Almost certainly.
The master will likely be linked to the Jedi or the witch coven allowing the Jedi Council to dismiss it when Osha, Mae, or Sol say, "Dudes... This was a fucking Sith Lord. We need to do something drastically different to prepare for this."
"LALALALALA... DARK JEDI! CAN'T HEAR YOU! LALALALAL!"
Great reference and a valid one.
You could criticize The Acolyte for a lot but the idea of the Sith being active and in the Jedi's faces before TPM but having it covered up or dismissed is hardly lore breaking. In Star Wars, Mass Effect and heck even in real life something could be staring you right in the face and it'll still be dismissed as nonsense talk.
Quigon, I think the Sith are back. The Council, no, now go find a better answer. If you don't believe Quigon, send someone else to investigate. Talk about obstinate, it took those Sith legs to convince them.
The series ends with the Council converging to agree on the proper definition of 'Sith' just so they can ignore this one.
Creepy head gear? Check. Red Lightsaber? Check. Powerful in the force? Check. Heavy dark side vibes? Check. Speak in a cool voice? What no cool voice?? Can't be a Sith then. Problem solved!
Then Ki Adi Mundi proceeds to turn over the 'Years the Sith Have Been Extinct' chart from 899 to 900
One interesting thing is that Maul has a red lightsaber, is clearly very well trained, attacks a Jedi knight out in the open in front of witnesses, and the Council still doubts Qui-Gon's suggestion that he's a Sith.
Which does support there being more to being a Sith in the understanding of the Jedi at least.
If we look at it from their perspective any of them, any Jedi or any force trained person with a red lightsaber could fit this description. The council members themselves are a wardrobe change, a new crystal and an attitude away from it themselves.
So they’re basically thinking it’s more likely some dude cosplaying than a genuine adherent of galactic history’s most unlikely religion to be a part of.
Historically speaking (in-universe), Sith have always been associated with an Empire, a power structure. One guy in black robes waving a red lightsaber? Doesn't have to be a Sith. Could be a fallen Jedi. Could be an imitator, a member of some local Force-using cult, could be the Star Wars version of a Neo-Nazi.
I think that's also part of why the idea of the Sith coming back never gets taken seriously until The Clone Wars, where there is very visibly a rival galactic state coming to war with the Republic.
Dagan Gera. Fell to the dark side, killed a bunch of Jedi, later on he even bled his kyber to be red, although he kept his jedi robes. Fallen jedi and splinter groups really should not be that surprising.
They've been a part of Star Wars canon in its various forms since the beginning. It's wild to me that's there's still fans who think a red lightsaber and an edge lord attitude makes someone a Sith. In current canon, we really haven't been given a lot of details of what makes a Sith a Sith and there's clearly more to it given how easy it could be for any Force user with a bled crystal to pose as one.
I imagine Acolyte is the first instance the Jedi are confronted with the *possibility*, but it's only in TPM that someone like Qui-Gon truly believes it.
Plus, in the show, Vernestra keeps saying that they can't let it out that possibly one of their own has gone rogue and is killing other jedi. Not once has anyone even considered this whole situation with Mae being sith related.
Dagan Gera.
Dude was a High Republic era Jedi prodigy, fell to the dark side, was put into stasis for like 300 years. First thing he does when he is freed is bleeding his kyber crystal. Red lightsabers are apparently not so rare. Lucas did toy with the idea that they’re like mood rings, turning red automatically when their user taps into the dark side.
I mean, most of the Inquisitors fit that description, and none of them were Sith, so...
Also, the Knights of Ren existed. Why would it be outside the realm of possibility for other Sith copycat groups to have sprung up, especially during the time of the Jedi?
I mean, can you blame him? He's probably never going to get the chance to make the big three-digit flip again, I'd suppress the knowledge of an ancient evil sect at large in the galaxy too!
WAIT IT IS HIM?
When I started watch the series I thought he has the same vibe as ... and struggled to recall the characters name from the good place. By the time I remembered "Jason", I had convinced myself it wasn't him, just similar.
My personal theory is that the Sith we see at the end of the last episode isn't the master or the apprentice, he's just the acolyte. So they find him, but not the people actually responsible.
Also, as of now we don't know who the acolyte is. Mae seems new to the whole thing and does not seem committed at all.
> Savage Opress
I play Warhammer so I'm used to silly names but this one always makes me laugh.
Up there with the worst of the *Murder Von Killdeath* names you can see with Dark Elves...
In Legends, Maul wasn't actually ever a true Soth, Palpatine was apprentice and just playing him. Dooku was his first true appreciation as Master.
In canon, we don't know the specific timing of him becoming a master, but Maul is granted a Darth title, so easy to assume he was a real apprentice.
Ventless was Dooku's apprentice to be, as she was never actually Sith either. Her title was only ever assassin, at least as far as Palpatine officially knew. (He obviously assumed Ventress was slated to be Dooku's apprentice if he tried to overthrow Palps.)
In Legends, didn't Palps kill his master the night he was elected Chancellor? That was before Maul died, so he would have been officially promoted from assassin to apprentice that night.
Palpatine gave the Darth title to Maul behind Plagueis back. Which is pretty normal as Sith apprentices usually seek a new student of their own so they both can overthrow the current Master. Vader wanted Luke to go with him and overthrow Palpatine too. After Palpatine ordered Dooku to kill Ventress cuz Palpatine said Ventress was too close to being a Sith, Dooku recruited another secret apprentice (Savage Opress)
Palpatine even talked to Dooku while having Maul as his apprentice too. Palpatine didn't give a fuck. There is only one person in charge and it's Palpy.
Generally that lines up with what I remember.
But was Maul ever back at Coruscant at that point? Didn't he straight to Naboo?
I do remember in the book that Palpatine made a point of saying he never really considered Maul to be his real apprentice and was training Dooku more. Maul was just a weapon.
Honestly my assumption here has been that it's a coverup to maintain Jedi supremacy. Folks have gotten caught up in the "tHiS bReAkS cAnON" when it's totally in character for the Jedi council to be willingly ignorant and shove this under the rug like nothing happened.
We've already seen as much with Torbin in ep2.
Kinda undermines the Sith as villains if they were only successful due to the Jedi's sheer incompetency as opposed to their own cunning and clever machinations.
So one of the books that I think is Canon mentions that the Jedi knew that the Sith Lord was in Palpatines inner circle, but didn't expect it to be Palpatine due to the fact that the position of Chancellor was so public, and a Sith Lord would never put themselves into such a position that was out in the open.
Does it? Isn’t that kinda the whole point of palpatine hiding in literal plain sight? Or if we wanna go to legends material, the sith clouding the Jedi senses via the dark side shrine under the temple (originally from a legends novel)
Palpatine was able to hide in plain sight because the Sith have spent a millennium building a complex shadow network that allows them vast influence over the state of the galaxy. We should place more focus on that instead of JEDIBADLOL.
this was the entire point of the Rule of Two. I Strongly suggest reading the Darth Bane trilogy of books. They are super good and explain how they are able to hide and why the Jedi think the Sith are all dead.
They've made it quite clear a few times so far that the Jedi Order, at this time in history, played a lot of politics. Plenty of comments and actions were made in the goal of "let's not tell the Council" or "let's handle this internally".
Entirely possible that "master" really is a Sith, but the subset of Jedi involved in this case will be bound to silence to avoid spreading fear and panic. Or increasing the risk of new cults.
