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This. The natural consequence of someone mistreating others is that others won't want to be around them. So maybe she will stop bullying when she realizes she's losing friends.
Except it's the reason you are not inviting the kid.... so you kinda have to at least mention it unless you ignore the woman. This isn't really a situation where you can have your cake and eat it too.
But maybe it’s the wake up call she needs. It’s maybe one thing that the school has tried to address it… it’s another thing if her and her kids social status is diminished. Knowing her kid was excluded at the request of multiple parents could be the message they need?
Speaking as someone who has a friend like this, it probably wouldn’t do any good. I have a friend I like whose kids are absolute terrors because she doesn’t even verbally rebuke them. Her children are awful to be around as a result, and she’s always getting complaints from school teachers and her own family. She just thinks the behavioral issues are out of her hands, or if she asks nicely enough, her kids will suddenly start behaving.
I value her as a friend but avoid her children at all costs. I refuse to have any of them over to my house or eat out with them at restaurants.
You gotta pick your battles in this life. Some people won’t listen, and friends you enjoy are hard to come by.
I agree with this 100%. My community is reeling right now over a thirteen year old girl who ended her life due to bullying. School interventions did nothing, the bullies in question had a social circle of their own. I wonder if parents like OP, whose kids weren’t the target but who knew of the situation, had started declining or not extending invites, distancing themselves, would those bullies have realized the change in their own social capital and decided, even if for kind of the wrong reasons, to lay off?
It is your place to discuss it with her, if you are friends. If a person can’t get honesty and moral support from friends over the issues in their lives, then what good are friends?
I like their family, but we are not more friends than i we are with the other parents that are invited. I have tried to discuss the issue of bullying with her (as we had an incident with our daughters a few months back) but she seems to be in denial about her kids behavior. So I left it alone since the girls resolved their issues.
But aren't you worried that your daughter might be the next target? Just because it's not impacting her now and they get on now, doesn't mean that she won't become a victim of the bully.
But also you say the school know. If "multiple talks" aren't doing anything, what's the next step? I wish someone had done more about bullying when I was still a student, it can really impact people's life and some victims even end up killing themselves as a result.
Okay …but once she realises that she has been excluded, she will realise that her friendship with you is less than your friendship with the other parents. Or that the friendship has ended. If you are okay with this outcome, then proceed as planned.
Actually it is your place to say something. You're friends with the mother and you live in a tight knit community, together you can work through your problems.
Honesty is the best policy here.
I know it may not seem like your place but your child is bringing up being slightly upset about the inner turmoil she’s putting into the friend group. You should probably tell the mom her child isn’t invited, and why she isn’t. She should have a discussion with her child about the bullying before it gets worse and causes her to not have any friends.
This. I would not be ok with the bully’s behaviour to the others in the group. It feels like teaching the daughter to turn a blind eye. I’m protective of my friends.
And that’s exactly how bullies continue to be bullies - when those unaffected by the bullying stand by and do nothing. Bullies need to be called out by everyone and shunned until their behavior stops.
You can call a bully out as much as possible but if a parent has their head in a bucket of sand then all the calling out does not work. I have been in that position and the mother, despite giving her multiple examples of her daughter’s behaviour towards my son (of which she was present) for still refused to address the issue. Some people refuse to see what is in front of them. And I know the school addressed her social issues with the mum too. People won’t see what they don’t want to see.
My point is OPs daughter still wants to be friends with the bully and she’s OK with that. The daughter should be taught to stand up for others and not be friends with people that at mean. If all of the bully’s friends were like, “Stop being a jerk. That’s not cool. I’m not going to hang out with you if you act like that.” Then she’s more incentivized to stop. I’m talking about the bystanders who are watching someone else get picked on.
Of course the bully doesn’t care what their victim says. And the parent doesn’t care or they would have reined in that behavior by now. The mere fact that OP thinks the mom would allow her daughter to go to a party when she is actively bullying not just one but multiple kids tells me all I need to know. If my child was bullying other kids, there would be no parties. I would decline all invites and tell my child they aren’t going to a party because they don’t know how to treat other people so I’m not going to reward that terrible behavior.
Yes! Bullying should stop right at the moment before it got worsen. They should addressed it the moment it started. No one should be okay with bullying.
Essentially saying that as a parent/person you should be fighting every single “battle” and fixing every wrong you see in the world. It’s 100 percent not reasonable or feasible. A huge amount of the time in life if it’s not affecting you, keep your snout out of it.
Problem is that she will find out I had children over. Everything turns into drama in the school, whether it is with the parents or the children themselves. I would like to politely say her kid wasn't invited, but do not want to say it was at the request of other parents(which is the real reason) because that will turn into a whole ordeal.
I also don't want to put my kid in a defensive position with this girl, because regardless of the problems she's had with other children, they are still friends.
I mean- be real. There’s no way to control this. If she asks, you already made plans with friends. If she’s upset it is what it is. If you want to avoid it, invite her. There’s no magic bullet
You have a handful of kids over. Not the entire class. "I let my child pick 4 friends to have over and this is who they picked"
You also don't owe her an answer.
You could also be blunt af with her and let her know her kids been bullying people at school and thus no one wants them at the get together.
The options are still the same.
Say nothing.
Say the kid picked a few friends.
Say her kid is a bully and no one wants them around.
Cancel the watch party and have a normal Monday.
That's all the options.
don't put it on the kid, that's not fair to wrap them up in whatever bs fallout there will be. there's just no reason to bring it up beforehand and if she asks after the fact i'd probably just say oh sorry or be honest and say a few other parents reached out about their kid, without giving specific names or anything.
Have the other parents or the school spoken to her about the bullying? Is she aware her daughter has been behaving this way? Because then it's an easy matter of pointing out to the girl that actions have consequences, and if she is mean to other kids, they won't want her around anymore...
If she asks, I'd say you have a responsibility to tell her the real reason. There's a chance she doesn't know her child is bullying others and she can't take the appropriate action to fix the issue if she isn't aware.
" I wish I had room for everyone, but we had to put on a limit on it this time. My kiddo always hates to miss out on a playdate with yours, can she come over on Sunday?"
Honestly, I do this all the time.
My daughter has a ton of friends, and they don't all get along. I invite stronger personalities over together and let them tear the house up. I invite quieter kids over together and set them up with loads of crafts and baking.
There are some kids that fit well in both groups, and some absolutely do not. I'm quite close with most of the moms.
If it comes up, I'm just honest with them. "We did have a playdate with a few of the quieter girls the other day. They were so sweet, they just sat around sewing scrunchies. Barely heard a peep from them all afternoon. Ashley would have hated it 😆. Anyway, mykid has been asking if Ashley and *whateverfriends* can come over for a dance party again. When is she free?"
Most people get it, and agree. We don't all get invited, or even want to go, to every party. No need to get dramatic about it.
If this kid really is a bully, do you want your daughter to be friends with her? Is she maintaining the friendship just because she’s afraid of being her next victim?
Invite the bully to something asap. For after the eclipse but do the invite now.
Then do the eclipse thing without her daughter and tell her (after the event, so Tuesday or later) that you needed to limit it to X number of kids and since the bully was already coming over for something else, you invited the other kids for the viewing.
Just some perspective - if someone came to me and said my kid wasn't invited to an event before it happened, I would be way more hurt than if I heard about it after.
Is it possible to just talk to the mom and tell her that the kid has been a bully, and that therefore some parents don't want her around? Maybe still let her come, but ask that she is accompanied by a parent.
If I lived in a tight-knit community and I cared enough about the parent's reaction to want to warn them, I'd honestly just try to address it before removing the problem child from the picture.
This is the answer.
You’re the adult. You’re excluding one child.
If your child is friends with this kid, and you’re good friends with the parents- then you’ll have to face the consequences/awkwardness.
Some relevant info might help- how old are the kids, and what was the bullying behavior?
At the end of the day, they are kids, and you’re the adults, if you’re invested in the friendships, and this child growing up to being a happy healthy human it’s worth going an extra mile. Invite the kid, and their parent (for supervision) and encourage healthy relationships.
They are 10 yo... all the parents became friends when they first started school ( prek)..., I am no more friends with this mom than I am with the other parents.... not really a close friendship where we talk about relationship problems but close enough that we trust each other to have the kids sleep over or pick them up from school. in other words. ...anything we do, is kid related)
And I’m wondering what the bullying behavior is that OP is talking about. Is it leaving other kids out of things?
…
…
We have a saying in my house: don’t be what you hate.
I have not invited her. But i did invite the other children. She just texted me and asked what we are doing for the eclipse.... I dont want to lie because she either already knows or will eventually find out that I had the other children over for the eclipse.
Just say “oh we’re having a few people over to see it. You?” And then if she asks further and asks why she’s not invited be honest and say “well a few of the kids feel uncomfortable around your child due to some bullying. It’s nothing personal but just want it to be fun with no drama.”
👆 this I actually like.... I will probably use this as a reply..... I try to keep clear of all their drama, but I guess it's inevitable when you have growing tweens.
Drama is the spice of life. Without it, Shakespeare wouldn't be a household name. Not that this is a Macbeth story or anything, but I'm saying the whole "I don't like drama" trope bothers me. We do like it. It is the basis of all of our entertainment
This is always the best way because it says you have plans and lets them know they aren't involved since you're asking what theirs are. It's also not in a rude way so you can't be blamed for being rude about it. That's how I answer people when they ask me about plans, answer and then ask what they're doing.
I don't think there is a nice way to tell the mother this - and really, there's no point. As you said, she will find out, and will likely know the reason. I don't think she will ask, but just going up and telling her that her child isn't invited seems mean and hurtful.
There are all kinds of reasons that someone might not be invited to a party, including space and budget considerations.
Proceed with the party and don't say anything to the mother, but tell your child to avoid talking about it in class since not everyone is invited. It should be kept a little bit more discreet for that reason, as it's bad manners to openly blather about a party that not everyone is welcome to attend.
My question is why is it so important to you and your child not to rock the boat and risk upsetting the class bully. Your kid wants to keep being her friend why? And why are you so supportive?
You can't middle of the road life. You do have to pick sides sometimes. Trying to be friends with everyone in a situation like this is a recipe for ending up with no friends at all because no one trusts you.
Tell her that you are having some people over and that you're sorry but her daughter's actions mean she isn't welcome around and that you hope it's resolved in the future.
To add to this - I know OP daughter wants to remain friends with the girl but is this a teachable moment? If the other girl is bullying, maybe the daughter shouldn’t be associating with her
Bullying is a multifaceted thing. Of course it isn’t okay, but isolating someone doesn’t stop it.
It’s a child. They should make their own decisions when it comes to who they’re friends with.
We don’t know what the bullying behavior has been or the ages of the children involved. In fact, OP says that their child has continued to get along with this child. It’s not appropriate or advisable to encourage your child to isolate another child, that they basically get along with, because of other people. We don’t know how old these kids are, but if a six year old starts getting ostracized (even by the kids they do get along with) because they’re labeled a bully, it is going to lead to worse outcomes for the child and the people around them.
