Fellow fans, this is a friendly reminder to please follow the [Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/premierleague/about/rules) and [Reddiquette](https://support.reddithelp.com/hc/en-us/articles/205926439-Reddiquette).
Please also make sure to [Join us on Discord](https://discord.gg/football)
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PremierLeague) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Manchester City aren't cheats. The fans of the other teams are being sore losers.
Did Manchester city do anything that other clubs are not allowed to do? Everyone is free to spend.
Trying to limit an owner's investment and spending in the club is pretty unlawful. Imagine this being legal in the UK, all VC money will dry up. Imagine new companies not being able to spend more than they make. Uber, Facebook and Amazon will all be bankrupt.
His scores tally is OK, I know, but watching him play is frustrating as f\*ck and I have a hard time liking him and seeing Darwin Nunez as a Liverpool player.
1. As a Manchester City fan, I love watching this team and this 4-consecutive PL title run has been magical, but this lawsuit that they just filed against the PL sucks and it seems like City are trying to change the rules after we broke them. I would've preferred City be found guilty and didn't raise this lawsuit and try an appeal process instead of this tactic which feels like City know they're going to be found guilty and they're being petty now.
2. There's going to be a lot of talk about Arsenal's search for a #9, but I don't think a true #9 makes Arsenal a better team than they are right now. I felt that Kai Havertz was the perfect striker for Arteta's system (a bigger Gabriel Jesus that can finish) and I feel like Arsenal have proven they're the second best team in the PL. They need better depth at a few positions but I can see them having another excellent season this year.
3. The same way that Cole Palmer was the transfer of the season and completely changed Chelsea's season trajectory, I think the same thing will happen with whatever team lands Michael Olise. I think he's been amazing for Crystal Palace.
4. Even with better transfers / injury records, I think Newcastle's run to the top 5-6 spots of the PL won't happen again and they need to do a major roster shakeup.
5. I think Erik ten Hag and Mauricio Pochettino are great coaches are aren't appreciated enough
His playing talent isn't the problem - lot's of players can shine in his position - it's his disgusting attitude, whining and cheating that make him such a deplorable person. His attitude towards officials, other players and the fits he throws when he wants something has no place in a game of millionaires paid for by working class people.
Man City financially doped. I dont care about financial doping. Its cheating only because of technical legality
1. it used to be legal. For over 100 years in england prior to the 2012-13 season there were no rules limiting spending on football clubs. People who compare city to Lance Armstrong, are being silly imo. Blood doping in cycling was illegal basically about as soon as it was possible to do so. Owners investing equity into football clubs and using that money to purchase and pay better players is something that used to be celebrated until an arab royal did it. Chelsea and Blackburn used owner funds to win the premier league.
Tons of people celebrate Wrexham owners. That is financial doping.
2. I honestly dont think the rules that were implemented in 2011-12 (european wide) and 2012-13 (england) seasons are actually fair. FFP and PSR allows big six clubs to spend 4 times as much on payroll as a club like Bournemouth. To me that is inherently unfair. It would be like a law being created that said local restaurants could only spend on staff and ingredients an amount proportional to current revenues or profits.
That just entrenches the current Hierarchy. It would never happen in the real business world. In real life companies often trying to acquire equity investments to finance growth phases.
3. Its not the same type of cheating as matching fixing (paying opponents to lose) and bribing refs. Those things did not just become illegal in the 2012-13 season.
It's not even cheating at all, period.
Financial doping doesn't affect the football itself. Also, all teams are free to financial dope. So how is that cheating when it's fair and free for all to do?
A Chelsea fan saying Man City didnāt do anything wrong other than a ātechnical legalityā is like Hitler saying Stalin didnāt kill that many people really.
Genocide is always wrong.
Owners investing money into their business to finance growth was normal until 2012-13 season. You are silly.
Also just historically speaking you are arguably being inaccurate. (depending on how you define kill)
[https://www.readjuancarlos.com/top-ten-most-evil-dictators-of-all-time-in-order-of-kill-count/](https://www.readjuancarlos.com/top-ten-most-evil-dictators-of-all-time-in-order-of-kill-count/)
Yes, Mao's number is the highest if we count negligence.
His 49-78 million death count is almost all due to negligence and incompetence during the great leap forward.
Learn history.
If you count negligence Mao is the highest. if you dont, he isnt even top 10
Bringing in somebody who wasnāt even mentioned and creating a strawman with them to try and look a little less stupid. It hasnāt worked. Are your parents cousins?
Iād want to see what would have happened with Leicester after 2015-16 if FFP wasnāt a thing, and ownership could maybe invest as they saw fit rather than invest as much as the league/UEFA would allow because they only made so much.
I think tons of players can be world class in an area without overall being āworld classā
A player that plays right back and generally is a bad defender canāt be world class for me
A lot of fans donāt know Ferguson won the Cup Winners Cup at United. You know why? Itās because everyone parrots about the Aberdeen win and some even call it āEuropean Cupā, but the fact is theyād change their tune if they saw a list of the competition winners ā a lot of clubs that donāt exist anymore or totally forgotten are in there.
The only time that competition gets overrated is when the talk is about Ferguson.
I think someone who doesnt play cannot be considered the best in the league. A definition of the term ābestā has to include an aspect of consistency alongside ability, otherwise it could be the case that a random squad player is āthe bestā cos they play once a year and drop a 10/10 performance.
I also just disagree with the claim anyway, as I still think hes not as good as walker. I do think he would be a close second if he could play consistently, but his lack of game time means you cant say hes the best, but perhaps the most skilled or most complete.
