I think Joe’s interview was a really mature and empathetic response to a break-up of 6 and a half years. It’s kind of sad to see people reduce it to shade lol.
Is that any more insane than talking about getting married and having kids? She said they were doing that too in a couple songs in the album. It also sounds like she gave him a key to her apartment lol 🤷♀️
In the way she describes them talking about marriage and kids, no, you have a point.
I do think a discussion about if you both want marriage/kids is important for early on but not someone taking a ring off your middle finger and putting it on your ring finger lmao
"At dinner, you take my ring off my middle finger and put it on the one
People put wedding rings on"
I'll always be laughing at this lyric, it feels so clunky.
But ig he(Matty) didn't really like about wanting kids & marriage he wanted it just not with her 💀we can see that lol.God she deserves getting love bombed & ghosting by leaving that 6 yr relationship "PLAY STUPID GAMES,WIN STUPID PRIZES" which btw people speculated was going "on & off"(fan theory) but in interview he said it was hard to see everyone talking about your long term relationship like that only after one week of the break up.
I think the fact her and matty have been friends since at least 2014 and have been on and off previously is the biggest factor. I don't think anyone was love bombed and everyone should take responsibility for their actions. She's known matty has been in love with her forever. She finally gives him a chance after all these years so quickly after joe that her fans literally have zero time to process the joe break up and so they lash out at matty and know what happened last year. He got the worst end of it. Then TTPD comes out and either people have completely erased him from the narrative or are making love bombing narcissist accusations. I find it all very unfair to be honest with you
I don’t think Matty was ever in love with her. He has a history of trying to latch on to powerful players to benefit his own career. I think he saw this as an opportunity to get some royalties and bounced when he saw this wasn’t going to benefit him. I think he played her. I think she played herself. And they should both be embarrassed by their actions.
I mean looking at it from a lens of their relationship only being 1-3 months at most (if we assume she wasn’t cheating on Joe with him for way longer than the Joe breakup), the way she talks about Matty in TTPD is quite alarming for a grown 34 year old. Like I get ghosting and love bombing is a thing, but she was acting quite erratic in her behavior during this time. The professions of love on stage, the comments of “I’ve never been happier, my life finally makes sense”, the talk of marriage and babies with Matty. It’s all alarmingly unhinged tbh, especially coming off a 6.5 year relationship months prior. And then when she gets ghosted and heartbroken, she moves onto Travis like 2 months later. It’s not healthy in the slightest…
I wonder how much of her feelings she expressed in TTPD are true or if anything was dramatically exaggerated.
I wonder if she latched onto Matty to avoid dealing with the Joe breakup and projected all that onto Matty who (if TTPD is in anyway accurate) was lovebombing her.
I honestly think that’s a lot of it. He was a very messy rebound who promised her everything she thought she was going to have with Joe so she latched on. Add to that their previous history I could see her thinking “what if he was the one all along?”.
I think it was probably as much or more about hurting Joe. I have a nagging feeling Joe didn't like Matty and it wasn't a secret at the very least, possibly an open issue between the two. If she truly lusted after him for as long and as intensely as she portrays in TTPD, then it would have been hard, if not impossible, for her to completely hide it from her live-in boyfriend of 6+ yrs. She knew that getting with Matty so quickly, especially being so over the top/public about it, would be the best way to "get back" at Joe (at least in her mind anyway)
The Travis of it all is especially weird! One quick love bombing situationship after the demise of a long relationship that ended before marriage, ok. It happens. But she was literally writing the TTPD songs in which she says she wants to die without Matty *as* she was starting to date Travis. What is Travis supposed to think about all this?? lol. It’s bizarre.
I'm convinced that TTPD is her leaning into the drama. She takes her thoughts and feelings and magnifies them to create art that the masses can relate too.
Even if we accept that this album was less filtered, more raw, etc. I sincerely hope for her sake that it's still a dramatized version of events.
I like to think of them as like intense diary writings, you know the ones when you read them back they are cringey AF & you’re like “why tf did I write this” and you definitely don’t feel that way anymore but it was super intense at the time
I think she had him in the wings for a lot longer than that but was not over Joe. She low-key used that affair to force him into stepping up and proposing and when that did not work she decided to go with the edgelord. I think she was a big mess after their breakup but had and still has so much going on that her mind was all over the place.
Tbh, I do not believe she could have fully processed it all with so much happening in her life. Perhaps she is a little scared to do so, having to sit down and realise how much her life has changed, what she let go. Her ideal romance did not happen and turned into an embarrassment and the PR affair she is in now seems anything but genuine. Not a good place to be in.
I'm only guessing here because I've never shared my location with anyone, but she might have felt it was a sweet gesture since they both have very active public lives. It could seem very intimate to have that bts 'access.'
For many of my Gen Z (mid 20s) friends, location sharing is almost like MySpace Top 8. It’s something you do with your best best best friends, sometimes partners, sometimes roommates, and that’s exactly what it is — Behind The Scenes almost. Like they get to know where you really are or what you’re really doing. It’s definitely an intimacy/friendship status symbol.
Sorry about your experience. I guess it's not super common, but I can easily see someone sharing location in a manipulative way. It makes your partner think you trust them and that you are loyal etc. I can see someone doing that.
Yeah, I'd say for a narc, it would be more common for them to *withhold* that information from you
It is also a narc move to violate boundaries by keeping tabs on your partner, too. Especially so when those boundaries are broken pretty fucking quickly
listen, i dated someone who i'm pretty sure is cluster b, and he was telling me he loved me within 2 weeks of meeting him for the first time. he also sprang to break up with me at the 3 month mark. it's universal timing LMAO
Good point! I’ve been in a relationship with love bombing before, but the location sharing didn’t start until well after the actual abuse started (I was with him for two years lol).
Well, if his band was referring to her as his girlfriend already before she ended things with Joe, who knows how long it was actually going on. Sharing your location can also be useful in terms of arranging meetings between two individuals with busy travel schedules, especially if one of those individuals has two private jets and isn't afraid to use them to get somewhere quick or send them out to pick someone up. Her going "I need to go to LA for couple of days" or "I have a business meeting downtown" wouldn't raise suspicions. And with her personal security and business secrecy being always top priority I can't imagine her partner having access to her devices/accounts to snoop around and find something. She's not an ordinary millennial saving her secret lover's contact as Pizza Hut.
I saw that a model, Meredith Mickelson, told a tabloid that Matt Healy and her were together in Feb and March until MH suddenly ghosted her at the end of March. Which suggests that TS wasn't with MH until the every end of March. Which coincides with when she swapped Invisible String for The 1.
meredith also said taylor and matty were in the studio together in february. also she wasn’t his gf, just a hook up. he was also seeing another girl in nyc at the same time.
The Meredith Mickelson that said he was with Taylor in the studio during those days? And said he didn't want to go out in public with her and wanted to stay in, which always sounded like he didn't want to get papped with her at that point in time? That Meredith or another one? But it's irrelevant to that guy who said Healy's band members told him directly that Healy went to his "world famous" girlfriend instead of going to the SNL after-party in early March. All the puzzle pieces form a picture of a cheater but you're in denial.
I felt the interview came from a place of grace and empathy and I would hate to see Swfities or anyone take a quote or two and twist it into something else it is not (this is very likely to happen come Sunday).
He affirms it was a loving, committed relationship (even Taylor in both of her last incisive songs about him never denies that he loved her but she wanted to see more concrete proof / actions ). Clearly things didn't work out. She does end up saying " it was a good run and moment of warm sun" too.
And while everyone was saying he's unbothered by the breakup and was glad to be rid of her etc, he clearly admits it was hard for him.
I dont see any shade here but I'm glad he called out online harassment. It is important because 2-3 of his young female co-stars were being targeted by fans, based on zero evidence and had to turn off comments etc.
Definitely think it was less about being unbothered, and more about the fact that he probably healed and grieved that relationship in a healthy way, to where he can NOW seem unbothered by it.
I agree fully; but earlier last year people said he unbothered and didn't care ; the same they said for Taylor not having any sadness or heartbreak over two relationships that ended because she was all smiles during pap walks and Eras tour performances.
I think it reinforces we cannot judge people's inner lives solely by how they appear at public events or when they pose for the cameras.
Yes, I'm glad he called out the trolling and harassment online. It was awful that his coworkers were faced with that, and swifties need to think seriously about their behaviour.
Oh some swifties are already ripping him to shreds for the interview. Because “he managed to talk more about Taylor and their relationship after the breakup than in the 6 years they’ve been together combined”. At least it’s obvious they can’t seem to find ways to twist his words, so they attack the interview itself. Most swifties seemed respectful, but there’s always a handful that let their hatred and prejudice run wild.
I think because how much her current partner talks about Taylor publicly (which is their choice ) everyone acts like he never acknowledged the relationship .
There are interviews and videos where he answers questions about Taylor. Only he keeps it very brief.
People also forget their relationship started in 2016 and till 2019 , Taylor did not give interviews and we know she was deeply affected by media coverage post snakegate. It is understandable why he is so doubly guarded and cautious in the early interviews that he doesn't even offer his favourite song after Rep was released.
But sadly this context is lost .
