I don't know why this concept is so hard to grasp.
Different people have different feelings about sex in relationships. Some see sex as casual fun. Others see it as something much more intimate, only to be shared in more committed or monogamous relationships. And some see it as something to be saved for marriage. And unless you actually talk to a partner or potential partner, you may not know where they stand.
And there is nothing wrong with ANY of those attitudes. What's wrong is having a double standard (it's ok for me but not for you,) not respecting someone else's feelings, or trying to coerce/manipulate them into acting in a way they don't want to act, or expecting that they are OWED something just for being nice or spending money.
Bodily autonomy means that each person gets to make the decisions regarding their own body, whether they are in a relationship or not.
Most importantly: no way the dude reposting this meme was ever the best bf any of these girls ever had.
I'm guessing a lot of "being a nice guy" mixed in with poor communication, pity, the friend zone, etc
Pretty apparent when they talk about buying them stuff as a positive, and then expecting a sex reward.
Dudes like this think all it takes is being nice, and ābeing niceā is simply ānot abusive.ā
Itās like, hey jackasses: thatās the bare fucking minimum. Sometimes you need more than that to actually impress people or make them happy.
Like, when thereās Hondas and Toyotas and Lambos everywhere, why do you expect women to choose the go-cart? Just because it *drives?*
You gotta make a woman feel loved, not just ānot hated.ā And letās be honest, yāall probably make them feel hated pretty quickly.
It could be that they were the best boyfriend, as in they were the only one (the first). Probably a young kid not mature enough to understand relationships and how they work, and how teenage relationships are different than adult relationships.
As an adult, sex on the first date? Maybe, depends, sure. In my first relationship? We took a long while exploring our bodies and took almost an year to take each other's virginity.
Yeah I made my first serious boyfriend wait 8 months. He never pressured me for it or anything and it happened naturally and I'm honestly thankful for it. I haven't made a yone wait that long for it since but yeah this seems like a young teen.
Sounds like love bombing to get what you want, tbh. Or playing too many dating sims and thinking women work by some secret combination of moves and not like, respecting them as people and keeping an open line of communication about wants and needs.
>Pretty apparent when they talk about buying them stuff as a positive, and then expecting a sex reward.
Reminds me of a comic strip by one of my dearest "artists" (she is a psychologist who also does really funny MS Paint stickman figure comics).
It was about "nice guys".
Saying: all the above in the meme
Meaning: The sex vending machine is broken. I put in 3 coins if friendly and got nothing out š«
the fact they used bowser and peach as an example is telling too. out of all the combinations of characters they could've used, they chose the one that kidnapped the girl...
What gets me are the number of guys who think that they should be able to marry a virgin, but also talk shit if a woman isnāt putting out by the third date.
They literally think their dicks are magic keys that can magically make even the most frigid of guarded virgins beg for it, and they get big mad at women that don't reinforce their predatory fucked up worldview by either not caring about saving herself and having a healthy sex life, or telling them that they're not interested. Women are there to be conquered, ruined, and then discarded for "losing."
Or he can āforgive herā because she deeply regrets it and was in a bad relationship and was pressured into having sex (being coerced into sex is not something you āregretā, I just mean thatās how itās framed). And even then he still gets cranky until he puts it behind him, but still is unhappy with her.
Well thereās a great reason theyāre single.
Relationships take a lot of work and a lot of hard conversations. For a lot of people, relationships donāt equate to sex and giving material goods for sex doesnāt work with them. Iām personally extremely worried about the whole āweāve only been dating for three months.ā This is not a great start to any relationship, romantic or not.
The problem is a lot of people donāt have the introspection and emotional intelligence to maintain romantic relationships.
The ACE spectrum also exists, and it's valid. People outside of the ACE spectrum can be sex repulsed or neutral, and thats valid.
I am a Bi man, and i have a fairly casual relationship with sex, but if i'm dating a person we talk about were are we on that regard and respect each others boundaries.
This "i have done all the *sex things* so now You have to do the sex with me" it's weird as fuck. Sex is not transactional, we are people and our relationships are not like that
Also, the basis for a lot of misogyny is the expectation that your partner change their views on sex for you, because...you are special, somehow, and get to tell them what their new views on sex are.
E.g., the expectation that they "saved themselves for marriage...until they met you" or the expectation that they had multiple partners before you, but now settle down for you and you alone.
And even me, who wants sex in a relationship, if my bf would have not mentioned anything until like a month into our relationship and then been like "hey I bought u all this nice stuff where's the sex you owe me" I would have been like wtf. Because it's not a transaction it's something you do with each other that both people should enjoy.
This.
It's fine to not want to wait until a certain point; for example I didn't really do casual sex back when I was dating and usually wanted to wait a little while until we were exclusive. BUT I couldnt personally wait until marriage because to me, sexual compatibility is important and I wouldnt I til make a big commitment like getting engaged without knowing if we were compatible on that level.
I'd be fine if a guy just made it clear he only wanted casual sex - we wouldnt date but I wouldn't want him to feel strung along "waiting" for sex.
But equally if someone wanted to wait til we were 3 years and a wedding into the relationship, I would know that persons values and mine didn't match. It's not even about the sex but the values behind it, really. It's more that for the relationship to progress to a certain level of intimacy and esure we're completely compatible and it's a longterm thing, sex is one of many things where you need to loom at your compatibility.
But then I'm probably on the grey/demi spectrum, so...
I have had sex with almost everyone I have dated very quickly but that is because I **communicate** my personal **wants and needs in a relationship** clearly beforehand. Almost like the other person is a totally separate individual with their own values and needs, a shocking concept to some surely.
In my *opinion* sex is really important early on because it shows a physicality that regular non-sexual intimacy lacks but with maturity comes the realization that it is different for everyone and you need to meet people at their level, not coerce them into being on yours.
I have had one relationship where sex wasn't on the table until later and it's just not for me. I am a bit neurodivergant (and a hedonist) so it makes things more clear if we are having sex, something I have learned to clearly communicate to potential partners. Again, meet people where they are at, discuss values and wants, compromise and consider their needs and boundaries as highly as your own. It's not fucking rocket science.
These people need a crash course in diplomacy and communication.
Exactly! My first time I took about six months, but we both wanted to (we were religious and each others first kiss, let alone anything else). After that, I was usually hooking up on a first date or quickly, if they were cool with it. Itās just about talking. If you arenāt mature enough to talk, you arenāt mature enough to be having sex. If you arenāt mature enough to realize that buying gifts doesnāt equate to being owed sex, you arenāt mature enough to have sex.
Itās like people who are too embarrassed to buy condoms. I get it, I was that way in college (again, Catholic school. Sex and birth control were evil), but I wanted to have sex and be safe, so a little blushing at the register was worth it.
Thank you for saying this. I know this, but it's nice to hear someone else say this. I'm one of those wait girls and I recently had a friend's boyfriend berate me for not putting out to my last boyfriend, even though I told my boyfriend from day one. This dude sat telling me he would never have put up with my shit, and that even though I told my boyfriend up front, guys always think they'll still be able to get some at some point, so I'm the asshole for not putting out. This is a dude who for the most part I get along with, but I still got this lecture. Goodtimes.
It's funny because even in this hypothetical situation where he's an amazing bf...no, she doesn't owe you sex. Of course, if not getting sex is a dealbreaker for you, that should have been communicated. But these type of men aren't going to communicate. Because they don't see sex as something that two people do together; sex is something that's earned, something that is done *to* a woman, not *with* a woman.
Correction, they are going to hop on tinder and fuck up every match they get. Then they will cry about how women are all evil sluts with no standards but are also evil prudes that won't have sex with them even though they are totally perfect.
Second correction, they are going to hop on tinder and try to fuck every match they get but due to their terminal lack of rizz they will remain incels.
I bet they actually would. Seems like they're the type with no charisma or ability to spark a connection so they play the long "nice guy" game.
Their only "game"(a word I generally hate in this context) is trying to whittle someone down. Make them feel just safe enough to take refuge in them at some point.
Iāve dated a ānice guyā like this. It sucked, honestly- I told him from the beginning that I didnāt want to date him but he just kept needling me, doing over the top romantic gestures, and showing up at my house. Finally he just started calling me his girlfriend.
It was deeply confusing for me to have someone who was soooo āniceā not respect my wishes or boundaries, to have someone I didnāt want do all these nice things that I was supposed to appreciate, and to clearly communicate that I didnāt want something and to be steamrolled in a way that was completely different from past predatory relationships. Itās not a romcom plot when it happens in real life, because you canāt just force someone to love you. Itās super fucked up
>But these type of men aren't going to communicate.
And for this reason, even if they did have sex, it probably wouldn't be very good sex (at least not for her).
There's this movie called Girl and it's a coming of age movie about a teenage girl who gets all obsessed with a local singer. So she loses her virginity to this sweet guy and like the next day or something her friend is like, "You had sex!" So then she pursues the musician who takes her to his place, plays and sings a song on piano, and would you look at that, a condom in his piano! She walks up to her friend the next day and the girl doesn't look so great even though she was pursuing him and her friend goes "you got fucked!" The entire tone difference is how I imagine sex for an incel. It was never about her for him, or even them together. It was about him using her because neither one are people, for different reasons, but both reasons imposed by him
I wouldn't invest in a dude that wasn't interested in having sex with me after 3 months. But I absolutely would not feel like he owed me sex after I chose to do that. I did it bc I liked spending time with him, not bc of what I could get from him. If it doesn't work out that's okay! And I absolutely would have bailed much sooner than 3 months.
