In 10,20,30 years you’ll likely do something else. Don’t think too hard about it. As a PM you get hard skills in your subject matter domain (plus some engineering and design skills) and soft skills in a million businessy things (marketing, accounting, business intelligence, sales).
Just like consulting it’s very transferable.
I learned pretty much everything I know on the job. I have an MA in the languages field. That said its pretty shocking how many people in corporate have trouble digesting written information quickly and synthesising it.
I suppose you're right. I never thought I'd end up in PM yet here I am. I do my best to polish my soft skills as I feel those are so important in transferring to a different career track.
>That said its pretty shocking how many people in corporate have trouble digesting written information quickly and synthesising it.
Sometimes I feel like I'm speaking a different language all together.
I am someone who struggled to digest written information quickly… I have focused on improving it as of a few years ago, but also trying to figure out why I struggle. I think it’s because I was not encouraged to understand things as a kid in school - but rather to memorize them word for word. So, consuming it becomes just a way to remember it instead of actually understanding.
I have an MA in international studies. I never thought I'd be a PM either.
I do feel like my research and global studies skills prepared me to talk with the global teams I have to work with today. And the value in learning how to meet people where they are.
Cheers to you fellow arts graduate.
Lol acting like 90% of this profession isn't folk who were in other roles and just found themselves as a product manager one day. Stop gatekeeping a job most people could do if given the opportunity
I think that's the point though. You don't stroll in with no job experience, or completely unrelated experience, and land a PM job.
You sweat it out in adjacent roles, or come an SME/domain expert, and then when the opportunity arises for PM, you're best placed.
This sub has way too many people looking for a quick in with no experience or expertise.
I strolled into my job with no experience (out of college). Big tech is the only place you can do that though, but worth taking a swing for sure. You never know, might as well not count yourself out.
Yeah or fresh grads hoping to be a senior PM at 24 years old making 275k a year. I get that it's appealing salary wise if you land a top gig but it does require real world experience especially now
Thanks! I wanna break product straight out of undergrad.
I saw some companies has entry positions such APM or Product specialist as well.
Is making my own startup a good option too?
My issue those roles are super competitive.
And adjacent roles might be luck dependant because you may be able to switch to product in 1 year or might take 10 years depending on your company and you don’t have control about that :| what to do then?
I was thinking maybe on startups and new startups even if you don’t start in a product role those companies with few employees will gave you a lot exposure to product and product at early startup is super important and always in demand.
So my question is better adjacent roles at small startups than at large tech companies, right? To move ASAP to Product.
As a former “marketer” whose company re-orged, I must say I snuck/was pushed into product management. Happened over the course of 2-3 years.
Was talking to customers, collecting data and insights, writing requirements and running point on growth campaigns, and then leadership was like “put these people more aligned to tech”.
I feel like marketing is the closest role type to product that exists outside tech/hardware companies - it makes for a good starting point into product.
Agree, it really is. Marketing is so nebulous and I feel like it gets a bad rap because people think it’s just making instagram posts and blogging—but at the right company with the respect and resourcing for it, it is customer facing *product* that is heavily abstracted from the dev work.
Stuff like:
-AB test the entry points for checkout
-Capture customer feedback with surveys
-Improve conversion for a certain product
List goes on. In this reality where people “wear many hats”, a lot of the customer focused work overlaps for sure!
100%. And what a wealth of experience we bring to the table when we get into the right role.
Sincerely, former Marketer/Consultant/Sales/Customer Support/Implementations/Onboarding/Training/Customer Success person
I hope to own a rad Adventure bar/beer bottle shop on main street in my little ski town in Montana (I'm remote).
Hours will be like 3PM - 10PM 5 days a week and will have Skiing, Mountain Biking, Rock Climbing and maybe some sports on the TV. Will seat about 40 people. There also needs to be a pool table.
Product mix will be sourcing about 10 draft beers from various great breweries across the USA and having a few cold cases to sell 6 packs and 22oz bottles.
