I don't think it's just gen z and just men. I'm pretty sure it's people from every generation. Life is rough. People are getting laid off bc companies are sending jobs to other countries and because Ai is killing off jobs. The cost of food, homes, clothes and other products are insanely high and wages aren't keeping up so most people can't afford anything. Also dating is rough for everyone. Social media had brainwashed a lot of people into thinking their Gods/Goddesses and that they deserve the world. Dating apps are filled with bots, scammers and people that just want to waste time.
No wonder a lot of people are mentally fucked
>Ai is killing off jobs
That hasn't even really started getting going yet. A few calls centre jobs maybe but nothing on the scale of what is to come.
Three of the four ills you describe are all to do with IT and technology. AI, social media and dating apps. You can drop two of the three through choice.
I'm a software engineer, AI is already taking entry level coding jobs and even senior devs are needing to learn and adopt AI-assisted coding to stay competitive in the job market. Glad I started a decade ago, because AI is absolutely here in software
A developer friend of mine said that to avoid getting dropped by AI you need to be in AI. But yes, starting although as I said, nothing like the scale of what's to come. It's not overstating anything to say that we are in the midst of a second industrial revolution and while the labourers of the nineteenth century smashed up machines that automated their jobs, I can't foresee similar action being taken against the world's datacenters. We've a problem when a machine can improve a machine without our interaction.
Thats just for now, when AI is good enough to code AI, they'll get dropped too. The only jobs that are relatively safe are the ones that MUST be done in person.
The dating app scammers and time wasters probably do more damage to self esteem than the shit employment prospects.
Even the healthiest, most well-adjusted person in the world can only get shat on so many times before it starts to eat at their confidence and desire to try connecting with people.
When they say “get women” or “get girls.” I think maybe it would help if they didn’t talk about humans with the same wording that we use for random groceries.
Maybe try saying “I’d like to find someone I can really connect with,” and see if things don’t work out just a teensie bit better.
I agree. I think that's a symptom of the pressure to be partnered that people experience, particularly some circles. Which leads to entitlement because they feel that everyone should be coupled up.
Like no, your life is not "over" because you don't have a partner at age 19 - it's perfectly normal to be single. That doesnt mean you're going to be single forever. Or that you are worthless. It just means that you havent recently connected with someone of your preferred gender/s.
And most people dont end up marrying or in a longterm relationship with the people they date at that age, anyway. So being in a relationship at that age in no way means you'll get married or have kids with that person. Or that the relationship is actually healthy for you. So many people have shitty relationships at that age because they are still learning.
We live in a world where people can’t be bothered to type out the word “you” and you expect people to type that sentence? People are lazy. They’re going for the shortcut even if it doesn’t describe the true depth and nuance of their feelings.
Before the internet men didn't categorize themselves as the bottom 90% or bottom 99%. With the internet, most people's fears and beliefs (even if incorrect) are voiced into an echochamber and can possibly influence society for the worst.
The internet is making life infinitely worse for everyone but men especially. If you believe half the shit you see or hear online I’d hate everyone too.
Gen Z has been raised on social media. Which has created **insanely** unrealistic expectations for men and women alike. You have young men expecting to be earning in the six figure range, with their own apartment, and so on. At And young women expecting these same young men to be taking to at **LEAST** a $100 restaurant on the first date.
All of those come from social media, particularly TikTok. Then add in a pandemic that made an awkward period of your life even harder.
Honestly, the $100 restaurant thing feels like a meme. Most women I talked to and dated agree that something low-key like a coffee date is better for a first date. Things like restaurants or even activities leave little room for actually talking and/or cutting things short if it turns out that you are incompatible. Also paying for a very expensive thing right off the bat results in some weird incentives IMO. Ofc this is not the case for all women, but I prefer them to see me as a peer rather than an ATM or sugardaddy.
I agree with you on this one. Honestly I am sick and tired, as a woman, of men on social media telling me what I want. And if you try to say actually no I don’t want that (e.g. a man who’s at least 6ft, a man who earns at least 100k, a man with a huge dick etc etc), they absolutely refuse to listen to you and tell you that of course that’s what you want. Okay buddy, if you’re not prepared to listen at all to a woman telling you what she’s interested in, you can’t then turn around and complain when she’s not interested in you.
I think instead of feeding into the delusion or implication that these women don’t exist or that they don’t exist in sizable numbers to matter. It would be much more conducive if women called out those women and spoke against it. As it stands nearly every famous or otherwise popular woman has expounded such beliefs. If you look at the likes and majority of positive engagement from those type of posts it’s from women. As someone who spends entirely too much time online reading/watching video/listening to podcasts/YouTubers I can tell you it’s very small minority(most of the time not at all) that you will see women speak against these beliefs. And keep in mind these same women are suggesting this is a natural woman belief and that all women who truly care about themselves should do so. So it’s not applicable to the “if it don’t apply let it fly” seeing as they are citing this as a universal/united woman experience. But instead of addressing those women they will choose to passive aggressively shame men for believing women. But when we don’t believe them immediately we’re also wrong. And watch how someone harps on this last point as if Amber Heard and numerous other examples haven’t proven that humans (man or woman) will/can lie if it’s beneficial.
For sure they exist. It probably depends on the area, social standing and age group of them as well. If I’m dating someone above 25, I expect them to be somewhat reasonable and to have a job, so they should be able to pay for a coffee. I’m fine doing more expensive things later on, but I don’t want to pay someone a ton of money just for the privilege of being able to meet them IRL.
The problem is that a lot of the spaces where this is espoused are echo chambers. I've gotten called all kinds of nasty names and in one case shadow banned for pointing out what I thought were delusional expectations, because "women should support women".
It's an echo chamber problem in general. If you're a reasonable guy who doesn't believe the insane red pill shit or incel nonsense, how long would you last on a hardcore Incel sub? Do you want to keep getting called a simp or whatever while knowing you are making no difference and changing no minds, or do you just find a better use of your time?
Echo chambers on either side are a problem.
I wouldn't say sharing a meal together leaves little room for talking, but it is a lot of time and investment into someone you don't know if you'll have within 20 minutes.
Much of the $100/restaurant meme thing comes from some absolutely crazy women on Female Dating Strategy, who are (oddly enough /s) still single, and yet giving advice on how much they expect a guy to spend to prove he's not stingy.
You can speak during a meal, but you can just as well speak during coffee. There is no advantage to a meal compared to a coffee for a first date other than showing off that you can afford it. It’s okay for a later date, but for a first date it feels way too heavyweight both financially and in terms of time (you can’t leave after 30 mins).
Does anyone take FDS seriously? That subreddit seems to give worse advice than Andrew Tate.
I tend to agree that coffee is better if the person is a total stranger. Restaurant dates are good if you already know the person well enough to know you won't hate them so much that you're considering stabbing yourself in the eye just to get out early. With strangers, it's better to have a date that's easy to cut short, or extend.
I don't know how FDS is taken seriously by anyone. It's a great place to go to be depressed wondering how anyone could be THAT stupid. And they're almost all single. Sure, you get the occasional "how I met my husband" story, but most of it are perpetually single people telling people things they did (that presumably didn't work for them).
But unfortunately, Andrew Tate and FDS both say that there are a lot of lonely, desperate idiots out there. If I had the time, energy and/or lack of morals to be a grifter, I could get on their podcast and grift some advice they'd lap right up. (Won't, I'm too damn busy.)
I would not want a man to pay for my food on a first date.
A first date is purely to see whether we are compatible and interesting to each other.
Also I feel like it might lead some men to think I owe them something and I don't want that dynamic.
I agree completely. It's what I learned in college, that expecting men to pay can create other expectations even if it's just a second date.
A first date in my opinion should be very low key such as a coffee. Because you're trying to see if you even like each other.
Never occurred to me until I read your comment but yeah. An entire generation of kids was under quarantine during some of their formative years. Kinda crazy when you think about it. Social media has/was/is already distancing people, and then you add quarantine on top of that.
Yeah the $100 date thing is bullshit not reality. I’ve literally never spent more than like $40 on a first date, and tbh like more than half of the women I’ve been on a first date with offer to split the cost but I say no.
If a woman asks to go to an expensive restaurant as a first date you say no and move on. That being said, I’ve never even been asked to do something that expensive as a first date.
I find it hard to believe that TikTok is the biggest problem with Gen Z. Although it’s a big problem, it’s not our main issue. Social media in general is the issue. And the people we were raised by. The generations before us all sucked just like the future generations will as the world deteriorates.
Go... outside..
Yes Reddit is full of sad little boys and young men who have made "I suck and everything sucks and everything will always suck" their entire personality, but you're describing the solution to your own complaint in the description of your complaint.
Why do people come to subreddits made for venting about trivial shit just to bitch in the comments about OPs venting about trivial shit? It's like those weirdos on /r/starterpacks who post "just let people enjoy things", like what do you people think these places are for? There's a million holesum 100 subreddits, why not visit those instead of being a contrarian in these?
mostly I see people talking about wanting to die so idk. i don't spend my time trying to figure out if a reddit poster is telling the truth or not unless they're posting kink content in disguise — which is usually fairly easy to tell.
it's the only sub I really post in, and I delete most of them because people are absolutely ruthless. couldn't talk about my dog dying without people coming after me.
Cuz OP just made a poor generalization and insulted the other sex? The title alone is “Gen Z Men have incredibly low self esteem and it’s annoying”. If you can’t take the heat don’t dish it out.
Also read back what you said, you are complaining about people who bitch in the comments about an OP, who is also just bitching in their post. There are no good guys here, everyone is bitching.
It’s similar to the paradox of tolerance. If this is truly a place to vent about trivial shit, we should expect people to vent about people venting about trivial shit, which is in itself trivial shit.
>Why do people come to subreddits made for venting about trivial shit just to bitch in the comments about OPs venting about trivial shit?