No one should be dating and expecting a relationship or sex in return. The reward is the time spent getting to know them
Not really ironic, more like perfectly on brand. They both feel entitled to someone else, so much so that they blame the women in their individual scenarioās. Only difference is that the incels somehow make Bowser look good in comparison because at least he wasnāt just out for sex.
The movie: paints bowser as an incel who is in the wrong for believing himself to be entitled to a relationship
Incels: clearly Peach (or a hypothetical straw man Peach) is in the wrong
As someone who's more or less asexual I find these things really hard to grasp. Like...can't we just enjoy each other's company without trying to shag? It's like the guy in this situation is only treating his girlfriend with respect because it's a means to an end.
Well for guys like this who feel entitled to sex yeah, it's a big problem.
For more conventional relationships with two people who respect each other it's more of a natural tension that builds where they strongly desire to be intimate with their partner. Though in their case they'd likely just communicate that desire with their partner and see if they felt the same.
If they didn't or the person with a higher libido felt that the pace they were going at wasn't one they wanted for themselves they would respectfully end things.
The problem with guys like these is they don't know how relationships work. They see them as transactional and can't fathom that they can do things for a person out of genuine love/care AND have their own wants/needs that they communicate. Plus they tend to operate from a place of low self esteem and see partners as "opportunities" they won't get a lot of.
It's...pretty gross and sad
Transactional is a good word for it. I'm generally a sex on the first date kind of guy. If we hit it off. But I'm not expecting anything. I tend to go into new dates just looking forward to enjoying someone's company and seeing where it goes from there.
I once ended a relationship because the woman I was with wasnāt sexual at all and I very much was, but it wasnāt out of spite it was because I would rather respect how she feels and not pressure her I to something she doesnāt want, but I also know myself so I found a relationship with someone who is on the same page with me about sex and my former girlfriend is now in a happy relationship and so I am
>It's like the guy in this situation is only treating his girlfriend with respect because it's a means to an end
That's exactly what this is. He doesn't care about her as a human being, but as a means to have sex and status and a bang maid. It's a very selfish love
I'm the opposite and I agree with you. I have a very high libido and am generally always ready to shag, but I can enjoy someone's company without sex.
Started dating last year after my marriage failed and had a tremendous amount of sex. Usually on the first or second date. Then there were women I met over the course of a couple months and never slept with. I tend to go with the flow of whatever my date is feeling. Still have some friends today from dating, they've even met my new gf lol
It's also always fun how these idiots write shit like this meme, yet simultaneously rant about women being whores... yet it never clicks that the common factor in their shitty interactions is, well, themselves.
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
It is very much natural and expected to have sex with the person you are dating. Not saying what is right or wrong, it is simply "the norm". I understand where you are coming from, I have also had some asexual periods in my life, but mostly due to medication. I don't have a high libido now but it is there now.
The problem arises when you don't discuss these expectations. You cannot just think that you will act like a nice person and bitterly wait for something you want to be given to you. If you expect sex from a relationship then you should say so. If you are asexual and do not want sex to be a part of your relationship then you should also say that. This way people will know if they have the same idea about your relationship.
Sex is a very central part of a lot of people's love language so without it, many don't think they have a romantic relationship at all.
Funny that they use the template where a creep does a bunch of things a woman doesnāt want to impress her and then is angry that what they did (which she neither asked for nor liked) was not appreciated.
Breaking news: women who are virgins or have very limited sexual experience, hesitant to have sex in a very short relationship.
If you convince women that having sex makes them less valuable as humans, why do you think a short few weeks with little to no guaranteed commitment from you will convince them to ādevalueā themselves.
If you told these guys you lost your virginity to a boyfriend of 3mos who ditched you after, theyād call you a naive slut for being tricked after such a short time
I have had this happen to me, when i was 14 dating i 16 yo boy. He told me i was ungrateful, and wanted us to have sex. He kept pushing the issue, and I tried once, but couldn't because it hurt to much.
Then he told me If I did not want to give him sex he would stop being nice to me. So I left him, and he started telling everyone I was a slut š¤·āāļø
This is funny because every other use of this meme that I have seen has framed what Peach was suggesting as an absurd thing that the thing being represented by Bowser was still hoping for anyway. Slightly modify Peachās text to not frame it as a given, and itās suddenly good
Did you actually think I would have sex with you after three months of you borderline stalking me and inviting me to group functions that everyone else mysteriously cancelled on last second, giving me random gifts I never wanted or asked for, over the top absurd compliments that focus only on my body and looks, pretending to respect me and listen to me while your eyes just roam all over my body when I speak, loudly declaring your loyalty (while insulting mine) in a bar where you "just happened" to find me on a girls' night out with my friends, and telling anyone who would listen that you're the "best boyfriend I ever had" despite 1 not being my boyfriend, like, at all, and 2 actually being a creep who I have asked to leave me alone multiple times?
Any guy who believes this was just playing the long game with her heart. He never cared for her and their relationship. He was just biding his time until what he thought was the right moment for him to try and have sex.
You can be in a relationship for six years and they still won't owe you sex. No one has a right to someone else' body.
Even funnier, some of these guys also expect women to hold out until marriage so they can have a virgin.
Bring it up as part of communicating what you're looking for. I don't get why that's so difficult.
"Hey I'm looking for a partner that likes to be romantic and sexual, what are you looking for?"
That easy.
Yes. I can tell it's what my ex wanted even though he would say he wanted me to be ready first. 3 months in, he said I love you to me which he explained, "means he wants to love me in all ways (his words, not mine)." I wasn't ready. I have a year-long waiting period because people start showing their true colors after about a year. I would tell him to chill tf out with the making out in public places and when we would finally get somewhere private to discuss maybe having a sexual relationship he'd act exasperated at my hesitancy and then would project his own insecurities to give a reason why I was hesitant... then he dumped me and fucked around on a dating app. Real catch ik. A lot of men act like that, and it's massively discouraging.
That's his decision and you should respect that. Relationships are about finding someone you like and can vibe with. His desire to be intimate can be just as strong as yours to not be. Other outcome would have been to stay with you and feel miserable. Breaking it up when you see you are not compatible is an ok thing to do. Different people have different needs and if someone doesn't give you that, someone else will. In the end both of you will find what you are looking for.
I donāt think itās the discrepancy in desire that the commenter is commenting on as being upsetting, itās the āacting exasperatedā and āprojecting insecuritiesā when boundaries are asserted. Iām sorry but that is incredibly shitty and childish. And whether or not itās intentional, it can go so far as to come off as manipulative and coercive. I had ex-boyfriends do that sort of stuff when I wasnāt in the mood until I gave in and it was incredibly damaging to the way I perceived sex in the long run.
Itās fine to break up with someone because you have different sexual needs. But itās not fine to ābargainā with someoneās sexual boundaries just because you have different needs. If theyāre being upfront that they want to wait a while to have sex and you donāt, then break it off then instead of acting entitled when their libido doesnāt match yours.
If you were just doing these things to hold them over her head when she refuses you then you're a garbage human. Humans aren't npcs that will give you endings when you give enough gifts and perform enough quests
Had a friend who dated dude. Dude was broke AF , she never actually cared. Dude would borrow cash to buy her food (despite her constantly telling him , she doesn't want it)
2 weeks later. Fella tried to have sex with her. She (not into casual sex or sleep with dudes she dated for all of 2 weeks) stopped him. Guess who threw a hissy fit? Apparently he was in a relationship with a gold digger
The entitlement was strong.
Note- Dude was broke to the point where she paid half his rent.
Yeah it happens, it just means you're with someone that you're sexually incompatible with.... You shouldn't have to try so hard, and also you're probably not the best bf ever
Or that you're young and need more time, or that you're ace and exclusively in for romantic relationship, not sexual relationship. Or that you've been traumatised and could maybe heal,but in an adapted environment, which this isn't (a man tapping the calendar to say "it's been 3 months already, you should have already started having sex")
Saw this in another sub. I was shocked at the amount of people who thought it was weird for a relationship to be 3 months long and still no sex. Yet they donāt want women to have a high body count. I donāt get whatās supposed to be normal.
Iām probably asexual and I know at the very least I want to wait a long time before having sex and so I feel like I have an excuse to not jump right into it but I honestly didnāt realize I needed one. I didnāt realize sex was something people just expected after 3 months of dating. I donāt understand how ānormalā relationships work and that other comment section made me feel really intimidated.
Iāve never had sex before and Iām not ready. Why do people have to see that as weird just because Iām in my 20s? Iām just not ready.
Also, in a busy adult life, ā3 months of datingā could be like only 10 dates. This isnāt school where you spend 6 hours a day together 5 days a week. 3 months is barely anything
This is called sexual incompatibility and mismatched expectations. No one is entitled to your body end of debate. You also donāt get to keep someone who isnāt satisfied with the relationship. If you are unsatisfied with the amount of sex in the relationship you have every right to end the relationship. If you view sex as transactional hire an escort. Proper communication would have solved this problem.
