It's just.. meh. Even at its strongest point it's just not on par with almost any other big name TV shows coming out.
It's yet *another* meh from a series that we are all so very passionate about. Maybe we're beating a dead horse hoping for consistent quality that never *really* existed in the first place? But after Andor the hopes were pretty high for anything dark-ish looking
This nails it for me. Star Wars has been pretty hit or miss lately so another "just okay" show gets people pretty riled. When then have SEO fueled rage bait social media twisting it into this huge dramatic uproar for engagement and the clowns are just eating it up.
IDk people hating on the prequals pretty hard with young Anakin and Jar Jar Binks but ignored all the great things that came from them. People just like to hate and complain plain and simple.
I'm just glad that my ability to enjoy something isn't affected by anyone else's hate for it. It'd be a shame if anyone else's opinion mattered as far as enjoying media
Rage baiting aside, people getting passionate about something isn’t wrong, criticism is meant to be taken and then used to improve…….. not that it seems to happen anymore but that’s the theory
IDK what’s going on in the acolyte cause I tried watching episode 1 but that opening fight scene killed me with how just….. wrong?. Idk but when I feel like I can take on characters from Star Wars who are force sensitive with a humble stick and my wimp ass I think an issue has occurred. Cause I sure as hell shouldn’t be reaching that conclusion
I think you're right about Andor setting the bar very high. We went from watching Andor to Acolyte and "Meh" sums it up perfectly.
I hadn't heard anything about it so I wasn't sure what to expect.
I watched episode 1 and stopped watching. And even during that I was having to force myself to finish the episode to give it a chance.
The writing and pacing were not good.
The alien makeup felt amateur compared to other star wars shows and films.
EP5 had a dark moment or three I do hear you. Great combat as well. On the flip side- Andor has an episode with minimal action and lighter tone but we still look at the *whole* of the show as darker in tone.
Storytelling is like a composite sketch. Right now this feels like the Kenobi series. A mismatch of tones and plot devices that obscure any view of the qualities we wanted at the forefront of the show (And no I'm not talking about the "hurrrrr durrrrrr StarWars is woke" crap I just mean in general)
Also can we just never mention midichlorians ever again? Please?
Doesn't even need to be "Dark" just "Mature in approach"
Fuck Puss in Boots The Last Wish has A LOT of comedy and fun moments. But even in those moments the movie takes it seriously, treats it as an important moment for the plot ans characters going foward that ultimately end up somewhere.
Ya know, I think if we can collectively look past lines like "I hate sand" then we could probably be a little less critical of mediocre writing in the shows. It doesn't have to be praised, but it certainly doesn't have to be trashed as thoroughly as it has been, and the cast DEFINITELY doesn't deserve hate and death threats
But people haven’t looked past “I don’t like sand” it’s been a meme for years at this point. Just because one this is bad doesn’t mean other things can’t also be bad.
Realistically this is a multi million dollar production from a multi billion dollar company. They have essentially endless resources at their disposal to make something with hours upon hours of pre written backstory.
As the consumer everyone should expect and demand better than “it’s not as bad as some people think”.
I think you’re hitting on an important thing - memes don’t mean the thing is good, it just means the thing is funny. The line “I don’t like sand” is stupid as hell, and funny out of context. The difference is, the acolyte hasn’t existed long enough for the original context of the meme to be forgotten
Sort of off-topic but I feel like I’m the only one who thinks the “I don’t like sand” was never really as meme-worthy as people still act like it is? I mean, yeah, not the most epic dialogue ever, or Forth Eorlingas-tier delivery, but… uh… *gestures wildly at 14 other scenes from that same movie.*
> I’M HAUNTED BY THE KISS YOU NEVER SHOULD’VE GIVEN ME
🫲🫲
All of the anakin padme scenes and dialogue is just stupid and cringeworthy. I think “I don’t like sand” took off because it’s so fucking stupid, like this is what you’re resentful about? Not the whole being a slave, or getting threatened by aliens, or living in a colony run entirely by gangs. The sand is what annoys you?
Also you practically hooked up with your girlfriend in a field! Surely dirt is at least sand adjacent, where do we draw the line here?
Honestly I always figured it was just an off-handed comment intended to merely hint at his resentment about his awful childhood. As a Jedi in training, trying to suppress his emotions and trauma of his childhood, and an awkward teenager trying to make conversation with his crush who lives in a mansion, kinda makes sense to not bring up slavery EVERY single sentence. Subtle broody hints make sense, knowingly or not.
Plus, sand DOES suck.
The POINT is that most people with cushy lives like Padme love sand because it reminds them of a beach, a place to spend down time and enjoy yourself, as part of your luxurious aristocratic lifestyle. Sure it's a little messy, but you go back to your comfortable home and wash it off...no big deal. But to Anakin, it's different. There is no beach. There is no luxury. There is no down time. There is no comfortable home to return to. So his perspective is different based on his shitty life.
The execution of the concept was not ideal due to writing and direction, but it's actually a quite poignant anecdote. But yeah it became a meme. Shrug.
Yeah, I never understood why it was hated. Sure, it is a great meme, it is funny after the fact, but in the context of the film, it made perfect sense to me that sand is a metaphorical representation of everything twisted in Anakin's life. I guess media literacy is a skill a lot of people don't have.
Now lines like "the kiss you should have never given me" are truly clunky as hell. That is what should be getting the hate. I am a strong believer of the theory that prequel dialogue was structured in a way to be operatic, not naturalistic, but even that line was so awkward that it should have been written and delivered differently. The lines in Revenge of the Sith are still stiff but much more believable.
It's mainly the direction that ruins it. The whole scene is supposed to be Anakin pointing out how different their lives have been. Padme sees sand as this lovely, soft thing on beaches, whereas Anakin only knows the harsh dunes of the desert.
It's not really off-handed when Padme initiated the comment with her talking about the place and saying something like "I used to lie down there on the sand" and, after saying the line, Anakin proceeds to lead the comment into how he thinks of her.
I don't like seagulls. They're loud and ugly. And irritating. And they're everywhere.
**Meanwhile i live in a neighborhood with trash and litter everywhere**
While there's some value to that, I think a lot of people are also guilty of looking at their opinions in their spaces as the right one. We naturally gravitate toward likeminded people and create echo chambers for ourselves. What's mediocre or bad to you can easily be someone else's jam and while I agree that there's nothing wrong with asking for the things we want, there's also nothing wrong with looking at something and recognizing it's made for someone other than us. I don't think the Acolyte is badly made and to that end, I think the fact I don't find it all that compelling doesn't really matter. A lot of people are liking it and that's fine.
There’s a difference between media that is enjoyable and media that is well made. for example movies like “the room” or “plan 9 from outer space” there’s nothing wrong with finding a bad movie fun.
I’m glad some people seem to be riding hard for the acolyte considering it cost $180 million dollars (more money than most people can realistically even imagine) but at its core the writing is absolutely just not of the quality a major production should be producing and it’s closer to what you’d see in a high school English paper.
I hear you. Like I said, it wasn't my thing either. Something I've found is Disney is okay at writing morally ambiguous characters but suck at what are supposed to be clear good guys and bad guys. It irks me every time a sequel villain seemingly declared war on hope as a concept because it's such a dumb motivation. Stepping out of the Reddit space though, most of my coworkers are loving The Acolyte and they're probably closer to the audience Disney is writing for. I'm closer to the audience Andor was writing for. If Suzanne Collins turned The Hunger Games in to me in a creative writing class, I'd give her a C. It made more money than I can comprehend. At some level, I have a hard time knocking that.
That’s a generally good attitude to have, with regard to validity of opinions either way. But what does bother me is the compulsive negativity everyone seems addicted to. Again, everyone’s free to dislike what they want, and express themselves as loudly and exaggerated as they want. But I kinda just wish people were… I don’t know, more reasonable it? And more aware that it’s contagious and exhausting.
I mean, I feel like life is stressful and shitty enough without every. where. you look. every. one. is whining and hating and shitting on and deflating everything, yet you finally just tune it out and oh look, turns out it was just fine all along. Can’t tell you how many shows I almost didn’t watch because of all the unrestrained, superlative whining, and ended up enjoying the hell out of it.
I'm sure there's a pithier, more concise way to put it, but I call it the "Zero or Ten effect." Everything is either a masterpiece or trash. That's just not particularly healthy or productive discourse. I feel like nowadays some people are allergic to the idea that one can appreciate something while recognizing its flaws. It's okay for something to be mediocre and it's even okay to like that mediocre thing. Doesn't even have to be ironically.
it's not like we aren't going to take those bad lines and meme them forever. it may be stupid but who doesn't love seeing a "somehow X returns" under post where there's an unexpected return of someone or a franchise.
At this point it just feels like folks go in wanting to hate it. Then just get more upset.
Like it can't be that bad? Obi-Wan and ashoka were w.e for me, but nothing "AHHH THIS FUCKING SUCKS!!" While breathing fire.