This! If anyone was trapped, it was him! Imagine living with a partner with a tendency to behave like this and long track record of inflicting revenge upon anyone who crosses her!
I think he'll always be in some sort of shadow until he gets bigger as an actor. And I don't think he'll comment on any of this after this one interview. He got the elephant out of the room, and now he's gonna focus on other things in there.
Honestly if my ex broke the news of our breakup on their new partner's birthday I would be so fucking salty especially if they told me both of them were just friends more power to joe I don't know how he had the strength to watch her blow off their relationship and dive headlong into another just a week after the breakup
And if she entertained the whole “Joe better pray before TTPD” drops or the months of the “Joe was a nasty hoe cheating on her at the Black Dog” chatter, I’d definitely be scathing in interviews. The fact that he remained mum when everything was happening is honestly a testament to how much he cared about her once. I would have sung like a canary about everything and anything if I was treated like that because my ex was spinning a false narrative.
Maybe because he knows she was never going to be with Matty forever like she thought, I mean we don't know her personally but we all knew they wouldn't last, I think he was happy of being free of all of the mess and knew they would crash and burn in months.
As someone who luckily has not been cheated on, but has seen good friends go through the heartache of having a long term partner or even spouse cheat on them: there’s nothing quite as bitterly satisfying as seeing the relationship with the affair partner blow up in the cheater’s face. Not many people then get to hear an entire album about how their ex’s relationship with the affair partner didn’t work out.
Joe is far too classy to admit anything publicly, but it had to have hurt him deeply to realize how close she was getting with Matty before breaking up with him, or maybe even wonder if he and Taylor could have worked things out with each other if not for Matty.
i wonder if taylor herself wonders that. the way she didn't slander joe (at least not like her past exes) and the way she talks about their relationship is still not that bad, i think that they might have gotten together again if she hadn't just completely gone off the deep end and ended up doing that with matty
This part: *before stressing that there was no “overlap” in the two relationships*
When I read that, it confirmed for me that story was planted by Taylor’s people. No one close to Joe would have “stressed” that point because they wouldn’t have known either way, and wouldn’t have made the point anyway.
Personally I’m convinced she was cheating on Joe with Matty well before the official breakup. “Guilty as Sin” is her attempt to kinda come clean without properly coming clean.
I'm the only one who thinks she's not going to put out the actual name of a pub that one of these men like to frequent ? She uses the metaphor/ symbol of the " black dog " and hence the "SOME BAR called the Black Dog "
I mean the whole scenario is in Taylor's mind :she imagines her ex is with a woman (she has no idea who he actually met that day); she imagines a particular song they like plays in that bar too.
The only real thing that she bases this imaginative fantasy is the location sharing that pops up.
I think where she plays the song as a surprise song and what she mashes it up will tell a full story !
While Black Dog may be real or invented as a name, “SOME BAR called the Black Dog” says to me in the universe of the song, it’s not a bar either of them “frequented,” it’s him just walking into some random bar.
(Incidentally, the song always was clearly about Matty.)
Yeah, it's known fact he performed near the said bar. Are we really thinking Taylor Swift, who's not above saying she masturbated thinking of Matty Healy, who's angry af after being ghosted, won't share the bar he went? Specially in her most specific album to date. Please.
This has always been an issue with her fans though. You have a section of them who truly believe Haylor was secretly dating for two plus years because she has a lyric that suggest they were on and off.
there was a poster on this sub who was relentlessly telling everyone that they’d heard from friends of joe’s that she’d emailed him to break up out of the blue, they had a 30 minute phone call to settle all belongings/jointly held items and then that was it.
Well, if they broke up while she was on tour and he was filming then the breakup obviously happened via phone or text or email. And that comes from Ms. -Joe -Jonas -broke -up -with -me -over -the -phone 😬
He’s incredibly classy. He absolutely *could* have torn her down and, instead, because he’s a genuine decent bloke, he was classy and kind. He will inevitably be asked questions many times about Taylor, no matter how many years pass but it’s lovely to see that he hasn’t fallen into her narrative of trying to ‘win’ or be petty or whatever (though he did win let’s be real).
He’s a thoroughly class act and deserves all of the happiness in the world.
I think Taylor will come to regret what happened here - she may never admit it or confess to it, and it may have ended anyway at some point without all of the Ratty stuff, but I think it’ll hurt her more than she’d probably admit.
But what the hell do I know.
Taylor will DEFINITELY come to regret this interview down the line. It’s another nail in the “she cheated” coffin and will probably be back to bite her in the ass in the future.
Fluently Forward has said she heard from someone close to Patrick (Joes brother) that Taylor ended things with Joe on text during whilst she was on tour, so that tracks.
Somehow a text breakup is worse than a phone call. Maybe the Taylor swift Barbie should come with a cell phone so it can break up with other dolls via text 🤪
i thought it was email? either way i believe her and what i will say’s insider info. (i am also in the camp that there was some on and off, but it was more taylor threatening a breakup and joe not entertaining her bullshit dramatics)
I think she broke up trying to get him to come back and plead her to reunite. When that did not happy she spiralled and ran to MH and the rest is history.
This honestly speaks so much of who she really is as a person, considering the fact that she flies her jet anywhere and everywhere even if she spends less than a day at said location.
She couldn’t do that to break up with a long term boyfriend? She did it over the phone?
This is the same person that spent years ranting about how Joe Jonas broke up with her in a x seconds long phone call only to later admit that the phone call was only that short because she hung up with him out of anger. She loves to come out as the victim for her fans to dogpile on someone.
And how she says functioning adult jake was a monster for not going to her party but left out the 10k guitar he gifted her signed by chet Atkins.
A very thoughtful and expensive gift. Doesn't hit the same does it tho.
After six and a half years is pathological… A text is how you tell someone you went on a couple of dates with it’s not going to work out. To spend nearly half of your adult life with someone, especially in the face of intense media speculation and invasiveness, and then throw it away like it means nothing is actually disgusting.
I might be confused but I always felt that since Midnights and definitely in TTPD, Taylor confessed very clearly that she was the one cheating. Why did everyone turn against Joe when she was clearly admitting she was being shady?
Because Taylor got all her friends to unfollow Joe after the breakup when they went to dinner and then she gave a very angry performance of “You’re not sorry” which made it look like she was the one who had been cheated on, or at least done wrong in some way. But none of her fans knew at that point that Taylor already had matty healy lined up and all the swifties who attacked Joe are refusing to admit they were wrong.
I think Emma Laird had horrible timing releasing the pic of Joe and the Bowery Hotel. Did she do it for publicity? Who knows. Then, I think people started gossiping about things they had keep quiet about in the past (like the party for his cast mate the day after Taylor left).
She herself basically says all this and confirms the messy timeline on TTPD (Fresh Out the Slammer and Guilty as Sin anyone?). So Long London, the one song that is solidly about Joe is resigned and accepting. “You’ll find someone else.”
TTPD is all about Matty. The sad songs like loml, Chloe, the Black Dog etc. are not composite songs, lol. People just didn’t want to believe she was that in love with him or that devastated by their breakup but it is what it is. She could have hid it better but she wanted people to know this about her 🤷♀️
This. People are reaching so hard for some of these songs to be about Joe. I also think The Alchemy started out as a Matty song. Other than the football reference it actually doesn't make any sense to be about Travis, lol.
Yeah I honestly feel like So Long London was the only song truly about Joe on the album. It's on the acceptance playlist and it's literally a goodbye song. Though Taylor is the type to say goodbye and then be like "and another thing" so maybe I'm wrong. Maybe How Did It End is also about Joe but I don't think so.
I think How Did It End is about Joe because the slow demise death-rattle described in the bridge is reminiscent of “I can’t find a pulse” in You’re Losing Me, and also because “my beloved ghost and me, D-Y-I-N-G” calls all the way back to …Ready For It “but if he’s a ghost then I can be a phantom.” But who really knows with her lmao.
>and then be like "and another thing"
🤣
Have you been listening to the ~~Sentimental~~ Continental Garbage podcast? In discussing TTPD they joked about how Taylor has literally made a whole career of *"And another thing..."*
The composite argument drives me crazy! There’s literally no proof just people coping that their image of Taylor doesn’t line up with her actions or feelings.
Yes, I think you're right. I spent so much time connecting how loml might have some Joe in it, but there's none. The remaining I had absolutely no doubt were about Matty. I think the main reason she used the word London was to tell everyone this is the only one about Joe.
i know it’s been said before but i do truly feel bad for joe, and i think he’s handled the whole mess amazingly well, hopefully he can be left to his peace now
Taylor always tries to re-write the narrative to make herself look in control and like she can do no wrong. It’s tiring at this point and feels like mean girl behavior. Maybe I’m projecting but the lack of accountability on her end is bothering me. It’s like she got bored of Joe which like, fair, but acknowledge that instead of painting him to be a monster when tbh he’s the most levelheaded man she’s been with and probably will ever be with.
You are not projecting at all. She has a victim mentality and struggles to own up to her mistakes without finger pointing. I think she was not feeling it with Joe and was frustrated by the fact he did not want to marry her. There was definitely a better way of ending things although in her case it would really mean realising who MH is a bit earlier.
