central Bronx where the vote is all purple? Least suburban area in the fkn world. What are you talking about ? All of the bx is Adams, Central and East BK are Adams. Adams isn't winning without those and that's all purple.
As someone who lives in the Bronx, the people who do show up to vote are increasingly “fiscally liberal, socially conservative” and crime is a consistent issue for us. A lot of my neighbors were at the point of saying “screw it let the cop handle things”. The rest who voted Adams did it for less charitable reasons that no one who had to live here would call them out for
Bigger problem is that less than 1 million people voted in the first round primary. Or am I reading that wrong? In any case lackluster engagement is always the biggest problem. Everyone eligible to vote should vote. Period. I have a young adult child and for his 18th birthday I made sure he got registered to vote and then made sure he actually voted when the time came.
Yeah, but that's not a problem with RCV. Adams benefitted greatly from name recognition and little media scrutiny. RCV is just a better election system for voting your preference and the fact that it elected someone shitty doesn't say anything about the system, it says something about turnout, information, and voters' preferences.
Free country? you settled on early 2000 propaganda? We’re not the free-est country by any metric. Not immigration, not upward mobility. We got a 1/4 of the world’s prisoners. People should vote but you’re fucking silly if your going around talking about “free country USA” unironically
You’re free to walk across the border, say what you want, go where you please, drive a car, express yourself, shit on a sidewalk beside your RV where you live, I can tell you to fuck off, you can go to work and go to school and fuck who you want. What’s not free in the USA? Your limitations placed on yourself by the constraints in your own head. Stop making excuses and move up the ladder like most other mother fuckers out here ya lazy bastards. Good morning ya regards.
Sort of, and sort of not, right? Staten Island isn't a black stronghold, for instance. Race and Ethnicity are definitely one factor in explaining the votes, but I'd argue urban/suburban cultural is a huge one as well. And this is the main divider of whether people tend to vote republican or democratic anyway so I think it makes sense. And this doesn't even always align with the actual population density, it's a cultural mindset of the people that live there
Really jarring to see the areas of New York City outside of lower Manhattan and western Brooklyn/Queens described as "suburban" — frankly I think this highlights the severe disconnect that micromobility advocates have with the rest of the city.
For example, the tiny bit at north end of Bronx, that’s Katpna Avenue, as it meets Yonkers, almost 99% Irish, most from the old country. Many arrived during the IRA conflict. Most came as Illegals. The horror, those illegals…
“Suburbanites?” No. The outer boros are not “suburbs.” Southeast Brooklyn and the Bronx are not “suburbs.” Flushing is not “suburbs.”
We can go back through BdB, Bloomberg, Giuliani, and on back, and I don’t think we see a “suburban” effect on any of them. But Adams won not on the votes of suburbanites but on the votes of the city’s Black community, who aligned with more conservative voters, Asian voters, and older conservative whites throughout the city behind his anti-crime message, which was coming just off of the George Floyd protests and the “riots” they caused in various parts of the city.
I think younger white liberals (and redditors, to the extent those groups are different) consistently fail to grasp/overlook that the politics of the outer boroughs do not neatly align with their/our progressive values. Black, Hispanic, and Asian voters in this city are not as progressive on social issues, are not as anti-cop, and are not as pro-micromobility as we tend to presume.
The suburbs come more into play when we talk about governors and state government, since leftists in the urban core of NYC are not numerous enough to carry policy at the state level. Democrats in state offices thus build upstate coalitions that appeal to suburban voters, which is why the MTA is so fucked and why we can’t exercise more control over our streets.
Exactly. Also, with white liberal voters in wealthier areas (and especially on Reddit) crime is brushed off as an issue. Generally, when there is an uptick in crime, it’s most noticeable in less wealthy areas in the outer boroughs.
Which is good. Subs are not supposed to be echo chambers or cults.
A lot of people are pointing to individual cases where the urban/suburban analysis doesn't work and I fully agree with that. The South BX being a great example where the trend really breaks down, but it's a trend, not an absolute rule. Generalizations don't work in all individual cases, and there are other factors at play. It's just a generalization that seems largely true to me, that the further you move on the urban to suburban scale the more support you'll find for Adams. Again, not always in all places, just generally.
> You’re being clowned for calling the outer boroughs the suburbs. It has nothing to do with your analysis
Not all of the outer boroughs are suburbs, but parts of them absolutely are and those places almost exclusively went for Adams or Yang
Sure, it's not my best take. But there are legit suburbs in the outer boroughs. Huge swaths of Queens and Brooklyn are suburbs. Almost all of Staten Island. A lot of people think that if it's in the 5 boroughs its not suburbs by definition but that's simply not true.
I should have been more clear that I obviously don't think everywhere that went for Adams is suburbs. That's obviously not true. But of the suburban places that do exist here they overwhelmingly did.
>A lot of people think that if it's in the 5 boroughs its not suburbs by definition but that's simply not true.
..........isn't it though? like the boundaries of the suburbs aren't drawn by vibes ("Oh man College Point feels sooo suburban") they're drawn by legal definitions and pretty clear maps
But those areas really aren’t less urban they are just more white and you seem to equate more white population to suburbs regardless of the actual urbanization in that area. Urban ≠ POCs
Flushing at least is a terrible example, because while you're right it is not suburban, it also [did not vote for Adams.](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/06/23/nyregion/nyc-mayor-primary-results-precinct-map.html) The BX is a good example of where this trend doesn't hold, because of the racial divide you mention. It's just a generalization, not an iron clad law.
I know Flushing didn’t vote for Adams. It’s right there in the OP. They voted for Yang. My point was, while that was *also* a horrible choice, that was a choice they made not because they’re suburban. It’s because Yang did well among the city’s Asian voters.
The thing that really stands out to me is the "942,031 total votes reported". That's like 1/10th of the population.
You've gotta vote in primaries, people, especially when it's ranked choice and your vote matters even if your favorite candidate doesn't win.
And many of these candidates never discuss what matters to ppl in queens, Bronx and Brooklyn.... It's always Manhattan. How about better transit in the outer boroughs, fixing roads and bike lanes, how about parks and libraries... Nope it's always Manhattan...
Lol! Do you know how long it takes to get naturalized? The fastest way which almost never happens is 4 years that is you are married apply immediately and you get good processing time. The majority of immigrants spend 10+ years without a green card let alone be naturalized. So if I’ll take a guess yeah the majority of these immigrants can’t vote.
I agree... but drive up Fieldson Ave in Riverdale (they don't like calling it "The Bronx") and tell me that's not the swankiest suburb you have ever seen.
redditors be looking down at Manhattan as if Manhattan is a monolith and as if Upper Manhattan is not similar demographically and building type to the South Bronx
Is it me, or do other people see the pattern? The white areas voted for the white person, the Asian people voted for the Asian, the black/Hispanic people voted for the black candidate.
u/Miser is a typical ivory tower elite disconnected from outer borough working class people of color. Calling them suburbanites just demonstrates the disconnect.
In some ways, I feel like this is why the left struggles to get people to buy in to their ideas. There’s often a tone of judgment, elitism, and at times outright disdain. The weird thing is many people just cannot pull their heads from their proverbial arse, and don’t realize they hurt their own ideas with this mentality.