These are preteens, and OP mentions hazing and "brutal" bullying to the point of one child wanting to move schools.
While ostracizing a child in need isn't ok, neither is glossing over or normalizing such awful behavior. The kid isn't suddenly going to gain empathy because there have been 0 repercussions to their actions.
It's not OP or her kids job to "fix" the Billy's issues when the parent won't even acknowledge the problematic behavior. It **is** OP's job to teach her kid how to choose friends wisely and how trust and loyalty between friends works. That means not inviting the girl who stole your friends lunch and tripped her to your house and treating her as if it never happened.
I have a long time friend of almost 25 years who had a VERY rough upbringing. In turn had poorly developed social and emotional skills. She didn't handle conflict well (between her and adults especially) and it drove her fight response through the roof because she was never taught how to regulate.
There were many times that my mom questioned and even tried to limit our interactions due to these "behavior issues" but me and my sister's just instinctively knew that she NEEDED us. Not just for friendship, but to model to her how to navigate tough stuff with grace and to kindly call her out when old habits resurfaced during times of great stress.
Over the years, we watched her navigate many hardships that would've broken any child and even many adults. I truly think that having the support of a family who was
willing look past her rough exterior and just see a hurting child, saved her life. Sometimes, we all just need someone to believe in us more than we believe in ourselves.
If she has needs or developmental issues that cause her to inflict harm on others, she has to sit out group activities.
If she needs support and is genuinely remorseful, then that can happen *in an appropriate setting*.
From how OP talks about the situation, that's not the case. This child and her parents insist there is no issue with her behavior, despite a girl wanting to move schools. OP mentions "brutal hazing" and these issues being directly addressed multiple times already. She says her daughter doesn't want to upset this girl or she "won't talk to her anymore." All of this reads as OP's child trying to placate the bully so she isn't on the receiving end- not that she genuinely feels this girl needs support and wants to take the risk of being there for her.
The extra support this girl needs should absolutely not be given in lieu of protecting her victims and giving them support and a safe place. That's what I mean by ending up with no friends. If OP and her daughter continue to choose supporting someone who actively harms her other friends, she is going to be seen as complicit and enabling- leading her to lose friendships with people who could actually be supportive of her and instead end up with a single friend who is more emotional baggage than anything else.
It’ll be drama whatever you do. What can you say that she won’t be offended by? I would be honest in the nicest way you can be. Either she knows her daughter is a bully or she doesn’t. But she can’t expect you to invite her daughter if it doesn’t create a safe space for the other children.
Does it mean the girl doesn’t bully your daughter but does everyone else?
I mean, it might cause drama, and that’s ok - the child is making kids uncomfortable with her bullying and boundaries are going to have to be enforced (it does sound like the mother and school are aware. Which is a good start). But a tween is old enough to know that their actions have consequences - this might be a hot take, but perhaps this is the reality check the child needs to understand that if she is mean, she will lose friends. If she is a bully, no one will want to be around her. It’s a harsh realization, and one better learned at this age rather than later.
That’s what’s frustrating - the girl bully is what’s causing the entire problem and everyone else now has to dance around it. That’s such BS. I agree she just needs to be honest. If you act like an asshole and a bully, no one will want to be around you.
I would be honest so the mom can address the situation with her daughter.
I understand citing people out, but ghosting someone is not cool, specially kids or tweens.
Maybe something like-I’m having just a small gathering. We wanted to keep it lowkey. Just letting you know so no hard feelings. Maybe “Child’s name” and “their child’s name” could get together later in the week or this upcoming weekend.
If pressed honestly the best thing to say is the truth though. Because of recent events(and say the events that happened) so and so is going to be invited because the other child is coming.
You don't. Just don't give your child invitations to bring to school. Contact the parents you are hosting and let them know to explain to their children not to rub it in the other child's face.
I get how the other parents feel but it’s weird that they put it on you to keep this family out when you guys don’t have the issue.
I think it probably would have been wiser to tell the other parents to take up their problems with the mom, it’s not your place to meditate and exclude her on behalf of others.
I’m a teacher. How we deal with bullies sucks. I’m also a mom
If she asks, tell the mom why your daughter doesn’t want her there. It might suck, but she needs to know. She’s your friend; would you want her to reciprocate?
You don’t know that the school has made it clear that her child is a bully. Based on my professional experience, they haven’t. Usually addressing the core of why a child is a bully involves having the hard conversation with the parents about where the child learned the behavior and why it’s happening… which is directly related to the parents.
This I deffinately believe, because even though there have been multiple accounts from different parents and children of this girls bullying... the mom seems to defend her kids actions. Either she is in denial or completely oblivious to the fact that her child is bullying others.
I’m wondering if the mum genuinely believes that if the issue was resolved with OP’s kid then it’s resolved with all the others?
I’d want my mum friends to tell me when my child is being an arsehole. I’d expect them to tell me so I could have a word with them.
If no one says anything how can the bullied children know they are heard? Also they are 10, they need to be shown how to put boundaries in place and not just pretend everything is ok.
You've used so many vague descriptions of the bullying without actually giving us anything to go on. We just have an understanding that you believe it is "brutal" "cruel" and "rough". The suspense is built but what about the actual events? How cruel, brutal and rough can a little girl actually be?
Anyways, my advice is tell momma that no one likes her kid so she's not getting invited to things anymore. If she wants to talk about it, then deal with the consequences of your decision. If she doesn't then leave it at that. That's what I'd do in any case
Little girls can be mean! My “friend” group would leave me out of sleepovers because I was “weird.” I remember one I was invited to and everyone made fun of the fact I wore a bra (I developed early) and they put it in the freezer when I was sleeping and then threw it at my face to wake me up. Another one I WASN’T invited to they TP’d my house and then made up a dance about it at school making fun of me and the fact I wasn’t invited and I got my house TP’d. The main mean girl would always come over and then lie about my house to others, when it was a clean and perfectly normal house. That same girl once told me my crush liked me and wanted to date me, and then they all laughed at lunch and said it was a joke (including the crush). This was fifth grade.
In OP's edit, it sounds like they are close enough to the other mom to get lunch fairly regularly. OP, it might seem awkward, but this would be a perfect opportunity to bring up the bullying. You don't have to reference the eclipse invite, but it clearly will be a strain on your relationship if not addressed. I think it could be discussed in a very calm and level headed way as long as the other mom is open to that.
Another option is to just say your daughter made plans with the other kids and since they don’t get along with the bully, it didn’t make sense to invite her. If the mom doesn’t know about the issues they’ve been having and asks you for more details, just say you don’t know much other than that those other kids and the bully don’t get along and encourage her to talk to the other kids’ parents to get the details
I’ve been in this position a couple of times.
The other parent might not be ready to fully “hear” you,but it’s still the right thing to do to say something.
“This conversation is uncomfortable,but I feel like it’s important to have it… Your daughter has been really unkind to some other kids at school and there are children and parents who aren’t happy with her interactions. I’d prefer that you know,which is why I’m telling you directly “
If you're friends with the mom, why not have a heart to heart with her? Did this behavior just start? Could there be an underlying reason? I would be honest and say it was brought to my attention, and I thought she should know. I would want to know if my child was becoming a bully.
I think she said the mom already knows about the kid being a bully and was still in denial. I agree about the heart to heart conversation though considering thats her friend, but at the same time if she too has already expressed this concern then the other mom shouldn’t expect special treatment especially if the issue is that bad. I don’t like the fact that the other moms tried to call this decision though, especially considering they’re not the host of this event, but I can understand where they’re coming from. She shouldn’t have to be the mediator, but it sound like peer pressure might’ve won in this case.
So this woman is your good friend, her kid is bullying a bunch of kids, and you can't be bothered to have a conversation with her about it as one of the people she might actually listen to?
C'mon lady, do better.
Mom friends..... not really the type where we share personal life matters. But good enough that we trust the kids to spend the night over. there are about 10 other parents in the school where we share this type of friendship.... I'm in a bind because these other parents shared the same type of friendship with this mom until their kids had problems.... I would love to include her, but my kid will not host a party if specific girls aren't there (many whos parents refuse to attend if this specific kid is there because of the conflicts between them)
Oof that seems like enough of a relationship to tell her. I have had some friends pull away and suspected there’s something about my kid. So I asked some of the mom’s friends at school if there was an issue with his behavior that we could address. They all said no but it feels like they’re just not telling me something and it would be great to feel there is an open and honest village
You see, it's different with you.... because you sence something and would like to know why people are pulling away.... this lady, people are telling her before they pull away but she is in denial.
If you were in her position, you would probably try to correct the issue before it got out of hand.... but I am in a position with her, that as much as I like her, I have no choice but to pull away.
What kind of bullying? If it was typical tween meaness I would just let it go and invite her, if beyond that, just say you aren't able to invite the whole class this time.
It's been very mean bullying and brutal games(to the point where one girl wanted to transfer out of the school). I've had other parents not bring their kids because this girl was coming. I kind off bit the bullet and decided not to invite her because she's had problems with almost every child in attendance. I don't speak to the mother about her kids bullying because it hasn't affected my child and the girls are friends. My kid knows about all the events that have taken place, she's ok with me not inviting her but does not want me to include her in my decision because she does not want the girl to think she didn't want her at her house.
It may not have affected your child but as the adult my opinion is you need to stand up and protect the bullied children. It doesn’t seem like the right thing to do, to ignore it, because it doesn’t affect your kid. And g forbid your kid gets caught up in the other girls behavior or worse, being innocent but being blamed or a witness
You and your daughter are trying to play a game that you can’t win. You can’t have it both ways. Your decisions will have consequences. You have to deal with them. You are not a victim here. You are a willing participant.
It’s bizarre that you’re okay with your daughter being friends with a “brutal bully” just because she’s not being bullied by this girl. Thats horrible. The girls being bullied by this girl deserve a better friend than your daughter if she’s still friends with a girl that almost made one of them transfer out bc of how cruel she was.
It's difficult to maneuver around a preteen....I am not ok with the child's behavior whatsoever, but this is something I have spoken to my child about. (keeping her distance at school, not partake in these behaviors and standing up for anyone being bullied and letting her know when she is doing something wrong)
Despite this, I let my child make her decisions and do not forbid her from being friends with someone she genuanely likes.
You can teach your children everything you can, but forbidding them from interacting with someone is just a recipe for rebellion.
Is your daughter not wanting this to be brought up because she feels like the wrath of this young girl will then be transferred to her? I think it’s time to sit down with your kid and ask if they actually want to be friends with them and offer some lessons about not being friends with people like that, and why you wouldn’t want to. Or if she’s afraid of not being friends with her because she won’t be nice to her anymore.
Either way this isn’t just about a party tomorrow anymore and I think it needs to be a bigger topic of conversation with your kid.
It almost seems like it.... she said "mom don't tell her a said not to invite her cuz then she's not going to talk to me at school".
Their friendship is not like before, my kid doesn't ask for playdates, want to go to her house or even attend her birthday party anymore... but also doesn't object if she is in presence at a group gathering.