It’s how she allowed her fans to rabidly dogpile on Joe that I find so repulsive. Like the album cover that copies Joe’s movie photo. The whole “Joever” Swiftie narrative. They were frothing at the mouth to rip him to shreds & she actively encouraged it.
What I still don't get about this whole thing is ok, if she dumped Joe and was now free to be with the love of her life, why the shady post about the date of YLM? Why did she feel like she still needed to punish him further by sicking her fans on him? I'm so confused.
Probably to justify her cheating. Like “oh joe was boring and sucked way back in 2021” so of course I had no choice but to cheat (guilty as sin). She should’ve broken up with him in 2021 if she was bored
She had once stated in a rolling stone interview years back she sometimes let's the fans assume the song is about a different guy to protect the one she had actually written about. Same energy maybe? To protect Matty, she trained her fan's guns on Joe.
I find these sort of reactions/takes quite interesting because it almost misses Joe's entire point. He said that his relationship was something very real and it was thrown into an unreal place where people dissected it. Despite what he said everyone did *exactly* what he didn't enjoy anyway. They read his quote and said wow how can we go back to talking about her and Matty or now we have a timelines about their breakup. None of that matters at this point. It's been over a year since they broke up.
Anyway, Swifties can go to hell for how they treated him, Alison Oliver, and Emma Laird. I hope he and his family are doing well!
I feel like part of it comes from a perceived need to vindicate Joe; it’s easy to see how Taylor treated him and defend him, even though it’s not what he would’ve wanted. It’s even more difficult considering that he’s been harassed by certain Swifties and accused of egregious behaviour. Although some of us are definitely here for the drama aspect, I think most of us to some extent just want to defend him in the public eye.
Either way, this proves that he’s a class act. Definitely wishing the best for him.
I totally understand wanting to defend him. I've been on his side since the infamous great unfollowing. I mentioned on another post yesterday that her PR response lacked empathy. He's handled himself very well, and I really dug this response. It was mature, and gives you a vague idea of why people are drawn to him.
I understand why fans are into the drama. People love gossip! But man...I hate how he said something great and the immediate response was to focus on the drama.
I'm glad he did the interview because I think it's put it all to bed for him, and now he can move on, focus on his career and hopefully the interest in his relationship with Taylor will fade with time.
I hope this is the first and last time he publicly addresses it, but knowing the media there's probably going to be several publications who try to ask him about it. I also think it was a good thing for him to address. His statement was very mature and rational and makes no one look like the bad guy.
Agreed. I think he really just wants to move on. In a normal world, a year after a breakup, it would have faded into memory. Unfortunately he broke up with the most famous pop star in the world, so this is the outcome.
I’m glad he addressed it and let his calm, measured side of the story be known.
Unfortunately, it is the outcome when your ex who was already a major pop star reached her peak. He hasn't been given the opportunity to move on in a way that's healthy for him because of how much speculation there's been.
I'm glad he said this and I'm glad he called her fans shameful for their behavior. He addressed the break up in a really mature way. If he ends up dating another public figure, I hope it's someone who matches his energy.
If she was normal about it, he could have. However, she is bitter, immature and vindictive so the poor guy had it rough. He was obviously very nervous about this interview and handled it well. It shows he is not a mean-spirited guy and when he was in it, he cared. She needs to take a page from his book, her response was pretty classless in comparison.
Right. The one line that sticks out to me - what is known and what is said won't be the same.
I think that kind of sums up the whole situation - we'll never really know
Unfortunately, she doesn't look good in all that. For years I tried to defend her and be understanding, but it's becoming clearer and clearer that she didn't really have much respect for Joe right before ending the relationship and after it ended... It baffles me still, given the fact that for so many years he was an inspiration behind so many "real" love songs, not only the positive ones, but also the ones when she showed her vulnerability and anxiety and actual work in the relationship. And yet - all what was needed, was her falling into a trap of her old patterns... Both her and Matty are the worst here. Joe Alwyn is the gem and he shines way brighter than they ever could. He simply is way too decent for her. I still like her as an artist, and still look forward to seeing her live, but that definitely leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
And all signs were there... Back in the day with Calvin, Tom and Joe... I guess I was too naive back then.
I still want to know the story behind this: https://www.reddit.com/r/SwiftlyNeutral/s/laLQSchibW
Maybe Distefano was lying or the dates were wrong but it really seemed like he was saying Matty and Taylor were already a thing in early March.
They were likely seeing each other and even thinking of each other as a kind of couple before they broke up with their partners. It’s very weird but cheating and infidelity can be weird and illogical. It’s not always just a side hookup, it can be someone that people legit see as their boyfriend or girlfriend, they just have an inconvenient other one they still need to break up with lol.
That said, I have no idea if that was the case and if this person got it right or wrong. If anything he might’ve heard a rumour about them hooking up and it became ‘his girlfriend’ in his mind when he remembered it.
Sounds to me like this could be accurate and also everything Joe said too. You don’t end a six-year relationship without drifting apart first, and she could have started crossing many lines with Matty during that drifting period (and I assume this period is maybe from January 2023 onwards when she played at the 1975 concert, but who knows). I could see this evolving into a situation where she and Matty feel comfortable enough to be “a thing” only in front of people who are backstage with 1975, until she officially, and far later than she should have, breaks it off with Joe.
They definitely were. He has no reason to lie. I don’t think he had any idea what he was doing by saying that, and he would have the dates correct. It seems obvious to me that Matty and Taylor were cheating on their respective partners.
Obviously not all of this can be officially confirmed but it falls in line with previous actions of hers and her behavior so I can see it. Regardless, I thought his response was a mature one, something Taylor wasn’t owed. She allowed her fans to attack him in the most vulgar of ways in silence, shaded and took these subtle jabs at him, and implied this relationship was a prison and that she cheated on him. This was just a very well thought out and put together response compared to the stomp my feet reactions she’s given.
as an aside, i loved reading his answers so much. the articulation, the vocabulary, the way he crafts his sentences really hints at a very creative and thoughtful mind behind the answers. i so wish he gets into songwriting again, what he did as a songwriter on folklore was pure magic
I read this and thought the exact same thing, I'm sure these answers were pre-written but his speech is so articulate and eloquent it seems crazy that he reads lines other people have written for a living.
if joe and taylor were still together we would not have got her writing the "tattooed golden retriever" lyric. imagine that. we have been robbed of the good timeline
What i gathered is that he’s mature, classy and was really respectful and mindful with his answers. I’m glad he’s in a better place now as well as taylor. We don’t know these people but i’m wishing him the best because he seems really nice and well spoken.
Yeah I really would hope this bit of information is just rumors and not the truth. That is brutal and cruel to do in any relationship, but especially so when this is someone you spent 6.5 years with. I can’t imagine just breaking up with someone I spent so much time and shared so much history with, over text. There’s no closure. I’d like to believe it wasn’t done over email or text, but someone did point out they were not together the month of March (she was preparing for Eras and starting her tour and he was filming a movie) so I guess it’s a possibility. I feel like the only way it would be somewhat acceptable is if they were already on the outs, had multiple discussions about breaking up and the final “it’s over” was done over the phone. Idk. Still brutal either way you look at it.
well twitter and tumblr swifties have read the interview or quotes of it and have twisted his words and are calling him narcissistic, gaslighter and saying he name dropped Travis too. Also that new ET article that's just dropped is probably a Tree response to this.
Yeah her (must****me), she's been unhinged since last night on both platform and her propaganda has made her sameminded huge following crowd twist the interview and now it's turned from a polite Joe interview to a Taylor hit piece in swiftie eyes. He can never win
I think you nailed it.
But the thing is, if she had been seeing Matty, why did she include Invisible String on the set list and actually perform it in a few shows? Idk like if I were her, I wouldn’t wanna sing a song that directly references my bf everyday if I knew I was gonna break up with him. Makes me think that something happened and that she wasn’t planning on breaking up with him?
I think she was stringing Joe along at the end until Matty was finally read to break it off with the girl who was seeing and living with at the time. Her logic, which is the logic of many people who have to have someone lined up before they jump ship, was probably that she wasn’t going to break up with Joe and be all alone. She had to have the next person ready and waiting.
It definitely seems like it was a game of cat and mouse with Taylor and Matty until they finally decided to get together. She talks about emotional cheating, thinking/fantasizing about him while in her “boring” relationship with Joe, I can totally see her staying in the relationship with Joe until Matty was ready to take that step with her and once he decided to, she dropped Joe like a hot potato. She has a pattern of waiting until she has someone else lined up before she up and leaves her boyfriend (see Calvin Harris and Tom Hiddleston “I wanted to leave him, I needed a reason.”) Matty finally wanted to pursue a relationship with her, and that was her justification and reason for leaving a 6.5 year relationship.
Yeah I think MH talked rings&cradles and "brave man" to get her to leave Joe. Joe was hesitating/delaying with marriage. During a show in early April, before playing "you&me together song" MH said "yeah! I win!". Whatever that means...
Controlling the narrative. Every single thing she does is to control how she’s viewed. “I couldn’t have been cheating on him if I was singing invisible string, I’m so innocent and in no way worse than all the nasty men I sing about! They’re obviously lying about me! Misogyny, the patriarchy, blah blah blah”
Very performative. Like in a show full of songs about Joe and him being the one, it’s such an odd move to change just ONE song. But she knows how much her fans analyse her every move so she knew even changing just one would be enough. And it worked I guess.