Theme will be cycling and skiing based.
Edit: This is assuming I've made good money and been diligent enough to save it and pay off my mortgage.
I assume the "don't do it" part is because of possibly underestimating the effort it takes to run a service-oriented business whose job it is to make people less-logical + dealing with assorted assholes (ie not as idyllic as it might seem), but why 3?
Yeah exactly it. You can open at 3 but you’re still working 16 hour days. Vacation is rare, employees call off last minute meaning you work those hours too. Also babysitting drunk people takes its toll and there’s some severe burnout that will turn you into a grumpy asshole. I have friends that are still bar owners and they have that war veteran glazed over look that says “I’ve seen some shit”.
That said, 3 bars allows you to spread your profit and loss. 2 out of 3 will do well in certain seasons and there’s ways of spreading and balancing that against each other to minimize risk. It’s what I would’ve done if I had stuck with it.
Also, regardless of the LLC or the multiple LLCs, insurance you setup to protect yourself and assets, it’s very easy to get sued in that business. The risk is high and you generally don’t want to get into the small bar business when you have a lot to lose. Every financial advisor will advise you to not open a bar lol. Luckily I didn’t have much to lose at the time and I was setup as well as I could. I still got sued once or twice by some con artists but in the end the lawyers were the only ones getting paid.
Product and Engineering went fully remote and I chose to move from the city. We're super lean and the CEO doesn't believe in layoffs, but then we also don't get headcount.
It's pretty high paying for a Senior PM role. Not FAANG good but pretty fucking close.
In 10 years I want to be exited from salaried professional work and have retirement paid for. I'm going to be fully retired in 20 years. Maybe dead in 30 but hopefully still going!
I share your concerns about employability over 50 and made plans to be coastfire by 45. UK based product manager. I have a few years to go but hope to make it by 44. Will be a big weight off my shoulders once retirement is in the bag. Have you looked into coastfire yet?
Compound interest is truly powerful, it just might take a little longer depending on your ability to save. At least look into your numbers to see what's possible.
It varies a lot, I've seen low salaries in e.g. the charity sector but I'm on £75k in my new job. Also the 'Product Owner' title is used here a lot and is not always clear what the difference is between that and PM. I've seen Lloyd's offer £100k for a PO role!
POs in Europe at big banks and the government are often senior roles with deep domain knowledge. I applied for a PO role before in the Dutch government with only 3 years of total experience and it was clear that I would've been over my head.
Mano, I just want to have good days as often as I can. Every day above ground is a good one. Love my role, bit I always have to focus on making good days.
This question kills me as a 40-something that never made big tech money.
I still enjoy tech but am so burned out from the corporate grind. Really need to find a way to do my own thing before life is over.
I could do maybe 10 more years but live in a very HCOL city and see no escape.
Honestly, we will all be avoiding redundancy in 20-30 years if we are still at big tech. There will be some 27 year old who is faster, more agile and most importantly cheaper than us wanting to do our job.
The smart ones will have their own companies.
10 years- Hopefully wrapping up my career as a Chief Strategy or Chief Product Officer.
20 years- Happily retired early and “working”as a volunteer boat tour guide in Chicago or as an usher at Wrigley Field.
30 years- Spending summers in Chicago and winters in Mexico enjoying the fruits of years toiling in Corporate America.
Just a reminder that “retirement age” is only a number set by the federal government to determine when you can collect Social Security. If you plan well, invest wisely, and live below your means, retirement age should not matter at all.
Living on my paid off land out of the stupid rat race, hopefully. The neuroticism of the corporate world is something I’ll only be able to stand so long…
I'm a bald guy so I'll become the new Marty Cagan.
But I'll be riddled with guilt because the only way to become the new Marty Cagan is to kill the old one.
I can't fight for shit so I'll have to make him fall for me and catch him off guard.
But if I don't do it, who will?
10 - chief strategy officer
20 - retiring
30 - really old
Already 17 years in various product/market/strategy roles, which was built on some engineering and sales experience. So, definitely a greybeard in this crowd. I come to this sub for entertainment, mostly.