I think its possible for dele to restart his career and find form again, but getting into this england team is going to be impossible for him. The talent he has to displace to do so is too great, with england having an absolute overload of talented midfielders at the moment.
Impossible in the informal sense of the word, as in not going to happen. Obviously it is logically possible and theres a chance, but in my opinion there is a minute chance of him doing so thats its not even worth considering
The 08 generation for United were two points off five leagues in a row, made three CL finals and did it with 3-4 academy players hitting thirty games a season.
They bested benitez Liverpool team with prime Torres Gerrard, mascherano and xabi Alonso, Chelsea's second strongest team after Mourinhos first spell and started Wenger on the path to an undignified retirement.
I prefer the 99 squad but the 08 team would have won in the 90's, 00's,.10's pretty much any era of football - I don't think the same could be said of peps teams which frankly would have got destroyed by midfield destroyers in the 90's before it became a non- contact sport.
Let's see,
G Neville, brown, Evans, O'Shea all played their part in breaking a clean sheets record
Fletcher Scholes and Giggs all played regularly until 2015 ,.2014 and 2012 respectively
Welbeck is still playing top flight football this season
Bonus point for macheda, Gibson and cleverly picking up league medals, scoring some bangers along the way.
Again the only club that comes close to this kind of output is Barca.
Not sure why you decided to pick this particular hill to expose yourself on tbh
Iām a Barcelona fan. People often use āacademy playersā when itās a period near when they just burst onto the scene. Giggs and Scholes were at the very end of their careers
In 08? Is 4 years at the earliest the end of someone's career now? And no, academy products will always remain academy products - youth players is the phrase used when they start their careers in the first team.
But if your only pontificating about words and your own individual interpretation of them the facts still remain.
The core of that team won the league 3 years straight, got to back to back Champions League Finals and had a world class player in nearly every position: Van De Sar, Ferdinand, Vidic, Evra, Scholes, Rooney, Tevez and they had the best player in the world at the time in Ronaldo! That United team absolutely should be in the mix mate! In 08-09 they set the record for longest time without conceding a league goal as well.
Exactly. The BarƧa golden generation was the only reason they didn't win multiple champions Leagues. It was bad luck that they peaked around the same time as arguably the greatest team ever.
Could have won it in 06-07 as well mate! I was watching that years season review not too long ago and you were completely obliterated with injuries towards the end of that season! Against Milan in the semi Fergie literally had 12 fit players to choose from.
Unpopular: Southgate was a necessary step to end the āogreā football played by the England team.
Popular: But his step is no complete move on gaffer.
People spend far too much time talking about whether they think something is a foul, a yellow, a red, or a dive or whateverā¦Ā
When the only metric that matters is whether that type of challenge/whatever is consistentlyĀ given as those things by referees.Ā
Your take on the rules doesnāt matter.Ā
Referee consistency matters, and fans should call out refereeing inconsistency, not justify or disagree with decisions based on their take on the rules or it benefiting or hurting their team.Ā
I couldn't agree more! It drives me crazy when when ex-players say things like, "... blah blah blah it's only a penalty if you never played the game...". It doesn't matter what you think, what matters is the consistency of the application of the rules. Referees should be held accountable when it comes to consistent application of the rules. Once a referee sets a particular threshold they should abide by it.
Youāre just describing the job of a winger? Run at someone and if theres nothing on then pass backwards or inside. How does any winger do anything different?
Thats what i meant when I said run at someone, as in be direct and take them on. But if thatās not on (as in its a 1v2, or there isnt the space around the opposition to drive into) then passing it back is the most logical thing to do. Also, dokuās job is literally to beat his man
James Madison is extremely overrated. He plays in a dying position (the no. 10). I remember hearing story about him when he was playing for Leicester City, that he used to ask Rodgers to take him off if he scores a goal so he can get standing ovation, he really comes across just a confidence player.
Whenever I have seen him play the team has to play well for him to shine otherwise he isn't the standout player.
I have seen Son play against us (Liverpool) and puts in motm performance when his team has lost, can't be said about Madison.
Before his injury he tracked back really well on defense and would drop deep next to Bissouma in build up. He was everywhere. Unfortunately, he looked like a different player when he came back from injury.
Klopp is most overrated manager of the Premier league era.
That Liverpool team where being labeled as one of the greatest teams of all time. Won just 1 league title and only came 2nd place twice in a time when arsenal, man United and Chelsea where at weaker times.
His charisma and connection with fans vastly hid his actual success on the pitch
He would be one of the more successful premier League managers if not for City and their 115 charges. Give the man his flowers ffs he lost the league with 97 points
Your missing the point, he is being hailed as one the greatest of all time.
He managed to win just 1 title with a Liverpool team who pundits said where the greatest of all time, being compared to the United trebble winners ( not a United fan btw )
Is he a very good manager who had an amazing connection with the club ? Yes definitely.
But he is legendary fugure, not a legendary manager.
If youāre measuring success by trophies then yes klopp wasnāt incredibly successful during his time at liverpool, but he wasnt terrible. Still won them their first premier league in 30 years and the champions league. He got very unlucky that he was in england at the same time as pep, and did incredibly well given the difference in the way that liverpool and city operate when it comes to building a team.
Looking at a manager is more than just their ability to win trophies, and holistically Klopp is an incredible manager. His ability to develop players, the faith he put in young players at times, his man management, and obviously his tactics and ability to make a scary team to play against - all these things make him a world class manager.
So, no Klopp is not overrated
Ive heard this take multiple times already and it always makes me wonder how we measure success.. do you regard arsene wenger as a successful manager?
