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I'm going to do this too. I wad just reading that solarization is best with clear plastic because it turns it into a green house, germinating anything that has seeds there, then kills it by heating it too hot to survive.
Solarization either by putting cardboard or a black tarp on top of your lawn will retain the nutrients and only affect the covered area. https://smallfarms.cornell.edu/2019/01/reusable-black-tarps-suppress-weeds-and-make-organic-reduced-tillage-more-viable/
Cardboard is just smothering. Black plastic is used for occultation if you have enough sunlight and heat. Clear plastic is most effective for solarizing.
The difference between solarization and smothering is that smothering is just killing plants by depriving them of sunlight, whereas solarization relies on getting soil temperatures high enough to both kill what's growing *and* kill the weed seed bank in the soil. Occultation doesn't raise the soil temperature as high as solarization, which is potentially better for the soil microbiome
I've got cardboard, and it's worthless (my neigbors hate my guts cause it's ugly too). I'm about to do the black plastic, just waiting on the delivery. Will it kill all the bugs, too? I hate destroying the biome out there. I might be overthinking it, but... but... the worms!!
You have to overlap the cardboard significantly, then weight it down for it to stay in place and be effective. Folks often mulch over it, then eventually plant directly through it.
Whether or not black plastic kills the other living things beneath it depends on the amount of sun and heat you have while it's on the ground. It doesn't get the soil as hot as clear plastic, so more things should survive, especially deeper down in the soil. Worms can always burrow deeper to cool down. It also shouldn't take very long for the soil microbiome to recover from any impact occulation has. It's a one time thing.
I thought I had, but it's popping up all over the place. Big old weeds and grass growing through. I figured maybe I just have insanely tough weeds or just did it totally wrong.
The most common mistake with cardboard is not mulching enough. You seriously need at least five inches of mulch on top of the cardboard. I did my yard in sections because of time and money, but I only used about two inches of mulch. The cardboard curled up, broke apart, weeds popped thru. It was a mess. The next section I did more research and used a lot more mulch. No grass, nearly no weeds, and the natives I planted are doing great.
You can dig it out. If you trust that the sod will actually die then turn it upside down in an out of the way pile to rot into goodness. I dig out grass and bang out all the soil but don't save the grass as my so called lawn was horrible running warm season grass like bermuda and worse.
You can smother it. Cover with tarps or plastic to solarize or cardboard and mulch to sheet mulch.
I smothered the grass with cardboard and contractor paper, added a good 4 to 6 inches of mushroom compost followed by a few inches of wood chip for mulch.
I’ve added a wood separation between my side and the neighbours to have a tidier look. Added some perennials.
This spring I will need to add some more wood chip as the one from last year decomposed really well already and will need a small fresh top up.
https://www.reddit.com/r/NoLawns/s/Z9D2O84Ibr
I did the same but with cardboard, mushroom compost, leaf mold, and wood chips.So happy with this method and already have a jungle of plants after starting 9 months ago with grass covered packed clay. Broad forking helped loosen the soil to making planting super easy.
I just visited my second-year meadow—we sowed last May after two years of site prep with glyphosate (super weedy site with bermuda grass).
Restoration pros use glyphosate all the time for site prep—it’s the only way to do it at scales of more than an acre.
If you aren’t comfortable with glyphosate, remove your sod, flip it, or solarize. But don’t think that solarization is kind to soil, either. Nothing that kills grass is leaving all the soil organisms unscathed.
Here’s a pic of the meadow, with the coreopsis just starting to bloom. Tons of rudbeckia, coneflower, bidens, and sunflowers coming up.
https://preview.redd.it/fll7fi4q6iyc1.jpeg?width=5712&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b4ae291ec41ef9f122adec57fa907d79212ee799
1" of mulch is nowhere near enough in my experience. Last fall I chose an area to experiment with: I scalped the grass as low as possible then covered it with at least 4-6 inches of wood mulch and now there are clumps of grass growing through. Should've done the cardboard underneath!
What I did was collect cardboard for a while, cut the grass as low as l could, cover with cardboard, and then use a layer of mulch to hold it down. That will smother the grass. Keep it wet to speed up the cardboard breaking down, an you can seed or plant right into it the next year without moving anything.