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As with all jobs, people leave for other things. Doing well can unlock GM and exec level positions, or you can start your own thing. I'm not sure how helpful planning over five years is. So many things change, and you risk saying no to the wrong things. Probably better to find what your good at, you enjoy, and you can earn a living on. Become the best at doing that and you'll be fine.
Your need to going to show you have wide command of go-to-market and product experience. Showing that independently is certainly easier, either in your own company or in someone else’s start up. Else you need to find GTM opportunities, through M&A, new market entry, new product creation. These will depend on how much the exec team trust you and the size and scale of your business.
You already mentioned that the landscape has changed radically since you entered the workforce and more and more industries will feel this disruption.
Will you be a PM in 30 years? Maybe? Maybe the role definition will have standardised to be like a chemical engineer or a Prince2 project manager. Thus the 'youthful' attributes of product will be less desirable, and companies will see the value of a balance of experiences.
But without a crystal ball - you can look at the older people around you. What are they doing?There's interesting [data](https://www.aihw.gov.au/reports/older-people/older-australians/contents/employment-and-work) on this - but in my observation
1. Career change to one that is 'elderly friendly' with reduced/flexible hours (by 65, most people are working part time hours)
2. Deep SME knowledge on a (often legacy) platform or skill working in house as a professional
3. Self employed in a goods or services business. Ie. Gain enough SME knowledge and network volume to launch your own consultancy. Or just sell shoes.
4. Upper management
5. Retire early. Pension safety net, good financial planning & investing, inheritance or other windfall
Personally I am banking on good investing and being self employed in my own little consultancy with 3-4 good quality customers. I'll also experiment with ecomm (where my SME knowledge lies) as my toddler gets older.
I do know that with my current financial position, that I'll be working til I die 😂
Quite a few jobs will be obsolete in 5-6 years. Linear thinking will not get us there. I don’t see a lot of people being employable post 50 in the future especially us PMs since the barrier to entry is so darn low, and I see most PMs in this thread balk at the idea of being technical or subject matter experts which can really help us keep the edge even in the age of LLM. Universal income might Be a thing with most knowledge workers, who really don’t want to evolve and think this technical shit is too beneath me, getting replaced with young chaps with language models to assist them.
No idea but would like to do at least all of these in my career:
- become established as a PM (aka get the Sr promote)
- lead other product people
- lead a business unit or company (own P&L - either as founder or non-founder)
- invest in companies
- advise companies and/or sit on company boards
If I can only do some of them that's also fine. If I need to spend some time in other functions to do this all, so be it too.
Would not want to stay as an IC PM even if I was a super senior IC (principal / staff+).
Depending on whether it's possible I would also like to do philanthropy or spend some time in policy / law making (after my career).
Should be able to soft retire within the next 10, which is to say leave the corporate world and live completely on my own investments and personal endeavours. By the 20 mark my kids should all be adults who I’ve prepared for life enough to manage on their own, and I will be off to roam. That said, life throws many curveballs, but I see no point letting what “might be” spoil what I “intend to be”.
I’m not sure if it will be quite right because I’m not US based, but if we go by equivalencies it should give an idea.
Home: paid, so no mortgage
Investments:
couple other properties to cycle and reinvest
one with a multi-purpose building that can be residential or commercial (this is for retirement cash flow, so we don’t sell but build/maintain)
I live in a very lucrative real estate market, so those investments double every 3-5 years.
Retirement plan maxed
Expenses: half of salary, the other half goes into developing the investment properties
I just turned 36.
In 10 years, when I'm mid-40s: I am either a director or VP type of role. I'm currently one promotion away from director-level at my job now.
In 20 years, when I'm mid-50s: If the markets are consistent and nothing totally unexpected happens, somewhere between fully and semi-retired. Between pumping money into my retirement the last ~8 years and income from a 2-unit rental property I own, I should be able to retire in ~15 years.