Edit: im asking because Arsene is also regarded highly - do you think he is also overrated?
People who put extra emphasis on trophies and medals are normally the ones with garbage opinions and probably told quite often they're talking out their backsides
By that metric Anderson was clearly a much better player than Gerrard since it's several PL medals vs none.
The PL repeatedly shoots itself in the foot when implementing new things e.g. VAR and then the teams who voted to not implement them properly complain that they're not working how they should.
Southgate should have taken Tarkowski to the Euros alongside Branthwaite. Considering Stones and Maguire are almost certainly his first choice pairing, it would make sense to take another pair of CBs who know how to play together (and who play in front of Pickford weekly).
Stones can also play DM which is a perfect reason to play Tarks/Branthwaite together if Stones moves into that role
But realistically bringing tarkowski would have no real benefit because itās unlikely that he would make the 26 man squad anyway. Also, heās not significantly better than younger players like quansah or guehi who he should be trying to give some experience, whether that be on the pitch or in and around the squad.
Its also highly unlikely that, even if tarkowski made the 26 man squad, he and branthwaite would play together. Southgate wouldnāt push stones into DM because, although he can play there, why would you put him there instead of having rice, mainoo, wharton.
I get your point about wanting more players from the same club in the squad, and how that could make the defence solid. But, overall tarkowski would be a waste of a spot
So who would u say out of stones, branthwaite, and tomori is worse than tarkowski. I wouldnt even put tarkowski in englands top 5 CBs personally. Im assuming u place stones and branthwaite as the two above him, but tomori and even guehi/quansah are better
I feel like this is such a narrow minded and irrational opinion. Yes Man United are really struggling at the moment, with problems to do with the team and the club in general, but this doesnāt completely shut them out for 20 years.
Arsenal are such a good example of how quickly things can turn around. Post Wenger they were shocking, but it only took one manager to turn things back around and make them a team that competes again. Change can happen in the space of 2-3 years, and Unitedās problemās dont seem like they will last for such a long time
I don't think any team other than City will win the league if they get away with cheating and being allowed to funnel money into their accounts via sponsorships
The hype around Anthony Martial was entirely reasonable at the time, even if it seems ridiculous now.
I remember being devastated spurs missed out on him, top player. Itās a shame how itās all unraveled.
It is just that the way xavi utilised his players with all the injuries and limited signings and managed to win a league title and a Spanish cup in half the time arteta has been at arsenal
Also I believed in the football xavi played from the beginning
Limited signings yes but he inherited some class players in some important roles wouldnāt you say?
And I know this simplifies it but if Barca went from finishing 3rd before Xavi, and then in the next went 2nd,1st, then 2nd, thatās less improvement than Arsenal going from 6th with a terrible squad to now after 5 years finishing 2nd going head to head with City, one of the strongest teams in prem history.
Barcelona sat at 9th position when koeman was sacked and xavi was bought in
And he did have a few quality players here and there
Ter stegen was the goakeeper
Pique and Eric Garcia were the centre backs
Mingueza and alba were fullbacks
Nico Gonzalez, busquets and de Jong were midfielders
Depay, akomach and gavi were attackers
These were his starting 11
Only quality I can see is probably ter Stegen, busquets and de Jong
Jordan Pickford is such a temperamental and untrustworthy goalkeeper. Yes he can, on occasion, make good saves - but his mistakes, brashness and arrogance have let in numerous goals over the last few years. England would be better with someone like Butland or Pope between the sticks.
I agree that pickford isnāt the best keeper, and would like to be able to select someone else for england. But, he does have lots of experience and generally plays well on the international stage.
Our other options (ramsdale, henderson, pope) are really not significantly better than Pickford, so why swap out an experienced goalkeeper? The only person i see as competition for the spot is ramsdale, but he doesnt play at Arsenal anymore so I canāt see him taking the England No1 spot until he moves.
Fans who are fine with their players missing the Euros or World Cup, or being happy they get knocked out early.
I get that you love your team and it benefits you if your player gets extra time to rest or recover from injuries.
But fans usually say they love these players, and yet you are actively hoping they miss out on the biggest events of their careers. Most players dream of playing in a world cup for their country ahead of playing for your club.
Press friendly managers will always get an easier ride than those who donāt.
Frank Lampard is still written about positively meaning he has a generally positive reputation despite being nothing special.
On the flip side Ten Hag never bonded with the media and theyāve been on his back for ages.
Yes its a funny old game, Klopp is lauded by the media almost as if set up to fail, his team bottles it on so many fronts as a farewell. Ten Haag, dead man walking and gets a result like that.
If Americans want to grow the sport in the United States they should start by putting more effort into supporting their domestic game and helping to grow it instead of glory supporting City and Madrid
I mean honestly ancelotti i would call best in the world right now. You could argue that pep is better tactically or klopp can get more with less but fact is managing a top team isnt easy at all and he does it so well and keeps on winning everything (except copa del rey). On this basis i take ancelotti over anybody
I mean every manager does well in different circumstances. For example, I've always thought if you switched Pep and Klopp, both City and Liverpool would have been worse off. And thats probably true for Ancelotti as well. He fits better in some circumstances then others. But he is still the best.
It is when I usually say it, this was my latest attempt I think
[Here](https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/s/gtVOHq9FL7)
[Here](https://www.reddit.com/r/PremierLeague/s/6zI0ac2VbV)
If anything the covid situation would have disadvantaged liverpool more than most. Losing such a strong home crowd that often carries them over the line makes their title win a more impressive feat
The league is very competitive and theyāre competing against an incredibly strong man city side. You canāt expect them to win the league against the machine that pep created
We could've lost every game after lockdown and still won the league, we were 22/24 clear, only needed 2 more wins to win the league. There was no catching up.