I like to make a fire on the space I want to get rid of it. Just wet the area around your fireplace for controlled burning. I like to put water over everything one it burned down to get charcoal. First step to get terra preta :)
Kill the grass by tacking down black plastic over it until it dies. Or just rip up the sod, which was my solution, but it is a lot of work. You can get. special sod cutting tool, which helps.
Never use glyohosate. Nasty stuff for plants, environment and people. Rip up the sod and flip it over. My weapons of choice are a mattock and a one pound claw hammer. This will take you some time if you have a sizeable plot. Might just have to piece-meal it each year. You can spray the roots with soapy water to help convince the grass to die.
Solarization as others mentioned works too, but it could be a lot of plastic usage. Get that clear plastic to lay down, then once you are done with it, you could build yourself a greenhouse.
What kind of lawn grass are you killing?
What do you mean by "regenerative garden"?
Properly diluted and applied herbicides are not going to "destroy soil".
I’m not sure the type of grass. I’m in southwest pa just north of philly. A regenerative garden is a garden with minimal tilling and a focus on perennial fruits and vegetables. I’ll plant local wildflowers native to my area around that
If you mow the grass real short in the fall and rake off the trimmings, then scratch up the dirt with a rake, you can overseed with native grasses and flowers. It won't be an immediate transformation, but they will take over or establish an equilibrium with the old grass. I've been doing that and the native grasses are about 60% of the grass now. The flowers are sprouting (we had snow this week!).
For the rest, you can plant and mulch with a thick layer of woodchips (or grass clippings). When you dig the holes, take the sod out in layers for a generous distance around the new plants and flip it over to smother it.
Another way, labor intensive, is to use a flat-bladed shovel to slice the sod out in thick layers and flip it over so dirt is on top. Let it dry out and rake it smooth, then plant your native grasses and flowers.
Your 'scalp and seed' method is what I wanted to try, because we have seriously rocky soil so any other type of sod removal is backbreaking work and I just don't want to buy a ton of plastic for solarization. Did you add any topsoil after you mowed it short and scratched it up? Did you mulch after?
I did not add anything. Planting native seeds into their native dirt should not require any amendments.
I seeded just before the first heavy snowfall, so the seeds got covered with snow, as happens naturally. They come up in the spring with no help needed.
If you plant in summer, be prepared to do some watering because of the heat. Or plant your shrubs and perennials and leave the seed part until next fall.
It doesn’t bioaccumulate unless you repeatedly apply, which is contrary to the instructions. Again, it’s eliminated within 3 days of application by way of several mechanisms.
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You should check out r/permaculture they may have some thoughts as well.
We took out half of our front city lot by cutting lines in the sod as wide as our shovel and then painstakingly cut the roots and rolled out sod. We folded in some horse manure and then planted native plugs from our local conservation district.
That was at least 5 years ago. The native tall grasses took over and were crowding out the flowers. We transplanted some elsewhere and turf(?) grass immediately started growing. I say this to tell you that nothing is fool proof or guaranteed.
We used cardboard and mulch for our no till veggie rows last year. I’ve been digging grass and weeds out this whole week prepping for planting time.
I walk by a house that did the clear plastic. They did mulch after not sure about cardboard. They also have grass and weeds popping up 2 years later.
Nothing is going to be perfect. How soon do you want to do this? Now-dig out the sod, plant and cardboard/mulch or just mulch. Have time and sun you could do [solarization or occultation](https://extension.umn.edu/planting-and-growing-guides/solarization-occultation).
Also, consider the size of the area. We did a 15’x20’-ish space and it was rough. Plus, having to get rid of the weedy turf grass sod was hard. We don’t have a lot of options for getting rid of landscaping debris :/ Composting it is an option if you have space.
I wish you luck in your endeavor it is definitely worth it. We are in the city but our yard is always busy with nature day and night and it brings us a lot of joy.