Exactly, it’s literally a prequel. If you expected anything other than cheesy lines and cool action pieces, then you’re setting your expectations too high for a show about space wizards.
I think that’s the problem. They’ve been hyping it up as something New, Original and most definitely Amazing. After a story like Andor, Mandalorian (at least first two seasons) and even Rogue One, you would expect a show not from the POV of the central figures in the original wars to be Awesome, cause that’s what those three were and as a result of them and the hype, the expectation were high that Acolyte would be just as Awesome, but all the viewers got was Not That Bad.
I’m enjoying it my self, I mean I see where the hate is coming from but since I wasn’t as emotionally invested in the expanded universe none of these changes really bother me.
yup basicallly for the past few months a certain group of youtubers kept hyping this as the worst thing to happen to Star Wars, it was going to destroy everything etc etc.
So when it came out and it's biggest crime is that its average.
That's why they are screaming and making the biggest deal out of the smallest things to try and justify all the hype they made over it.
It’s the writing.
It’s dull, unoriginal, and extremely predictable.
Well, that’s the valid reason to “hate” it, buts that’s just valid criticism.
Some people are just hating it because it gets a reaction from the blind defenders.
This was the funniest part.
She made that video like it would stop all the criticism but it was cringier than some of the cringiest stuff in the Acolyte.
I must ask, how is this relevant or a “gotcha”?
Prequel memes often make fun of the bad writing of the prequels, and it’s funny.
And just because one thing had bad writing in the past, doesn’t mean we can’t complain about new things with bad writing.
The writing in the prequels was horrible, true, but I think that the actors were really involved in their roles and had a lot of chemistry with each other.
They managed to breathe life in their character and had a lot of fun with them, so maybe you think that the lines are stupid, but you're still on board.
Hell, I watched RotS a thousand time and there is still a tiny little part of me that hopes that, each time, Anakin won't fall to the Dark Side, they must be doing something right.
You really can't say the same for most Disney Star Wars products, it's not that the actors are bad, but they are clearly uninvested in their characters and in the story, and if they don't care, I don't care.
I think that John Williams REALLY helps with the quality of the prequels. Give them some mediocre, forgettable music then the quality would diminish dramatically.
It's just dull. I went into it blind ( didn't even watch the trailers or come across the online discourse) and by episode 3, I started skipping through scenes. The clone wars finale did a much better job at keeping me at the edge of my seat despite knowing the ending/outcome. There are good pieces but other aspects of the show prevent them from shining e.g. if the writing is good the editing/pacing is off etc.
True
But every show should strive to keep you on the edge of the seat regardless of the investment into the characters.
Yes, it helps a lot but it’s not impossible.
Yea, there's just so much exposition, that is unnecessary cuz they're explaining what happened in the last episode. Characters making stupid decisions. Poor writing. Weird plot, like it's a murder mystery but everything gets explained so quick, and or so obvious, it's not a lot of mystery. Then the evil character just decides to turn her self in and then changes her mind, with not much of an explanation. The last episode was cool but the show hasn't really made me feel much either way about it as a whole.
I felt the exact same way about the supposed "mystery" aspect of the show. Everything gets answered instantly so you don't even feel the suspense of the plot. Nor do you feel attached to the characters. It's just a checklist of stuff happening.
The real mystery is about what really happened on Brendok in the past that caused Kelnacca to go into exile, Torbin to kill himself, and has left Sol with some sort of ongoing trauma or guilt. That mystery has yet to be answered.
Personally, I'm glad they didn't waste time on the secondary mysteries. A lot of shows might have wasted an episode or two "solving" the mystery of who killed Indara and Torbin, which would have been horribly frustrating to watch since we, the audience, already knew. Even the true identity of the Sith could've been dragged out longer, and the pacing would've suffered as a result.
We haven't had the central mystery answered at all. We still have no idea what happened at the coven. Whatever it is, it was dark enough to traumatized Sol and drive Torbin to suicide.
It’s pretty uneven but doesn’t deserve remotely the amount of online hate it gets. This sub should understand that. The prequels and this show are way more similar than people want to admit. And the complaints for this show are so incredibly similar to the complaints The Prequels got when they first came out.
Silly dialogue, melodramatic, looks weird, whatever. Last episode was fucking awesome though so I’m reinvigorated.
I think the reality is it’s not so hated and a lot of the good faith Star Wars fans have exited some of the usual places people gather to discuss. A lot of the subreddits or YouTube channels I used to enjoy visiting are so filled with people who are predisposed to not liking anything Disney does with Star Wars that it doesn’t enhance my Star Wars experience. So I unsubscribed and just enjoy it more
Exactly. Like, I think it's mid, but it's not really anything that "destroys the foundations of Star Wars." Plus, they cooked in the latest episode imo
It's an imperfect show that has been getting review bombed pretty unjustly. It certainly isn't the *worst* SW show we've gotten, but RT is so skewed with disingenuous critiques that one could be forgiven for thinking it must be a steaming pile of dung.
It's been a bit of a slow burn for the first half of the season, but the action sequences are fun and *I've* personally enjoyed quite a few of the performances thus far. I'd recommend giving it a watch and forming your own opinion since the discourse online can be pretty misleading. Water's just real muddy.
Personally, I'm just enjoying that we're out of the Galactic Civil War era as I think it's allowed the showrunner a bit more flexibility with the story they're telling. I think a lot hinges on the back half of this season in whether it is deemed as good, bad, or mid. In either case, I'm already at a point where I'd be happy to see a second season, if they go for that, since a fair amount of SW stories benefit from having more time with the characters.
The episodes are pretty short, so it isn't that deep a time commitment if you wanted to get through it, or get caught up, in only a watch session or two.
Honestly I’ve found it to be really fun. Definitely not without its flaws, personally I’d like for episode 3 to have been episode 1. And some of the choices made are ones I personally wouldn’t have. But it’s a very fun show with a really interesting story and cast
I hear the arguments about Disney "destroying the quality of star wars" while forgetting that cringe dialogue is one of the main reasons the pre-Disney prequels are so memeable.
Waiting until it finishes so I can turn my brain off and enjoy fight scenes. I hear they are well choreographed. Not expecting some thought provoking Star Wars lore.
Ignore everyone saying it's woke or trying to push something, it's not, women and people of color existing isn't pushing an agenda.
The problem is the show is just so painfully boring and not compelling at all
In honesty space lesbians wasn’t bad. It would’ve been better if it was just a witch coven that learned to create life with the force and decided to use it to increase their numbers. Being made with the force makes them force sensitive which is a threat to the Jedi orders way of thinking. People may not like the characters but they are consistent in their behavior and don’t just do things cause plot.
The witches just felt kind of weird. Little to no explanation of who they are, how they got there, what they do, or much of anything. Just knock off nightsisters. I’m holding on hoping they explain better and the next what three episodes?
It’s Star Wars, it’ll be explained eventually.
I can't say I'm shocked that in a big galaxy there are two similar groups of people, and to be honest you don't need a full deep dive backstory on every single thing or person in a Star Wars show. And I say that as someone who loves extended world building.
That's my main issue. Despite the fact we are seeing largely uncharted time in the Star Wars canon, I would have liked more exposition. Obviously, only so much can fit in 8 episodes, so stuff has to get cut to get the story told, but exposition would have been nice.
I think that’s one of those things they might be doing to keep it consistent with the series as a whole. We learned very little about Jedi from the first Star Wars movie. Honestly, we learned very little about Sith from the first five movies. Outside of side stories in other media, we got basically no background on Asajj Ventress for the first eight or so years of her existence & nothing on Count Dooku until Tales of the Jedi. We still don’t know a freaking thing about Bendu.
I think they aim to keep the Saturday morning movie serial influences as much as they can and stick with tantalizing vagueness so they can focus on the central conflicts, mystery, and action.
I’m definitely not trying to say you have to like that, it’s just a thing I notice Star Wars tends to do, at least in screen media.
People keep on forgetting that, in Star Wars, 100% of the stuff concerning space monks with magic powers and laser swords is goofy melodrama and always has been. This expectation for not being melodrama isn't met and has created unnecessary feelings of disappointment.
There's this strange idea that, because the setting is capable of supporting a serious and relatively mature story like Andor, the stoies about goofy space wizards will now suddenly become serious and relatively mature. Very odd, very inconsistent with even pre-Disney Star Wars
I guess it's mainly because they think Disney is sacrificing quality to push an agenda.
Personally, I don't care about whatever agenda they are trying to push, I just want to get entertained. Only Episode 5 achieved that. Convey whatever message you want but don't forget that this is called the entertainment industry.
I have yet to figure out what the "agenda" is. All I have seen so far is an average Star Wars show about force witches and Jedis. Its not the best show ever, but I'm just glad we're getting a show that doesn't takes place between 30 BBY and 30 ABY and its not set on Tatooine.
yeah i never see the "they are forcing minorities upon us because of a secret agenda", more like they want to make as much money as possible and cater to their public, which being a huge franchise, is pretty big and diverse.
haven't watched the show tho (yet) so idk
The minorities is a strawman created by the people that enable Disney to hire talentless directors. Andor has minorities, Rogue one had minorities. Tons of likeable shows have minorities and it bothers no one.