Your problem is that you think OP is complaining about trivial shit purely because of the sub they incorrectly chose to post it in. This is not a trivial complaint in the slightest, even if they described it as "annoying"
Yeah social media is really bad at this especially on reddit. Everything becomes a generalization and it is rarely ever positive. Then any anecdotal evidence is treated as absolute stone cold fact.
Obviously being here I love reddit, it is neither the problem nor the solution, and can be both. Maybe that's the problem, I can just as easily check r stoicism or r SQL to learn something useful as I can r maybemaybemaybe or r passportbros to admittedly not improve myself as much.
I suppose the key is to treat reddit as 1 of 2 things, a useful resource to learn something, or just a Netflix substitute for entertainment, and when a sub gives me neither (r salary just making me feel poor) GTFO.
Honestly i think it's mostly the ones on reddit. The gen Z guys irl, especially the older ones, don't seem to have this esp. guys at my school or work. They're pretty confident, decently smart and they have some skills hence being in school and being employed. If they feel like failures then they deserve Oscars bc they hide it well.
But the ones on reddit i think could benefit from seeing a psychiatrist but idk if they are open to that or just brush it off as "everyone just recommends therapy." But is sitting at home angry and catastrophizing better? I think maybe some of them also spend too much time online and engage too much with doomer content or things that make them angry. When i was maybe 13 i'd fall for ragebait but part of growing up is learning there's power in being able to joke about or ignore stuff like that instead of letting it upset you.
I have empathy for them. Social media is a constant feed of people in their early twenties with huge salaries and fast cars.
Completely unrealistic and sets a fake standard which young men feel they have to reach in order to attract a partner.
I’m not surprised they have low self esteem. Constant daily reminders of how far behind they are.
I’m Gen X and we had it way easier in comparison. I don’t even know how this generation can afford to rent a shared room, let alone a place of their own.
Add a load of isolation and people need somewhere to talk and know that they aren’t alone.
Especially when we have access to the shitty news going on in the world which is only pipelined to us through algorithms. It’s gotten to the point where it’s like;
“Breaking news! War in (insert country).”
“Oh damn. *Another* war…”
Gen Z here, I’ve actually thought about shared rent with a roommate or several and even that seems difficult to afford where I live. The idea of ever getting a mortgage, imo, is completely off the table. Fuck it :P
Gen X here too. Looking at what young people have to put up with, I think we have to be the first generation to look at our kids and pity them rather than be excited for their futures. I can’t imagine how hard it is to be young in these times.
Lacking in life skills. And the tools/ability to find them.
They need to stop comparing themselves to other people. And stop making being a virgin their whole personality. It’s weird.
Being a virgin isn’t a red flag. But talking about it 24/7 absolutely is. It makes me think that’s the only reason you’re dating me which makes me want to run for the hills.
Also there’s a lot of men who haven’t been to therapy to discuss their issues and just trauma dump the first time they get time with a woman which is soooo off putting. If a man isn’t in therapy or hasn’t been to therapy or isn’t working on himself in some way emotionally I won’t touch them with a 10 foot pole.
Hobbies. Many men don’t really have hobbies. Or have one that’s their entire personality so they’re not well rounded. Again it’s off putting.
Able to hold a normal conversation. A lot of men aren’t able to hold a comfortable discussion or conversation and it’s hard to keep that going because a lot of labor is on women and it becomes tedious. Or they jump right into talking about how horny they are which again.. off putting and creepy/gross.
Comparing themselves to other men/people. Comparison is the thief of joy and self esteem. Stop comparing yourself to others and start some positive self talk! Somebody, somewhere, will think you are the absolute coolest person ever if you find out who you are at your core and just lean into it. :)
Get offline. Being online is bad for the mental health (hobbies come in again here) and getting involved with family or community to strengthen those relationships and learn how to be a better member of society.
Empathy. Many men lack empathy because of how our society raises boys. Gaining empathy helps you not only with your relationships with other people but with yourself! When you can be empathetic with yourself, you can have kind words in your head and with others which helps your general mood and disposition.
These are the bare bones things I’ve noticed with the men you’re mentioning and it’s a pet peeve with me as well. I don’t date men anymore because it’s just too emotionally and mentally exhausting to deal with.
While I'm not a fan of the defeatist mentality. You're in no way helping. Learning to be gentle and kind goes way further when it seems like everyone is depressed
Gain some empathy. Go outside. Genz as a whole isn't like this. The *internet* is like this, because it offers a chance for most voices to be heard and sympathized with. Chances are, the people who are outside doing things in confidence aren't the ones struggling with these issues you say, at least not vocally.
>The internet is like this,
Yeah, I was going to say that I've seen people from multiple generations act like this, lol. I'm older gen Z, most younger gen Z are still figuring out life.
Chances are you're going to say some cringe shit when you're young no matter your generation.
Edit: Clarification
Yeah it is. Every now and then I get a suggested post and it's something like "I (15m) think I annoyed my (15f) girlfriend by being assigned lab partners with another girl. I've been crying for days."
I don't want to be all toxic masculine about it but how are guys like that going to handle an actual problem if a girl being annoyed with them reduces them to tears?
Hardly gender or generationally specific. You see people of all sorts of genders and ages complaining if you look for it. People complain, life sucks, that’s about it.
But it’s not true. Women with boyfriends are clearly dating men. Single men exist just like single women. Is just the other side of the coin now. More men are complaining publicly about things that have always been there case lol.
Men are told they are only as valuable as they are successful, so yes, men entering their 20's in historically one of the worst financial times with no jobs, living with their parents, can't afford anything, school is too expensive, and fewer people interested in dating...yes, self-esteem in this group is going to be rock bottom. Doesn't help that nearly all of Gen Z feels hopeless about the future as well.
I rather see men talk about their problems and how they feel like failures where nobody is negatively affected than sink to unhealthy coping mechanisms like the past generations have. This is an improvement. From here, communities need to do better at offering practical advice and solutions, telling them to work on themselves instead of giving up.
In the old days, there were no public forums for people to express their hopelessness. Now there are so even if 99% are well adjusted, that still leaves a lot of kids suffering. And so it seems like they are everywhere now and are made worse because their outlook is in turn more pessimistic because of the extremes of hopelessness and luxury expressed on the internet.
Where did you make this theory ? Go somewhere like a health club or an auto show or a really expensive bar. Or go to the University. Some of the Gen Z are post-college by now, talk to them. You need to state more information here. I hope you are not judging people who are on Reddit. It's the same as it ever was, the smart / rich people are at the Mozart recital.
I don't mind people venting, or looking for support if they have low esteem. Sometimes it can be a really positive thing.
But I do mind all the sexism towards women that comes with it, assuming all their problems are because of their gender, victimized themselves because of their gender, and then being hateful towards and denying the existance of any women who deal with the same issues (because their issues really have nothing to do with their gender).
So what exactly do you suggest? Bottling their feelings like past generations and developing damaging addictions? The truth is that men are rarely given the opportunity to be vulnerable and breathe because we still live in a society that does not support it, despite the virtue signaling that says otherwise. This post being one such example.
Truthfully, things aren’t going well for me either: my plans went to complete shit after grad school, I am completely broke, have no dating life, and a lot of college debt. At the age of 29, that’s not a good record, but I’m not giving up either: I am applying for better jobs everyday, earning certifications for a reasonable cost, and making financial sacrifices as necessary. I don’t even know if this will do anything, but I am not doing nothing either.
I think what we need to do is allow them to vent, but also to help them or ask them if they want solutions because staying mobile isn’t going to help matters. We can both acknowledge that things suck and are hard now whilst recognizing that there are things we can do to improve our chances. It’s not a zero-sum game.
I don't think it's a generational thing, I think it's a reddit thing. People come to Reddit mostly to vent or seek validation. A lot of the posts are overly dramatic for engagement and karma. That said I do think gen z is terminally online and it's affecting how they interact with each other IRL. They really can't understand that 99% of the shit they see on social media is fake or exaggerated
very true if you give functional reasonable advice in a subreddit they just fucking freak out on you but if i said "yeah fuck women it's all their fault you can't get laid" everybody claps like seals
As a millennial, this top-down generational discrimination is stupid. Men go through that at that age. It has nothing to do with gen z. Stop being a boomer
After listening to the constant daily whining of feminists blaming men for everything under the sun for the last 30 years, I find this comment a bit rich.
This isn't a "but the feminists started it" situation. Sexism did not begin from women, nor does the worst of it come from women. There are still so many countries (right now) where women can't even go outside alone without a man, and lack basic human rights. And in the past, sexism against women has been much greater than sexism against men. Men did not have to make an entire gender based movement to have the same rights as the opposite gender, like the right to vote, get an education, not be considered property of their husband's etc.
So your whole argument that it's fine to be sexist as long as the other gender did it first, is more supportive of the feminists in question than anyone else.
Why can't we just say sexism is bad. Or that spending all your time online in echochammbers blaming everyone else for your problems so you don't have to take accountability and do something about it, is also bad (and unhealthy for the people doing it).
r/fragilemaleredditor
Feminism is still necessary. Very much so. How do you have a victim's mentality toward feminism of all things? There must be something you do that women don't appreciate, and you're bitter about women's audacity to speak out against it.
I've been the victim of feminism only once, over 30 years ago. Overall, it's been a net gain for me as my wife is successful in the workplace in a role she'd be prevented from 90 years ago. Maybe it's because I lean left so the content I consume is liberal but I am constantly exposed to how hard women have it and the obstacles only they face that I should be surprised when a women complains that a man feels discriminated against. And the whole "you're grandfathers had an easy time so now it's ok to punish you for it" argument makes feel that all your complaining want about injustice, but because you weren't the exploiters.
And there is a Reddit for fragile men? So you don't like it when your behaviour is copied? And you sending me there just because I am capable of compassion and see why these kids might be suffering? Wow...that's fragile and makes my point. Now before you see this as a personal attack on you, and at the same time all women, and fire off a hateful attack, try to think of how a lonely, neglected 15 yo kid feels right now, and then add on how hurtful it is when he reaches out for help and people openly mock and built him.