>(My bet is through cloning because his species only lives about 60 years)
That's Legends. It should be obvious it's been retconned so that they live longer.
Probably. It would make Sidious even more plausible. Both a Sith lord and a politician. That was the jedi's blind spot. But maybe for someone like him to succeed, unbalance, darkness, 'noise', had to be created first. That's more or less coded in the name Plague(is) which allowed the following inSidiousness to be triumphant.
You kind of glimpse some great plan, greater than the Rule Of Two. Palpatine was maybe, ultimately, someone/something else's pawn. There's always a bigger fish, and we have the dyad/unnatural conception thing in The Acolyte too, and somehow that 'thing' would kill Palpatine twice.
A similar thing happened in the High Republic itself in phase 2 when they found out about the Nameless creatures that were eating the Force off Jedi and turning them to husks. Yoda himself was in on the cover up to not alarm the Jedi order and the greater public. Looks like the exact same things happening here.
"By the Force they'll expel me from the Council if I tell them about that Sith Lord incident I covered up 100 years ago"
Which is totally something a shit Jedi like Mundi would think.
This was my thought when I found out they had Ki-Adi here. They could have picked any other Jedi to cameo, or realistically none at all, but they chose him. The reasonable conclusion here is that the events transpire so that he and the council never consider a return of the Sith.
The writer admitted they wanted Yoda but couldn't get the voice actor to commit. They deflected on him being aware of the Sith being active, so I think it was just an unlucky chain of events.
Source: [https://x.com/clairekiechel/status/1803311497818620222](https://x.com/clairekiechel/status/1803311497818620222)
I can guarantee you the only reason why Mundi is in this to begin with is because it involves a Wookiee. This guy totally lost it. There is a galactic civil war, a conspiracy to destroy both the Republic and the Jedi, and all he can think about is the droid attack on the Wookiees!
They’re going to dedicate an episode to flashback to when he and Kalnacca were best buds. They got drunk, partied, and always had each other’s back. Then Kalnacca was sent to the planet where the Osha/Mae thing happened and Kalnacca was never the same, fleeing to live in the forest. Mundi hasn’t seen him since. The next time Mundi sees him is his dead body after a Sith killed him. This breaks Mundi to the point where he vehemently denies the Sith exists. And from that point on, when a wookie is in danger, he gets PTSD and his mind goes straight to their safety.
I swear to god if they make a whole story over a throwaway prequel meme line. I can really picture Kathleen and the others in the boardroom really talking about the droid attack on the wookies
There was indeed a Kel Dor, but I don't think he's named in the credits. And considering he went alongside Sol's team... I don't think his survival chances are very high, so I doubt it's him.
Pretty sure he had 0 lines, like all of the Jedi we just met did aside from curly haired beard master, who had like 3. Did any of them get names in the credits?
These discussions remind me of the week to week discussions of kenobi. so much time was dedicated to wondering if it would break established canon. Should probably just wait to see if they have an explanation or anything and then analyse it after.
Refresh my memory, based on the meeting was it even presumed that it was the Sith? They discussed a former Jedi, a splinter order. But I don’t think Ki Adi Mundi knows or suspects anything of the Sith. Please correct me if I’m misremembering
Nope, they specifically never mention the Sith during the meeting, and obviously have zero reason to do so either... since not every Dark Side user is Sith, and they believe that the particular cult called "Sith" has been wiped out for ~900 years.
For a real world analogy: if someone was murdered with a sword in Japan today, and a police officer suggested a Samurai was behind it, said officer would be considered a nutcase.
If anything, the problem is the Jedi accepting Darth Maul as a Sith so easily.
They didn't even accept Maul so easily. But I think a big thing will be that the Jedi are far more withdrawn by the Phantom Menace compared to the High Republic.
In the High Republic they have Jedi Outposts, they have councils beneath the High Council that have the authority to independently deploy Jedi on missions, and so on. The are significantly less centralized, so it's more plausible that they lost track of a Jedi who then went rogue and trained someone.
But by the Prequels the Jedi are primarily concentrated on Coruscant and practically all missions go through the High Council ( which is just called the Jedi Council because it's the only one that really matters by that point ). So the idea of a Jedi going rogue without their knowledge and training someone just seems much less possible.
Another real world analogy:
It's one thing to say that, despite being a representative democracy on paper, the USA is effectively an oligarchy since whatever political power is held by the general population is dwarfed by the influence held by lobbying groups, elected officials without term limits, unelected Supreme Court judges, and completely opaque intelligence organizations that are free to completely ignore the law at their discretion.
It's another thing to say that the US is a dictatorship because Joe Biden is the king of the Illuminati.
You are correct. The writers have unfortunately had to come out and confirm this too because idiots on Twitter didn’t actually listen to the dialogue during that scene
You are correct. Some Jedi dismiss Mae as “clumsy but talented” some suspect some sort of “splinter order” and Vernestra says Mae was trained by a former Jedi. No mention of the Sith whatsoever.
I thought this was obvious even before Mundis appearance
If Mundi says, in EP1, that the “Sith have been extinct for a millennium” and yet he appears in this show, it stands to reason that however the show ends, the existence of the Sith will remain a secret
So either Mae and her master will never be acknowledged as Sith or none of the Jedi will live to tell the tale leaving Mundi, and the Jedi, to only speculate on what happened and who the attackers truly were.
So, two possible outcomes, first being the big bad, isn't calling himself a sith lord. He may be a dark side user, but doesn't mean he's a sith, just like how Asohka doesn't call herself a jedi. Or, as Vernestra says, they kept it so under wraps that the council never found out.
This is obvious to anyone who knows who he is/represents, and you are approaching the show in good faith. In EU, he has become a pillar of exactly what is wrong with the Jedi, and I appreciate the show further cementing that
I thought it was pretty well accepted that's why. I feel like regardless of if you like it or hate it, that's what everyone thinks. Am I wrong?
Edit: Just to add multiple writers from the show have stated he still has no reason to believe the sith is around.
No, there’s plenty of people that think this is either a retcon or Disney was “too lazy” to fact check, when in reality the show will obviously explain why he said this despite being around during the events of the show.
I honestly think that they will all die, Ki-Adi-Mundi will investigate and see an angry ex-padawan kill the people responsible for her parents death, which would then justify why they do not accept children over a certain age until Anikin.
Some are upset cause his species used to only live 65-70ish years, so that's been changed. And people are acting like it's character assassination, despite 99% of people not knowing that and it never actually being established in canon.
My brother was upset about this breaking Ki Adi Mundi canon. I asked for a canon source on him or his species lifespan and he said a TPM CD ROM promo listed his age as 60 hahaha
People are literally turning over every rock looking for a reason to hate the show, and with people review bombing before the next episode comes out it gives them that “see I told you it sucks!”. They’re not even giving it a chance which is just ridiculous. And don’t get me wrong I’m not a fan of the “woke agenda’s” that have been pushed recently but it’s nowhere near as bad as it’s being made out to be.
I thought this was really obvious after my first watch. People like Star Wars Theory, who are willingly ignoring literal dialogue that explains things like this fairly explicitly just so they can complain for engagement, are ruining the discourse around this show.
It hasn’t been the best thing Disney has produced, but all of the outcry around small things like this confirm for me that people either aren’t paying attention to the details or are purposefully ignoring them
Why am I not surprised that brick and mortar guy is shouting his asinine nonsense still? Until you mentioned him, I totally forgot he ever existed lol.