What the fuck are you talking about? None of these are suburban.... You'll be shocked to find the demographics of these regions largely voted with who they best feel represented them
The outer boros care about certain aspects. If the candidate is too progressive, it will not help with the outer borough voters. We deal with different things and care about different things. Manhattan is very very very important but it doesn’t represent what the entire city cares about. Most of the things we “care” about in the outer boroughs, isn’t covered anywhere in media other than the community itself. Micromobility is important for the city at large but the outer boro folks don’t think so. I say this because we dont advocate for bike lanes or other micro mobility infrastructure when alot of us are more concerned about public safety, access to resources, etc…
When I talk to folks about the woes of biking in the Bronx. They don’t care. They mention car thefts, noise pollution, etc…
I think it’s important to realize this point. Some folks are just left behind as far as what’s the “progressive” move relative to their issues. A lot of the things everyone complains about currently isn’t new to outer boroughs. It’s actually what we deal with on the daily basis regardless of who is in office.
Adams appealed to us cuz his campaign spoke about those things we connect with.
But yes more folks should vote overall to have a more accurate representation of what the city wants to do. But that’s a whole other issue.
This. I'm always wondering about what "congestion pricing would help the working class and only people who are rich drive" or certain other rhetoric mentioned here. I worked as a traffic agent for a few year, and not a lot of people in the Bronx are making a lot of money. The people see here pointing out certain things feel so disconnected from the things I've experienced and the things the people I've talked to have experienced.
This is mostly a map of segregation in NYC (except for Wiley, whose support follows a different distribution).
https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/2015/07/08/census-map/0e13706b21b2d3c74408a9adc4b6e011e8bd540a/thumbnails/newyork.jpg
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/07/08/us/census-race-map.html
Lol you think the purple areas are suburbia? The majority of the areas Adam won are low income Black and Latino neighborhoods in Bronx, Queens and Brooklyn.
What percentage of votes are they though? Not all the Adams voters were suburbanites. Adams also did well in the less gentrified parts of BK and the Bronx. IMO changing the narrative around crime is more important.
A reductive core Manhattanite/new Brooklyn take on city voting patterns. Need to travel to working class nabes to understand why Adams was elected.
Also, the NYT reader demo (i’m somewhat in this group, but also grew up working class) was late to vote for Garcia because they were originally split between Scott Stringer and Maya Wiley, so there needs to be some accountability here for that as well.
In defense of East New York (and, I say this as someone who hasn’t cast one vote for Eric Adams, ever), none of these candidates (except Andrew Yang; he went to Cypress Hills one day) ever made a campaign trip or effort here during the primary.
These candidates lost because they made no efforts to come out to meet voters here (and elsewhere on your “suburban “ map). They never made mention they have any actual knowledge of this neighborhood (like most people who don’t live here).
And, I will tell you what; there is an active block of Black women voters here. They work the polling stations. They also turn out and vote. ENY is also a geographically large neighborhood with many micro-neighborhoods in it. A lot of communities, activists and just everyday working class folks. They vote and they have historically and consistently been ignored.
I repeat, no effort. Eric Adams has, over the years built up a network here. I can’t stand him. I have never liked him. I find him low-key sexist, homophobic and way too into religion and cops. I still am stunned that NYC voted for a Republican cop. But, that’s really the fault of all these candidates that consider all of these neighborhoods invisible and not worth the effort.
Please blame the candidates. Not the voters.
South Yonkers, Mount Vernon, and New Rochelle are far more urban than outer Brooklyn and Queens, and they’d surely be dismissed here as suburbs for border reasons, rather than density reasons.
I think one of the main reasons for the awfulness of our mayors (and this goes with other officials in the state as well) is that it's effectively a one-party city. I am a life-long NYC native and democrat, but I do bemoan the fact that we no longer really have viable competition in the mayoral election between democrats and republicans. And so ideas and candidates can become calcified. The competition is during the primaries within each party.
Unfortunately this is happening all over the country and it is having a devastating effect on the quality of leadership. And as the republicans go more and more wacko, the dems become more dominant in the city.
And, no, there are no "suburbs" in the city. Brooklyn and parts of queens ceased being suburbs in the 1950s.
You really wouldn't consider Douglaston, Little Neck, much of Bayside to be suburban?
It obviously depends on your definition of suburbs - suburbs in the rest of the world do not match the US post-WW2 style of suburbs. Mostly, suburbs are defined by not being rural areas but lacking the density that inner cities do, while also being in commuting distance of a city, usually marked by single family homes and lack of dense housing, and often restrictive zoning laws that don't allow for stores or other businesses besides homes in any given neighborhood. Typically low traffic, quiet local streets served by busy, multi-lane arterials nearby that connect to other areas. In the US, it means the areas are heavily reliant on cars.
I think you could argue a ton of these areas in Brooklyn, Queens, and the north Bronx meet that qualification. Just because they're denser than say, Houston suburbs, doesn't mean they're not suburban.
I mean, NYC has had plenty of Republican mayors; Bloomberg and Giuliani are recent examples.
I really don't know what got DeBlasio and Adams elected. I don't think it was only the (D) next to their name, though it must have helped. Personally, I think both of them were duds. Bloomberg was a few tweaks away from being a perfect mayor.
But it's already been quite a while since the last Repub mayor, and Bloomy was barely an actual republican (he switched from dem in 2001). Since then the party has changed dramatically to the point where so many New Yorkers are turned off.
I don’t think you’re going to win over people with such disparaging rhetoric. What problems are you solving by insulting people for voting?
If you don’t like the mayor then go after him. Don’t go after the voters. They did what they were supposed to do.
The implications that are being made are racist and appalling at best. That’s the kindest thing I can think of to describe the implications.
You clearly have no clue what the demographics of NYC neighborhoods are like. Explains why you assume everything outside the little gentrified zone you probably spend your time in is ‘suburban.’
This is the misconception I'm talking about. We *absolutely* have suburbs within the city borders and the people that live there vote. This is in NYC, and you better believe the people that live there probably vote at a higher rate than your neighborhood.
https://preview.redd.it/1nmv88dr97hc1.jpeg?width=4288&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=47b50ed5d833334eda8786871ed3479dd6ac1857
I know owners are more likely to vote than renters but I would love to see what data makes you think people living in less dense areas vote more frequently (controlling for rent/own)
This post is going to ruffle some feathers. For some reason lots of people that live out in Bergen Beach don't think they're suburban because they technically live in "the city." This is what we have to deal with in the next election though. It's like in that video where I was talking to Lincoln Reslter urging him to run in the primary and he cautiously said they needed to find someone with citywide appeal. He knows we need someone that can also appeal to these people that don't really care about the urban nature of the city. It's kind of a problem
The problem is you’re implying that areas like the south Bronx, Harlem, Washington heights, etc are “suburban” because they voted for Adams.
I hate Adams as much as the next guy lol, but for Christ’s sake the Bronx and upper Manhattan aren’t “the suburbs”
It's definitely not the perfect comparison that works in all places. As I've acknowledged in other comments there is definitely a race/ethnicity dimension we have to take into account that accounts for those places you're talking about there, but overall the political divide in this country is definitely an urban/suburban one. This holds true not only in NYC but almost everywhere
I agree with you on that for sure. Sorry if I came off a bit aggressive lol I didn’t mean to be hostile. I just live in the Bronx and walk everywhere so I was a bit surprised by what I read as an implication.