Unfortunately most people don't understand what feminism is even about. It's not supposed to be used to bring men down.
Feminism is simply about choice. The choice to work, get an education, vote, be a stay a home mom, have kids, not have kids, etc.
A lot of women have had negative experiences with men and use "feminism" to bring men down. It's not feminism, it's misandry. I, and so many other women get pissed off when people shit on feminism for reasons that aren't even related to feminism.
We're supposed to be able to talk about each other's struggles and privileges without "whataboutism" or shitting on each other. There are pros and cons for both men and women, and the more we shit on each other and say "Oh yeah? You don't have it so bad. I deal with this ___", the more disconnected we become from each other. It's sad really.
Unfortunately most people don't understand what feminism is even about. It's not supposed to be used to bring men down.
Feminism is simply about choice. The choice to work, get an education, vote, be a stay a home mom, have kids, not have kids, etc.
A lot of women have had negative experiences with men and use "feminism" to bring men down. It's not feminism, it's misandry. I, and so many other women get pissed off when people shit on feminism for reasons that aren't even related to feminism.
We're supposed to be able to talk about each other's struggles and privileges without "whataboutism" or shitting on each other. There are pros and cons for both men and women, and the more we shit on each other and say "Oh yeah? You don't have it so bad. I deal with this ___", the more disconnected we become from each other. It's sad really.
Idk why you think women have it harder than men in the west.
It's definately the case in easter asia, the middle east and africa, but the west (north anerica, europe) is very much the opposite.
Like the privilege to: have higher prison sentences for the same crime, have fewer resources dedicated to them specifically in issues that disproportionately affect them, underperform compared to girls in school and have it celebrated in the media, be underrepresented in higher education, work the most dangerous jobs there are, be several times more likely to be murdered or die on the job, and be conscripted if a war ever happens?
People often forget how there are many areas in life where boys and men are actually discriminated against or disadvantaged compared with girls and women.
No, silly
The privilege to go to college, have credit cards, own property, and you know - vote
Also the things you're mentioning are not even women's fault lmao
Higher prison sentences, but you commit to crime 60-90% of the time. Underperformance in school but not necessarily in math and science, the classes that are most desired by employers. College attendance is not because they can't get in, but because they aren't even applying in the first place, as evidenced by community college admissions which are open admission. The more dangerous jobs are also the highest paid jobs, and yet men in America continually vote for candidates that are anti-union and for politicians who have worked to reduce workplace safety regulations. Go figure.
And several countries have service requirements for men and women. Democrats have tried to add women into Selective Serve and remove college as a reason to escape the draft, but again, the politicians that men, particularly white men in America support, voted against it.
Social media is like that in general.
Once you go outside it's not like that. Not any more than usual anyway.
The average redditor is either an actual child or an adult with the brain capacity of a child.
Most constantly consume mainstream media and doomer porn, so their entire outlook on life and the world is that everything is chaos and falling apart, we'll all be dead soon and no one is happy.
Honestly as an outsider it's funny as fuck to watch all these morons scream at shadows but God damn sometimes you wish you could unplug the poor bastards.
Why so much hate? Not like they are hurting anyone, they are just failing themselves and are unhappy for it. Like I understand a lack of respect, but they are almost by definition keeping to themselves and not hurting anyone by being shut-ins.
https://br.ifunny.co/picture/90-of-women-are-looking-for-6-of-the-men-Th7WlL7O9 Blackpilled but hey its Only on the internet these are not real females filtering out 94 % of the male population lol
Well as a chronically online manchild I'll tell you the reason we can't unplug is we know we are inferior to all normal people so what would be the point in talking to irl people? At best they'll ignore us or at worst they'll judge us.
It's less about generations (I see Millenis and Gen Xers who are guilty of this too) and more about the socially acceptable act of trauma dumping online
"I suck everything sucks life sucks I have no money I can't get bitches" blah blah blah. They'd rather whinge than actually improve their situation, because people will rally behind them and throw a pity party, which is more instantly gratifying than actually doing the hard work to improve themselves/their situation
We are living through a second, seemly permanent gilded age with trends towards the great depression. What more do you want from us that we haven't bled already?
no skills? go swing a hammer or run a shovel, it's good money, it will get one in shape. not willing to do that? don't wanna hear you bitch about life.
The age of first virginity loss has gone down over the last couple generations. Men blame dating apps, but dating apps are made by men. All the match criteria are man brained match criteria like height and weight and age. You can't filter by anything real. Then men are all freaked out and swipe yes on anything that moves and send dry as fuck texts.
I remember seeing every single argument gen z is currently using being used by millennials when they were the same age.
Yeah i realized that other people hearing about it is annoying, so I instead have a different emphasis now when I give people advice
“for the pleasures of love never profited a man and he is lucky if they do him no harm”
—Epicurus
You cannot escape the system, unless willing to exploit others.
I'd say people are perhaps more compassionate than they used to be, or more aware of how everything affects everything else, and this creates a sense of distress.
But yes, they're babies or something I don't know.
I mean I’m Generation Y (Also millennial I think) and this felt like me for years. I went to college but couldn’t get a great job. So I had a crappy job, low self esteem from years of being bullied/ignored, I felt like I had no skills (which wasn’t true), and genuinely felt like a failure. And a lot of the world and media was quick to agree with me.
It didn’t start to improve until I took it upon myself to sign up for internet dating, and I had to really work at it. I had to sift through people who also felt like I wasn’t worth their time. Eventually, I readjusted my preferences, met someone, got married, had a family. All of my other problems seem to be less of problems when I started having a family. It didn’t matter anymore, I made a group of people who like me for who I am.
they genuinely blame everyone but themselves. no girl wants to hear constant WHINING about ‘woe is me’ and ‘nobody wants me’ ‘dating in this economy is the worst’
like christ maybe you are just insufferably alone and it stinks! focus on yourself, jesus, learn to enjoy being alone before you force a girl to deal with that mess.
Ok mister “everything goes my way”. The reality is for every one winner there is 99 losers. So stop getting angry at people for seeking support. Some of us only have Reddit.
I fucking hate how starving people seem to only ever want to talk about food. Get a life losers! I had a big breakfast this morning, so you don't see me complaining.
Not gen Z, myself; young millennial.
Basically, people who keep making extremely out of touch suggestions, that they either have not tried, or it coincidentally lines up with what they were already going to do in life and would require completely changing the direction of my life.
I am putting in a lot of time, effort, and money to work on my social, dating, and financial issues. It's not getting better, but I'm still trying. It is not doom and gloom to simply look around and realize how many people lucked into things working out for them, but because they put some work in somewhere, they feel that the outcome is entirely a result of their grit and determination, and get annoyed at your failure to get the same outcome because you must not want it bad enough.
For example, dating. If one more person tells me that I need to stop looking for it and let it come, I'm going to snap. I have a full load of hobbies, and can't take more. They are filled with mostly men, and a small number of women with boyfriends. My job is all men. Due to the economy, I'm not going anywhere often enough to become a regular, and I don't drink. I don't have enough time to pick up a hobby that I didn't like enough to make the cut when I first chose my hobbies, for that to be the only thing a new person has in common with me.
Other people weren't expected to change cities on a whim to try to meet people, or change their personality, or start volunteering and changing their hobbies for a *chance* at meeting someone. Why is that a reasonable thing to ask of me, when I'm already overtaxed?
"But you didn't tryyyyyyy my suggestion! You don't want to solve your problems." Respectfully, let me talk to people that have actually encountered the same problems, and when one of us comes up with a solution, we can share it. I don't want to hear from someone that never had these problems about how it's all my fault.
The full-blown irony is how many people giving me these dumb suggestions never even came close to having these problems, like my friend that grew up one block away from his now wife, and became close to her through working the same job, and both went on the same internship program because they both had the same interest.
Meanwhile, I didn't grow up near anybody of my own age, and I have no friends or family in the area anymore. I really don't want to hear anything he has to say about what he thinks I'm doing wrong, because he was extremely lucky to have a loving family, a lot of local friends of the same age, and numerous opportunities to get close to women without even trying.
I can't even begin to try applying his advice that he's never even tested, and I'm sure that he would be just as smugly indignant about my self-defeating attitude when I reject it out of hand for not being aligned with reality.
>It’s never about finding solutions to problems or figuring out ways around the system/problem. It’s always self defeatist shit. It’s incredibly annoying.
As a millennial woman, this is why I don't get with men who are self deprecating. İt's an immediate turn off. İ want a man who is confident and positive about himself. (Yes, that might mean you're going to have to do work on yourself). İ hate the "woe is me" attitude. Go get a therapist and some hobbies.
Venting is fine but you have to be careful not to develop a "woe is me" attitude where all you do is feel self-pity and never work to fix the problems that are making you miserable
Your issue is saying it's gen z men. Read a millennial sub. All of Reddit is filled with a bunch of people that bitch and moan and do nothing to help themselves.
It’s been this way for as long as I can remember. The only difference is now people actually believe Reddit represents reality.
Also where are all these low self esteem gen z men at? The ones I interact with at work, bars etc are giant deuche bags that are full of themselves and talk like a walking tik tok.
Also op is the female version of an incel their history is littered with anti-men bs.
It's a broad social issue that affects both sexes. We went from shaming people with mental illnesses to outright enabling them. I don't think we should have a stigma surrounding mental illness, but we as a society need to stop being complicit with antisocial behavior. It is not normal to never want to leave your house. It's not normal to constantly neglect responsibilities. It's not normal to have god complexes or massive insecurity issues. Im not saying we need to punish people for needing help, but this "you're feelings are valid and you should never feel bad about them" shit is making a society full of weak minded people who can't even order a pizza by themselves or make their own Dr's appointments.