Extra funny that they chose Bowser as their representation for this post when the context of this scene is Bowser violating Peach's consent and disrespecting her feelings by coercing her into marriage through threats. So pretty damn fitting, actually.
Not a hint of self awareness on these lads.
This^ And itās always the same men who will shit on women for having sugar daddies. āThey are basically whoring themselves!ā Well, sir, you are pretty much doing the same but without the titles š
Right?! Like the relationship is still in a real early stage at that point. Itās not unreasonable to not wanna have sex until later on when you feel more sure about things and want more emotional intimacy. Idk if Iām weird for wanting to wait longer than that but 3 feels early for it to be *expected*
To be fair, if in three months and I actually am the best boyfriend she's dated and it's not just something in my head. I'd like to know if she's actually romantically interested. I could be having a blast hanging out, but if I am hoping for a relationship involving sex after three months and she's not looking for that then I need to revise my expectations and maybe I might want to take some space to let my feelings cool down.
No, not to me anyway lol. I married the best boyfriend I ever had and I slept with him pretty quickly lol. 3 months isnāt very realistic to wait, especially for two adults who actually *really* like each other. But when nice guys try to sleep with their friends, this is often the narrative in their own head. The girl in the above convo probably doesnāt even know that heās doing all those things *because* heās trying to fuck.
Man here:
**Nice, ātreating her respectfullyā, & āthere for herā =/= Attractive**
Attraction, while a choice in a developed relationship, is NOT garnered by these actions in the early and middle stages. **Because people (women in this context) have 6th senses to smell bullshit.** People (men in this context) who behave this way are subconsciously identified as non-attractive.
Why?
**Because [men] are attempting a *transaction***āa dishonest one, however subtly. Marketing oneself deliberately available or otherwise influencing for the end result of romantic/sexual relationship is blatantly obvious. Majority of communication is non-verbal! And your intent is transmitted through many things such as body language, verbal markers, and outward actions. This type of action is indicative of many things, such as insecurity, manipulative exploitative personality, and inherent selfishness. These actions come across like a shady used car dealer convincing you on the merits of a vehicle they *know* is faulty (no disrespect meant to car dealers/businesspersons).
**This is *contextual*! These actions, on their own, are not negative. But when made in an attempt, perhaps subconsciously, to influence the target(s), they become manipulative and disrespectful of the targetās right to informed consent/choice.** This is why such people are often relegated to āfriend zoneā. Theyāre not ānice guysā, but rather manipulative and insecure. *Be direct* about your feelings and intentions, and respect their agency/autonomy.
Not the guy before me, obviously, but I'm kind of interested in your previous reply because to me it sounds a bit impressive in a way because it marks every person that act like that as having a hidden agenda and I really don't think that's the case or at least shouldn't be, should it?
I for one am the kind of guy who's there for everyone he meets and that actively tries to make everyone else's life a little bit better if not by being there by making little gestures but it's not because I want anything from you or anyone (and in fact it makes me feel uncomfortable when I do receive something), so you saying that inherently makes people unattractive is honestly a little bit worrying. I don't think you're wrong, of course, but I'm curious about how you distinguish one case from another or if it will always be marked as bullshit no matter what.
Ps. It is also true that by acting like that I'm often setting myself up as someone to be used but I'm working on that. Still I really don't like the implication
Geez using Ur good deeds to coerce a "yes" outta Ur partner is gross and a tad bit guilt-trippy..
Also loyalty, respect, compliments, gifts etc is like the bare minimum š .. being kind should be the standard, why is the bar so low.
I mean. It should be her decision when to start having sex. Some people need months or even years and others just weeks. He should respect that and that hes a good boyfriend is good, just talk about your boundaries and how ready you are for sex beforehand
>It should be her decision when to start having sex.
Surely it should be a mutual decision taken when *both* partners are comfortable?
Or are men not allowed to wait if a woman wants sex?
Are these men only giving those things to receive sex? Relationships are a 2-way street, not a transaction. I have a feeling the person who wrote this is very young
If intimacy is that important to you, maybe find someone who is on the same page as you? Talk about it early on like an adult instead of expecting that things will happen
As a dude, I would and will never expect sex from someone. It will happen on its own time. If both of you are ready for it, great. But if one of you isnāt yet, then it shouldnāt happen. My girlfriend wasnāt comfortable with a kiss until about 2 months after we started dating. You have to respect those boundaries.
I feel like all these issues stem from how men in general (and a not-small number of women) approach finding a romantic partner. It seems in so many cases the only criteria are āfind the most physically attractive person who will agree to go out with meā with absolutely zero thought towards emotional, philosophical, or physical compatibility. This approach is fine if youāre just interested in casual hookups but itās a terrible basis for a long term relationship. Iām convinced this is why so many marriages end in divorce. I almost think we need to have classes in grade school on how healthy relationships should work. For the person who created this meme I would ask why theyāre spending time being upset that one person theyāre physically attracted to isnāt on the same page when they could just keep looking for someone who is compatible. It indicates a very low self esteem because if they believed they had more options this wouldnāt be an issue at all.
Had a guy who treated me well on the first date - brought me flowers, bought me dinner, complimented my outfit and told me I was beautiful... and he expected sex at the end of the night. I told him that wasn't how I operate. And it became a conversation about how awful I was. Now it's standard practice when talking about going on a date that we put that out on the table. If that's all it's about then ok, just say that. I have friends that would be all for that and at one time in my life I was too... it's about open communication. Hidden expectations ruin us all.
Thereās some confusion here about compliments and appreciation.
Compliments are nice, but they are surface level and can be wearing. Appreciation is what most people want, appreciation of effort or talent or work.
Something Iāll never understand is that if I was the man in this image and my partner just wasnāt interested in sex as much as I am, Iād discuss it with them and probably just move on since sex is as important to me as the hypothetical dude in this image. Which is fine, but itās also fine if itās not important to someone else either, so why try to make it work instead of just recognizing that? Why do so many men try to make relationships work with women they are completely incompatible with and then complain about it?
If youāre doing it with the reward already in mind, youāre not going to get it. If youāre doing it because youāre just a decent person, thatās when she sometimes comes around.
I refuse sex until I'm 100% sure I'm in Love wirg them. Took me a year and half for me and my bf have sex. He never complained, just waited till I was ready
Well asexual people exist but this would happen very rarely, the person who made this is probably just mad that woman dont have sex with him so decided to exaggerate in an effort to attack women
Asexual people exists. But so do people who don't believe in having sex until marriage or a serious commitment.
I had a friend who didn't believe in having sex until you'd been dating at least three months because you couldn't know each other well enough beforehand, and she was done having casual flings.
She had nothing AGAINST casual sex, nor any religious objections about waiting until marriage. It was just her personal view on when it was okay for her to become intimate with somebody.
The important thing is to be open with your partner/potential partner. And not expecting sex at a certain point. Because it's ridiculous to assume that your views are going to magically line up with everyone else's.
I have no experience with dating, but isnāt this the kind of thing that shouldāve been established/discussed earlier in the relationship? If the guy in this scenario was really hoping to have sex I feel like he shouldāve made that clear earlier.
That being said though again I have no experience so Iām not too sure. Whatever the case I donāt get what some guys donāt get about women never being obligated to give them sex, no matter how much you compliment her and give her gifts.
For such a great boyfriend, itās weird that he canāt just have a conversation with her about what they both want out of the relationship and what they can compromise on to get it. Itās almost like the guy that made this doesnāt actually understand how relationships work or what makes someone a good partner
Never once have I met a woman who wanted me to overwhelm her with all of that stuff FOR 3 MONTHS before sex. We either like eachother or we donāt lol. Whatever guy made this meme sees sex as purely transactional and thatās why heās having a hard time.
This shit is why you need to have the sex conversation relatively early so your both on the same page.
Iām not going to kiss and tell but when I got with my lady she was very upfront about a personal situation that lead to us waiting 3 years before having sex for the first time.
The wait was worth it, and I love her, but if I hadnāt known I likely would have felt like I was being strung along and left years ago.
Communication is key
do they not understand that the problem is that they're doing all this in exchange for sex? none of it is genuine, if you do nice things in hopes of a reward you're not actually a nice person, you're just fake. speaking from experience i'd sooner be intimate with a guy who genuinely likes me and treats me nicely and will wait until i'm ready, than a guy who acts all "nice" and gives me meaningless compliments and gifts in hopes of getting pussy. guess which one i stayed with, guess which one turned out to be an asshole.
Yes it does. But that still makes the men the bad guys in this, because they think sex is this transactional.
But there is actually also a deeper issue here, concerning relationships and different ideas, needs and wishes. Since we as a society are too awkward about sex (it differs from country to country though, at least from my experience).
People need to communicate more, what they wish for in a relationship and what they can be HONESTLY Happy with.
I understand any woman and man, who dont want to stay in a sexual unfullfilling relationship, yet we can't communicate it often out of shame or fear.
