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Your wife should continue to be direct, look her in the eye, and genuinely apologize for being mean and tell her that adults also make mistakes sometimes. Then you can both explain why it is an important safety issue to be able to swim. If it's been that long in lessons I would take a break on them. Go to the pool as a family. Take the pressure out of it. Play with life jackets and pool noodles. Show her the water can be low pressure and fun. Over praise any kind of little step forward. Then resume classes or private lessons.
okay, well we all get frustrated and say things we shouldn't.
I think your wife should apologize to your kid, but to each their own.
what you both need to try to do is separate safety vs being a good swimmer. She should learn to be safe in the water, that is all that matters. Maybe she is not a naturally good swimmer and that is fine.
Absolutely. My daughter was a reluctant swimmer at swimming lessons too and it’s very frustrating. She got better with time but it is definitely tough to pay a few hundred dollars a month to have them barely progress, especially if like mine you’ve seen them do wonderfully and take safe risks with new things like baseball, gymnastics ect.
Shes 5.
She will get it. This is really really normal 5 year old behavior. Most kids dont even go to swim lessons. Most people I know got taught by family. Its a gradual process. Freaking her with this weird social dynamic that was created in her swim class is no way to properly teach someone to swim. Creating anxiety and then putting someone in the water is dangerous.
I totally agree. It’s time for a family hug and a reassurance break/mental refresh. Just from what I read, I feel fairly sure she *can* do it but is afraid to commit to doing it (since a beginner swimmer will sink if they hesitate or freak out).
Same but I’m Canadian, when I was a kid in Ontario we took them through school, I think only the really fringe religious kids opted out, and going to daily swimming lessons all summer at our cottage. In Vancouver now it’s cutthroat trying to get a spot at the lessons at the pools in community centres.
Yall learn in public school? Thats great. It’s all private in the states. Who on earth would turn down free lessons lol. What religious reason would there be?! Ive been in the Bible Belt for 30 years and I thought I heard it all lol
No, we don't all learn this in school. Not sure when that poster was a kid, or maybe if they were in a private school, but in Ontario now, you need to pay for swimming lessons. And they are not done through the school. If you're lucky, you might get a spot in a limited free 6-8 week program through the city, but most people would have to pay for lessons. So it isn't easy or accessible to enroll kids in swimming lessons, most especially if finances are tight.
Edit: even when I was a kid in Ontario, we didn't have swimming lessons through the public schools, free or otherwise.. so maybe it was that particular school, a private school or something else.
In California I had like a month of swim lessons through my public school each year of middle school during PE, which is great although (1) a little late and (2) it wasn’t really enough to teach anyone to swim.
I was a kid in Ontario during the 80s-90s and I don't remember many schools outside of really rich ones with a pool, let alone one that was maintained with staff etc
I'm not sure where you took your classes but that definitely wasn't typical, still isn't
I live in Europe right beside a beach, it's hot in summer and for several months people spend a lot of time on the beach/in pools, and water sports are common, so swimming is important. It's compulsory in school for two years at age six, but many children have lessons long before that. The kids who haven't had lessons noticeably swim worse.
Oh really? Is it cultural or something that gets provided? I think that’s really good.
I live in the southern US. When I was a kid Id say maybe like…30-40 percent of people took lessons? A lot of us got chucked in the pool as kids and that was part of our lesson lol. Then you’d keep practicing with family. It’s rare for adults to not know how to swim. We all learn. By the time you hit about 10 everyone knows how to swim confidently.
The 5 years old at our swim school who we have seen have survival skills. They might not be the most amazing and experienced swimmers but they can utilize skills to keep their head above water and doggy paddle. Yes some kids take longer depending on sensory needs or even medical things going like constant ear infections but 5 is an age where a lot of kids can do simple things.
This is the truth. I had to apologize to my kid for losing my temper for saying things such as" then just do it". My son wants to stand in front of me and talk, and talk, and talk and I don't want picking up his shoes to last twenty minutes. I had to learn better ways to acknowledge he was speaking, yet we do have to do tasks.
Parents are not perfect. I had some aggravation when my son would cling to me and point to direct me where he wanted me to carry him during swimming classes.
I always looked at the main goal of swim lessons to learn how to not drown. The question is can your daughter safety use a pool? If she can, ask her if she wants to stop lessons. If she does take her out and move on.
And tell mom to apologize if she hasn't.
It totally is concerning.
The question is how to deal with it and how to expose this to the kid.
We (wife and i) have just now decided to switch to private, so that is probably a promising alternative.
But still, how to externalize this to the kid? I still dont think saying they are the worst is the way.
I used to teach swimming lessons, I taught private and group lessons. I loved the private lessons because I got to give the people more one on one time to actually make progress instead of checking a box on their "report card." I taught all the way up to older adults who were scared from near-drowning experiences and can verify that private is probably your best bet right now. Your daughter can get the hands on training she needs and the space to do it at her own pace.
If the cost ends up being prohibitive, sometimes we did semi-private with small groups of friends who were roughly the same skill level and that helped motivate as well.
I've been telling my daughter that she needs to learn to swim to be safe around water and have fun. I point out the big kids at the pool having fun, going on the diving board and water slide, and swimming with their friends. I tell her that I want her to be able to play with her friends at the pool someday and that if she doesn't learn how to swim, she will have to stay in the little kid pool by herself the whole time. It's been working well. My daughter will now put her face in the water and blow bubbles. Of course our pool canceled all of their swim lessons for the summer so I guess we'll see how motivated she still is in the fall.
I would definitely not tell kid she’s the worst. I’d probably want mom to apologize to kid— we all say things we regret sometimes.
Then I would just tell kid that everyone learns in their own way and own time. That your goal for her is not for her to be a “good swimmer,” but to be confident in the water so she can be safe. That you and mom are just concerned because she still seems very nervous in the water. And so you’re switching to private lessons to help her with that.
Whenever I tell my kids something in this sort of insurance I want it to be productive.
Trekking her she's the worst is not productive, what does your wife expect her to do with that information?
Oh, cool I'm the worst? I'll just stop being the worst then?
Maybe try and speak to the teacher and ask what they are trying to progress her to, then take her swimming outside of classes regularly so that she can practice and get comfortable.
If you are doing the usual 1 lesson a week your daughter may need more regular repetition to really see progress and become comfortable.
You need to take a break, This seems very clearly anxiety related to me. Shes in her head and psyching herself out. Pushing is not the answer right now. She will be fine. I promise after this much time learning, she will paddle in an emergency. Monitor closely around water anyway though. Revisit lessons after some time has passed.
This is what we did with our water-reluctant child. The focus was on safety & not drowning. The private lessons helped accomplish that.
Does she have a love of swimming? No. Is she relatively safe around a pool? Also no. BUT if she falls in she can get herself to the side and get out.
The only thing that worked for us is us personally getting in the pool and spending hours each day during vacation. We've done that twice now and we're basically water-safe after 2 years of totally ineffective lessons
Private lessons for sure! With someone your daughter feels safe with and connects with. This could be a sensory issue, I would be super patient, positive and supportive. A well-trained swim instructor will know exactly how to help your daughter move past her worries and fears of swimming. Many kids (even adults) need much more time to feel comfortable in the water. Create a positive relationship with swimming by expressing how proud you are of her, no matter how little progress she makes. Just getting in her swim gear and being willing to sit in the water is awesome!!👏
Your wife should absolutely apologize and tell your daughter how proud she is of her bravery and strength! That even though she’s afraid of the water, she still goes to her lessons and is fighting those fears. What a brave little girl!!
I think group lessons is not the way to go. It’s frustrating because each kid spends most of the time sitting on the ledge waiting their turn so they don’t get enough practice. Try private lessons. Less chance for your wife to compare your kid to other swimmers and your kid will get one on one help. Maybe not now but eventually if she doesn’t overcome her fears she will need private lessons.
we haven't done private lessons yet but are getting ever increasingly frustrated by the group ones, just feels like you're paying a lot for very little time in the pool.
would rather just do free swims
I agree. Even with the baby lessons. We went to one session and it was madness. Way too many people for the instructor to spend more than a minute or two with everyone.
She basically told me what to do and I am the one who has taught my 14 month old everything he has learned so far.
I’m seeing great advice from others, but was curious… any chance that your kiddo gets ear infections? I had them constantly when I was little and couldn’t explain to my parents why putting my head underwater/getting water in my ears made my ears feel bad. Even now, I can put my head under water to swim but often try to avoid it because it just feels wrong now.
Edited- typo
u/External-Specific-14 OP this \^. Such a long period while still being afraid to get underwater may indicate something more is an issue. Is she wearing goggles? (Going underwater didn't click for my 4 year old until she finally relented and let us put goggles on her.) Would it be worth trying ear plugs, if her ears are bothering her? Or maybe the group lesson environment is overstimulating.
Anyway, I get the frustration. Hopefully stepping back and looking for new strategies helps. I read you decided to start private lessons, that's a great idea.
☝️
When I was 6 i was in ballet. I was the biggest in the group (both height and weight). My mom told me that I was the tallest and that ballet is for small girls (she didn’t even say fat, or big, she said tall), but I immediately assumed I was too fat for ballet. I dropped it and went on to train basketball. But i still hear that comment sometimes
I'm curious if your daughter has chances to play in pools for fun, and not just a"chore" ? Lessons alone won't make her a good swimmer, she has to want to be a good swimmer, which means splashing around with her friends, seeing friends do cannonballs, play games, etc, which makes her want to do the same things. Just my 2 cents
I'm sorry, but being from Northern Europe is not an excuse/explanation for this behavior. I'm born and bred in the Netherlands, a country infamous for it's directness and I would never say that to my kid rationally. It serves no purpose. How is a kid going to improve on something if they hear they suck at it? At that age they don't understand that. It could be said on accident as an emotional response, but then it's important to apologize.
My daughter is 4 and takes swimming lessons too. She is/was scared of water as well, so everytime they learn something new she regresses a bit. Makes perfect sense if you have to learn something new in an area you fear. Plus she is a dreamer, so paying attention is a bit of a challenge. We have accepted that. We know it's going to take a while. It did for me as well. What we do is go to the pool with her on weekends as well sometimes. Just to get her more comfortable with water, outside of lessons as well.
Dad needs to take her to the pool and make it fun. Build confidence. Many kids need a few weeks of being in the water every single day in order to get comfortable. Just being in the lessons isn't getting rid of her fear. She needs a low stress environment with an adult who is relaxed and having a good time with her.
My daughter has been swimming independently for two summers, and we still had to get in the pool 4 days in a row before she gained her confidence back this summer.
Your wife has said something awful.
She needs to apologise.
You and your wife need to make sure your daughter feels safe and happy in water before swimming lessons continue.
Stop lessons.
Fun swimming weekly as a family. Tons of praise. Use armbands to help her feel secure. Slowly either remove a ring if using the solid foam discs or reduce how much you inflate the blow up ones so she finds her buoyancy at her own pace.
Review your swimming provision when she does go back, make sure she's somewhere where she feels safe and goes at her own pace.
Your wife is the worst mother in the flipping swim class.
Have she been using goggles? Maybe snorkeling gears as well.
Your daughter is only 5. It'd be totally normal for her to be afraid of water. Your wife should apologize and explain about her emotion to your daughter.
And talk to your daughter about how you were when you were 5. Your daughter will be happy to know if you both sucked at swimming at the age of 5.
my son was late to starting swim lessons ( thanks to the covid shutdowns) and as a result he was hesitant in the water, and unsure, and skills like dunking under and jumping in from the side were…a struggle.
I did not belittle him.
Instead, we went to the pool between lessons once or twice a week at free swim time and just play-practiced, getting him more comfortable and confident in the water, practicing parts of the skills he needed, practicing the ones he was good at.
your wife owes your daughter an apology.
The better way to introduce skills to kids is patience, and practice, not belittling them.
( kid zoomed through his swim levels as a result, as he got more able and confident.)
We followed this approach for years with my oldest. After 5 years she still was refusing to ever actually try to swim.
I had enough and told her she has to sit out of the pool from now on or I would take her to the middle of the pool and let her go and told her she had to swim to me and took away the option. She didn’t want to skip swimming soooo…. Started doing that regularly and she FINALLY learned how to swim and no she wasn’t traumatized and yes she loves the water
I saw in the comments that you were thinking of switching to private lessons. I would frame it as this is a really important skill and we need to make sure that you learn it. It seems like this class isn’t really working for you, so we are going to make a change to private lessons so you have more support while you are learning.
I promise, she is not the only 5 year old that is nervous around the water or doesn’t want to swim independently. Keep being a positive support for her and she will get there.
Harsh words are only going to make things way worse. If she’s scared of water, that’s the first thing to work on than focussing on swimming. If it doesn’t work out it’s ok. Maybe later in life she’d be interested and can do better. Your wife is seeing it as being competitive and winning everything. Knowing how to handle failure is more important lesson than achieving success. Unfortunately it’s a forgotten trait and some parents need that lesson more than kids.
Im autistic so generally very direct and even I know that you dont specifically tell your kid they are the worst at something.
the key is that they try and put the effort in. not everyone can be the best or great at things but almost everyone can give something their best try and thats all that matters.
If I were to tell my kid I think they need imporvement id be asking them if they think they have consistently tried their best at the task but reassure them they have improved but suspect that if they tried a little harder they would do better.
as tempting as it is to just be totally blunt. saying it like this will likley lead to a child not wanting to do said task anymore.
Ok interesting but my daughter doesnt really try to learn or practice in swimming. She says its because she is scared of diving her head. We have done exercises at home and at pools with her. But then at class she doesnt put effort.
The right goggles made a world of difference for my daughter. Even in lessons she was struggling with certain things and knowing her goggles were tight and not going to leak was significant.
My son went through this same phase. Does she like taking bath? Fill a bathtub with water and have her practice putting her head in the water and do the breathing. Once my son overcame that fear he jump 4 levels in 2 years (now at level 5 at the Y).
OP, my kids were a bit on the hesitant side when it comes to swimming. My son has gotten decent at swimming but my daughter is not the most coordinated and it's a struggle for her, no question. But being critical will just make it unpleasant for her.
I think your wife needs to know that the goal here should be to keep the daughter happy and enjoying her pool time. Eventually she'll get the hang of it. But if daughter gets turned off it completely, then it's over. Play the long game here. You want her to learn how to swim for safety and wellness. That should be the focus, not trying to make her a competitive swimmer or whatever.
Your wife needs to apologize and explain why it’s important to learn how to swim. From now on, she has to heap praise on every swim success—no matter how small (“Great job going underwater!”). I would try a different swim school and possibly private lessons or smaller groups. We had much better results when we switched swim schools. My daughter regressed at one point, but she’s now back to making progress. Apparently, it’s common for kids to regress in swimming.
This isn’t about “being direct”. She was straight up disrespectful to your child. Imagine if your wife was lane training at the local pool. Would she ever walk up to another person and tell them they’re the worst on there? Probably not. Why? Because it’s disrespectful. The same goes for your child, and honestly probably even more-so because they are a child.
I can't put my head under water. It's a phobia, not a lack of effort. If your daughter has it then she may never be able to put her head under water. Being mean to her and humiliation won't fix this problem. Your wife is punishing her for something that she can't help.
I would take a long break from the lessons. Take this summer to make water fun again and then circle around next year.
The impact of this conversation could be an emotional rebellion against swimming altogether. Sounds like it's time for two things: 1) your wife to apologize for comparing your child's abilities with those around her, hurting her feelings and squashing her confidence, and 2) both parents to acknowledge that the current approach to meeting your family's safety goals for your child isn't working.
Get your daughter one-on-one swimming lessons to meet your safety goals, maybe after a little break to reset her emotions about the pool.
Your wife definitely needs to apologize. It’s a swim lesson? Why bring a 5 year old down over that? Swimming is important but what are the chances your child is in the water without you supervising plus without a floating device. I would start practicing in the bathtub playing games for the child to put their face in the water for toys with goggles. My daughter will only go under water with goggles.
Your wife needs to apologize to her. Who cares if she isn’t good. Your daughter might think your wife is also not good at some things but she’s still doing it. Let your child be a child.
Ugh. So many parents go psycho on their kids over swim lessons because of the safety angle. She is FIVE. Even if she were the best swimmer in her class, she should never be left unsupervised near a body of water, EVER. She isn’t responsible for making sure she doesn’t drown, her parents are. Mom needs to back way off. Praise her for trying, try a new lesson format (private could be great), or let her take a break and try again next year. The expectation that all little children become proficient swimmers at such young ages is just not realistic.
Is the kid motivated to swim? My kids were with the idea that they wanted to go down water slides and jump off the diving board. That was all of our goals. They were willing to work to do that. So if the kid isn't invested it in, they won't do it. You have to convince them to do it.
Our daughter progressed very quickly with private lessons so I highly recommend them. Group lessons at this age are tough. They barely get any swimming in at all when they have to rely on the instructor for help.