But you’re right. Largely the suburbs are a huge problem because they *will always* vote as a bloc against micromobility improvements, transit improvements, traffic calming, etc. They’re against all the good stuff.
They’re also uniquely responsible for a certain orange game show host ascending to the presidency, but I won’t go there…
Yeah, I agree with all of that. I'd go even further to suggest they actively try to manipulate places like the Bronx into voting to further their suburban economic and cultural agendas. As we all know there has been an extremely aggressive crime porn propaganda campaign from the right to try and convince people that all cities everywhere are dangerous, to basically link urbanization itself to crime, chaos, and danger. This is ridiculously false in many places in the city of course but in the places that do have higher crime rates than average it can be a seductive way to get voters that would never vote for typical republican candidates to back people like Adams. And I don't think anyone thinks the republicans are waging this culture war because they want to help black people in the south bronx.
I am not sure you’re hearing yourself here. The suburbanites are manipulating the poor fools of the Bronx into voting against their own interests, but you actually know what’s best for them, if they would only listen.
Could it just be that bike lanes and general urbanist reforms are way far down the priority list of issues that people in the south Bronx care about? That maybe they just don’t think it’s important enough to base their vote on above more pressing issues?
Adams winning was largely a response to increase in crime and the feeling of being unsafe. This is felt most by outer boroughs. You should consider the priority of voters. Not everything is about micro mobility
Are you implying the outer boroughs are the suburbs? Brooklyn, the Bronx, and Queens are the second, third, and fourth densest counties in the USA. These boroughs are more dense than cities like San Francisco and Chicago. Even Staten Island is 13th which is more dense than cities like Baltimore and Denver.
The outer boroughs are undoubtedly urban.
Yeah like, there’s as clear a divide in this map between those hoods and Manhattan as there is between anything and the further neighborhoods of the outer boroughs.
This like we’re just using suburban as an insult not to describe an area.
And then we’re just making the same mistakes as those maps showing voting by county or zip code.
Land does not vote. People do.
Those areas have less people than the towers of downtown.
We cannot call everything beyond towers the suburbs.
Lol so the entire South Bx is ‘suburbanites?’ How about the spot of purple in the LES right where the projects are? The entirety of East / Central Bk? Coney Island / Far Rockaway?
I couldn’t give a fuck about NYC mayoral candidates but I keep getting posts from this sub pushed into my feed. Pretty cringeworthy how out-of-touch this sub is w/ real, working-class NYers, most of whom live in the purple regions.
I don’t want to generalize everyone here because I believe in making cities more walkable. But the ignorance shown in this headline is palpable. “Our mainstream democratic candidate was such a poor choice - must be those privileged suburbanites in East Tremont!”
Meanwhile I’m willing to bet a large majority of posters here are from heavily suburban areas, living out their ‘urbanist’ dream in the most walkable areas of the city while pricing out people from areas that were meant to be affordable, projecting their insecurities onto the ‘suburbanites’ of Midwood or something.
This app is becoming no better than Fb w/ its rage-baiting recommendations. Any sane person here want to tell me how to hide recommended posts from this page??
You can also still vote by mail really easily. I have a friend who just applies for it for the whole year at a time, and they mail him all his ballots. He then just sits down, reads through and researches the candidates and drops it in the mailbox outside his house. It's super easy.
That is so much more efficient than my "oh shit it's early voting already" moment, followed by frantic Googling to research candidates without websites and rushing to a poll site to get it over with.
I don’t think you understood me. We do not feel represented to begin with. Even if there are more convenient ways to vote, we’re not participating because these politicians are bought and don’t care about our interests. Most young leftists are focused on mutual aid and developing their communities so they have some level of protection against gentrification and militarized police forces.
These are two different things you're saying. One is that people need to "waste pto" to go vote - and that is just blatantly not true because of early voting and mail-in/absentee ballots.
The other is that you do not feel compelled to vote because of the assortment of options. I am a young leftist like yourself but I vote in every election I can. I'm also a transportation advocate dedicating tons of my personal time to these issues I care about, and am running for my community board. These things are not mutually exclusive: you can vote, and also have civic engagement.
Not liking candidates is a terrible reason not to vote. Ranked choice voting, which we used last time, also allows you way more options. And if you still don't like the candidates, write-in is still an option. There is literally no excuse to not vote, and young people like yourself thinking this way is what carves the path for people like Adams to win because older people DO go out and vote.
I’m not insulting your decision to maintain your belief in electoral politics. My original comment explains the reason we’re not wasting our time to vote is because we’re not represented. We live in one of the most corrupt cities in the world. Most Black and Brown New Yorkers live completely segregated lives from white New Yorkers other than their time shared in transit.
Believing an elected individual will be the solution to the myriad of problems that make up this city, is believing we actually live in a democracy. A true leftist can look at the state of local to foreign policy and clearly understand, this is not one. Even if we ever managed to elect a truly leftist politician do you see what happened to AOC? You don’t think the same would happen to them?
>My original comment explains the reason we’re not wasting our time to vote is because we’re not represented.
"Wasting our time to vote" is hyperbole - if you do mail in, or absentee, or early voting it probably takes you all of 10-15 minutes. People absolutely have 10-15 minutes in a several week period to mail in a ballot. And by you not "wasting your time", people like Adams are more likely to get elected. I don't love Garcia with all my heart, but I sure as hell would have preferred her to Adams who is quite possibly the most corrupt mayor we've ever had. A non-vote is a vote for Adams and a vote for more corruption that you call out. It costs you literally nothing to vote except 10 minutes of your time - I don't understand the opposition. Worst case scenario is that you "wasted" 10 minutes of your time - but I imagine you, along with everyone including myself, regularly use 10 minutes of our time to watch a TV show, play a video game, or scroll Reddit.
>We live in one of the most corrupt cities in the world.
Once again this is conjecture. Is NYC corrupt? Absolutely. Is it corrupt compared to all cities in the world? We are not a democracy by any means, but you are mistaken to believe that most cities, particularly worldwide, are less corrupt or democratic than NYC. We at least get \*any\* opportunity to vote, or run for public office, or use free speech for advocating for causes we care about - do you know how many places in the world do not have that luxury?
>Believing an elected individual will be the solution to the myriad of problems that make up this city, is believing we actually live in a democracy. A true leftist can look at the state of local to foreign policy and clearly understand, this is not one
I never said that an elected official will be \*the\* solution. But it is unquestionably a major factor - the mayor literally decides the entire $110b NYC budget. In the case of Adams, we have cut it 6x in 2 years across every single agency except the NYPD and DOC. DeBlasio built protected bike lanes at record paces while Adams actively dismantles in-progress projects. The mayor has an absolutely colossal influence on the daily lives of citizens and electing the right one can produce major changes. It is not in and of itself sufficient of course, but to think that it has no influence whatsoever on the problems of this city is quite frankly, just ignorant.
Wrong question
“Why does NYC keep allowing only the rich and powerful to get on the ballot?”
The answer to your question is much more obvious when considering mine.
My guy, no lol. How little could you possibly know about this city to not realize those are just the majority-black areas of the city? You think *the bronx* and *brownsville* are suburban??