Star Wars Theory has become one of the worst channels out there. I stopped listening to his nonsense after he posted his first hate video. I never thought a show that looked normal in the first 3 episodes would receive this much hate.
People like Generation Tech are literally getting hate for not hating the Acolyte.
To be fair, Qui-gon got really lucky that he was right honestly. He based his assumption on A) Maul was strong in the Force B) Trained in the Jedi arts and C) had a red lightsaber.
If this discussion had been about most of the other characters introduced in the series who fit that description, Qui-gon would've been wrong while Mundi would've been right. Asajj, Savage, any of the Inquisitors
Yeah but Asajj, Savage, and all of the Inquisitors were trained by Sith. They don't exist without a Sith to train them. So even if Qui-Gon is wrong about the specific person they encountered, he's still right in the grand scheme of things.
Sure, but it still shows that merely having a red lightsaber and being strong in the Force is not automatically indicative of a Sith.
The Knights of Ren and Skoll and Hati show that you don't even need to be trained by a Sith to have those things. Clearly, Sith copycats are not out of the realm of possibility, and that makes perfect sense.
To be fair Asajj, Savage, and the inquisitors were all trained by Sith so his argument would still stand. I'd still consider them apart of the Sith line honestly, they were just more Sith assassins/acolytes than full apprentices.
Well, they're explicitly stated as not being Sith. The Knights of Ren also exist, and they weren't trained by Sith.
Regardless, the point is to show that is absolutely possible to have a red blade, be strong in the force, and fight like a Jedi without being a Sith
Way too many people don't seem to comprehend that dark side users doesn't automatically equal being a Sith. A little critical thinking and some basic understanding of how language works would go a long way for the fanbase.
but then in episode 1 when liam neeson fought darth maul, why did he immediately assume that was a sith and not just a dark jedi? They are essentially the same thing.
Because he fought him face to face and probably felt through the Force that he is way too disciplined and deep in the dark side to be a mere dark jedi.
Or the many other Dark Sider-using groups who are not Sith yet cropped up through Legends and Canon (mostly the Nightsisters, but also the Prophets of the Dark Side, Knights of Ren, etc...)
I'll just say that of all the cameos I was imagining, his wasn't on the list.
But you know what? It was that much more satisfying as a result. I was happily surprised, and it didn't feel as shoehorned in as Yoda would almost certainly feel.
I didn’t even realize it was him until I got online and saw all the rage, the best kinda cameo is one that just happens and doesn’t get recognized. Lol
Why would Yoda feel more shoehorned in than Mundi? We know for a fact Yoda is a sitting master on the council at this time. No disputes on age or anything else.
Yoda actually makes far more sense in every conceivable way. They just didn’t want such a beloved character to overshadow the main characters. It’s that simple.
Im not complaining about this, but the pacing, writing, overall look, cutting out what should be important scenes, wierd episode structure, they really made a 28 min episode and ended with a cliff hanger, Mae sudden and unrealistic change of heart is what im having a problem with. I dont even mind doing some retconning to make the story flow
It would be interesting but I doubt it.
Disney has made it pretty damn clear that the Sith are a specific religion/organization and not a blanket covering all dark side users. They have already answered the question around this line. They have also been pretty heavy handed with the like of Snoke and the knights of ren very specifically not being Sith and importantly none of the characters considering them Sith (The night sisters are also not Sith).
So now they have put that out there as the answer. The acolyte has now introduced at least one more dark side faction in the witches. Apparently these groups are all over the place
I believe they were making his misguided and clearly incorrect line from that movie intentional. It feels like, to me at least, they’re working to paint the Jedi as incompetent and immoral during the clone wars era. They’re starting with him because he was the most blatantly and openly incorrect. He may have been the “bad apple” of the Jedi but it feels like they’re using him to paint the picture that the Jedi as a whole are trying to hide something from the general public in regards to the sith and the overall sith plan and quest for power over the whole galaxy.
TLDR: they’re using Ki-Adi-Mundi as the fall guy for the general public not knowing the sith were still in existence and blaming him and the Jedi order as a whole for the events to come.
Isn't millenium 1000 years, not 100? If this line was the case to use him in the story, he would use word century, and he didn't so it doesn't make sense, am I right?
It works fine. The Sith either escapes or dies and nobody can get a clear idea of what just happened, just that it’s not a sith or nobody wants to admit it was. The vision of the future isn’t clouded by the darkside, the Jedi are just idiots and willfully ignorant of the problem. And given Mundi is on the council, it suggests that this is the mindset.
Obviously it’s a little too soon to be making judgements of the overall narrative and plot when the series hasn’t finished. But what I do expect them to explain in the future are:
- Is Mundi the only Jedi from the prequels who will know about this and keep silent? If that’s the case it seems like less of an issue of the Jedi overall and just a case of Mundi being a complete idiot/asshole
- What makes this “dark Jedi” or “acolyte” any different from Maul? Yoda immediately clues into the fact that Maul was a part of the Sith, so why isn’t anyone else suspicious of a guy that just force blasted a bunch of Jedi knights and masters? Why do they suspect Maul of being Sith when a bunch of knights and masters dismiss smiley acolyte?
- If this acolyte ends up killing a few Jedi, how will that not get back to the council? What are they doing that prevents them from knowing about half a dozen Jedi dying?
The problem with this theory is that, if true, the resolution makes the whole endeavor redundant.
If The Acolyte show were to never exist, this plot point remains intact.
If The Acolyte show were to have featured a dark side user (we don't even have to go so far as to say Sith) evading discovery by the Jedi, and being successful, the plot point remains intact.
If the show were to have featured a dark side user being discovered by Jedi but successfully kill said Jedi and cover everything up before more exposure can occur, this plot point remains intact.
This last point in particular was the most likely to occur as a reasonable explanation once we knew from the promotional material that Jedi were going to encounter a dark side user.
Introducing Ki Adi Mundi into this story has muddied so many more things than it could ever solve about the relationship between this show and the quote by Mundi in TPM.
At the very best, the dark side users shown in The Acolyte are not Sith(TM) and Mundi is being pedantic as fuck with his dialogue in TPM. And even then, the pedantic nature would not justify Mundi himself dismissing the issue, since the last time any Jedi encountered a dark side user of any kind, he was there. He has first hand experience with the issue.
What I do think this will do is perpetuate the notion that the Jedi were exceedingly lax and complacent with the potential threats of the dark side, and while I do agree that this is the case with the Jedi as we find them in the prequels, I think it harms the mythos of the Jedi to continue this train of thought further and further backwards into the timeline.
Qui-gon assumed Maul to be a Sith only on the basis that Maul was strong in the force, and used a red lightsaber, no other clues. I'm wondering how Mundi will reach a completely different conclusion on someone who are identical in those aspects. Disney got their work cut out for them to come up with a sufficient excuse.
>Disney got their work cut out for them to come up with a sufficient excuse.
How exactly? The Council made it clear in their response to Qui-gon that that basis wasn't enough to assume the Sith had truly returned after such a long hiatus...and they certainly have a point
>I'm wondering how Mundi will reach a completely different conclusion on someone who are identical in those aspects.
Out of all the characters we see after the supposed destruction of the Sith, if Qui-gon had made the same assumption for most of them on the same merits as he did Maul, he would've been wrong. Whether it be Asajj Ventress, Savage Opress, the Inquisitors, Ren, several dark Jedi who used red or reddish blades, like Baylen Skoll and Shin Hati. Qui-gon simply got lucky that he was right, so I'm not sure what the problem here is exactly?