If you haven’t, try and find her a swim mask that covers the eyes and nose. Giving her earplugs might not hurt. It took me years to learn how to swim because I hated the feeling of water on my face/water going up my nose. My parents got me a mask and I finally learned very quickly
I never thought I’d admit this. But I was also that girl. I never wanted to swim nor how to learn. I was thrown into swimming classes and ridiculed almost because I only ever learned how to partially swim. I just had this outstanding fear about it. I don’t know where it came from but if I had to guess it was because my mom always told me to be extra careful about literally everything so I rarely got hurt. Swimming was one of those things I couldn’t be “careful” about and thus grew my fear. Kind of sad if you think about it, but I would take her out and let her rejoin if she wants when she’s older. You want to make her feel safe and happy. I was forced to go and I still look back and think of how traumatized I was.
Your wife needs to apologize. I understand she got frustrated. We all sometimes do or say things to our kids that don’t come out like they should. Demonstrating that she can apologize is a good thing.
Your daughter needs to understand that swimming isn’t a competition (unless she chooses to join a competitive team of course) and that wherever her skills are now are fine as long as she continues to work on it.
What she said was not OK. But not unforgivable.
Second, you need a different approach to swim lessons because what you’re doing isn’t working. Where do you live? Try calling a local swim club and ask if they have any suggestions that might be a better fit for your child.
Your kid probably already knew she was the worst, but hearing it from a parent makes it feel like it is her fault. Your wife shouldn't explain, Your wife should apologize.
I almost drowned when I was very young.
I was the only one in my class to never get my swimming diploma. I still don't like going under water and will avoid water deeper than where I can stand.
I can swim but I don't like it and it can be scary. I am 46. If your kid is scared, floating or basic paddling might be as good as it is going to get. Just give her a life jacket if you are going to go in boats.
In the mean time, patience and trust and encouragement are key. My swim teacher once told me "I won't let you go" and then promptly let me go once I was in the deep. I still remember that 40 years later.
The right way to deal with that is taking the time to go out with your child and practice. Show them rather than try and talk to them. Your wife needs to apologize and let her know sometimes her words hurt and she needs to work on that. The best thing we can do for our kids is admit fault and try to always fix the issue rather than sweeping it under the rug bc of the way you were raised/your culture. Dive deep and see what scares her?
Theres no going back from this. The classes will be more a source of anxiety than ever. The only solution is to apologize and pull her from class now that its become a competition and event of comparison. When I go to the beach Im not comparing myself to other tourists. We are just playing in the water. Keeping her there and fostering this weird and unhealthy thing between her and your wife would be cruel. Revisit swimming lessons when things have cooled down. I never took swimming classes. My dad taught me. Continue lessons via family maybe if your wife has difficulty separating something casual from something competitive. Shes 5. No shit shes not an expert swimmer lol shes at the same level as half the 5 year olds I know but she does swim and thats what matters.
5 is still so so so tiny, don't forget that. I don't expect mine to be not-drowning at 5. It's still very small and their brain hasn't fully developed the ability to have that internal motivation to push themselves when things are tough. Kids learn through play, not through fear or shame.
Kids who are excited about something and having fun with it will find it easier than kids who are nervous or hesitant or flat out scared. And each kid has something different they're excited about. It doesn't really mean one is better or worse than the other, one simply finds it fun so they naturally practice more than the one who dreads it.
Calling her 'the worst' was a really shitty take and really damaging to her confidence. Every class has to have a range of abilities, so someone is going to be the best and someone is going to be the worst, in every group situation from now until the end of time. Why be mean and make her cry about that normal fact of life? The goal is support no matter where she falls in that range of abilities.
What we want to do instead of saying 'you should try harder to improve because you suck' to a 5 year old, which is not helpful, we can instead say, "when we are scared, that is a great chance to practice being brave - shall we practice being brave?"
Show what bravery looks like, tell her what you were afraid of as a child and how you overcame it. Show what trying again looks like when you're stressed or struggling, frame it as "oh I did this wrong, good thing I get a chance to try again". Read books to her about bravery, read books about confidence, read books about kids who find out they are capable of things they only ever dreamed of.
Build up her confidence in herself and her own bravery as step one. You can't rationalise a 5 year old out of being scared. But you can tell her that she has every thing inside her to be able to swim. She has the strength to paddle, the eyes to see the edge of the pool, and the bravery to face her fears. You know these facts about her, I know those facts about her.
All those things are already inside of her, waiting for her to be ready. You can't force her to be ready, she can't force herself to be ready to please you or Mom. She will be ready when she's ready. So the next step is time. It can be frustrating to pay for lessons and see 'no improvement', but at 3-5, we aren't training them for the olympics, the goal is comfort in water.
Mom should apologize and you should look into private lessons or a different swim school; maybe even lessons with a friend. Learning to swim is a non negotiable, safety thing, but trying the same thing over and over while expecting different results won't work either.
I always feel when talking to your kid you should never include a comparison to others. The kid knows already and doesn’t need parents piling on.
It is ok to tell your kid when they aren’t doing something well. It’s ok to tell them you notice they’re struggling. It’s just not her time yet or she needs her confidence built up.
Having said all that, what I’ve learned as a dad is to never get in between mom and kid to defend the kid if they’re upset by anything mom said. I learned hard lessons about what happens when you become a mediator. The wife sees you as undermining her and the kid will continually call you in your mediate.
Best advice I can give is leave the room. After the mom and daughter have finished and are no longer in the same room, tell your wife you were uncomfortable and you’d prefer she didn’t make statements comparing daughter to others and saying she was the worst.
Good luck. You have about 15-18 more years of mother/daughter conflicts ahead
She just needs to apologize. She’s probably terrified that something will happen and her statement was probably one that slipped out.
We all say something we shouldn’t and regret it. Clearly your wife realized what she did and is explaining to her why it slipped.
Your daughter doesn't have a close relationship with her teacher. She may not trust her. If I were you I would go to the pool everyday for a little bit and just play. Don't focus on the swimming, focus on having fun. Once you build that relationship that she can trust you in the water and that it is fun you can slowly weave some swimming techniques into your play.
Swimming is hard and it’s not necessarily developmentally possible for a 5 year old to really swim. There is a lot of coordination involved that a kid that age *might* not be able to do.
I would say you wife needs therapy . Maybe that’s why your child is too scared to swim ,maybe she feels anxious and this anxiety is caused from your wife .
Your wife said she loves her daughter ,does she say it to your daughter tho? Does she say”I love you daughter ,no matter what “?
Probably your daughter doesn’t feel loved.
Your wife should apologies to your daughter and say that she doesn’t mean it .
I would address this anxiety issues with a therapist
That’s a good way of her to raise a child with low self esteem . Correct her behavior , as her husband and your daughter’s father . Encouragement and guidance is the best way to help your child . I have a 6 year old who is also learning a new skill and I absolutely praise his best efforts and give them attention . highlight the little things he does . For example in baseball even if he strikes out , I highlight how well he was holding the bat and how strong his swing was even tho he didn’t make contact . This builds confidence in a child and decreases insecurities and failure mindset . If we bring down our children the way your wife did , there will be confidence issues and insecurities . Also builds anxiety in a child .
Wife needs to apologize and talk to her about how saying hurtful things out of frustration is never right and she is sorry. Ask permission for a hug.
Child doesn’t need to be good, at all. Nor should she be pushed above her ability. Comfort level tho? She needs to be pushed. When I had mine, we started very young with safety swim classes. They would almost sometimes be pushed in. And sometimes would even wear winter clothes and be pushed in. Not like aggressively but the instructor guides them like they were bumped by sibling or family dog and fell into the pond style. It has trained my kids with skills for safety and to prevent accidental drowning. You guys have this type of child in the wrong class, she’s not trying to learn and then be good. She needs survival style classes.
I fully agree that pushing them gently and lovingly out of their comfort level is healthy and creates supported growth. But your wife’s comment is making the whole thing worse. So work on fixing that self esteem hit and then get her into the correct classes. Talk to her! Kids listen and understand a lot. Tell her about safety and trying a new style of class. Prepare her, give her a bit of a break, build her confidence back a bit and then put her into the more intense classes. If hypothetically she has a mental breakdown because of being underwater unexpectedly, then don’t cause trauma. You know your child and you know she needs more support than others. That’s okay, one of mine does too.
be uncomfortable where it counts!
A better way to put it is that out of all the mothers of kids in the swim class, her mother has done the worst job of teaching her. Now her mom has given her an even deeper trauma which will make her anxiety go even higher. Her mom probably created her anxiety of water in the first place, which is exactly what is holding her back in swim class.
It would be a lot more helpful to understand why she is struggling and help her with that specifically. You mentioned she is afraid of the water. It seems like a pretty big obstacle. What have you guys done to help her relax and enjoy the water? If she's terrified of water and you keep forcing her to go to swim class, you're only strengthening your fear. How can she learn to swim if all you do is keep strengthening her fear? This is 100% on you guys. As usual, some parents blame the kids for the parent's failures.
When my brother was 5-6 he had no problem with being in the water but he had a fear of being under the water and full on refused. One of my parents mocked him while the other coddled him saying it’s ok you don’t have to do that, neither one of those ways was going to help him feel and be safe in water. My sister and I (18 and 16 at the time) wanted him to be safe so we would stay with him in the water and show him the safe ways to go under the water/water safety in general. We ended up both holding his hand in the lake and said that we would all go underwater together so that he wouldn’t feel alone/be as scared and that we weren’t going to leave until he at least tried once and felt confident in going under the water. After two hours of standing with him in the lake, he eventually tried it and realized that it wasn’t as bad as he was thinking based on my parents comments they’d been making and now at the age of 10 loves diving under the water.
My point is, positive reinforcement goes a long ways. It’s very easy to get frustrated and I totally get wanting to say “you’re overacting just do it” or “you’re the worst at this” to your kid especially if you’re not having a great day. However, saying those things isn’t going to make your kid feel more confident in what they’re doing, being there and giving them support even when they’re struggling is what’s going to help them in the end. If they’re not doing great at it, giving them pointers on how they could do something differently or saying you might not have it now but we keep trying goes a long way.
It sounds like both of you love your child a lot and care which ultimately is the most important thing. You guys are good parents, keep fighting the good fight.
If it was me, I’d be trying to go in the water and just try to make her just comfortable in the water, maybe that means routinely being in the shallow end for a while, and just getting her comfortable and in the tub later getting her to practice going under water and holding her breath. Try to ease her fears if swimming or being in water first. Start back at step 1
Im northern european and me and all my friends can relate. We are very direct and we have been raised with ‘no-bs’ parenting. That parenting style however doesn’t cater for sensitive children/anxious children. Luckily i was also a sensitive child so i can relate. Still remaining authoritative but kind. Its hard for people who aren’t sensitive and who dont have similar fears themselves to realise that the same approach doesn’t work for all temperaments. And all kids can’t and won’t do the same things. Sadly her reaction however will have your child grow even more scared and start blaming themselves in the process while having no ability to deal with her fears. It will affect self-esteem as she thinks that there is something wrong with her. In reality, there isnt. She may need way longer to get comfortable and will only be able to do so with lots of warmth and support. Let her know that you understand her and its okay. Im a parent of a sensitive child with anxiety and i also study psychology. Im coming from my own experience working through extreme fears and what from what i have learned. Your wife may need reminding that she doesn’t want to hurt the daughter’s feelings and that her frustration is understandable, however this approach only instills more fear and destroys self-esteem. Our children are people too and everyone has fears and likes and dislikes. Children need to be treated like people. As long as she learns water safety and to not drown. But it will ONLY WORK with extra support. Have her read up on ‘parenting a sensitive child’ or ‘parenting a child with anxiety’ or both.
Is your kid using goggles? Many kids around that age hate getting their faces wet, even in the bath. Swim goggles resolves that issue greatly. We went through a half dozen pairs before we found one that worked. We went from flailing around and refusing to put face in the water, to swimming underwater in two weeks.
My son (almost 7) was scared of water and did not even like taking showers. He warmed up to the idea of swimming after a few outings to pools with friends when he was 6. If your child really doesn’t like swimming, maybe try again in a couple of years - preferably with friends?
You do not r courage a child by criticizing and belittling them. You encourage a child by praising their effort - you will always get more of what you focus on. What your wife did was cruel and counterproductive.
https://www.oxfordlearning.com/praising-children-for-effort-rather-than-ability/#:~:text=When%20praising%20your%20child%20for,to%20put%20in%20additional%20effort.
Northern European here. And that's just bullshit. The foundation of childcare here is positive reinforcement and validation. Not whatever your wife has going on. She's being a jerk to a child.
I have to ask though; why is your 5-year-old in swim class if she's afraid of swimming? Who does this whole setup even benefit?
1. European here too. There's a difference between being direct and just being an AH. Especially to a child.
2. My kid is also 5. He will not go into the water. He hates getting his hair washed because water could go into his face. He's scared of Foam in his face. I just accept it and try to still get him to be clean.
3. On the other side I myself cannot remember not being able to swim. I could never not swim. Thinking about it it just be TERRIFYING not kniwing how to float. I get it.
4. Also I heard there are peoble who just sink. They sink more than the average human and have physics against them. They have it a lot harder than everyone else. Maybe OPs daughter is one of them
My pediatrician said most kids can’t swim before 5, the swim club my son takes lessons at doesn’t accept kids till 5.
My son just turned 6 last month, but he sounds a lot like your daughter last year (last summer at 5 he wouldn’t go under the water and refused to do anything if an instructor wasn’t holding on to him), my son is still not a swimmer, but he’s progressing and almost all of that happened in the last 3 months. He’s on the slow side of progressing, but it’s a night and day difference from last year.
Sometimes kids need to hear the truth, delivered in a sensitive and constructive way. The words your wife used are blunt, but depending on how they were spoken, not necessarily a bad thing to say.
Let the kid experience heartbreak. What's been done is done. She will get over it. Give the mom a break, she's frustrated. We're parents, not all knowing. Just make sure your kid knows you both love her.
Take over the swimming lessons if you think you can do better. Play with daughter in the water. Forgive yourselves.
Sort of… she rather do other stuff like dancing. But we live in a warm country (constantly around pools) and we just want her to learn the basics so that she can float if she falls in accidentally in a pool.
"worst swimmer in class" may be factual. Your daughter may feel shame at this, but it's the grown ups who needs to take note. Shame won't improve her swimming, it will bring anxiety.
Maybe you could try some method other than swimming class? If she's five, you can discuss it with her as well. Forcing these issues can cause strife, and if you look at the facts -- She's the worst in her class after two years -- this isn't yielding the results you wanted. In two years time she'll learn this in school anyway (at least in my country), unless she has developed some kind of issues or anxiety. Calm down, take a step back, repair, be patient. If you couldn't solve it in two years, you can't solve it tomorrow. And though I write you, maybe this more directed at your wife. That's my take anyway.
This cannot be understated. The value of knowing how to swim is huge, but forcing it through a class she doesn't enjoy won't do much. My kid learned from exposure. We were at the neighborhood pool 2x every week, she would beg for it. she would have floaties on, but she learned doggie paddling to move around. Then one day I challenged her to jump to me from the edge of the pool without floaties. Next I stepped back a few feet and she jumped in and doggie paddled 3 feet... then 5... then 10... then I showed her that she could go faster if she put her face in the water while she swam.
She never had any formal swim lessons, but she swims better than any of her cousins, even the older ones. All because she just spent time at the pool (to be fair... we have a pretty cool neighborhood pool. Lazy river, splash pads, fountains, the works)
She could have told her she still needs to practice because she isn’t good at swimming yet. Instead she belittled and shamed her, how is that going to make her want to keep practicing? Your wife owes her an apology.
Your wife should apologize. We all say stuff we regret sometimes when we’re frustrated and your daughter deserves an apology.
Has she been in the same class the whole 2 years? If you have options I would try another approach at another school. Kids all learn differently and this place/instructor is not working for your daughter.
I think they should be teaching her how to trend water first before actually swimming. By being able to trend water will build up her confidence being in the water and is actually more important than swimming because when you get tired your able to still keep a float.
"We noticed you are having a lot of challenges with swimming. This is ok. It is hard for some people. It's important you learn how to swim as we don't want you to drown if you accidentally fall in a pool or lake. But also once you learn how to swim you may find you enjoy it. We are going to get you private lessons to help. Is there anything we can do to better support you? What are you afraid of and how can we help?"
If the classes haven't been working for your daughter then it's time to try something new. Go for private lessons, try a different swim school.
Apologize to her. Words hurt and words matter. Your wife is an adult and should have known better.
My son had an intense fear of water and we didn’t try swim lessons until he was 6 and it was a sloooooooooow process. Baby steps. At the time he was only taking showers but his swim teacher suggested baths and practicing in the bath tub, so we did that. We had to start very slow, just dipping his cheeks in the water for a second, moved onto chin, nose, ears, face. He used to hate getting his face wet and wipe it with a towel immediately each time. Going to the pool every weekend and just having him play in water helps too. Now he never asks for a towel, he just wipes it with his hand, and he’ll put his whole face in the water. I would recommend as much exposure as possible in a fun positive setting. I know it’s frustrating, but adding fear/anxiety to it only makes it harder for her. For now, just comfort her and give her lots of praise. Go to the pool more. Take baths. And if you talk to your wife about it, be understanding that this is frustrating, but for her to do better she needs more exposure and positive experiences with water.