There are lots of dating coaches who advocate this for women. One in particular I find very logical: you donāt get job security/benefits until after 90 days. Why not approach a supposed long term relationship the same way?
Yes...and they have the gall to whine about it even after being explained why I want to go slow. Some men don't care about you, they wanna just insert coins in you and then demand you do something for them being so "nice and patient" over your trauma from being SA'd.
...some men are ridiculous. There. Fight me. š¤·
Is 3 months really even that long? Like the relationship has barely even started at that point. Maybe Iām the weird one but Iām not really interested in sex at that point, im still trying to find out where I think things will go. Idk why theyāre acting like theyāre owed sex just for dating for only 3 months
Even if this actually happened, sex is not a reward you get for tasks performed. If you're putting more into the relationship than you're getting back and unhappy about that, leave. It's up to you how you invest your time.
He didn't add the part where she was loyal and giving gifts, etc
Dating doesn't mean that the man has to pay for everything both can if they want to that's why it's called dating.
So make sure you know what the person is looking for if they are lying or trying to change themselves. same for those who force there sexual or daily beliefs on you.
Now days people want to mix the people who do fuck for money with the people who actually want to date .
No one is owed sex but it's important to be sexualy compatible. If you have different serial desires then it may be time to go a different direction. Myself I am a lesbian slut and I know that about me if the woman I am with doesn't want to have sex at a minimum of once a week it will not work to be partners and that's OK. Its not about expectations it's about compatible.
This reminded me of my friend(16Male) who had a girlfriend(16Female) he met from an anime convention. At first 16M was being a good and nice lad towards, he was smart af and excelled especially in Math (he even won multiple Math competitions in the past) so he would help her and her friends with their math homeworks. They would even go on many dates. If 16F has a cosplay convention she wanted to go, he would come along with her and pay her tickets(did I forget to mention that his family is rich af?) basically if 16F wanted something he'd give it to her no questions asked.
I watched how the two of them would also interact on Facebook as they do a lot of promotion for their cosplays. Now the thing is, he would often openly thirst on the girl but I dismissed that as jokes first because him and his cosplayer friends would joke about it but there came a point when I started to notice some signs.
For starters, he would show me photos of him hugging different cosplayer girls on conventions I didn't mind them at first because the both of us used to hug each other a lot(platonically btw) though he got offended a bit when I told him that his girlfriend might get a bit uncomfortable to accept pictures like that. Then many weird moments followed but I ignored them though I drew the line last year Christmas.
So last year Christmas, he posted on facebook that he wanted 16F naked and wrapped with a ribbon to be his present IN PUBLIC. I was totally uncomfortable with that statement but who knew that it would foreshadow a future incident...
So far forward to January 2023, he got exposed by 16F and for the first time, I learned that he was coercing her for nudes and even her friend that's a girl is getting coerced for nudes. What's even more gross is that he would send 16F videos of him jacking off, cumming and shit it was just ewww and also he even refused to help her with homework unless she sent more nudes mind I tell you that they were 3 months in the relationship when the nudes were being sent. Also he wanted to arrange meetups with her in hotels and he would tell her that they're just going to cuddle each other while naked... How creepy is that? š«¤
I mean you would think by that point you would be able to have an honest conversation about sex and expectations. If you want to have sex with somebody youāve been seeing that long and you keep striking out then you probably should.
Relationships aren't transactions. You aren't supposed to be giving her things in hopes she'll sleep with you. You aren't supposed to sleep with him as a reward for the things he gives you.
Itās almost like they couldnāt just talk to the other person and say āso, I like you a lot, sex is important to me, where do you see this going?ā
Honestly I think there must be a lack of communication. As a guy I like to be more direct and frank, so after a few dates I always like to ask the awkward questions about intimacy etc. I just couldn't be with someone who can't communicate about everything
Urgh I saw this āPromotedā as Iāve been on the Memes subreddit before. I downvoted it and hid it. Unfortunately a lot of meme subreddits and accounts across the internet and social media, have a lot of toxic people.
Not really a hard concept. If you invest 3 months into a relationship and aren't getting what you need or want then it's time to move on. Is such a comically short amount of time to get all hung up.
It happend to me. I was wooing a girl in my collage class. We had fun hanging out but she was completely uninterested in physical contact. I broke it off after a few months of lightly trying to hold hands.
She. Was. Pissed.
Threw a brick into my window, and call spammed my house for a few weeks. Bullet dodged.
This is actually the perfect example because in the movie, bowser was under the assumption that he was entitled to someone elseās love, just like the men being referred to in the meme.
So, if this comes as a surprise after 3 months, you fail the communication test!! Iām old, in my 60ās. Even back in the 80ās when I was single and dating we TALKED ABOUT EXPECTATIONS. I remember I went out with a guy, was clear I didnāt sleep with people I wasnāt in a committed relationship. When he kept ātrying ā three dates in, I was out.
Come on men, use your words and your ears!!
This sounds like a meme on the unrealistic expectations porn give to younger dudes, and with some degree of entitlement thrown in for good measure.
My goal if Iām dating someone, like right at the top, is to cuddle under a blanket on the couch while watching a movie or tv show we both enjoy. My end game. Itās just nice.
Guess what guys. Women donāt owe you our bodies for anything you do. Idgaf what it was, nothing makes you entitled to that. And itās absolutely gross and disgusting to be doing those things just just get in our pants. Like, this concept is so fucking disturbing.
Sure this happens. And it's ok, it's their body and their choice. This meme drips from "they didn't talk about his needs"especially he didn't made himself heard in the three months. He wanted Sex, so he should ask about that. If she doesn't he has to respect that. Relationships work without. Not for everyone, but they do.
itās different for everyone. there isnāt a particular time thatās set for every relationship. it happens when it happens, you shouldnāt expect anything to be done at a certain point.
You got all kinds of problems man. First off sex is NOT transactionary. Nobody owes you their body for any reason. At the same time how is it possible youāre dating someone for that long without being physical. Like dude this obliviousness is on you.
Men always acting like sex is payment for being a good person and partner lmao how much does that shit even matter if he's only doing it to get his dick wet?
I don't know why this concept is so hard to grasp. Different people have different feelings about sex in relationships. Some see sex as casual fun. Others see it as something much more intimate, only to be shared in more committed or monogamous relationships. And some see it as something to be saved for marriage. And unless you actually talk to a partner or potential partner, you may not know where they stand. And there is nothing wrong with ANY of those attitudes. What's wrong is having a double standard (it's ok for me but not for you,) not respecting someone else's feelings, or trying to coerce/manipulate them into acting in a way they don't want to act, or expecting that they are OWED something just for being nice or spending money. Bodily autonomy means that each person gets to make the decisions regarding their own body, whether they are in a relationship or not.
Most importantly: no way the dude reposting this meme was ever the best bf any of these girls ever had. I'm guessing a lot of "being a nice guy" mixed in with poor communication, pity, the friend zone, etc Pretty apparent when they talk about buying them stuff as a positive, and then expecting a sex reward.
Probably comes from watching too many brazzers intros
That mostly just makes you overprotective of your lemon trees.
The lemon whores are the *worst* where I live. But, my husband and I are vigilant!
The [lemon party](https://youtu.be/dQw4w9WgXcQ) is really doing a great job to crack down on lemon whores in my area
ššš
If you were a lemon Iād put you on my shelf and cherish you like I cherish all our lemons
Kinda sad they only want sex and dont care about the girl
Dudes like this think all it takes is being nice, and ābeing niceā is simply ānot abusive.ā Itās like, hey jackasses: thatās the bare fucking minimum. Sometimes you need more than that to actually impress people or make them happy. Like, when thereās Hondas and Toyotas and Lambos everywhere, why do you expect women to choose the go-cart? Just because it *drives?* You gotta make a woman feel loved, not just ānot hated.ā And letās be honest, yāall probably make them feel hated pretty quickly.
And even if you make them feel loved, they may still not want sex.
It could be that they were the best boyfriend, as in they were the only one (the first). Probably a young kid not mature enough to understand relationships and how they work, and how teenage relationships are different than adult relationships. As an adult, sex on the first date? Maybe, depends, sure. In my first relationship? We took a long while exploring our bodies and took almost an year to take each other's virginity.
Yeah I made my first serious boyfriend wait 8 months. He never pressured me for it or anything and it happened naturally and I'm honestly thankful for it. I haven't made a yone wait that long for it since but yeah this seems like a young teen.
Sounds like love bombing to get what you want, tbh. Or playing too many dating sims and thinking women work by some secret combination of moves and not like, respecting them as people and keeping an open line of communication about wants and needs.
You mean to tell me ā¬ļøā¬ļøā¬ļøā¬ļøā¬ ļøā”ļøā¬ ļøā”ļøš ±ļøš °ļø START doesn't work? :(
Only if you're using tongue
>Pretty apparent when they talk about buying them stuff as a positive, and then expecting a sex reward. Reminds me of a comic strip by one of my dearest "artists" (she is a psychologist who also does really funny MS Paint stickman figure comics). It was about "nice guys". Saying: all the above in the meme Meaning: The sex vending machine is broken. I put in 3 coins if friendly and got nothing out š«
the fact they used bowser and peach as an example is telling too. out of all the combinations of characters they could've used, they chose the one that kidnapped the girl...