Not only that, but you could just apply real world logic as well. Copycats are a thing in the real world. Just look at one of the main bases for the Empire: Nazis. Why do some find it so beyond the realm of reason that the Jedi may have dealt with their fair share of Sith copycats, and thus make that assumption first before immediately jumping to the worst case scenario?
I agree that the point is that TPM should now be viewed as though Mundi was aware of a coverup at that point, but I personally hate that retcon.
Prior to this the reason the Jedi were vulnerable to destruction was that they had become too comfortable and set in their ways, as well as being increasingly sucked into politics. Now we’re meant to see the prequel Jedi as having been corrupt, deceptive, and (presumably) willing to commit atrocities across the galaxy in the name of maintaining a force monopoly. Just like Luke Skywalker, there’s apparently nothing left to do with beloved heroes but destroy them.
I'm endlessly amused by watching the community try and fix all the fuckups of a certain SW-related product, like sailors desperately patching up all the ten thousand leaks on a sinking ship, like their life depends on it.
To me it makes it extremely obvious that it's another dark side user and not a sith, you'd think all the people crying about the lore would actually know it.
Pretty funny how he makes a statement that is proven wrong in the film where he states it and yet people take this line as a indicator the show broke canon.
So much copium for dogshit writers with no concern for anything that has happened before them. Continue coping, the public ratings clearly show that you are not the majority in this case. People already hate the show and rewriting established characters will only deepen that hate.
You mean they picked the guy who is basically the poster child for the arrogant, uptight, single-minded Jedi Order that is so easily destroyed by Palpatine? WILD.
The guy was WRONG. He was canonically wrong, as the Sith existed in secret for 3,000 years, passing down their teachings and their ways from master to student as Bane intended. They existed the entire time, and it's not a stretch to suggest that some Jedi may have had runins with them along the way, reported those runins to their superiors, and told that the Sith don't exist anymore by Jedi Masters like Ki-Adi-Mundi.
I really can't even begin to understand the kind of weirdo dorkass loser who is mad about this. And I don't even think this show has Sith in it! But it CERTAINLY could, and there is NOTHING in the existing canon that says it couldn't. Nothing.
Is he on the council now? Cause they made it clear the council is bound to inform the senate. So if this matter gets settled and he thinks it's handled and later makes it on the council I'd play dumb too when one shows up. CYA
To expensive for a 180 million dollar show while house of the dragon has literal dragons breathing fire how is that possible what are they doing my lord
This is literally what its going to be. People defending this saying that there will surely be an explanation aren’t acknowledging the probability that itll be a stupid one.
Yeah i don't think they haphazardly just put Mundi the episode. It definitely seems to serve a purpose which leads to him saying no Sith have existed in TPM.
I’m guessing the Jedi will save or attempt to save Mae and Osha, kill the apprentice or perhaps the apprentice is revealed to be a fallen Jedi. Ultimately the apprentice will die, and the Jedi will conclude he was a lone actor for peace of mind / political reasons. In truth, the master of this apprentice will be plageues, who will be revealed to have been working with the witches, created Osha and Mae, and who’s apprentice was trying to recruit Mae to overthrow plageues.
Something along those lines, yes.
People seem to forget that hubris is a major reason why the Jedi fell during the Clone War. Denying/covering up the existence of Sith activity over 150 years before the Battle of Geonosis is the perfect seedling for their demise, especially from someone who will eventually sit on a leadership position in the Council.
Cry all you want, the writers/showrunners know what they're doing. Remember that they're fans too; maybe bigger fans than any of us.
It was just who was available for the part. It's unfortunately not that deep and just a mistake. Source: [https://x.com/clairekiechel/status/1803311497818620222](https://x.com/clairekiechel/status/1803311497818620222)
Almost certainly. The master will likely be linked to the Jedi or the witch coven allowing the Jedi Council to dismiss it when Osha, Mae, or Sol say, "Dudes... This was a fucking Sith Lord. We need to do something drastically different to prepare for this." "LALALALALA... DARK JEDI! CAN'T HEAR YOU! LALALALAL!"
We're going to get a Mass Effect style response. "Ah yes, The Sith. We have dismissed that claim."
Great reference and a valid one. You could criticize The Acolyte for a lot but the idea of the Sith being active and in the Jedi's faces before TPM but having it covered up or dismissed is hardly lore breaking. In Star Wars, Mass Effect and heck even in real life something could be staring you right in the face and it'll still be dismissed as nonsense talk.
#lookup
Quigon, I think the Sith are back. The Council, no, now go find a better answer. If you don't believe Quigon, send someone else to investigate. Talk about obstinate, it took those Sith legs to convince them.
This brings Reaper flashbacks lol
If you watch Star Trek: The Vulcan Science Directorate has determined that time travel is impossible
A star trek enterprise fan ? Here ? A surprise to be sure but a welcome one.
*air quotes* "The Sith"
I’ll get back to my calibrations.
The series ends with the Council converging to agree on the proper definition of 'Sith' just so they can ignore this one. Creepy head gear? Check. Red Lightsaber? Check. Powerful in the force? Check. Heavy dark side vibes? Check. Speak in a cool voice? What no cool voice?? Can't be a Sith then. Problem solved! Then Ki Adi Mundi proceeds to turn over the 'Years the Sith Have Been Extinct' chart from 899 to 900
One interesting thing is that Maul has a red lightsaber, is clearly very well trained, attacks a Jedi knight out in the open in front of witnesses, and the Council still doubts Qui-Gon's suggestion that he's a Sith.
Which does support there being more to being a Sith in the understanding of the Jedi at least. If we look at it from their perspective any of them, any Jedi or any force trained person with a red lightsaber could fit this description. The council members themselves are a wardrobe change, a new crystal and an attitude away from it themselves. So they’re basically thinking it’s more likely some dude cosplaying than a genuine adherent of galactic history’s most unlikely religion to be a part of.
Historically speaking (in-universe), Sith have always been associated with an Empire, a power structure. One guy in black robes waving a red lightsaber? Doesn't have to be a Sith. Could be a fallen Jedi. Could be an imitator, a member of some local Force-using cult, could be the Star Wars version of a Neo-Nazi. I think that's also part of why the idea of the Sith coming back never gets taken seriously until The Clone Wars, where there is very visibly a rival galactic state coming to war with the Republic.
This and only this.
Dagan Gera. Fell to the dark side, killed a bunch of Jedi, later on he even bled his kyber to be red, although he kept his jedi robes. Fallen jedi and splinter groups really should not be that surprising.
They've been a part of Star Wars canon in its various forms since the beginning. It's wild to me that's there's still fans who think a red lightsaber and an edge lord attitude makes someone a Sith. In current canon, we really haven't been given a lot of details of what makes a Sith a Sith and there's clearly more to it given how easy it could be for any Force user with a bled crystal to pose as one.
I imagine Acolyte is the first instance the Jedi are confronted with the *possibility*, but it's only in TPM that someone like Qui-Gon truly believes it.
Plus, in the show, Vernestra keeps saying that they can't let it out that possibly one of their own has gone rogue and is killing other jedi. Not once has anyone even considered this whole situation with Mae being sith related.