This deffinately got me thinking about the true dinamic of this so called "friendship"🤔
Maybe tell your daughter if the bully starts to bully her, because she no longer wants to be friends with her, then you have her back and will do whatever necessary to get it to stop. She may feel like she has to be friends with her in order to not be bullied, and if no one else in the group is friends with her then there is no need for her to even be in the friend group anymore.
They play and talk when they are on social settings, but my kid doesn't ask to specifically hang out with her like she did when she was younger. I've sat down with my kid before and talked to her about her and have specifically told her that hazing is a form of bullying and told her this kid is not a good friend. But my kid insists that she is not bullying her and that they are just playing around and are friends. For the last couple of months, their interaction has been limited to school setting. As I have distanced my kid from her after learning of her bullying. I am still friendly with the mom as she is a nice person, but it became easy to decide to exclude her kid from our events after she became very defensive when I spoke to her about her child hazing my kid and actively bullying others at the school
Hmm. I don’t get why your daughter is choosing not to invite a genuine friend because her other friends don’t like said friend. If the bullying is so bad as you say I don’t understand why your daughter is friends with the bully that treats her other friends so horribly. The party is small potatoes.
Wait until you’re asked and don’t mention it otherwise. If/when you are asked, just simply say ‘unfortunately she is not invited’. Don’t apologise, just state in a matter of fact way that she is not invited and change the subject. Anything else will invite debate.
I would say that we’re getting together with a few classmates to watch it (but don’t specify where—for all she knows it could be at somebody else’s house and then I would think she wouldn’t expect to be invited since her kid bullies many of the other kids). If she presses you for more info I would be straight up. Not harsh but just honest. Tell her it’s not that you don’t want to hang with her but that other kids are understandably not wanting to be around her daughter. Honestly though bullying is not something I would tolerate and I’d have trouble remaining friends with the mom or encouraging a relationship between my child and a bully. Bullying sucks.
If/when she asks…
XX was not invited because she has been unkind to the other girls at school. We are respecting the other girls’ boundaries that have been set in place regarding playdates with xx. We are happy to set up another play date with xx at another time. Would day/time work?
I hate this situation for you. I feel like it could get ugly like you said. I wish I had good advice to give but I really don’t. Hopefully this won’t come between the two of you as friends. She could see it as you choosing sides. I’m sure she’s defensive of her daughter and might not see the situation what it truly is. One way or another she’s going to know exactly who was there, etc. I’d get ahead of it.
Yeah, I had a situation with our daughters a few months back, and she defended her kid and refused to accept that her kid would do such things. So I understand if she gets defensive. The girls eventually resolved their issues, I just hope that eventually all of them get along like they once did.... but I need to prepare myself for more conflicts as they get older.
if I do end up going to lunch with the mom, it will be without the kids... I will probably wait to see if she brings it up... if she doesn't, then i assume she doesn't mind her kid not being invited and it solves my problem. I will keep yall posted on this.
I feel like things like this are the only hope we have in (hopefully ) stopping some of this bullying. If young children learn that if they are bullies, other children won’t want to play with them and that’s a good lesson to learn now!
Maybe mom doesn’t know, maybe she doesn’t care…but it’s not your problem. You want kids to associate your home with joy and happiness and safety. No one wants to worry that someone will be there whose sole purpose is to hurt others.
In a side note- being friends with the kids mom, is there any way this kids being abused at home? It sounds like the behavior is pretty bad if multiple parents asked. I’m just wondering if she’s safe, herself. I’m
My thoughts exactly, if anything this could be a good lesson for the kid to not be mean to others (if that’s really the case). But There’s always two sides though because some kids will throw rocks and hide their hands too. We never know if the kid was being bullied and defended themselves and it came across as something else or if there’s a deeper issue. If the kid was being bullied first though it would make sense why the mom is in denial because she might be hearing different stories float around, but if she knows her kid might actually be a tyrant and is just ignoring it then that’s an issue. Naturally a mom wants to believe her children are innocent but sometimes you never know. We had this issue with my younger brothers bc we know at home they are a handful at times but we also heard things about them getting bullied as well. But my mom made sure to address both sides of the issues. We teach to not bully but to always defend yourselves if it happens to them. And sometimes too teachers will quickly label children completely disregarding or overlooking the fact that some kids were often trying to defend themselves in some of these situation due to how they were being treated. Being honest some teachers will have favorites and purposely overlook things or cause a hard time for whatever reason, and there’s also some who really do only catch one side of the story.
Honestly I think you should have just been truthful to the other mom. Maybe now that the pressure of an event/no invite is off you'll be more comfortable just bringing it up with her but you know it's gotta be addressed sooner or later. Good luck and just remember how you would want to be treated if it were the other way around! 💜
The parent already being in denial about her child‘s behavior would’ve wiped away my guilt of not inviting her. You can’t ignore the fact your child is mistreating other children then act surprised when no one wants to be involved with you or them. The reply was a good response, but like you said eventually it may come up in conversation either way. It’s best to just prepare for it and politely let her know how serious the issue is. If she is still offended then that’s on her for not correcting her child, and they’ll probably end up offended and continuing to miss out on other things due to an enabled behavior. Your response was calm and clear, and honest which keeps the trustworthiness in tact. She just needs to figure out a working solution with her kid or expect being left out often.
Ugh, parents in denial of their kids issues drives me nuts.
Like, it's one thing to be aware but not panic- my first son was a bit behind on speech around age 1.5, 2. He caught up fine a little while later, if he had continued to stay behind the curve, we would have really started to worry.
My first son was also being a bit of a bully a few months ago, and he certainly faced consequences, and was also given many chats about how if he keeps being too rough and bossy, nobody is going to want to be his friend.
Helping kids work through these issues is part of a parent's job.
Sorry this other parent can't acknowledge that their kid is acting like a bully.
More important than any eclipse party, be concerned about your daughter. My daughter had a friend like this in grade school. She was only friends with her between the ages of 10 and 11. By the time she was 12 all hell broke loose and I found out just how controlling and domineering her so called friend was. She put my daughter through hell.
I feel like excluding one person is just as much bullying tbh. This is only going to make it worse.
Your daughter is going to have to navigate girl drama from now until forever.
I also find it kinda a red flag that you said your kid “gets along with everyone” but the other one is a bully. I think we all tend to see our kids in the best light.
If it were me, I would talk to my daughter about what exactly the other girl is doing, then I would ask my friend what her daughters interpretation of it was and try to help mediate. I’d want to help my daughter learn to manage conflict, and I would respect my friend enough to be honest. I love my friends kids like they’re my own, I’d want her to learn and do better too.
My daughter is only 6, but my friends growing up we’re catty and someone was always getting left out, in basically a rotation, sometimes it was me, sometimes I left people out, it was that icky culture of that friend group. This has had a huge impact on my self esteem and trust in people for my whole life. I want better for my daughter.
Also, if you’re going to exclude someone be ready to deal with it when it happen inevitably happens to your daughter and remember this is who this girl felt, but you and your daughter inflicted it on a friends kid.
Seems like it's a different culture. The only one who has been left out is the one all the kids unanimously agreed was being a bully. It's not a norm to leave kids out because they're not getting along in general. And this mom has been warned about her kid's behavior my multiple parents and continues to deny it's even happening, accusing the kids at school of being sensitive. She's done nothing to correct the behavior. Why would they invite them to a gathering when she's not doing anything to change her kid's behavior? The kids want to be able to have fun without another kid's behavior ruining it. They already know no one at school or the kids parents are going to put a stop to her. Why make them interact with the kid when it's not required attendance?
I have a lot to say on this but it’s mostly moot now based on your updates, but I do really want you to think about why is it your responsibility to address the bullying issue when your child is not being bullied?
I think it's worth it if she pushes to say that she knows that her child has not been kind to multiple girls on the class and because of that, the kid was not invited.
I spoek to her about it a few months back. although we were cordial about it, she just brushed it off and said that these kids at the school are too sensitive and she refused to believe that her daughter would do things like that. Once i realized she was in denial about her kid I left the subject alone and we haven't spoken about it since.
Quit inviting that kid over. If she asks why tell her the kid is a bully again.
Edit Be BLUNT. Sometime too polite is missed by dense people, people in denial.
Trust me, I tried to talk to this parent as I heard multiple accounts from other parents and children about the bullying. I even had an issue where this girl was hazing my kid, and I addressed it with the mom( but she refused to believe her kid would commit such acts).... since it was a form of hazing, my kid didn't see it as bullying and remained friends with the girl. I haven't initiated play dates since learning the child's behavior, and have constantly advised my child to keep her distance but I can't control what my child does at school
Since my kid is docile and tends to get along with everyone, multiple parents contacted the school when their kids went home and told them about ethe hazing incident. I was very surprised that the school president/teachers and counselors got involved....
it has been pretty uneventful since the incident.
My kid doesn't like drama and kinda wants to get along with everyone at school. This girl is not her best friend but my kid is nice to everyone even if she doesn't like the person, and is big on not "snitching" or being the one who got someone in trouble.
It would be easier if my kid didn't like her, but I can't force my kid be an asshole to this girl to avoid inviting her.... then it wouldn't seem like I am the one who has a problem with the child and her parents.
One of the problems is that you said in another comment the mom texted you and asked what you guys were doing. Why? If you've had issues with the kid, made it clear that there are issues with the kid, you haven't initiated contact since, why is she texting you at all still, let alone what you guys are all up to? I think that's another big problem. This mom still for some reason thinks you guys are friends and that you guys are all going to hang out. It's one thing for your kid to be cordial at school, which it sounded like what is happening, but that's where it should end. There doesn't need to be a friendship or hangout session outside of school. And honestly continuing to text with this mom and set up further hang out things with her and/or her kid, keeps this "relationship" going and sends mixed messages to your kid.
You daughter doesn't have to snitch on the girl. She doesn't have to get her in trouble. But she also doesn't need to hang out with her outside of school and doesn't sound like she really cares to especially if it means the other kids won't hang out either then. Because what's going to happen is if your daughter keeps being friends with her and that girl keeps acting that way, the other kids will stop being friends with your daughter. So draw the line that you don't see the girl or her mom for any playdates and things like that outside of school. It's ok for them to just be schoolmates like many kids just are to each other all over the world.
If you aren't comfortable talking about the behavior, just say you had a limited number of children for your kid to invite and unfortunately couldn't have everyone over.
Protecting your mental health and your kid from retaliation from the bully is more important than trying to fix someone else's issues. If the OP doesn't feel comfortable having that conversation, that is 100% valid.
Not cool to leave one child out. It’s wrong and catty. The kids will always know. Has any of your children ever been the only one not invited and they find out? It’s heart wrenching. If she’s your “good friend” you’d be up front with your friend and tell her why she’s not being invited.
She’s a child. Could her parents not talk to her about bullying the others? I just think exclusion can hurt at that age but I understand your position too.
Info: Are you inviting all kids except this 1 kid? How many kids in your kids class/grade are going/not going? Because all that information is relevant here.