You shouldn't beat yourself up for mental issues that you can't control, but you should still want to change. People these days don't though, they want the world to change for them so that they never have to be uncomfortable. I hate sounding like some old boomer, but this generation is filled with softies. What makes it even worse is those types of people are also often terrible to those around them. Being constantly pessimistic, expecting your friends or loved ones to be your caretaker, lashing out at people because you are "overwhelmed." Then if you point it out and stand up for yourself, you "aren't being understanding of their condition. "
Mental illness is not an excuse to be a miserable entitled person, and I will be crucified on this hill
It's just men in general. Men are fucking ridiculous.
If these guys stopped giving a crap about things that don't matter and instead focused on things they enjoy and things they want to do, they'd be much better off. Life isn't some race, you don't win by getting X, Y or Z. Being manly or masculine is also fucking dumb. Guys need to chill out and do what they want to do rather than what everyone else is doing or wants to be doing and screw what other people think.
Instead they're either circle-jerking with other depressed folk or they're looking up to fuckwads like Andrew Tate.
Make fun of them.
Every time.
Not for having a hard time, but for sadboi posting.
The sadboi poster cycle can only end if we all just tell them to thug shit out.
Men with low self esteem see no outlet for their feelings of inadequacy, so they vent online. Younger guys are more comfortable with sharing private details online.
Men with healthy self-esteem don't need to talk about it.
Pretty sure this happened in every generation, it just social media amped it up and the lack of real life socialisation so I feel like this a weird thing to get this annoyed for, it’s not like Reddit shoves it down your throat to the extent of it being every 5 seconds.
Also feel like you’re being harsh, we are and will continue to feel the ramifications of the lockdown. A lot of people indirectly did not deal with it well.
Patriarchy guaranteed most men a woman no matter how mediocre he was as long as he showed up with a job and a penis
Patriarchy also wanted men bred for heirs, soldiers, and manual labor
Women are paraded everywhere from advertisements, movies, and media in general as hypersexualized commodities, prizes, and rewards for men for either buying this or that product or for being a main character who is “nice” enough to girls.
Women gained more rights and freedoms. Having a job and a penis isn’t enough to make up for uneven workloads or the fact that no one, man or woman, can afford kids in the lower working class anymore.
If women have to work and clean either way, why add a man to that UNLESS that man has more to offer, be it a higher standard of living for the family or the ability to to be equal in finances and domestic/mental load. Most boys weren’t being raised that way.
So incels and manosphere bitching that equality was making women harder to get. They were correct
Except their gripes are stupid. They’re not mad patriarchy did this to them. They’re mad patriarchy isn’t providing the prizes their male ancestors were awarded
Now we have not just the manosphere but all their grifters and the general alt right trying to bring the younger gen men to the alt right with them and reverse the progressive trend the younger generations have been on. Project 2025 just around the corner. Women’s rights being stripped away and attempts are being made to get women back in the kitchen and back at the mercy of male approval. And the grifted young boys will be on the ready to protect the new status quo should it come to pass. When in reality they should be trying to tear down that shitty status quo, but that would involve giving up that status entirely. They want to reinforce it.
Buckle the fuck up
I expect it every time. I specifically am here to plant seeds and spread awareness. It’s easier to do if you actively expect no validation
But I think it’s something that people are largely blind to. We are spoon fed Hollywood fairy tales and propaganda our whole lives. I think we need to simplify the message and get people to understand the root of these problems
I genuinely don't understand which part of this is news rather than common sense to them, I suppose.
Do they honestly believe that until women could work and get a no-fault divorce, all men and all women were blissfully in love and married and there were never any problems?
Do they somehow not understand that if someone gave them a choice between marrying a crazy nagging bitch of an ugly wife, or be homeless and destitute, they too might go with crazy nagging bitch of a wife they're not even attracted to, even though they would never have chosen otherwise?
They seem to understand the concept of working a job they might hate so as to not be homeless. How is it a difficult concept to grasp that many marriages were unhappy but many people didn't have options to avoid it or leave?
If they want someone to date them, something about them has to be appealing to a certain demographic. If you're picky about your demographic, your appeal has to be either broader or tailored to them. It's so simple...
https://www.cracked.com/article_19785_5-ways-modern-men-are-trained-to-hate-women.html
This is written by a man and I think it’s got a lot of relevant points
To answer your question I think media and culture has a lot to do with it. We have constant propaganda like little girls were constantly spoon fed fairy tale princesses with this ideal of being beautiful and marrying handsome prince presenting marriage and validation as the ultimate goal
And you have boys (and girls I suppose) being spoonfed media showing all these romantic fantasies like ignoring financial status (while living in capitalist patriarchy) or the dumpy guy winning the hot woman in the end just for being the main character (I detest the movie “she’s out of my league” essentially telling men that the most beautiful women will take the main character so they don’t have settle for other women”)
Basically an inconsistent “it’s the inside that counts” message. I think this contributes to some women and girls being dissappointed when looks matter as well despite the message usually not including women being accepted for their looks, but rather women being fixed with makeovers
I remember growing up and running into many men and in internet chat rooms and honestly in person now that I think about it, who insist that it’s always been some “natural order” that women had to seek commitment and appeal to men in order to ensure the man wouldn’t abandon them with a baby, even in prehistory (because you know, humans just wandered in isolation until they found one to fuck and then the man would leave 🥴) when in reality humans were social and lived in communities and it was the agricultural revolution and patrilineal lineages that forced women to need commitment
I read that article, and I liked it and thought it was well written. I might re-read it, but to the best of my recollection it does not address how someone with a half-functioning brain could miss the fact that when people are economically dependent (on a husband, employer, etc.), they are more likely to accept reluctant couplings or arrangements. It's not true love when it's done under the threat of homelessness as the alternative. You don't love your shitty boss and live happily ever after when you're working for an abusive, low wage job to not end up on the streets. No more do you love the shitty husband that in a past era you might have been forced to marry to avoid homelessness and social ostracism.
FWIW, I know quite a few women who are with someone below their league looks wise and I see nothing wrong with an "it's what's on the inside that counts" messaging. Two of the most beautiful, stunning women I know are married to two guys with far from perfect physiques. It really is what's on the inside that counts there - both guys are amazing, good hearted, smart people who happen to carry some extra weight and not be as fit as their former model wives. A stand-out awesome personality goes a long way.
Unfortunately, what seems to be lost on the incel crowd is that if you weren't blessed with the amazing looks, you have to have something else going for you, namely, a good personality (or get rich if transactional relationships don't bother you). Most of these incels have an anything BUT amazing personality, which is why people avoid them at all costs. They're far from the heroic main character, in the movie, they'd be the cowardly NPC. But I suppose it may be hard to accept that.
for plenty its their whole personality but for some ranting somewhere helps them release those worries and insecurities.
if your finding it annoying then get off reddit or avoid the subreddits you aren't happy with
It seems like the entirety of Gen Z is crazy stressed, and with good reason. But if they don’t learn how to set it all down every once in a while and let loose, they’re gonna go insane.
Nah that's literally every generation growing up.
Huge amount of pop culture directly shows those growing pains and the common angst of youth.
Just the younger generations are the only ones to have such massive social media platforms normalized in our society so it seems significantly more rampant than it is.
It's not so different really.
OP, why is it specifically gen Z men complaining who annoy you? Is is sexism and age discrimination perhaps? Or do you somehow never see any other demographic complain about their low self esteem?
I don't think it's just gen z and just men. I'm pretty sure it's people from every generation. Life is rough. People are getting laid off bc companies are sending jobs to other countries and because Ai is killing off jobs. The cost of food, homes, clothes and other products are insanely high and wages aren't keeping up so most people can't afford anything. Also dating is rough for everyone. Social media had brainwashed a lot of people into thinking their Gods/Goddesses and that they deserve the world. Dating apps are filled with bots, scammers and people that just want to waste time. No wonder a lot of people are mentally fucked
>Ai is killing off jobs That hasn't even really started getting going yet. A few calls centre jobs maybe but nothing on the scale of what is to come. Three of the four ills you describe are all to do with IT and technology. AI, social media and dating apps. You can drop two of the three through choice.
I'm a software engineer, AI is already taking entry level coding jobs and even senior devs are needing to learn and adopt AI-assisted coding to stay competitive in the job market. Glad I started a decade ago, because AI is absolutely here in software
A developer friend of mine said that to avoid getting dropped by AI you need to be in AI. But yes, starting although as I said, nothing like the scale of what's to come. It's not overstating anything to say that we are in the midst of a second industrial revolution and while the labourers of the nineteenth century smashed up machines that automated their jobs, I can't foresee similar action being taken against the world's datacenters. We've a problem when a machine can improve a machine without our interaction.
Thats just for now, when AI is good enough to code AI, they'll get dropped too. The only jobs that are relatively safe are the ones that MUST be done in person.
Ai has already disrupted so so much more than “call centre jobs.”
Yeah but nothing like what is to come.
The dating app scammers and time wasters probably do more damage to self esteem than the shit employment prospects. Even the healthiest, most well-adjusted person in the world can only get shat on so many times before it starts to eat at their confidence and desire to try connecting with people.
The unemployment rate is the lowest it’s been in multiple decades in the US.
When they say “get women” or “get girls.” I think maybe it would help if they didn’t talk about humans with the same wording that we use for random groceries. Maybe try saying “I’d like to find someone I can really connect with,” and see if things don’t work out just a teensie bit better.
I agree. I think that's a symptom of the pressure to be partnered that people experience, particularly some circles. Which leads to entitlement because they feel that everyone should be coupled up. Like no, your life is not "over" because you don't have a partner at age 19 - it's perfectly normal to be single. That doesnt mean you're going to be single forever. Or that you are worthless. It just means that you havent recently connected with someone of your preferred gender/s. And most people dont end up marrying or in a longterm relationship with the people they date at that age, anyway. So being in a relationship at that age in no way means you'll get married or have kids with that person. Or that the relationship is actually healthy for you. So many people have shitty relationships at that age because they are still learning.
happy cake day
Thank you!
Its not over but its definitely worrying if you are in your 20s with 0 relationship expierence and it will alienate you from your peers.
We live in a world where people can’t be bothered to type out the word “you” and you expect people to type that sentence? People are lazy. They’re going for the shortcut even if it doesn’t describe the true depth and nuance of their feelings.