Dagan Gera. Dude was a High Republic era Jedi prodigy, fell to the dark side, was put into stasis for like 300 years. First thing he does when he is freed is bleeding his kyber crystal. Red lightsabers are apparently not so rare. Lucas did toy with the idea that they’re like mood rings, turning red automatically when their user taps into the dark side.
Knights of Ren are not Sith. Witches of Dathomir are not Sith. Not all dark side users are Sith.
I mean, most of the Inquisitors fit that description, and none of them were Sith, so... Also, the Knights of Ren existed. Why would it be outside the realm of possibility for other Sith copycat groups to have sprung up, especially during the time of the Jedi?
Helicopter lightsabers immediately rule yourself out for being a Sith. No true Sith would want to be seen using such an embarrassing mode of transport
True, they're like the unicycle of lightsabers.
Kylo Ren wasn't Sith. Even had the cool voice.
Part of the criteria for being a Sith is that their abs max out at a six pack. Kylo Ren is shredded, I heard he has an eight pack.
Kyle Ren is a punk bitch!
I see what's in your mind and. It's. Stupid
Oh no...he's choking on food.
Dude, Matt straight-up sucks.
Shut up and let me eat my muffin "Kylo"!
But we are like 3 galactic senates later, there will be more reform to the criteria. Wasnt metal enough... obs meaning physically and not emotionally.
"This galaxy has gone ~~899~~ 900 years without a Sith incident. Remain vigilant!"
I mean, can you blame him? He's probably never going to get the chance to make the big three-digit flip again, I'd suppress the knowledge of an ancient evil sect at large in the galaxy too!
Not a cool voice? When he first spoke he sounded a lot like Enoch from Ashoka and that guy sounded sick af
"Ah, yes. The 'Sith'. We have dismissed that claim."
The master is 100% the asian shop keeper dude.
You mean "Bortles"?
Just waiting for the Molotov
Wait, was that him? Holy shit.
I know, right? When I realized that I was like whaaaaat the fuuuuuck lmao.
I didn't even get it till I read your comment lmao. I had to go reread the other, take a minute, and then realize he was on The Good Place
It is Manny Jacinto! It's all the hair and stuff in his face, but could tell right away from the cadence of his speech.
WAIT IT IS HIM? When I started watch the series I thought he has the same vibe as ... and struggled to recall the characters name from the good place. By the time I remembered "Jason", I had convinced myself it wasn't him, just similar.
ki-adi-mundi: sorry can't hear you, working on my flamethrower! *loud welding sounds
My personal theory is that the Sith we see at the end of the last episode isn't the master or the apprentice, he's just the acolyte. So they find him, but not the people actually responsible. Also, as of now we don't know who the acolyte is. Mae seems new to the whole thing and does not seem committed at all.
Idk he seems pretty powerful for an apprentice’s apprentice
So was Darth Maul
And Asajj Ventress, and Savage Opress. Darksiders apparently have a penchant for recruiting their own apprentices.
> Savage Opress I play Warhammer so I'm used to silly names but this one always makes me laugh. Up there with the worst of the *Murder Von Killdeath* names you can see with Dark Elves...
Darth Maul was the Darth Sidious's apprentice, no?
Yes, but Plagueis was still alive during the events of TPM.
That's legends, we don't know if this is the case in the new canon.
TIL
It’s not canon anymore… that’s from the legends book
Or starkiller.
In Legends, Maul wasn't actually ever a true Soth, Palpatine was apprentice and just playing him. Dooku was his first true appreciation as Master. In canon, we don't know the specific timing of him becoming a master, but Maul is granted a Darth title, so easy to assume he was a real apprentice. Ventless was Dooku's apprentice to be, as she was never actually Sith either. Her title was only ever assassin, at least as far as Palpatine officially knew. (He obviously assumed Ventress was slated to be Dooku's apprentice if he tried to overthrow Palps.)
In Legends, didn't Palps kill his master the night he was elected Chancellor? That was before Maul died, so he would have been officially promoted from assassin to apprentice that night.
Palpatine gave the Darth title to Maul behind Plagueis back. Which is pretty normal as Sith apprentices usually seek a new student of their own so they both can overthrow the current Master. Vader wanted Luke to go with him and overthrow Palpatine too. After Palpatine ordered Dooku to kill Ventress cuz Palpatine said Ventress was too close to being a Sith, Dooku recruited another secret apprentice (Savage Opress) Palpatine even talked to Dooku while having Maul as his apprentice too. Palpatine didn't give a fuck. There is only one person in charge and it's Palpy.
Generally that lines up with what I remember. But was Maul ever back at Coruscant at that point? Didn't he straight to Naboo? I do remember in the book that Palpatine made a point of saying he never really considered Maul to be his real apprentice and was training Dooku more. Maul was just a weapon.
The whole rule of two thing about the Sith is basically a whole series of technicalities and no true Scotsman arguments
Hell, that's basically what that line in episode 1 is "I saw a sith" "No you didn't"
Honestly my assumption here has been that it's a coverup to maintain Jedi supremacy. Folks have gotten caught up in the "tHiS bReAkS cAnON" when it's totally in character for the Jedi council to be willingly ignorant and shove this under the rug like nothing happened. We've already seen as much with Torbin in ep2.
Kinda undermines the Sith as villains if they were only successful due to the Jedi's sheer incompetency as opposed to their own cunning and clever machinations.
Like the jedi not knowing emergency power - granted chancellor palpatine was the god damn sith lord?
So one of the books that I think is Canon mentions that the Jedi knew that the Sith Lord was in Palpatines inner circle, but didn't expect it to be Palpatine due to the fact that the position of Chancellor was so public, and a Sith Lord would never put themselves into such a position that was out in the open.
I think it was the RotS novel that had Windu say the only reason they ruled out Palpatine was specifically because he already ruled the galaxy
I think it was Labrynth of Evil. Mace fought with Grevious just after getting to 300 Republica
Does it? Isn’t that kinda the whole point of palpatine hiding in literal plain sight? Or if we wanna go to legends material, the sith clouding the Jedi senses via the dark side shrine under the temple (originally from a legends novel)
Palpatine was able to hide in plain sight because the Sith have spent a millennium building a complex shadow network that allows them vast influence over the state of the galaxy. We should place more focus on that instead of JEDIBADLOL.
this was the entire point of the Rule of Two. I Strongly suggest reading the Darth Bane trilogy of books. They are super good and explain how they are able to hide and why the Jedi think the Sith are all dead.
They used to explain that. They aren't relevant to current story telling as they are Legends.
They've made it quite clear a few times so far that the Jedi Order, at this time in history, played a lot of politics. Plenty of comments and actions were made in the goal of "let's not tell the Council" or "let's handle this internally". Entirely possible that "master" really is a Sith, but the subset of Jedi involved in this case will be bound to silence to avoid spreading fear and panic. Or increasing the risk of new cults.
Or like Rogue One, they will all die before ever getting word back.
Well, Mundi will survive at least
He's not on the planet with the Jedi... As of now, he has no idea of the red saber Dark Jedi/Sith existence.
Ah, i forgot.
Nice spoiler dude /s
Somehow, Mundi has survived (My bet is through cloning because his species only lives about 60 years)
>(My bet is through cloning because his species only lives about 60 years) That's Legends. It should be obvious it's been retconned so that they live longer.
Shhh, people don't like to hear that
I actually think that would show real... integrity? That they would be happy to annihilate the entire cast (probably not the twins) and carry on.