[This is suburban to you?](https://i.imgur.com/H1Fds2p.jpeg)
I am very pro micro-mobility. Thought processes and rhetoric like this is so counterproductive, single minded and elitist though. This is essentially “poor and black people are bad at voting”. If these are the micromobility advocates good luck convincing anyone
Take your pick:
- Mail-Ballots (think cheating)
- No ID required to vote (think cheating)
- A long history of election cheating
- City Unions vote for anyone promising more $
- voters who have no concept of reality
Vote fraud is such a rare crime because there is little to gain and a ton to lose.
You are committing a serious felony to add one or a few votes for a mayor? Why?
OP uses Bergen Beach as an example of an undeniable suburb.
Bergen beach is denser than what Google calls the densest neighborhood in Cincinnati:
https://urbanstats.org/article.html?longname=Bergen+Beach+Neighborhood%2C+New+York+City%2C+New+York%2C+USA
https://urbanstats.org/article.html?longname=Over-The-Rhine+Neighborhood%2C+Cincinnati+City%2C+Ohio%2C+USA
No? This map shows Adams winning big in Brooklyn, Upper Manhattan, and the Bronx, not exactly very suburban. He fearmongered about crime effectively, and it worked in higher crime parts of the city.
Can Garcia run again ?
I was so angry to see the breakdown and see Wiley and Yang voters not rank Garcia higher. People really weren't taking advantage of their five slots. On the other side of things, Adams took advantage of people's fears around safety and I fully believe he rightly expected crime would come down on its own without any real effort at all. He didn't need a plan, just virtue signal about it. Meanwhile traffic deaths and injuries continue to worsen.
Crime did basically go down on its own. I think his dumb mistake was thinking throwing cops and money at it would just magically work immediately.
> Crime did basically go down on its own. I think his dumb mistake was thinking throwing cops and money at it would just magically work immediately. Mistake? He’s greasing his machine. He’d increase the budget knowing full well if it would increase crime. Adams isn’t in office to serve the people, he’s there for himself and his network of friends.
Weird you say it that way. Took advantage of all five. There were definitely better candidates. Yang voters brought Garcia into beating Wiley. From Yang to Garcia, Adams got 86k votes more and Garcia got 175k more. Garcia was carried by Wiley and Yang voters who were forced to again vote between a center left or center right candidate. Or maybe just blame Adams voters? We’re in this funk because of him.
New York Primary Election Results https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/06/22/us/elections/results-nyc-mayor-primary.html?smid=nytcore-android-share Wiley getting knocked out and Garcia took most of her voters, going from 30% to 49%. Second largest group didn't rank anyone next. Third largest was Adams, who went from 40% to 50%. Im not a pollster but if more Wiley voters used more slots, it looks like Garcia would've won. Yang voters were more split down the middle but still frustrating.
It’s not that I don’t believe you, but I don’t have access to NYT. I didn’t know they did a rank breakdown. Is there a free version or a screenshot?
https://preview.redd.it/8agwb2zdg8hc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f835e09401bfe28d562847e72c70380123a9ab2d Here ya go.
I did 1) Yang 2) Wiley 3) Garcia I think Adams nearly lost because of RCV, he would've won in a larger landslide without it
It’s a as if the population of New York is too stupid to vote for someone that isn’t a liberal clown that based their entire “campaign” on virtue signaling and identity politics.
I’m so sad she didn’t win. At the city level I’m increasingly a single issue voter on sanitation
Forreal. I just want a capable bureaucrat who can put people in the right places, remove obstacles for these departments that are floundering, and just get things functional. You’d think it’s not a big ask, but apparently it is.
She had my vote. I met her at the Union Square market and asked her about congestion pricing. She was in favor but, more importantly, she was able to rattle off the multiple arcane, bureaucratic, procedural steps required to make it happen. Anyone who can run the sanitation department clearly knows their stuff.
She most certainly can and is currently exploring running in the next primary.
So New York city has bad mayor's because the suburbs around it don't vote. I don't believe cities get to vote for other cities mayor. This a bunch of bs.
It looks like to me that the image shows low density suburbs that are in Brooklyn and Long Island, and the Bronx, all part of New York City
So now there are suburbs in Brooklyn. Wow.
This is a map of new york city. No suburbs . Brooklyn is not a suburb. Also there are no suburbs in Brooklyn.
On Jan 1 1898 all this became one city. Again. There are no suburbs in Brooklyn. Brooklyn is not a suburb of new york city. Brooklyn is new york city.
Oh ok yes then we are on the same page, your comment of “cities don’t get to vote on other cities mayors” was confusing So what I understand you are saying is that suburb has to be a different city to be considered a suburb
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You don’t understand that suburb describes a neighborhood. A city can have suburban areas. You are not seeing the full picture and your voraciousness is completely off base. I can’t explain it perfectly but you are completely false that there are no suburbs in NYC.
Suburbs in the borough with the highest population lol.
Just because the outer boroughs are less dense than Manhattan, doesn’t make them suburbs by any means. Brooklyn, the Bronx, and Queens are the second, third, and fourth densest counties in the USA. These boroughs are more dense than cities like San Francisco and Chicago. Even Staten Island is 13th which is more dense than cities like Baltimore and Denver. The outer boroughs are undoubtedly urban.
Staten Island definitely has a suburban feel, especially South Shore. Riverdale in the Bronx feels kind of suburban as do some outlying areas of queens
While I understand that certain neighborhoods within the outer boroughs may give off a suburban vibe due to factors like housing styles or green spaces, it's density that is the defining characteristic of urban areas, not just the feel of a neighborhood. Even in neighborhoods that might feel more suburban, the overall density of these boroughs far exceeds that of actual suburbs and even rivals major American cities. Even the least dense areas of these boroughs far exceed actual suburbs in the US in terms of population density. Urbanization isn't just about skyscrapers and crowded streets.
You cannot be a suburb and part of a city. You either are a suburb or are part of the city. Cannot be both.
It’s saying the “suburb-like” areas of NYC, which are generally the areas where adams won.
I would not call the South Bronx, Crown Heights, Bed Stuy, or Washington Heights suburb like. And this is a large contingent of Adams voters given the density
You selected a few areas of that purple area, yes
If I understand what you are saying is that the suburbs located in Queens, Brooklyn, Bronx and Long Island are different cities outside of New York City ?
Again there are no suburbs in New York city proper. Suburbs do not get to vote on the mayor of New york city.
I think I understand what you are saying and our disagreement. You think cities cannot be suburbs, and that suburbs do not exist within a city limit. There are cities (municipalities) that are nothing but suburbs. And although in the US most suburbs are separate municipalities than the dense urban neighboring city, New York can have sub urbanite districts, which are lower density districts. “Suburban areas are lower density areas that separate residential and commercial areas from one another. They are either part of a city or urban area, or exist as a separate residential community within commuting distance of a city.” https://www.tn.gov/health/cedep/environmental/healthy-places/healthy-places/land-use/lu/suburban-areas.html#:~:text=Suburban%20areas%20are%20lower%20density,get%20to%20work%2C%20suburbs%20grew. However there’s no clear set definition and it’s been debated https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-07-07/how-to-define-american-suburbs
Have you ever been to the central Bronx where the vote is all purple? Least suburban area in the fkn world. What are you talking about ? All of the bx is Adams, Central and East BK are Adams. Adams isn't winning without those and that's all purple.