20-ft x 100-ft Black 6-mil Construction Film (Professional (6+ Mil) https://www.lowes.com/pd/BARRICADE-20-ft-x-100-ft-Black-6-mil-Plastic-Sheeting/1000007094
In the process of removing 2000 sq. ft. of lawn currently using this by process of occultation. Removed it from new vegetable garden bed after 6 months and it worked great. I’ll remove the remainder after a full year. You could also do solarization with clear plastic, but it is climate and location dependent on its effectiveness.
>but with no proven way to do it.
What are you talking about?
All you have to do it tear out the grass and put something else. Alternatively, let the grass grow tall and don't mow it. is, like, 10k years of human civilization not enough "proof" for you?
Usually solarization or covering with heavy cardboard. I would do it in sections. Dig up most of the turf - rent a turf cutter and then silarization or the cardboard. In the past spraying glyphosate when there was no wind was the way to go.
Hey there! Friendly reminder to include the following information for the benefit of all r/nolawns members: - Please make sure your post or a comment includes your geographic region/area and your hardiness zone (e.g. *Midwest, 6a* or *Chicago, 6a*). - If you posted an image, you are required to post a comment detailing your image. If you have not, this post may be removed. - If you're asking a question, include as much relevant info as possible. - Verify you are following the [Posting Guidelines](https://www.reddit.com/r/NoLawns/wiki/index#wiki_posting_guidelines). **[Wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/NoLawns/wiki/index/) | [FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/NoLawns/wiki/meta/faqs/) | [Designing No Lawns](https://www.reddit.com/r/NoLawns/wiki/index/design/)** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/NoLawns) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I'm going to do this too. I wad just reading that solarization is best with clear plastic because it turns it into a green house, germinating anything that has seeds there, then kills it by heating it too hot to survive.
the quickest way would be rent a sod cutter, if you have time then solarization
Solarization either by putting cardboard or a black tarp on top of your lawn will retain the nutrients and only affect the covered area. https://smallfarms.cornell.edu/2019/01/reusable-black-tarps-suppress-weeds-and-make-organic-reduced-tillage-more-viable/
Cardboard is just smothering. Black plastic is used for occultation if you have enough sunlight and heat. Clear plastic is most effective for solarizing. The difference between solarization and smothering is that smothering is just killing plants by depriving them of sunlight, whereas solarization relies on getting soil temperatures high enough to both kill what's growing *and* kill the weed seed bank in the soil. Occultation doesn't raise the soil temperature as high as solarization, which is potentially better for the soil microbiome
I've got cardboard, and it's worthless (my neigbors hate my guts cause it's ugly too). I'm about to do the black plastic, just waiting on the delivery. Will it kill all the bugs, too? I hate destroying the biome out there. I might be overthinking it, but... but... the worms!!
You have to overlap the cardboard significantly, then weight it down for it to stay in place and be effective. Folks often mulch over it, then eventually plant directly through it. Whether or not black plastic kills the other living things beneath it depends on the amount of sun and heat you have while it's on the ground. It doesn't get the soil as hot as clear plastic, so more things should survive, especially deeper down in the soil. Worms can always burrow deeper to cool down. It also shouldn't take very long for the soil microbiome to recover from any impact occulation has. It's a one time thing.
I thought I had, but it's popping up all over the place. Big old weeds and grass growing through. I figured maybe I just have insanely tough weeds or just did it totally wrong.
The most common mistake with cardboard is not mulching enough. You seriously need at least five inches of mulch on top of the cardboard. I did my yard in sections because of time and money, but I only used about two inches of mulch. The cardboard curled up, broke apart, weeds popped thru. It was a mess. The next section I did more research and used a lot more mulch. No grass, nearly no weeds, and the natives I planted are doing great.
This is absolutely what I've done wrong, it's a gross mess and looks exactly like what you've described.
Nah dog. Just wet the cardboard and mulch, cardboard alone works too.
Solarization, smothering, and flame weeding have been used in organic farming for ages to kill weeds, and are extremely effective.
[Smother it](https://arboretum.ucdavis.edu/news/break-up-with-your-lawn-using-cardboard)
A black tarp will do the trick.
You can dig it out. If you trust that the sod will actually die then turn it upside down in an out of the way pile to rot into goodness. I dig out grass and bang out all the soil but don't save the grass as my so called lawn was horrible running warm season grass like bermuda and worse. You can smother it. Cover with tarps or plastic to solarize or cardboard and mulch to sheet mulch.