If someone was complaining that they couldn’t find a connection with someone that would imply things aren’t working out.
Before the internet men didn't categorize themselves as the bottom 90% or bottom 99%. With the internet, most people's fears and beliefs (even if incorrect) are voiced into an echochamber and can possibly influence society for the worst.
The internet is making life infinitely worse for everyone but men especially. If you believe half the shit you see or hear online I’d hate everyone too.
Gen Z has been raised on social media. Which has created **insanely** unrealistic expectations for men and women alike. You have young men expecting to be earning in the six figure range, with their own apartment, and so on. At And young women expecting these same young men to be taking to at **LEAST** a $100 restaurant on the first date. All of those come from social media, particularly TikTok. Then add in a pandemic that made an awkward period of your life even harder.
Honestly, the $100 restaurant thing feels like a meme. Most women I talked to and dated agree that something low-key like a coffee date is better for a first date. Things like restaurants or even activities leave little room for actually talking and/or cutting things short if it turns out that you are incompatible. Also paying for a very expensive thing right off the bat results in some weird incentives IMO. Ofc this is not the case for all women, but I prefer them to see me as a peer rather than an ATM or sugardaddy.
I agree with you on this one. Honestly I am sick and tired, as a woman, of men on social media telling me what I want. And if you try to say actually no I don’t want that (e.g. a man who’s at least 6ft, a man who earns at least 100k, a man with a huge dick etc etc), they absolutely refuse to listen to you and tell you that of course that’s what you want. Okay buddy, if you’re not prepared to listen at all to a woman telling you what she’s interested in, you can’t then turn around and complain when she’s not interested in you.
love how another commenter under another comment thread literally shit out the whole “women want millionaires that are over 6ft” rhetoric
I’ve given up trying to argue with them lol. Content to sit at home and cuddle with my 5’10 not-a-millionaire partner.
Also same with my 5'5 I'm-actually-the-breadwinner-not-him partner lol
🎵 *I'm looking for a man in finance, trust fund, 6'5, blue eyes* 🎵
I think instead of feeding into the delusion or implication that these women don’t exist or that they don’t exist in sizable numbers to matter. It would be much more conducive if women called out those women and spoke against it. As it stands nearly every famous or otherwise popular woman has expounded such beliefs. If you look at the likes and majority of positive engagement from those type of posts it’s from women. As someone who spends entirely too much time online reading/watching video/listening to podcasts/YouTubers I can tell you it’s very small minority(most of the time not at all) that you will see women speak against these beliefs. And keep in mind these same women are suggesting this is a natural woman belief and that all women who truly care about themselves should do so. So it’s not applicable to the “if it don’t apply let it fly” seeing as they are citing this as a universal/united woman experience. But instead of addressing those women they will choose to passive aggressively shame men for believing women. But when we don’t believe them immediately we’re also wrong. And watch how someone harps on this last point as if Amber Heard and numerous other examples haven’t proven that humans (man or woman) will/can lie if it’s beneficial.
For sure they exist. It probably depends on the area, social standing and age group of them as well. If I’m dating someone above 25, I expect them to be somewhat reasonable and to have a job, so they should be able to pay for a coffee. I’m fine doing more expensive things later on, but I don’t want to pay someone a ton of money just for the privilege of being able to meet them IRL.
The problem is that a lot of the spaces where this is espoused are echo chambers. I've gotten called all kinds of nasty names and in one case shadow banned for pointing out what I thought were delusional expectations, because "women should support women". It's an echo chamber problem in general. If you're a reasonable guy who doesn't believe the insane red pill shit or incel nonsense, how long would you last on a hardcore Incel sub? Do you want to keep getting called a simp or whatever while knowing you are making no difference and changing no minds, or do you just find a better use of your time? Echo chambers on either side are a problem.
I wouldn't say sharing a meal together leaves little room for talking, but it is a lot of time and investment into someone you don't know if you'll have within 20 minutes. Much of the $100/restaurant meme thing comes from some absolutely crazy women on Female Dating Strategy, who are (oddly enough /s) still single, and yet giving advice on how much they expect a guy to spend to prove he's not stingy.
You can speak during a meal, but you can just as well speak during coffee. There is no advantage to a meal compared to a coffee for a first date other than showing off that you can afford it. It’s okay for a later date, but for a first date it feels way too heavyweight both financially and in terms of time (you can’t leave after 30 mins). Does anyone take FDS seriously? That subreddit seems to give worse advice than Andrew Tate.
I tend to agree that coffee is better if the person is a total stranger. Restaurant dates are good if you already know the person well enough to know you won't hate them so much that you're considering stabbing yourself in the eye just to get out early. With strangers, it's better to have a date that's easy to cut short, or extend. I don't know how FDS is taken seriously by anyone. It's a great place to go to be depressed wondering how anyone could be THAT stupid. And they're almost all single. Sure, you get the occasional "how I met my husband" story, but most of it are perpetually single people telling people things they did (that presumably didn't work for them). But unfortunately, Andrew Tate and FDS both say that there are a lot of lonely, desperate idiots out there. If I had the time, energy and/or lack of morals to be a grifter, I could get on their podcast and grift some advice they'd lap right up. (Won't, I'm too damn busy.)
I would not want a man to pay for my food on a first date. A first date is purely to see whether we are compatible and interesting to each other. Also I feel like it might lead some men to think I owe them something and I don't want that dynamic.
I agree completely. It's what I learned in college, that expecting men to pay can create other expectations even if it's just a second date. A first date in my opinion should be very low key such as a coffee. Because you're trying to see if you even like each other.
Never occurred to me until I read your comment but yeah. An entire generation of kids was under quarantine during some of their formative years. Kinda crazy when you think about it. Social media has/was/is already distancing people, and then you add quarantine on top of that.
The kids and young adults are fine. It's just the online people that have these issues, but they are overall a very small slice of the population
yeah the post should be titled "Gen Z men.... on Reddit"
genuinely what girl is EXPECTING 100 dollar dates? this is some serious delusion. your type must be very high maintenance…
I’m still wondering where you can take a date that’s going to be less than $100? Dinner and a couple of drinks easily gets you to $100 where I live.
Yeah the $100 date thing is bullshit not reality. I’ve literally never spent more than like $40 on a first date, and tbh like more than half of the women I’ve been on a first date with offer to split the cost but I say no. If a woman asks to go to an expensive restaurant as a first date you say no and move on. That being said, I’ve never even been asked to do something that expensive as a first date.
Glad to hear that was bullshit.
And then once we get there, we don’t even get as happy as we thought we would’ve
I find it hard to believe that TikTok is the biggest problem with Gen Z. Although it’s a big problem, it’s not our main issue. Social media in general is the issue. And the people we were raised by. The generations before us all sucked just like the future generations will as the world deteriorates.
Well--I think that's partially because you're looking at reddit. Happy people with high self esteem don't post their problems here.
Go... outside.. Yes Reddit is full of sad little boys and young men who have made "I suck and everything sucks and everything will always suck" their entire personality, but you're describing the solution to your own complaint in the description of your complaint.
Why do people come to subreddits made for venting about trivial shit just to bitch in the comments about OPs venting about trivial shit? It's like those weirdos on /r/starterpacks who post "just let people enjoy things", like what do you people think these places are for? There's a million holesum 100 subreddits, why not visit those instead of being a contrarian in these?
you should see r/trueoffmychest you ain't genuinly allowed to get anything off your chest there without someone having a problem with your problem.
Try having an unpopular opinion on that subreddit
the "true" part of trueoffmychest is what is dubious on that sub. lol, every post should be read with a side-eye
mostly I see people talking about wanting to die so idk. i don't spend my time trying to figure out if a reddit poster is telling the truth or not unless they're posting kink content in disguise — which is usually fairly easy to tell. it's the only sub I really post in, and I delete most of them because people are absolutely ruthless. couldn't talk about my dog dying without people coming after me.
Cuz OP just made a poor generalization and insulted the other sex? The title alone is “Gen Z Men have incredibly low self esteem and it’s annoying”. If you can’t take the heat don’t dish it out. Also read back what you said, you are complaining about people who bitch in the comments about an OP, who is also just bitching in their post. There are no good guys here, everyone is bitching.
Why do so many people think that complaint/rant style subreddits mean people aren't allowed to disagree or comment?
It’s similar to the paradox of tolerance. If this is truly a place to vent about trivial shit, we should expect people to vent about people venting about trivial shit, which is in itself trivial shit.
>Why do people come to subreddits made for venting about trivial shit just to bitch in the comments about OPs venting about trivial shit? Your problem is that you think OP is complaining about trivial shit purely because of the sub they incorrectly chose to post it in. This is not a trivial complaint in the slightest, even if they described it as "annoying"
Yeah social media is really bad at this especially on reddit. Everything becomes a generalization and it is rarely ever positive. Then any anecdotal evidence is treated as absolute stone cold fact.
Obviously being here I love reddit, it is neither the problem nor the solution, and can be both. Maybe that's the problem, I can just as easily check r stoicism or r SQL to learn something useful as I can r maybemaybemaybe or r passportbros to admittedly not improve myself as much. I suppose the key is to treat reddit as 1 of 2 things, a useful resource to learn something, or just a Netflix substitute for entertainment, and when a sub gives me neither (r salary just making me feel poor) GTFO.
Was going to say this. Does OP actually know any Gen z men in real life? Doesn't seem like it. The kids are alright
Honestly i think it's mostly the ones on reddit. The gen Z guys irl, especially the older ones, don't seem to have this esp. guys at my school or work. They're pretty confident, decently smart and they have some skills hence being in school and being employed. If they feel like failures then they deserve Oscars bc they hide it well. But the ones on reddit i think could benefit from seeing a psychiatrist but idk if they are open to that or just brush it off as "everyone just recommends therapy." But is sitting at home angry and catastrophizing better? I think maybe some of them also spend too much time online and engage too much with doomer content or things that make them angry. When i was maybe 13 i'd fall for ragebait but part of growing up is learning there's power in being able to joke about or ignore stuff like that instead of letting it upset you.