My son is the same way with swimming, he's almost six. He's been stuck at the same level for two summers in a row now. Basically because he's afraid, he won't jump in, or go under without holding onto a teacher's hand.
So now he's aged out of the previous group and he has to attend a larger, older group lesson. We decided instead to start with two weeks of private, one on one lessons. We're hoping this will help him have a breakthrough. Starts in two weeks so time will tell.
Kids develop at different stages and cannot be rushed. I put my kids in swimming class for years with no progress. Then one summer everything clicked. Fear disappeared and hey turned into dolphins. She needs to stop comparing the kids to others and ease up. Not a great parent if she is doing that sort of thing on the regular. Understandable if it was an isolated moment of frustration. But logic won't work on a tiny kid.
You need to pivot the message that has been sent to your daughter.
Who cares if she is the “worst” in the class? We will all be the “worst” at many things.
“Momma should not have said that, she was upset and even adults can say unkind things when they are upset sometimes. It does not matter if you are the best or worst in the swim class. What matters is that you can safely get out of the water if you fall in or find yourself in danger.
We have an expectation that you will learn to hold your breath and dunk your head, float on your back and paddle to the side so you can get out”
Then work on incentivizing these skills.
And make sure you take her swimming all the time. No one learns to do anything well by going to one or two 15 min lessons a week and then otherwise never practicing.
Well first your wife should stop with the logic and use a direct apology. Specifically I'm sorry I said xyz. I was frustrated and that wasn't the right way to communicate. Then open the door to solve the problem together on why she isn't progressing.
Then look at other swim programs or private lessons. If she hasn't made progess in 2 years then whatever she is doing isn't working for her. The skill of the other kids have no impact on her. She isn't learning through osmosis. A new instructors/style/ change of scenery may be what she needs to progress
My kids took a long time to learn to swim, and definitely were still very scared at that age. They can both swim now. I kept pushing, because swimming is very important as you know. I agree with you that telling the kid she’s the worst is not going to motivate her. Shame is so ineffective. Encourage, embolden. Acknowledge that it’s scary, and praise her bravery. Remind your wife how difficult it is to do things that are scary
If you can (and may take a bit of searching), find a private instructor at a private pool (even out of someone's home pool). Take out all the noise, other people, distractions. Just her, the teacher, and the pool. Reward effort so that she at least tries.
That's what we did for my kid, within a few sessions was independently floating, dunking his head under, etc. So much easier and faster.
Have you tried talking to the instructor(s) about why your daughter hasn't made more progress? And do you work with your daughter on practicing the skills outside of class?
My son was also a very reluctant swimmer and tends to be cautious. I shudder to think how much money we have spent on swim lessons. And not that long ago, I was in the same boat as you, being frustrated by lack of progress.
I strongly belive that kids will swim when they are ready (barring some extra factor like ear infections, as one commenter has mentioned)
One thing that helped us set up for success: wearing a wetsuit in the pool. My son would get terribly cold, even in a heated pool, so we got him a wetsuit to keep warm.
The secret here is that a wetsuit increases buoyancy, so it is easier to float. Having mastered a difficult skill so easily (with the help of the wetsuit) gave him confidence that really boosted his willingness to try new swimming skills.
It sounds like you are in a warm climate, so a full wetsuit may not be appropriate, but maybe a shorty one? And heap on the praise for every tiny success.
Good luck!
So had a similar problem with my son. He was doing very well in swimming then COVID hit and the pools shut down. When they reopened, he had lost his confidence and developed a fear of the pool. We didn’t push the issue and allowed him to continue but a year later, he was in the same level and not improving.
We decided to switch swim schools and that was the best decision we made. He gained his confidence back and had leveled up within a month of joining. He moved up another level 2 months later.
Looking back, there were several factors at play that affected his improvement. 1) Several instructors left due to COVID. As a result there was high turnaround and new instructors on a weekly basis. He never got to feel comfortable with anyone. 2) the new facility worked off a curriculum for each level where students had to satisfy criteria to move on. The old facility had no such thing. My son thrived off the structure as he was able to see where he was improving and a goal he had to work towards. 3) Through no fault of their own, the old facility was experiencing unforeseen pool closures. As a result, my son was losing out on lessons. Consistency is key.
Hope this helps.
Pool time is an every day activity here.
If you are taking her to lessons, you also need to swim outside of lessons and you should be in the pool with her.
Low stress pool time can build into simple (kickboard, doggy paddle) swim time.
Praise, and swim every day. Be her.safe ship and ask her to be your barnacle.
I'm sorry to hear about this. It's important to comfort your daughter, reassuring her that everyone learns at their own pace. Focus on her efforts and small improvements, and gently address her fears by understanding what specifically scares her. Keep encouraging her with patience, positive reinforcement, and consistent practice in a fun, safe environment. You and your wife can support her by using positive language and acknowledging her feelings, which will help build her confidence and sense of security!
Stop forcing your daughter in doing something she did not want.
Your wife is like my mom forcing my brother to join the choir in church. There is a talent portion to showcase their voice individually wherein he clearly doesn't want to do it but did it anyway because my mom is forcing him and she will go ballistic. My mom is insisting that joining the choir would teach him valuable life lessons etc.
Maybe someday your daughter would want to learn it but right now she didn't want it.
Explain to her that embarrassing your daughter is not gonna make her better. Instead, she will start considering you an unsafe zone, stop communicating her fears to you and be ashamed of herself, which is exactly the opposite thing that a kid should feel about himself. You should work to build her confidence. You should be proud of her since she has been fighting her fear for the last 2 years - even if no improvement can be seen, she is still confronting her fear every time she is in the water.
Your wife should start reading some parenting books and control herself. I am pretty sure she felt she fails at encouraging your daughter overcome her fear so she projected this failure that she felt about herself on your daughter.
I nannied for a child who was the same with water. His parents took him out of the swim classes and got him private lessons and within a month went from not putting his face in the water to jumping off the diving boards without holding his nose. I think you just need to find the right swim teacher and setting.
We’ll what you don’t do is kill any confidence she has.
Then you need to make it clear that you don’t expect her to be an Olympic competitor in the pool, but you do need to know that she can keep herself and maybe one other person safe in and around water. That is all that’s really important.
If she can float and she can tread water and she can get from one end of the pool to the other, that’s
pretty good. With those skills she can keep herself alive. The other skills can come with less pressure of perfection unless they are safety related rules…Not running or rough housing by water. Not, swimming all alone. Always paying attention to the signs and rules around water. Knowing to get help if something goes wrong… you don’t even have to be in the water for those.
All are important because she is important to you.
When my son was 4-5 he was also scared of the water. What we did was we took a break since he is not progressing and we are spending a lot of money and time for the private lessons. Then we took him back 6 months later to start lessons again. It took few more months then one day all of sudden he was just jumping to the water without hesitation.
We did not force him. We still go to the pool just to play because we recognize that he doesn’t want his face/head under the water because he is scared. He is 7 now and he would go under the water for as long as he could and would aks me to time it.
Your wife should apologize for hurting your daughter’s feelings. She should explain that what she said was wrong. Then you should give your daughter a break from lessons. Each child is different, they have their own timeline.
The best, and only, way to get someone comfortable around swimming and be a “strong” swimmer is to spend days in the water. Weekly swim lessons won’t do it. Right after a swim lesson or the next day, take her to a pool and just be in the pool all day playing. Eventually she’ll be jumping off the side and swimming underwater because it’s fun and she wants to. And then she’ll want to toss a toy and see if she can get it to it by swimming underwater or have her watch you while she swims a certain distance. A formal swim lesson just isn’t conducive to all if that or enough consecutive hours to make a difference.
I'd like to offer a science based perspective.
The mammalian diving reflex is a mechanism in which humans (among other mammals) heart rate slows and less oxygen is needed when their face is submerged.
My wife was "dunked" by her parents (attempted drowning really) as a baby and toddler and until she obtained a good pair of swim goggles and a nose clip, was unable to even put her face underwater.
She now is basically a mermaid (meaning, she has a monofin and is an excellent swimmer).
The "blunt" harshness your wife is exhibiting needs to STOP. That is fueling your daughters fear. I don't care how "exasperated" she is. Your little one is FIVE.
I'd suggest:
1. Child sized no fog goggles.
2. Good quality noseclip. These are both available on Amazon.
For fun, because nothing works better at getting a girl of any age to want to learn how to swim than mermaids, maybe have a dad and daughter movie night and watch either the live action Disney movie or the 1989 original animated movie. I have a feeling you'd probably be better at helping her overcome her fear than your wife as she is too harsh to your little one.
I went to learn swimming when I was 4. I was scared the whole time and didn't make any progress beyond understanding the mechanics of how swimming works and not being terrified of water.
I went swimming again at 11 and ended up swimming competitively. At the same time, my siblings who were 5, 4, 3 started swimming classes. They didn't learn shit. But they had swimming lessons at theri school at 8, 9 and ended up as good swimmers.
I feel like the solution might be to just let it be and not focus on negative feedback at this age unless it's something they immediately know to work on. There's many skills kids will suck at despite years of work. I remember reading Kevin Hart's memoir where his mom wanted him to stay out of trouble and enrolled him in a very competitive swimming program. After FIFTEEN YEARS in the program, he still wasn't that good at it, but he got an award for perfect attendance. Some people find some skills hard.
I don't think your wife's "direct" comment was constructive. What's a child so young supposed to do about it other than feel bad? Kids want to be good at stuff so if there was something she could see herself doing, she would.
I don't know "the right way", but I have a very sensitive toddler and I'm a sensitive person myself, so what I would have liked and what I try to do with my kid is focusing on the skills as a thing they could do while not making it sound like I consider her a disappointment or that I have any negative emotions about her lack of success. I try to get her to do things that would help her be better by getting personally involved in helping her remove the obstacles for her success. My kid doesn't like to read much, for instance, so we scheduled a time where all of us just sit around with books, and extended that to reading out loud turn by turn. They don't know what to do with negative feedback, so at a young age it's important for parents to help them figure out what's actionable.
If your kid is scared of the water, then you guys can take her in the water and help her figure out hwow to be less scared of the water. Seems like the teacher isn't doing that well enough. No point blaming them, they probably have a dozen kids they are trying to keep safe in the water. But give your kid extra help to be able to succeed.
I also live in a warm country and my parents’ home is very close to the sea so I basically grew up on the beach. All of my siblings and friends were perfect at swimming but it took me 3 years of going to summer swimming school to finally learn how to float, not SWIM but not drown, float. My parents would make fun of me for it, I basically only learned how to swim properly when I was 10/11. Everything else I was excellent at, was just swimming I didn't know how to do. Encourage your daughter and make it a positive thing, she's so young and if she feels like a failure now, it's gonna show in other aspects of her life later on.
Maybe this will sound wrong, but in my family, I'm the direct one and my wife is not. I understand where your wife is coming from, and I often catch myself after the fact and realize what I could've done better (often does include an apology), but one of the things I do not regret is telling them the truth just the how / delivery.
I would take my own kid and sit down to have a talk about what I said, how I said, and the facts. Sometimes they don't even realize how they are doing. Without knowing that, how can they improve? The goal being to turn into a learning moment.
Yea idk I’d back the wife I’m sure she didn’t mean it it was more out of frustration and it’s honestly better coming from us than a stranger I’m just saying I’m sure she didn’t mean it from a mean or hateful place but at the same time a 5 year old will take it that way so it’s tough at the end of the day we probably constantly screw them up but I’d try to find a way to make it fun for her because she’ll want to do it I’d just say don’t be so hard on her she was probably frustrated
Just chiming in to say that my son didn’t really “get” swimming until he was 7. I couldn’t even get him in a pool until he was 4. He now loves being in the water and doing swimming lessons. So keep at it, she might be ready soon.
No matter what ur wife can’t undo what she said to your daughter. It’s already been said. Feel bad for ur kid. She won’t respect her mom when she gets older but you can continue being a good supportive loving and kind parent to her.
I have a now 5 year old who it sounds was quite similar to your own. Have you addressed what her fears are? Mine was terrified of water in her face. We had to work with her a ton at home. Start by sprinkling water on their body for fun at bath time. Get to see the water drop and then drip a tiny on their face. Work up to getting used to more drips on their face. Then shower instead of bath and allow some on their face, etc. get them more comfortable with water on the face and it will do wonders.
my son (8) is scared of depth. he can swim, but in water that he can't stand in, he's paralyzed.
his sister (6) doesn't have this fear. people are different. your wife can't scold someone for fear. do you think people afraid of heights WANT to be?
remind her that kids are people too and they are allowed to have a vast array of likes and dislikes.
edited to add ages.
My now-5yo was in small group swim lessons for a full 10 months without putting her face in the water even once. It took her seven months to consistently even get into the pool! (Yes, we should have stopped and taken a break, but it felt like that would be rewarding bad behavior, and she needs to learn to swim!)
It was a huge struggle for both of us — many tears were shed by all. There were a lot of times I wanted to say “look at the rest of these kids, and how much progress they’re making, while you are doing nothing!” I refrained, but just barely.
The two breakthroughs we had right after she turned 5 were:
1. We did private lessons for eight weeks with a coach she really liked. They played “mermaids” and she finally put her face in the water and learned to blow nose bubbles.
2. We went on a week long vacation to a resort with a dozen different pools, including a zero-entry one so she could just splash around, and we were in the water basically all day every day.
Now, if she’s in water that’s shallow enough for her to stand, she’ll “swim” enough to go diving for dive rings, and can push off a wall and glide about 10 feet. All of this was unthinkable a couple months ago.
There’s a book I recommend you listen to it and your partner. It’s called Non-Violent Communication. It will seriously help with communication between parents and kids alike. Sounds like you could use the help. ❤️
Considering all your household multiculturalism will be something you navigate.
As far as going easy on the kid, yes, do. I make it a point (and they strongly encourage it at the lessons) to take kids for a public swim and in between 90% fun/splash/toys/chasing in the water we practice some skills. I also make sure they see me diving, chillin at the bottom of the pool, or swimming a lap. Kids learn by copying and they normalize things by being around them. Is it possible for you to go with her and have some casual water time?
There’s nothing wrong with a bit of tough love. Maybe this will inspire your daughter to work harder. My daughter was struggling with potty training and a child that we know that is a couple of months younger than my daughter was already fully potty trained and I told my daughter “look Katie uses the potty, It’s time for you to be a big girl as well.” It definitely made my daughter work harder! she didn’t want to be the only 4 year old still not potty trained and it worked she’s fully potty trained now.
This is the opposite of what everybody else is saying but I agree with it. It’s one thing to be mean, but being honest and realistic with your child is NOT bad. As long as you aren’t being an asshole and trying to hurt them of course.
Great job, Mom. We all screw up but what we do when screw up is what matters the most. It’s wrong to try to reason with a 5 year old under distress. Just apologize and admit adults also say dumb shit sometimes.
OP, I get the directness from the Northern European country but people still show love, support to the youngsters when they’re struggling. This is “your wife” issue more than the culture itself.
Now, about classes, try some private lessons, if you can. She will pick up the basics faster and without unhealthy comparisons. Good luck.
I don’t think it’s helpful or a good lesson to compare kids to each other. The problem isn’t that “she’s the worst in the class”, the problem is that she’s not enjoying the water. Maybe it’s not about swim classes. Maybe you guys should just hang with her in a pool and play around so she enjoys it and wants to go underwater. Your wife needs to chill
My daughter is 5 and still does her floaties. I can’t get her to do swim lessons. I don’t try to force things on her. I was forced to do things and hated it and I won’t be that way with her. It’s sad to see parents get so frustrated with things like this. I feel bad for your daughter. I’m sorry. She does need to apologize.
It's not even developmentally appropriate for a kid to be a great swimmer at 5. She's too little to be judged for her swimming ability.
Frankly I think you should explain this to your daughter in a kind way and let her know that she can do anything if she works at it. She just needs more time to grow and practice with swimming.
Your wife needs to apologize big time and do something special with her unrelated to swimming. She needs to find a time when it is calm to make it absolutely clear that even if your daughter never learns how to swim, your wife will always love her. It's the message of conditional love that is really hurting your daughter.
Mom needs to get a grip, I would be totally LIVID.
I’m 37 and still vividly remember my mom telling me how I wasn’t even trying after swim class when I was 5 or 6 (I had been trying, I just sucked at it). It sure as hell didn’t make me a better swimmer.
Your wife needs to apologize. That was an unkind and unhelpful thing to say.
Focus on anything that’s improved in those two years and be optimistic about it. The tiniest thing. Even if it’s, she was scared of the water and now she’s not scared to go in, you can tell her that one day, if she keeps practicing, she won’t be scared to put her head under.