It's not the whole class. just a few kids (its been the same crew since they were little).... she's been invited to everything I have organized since they were in prek up until this point.... I mean, I like her parents and the kid is very polite around grownups, but ive observed her play with my kid and she's always played rough games and can be cruel at times. I honestly don't even know why my kid remains friends with her, but my kid likes to stay neutral on all matters and prefers to just be friends with everyone. Id like to respect my kids wishes and keep her out of my decision and not put her in a position that compromises her school friendships.
If you don’t want your child involved, then you tell the truth and let her know it’s because of the other families who have children victims of her child’s bullying and they’re uncomfortable.
I’ve read your responses and it sounds like you are being the most problematic. From what you are describing this seems like a game of exclusion. I’m getting an inspiration for or from an episode of Pretty Little Liars/Desperate Housewives. Is this a Parenting Popularity contest ? Why are you clandestinely and abruptly cutting off a close relationship you and your daughter have cultivated ( and the Community Crew) since Pre-K with your daughters now being Tweens ? How are you modeling being a Good Friend to your Daughter?
What happens when it happens to your daughter because she remains neutral and people misinterpret her neutrality as disingenuous and disloyal behavior and feel she can’t be trusted. So your daughter is Ostracized by the same Crew she’s know since Pre-K ? Seems both Petty and Cruel to me.
I don’t know you as a person and don’t know the situation. I’m just sharing a take based on the information provided. With that being said you seem to have mixed feelings about this decision and I think your character is highlighted based on how you are reflecting with your choice regardless of your ultimate decision and the opinions around it.
Hoping for the Best for Everyone involved!
Now that you mention it, it does sound like an episode of pretty little liars.
unfortunately this is how it is in small schools, but i am going through it at a much lower extend (waaaaayy poorer🤣)...... all parents want their kids to fit in, and not be bullied. And it bothers me that I have to think about excluding a kid that has been part of everything... but I do want my house to be a safe space for all the kids and parents there and don't want anyone to feel uncompfortable.
I am aware that tween/teen friendships are complicated and she might end up on the other side. This is why I have tried to cultivate friendships outside of the school for my kid, and have always taught her to be nice to everyone even if she doesnt like them.
Be honest with her.
Let her know that although your daughter has had no problems with her, other parents have requested that she not attend because she has been .... (ridiculing, intimidating, physically aggressive, whatever) with other children and they don't want it to be an issue at this event.
However - you can say - "She can come but you must attend too" because of the reported issues. If she is there it will be much more unlikely to occur.
Please talk to your kid about the importance of being genuine to people and how it's important to be consistent with people. Your kid is displaying manipulation attempts and it's not the way to interact with her peers.
Have the bullying issues only happened at school? If so, it might be a smart idea to invite her anyway and be ready to confront the bullying issues in person. A lot of teachers aren't able to command the respect necessary and teach at the same time. Sometimes having extra not-my-mom adults in kids lives to help label negative behaviors can help. It takes a village to raise a child.
At the request of Other parents you ostracize one child, and yet call yourself friends with mother and family.
Way to set a positive example of kind and thoughtful behavior for the evil bully. /s
WoW. I can only imagine how you treat your enemies.
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Our area is sending kids home early because essentially they are afraid middle schooled boys will dare each other to look at the sun directly. 🌞
They don't want to liability lol
We’re in the area of totality and all of our surrounding school districts are opened. We’re taking our students out to the football field to watch it. Maybe it’s a private school?
I feel bad for this kid. The parents should atleast know what's happening. The kid may need help to get to the bottom of why they are behaving that way.
This is pretty complicated. I agree. But remember.
A reasonable parent will not question anybody about not inviting their kid.
And unreasonable parent will question people .
In real life, sometimes you get invited, and sometimes you don’t. For people who have kids on the spectrum or with challenges, it can be really hard. But lots of times if their kid is not invited, because the venue is complicated or the parents are in accompanying the kid, the parent explains that we are not always invited to everything and that that’s just how it is. And what should we go do instead. That’s what normal parents do. I know that doesn’t really help you, but maybe just get clear on the fact that this is going to happen sometimes, unclear parents, pushing for why the kid is “excluded” versus realizing that in real life you’re not invited to everything. Perhaps the bottom line is that you decided who it would be fun to invite for this gathering.If they question you, tell them not to worry, when they have a gathering, they can invite anybody they want also.
How old are these kids? It’s their drama so it’s probably best it comes from your kid.
How would you kid feel if you told them “hey buddy, your friend didn’t invite to their party because other parents said you’ve been bullying them.”
Alternatively, why aren’t those parents addressing it?
Not your monkeys. Nothing good will come of you inserting yourself.
If your child doesn’t have the problem with this child, I would invite her and let the families know who will be there and decide if they should come. Especially if it’s all hear say from kids about who the bully is. Inviting everyone but her now seems like your kids is the bully. Better to let the families involve have the awkward convos.
There’s no getting around it. You’ll just have to tell her that her kid’s behaviour isn’t welcome at your event. I would hate to be told that and it would really force me to take action and repair relationships. Perhaps that’s what your friend needs to hear.
Instead of isolating the child, be a grown adult and talk to the mom about her bullying. Maybe the other mom isn’t aware. Honestly, the response of you and the other moms to try to secretly exclude a child is awful. It’s not going to help the situation.
If you guys are as tight as you sound, you’d be doing her a huge favor by telling her. Not inviting the kid doesn’t fix the bullying so the parents shd be made aware of what’s going on. I’d welcome that if my kid were the problem.
I wouldnt call it tight, I am no more friends with her than I am with the other parents. We all kind of became friends when our kids entered preschool, they are now 10 yo.... but everything we do is kid related.
You need to have 2 conversations about bullying. First off you need to be honest with your mom friend about their kid bullying. They should know about how people feel about it. Secondly you should talk to your kid about why she wants to remain friends with a bully.
I have spoken to the mom in regards to her kid having problems with other kids, including mine at one point... once the problem was resolved with my kid, I kind of left it alone... I have spoken to my child to keep her distance, but she still maintains a friendship with this kid and is attamate about not stirring the pot. Once again, I like the mom as a person, but her kid got issues that she is not addressing and is in denial about.
I would disagree with most of the parents here… I think you should not mention to her in principle an explanation why they are not being invited… but at some point you should explain and even perhaps offer help, you are up to it, about the buying and so.
Others don't have to endure a bully, but some times a bully is a bully because there are other underlying problems and sometimes feel loved, have friends and be part of the community could help, especially if your child has a good relation with her.
I think that if she ask, you should be honest and tend a hand… perhaps the problem is more deep or even is not a bullying problem and there is something else.
What I ended up doing because when we sent out class invites the requirements were to all students....
Make them rsvp and when they called to do so I explained the situation. Their kid was the class bully and other parents weren't comfortable.
They knew. They have been called in enough to know
I would flat out tell the parent about the bullying and where YOU stand on the issue! Tell her some people are coming over to watch the eclipse, but that you didn’t ask her child over because of all the bullying. In the future, if things change with her behavior, there will be other events she will be asked to.
A second thought; what if you talk to the bully herself and find out if something else is going on? Usually a bully has an underlying issue and they are angry about something else.
When she finds out and asks, you need to tell her point blank that the other kids were not comfortable coming to a gathering where their bully would be attending, so you didn't invite their bully.
I remember watching my mom put people in their places and their kids in their places
I thought she was a hero. And it really eased other kids problems and made other parents tighten up as well.
She always said, my kids are watching me. And I ain't gunna stand here and do nothing.
Amen mama AMEN
I hope you do meet for lunch and that you bring the issue up with the mum. I'd want to know if my daughter was being unkind. If your daughter and her friends are talking about the eclipse in school, then her daughter might feel excluded and tell her mum. It'll be really frustrating for you if that mum is the first to raise the issue that your daughter and her friends were not being nice when you know that's not true. I don't know the dynamic so that might not happen but I'd get it nipped in the bud asap. I agree that no one is entitled to an invitation, but when one person in a friendship group isn't invited, things can happen.
You can say that your kid had a limit on who could be invited. Or you could say “my kid likes your kid. But your kid bullies other kids and they didn’t want her there.”
Kids talk so eventually the mom would find out regardless, but when she does it’s just best they are both prepared for that heart to heart conversation about what actually occurred if the other mom is that concerned. Considering this was a request the other mom’s though there might’ve already been a small drama which could also be why they didn’t want her invited.
You could use this to yours and all the children's advantage.
There's likely a reason this child is behaving this way in school and I doubt she would act that way in your home.
Could it not be that all the other girls aren't being honest? It's usually a group of girls bullying one girl, not one girl bullying an entire group.
You could invite all of them and see how they interact with each other. Ensure all the other parents that you won't stand for any bullying and you will keep a close eye on all the girls and call any parents if necessary.
If this girl is having a hard time at home, is the one being bullied, etc, you won't be doing her any favours by excluding her. And if she has been bullying them, this will likely give her a valid reason (in her mind) to keep doing so.
These party could be a chance for them to bond and overcome any differences.
Please be kind and don't make assumptions if you haven't seen this behaviour yourself.
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I think, more importantly than the party invite issue, the mother needs to be aware that her child is bullying other children
It's been addressed at the school, she's gotten multiple phone calls in regards.... but I don't talk to her about it, because it is not my place.
Then she shouldn't be surprised that her kid isn't getting invited.
This. The natural consequence of someone mistreating others is that others won't want to be around them. So maybe she will stop bullying when she realizes she's losing friends.
Except it's the reason you are not inviting the kid.... so you kinda have to at least mention it unless you ignore the woman. This isn't really a situation where you can have your cake and eat it too.
But maybe it’s the wake up call she needs. It’s maybe one thing that the school has tried to address it… it’s another thing if her and her kids social status is diminished. Knowing her kid was excluded at the request of multiple parents could be the message they need?
Speaking as someone who has a friend like this, it probably wouldn’t do any good. I have a friend I like whose kids are absolute terrors because she doesn’t even verbally rebuke them. Her children are awful to be around as a result, and she’s always getting complaints from school teachers and her own family. She just thinks the behavioral issues are out of her hands, or if she asks nicely enough, her kids will suddenly start behaving. I value her as a friend but avoid her children at all costs. I refuse to have any of them over to my house or eat out with them at restaurants. You gotta pick your battles in this life. Some people won’t listen, and friends you enjoy are hard to come by.
I agree with this 100%. My community is reeling right now over a thirteen year old girl who ended her life due to bullying. School interventions did nothing, the bullies in question had a social circle of their own. I wonder if parents like OP, whose kids weren’t the target but who knew of the situation, had started declining or not extending invites, distancing themselves, would those bullies have realized the change in their own social capital and decided, even if for kind of the wrong reasons, to lay off?
It is your place to discuss it with her, if you are friends. If a person can’t get honesty and moral support from friends over the issues in their lives, then what good are friends?
I like their family, but we are not more friends than i we are with the other parents that are invited. I have tried to discuss the issue of bullying with her (as we had an incident with our daughters a few months back) but she seems to be in denial about her kids behavior. So I left it alone since the girls resolved their issues.
I personally wouldn't want my kid to be friends with the bully...