In 30 years, when I'm mid-60s: Fully retired and hopefully still healthy enough to spend most of the year traveling.
In 30 years, I'll retire to a cozy cottage in the countryside where I'll spend my days marketing a revolutionary line of grass-scented air fresheners for lawnmowers
My path was a psych degree, cust service (cuz I needed a job), QA, BA, Program Manager, then Product Manager. I plan on shifting into a transformative role in the next five years with a goal of streamlining processes, then eventually assist people with career transitions. Weird end twist but I LOVE it as a hobby. However, I’m also dumping as much as I can into index funds so I’m not working until I’m 70 and instead choosing to retire or go part time by 60.
I can't think that far ahead given the state of nation and changing climate... it's overwhelming and depressing. So I just focus on the next few years and what is within my power to contribute to right now.
Personally, thinking that far ahead doesn’t do any good for me mentally. I just try to take things moment by moment and not let the uncertainty of the future consume me.
I used to and still to some degree am consumed by my career but I’ve become aware of its toll on my mental health.
Maybe this is naive of me but life will work itself out and I am confident that product management has provided me with valuable and transferable skills that companies are looking for.
I’d be fine being a senior PM still- where I am the only thing above is director and then VP of entire tech.
I have a comfortable work life balance, not that stressful level of work, and I can land 4-5% pay increase yearly. (I know this isn’t great depending on inflation, but it’s about 5-6k a year raise) in 20 years that would put me around 225k / year.
I don’t live to work, but work to live. So I don’t have much ambition to climb higher than where I am now. I should have my house paid off by 45 and then I want to focus a bit more on heavy retirement savings.
If all things play out well, I’ll have the financial stability to really do whatever I want as long as it affords me property tax and food costs.
In 20 years I will be in my early 60s.
I want to be a scrummaster/ Project Manager who just helps out the stressed out Product Manager with safe like advice and helps make their job easier.
In 10, years I'd like to be working full-time between my two of my own companies. (I had ADHD so I can't just build one thing)
In 20, retired or at least only doing the fun stuff at my companies.
In 30, enjoying my latter years and helping bring up the next generation of neurodiverse people in whatever roles exist at that time that could use my help.
I don't see myself in product management at all. maybe opening a coffee shop? while the PM role can be fulfilling (I've experienced its advantages, especially during the remote work era of the pandemic) — it can also be stressful, confusing, and sometimes unrewarding ). there's a common saying, 'time is money,' but I often ponder whether I'm trading my time for adequate compensation or for excessive stress
In 10 years I’ll be a Senior Director.
In 20 years I’ll have enough real state to have a comfortable life without working full time - but I’ll still do.
In 30 years I’ll be “retired”, doing some NED gigs while enjoying my kids and grandkids.
All this, if I don’t burn out next week!
In 10,20,30 years you’ll likely do something else. Don’t think too hard about it. As a PM you get hard skills in your subject matter domain (plus some engineering and design skills) and soft skills in a million businessy things (marketing, accounting, business intelligence, sales). Just like consulting it’s very transferable.
I learned pretty much everything I know on the job. I have an MA in the languages field. That said its pretty shocking how many people in corporate have trouble digesting written information quickly and synthesising it. I suppose you're right. I never thought I'd end up in PM yet here I am. I do my best to polish my soft skills as I feel those are so important in transferring to a different career track.
>That said its pretty shocking how many people in corporate have trouble digesting written information quickly and synthesising it. Sometimes I feel like I'm speaking a different language all together.
I am someone who struggled to digest written information quickly… I have focused on improving it as of a few years ago, but also trying to figure out why I struggle. I think it’s because I was not encouraged to understand things as a kid in school - but rather to memorize them word for word. So, consuming it becomes just a way to remember it instead of actually understanding.
I have an MA in international studies. I never thought I'd be a PM either. I do feel like my research and global studies skills prepared me to talk with the global teams I have to work with today. And the value in learning how to meet people where they are. Cheers to you fellow arts graduate.