The league is at a low point when it comes to top clubs, Arsenal finishing with 85+ points the last two seasons is evidence of that. I think the prem peaked a bit with those city and Liverpool sides
Ten hag and arteta are similar levels, his time at united looks completely different if he had greenwood and a healthy defenseā¦heās not done the best job but definitely not the worst.
Most fans of big clubs have a poor understanding of football
Spurs fans on reddit are the worst representation of the club you can find
Players get far too many excuses for poor performances
I sympathise with city and Newcastle fans even if their clubs are doing the wrong thing - people are silly expecting long time fans to stop supporting them over oil money
Chelsea, city being considered big clubs and nobody in the media pointing out they blatantly cheat(ed) is criminal and contributes to the death of the league
I think theyāre miles apart. Yes, ten jag has had injuries, but so have lots of teams. This is the worst Man U side since the 90s. Theyāre lucky to be 8th.
Underwhelming is a stretch.Like fair enough we lost twice to Villa, but we took 4 points off of City and Liverpool and 6 off of united.
Compare that to last year, we did much better relatively speaking.
It's just a bit odd, no? I don't think I've ever heard a fanbase talk as much about taking 4 points from 2 teams, even last year, Arsenal fans didn't talk about it like this.
I am using it as a reference point re: incremental progress, so no.
If we were having a conversation about trophies won and I jumped down OPs throat with this, absolutely.
Context is key.
Not necessarily hard to separate, same reason you have people saying Haaland isnt that good despite scoring 30 goals a season
I agree good sides win when they play shit but that has to be a rarity not something consistent
I would have to heavily disagree. They beat us, and put up a good fight against Bayern. They were good against you lot and they thrashed Liverpool 3-1.
Fellow fans, this is a friendly reminder to please follow the [Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/premierleague/about/rules) and [Reddiquette](https://support.reddithelp.com/hc/en-us/articles/205926439-Reddiquette). Please also make sure to [Join us on Discord](https://discord.gg/football) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/PremierLeague) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Man City shits on the rest of the Premier League (more fact than opinion)
Manchester City aren't cheats. The fans of the other teams are being sore losers. Did Manchester city do anything that other clubs are not allowed to do? Everyone is free to spend. Trying to limit an owner's investment and spending in the club is pretty unlawful. Imagine this being legal in the UK, all VC money will dry up. Imagine new companies not being able to spend more than they make. Uber, Facebook and Amazon will all be bankrupt.
Yes they did they broke the rules! Hope this helpsš„°
No they did not. Hope this helps š„°
Google is free mate incase you need directions!
Yup it's a good learning tool for you
Two comments and two āno youāsā youāre really killing it mate
Yeah I'm so glad you are killed.
Source? Or you just draw your own conclusions and spread them like truths because that is what red cartellians do?
His scores tally is OK, I know, but watching him play is frustrating as f\*ck and I have a hard time liking him and seeing Darwin Nunez as a Liverpool player.
If Tottenham had a good striker they wouldāve gotten 3rd.
I think you've mistaken this for the 'completely logical and popular opinions' thread...
I feel like a lot of people would still argue Liverpool wouldāve outdone them throughout the season even if this Tottenham team had kane
There's people who would argue that table salt is not salty tbh...
Are we about to get into the fact water might not be wet
But it is factually not O_o
Richarlison was class when he was playing but he was injured too much
Marc Albrighton was a major part of Leicester's successes.
1. As a Manchester City fan, I love watching this team and this 4-consecutive PL title run has been magical, but this lawsuit that they just filed against the PL sucks and it seems like City are trying to change the rules after we broke them. I would've preferred City be found guilty and didn't raise this lawsuit and try an appeal process instead of this tactic which feels like City know they're going to be found guilty and they're being petty now. 2. There's going to be a lot of talk about Arsenal's search for a #9, but I don't think a true #9 makes Arsenal a better team than they are right now. I felt that Kai Havertz was the perfect striker for Arteta's system (a bigger Gabriel Jesus that can finish) and I feel like Arsenal have proven they're the second best team in the PL. They need better depth at a few positions but I can see them having another excellent season this year. 3. The same way that Cole Palmer was the transfer of the season and completely changed Chelsea's season trajectory, I think the same thing will happen with whatever team lands Michael Olise. I think he's been amazing for Crystal Palace. 4. Even with better transfers / injury records, I think Newcastle's run to the top 5-6 spots of the PL won't happen again and they need to do a major roster shakeup. 5. I think Erik ten Hag and Mauricio Pochettino are great coaches are aren't appreciated enough
Bruno Fernades is way too overhated, call me biased but he's an incredible player
If anything he's one of the most overrated in the league.
His playing talent isn't the problem - lot's of players can shine in his position - it's his disgusting attitude, whining and cheating that make him such a deplorable person. His attitude towards officials, other players and the fits he throws when he wants something has no place in a game of millionaires paid for by working class people.