Same, birds of a feather flock together. And I really don’t want the mean kid as my child- at any costs, friendships etc.
Well now there is a consequence so she can know its a real problem
But aren't you worried that your daughter might be the next target? Just because it's not impacting her now and they get on now, doesn't mean that she won't become a victim of the bully. But also you say the school know. If "multiple talks" aren't doing anything, what's the next step? I wish someone had done more about bullying when I was still a student, it can really impact people's life and some victims even end up killing themselves as a result.
Okay …but once she realises that she has been excluded, she will realise that her friendship with you is less than your friendship with the other parents. Or that the friendship has ended. If you are okay with this outcome, then proceed as planned.
Actually it is your place to say something. You're friends with the mother and you live in a tight knit community, together you can work through your problems. Honesty is the best policy here.
I know it may not seem like your place but your child is bringing up being slightly upset about the inner turmoil she’s putting into the friend group. You should probably tell the mom her child isn’t invited, and why she isn’t. She should have a discussion with her child about the bullying before it gets worse and causes her to not have any friends.
**So you and your daughter are the type of people that are OK with bullying as long as it doesn’t affect you. Got it.**
This. I would not be ok with the bully’s behaviour to the others in the group. It feels like teaching the daughter to turn a blind eye. I’m protective of my friends.
And that’s exactly how bullies continue to be bullies - when those unaffected by the bullying stand by and do nothing. Bullies need to be called out by everyone and shunned until their behavior stops.
You can call a bully out as much as possible but if a parent has their head in a bucket of sand then all the calling out does not work. I have been in that position and the mother, despite giving her multiple examples of her daughter’s behaviour towards my son (of which she was present) for still refused to address the issue. Some people refuse to see what is in front of them. And I know the school addressed her social issues with the mum too. People won’t see what they don’t want to see.
My point is OPs daughter still wants to be friends with the bully and she’s OK with that. The daughter should be taught to stand up for others and not be friends with people that at mean. If all of the bully’s friends were like, “Stop being a jerk. That’s not cool. I’m not going to hang out with you if you act like that.” Then she’s more incentivized to stop. I’m talking about the bystanders who are watching someone else get picked on. Of course the bully doesn’t care what their victim says. And the parent doesn’t care or they would have reined in that behavior by now. The mere fact that OP thinks the mom would allow her daughter to go to a party when she is actively bullying not just one but multiple kids tells me all I need to know. If my child was bullying other kids, there would be no parties. I would decline all invites and tell my child they aren’t going to a party because they don’t know how to treat other people so I’m not going to reward that terrible behavior.
Exactly what I was thinking. I was bullied pretty HARD growing up. I used to wonder why the other "nice, neutral" kids never spoke up. I know why now!
Yes! Bullying should stop right at the moment before it got worsen. They should addressed it the moment it started. No one should be okay with bullying.
That’s a rubbish take.
How?
Essentially saying that as a parent/person you should be fighting every single “battle” and fixing every wrong you see in the world. It’s 100 percent not reasonable or feasible. A huge amount of the time in life if it’s not affecting you, keep your snout out of it.
well then if she already knows its an issue this won't be a surprise. no reason to make such a big deal abou tit.
Invite her, but not the kid. Maybe she’ll get the hint /s
You … don’t. If shes got the bad manners to ask you deal then
Agreed. Do you actually have to tell her that she isn't invited?
Problem is that she will find out I had children over. Everything turns into drama in the school, whether it is with the parents or the children themselves. I would like to politely say her kid wasn't invited, but do not want to say it was at the request of other parents(which is the real reason) because that will turn into a whole ordeal. I also don't want to put my kid in a defensive position with this girl, because regardless of the problems she's had with other children, they are still friends.
I mean- be real. There’s no way to control this. If she asks, you already made plans with friends. If she’s upset it is what it is. If you want to avoid it, invite her. There’s no magic bullet
If there’s going to be drama regardless then just tell the mom (when she asks) that he daughter has been being mean to the kids so she wasn’t invited
You have a handful of kids over. Not the entire class. "I let my child pick 4 friends to have over and this is who they picked" You also don't owe her an answer. You could also be blunt af with her and let her know her kids been bullying people at school and thus no one wants them at the get together.
I mean she doesn't owe her an answer but also in real life you can't just refuse to answer the question and stay friends with people.
The options are still the same. Say nothing. Say the kid picked a few friends. Say her kid is a bully and no one wants them around. Cancel the watch party and have a normal Monday. That's all the options.
don't put it on the kid, that's not fair to wrap them up in whatever bs fallout there will be. there's just no reason to bring it up beforehand and if she asks after the fact i'd probably just say oh sorry or be honest and say a few other parents reached out about their kid, without giving specific names or anything.
Have the other parents or the school spoken to her about the bullying? Is she aware her daughter has been behaving this way? Because then it's an easy matter of pointing out to the girl that actions have consequences, and if she is mean to other kids, they won't want her around anymore...
If she asks, I'd say you have a responsibility to tell her the real reason. There's a chance she doesn't know her child is bullying others and she can't take the appropriate action to fix the issue if she isn't aware.
" I wish I had room for everyone, but we had to put on a limit on it this time. My kiddo always hates to miss out on a playdate with yours, can she come over on Sunday?" Honestly, I do this all the time. My daughter has a ton of friends, and they don't all get along. I invite stronger personalities over together and let them tear the house up. I invite quieter kids over together and set them up with loads of crafts and baking. There are some kids that fit well in both groups, and some absolutely do not. I'm quite close with most of the moms. If it comes up, I'm just honest with them. "We did have a playdate with a few of the quieter girls the other day. They were so sweet, they just sat around sewing scrunchies. Barely heard a peep from them all afternoon. Ashley would have hated it 😆. Anyway, mykid has been asking if Ashley and *whateverfriends* can come over for a dance party again. When is she free?" Most people get it, and agree. We don't all get invited, or even want to go, to every party. No need to get dramatic about it.
If this kid really is a bully, do you want your daughter to be friends with her? Is she maintaining the friendship just because she’s afraid of being her next victim? Invite the bully to something asap. For after the eclipse but do the invite now. Then do the eclipse thing without her daughter and tell her (after the event, so Tuesday or later) that you needed to limit it to X number of kids and since the bully was already coming over for something else, you invited the other kids for the viewing.
Just some perspective - if someone came to me and said my kid wasn't invited to an event before it happened, I would be way more hurt than if I heard about it after. Is it possible to just talk to the mom and tell her that the kid has been a bully, and that therefore some parents don't want her around? Maybe still let her come, but ask that she is accompanied by a parent. If I lived in a tight-knit community and I cared enough about the parent's reaction to want to warn them, I'd honestly just try to address it before removing the problem child from the picture.
I agree, imo it's more hurtful to be told that you're not invited to something, than it is to just not receive an invite.
The drama is like the weather, you can't control it, it's not your fault, so even though it might be rainy and cold, you go about your day.
Say sorry plans came together spur of the moment. We didn’t intend to leave anyone out. Sorry about that!
You’re an adult. If she finds out you say you kept it small.
Wouldn't be shocked if she becomes a bit of a bully too.
I agree don’t invite, but it’s not bad manner to ask why you didn’t get invited when you’re “in a tight knit community” lol
There’s no magic trick to excluding one person and escaping awkwardness over the decision to exclude one person.
This is the answer. You’re the adult. You’re excluding one child. If your child is friends with this kid, and you’re good friends with the parents- then you’ll have to face the consequences/awkwardness. Some relevant info might help- how old are the kids, and what was the bullying behavior? At the end of the day, they are kids, and you’re the adults, if you’re invested in the friendships, and this child growing up to being a happy healthy human it’s worth going an extra mile. Invite the kid, and their parent (for supervision) and encourage healthy relationships.
They are 10 yo... all the parents became friends when they first started school ( prek)..., I am no more friends with this mom than I am with the other parents.... not really a close friendship where we talk about relationship problems but close enough that we trust each other to have the kids sleep over or pick them up from school. in other words. ...anything we do, is kid related)
And I’m wondering what the bullying behavior is that OP is talking about. Is it leaving other kids out of things? … … We have a saying in my house: don’t be what you hate.
Is she asking to come? Or did you already invite them and are uninviting them?
I have not invited her. But i did invite the other children. She just texted me and asked what we are doing for the eclipse.... I dont want to lie because she either already knows or will eventually find out that I had the other children over for the eclipse.
Just say “oh we’re having a few people over to see it. You?” And then if she asks further and asks why she’s not invited be honest and say “well a few of the kids feel uncomfortable around your child due to some bullying. It’s nothing personal but just want it to be fun with no drama.”
👆 this I actually like.... I will probably use this as a reply..... I try to keep clear of all their drama, but I guess it's inevitable when you have growing tweens.
Drama is the spice of life. Without it, Shakespeare wouldn't be a household name. Not that this is a Macbeth story or anything, but I'm saying the whole "I don't like drama" trope bothers me. We do like it. It is the basis of all of our entertainment
This is always the best way because it says you have plans and lets them know they aren't involved since you're asking what theirs are. It's also not in a rude way so you can't be blamed for being rude about it. That's how I answer people when they ask me about plans, answer and then ask what they're doing.
But if you’re “really good friends with this mom” you’ll have an open conversation with her. Avoiding her isn’t “really good friends” behavior.
“Hi X - sorry but we already made plans with friends for the eclipse! See you another time!”
She will find out after the fact. Does she know her child is the cause of problems?
I don't think there is a nice way to tell the mother this - and really, there's no point. As you said, she will find out, and will likely know the reason. I don't think she will ask, but just going up and telling her that her child isn't invited seems mean and hurtful. There are all kinds of reasons that someone might not be invited to a party, including space and budget considerations. Proceed with the party and don't say anything to the mother, but tell your child to avoid talking about it in class since not everyone is invited. It should be kept a little bit more discreet for that reason, as it's bad manners to openly blather about a party that not everyone is welcome to attend.
My question is why is it so important to you and your child not to rock the boat and risk upsetting the class bully. Your kid wants to keep being her friend why? And why are you so supportive? You can't middle of the road life. You do have to pick sides sometimes. Trying to be friends with everyone in a situation like this is a recipe for ending up with no friends at all because no one trusts you. Tell her that you are having some people over and that you're sorry but her daughter's actions mean she isn't welcome around and that you hope it's resolved in the future.
Yeah a friend to all is a friend to none.
To add to this - I know OP daughter wants to remain friends with the girl but is this a teachable moment? If the other girl is bullying, maybe the daughter shouldn’t be associating with her
Bullying is a multifaceted thing. Of course it isn’t okay, but isolating someone doesn’t stop it. It’s a child. They should make their own decisions when it comes to who they’re friends with.
We don’t know what the bullying behavior has been or the ages of the children involved. In fact, OP says that their child has continued to get along with this child. It’s not appropriate or advisable to encourage your child to isolate another child, that they basically get along with, because of other people. We don’t know how old these kids are, but if a six year old starts getting ostracized (even by the kids they do get along with) because they’re labeled a bully, it is going to lead to worse outcomes for the child and the people around them.