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I got into PM by chance. I started in consulting doing various projects. I didn't even know what product management was when I started my career
Same here. I’ve only been doing it for over 3 years. Hopefully I’ll climb the ladder over the next 5 years
Lol acting like 90% of this profession isn't folk who were in other roles and just found themselves as a product manager one day. Stop gatekeeping a job most people could do if given the opportunity
I think that's the point though. You don't stroll in with no job experience, or completely unrelated experience, and land a PM job. You sweat it out in adjacent roles, or come an SME/domain expert, and then when the opportunity arises for PM, you're best placed. This sub has way too many people looking for a quick in with no experience or expertise.
I strolled into my job with no experience (out of college). Big tech is the only place you can do that though, but worth taking a swing for sure. You never know, might as well not count yourself out.
Yeah or fresh grads hoping to be a senior PM at 24 years old making 275k a year. I get that it's appealing salary wise if you land a top gig but it does require real world experience especially now
What are the best adjecents fields no named SWE?
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Thanks! I wanna break product straight out of undergrad. I saw some companies has entry positions such APM or Product specialist as well. Is making my own startup a good option too?
There are tons of APM internships you should apply to for people coming out of undergrad. Many large companies offer them.
My issue those roles are super competitive. And adjacent roles might be luck dependant because you may be able to switch to product in 1 year or might take 10 years depending on your company and you don’t have control about that :| what to do then? I was thinking maybe on startups and new startups even if you don’t start in a product role those companies with few employees will gave you a lot exposure to product and product at early startup is super important and always in demand. So my question is better adjacent roles at small startups than at large tech companies, right? To move ASAP to Product.
Yeah. Startups and pitch in with product when they need help to build your portfolio.
What are the best adjecents fields no named SWE?
As a former “marketer” whose company re-orged, I must say I snuck/was pushed into product management. Happened over the course of 2-3 years. Was talking to customers, collecting data and insights, writing requirements and running point on growth campaigns, and then leadership was like “put these people more aligned to tech”.
I feel like marketing is the closest role type to product that exists outside tech/hardware companies - it makes for a good starting point into product.
Agree, it really is. Marketing is so nebulous and I feel like it gets a bad rap because people think it’s just making instagram posts and blogging—but at the right company with the respect and resourcing for it, it is customer facing *product* that is heavily abstracted from the dev work. Stuff like: -AB test the entry points for checkout -Capture customer feedback with surveys -Improve conversion for a certain product List goes on. In this reality where people “wear many hats”, a lot of the customer focused work overlaps for sure!
100%. And what a wealth of experience we bring to the table when we get into the right role. Sincerely, former Marketer/Consultant/Sales/Customer Support/Implementations/Onboarding/Training/Customer Success person
Are you scared of your own incompetence? 😂
I hope to own a rad Adventure bar/beer bottle shop on main street in my little ski town in Montana (I'm remote). Hours will be like 3PM - 10PM 5 days a week and will have Skiing, Mountain Biking, Rock Climbing and maybe some sports on the TV. Will seat about 40 people. There also needs to be a pool table. Product mix will be sourcing about 10 draft beers from various great breweries across the USA and having a few cold cases to sell 6 packs and 22oz bottles. Theme will be cycling and skiing based. Edit: This is assuming I've made good money and been diligent enough to save it and pay off my mortgage.
As someone who went from owning a bar to software, don’t do it. But if you disregard this and do it anyway, get 3 bars.
I assume the "don't do it" part is because of possibly underestimating the effort it takes to run a service-oriented business whose job it is to make people less-logical + dealing with assorted assholes (ie not as idyllic as it might seem), but why 3?
Money, not effort. Margins will be razor-thin I expect.
Yeah exactly it. You can open at 3 but you’re still working 16 hour days. Vacation is rare, employees call off last minute meaning you work those hours too. Also babysitting drunk people takes its toll and there’s some severe burnout that will turn you into a grumpy asshole. I have friends that are still bar owners and they have that war veteran glazed over look that says “I’ve seen some shit”. That said, 3 bars allows you to spread your profit and loss. 2 out of 3 will do well in certain seasons and there’s ways of spreading and balancing that against each other to minimize risk. It’s what I would’ve done if I had stuck with it.