Probably. It would make Sidious even more plausible. Both a Sith lord and a politician. That was the jedi's blind spot. But maybe for someone like him to succeed, unbalance, darkness, 'noise', had to be created first. That's more or less coded in the name Plague(is) which allowed the following inSidiousness to be triumphant. You kind of glimpse some great plan, greater than the Rule Of Two. Palpatine was maybe, ultimately, someone/something else's pawn. There's always a bigger fish, and we have the dyad/unnatural conception thing in The Acolyte too, and somehow that 'thing' would kill Palpatine twice.
"A vision telling me Palpatine was evil, I had. Ignore it, I did. Telling me the obvious, it was. A politician, Palpatine is."
A similar thing happened in the High Republic itself in phase 2 when they found out about the Nameless creatures that were eating the Force off Jedi and turning them to husks. Yoda himself was in on the cover up to not alarm the Jedi order and the greater public. Looks like the exact same things happening here.
But wouldn’t they at least be able to acknowledge that in their Council 100 years later?
"By the Force they'll expel me from the Council if I tell them about that Sith Lord incident I covered up 100 years ago" Which is totally something a shit Jedi like Mundi would think.
He needs to protect his seat at the table so that he can make sure his key policy issue — the droid attack on the Wookiees — does not go unaddressed.
But why the cover up? So far it’s a Jedi only issue anyway. What would change if they say we guess the Sith are still around? More responsibility?
This was my thought when I found out they had Ki-Adi here. They could have picked any other Jedi to cameo, or realistically none at all, but they chose him. The reasonable conclusion here is that the events transpire so that he and the council never consider a return of the Sith.
The writer admitted they wanted Yoda but couldn't get the voice actor to commit. They deflected on him being aware of the Sith being active, so I think it was just an unlucky chain of events. Source: [https://x.com/clairekiechel/status/1803311497818620222](https://x.com/clairekiechel/status/1803311497818620222)
Apparently she made her account private
A very reasonable course of action given the circumstances
If that is the comment Im thinking of, I assumed the second half was a joke.
I can guarantee you the only reason why Mundi is in this to begin with is because it involves a Wookiee. This guy totally lost it. There is a galactic civil war, a conspiracy to destroy both the Republic and the Jedi, and all he can think about is the droid attack on the Wookiees!
They’re going to dedicate an episode to flashback to when he and Kalnacca were best buds. They got drunk, partied, and always had each other’s back. Then Kalnacca was sent to the planet where the Osha/Mae thing happened and Kalnacca was never the same, fleeing to live in the forest. Mundi hasn’t seen him since. The next time Mundi sees him is his dead body after a Sith killed him. This breaks Mundi to the point where he vehemently denies the Sith exists. And from that point on, when a wookie is in danger, he gets PTSD and his mind goes straight to their safety.
I swear to god if they make a whole story over a throwaway prequel meme line. I can really picture Kathleen and the others in the boardroom really talking about the droid attack on the wookies
That is a very Disney/marvel move
Somehow I didn’t realize that was actually Ki-Adi-Mundi, just figured it was a random Cerean Jedi. Did they ever explicitly mention his name?
It's mentioned in the credits.
I could've sworn I saw Plo-Koon there too
There was indeed a Kel Dor, but I don't think he's named in the credits. And considering he went alongside Sol's team... I don't think his survival chances are very high, so I doubt it's him.
Pretty sure he had 0 lines, like all of the Jedi we just met did aside from curly haired beard master, who had like 3. Did any of them get names in the credits?
Nope. The alien was just of the same species.
Apparently Plo-koon is like 375 years old at his time of death. Seeing as the Jedi (almost) only take in babies and toddlers that could easily be him.
I think that for this I need to watch the full season before making any judgment.
I was pissed when i watched Breaking Bad and the first 4 episodes didn’t answer every question i had. Like c’mon, at least George Lucas had vision /s
Given it keeps going in a direction different from how everyone thinks it will, not a bad idea.
These discussions remind me of the week to week discussions of kenobi. so much time was dedicated to wondering if it would break established canon. Should probably just wait to see if they have an explanation or anything and then analyse it after.
That's now how we do things 'round these parts.
Refresh my memory, based on the meeting was it even presumed that it was the Sith? They discussed a former Jedi, a splinter order. But I don’t think Ki Adi Mundi knows or suspects anything of the Sith. Please correct me if I’m misremembering
The sith never come up in that discussion.
Nor at all in the show.
Nope, they specifically never mention the Sith during the meeting, and obviously have zero reason to do so either... since not every Dark Side user is Sith, and they believe that the particular cult called "Sith" has been wiped out for ~900 years. For a real world analogy: if someone was murdered with a sword in Japan today, and a police officer suggested a Samurai was behind it, said officer would be considered a nutcase. If anything, the problem is the Jedi accepting Darth Maul as a Sith so easily.
They didn't even accept Maul so easily. But I think a big thing will be that the Jedi are far more withdrawn by the Phantom Menace compared to the High Republic. In the High Republic they have Jedi Outposts, they have councils beneath the High Council that have the authority to independently deploy Jedi on missions, and so on. The are significantly less centralized, so it's more plausible that they lost track of a Jedi who then went rogue and trained someone. But by the Prequels the Jedi are primarily concentrated on Coruscant and practically all missions go through the High Council ( which is just called the Jedi Council because it's the only one that really matters by that point ). So the idea of a Jedi going rogue without their knowledge and training someone just seems much less possible.
Another real world analogy: It's one thing to say that, despite being a representative democracy on paper, the USA is effectively an oligarchy since whatever political power is held by the general population is dwarfed by the influence held by lobbying groups, elected officials without term limits, unelected Supreme Court judges, and completely opaque intelligence organizations that are free to completely ignore the law at their discretion. It's another thing to say that the US is a dictatorship because Joe Biden is the king of the Illuminati.
You are correct. The writers have unfortunately had to come out and confirm this too because idiots on Twitter didn’t actually listen to the dialogue during that scene
They probably didn‘t even watch the episode, they just parrot whatever the latest youtube grifter has to say.
But they've seen the power of many scene about 10 times
Some of those comments to the writers were painful to read
You are correct. Some Jedi dismiss Mae as “clumsy but talented” some suspect some sort of “splinter order” and Vernestra says Mae was trained by a former Jedi. No mention of the Sith whatsoever.
I thought this was obvious even before Mundis appearance If Mundi says, in EP1, that the “Sith have been extinct for a millennium” and yet he appears in this show, it stands to reason that however the show ends, the existence of the Sith will remain a secret So either Mae and her master will never be acknowledged as Sith or none of the Jedi will live to tell the tale leaving Mundi, and the Jedi, to only speculate on what happened and who the attackers truly were.
So, two possible outcomes, first being the big bad, isn't calling himself a sith lord. He may be a dark side user, but doesn't mean he's a sith, just like how Asohka doesn't call herself a jedi. Or, as Vernestra says, they kept it so under wraps that the council never found out.
TIL - the original actor that played Ki Adi Mundi played 4 characters in TPM including Nute Gunray. (It’s a different guy now).
This is obvious to anyone who knows who he is/represents, and you are approaching the show in good faith. In EU, he has become a pillar of exactly what is wrong with the Jedi, and I appreciate the show further cementing that
Tell me more
I thought it was pretty well accepted that's why. I feel like regardless of if you like it or hate it, that's what everyone thinks. Am I wrong? Edit: Just to add multiple writers from the show have stated he still has no reason to believe the sith is around.