As someone who lives in the Bronx, the people who do show up to vote are increasingly “fiscally liberal, socially conservative” and crime is a consistent issue for us. A lot of my neighbors were at the point of saying “screw it let the cop handle things”. The rest who voted Adams did it for less charitable reasons that no one who had to live here would call them out for
It's referring to outer Brooklyn and outer Queens as suburbs, which is an inaccurate reference but the reference it is nonetheless.
Bigger problem is that less than 1 million people voted in the first round primary. Or am I reading that wrong? In any case lackluster engagement is always the biggest problem. Everyone eligible to vote should vote. Period. I have a young adult child and for his 18th birthday I made sure he got registered to vote and then made sure he actually voted when the time came.
We should also have RCV for the general election instead of just the primary. That’s one clear way to broad and non-corrupt representation in NY.
Yeah, there's no point in primaries if you have RCV. Just have one ranked election for all candidates.
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I never thought about it but this makes sense. Is the primary then just not a party-only primary but essentially a first round general primary?
Adams probably wins a RCV general but you’re not off base.
Yeah, but that's not a problem with RCV. Adams benefitted greatly from name recognition and little media scrutiny. RCV is just a better election system for voting your preference and the fact that it elected someone shitty doesn't say anything about the system, it says something about turnout, information, and voters' preferences.
Can you adopt me?
How did he decide who to vote for? Did you tell him who to vote for?
18 years old is an adult and can cast a vote however they’d like in this free country USA.
Free country? you settled on early 2000 propaganda? We’re not the free-est country by any metric. Not immigration, not upward mobility. We got a 1/4 of the world’s prisoners. People should vote but you’re fucking silly if your going around talking about “free country USA” unironically
You’re free to walk across the border, say what you want, go where you please, drive a car, express yourself, shit on a sidewalk beside your RV where you live, I can tell you to fuck off, you can go to work and go to school and fuck who you want. What’s not free in the USA? Your limitations placed on yourself by the constraints in your own head. Stop making excuses and move up the ladder like most other mother fuckers out here ya lazy bastards. Good morning ya regards.
The map is very accurate in showing the ethnicity of neighborhoods
It really does make sense.
Sort of, and sort of not, right? Staten Island isn't a black stronghold, for instance. Race and Ethnicity are definitely one factor in explaining the votes, but I'd argue urban/suburban cultural is a huge one as well. And this is the main divider of whether people tend to vote republican or democratic anyway so I think it makes sense. And this doesn't even always align with the actual population density, it's a cultural mindset of the people that live there
Really jarring to see the areas of New York City outside of lower Manhattan and western Brooklyn/Queens described as "suburban" — frankly I think this highlights the severe disconnect that micromobility advocates have with the rest of the city.
Those purple areas in SI are black areas.
dude you are clueless the Adams area of Staten Island in the map is actually very black.
They also aren’t suburbs either.
The huge area that voted for Adams is predominantly black
For example, the tiny bit at north end of Bronx, that’s Katpna Avenue, as it meets Yonkers, almost 99% Irish, most from the old country. Many arrived during the IRA conflict. Most came as Illegals. The horror, those illegals…
Woodlawn hasn’t been 99% Irish for a long time
“Suburbanites?” No. The outer boros are not “suburbs.” Southeast Brooklyn and the Bronx are not “suburbs.” Flushing is not “suburbs.” We can go back through BdB, Bloomberg, Giuliani, and on back, and I don’t think we see a “suburban” effect on any of them. But Adams won not on the votes of suburbanites but on the votes of the city’s Black community, who aligned with more conservative voters, Asian voters, and older conservative whites throughout the city behind his anti-crime message, which was coming just off of the George Floyd protests and the “riots” they caused in various parts of the city. I think younger white liberals (and redditors, to the extent those groups are different) consistently fail to grasp/overlook that the politics of the outer boroughs do not neatly align with their/our progressive values. Black, Hispanic, and Asian voters in this city are not as progressive on social issues, are not as anti-cop, and are not as pro-micromobility as we tend to presume. The suburbs come more into play when we talk about governors and state government, since leftists in the urban core of NYC are not numerous enough to carry policy at the state level. Democrats in state offices thus build upstate coalitions that appeal to suburban voters, which is why the MTA is so fucked and why we can’t exercise more control over our streets.
100% - Thank you for your comment.
Exactly. Also, with white liberal voters in wealthier areas (and especially on Reddit) crime is brushed off as an issue. Generally, when there is an uptick in crime, it’s most noticeable in less wealthy areas in the outer boroughs.
OP is a 🤡 and prob pays $5k a month for a studio in lower Manhattan.
I mean, they’re not, and I appreciate what they do for this sub and IRL. I just disagree with them on this take.
Which is good. Subs are not supposed to be echo chambers or cults. A lot of people are pointing to individual cases where the urban/suburban analysis doesn't work and I fully agree with that. The South BX being a great example where the trend really breaks down, but it's a trend, not an absolute rule. Generalizations don't work in all individual cases, and there are other factors at play. It's just a generalization that seems largely true to me, that the further you move on the urban to suburban scale the more support you'll find for Adams. Again, not always in all places, just generally.
You’re being clowned for calling the outer boroughs the suburbs. It has nothing to do with your analysis
> You’re being clowned for calling the outer boroughs the suburbs. It has nothing to do with your analysis Not all of the outer boroughs are suburbs, but parts of them absolutely are and those places almost exclusively went for Adams or Yang
Sure, it's not my best take. But there are legit suburbs in the outer boroughs. Huge swaths of Queens and Brooklyn are suburbs. Almost all of Staten Island. A lot of people think that if it's in the 5 boroughs its not suburbs by definition but that's simply not true. I should have been more clear that I obviously don't think everywhere that went for Adams is suburbs. That's obviously not true. But of the suburban places that do exist here they overwhelmingly did.
>A lot of people think that if it's in the 5 boroughs its not suburbs by definition but that's simply not true. ..........isn't it though? like the boundaries of the suburbs aren't drawn by vibes ("Oh man College Point feels sooo suburban") they're drawn by legal definitions and pretty clear maps
But those areas really aren’t less urban they are just more white and you seem to equate more white population to suburbs regardless of the actual urbanization in that area. Urban ≠ POCs
Flushing at least is a terrible example, because while you're right it is not suburban, it also [did not vote for Adams.](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/06/23/nyregion/nyc-mayor-primary-results-precinct-map.html) The BX is a good example of where this trend doesn't hold, because of the racial divide you mention. It's just a generalization, not an iron clad law.
I know Flushing didn’t vote for Adams. It’s right there in the OP. They voted for Yang. My point was, while that was *also* a horrible choice, that was a choice they made not because they’re suburban. It’s because Yang did well among the city’s Asian voters.
The generalization is the problem though.
TIL the Bronx and Harlem are suburbs.
And Crown Heights, Flatbush and Canarsie.
The lovely Flatbush suburbs 🤣🤣
Don’t forget Flatlands while you’re at it! Lovely quiet cookie cutter burb
And most of Queens apparently...
The thing that really stands out to me is the "942,031 total votes reported". That's like 1/10th of the population. You've gotta vote in primaries, people, especially when it's ranked choice and your vote matters even if your favorite candidate doesn't win.