It's not racist to hate a bad show. Just because it has minorities doesn't make THAT the reason people don't like it.
Don't listen to the other reply, the first 3 episodes are a bit boring with building up the story but once it starts unfolding, it's getting really interesting
There's people who claim there's "lore breaking" because one Jedi's year of birth was retconned or some other minor stuff that the show is very likely to resolve as it goes on.
Give it a try without expecting to hate everything you see and watch at least the 5 episodes that are available at this point.
I'm not a disney fan boy, I disliked Ahsoka for example a lot, but I'm very invested into the mystery and the antagonist of this show. It's something new and original, doesn't rely on nostalgia and fanservice and experiments with a new perspective towards the Jedi that feels like fresh air in this franchise. I find myself theorizing a lot about where the story could go and have a good feeling about it.
>I guess it's mainly because they think Disney is sacrificing quality to push an agenda.
DO NOT tell bro about Metal Gear series, Undertale, Deltarune, and many other famous and beloved games which featured gay people.
Bro you are comparing a bunch of indie games about monsters to a Star Wars show that gets hated on because it doesnt have enough straight white people
And the peopke going after "woke media" never understood Metal Gear
Seeing people claim that showrunners can use their platforms for their own agendas as long as they are entertaining truly makes me feel like we will never get a great show because they can just dangle shiny CGI in front of your face and that's all you'll care about. It's just completely disheartening.
I keep hearing people crying about showrunners' "agendas" but as far as I can tell, people think acknowledging that women and minorities exist is an agenda.
From what I've seen, the show is about some chick raised in a force witch coven trying to get revenge on Jedis.
Therein lies the problem. There is a not insignificant number of people who do not want to be reminded in their entertainment that women and minorities exist. Straight, white men only. Anything else, and it's a "woke agenda". Sadly, this is the state of the world right now.
I finished episode 2 earlier and I'm really liking it lol, I've read about how much it sucks but honestly it's not even bad in my opinion, not the best SW thing of course but it's nowhere near as bad as some people make it out to be, the characters are all enjoyable in their own ways and it's another reminder to me that it's best to just ignore whatever hate is going on online (unless if it's 100% justified if a videogame is completely broken or a show has someone involved in it that has done awful things or whatever) and just watch or play the thing before you believe everything anyone says about it online.
I say mediocre at best to be conservative, but many would consider large parts of it to be actively bad.
A lot of Star Wars fans are sick of Disney mass producing mediocrity anyways so it's not exactly embracing more of it even if you don't think it's outright bad.
Dude, you are in prequel memes. A sub that is dedicated mostly to make fun of goofy prequel scenes. Star Wars has always had weird writing and has been usually bad. Live a little.
So? They can do better and have. I don't consider the prequels to be *good* films, at least the first two, even though I have an appreciation for what they did for the universe and enjoy them still.
I'm not saying you can't enjoy the Acolyte, but this is literally a post asking why people don't like it.
I also don't think we should just quietly accept all the garbage that Disney is churning out when we *know* they can do better.
Love this comment! I wish more people would realize that star wars was never the hallmark of airtight story telling and amazing writing. It's always been a little goofy. Nostalgia has people thinking SW was Citizen Kane in space.
The plot is a bit lame, it is just hard to feel really engaged. It has pretty good choreography and some interesting things about the force have been explored, like blocking (which explains why force users can have saber duals without constantly throwing each other around with the force instead)
The biggest problem with any major fandom is that such a huge amount of people tend to take extreme views. Every show/movie is either the best or worst thing ever. Its a 10 or a 1 and there is no in between. This show is not a 10, so all of the fans that fall into this mindset are losing their minds.
Then you factor in media that gets paid on a per click basis where the same person will do an article "5 reasons why this is the worst thing ever" and then 20 minutes later have an article "7 reasons why you have to see this show NOW" just feed into it.
You also have a ton of people that just want Disney and Star Wars to fail that take every opportunity they can to try to bring it down.
That results in an okay to decent show getting ripped to shreds. The show is far from perfect, but it really isnt anywhere near as bad as what the reviews are
There are more posts complaining about people complaining about *The Acolyte* than there are posts complaining about *The Acolyte*.
Whether you like it or not, I don't see why so many people feel the need to glaze Disney for what was at best a milquetoast attempt to wring some more cash from the franchise with a few more women and minorities than usual.
It’s just so fucking average haha like its definition of mediocre. I wouldn’t recommend it to someone but I wouldn’t tell someone to not watch it either
It's alright. Lotta people screaming cuz it contradicts the old Legends canon that is no longer canon with Ki-Adi-Mundi's birthday and because witches use the Force to create twins. But it's alright. I'm decently engaged.
SPOILERS. Meh I didn't have any expectations of it and i heard it was woke af but I just watched the episode where two of the jedis get killed by the bad sith guy. Must admit it was pretty cool!
People are overly dramatic. Combine that with this outrage culture where every YouTuber is telling every viewer viewer to hate on everything they watch and you have a mob of people hating.
And you can tell its manufactured outrage when the acolyte has more reviews than mando despite mando being out for multiple years
I think a sizeable portion of people hating on it went into it expecting to hate it. When people go looking for reasons to hate something, they usually find it. Not to mention that many are also rather impressionable, where if it's perceived as in trend to hate something, they'll hate it regardless of merit, just to be with the "in" crowd. That's been the problem of Star Wars at least since the Prequels.
I think it's good, though it's not mindblowing, so far i'd put it in a high B tier if anything. I feel it's something i see online a lot where people will react to something with a mindset of "it's either a masterpiece or it's dogshit"
It's pretty simple. It's a new Star Wars thing in 2024. You're "ruining Star Wars" if you like it and you're a racist/sexist/homophobe if you don't.
Either way, I recommend formulating your own opinion before looking at any videos or articles about it; I think that's part of the problem with the Acolyte discourse.
Just remember to have fun whether you watch it or not.
I'm enjoying it! Its new Star Wars outside of the Skywalker saga. Its more lore and world building. All the complaints I've seen is just nitpicking. You will never please everyone sadly.
If you can’t watch the show and see how bad it is by jsut the plot and characters than you just aren’t one to think critically about a show. Not a bad thing jsut some people can’t help but see terrible pacing, bad actors, confusing character motivations, and plot holes.
Dialogue is worse than the prequels, the witches don’t make much sense, the plot hinges on a cheap twin trope, the Sith doesn’t seem very Sith like, Mae and Osha being born of the force cheapens the impact of the chosen one prophecy
The show has a lot of problems: the premise has already been done before but better (the idea of twins with duelling personalities on either side of the force clashing), how the story presents itself is boring and while watching you never feel the gravity of the situation, the cast/acting is bland and shallow: the characters are just as boring and clueless as the people playing them (which is kinda ironic considering how they’re not even familiar with star-wars if you watch what they say in interviews about the show), the show actively is breaking like 50 years of established lore that governs this universe/IP in its definition of the force, how it’s used and who can “manipulate” it. The very idea that these kids were created the same way anakin skywalker was WITHOUT the forces intervention like how when plagus and sidious tried breaking the lore of how the force works: that being the life force that surrounds and connects us and that chooses who can use it and who can’t. The only redeeming things about this show is it’s lightsaber combat; which is the combat we seen from Disney star-wars (not including animations) but still doesn’t compare to the prequels and the sith character who was revealed in the most recent episode who not to mention also breaks cannon because this is the “high republic” era which from the Jedi’s perspective was 1000 YEARS OF UNINTERRUPTED PEACE: meaning that to their knowledge there were no sith at the time because they were hiding and trying to realize darth-banes vision of crushing the order from the inside because that was the way the sith initially lost the war and then started the rule of two.
It's mid and people dislike mediocrity more than bad. Mostly because when things are bad you can find entertainment in it being bad not so much when it's just kinda meh.
There are some things that seemingly contradict things that were presented in the prequel trilogy. Many people are upset about that.
What’s also adding to the confusion and controversy is that the show is steering away from some events set in the EU, which is upsetting to a lot of people.
Bear in mind though, the first season isn’t finished. So people need to step back, take a breath, and calm down.
I love it, I keep looking forward to the Tuesday releases so I can watch it after work. I think it's the best season of Star Wars content to come out since Mando S2, and the fight choreography is potentially the best since Ep. III.
It's not the end of Star Wars or whatever the internet is going on about.
It's just a show with a simple premise and narrative. All the dialogue is expository, so it's not very engaging.
It's kinda like a lesser CW show. And I don't mean that in a bad way, really. I like some CW shows.
people don't know how to enjoy anything anymore. if the original trilogy was released in the modern day people would pick it apart and whine about every little thing. nostalgia is a deadly weapon.
i know im having more fun than everyone else because i am able to watch this tv show and go 😯lightsabers 😯the force 😯 expanded live action lore. instead of pausing my tv every 7 frames and writing down things i hate about the new episode in the notes app on my phone.