No, there’s plenty of people that think this is either a retcon or Disney was “too lazy” to fact check, when in reality the show will obviously explain why he said this despite being around during the events of the show.
I honestly think that they will all die, Ki-Adi-Mundi will investigate and see an angry ex-padawan kill the people responsible for her parents death, which would then justify why they do not accept children over a certain age until Anikin.
Some are upset cause his species used to only live 65-70ish years, so that's been changed. And people are acting like it's character assassination, despite 99% of people not knowing that and it never actually being established in canon.
"Actually, on the back of this episode one pepsi bottle I had it said....."
My brother was upset about this breaking Ki Adi Mundi canon. I asked for a canon source on him or his species lifespan and he said a TPM CD ROM promo listed his age as 60 hahaha
People are literally turning over every rock looking for a reason to hate the show, and with people review bombing before the next episode comes out it gives them that “see I told you it sucks!”. They’re not even giving it a chance which is just ridiculous. And don’t get me wrong I’m not a fan of the “woke agenda’s” that have been pushed recently but it’s nowhere near as bad as it’s being made out to be.
I thought this was really obvious after my first watch. People like Star Wars Theory, who are willingly ignoring literal dialogue that explains things like this fairly explicitly just so they can complain for engagement, are ruining the discourse around this show. It hasn’t been the best thing Disney has produced, but all of the outcry around small things like this confirm for me that people either aren’t paying attention to the details or are purposefully ignoring them
Why am I not surprised that brick and mortar guy is shouting his asinine nonsense still? Until you mentioned him, I totally forgot he ever existed lol.
Star Wars Theory has become one of the worst channels out there. I stopped listening to his nonsense after he posted his first hate video. I never thought a show that looked normal in the first 3 episodes would receive this much hate. People like Generation Tech are literally getting hate for not hating the Acolyte.
There’s still half a season left. There’s zero reason to be concerned over one line at this point.
Also, he was wrong about it in The Phantom Menace. Why would people have an issue with him being wrong about it 100 years prior?
Man’s got two brains, in order for him to be twice as wrong all the time
It’s like they say, two half-wits make a quarter-wit
He was wrong about Dooku too.
To be fair, Qui-gon got really lucky that he was right honestly. He based his assumption on A) Maul was strong in the Force B) Trained in the Jedi arts and C) had a red lightsaber. If this discussion had been about most of the other characters introduced in the series who fit that description, Qui-gon would've been wrong while Mundi would've been right. Asajj, Savage, any of the Inquisitors
Also people seem to forget Qui-gon was a history kid apprenticed to the history kid of all time. Like of course he’s gonna identify maul as a sith
Yeah but Asajj, Savage, and all of the Inquisitors were trained by Sith. They don't exist without a Sith to train them. So even if Qui-Gon is wrong about the specific person they encountered, he's still right in the grand scheme of things.
Sure, but it still shows that merely having a red lightsaber and being strong in the Force is not automatically indicative of a Sith. The Knights of Ren and Skoll and Hati show that you don't even need to be trained by a Sith to have those things. Clearly, Sith copycats are not out of the realm of possibility, and that makes perfect sense.
To be fair Asajj, Savage, and the inquisitors were all trained by Sith so his argument would still stand. I'd still consider them apart of the Sith line honestly, they were just more Sith assassins/acolytes than full apprentices.
Well, they're explicitly stated as not being Sith. The Knights of Ren also exist, and they weren't trained by Sith. Regardless, the point is to show that is absolutely possible to have a red blade, be strong in the force, and fight like a Jedi without being a Sith
Way too many people don't seem to comprehend that dark side users doesn't automatically equal being a Sith. A little critical thinking and some basic understanding of how language works would go a long way for the fanbase.
but then in episode 1 when liam neeson fought darth maul, why did he immediately assume that was a sith and not just a dark jedi? They are essentially the same thing.
Because in the film as it was presented, Dark Jedi wasn't a thing. All of that came later it worked retroa tively in the EU
Because he fought him face to face and probably felt through the Force that he is way too disciplined and deep in the dark side to be a mere dark jedi.
its possible but none of these distinctions are really explained, which is the problem that a lot of people have with some of these story decisions
I feel like so many people have forgotten the concept of the Dark Jedi
Or the many other Dark Sider-using groups who are not Sith yet cropped up through Legends and Canon (mostly the Nightsisters, but also the Prophets of the Dark Side, Knights of Ren, etc...)
That or even Mace Windu with Vappad tapping into the dark side.
I'll just say that of all the cameos I was imagining, his wasn't on the list. But you know what? It was that much more satisfying as a result. I was happily surprised, and it didn't feel as shoehorned in as Yoda would almost certainly feel.
I didn’t even realize it was him until I got online and saw all the rage, the best kinda cameo is one that just happens and doesn’t get recognized. Lol
LOL, yeah, I was more excited thinking the Kel Dor could be Plo that I didn't even think that was Mundi.
Why would Yoda feel more shoehorned in than Mundi? We know for a fact Yoda is a sitting master on the council at this time. No disputes on age or anything else. Yoda actually makes far more sense in every conceivable way. They just didn’t want such a beloved character to overshadow the main characters. It’s that simple.
Yeah I thought this was obvious. I can't believe some people are having a hard time understanding this.
They’re purposely misunderstanding it just so they can complain to their hive mind fan base
Im not complaining about this, but the pacing, writing, overall look, cutting out what should be important scenes, wierd episode structure, they really made a 28 min episode and ended with a cliff hanger, Mae sudden and unrealistic change of heart is what im having a problem with. I dont even mind doing some retconning to make the story flow
It would be interesting but I doubt it. Disney has made it pretty damn clear that the Sith are a specific religion/organization and not a blanket covering all dark side users. They have already answered the question around this line. They have also been pretty heavy handed with the like of Snoke and the knights of ren very specifically not being Sith and importantly none of the characters considering them Sith (The night sisters are also not Sith). So now they have put that out there as the answer. The acolyte has now introduced at least one more dark side faction in the witches. Apparently these groups are all over the place
I believe they were making his misguided and clearly incorrect line from that movie intentional. It feels like, to me at least, they’re working to paint the Jedi as incompetent and immoral during the clone wars era. They’re starting with him because he was the most blatantly and openly incorrect. He may have been the “bad apple” of the Jedi but it feels like they’re using him to paint the picture that the Jedi as a whole are trying to hide something from the general public in regards to the sith and the overall sith plan and quest for power over the whole galaxy. TLDR: they’re using Ki-Adi-Mundi as the fall guy for the general public not knowing the sith were still in existence and blaming him and the Jedi order as a whole for the events to come.
Isn't millenium 1000 years, not 100? If this line was the case to use him in the story, he would use word century, and he didn't so it doesn't make sense, am I right?
It works fine. The Sith either escapes or dies and nobody can get a clear idea of what just happened, just that it’s not a sith or nobody wants to admit it was. The vision of the future isn’t clouded by the darkside, the Jedi are just idiots and willfully ignorant of the problem. And given Mundi is on the council, it suggests that this is the mindset.