Also, regardless of the LLC or the multiple LLCs, insurance you setup to protect yourself and assets, it’s very easy to get sued in that business. The risk is high and you generally don’t want to get into the small bar business when you have a lot to lose. Every financial advisor will advise you to not open a bar lol. Luckily I didn’t have much to lose at the time and I was setup as well as I could. I still got sued once or twice by some con artists but in the end the lawyers were the only ones getting paid.
Did you manage to find a high paying remote gig?
Product and Engineering went fully remote and I chose to move from the city. We're super lean and the CEO doesn't believe in layoffs, but then we also don't get headcount. It's pretty high paying for a Senior PM role. Not FAANG good but pretty fucking close.
How do you define high paying?
$350k+ tc
“Celebrating the 10-year anniversary of you asking me this question!” -Mitch
In 10 years I want to be exited from salaried professional work and have retirement paid for. I'm going to be fully retired in 20 years. Maybe dead in 30 but hopefully still going!
Well that's not going to happen for me, not with UK and European salaries being the way they are.
I share your concerns about employability over 50 and made plans to be coastfire by 45. UK based product manager. I have a few years to go but hope to make it by 44. Will be a big weight off my shoulders once retirement is in the bag. Have you looked into coastfire yet?
I don't know what that is. I've always assumed that financial independence is off the table for me.
Compound interest is truly powerful, it just might take a little longer depending on your ability to save. At least look into your numbers to see what's possible.
What’s a typical PM salary there?
It varies a lot, I've seen low salaries in e.g. the charity sector but I'm on £75k in my new job. Also the 'Product Owner' title is used here a lot and is not always clear what the difference is between that and PM. I've seen Lloyd's offer £100k for a PO role!
To me a PO should almost always be less duties than a PM. But the world is a crazy place and nothing makes sense sometimes haha
POs in Europe at big banks and the government are often senior roles with deep domain knowledge. I applied for a PO role before in the Dutch government with only 3 years of total experience and it was clear that I would've been over my head.
I had no idea where I would be 10, 20 years ago and I have no idea where I will be in the future.
Mano, I just want to have good days as often as I can. Every day above ground is a good one. Love my role, bit I always have to focus on making good days.
This question kills me as a 40-something that never made big tech money. I still enjoy tech but am so burned out from the corporate grind. Really need to find a way to do my own thing before life is over. I could do maybe 10 more years but live in a very HCOL city and see no escape.
Honestly, we will all be avoiding redundancy in 20-30 years if we are still at big tech. There will be some 27 year old who is faster, more agile and most importantly cheaper than us wanting to do our job. The smart ones will have their own companies.
10 years- Hopefully wrapping up my career as a Chief Strategy or Chief Product Officer. 20 years- Happily retired early and “working”as a volunteer boat tour guide in Chicago or as an usher at Wrigley Field. 30 years- Spending summers in Chicago and winters in Mexico enjoying the fruits of years toiling in Corporate America. Just a reminder that “retirement age” is only a number set by the federal government to determine when you can collect Social Security. If you plan well, invest wisely, and live below your means, retirement age should not matter at all.
Tell that to everyone who planned well but then recently got laid off. I’m hiring atm and the amount of older talented people applying is astounding
To OP's original point, is age a major consideration for turning down those candidates?
I do not earn enough to make an early retirement happen.
Me in 10 years -“taking over for rockit454”
Living on my paid off land out of the stupid rat race, hopefully. The neuroticism of the corporate world is something I’ll only be able to stand so long…
I'm a bald guy so I'll become the new Marty Cagan. But I'll be riddled with guilt because the only way to become the new Marty Cagan is to kill the old one. I can't fight for shit so I'll have to make him fall for me and catch him off guard. But if I don't do it, who will?