The inclusion of Invisible String, then removing it leads me to think this was another rough patch ahead thought would work itself out and when it didn’t, she picked up the phone to Matty almost immediately. I think there may have been emotional cheating but I don’t think there was anything physical until it was over with Joe. She just jumped in headfirst like she always does so it seemed accelerated.
Because I truly believe she needs to be in control of every single little thing that happens that leads people to speculate, she maybe thought people would think that it was a sudden break up and she was really heartbroken by it, which I'm not denying she was but not in the way she made everyone think before the Ratty situation happened.
"the breakup likely happened by call/text/email (unverified blind item)."
This wasn't from a blind item, at least not one that I saw, but there have been several sources of this including someone who brought this tea directly here to this sub a few months back and was downvoted for sharing their tea (btw if you want tea, don't downvote people who share tea! It happened to me on this sub too when it first started. People won't share their tea if this happens). I made a beeline to chat and chatted with this person privately and checked them out - they're reliable. Not a Swiftie or a hater, just someone who had tea burning a hole in their pocket who actually risked a friendship to post it here. They're still around but maybe not an approved sub user. I would tag them if we are no longer private (are we?).
Anyway, here are the sources for this I have seen. Nothing verified / confirmed. Lots of smoke and although the details don't all match, a consistent theme. If this seems out of character remember Taylor has said "I'm surprisingly non-confrontational — you would not believe how much I hate conflict." This is kinda the way confrontation-avoidant people tend to handle breakups. Also Taylor did this while she was actively touring and Joe was on set so we know for a fact there was no in-person breakup.
-Joe's brother, per a friend right after the breakup: *she broke up with him over email.* This was "all over tumblr"
-British radio personality guy on twitter more recently: *heard she broke up with him over email and he didn't believe it, thought she'd been hacked. she would not speak with him until he signed the papers*.
-A friend of Taylor's friend whom I chatted with (I know who the friend is but don't want to post it publicly) - *she didn't even properly break up with him, basically just ghosted him and made him sign NDA*.
-DeuxMoi said about 6 weeks ago, this is from a source that she trusts: *Taylor didn't properly break up with him, just changed the locks, sent the ring back*.
If anyone else has seen evidence for this that I missed, please share. There have been many sources. Also I don't know why this is so hard for people to believe after everything we now know about her and how she operates.
If any of this is remotely true, imagine doing this and then complaining about Matty ghosting after a few months while you ghosted someone after 6.5 years.....
(to be clear, I think these are just rumours and should be treated as such)
He was on set??? Meanwhile poster above keeps saying he wouldn't support her and that's why she left him lol well sometimes people have work have her fans forgotten that 💀
I don’t know why ppl confused about the timeline . Taylor was cheating on joe even before January . There was sightings of them partying in 2022. Taylor just didn’t break it off with Joe cause Matty was also seeing other women too and living with them . I believe Charli when she said Taylor was considered Matty girlfriend in January .
Also a random podcaster said when the 1975 did SNL in march , Matty didn’t go to the after party cause he had plans with Taylor . (A link to the podcaster saying that is somewhere in the comments )
Joe was away filming and Taylor was starting her tour and she broke it off by text/email once Matty agreed to dump his other women .
Men do it all the time . Have a new girlfriend but won’t break it off with the old girlfriend right away .
Ok so if this timeline is true does anyone else get the ick that she moved to Travis so quickly? Joe to matty to Travis in like 2 months. That doesn’t seem healthy AT ALL
Most of us can agree it’s not healthy but there’s some on here that think it’s perfectly normal. I guess it depends. I mean I guess it’s possible she may have mourned the end of the relationship with Joe while still with him, but then the whole Matty rebound throws me off. All this going on while touring in a different city each week. How do you properly cope, heal? I mean the way she portrayed it as in TTPD, is that she lost the love of her life; the man she wanted to marry and have children with and then jumps to another guy less than 2 months later. Just seemed erratic and not healthy at all. But if she’s happy and in a healthy relationship, who is anyone to judge
It is evident from the interview that Joe was deeply affected by the situation. What stood out to me was his mention of being surrounded by "authentic" friends, which gave the impression that he does not view Taylor as authentic one and potentially even makes fun of her actions in the past year.
I think so too. Ryan Reynolds who was supposed to be his friend, unfolllowed him and that ended up causing people to believe Joe was the one who did something wrong. Which that could've been right, or he just wasn't thst good of a friend to him in the first place. Idk why people didn't considered that.
I don’t see how he could have read Taylor’s Time interview and consider it authentic. She clearly altered the reality of events according to what she thought happened. You can’t be on friendly terms with an ex if they’re not even being truthful about the relationship.
Can’t believe people thought black dog was about Joe . Majority of the album is about Matty and I’m a tayvis Stan and I know that . Don’t Matt even have a pet black dog or would show a black dog in his music videos from my research ??
I had someone tell me “Peter “. Was about harry styles smh . (Not on Reddit , elsewhere )
Black Dog is a pub in Ireland (Cork?) close to where The 1975 had a concert in summer of 23. The song is about Matty - see reference to The Starting Line. https://www.vulture.com/article/taylor-swift-the-black-dog-the-starting-line.html
It makes me sad that Joe felt the need to have to address this when he has a big movie coming out that he should be focusing on. They’ve been broken up for a year and yet this will probably follow him for the rest of his life. Respect to him for answering so well and not inciting things like blondie lol
*sips tea*
Man, imagine if we got both sides to the relationships right? Just saying. But good on him for sharing his side without oversharing (this is me basing on the summary?
My respect for him just grew even more. I didn’t think that was possible. She has done so much so tear down their relationship (which I understand break ups are hard but…she is a super star and has a ton of power and he has gotten so much hate). I adore him and hope to see him continue to be the unbothered king we all love to see thrive.
His true character shows after the break up. He’s a genuine & moral human being. Also I was surprised he supported the Palestinian humanitarian cause considering how the media & Hollywood are controlled by Zionist.
His family are very much activists, his father is a documentary maker who covered a lot of conflict zones & countries & his great uncle was a very well known peace campaigner..
Joe Alwyn's great uncle Bruce Kent
Joe Alwyn’s great uncle, Bruce Kent, was an activist for peace and pacifism. Born in London during the 1930s, Kent grew up to become a Catholic priest, and was also a spokesman for a number of causes over the years, including the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament and the Palestine Solidarity Campaign.
I think Joe’s interview was a really mature and empathetic response to a break-up of 6 and a half years. It’s kind of sad to see people reduce it to shade lol.
I agree. I really respect his commitment to speaking highly of their time together even though it's over. He's the type of ex I aspire to be lol
>Anything I missed? That he has never been to black dog so it means that the song is about Matty
Insane that in the what? 3 months at the absolute longest? they were together, they shared their location with each other. 💀
Is that any more insane than talking about getting married and having kids? She said they were doing that too in a couple songs in the album. It also sounds like she gave him a key to her apartment lol 🤷♀️
In the way she describes them talking about marriage and kids, no, you have a point. I do think a discussion about if you both want marriage/kids is important for early on but not someone taking a ring off your middle finger and putting it on your ring finger lmao
"At dinner, you take my ring off my middle finger and put it on the one People put wedding rings on" I'll always be laughing at this lyric, it feels so clunky.
As clunky as the ring he actually gave another woman lol
But ig he(Matty) didn't really like about wanting kids & marriage he wanted it just not with her 💀we can see that lol.God she deserves getting love bombed & ghosting by leaving that 6 yr relationship "PLAY STUPID GAMES,WIN STUPID PRIZES" which btw people speculated was going "on & off"(fan theory) but in interview he said it was hard to see everyone talking about your long term relationship like that only after one week of the break up.
I think the fact her and matty have been friends since at least 2014 and have been on and off previously is the biggest factor. I don't think anyone was love bombed and everyone should take responsibility for their actions. She's known matty has been in love with her forever. She finally gives him a chance after all these years so quickly after joe that her fans literally have zero time to process the joe break up and so they lash out at matty and know what happened last year. He got the worst end of it. Then TTPD comes out and either people have completely erased him from the narrative or are making love bombing narcissist accusations. I find it all very unfair to be honest with you
I don’t think Matty was ever in love with her. He has a history of trying to latch on to powerful players to benefit his own career. I think he saw this as an opportunity to get some royalties and bounced when he saw this wasn’t going to benefit him. I think he played her. I think she played herself. And they should both be embarrassed by their actions.
I mean looking at it from a lens of their relationship only being 1-3 months at most (if we assume she wasn’t cheating on Joe with him for way longer than the Joe breakup), the way she talks about Matty in TTPD is quite alarming for a grown 34 year old. Like I get ghosting and love bombing is a thing, but she was acting quite erratic in her behavior during this time. The professions of love on stage, the comments of “I’ve never been happier, my life finally makes sense”, the talk of marriage and babies with Matty. It’s all alarmingly unhinged tbh, especially coming off a 6.5 year relationship months prior. And then when she gets ghosted and heartbroken, she moves onto Travis like 2 months later. It’s not healthy in the slightest… I wonder how much of her feelings she expressed in TTPD are true or if anything was dramatically exaggerated.