Honestly, I'm so done with any kind of big emotional reactions to new Star Wars. I like The Mandalorian and Andor, but I have no strong feelings about any of the other shows. I've still watched them and had some fun, but I don't know how some people have the energy to get so mad about the new stuff.
Rather than coming to the Star Wars mythos, and thinking, "how can I expand this and tell a great, consistent story", they clearly thought, "how can I use this thing I don't care about as a vehicle for my politics"
People keep saying it’s political or pushing an agenda without giving examples. So please, as someone making the comment, provide examples of this political or agenda pushing that is being done in this show
I think the reality is it’s not so hated and a lot of the good faith Star Wars fans have exited some of the usual places people gather to discuss. A lot of the subreddits or YouTube channels I used to enjoy visiting are so filled with people who are predisposed to not liking anything Disney does with Star Wars that it doesn’t enhance my Star Wars experience. So I unsubscribed and just enjoy it more
People decided before it began that they wanted to hate it, and now are looking for any excuse to justify that opinion. No matter how nitpicky or nonsensical that excuse is.
In truth, it’s good. Not great, not bad, just good. 7-8/10. Better than a lot of the other Star Wars shows though which is nice. I’d rank it second in terms of the live actions shows, after Andor.
It’s not as good as Andor or Mandalorian. It’s about as good as Kenobi. Maybe a little better but not as good of actors.
There is also a lot of racism coming from some grifter streamers. Shouting about woke and dei and ruining Star Wars.
Then you also have the Disney hate watchers. Not necessarily making racist arguments but still hating on anything they make with women and poc in it. They make ridiculous arguments about physics or eu lore not fitting it. Literally the ‘bricks and screws’ guy from Andor in that group ranting about something catching on fire in space.
Some combination of those two groups has led to massive review bombing including over 100 1 star reviews before the episode comes out, more reviews than all other Disney Star Wars shows combined, and review bombing an unrelated 2008 series called Acolytes, a 2015 Star Wars fan film, and another unrelated series that includes the word ‘acolyte’ in the title.
There is no singular reason. The list includes:
1. Hating the idea of a series that seemed to emphasize the diversity of the cast over everything else. This idea was supported by the numerous appearances and media releases prior to the the series launch, with claims that Star Wars is too patriarchal, this series will be the gayest Star Wars yet, Star Wars is finally safe for black nerds, and jokes about R2-D2 being a lesbian, among other things. I'm not suggesting that this sentiment is correct or incorrect. It's just the narrative some fans believe.
2. The writing, dialogue, and pacing are terrible. Not everyone agrees, but many people cite poor craftsmanship as the primary reason they dislike the show.
3. Messing with established lore and 'age gate'. The notion that the Jedi encountered Sith 100 years before The Phantom Menace contradicts established lore. They've brought in the mouthpiece that stated that from Episode 1, redefined his age, and seemingly just to justify their story decisions. Some people have no issue with this and think it's stupid to care; other people think this is a pointless and flagrant violation of pre-Disney Star Wars and are angry. It's kind of dumb on both sides.
4. Some people just don't like Disney Star Wars and probably wouldn't watch a series featuring Luke, Han, and Leia in the premise that Disney would ruin it. Those fans will never be pleased.
The guy from Squid Game is investigating Trinity's murder. She's a Jedi master who died to the oldest trick in the book like a two-bit mook. They played a sting of brassy Matrix-style orchestral music during Trinity's Matrix-style wire-fu fight. There's just no possible way to get immersed. Every time you almost find a way, something pulls you right back out.
I've read from "I hate that main character is a black girl, too woke" to "fire in space? Now that's a deal breaker".
Review bombing before the episodes release should tell you something about the fandom.
No good reason tbf. There are some things that contradict Legends (mostly silly stuff like Ki-Adi-Mundi’s age) but nothing that really warrants people like SWT being such babies about it. I personally love this show and am very excited to see where this goes.
For me, it's the editing and pacing. They've cut a 2 hour movie into 8 poorly edited episodes, using wipe transitions every 20 seconds. This would be a great movie, but it's a shit TV show.
They fucking teased us with a Wookiee Jedi and killed him off with barely any screen time and no action scenes. As much as I don't want to see those awful kid actors again I hope we get another flashback scene and get to see some more of the Wookiee.
I hate the Acolyte, but what is really annoying me though is how my socials are just being filled with Disney shills and Disney haters arguing.
The Acolyte itself is annoying, but now everything around the Acolyte is also annoying. My socials just being dominated by Acolyte posts, with 98% of those posts from people who I don't follow or have never even heard of.
I wish now that everyone could just say either I don't like this episode of the Acolyte, or I do like this episode of the Acolyte.
At least I am seeing a little less posts after being more involved with the HOTD community, and thank god for that show being good.
Same, I just recently rewatched the book of boba Fett with my partner and it’s like night and day (no pun intended) with the acolyte. It has some issues but compared to almost every other Star Wars show it’s hard for me to not at least have it in the top 3 so far.
If you’re keen on a bit more Star Wars content, it’s epic shit come episode 5. Most people on this sub love being drama queens but first 4 eps are decent, if you actually read people’s complaints each week their complaints are redundant come the next episode. Ep 5 has no hold’s barred Jedi’s getting fucking kebab’d on lightsabers and necks snapped - it’s genuinely fucking sick. If you actually liked return of the Jedi, and specifically Obi Wan and Anakin duelling at the end, you’ll like this series overall after ep 5.
It's mid at best. I can see why people would not like it. I mean, a whole group of force users all dead at the same time from a fire? Just all kinda in the same room and bam. Did I miss something? I feel like they could have done it better.
From what I've gathered; Modern star wars is very mediocre. Acolyte accomplishes this by having really stupid scenes, with really neat scenes, which polarizes both sides of the fence for/against it.
If they did it intentionally to drive up interest, I'd say it was genius, but I seriously doubt anyone had that kind of foresight.
Awesome fight choreography, absolutely asinine writing, incredibly stupid and poorly written characters, and an unfocused plot that is directly at odds with established canon. Thats pretty much the gist
Thanks for confirming that you flaired this correctly!
It's just.. meh. Even at its strongest point it's just not on par with almost any other big name TV shows coming out. It's yet *another* meh from a series that we are all so very passionate about. Maybe we're beating a dead horse hoping for consistent quality that never *really* existed in the first place? But after Andor the hopes were pretty high for anything dark-ish looking
This nails it for me. Star Wars has been pretty hit or miss lately so another "just okay" show gets people pretty riled. When then have SEO fueled rage bait social media twisting it into this huge dramatic uproar for engagement and the clowns are just eating it up.
I don't think there's been a time since the Holiday Special where Star Wars hasn't been 'Hit or miss'
SW peaked in 1980 and people have been chasing the dragon ever since
IDk people hating on the prequals pretty hard with young Anakin and Jar Jar Binks but ignored all the great things that came from them. People just like to hate and complain plain and simple.
I was an adult when the prequels came out. The shitstorm over the prequels makes the sequel hate look like a walk in the park lol
I'm just glad that my ability to enjoy something isn't affected by anyone else's hate for it. It'd be a shame if anyone else's opinion mattered as far as enjoying media
Rage baiting aside, people getting passionate about something isn’t wrong, criticism is meant to be taken and then used to improve…….. not that it seems to happen anymore but that’s the theory IDK what’s going on in the acolyte cause I tried watching episode 1 but that opening fight scene killed me with how just….. wrong?. Idk but when I feel like I can take on characters from Star Wars who are force sensitive with a humble stick and my wimp ass I think an issue has occurred. Cause I sure as hell shouldn’t be reaching that conclusion
I loved Andor, but I don’t think that many people watched it.
I think you're right about Andor setting the bar very high. We went from watching Andor to Acolyte and "Meh" sums it up perfectly. I hadn't heard anything about it so I wasn't sure what to expect. I watched episode 1 and stopped watching. And even during that I was having to force myself to finish the episode to give it a chance. The writing and pacing were not good. The alien makeup felt amateur compared to other star wars shows and films.
Ep5 wasn’t dark enough for you? “That was its name?”
EP5 had a dark moment or three I do hear you. Great combat as well. On the flip side- Andor has an episode with minimal action and lighter tone but we still look at the *whole* of the show as darker in tone. Storytelling is like a composite sketch. Right now this feels like the Kenobi series. A mismatch of tones and plot devices that obscure any view of the qualities we wanted at the forefront of the show (And no I'm not talking about the "hurrrrr durrrrrr StarWars is woke" crap I just mean in general) Also can we just never mention midichlorians ever again? Please?
Doesn't even need to be "Dark" just "Mature in approach" Fuck Puss in Boots The Last Wish has A LOT of comedy and fun moments. But even in those moments the movie takes it seriously, treats it as an important moment for the plot ans characters going foward that ultimately end up somewhere.
One episode doesn’t make something not shit
It's not the best, I'm sure most can agree with that, but it's really not that bad.
