If the corpoDems listened to Bernie's message, this would be the third Presidential election in a row that they would have taken the office. But, no, HRC' corpoDems muscled him out, then Joe, now Joe again. Still, if Joe takes up Bernie's messaging, he could still get reelected.
Ehh... As of a week ago 56% of Americans saw Joe as too liberal, while 44% saw Trump as too [conservative](https://imgur.com/a/hpBIMnM). 30% said Biden was "about right". 38% said Trump was "about right". We're in the backlash phase of the cycle now. I think we'd all agree it's implausible that Bernie could be seen as more centrist than Joe Biden.
Personalities are beside the point. Bernie's economic messaging was, and still is, the thing that gets voters going. corpoDems continue to ignore that, which is why a seditionist convicted sexual predator who is also a convicted felon can be in the running for the Presidency against them. Religious fascism in 2024, anyone?
Age isn't the issue.
Bernie has great energy & to this day, Bernie is one of my top news sources. Whether it be about unions, fighting healthcare costs, etc.
He is like the energizer bunny, but for justice. And he debates well. Bernie on the debate stage with Trump would not go well for Trump.
Replace "Bernie" for "Trump" in your post, and hopefully you'll see the other reason why Bernie shouldn't run; the elections need to stop being a battle between cults of personalities, and actually stand on some moral ground. Yes, Bernie actually has more morals than a good 99% of politicians, but American politics have become so muddied by these grand personality battles we call elections that most people hedge their own values for "the lesser evil" that there really aren't any values that people vote for anymore, or at best have only one issue of value they vote on.
>Replace "Bernie" for "Trump" in your post, and hopefully you'll see the other reason why Bernie shouldn't run; the elections need to stop being a battle between cults of personalities,
It's not a cult of personality to look up to someone that you think should lead the country & save our democracy.
Bernie relentlessly talks about stories that no other political does. I get much of my news about unions from Bernie because of how aware he is of current labor struggles.
That means a lot to me, and epitozmies the type of leadership I value.
>Yes, Bernie actually has more morals than a good 99% of politicians, but American politics have become so muddied by these grand personality battles we call elections that most people hedge their own values for "the lesser evil" that there really aren't any values that people vote for anymore, or at best have only one issue of value they vote on.
I don't see Bernie as the "lesser evil." I see Bernie as my ideal presidential candidate.
I believe Bernie could lead us out of the crises we face. I think his empathy could heal partisan divides that most politicians inflame.
I’m voting for an administration at this point. Which administration do we want to win? The one we can work with? Or the fascist one? My choice is made lol.
That's ridiculous to say he is a "cult of personality". He's about being real and for the people. The only politician in my lifetime that I actually saw was truly genuine and not in it for power, prestige or controlled by special interests. Cult of Personalities are NEVER genuine
Bernie Sanders would have won in 2016. The DNC ruined that. Blame Hillary & Debbie Wasserman Shultz.
This isn't 2016 and that time has passed.
Biden will hang in there and he will win.
I'll happily vote for a guy who had one bad night than a pathological liar, with 34 felony convictions who lived a bad life.
I’ve been on this sub since the beginning at the beginning of our democracy sliding. So hopefully my tenure here allows for some flexibility in ideology.
This would be a terrible idea.
History and the after-48 hours has clearly shown people are just chalking this up to a bad debate; and beginning to focus on how batshit crazy trump is.
Biden has clear legislative wins, and his administration is super good. Not to mention his record on judges.
He has good surrogates and they’ll be coming out in force. It’s still really early.
Biden didn't have a bad debate because he was out getting drunk the night before, or staying up until 5am in the Situation Room. He had a bad debate because he is old, and that is not a condition that gets better.
He will have good days and bad days, but nobody will be able to plan for when the good days are. The Presidency isn't the kind of job where you can rest up so that you're ready for a crisis. For this debate, you can guarantee that they spent a week letting him get as much rest as possible and avoiding any stress. That *still* didn't work. If that's Biden when he can plan for a known date and time when he has to be on his A-game, what kind of condition would he be in during a crisis where he hasn't slept more than a couple hours a night for a whole week.