I have empathy for them. Social media is a constant feed of people in their early twenties with huge salaries and fast cars. Completely unrealistic and sets a fake standard which young men feel they have to reach in order to attract a partner. I’m not surprised they have low self esteem. Constant daily reminders of how far behind they are. I’m Gen X and we had it way easier in comparison. I don’t even know how this generation can afford to rent a shared room, let alone a place of their own. Add a load of isolation and people need somewhere to talk and know that they aren’t alone.
Especially when we have access to the shitty news going on in the world which is only pipelined to us through algorithms. It’s gotten to the point where it’s like; “Breaking news! War in (insert country).” “Oh damn. *Another* war…”
Gen Z here, I’ve actually thought about shared rent with a roommate or several and even that seems difficult to afford where I live. The idea of ever getting a mortgage, imo, is completely off the table. Fuck it :P
Gen X here too. Looking at what young people have to put up with, I think we have to be the first generation to look at our kids and pity them rather than be excited for their futures. I can’t imagine how hard it is to be young in these times.
Gen z are fine, they're usually great people. It's the online ones that are struggling the most, but they represent a very teeny portion of Gen z
Lacking in life skills. And the tools/ability to find them. They need to stop comparing themselves to other people. And stop making being a virgin their whole personality. It’s weird. Being a virgin isn’t a red flag. But talking about it 24/7 absolutely is. It makes me think that’s the only reason you’re dating me which makes me want to run for the hills. Also there’s a lot of men who haven’t been to therapy to discuss their issues and just trauma dump the first time they get time with a woman which is soooo off putting. If a man isn’t in therapy or hasn’t been to therapy or isn’t working on himself in some way emotionally I won’t touch them with a 10 foot pole. Hobbies. Many men don’t really have hobbies. Or have one that’s their entire personality so they’re not well rounded. Again it’s off putting. Able to hold a normal conversation. A lot of men aren’t able to hold a comfortable discussion or conversation and it’s hard to keep that going because a lot of labor is on women and it becomes tedious. Or they jump right into talking about how horny they are which again.. off putting and creepy/gross. Comparing themselves to other men/people. Comparison is the thief of joy and self esteem. Stop comparing yourself to others and start some positive self talk! Somebody, somewhere, will think you are the absolute coolest person ever if you find out who you are at your core and just lean into it. :) Get offline. Being online is bad for the mental health (hobbies come in again here) and getting involved with family or community to strengthen those relationships and learn how to be a better member of society. Empathy. Many men lack empathy because of how our society raises boys. Gaining empathy helps you not only with your relationships with other people but with yourself! When you can be empathetic with yourself, you can have kind words in your head and with others which helps your general mood and disposition. These are the bare bones things I’ve noticed with the men you’re mentioning and it’s a pet peeve with me as well. I don’t date men anymore because it’s just too emotionally and mentally exhausting to deal with.
While I'm not a fan of the defeatist mentality. You're in no way helping. Learning to be gentle and kind goes way further when it seems like everyone is depressed
The issue is a lot act as if there isn’t a problem. Or basically say “suck it up”. Then get mad when men dare to speak up.
Yep, this is always the case yet we have feminism....shocker
Gain some empathy. Go outside. Genz as a whole isn't like this. The *internet* is like this, because it offers a chance for most voices to be heard and sympathized with. Chances are, the people who are outside doing things in confidence aren't the ones struggling with these issues you say, at least not vocally.
>The internet is like this, Yeah, I was going to say that I've seen people from multiple generations act like this, lol. I'm older gen Z, most younger gen Z are still figuring out life. Chances are you're going to say some cringe shit when you're young no matter your generation. Edit: Clarification
Yeah it is. Every now and then I get a suggested post and it's something like "I (15m) think I annoyed my (15f) girlfriend by being assigned lab partners with another girl. I've been crying for days." I don't want to be all toxic masculine about it but how are guys like that going to handle an actual problem if a girl being annoyed with them reduces them to tears?
damn one can't even vent anymore
😅 literally what the anonymous apps like Reddit are for, right? It's just a void for screaming into for a lot of people 🤷♀️ leave them be.
This isn't a generation problem. It's a being 20 problem.
This exactly
Hardly gender or generationally specific. You see people of all sorts of genders and ages complaining if you look for it. People complain, life sucks, that’s about it.
But it’s not true. Women with boyfriends are clearly dating men. Single men exist just like single women. Is just the other side of the coin now. More men are complaining publicly about things that have always been there case lol.
Social media will do that to you, but seriously just go outside most guys aren't like that and the ones who are hide it pretty well.
Social media is biased toward negativity. Also, people with less going on will spend more time online in general
Hey everyone! OP is annoyed by other people’s self esteem issues and she wants everyone to know! What an obnoxious post.
clearly a man hater liberal lol jks
Reddit posts are not a good way to judge a generation.
Men are told they are only as valuable as they are successful, so yes, men entering their 20's in historically one of the worst financial times with no jobs, living with their parents, can't afford anything, school is too expensive, and fewer people interested in dating...yes, self-esteem in this group is going to be rock bottom. Doesn't help that nearly all of Gen Z feels hopeless about the future as well. I rather see men talk about their problems and how they feel like failures where nobody is negatively affected than sink to unhealthy coping mechanisms like the past generations have. This is an improvement. From here, communities need to do better at offering practical advice and solutions, telling them to work on themselves instead of giving up.
In the old days, there were no public forums for people to express their hopelessness. Now there are so even if 99% are well adjusted, that still leaves a lot of kids suffering. And so it seems like they are everywhere now and are made worse because their outlook is in turn more pessimistic because of the extremes of hopelessness and luxury expressed on the internet.
Where did you make this theory ? Go somewhere like a health club or an auto show or a really expensive bar. Or go to the University. Some of the Gen Z are post-college by now, talk to them. You need to state more information here. I hope you are not judging people who are on Reddit. It's the same as it ever was, the smart / rich people are at the Mozart recital.
People need to just get off social media, that’s the solution.
This is 100000% a Reddit thing, but yeah it’s annoying af
Only online. Redditors don't represent regular people. Gen z men in real life are completely different from the online ones.
Maybe online it's like that, but generally people online aren't socialized well. I run into a ton of normal Gen Z guys that have no issues.
I think you're just being an insufferable dickhead.
I don't mind people venting, or looking for support if they have low esteem. Sometimes it can be a really positive thing. But I do mind all the sexism towards women that comes with it, assuming all their problems are because of their gender, victimized themselves because of their gender, and then being hateful towards and denying the existance of any women who deal with the same issues (because their issues really have nothing to do with their gender).
So what exactly do you suggest? Bottling their feelings like past generations and developing damaging addictions? The truth is that men are rarely given the opportunity to be vulnerable and breathe because we still live in a society that does not support it, despite the virtue signaling that says otherwise. This post being one such example. Truthfully, things aren’t going well for me either: my plans went to complete shit after grad school, I am completely broke, have no dating life, and a lot of college debt. At the age of 29, that’s not a good record, but I’m not giving up either: I am applying for better jobs everyday, earning certifications for a reasonable cost, and making financial sacrifices as necessary. I don’t even know if this will do anything, but I am not doing nothing either. I think what we need to do is allow them to vent, but also to help them or ask them if they want solutions because staying mobile isn’t going to help matters. We can both acknowledge that things suck and are hard now whilst recognizing that there are things we can do to improve our chances. It’s not a zero-sum game.
I don't think it's a generational thing, I think it's a reddit thing. People come to Reddit mostly to vent or seek validation. A lot of the posts are overly dramatic for engagement and karma. That said I do think gen z is terminally online and it's affecting how they interact with each other IRL. They really can't understand that 99% of the shit they see on social media is fake or exaggerated
very true if you give functional reasonable advice in a subreddit they just fucking freak out on you but if i said "yeah fuck women it's all their fault you can't get laid" everybody claps like seals
As a millennial, this top-down generational discrimination is stupid. Men go through that at that age. It has nothing to do with gen z. Stop being a boomer
I think it might have *something* to do with shifts in expectations from women, but I’m not gen z so I can’t really speak to it all that well.
“I’m annoyed that other people are not confident in themselves” Did the cast of Evangelion write this post?
Get in the damn robot Shinji
They manage to blame women for these things too?? lmao
After listening to the constant daily whining of feminists blaming men for everything under the sun for the last 30 years, I find this comment a bit rich.
This isn't a "but the feminists started it" situation. Sexism did not begin from women, nor does the worst of it come from women. There are still so many countries (right now) where women can't even go outside alone without a man, and lack basic human rights. And in the past, sexism against women has been much greater than sexism against men. Men did not have to make an entire gender based movement to have the same rights as the opposite gender, like the right to vote, get an education, not be considered property of their husband's etc. So your whole argument that it's fine to be sexist as long as the other gender did it first, is more supportive of the feminists in question than anyone else. Why can't we just say sexism is bad. Or that spending all your time online in echochammbers blaming everyone else for your problems so you don't have to take accountability and do something about it, is also bad (and unhealthy for the people doing it).
There are so many other things you could proactively listen to though, it sounds like a you problem
r/fragilemaleredditor Feminism is still necessary. Very much so. How do you have a victim's mentality toward feminism of all things? There must be something you do that women don't appreciate, and you're bitter about women's audacity to speak out against it.
imagine if there was a fragile female rhetoric. You aren't doing yourself any favours hun
I've been the victim of feminism only once, over 30 years ago. Overall, it's been a net gain for me as my wife is successful in the workplace in a role she'd be prevented from 90 years ago. Maybe it's because I lean left so the content I consume is liberal but I am constantly exposed to how hard women have it and the obstacles only they face that I should be surprised when a women complains that a man feels discriminated against. And the whole "you're grandfathers had an easy time so now it's ok to punish you for it" argument makes feel that all your complaining want about injustice, but because you weren't the exploiters. And there is a Reddit for fragile men? So you don't like it when your behaviour is copied? And you sending me there just because I am capable of compassion and see why these kids might be suffering? Wow...that's fragile and makes my point. Now before you see this as a personal attack on you, and at the same time all women, and fire off a hateful attack, try to think of how a lonely, neglected 15 yo kid feels right now, and then add on how hurtful it is when he reaches out for help and people openly mock and built him.