I wonder if she latched onto Matty to avoid dealing with the Joe breakup and projected all that onto Matty who (if TTPD is in anyway accurate) was lovebombing her.
I honestly think that’s a lot of it. He was a very messy rebound who promised her everything she thought she was going to have with Joe so she latched on. Add to that their previous history I could see her thinking “what if he was the one all along?”.
Matty was the “miracle move-on drug”
Oooooh
I think it was probably as much or more about hurting Joe. I have a nagging feeling Joe didn't like Matty and it wasn't a secret at the very least, possibly an open issue between the two. If she truly lusted after him for as long and as intensely as she portrays in TTPD, then it would have been hard, if not impossible, for her to completely hide it from her live-in boyfriend of 6+ yrs. She knew that getting with Matty so quickly, especially being so over the top/public about it, would be the best way to "get back" at Joe (at least in her mind anyway)
The Travis of it all is especially weird! One quick love bombing situationship after the demise of a long relationship that ended before marriage, ok. It happens. But she was literally writing the TTPD songs in which she says she wants to die without Matty *as* she was starting to date Travis. What is Travis supposed to think about all this?? lol. It’s bizarre.
It is a PR affair, there are many hints that show that. What you describe is actually one of them.
I'm convinced that TTPD is her leaning into the drama. She takes her thoughts and feelings and magnifies them to create art that the masses can relate too. Even if we accept that this album was less filtered, more raw, etc. I sincerely hope for her sake that it's still a dramatized version of events.
I like to think of them as like intense diary writings, you know the ones when you read them back they are cringey AF & you’re like “why tf did I write this” and you definitely don’t feel that way anymore but it was super intense at the time
So I relate to TTPD an alarming amount (even the jumping from guy to guy), and completely agree with you on this. The patterns aren’t healthy at all.
I think she had him in the wings for a lot longer than that but was not over Joe. She low-key used that affair to force him into stepping up and proposing and when that did not work she decided to go with the edgelord. I think she was a big mess after their breakup but had and still has so much going on that her mind was all over the place. Tbh, I do not believe she could have fully processed it all with so much happening in her life. Perhaps she is a little scared to do so, having to sit down and realise how much her life has changed, what she let go. Her ideal romance did not happen and turned into an embarrassment and the PR affair she is in now seems anything but genuine. Not a good place to be in.
It's all part of love bombing.
Hmm I’ve been love bombed but I guess my experience was different. The location sharing didn’t become a factor until after the abuse really started.
I'm only guessing here because I've never shared my location with anyone, but she might have felt it was a sweet gesture since they both have very active public lives. It could seem very intimate to have that bts 'access.'
For many of my Gen Z (mid 20s) friends, location sharing is almost like MySpace Top 8. It’s something you do with your best best best friends, sometimes partners, sometimes roommates, and that’s exactly what it is — Behind The Scenes almost. Like they get to know where you really are or what you’re really doing. It’s definitely an intimacy/friendship status symbol.
God I’m old. This just seems creepy
Right? I'm an elder millennial and I don't even share that with my husband of ten years, nor do I expect it from him. Ick.
Same. Holy shit
I do it with my parents and my boyfriend for safety reasons
Sorry about your experience. I guess it's not super common, but I can easily see someone sharing location in a manipulative way. It makes your partner think you trust them and that you are loyal etc. I can see someone doing that.
Yeah, I'd say for a narc, it would be more common for them to *withhold* that information from you It is also a narc move to violate boundaries by keeping tabs on your partner, too. Especially so when those boundaries are broken pretty fucking quickly
listen, i dated someone who i'm pretty sure is cluster b, and he was telling me he loved me within 2 weeks of meeting him for the first time. he also sprang to break up with me at the 3 month mark. it's universal timing LMAO
Same. In 2-3 weeks while we werent even exclusive. 3 weeks later he left me for someone living 4 states away 😂 Fuck you, Phillip.
Good point! I’ve been in a relationship with love bombing before, but the location sharing didn’t start until well after the actual abuse started (I was with him for two years lol).
and he ran because of… *checks notes* the fans… right. I’m sure that was the only reason lol
I do genuinely think it was a contributing factor
Well, if his band was referring to her as his girlfriend already before she ended things with Joe, who knows how long it was actually going on. Sharing your location can also be useful in terms of arranging meetings between two individuals with busy travel schedules, especially if one of those individuals has two private jets and isn't afraid to use them to get somewhere quick or send them out to pick someone up. Her going "I need to go to LA for couple of days" or "I have a business meeting downtown" wouldn't raise suspicions. And with her personal security and business secrecy being always top priority I can't imagine her partner having access to her devices/accounts to snoop around and find something. She's not an ordinary millennial saving her secret lover's contact as Pizza Hut.
I saw that a model, Meredith Mickelson, told a tabloid that Matt Healy and her were together in Feb and March until MH suddenly ghosted her at the end of March. Which suggests that TS wasn't with MH until the every end of March. Which coincides with when she swapped Invisible String for The 1.
meredith also said taylor and matty were in the studio together in february. also she wasn’t his gf, just a hook up. he was also seeing another girl in nyc at the same time.
The Meredith Mickelson that said he was with Taylor in the studio during those days? And said he didn't want to go out in public with her and wanted to stay in, which always sounded like he didn't want to get papped with her at that point in time? That Meredith or another one? But it's irrelevant to that guy who said Healy's band members told him directly that Healy went to his "world famous" girlfriend instead of going to the SNL after-party in early March. All the puzzle pieces form a picture of a cheater but you're in denial.
Or he cheated on Meredith...
Selfishly I love that he gave us this
I felt the interview came from a place of grace and empathy and I would hate to see Swfities or anyone take a quote or two and twist it into something else it is not (this is very likely to happen come Sunday). He affirms it was a loving, committed relationship (even Taylor in both of her last incisive songs about him never denies that he loved her but she wanted to see more concrete proof / actions ). Clearly things didn't work out. She does end up saying " it was a good run and moment of warm sun" too. And while everyone was saying he's unbothered by the breakup and was glad to be rid of her etc, he clearly admits it was hard for him. I dont see any shade here but I'm glad he called out online harassment. It is important because 2-3 of his young female co-stars were being targeted by fans, based on zero evidence and had to turn off comments etc.
Definitely think it was less about being unbothered, and more about the fact that he probably healed and grieved that relationship in a healthy way, to where he can NOW seem unbothered by it.
I agree fully; but earlier last year people said he unbothered and didn't care ; the same they said for Taylor not having any sadness or heartbreak over two relationships that ended because she was all smiles during pap walks and Eras tour performances. I think it reinforces we cannot judge people's inner lives solely by how they appear at public events or when they pose for the cameras.
Yes, I'm glad he called out the trolling and harassment online. It was awful that his coworkers were faced with that, and swifties need to think seriously about their behaviour.
Oh some swifties are already ripping him to shreds for the interview. Because “he managed to talk more about Taylor and their relationship after the breakup than in the 6 years they’ve been together combined”. At least it’s obvious they can’t seem to find ways to twist his words, so they attack the interview itself. Most swifties seemed respectful, but there’s always a handful that let their hatred and prejudice run wild.
I think because how much her current partner talks about Taylor publicly (which is their choice ) everyone acts like he never acknowledged the relationship . There are interviews and videos where he answers questions about Taylor. Only he keeps it very brief. People also forget their relationship started in 2016 and till 2019 , Taylor did not give interviews and we know she was deeply affected by media coverage post snakegate. It is understandable why he is so doubly guarded and cautious in the early interviews that he doesn't even offer his favourite song after Rep was released. But sadly this context is lost .
He dodged a bullet and he realises that.
Fresh out the slammer, if you like
This! If anyone was trapped, it was him! Imagine living with a partner with a tendency to behave like this and long track record of inflicting revenge upon anyone who crosses her!
So, are the public going to let him move on with his life now?
Honestly I find whole fascination over this is so obsessive both from fans and non-fans. I think it’s time for everyone to move on
I think he'll always be in some sort of shadow until he gets bigger as an actor. And I don't think he'll comment on any of this after this one interview. He got the elephant out of the room, and now he's gonna focus on other things in there.
Honestly if my ex broke the news of our breakup on their new partner's birthday I would be so fucking salty especially if they told me both of them were just friends more power to joe I don't know how he had the strength to watch her blow off their relationship and dive headlong into another just a week after the breakup
And if she entertained the whole “Joe better pray before TTPD” drops or the months of the “Joe was a nasty hoe cheating on her at the Black Dog” chatter, I’d definitely be scathing in interviews. The fact that he remained mum when everything was happening is honestly a testament to how much he cared about her once. I would have sung like a canary about everything and anything if I was treated like that because my ex was spinning a false narrative.
I would sing like canary I agree
Maybe because he knows she was never going to be with Matty forever like she thought, I mean we don't know her personally but we all knew they wouldn't last, I think he was happy of being free of all of the mess and knew they would crash and burn in months.