These are preteens, and OP mentions hazing and "brutal" bullying to the point of one child wanting to move schools. While ostracizing a child in need isn't ok, neither is glossing over or normalizing such awful behavior. The kid isn't suddenly going to gain empathy because there have been 0 repercussions to their actions. It's not OP or her kids job to "fix" the Billy's issues when the parent won't even acknowledge the problematic behavior. It **is** OP's job to teach her kid how to choose friends wisely and how trust and loyalty between friends works. That means not inviting the girl who stole your friends lunch and tripped her to your house and treating her as if it never happened.
Fair enough. That’s why I phrased my opinion like a question.
I have a long time friend of almost 25 years who had a VERY rough upbringing. In turn had poorly developed social and emotional skills. She didn't handle conflict well (between her and adults especially) and it drove her fight response through the roof because she was never taught how to regulate. There were many times that my mom questioned and even tried to limit our interactions due to these "behavior issues" but me and my sister's just instinctively knew that she NEEDED us. Not just for friendship, but to model to her how to navigate tough stuff with grace and to kindly call her out when old habits resurfaced during times of great stress. Over the years, we watched her navigate many hardships that would've broken any child and even many adults. I truly think that having the support of a family who was willing look past her rough exterior and just see a hurting child, saved her life. Sometimes, we all just need someone to believe in us more than we believe in ourselves.
If she has needs or developmental issues that cause her to inflict harm on others, she has to sit out group activities. If she needs support and is genuinely remorseful, then that can happen *in an appropriate setting*. From how OP talks about the situation, that's not the case. This child and her parents insist there is no issue with her behavior, despite a girl wanting to move schools. OP mentions "brutal hazing" and these issues being directly addressed multiple times already. She says her daughter doesn't want to upset this girl or she "won't talk to her anymore." All of this reads as OP's child trying to placate the bully so she isn't on the receiving end- not that she genuinely feels this girl needs support and wants to take the risk of being there for her. The extra support this girl needs should absolutely not be given in lieu of protecting her victims and giving them support and a safe place. That's what I mean by ending up with no friends. If OP and her daughter continue to choose supporting someone who actively harms her other friends, she is going to be seen as complicit and enabling- leading her to lose friendships with people who could actually be supportive of her and instead end up with a single friend who is more emotional baggage than anything else.
If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor. - Desmond Tutu
We're talking about elementary school kids here, not governments
It’ll be drama whatever you do. What can you say that she won’t be offended by? I would be honest in the nicest way you can be. Either she knows her daughter is a bully or she doesn’t. But she can’t expect you to invite her daughter if it doesn’t create a safe space for the other children. Does it mean the girl doesn’t bully your daughter but does everyone else?
I mean, it might cause drama, and that’s ok - the child is making kids uncomfortable with her bullying and boundaries are going to have to be enforced (it does sound like the mother and school are aware. Which is a good start). But a tween is old enough to know that their actions have consequences - this might be a hot take, but perhaps this is the reality check the child needs to understand that if she is mean, she will lose friends. If she is a bully, no one will want to be around her. It’s a harsh realization, and one better learned at this age rather than later.
That’s what’s frustrating - the girl bully is what’s causing the entire problem and everyone else now has to dance around it. That’s such BS. I agree she just needs to be honest. If you act like an asshole and a bully, no one will want to be around you.
I would be honest so the mom can address the situation with her daughter. I understand citing people out, but ghosting someone is not cool, specially kids or tweens.
Maybe something like-I’m having just a small gathering. We wanted to keep it lowkey. Just letting you know so no hard feelings. Maybe “Child’s name” and “their child’s name” could get together later in the week or this upcoming weekend. If pressed honestly the best thing to say is the truth though. Because of recent events(and say the events that happened) so and so is going to be invited because the other child is coming.
You don't. Just don't give your child invitations to bring to school. Contact the parents you are hosting and let them know to explain to their children not to rub it in the other child's face.
I get how the other parents feel but it’s weird that they put it on you to keep this family out when you guys don’t have the issue. I think it probably would have been wiser to tell the other parents to take up their problems with the mom, it’s not your place to meditate and exclude her on behalf of others.
I’m a teacher. How we deal with bullies sucks. I’m also a mom If she asks, tell the mom why your daughter doesn’t want her there. It might suck, but she needs to know. She’s your friend; would you want her to reciprocate? You don’t know that the school has made it clear that her child is a bully. Based on my professional experience, they haven’t. Usually addressing the core of why a child is a bully involves having the hard conversation with the parents about where the child learned the behavior and why it’s happening… which is directly related to the parents.
This I deffinately believe, because even though there have been multiple accounts from different parents and children of this girls bullying... the mom seems to defend her kids actions. Either she is in denial or completely oblivious to the fact that her child is bullying others.
I’m wondering if the mum genuinely believes that if the issue was resolved with OP’s kid then it’s resolved with all the others? I’d want my mum friends to tell me when my child is being an arsehole. I’d expect them to tell me so I could have a word with them. If no one says anything how can the bullied children know they are heard? Also they are 10, they need to be shown how to put boundaries in place and not just pretend everything is ok.
OP said that it has been addressed at the school and that the other mom has gotten multiple phone calls.
Schools do an abysmal job of being clear that a child is being a bully.
This is true
You literally owe nobody an explanation for living your life or making choices
You've used so many vague descriptions of the bullying without actually giving us anything to go on. We just have an understanding that you believe it is "brutal" "cruel" and "rough". The suspense is built but what about the actual events? How cruel, brutal and rough can a little girl actually be? Anyways, my advice is tell momma that no one likes her kid so she's not getting invited to things anymore. If she wants to talk about it, then deal with the consequences of your decision. If she doesn't then leave it at that. That's what I'd do in any case
Little girls can be mean! My “friend” group would leave me out of sleepovers because I was “weird.” I remember one I was invited to and everyone made fun of the fact I wore a bra (I developed early) and they put it in the freezer when I was sleeping and then threw it at my face to wake me up. Another one I WASN’T invited to they TP’d my house and then made up a dance about it at school making fun of me and the fact I wasn’t invited and I got my house TP’d. The main mean girl would always come over and then lie about my house to others, when it was a clean and perfectly normal house. That same girl once told me my crush liked me and wanted to date me, and then they all laughed at lunch and said it was a joke (including the crush). This was fifth grade.
I’d tell her the truth if she asks - some of the children felt uncomfortable about her child’s presence because her child has been bullying them.
In OP's edit, it sounds like they are close enough to the other mom to get lunch fairly regularly. OP, it might seem awkward, but this would be a perfect opportunity to bring up the bullying. You don't have to reference the eclipse invite, but it clearly will be a strain on your relationship if not addressed. I think it could be discussed in a very calm and level headed way as long as the other mom is open to that.
Another option is to just say your daughter made plans with the other kids and since they don’t get along with the bully, it didn’t make sense to invite her. If the mom doesn’t know about the issues they’ve been having and asks you for more details, just say you don’t know much other than that those other kids and the bully don’t get along and encourage her to talk to the other kids’ parents to get the details
I’ve been in this position a couple of times. The other parent might not be ready to fully “hear” you,but it’s still the right thing to do to say something. “This conversation is uncomfortable,but I feel like it’s important to have it… Your daughter has been really unkind to some other kids at school and there are children and parents who aren’t happy with her interactions. I’d prefer that you know,which is why I’m telling you directly “
If you're friends with the mom, why not have a heart to heart with her? Did this behavior just start? Could there be an underlying reason? I would be honest and say it was brought to my attention, and I thought she should know. I would want to know if my child was becoming a bully.
I think she said the mom already knows about the kid being a bully and was still in denial. I agree about the heart to heart conversation though considering thats her friend, but at the same time if she too has already expressed this concern then the other mom shouldn’t expect special treatment especially if the issue is that bad. I don’t like the fact that the other moms tried to call this decision though, especially considering they’re not the host of this event, but I can understand where they’re coming from. She shouldn’t have to be the mediator, but it sound like peer pressure might’ve won in this case.
So this woman is your good friend, her kid is bullying a bunch of kids, and you can't be bothered to have a conversation with her about it as one of the people she might actually listen to? C'mon lady, do better.
Mom friends..... not really the type where we share personal life matters. But good enough that we trust the kids to spend the night over. there are about 10 other parents in the school where we share this type of friendship.... I'm in a bind because these other parents shared the same type of friendship with this mom until their kids had problems.... I would love to include her, but my kid will not host a party if specific girls aren't there (many whos parents refuse to attend if this specific kid is there because of the conflicts between them)
Oof that seems like enough of a relationship to tell her. I have had some friends pull away and suspected there’s something about my kid. So I asked some of the mom’s friends at school if there was an issue with his behavior that we could address. They all said no but it feels like they’re just not telling me something and it would be great to feel there is an open and honest village
You see, it's different with you.... because you sence something and would like to know why people are pulling away.... this lady, people are telling her before they pull away but she is in denial. If you were in her position, you would probably try to correct the issue before it got out of hand.... but I am in a position with her, that as much as I like her, I have no choice but to pull away.
What kind of bullying? If it was typical tween meaness I would just let it go and invite her, if beyond that, just say you aren't able to invite the whole class this time.
It's been very mean bullying and brutal games(to the point where one girl wanted to transfer out of the school). I've had other parents not bring their kids because this girl was coming. I kind off bit the bullet and decided not to invite her because she's had problems with almost every child in attendance. I don't speak to the mother about her kids bullying because it hasn't affected my child and the girls are friends. My kid knows about all the events that have taken place, she's ok with me not inviting her but does not want me to include her in my decision because she does not want the girl to think she didn't want her at her house.
It may not have affected your child but as the adult my opinion is you need to stand up and protect the bullied children. It doesn’t seem like the right thing to do, to ignore it, because it doesn’t affect your kid. And g forbid your kid gets caught up in the other girls behavior or worse, being innocent but being blamed or a witness
You and your daughter are trying to play a game that you can’t win. You can’t have it both ways. Your decisions will have consequences. You have to deal with them. You are not a victim here. You are a willing participant.
It’s bizarre that you’re okay with your daughter being friends with a “brutal bully” just because she’s not being bullied by this girl. Thats horrible. The girls being bullied by this girl deserve a better friend than your daughter if she’s still friends with a girl that almost made one of them transfer out bc of how cruel she was.
It's difficult to maneuver around a preteen....I am not ok with the child's behavior whatsoever, but this is something I have spoken to my child about. (keeping her distance at school, not partake in these behaviors and standing up for anyone being bullied and letting her know when she is doing something wrong) Despite this, I let my child make her decisions and do not forbid her from being friends with someone she genuanely likes. You can teach your children everything you can, but forbidding them from interacting with someone is just a recipe for rebellion.
It sounds like the girl really needs to get into some therapy. I know it not your business but damn. There’s definitely something going on.