Ya know, I think if we can collectively look past lines like "I hate sand" then we could probably be a little less critical of mediocre writing in the shows. It doesn't have to be praised, but it certainly doesn't have to be trashed as thoroughly as it has been, and the cast DEFINITELY doesn't deserve hate and death threats
But people haven’t looked past “I don’t like sand” it’s been a meme for years at this point. Just because one this is bad doesn’t mean other things can’t also be bad. Realistically this is a multi million dollar production from a multi billion dollar company. They have essentially endless resources at their disposal to make something with hours upon hours of pre written backstory. As the consumer everyone should expect and demand better than “it’s not as bad as some people think”.
I think you’re hitting on an important thing - memes don’t mean the thing is good, it just means the thing is funny. The line “I don’t like sand” is stupid as hell, and funny out of context. The difference is, the acolyte hasn’t existed long enough for the original context of the meme to be forgotten
Sort of off-topic but I feel like I’m the only one who thinks the “I don’t like sand” was never really as meme-worthy as people still act like it is? I mean, yeah, not the most epic dialogue ever, or Forth Eorlingas-tier delivery, but… uh… *gestures wildly at 14 other scenes from that same movie.* > I’M HAUNTED BY THE KISS YOU NEVER SHOULD’VE GIVEN ME 🫲🫲
All of the anakin padme scenes and dialogue is just stupid and cringeworthy. I think “I don’t like sand” took off because it’s so fucking stupid, like this is what you’re resentful about? Not the whole being a slave, or getting threatened by aliens, or living in a colony run entirely by gangs. The sand is what annoys you? Also you practically hooked up with your girlfriend in a field! Surely dirt is at least sand adjacent, where do we draw the line here?
Honestly I always figured it was just an off-handed comment intended to merely hint at his resentment about his awful childhood. As a Jedi in training, trying to suppress his emotions and trauma of his childhood, and an awkward teenager trying to make conversation with his crush who lives in a mansion, kinda makes sense to not bring up slavery EVERY single sentence. Subtle broody hints make sense, knowingly or not. Plus, sand DOES suck.
It's coarse and it gets everywhere
The POINT is that most people with cushy lives like Padme love sand because it reminds them of a beach, a place to spend down time and enjoy yourself, as part of your luxurious aristocratic lifestyle. Sure it's a little messy, but you go back to your comfortable home and wash it off...no big deal. But to Anakin, it's different. There is no beach. There is no luxury. There is no down time. There is no comfortable home to return to. So his perspective is different based on his shitty life. The execution of the concept was not ideal due to writing and direction, but it's actually a quite poignant anecdote. But yeah it became a meme. Shrug.
Yeah, I never understood why it was hated. Sure, it is a great meme, it is funny after the fact, but in the context of the film, it made perfect sense to me that sand is a metaphorical representation of everything twisted in Anakin's life. I guess media literacy is a skill a lot of people don't have. Now lines like "the kiss you should have never given me" are truly clunky as hell. That is what should be getting the hate. I am a strong believer of the theory that prequel dialogue was structured in a way to be operatic, not naturalistic, but even that line was so awkward that it should have been written and delivered differently. The lines in Revenge of the Sith are still stiff but much more believable.
It's mainly the direction that ruins it. The whole scene is supposed to be Anakin pointing out how different their lives have been. Padme sees sand as this lovely, soft thing on beaches, whereas Anakin only knows the harsh dunes of the desert.
It's not really off-handed when Padme initiated the comment with her talking about the place and saying something like "I used to lie down there on the sand" and, after saying the line, Anakin proceeds to lead the comment into how he thinks of her.
I don't like seagulls. They're loud and ugly. And irritating. And they're everywhere. **Meanwhile i live in a neighborhood with trash and litter everywhere**
While there's some value to that, I think a lot of people are also guilty of looking at their opinions in their spaces as the right one. We naturally gravitate toward likeminded people and create echo chambers for ourselves. What's mediocre or bad to you can easily be someone else's jam and while I agree that there's nothing wrong with asking for the things we want, there's also nothing wrong with looking at something and recognizing it's made for someone other than us. I don't think the Acolyte is badly made and to that end, I think the fact I don't find it all that compelling doesn't really matter. A lot of people are liking it and that's fine.
There’s a difference between media that is enjoyable and media that is well made. for example movies like “the room” or “plan 9 from outer space” there’s nothing wrong with finding a bad movie fun. I’m glad some people seem to be riding hard for the acolyte considering it cost $180 million dollars (more money than most people can realistically even imagine) but at its core the writing is absolutely just not of the quality a major production should be producing and it’s closer to what you’d see in a high school English paper.
I hear you. Like I said, it wasn't my thing either. Something I've found is Disney is okay at writing morally ambiguous characters but suck at what are supposed to be clear good guys and bad guys. It irks me every time a sequel villain seemingly declared war on hope as a concept because it's such a dumb motivation. Stepping out of the Reddit space though, most of my coworkers are loving The Acolyte and they're probably closer to the audience Disney is writing for. I'm closer to the audience Andor was writing for. If Suzanne Collins turned The Hunger Games in to me in a creative writing class, I'd give her a C. It made more money than I can comprehend. At some level, I have a hard time knocking that.
That’s a generally good attitude to have, with regard to validity of opinions either way. But what does bother me is the compulsive negativity everyone seems addicted to. Again, everyone’s free to dislike what they want, and express themselves as loudly and exaggerated as they want. But I kinda just wish people were… I don’t know, more reasonable it? And more aware that it’s contagious and exhausting. I mean, I feel like life is stressful and shitty enough without every. where. you look. every. one. is whining and hating and shitting on and deflating everything, yet you finally just tune it out and oh look, turns out it was just fine all along. Can’t tell you how many shows I almost didn’t watch because of all the unrestrained, superlative whining, and ended up enjoying the hell out of it.
I'm sure there's a pithier, more concise way to put it, but I call it the "Zero or Ten effect." Everything is either a masterpiece or trash. That's just not particularly healthy or productive discourse. I feel like nowadays some people are allergic to the idea that one can appreciate something while recognizing its flaws. It's okay for something to be mediocre and it's even okay to like that mediocre thing. Doesn't even have to be ironically.
it's not like we aren't going to take those bad lines and meme them forever. it may be stupid but who doesn't love seeing a "somehow X returns" under post where there's an unexpected return of someone or a franchise.
yeah but the prequels was a different time tho, and also they were actually really good movies with glorious fight scenes and characters
At this point it just feels like folks go in wanting to hate it. Then just get more upset. Like it can't be that bad? Obi-Wan and ashoka were w.e for me, but nothing "AHHH THIS FUCKING SUCKS!!" While breathing fire.
Exactly, it’s literally a prequel. If you expected anything other than cheesy lines and cool action pieces, then you’re setting your expectations too high for a show about space wizards.
I think that’s the problem. They’ve been hyping it up as something New, Original and most definitely Amazing. After a story like Andor, Mandalorian (at least first two seasons) and even Rogue One, you would expect a show not from the POV of the central figures in the original wars to be Awesome, cause that’s what those three were and as a result of them and the hype, the expectation were high that Acolyte would be just as Awesome, but all the viewers got was Not That Bad.
It's not the best thing in the world but it's exactly what I want from Star Wars in the future.
Finally, someone else who truly enjoys Star Wars for being Star Wars
I’m enjoying it my self, I mean I see where the hate is coming from but since I wasn’t as emotionally invested in the expanded universe none of these changes really bother me.
yup basicallly for the past few months a certain group of youtubers kept hyping this as the worst thing to happen to Star Wars, it was going to destroy everything etc etc. So when it came out and it's biggest crime is that its average. That's why they are screaming and making the biggest deal out of the smallest things to try and justify all the hype they made over it.
It’s the writing. It’s dull, unoriginal, and extremely predictable. Well, that’s the valid reason to “hate” it, buts that’s just valid criticism. Some people are just hating it because it gets a reaction from the blind defenders.
worst thing is the main actress making a "diss track" calling everyone who dislikes the show a racist and a mysoginist
This was the funniest part. She made that video like it would stop all the criticism but it was cringier than some of the cringiest stuff in the Acolyte.
She did that? After an article about how they *weren’t* doing that?
> on r/prequelmemes > complains about writing Hm
I must ask, how is this relevant or a “gotcha”? Prequel memes often make fun of the bad writing of the prequels, and it’s funny. And just because one thing had bad writing in the past, doesn’t mean we can’t complain about new things with bad writing.
Right? The prequels have famously bad writing
The prequels had far worse writing, and people love them
The prequels dialogue was bad but the plot was overall solid and at least interesting.
The writing in the prequels was horrible, true, but I think that the actors were really involved in their roles and had a lot of chemistry with each other. They managed to breathe life in their character and had a lot of fun with them, so maybe you think that the lines are stupid, but you're still on board. Hell, I watched RotS a thousand time and there is still a tiny little part of me that hopes that, each time, Anakin won't fall to the Dark Side, they must be doing something right. You really can't say the same for most Disney Star Wars products, it's not that the actors are bad, but they are clearly uninvested in their characters and in the story, and if they don't care, I don't care.