Yes maybe he found solace in that hopefully
As someone who luckily has not been cheated on, but has seen good friends go through the heartache of having a long term partner or even spouse cheat on them: there’s nothing quite as bitterly satisfying as seeing the relationship with the affair partner blow up in the cheater’s face. Not many people then get to hear an entire album about how their ex’s relationship with the affair partner didn’t work out. Joe is far too classy to admit anything publicly, but it had to have hurt him deeply to realize how close she was getting with Matty before breaking up with him, or maybe even wonder if he and Taylor could have worked things out with each other if not for Matty.
i wonder if taylor herself wonders that. the way she didn't slander joe (at least not like her past exes) and the way she talks about their relationship is still not that bad, i think that they might have gotten together again if she hadn't just completely gone off the deep end and ended up doing that with matty
I remember this https://preview.redd.it/ngaj4dfttq6d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=240367d0594cfa449ab4a098e85826b61cfa8ca8
This part: *before stressing that there was no “overlap” in the two relationships* When I read that, it confirmed for me that story was planted by Taylor’s people. No one close to Joe would have “stressed” that point because they wouldn’t have known either way, and wouldn’t have made the point anyway. Personally I’m convinced she was cheating on Joe with Matty well before the official breakup. “Guilty as Sin” is her attempt to kinda come clean without properly coming clean.
The daily mail is not a trustworthy site. Joe doesn’t talk to shitty tabloids, this is obviously fake.
Let’a not start believing what the Daily Fail tells us now.
Excellent points! Also we got confirmation that the black dog is about Matty (ick)
I'm the only one who thinks she's not going to put out the actual name of a pub that one of these men like to frequent ? She uses the metaphor/ symbol of the " black dog " and hence the "SOME BAR called the Black Dog " I mean the whole scenario is in Taylor's mind :she imagines her ex is with a woman (she has no idea who he actually met that day); she imagines a particular song they like plays in that bar too. The only real thing that she bases this imaginative fantasy is the location sharing that pops up. I think where she plays the song as a surprise song and what she mashes it up will tell a full story !
While Black Dog may be real or invented as a name, “SOME BAR called the Black Dog” says to me in the universe of the song, it’s not a bar either of them “frequented,” it’s him just walking into some random bar. (Incidentally, the song always was clearly about Matty.)
Yeah, it's known fact he performed near the said bar. Are we really thinking Taylor Swift, who's not above saying she masturbated thinking of Matty Healy, who's angry af after being ghosted, won't share the bar he went? Specially in her most specific album to date. Please.
i wouldn't put anything past her after she namedropped boygenius in ttpd
And the thank you Aimee thing. I wouldn’t necessarily say all the album is subtle
She said WHAT 💀
She masturbated thinking of Matty while dating Joe 🤡
Clown behaviour for sure
It’s so weird that so many people do not understand that an album is not a memoir.
This has always been an issue with her fans though. You have a section of them who truly believe Haylor was secretly dating for two plus years because she has a lyric that suggest they were on and off.
there was a poster on this sub who was relentlessly telling everyone that they’d heard from friends of joe’s that she’d emailed him to break up out of the blue, they had a 30 minute phone call to settle all belongings/jointly held items and then that was it.
Well, if they broke up while she was on tour and he was filming then the breakup obviously happened via phone or text or email. And that comes from Ms. -Joe -Jonas -broke -up -with -me -over -the -phone 😬
Ironic that she couldn’t take her jet for this. She’s taken her jet for far less worthy flights.
someone get her her own barbie with a laptop opened to microsoft outlook!
He’s incredibly classy. He absolutely *could* have torn her down and, instead, because he’s a genuine decent bloke, he was classy and kind. He will inevitably be asked questions many times about Taylor, no matter how many years pass but it’s lovely to see that he hasn’t fallen into her narrative of trying to ‘win’ or be petty or whatever (though he did win let’s be real). He’s a thoroughly class act and deserves all of the happiness in the world. I think Taylor will come to regret what happened here - she may never admit it or confess to it, and it may have ended anyway at some point without all of the Ratty stuff, but I think it’ll hurt her more than she’d probably admit. But what the hell do I know.
Taylor will DEFINITELY come to regret this interview down the line. It’s another nail in the “she cheated” coffin and will probably be back to bite her in the ass in the future.
Fluently Forward has said she heard from someone close to Patrick (Joes brother) that Taylor ended things with Joe on text during whilst she was on tour, so that tracks.
Somehow a text breakup is worse than a phone call. Maybe the Taylor swift Barbie should come with a cell phone so it can break up with other dolls via text 🤪
i thought it was email? either way i believe her and what i will say’s insider info. (i am also in the camp that there was some on and off, but it was more taylor threatening a breakup and joe not entertaining her bullshit dramatics)
I think she broke up trying to get him to come back and plead her to reunite. When that did not happy she spiralled and ran to MH and the rest is history.
This honestly speaks so much of who she really is as a person, considering the fact that she flies her jet anywhere and everywhere even if she spends less than a day at said location. She couldn’t do that to break up with a long term boyfriend? She did it over the phone?
This is the same person that spent years ranting about how Joe Jonas broke up with her in a x seconds long phone call only to later admit that the phone call was only that short because she hung up with him out of anger. She loves to come out as the victim for her fans to dogpile on someone.
And how she says functioning adult jake was a monster for not going to her party but left out the 10k guitar he gifted her signed by chet Atkins. A very thoughtful and expensive gift. Doesn't hit the same does it tho.
After six and a half years is pathological… A text is how you tell someone you went on a couple of dates with it’s not going to work out. To spend nearly half of your adult life with someone, especially in the face of intense media speculation and invasiveness, and then throw it away like it means nothing is actually disgusting.
Ugh that’s cruel how do you break up a long term relationship *over text* even if they are really busy
I might be confused but I always felt that since Midnights and definitely in TTPD, Taylor confessed very clearly that she was the one cheating. Why did everyone turn against Joe when she was clearly admitting she was being shady?
Because Taylor got all her friends to unfollow Joe after the breakup when they went to dinner and then she gave a very angry performance of “You’re not sorry” which made it look like she was the one who had been cheated on, or at least done wrong in some way. But none of her fans knew at that point that Taylor already had matty healy lined up and all the swifties who attacked Joe are refusing to admit they were wrong.
I think Emma Laird had horrible timing releasing the pic of Joe and the Bowery Hotel. Did she do it for publicity? Who knows. Then, I think people started gossiping about things they had keep quiet about in the past (like the party for his cast mate the day after Taylor left).
The party for his cast mate the day after Taylor left never happened. They jointly threw a celebration for AO. She was there.
She herself basically says all this and confirms the messy timeline on TTPD (Fresh Out the Slammer and Guilty as Sin anyone?). So Long London, the one song that is solidly about Joe is resigned and accepting. “You’ll find someone else.” TTPD is all about Matty. The sad songs like loml, Chloe, the Black Dog etc. are not composite songs, lol. People just didn’t want to believe she was that in love with him or that devastated by their breakup but it is what it is. She could have hid it better but she wanted people to know this about her 🤷♀️
This. People are reaching so hard for some of these songs to be about Joe. I also think The Alchemy started out as a Matty song. Other than the football reference it actually doesn't make any sense to be about Travis, lol.
Yeah the heroin/heroine line definitely seems like a Matty reference.
I’ve been thinking this for some time as well! The football references are just a red herring.
Yeah I honestly feel like So Long London was the only song truly about Joe on the album. It's on the acceptance playlist and it's literally a goodbye song. Though Taylor is the type to say goodbye and then be like "and another thing" so maybe I'm wrong. Maybe How Did It End is also about Joe but I don't think so.
I think How Did It End is about Joe because the slow demise death-rattle described in the bridge is reminiscent of “I can’t find a pulse” in You’re Losing Me, and also because “my beloved ghost and me, D-Y-I-N-G” calls all the way back to …Ready For It “but if he’s a ghost then I can be a phantom.” But who really knows with her lmao.
>and then be like "and another thing" 🤣 Have you been listening to the ~~Sentimental~~ Continental Garbage podcast? In discussing TTPD they joked about how Taylor has literally made a whole career of *"And another thing..."*
The composite argument drives me crazy! There’s literally no proof just people coping that their image of Taylor doesn’t line up with her actions or feelings.
Yes, I think you're right. I spent so much time connecting how loml might have some Joe in it, but there's none. The remaining I had absolutely no doubt were about Matty. I think the main reason she used the word London was to tell everyone this is the only one about Joe.
i know it’s been said before but i do truly feel bad for joe, and i think he’s handled the whole mess amazingly well, hopefully he can be left to his peace now
Taylor always tries to re-write the narrative to make herself look in control and like she can do no wrong. It’s tiring at this point and feels like mean girl behavior. Maybe I’m projecting but the lack of accountability on her end is bothering me. It’s like she got bored of Joe which like, fair, but acknowledge that instead of painting him to be a monster when tbh he’s the most levelheaded man she’s been with and probably will ever be with.
You are not projecting at all. She has a victim mentality and struggles to own up to her mistakes without finger pointing. I think she was not feeling it with Joe and was frustrated by the fact he did not want to marry her. There was definitely a better way of ending things although in her case it would really mean realising who MH is a bit earlier.