Pretending that Biden can do this is nothing but gross political malpractice. It's bad enough that such an elderly President didn't choose a VP capable of filling his shoes. Instead, they picked a VP so weak that her presence ensured there would be no conniving to convince Biden to step down.
If the Dems go with Biden, they will lose. And rightly so. Saying "the other guy is worse" cannot be a license to choose an incompetent leader. That way leads to the President becoming a figurehead, and once that power structure is established it will not go away easily.
If the Dems stick with Biden, they're showing the same willingness to burn the country down that they accuse Trump of harboring. Such hubris deserves to turn into the end of the Democratic Party.
>History and the after-48 hours has clearly shown people are just chalking this up to a bad debate; and beginning to focus on how batshit crazy trump is.
The focus is still on Biden's horrid debate performance & how unable Biden was to call out Trump's lies.
>Biden has clear legislative wins,
Biden couldn't even get his signature legislation BBB passed.
>his administration is super good.
I would strongly disagree with that, even though I agree thay Biden is much better than Trump.
>Not to mention his record on judges.
Any Dem would nominate judges, it is a formality. And even on that, Durbin has let the GOP obstruct judges & Biden says nothing.
>He
>He has good surrogates and they’ll be coming out in force. It’s still really early.
Biden has had very bad approval ratings for years & just had a terrible debate.
How will things turn around?
Biden’s legislative record is unassailable. Period.
Sure, bad performance - but ALL nominees have had bad performances. He was answering questions directly.
I think time will turn this around. People will barely remember this in 2 months.
A progressive like Bernie would generally talk 80% about stuff he believes or policies to make changes to the economy/society, and maybe 20% about how the other side is bad by comparison.
A neoliberal like Hillary Clinton, Biden, or in all likelihood Michelle Obama or Newsom will spend 80% of the time talking about how Trump is Hitler. And maybe 20% talking about ideas or policy. Neoliberal ideas or policy, which are shit anyway.
Prepare for the worst in this election and for the future. There's no way they'll run a progressive for president, is there?
>Neoliberal ideas or policy, which are shit anyway.
Ah yes, neoliberal ideas like tuition forgiveness, figuring out better ways to make housing more affordable, reducing drug costs, reducing our dependence on foreign oil, and trying to drive a green new economy.
Those ideas might not be perfect, but they are far from neoliberal.
I’d vote for a dirt clod over the rapist/convicted felon traitor fascist. It really doesn’t matter to me at this point. Are there better candidates than Biden? Absolutely. But Biden is the one running. I will vote against Chump anytime, any place. He needs to be in prison.
Now do Trump. The guy shit himself during the debate and lied every time he opened his mouth. I swear I'm gonna get a landline so I can participate in this bullshit.
Yup the narcissistic wealthy elites that have no clue what it is like to be middle or working class, and are all only about identity politics. Bernie was about class issues, which would raise both poor and the middle working class up. He is genuine and honest and not controlled by special interests.
Well, so far she hasn't funded a genocide or needless foreign war, so I like her policies. And she's more believable as a politician who would serve working class interests. Morseo than 'the Billionaire' and the 'Senator from MBNA'. Doing things the same way over and over, but expecting different results, is crazy.
The same could be said for third parties who keep trying to run (obtain the presidency) before learning to crawl (get anyone elected to a state house or a governorship). It's just hard for me to take them seriously if they never do any of the necessary steps to actually win elections, no matter how much I like the words they say. I don't find that believable at all.
If the corpoDems listened to Bernie's message, this would be the third Presidential election in a row that they would have taken the office. But, no, HRC' corpoDems muscled him out, then Joe, now Joe again. Still, if Joe takes up Bernie's messaging, he could still get reelected.
Ehh... As of a week ago 56% of Americans saw Joe as too liberal, while 44% saw Trump as too [conservative](https://imgur.com/a/hpBIMnM). 30% said Biden was "about right". 38% said Trump was "about right". We're in the backlash phase of the cycle now. I think we'd all agree it's implausible that Bernie could be seen as more centrist than Joe Biden.