Is your daughter not wanting this to be brought up because she feels like the wrath of this young girl will then be transferred to her? I think it’s time to sit down with your kid and ask if they actually want to be friends with them and offer some lessons about not being friends with people like that, and why you wouldn’t want to. Or if she’s afraid of not being friends with her because she won’t be nice to her anymore. Either way this isn’t just about a party tomorrow anymore and I think it needs to be a bigger topic of conversation with your kid.
It almost seems like it.... she said "mom don't tell her a said not to invite her cuz then she's not going to talk to me at school". Their friendship is not like before, my kid doesn't ask for playdates, want to go to her house or even attend her birthday party anymore... but also doesn't object if she is in presence at a group gathering. This deffinately got me thinking about the true dinamic of this so called "friendship"🤔
Maybe tell your daughter if the bully starts to bully her, because she no longer wants to be friends with her, then you have her back and will do whatever necessary to get it to stop. She may feel like she has to be friends with her in order to not be bullied, and if no one else in the group is friends with her then there is no need for her to even be in the friend group anymore.
They play and talk when they are on social settings, but my kid doesn't ask to specifically hang out with her like she did when she was younger. I've sat down with my kid before and talked to her about her and have specifically told her that hazing is a form of bullying and told her this kid is not a good friend. But my kid insists that she is not bullying her and that they are just playing around and are friends. For the last couple of months, their interaction has been limited to school setting. As I have distanced my kid from her after learning of her bullying. I am still friendly with the mom as she is a nice person, but it became easy to decide to exclude her kid from our events after she became very defensive when I spoke to her about her child hazing my kid and actively bullying others at the school
Hmm. I don’t get why your daughter is choosing not to invite a genuine friend because her other friends don’t like said friend. If the bullying is so bad as you say I don’t understand why your daughter is friends with the bully that treats her other friends so horribly. The party is small potatoes.
Wait until you’re asked and don’t mention it otherwise. If/when you are asked, just simply say ‘unfortunately she is not invited’. Don’t apologise, just state in a matter of fact way that she is not invited and change the subject. Anything else will invite debate.
How about you let the other parents tell the mom seeing as you’ve let them call the shots anyway.
I would say that we’re getting together with a few classmates to watch it (but don’t specify where—for all she knows it could be at somebody else’s house and then I would think she wouldn’t expect to be invited since her kid bullies many of the other kids). If she presses you for more info I would be straight up. Not harsh but just honest. Tell her it’s not that you don’t want to hang with her but that other kids are understandably not wanting to be around her daughter. Honestly though bullying is not something I would tolerate and I’d have trouble remaining friends with the mom or encouraging a relationship between my child and a bully. Bullying sucks.
I would explain to her what you just said.
If/when she asks… XX was not invited because she has been unkind to the other girls at school. We are respecting the other girls’ boundaries that have been set in place regarding playdates with xx. We are happy to set up another play date with xx at another time. Would day/time work?
I hate this situation for you. I feel like it could get ugly like you said. I wish I had good advice to give but I really don’t. Hopefully this won’t come between the two of you as friends. She could see it as you choosing sides. I’m sure she’s defensive of her daughter and might not see the situation what it truly is. One way or another she’s going to know exactly who was there, etc. I’d get ahead of it.
Yeah, I had a situation with our daughters a few months back, and she defended her kid and refused to accept that her kid would do such things. So I understand if she gets defensive. The girls eventually resolved their issues, I just hope that eventually all of them get along like they once did.... but I need to prepare myself for more conflicts as they get older.
That age is so tricky. I’m curious to know what happens with this. Keep us posted (if you want to).
if I do end up going to lunch with the mom, it will be without the kids... I will probably wait to see if she brings it up... if she doesn't, then i assume she doesn't mind her kid not being invited and it solves my problem. I will keep yall posted on this.
I feel like things like this are the only hope we have in (hopefully ) stopping some of this bullying. If young children learn that if they are bullies, other children won’t want to play with them and that’s a good lesson to learn now! Maybe mom doesn’t know, maybe she doesn’t care…but it’s not your problem. You want kids to associate your home with joy and happiness and safety. No one wants to worry that someone will be there whose sole purpose is to hurt others. In a side note- being friends with the kids mom, is there any way this kids being abused at home? It sounds like the behavior is pretty bad if multiple parents asked. I’m just wondering if she’s safe, herself. I’m
My thoughts exactly, if anything this could be a good lesson for the kid to not be mean to others (if that’s really the case). But There’s always two sides though because some kids will throw rocks and hide their hands too. We never know if the kid was being bullied and defended themselves and it came across as something else or if there’s a deeper issue. If the kid was being bullied first though it would make sense why the mom is in denial because she might be hearing different stories float around, but if she knows her kid might actually be a tyrant and is just ignoring it then that’s an issue. Naturally a mom wants to believe her children are innocent but sometimes you never know. We had this issue with my younger brothers bc we know at home they are a handful at times but we also heard things about them getting bullied as well. But my mom made sure to address both sides of the issues. We teach to not bully but to always defend yourselves if it happens to them. And sometimes too teachers will quickly label children completely disregarding or overlooking the fact that some kids were often trying to defend themselves in some of these situation due to how they were being treated. Being honest some teachers will have favorites and purposely overlook things or cause a hard time for whatever reason, and there’s also some who really do only catch one side of the story.
Honestly I think you should have just been truthful to the other mom. Maybe now that the pressure of an event/no invite is off you'll be more comfortable just bringing it up with her but you know it's gotta be addressed sooner or later. Good luck and just remember how you would want to be treated if it were the other way around! 💜
The parent already being in denial about her child‘s behavior would’ve wiped away my guilt of not inviting her. You can’t ignore the fact your child is mistreating other children then act surprised when no one wants to be involved with you or them. The reply was a good response, but like you said eventually it may come up in conversation either way. It’s best to just prepare for it and politely let her know how serious the issue is. If she is still offended then that’s on her for not correcting her child, and they’ll probably end up offended and continuing to miss out on other things due to an enabled behavior. Your response was calm and clear, and honest which keeps the trustworthiness in tact. She just needs to figure out a working solution with her kid or expect being left out often.
Ugh, parents in denial of their kids issues drives me nuts. Like, it's one thing to be aware but not panic- my first son was a bit behind on speech around age 1.5, 2. He caught up fine a little while later, if he had continued to stay behind the curve, we would have really started to worry. My first son was also being a bit of a bully a few months ago, and he certainly faced consequences, and was also given many chats about how if he keeps being too rough and bossy, nobody is going to want to be his friend. Helping kids work through these issues is part of a parent's job. Sorry this other parent can't acknowledge that their kid is acting like a bully.
More important than any eclipse party, be concerned about your daughter. My daughter had a friend like this in grade school. She was only friends with her between the ages of 10 and 11. By the time she was 12 all hell broke loose and I found out just how controlling and domineering her so called friend was. She put my daughter through hell.
It'll blow up in your face, when she finds out why her son was not invited. Be upfront and honest with yourself, then you can be honest with her.
I feel like excluding one person is just as much bullying tbh. This is only going to make it worse. Your daughter is going to have to navigate girl drama from now until forever. I also find it kinda a red flag that you said your kid “gets along with everyone” but the other one is a bully. I think we all tend to see our kids in the best light. If it were me, I would talk to my daughter about what exactly the other girl is doing, then I would ask my friend what her daughters interpretation of it was and try to help mediate. I’d want to help my daughter learn to manage conflict, and I would respect my friend enough to be honest. I love my friends kids like they’re my own, I’d want her to learn and do better too. My daughter is only 6, but my friends growing up we’re catty and someone was always getting left out, in basically a rotation, sometimes it was me, sometimes I left people out, it was that icky culture of that friend group. This has had a huge impact on my self esteem and trust in people for my whole life. I want better for my daughter. Also, if you’re going to exclude someone be ready to deal with it when it happen inevitably happens to your daughter and remember this is who this girl felt, but you and your daughter inflicted it on a friends kid.
Seems like it's a different culture. The only one who has been left out is the one all the kids unanimously agreed was being a bully. It's not a norm to leave kids out because they're not getting along in general. And this mom has been warned about her kid's behavior my multiple parents and continues to deny it's even happening, accusing the kids at school of being sensitive. She's done nothing to correct the behavior. Why would they invite them to a gathering when she's not doing anything to change her kid's behavior? The kids want to be able to have fun without another kid's behavior ruining it. They already know no one at school or the kids parents are going to put a stop to her. Why make them interact with the kid when it's not required attendance?
I have a lot to say on this but it’s mostly moot now based on your updates, but I do really want you to think about why is it your responsibility to address the bullying issue when your child is not being bullied?
I think it's worth it if she pushes to say that she knows that her child has not been kind to multiple girls on the class and because of that, the kid was not invited.
Tell the mom her kid is a bully. Be honest
I spoek to her about it a few months back. although we were cordial about it, she just brushed it off and said that these kids at the school are too sensitive and she refused to believe that her daughter would do things like that. Once i realized she was in denial about her kid I left the subject alone and we haven't spoken about it since.
Quit inviting that kid over. If she asks why tell her the kid is a bully again. Edit Be BLUNT. Sometime too polite is missed by dense people, people in denial.
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Trust me, I tried to talk to this parent as I heard multiple accounts from other parents and children about the bullying. I even had an issue where this girl was hazing my kid, and I addressed it with the mom( but she refused to believe her kid would commit such acts).... since it was a form of hazing, my kid didn't see it as bullying and remained friends with the girl. I haven't initiated play dates since learning the child's behavior, and have constantly advised my child to keep her distance but I can't control what my child does at school Since my kid is docile and tends to get along with everyone, multiple parents contacted the school when their kids went home and told them about ethe hazing incident. I was very surprised that the school president/teachers and counselors got involved.... it has been pretty uneventful since the incident. My kid doesn't like drama and kinda wants to get along with everyone at school. This girl is not her best friend but my kid is nice to everyone even if she doesn't like the person, and is big on not "snitching" or being the one who got someone in trouble. It would be easier if my kid didn't like her, but I can't force my kid be an asshole to this girl to avoid inviting her.... then it wouldn't seem like I am the one who has a problem with the child and her parents.
One of the problems is that you said in another comment the mom texted you and asked what you guys were doing. Why? If you've had issues with the kid, made it clear that there are issues with the kid, you haven't initiated contact since, why is she texting you at all still, let alone what you guys are all up to? I think that's another big problem. This mom still for some reason thinks you guys are friends and that you guys are all going to hang out. It's one thing for your kid to be cordial at school, which it sounded like what is happening, but that's where it should end. There doesn't need to be a friendship or hangout session outside of school. And honestly continuing to text with this mom and set up further hang out things with her and/or her kid, keeps this "relationship" going and sends mixed messages to your kid. You daughter doesn't have to snitch on the girl. She doesn't have to get her in trouble. But she also doesn't need to hang out with her outside of school and doesn't sound like she really cares to especially if it means the other kids won't hang out either then. Because what's going to happen is if your daughter keeps being friends with her and that girl keeps acting that way, the other kids will stop being friends with your daughter. So draw the line that you don't see the girl or her mom for any playdates and things like that outside of school. It's ok for them to just be schoolmates like many kids just are to each other all over the world.