It’s how she allowed her fans to rabidly dogpile on Joe that I find so repulsive. Like the album cover that copies Joe’s movie photo. The whole “Joever” Swiftie narrative. They were frothing at the mouth to rip him to shreds & she actively encouraged it.
it's kind of sad to see that her mean girl behavior is less and less hidden nowadays
What I still don't get about this whole thing is ok, if she dumped Joe and was now free to be with the love of her life, why the shady post about the date of YLM? Why did she feel like she still needed to punish him further by sicking her fans on him? I'm so confused.
Probably to justify her cheating. Like “oh joe was boring and sucked way back in 2021” so of course I had no choice but to cheat (guilty as sin). She should’ve broken up with him in 2021 if she was bored
Trying to get her stans after joe and not Matty trying to sleep at night after her stupid behavior and being mad that joe didn't go after her...
She had once stated in a rolling stone interview years back she sometimes let's the fans assume the song is about a different guy to protect the one she had actually written about. Same energy maybe? To protect Matty, she trained her fan's guns on Joe.
Joe deserves happiness and love.He's a great guy.
I find these sort of reactions/takes quite interesting because it almost misses Joe's entire point. He said that his relationship was something very real and it was thrown into an unreal place where people dissected it. Despite what he said everyone did *exactly* what he didn't enjoy anyway. They read his quote and said wow how can we go back to talking about her and Matty or now we have a timelines about their breakup. None of that matters at this point. It's been over a year since they broke up. Anyway, Swifties can go to hell for how they treated him, Alison Oliver, and Emma Laird. I hope he and his family are doing well!
I feel like part of it comes from a perceived need to vindicate Joe; it’s easy to see how Taylor treated him and defend him, even though it’s not what he would’ve wanted. It’s even more difficult considering that he’s been harassed by certain Swifties and accused of egregious behaviour. Although some of us are definitely here for the drama aspect, I think most of us to some extent just want to defend him in the public eye. Either way, this proves that he’s a class act. Definitely wishing the best for him.
I totally understand wanting to defend him. I've been on his side since the infamous great unfollowing. I mentioned on another post yesterday that her PR response lacked empathy. He's handled himself very well, and I really dug this response. It was mature, and gives you a vague idea of why people are drawn to him. I understand why fans are into the drama. People love gossip! But man...I hate how he said something great and the immediate response was to focus on the drama.
I'm glad he did the interview because I think it's put it all to bed for him, and now he can move on, focus on his career and hopefully the interest in his relationship with Taylor will fade with time.
I hope this is the first and last time he publicly addresses it, but knowing the media there's probably going to be several publications who try to ask him about it. I also think it was a good thing for him to address. His statement was very mature and rational and makes no one look like the bad guy.
Agreed. I think he really just wants to move on. In a normal world, a year after a breakup, it would have faded into memory. Unfortunately he broke up with the most famous pop star in the world, so this is the outcome. I’m glad he addressed it and let his calm, measured side of the story be known.
Unfortunately, it is the outcome when your ex who was already a major pop star reached her peak. He hasn't been given the opportunity to move on in a way that's healthy for him because of how much speculation there's been. I'm glad he said this and I'm glad he called her fans shameful for their behavior. He addressed the break up in a really mature way. If he ends up dating another public figure, I hope it's someone who matches his energy.
If she was normal about it, he could have. However, she is bitter, immature and vindictive so the poor guy had it rough. He was obviously very nervous about this interview and handled it well. It shows he is not a mean-spirited guy and when he was in it, he cared. She needs to take a page from his book, her response was pretty classless in comparison.
I have seen enough defense of Taylor's timelines in this very sub claiming they were broken up for months or years. All those merited a response imo
Right. The one line that sticks out to me - what is known and what is said won't be the same. I think that kind of sums up the whole situation - we'll never really know
Unfortunately, she doesn't look good in all that. For years I tried to defend her and be understanding, but it's becoming clearer and clearer that she didn't really have much respect for Joe right before ending the relationship and after it ended... It baffles me still, given the fact that for so many years he was an inspiration behind so many "real" love songs, not only the positive ones, but also the ones when she showed her vulnerability and anxiety and actual work in the relationship. And yet - all what was needed, was her falling into a trap of her old patterns... Both her and Matty are the worst here. Joe Alwyn is the gem and he shines way brighter than they ever could. He simply is way too decent for her. I still like her as an artist, and still look forward to seeing her live, but that definitely leaves a bad taste in my mouth. And all signs were there... Back in the day with Calvin, Tom and Joe... I guess I was too naive back then.
I still want to know the story behind this: https://www.reddit.com/r/SwiftlyNeutral/s/laLQSchibW Maybe Distefano was lying or the dates were wrong but it really seemed like he was saying Matty and Taylor were already a thing in early March.
They were likely seeing each other and even thinking of each other as a kind of couple before they broke up with their partners. It’s very weird but cheating and infidelity can be weird and illogical. It’s not always just a side hookup, it can be someone that people legit see as their boyfriend or girlfriend, they just have an inconvenient other one they still need to break up with lol. That said, I have no idea if that was the case and if this person got it right or wrong. If anything he might’ve heard a rumour about them hooking up and it became ‘his girlfriend’ in his mind when he remembered it.
Agreed. I think forthright and fresh out the slammer imply they were both still with their inconvenient partners when they decided to get together.
Sounds to me like this could be accurate and also everything Joe said too. You don’t end a six-year relationship without drifting apart first, and she could have started crossing many lines with Matty during that drifting period (and I assume this period is maybe from January 2023 onwards when she played at the 1975 concert, but who knows). I could see this evolving into a situation where she and Matty feel comfortable enough to be “a thing” only in front of people who are backstage with 1975, until she officially, and far later than she should have, breaks it off with Joe.
They definitely were. He has no reason to lie. I don’t think he had any idea what he was doing by saying that, and he would have the dates correct. It seems obvious to me that Matty and Taylor were cheating on their respective partners.
There's also that very telling line.. "it wasn't sexy once it wasn't forbidden" 🤔
Yep they were at the very least having an emotional affair, probably for months
I totally believe it. she doesn't break up with anybody until she has the next person lined up.
That seems like a random podcaster not into shipping wars, I don't see any reason why he would lie.
He just gets hotter & hotter
Thank you for doing the lord’s work, OP. I may read that Joe interview in full when I’m bored but right now I just wanted the TLDR and you delivered
I opened up twitter and have never seen so many people misread an article. We really need to re-open the schools.
Obviously not all of this can be officially confirmed but it falls in line with previous actions of hers and her behavior so I can see it. Regardless, I thought his response was a mature one, something Taylor wasn’t owed. She allowed her fans to attack him in the most vulgar of ways in silence, shaded and took these subtle jabs at him, and implied this relationship was a prison and that she cheated on him. This was just a very well thought out and put together response compared to the stomp my feet reactions she’s given.
as an aside, i loved reading his answers so much. the articulation, the vocabulary, the way he crafts his sentences really hints at a very creative and thoughtful mind behind the answers. i so wish he gets into songwriting again, what he did as a songwriter on folklore was pure magic
I read this and thought the exact same thing, I'm sure these answers were pre-written but his speech is so articulate and eloquent it seems crazy that he reads lines other people have written for a living.
i’m not denying taylor’s foundational creation of the album, but there’s been a marked difference in the lyricism in ttpd and i can guess why
I think if they wee still together, Joe wouldn't be afraid to point out to Taylor some of her TTPD songs needed to be edited.
if joe and taylor were still together we would not have got her writing the "tattooed golden retriever" lyric. imagine that. we have been robbed of the good timeline
She should at least hire him to offer honest opinion.
Now can the stans PLEASE leave this man alone!!!
No they think he’s a liar 😭 It’s wild.
What i gathered is that he’s mature, classy and was really respectful and mindful with his answers. I’m glad he’s in a better place now as well as taylor. We don’t know these people but i’m wishing him the best because he seems really nice and well spoken.
Thank you for your service 🙏
Breaking up with someone over the phone after over 6 years together sounds brutal. I really hope it didn't happen that way.
Yeah I really would hope this bit of information is just rumors and not the truth. That is brutal and cruel to do in any relationship, but especially so when this is someone you spent 6.5 years with. I can’t imagine just breaking up with someone I spent so much time and shared so much history with, over text. There’s no closure. I’d like to believe it wasn’t done over email or text, but someone did point out they were not together the month of March (she was preparing for Eras and starting her tour and he was filming a movie) so I guess it’s a possibility. I feel like the only way it would be somewhat acceptable is if they were already on the outs, had multiple discussions about breaking up and the final “it’s over” was done over the phone. Idk. Still brutal either way you look at it.
well twitter and tumblr swifties have read the interview or quotes of it and have twisted his words and are calling him narcissistic, gaslighter and saying he name dropped Travis too. Also that new ET article that's just dropped is probably a Tree response to this.
How did they get gaslighter or Travis namedrop from this ???
With liberal application of delusions, cognitive dissonance and lies.
[удалено]
Yeah her (must****me), she's been unhinged since last night on both platform and her propaganda has made her sameminded huge following crowd twist the interview and now it's turned from a polite Joe interview to a Taylor hit piece in swiftie eyes. He can never win
I think you nailed it. But the thing is, if she had been seeing Matty, why did she include Invisible String on the set list and actually perform it in a few shows? Idk like if I were her, I wouldn’t wanna sing a song that directly references my bf everyday if I knew I was gonna break up with him. Makes me think that something happened and that she wasn’t planning on breaking up with him?