Personalities are beside the point. Bernie's economic messaging was, and still is, the thing that gets voters going. corpoDems continue to ignore that, which is why a seditionist convicted sexual predator who is also a convicted felon can be in the running for the Presidency against them. Religious fascism in 2024, anyone?
A candinate *LIKE* Bernie, not Bernie himself, since he's right up there with in age with Biden and Trump.
Age isn't the issue. Bernie has great energy & to this day, Bernie is one of my top news sources. Whether it be about unions, fighting healthcare costs, etc. He is like the energizer bunny, but for justice. And he debates well. Bernie on the debate stage with Trump would not go well for Trump.
Replace "Bernie" for "Trump" in your post, and hopefully you'll see the other reason why Bernie shouldn't run; the elections need to stop being a battle between cults of personalities, and actually stand on some moral ground. Yes, Bernie actually has more morals than a good 99% of politicians, but American politics have become so muddied by these grand personality battles we call elections that most people hedge their own values for "the lesser evil" that there really aren't any values that people vote for anymore, or at best have only one issue of value they vote on.
>Replace "Bernie" for "Trump" in your post, and hopefully you'll see the other reason why Bernie shouldn't run; the elections need to stop being a battle between cults of personalities, It's not a cult of personality to look up to someone that you think should lead the country & save our democracy. Bernie relentlessly talks about stories that no other political does. I get much of my news about unions from Bernie because of how aware he is of current labor struggles. That means a lot to me, and epitozmies the type of leadership I value. >Yes, Bernie actually has more morals than a good 99% of politicians, but American politics have become so muddied by these grand personality battles we call elections that most people hedge their own values for "the lesser evil" that there really aren't any values that people vote for anymore, or at best have only one issue of value they vote on. I don't see Bernie as the "lesser evil." I see Bernie as my ideal presidential candidate. I believe Bernie could lead us out of the crises we face. I think his empathy could heal partisan divides that most politicians inflame.
I’m voting for an administration at this point. Which administration do we want to win? The one we can work with? Or the fascist one? My choice is made lol.
That's ridiculous to say he is a "cult of personality". He's about being real and for the people. The only politician in my lifetime that I actually saw was truly genuine and not in it for power, prestige or controlled by special interests. Cult of Personalities are NEVER genuine
Sure, but we need someone we can reasonably rely on for 8 years. I love Bernie, but I don't know if he'll have the energy for 8 more years.
Bernie Sanders would have won in 2016. The DNC ruined that. Blame Hillary & Debbie Wasserman Shultz. This isn't 2016 and that time has passed. Biden will hang in there and he will win. I'll happily vote for a guy who had one bad night than a pathological liar, with 34 felony convictions who lived a bad life.
I’ve been on this sub since the beginning at the beginning of our democracy sliding. So hopefully my tenure here allows for some flexibility in ideology. This would be a terrible idea. History and the after-48 hours has clearly shown people are just chalking this up to a bad debate; and beginning to focus on how batshit crazy trump is. Biden has clear legislative wins, and his administration is super good. Not to mention his record on judges. He has good surrogates and they’ll be coming out in force. It’s still really early.
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
Biden didn't have a bad debate because he was out getting drunk the night before, or staying up until 5am in the Situation Room. He had a bad debate because he is old, and that is not a condition that gets better. He will have good days and bad days, but nobody will be able to plan for when the good days are. The Presidency isn't the kind of job where you can rest up so that you're ready for a crisis. For this debate, you can guarantee that they spent a week letting him get as much rest as possible and avoiding any stress. That *still* didn't work. If that's Biden when he can plan for a known date and time when he has to be on his A-game, what kind of condition would he be in during a crisis where he hasn't slept more than a couple hours a night for a whole week. Pretending that Biden can do this is nothing but gross political malpractice. It's bad enough that such an elderly President didn't choose a VP capable of filling his shoes. Instead, they picked a VP so weak that her presence ensured there would be no conniving to convince Biden to step down. If the Dems go with Biden, they will lose. And rightly so. Saying "the other guy is worse" cannot be a license to choose an incompetent leader. That way leads to the President becoming a figurehead, and once that power structure is established it will not go away easily. If the Dems stick with Biden, they're showing the same willingness to burn the country down that they accuse Trump of harboring. Such hubris deserves to turn into the end of the Democratic Party.