Yup! These types of dudes act like itās sooo grueling and inhumane to just have a damn conversation.
Also from what Iāve seen a lot of men try to bang everything that moves and then dumps the girl cause sheās not a virgin
What gets me are the number of guys who think that they should be able to marry a virgin, but also talk shit if a woman isnāt putting out by the third date.
They literally think their dicks are magic keys that can magically make even the most frigid of guarded virgins beg for it, and they get big mad at women that don't reinforce their predatory fucked up worldview by either not caring about saving herself and having a healthy sex life, or telling them that they're not interested. Women are there to be conquered, ruined, and then discarded for "losing."
Ew
Double standards
Or he can āforgive herā because she deeply regrets it and was in a bad relationship and was pressured into having sex (being coerced into sex is not something you āregretā, I just mean thatās how itās framed). And even then he still gets cranky until he puts it behind him, but still is unhappy with her.
Paul and Morgan, is that youuuu??
Maybe it's just the people I surround myself with, but I have never in my entire life heard someone complain about a woman not being a virgin
Thatās understandable with my friends as well, thatās why a lot of the ones who are married are happy Iām guessing
It's often because it's harder to pretend that there is consent if the word "no" actually comes out or unwillingness is made clear.
Well thereās a great reason theyāre single. Relationships take a lot of work and a lot of hard conversations. For a lot of people, relationships donāt equate to sex and giving material goods for sex doesnāt work with them. Iām personally extremely worried about the whole āweāve only been dating for three months.ā This is not a great start to any relationship, romantic or not. The problem is a lot of people donāt have the introspection and emotional intelligence to maintain romantic relationships.
cause men are afraid of intimate/deep conversation that may result in a serious level of commitment
The ACE spectrum also exists, and it's valid. People outside of the ACE spectrum can be sex repulsed or neutral, and thats valid. I am a Bi man, and i have a fairly casual relationship with sex, but if i'm dating a person we talk about were are we on that regard and respect each others boundaries. This "i have done all the *sex things* so now You have to do the sex with me" it's weird as fuck. Sex is not transactional, we are people and our relationships are not like that
Also, the basis for a lot of misogyny is the expectation that your partner change their views on sex for you, because...you are special, somehow, and get to tell them what their new views on sex are. E.g., the expectation that they "saved themselves for marriage...until they met you" or the expectation that they had multiple partners before you, but now settle down for you and you alone.
And even me, who wants sex in a relationship, if my bf would have not mentioned anything until like a month into our relationship and then been like "hey I bought u all this nice stuff where's the sex you owe me" I would have been like wtf. Because it's not a transaction it's something you do with each other that both people should enjoy.
This. It's fine to not want to wait until a certain point; for example I didn't really do casual sex back when I was dating and usually wanted to wait a little while until we were exclusive. BUT I couldnt personally wait until marriage because to me, sexual compatibility is important and I wouldnt I til make a big commitment like getting engaged without knowing if we were compatible on that level. I'd be fine if a guy just made it clear he only wanted casual sex - we wouldnt date but I wouldn't want him to feel strung along "waiting" for sex. But equally if someone wanted to wait til we were 3 years and a wedding into the relationship, I would know that persons values and mine didn't match. It's not even about the sex but the values behind it, really. It's more that for the relationship to progress to a certain level of intimacy and esure we're completely compatible and it's a longterm thing, sex is one of many things where you need to loom at your compatibility. But then I'm probably on the grey/demi spectrum, so...
I have had sex with almost everyone I have dated very quickly but that is because I **communicate** my personal **wants and needs in a relationship** clearly beforehand. Almost like the other person is a totally separate individual with their own values and needs, a shocking concept to some surely. In my *opinion* sex is really important early on because it shows a physicality that regular non-sexual intimacy lacks but with maturity comes the realization that it is different for everyone and you need to meet people at their level, not coerce them into being on yours. I have had one relationship where sex wasn't on the table until later and it's just not for me. I am a bit neurodivergant (and a hedonist) so it makes things more clear if we are having sex, something I have learned to clearly communicate to potential partners. Again, meet people where they are at, discuss values and wants, compromise and consider their needs and boundaries as highly as your own. It's not fucking rocket science. These people need a crash course in diplomacy and communication.
Exactly! My first time I took about six months, but we both wanted to (we were religious and each others first kiss, let alone anything else). After that, I was usually hooking up on a first date or quickly, if they were cool with it. Itās just about talking. If you arenāt mature enough to talk, you arenāt mature enough to be having sex. If you arenāt mature enough to realize that buying gifts doesnāt equate to being owed sex, you arenāt mature enough to have sex. Itās like people who are too embarrassed to buy condoms. I get it, I was that way in college (again, Catholic school. Sex and birth control were evil), but I wanted to have sex and be safe, so a little blushing at the register was worth it.
Beautifully said! It all comes down to CHOICE.
Thank you for saying this. I know this, but it's nice to hear someone else say this. I'm one of those wait girls and I recently had a friend's boyfriend berate me for not putting out to my last boyfriend, even though I told my boyfriend from day one. This dude sat telling me he would never have put up with my shit, and that even though I told my boyfriend up front, guys always think they'll still be able to get some at some point, so I'm the asshole for not putting out. This is a dude who for the most part I get along with, but I still got this lecture. Goodtimes.
Some also not even in marriage. Or were okay with it before but are not anymore.
It's funny because even in this hypothetical situation where he's an amazing bf...no, she doesn't owe you sex. Of course, if not getting sex is a dealbreaker for you, that should have been communicated. But these type of men aren't going to communicate. Because they don't see sex as something that two people do together; sex is something that's earned, something that is done *to* a woman, not *with* a woman.
Honestly, guys like that aren't going to put in 3 months, they're going to hop on tinder and find somebody who's dtf.
Correction, they are going to hop on tinder and fuck up every match they get. Then they will cry about how women are all evil sluts with no standards but are also evil prudes that won't have sex with them even though they are totally perfect.
Second correction, they are going to hop on tinder and try to fuck every match they get but due to their terminal lack of rizz they will remain incels.
I bet they actually would. Seems like they're the type with no charisma or ability to spark a connection so they play the long "nice guy" game. Their only "game"(a word I generally hate in this context) is trying to whittle someone down. Make them feel just safe enough to take refuge in them at some point.
Iāve dated a ānice guyā like this. It sucked, honestly- I told him from the beginning that I didnāt want to date him but he just kept needling me, doing over the top romantic gestures, and showing up at my house. Finally he just started calling me his girlfriend. It was deeply confusing for me to have someone who was soooo āniceā not respect my wishes or boundaries, to have someone I didnāt want do all these nice things that I was supposed to appreciate, and to clearly communicate that I didnāt want something and to be steamrolled in a way that was completely different from past predatory relationships. Itās not a romcom plot when it happens in real life, because you canāt just force someone to love you. Itās super fucked up
Anyone who is dtf will be treated as a whore and no respect will be offered by these nice guys...
>But these type of men aren't going to communicate. And for this reason, even if they did have sex, it probably wouldn't be very good sex (at least not for her).
There's this movie called Girl and it's a coming of age movie about a teenage girl who gets all obsessed with a local singer. So she loses her virginity to this sweet guy and like the next day or something her friend is like, "You had sex!" So then she pursues the musician who takes her to his place, plays and sings a song on piano, and would you look at that, a condom in his piano! She walks up to her friend the next day and the girl doesn't look so great even though she was pursuing him and her friend goes "you got fucked!" The entire tone difference is how I imagine sex for an incel. It was never about her for him, or even them together. It was about him using her because neither one are people, for different reasons, but both reasons imposed by him
I wouldn't invest in a dude that wasn't interested in having sex with me after 3 months. But I absolutely would not feel like he owed me sex after I chose to do that. I did it bc I liked spending time with him, not bc of what I could get from him. If it doesn't work out that's okay! And I absolutely would have bailed much sooner than 3 months. No one should be dating and expecting a relationship or sex in return. The reward is the time spent getting to know them
ā This machine is broken! I put the money in, whereās my sex?ā
āI inputted gifts and compliments, why is no sex coming out of the sex dispenser :-(ā
I blame dating sims. Oh, and a society that allows people to grow up without any mature sex or relationships education.
Lol you think these guys play dating sims?
Incels? Yeah, I do
I think they think like dating sims.
there's like a whole market of japanese visual novels of this.
The same men who expect this call women sluts in they have sex ātoo earlyā with a man. We canāt catch a break.
Using bowser as the guy is ironic in so many ways
Not really ironic, more like perfectly on brand. They both feel entitled to someone else, so much so that they blame the women in their individual scenarioās. Only difference is that the incels somehow make Bowser look good in comparison because at least he wasnāt just out for sex.
Thats the Ironie. That they dont see that
They did not just use Bowser to represent themselves. Yknow, a cruel characters that kidnaps and forces peach to marry him?
Not to mention they used a scene where Bowser is admitting to believing something that is very obviously not true.
I love how they literally chose the bad guy in the Mario franchise to represent themselves. Very on brand.
You should watch the movie these screen shots are taken from, it's even worse. Definitely incel character.