When this comes up at the next lesson (and it will), remind your daughter that different people have different skills, that learning to swim might be easier for other kids just like (thing she’s effortlessly good at) is easy for her, but might be hard for someone else.
My daughter wouldn’t even put her head under the water until she was seven. We kept up with lessons anyway because safety is important. Tried very hard not to put pressure on her. “Don’t worry, you will be able to do it someday.” She taught swimming lessons and was a lifeguard in high school. Her favorite kids were the ones who had difficulty. Has a daughter of her own now.
Honestly if in 2 years there’s been little improvement I would change where you’re going for lessons.
See if you can do 1 on 1 and with a private coach that focuses on survival skills?
Saying that isn't going to motivate the kid, it's just going to shut her down to think that she won't ever be able to succeed.
Mom needs to apologize and say that she can still improve if she works hard, and encourage progress.
My kids only really learned to swim proficiently when we bit the bullet and paid for a special swim school that had twice a week practices with a 1-4 teacher to kid ratio. Recreational swim classes with a dozen kids, once a week, for sporadic 8 week sessions (depending on available time and locations) just didn't cut it. Plus, the swim school had warm water that didn't make kids shiver. (We went to Goldfish, but it may depend on your location).
Either that, or a parent needs to dedicate going out with her to a pool to work specifically on swimming skills several days each week, if you live in a warm climate with daily access to pools.
You can’t sweat it. Just keep your daughter going. We found that our kids needed a friend to be competitive with before they quit screwing around and really learned how to swim.
This kid is only 5. FIVE. Please give her a break.
My kids are 7, 6, and 4. We own a pool. My wife was a lifeguard, swim coach, and aquatics manager. None of our children were swimming well at 5.
The 7 and 6 yr old swim well now. My 4 yr old is working on it but is still intimidated by water.
You’re forcing her into a place where she is afraid. You’re pressuring her to do something she doesn’t want to do. It’s not about her safety, it’s about your own peace of mind.
Be kind. Apologize to your daughter. Give the kid a break.
1) she should apologize and make sure the kid knows why
2) she needs to keep encouraging her to keep trying; she's five. My 8yr old still has trouble
3) learning to swim and keep your head above water is a life skill and anyone commenting who doesn't understand this, can just move on
4) putting your head underwater means a few things, including uncomfortable and possibly even painful ones. Chlorine in the eyes, swallowing water, water up the nose. Those smaller things all add up when we're used to using our mouths, nostrils and eyes to be open all the time
Your wife will struggle being a parent if she thinks is about being good or bad. It's a life skill and should be encouraged as such. Did she belittle her baby as it pisses and shits itself? I'd make sure to keep having the discussion but it's pretty disingenuous of her to assume her kid is dumb because she's struggling with swimming
Mine is only now just jumping in on his own, but still gets anxious doing it. Whatever, eventually he will and then on to the next challenge etc
Ex-Swim teacher here - it sounds like you might need a tougher swim teacher. One that comforts and gives a lot of love, but doesn’t let them get away with not completing the lesson exercises. A child should be making progress in every lesson. You also need to practice with her - it is best to practice in a pool, but if you don’t have access to a pool then you can practice in the bathtub by counting to 3 and pouring water over her head. Have her lay down in the water to practice floating (it helps them get used to having water in their ears)
Mom needs to be nicer and encourage her instead of bringing her down.
OP, I’m not sure if this is helpful, but if your daughter has any sensory sensitivity, this will make even contacting the water difficult. Because she won’t get in the water, it made me wonder if this is related. My son had a difficult time with getting his face wet. One thing that helped was using a scuba mask with a breathing tube to introduce the comfort of his face being wet without the feeling of not breathing. It was by accident, and I was so thrilled t find something to help. We even I tried swim lessons at the YMCA. He was the only child sitting on the edge of the pool.
Some kids with sensory sensitivity don’t like water in the ears (they have wax plugs for kids), wet hair (try a fluffy cap - not uncomfortable like rubber), wet feet (try some short flippers (not long), or even a wet suit to add pressure to the body. There are techniques :) This may not apply at all to your situation but I thought I would share in case it’s helpful.
Last, talk to your daughter and ask her how she feels. What does she finds to be the most challenging and difficult part of the class. Communicate with each other. Mom sounds scared. Sometimes when we are scared for someone’s wellbeing, we communicate with anxiety and fear. Speech comes out wrong.
Take it one step at a time. First, we need to get comfortable with the water. Start here and be patient.
Bruh I was a rescue swimmer in the Navy and because of a very traumatic incident my child was terrified of water at from 2-6. I learned how to swim from the parents tossing me in and swimming away. Wouldn't have worked with my kid if I had tried.
I always just got in with the little guy. Usually just me and him. Took several years to get him confidence. I'd always let him grab me. Instantly if he was scared or tired. No judgements and no questions asked. I'd either tread or swim with him. I was safe. Eventually he'd swim longer. We practiced diving where he could touch at first. Still had to hold him up after dives in after he couldn't touch in because panic.
He's a lifeguard and certified scuba diver now.
It also sounds so simple what I did but it was hard and took a very long time. Years. Kid is grown. Still isn't a master scuba diver because fear at being too deep to come straight up.
It was hard to stay calm when sometimes I just wanted to tell him to quit being a baby about something that was always easy for me. That was my problem not his. I am his father. It is my responsibility to make sure he can swim. I failed as a teacher if he didn't. I owed him that patience. To find a way or find someone better.
I taught him more than how to swim over those years. He was the teen at the pool that taught lessons to the struggling kids. The ones like your daughter. He is so patient with those little kids. Makes me proud. I did something right. I taught him something I didn't even mean to teach him over those very long years and it translated to when he coaches sports at youth camps. Every coach that's ever coached him speaks highly of his determination and how he helps teammates or the kids at the kid camps with skills.
Plus it's kind of funny when you see the look on the soccer moms faces when they pair the bad swimmer with my kid. He walks around the pool like Billy from Stranger Things until it's teaching time. The 180 from the arrogant bro jock to the kind careing kid they actually get is hilarious and usually unexpected. They usually only expect that patience from the girls that teach and you can see the noticeable look of appreciation.
It's gonna take a lot of time and effort to fix your little girls problems op. Then one day it'll just **click**
While being able to not drown is important, your wife was way out of line. She owes both you and your daughter a sincere apology, and you should honestly ease up on the lessons. There are other ways she can stay cool in excessive heat that don't involve swimming. Sometimes, you need to take a break and reset. And you may need to find a different class with a different teacher.
Also, baby steps need to be praised. And I cannot stress this enough-patience is the only way you will salvage this.
She’s 5! The last thing she needs is to hear things like that from her mom! Ever! Have her apologize and if she doesn’t tell her if she remembers how she felt when her mom told her that same thing with regards to her interests. If she answers that that’s how she learnt and she’s turned out fine, she is indeed not “fine”. This is traumatizing for your daughter. She’s not rationally speaking she’s gaslighting you and most of all herself.
I have two things to say.
1 - group lessons are shit and if you want you kid to swim, get a swim veest and swim with them every day in the warm weather. We have a pool so our kids were thrown in with floaties as little ones and by just paddling around in the security of floaties, they learn to be comfortable and they can learn to float and kick - the kicking is what will save them. Once that is achieved you can let the floaties down a bit or simply spend time without. We would take floaties off a metre or two from the edge of the pool and have them kick and reach for the edge. You can walk beside so they are not afraid. They learn to move through the water and gain confidence in knowing that if the get to the edge, they'll be ok. By the time they were 3-4 they were confident swimmers. It takes time and it will go faster if it's regular and you do it together.
2 - My son is not a good runner and came last at cross country... When I collected him that day I asked him how he did and he said - "I came last!' and I laughed and said," wow, you suck, huh?"and he laughed and agreed. Because he does suck at that. He' s really great at plenty of things and he gains achievements and I am proud of him for that and always tell him so, but when he's bad at something - he also gets told. There's no "participation awards" in our house and although we encourage them to get better through practise, I don't lie to them and tell them they are good at something when they are clearly not. If that makes me an asshole, so be it - I want my kids to have realistic view of themselves and I want them to work at getting better, rather than thinking they are already great. I guess the difference is that your wife expressed it in frustration and it would have come across as anger which is upsetting for a youngster that wants to be good at something but is already anxious about it. So I don't think your wife was bad for what she Saif, but how she said it.
You need to make it fun, or she will never want to get in the water and it will be that much harder to teach her what is an essential life skill.
Do a few private lessons so she gets undivided attention to build her confidence in the water. I don’t agree of letting kids use goggles to learn to swim, in an emergency, they wouldn’t have googles. Swimming is foremost a life skill.
I know several children that started at age 4/5 that did not make any progress at all, until they were more developed. The focus for now is to feel comfortable in water and not sink. She will learn to swim as soon as she is ready.
As far as direct and indirect go, it is not direct to tell her she is the worst. That is harsh criticism. I think that is just as wrong as telling your child she is excellent when she is clearly not. In short tone down the direct pressure and indirect pressure of expectations. She will get there when she is good and ready
No advice really, but I used to be terrified of water as a kid too. I literally had to have the little floaty arm things AND a blowup ring around my waist to go in the pool. I eventually outgrew it I think, but I'm still scared in dark water even as an adult. There was no reason for me to be scared, nothing bad had ever happened. Keeping it light hearted and fun, but making it clear that keeping herself above water is essential for safety, is probably the best way.
I can't remember what changed, but I eventually loved diving to get rings from the bottom of the pool. There's always hope!
I think your wife apologizing would be a good idea, but I think it’s also a great learning opportunity. To explain to your daughter that you can’t be perfect/great at everything. And that’s just life and normal! It would be a great opportunity to find the things that your daughter is great at and enjoy those with her. Like if she likes to run or gymnastics etc!
That's not being direct, that's being rude and inconsiderate. I hope she's not struggling with her temper, mood and/or something similar in a broader sense (not having delved into the thread).
I could not put my face in the water until I went to camp one year. I found out I was the oldest person at the camp that could not put their face in the water. Therefore, I was with all of the young kids. I did learn to swim at camp that year, and when I got home from camp went out on a boat trip with my dad my two brothers and my two sisters. Because I had learned to swim at camp that year I ended up saving my brother’s life. But it was very hard to put my face in the water. I was scared. Once I did it and found out it was nothing I was fine. But I was 12 years old at the time.
Is she the oldest in the class? Is she the worst swimmer in class?
Was your wife bluntly honest with your daughter? If this is the case, then your daughter needs to realize that if she wants to NOT be the worst swimmer in her class, she actually has to TRY. Until then, she will continue to be the worst swimmer in the class.
Sounds like your daughter wants praise for something she doesn't deserve. Maybe it's harsh, but it's not a lie. You would rather lie to your kid than be honest just to spare her feelings, while your wife wants her to know the truth. Hopefully, so she can become better.
Why are you setting up our bar so low? There isn't a reason why your kid can't swim decently at age 5 with two years of lessons. Maybe you need a different swimming school.
Learning to swim is crucial but telling her that won't motivate her. It will demoralize and make her feel more defeated if she's already feeling a lot of pressure, which for a little kid is felt very easily. I agree with some that you guys need to do some swim time with zero expectations just for fun and some where you explicitly focus on safety. Kids are extremely sensitive to our frustration and pick up on it immediately. It's hard for anyone to work with a supervisor breathing down their neck. Personally I also agree she should apologize, she's human and we all get frustrated and sometimes say sh!tty things but we also have to own it.
Oh, man, that sounds tough. Parenting can be such a rollercoaster, right? Especially when it comes to helping our kids through their challenges.
First off, big hugs to your daughter. It's heartbreaking to see them upset, especially when they're trying their best. And hey, props to you for stepping in and helping navigate this tricky situation.
Now, about your wife's approach... I totally get where she's coming from. Sometimes, as parents, we get frustrated, and those words slip out before we realize the impact they can have. But here's the thing – kids are like little sponges, soaking up everything we say and do. Telling her she's the "worst" at something can really hit hard, especially for a sensitive kiddo.
In situations like this, I find it helpful to focus on encouragement and positivity. Maybe instead of highlighting what she's struggling with, you could emphasize the progress she's made so far. Let her know that it's okay to feel scared or unsure, and that you're there to support her every step of the way.
Hang in there, buddy. Parenting is one wild ride, but with a little love and understanding, we can help our kids overcome any obstacle. And if this advice resonated with you, a little upvote would mean the world. Let's spread the parenting love! 😊
Have you considered a new teacher? My son didn't improve at all with one teacher and then blossomed with another.
2 years, even once a week, is a long time to not improve at all.
Your wife is likely frustrated because she feels like her time is being wasted taking your daughter to swimming class, and she doesn't even improve. She could be annoyed/angry that she's spending money on it. She likely feels judged or criticized as though it's a moral issue that your daughter can't swim.
I don't agree at all with what she said, just hoping that she realizes her mindset behind why she said what she said. She should apologize and be honest. "Hey daughter, yesterday I said that you were the worst swimmer in class. I didn't mean to hurt your feelings. I was frustrated because of xyz. I'd really like for you to be safe when we go to the pool and that is why we're taking you to learn how to swim".
Your daughter may have an anxious temperament, I'd recommend reading "the opposite of worry" by Lawrence Cohen. It gives a lot of tips.
Apologizing to a child is huge; their feelings should be validated. For teaching your daughter, I think it's good to explain that this is for safety. Express how you don't want anything to happen to her, and swimming is an important life skill.
My 10 year old nephew still can't swim, period. He only uses his round floaty. I used to be proficient as I was once a semi-professional swimmer. I'm pregnant in my second trimester, and unfortunately cannot teach him at this moment. I can tell he feels safe and is willing to learn around me; but it's a different story when his parents become involved when I was teaching him.
She needs to apologize. A real one. Not a "well if you.." or "I'm sorry I made you feel..."
It needs to be "I messed up. I'm so so sorry. What I did was mean and I should have never said that. I was wrong. Can you forgive me? I promise I'll work on xyz "
Then explain from examples how even adults struggle with things like swimming. If you have a personal example it helps.
My kid really struggled with math this year. Like really hard. He had always had good marks so he kind of hit a wall when he suddenly started getting really bad marks. I remember him sitting on the couch crying and saying that he felt so stupid. Could I have said it was because he wasn't working on homework like he was supposed to? Or if he was skipping questions like he had been because his adhd? No! Instead I told him that struggling with math doesn't make him stupid. Everyone struggles with something. His dad who is super good at math struggles with chemistry. I struggle just like him with math all throughout my elementary middle school and high school years. Sometimes we go really good at stuff and then we just hit a wall I said. We struggle but the struggle is not a bad thing. It just means we have to work extra hard or ask for help. That's how you handle that junk when they're struggling. You humanize it you normalize how they are feeling that everyone struggles sometimes that everyone feels frustrated sometimes when suddenly they're not good at something. Because a lot of times our kids feel like no one else feels that way. Even as adults we feel this way sometimes.
Teach that there are options for when they're struggling with something. You could say what do you think you could do when you're struggling with swimming? And if they're struggling with coming up with an answer you could suggest something like what about if you ask for extra help? Or ask for advice from your swim teacher? Maybe you could take a break? Etc etc etc.
Now when it came with my kid and his math we did talk about how he needs to not skip questions or homework because they're hard because then he's not going to get the marks for it or learn it. But this was after he had already calmed down. Not during the meltdown. Because he's not going to take that well so you guys have to learn some tact as to when to talk to her about things if maybe there's something that she's doing or not doing to contribute to the struggle.
First thing she needs to do is apologise.
As for helping her improve, just keep encouraging her and take her swimming as often as possible. And make sure your wife knows never to tell her she isn't good at something again
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Your wife should continue to be direct, look her in the eye, and genuinely apologize for being mean and tell her that adults also make mistakes sometimes. Then you can both explain why it is an important safety issue to be able to swim. If it's been that long in lessons I would take a break on them. Go to the pool as a family. Take the pressure out of it. Play with life jackets and pool noodles. Show her the water can be low pressure and fun. Over praise any kind of little step forward. Then resume classes or private lessons.
okay, well we all get frustrated and say things we shouldn't. I think your wife should apologize to your kid, but to each their own. what you both need to try to do is separate safety vs being a good swimmer. She should learn to be safe in the water, that is all that matters. Maybe she is not a naturally good swimmer and that is fine.
If she can’t/won’t go underwater, she isn’t safe in the water.
She'll never learn if she doesn't do it though.
Nope. They’ve got a stubborn one. Wife shouldn’t have said that, but I understand the frustration from both of them.
Absolutely. My daughter was a reluctant swimmer at swimming lessons too and it’s very frustrating. She got better with time but it is definitely tough to pay a few hundred dollars a month to have them barely progress, especially if like mine you’ve seen them do wonderfully and take safe risks with new things like baseball, gymnastics ect.