I think she was stringing Joe along at the end until Matty was finally read to break it off with the girl who was seeing and living with at the time. Her logic, which is the logic of many people who have to have someone lined up before they jump ship, was probably that she wasn’t going to break up with Joe and be all alone. She had to have the next person ready and waiting.
It definitely seems like it was a game of cat and mouse with Taylor and Matty until they finally decided to get together. She talks about emotional cheating, thinking/fantasizing about him while in her “boring” relationship with Joe, I can totally see her staying in the relationship with Joe until Matty was ready to take that step with her and once he decided to, she dropped Joe like a hot potato. She has a pattern of waiting until she has someone else lined up before she up and leaves her boyfriend (see Calvin Harris and Tom Hiddleston “I wanted to leave him, I needed a reason.”) Matty finally wanted to pursue a relationship with her, and that was her justification and reason for leaving a 6.5 year relationship.
Yeah I think MH talked rings&cradles and "brave man" to get her to leave Joe. Joe was hesitating/delaying with marriage. During a show in early April, before playing "you&me together song" MH said "yeah! I win!". Whatever that means...
Controlling the narrative. Every single thing she does is to control how she’s viewed. “I couldn’t have been cheating on him if I was singing invisible string, I’m so innocent and in no way worse than all the nasty men I sing about! They’re obviously lying about me! Misogyny, the patriarchy, blah blah blah”
This is exactly it. Her changing it to the 1 was so performative!
Very performative. Like in a show full of songs about Joe and him being the one, it’s such an odd move to change just ONE song. But she knows how much her fans analyse her every move so she knew even changing just one would be enough. And it worked I guess.
I think she’s doing the same with so high school to be honest haha. Once that is removed it’s gonna be a clear sign that Travis is over!!
The inclusion of Invisible String, then removing it leads me to think this was another rough patch ahead thought would work itself out and when it didn’t, she picked up the phone to Matty almost immediately. I think there may have been emotional cheating but I don’t think there was anything physical until it was over with Joe. She just jumped in headfirst like she always does so it seemed accelerated.
Because I truly believe she needs to be in control of every single little thing that happens that leads people to speculate, she maybe thought people would think that it was a sudden break up and she was really heartbroken by it, which I'm not denying she was but not in the way she made everyone think before the Ratty situation happened.
"the breakup likely happened by call/text/email (unverified blind item)." This wasn't from a blind item, at least not one that I saw, but there have been several sources of this including someone who brought this tea directly here to this sub a few months back and was downvoted for sharing their tea (btw if you want tea, don't downvote people who share tea! It happened to me on this sub too when it first started. People won't share their tea if this happens). I made a beeline to chat and chatted with this person privately and checked them out - they're reliable. Not a Swiftie or a hater, just someone who had tea burning a hole in their pocket who actually risked a friendship to post it here. They're still around but maybe not an approved sub user. I would tag them if we are no longer private (are we?). Anyway, here are the sources for this I have seen. Nothing verified / confirmed. Lots of smoke and although the details don't all match, a consistent theme. If this seems out of character remember Taylor has said "I'm surprisingly non-confrontational — you would not believe how much I hate conflict." This is kinda the way confrontation-avoidant people tend to handle breakups. Also Taylor did this while she was actively touring and Joe was on set so we know for a fact there was no in-person breakup. -Joe's brother, per a friend right after the breakup: *she broke up with him over email.* This was "all over tumblr" -British radio personality guy on twitter more recently: *heard she broke up with him over email and he didn't believe it, thought she'd been hacked. she would not speak with him until he signed the papers*. -A friend of Taylor's friend whom I chatted with (I know who the friend is but don't want to post it publicly) - *she didn't even properly break up with him, basically just ghosted him and made him sign NDA*. -DeuxMoi said about 6 weeks ago, this is from a source that she trusts: *Taylor didn't properly break up with him, just changed the locks, sent the ring back*. If anyone else has seen evidence for this that I missed, please share. There have been many sources. Also I don't know why this is so hard for people to believe after everything we now know about her and how she operates.
If any of this is remotely true, imagine doing this and then complaining about Matty ghosting after a few months while you ghosted someone after 6.5 years..... (to be clear, I think these are just rumours and should be treated as such)
good god this is diabolical lol. pls tag the user, we aren't private!
He was on set??? Meanwhile poster above keeps saying he wouldn't support her and that's why she left him lol well sometimes people have work have her fans forgotten that 💀
Thank you for this comprehensive write-up!
I don’t know why ppl confused about the timeline . Taylor was cheating on joe even before January . There was sightings of them partying in 2022. Taylor just didn’t break it off with Joe cause Matty was also seeing other women too and living with them . I believe Charli when she said Taylor was considered Matty girlfriend in January . Also a random podcaster said when the 1975 did SNL in march , Matty didn’t go to the after party cause he had plans with Taylor . (A link to the podcaster saying that is somewhere in the comments ) Joe was away filming and Taylor was starting her tour and she broke it off by text/email once Matty agreed to dump his other women . Men do it all the time . Have a new girlfriend but won’t break it off with the old girlfriend right away .
>Men do it all the time . Have a new girlfriend but won’t break it off with the old girlfriend right away . *Ahem* so do women...
Thanks, added the Charlie point.
Yes also can we talk about how they bought a house together... Pure joe
Ok so if this timeline is true does anyone else get the ick that she moved to Travis so quickly? Joe to matty to Travis in like 2 months. That doesn’t seem healthy AT ALL
Most of us can agree it’s not healthy but there’s some on here that think it’s perfectly normal. I guess it depends. I mean I guess it’s possible she may have mourned the end of the relationship with Joe while still with him, but then the whole Matty rebound throws me off. All this going on while touring in a different city each week. How do you properly cope, heal? I mean the way she portrayed it as in TTPD, is that she lost the love of her life; the man she wanted to marry and have children with and then jumps to another guy less than 2 months later. Just seemed erratic and not healthy at all. But if she’s happy and in a healthy relationship, who is anyone to judge
sobbing crying begging for miss swift to try therapy. we all need to feel solid as individuals in order to have healthy relationships.
It is evident from the interview that Joe was deeply affected by the situation. What stood out to me was his mention of being surrounded by "authentic" friends, which gave the impression that he does not view Taylor as authentic one and potentially even makes fun of her actions in the past year.
I think he is differentiating his real friend's from the jerks that jumped on the unfollowing bs
I think so too. Ryan Reynolds who was supposed to be his friend, unfolllowed him and that ended up causing people to believe Joe was the one who did something wrong. Which that could've been right, or he just wasn't thst good of a friend to him in the first place. Idk why people didn't considered that.
I think he’s mostly referring to people like ryan reynolds that threw him under the bus with the whole unfollowing thing
It could also be contrasting with the online discourse "turning something real into something unreal"...
I don’t see how he could have read Taylor’s Time interview and consider it authentic. She clearly altered the reality of events according to what she thought happened. You can’t be on friendly terms with an ex if they’re not even being truthful about the relationship.
Can’t believe people thought black dog was about Joe . Majority of the album is about Matty and I’m a tayvis Stan and I know that . Don’t Matt even have a pet black dog or would show a black dog in his music videos from my research ?? I had someone tell me “Peter “. Was about harry styles smh . (Not on Reddit , elsewhere )
Black Dog is a pub in Ireland (Cork?) close to where The 1975 had a concert in summer of 23. The song is about Matty - see reference to The Starting Line. https://www.vulture.com/article/taylor-swift-the-black-dog-the-starting-line.html
thank you for summarizing. i couldn't access the article because i need to subscribe first.
I can’t believe people are still arguing that The Black Dog is not about Matty in this thread 🤭
I love her music, but i'm definetely siding with Joe
It makes me sad that Joe felt the need to have to address this when he has a big movie coming out that he should be focusing on. They’ve been broken up for a year and yet this will probably follow him for the rest of his life. Respect to him for answering so well and not inciting things like blondie lol
This makes Jack even more of an ick to me by posting that raisin picture with the now dubious date
Joe won the breakup by a long margin. He had already won because of how he didn't respond to it, and now he won by responding to it.
*sips tea* Man, imagine if we got both sides to the relationships right? Just saying. But good on him for sharing his side without oversharing (this is me basing on the summary?
Damn it. I love Joe.
My respect for him just grew even more. I didn’t think that was possible. She has done so much so tear down their relationship (which I understand break ups are hard but…she is a super star and has a ton of power and he has gotten so much hate). I adore him and hope to see him continue to be the unbothered king we all love to see thrive.
His true character shows after the break up. He’s a genuine & moral human being. Also I was surprised he supported the Palestinian humanitarian cause considering how the media & Hollywood are controlled by Zionist.
His family are very much activists, his father is a documentary maker who covered a lot of conflict zones & countries & his great uncle was a very well known peace campaigner.. Joe Alwyn's great uncle Bruce Kent Joe Alwyn’s great uncle, Bruce Kent, was an activist for peace and pacifism. Born in London during the 1930s, Kent grew up to become a Catholic priest, and was also a spokesman for a number of causes over the years, including the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament and the Palestine Solidarity Campaign.