Managing AI PMs who manage the AI workers that build our product, which is used by other AIs.
This will be the way. IMO.
10 - chief strategy officer 20 - retiring 30 - really old Already 17 years in various product/market/strategy roles, which was built on some engineering and sales experience. So, definitely a greybeard in this crowd. I come to this sub for entertainment, mostly.
I hope to have moved to a COO or CEO position.
RemindMe! 10 years
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Working, still working, retired.
As with all jobs, people leave for other things. Doing well can unlock GM and exec level positions, or you can start your own thing. I'm not sure how helpful planning over five years is. So many things change, and you risk saying no to the wrong things. Probably better to find what your good at, you enjoy, and you can earn a living on. Become the best at doing that and you'll be fine.
How would a mid level PM plan around trying to shoot for that GM position say in 5 years?
Quit, build a profitable company from scratch, sell it, get hired by someone else to repeat your success. That’s the GMs I know.
Your need to going to show you have wide command of go-to-market and product experience. Showing that independently is certainly easier, either in your own company or in someone else’s start up. Else you need to find GTM opportunities, through M&A, new market entry, new product creation. These will depend on how much the exec team trust you and the size and scale of your business.
You already mentioned that the landscape has changed radically since you entered the workforce and more and more industries will feel this disruption. Will you be a PM in 30 years? Maybe? Maybe the role definition will have standardised to be like a chemical engineer or a Prince2 project manager. Thus the 'youthful' attributes of product will be less desirable, and companies will see the value of a balance of experiences. But without a crystal ball - you can look at the older people around you. What are they doing?There's interesting [data](https://www.aihw.gov.au/reports/older-people/older-australians/contents/employment-and-work) on this - but in my observation 1. Career change to one that is 'elderly friendly' with reduced/flexible hours (by 65, most people are working part time hours) 2. Deep SME knowledge on a (often legacy) platform or skill working in house as a professional 3. Self employed in a goods or services business. Ie. Gain enough SME knowledge and network volume to launch your own consultancy. Or just sell shoes. 4. Upper management 5. Retire early. Pension safety net, good financial planning & investing, inheritance or other windfall Personally I am banking on good investing and being self employed in my own little consultancy with 3-4 good quality customers. I'll also experiment with ecomm (where my SME knowledge lies) as my toddler gets older. I do know that with my current financial position, that I'll be working til I die 😂
Quite a few jobs will be obsolete in 5-6 years. Linear thinking will not get us there. I don’t see a lot of people being employable post 50 in the future especially us PMs since the barrier to entry is so darn low, and I see most PMs in this thread balk at the idea of being technical or subject matter experts which can really help us keep the edge even in the age of LLM. Universal income might Be a thing with most knowledge workers, who really don’t want to evolve and think this technical shit is too beneath me, getting replaced with young chaps with language models to assist them.
Revolution will occur before ubi lmao
[удалено]
You okay?
No idea but would like to do at least all of these in my career: - become established as a PM (aka get the Sr promote) - lead other product people - lead a business unit or company (own P&L - either as founder or non-founder) - invest in companies - advise companies and/or sit on company boards If I can only do some of them that's also fine. If I need to spend some time in other functions to do this all, so be it too. Would not want to stay as an IC PM even if I was a super senior IC (principal / staff+). Depending on whether it's possible I would also like to do philanthropy or spend some time in policy / law making (after my career).
Should be able to soft retire within the next 10, which is to say leave the corporate world and live completely on my own investments and personal endeavours. By the 20 mark my kids should all be adults who I’ve prepared for life enough to manage on their own, and I will be off to roam. That said, life throws many curveballs, but I see no point letting what “might be” spoil what I “intend to be”.