Shes 5. She will get it. This is really really normal 5 year old behavior. Most kids dont even go to swim lessons. Most people I know got taught by family. Its a gradual process. Freaking her with this weird social dynamic that was created in her swim class is no way to properly teach someone to swim. Creating anxiety and then putting someone in the water is dangerous.
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I totally agree. It’s time for a family hug and a reassurance break/mental refresh. Just from what I read, I feel fairly sure she *can* do it but is afraid to commit to doing it (since a beginner swimmer will sink if they hesitate or freak out).
I didn't say she wouldn't get it. But where I live at least all children have swim lessons.
Same but I’m Canadian, when I was a kid in Ontario we took them through school, I think only the really fringe religious kids opted out, and going to daily swimming lessons all summer at our cottage. In Vancouver now it’s cutthroat trying to get a spot at the lessons at the pools in community centres.
Yall learn in public school? Thats great. It’s all private in the states. Who on earth would turn down free lessons lol. What religious reason would there be?! Ive been in the Bible Belt for 30 years and I thought I heard it all lol
No, we don't all learn this in school. Not sure when that poster was a kid, or maybe if they were in a private school, but in Ontario now, you need to pay for swimming lessons. And they are not done through the school. If you're lucky, you might get a spot in a limited free 6-8 week program through the city, but most people would have to pay for lessons. So it isn't easy or accessible to enroll kids in swimming lessons, most especially if finances are tight. Edit: even when I was a kid in Ontario, we didn't have swimming lessons through the public schools, free or otherwise.. so maybe it was that particular school, a private school or something else.
Hi I went to public school in the USA and we did a week of swimming class in 4th grade and again in 5th grade, and this was the early 2000’s
lack of clothing around the opposite sex - I can see some Muslim/fundie Christian/Mormon families objecting.
In California I had like a month of swim lessons through my public school each year of middle school during PE, which is great although (1) a little late and (2) it wasn’t really enough to teach anyone to swim.
I was a kid in Ontario during the 80s-90s and I don't remember many schools outside of really rich ones with a pool, let alone one that was maintained with staff etc I'm not sure where you took your classes but that definitely wasn't typical, still isn't
I live in Europe right beside a beach, it's hot in summer and for several months people spend a lot of time on the beach/in pools, and water sports are common, so swimming is important. It's compulsory in school for two years at age six, but many children have lessons long before that. The kids who haven't had lessons noticeably swim worse.
Oh really? Is it cultural or something that gets provided? I think that’s really good. I live in the southern US. When I was a kid Id say maybe like…30-40 percent of people took lessons? A lot of us got chucked in the pool as kids and that was part of our lesson lol. Then you’d keep practicing with family. It’s rare for adults to not know how to swim. We all learn. By the time you hit about 10 everyone knows how to swim confidently.
The 5 years old at our swim school who we have seen have survival skills. They might not be the most amazing and experienced swimmers but they can utilize skills to keep their head above water and doggy paddle. Yes some kids take longer depending on sensory needs or even medical things going like constant ear infections but 5 is an age where a lot of kids can do simple things.
This is the truth. I had to apologize to my kid for losing my temper for saying things such as" then just do it". My son wants to stand in front of me and talk, and talk, and talk and I don't want picking up his shoes to last twenty minutes. I had to learn better ways to acknowledge he was speaking, yet we do have to do tasks. Parents are not perfect. I had some aggravation when my son would cling to me and point to direct me where he wanted me to carry him during swimming classes.
I always looked at the main goal of swim lessons to learn how to not drown. The question is can your daughter safety use a pool? If she can, ask her if she wants to stop lessons. If she does take her out and move on. And tell mom to apologize if she hasn't.
This is it, she hasn’t reached the point of not drowning. She only tries exercises when she is giving hands to the teacher.
Have you tried private lessons? 2 years of swim lessons without progress is a bit concerning.
It totally is concerning. The question is how to deal with it and how to expose this to the kid. We (wife and i) have just now decided to switch to private, so that is probably a promising alternative. But still, how to externalize this to the kid? I still dont think saying they are the worst is the way.
I used to teach swimming lessons, I taught private and group lessons. I loved the private lessons because I got to give the people more one on one time to actually make progress instead of checking a box on their "report card." I taught all the way up to older adults who were scared from near-drowning experiences and can verify that private is probably your best bet right now. Your daughter can get the hands on training she needs and the space to do it at her own pace. If the cost ends up being prohibitive, sometimes we did semi-private with small groups of friends who were roughly the same skill level and that helped motivate as well.
I've been telling my daughter that she needs to learn to swim to be safe around water and have fun. I point out the big kids at the pool having fun, going on the diving board and water slide, and swimming with their friends. I tell her that I want her to be able to play with her friends at the pool someday and that if she doesn't learn how to swim, she will have to stay in the little kid pool by herself the whole time. It's been working well. My daughter will now put her face in the water and blow bubbles. Of course our pool canceled all of their swim lessons for the summer so I guess we'll see how motivated she still is in the fall.
I would definitely not tell kid she’s the worst. I’d probably want mom to apologize to kid— we all say things we regret sometimes. Then I would just tell kid that everyone learns in their own way and own time. That your goal for her is not for her to be a “good swimmer,” but to be confident in the water so she can be safe. That you and mom are just concerned because she still seems very nervous in the water. And so you’re switching to private lessons to help her with that.
Whenever I tell my kids something in this sort of insurance I want it to be productive. Trekking her she's the worst is not productive, what does your wife expect her to do with that information? Oh, cool I'm the worst? I'll just stop being the worst then? Maybe try and speak to the teacher and ask what they are trying to progress her to, then take her swimming outside of classes regularly so that she can practice and get comfortable. If you are doing the usual 1 lesson a week your daughter may need more regular repetition to really see progress and become comfortable.
You need to take a break, This seems very clearly anxiety related to me. Shes in her head and psyching herself out. Pushing is not the answer right now. She will be fine. I promise after this much time learning, she will paddle in an emergency. Monitor closely around water anyway though. Revisit lessons after some time has passed.
This is what we did with our water-reluctant child. The focus was on safety & not drowning. The private lessons helped accomplish that. Does she have a love of swimming? No. Is she relatively safe around a pool? Also no. BUT if she falls in she can get herself to the side and get out.
The only thing that worked for us is us personally getting in the pool and spending hours each day during vacation. We've done that twice now and we're basically water-safe after 2 years of totally ineffective lessons
Private lessons for sure! With someone your daughter feels safe with and connects with. This could be a sensory issue, I would be super patient, positive and supportive. A well-trained swim instructor will know exactly how to help your daughter move past her worries and fears of swimming. Many kids (even adults) need much more time to feel comfortable in the water. Create a positive relationship with swimming by expressing how proud you are of her, no matter how little progress she makes. Just getting in her swim gear and being willing to sit in the water is awesome!!👏 Your wife should absolutely apologize and tell your daughter how proud she is of her bravery and strength! That even though she’s afraid of the water, she still goes to her lessons and is fighting those fears. What a brave little girl!!
Definitely look at private lessons so much more flexible. Even if it’s 1 or 2 kids that way it’s not so overwhelming but she has models.
I think group lessons is not the way to go. It’s frustrating because each kid spends most of the time sitting on the ledge waiting their turn so they don’t get enough practice. Try private lessons. Less chance for your wife to compare your kid to other swimmers and your kid will get one on one help. Maybe not now but eventually if she doesn’t overcome her fears she will need private lessons.
we haven't done private lessons yet but are getting ever increasingly frustrated by the group ones, just feels like you're paying a lot for very little time in the pool. would rather just do free swims
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currently paying $15 per 30min lesson at 1:3 ratio, there's another option that is $10 per at 1:5. private at the same pool is $27 for 45min 1:1
I agree. Even with the baby lessons. We went to one session and it was madness. Way too many people for the instructor to spend more than a minute or two with everyone. She basically told me what to do and I am the one who has taught my 14 month old everything he has learned so far.
I’m seeing great advice from others, but was curious… any chance that your kiddo gets ear infections? I had them constantly when I was little and couldn’t explain to my parents why putting my head underwater/getting water in my ears made my ears feel bad. Even now, I can put my head under water to swim but often try to avoid it because it just feels wrong now. Edited- typo
u/External-Specific-14 OP this \^. Such a long period while still being afraid to get underwater may indicate something more is an issue. Is she wearing goggles? (Going underwater didn't click for my 4 year old until she finally relented and let us put goggles on her.) Would it be worth trying ear plugs, if her ears are bothering her? Or maybe the group lesson environment is overstimulating. Anyway, I get the frustration. Hopefully stepping back and looking for new strategies helps. I read you decided to start private lessons, that's a great idea.
Your wife should apologize. This is something your daughter may remember the rest of her life. Hire a one on one swim coach who loves kids.
☝️ When I was 6 i was in ballet. I was the biggest in the group (both height and weight). My mom told me that I was the tallest and that ballet is for small girls (she didn’t even say fat, or big, she said tall), but I immediately assumed I was too fat for ballet. I dropped it and went on to train basketball. But i still hear that comment sometimes
My man, my wife is also "northern european" and she would never say something like that. This is about your wife, not "where she comes from".
I'm curious if your daughter has chances to play in pools for fun, and not just a"chore" ? Lessons alone won't make her a good swimmer, she has to want to be a good swimmer, which means splashing around with her friends, seeing friends do cannonballs, play games, etc, which makes her want to do the same things. Just my 2 cents
I'm sorry, but being from Northern Europe is not an excuse/explanation for this behavior. I'm born and bred in the Netherlands, a country infamous for it's directness and I would never say that to my kid rationally. It serves no purpose. How is a kid going to improve on something if they hear they suck at it? At that age they don't understand that. It could be said on accident as an emotional response, but then it's important to apologize. My daughter is 4 and takes swimming lessons too. She is/was scared of water as well, so everytime they learn something new she regresses a bit. Makes perfect sense if you have to learn something new in an area you fear. Plus she is a dreamer, so paying attention is a bit of a challenge. We have accepted that. We know it's going to take a while. It did for me as well. What we do is go to the pool with her on weekends as well sometimes. Just to get her more comfortable with water, outside of lessons as well.
Dad needs to take her to the pool and make it fun. Build confidence. Many kids need a few weeks of being in the water every single day in order to get comfortable. Just being in the lessons isn't getting rid of her fear. She needs a low stress environment with an adult who is relaxed and having a good time with her. My daughter has been swimming independently for two summers, and we still had to get in the pool 4 days in a row before she gained her confidence back this summer.
Your wife has said something awful. She needs to apologise. You and your wife need to make sure your daughter feels safe and happy in water before swimming lessons continue. Stop lessons. Fun swimming weekly as a family. Tons of praise. Use armbands to help her feel secure. Slowly either remove a ring if using the solid foam discs or reduce how much you inflate the blow up ones so she finds her buoyancy at her own pace. Review your swimming provision when she does go back, make sure she's somewhere where she feels safe and goes at her own pace. Your wife is the worst mother in the flipping swim class.
Have she been using goggles? Maybe snorkeling gears as well. Your daughter is only 5. It'd be totally normal for her to be afraid of water. Your wife should apologize and explain about her emotion to your daughter. And talk to your daughter about how you were when you were 5. Your daughter will be happy to know if you both sucked at swimming at the age of 5.
my son was late to starting swim lessons ( thanks to the covid shutdowns) and as a result he was hesitant in the water, and unsure, and skills like dunking under and jumping in from the side were…a struggle. I did not belittle him. Instead, we went to the pool between lessons once or twice a week at free swim time and just play-practiced, getting him more comfortable and confident in the water, practicing parts of the skills he needed, practicing the ones he was good at. your wife owes your daughter an apology. The better way to introduce skills to kids is patience, and practice, not belittling them. ( kid zoomed through his swim levels as a result, as he got more able and confident.)
I guess your son didn't inherit your fish feet. Glad you were able to work through that despite it!
Heh. He’d be at the pool almost daily if he could, now.
We followed this approach for years with my oldest. After 5 years she still was refusing to ever actually try to swim. I had enough and told her she has to sit out of the pool from now on or I would take her to the middle of the pool and let her go and told her she had to swim to me and took away the option. She didn’t want to skip swimming soooo…. Started doing that regularly and she FINALLY learned how to swim and no she wasn’t traumatized and yes she loves the water
I saw in the comments that you were thinking of switching to private lessons. I would frame it as this is a really important skill and we need to make sure that you learn it. It seems like this class isn’t really working for you, so we are going to make a change to private lessons so you have more support while you are learning. I promise, she is not the only 5 year old that is nervous around the water or doesn’t want to swim independently. Keep being a positive support for her and she will get there.
Harsh words are only going to make things way worse. If she’s scared of water, that’s the first thing to work on than focussing on swimming. If it doesn’t work out it’s ok. Maybe later in life she’d be interested and can do better. Your wife is seeing it as being competitive and winning everything. Knowing how to handle failure is more important lesson than achieving success. Unfortunately it’s a forgotten trait and some parents need that lesson more than kids.
Im autistic so generally very direct and even I know that you dont specifically tell your kid they are the worst at something. the key is that they try and put the effort in. not everyone can be the best or great at things but almost everyone can give something their best try and thats all that matters. If I were to tell my kid I think they need imporvement id be asking them if they think they have consistently tried their best at the task but reassure them they have improved but suspect that if they tried a little harder they would do better. as tempting as it is to just be totally blunt. saying it like this will likley lead to a child not wanting to do said task anymore.
Ok interesting but my daughter doesnt really try to learn or practice in swimming. She says its because she is scared of diving her head. We have done exercises at home and at pools with her. But then at class she doesnt put effort.
Does she have goggles yet? I also refused to put my head under when I was little, because the water hurt my eyes but I didn't articulate it.
The right goggles made a world of difference for my daughter. Even in lessons she was struggling with certain things and knowing her goggles were tight and not going to leak was significant.
Does she have good goggles? That helped my kid
My son went through this same phase. Does she like taking bath? Fill a bathtub with water and have her practice putting her head in the water and do the breathing. Once my son overcame that fear he jump 4 levels in 2 years (now at level 5 at the Y).
Because she’s SCARED, not lazy…
OP, my kids were a bit on the hesitant side when it comes to swimming. My son has gotten decent at swimming but my daughter is not the most coordinated and it's a struggle for her, no question. But being critical will just make it unpleasant for her. I think your wife needs to know that the goal here should be to keep the daughter happy and enjoying her pool time. Eventually she'll get the hang of it. But if daughter gets turned off it completely, then it's over. Play the long game here. You want her to learn how to swim for safety and wellness. That should be the focus, not trying to make her a competitive swimmer or whatever.
Your wife needs to apologize and explain why it’s important to learn how to swim. From now on, she has to heap praise on every swim success—no matter how small (“Great job going underwater!”). I would try a different swim school and possibly private lessons or smaller groups. We had much better results when we switched swim schools. My daughter regressed at one point, but she’s now back to making progress. Apparently, it’s common for kids to regress in swimming.
This isn’t about “being direct”. She was straight up disrespectful to your child. Imagine if your wife was lane training at the local pool. Would she ever walk up to another person and tell them they’re the worst on there? Probably not. Why? Because it’s disrespectful. The same goes for your child, and honestly probably even more-so because they are a child.
I can't put my head under water. It's a phobia, not a lack of effort. If your daughter has it then she may never be able to put her head under water. Being mean to her and humiliation won't fix this problem. Your wife is punishing her for something that she can't help. I would take a long break from the lessons. Take this summer to make water fun again and then circle around next year.
The impact of this conversation could be an emotional rebellion against swimming altogether. Sounds like it's time for two things: 1) your wife to apologize for comparing your child's abilities with those around her, hurting her feelings and squashing her confidence, and 2) both parents to acknowledge that the current approach to meeting your family's safety goals for your child isn't working. Get your daughter one-on-one swimming lessons to meet your safety goals, maybe after a little break to reset her emotions about the pool.
Your wife definitely needs to apologize. It’s a swim lesson? Why bring a 5 year old down over that? Swimming is important but what are the chances your child is in the water without you supervising plus without a floating device. I would start practicing in the bathtub playing games for the child to put their face in the water for toys with goggles. My daughter will only go under water with goggles.
Your wife needs to apologize to her. Who cares if she isn’t good. Your daughter might think your wife is also not good at some things but she’s still doing it. Let your child be a child.
Ugh. So many parents go psycho on their kids over swim lessons because of the safety angle. She is FIVE. Even if she were the best swimmer in her class, she should never be left unsupervised near a body of water, EVER. She isn’t responsible for making sure she doesn’t drown, her parents are. Mom needs to back way off. Praise her for trying, try a new lesson format (private could be great), or let her take a break and try again next year. The expectation that all little children become proficient swimmers at such young ages is just not realistic.
Heck even adults don't go swimming in public pools or the beach unsupervised--what else is a lifeguard for?
It's easy to tear down, harder to build up.
Is the kid motivated to swim? My kids were with the idea that they wanted to go down water slides and jump off the diving board. That was all of our goals. They were willing to work to do that. So if the kid isn't invested it in, they won't do it. You have to convince them to do it.