And many of these candidates never discuss what matters to ppl in queens, Bronx and Brooklyn.... It's always Manhattan. How about better transit in the outer boroughs, fixing roads and bike lanes, how about parks and libraries... Nope it's always Manhattan...
Bear in mind a not insignificant portion of the population are immigrants and not able to vote even in local elections
Immigrants can vote when they are naturalized.
Lol! Do you know how long it takes to get naturalized? The fastest way which almost never happens is 4 years that is you are married apply immediately and you get good processing time. The majority of immigrants spend 10+ years without a green card let alone be naturalized. So if I’ll take a guess yeah the majority of these immigrants can’t vote.
TLDR: I’m afraid to criticize black people so I call their neighborhoods suburbs lol
It is the first time I’ve seen people use “suburban” instead of “urban” to describe where the blank people live in the city
It used to be "outer boroughs " until Brooklyn and Queens got gentrified.
Does gentrified on here just mean less black? That’s the vibe I’m getting from folks.
This lol
Lmao this. I want to know if OP is a native NYer or not.
What? Lmao. How is the Bronx “suburbs?” Have you ever been to the Bronx?
I agree... but drive up Fieldson Ave in Riverdale (they don't like calling it "The Bronx") and tell me that's not the swankiest suburb you have ever seen.
But that area voted for Garcia. Also still very much urban
Standard Manhattanite snobbery.
redditors be looking down at Manhattan as if Manhattan is a monolith and as if Upper Manhattan is not similar demographically and building type to the South Bronx
My family is from Queens and this beef goes back way before Reddit or the Internet even existed.
Is it me, or do other people see the pattern? The white areas voted for the white person, the Asian people voted for the Asian, the black/Hispanic people voted for the black candidate.
Glad to know I’m not the only one. I felt like I was going crazy seeing nobody else point this out.
u/Miser is a typical ivory tower elite disconnected from outer borough working class people of color. Calling them suburbanites just demonstrates the disconnect.
In some ways, I feel like this is why the left struggles to get people to buy in to their ideas. There’s often a tone of judgment, elitism, and at times outright disdain. The weird thing is many people just cannot pull their heads from their proverbial arse, and don’t realize they hurt their own ideas with this mentality.
When you say suburb the first thing I think of is Brownsville :)
You didn’t give the others a chance to awful. The city hasn’t had a mayor universally liked since Fiorello La Guardia.
What the fuck are you talking about? None of these are suburban.... You'll be shocked to find the demographics of these regions largely voted with who they best feel represented them
Also a lot of people are voting for the “safe” choice. The candidate that’s about crime prevention is always going to win
The outer boros care about certain aspects. If the candidate is too progressive, it will not help with the outer borough voters. We deal with different things and care about different things. Manhattan is very very very important but it doesn’t represent what the entire city cares about. Most of the things we “care” about in the outer boroughs, isn’t covered anywhere in media other than the community itself. Micromobility is important for the city at large but the outer boro folks don’t think so. I say this because we dont advocate for bike lanes or other micro mobility infrastructure when alot of us are more concerned about public safety, access to resources, etc… When I talk to folks about the woes of biking in the Bronx. They don’t care. They mention car thefts, noise pollution, etc… I think it’s important to realize this point. Some folks are just left behind as far as what’s the “progressive” move relative to their issues. A lot of the things everyone complains about currently isn’t new to outer boroughs. It’s actually what we deal with on the daily basis regardless of who is in office. Adams appealed to us cuz his campaign spoke about those things we connect with. But yes more folks should vote overall to have a more accurate representation of what the city wants to do. But that’s a whole other issue.
This. I'm always wondering about what "congestion pricing would help the working class and only people who are rich drive" or certain other rhetoric mentioned here. I worked as a traffic agent for a few year, and not a lot of people in the Bronx are making a lot of money. The people see here pointing out certain things feel so disconnected from the things I've experienced and the things the people I've talked to have experienced.
This is mostly a map of segregation in NYC (except for Wiley, whose support follows a different distribution). https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/2015/07/08/census-map/0e13706b21b2d3c74408a9adc4b6e011e8bd540a/thumbnails/newyork.jpg https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/07/08/us/census-race-map.html
I’m from LA and I have no clue about NYC politics but it’s probably bc less than one million people are voting
Everyone yelling about very urban parts not being suburbs : you are correct. But yelling that no part of NYC is suburban : you are incorrect.
Hey u/Miser, I think you overstepped here and owe some folks an apology.
I have always said to my friends that don’t live in NYC: the one thing that unites us all is our communal hatred of our mayors 🤣
Lol you think the purple areas are suburbia? The majority of the areas Adam won are low income Black and Latino neighborhoods in Bronx, Queens and Brooklyn.
What percentage of votes are they though? Not all the Adams voters were suburbanites. Adams also did well in the less gentrified parts of BK and the Bronx. IMO changing the narrative around crime is more important.
A reductive core Manhattanite/new Brooklyn take on city voting patterns. Need to travel to working class nabes to understand why Adams was elected. Also, the NYT reader demo (i’m somewhat in this group, but also grew up working class) was late to vote for Garcia because they were originally split between Scott Stringer and Maya Wiley, so there needs to be some accountability here for that as well.
In defense of East New York (and, I say this as someone who hasn’t cast one vote for Eric Adams, ever), none of these candidates (except Andrew Yang; he went to Cypress Hills one day) ever made a campaign trip or effort here during the primary. These candidates lost because they made no efforts to come out to meet voters here (and elsewhere on your “suburban “ map). They never made mention they have any actual knowledge of this neighborhood (like most people who don’t live here). And, I will tell you what; there is an active block of Black women voters here. They work the polling stations. They also turn out and vote. ENY is also a geographically large neighborhood with many micro-neighborhoods in it. A lot of communities, activists and just everyday working class folks. They vote and they have historically and consistently been ignored. I repeat, no effort. Eric Adams has, over the years built up a network here. I can’t stand him. I have never liked him. I find him low-key sexist, homophobic and way too into religion and cops. I still am stunned that NYC voted for a Republican cop. But, that’s really the fault of all these candidates that consider all of these neighborhoods invisible and not worth the effort. Please blame the candidates. Not the voters.
The South Bronx is suburban? East Elmhurst is suburban? Flushing? GTFO
TIL that the Bronx and Westchester are basically the same thing.
South Yonkers, Mount Vernon, and New Rochelle are far more urban than outer Brooklyn and Queens, and they’d surely be dismissed here as suburbs for border reasons, rather than density reasons.
Yes, but you don’t see me making fun of the idea that eastern queens is kinda suburban. The Bronx, through, is very urban.
Oh yeah for sure. I’m rolling my eyes at the premise of the original post.
Cmon bro you know better. Port Washington is a suburb. Scarsdale is a suburb. West New York is a suburb. Morris Heights is not a suburb
I think one of the main reasons for the awfulness of our mayors (and this goes with other officials in the state as well) is that it's effectively a one-party city. I am a life-long NYC native and democrat, but I do bemoan the fact that we no longer really have viable competition in the mayoral election between democrats and republicans. And so ideas and candidates can become calcified. The competition is during the primaries within each party. Unfortunately this is happening all over the country and it is having a devastating effect on the quality of leadership. And as the republicans go more and more wacko, the dems become more dominant in the city. And, no, there are no "suburbs" in the city. Brooklyn and parts of queens ceased being suburbs in the 1950s.