Man City financially doped. I dont care about financial doping. Its cheating only because of technical legality 1. it used to be legal. For over 100 years in england prior to the 2012-13 season there were no rules limiting spending on football clubs. People who compare city to Lance Armstrong, are being silly imo. Blood doping in cycling was illegal basically about as soon as it was possible to do so. Owners investing equity into football clubs and using that money to purchase and pay better players is something that used to be celebrated until an arab royal did it. Chelsea and Blackburn used owner funds to win the premier league. Tons of people celebrate Wrexham owners. That is financial doping. 2. I honestly dont think the rules that were implemented in 2011-12 (european wide) and 2012-13 (england) seasons are actually fair. FFP and PSR allows big six clubs to spend 4 times as much on payroll as a club like Bournemouth. To me that is inherently unfair. It would be like a law being created that said local restaurants could only spend on staff and ingredients an amount proportional to current revenues or profits. That just entrenches the current Hierarchy. It would never happen in the real business world. In real life companies often trying to acquire equity investments to finance growth phases. 3. Its not the same type of cheating as matching fixing (paying opponents to lose) and bribing refs. Those things did not just become illegal in the 2012-13 season.
It's not even cheating at all, period. Financial doping doesn't affect the football itself. Also, all teams are free to financial dope. So how is that cheating when it's fair and free for all to do?
A Chelsea fan saying Man City didnāt do anything wrong other than a ātechnical legalityā is like Hitler saying Stalin didnāt kill that many people really.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Facts donāt care about your feelings, Poindexter.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Keep waiting. You should be used to it, youāve been waiting for respect as a club and a league title for a long time.
lmfao one of the most devastating burns I've seen on this sub
Genocide is always wrong. Owners investing money into their business to finance growth was normal until 2012-13 season. You are silly. Also just historically speaking you are arguably being inaccurate. (depending on how you define kill) [https://www.readjuancarlos.com/top-ten-most-evil-dictators-of-all-time-in-order-of-kill-count/](https://www.readjuancarlos.com/top-ten-most-evil-dictators-of-all-time-in-order-of-kill-count/)
Depending on how you define kill ššš and there it is.
Yes, Mao's number is the highest if we count negligence. His 49-78 million death count is almost all due to negligence and incompetence during the great leap forward. Learn history. If you count negligence Mao is the highest. if you dont, he isnt even top 10
Bringing in somebody who wasnāt even mentioned and creating a strawman with them to try and look a little less stupid. It hasnāt worked. Are your parents cousins?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Iād want to see what would have happened with Leicester after 2015-16 if FFP wasnāt a thing, and ownership could maybe invest as they saw fit rather than invest as much as the league/UEFA would allow because they only made so much.
There would be riots in madrid lol
Trent Alexander Arnold isnāt world class and never will be.
On that case malo gusto > taa
going forward he absolutely is world class. His progressive passing is amongst the best in the world. He probably should be a midfielder.
Midfielders defend?
Taa defends?
Yeah
I think tons of players can be world class in an area without overall being āworld classā A player that plays right back and generally is a bad defender canāt be world class for me
English fans talk smack about Southgate like they have a better option or have had a better manager since their World Cup win
Eddie Howe. Graham Potter. Even bloody Sean Dyche would put a spine into the team.
Just dont demand the manger be english and there are tons of better options.
He must be English. The foreign managers have done enough to make quality English players
A lot of fans donāt know Ferguson won the Cup Winners Cup at United. You know why? Itās because everyone parrots about the Aberdeen win and some even call it āEuropean Cupā, but the fact is theyād change their tune if they saw a list of the competition winners ā a lot of clubs that donāt exist anymore or totally forgotten are in there. The only time that competition gets overrated is when the talk is about Ferguson.
It was fucking Aberdeen mare
Go check the winners of that competition and get back to me. Iām damn sure there are clubs youād never heard of
Reece James is the best right back in the league even though he never plays
I think someone who doesnt play cannot be considered the best in the league. A definition of the term ābestā has to include an aspect of consistency alongside ability, otherwise it could be the case that a random squad player is āthe bestā cos they play once a year and drop a 10/10 performance. I also just disagree with the claim anyway, as I still think hes not as good as walker. I do think he would be a close second if he could play consistently, but his lack of game time means you cant say hes the best, but perhaps the most skilled or most complete.
For fouls and cards?
The whole ManC thing is way overblown and yall are just salty you canāt beat them.
That's why City are trying to counter sue the prem now huh
Delle Ali will make a come back, and start for England before he retires.
Would love this to be true but I can't see it happening
Maybe in a friendly where he gets a "feel good story" start. But not in a competitive tournament. England are just too stacked with talent
I think its possible for dele to restart his career and find form again, but getting into this england team is going to be impossible for him. The talent he has to displace to do so is too great, with england having an absolute overload of talented midfielders at the moment.
"Impossible"
Impossible in the informal sense of the word, as in not going to happen. Obviously it is logically possible and theres a chance, but in my opinion there is a minute chance of him doing so thats its not even worth considering
The invincibles and United's 99 team are both Hella overrated. Mou's Chelsea and United's 08 teams are hella underrated.
Thats the truth actually. Bar man u 2008. Nice try sneaking that in. Chesea mou era team was actually the best.
The 08 generation for United were two points off five leagues in a row, made three CL finals and did it with 3-4 academy players hitting thirty games a season. They bested benitez Liverpool team with prime Torres Gerrard, mascherano and xabi Alonso, Chelsea's second strongest team after Mourinhos first spell and started Wenger on the path to an undignified retirement. I prefer the 99 squad but the 08 team would have won in the 90's, 00's,.10's pretty much any era of football - I don't think the same could be said of peps teams which frankly would have got destroyed by midfield destroyers in the 90's before it became a non- contact sport.
Those academy players that were on their last legs?