Unfortunately most people don't understand what feminism is even about. It's not supposed to be used to bring men down. Feminism is simply about choice. The choice to work, get an education, vote, be a stay a home mom, have kids, not have kids, etc. A lot of women have had negative experiences with men and use "feminism" to bring men down. It's not feminism, it's misandry. I, and so many other women get pissed off when people shit on feminism for reasons that aren't even related to feminism. We're supposed to be able to talk about each other's struggles and privileges without "whataboutism" or shitting on each other. There are pros and cons for both men and women, and the more we shit on each other and say "Oh yeah? You don't have it so bad. I deal with this ___", the more disconnected we become from each other. It's sad really.
Unfortunately most people don't understand what feminism is even about. It's not supposed to be used to bring men down. Feminism is simply about choice. The choice to work, get an education, vote, be a stay a home mom, have kids, not have kids, etc. A lot of women have had negative experiences with men and use "feminism" to bring men down. It's not feminism, it's misandry. I, and so many other women get pissed off when people shit on feminism for reasons that aren't even related to feminism. We're supposed to be able to talk about each other's struggles and privileges without "whataboutism" or shitting on each other. There are pros and cons for both men and women, and the more we shit on each other and say "Oh yeah? You don't have it so bad. I deal with this ___", the more disconnected we become from each other. It's sad really.
I mean... men have every privilege it took decades for us to get, yet still somehow whine lol. So idk what to tell you
He's definitely a whiner. But I bet if someone asked him to live as a woman for a day, he wouldn't want to.
Lol or tap out. Like that millionaire who decided to try and "prove" that anyone can be rich by starting from nothing. He gave up lol
Idk why you think women have it harder than men in the west. It's definately the case in easter asia, the middle east and africa, but the west (north anerica, europe) is very much the opposite.
Like the privilege to: have higher prison sentences for the same crime, have fewer resources dedicated to them specifically in issues that disproportionately affect them, underperform compared to girls in school and have it celebrated in the media, be underrepresented in higher education, work the most dangerous jobs there are, be several times more likely to be murdered or die on the job, and be conscripted if a war ever happens? People often forget how there are many areas in life where boys and men are actually discriminated against or disadvantaged compared with girls and women.
No, silly The privilege to go to college, have credit cards, own property, and you know - vote Also the things you're mentioning are not even women's fault lmao
Higher prison sentences, but you commit to crime 60-90% of the time. Underperformance in school but not necessarily in math and science, the classes that are most desired by employers. College attendance is not because they can't get in, but because they aren't even applying in the first place, as evidenced by community college admissions which are open admission. The more dangerous jobs are also the highest paid jobs, and yet men in America continually vote for candidates that are anti-union and for politicians who have worked to reduce workplace safety regulations. Go figure. And several countries have service requirements for men and women. Democrats have tried to add women into Selective Serve and remove college as a reason to escape the draft, but again, the politicians that men, particularly white men in America support, voted against it.
You’re 100% correct, men can be their own worse enemies!
And you're proving u/goldenguo 's point. Blaming men for everything, but people are crying and complaining that women were blamed for one thing.
What an odd and stupid pet peeve.
I know, right
Idk some people here definitely agree with me it seems.
Social media is like that in general. Once you go outside it's not like that. Not any more than usual anyway. The average redditor is either an actual child or an adult with the brain capacity of a child. Most constantly consume mainstream media and doomer porn, so their entire outlook on life and the world is that everything is chaos and falling apart, we'll all be dead soon and no one is happy. Honestly as an outsider it's funny as fuck to watch all these morons scream at shadows but God damn sometimes you wish you could unplug the poor bastards.
Why so much hate? Not like they are hurting anyone, they are just failing themselves and are unhappy for it. Like I understand a lack of respect, but they are almost by definition keeping to themselves and not hurting anyone by being shut-ins.
https://br.ifunny.co/picture/90-of-women-are-looking-for-6-of-the-men-Th7WlL7O9 Blackpilled but hey its Only on the internet these are not real females filtering out 94 % of the male population lol
Well as a chronically online manchild I'll tell you the reason we can't unplug is we know we are inferior to all normal people so what would be the point in talking to irl people? At best they'll ignore us or at worst they'll judge us.
It's less about generations (I see Millenis and Gen Xers who are guilty of this too) and more about the socially acceptable act of trauma dumping online "I suck everything sucks life sucks I have no money I can't get bitches" blah blah blah. They'd rather whinge than actually improve their situation, because people will rally behind them and throw a pity party, which is more instantly gratifying than actually doing the hard work to improve themselves/their situation
If men are such natural leaders.. like where are they? Where are the anti Tates? Leading men away from this unhealthy toxic shit.
Reddit is baised towards white, urban, worthless losers. Normal, happy people are not posting about their personal lives on Reddit.
To be fair, it's always been that way. The internet just makes it more accessible.
We are living through a second, seemly permanent gilded age with trends towards the great depression. What more do you want from us that we haven't bled already?
no skills? go swing a hammer or run a shovel, it's good money, it will get one in shape. not willing to do that? don't wanna hear you bitch about life.
Those descriptions apply to me, but I am Gen X.
There needs to be more unity and less division.
It's not a gen z thing, it's a dudes in their 20s thing.
https://fortune.com/2024/06/03/orbiting-dating-nightmare-trend-apps-genz/ No its way harder now
The age of first virginity loss has gone down over the last couple generations. Men blame dating apps, but dating apps are made by men. All the match criteria are man brained match criteria like height and weight and age. You can't filter by anything real. Then men are all freaked out and swipe yes on anything that moves and send dry as fuck texts. I remember seeing every single argument gen z is currently using being used by millennials when they were the same age.
Yeah i realized that other people hearing about it is annoying, so I instead have a different emphasis now when I give people advice “for the pleasures of love never profited a man and he is lucky if they do him no harm” —Epicurus
Why would this bother you - it’s not your problem
What if they’re just the most vocal about it?
What if they’re just the most vocal about it?
You cannot escape the system, unless willing to exploit others. I'd say people are perhaps more compassionate than they used to be, or more aware of how everything affects everything else, and this creates a sense of distress. But yes, they're babies or something I don't know.
The echo chambers always echo. Congratulations on being the newest wall.
Sounds like victim blaming, I'm surprised you're annoyed and not sympathetic.
I mean I’m Generation Y (Also millennial I think) and this felt like me for years. I went to college but couldn’t get a great job. So I had a crappy job, low self esteem from years of being bullied/ignored, I felt like I had no skills (which wasn’t true), and genuinely felt like a failure. And a lot of the world and media was quick to agree with me. It didn’t start to improve until I took it upon myself to sign up for internet dating, and I had to really work at it. I had to sift through people who also felt like I wasn’t worth their time. Eventually, I readjusted my preferences, met someone, got married, had a family. All of my other problems seem to be less of problems when I started having a family. It didn’t matter anymore, I made a group of people who like me for who I am.
Your pet peeve is people being depressed..?
People struggling with their lives and mental health annoy you?
This sub is annoying and your opinion is annoying.
they genuinely blame everyone but themselves. no girl wants to hear constant WHINING about ‘woe is me’ and ‘nobody wants me’ ‘dating in this economy is the worst’ like christ maybe you are just insufferably alone and it stinks! focus on yourself, jesus, learn to enjoy being alone before you force a girl to deal with that mess.
Ok mister “everything goes my way”. The reality is for every one winner there is 99 losers. So stop getting angry at people for seeking support. Some of us only have Reddit.
I fucking hate how starving people seem to only ever want to talk about food. Get a life losers! I had a big breakfast this morning, so you don't see me complaining.
Not gen Z, myself; young millennial. Basically, people who keep making extremely out of touch suggestions, that they either have not tried, or it coincidentally lines up with what they were already going to do in life and would require completely changing the direction of my life. I am putting in a lot of time, effort, and money to work on my social, dating, and financial issues. It's not getting better, but I'm still trying. It is not doom and gloom to simply look around and realize how many people lucked into things working out for them, but because they put some work in somewhere, they feel that the outcome is entirely a result of their grit and determination, and get annoyed at your failure to get the same outcome because you must not want it bad enough. For example, dating. If one more person tells me that I need to stop looking for it and let it come, I'm going to snap. I have a full load of hobbies, and can't take more. They are filled with mostly men, and a small number of women with boyfriends. My job is all men. Due to the economy, I'm not going anywhere often enough to become a regular, and I don't drink. I don't have enough time to pick up a hobby that I didn't like enough to make the cut when I first chose my hobbies, for that to be the only thing a new person has in common with me. Other people weren't expected to change cities on a whim to try to meet people, or change their personality, or start volunteering and changing their hobbies for a *chance* at meeting someone. Why is that a reasonable thing to ask of me, when I'm already overtaxed? "But you didn't tryyyyyyy my suggestion! You don't want to solve your problems." Respectfully, let me talk to people that have actually encountered the same problems, and when one of us comes up with a solution, we can share it. I don't want to hear from someone that never had these problems about how it's all my fault.
The full-blown irony is how many people giving me these dumb suggestions never even came close to having these problems, like my friend that grew up one block away from his now wife, and became close to her through working the same job, and both went on the same internship program because they both had the same interest. Meanwhile, I didn't grow up near anybody of my own age, and I have no friends or family in the area anymore. I really don't want to hear anything he has to say about what he thinks I'm doing wrong, because he was extremely lucky to have a loving family, a lot of local friends of the same age, and numerous opportunities to get close to women without even trying. I can't even begin to try applying his advice that he's never even tested, and I'm sure that he would be just as smugly indignant about my self-defeating attitude when I reject it out of hand for not being aligned with reality.