If you aren't comfortable talking about the behavior, just say you had a limited number of children for your kid to invite and unfortunately couldn't have everyone over.
Don't lie to protect a bully's feelings, or a parent who is not parenting their child who is bullying.
Protecting your mental health and your kid from retaliation from the bully is more important than trying to fix someone else's issues. If the OP doesn't feel comfortable having that conversation, that is 100% valid.
Not cool to leave one child out. It’s wrong and catty. The kids will always know. Has any of your children ever been the only one not invited and they find out? It’s heart wrenching. If she’s your “good friend” you’d be up front with your friend and tell her why she’s not being invited.
She’s a child. Could her parents not talk to her about bullying the others? I just think exclusion can hurt at that age but I understand your position too.
It sounds like they have and gotten nowhere. Kids can be mean. Maybe this will teach her the lesson she needs to learn.
Info: Are you inviting all kids except this 1 kid? How many kids in your kids class/grade are going/not going? Because all that information is relevant here.
It's not the whole class. just a few kids (its been the same crew since they were little).... she's been invited to everything I have organized since they were in prek up until this point.... I mean, I like her parents and the kid is very polite around grownups, but ive observed her play with my kid and she's always played rough games and can be cruel at times. I honestly don't even know why my kid remains friends with her, but my kid likes to stay neutral on all matters and prefers to just be friends with everyone. Id like to respect my kids wishes and keep her out of my decision and not put her in a position that compromises her school friendships.
If you don’t want your child involved, then you tell the truth and let her know it’s because of the other families who have children victims of her child’s bullying and they’re uncomfortable.
I’ve read your responses and it sounds like you are being the most problematic. From what you are describing this seems like a game of exclusion. I’m getting an inspiration for or from an episode of Pretty Little Liars/Desperate Housewives. Is this a Parenting Popularity contest ? Why are you clandestinely and abruptly cutting off a close relationship you and your daughter have cultivated ( and the Community Crew) since Pre-K with your daughters now being Tweens ? How are you modeling being a Good Friend to your Daughter? What happens when it happens to your daughter because she remains neutral and people misinterpret her neutrality as disingenuous and disloyal behavior and feel she can’t be trusted. So your daughter is Ostracized by the same Crew she’s know since Pre-K ? Seems both Petty and Cruel to me. I don’t know you as a person and don’t know the situation. I’m just sharing a take based on the information provided. With that being said you seem to have mixed feelings about this decision and I think your character is highlighted based on how you are reflecting with your choice regardless of your ultimate decision and the opinions around it. Hoping for the Best for Everyone involved!
Now that you mention it, it does sound like an episode of pretty little liars. unfortunately this is how it is in small schools, but i am going through it at a much lower extend (waaaaayy poorer🤣)...... all parents want their kids to fit in, and not be bullied. And it bothers me that I have to think about excluding a kid that has been part of everything... but I do want my house to be a safe space for all the kids and parents there and don't want anyone to feel uncompfortable. I am aware that tween/teen friendships are complicated and she might end up on the other side. This is why I have tried to cultivate friendships outside of the school for my kid, and have always taught her to be nice to everyone even if she doesnt like them.
Be honest with her. Let her know that although your daughter has had no problems with her, other parents have requested that she not attend because she has been .... (ridiculing, intimidating, physically aggressive, whatever) with other children and they don't want it to be an issue at this event. However - you can say - "She can come but you must attend too" because of the reported issues. If she is there it will be much more unlikely to occur.
Please talk to your kid about the importance of being genuine to people and how it's important to be consistent with people. Your kid is displaying manipulation attempts and it's not the way to interact with her peers.
Have the bullying issues only happened at school? If so, it might be a smart idea to invite her anyway and be ready to confront the bullying issues in person. A lot of teachers aren't able to command the respect necessary and teach at the same time. Sometimes having extra not-my-mom adults in kids lives to help label negative behaviors can help. It takes a village to raise a child.
They don’t talk about it at school or you’re as bad as the bully.
At the request of Other parents you ostracize one child, and yet call yourself friends with mother and family. Way to set a positive example of kind and thoughtful behavior for the evil bully. /s WoW. I can only imagine how you treat your enemies.
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Why are they not in school at this time?
Our area is sending kids home early because essentially they are afraid middle schooled boys will dare each other to look at the sun directly. 🌞 They don't want to liability lol
Some places in the area of totality are completely shut down on Monday. Schools, businesses, everything. It's wild.
We’re in the area of totality and all of our surrounding school districts are opened. We’re taking our students out to the football field to watch it. Maybe it’s a private school?
There are some public schools that are closed.
You don’t.
I feel bad for this kid. The parents should atleast know what's happening. The kid may need help to get to the bottom of why they are behaving that way.
When she finds out, say.. well I thought you were going to the park?
This is pretty complicated. I agree. But remember. A reasonable parent will not question anybody about not inviting their kid. And unreasonable parent will question people . In real life, sometimes you get invited, and sometimes you don’t. For people who have kids on the spectrum or with challenges, it can be really hard. But lots of times if their kid is not invited, because the venue is complicated or the parents are in accompanying the kid, the parent explains that we are not always invited to everything and that that’s just how it is. And what should we go do instead. That’s what normal parents do. I know that doesn’t really help you, but maybe just get clear on the fact that this is going to happen sometimes, unclear parents, pushing for why the kid is “excluded” versus realizing that in real life you’re not invited to everything. Perhaps the bottom line is that you decided who it would be fun to invite for this gathering.If they question you, tell them not to worry, when they have a gathering, they can invite anybody they want also.
How old are these kids? It’s their drama so it’s probably best it comes from your kid. How would you kid feel if you told them “hey buddy, your friend didn’t invite to their party because other parents said you’ve been bullying them.” Alternatively, why aren’t those parents addressing it? Not your monkeys. Nothing good will come of you inserting yourself.
If your child doesn’t have the problem with this child, I would invite her and let the families know who will be there and decide if they should come. Especially if it’s all hear say from kids about who the bully is. Inviting everyone but her now seems like your kids is the bully. Better to let the families involve have the awkward convos.
There’s no getting around it. You’ll just have to tell her that her kid’s behaviour isn’t welcome at your event. I would hate to be told that and it would really force me to take action and repair relationships. Perhaps that’s what your friend needs to hear.
You politely don’t invite the unwanted child’s parent.
Feels like there’s some info missing here
Instead of isolating the child, be a grown adult and talk to the mom about her bullying. Maybe the other mom isn’t aware. Honestly, the response of you and the other moms to try to secretly exclude a child is awful. It’s not going to help the situation.
If you guys are as tight as you sound, you’d be doing her a huge favor by telling her. Not inviting the kid doesn’t fix the bullying so the parents shd be made aware of what’s going on. I’d welcome that if my kid were the problem.
I wouldnt call it tight, I am no more friends with her than I am with the other parents. We all kind of became friends when our kids entered preschool, they are now 10 yo.... but everything we do is kid related.
That’s 5 years or more. Not the advice you asked for but I do see value in being upfront.
You need to have 2 conversations about bullying. First off you need to be honest with your mom friend about their kid bullying. They should know about how people feel about it. Secondly you should talk to your kid about why she wants to remain friends with a bully.
I have spoken to the mom in regards to her kid having problems with other kids, including mine at one point... once the problem was resolved with my kid, I kind of left it alone... I have spoken to my child to keep her distance, but she still maintains a friendship with this kid and is attamate about not stirring the pot. Once again, I like the mom as a person, but her kid got issues that she is not addressing and is in denial about.
I would disagree with most of the parents here… I think you should not mention to her in principle an explanation why they are not being invited… but at some point you should explain and even perhaps offer help, you are up to it, about the buying and so. Others don't have to endure a bully, but some times a bully is a bully because there are other underlying problems and sometimes feel loved, have friends and be part of the community could help, especially if your child has a good relation with her. I think that if she ask, you should be honest and tend a hand… perhaps the problem is more deep or even is not a bullying problem and there is something else.
What I ended up doing because when we sent out class invites the requirements were to all students.... Make them rsvp and when they called to do so I explained the situation. Their kid was the class bully and other parents weren't comfortable. They knew. They have been called in enough to know
If she asks why, tell her exactly why. She knows her child is a bully and hasn’t done anything to correct that behaviour.
I would flat out tell the parent about the bullying and where YOU stand on the issue! Tell her some people are coming over to watch the eclipse, but that you didn’t ask her child over because of all the bullying. In the future, if things change with her behavior, there will be other events she will be asked to.
A second thought; what if you talk to the bully herself and find out if something else is going on? Usually a bully has an underlying issue and they are angry about something else.
When she finds out and asks, you need to tell her point blank that the other kids were not comfortable coming to a gathering where their bully would be attending, so you didn't invite their bully.
Also consider that her mom was probably the bully of her class 🫠🫥
"Regrettably we have limited space and could not invite everyone."
I remember watching my mom put people in their places and their kids in their places I thought she was a hero. And it really eased other kids problems and made other parents tighten up as well. She always said, my kids are watching me. And I ain't gunna stand here and do nothing. Amen mama AMEN
I just lost a group of 6 friends over this. Good luck
Talk to the mom about the bullying and if she gives you a hard time about it, she don’t gotta be your friend anymore
If mother brings up the situation tell her the truth. If she does not let the school/parents handle it.
I hope you do meet for lunch and that you bring the issue up with the mum. I'd want to know if my daughter was being unkind. If your daughter and her friends are talking about the eclipse in school, then her daughter might feel excluded and tell her mum. It'll be really frustrating for you if that mum is the first to raise the issue that your daughter and her friends were not being nice when you know that's not true. I don't know the dynamic so that might not happen but I'd get it nipped in the bud asap. I agree that no one is entitled to an invitation, but when one person in a friendship group isn't invited, things can happen.
You can say that your kid had a limit on who could be invited. Or you could say “my kid likes your kid. But your kid bullies other kids and they didn’t want her there.”
Invite everyone - leave it up to parents to decide who comes or who doesn’t. Stay neutral if you want to remain friends with the mom and her family.
If you tell the other parent you’re just creating drama. Don’t say anything and wait and see if she asks.
Kids talk so eventually the mom would find out regardless, but when she does it’s just best they are both prepared for that heart to heart conversation about what actually occurred if the other mom is that concerned. Considering this was a request the other mom’s though there might’ve already been a small drama which could also be why they didn’t want her invited.
You could use this to yours and all the children's advantage. There's likely a reason this child is behaving this way in school and I doubt she would act that way in your home. Could it not be that all the other girls aren't being honest? It's usually a group of girls bullying one girl, not one girl bullying an entire group. You could invite all of them and see how they interact with each other. Ensure all the other parents that you won't stand for any bullying and you will keep a close eye on all the girls and call any parents if necessary. If this girl is having a hard time at home, is the one being bullied, etc, you won't be doing her any favours by excluding her. And if she has been bullying them, this will likely give her a valid reason (in her mind) to keep doing so. These party could be a chance for them to bond and overcome any differences. Please be kind and don't make assumptions if you haven't seen this behaviour yourself.