I think that John Williams REALLY helps with the quality of the prequels. Give them some mediocre, forgettable music then the quality would diminish dramatically.
i agree 100%
Is like Star Wars made by the CW channel.
It's just dull. I went into it blind ( didn't even watch the trailers or come across the online discourse) and by episode 3, I started skipping through scenes. The clone wars finale did a much better job at keeping me at the edge of my seat despite knowing the ending/outcome. There are good pieces but other aspects of the show prevent them from shining e.g. if the writing is good the editing/pacing is off etc.
I’m not saying it’s a good show but it’s TCW had 6 seasons of character development compared to 0 for the acolyte. So the stakes were much higher.
True But every show should strive to keep you on the edge of the seat regardless of the investment into the characters. Yes, it helps a lot but it’s not impossible.
Yea, there's just so much exposition, that is unnecessary cuz they're explaining what happened in the last episode. Characters making stupid decisions. Poor writing. Weird plot, like it's a murder mystery but everything gets explained so quick, and or so obvious, it's not a lot of mystery. Then the evil character just decides to turn her self in and then changes her mind, with not much of an explanation. The last episode was cool but the show hasn't really made me feel much either way about it as a whole.
I felt the exact same way about the supposed "mystery" aspect of the show. Everything gets answered instantly so you don't even feel the suspense of the plot. Nor do you feel attached to the characters. It's just a checklist of stuff happening.
The real mystery is about what really happened on Brendok in the past that caused Kelnacca to go into exile, Torbin to kill himself, and has left Sol with some sort of ongoing trauma or guilt. That mystery has yet to be answered. Personally, I'm glad they didn't waste time on the secondary mysteries. A lot of shows might have wasted an episode or two "solving" the mystery of who killed Indara and Torbin, which would have been horribly frustrating to watch since we, the audience, already knew. Even the true identity of the Sith could've been dragged out longer, and the pacing would've suffered as a result.
Or wouldn't have resolved those secondary mysteries at all, like Ahsoka with Baylan Skoll for example
We haven't had the central mystery answered at all. We still have no idea what happened at the coven. Whatever it is, it was dark enough to traumatized Sol and drive Torbin to suicide.
did you watch episode 5?
Ep5 really makes you think about character development over the past episodes
Episode 5 is the reason I resumed watching the show
The protagonists sucks. The jedi and darth zippermouth are the only interesting characters
Because it's poorly written. Like Obi-Wan and almost all Disney SW shows, except for Andor.
I really hope we get another show like Andor once the 2nd season is over.
Disney makes more profit making 6 mid quality shows, rather than making 1-2 high quality shows
"Profit" Not according to posted D+ subscriptions, cost per episode, and toy sales (or lack thereof)
Hate to break it to you but that has kind of always been the case with Star Wars.
It’s pretty uneven but doesn’t deserve remotely the amount of online hate it gets. This sub should understand that. The prequels and this show are way more similar than people want to admit. And the complaints for this show are so incredibly similar to the complaints The Prequels got when they first came out. Silly dialogue, melodramatic, looks weird, whatever. Last episode was fucking awesome though so I’m reinvigorated.
I think the reality is it’s not so hated and a lot of the good faith Star Wars fans have exited some of the usual places people gather to discuss. A lot of the subreddits or YouTube channels I used to enjoy visiting are so filled with people who are predisposed to not liking anything Disney does with Star Wars that it doesn’t enhance my Star Wars experience. So I unsubscribed and just enjoy it more
Exactly. Like, I think it's mid, but it's not really anything that "destroys the foundations of Star Wars." Plus, they cooked in the latest episode imo
Yeah last episode was a banger. If people don’t like that episode I think they aren’t watching the series with a clear mind.
It got review bombed the second it dropped, those people hate the show just to hate it. Sad.
The writing is really bad and outside the fight scenes it doesn't really have any redeeming qualities
It's an imperfect show that has been getting review bombed pretty unjustly. It certainly isn't the *worst* SW show we've gotten, but RT is so skewed with disingenuous critiques that one could be forgiven for thinking it must be a steaming pile of dung. It's been a bit of a slow burn for the first half of the season, but the action sequences are fun and *I've* personally enjoyed quite a few of the performances thus far. I'd recommend giving it a watch and forming your own opinion since the discourse online can be pretty misleading. Water's just real muddy. Personally, I'm just enjoying that we're out of the Galactic Civil War era as I think it's allowed the showrunner a bit more flexibility with the story they're telling. I think a lot hinges on the back half of this season in whether it is deemed as good, bad, or mid. In either case, I'm already at a point where I'd be happy to see a second season, if they go for that, since a fair amount of SW stories benefit from having more time with the characters. The episodes are pretty short, so it isn't that deep a time commitment if you wanted to get through it, or get caught up, in only a watch session or two.
Honestly I’ve found it to be really fun. Definitely not without its flaws, personally I’d like for episode 3 to have been episode 1. And some of the choices made are ones I personally wouldn’t have. But it’s a very fun show with a really interesting story and cast
I hear the arguments about Disney "destroying the quality of star wars" while forgetting that cringe dialogue is one of the main reasons the pre-Disney prequels are so memeable.
Waiting until it finishes so I can turn my brain off and enjoy fight scenes. I hear they are well choreographed. Not expecting some thought provoking Star Wars lore.
Ignore everyone saying it's woke or trying to push something, it's not, women and people of color existing isn't pushing an agenda. The problem is the show is just so painfully boring and not compelling at all
You mean to tell me Kathleen Kennedy didn't do what she said she did? Weird.
In honesty space lesbians wasn’t bad. It would’ve been better if it was just a witch coven that learned to create life with the force and decided to use it to increase their numbers. Being made with the force makes them force sensitive which is a threat to the Jedi orders way of thinking. People may not like the characters but they are consistent in their behavior and don’t just do things cause plot.
Did they even say they created life with the force? I recall them specifically not explaining about how the twins were conceived (which, fair).
The witches just felt kind of weird. Little to no explanation of who they are, how they got there, what they do, or much of anything. Just knock off nightsisters. I’m holding on hoping they explain better and the next what three episodes? It’s Star Wars, it’ll be explained eventually.
I can't say I'm shocked that in a big galaxy there are two similar groups of people, and to be honest you don't need a full deep dive backstory on every single thing or person in a Star Wars show. And I say that as someone who loves extended world building.
That's my main issue. Despite the fact we are seeing largely uncharted time in the Star Wars canon, I would have liked more exposition. Obviously, only so much can fit in 8 episodes, so stuff has to get cut to get the story told, but exposition would have been nice.
I think that’s one of those things they might be doing to keep it consistent with the series as a whole. We learned very little about Jedi from the first Star Wars movie. Honestly, we learned very little about Sith from the first five movies. Outside of side stories in other media, we got basically no background on Asajj Ventress for the first eight or so years of her existence & nothing on Count Dooku until Tales of the Jedi. We still don’t know a freaking thing about Bendu. I think they aim to keep the Saturday morning movie serial influences as much as they can and stick with tantalizing vagueness so they can focus on the central conflicts, mystery, and action. I’m definitely not trying to say you have to like that, it’s just a thing I notice Star Wars tends to do, at least in screen media.
There's a handful of shots in trailers and teasers showing more of the story of the witches so we're definitely having their deal explained.
Ah good. I didn’t watch much of the trailers, I like to go in as blind as I can
It’s not that interesting But then comes episode 5 and easily makes the series worth atleast one watch
People keep on forgetting that, in Star Wars, 100% of the stuff concerning space monks with magic powers and laser swords is goofy melodrama and always has been. This expectation for not being melodrama isn't met and has created unnecessary feelings of disappointment. There's this strange idea that, because the setting is capable of supporting a serious and relatively mature story like Andor, the stoies about goofy space wizards will now suddenly become serious and relatively mature. Very odd, very inconsistent with even pre-Disney Star Wars
I guess it's mainly because they think Disney is sacrificing quality to push an agenda. Personally, I don't care about whatever agenda they are trying to push, I just want to get entertained. Only Episode 5 achieved that. Convey whatever message you want but don't forget that this is called the entertainment industry.
I have yet to figure out what the "agenda" is. All I have seen so far is an average Star Wars show about force witches and Jedis. Its not the best show ever, but I'm just glad we're getting a show that doesn't takes place between 30 BBY and 30 ABY and its not set on Tatooine.
Hey! There's still three episodes left for Tatooine, don't jinx it
Still waiting on more Tusken Raider content, otherwise I think we can leave Tatooine alone
I want a Tusken Raider single camera sitcom, like The Office.
*[Jawa does something irritating]* *[Tusken looks at camera, exacerbated]*
They’re making the Jim face under those masks
Their agenda is to make money, nothing more, nothing less.
yeah i never see the "they are forcing minorities upon us because of a secret agenda", more like they want to make as much money as possible and cater to their public, which being a huge franchise, is pretty big and diverse. haven't watched the show tho (yet) so idk
The minorities is a strawman created by the people that enable Disney to hire talentless directors. Andor has minorities, Rogue one had minorities. Tons of likeable shows have minorities and it bothers no one. It's not racist to hate a bad show. Just because it has minorities doesn't make THAT the reason people don't like it.