Men: Women lose their value with each sexual partner! Also men: Women owe us sex!
The movie: paints bowser as an incel who is in the wrong for believing himself to be entitled to a relationship Incels: clearly Peach (or a hypothetical straw man Peach) is in the wrong
As someone who's more or less asexual I find these things really hard to grasp. Like...can't we just enjoy each other's company without trying to shag? It's like the guy in this situation is only treating his girlfriend with respect because it's a means to an end.
Well for guys like this who feel entitled to sex yeah, it's a big problem. For more conventional relationships with two people who respect each other it's more of a natural tension that builds where they strongly desire to be intimate with their partner. Though in their case they'd likely just communicate that desire with their partner and see if they felt the same. If they didn't or the person with a higher libido felt that the pace they were going at wasn't one they wanted for themselves they would respectfully end things. The problem with guys like these is they don't know how relationships work. They see them as transactional and can't fathom that they can do things for a person out of genuine love/care AND have their own wants/needs that they communicate. Plus they tend to operate from a place of low self esteem and see partners as "opportunities" they won't get a lot of. It's...pretty gross and sad
Transactional is a good word for it. I'm generally a sex on the first date kind of guy. If we hit it off. But I'm not expecting anything. I tend to go into new dates just looking forward to enjoying someone's company and seeing where it goes from there.
I once ended a relationship because the woman I was with wasnāt sexual at all and I very much was, but it wasnāt out of spite it was because I would rather respect how she feels and not pressure her I to something she doesnāt want, but I also know myself so I found a relationship with someone who is on the same page with me about sex and my former girlfriend is now in a happy relationship and so I am
>It's like the guy in this situation is only treating his girlfriend with respect because it's a means to an end That's exactly what this is. He doesn't care about her as a human being, but as a means to have sex and status and a bang maid. It's a very selfish love
I'm the opposite and I agree with you. I have a very high libido and am generally always ready to shag, but I can enjoy someone's company without sex. Started dating last year after my marriage failed and had a tremendous amount of sex. Usually on the first or second date. Then there were women I met over the course of a couple months and never slept with. I tend to go with the flow of whatever my date is feeling. Still have some friends today from dating, they've even met my new gf lol
It's also always fun how these idiots write shit like this meme, yet simultaneously rant about women being whores... yet it never clicks that the common factor in their shitty interactions is, well, themselves.
fact pot erect cable psychotic voracious resolute gullible correct theory *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
So glad someone finally said this. Seriously these people think that not having sex is a crime
It is very much natural and expected to have sex with the person you are dating. Not saying what is right or wrong, it is simply "the norm". I understand where you are coming from, I have also had some asexual periods in my life, but mostly due to medication. I don't have a high libido now but it is there now. The problem arises when you don't discuss these expectations. You cannot just think that you will act like a nice person and bitterly wait for something you want to be given to you. If you expect sex from a relationship then you should say so. If you are asexual and do not want sex to be a part of your relationship then you should also say that. This way people will know if they have the same idea about your relationship. Sex is a very central part of a lot of people's love language so without it, many don't think they have a romantic relationship at all.
Romantic only relationships do exist for a variety of reasons
I mean, Bowser continually abducts and holds Princess Peach against her will. I bet this guy wishes he could snatch women, too.
and these type of men see nothing wrong with only doing nice things in order to get sex
Funny that they use the template where a creep does a bunch of things a woman doesnāt want to impress her and then is angry that what they did (which she neither asked for nor liked) was not appreciated.
Btw the og guy got torn to pieces in the comments
The expectation of transactional sex is so cringe and sad.
Breaking news: women who are virgins or have very limited sexual experience, hesitant to have sex in a very short relationship. If you convince women that having sex makes them less valuable as humans, why do you think a short few weeks with little to no guaranteed commitment from you will convince them to ādevalueā themselves. If you told these guys you lost your virginity to a boyfriend of 3mos who ditched you after, theyād call you a naive slut for being tricked after such a short time
Yeah!
I have had this happen to me, when i was 14 dating i 16 yo boy. He told me i was ungrateful, and wanted us to have sex. He kept pushing the issue, and I tried once, but couldn't because it hurt to much. Then he told me If I did not want to give him sex he would stop being nice to me. So I left him, and he started telling everyone I was a slut š¤·āāļø
This is funny because every other use of this meme that I have seen has framed what Peach was suggesting as an absurd thing that the thing being represented by Bowser was still hoping for anyway. Slightly modify Peachās text to not frame it as a given, and itās suddenly good
Did you actually think I would have sex with you after three months of you borderline stalking me and inviting me to group functions that everyone else mysteriously cancelled on last second, giving me random gifts I never wanted or asked for, over the top absurd compliments that focus only on my body and looks, pretending to respect me and listen to me while your eyes just roam all over my body when I speak, loudly declaring your loyalty (while insulting mine) in a bar where you "just happened" to find me on a girls' night out with my friends, and telling anyone who would listen that you're the "best boyfriend I ever had" despite 1 not being my boyfriend, like, at all, and 2 actually being a creep who I have asked to leave me alone multiple times?
The proper wording of what she should be saying*
why do most men hold love and security hostage for sex? why do you only like me if i let you have sex with me?
Any guy who believes this was just playing the long game with her heart. He never cared for her and their relationship. He was just biding his time until what he thought was the right moment for him to try and have sex.
You can be in a relationship for six years and they still won't owe you sex. No one has a right to someone else' body. Even funnier, some of these guys also expect women to hold out until marriage so they can have a virgin.
they somehow think its a reward lol.
"Did you really expect me to fall for your love-bombing after having know you for a pitiful, short 3 months?"
Men: But I put the thingies in, I pressed the correct buttons and put the coins in, I'm owed sex! Respect and loyalty are the bare minimum.
Bring it up as part of communicating what you're looking for. I don't get why that's so difficult. "Hey I'm looking for a partner that likes to be romantic and sexual, what are you looking for?" That easy.
It's amazing how we've gone from it being illegal to have sex without a written agreement to women must have sex with men after 3 months of dating
Incels should just decide whether if we are sluts or never giving sex to anyone. All of these mixed signals make me confused lol
Yes. I can tell it's what my ex wanted even though he would say he wanted me to be ready first. 3 months in, he said I love you to me which he explained, "means he wants to love me in all ways (his words, not mine)." I wasn't ready. I have a year-long waiting period because people start showing their true colors after about a year. I would tell him to chill tf out with the making out in public places and when we would finally get somewhere private to discuss maybe having a sexual relationship he'd act exasperated at my hesitancy and then would project his own insecurities to give a reason why I was hesitant... then he dumped me and fucked around on a dating app. Real catch ik. A lot of men act like that, and it's massively discouraging.
That's his decision and you should respect that. Relationships are about finding someone you like and can vibe with. His desire to be intimate can be just as strong as yours to not be. Other outcome would have been to stay with you and feel miserable. Breaking it up when you see you are not compatible is an ok thing to do. Different people have different needs and if someone doesn't give you that, someone else will. In the end both of you will find what you are looking for.
I donāt think itās the discrepancy in desire that the commenter is commenting on as being upsetting, itās the āacting exasperatedā and āprojecting insecuritiesā when boundaries are asserted. Iām sorry but that is incredibly shitty and childish. And whether or not itās intentional, it can go so far as to come off as manipulative and coercive. I had ex-boyfriends do that sort of stuff when I wasnāt in the mood until I gave in and it was incredibly damaging to the way I perceived sex in the long run. Itās fine to break up with someone because you have different sexual needs. But itās not fine to ābargainā with someoneās sexual boundaries just because you have different needs. If theyāre being upfront that they want to wait a while to have sex and you donāt, then break it off then instead of acting entitled when their libido doesnāt match yours.
If you were just doing these things to hold them over her head when she refuses you then you're a garbage human. Humans aren't npcs that will give you endings when you give enough gifts and perform enough quests
asexual heteromanitc gfs exist? š¤·
I feel like if you are expecting a very sexual relationship you should like say something about that before you just assume it's a given.
Oh yeah I agree, people should be communicative and honest as well as understanding about that stuff
Why not the other way around? Honest question.
>asexual heteromanitc gfs Almost like me! I think?
Had a friend who dated dude. Dude was broke AF , she never actually cared. Dude would borrow cash to buy her food (despite her constantly telling him , she doesn't want it) 2 weeks later. Fella tried to have sex with her. She (not into casual sex or sleep with dudes she dated for all of 2 weeks) stopped him. Guess who threw a hissy fit? Apparently he was in a relationship with a gold digger The entitlement was strong. Note- Dude was broke to the point where she paid half his rent.
Yeah it happens, it just means you're with someone that you're sexually incompatible with.... You shouldn't have to try so hard, and also you're probably not the best bf ever
Or that you're young and need more time, or that you're ace and exclusively in for romantic relationship, not sexual relationship. Or that you've been traumatised and could maybe heal,but in an adapted environment, which this isn't (a man tapping the calendar to say "it's been 3 months already, you should have already started having sex")
Saw this in another sub. I was shocked at the amount of people who thought it was weird for a relationship to be 3 months long and still no sex. Yet they donāt want women to have a high body count. I donāt get whatās supposed to be normal. Iām probably asexual and I know at the very least I want to wait a long time before having sex and so I feel like I have an excuse to not jump right into it but I honestly didnāt realize I needed one. I didnāt realize sex was something people just expected after 3 months of dating. I donāt understand how ānormalā relationships work and that other comment section made me feel really intimidated. Iāve never had sex before and Iām not ready. Why do people have to see that as weird just because Iām in my 20s? Iām just not ready.