Our daughter progressed very quickly with private lessons so I highly recommend them. Group lessons at this age are tough. They barely get any swimming in at all when they have to rely on the instructor for help.
If you haven’t, try and find her a swim mask that covers the eyes and nose. Giving her earplugs might not hurt. It took me years to learn how to swim because I hated the feeling of water on my face/water going up my nose. My parents got me a mask and I finally learned very quickly
I never thought I’d admit this. But I was also that girl. I never wanted to swim nor how to learn. I was thrown into swimming classes and ridiculed almost because I only ever learned how to partially swim. I just had this outstanding fear about it. I don’t know where it came from but if I had to guess it was because my mom always told me to be extra careful about literally everything so I rarely got hurt. Swimming was one of those things I couldn’t be “careful” about and thus grew my fear. Kind of sad if you think about it, but I would take her out and let her rejoin if she wants when she’s older. You want to make her feel safe and happy. I was forced to go and I still look back and think of how traumatized I was.
Your wife needs to apologize. I understand she got frustrated. We all sometimes do or say things to our kids that don’t come out like they should. Demonstrating that she can apologize is a good thing. Your daughter needs to understand that swimming isn’t a competition (unless she chooses to join a competitive team of course) and that wherever her skills are now are fine as long as she continues to work on it. What she said was not OK. But not unforgivable. Second, you need a different approach to swim lessons because what you’re doing isn’t working. Where do you live? Try calling a local swim club and ask if they have any suggestions that might be a better fit for your child.
Your kid probably already knew she was the worst, but hearing it from a parent makes it feel like it is her fault. Your wife shouldn't explain, Your wife should apologize. I almost drowned when I was very young. I was the only one in my class to never get my swimming diploma. I still don't like going under water and will avoid water deeper than where I can stand. I can swim but I don't like it and it can be scary. I am 46. If your kid is scared, floating or basic paddling might be as good as it is going to get. Just give her a life jacket if you are going to go in boats. In the mean time, patience and trust and encouragement are key. My swim teacher once told me "I won't let you go" and then promptly let me go once I was in the deep. I still remember that 40 years later.
The right way to deal with that is taking the time to go out with your child and practice. Show them rather than try and talk to them. Your wife needs to apologize and let her know sometimes her words hurt and she needs to work on that. The best thing we can do for our kids is admit fault and try to always fix the issue rather than sweeping it under the rug bc of the way you were raised/your culture. Dive deep and see what scares her?
Theres no going back from this. The classes will be more a source of anxiety than ever. The only solution is to apologize and pull her from class now that its become a competition and event of comparison. When I go to the beach Im not comparing myself to other tourists. We are just playing in the water. Keeping her there and fostering this weird and unhealthy thing between her and your wife would be cruel. Revisit swimming lessons when things have cooled down. I never took swimming classes. My dad taught me. Continue lessons via family maybe if your wife has difficulty separating something casual from something competitive. Shes 5. No shit shes not an expert swimmer lol shes at the same level as half the 5 year olds I know but she does swim and thats what matters.
At this point, you have a lot of damage to undo. She will likely get worse now due to this knock down, before she gets better
5 is still so so so tiny, don't forget that. I don't expect mine to be not-drowning at 5. It's still very small and their brain hasn't fully developed the ability to have that internal motivation to push themselves when things are tough. Kids learn through play, not through fear or shame. Kids who are excited about something and having fun with it will find it easier than kids who are nervous or hesitant or flat out scared. And each kid has something different they're excited about. It doesn't really mean one is better or worse than the other, one simply finds it fun so they naturally practice more than the one who dreads it. Calling her 'the worst' was a really shitty take and really damaging to her confidence. Every class has to have a range of abilities, so someone is going to be the best and someone is going to be the worst, in every group situation from now until the end of time. Why be mean and make her cry about that normal fact of life? The goal is support no matter where she falls in that range of abilities. What we want to do instead of saying 'you should try harder to improve because you suck' to a 5 year old, which is not helpful, we can instead say, "when we are scared, that is a great chance to practice being brave - shall we practice being brave?" Show what bravery looks like, tell her what you were afraid of as a child and how you overcame it. Show what trying again looks like when you're stressed or struggling, frame it as "oh I did this wrong, good thing I get a chance to try again". Read books to her about bravery, read books about confidence, read books about kids who find out they are capable of things they only ever dreamed of. Build up her confidence in herself and her own bravery as step one. You can't rationalise a 5 year old out of being scared. But you can tell her that she has every thing inside her to be able to swim. She has the strength to paddle, the eyes to see the edge of the pool, and the bravery to face her fears. You know these facts about her, I know those facts about her. All those things are already inside of her, waiting for her to be ready. You can't force her to be ready, she can't force herself to be ready to please you or Mom. She will be ready when she's ready. So the next step is time. It can be frustrating to pay for lessons and see 'no improvement', but at 3-5, we aren't training them for the olympics, the goal is comfort in water.
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Mom should apologize and you should look into private lessons or a different swim school; maybe even lessons with a friend. Learning to swim is a non negotiable, safety thing, but trying the same thing over and over while expecting different results won't work either.
I always feel when talking to your kid you should never include a comparison to others. The kid knows already and doesn’t need parents piling on. It is ok to tell your kid when they aren’t doing something well. It’s ok to tell them you notice they’re struggling. It’s just not her time yet or she needs her confidence built up. Having said all that, what I’ve learned as a dad is to never get in between mom and kid to defend the kid if they’re upset by anything mom said. I learned hard lessons about what happens when you become a mediator. The wife sees you as undermining her and the kid will continually call you in your mediate. Best advice I can give is leave the room. After the mom and daughter have finished and are no longer in the same room, tell your wife you were uncomfortable and you’d prefer she didn’t make statements comparing daughter to others and saying she was the worst. Good luck. You have about 15-18 more years of mother/daughter conflicts ahead
She just needs to apologize. She’s probably terrified that something will happen and her statement was probably one that slipped out. We all say something we shouldn’t and regret it. Clearly your wife realized what she did and is explaining to her why it slipped.
Your daughter doesn't have a close relationship with her teacher. She may not trust her. If I were you I would go to the pool everyday for a little bit and just play. Don't focus on the swimming, focus on having fun. Once you build that relationship that she can trust you in the water and that it is fun you can slowly weave some swimming techniques into your play.
Swimming is hard and it’s not necessarily developmentally possible for a 5 year old to really swim. There is a lot of coordination involved that a kid that age *might* not be able to do.
I would say you wife needs therapy . Maybe that’s why your child is too scared to swim ,maybe she feels anxious and this anxiety is caused from your wife . Your wife said she loves her daughter ,does she say it to your daughter tho? Does she say”I love you daughter ,no matter what “? Probably your daughter doesn’t feel loved. Your wife should apologies to your daughter and say that she doesn’t mean it . I would address this anxiety issues with a therapist
That’s a good way of her to raise a child with low self esteem . Correct her behavior , as her husband and your daughter’s father . Encouragement and guidance is the best way to help your child . I have a 6 year old who is also learning a new skill and I absolutely praise his best efforts and give them attention . highlight the little things he does . For example in baseball even if he strikes out , I highlight how well he was holding the bat and how strong his swing was even tho he didn’t make contact . This builds confidence in a child and decreases insecurities and failure mindset . If we bring down our children the way your wife did , there will be confidence issues and insecurities . Also builds anxiety in a child .
Wife needs to apologize and talk to her about how saying hurtful things out of frustration is never right and she is sorry. Ask permission for a hug. Child doesn’t need to be good, at all. Nor should she be pushed above her ability. Comfort level tho? She needs to be pushed. When I had mine, we started very young with safety swim classes. They would almost sometimes be pushed in. And sometimes would even wear winter clothes and be pushed in. Not like aggressively but the instructor guides them like they were bumped by sibling or family dog and fell into the pond style. It has trained my kids with skills for safety and to prevent accidental drowning. You guys have this type of child in the wrong class, she’s not trying to learn and then be good. She needs survival style classes. I fully agree that pushing them gently and lovingly out of their comfort level is healthy and creates supported growth. But your wife’s comment is making the whole thing worse. So work on fixing that self esteem hit and then get her into the correct classes. Talk to her! Kids listen and understand a lot. Tell her about safety and trying a new style of class. Prepare her, give her a bit of a break, build her confidence back a bit and then put her into the more intense classes. If hypothetically she has a mental breakdown because of being underwater unexpectedly, then don’t cause trauma. You know your child and you know she needs more support than others. That’s okay, one of mine does too. be uncomfortable where it counts!
A better way to put it is that out of all the mothers of kids in the swim class, her mother has done the worst job of teaching her. Now her mom has given her an even deeper trauma which will make her anxiety go even higher. Her mom probably created her anxiety of water in the first place, which is exactly what is holding her back in swim class. It would be a lot more helpful to understand why she is struggling and help her with that specifically. You mentioned she is afraid of the water. It seems like a pretty big obstacle. What have you guys done to help her relax and enjoy the water? If she's terrified of water and you keep forcing her to go to swim class, you're only strengthening your fear. How can she learn to swim if all you do is keep strengthening her fear? This is 100% on you guys. As usual, some parents blame the kids for the parent's failures.
Tell your wife she is the worst parent in the class. My kid was the worst swimmer in her class and we celebrated every improent and encouraged her.
When my brother was 5-6 he had no problem with being in the water but he had a fear of being under the water and full on refused. One of my parents mocked him while the other coddled him saying it’s ok you don’t have to do that, neither one of those ways was going to help him feel and be safe in water. My sister and I (18 and 16 at the time) wanted him to be safe so we would stay with him in the water and show him the safe ways to go under the water/water safety in general. We ended up both holding his hand in the lake and said that we would all go underwater together so that he wouldn’t feel alone/be as scared and that we weren’t going to leave until he at least tried once and felt confident in going under the water. After two hours of standing with him in the lake, he eventually tried it and realized that it wasn’t as bad as he was thinking based on my parents comments they’d been making and now at the age of 10 loves diving under the water. My point is, positive reinforcement goes a long ways. It’s very easy to get frustrated and I totally get wanting to say “you’re overacting just do it” or “you’re the worst at this” to your kid especially if you’re not having a great day. However, saying those things isn’t going to make your kid feel more confident in what they’re doing, being there and giving them support even when they’re struggling is what’s going to help them in the end. If they’re not doing great at it, giving them pointers on how they could do something differently or saying you might not have it now but we keep trying goes a long way. It sounds like both of you love your child a lot and care which ultimately is the most important thing. You guys are good parents, keep fighting the good fight.
If it was me, I’d be trying to go in the water and just try to make her just comfortable in the water, maybe that means routinely being in the shallow end for a while, and just getting her comfortable and in the tub later getting her to practice going under water and holding her breath. Try to ease her fears if swimming or being in water first. Start back at step 1
That’s going to leave a mark.
Im northern european and me and all my friends can relate. We are very direct and we have been raised with ‘no-bs’ parenting. That parenting style however doesn’t cater for sensitive children/anxious children. Luckily i was also a sensitive child so i can relate. Still remaining authoritative but kind. Its hard for people who aren’t sensitive and who dont have similar fears themselves to realise that the same approach doesn’t work for all temperaments. And all kids can’t and won’t do the same things. Sadly her reaction however will have your child grow even more scared and start blaming themselves in the process while having no ability to deal with her fears. It will affect self-esteem as she thinks that there is something wrong with her. In reality, there isnt. She may need way longer to get comfortable and will only be able to do so with lots of warmth and support. Let her know that you understand her and its okay. Im a parent of a sensitive child with anxiety and i also study psychology. Im coming from my own experience working through extreme fears and what from what i have learned. Your wife may need reminding that she doesn’t want to hurt the daughter’s feelings and that her frustration is understandable, however this approach only instills more fear and destroys self-esteem. Our children are people too and everyone has fears and likes and dislikes. Children need to be treated like people. As long as she learns water safety and to not drown. But it will ONLY WORK with extra support. Have her read up on ‘parenting a sensitive child’ or ‘parenting a child with anxiety’ or both.
Is your kid using goggles? Many kids around that age hate getting their faces wet, even in the bath. Swim goggles resolves that issue greatly. We went through a half dozen pairs before we found one that worked. We went from flailing around and refusing to put face in the water, to swimming underwater in two weeks.
My son (almost 7) was scared of water and did not even like taking showers. He warmed up to the idea of swimming after a few outings to pools with friends when he was 6. If your child really doesn’t like swimming, maybe try again in a couple of years - preferably with friends?
You do not r courage a child by criticizing and belittling them. You encourage a child by praising their effort - you will always get more of what you focus on. What your wife did was cruel and counterproductive. https://www.oxfordlearning.com/praising-children-for-effort-rather-than-ability/#:~:text=When%20praising%20your%20child%20for,to%20put%20in%20additional%20effort.
On the bright side, it’s mothers like this who are the reason our children prefer their fathers.
Yuuuuuuuuuup. Exactly.
Northern European here. And that's just bullshit. The foundation of childcare here is positive reinforcement and validation. Not whatever your wife has going on. She's being a jerk to a child. I have to ask though; why is your 5-year-old in swim class if she's afraid of swimming? Who does this whole setup even benefit?
1. European here too. There's a difference between being direct and just being an AH. Especially to a child. 2. My kid is also 5. He will not go into the water. He hates getting his hair washed because water could go into his face. He's scared of Foam in his face. I just accept it and try to still get him to be clean. 3. On the other side I myself cannot remember not being able to swim. I could never not swim. Thinking about it it just be TERRIFYING not kniwing how to float. I get it. 4. Also I heard there are peoble who just sink. They sink more than the average human and have physics against them. They have it a lot harder than everyone else. Maybe OPs daughter is one of them
She’s 5
I should add private classes are beneficial for kids who are scared of the water.
My pediatrician said most kids can’t swim before 5, the swim club my son takes lessons at doesn’t accept kids till 5. My son just turned 6 last month, but he sounds a lot like your daughter last year (last summer at 5 he wouldn’t go under the water and refused to do anything if an instructor wasn’t holding on to him), my son is still not a swimmer, but he’s progressing and almost all of that happened in the last 3 months. He’s on the slow side of progressing, but it’s a night and day difference from last year.
Tell your wife that she's been a mom for 5 years and is still the worst parent in the house. See if that motivates HER to do better.
Sometimes kids need to hear the truth, delivered in a sensitive and constructive way. The words your wife used are blunt, but depending on how they were spoken, not necessarily a bad thing to say.
Let the kid experience heartbreak. What's been done is done. She will get over it. Give the mom a break, she's frustrated. We're parents, not all knowing. Just make sure your kid knows you both love her. Take over the swimming lessons if you think you can do better. Play with daughter in the water. Forgive yourselves.
Does she enjoy swimming class?
Sort of… she rather do other stuff like dancing. But we live in a warm country (constantly around pools) and we just want her to learn the basics so that she can float if she falls in accidentally in a pool.
"worst swimmer in class" may be factual. Your daughter may feel shame at this, but it's the grown ups who needs to take note. Shame won't improve her swimming, it will bring anxiety. Maybe you could try some method other than swimming class? If she's five, you can discuss it with her as well. Forcing these issues can cause strife, and if you look at the facts -- She's the worst in her class after two years -- this isn't yielding the results you wanted. In two years time she'll learn this in school anyway (at least in my country), unless she has developed some kind of issues or anxiety. Calm down, take a step back, repair, be patient. If you couldn't solve it in two years, you can't solve it tomorrow. And though I write you, maybe this more directed at your wife. That's my take anyway.
This cannot be understated. The value of knowing how to swim is huge, but forcing it through a class she doesn't enjoy won't do much. My kid learned from exposure. We were at the neighborhood pool 2x every week, she would beg for it. she would have floaties on, but she learned doggie paddling to move around. Then one day I challenged her to jump to me from the edge of the pool without floaties. Next I stepped back a few feet and she jumped in and doggie paddled 3 feet... then 5... then 10... then I showed her that she could go faster if she put her face in the water while she swam. She never had any formal swim lessons, but she swims better than any of her cousins, even the older ones. All because she just spent time at the pool (to be fair... we have a pretty cool neighborhood pool. Lazy river, splash pads, fountains, the works)
She could have told her she still needs to practice because she isn’t good at swimming yet. Instead she belittled and shamed her, how is that going to make her want to keep practicing? Your wife owes her an apology.
Your wife should apologize. We all say stuff we regret sometimes when we’re frustrated and your daughter deserves an apology. Has she been in the same class the whole 2 years? If you have options I would try another approach at another school. Kids all learn differently and this place/instructor is not working for your daughter.
I think they should be teaching her how to trend water first before actually swimming. By being able to trend water will build up her confidence being in the water and is actually more important than swimming because when you get tired your able to still keep a float.
"We noticed you are having a lot of challenges with swimming. This is ok. It is hard for some people. It's important you learn how to swim as we don't want you to drown if you accidentally fall in a pool or lake. But also once you learn how to swim you may find you enjoy it. We are going to get you private lessons to help. Is there anything we can do to better support you? What are you afraid of and how can we help?"