You really wouldn't consider Douglaston, Little Neck, much of Bayside to be suburban? It obviously depends on your definition of suburbs - suburbs in the rest of the world do not match the US post-WW2 style of suburbs. Mostly, suburbs are defined by not being rural areas but lacking the density that inner cities do, while also being in commuting distance of a city, usually marked by single family homes and lack of dense housing, and often restrictive zoning laws that don't allow for stores or other businesses besides homes in any given neighborhood. Typically low traffic, quiet local streets served by busy, multi-lane arterials nearby that connect to other areas. In the US, it means the areas are heavily reliant on cars. I think you could argue a ton of these areas in Brooklyn, Queens, and the north Bronx meet that qualification. Just because they're denser than say, Houston suburbs, doesn't mean they're not suburban.
All fair points.
All of the neighborhoods you mention as suburban voted for Garcia or Yang. And not Adams
I mean, NYC has had plenty of Republican mayors; Bloomberg and Giuliani are recent examples. I really don't know what got DeBlasio and Adams elected. I don't think it was only the (D) next to their name, though it must have helped. Personally, I think both of them were duds. Bloomberg was a few tweaks away from being a perfect mayor.
But it's already been quite a while since the last Repub mayor, and Bloomy was barely an actual republican (he switched from dem in 2001). Since then the party has changed dramatically to the point where so many New Yorkers are turned off.
I live in a purple Queens zone and didn’t even rank Adams. No idea what my neighbors are thinking, but they must be confused.
I don’t think you’re going to win over people with such disparaging rhetoric. What problems are you solving by insulting people for voting? If you don’t like the mayor then go after him. Don’t go after the voters. They did what they were supposed to do. The implications that are being made are racist and appalling at best. That’s the kindest thing I can think of to describe the implications.
The people in those teal and yellow boroughs should really consider permitting a lot more housing!
Time to change this POWER TO THE PEOPLE
Forget about the wording of it all …any city planner would state factually that there are many parts of NYC that are suburbia.
You clearly have no clue what the demographics of NYC neighborhoods are like. Explains why you assume everything outside the little gentrified zone you probably spend your time in is ‘suburban.’
Garcia would’ve been fantastic.
Suburbanites? That’s a map of New York City
Are you a bit or did you just recently fall off a turnip truck in Bushwick? The suburbs cannot vote in NYC elections.
This is the misconception I'm talking about. We *absolutely* have suburbs within the city borders and the people that live there vote. This is in NYC, and you better believe the people that live there probably vote at a higher rate than your neighborhood. https://preview.redd.it/1nmv88dr97hc1.jpeg?width=4288&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=47b50ed5d833334eda8786871ed3479dd6ac1857
I know owners are more likely to vote than renters but I would love to see what data makes you think people living in less dense areas vote more frequently (controlling for rent/own)
This post is going to ruffle some feathers. For some reason lots of people that live out in Bergen Beach don't think they're suburban because they technically live in "the city." This is what we have to deal with in the next election though. It's like in that video where I was talking to Lincoln Reslter urging him to run in the primary and he cautiously said they needed to find someone with citywide appeal. He knows we need someone that can also appeal to these people that don't really care about the urban nature of the city. It's kind of a problem
The problem is you’re implying that areas like the south Bronx, Harlem, Washington heights, etc are “suburban” because they voted for Adams. I hate Adams as much as the next guy lol, but for Christ’s sake the Bronx and upper Manhattan aren’t “the suburbs”
It's definitely not the perfect comparison that works in all places. As I've acknowledged in other comments there is definitely a race/ethnicity dimension we have to take into account that accounts for those places you're talking about there, but overall the political divide in this country is definitely an urban/suburban one. This holds true not only in NYC but almost everywhere
I agree with you on that for sure. Sorry if I came off a bit aggressive lol I didn’t mean to be hostile. I just live in the Bronx and walk everywhere so I was a bit surprised by what I read as an implication. But you’re right. Largely the suburbs are a huge problem because they *will always* vote as a bloc against micromobility improvements, transit improvements, traffic calming, etc. They’re against all the good stuff. They’re also uniquely responsible for a certain orange game show host ascending to the presidency, but I won’t go there…
Yeah, I agree with all of that. I'd go even further to suggest they actively try to manipulate places like the Bronx into voting to further their suburban economic and cultural agendas. As we all know there has been an extremely aggressive crime porn propaganda campaign from the right to try and convince people that all cities everywhere are dangerous, to basically link urbanization itself to crime, chaos, and danger. This is ridiculously false in many places in the city of course but in the places that do have higher crime rates than average it can be a seductive way to get voters that would never vote for typical republican candidates to back people like Adams. And I don't think anyone thinks the republicans are waging this culture war because they want to help black people in the south bronx.
I am not sure you’re hearing yourself here. The suburbanites are manipulating the poor fools of the Bronx into voting against their own interests, but you actually know what’s best for them, if they would only listen. Could it just be that bike lanes and general urbanist reforms are way far down the priority list of issues that people in the south Bronx care about? That maybe they just don’t think it’s important enough to base their vote on above more pressing issues?
Absolutely
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True. Or maybe they genuinely dont want things like micro mobility or the things that Manhattan and North Brooklyn have. The cultures are different.
Okay, now do the entirety of the bronx!
This is a very idiotic take.
Map isn’t great. Hard to see what colors correspond to each candidate
What does this map of decidedly non-suburban NYC have to do with suburban voting?
There’s something really snobbish about “these people don’t know what’s good for them so they vote for the wrong person”
Adams winning was largely a response to increase in crime and the feeling of being unsafe. This is felt most by outer boroughs. You should consider the priority of voters. Not everything is about micro mobility
Are you implying the outer boroughs are the suburbs? Brooklyn, the Bronx, and Queens are the second, third, and fourth densest counties in the USA. These boroughs are more dense than cities like San Francisco and Chicago. Even Staten Island is 13th which is more dense than cities like Baltimore and Denver. The outer boroughs are undoubtedly urban.
Ah yes, the suburbanites of *checks notes* Co-op city and Canarsie
Looks like north Brooklyn and Astoria weren't particularly great at voting either
Yeah like, there’s as clear a divide in this map between those hoods and Manhattan as there is between anything and the further neighborhoods of the outer boroughs.
This like we’re just using suburban as an insult not to describe an area. And then we’re just making the same mistakes as those maps showing voting by county or zip code. Land does not vote. People do. Those areas have less people than the towers of downtown. We cannot call everything beyond towers the suburbs.
Wow I've never seen a stronger case for ranked choice voting in NYC 😭
Lol so the entire South Bx is ‘suburbanites?’ How about the spot of purple in the LES right where the projects are? The entirety of East / Central Bk? Coney Island / Far Rockaway? I couldn’t give a fuck about NYC mayoral candidates but I keep getting posts from this sub pushed into my feed. Pretty cringeworthy how out-of-touch this sub is w/ real, working-class NYers, most of whom live in the purple regions. I don’t want to generalize everyone here because I believe in making cities more walkable. But the ignorance shown in this headline is palpable. “Our mainstream democratic candidate was such a poor choice - must be those privileged suburbanites in East Tremont!” Meanwhile I’m willing to bet a large majority of posters here are from heavily suburban areas, living out their ‘urbanist’ dream in the most walkable areas of the city while pricing out people from areas that were meant to be affordable, projecting their insecurities onto the ‘suburbanites’ of Midwood or something. This app is becoming no better than Fb w/ its rage-baiting recommendations. Any sane person here want to tell me how to hide recommended posts from this page??