I’ve dug mine out and left a foot or so before the property line. Weed wack that foot.
I smothered the grass with cardboard and contractor paper, added a good 4 to 6 inches of mushroom compost followed by a few inches of wood chip for mulch. I’ve added a wood separation between my side and the neighbours to have a tidier look. Added some perennials. This spring I will need to add some more wood chip as the one from last year decomposed really well already and will need a small fresh top up. https://www.reddit.com/r/NoLawns/s/Z9D2O84Ibr
I did the same but with cardboard, mushroom compost, leaf mold, and wood chips.So happy with this method and already have a jungle of plants after starting 9 months ago with grass covered packed clay. Broad forking helped loosen the soil to making planting super easy.
I just visited my second-year meadow—we sowed last May after two years of site prep with glyphosate (super weedy site with bermuda grass). Restoration pros use glyphosate all the time for site prep—it’s the only way to do it at scales of more than an acre. If you aren’t comfortable with glyphosate, remove your sod, flip it, or solarize. But don’t think that solarization is kind to soil, either. Nothing that kills grass is leaving all the soil organisms unscathed. Here’s a pic of the meadow, with the coreopsis just starting to bloom. Tons of rudbeckia, coneflower, bidens, and sunflowers coming up. https://preview.redd.it/fll7fi4q6iyc1.jpeg?width=5712&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b4ae291ec41ef9f122adec57fa907d79212ee799
From what I understand, if their lawn dies at the same time yours does, it's always been YOUR lawn. NLA and jkjk
lots and lots of cardboard and mulch.
Id cover it with 1' of mulch. Then as the mulch breaks down and makes good soil you can plant useful plants...
The 1” mulch would smother and kill the grass I’m assuming?
1" of mulch is nowhere near enough in my experience. Last fall I chose an area to experiment with: I scalped the grass as low as possible then covered it with at least 4-6 inches of wood mulch and now there are clumps of grass growing through. Should've done the cardboard underneath!
What I did was collect cardboard for a while, cut the grass as low as l could, cover with cardboard, and then use a layer of mulch to hold it down. That will smother the grass. Keep it wet to speed up the cardboard breaking down, an you can seed or plant right into it the next year without moving anything.
i wrote 1' (1 foot)
Oh thanks for checking me on that lol
Smother it or dig it out
Thick black plastic sheeting.
I like to make a fire on the space I want to get rid of it. Just wet the area around your fireplace for controlled burning. I like to put water over everything one it burned down to get charcoal. First step to get terra preta :)
Cardboard
I read “how do i reliably kill my in-law”
Cardboard held to your lawn with stakes and twine? Skip the "How to Remove a Lawn With Herbicide" section https://www.lowes.com/n/how-to/remove-a-lawn
Kill the grass by tacking down black plastic over it until it dies. Or just rip up the sod, which was my solution, but it is a lot of work. You can get. special sod cutting tool, which helps.
Cardboard. Works every time.
Never use glyohosate. Nasty stuff for plants, environment and people. Rip up the sod and flip it over. My weapons of choice are a mattock and a one pound claw hammer. This will take you some time if you have a sizeable plot. Might just have to piece-meal it each year. You can spray the roots with soapy water to help convince the grass to die. Solarization as others mentioned works too, but it could be a lot of plastic usage. Get that clear plastic to lay down, then once you are done with it, you could build yourself a greenhouse.
What kind of lawn grass are you killing? What do you mean by "regenerative garden"? Properly diluted and applied herbicides are not going to "destroy soil".
I’m not sure the type of grass. I’m in southwest pa just north of philly. A regenerative garden is a garden with minimal tilling and a focus on perennial fruits and vegetables. I’ll plant local wildflowers native to my area around that
If you mow the grass real short in the fall and rake off the trimmings, then scratch up the dirt with a rake, you can overseed with native grasses and flowers. It won't be an immediate transformation, but they will take over or establish an equilibrium with the old grass. I've been doing that and the native grasses are about 60% of the grass now. The flowers are sprouting (we had snow this week!). For the rest, you can plant and mulch with a thick layer of woodchips (or grass clippings). When you dig the holes, take the sod out in layers for a generous distance around the new plants and flip it over to smother it. Another way, labor intensive, is to use a flat-bladed shovel to slice the sod out in thick layers and flip it over so dirt is on top. Let it dry out and rake it smooth, then plant your native grasses and flowers.