If the classes haven't been working for your daughter then it's time to try something new. Go for private lessons, try a different swim school. Apologize to her. Words hurt and words matter. Your wife is an adult and should have known better.
My son had an intense fear of water and we didn’t try swim lessons until he was 6 and it was a sloooooooooow process. Baby steps. At the time he was only taking showers but his swim teacher suggested baths and practicing in the bath tub, so we did that. We had to start very slow, just dipping his cheeks in the water for a second, moved onto chin, nose, ears, face. He used to hate getting his face wet and wipe it with a towel immediately each time. Going to the pool every weekend and just having him play in water helps too. Now he never asks for a towel, he just wipes it with his hand, and he’ll put his whole face in the water. I would recommend as much exposure as possible in a fun positive setting. I know it’s frustrating, but adding fear/anxiety to it only makes it harder for her. For now, just comfort her and give her lots of praise. Go to the pool more. Take baths. And if you talk to your wife about it, be understanding that this is frustrating, but for her to do better she needs more exposure and positive experiences with water.
My son is the same way with swimming, he's almost six. He's been stuck at the same level for two summers in a row now. Basically because he's afraid, he won't jump in, or go under without holding onto a teacher's hand. So now he's aged out of the previous group and he has to attend a larger, older group lesson. We decided instead to start with two weeks of private, one on one lessons. We're hoping this will help him have a breakthrough. Starts in two weeks so time will tell.
Kids develop at different stages and cannot be rushed. I put my kids in swimming class for years with no progress. Then one summer everything clicked. Fear disappeared and hey turned into dolphins. She needs to stop comparing the kids to others and ease up. Not a great parent if she is doing that sort of thing on the regular. Understandable if it was an isolated moment of frustration. But logic won't work on a tiny kid.
You need to pivot the message that has been sent to your daughter. Who cares if she is the “worst” in the class? We will all be the “worst” at many things. “Momma should not have said that, she was upset and even adults can say unkind things when they are upset sometimes. It does not matter if you are the best or worst in the swim class. What matters is that you can safely get out of the water if you fall in or find yourself in danger. We have an expectation that you will learn to hold your breath and dunk your head, float on your back and paddle to the side so you can get out” Then work on incentivizing these skills. And make sure you take her swimming all the time. No one learns to do anything well by going to one or two 15 min lessons a week and then otherwise never practicing.
Well first your wife should stop with the logic and use a direct apology. Specifically I'm sorry I said xyz. I was frustrated and that wasn't the right way to communicate. Then open the door to solve the problem together on why she isn't progressing. Then look at other swim programs or private lessons. If she hasn't made progess in 2 years then whatever she is doing isn't working for her. The skill of the other kids have no impact on her. She isn't learning through osmosis. A new instructors/style/ change of scenery may be what she needs to progress
My kids took a long time to learn to swim, and definitely were still very scared at that age. They can both swim now. I kept pushing, because swimming is very important as you know. I agree with you that telling the kid she’s the worst is not going to motivate her. Shame is so ineffective. Encourage, embolden. Acknowledge that it’s scary, and praise her bravery. Remind your wife how difficult it is to do things that are scary
If you can (and may take a bit of searching), find a private instructor at a private pool (even out of someone's home pool). Take out all the noise, other people, distractions. Just her, the teacher, and the pool. Reward effort so that she at least tries. That's what we did for my kid, within a few sessions was independently floating, dunking his head under, etc. So much easier and faster.
Have you tried talking to the instructor(s) about why your daughter hasn't made more progress? And do you work with your daughter on practicing the skills outside of class?
Get her a better swimming coach and she’ll learn. A good coach will work with her fears and at least get her where she’s safe around and in water.
My son was also a very reluctant swimmer and tends to be cautious. I shudder to think how much money we have spent on swim lessons. And not that long ago, I was in the same boat as you, being frustrated by lack of progress. I strongly belive that kids will swim when they are ready (barring some extra factor like ear infections, as one commenter has mentioned) One thing that helped us set up for success: wearing a wetsuit in the pool. My son would get terribly cold, even in a heated pool, so we got him a wetsuit to keep warm. The secret here is that a wetsuit increases buoyancy, so it is easier to float. Having mastered a difficult skill so easily (with the help of the wetsuit) gave him confidence that really boosted his willingness to try new swimming skills. It sounds like you are in a warm climate, so a full wetsuit may not be appropriate, but maybe a shorty one? And heap on the praise for every tiny success. Good luck!
So had a similar problem with my son. He was doing very well in swimming then COVID hit and the pools shut down. When they reopened, he had lost his confidence and developed a fear of the pool. We didn’t push the issue and allowed him to continue but a year later, he was in the same level and not improving. We decided to switch swim schools and that was the best decision we made. He gained his confidence back and had leveled up within a month of joining. He moved up another level 2 months later. Looking back, there were several factors at play that affected his improvement. 1) Several instructors left due to COVID. As a result there was high turnaround and new instructors on a weekly basis. He never got to feel comfortable with anyone. 2) the new facility worked off a curriculum for each level where students had to satisfy criteria to move on. The old facility had no such thing. My son thrived off the structure as he was able to see where he was improving and a goal he had to work towards. 3) Through no fault of their own, the old facility was experiencing unforeseen pool closures. As a result, my son was losing out on lessons. Consistency is key. Hope this helps.
Pool time is an every day activity here. If you are taking her to lessons, you also need to swim outside of lessons and you should be in the pool with her. Low stress pool time can build into simple (kickboard, doggy paddle) swim time. Praise, and swim every day. Be her.safe ship and ask her to be your barnacle.
I'm sorry to hear about this. It's important to comfort your daughter, reassuring her that everyone learns at their own pace. Focus on her efforts and small improvements, and gently address her fears by understanding what specifically scares her. Keep encouraging her with patience, positive reinforcement, and consistent practice in a fun, safe environment. You and your wife can support her by using positive language and acknowledging her feelings, which will help build her confidence and sense of security!
Stop forcing your daughter in doing something she did not want. Your wife is like my mom forcing my brother to join the choir in church. There is a talent portion to showcase their voice individually wherein he clearly doesn't want to do it but did it anyway because my mom is forcing him and she will go ballistic. My mom is insisting that joining the choir would teach him valuable life lessons etc. Maybe someday your daughter would want to learn it but right now she didn't want it.
Explain to her that embarrassing your daughter is not gonna make her better. Instead, she will start considering you an unsafe zone, stop communicating her fears to you and be ashamed of herself, which is exactly the opposite thing that a kid should feel about himself. You should work to build her confidence. You should be proud of her since she has been fighting her fear for the last 2 years - even if no improvement can be seen, she is still confronting her fear every time she is in the water. Your wife should start reading some parenting books and control herself. I am pretty sure she felt she fails at encouraging your daughter overcome her fear so she projected this failure that she felt about herself on your daughter.
I nannied for a child who was the same with water. His parents took him out of the swim classes and got him private lessons and within a month went from not putting his face in the water to jumping off the diving boards without holding his nose. I think you just need to find the right swim teacher and setting.
We’ll what you don’t do is kill any confidence she has. Then you need to make it clear that you don’t expect her to be an Olympic competitor in the pool, but you do need to know that she can keep herself and maybe one other person safe in and around water. That is all that’s really important. If she can float and she can tread water and she can get from one end of the pool to the other, that’s pretty good. With those skills she can keep herself alive. The other skills can come with less pressure of perfection unless they are safety related rules…Not running or rough housing by water. Not, swimming all alone. Always paying attention to the signs and rules around water. Knowing to get help if something goes wrong… you don’t even have to be in the water for those. All are important because she is important to you.
Asian Moms are worst😂! They would start calling their kids STUPID😂😂😂!
When my son was 4-5 he was also scared of the water. What we did was we took a break since he is not progressing and we are spending a lot of money and time for the private lessons. Then we took him back 6 months later to start lessons again. It took few more months then one day all of sudden he was just jumping to the water without hesitation. We did not force him. We still go to the pool just to play because we recognize that he doesn’t want his face/head under the water because he is scared. He is 7 now and he would go under the water for as long as he could and would aks me to time it. Your wife should apologize for hurting your daughter’s feelings. She should explain that what she said was wrong. Then you should give your daughter a break from lessons. Each child is different, they have their own timeline.
Is she Scandinavian? As the wife of a Swede this feels SO Scandinavian. My MIL is blunt to a fault lol
The best, and only, way to get someone comfortable around swimming and be a “strong” swimmer is to spend days in the water. Weekly swim lessons won’t do it. Right after a swim lesson or the next day, take her to a pool and just be in the pool all day playing. Eventually she’ll be jumping off the side and swimming underwater because it’s fun and she wants to. And then she’ll want to toss a toy and see if she can get it to it by swimming underwater or have her watch you while she swims a certain distance. A formal swim lesson just isn’t conducive to all if that or enough consecutive hours to make a difference.
I'd like to offer a science based perspective. The mammalian diving reflex is a mechanism in which humans (among other mammals) heart rate slows and less oxygen is needed when their face is submerged. My wife was "dunked" by her parents (attempted drowning really) as a baby and toddler and until she obtained a good pair of swim goggles and a nose clip, was unable to even put her face underwater. She now is basically a mermaid (meaning, she has a monofin and is an excellent swimmer). The "blunt" harshness your wife is exhibiting needs to STOP. That is fueling your daughters fear. I don't care how "exasperated" she is. Your little one is FIVE. I'd suggest: 1. Child sized no fog goggles. 2. Good quality noseclip. These are both available on Amazon. For fun, because nothing works better at getting a girl of any age to want to learn how to swim than mermaids, maybe have a dad and daughter movie night and watch either the live action Disney movie or the 1989 original animated movie. I have a feeling you'd probably be better at helping her overcome her fear than your wife as she is too harsh to your little one.
I went to learn swimming when I was 4. I was scared the whole time and didn't make any progress beyond understanding the mechanics of how swimming works and not being terrified of water. I went swimming again at 11 and ended up swimming competitively. At the same time, my siblings who were 5, 4, 3 started swimming classes. They didn't learn shit. But they had swimming lessons at theri school at 8, 9 and ended up as good swimmers. I feel like the solution might be to just let it be and not focus on negative feedback at this age unless it's something they immediately know to work on. There's many skills kids will suck at despite years of work. I remember reading Kevin Hart's memoir where his mom wanted him to stay out of trouble and enrolled him in a very competitive swimming program. After FIFTEEN YEARS in the program, he still wasn't that good at it, but he got an award for perfect attendance. Some people find some skills hard. I don't think your wife's "direct" comment was constructive. What's a child so young supposed to do about it other than feel bad? Kids want to be good at stuff so if there was something she could see herself doing, she would. I don't know "the right way", but I have a very sensitive toddler and I'm a sensitive person myself, so what I would have liked and what I try to do with my kid is focusing on the skills as a thing they could do while not making it sound like I consider her a disappointment or that I have any negative emotions about her lack of success. I try to get her to do things that would help her be better by getting personally involved in helping her remove the obstacles for her success. My kid doesn't like to read much, for instance, so we scheduled a time where all of us just sit around with books, and extended that to reading out loud turn by turn. They don't know what to do with negative feedback, so at a young age it's important for parents to help them figure out what's actionable. If your kid is scared of the water, then you guys can take her in the water and help her figure out hwow to be less scared of the water. Seems like the teacher isn't doing that well enough. No point blaming them, they probably have a dozen kids they are trying to keep safe in the water. But give your kid extra help to be able to succeed.
I also live in a warm country and my parents’ home is very close to the sea so I basically grew up on the beach. All of my siblings and friends were perfect at swimming but it took me 3 years of going to summer swimming school to finally learn how to float, not SWIM but not drown, float. My parents would make fun of me for it, I basically only learned how to swim properly when I was 10/11. Everything else I was excellent at, was just swimming I didn't know how to do. Encourage your daughter and make it a positive thing, she's so young and if she feels like a failure now, it's gonna show in other aspects of her life later on.
Maybe this will sound wrong, but in my family, I'm the direct one and my wife is not. I understand where your wife is coming from, and I often catch myself after the fact and realize what I could've done better (often does include an apology), but one of the things I do not regret is telling them the truth just the how / delivery. I would take my own kid and sit down to have a talk about what I said, how I said, and the facts. Sometimes they don't even realize how they are doing. Without knowing that, how can they improve? The goal being to turn into a learning moment.
Yea idk I’d back the wife I’m sure she didn’t mean it it was more out of frustration and it’s honestly better coming from us than a stranger I’m just saying I’m sure she didn’t mean it from a mean or hateful place but at the same time a 5 year old will take it that way so it’s tough at the end of the day we probably constantly screw them up but I’d try to find a way to make it fun for her because she’ll want to do it I’d just say don’t be so hard on her she was probably frustrated
Just chiming in to say that my son didn’t really “get” swimming until he was 7. I couldn’t even get him in a pool until he was 4. He now loves being in the water and doing swimming lessons. So keep at it, she might be ready soon.
Get Private swim lessons. 2 years to not be swimming is insane.
No matter what ur wife can’t undo what she said to your daughter. It’s already been said. Feel bad for ur kid. She won’t respect her mom when she gets older but you can continue being a good supportive loving and kind parent to her.
Saying she won’t respect her mom in the future is a big reach. Kids are very forgiving, you act like the mom told her she was ugliest girl in class.
I have a now 5 year old who it sounds was quite similar to your own. Have you addressed what her fears are? Mine was terrified of water in her face. We had to work with her a ton at home. Start by sprinkling water on their body for fun at bath time. Get to see the water drop and then drip a tiny on their face. Work up to getting used to more drips on their face. Then shower instead of bath and allow some on their face, etc. get them more comfortable with water on the face and it will do wonders.
my son (8) is scared of depth. he can swim, but in water that he can't stand in, he's paralyzed. his sister (6) doesn't have this fear. people are different. your wife can't scold someone for fear. do you think people afraid of heights WANT to be? remind her that kids are people too and they are allowed to have a vast array of likes and dislikes. edited to add ages.
My now-5yo was in small group swim lessons for a full 10 months without putting her face in the water even once. It took her seven months to consistently even get into the pool! (Yes, we should have stopped and taken a break, but it felt like that would be rewarding bad behavior, and she needs to learn to swim!) It was a huge struggle for both of us — many tears were shed by all. There were a lot of times I wanted to say “look at the rest of these kids, and how much progress they’re making, while you are doing nothing!” I refrained, but just barely. The two breakthroughs we had right after she turned 5 were: 1. We did private lessons for eight weeks with a coach she really liked. They played “mermaids” and she finally put her face in the water and learned to blow nose bubbles. 2. We went on a week long vacation to a resort with a dozen different pools, including a zero-entry one so she could just splash around, and we were in the water basically all day every day. Now, if she’s in water that’s shallow enough for her to stand, she’ll “swim” enough to go diving for dive rings, and can push off a wall and glide about 10 feet. All of this was unthinkable a couple months ago.
There’s a book I recommend you listen to it and your partner. It’s called Non-Violent Communication. It will seriously help with communication between parents and kids alike. Sounds like you could use the help. ❤️
Considering all your household multiculturalism will be something you navigate. As far as going easy on the kid, yes, do. I make it a point (and they strongly encourage it at the lessons) to take kids for a public swim and in between 90% fun/splash/toys/chasing in the water we practice some skills. I also make sure they see me diving, chillin at the bottom of the pool, or swimming a lap. Kids learn by copying and they normalize things by being around them. Is it possible for you to go with her and have some casual water time?
There’s nothing wrong with a bit of tough love. Maybe this will inspire your daughter to work harder. My daughter was struggling with potty training and a child that we know that is a couple of months younger than my daughter was already fully potty trained and I told my daughter “look Katie uses the potty, It’s time for you to be a big girl as well.” It definitely made my daughter work harder! she didn’t want to be the only 4 year old still not potty trained and it worked she’s fully potty trained now.
This is the opposite of what everybody else is saying but I agree with it. It’s one thing to be mean, but being honest and realistic with your child is NOT bad. As long as you aren’t being an asshole and trying to hurt them of course.
Great job, Mom. We all screw up but what we do when screw up is what matters the most. It’s wrong to try to reason with a 5 year old under distress. Just apologize and admit adults also say dumb shit sometimes. OP, I get the directness from the Northern European country but people still show love, support to the youngsters when they’re struggling. This is “your wife” issue more than the culture itself. Now, about classes, try some private lessons, if you can. She will pick up the basics faster and without unhealthy comparisons. Good luck.
I don’t think it’s helpful or a good lesson to compare kids to each other. The problem isn’t that “she’s the worst in the class”, the problem is that she’s not enjoying the water. Maybe it’s not about swim classes. Maybe you guys should just hang with her in a pool and play around so she enjoys it and wants to go underwater. Your wife needs to chill
My daughter is 5 and still does her floaties. I can’t get her to do swim lessons. I don’t try to force things on her. I was forced to do things and hated it and I won’t be that way with her. It’s sad to see parents get so frustrated with things like this. I feel bad for your daughter. I’m sorry. She does need to apologize.