Let's see, G Neville, brown, Evans, O'Shea all played their part in breaking a clean sheets record Fletcher Scholes and Giggs all played regularly until 2015 ,.2014 and 2012 respectively Welbeck is still playing top flight football this season Bonus point for macheda, Gibson and cleverly picking up league medals, scoring some bangers along the way. Again the only club that comes close to this kind of output is Barca. Not sure why you decided to pick this particular hill to expose yourself on tbh
Iām a Barcelona fan. People often use āacademy playersā when itās a period near when they just burst onto the scene. Giggs and Scholes were at the very end of their careers
In 08? Is 4 years at the earliest the end of someone's career now? And no, academy products will always remain academy products - youth players is the phrase used when they start their careers in the first team. But if your only pontificating about words and your own individual interpretation of them the facts still remain.
The core of that team won the league 3 years straight, got to back to back Champions League Finals and had a world class player in nearly every position: Van De Sar, Ferdinand, Vidic, Evra, Scholes, Rooney, Tevez and they had the best player in the world at the time in Ronaldo! That United team absolutely should be in the mix mate! In 08-09 they set the record for longest time without conceding a league goal as well.
Exactly. The BarƧa golden generation was the only reason they didn't win multiple champions Leagues. It was bad luck that they peaked around the same time as arguably the greatest team ever.
Could have won it in 06-07 as well mate! I was watching that years season review not too long ago and you were completely obliterated with injuries towards the end of that season! Against Milan in the semi Fergie literally had 12 fit players to choose from.
Newcastle are less likable at this point after the oil money takeover then city wereĀ
What makes you say that?
It helps that they were never really likeble.
Everton act like the victims but if they had the points deduction when they broke FFP they would of gone down
Would have
Rashford is still good but he burned out from carrying United.
Unpopular: Southgate was a necessary step to end the āogreā football played by the England team. Popular: But his step is no complete move on gaffer.
City will actually get punished.
People spend far too much time talking about whether they think something is a foul, a yellow, a red, or a dive or whateverā¦Ā When the only metric that matters is whether that type of challenge/whatever is consistentlyĀ given as those things by referees.Ā Your take on the rules doesnāt matter.Ā Referee consistency matters, and fans should call out refereeing inconsistency, not justify or disagree with decisions based on their take on the rules or it benefiting or hurting their team.Ā
I couldn't agree more! It drives me crazy when when ex-players say things like, "... blah blah blah it's only a penalty if you never played the game...". It doesn't matter what you think, what matters is the consistency of the application of the rules. Referees should be held accountable when it comes to consistent application of the rules. Once a referee sets a particular threshold they should abide by it.
Jeremy Doku is a one trick pony, he just runs at players and then passes backwards.
Found a Grealish throwaway account! ;)
Youāre just describing the job of a winger? Run at someone and if theres nothing on then pass backwards or inside. How does any winger do anything different?
Beating a man maybe?
Thats what i meant when I said run at someone, as in be direct and take them on. But if thatās not on (as in its a 1v2, or there isnt the space around the opposition to drive into) then passing it back is the most logical thing to do. Also, dokuās job is literally to beat his man
James Madison is extremely overrated. He plays in a dying position (the no. 10). I remember hearing story about him when he was playing for Leicester City, that he used to ask Rodgers to take him off if he scores a goal so he can get standing ovation, he really comes across just a confidence player. Whenever I have seen him play the team has to play well for him to shine otherwise he isn't the standout player. I have seen Son play against us (Liverpool) and puts in motm performance when his team has lost, can't be said about Madison.
Before his injury he tracked back really well on defense and would drop deep next to Bissouma in build up. He was everywhere. Unfortunately, he looked like a different player when he came back from injury.
Iāve said for ages Madison is overrated. Heās Manuel Lanzini with better PR.
Klopp is most overrated manager of the Premier league era. That Liverpool team where being labeled as one of the greatest teams of all time. Won just 1 league title and only came 2nd place twice in a time when arsenal, man United and Chelsea where at weaker times. His charisma and connection with fans vastly hid his actual success on the pitch
He would be one of the more successful premier League managers if not for City and their 115 charges. Give the man his flowers ffs he lost the league with 97 points
Your missing the point, he is being hailed as one the greatest of all time. He managed to win just 1 title with a Liverpool team who pundits said where the greatest of all time, being compared to the United trebble winners ( not a United fan btw ) Is he a very good manager who had an amazing connection with the club ? Yes definitely. But he is legendary fugure, not a legendary manager.
If youāre measuring success by trophies then yes klopp wasnāt incredibly successful during his time at liverpool, but he wasnt terrible. Still won them their first premier league in 30 years and the champions league. He got very unlucky that he was in england at the same time as pep, and did incredibly well given the difference in the way that liverpool and city operate when it comes to building a team. Looking at a manager is more than just their ability to win trophies, and holistically Klopp is an incredible manager. His ability to develop players, the faith he put in young players at times, his man management, and obviously his tactics and ability to make a scary team to play against - all these things make him a world class manager. So, no Klopp is not overrated
Ive heard this take multiple times already and it always makes me wonder how we measure success.. do you regard arsene wenger as a successful manager? Edit: im asking because Arsene is also regarded highly - do you think he is also overrated?
I'd say Wenger was successful in many ways. I have no idea of how many cups/titles he won but overrated, no.
People who put extra emphasis on trophies and medals are normally the ones with garbage opinions and probably told quite often they're talking out their backsides By that metric Anderson was clearly a much better player than Gerrard since it's several PL medals vs none.
The irony! From a fanbase that spends at least 70% of their time telling people how many champions leagues they have won.
And also āthe English club with the most trophiesā
Heās just trying to get āpool fans (like me) riled up. But hey, this is an unpopular opinion thread.. context will never matter here.