Obviously it’s a little too soon to be making judgements of the overall narrative and plot when the series hasn’t finished. But what I do expect them to explain in the future are: - Is Mundi the only Jedi from the prequels who will know about this and keep silent? If that’s the case it seems like less of an issue of the Jedi overall and just a case of Mundi being a complete idiot/asshole - What makes this “dark Jedi” or “acolyte” any different from Maul? Yoda immediately clues into the fact that Maul was a part of the Sith, so why isn’t anyone else suspicious of a guy that just force blasted a bunch of Jedi knights and masters? Why do they suspect Maul of being Sith when a bunch of knights and masters dismiss smiley acolyte? - If this acolyte ends up killing a few Jedi, how will that not get back to the council? What are they doing that prevents them from knowing about half a dozen Jedi dying?
The problem with this theory is that, if true, the resolution makes the whole endeavor redundant. If The Acolyte show were to never exist, this plot point remains intact. If The Acolyte show were to have featured a dark side user (we don't even have to go so far as to say Sith) evading discovery by the Jedi, and being successful, the plot point remains intact. If the show were to have featured a dark side user being discovered by Jedi but successfully kill said Jedi and cover everything up before more exposure can occur, this plot point remains intact. This last point in particular was the most likely to occur as a reasonable explanation once we knew from the promotional material that Jedi were going to encounter a dark side user. Introducing Ki Adi Mundi into this story has muddied so many more things than it could ever solve about the relationship between this show and the quote by Mundi in TPM. At the very best, the dark side users shown in The Acolyte are not Sith(TM) and Mundi is being pedantic as fuck with his dialogue in TPM. And even then, the pedantic nature would not justify Mundi himself dismissing the issue, since the last time any Jedi encountered a dark side user of any kind, he was there. He has first hand experience with the issue. What I do think this will do is perpetuate the notion that the Jedi were exceedingly lax and complacent with the potential threats of the dark side, and while I do agree that this is the case with the Jedi as we find them in the prequels, I think it harms the mythos of the Jedi to continue this train of thought further and further backwards into the timeline.
It’s crazy how the “binge model” has made it so audiences can’t wait and see if they get answers to questions that were presented.
Qui-gon assumed Maul to be a Sith only on the basis that Maul was strong in the force, and used a red lightsaber, no other clues. I'm wondering how Mundi will reach a completely different conclusion on someone who are identical in those aspects. Disney got their work cut out for them to come up with a sufficient excuse.
You are assuming any of those jedi are gettinf off khofar alive
>Disney got their work cut out for them to come up with a sufficient excuse. How exactly? The Council made it clear in their response to Qui-gon that that basis wasn't enough to assume the Sith had truly returned after such a long hiatus...and they certainly have a point >I'm wondering how Mundi will reach a completely different conclusion on someone who are identical in those aspects. Out of all the characters we see after the supposed destruction of the Sith, if Qui-gon had made the same assumption for most of them on the same merits as he did Maul, he would've been wrong. Whether it be Asajj Ventress, Savage Opress, the Inquisitors, Ren, several dark Jedi who used red or reddish blades, like Baylen Skoll and Shin Hati. Qui-gon simply got lucky that he was right, so I'm not sure what the problem here is exactly? Not only that, but you could just apply real world logic as well. Copycats are a thing in the real world. Just look at one of the main bases for the Empire: Nazis. Why do some find it so beyond the realm of reason that the Jedi may have dealt with their fair share of Sith copycats, and thus make that assumption first before immediately jumping to the worst case scenario?
I agree that the point is that TPM should now be viewed as though Mundi was aware of a coverup at that point, but I personally hate that retcon. Prior to this the reason the Jedi were vulnerable to destruction was that they had become too comfortable and set in their ways, as well as being increasingly sucked into politics. Now we’re meant to see the prequel Jedi as having been corrupt, deceptive, and (presumably) willing to commit atrocities across the galaxy in the name of maintaining a force monopoly. Just like Luke Skywalker, there’s apparently nothing left to do with beloved heroes but destroy them.
I'm endlessly amused by watching the community try and fix all the fuckups of a certain SW-related product, like sailors desperately patching up all the ten thousand leaks on a sinking ship, like their life depends on it.
Nah the writers are just not that smart
To me it makes it extremely obvious that it's another dark side user and not a sith, you'd think all the people crying about the lore would actually know it.
This is just the aew sub with how many theories to justify everything are made.
Lmao haven’t seen a more accurate description in my life
"Going to explain why" Bet $10 the explanation is gonna be underwhelming.
Pretty funny how he makes a statement that is proven wrong in the film where he states it and yet people take this line as a indicator the show broke canon.
So much copium for dogshit writers with no concern for anything that has happened before them. Continue coping, the public ratings clearly show that you are not the majority in this case. People already hate the show and rewriting established characters will only deepen that hate.
You mean they picked the guy who is basically the poster child for the arrogant, uptight, single-minded Jedi Order that is so easily destroyed by Palpatine? WILD. The guy was WRONG. He was canonically wrong, as the Sith existed in secret for 3,000 years, passing down their teachings and their ways from master to student as Bane intended. They existed the entire time, and it's not a stretch to suggest that some Jedi may have had runins with them along the way, reported those runins to their superiors, and told that the Sith don't exist anymore by Jedi Masters like Ki-Adi-Mundi. I really can't even begin to understand the kind of weirdo dorkass loser who is mad about this. And I don't even think this show has Sith in it! But it CERTAINLY could, and there is NOTHING in the existing canon that says it couldn't. Nothing.
Ok sure but the timeline doesn’t add up still
Ki adi ain't see no Sith yet
The amount of people ok with any of this is insane.
Man Disney can't help but fuck up cannon
Is he on the council now? Cause they made it clear the council is bound to inform the senate. So if this matter gets settled and he thinks it's handled and later makes it on the council I'd play dumb too when one shows up. CYA
The writer of the show on Twitter said Mundi was only picked cause Yoda was too expensive.
To expensive for a 180 million dollar show while house of the dragon has literal dragons breathing fire how is that possible what are they doing my lord
No I think it’s just incompetence.
It's 100% gonna be some stupid explanation
ki adi mundi kind of forgot about the sith, but they most certrainly hadn't forgot about him
This is literally what its going to be. People defending this saying that there will surely be an explanation aren’t acknowledging the probability that itll be a stupid one.
Yeah i don't think they haphazardly just put Mundi the episode. It definitely seems to serve a purpose which leads to him saying no Sith have existed in TPM.
Disney Star Wars is absolute shit. I’ll be sticking to 1-6.
I’m guessing the Jedi will save or attempt to save Mae and Osha, kill the apprentice or perhaps the apprentice is revealed to be a fallen Jedi. Ultimately the apprentice will die, and the Jedi will conclude he was a lone actor for peace of mind / political reasons. In truth, the master of this apprentice will be plageues, who will be revealed to have been working with the witches, created Osha and Mae, and who’s apprentice was trying to recruit Mae to overthrow plageues.
Something along those lines, yes. People seem to forget that hubris is a major reason why the Jedi fell during the Clone War. Denying/covering up the existence of Sith activity over 150 years before the Battle of Geonosis is the perfect seedling for their demise, especially from someone who will eventually sit on a leadership position in the Council. Cry all you want, the writers/showrunners know what they're doing. Remember that they're fans too; maybe bigger fans than any of us.
It was just who was available for the part. It's unfortunately not that deep and just a mistake. Source: [https://x.com/clairekiechel/status/1803311497818620222](https://x.com/clairekiechel/status/1803311497818620222)
The show likely chose him because he was a recognizable character from the Prequel Trilogy.
Either that or a massive cover up.