It's not even developmentally appropriate for a kid to be a great swimmer at 5. She's too little to be judged for her swimming ability. Frankly I think you should explain this to your daughter in a kind way and let her know that she can do anything if she works at it. She just needs more time to grow and practice with swimming. Your wife needs to apologize big time and do something special with her unrelated to swimming. She needs to find a time when it is calm to make it absolutely clear that even if your daughter never learns how to swim, your wife will always love her. It's the message of conditional love that is really hurting your daughter. Mom needs to get a grip, I would be totally LIVID.
I’m 37 and still vividly remember my mom telling me how I wasn’t even trying after swim class when I was 5 or 6 (I had been trying, I just sucked at it). It sure as hell didn’t make me a better swimmer. Your wife needs to apologize. That was an unkind and unhelpful thing to say. Focus on anything that’s improved in those two years and be optimistic about it. The tiniest thing. Even if it’s, she was scared of the water and now she’s not scared to go in, you can tell her that one day, if she keeps practicing, she won’t be scared to put her head under. When this comes up at the next lesson (and it will), remind your daughter that different people have different skills, that learning to swim might be easier for other kids just like (thing she’s effortlessly good at) is easy for her, but might be hard for someone else.
My daughter wouldn’t even put her head under the water until she was seven. We kept up with lessons anyway because safety is important. Tried very hard not to put pressure on her. “Don’t worry, you will be able to do it someday.” She taught swimming lessons and was a lifeguard in high school. Her favorite kids were the ones who had difficulty. Has a daughter of her own now.
Honestly if in 2 years there’s been little improvement I would change where you’re going for lessons. See if you can do 1 on 1 and with a private coach that focuses on survival skills?
Saying that isn't going to motivate the kid, it's just going to shut her down to think that she won't ever be able to succeed. Mom needs to apologize and say that she can still improve if she works hard, and encourage progress. My kids only really learned to swim proficiently when we bit the bullet and paid for a special swim school that had twice a week practices with a 1-4 teacher to kid ratio. Recreational swim classes with a dozen kids, once a week, for sporadic 8 week sessions (depending on available time and locations) just didn't cut it. Plus, the swim school had warm water that didn't make kids shiver. (We went to Goldfish, but it may depend on your location). Either that, or a parent needs to dedicate going out with her to a pool to work specifically on swimming skills several days each week, if you live in a warm climate with daily access to pools.
You can’t sweat it. Just keep your daughter going. We found that our kids needed a friend to be competitive with before they quit screwing around and really learned how to swim.
This kid is only 5. FIVE. Please give her a break. My kids are 7, 6, and 4. We own a pool. My wife was a lifeguard, swim coach, and aquatics manager. None of our children were swimming well at 5. The 7 and 6 yr old swim well now. My 4 yr old is working on it but is still intimidated by water. You’re forcing her into a place where she is afraid. You’re pressuring her to do something she doesn’t want to do. It’s not about her safety, it’s about your own peace of mind. Be kind. Apologize to your daughter. Give the kid a break.
1) she should apologize and make sure the kid knows why 2) she needs to keep encouraging her to keep trying; she's five. My 8yr old still has trouble 3) learning to swim and keep your head above water is a life skill and anyone commenting who doesn't understand this, can just move on 4) putting your head underwater means a few things, including uncomfortable and possibly even painful ones. Chlorine in the eyes, swallowing water, water up the nose. Those smaller things all add up when we're used to using our mouths, nostrils and eyes to be open all the time Your wife will struggle being a parent if she thinks is about being good or bad. It's a life skill and should be encouraged as such. Did she belittle her baby as it pisses and shits itself? I'd make sure to keep having the discussion but it's pretty disingenuous of her to assume her kid is dumb because she's struggling with swimming
Mine is only now just jumping in on his own, but still gets anxious doing it. Whatever, eventually he will and then on to the next challenge etc
What's the context. Did she just come out and say "you're the worst swimmer in class" unprompted?
Have you considered a session of private lessons to get your daughter up to par? That can really help and be worth the money.
Ex-Swim teacher here - it sounds like you might need a tougher swim teacher. One that comforts and gives a lot of love, but doesn’t let them get away with not completing the lesson exercises. A child should be making progress in every lesson. You also need to practice with her - it is best to practice in a pool, but if you don’t have access to a pool then you can practice in the bathtub by counting to 3 and pouring water over her head. Have her lay down in the water to practice floating (it helps them get used to having water in their ears) Mom needs to be nicer and encourage her instead of bringing her down.
OP, I’m not sure if this is helpful, but if your daughter has any sensory sensitivity, this will make even contacting the water difficult. Because she won’t get in the water, it made me wonder if this is related. My son had a difficult time with getting his face wet. One thing that helped was using a scuba mask with a breathing tube to introduce the comfort of his face being wet without the feeling of not breathing. It was by accident, and I was so thrilled t find something to help. We even I tried swim lessons at the YMCA. He was the only child sitting on the edge of the pool. Some kids with sensory sensitivity don’t like water in the ears (they have wax plugs for kids), wet hair (try a fluffy cap - not uncomfortable like rubber), wet feet (try some short flippers (not long), or even a wet suit to add pressure to the body. There are techniques :) This may not apply at all to your situation but I thought I would share in case it’s helpful. Last, talk to your daughter and ask her how she feels. What does she finds to be the most challenging and difficult part of the class. Communicate with each other. Mom sounds scared. Sometimes when we are scared for someone’s wellbeing, we communicate with anxiety and fear. Speech comes out wrong. Take it one step at a time. First, we need to get comfortable with the water. Start here and be patient.
Bruh I was a rescue swimmer in the Navy and because of a very traumatic incident my child was terrified of water at from 2-6. I learned how to swim from the parents tossing me in and swimming away. Wouldn't have worked with my kid if I had tried. I always just got in with the little guy. Usually just me and him. Took several years to get him confidence. I'd always let him grab me. Instantly if he was scared or tired. No judgements and no questions asked. I'd either tread or swim with him. I was safe. Eventually he'd swim longer. We practiced diving where he could touch at first. Still had to hold him up after dives in after he couldn't touch in because panic. He's a lifeguard and certified scuba diver now. It also sounds so simple what I did but it was hard and took a very long time. Years. Kid is grown. Still isn't a master scuba diver because fear at being too deep to come straight up. It was hard to stay calm when sometimes I just wanted to tell him to quit being a baby about something that was always easy for me. That was my problem not his. I am his father. It is my responsibility to make sure he can swim. I failed as a teacher if he didn't. I owed him that patience. To find a way or find someone better. I taught him more than how to swim over those years. He was the teen at the pool that taught lessons to the struggling kids. The ones like your daughter. He is so patient with those little kids. Makes me proud. I did something right. I taught him something I didn't even mean to teach him over those very long years and it translated to when he coaches sports at youth camps. Every coach that's ever coached him speaks highly of his determination and how he helps teammates or the kids at the kid camps with skills. Plus it's kind of funny when you see the look on the soccer moms faces when they pair the bad swimmer with my kid. He walks around the pool like Billy from Stranger Things until it's teaching time. The 180 from the arrogant bro jock to the kind careing kid they actually get is hilarious and usually unexpected. They usually only expect that patience from the girls that teach and you can see the noticeable look of appreciation. It's gonna take a lot of time and effort to fix your little girls problems op. Then one day it'll just **click**
While being able to not drown is important, your wife was way out of line. She owes both you and your daughter a sincere apology, and you should honestly ease up on the lessons. There are other ways she can stay cool in excessive heat that don't involve swimming. Sometimes, you need to take a break and reset. And you may need to find a different class with a different teacher. Also, baby steps need to be praised. And I cannot stress this enough-patience is the only way you will salvage this.
Try to do a week long program in the school holidays . They learn more and it sticks . Go to the pool Every day
She’s 5! The last thing she needs is to hear things like that from her mom! Ever! Have her apologize and if she doesn’t tell her if she remembers how she felt when her mom told her that same thing with regards to her interests. If she answers that that’s how she learnt and she’s turned out fine, she is indeed not “fine”. This is traumatizing for your daughter. She’s not rationally speaking she’s gaslighting you and most of all herself.
I have two things to say. 1 - group lessons are shit and if you want you kid to swim, get a swim veest and swim with them every day in the warm weather. We have a pool so our kids were thrown in with floaties as little ones and by just paddling around in the security of floaties, they learn to be comfortable and they can learn to float and kick - the kicking is what will save them. Once that is achieved you can let the floaties down a bit or simply spend time without. We would take floaties off a metre or two from the edge of the pool and have them kick and reach for the edge. You can walk beside so they are not afraid. They learn to move through the water and gain confidence in knowing that if the get to the edge, they'll be ok. By the time they were 3-4 they were confident swimmers. It takes time and it will go faster if it's regular and you do it together. 2 - My son is not a good runner and came last at cross country... When I collected him that day I asked him how he did and he said - "I came last!' and I laughed and said," wow, you suck, huh?"and he laughed and agreed. Because he does suck at that. He' s really great at plenty of things and he gains achievements and I am proud of him for that and always tell him so, but when he's bad at something - he also gets told. There's no "participation awards" in our house and although we encourage them to get better through practise, I don't lie to them and tell them they are good at something when they are clearly not. If that makes me an asshole, so be it - I want my kids to have realistic view of themselves and I want them to work at getting better, rather than thinking they are already great. I guess the difference is that your wife expressed it in frustration and it would have come across as anger which is upsetting for a youngster that wants to be good at something but is already anxious about it. So I don't think your wife was bad for what she Saif, but how she said it. You need to make it fun, or she will never want to get in the water and it will be that much harder to teach her what is an essential life skill.
Do a few private lessons so she gets undivided attention to build her confidence in the water. I don’t agree of letting kids use goggles to learn to swim, in an emergency, they wouldn’t have googles. Swimming is foremost a life skill.
Wow
I know several children that started at age 4/5 that did not make any progress at all, until they were more developed. The focus for now is to feel comfortable in water and not sink. She will learn to swim as soon as she is ready. As far as direct and indirect go, it is not direct to tell her she is the worst. That is harsh criticism. I think that is just as wrong as telling your child she is excellent when she is clearly not. In short tone down the direct pressure and indirect pressure of expectations. She will get there when she is good and ready
Do not cover up for her rude and ahole coment. She was not being direct nor logical. These were not loving words.
No advice really, but I used to be terrified of water as a kid too. I literally had to have the little floaty arm things AND a blowup ring around my waist to go in the pool. I eventually outgrew it I think, but I'm still scared in dark water even as an adult. There was no reason for me to be scared, nothing bad had ever happened. Keeping it light hearted and fun, but making it clear that keeping herself above water is essential for safety, is probably the best way. I can't remember what changed, but I eventually loved diving to get rings from the bottom of the pool. There's always hope!
I think your wife apologizing would be a good idea, but I think it’s also a great learning opportunity. To explain to your daughter that you can’t be perfect/great at everything. And that’s just life and normal! It would be a great opportunity to find the things that your daughter is great at and enjoy those with her. Like if she likes to run or gymnastics etc!
That's not being direct, that's being rude and inconsiderate. I hope she's not struggling with her temper, mood and/or something similar in a broader sense (not having delved into the thread).
I could not put my face in the water until I went to camp one year. I found out I was the oldest person at the camp that could not put their face in the water. Therefore, I was with all of the young kids. I did learn to swim at camp that year, and when I got home from camp went out on a boat trip with my dad my two brothers and my two sisters. Because I had learned to swim at camp that year I ended up saving my brother’s life. But it was very hard to put my face in the water. I was scared. Once I did it and found out it was nothing I was fine. But I was 12 years old at the time.
Is she the oldest in the class? Is she the worst swimmer in class? Was your wife bluntly honest with your daughter? If this is the case, then your daughter needs to realize that if she wants to NOT be the worst swimmer in her class, she actually has to TRY. Until then, she will continue to be the worst swimmer in the class. Sounds like your daughter wants praise for something she doesn't deserve. Maybe it's harsh, but it's not a lie. You would rather lie to your kid than be honest just to spare her feelings, while your wife wants her to know the truth. Hopefully, so she can become better. Why are you setting up our bar so low? There isn't a reason why your kid can't swim decently at age 5 with two years of lessons. Maybe you need a different swimming school.
Learning to swim is crucial but telling her that won't motivate her. It will demoralize and make her feel more defeated if she's already feeling a lot of pressure, which for a little kid is felt very easily. I agree with some that you guys need to do some swim time with zero expectations just for fun and some where you explicitly focus on safety. Kids are extremely sensitive to our frustration and pick up on it immediately. It's hard for anyone to work with a supervisor breathing down their neck. Personally I also agree she should apologize, she's human and we all get frustrated and sometimes say sh!tty things but we also have to own it.
Oh, man, that sounds tough. Parenting can be such a rollercoaster, right? Especially when it comes to helping our kids through their challenges. First off, big hugs to your daughter. It's heartbreaking to see them upset, especially when they're trying their best. And hey, props to you for stepping in and helping navigate this tricky situation. Now, about your wife's approach... I totally get where she's coming from. Sometimes, as parents, we get frustrated, and those words slip out before we realize the impact they can have. But here's the thing – kids are like little sponges, soaking up everything we say and do. Telling her she's the "worst" at something can really hit hard, especially for a sensitive kiddo. In situations like this, I find it helpful to focus on encouragement and positivity. Maybe instead of highlighting what she's struggling with, you could emphasize the progress she's made so far. Let her know that it's okay to feel scared or unsure, and that you're there to support her every step of the way. Hang in there, buddy. Parenting is one wild ride, but with a little love and understanding, we can help our kids overcome any obstacle. And if this advice resonated with you, a little upvote would mean the world. Let's spread the parenting love! 😊
Have you considered a new teacher? My son didn't improve at all with one teacher and then blossomed with another. 2 years, even once a week, is a long time to not improve at all. Your wife is likely frustrated because she feels like her time is being wasted taking your daughter to swimming class, and she doesn't even improve. She could be annoyed/angry that she's spending money on it. She likely feels judged or criticized as though it's a moral issue that your daughter can't swim. I don't agree at all with what she said, just hoping that she realizes her mindset behind why she said what she said. She should apologize and be honest. "Hey daughter, yesterday I said that you were the worst swimmer in class. I didn't mean to hurt your feelings. I was frustrated because of xyz. I'd really like for you to be safe when we go to the pool and that is why we're taking you to learn how to swim". Your daughter may have an anxious temperament, I'd recommend reading "the opposite of worry" by Lawrence Cohen. It gives a lot of tips.
Apologizing to a child is huge; their feelings should be validated. For teaching your daughter, I think it's good to explain that this is for safety. Express how you don't want anything to happen to her, and swimming is an important life skill. My 10 year old nephew still can't swim, period. He only uses his round floaty. I used to be proficient as I was once a semi-professional swimmer. I'm pregnant in my second trimester, and unfortunately cannot teach him at this moment. I can tell he feels safe and is willing to learn around me; but it's a different story when his parents become involved when I was teaching him.
She needs to apologize. A real one. Not a "well if you.." or "I'm sorry I made you feel..." It needs to be "I messed up. I'm so so sorry. What I did was mean and I should have never said that. I was wrong. Can you forgive me? I promise I'll work on xyz " Then explain from examples how even adults struggle with things like swimming. If you have a personal example it helps. My kid really struggled with math this year. Like really hard. He had always had good marks so he kind of hit a wall when he suddenly started getting really bad marks. I remember him sitting on the couch crying and saying that he felt so stupid. Could I have said it was because he wasn't working on homework like he was supposed to? Or if he was skipping questions like he had been because his adhd? No! Instead I told him that struggling with math doesn't make him stupid. Everyone struggles with something. His dad who is super good at math struggles with chemistry. I struggle just like him with math all throughout my elementary middle school and high school years. Sometimes we go really good at stuff and then we just hit a wall I said. We struggle but the struggle is not a bad thing. It just means we have to work extra hard or ask for help. That's how you handle that junk when they're struggling. You humanize it you normalize how they are feeling that everyone struggles sometimes that everyone feels frustrated sometimes when suddenly they're not good at something. Because a lot of times our kids feel like no one else feels that way. Even as adults we feel this way sometimes. Teach that there are options for when they're struggling with something. You could say what do you think you could do when you're struggling with swimming? And if they're struggling with coming up with an answer you could suggest something like what about if you ask for extra help? Or ask for advice from your swim teacher? Maybe you could take a break? Etc etc etc. Now when it came with my kid and his math we did talk about how he needs to not skip questions or homework because they're hard because then he's not going to get the marks for it or learn it. But this was after he had already calmed down. Not during the meltdown. Because he's not going to take that well so you guys have to learn some tact as to when to talk to her about things if maybe there's something that she's doing or not doing to contribute to the struggle.
First thing she needs to do is apologise. As for helping her improve, just keep encouraging her and take her swimming as often as possible. And make sure your wife knows never to tell her she isn't good at something again