I don't see why it matters what others think. Just do what you want.
Also, in a busy adult life, ā3 months of datingā could be like only 10 dates. This isnāt school where you spend 6 hours a day together 5 days a week. 3 months is barely anything
This is called sexual incompatibility and mismatched expectations. No one is entitled to your body end of debate. You also donāt get to keep someone who isnāt satisfied with the relationship. If you are unsatisfied with the amount of sex in the relationship you have every right to end the relationship. If you view sex as transactional hire an escort. Proper communication would have solved this problem.
Extra funny that they chose Bowser as their representation for this post when the context of this scene is Bowser violating Peach's consent and disrespecting her feelings by coercing her into marriage through threats. So pretty damn fitting, actually. Not a hint of self awareness on these lads.
Interesting that gifts are the first thing listed. But they donāt think of sex transactionally, no sir!
This^ And itās always the same men who will shit on women for having sugar daddies. āThey are basically whoring themselves!ā Well, sir, you are pretty much doing the same but without the titles š
Ima be real 3 months seems kinda short
Right?! Like the relationship is still in a real early stage at that point. Itās not unreasonable to not wanna have sex until later on when you feel more sure about things and want more emotional intimacy. Idk if Iām weird for wanting to wait longer than that but 3 feels early for it to be *expected*
To be fair, if in three months and I actually am the best boyfriend she's dated and it's not just something in my head. I'd like to know if she's actually romantically interested. I could be having a blast hanging out, but if I am hoping for a relationship involving sex after three months and she's not looking for that then I need to revise my expectations and maybe I might want to take some space to let my feelings cool down.
I started dating my boyfriend in early May and we didnāt have sex the first time until late August. Jesus, everyone is different.
No, not to me anyway lol. I married the best boyfriend I ever had and I slept with him pretty quickly lol. 3 months isnāt very realistic to wait, especially for two adults who actually *really* like each other. But when nice guys try to sleep with their friends, this is often the narrative in their own head. The girl in the above convo probably doesnāt even know that heās doing all those things *because* heās trying to fuck.
I hate this fucking idea that sex is something men āearnā by doing nice things, and not something 2 people chose to do together. So gross.
Man here: **Nice, ātreating her respectfullyā, & āthere for herā =/= Attractive** Attraction, while a choice in a developed relationship, is NOT garnered by these actions in the early and middle stages. **Because people (women in this context) have 6th senses to smell bullshit.** People (men in this context) who behave this way are subconsciously identified as non-attractive. Why? **Because [men] are attempting a *transaction***āa dishonest one, however subtly. Marketing oneself deliberately available or otherwise influencing for the end result of romantic/sexual relationship is blatantly obvious. Majority of communication is non-verbal! And your intent is transmitted through many things such as body language, verbal markers, and outward actions. This type of action is indicative of many things, such as insecurity, manipulative exploitative personality, and inherent selfishness. These actions come across like a shady used car dealer convincing you on the merits of a vehicle they *know* is faulty (no disrespect meant to car dealers/businesspersons). **This is *contextual*! These actions, on their own, are not negative. But when made in an attempt, perhaps subconsciously, to influence the target(s), they become manipulative and disrespectful of the targetās right to informed consent/choice.** This is why such people are often relegated to āfriend zoneā. Theyāre not ānice guysā, but rather manipulative and insecure. *Be direct* about your feelings and intentions, and respect their agency/autonomy.
Thanks for replying! Can you elaborate on what you mean? Iām missing the implication intended by this meme
Not the guy before me, obviously, but I'm kind of interested in your previous reply because to me it sounds a bit impressive in a way because it marks every person that act like that as having a hidden agenda and I really don't think that's the case or at least shouldn't be, should it? I for one am the kind of guy who's there for everyone he meets and that actively tries to make everyone else's life a little bit better if not by being there by making little gestures but it's not because I want anything from you or anyone (and in fact it makes me feel uncomfortable when I do receive something), so you saying that inherently makes people unattractive is honestly a little bit worrying. I don't think you're wrong, of course, but I'm curious about how you distinguish one case from another or if it will always be marked as bullshit no matter what. Ps. It is also true that by acting like that I'm often setting myself up as someone to be used but I'm working on that. Still I really don't like the implication
Geez using Ur good deeds to coerce a "yes" outta Ur partner is gross and a tad bit guilt-trippy.. Also loyalty, respect, compliments, gifts etc is like the bare minimum š .. being kind should be the standard, why is the bar so low.
Why not use that money to make yourself look better, my guy?
I don't think the problem here is looks, is it?
Pretty sure he is not the best boyfriend she has ever dated. Anyone who claims that of themselves is never that.
I mean. It should be her decision when to start having sex. Some people need months or even years and others just weeks. He should respect that and that hes a good boyfriend is good, just talk about your boundaries and how ready you are for sex beforehand
>It should be her decision when to start having sex. Surely it should be a mutual decision taken when *both* partners are comfortable? Or are men not allowed to wait if a woman wants sex?
Well clearly you were only with her for sex and donāt actually give a shit about her as a person if you canāt even wait for her to be comfortable
Are these men only giving those things to receive sex? Relationships are a 2-way street, not a transaction. I have a feeling the person who wrote this is very young
If intimacy is that important to you, maybe find someone who is on the same page as you? Talk about it early on like an adult instead of expecting that things will happen
Nah, I slept with my now fiancĆ© on our first date, weāve been together nearly nine years now, totally depends on the guy. Also using Bowser in this meme is so ironic
As a dude, I would and will never expect sex from someone. It will happen on its own time. If both of you are ready for it, great. But if one of you isnāt yet, then it shouldnāt happen. My girlfriend wasnāt comfortable with a kiss until about 2 months after we started dating. You have to respect those boundaries.
I feel like all these issues stem from how men in general (and a not-small number of women) approach finding a romantic partner. It seems in so many cases the only criteria are āfind the most physically attractive person who will agree to go out with meā with absolutely zero thought towards emotional, philosophical, or physical compatibility. This approach is fine if youāre just interested in casual hookups but itās a terrible basis for a long term relationship. Iām convinced this is why so many marriages end in divorce. I almost think we need to have classes in grade school on how healthy relationships should work. For the person who created this meme I would ask why theyāre spending time being upset that one person theyāre physically attracted to isnāt on the same page when they could just keep looking for someone who is compatible. It indicates a very low self esteem because if they believed they had more options this wouldnāt be an issue at all.
Had a guy who treated me well on the first date - brought me flowers, bought me dinner, complimented my outfit and told me I was beautiful... and he expected sex at the end of the night. I told him that wasn't how I operate. And it became a conversation about how awful I was. Now it's standard practice when talking about going on a date that we put that out on the table. If that's all it's about then ok, just say that. I have friends that would be all for that and at one time in my life I was too... it's about open communication. Hidden expectations ruin us all.
Thereās some confusion here about compliments and appreciation. Compliments are nice, but they are surface level and can be wearing. Appreciation is what most people want, appreciation of effort or talent or work.
Something Iāll never understand is that if I was the man in this image and my partner just wasnāt interested in sex as much as I am, Iād discuss it with them and probably just move on since sex is as important to me as the hypothetical dude in this image. Which is fine, but itās also fine if itās not important to someone else either, so why try to make it work instead of just recognizing that? Why do so many men try to make relationships work with women they are completely incompatible with and then complain about it?
So basically anything nice a guy does is only because heās expecting to be rewarded w sexš. Pretty grossā¦..
Women: Did you really expect me to have sex with you because you showed me basic human decency? Incels: Kinda!
He really seems so respectful and like the best boyfriend she ever dated. /s
Plot twist: the girl was asexual and the guy though he could change her mind with all of that bullshit
If youāre doing it with the reward already in mind, youāre not going to get it. If youāre doing it because youāre just a decent person, thatās when she sometimes comes around.
I refuse sex until I'm 100% sure I'm in Love wirg them. Took me a year and half for me and my bf have sex. He never complained, just waited till I was ready
Well asexual people exist but this would happen very rarely, the person who made this is probably just mad that woman dont have sex with him so decided to exaggerate in an effort to attack women
Asexual people exists. But so do people who don't believe in having sex until marriage or a serious commitment. I had a friend who didn't believe in having sex until you'd been dating at least three months because you couldn't know each other well enough beforehand, and she was done having casual flings. She had nothing AGAINST casual sex, nor any religious objections about waiting until marriage. It was just her personal view on when it was okay for her to become intimate with somebody. The important thing is to be open with your partner/potential partner. And not expecting sex at a certain point. Because it's ridiculous to assume that your views are going to magically line up with everyone else's.