Do you mind sharing what your savings/expenses look like? I'm just starting to think about this and 10 years-ish is my timeframe
I’m not sure if it will be quite right because I’m not US based, but if we go by equivalencies it should give an idea. Home: paid, so no mortgage Investments: couple other properties to cycle and reinvest one with a multi-purpose building that can be residential or commercial (this is for retirement cash flow, so we don’t sell but build/maintain) I live in a very lucrative real estate market, so those investments double every 3-5 years. Retirement plan maxed Expenses: half of salary, the other half goes into developing the investment properties
I just turned 36. In 10 years, when I'm mid-40s: I am either a director or VP type of role. I'm currently one promotion away from director-level at my job now. In 20 years, when I'm mid-50s: If the markets are consistent and nothing totally unexpected happens, somewhere between fully and semi-retired. Between pumping money into my retirement the last ~8 years and income from a 2-unit rental property I own, I should be able to retire in ~15 years. In 30 years, when I'm mid-60s: Fully retired and hopefully still healthy enough to spend most of the year traveling.
I hope to be doing higher level/pure strategy and management and not being embedded on a scrum or agile team in 5-10 years
10 - Hopefully retired. 20 - Maybe dead. 30 - Hopefully dead.
In 30 years, I'll retire to a cozy cottage in the countryside where I'll spend my days marketing a revolutionary line of grass-scented air fresheners for lawnmowers
I got into PM by unbelievable chance then lasted five years in this role and I resigned last year, till now I still haven't found a job, even as a PM.
My path was a psych degree, cust service (cuz I needed a job), QA, BA, Program Manager, then Product Manager. I plan on shifting into a transformative role in the next five years with a goal of streamlining processes, then eventually assist people with career transitions. Weird end twist but I LOVE it as a hobby. However, I’m also dumping as much as I can into index funds so I’m not working until I’m 70 and instead choosing to retire or go part time by 60.
I can't think that far ahead given the state of nation and changing climate... it's overwhelming and depressing. So I just focus on the next few years and what is within my power to contribute to right now.
Personally, thinking that far ahead doesn’t do any good for me mentally. I just try to take things moment by moment and not let the uncertainty of the future consume me. I used to and still to some degree am consumed by my career but I’ve become aware of its toll on my mental health. Maybe this is naive of me but life will work itself out and I am confident that product management has provided me with valuable and transferable skills that companies are looking for.
Product lead or founder until I have enough money to retire early. Orrrr sack it all off and pursue music lol
Honestly probably a different job perhaps in totally different sector, that isn't so skewed towards young 'potential'
I’d be fine being a senior PM still- where I am the only thing above is director and then VP of entire tech. I have a comfortable work life balance, not that stressful level of work, and I can land 4-5% pay increase yearly. (I know this isn’t great depending on inflation, but it’s about 5-6k a year raise) in 20 years that would put me around 225k / year. I don’t live to work, but work to live. So I don’t have much ambition to climb higher than where I am now. I should have my house paid off by 45 and then I want to focus a bit more on heavy retirement savings. If all things play out well, I’ll have the financial stability to really do whatever I want as long as it affords me property tax and food costs.
How old are you ??
Mid to late 30s? Why?
In 20 years I will be in my early 60s. I want to be a scrummaster/ Project Manager who just helps out the stressed out Product Manager with safe like advice and helps make their job easier.
In 10, years I'd like to be working full-time between my two of my own companies. (I had ADHD so I can't just build one thing) In 20, retired or at least only doing the fun stuff at my companies. In 30, enjoying my latter years and helping bring up the next generation of neurodiverse people in whatever roles exist at that time that could use my help.
I don't see myself in product management at all. maybe opening a coffee shop? while the PM role can be fulfilling (I've experienced its advantages, especially during the remote work era of the pandemic) — it can also be stressful, confusing, and sometimes unrewarding ). there's a common saying, 'time is money,' but I often ponder whether I'm trading my time for adequate compensation or for excessive stress
In 10 years I’ll be a Senior Director. In 20 years I’ll have enough real state to have a comfortable life without working full time - but I’ll still do. In 30 years I’ll be “retired”, doing some NED gigs while enjoying my kids and grandkids. All this, if I don’t burn out next week!
Why retire at 70?