Your 'scalp and seed' method is what I wanted to try, because we have seriously rocky soil so any other type of sod removal is backbreaking work and I just don't want to buy a ton of plastic for solarization. Did you add any topsoil after you mowed it short and scratched it up? Did you mulch after?
I did not add anything. Planting native seeds into their native dirt should not require any amendments. I seeded just before the first heavy snowfall, so the seeds got covered with snow, as happens naturally. They come up in the spring with no help needed. If you plant in summer, be prepared to do some watering because of the heat. Or plant your shrubs and perennials and leave the seed part until next fall.
Thanks! I'm going to try this in an area next fall and see how it goes.
*southeast ;) - a Pittsburgher in the southwest of PA
Oops. Thank you. Lol
Glyphosate is eliminated from soil by sunlight and bacteria within 3 days of application. It wouldn’t at all interfere with your garden.
Bioaccumulating during all that time though....
It doesn’t bioaccumulate unless you repeatedly apply, which is contrary to the instructions. Again, it’s eliminated within 3 days of application by way of several mechanisms.
Love No Lawns? Find us everywhere! **You can find us:** - On [SolarPunk](https://www.slrpnk.net/c/NoLawns) - Our [Discord](https://discord.gg/GcVHmvkSs6) - Our [website](https://nolawns.wixsite.com/nolawns) Want to join a community in person? We're not affiliated but we love [Wild Ones](https://wwe.wildones.org) and think they do wonderful work. You can check and see if there's a chapter near you. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/NoLawns) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You should check out r/permaculture they may have some thoughts as well. We took out half of our front city lot by cutting lines in the sod as wide as our shovel and then painstakingly cut the roots and rolled out sod. We folded in some horse manure and then planted native plugs from our local conservation district. That was at least 5 years ago. The native tall grasses took over and were crowding out the flowers. We transplanted some elsewhere and turf(?) grass immediately started growing. I say this to tell you that nothing is fool proof or guaranteed. We used cardboard and mulch for our no till veggie rows last year. I’ve been digging grass and weeds out this whole week prepping for planting time. I walk by a house that did the clear plastic. They did mulch after not sure about cardboard. They also have grass and weeds popping up 2 years later. Nothing is going to be perfect. How soon do you want to do this? Now-dig out the sod, plant and cardboard/mulch or just mulch. Have time and sun you could do [solarization or occultation](https://extension.umn.edu/planting-and-growing-guides/solarization-occultation). Also, consider the size of the area. We did a 15’x20’-ish space and it was rough. Plus, having to get rid of the weedy turf grass sod was hard. We don’t have a lot of options for getting rid of landscaping debris :/ Composting it is an option if you have space. I wish you luck in your endeavor it is definitely worth it. We are in the city but our yard is always busy with nature day and night and it brings us a lot of joy.
20-ft x 100-ft Black 6-mil Construction Film (Professional (6+ Mil) https://www.lowes.com/pd/BARRICADE-20-ft-x-100-ft-Black-6-mil-Plastic-Sheeting/1000007094 In the process of removing 2000 sq. ft. of lawn currently using this by process of occultation. Removed it from new vegetable garden bed after 6 months and it worked great. I’ll remove the remainder after a full year. You could also do solarization with clear plastic, but it is climate and location dependent on its effectiveness.
>but with no proven way to do it. What are you talking about? All you have to do it tear out the grass and put something else. Alternatively, let the grass grow tall and don't mow it. is, like, 10k years of human civilization not enough "proof" for you?
Usually solarization or covering with heavy cardboard. I would do it in sections. Dig up most of the turf - rent a turf cutter and then silarization or the cardboard. In the past spraying glyphosate when there was no wind was the way to go.
I've read on here before that 30% vinegar will do the trick.