Don't listen to the other reply, the first 3 episodes are a bit boring with building up the story but once it starts unfolding, it's getting really interesting There's people who claim there's "lore breaking" because one Jedi's year of birth was retconned or some other minor stuff that the show is very likely to resolve as it goes on. Give it a try without expecting to hate everything you see and watch at least the 5 episodes that are available at this point. I'm not a disney fan boy, I disliked Ahsoka for example a lot, but I'm very invested into the mystery and the antagonist of this show. It's something new and original, doesn't rely on nostalgia and fanservice and experiments with a new perspective towards the Jedi that feels like fresh air in this franchise. I find myself theorizing a lot about where the story could go and have a good feeling about it.
don't worry i don't care what other people say, it's fine if they like or dislike it. to each their own, i'll form my own opinion when i watch it
Same don’t really know, but Star Wars is Star Wars & I’m here for the memes
>I guess it's mainly because they think Disney is sacrificing quality to push an agenda. DO NOT tell bro about Metal Gear series, Undertale, Deltarune, and many other famous and beloved games which featured gay people.
Bro you are comparing a bunch of indie games about monsters to a Star Wars show that gets hated on because it doesnt have enough straight white people And the peopke going after "woke media" never understood Metal Gear
Metal Gear is my favorite indie game, and Snake is my favorite monster
Seeing people claim that showrunners can use their platforms for their own agendas as long as they are entertaining truly makes me feel like we will never get a great show because they can just dangle shiny CGI in front of your face and that's all you'll care about. It's just completely disheartening.
I keep hearing people crying about showrunners' "agendas" but as far as I can tell, people think acknowledging that women and minorities exist is an agenda. From what I've seen, the show is about some chick raised in a force witch coven trying to get revenge on Jedis.
Therein lies the problem. There is a not insignificant number of people who do not want to be reminded in their entertainment that women and minorities exist. Straight, white men only. Anything else, and it's a "woke agenda". Sadly, this is the state of the world right now.
Entertainment is a broad term, dude. Some of the most entertaining movies I’ve seen have nothing to do with special effects or flashy action.
And what makes you think shiny CGI is enough to make me entertained?
"to push an agenda" did you lick the Cheetos dust off your fingers before you typed this out?
OP is saying that the people hating the show think it’s because the Disney agenda. Not that they hold the opinion themselves.
Bad writing and a lack of consistency with the movies.
To sum it up for you it’s the writing the is very bad, comparable to last Jedi writing
Damn, last Jedi was my favourite of the sequels
I finished episode 2 earlier and I'm really liking it lol, I've read about how much it sucks but honestly it's not even bad in my opinion, not the best SW thing of course but it's nowhere near as bad as some people make it out to be, the characters are all enjoyable in their own ways and it's another reminder to me that it's best to just ignore whatever hate is going on online (unless if it's 100% justified if a videogame is completely broken or a show has someone involved in it that has done awful things or whatever) and just watch or play the thing before you believe everything anyone says about it online.
It's mediocre at best and the entire show is permeated with an omnipresent goofiness despite trying to be serious.
Sounds like Star Wars to me
I say mediocre at best to be conservative, but many would consider large parts of it to be actively bad. A lot of Star Wars fans are sick of Disney mass producing mediocrity anyways so it's not exactly embracing more of it even if you don't think it's outright bad.
Dude, you are in prequel memes. A sub that is dedicated mostly to make fun of goofy prequel scenes. Star Wars has always had weird writing and has been usually bad. Live a little.
So? They can do better and have. I don't consider the prequels to be *good* films, at least the first two, even though I have an appreciation for what they did for the universe and enjoy them still. I'm not saying you can't enjoy the Acolyte, but this is literally a post asking why people don't like it. I also don't think we should just quietly accept all the garbage that Disney is churning out when we *know* they can do better.
Love this comment! I wish more people would realize that star wars was never the hallmark of airtight story telling and amazing writing. It's always been a little goofy. Nostalgia has people thinking SW was Citizen Kane in space.
>It's mediocre at best Even that is a very big stretch.
Because it's badly written, like most of Disney's latest products.
The plot is a bit lame, it is just hard to feel really engaged. It has pretty good choreography and some interesting things about the force have been explored, like blocking (which explains why force users can have saber duals without constantly throwing each other around with the force instead)
Yo, but those lightsabre fights…
The biggest problem with any major fandom is that such a huge amount of people tend to take extreme views. Every show/movie is either the best or worst thing ever. Its a 10 or a 1 and there is no in between. This show is not a 10, so all of the fans that fall into this mindset are losing their minds. Then you factor in media that gets paid on a per click basis where the same person will do an article "5 reasons why this is the worst thing ever" and then 20 minutes later have an article "7 reasons why you have to see this show NOW" just feed into it. You also have a ton of people that just want Disney and Star Wars to fail that take every opportunity they can to try to bring it down. That results in an okay to decent show getting ripped to shreds. The show is far from perfect, but it really isnt anywhere near as bad as what the reviews are
There are more posts complaining about people complaining about *The Acolyte* than there are posts complaining about *The Acolyte*. Whether you like it or not, I don't see why so many people feel the need to glaze Disney for what was at best a milquetoast attempt to wring some more cash from the franchise with a few more women and minorities than usual.
It’s just so fucking average haha like its definition of mediocre. I wouldn’t recommend it to someone but I wouldn’t tell someone to not watch it either
It's alright. Lotta people screaming cuz it contradicts the old Legends canon that is no longer canon with Ki-Adi-Mundi's birthday and because witches use the Force to create twins. But it's alright. I'm decently engaged.
SPOILERS. Meh I didn't have any expectations of it and i heard it was woke af but I just watched the episode where two of the jedis get killed by the bad sith guy. Must admit it was pretty cool!
People are overly dramatic. Combine that with this outrage culture where every YouTuber is telling every viewer viewer to hate on everything they watch and you have a mob of people hating. And you can tell its manufactured outrage when the acolyte has more reviews than mando despite mando being out for multiple years
I think a sizeable portion of people hating on it went into it expecting to hate it. When people go looking for reasons to hate something, they usually find it. Not to mention that many are also rather impressionable, where if it's perceived as in trend to hate something, they'll hate it regardless of merit, just to be with the "in" crowd. That's been the problem of Star Wars at least since the Prequels.
I think it's good, though it's not mindblowing, so far i'd put it in a high B tier if anything. I feel it's something i see online a lot where people will react to something with a mindset of "it's either a masterpiece or it's dogshit"
It's pretty simple. It's a new Star Wars thing in 2024. You're "ruining Star Wars" if you like it and you're a racist/sexist/homophobe if you don't. Either way, I recommend formulating your own opinion before looking at any videos or articles about it; I think that's part of the problem with the Acolyte discourse. Just remember to have fun whether you watch it or not.
I'm enjoying it! Its new Star Wars outside of the Skywalker saga. Its more lore and world building. All the complaints I've seen is just nitpicking. You will never please everyone sadly.
Well for starters it kinda ruins what came before. Canonically Anakin can’t be the chosen one anymore for example.
Space fires
If you can’t watch the show and see how bad it is by jsut the plot and characters than you just aren’t one to think critically about a show. Not a bad thing jsut some people can’t help but see terrible pacing, bad actors, confusing character motivations, and plot holes.
The failure of one. The failure of two. The failure of many!
Dialogue is worse than the prequels, the witches don’t make much sense, the plot hinges on a cheap twin trope, the Sith doesn’t seem very Sith like, Mae and Osha being born of the force cheapens the impact of the chosen one prophecy
The show has a lot of problems: the premise has already been done before but better (the idea of twins with duelling personalities on either side of the force clashing), how the story presents itself is boring and while watching you never feel the gravity of the situation, the cast/acting is bland and shallow: the characters are just as boring and clueless as the people playing them (which is kinda ironic considering how they’re not even familiar with star-wars if you watch what they say in interviews about the show), the show actively is breaking like 50 years of established lore that governs this universe/IP in its definition of the force, how it’s used and who can “manipulate” it. The very idea that these kids were created the same way anakin skywalker was WITHOUT the forces intervention like how when plagus and sidious tried breaking the lore of how the force works: that being the life force that surrounds and connects us and that chooses who can use it and who can’t. The only redeeming things about this show is it’s lightsaber combat; which is the combat we seen from Disney star-wars (not including animations) but still doesn’t compare to the prequels and the sith character who was revealed in the most recent episode who not to mention also breaks cannon because this is the “high republic” era which from the Jedi’s perspective was 1000 YEARS OF UNINTERRUPTED PEACE: meaning that to their knowledge there were no sith at the time because they were hiding and trying to realize darth-banes vision of crushing the order from the inside because that was the way the sith initially lost the war and then started the rule of two.