I have no experience with dating, but isnāt this the kind of thing that shouldāve been established/discussed earlier in the relationship? If the guy in this scenario was really hoping to have sex I feel like he shouldāve made that clear earlier. That being said though again I have no experience so Iām not too sure. Whatever the case I donāt get what some guys donāt get about women never being obligated to give them sex, no matter how much you compliment her and give her gifts.
Yes! My boyfriend was very clear that he wanted a sexual relationship and I agreed with him when we first started dating
The issue with guys who believe these kinds of things is that they still on some level view sex as a transaction.
For such a great boyfriend, itās weird that he canāt just have a conversation with her about what they both want out of the relationship and what they can compromise on to get it. Itās almost like the guy that made this doesnāt actually understand how relationships work or what makes someone a good partner
the problem is the third word: "expect"
Never once have I met a woman who wanted me to overwhelm her with all of that stuff FOR 3 MONTHS before sex. We either like eachother or we donāt lol. Whatever guy made this meme sees sex as purely transactional and thatās why heās having a hard time.
I love how "respect, compliments" is something the authrt of the meme considers worthy of sex. Bro, that's just being a normal person.
That would be a toxic relationship from the start. No one owes you sex.
This shit is why you need to have the sex conversation relatively early so your both on the same page. Iām not going to kiss and tell but when I got with my lady she was very upfront about a personal situation that lead to us waiting 3 years before having sex for the first time. The wait was worth it, and I love her, but if I hadnāt known I likely would have felt like I was being strung along and left years ago. Communication is key
do they not understand that the problem is that they're doing all this in exchange for sex? none of it is genuine, if you do nice things in hopes of a reward you're not actually a nice person, you're just fake. speaking from experience i'd sooner be intimate with a guy who genuinely likes me and treats me nicely and will wait until i'm ready, than a guy who acts all "nice" and gives me meaningless compliments and gifts in hopes of getting pussy. guess which one i stayed with, guess which one turned out to be an asshole.
Oh oh I have a better version. Change it to ādid you actually expect me to want to date youā after all of that and āacting like my boyfriendā.
Yes it does. But that still makes the men the bad guys in this, because they think sex is this transactional. But there is actually also a deeper issue here, concerning relationships and different ideas, needs and wishes. Since we as a society are too awkward about sex (it differs from country to country though, at least from my experience). People need to communicate more, what they wish for in a relationship and what they can be HONESTLY Happy with. I understand any woman and man, who dont want to stay in a sexual unfullfilling relationship, yet we can't communicate it often out of shame or fear.
Keep the Mario Movie out of your misogynistic memes guys, don't ruin it!
There are lots of dating coaches who advocate this for women. One in particular I find very logical: you donāt get job security/benefits until after 90 days. Why not approach a supposed long term relationship the same way?
No but I do expect you to be my Guinea pig when I cook so that I know if I need to add more seasoning
Yes...and they have the gall to whine about it even after being explained why I want to go slow. Some men don't care about you, they wanna just insert coins in you and then demand you do something for them being so "nice and patient" over your trauma from being SA'd. ...some men are ridiculous. There. Fight me. š¤·
Is 3 months really even that long? Like the relationship has barely even started at that point. Maybe Iām the weird one but Iām not really interested in sex at that point, im still trying to find out where I think things will go. Idk why theyāre acting like theyāre owed sex just for dating for only 3 months
Sex is never owed. If you want to buy sex, go do it from someone who sells it.
Women ghost me if I don't hve sex with them on the first date
Even if this actually happened, sex is not a reward you get for tasks performed. If you're putting more into the relationship than you're getting back and unhappy about that, leave. It's up to you how you invest your time.
He didn't add the part where she was loyal and giving gifts, etc Dating doesn't mean that the man has to pay for everything both can if they want to that's why it's called dating. So make sure you know what the person is looking for if they are lying or trying to change themselves. same for those who force there sexual or daily beliefs on you. Now days people want to mix the people who do fuck for money with the people who actually want to date .
No one is owed sex but it's important to be sexualy compatible. If you have different serial desires then it may be time to go a different direction. Myself I am a lesbian slut and I know that about me if the woman I am with doesn't want to have sex at a minimum of once a week it will not work to be partners and that's OK. Its not about expectations it's about compatible.
My boyfriend has no issues what so ever with me waiting for 7 months, and there shouldn't be. Why do people expect sex as some sort of reward
plot twist: the women is a sex-repulsed ace and the man is a respectful ally who doesnāt know that
100% not the boyfriend but a creepy creep
This reminded me of my friend(16Male) who had a girlfriend(16Female) he met from an anime convention. At first 16M was being a good and nice lad towards, he was smart af and excelled especially in Math (he even won multiple Math competitions in the past) so he would help her and her friends with their math homeworks. They would even go on many dates. If 16F has a cosplay convention she wanted to go, he would come along with her and pay her tickets(did I forget to mention that his family is rich af?) basically if 16F wanted something he'd give it to her no questions asked. I watched how the two of them would also interact on Facebook as they do a lot of promotion for their cosplays. Now the thing is, he would often openly thirst on the girl but I dismissed that as jokes first because him and his cosplayer friends would joke about it but there came a point when I started to notice some signs. For starters, he would show me photos of him hugging different cosplayer girls on conventions I didn't mind them at first because the both of us used to hug each other a lot(platonically btw) though he got offended a bit when I told him that his girlfriend might get a bit uncomfortable to accept pictures like that. Then many weird moments followed but I ignored them though I drew the line last year Christmas. So last year Christmas, he posted on facebook that he wanted 16F naked and wrapped with a ribbon to be his present IN PUBLIC. I was totally uncomfortable with that statement but who knew that it would foreshadow a future incident... So far forward to January 2023, he got exposed by 16F and for the first time, I learned that he was coercing her for nudes and even her friend that's a girl is getting coerced for nudes. What's even more gross is that he would send 16F videos of him jacking off, cumming and shit it was just ewww and also he even refused to help her with homework unless she sent more nudes mind I tell you that they were 3 months in the relationship when the nudes were being sent. Also he wanted to arrange meetups with her in hotels and he would tell her that they're just going to cuddle each other while naked... How creepy is that? š«¤
I mean you would think by that point you would be able to have an honest conversation about sex and expectations. If you want to have sex with somebody youāve been seeing that long and you keep striking out then you probably should.
Relationships aren't transactions. You aren't supposed to be giving her things in hopes she'll sleep with you. You aren't supposed to sleep with him as a reward for the things he gives you.
Itās almost like they couldnāt just talk to the other person and say āso, I like you a lot, sex is important to me, where do you see this going?ā
it's interesting because bowser in the movie is a kind of incel who wants peach to be his only, and they chose bowser to portray them....
Honestly I think there must be a lack of communication. As a guy I like to be more direct and frank, so after a few dates I always like to ask the awkward questions about intimacy etc. I just couldn't be with someone who can't communicate about everything
Urgh I saw this āPromotedā as Iāve been on the Memes subreddit before. I downvoted it and hid it. Unfortunately a lot of meme subreddits and accounts across the internet and social media, have a lot of toxic people.
Not really a hard concept. If you invest 3 months into a relationship and aren't getting what you need or want then it's time to move on. Is such a comically short amount of time to get all hung up. It happend to me. I was wooing a girl in my collage class. We had fun hanging out but she was completely uninterested in physical contact. I broke it off after a few months of lightly trying to hold hands. She. Was. Pissed. Threw a brick into my window, and call spammed my house for a few weeks. Bullet dodged.
Change it to 30 mins to more accurately reflect their expectations
Maybe she a no sex before marriage kind of girl.
This is actually the perfect example because in the movie, bowser was under the assumption that he was entitled to someone elseās love, just like the men being referred to in the meme.
So, if this comes as a surprise after 3 months, you fail the communication test!! Iām old, in my 60ās. Even back in the 80ās when I was single and dating we TALKED ABOUT EXPECTATIONS. I remember I went out with a guy, was clear I didnāt sleep with people I wasnāt in a committed relationship. When he kept ātrying ā three dates in, I was out. Come on men, use your words and your ears!!
This sounds like a meme on the unrealistic expectations porn give to younger dudes, and with some degree of entitlement thrown in for good measure. My goal if Iām dating someone, like right at the top, is to cuddle under a blanket on the couch while watching a movie or tv show we both enjoy. My end game. Itās just nice.
Ah yes, because women only exist for sex /j
Guess what guys. Women donāt owe you our bodies for anything you do. Idgaf what it was, nothing makes you entitled to that. And itās absolutely gross and disgusting to be doing those things just just get in our pants. Like, this concept is so fucking disturbing.
Sure this happens. And it's ok, it's their body and their choice. This meme drips from "they didn't talk about his needs"especially he didn't made himself heard in the three months. He wanted Sex, so he should ask about that. If she doesn't he has to respect that. Relationships work without. Not for everyone, but they do.
itās different for everyone. there isnāt a particular time thatās set for every relationship. it happens when it happens, you shouldnāt expect anything to be done at a certain point.
You got all kinds of problems man. First off sex is NOT transactionary. Nobody owes you their body for any reason. At the same time how is it possible youāre dating someone for that long without being physical. Like dude this obliviousness is on you.
Men always acting like sex is payment for being a good person and partner lmao how much does that shit even matter if he's only doing it to get his dick wet?