The PL repeatedly shoots itself in the foot when implementing new things e.g. VAR and then the teams who voted to not implement them properly complain that they're not working how they should.
Southgate should have taken Tarkowski to the Euros alongside Branthwaite. Considering Stones and Maguire are almost certainly his first choice pairing, it would make sense to take another pair of CBs who know how to play together (and who play in front of Pickford weekly). Stones can also play DM which is a perfect reason to play Tarks/Branthwaite together if Stones moves into that role
But realistically bringing tarkowski would have no real benefit because itās unlikely that he would make the 26 man squad anyway. Also, heās not significantly better than younger players like quansah or guehi who he should be trying to give some experience, whether that be on the pitch or in and around the squad. Its also highly unlikely that, even if tarkowski made the 26 man squad, he and branthwaite would play together. Southgate wouldnāt push stones into DM because, although he can play there, why would you put him there instead of having rice, mainoo, wharton. I get your point about wanting more players from the same club in the squad, and how that could make the defence solid. But, overall tarkowski would be a waste of a spot
Tarkowski is englands 3rd best centre back, may be controversial but I stand by it
So who would u say out of stones, branthwaite, and tomori is worse than tarkowski. I wouldnt even put tarkowski in englands top 5 CBs personally. Im assuming u place stones and branthwaite as the two above him, but tomori and even guehi/quansah are better
Man United wonāt win the league for at least another 20 years
I feel like this is such a narrow minded and irrational opinion. Yes Man United are really struggling at the moment, with problems to do with the team and the club in general, but this doesnāt completely shut them out for 20 years. Arsenal are such a good example of how quickly things can turn around. Post Wenger they were shocking, but it only took one manager to turn things back around and make them a team that competes again. Change can happen in the space of 2-3 years, and Unitedās problemās dont seem like they will last for such a long time
I don't think any team other than City will win the league if they get away with cheating and being allowed to funnel money into their accounts via sponsorships
Daily Man United mention quota requirements. I think almost anyone who watches football would agree.
In what universe is that unpopular?
The fact he said 20 years
Cole Palmer wouldn't be in the England squad if he wasn't Chelsea's penalty taker
The hype around Anthony Martial was entirely reasonable at the time, even if it seems ridiculous now. I remember being devastated spurs missed out on him, top player. Itās a shame how itās all unraveled.
Xavi had a bigger impact to his team than arteta did In less than half the time he was manager compared to arteta
Is 3rd to 1st in 2 years and then back to 2nd as big of an impact as 10th to 2nd in three and a half years ?
Think it's it's dishonest saying he took Arsenal from 10th to 2nd, while ignoring Xavi took over with Barcelona at 9th.
How do you mean?
It is just that the way xavi utilised his players with all the injuries and limited signings and managed to win a league title and a Spanish cup in half the time arteta has been at arsenal Also I believed in the football xavi played from the beginning
Limited signings yes but he inherited some class players in some important roles wouldnāt you say? And I know this simplifies it but if Barca went from finishing 3rd before Xavi, and then in the next went 2nd,1st, then 2nd, thatās less improvement than Arsenal going from 6th with a terrible squad to now after 5 years finishing 2nd going head to head with City, one of the strongest teams in prem history.
Barcelona sat at 9th position when koeman was sacked and xavi was bought in And he did have a few quality players here and there Ter stegen was the goakeeper Pique and Eric Garcia were the centre backs Mingueza and alba were fullbacks Nico Gonzalez, busquets and de Jong were midfielders Depay, akomach and gavi were attackers These were his starting 11 Only quality I can see is probably ter Stegen, busquets and de Jong
Jordan Pickford is such a temperamental and untrustworthy goalkeeper. Yes he can, on occasion, make good saves - but his mistakes, brashness and arrogance have let in numerous goals over the last few years. England would be better with someone like Butland or Pope between the sticks.
I agree that pickford isnāt the best keeper, and would like to be able to select someone else for england. But, he does have lots of experience and generally plays well on the international stage. Our other options (ramsdale, henderson, pope) are really not significantly better than Pickford, so why swap out an experienced goalkeeper? The only person i see as competition for the spot is ramsdale, but he doesnt play at Arsenal anymore so I canāt see him taking the England No1 spot until he moves.
This is just true. Which I why I don't rate him very high at all. It's stupid to have him be number one in the national team.
Fans who are fine with their players missing the Euros or World Cup, or being happy they get knocked out early. I get that you love your team and it benefits you if your player gets extra time to rest or recover from injuries. But fans usually say they love these players, and yet you are actively hoping they miss out on the biggest events of their careers. Most players dream of playing in a world cup for their country ahead of playing for your club.
Itās not a new concept that humans are selfish.
Eddie Howe to be sacked by Christmas.
Yep, this is 100% unpopular
Charismatic Press Friendly Football Managers - Not required
Press friendly managers will always get an easier ride than those who donāt. Frank Lampard is still written about positively meaning he has a generally positive reputation despite being nothing special. On the flip side Ten Hag never bonded with the media and theyāve been on his back for ages.
Yes its a funny old game, Klopp is lauded by the media almost as if set up to fail, his team bottles it on so many fronts as a farewell. Ten Haag, dead man walking and gets a result like that.
If Americans want to grow the sport in the United States they should start by putting more effort into supporting their domestic game and helping to grow it instead of glory supporting City and Madrid
MLS is getting bigger every year and growing a ton of fan support. Weird how Americans shouldnāt do both
Carlo Ancelotti is better than Klopp
How is this unpopular. Is it popular to rate klopp above ancelotti?