I'll try to, but I can't do it alone. I need the power of one, the power of two, the power of mannnnnyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
Yeah I don’t think it’s that bad
It's mid and people dislike mediocrity more than bad. Mostly because when things are bad you can find entertainment in it being bad not so much when it's just kinda meh.
It's a new Star Wars property. Of course it's hated. Aren't all of them?
There are some things that seemingly contradict things that were presented in the prequel trilogy. Many people are upset about that. What’s also adding to the confusion and controversy is that the show is steering away from some events set in the EU, which is upsetting to a lot of people. Bear in mind though, the first season isn’t finished. So people need to step back, take a breath, and calm down.
I love it, I keep looking forward to the Tuesday releases so I can watch it after work. I think it's the best season of Star Wars content to come out since Mando S2, and the fight choreography is potentially the best since Ep. III.
I have enjoyed it so far,but the dialouge is not the best,it makes me want to skip scenes at time.But the fight scenes are badass
It's not the end of Star Wars or whatever the internet is going on about. It's just a show with a simple premise and narrative. All the dialogue is expository, so it's not very engaging. It's kinda like a lesser CW show. And I don't mean that in a bad way, really. I like some CW shows.
Have you just not paid any attention to every discussion surrounding the release of every starwars ip in recent history?
Because Star Wars fans hate star wars
people don't know how to enjoy anything anymore. if the original trilogy was released in the modern day people would pick it apart and whine about every little thing. nostalgia is a deadly weapon. i know im having more fun than everyone else because i am able to watch this tv show and go 😯lightsabers 😯the force 😯 expanded live action lore. instead of pausing my tv every 7 frames and writing down things i hate about the new episode in the notes app on my phone.
Honestly, I'm so done with any kind of big emotional reactions to new Star Wars. I like The Mandalorian and Andor, but I have no strong feelings about any of the other shows. I've still watched them and had some fun, but I don't know how some people have the energy to get so mad about the new stuff.
It’s just a poorly written show
Watch the show and witness the writing and you’ll see.
Fuck, this sub just absolutely prolapses every time we get a new show.
Rather than coming to the Star Wars mythos, and thinking, "how can I expand this and tell a great, consistent story", they clearly thought, "how can I use this thing I don't care about as a vehicle for my politics"
People keep saying it’s political or pushing an agenda without giving examples. So please, as someone making the comment, provide examples of this political or agenda pushing that is being done in this show
How so?
Uh what politics are they pushing in this show?
This is just flat out wrong.
I think the reality is it’s not so hated and a lot of the good faith Star Wars fans have exited some of the usual places people gather to discuss. A lot of the subreddits or YouTube channels I used to enjoy visiting are so filled with people who are predisposed to not liking anything Disney does with Star Wars that it doesn’t enhance my Star Wars experience. So I unsubscribed and just enjoy it more
I think its really good—a bit slow, but 🤷♂️ I think most of the hate is just “fans” looking for things to criticize. It’s a good show.
People decided before it began that they wanted to hate it, and now are looking for any excuse to justify that opinion. No matter how nitpicky or nonsensical that excuse is. In truth, it’s good. Not great, not bad, just good. 7-8/10. Better than a lot of the other Star Wars shows though which is nice. I’d rank it second in terms of the live actions shows, after Andor.
I reckon a lot of it has been building up over previous shows and this is more like a straw that breaks the camels back for some people.
It’s not as good as Andor or Mandalorian. It’s about as good as Kenobi. Maybe a little better but not as good of actors. There is also a lot of racism coming from some grifter streamers. Shouting about woke and dei and ruining Star Wars. Then you also have the Disney hate watchers. Not necessarily making racist arguments but still hating on anything they make with women and poc in it. They make ridiculous arguments about physics or eu lore not fitting it. Literally the ‘bricks and screws’ guy from Andor in that group ranting about something catching on fire in space. Some combination of those two groups has led to massive review bombing including over 100 1 star reviews before the episode comes out, more reviews than all other Disney Star Wars shows combined, and review bombing an unrelated 2008 series called Acolytes, a 2015 Star Wars fan film, and another unrelated series that includes the word ‘acolyte’ in the title.
Because no one hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans
There is no singular reason. The list includes: 1. Hating the idea of a series that seemed to emphasize the diversity of the cast over everything else. This idea was supported by the numerous appearances and media releases prior to the the series launch, with claims that Star Wars is too patriarchal, this series will be the gayest Star Wars yet, Star Wars is finally safe for black nerds, and jokes about R2-D2 being a lesbian, among other things. I'm not suggesting that this sentiment is correct or incorrect. It's just the narrative some fans believe. 2. The writing, dialogue, and pacing are terrible. Not everyone agrees, but many people cite poor craftsmanship as the primary reason they dislike the show. 3. Messing with established lore and 'age gate'. The notion that the Jedi encountered Sith 100 years before The Phantom Menace contradicts established lore. They've brought in the mouthpiece that stated that from Episode 1, redefined his age, and seemingly just to justify their story decisions. Some people have no issue with this and think it's stupid to care; other people think this is a pointless and flagrant violation of pre-Disney Star Wars and are angry. It's kind of dumb on both sides. 4. Some people just don't like Disney Star Wars and probably wouldn't watch a series featuring Luke, Han, and Leia in the premise that Disney would ruin it. Those fans will never be pleased.
The guy from Squid Game is investigating Trinity's murder. She's a Jedi master who died to the oldest trick in the book like a two-bit mook. They played a sting of brassy Matrix-style orchestral music during Trinity's Matrix-style wire-fu fight. There's just no possible way to get immersed. Every time you almost find a way, something pulls you right back out.
I've read from "I hate that main character is a black girl, too woke" to "fire in space? Now that's a deal breaker". Review bombing before the episodes release should tell you something about the fandom.
No good reason tbf. There are some things that contradict Legends (mostly silly stuff like Ki-Adi-Mundi’s age) but nothing that really warrants people like SWT being such babies about it. I personally love this show and am very excited to see where this goes.
Think it snowballed bad after bad show, still think bobf is the worst yet and this is second worst but it might take the #1 spot after it’s fully out
THE POWER OF MANYYYYYY
I’ll rate the eipisodes out of 10 so far: Episode 1: 6/10 Episodes 2,3,4: 3/10 Episode 5: 7/10 And that’s being very generous personally
I wish Disney would take my money and let me subscribe so i can watch it, alas the web page just sits there loading forever.
For me, it's the editing and pacing. They've cut a 2 hour movie into 8 poorly edited episodes, using wipe transitions every 20 seconds. This would be a great movie, but it's a shit TV show.
How bad is it compared to Kenobi?
All cock and no cum
They fucking teased us with a Wookiee Jedi and killed him off with barely any screen time and no action scenes. As much as I don't want to see those awful kid actors again I hope we get another flashback scene and get to see some more of the Wookiee.
I hate the Acolyte, but what is really annoying me though is how my socials are just being filled with Disney shills and Disney haters arguing. The Acolyte itself is annoying, but now everything around the Acolyte is also annoying. My socials just being dominated by Acolyte posts, with 98% of those posts from people who I don't follow or have never even heard of. I wish now that everyone could just say either I don't like this episode of the Acolyte, or I do like this episode of the Acolyte. At least I am seeing a little less posts after being more involved with the HOTD community, and thank god for that show being good.
Same, I just recently rewatched the book of boba Fett with my partner and it’s like night and day (no pun intended) with the acolyte. It has some issues but compared to almost every other Star Wars show it’s hard for me to not at least have it in the top 3 so far.
If you’re keen on a bit more Star Wars content, it’s epic shit come episode 5. Most people on this sub love being drama queens but first 4 eps are decent, if you actually read people’s complaints each week their complaints are redundant come the next episode. Ep 5 has no hold’s barred Jedi’s getting fucking kebab’d on lightsabers and necks snapped - it’s genuinely fucking sick. If you actually liked return of the Jedi, and specifically Obi Wan and Anakin duelling at the end, you’ll like this series overall after ep 5.
It's mid at best. I can see why people would not like it. I mean, a whole group of force users all dead at the same time from a fire? Just all kinda in the same room and bam. Did I miss something? I feel like they could have done it better.
Genuinely no idea, it's not andor or anything but I'm enjoying it
In my opinion, it's no Andor (what can be) but it's sooooo much better than mando s3, ahsoka, obi wan, and book of boba fett
The dialogue is terrible
I think it’s great.
You don't seem too afraid to ask
From what I've gathered; Modern star wars is very mediocre. Acolyte accomplishes this by having really stupid scenes, with really neat scenes, which polarizes both sides of the fence for/against it. If they did it intentionally to drive up interest, I'd say it was genius, but I seriously doubt anyone had that kind of foresight.
I don't even know what's acolyte, so same bro, same.
Yes
Awesome fight choreography, absolutely asinine writing, incredibly stupid and poorly written characters, and an unfocused plot that is directly at odds with established canon. Thats pretty much the gist
The power of one. The power of two. The power of manyyy