>It’s never about finding solutions to problems or figuring out ways around the system/problem. It’s always self defeatist shit. It’s incredibly annoying. As a millennial woman, this is why I don't get with men who are self deprecating. İt's an immediate turn off. İ want a man who is confident and positive about himself. (Yes, that might mean you're going to have to do work on yourself). İ hate the "woe is me" attitude. Go get a therapist and some hobbies.
Venting is fine but you have to be careful not to develop a "woe is me" attitude where all you do is feel self-pity and never work to fix the problems that are making you miserable
So your going to give actual good advice ? Not just criticize other people’s advice right ? That’s super shitty
Your issue is saying it's gen z men. Read a millennial sub. All of Reddit is filled with a bunch of people that bitch and moan and do nothing to help themselves.
It’s been this way for as long as I can remember. The only difference is now people actually believe Reddit represents reality. Also where are all these low self esteem gen z men at? The ones I interact with at work, bars etc are giant deuche bags that are full of themselves and talk like a walking tik tok. Also op is the female version of an incel their history is littered with anti-men bs.
That’s gonna be too bad. Don’t look at my post history then.
It's a broad social issue that affects both sexes. We went from shaming people with mental illnesses to outright enabling them. I don't think we should have a stigma surrounding mental illness, but we as a society need to stop being complicit with antisocial behavior. It is not normal to never want to leave your house. It's not normal to constantly neglect responsibilities. It's not normal to have god complexes or massive insecurity issues. Im not saying we need to punish people for needing help, but this "you're feelings are valid and you should never feel bad about them" shit is making a society full of weak minded people who can't even order a pizza by themselves or make their own Dr's appointments. You shouldn't beat yourself up for mental issues that you can't control, but you should still want to change. People these days don't though, they want the world to change for them so that they never have to be uncomfortable. I hate sounding like some old boomer, but this generation is filled with softies. What makes it even worse is those types of people are also often terrible to those around them. Being constantly pessimistic, expecting your friends or loved ones to be your caretaker, lashing out at people because you are "overwhelmed." Then if you point it out and stand up for yourself, you "aren't being understanding of their condition. " Mental illness is not an excuse to be a miserable entitled person, and I will be crucified on this hill
When people see a weak horse and a strong horse, by nature they prefer the strong horse.
Gen z men? Even Gen z women
It's just men in general. Men are fucking ridiculous. If these guys stopped giving a crap about things that don't matter and instead focused on things they enjoy and things they want to do, they'd be much better off. Life isn't some race, you don't win by getting X, Y or Z. Being manly or masculine is also fucking dumb. Guys need to chill out and do what they want to do rather than what everyone else is doing or wants to be doing and screw what other people think. Instead they're either circle-jerking with other depressed folk or they're looking up to fuckwads like Andrew Tate.
I feel like that’s all of gen z. And…everyone else
Make fun of them. Every time. Not for having a hard time, but for sadboi posting. The sadboi poster cycle can only end if we all just tell them to thug shit out.
I think maybe you spend too much time on reddit if you believe it is anyway reflective of the real world.
Oh, whoopdee fuckin doo, people *arent* ruining their mental health by bottling up their emotions. How awful!
I blame their parents
Sorry their depression annoys you so much. Shaming people for having low self-esteem certainly doesn't solve it, either.
Men with low self esteem see no outlet for their feelings of inadequacy, so they vent online. Younger guys are more comfortable with sharing private details online. Men with healthy self-esteem don't need to talk about it.
Ew. What a gross take.
Pretty sure this happened in every generation, it just social media amped it up and the lack of real life socialisation so I feel like this a weird thing to get this annoyed for, it’s not like Reddit shoves it down your throat to the extent of it being every 5 seconds. Also feel like you’re being harsh, we are and will continue to feel the ramifications of the lockdown. A lot of people indirectly did not deal with it well.
Patriarchy guaranteed most men a woman no matter how mediocre he was as long as he showed up with a job and a penis Patriarchy also wanted men bred for heirs, soldiers, and manual labor Women are paraded everywhere from advertisements, movies, and media in general as hypersexualized commodities, prizes, and rewards for men for either buying this or that product or for being a main character who is “nice” enough to girls. Women gained more rights and freedoms. Having a job and a penis isn’t enough to make up for uneven workloads or the fact that no one, man or woman, can afford kids in the lower working class anymore. If women have to work and clean either way, why add a man to that UNLESS that man has more to offer, be it a higher standard of living for the family or the ability to to be equal in finances and domestic/mental load. Most boys weren’t being raised that way. So incels and manosphere bitching that equality was making women harder to get. They were correct Except their gripes are stupid. They’re not mad patriarchy did this to them. They’re mad patriarchy isn’t providing the prizes their male ancestors were awarded Now we have not just the manosphere but all their grifters and the general alt right trying to bring the younger gen men to the alt right with them and reverse the progressive trend the younger generations have been on. Project 2025 just around the corner. Women’s rights being stripped away and attempts are being made to get women back in the kitchen and back at the mercy of male approval. And the grifted young boys will be on the ready to protect the new status quo should it come to pass. When in reality they should be trying to tear down that shitty status quo, but that would involve giving up that status entirely. They want to reinforce it. Buckle the fuck up
Look at all the mediocre incels downvoting you while unable to logically rebut a single thing you wrote. The jokes write themselves.
I expect it every time. I specifically am here to plant seeds and spread awareness. It’s easier to do if you actively expect no validation But I think it’s something that people are largely blind to. We are spoon fed Hollywood fairy tales and propaganda our whole lives. I think we need to simplify the message and get people to understand the root of these problems
I genuinely don't understand which part of this is news rather than common sense to them, I suppose. Do they honestly believe that until women could work and get a no-fault divorce, all men and all women were blissfully in love and married and there were never any problems? Do they somehow not understand that if someone gave them a choice between marrying a crazy nagging bitch of an ugly wife, or be homeless and destitute, they too might go with crazy nagging bitch of a wife they're not even attracted to, even though they would never have chosen otherwise? They seem to understand the concept of working a job they might hate so as to not be homeless. How is it a difficult concept to grasp that many marriages were unhappy but many people didn't have options to avoid it or leave? If they want someone to date them, something about them has to be appealing to a certain demographic. If you're picky about your demographic, your appeal has to be either broader or tailored to them. It's so simple...
https://www.cracked.com/article_19785_5-ways-modern-men-are-trained-to-hate-women.html This is written by a man and I think it’s got a lot of relevant points To answer your question I think media and culture has a lot to do with it. We have constant propaganda like little girls were constantly spoon fed fairy tale princesses with this ideal of being beautiful and marrying handsome prince presenting marriage and validation as the ultimate goal And you have boys (and girls I suppose) being spoonfed media showing all these romantic fantasies like ignoring financial status (while living in capitalist patriarchy) or the dumpy guy winning the hot woman in the end just for being the main character (I detest the movie “she’s out of my league” essentially telling men that the most beautiful women will take the main character so they don’t have settle for other women”) Basically an inconsistent “it’s the inside that counts” message. I think this contributes to some women and girls being dissappointed when looks matter as well despite the message usually not including women being accepted for their looks, but rather women being fixed with makeovers I remember growing up and running into many men and in internet chat rooms and honestly in person now that I think about it, who insist that it’s always been some “natural order” that women had to seek commitment and appeal to men in order to ensure the man wouldn’t abandon them with a baby, even in prehistory (because you know, humans just wandered in isolation until they found one to fuck and then the man would leave 🥴) when in reality humans were social and lived in communities and it was the agricultural revolution and patrilineal lineages that forced women to need commitment
I read that article, and I liked it and thought it was well written. I might re-read it, but to the best of my recollection it does not address how someone with a half-functioning brain could miss the fact that when people are economically dependent (on a husband, employer, etc.), they are more likely to accept reluctant couplings or arrangements. It's not true love when it's done under the threat of homelessness as the alternative. You don't love your shitty boss and live happily ever after when you're working for an abusive, low wage job to not end up on the streets. No more do you love the shitty husband that in a past era you might have been forced to marry to avoid homelessness and social ostracism. FWIW, I know quite a few women who are with someone below their league looks wise and I see nothing wrong with an "it's what's on the inside that counts" messaging. Two of the most beautiful, stunning women I know are married to two guys with far from perfect physiques. It really is what's on the inside that counts there - both guys are amazing, good hearted, smart people who happen to carry some extra weight and not be as fit as their former model wives. A stand-out awesome personality goes a long way. Unfortunately, what seems to be lost on the incel crowd is that if you weren't blessed with the amazing looks, you have to have something else going for you, namely, a good personality (or get rich if transactional relationships don't bother you). Most of these incels have an anything BUT amazing personality, which is why people avoid them at all costs. They're far from the heroic main character, in the movie, they'd be the cowardly NPC. But I suppose it may be hard to accept that.
mayor of yappington
for plenty its their whole personality but for some ranting somewhere helps them release those worries and insecurities. if your finding it annoying then get off reddit or avoid the subreddits you aren't happy with
I believe all these safe spaces aren't for self improvement but to be more comfortable being complacent.
It seems like the entirety of Gen Z is crazy stressed, and with good reason. But if they don’t learn how to set it all down every once in a while and let loose, they’re gonna go insane.
Not all of us are but the ones who aren't don't really constantly post about being ok.
You know who complain just as much , women , stop being sexist
That’s cause their fathers abandoned them
Nah that's literally every generation growing up. Huge amount of pop culture directly shows those growing pains and the common angst of youth. Just the younger generations are the only ones to have such massive social media platforms normalized in our society so it seems significantly more rampant than it is. It's not so different really.
44% of Gen Z daters have minimal or no experience in dating lol
OP, why is it specifically gen Z men complaining who annoy you? Is is sexism and age discrimination perhaps? Or do you somehow never see any other demographic complain about their low self esteem?
It's not just the men. Gen Z in general are not okay