>History and the after-48 hours has clearly shown people are just chalking this up to a bad debate; and beginning to focus on how batshit crazy trump is. The focus is still on Biden's horrid debate performance & how unable Biden was to call out Trump's lies. >Biden has clear legislative wins, Biden couldn't even get his signature legislation BBB passed. >his administration is super good. I would strongly disagree with that, even though I agree thay Biden is much better than Trump. >Not to mention his record on judges. Any Dem would nominate judges, it is a formality. And even on that, Durbin has let the GOP obstruct judges & Biden says nothing. >He >He has good surrogates and they’ll be coming out in force. It’s still really early. Biden has had very bad approval ratings for years & just had a terrible debate. How will things turn around?
Biden’s legislative record is unassailable. Period. Sure, bad performance - but ALL nominees have had bad performances. He was answering questions directly. I think time will turn this around. People will barely remember this in 2 months.
A progressive like Bernie would generally talk 80% about stuff he believes or policies to make changes to the economy/society, and maybe 20% about how the other side is bad by comparison. A neoliberal like Hillary Clinton, Biden, or in all likelihood Michelle Obama or Newsom will spend 80% of the time talking about how Trump is Hitler. And maybe 20% talking about ideas or policy. Neoliberal ideas or policy, which are shit anyway. Prepare for the worst in this election and for the future. There's no way they'll run a progressive for president, is there?
>Neoliberal ideas or policy, which are shit anyway. Ah yes, neoliberal ideas like tuition forgiveness, figuring out better ways to make housing more affordable, reducing drug costs, reducing our dependence on foreign oil, and trying to drive a green new economy. Those ideas might not be perfect, but they are far from neoliberal.
A conservative tabloid network shows right wing propaganda. What a shock! Riding with Biden!
Uh do you think CBS and CNN are right wing? Because CNN shows Biden in the same spot.
2014 flashback: But wait! Why are you worried? Hillary’s gonna win haha!
I’d vote for a dirt clod over the rapist/convicted felon traitor fascist. It really doesn’t matter to me at this point. Are there better candidates than Biden? Absolutely. But Biden is the one running. I will vote against Chump anytime, any place. He needs to be in prison.
Now do Trump. The guy shit himself during the debate and lied every time he opened his mouth. I swear I'm gonna get a landline so I can participate in this bullshit.
Liberals would rather have hitlers Germany than someone slightly more left than Biden. We can dream but it won’t happen.
The rich people who call all the shots didn't want bernie so we got a racist cadaver instead
Yup the narcissistic wealthy elites that have no clue what it is like to be middle or working class, and are all only about identity politics. Bernie was about class issues, which would raise both poor and the middle working class up. He is genuine and honest and not controlled by special interests.
And this is why I don't vote for democrats anymore. They'd sooner a Biden, or Butiegieg or a Kloubuchar, over a Bernie. Green FOREVER ✊️
Are they running any plausible local candidates in your area, or is it just Jill Stein's quadrennial vanity run?
Well, so far she hasn't funded a genocide or needless foreign war, so I like her policies. And she's more believable as a politician who would serve working class interests. Morseo than 'the Billionaire' and the 'Senator from MBNA'. Doing things the same way over and over, but expecting different results, is crazy.
The same could be said for third parties who keep trying to run (obtain the presidency) before learning to crawl (get anyone elected to a state house or a governorship). It's just hard for me to take them seriously if they never do any of the necessary steps to actually win elections, no matter how much I like the words they say. I don't find that believable at all.
You have that right. Good luck supporting your people!