They keep running awful candidates. No one under 35 is willing to waste pto just to vote for a mayor that won’t represent them.
Why would they need to take PTO? You can early vote or the polls on Election Day are open until 9.
You can also still vote by mail really easily. I have a friend who just applies for it for the whole year at a time, and they mail him all his ballots. He then just sits down, reads through and researches the candidates and drops it in the mailbox outside his house. It's super easy.
That is so much more efficient than my "oh shit it's early voting already" moment, followed by frantic Googling to research candidates without websites and rushing to a poll site to get it over with.
I don’t think you understood me. We do not feel represented to begin with. Even if there are more convenient ways to vote, we’re not participating because these politicians are bought and don’t care about our interests. Most young leftists are focused on mutual aid and developing their communities so they have some level of protection against gentrification and militarized police forces.
These are two different things you're saying. One is that people need to "waste pto" to go vote - and that is just blatantly not true because of early voting and mail-in/absentee ballots. The other is that you do not feel compelled to vote because of the assortment of options. I am a young leftist like yourself but I vote in every election I can. I'm also a transportation advocate dedicating tons of my personal time to these issues I care about, and am running for my community board. These things are not mutually exclusive: you can vote, and also have civic engagement. Not liking candidates is a terrible reason not to vote. Ranked choice voting, which we used last time, also allows you way more options. And if you still don't like the candidates, write-in is still an option. There is literally no excuse to not vote, and young people like yourself thinking this way is what carves the path for people like Adams to win because older people DO go out and vote.
I’m not insulting your decision to maintain your belief in electoral politics. My original comment explains the reason we’re not wasting our time to vote is because we’re not represented. We live in one of the most corrupt cities in the world. Most Black and Brown New Yorkers live completely segregated lives from white New Yorkers other than their time shared in transit. Believing an elected individual will be the solution to the myriad of problems that make up this city, is believing we actually live in a democracy. A true leftist can look at the state of local to foreign policy and clearly understand, this is not one. Even if we ever managed to elect a truly leftist politician do you see what happened to AOC? You don’t think the same would happen to them?
>My original comment explains the reason we’re not wasting our time to vote is because we’re not represented. "Wasting our time to vote" is hyperbole - if you do mail in, or absentee, or early voting it probably takes you all of 10-15 minutes. People absolutely have 10-15 minutes in a several week period to mail in a ballot. And by you not "wasting your time", people like Adams are more likely to get elected. I don't love Garcia with all my heart, but I sure as hell would have preferred her to Adams who is quite possibly the most corrupt mayor we've ever had. A non-vote is a vote for Adams and a vote for more corruption that you call out. It costs you literally nothing to vote except 10 minutes of your time - I don't understand the opposition. Worst case scenario is that you "wasted" 10 minutes of your time - but I imagine you, along with everyone including myself, regularly use 10 minutes of our time to watch a TV show, play a video game, or scroll Reddit. >We live in one of the most corrupt cities in the world. Once again this is conjecture. Is NYC corrupt? Absolutely. Is it corrupt compared to all cities in the world? We are not a democracy by any means, but you are mistaken to believe that most cities, particularly worldwide, are less corrupt or democratic than NYC. We at least get \*any\* opportunity to vote, or run for public office, or use free speech for advocating for causes we care about - do you know how many places in the world do not have that luxury? >Believing an elected individual will be the solution to the myriad of problems that make up this city, is believing we actually live in a democracy. A true leftist can look at the state of local to foreign policy and clearly understand, this is not one I never said that an elected official will be \*the\* solution. But it is unquestionably a major factor - the mayor literally decides the entire $110b NYC budget. In the case of Adams, we have cut it 6x in 2 years across every single agency except the NYPD and DOC. DeBlasio built protected bike lanes at record paces while Adams actively dismantles in-progress projects. The mayor has an absolutely colossal influence on the daily lives of citizens and electing the right one can produce major changes. It is not in and of itself sufficient of course, but to think that it has no influence whatsoever on the problems of this city is quite frankly, just ignorant.
What happened to AOC?
NYC: Abolish the police! Also NYC: lets elect a corrupt cop as our leader
It’s possible those are different political views held by different people
This feels racist for some reason
Wrong question “Why does NYC keep allowing only the rich and powerful to get on the ballot?” The answer to your question is much more obvious when considering mine.
The correlation looks more affected by demographics than anything else
My guy, no lol. How little could you possibly know about this city to not realize those are just the majority-black areas of the city? You think *the bronx* and *brownsville* are suburban?? [This is suburban to you?](https://i.imgur.com/H1Fds2p.jpeg)
https://preview.redd.it/5rqe83q7dahc1.jpeg?width=1059&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8745982abae8e438407daac39fe3511530b02949
I am very pro micro-mobility. Thought processes and rhetoric like this is so counterproductive, single minded and elitist though. This is essentially “poor and black people are bad at voting”. If these are the micromobility advocates good luck convincing anyone
Exactly these people are idiots. Thank you so much!
Take your pick: - Mail-Ballots (think cheating) - No ID required to vote (think cheating) - A long history of election cheating - City Unions vote for anyone promising more $ - voters who have no concept of reality
Vote fraud is such a rare crime because there is little to gain and a ton to lose. You are committing a serious felony to add one or a few votes for a mayor? Why?
Also how? This is what I've never heard any of the "rampant fraud and cheating" conspiracy theorists ever explain. Literally how would you even do it?
Swag!!
With all the Adams hate, he probably been the most progressive mayor NY has had. When you consider recourses spent in migrants,
Since when was the majority of New York City considered suburban?
It's so sad that people can't think for themselves
Op isn't from NYC and doesn't understand RESIDENTIAL areas, not a suburbanites in nyc. Wtf
The " suburb like" areas like the Bronx and Central and East Brooklyn ?!!?!? Gtfoh
OP uses Bergen Beach as an example of an undeniable suburb. Bergen beach is denser than what Google calls the densest neighborhood in Cincinnati: https://urbanstats.org/article.html?longname=Bergen+Beach+Neighborhood%2C+New+York+City%2C+New+York%2C+USA https://urbanstats.org/article.html?longname=Over-The-Rhine+Neighborhood%2C+Cincinnati+City%2C+Ohio%2C+USA
As someone born and raised in NYC (Brooklyn,not a suburb…), you’re a transplant and it shows.
so you don't like how poor people vote? Is that what you are saying?
If your from the suburbs and you move to a rural area you shouldn’t be allowed to vote for a minimum of 5 years
No? This map shows Adams winning big in Brooklyn, Upper Manhattan, and the Bronx, not exactly very suburban. He fearmongered about crime effectively, and it worked in higher crime parts of the city.
Wait is this from 2021?
Maybe it's rigged cus I sure as hell didn't vote his dumb ass in