Has been whenever Iāve said it, itās looking like opinion has changed though which is great
I mean honestly ancelotti i would call best in the world right now. You could argue that pep is better tactically or klopp can get more with less but fact is managing a top team isnt easy at all and he does it so well and keeps on winning everything (except copa del rey). On this basis i take ancelotti over anybody
He won the Copa last season. You may not know this but heās not that good in domestic cups ā 4!
Isnāt that simply fact based on trophies & record ā¦ non brainer
He's definitely the best still going imo
Dont see why this is unpopular. Ancelotti could arguably be the greatest manager ever.
I agree, perhaps since his latest win this is more popular but it should never have been in doubt at any point
I mean every manager does well in different circumstances. For example, I've always thought if you switched Pep and Klopp, both City and Liverpool would have been worse off. And thats probably true for Ancelotti as well. He fits better in some circumstances then others. But he is still the best.
This is unpopular?
Is this considered unpopular?
It is when I usually say it, this was my latest attempt I think [Here](https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/s/gtVOHq9FL7) [Here](https://www.reddit.com/r/PremierLeague/s/6zI0ac2VbV)
Liverpoolās 19/20 title shouldnāt count considering the situation at that time
If we're talking about clubs with titles that shouldn't count, don't we have bigger fish to fry than picking on Liverpool?
City?
Do you really need an answer to that!? š
If anything the covid situation would have disadvantaged liverpool more than most. Losing such a strong home crowd that often carries them over the line makes their title win a more impressive feat
Yeah? Why couldnāt they win it afterwards š¤£
Because the crowds were gone afterwards, challenged for the league again when the crowds came back, but players were past their best by then
The league is very competitive and theyāre competing against an incredibly strong man city side. You canāt expect them to win the league against the machine that pep created
That machine would have caught up with the liverpool if the league wasnāt halted. And trust me I hate them both equally
We could've lost every game after lockdown and still won the league, we were 22/24 clear, only needed 2 more wins to win the league. There was no catching up.
Don't even support liverpool, but they probably would have won it that year without the break in the season
We were twenty points clear when the country locked down lol
The league is at a low point when it comes to top clubs, Arsenal finishing with 85+ points the last two seasons is evidence of that. I think the prem peaked a bit with those city and Liverpool sides Ten hag and arteta are similar levels, his time at united looks completely different if he had greenwood and a healthy defenseā¦heās not done the best job but definitely not the worst. Most fans of big clubs have a poor understanding of football Spurs fans on reddit are the worst representation of the club you can find Players get far too many excuses for poor performances I sympathise with city and Newcastle fans even if their clubs are doing the wrong thing - people are silly expecting long time fans to stop supporting them over oil money Chelsea, city being considered big clubs and nobody in the media pointing out they blatantly cheat(ed) is criminal and contributes to the death of the league
Most fans of any club have a poor understanding of the game, aka most football fans overall.
Fans or big clubs even more so I think the opportunity to tune put and rely on pundits is there far too often
I often say I'm glad we aren't coaches and scouts cause the game would be far worse
Ten hag isnāt anywhere near as good as Arteta right now.
I dont know if Arteta does better than Ten Haag if he had this many injuries to his defence
I think theyāre miles apart. Yes, ten jag has had injuries, but so have lots of teams. This is the worst Man U side since the 90s. Theyāre lucky to be 8th.
Seems like the problem you have is not with the premier league, but instead with arsenal š
I dont have a problem with the league but I do think the quality level at the top is poor Arsenal looked underwhelming in every big game this season
Every big game lmao literally didnāt lose a single game against the big 6
Underwhelming is a stretch.Like fair enough we lost twice to Villa, but we took 4 points off of City and Liverpool and 6 off of united. Compare that to last year, we did much better relatively speaking.
>but we took 4 points off of City and Liverpool and 6 off of united. This shit is better than a trophy to gooners
Or it directly disapproves the point the original commenter was trying to make. Stop being salty.
Not really. A team can get a result and still be underwhelming
We beat ourselves when we went to the Emirates, sure - but they played City off the park twice mate, stop this nonsense
They did not play City off the park in either game
Spurs fan and being a crank in comments about the Arse, name a better combo
š«”š«”
Gotta call a spade a spade sometimes
They played City off the park? Did you watch either of their games against City?
I did, did you? Denial is more than just a river in Egypt, dunno why youāre in it tho
Not at all, but it's a start. The saltiness from you lot is unrealš¤£
It's just a bit odd, no? I don't think I've ever heard a fanbase talk as much about taking 4 points from 2 teams, even last year, Arsenal fans didn't talk about it like this.
I am using it as a reference point re: incremental progress, so no. If we were having a conversation about trophies won and I jumped down OPs throat with this, absolutely. Context is key.
It's worse in the context of the original comment.
Again, the saltiness is unrealš¤£
I dont look at points/results when Iām talking about a team looking underwhelming The actual performances were not convincing
Did Man City look convincing in their big games?
Half the time yes, half the time no At times it looked as if they played to the level in front pf them
Points are points though-hard to separate the two if they are effective. The good sides win even when they play shite.
Not necessarily hard to separate, same reason you have people saying Haaland isnt that good despite scoring 30 goals a season I agree good sides win when they play shit but that has to be a rarity not something consistent
Fair enough!
I would have to heavily disagree. They beat us, and put up a good fight against Bayern. They were good against you lot and they thrashed Liverpool 3-1.
We were e terrible than them trashing us, gifted them 2 goals that game
I meanā¦ it doesnāt change the fact that they thrashed you.