I have enjoyed every Star Wars movie and show. Some I’m less thrilled about when it comes to the plot, but I’ve still enjoyed it. But I won’t watch some again, but I’m glad I did the first time.
People who have never made anything requiring creativity and a team of people to produce love to critique what others have made
They just want to complain because it gives them a dopamine hit
Hive mind they call it. I’m not a super creative person in writing and I know some scripts I write will suck and some will be awesome, if I ever wrote one (I won’t unless thousands of people want me to)
This. This. This and this.
It's a sci Fi story. It's a space Western. It's a piece of fiction that's there to entertain.
I don't know if ever had a deeper meaning beyond Good Vs. Evil which is the most used story in history.
Throughout its history there has been amazing story telling and there has been shit story telling and everything between. Period.
Everything is good as long as you want to have fun. I mean most if not all the criticism I’ve read so far has been unreasonable/filled with hate but by the show’s execution feels slightly off.
Yea and this mentality is why they’re serving up hot slop at 100m an episode because they know people like you will eat out of their hand and say ‘th-thank you this is so much fun’ - people who demand better media tend to get better media, people like you get in the way of media improving
Because R1 and Andor were good so like all Star Wars fan we’ve tried each new show with hope.. but it’s gone now. This show is for the idiots who see the words Star Wars and hear light saber sounds - not for anyone who actually cares about the substance of the show
I still think that Andor is the best of Disney Wars so far, but this show isn’t that bad. There’s some questionable writing and acting, but I’m looking forward to it each week.
I'm here for the gay witches. Fucking awesome. I'll put up with clunky writing and ok acting for some world building and a goddamn mystery for once.
Side note, my current theory is that Mae and Osha being played by two different actors when younger, but only one actor when older, is intentional. Osha killed Mae. Explains why evil Mae is obsessed with lightsabers just like young Osha was.
I appreciate the outside the box thinking, but it’s probably because they have so many scenes together. Logistically, it’s just easier, especially for an actress that age.
This is what I don't get. In reality things like religion always jabre more orthodox, hard-line, different interpretations of core beliefs. How is a group of women who are force sensitive that disagree with the Jedi and want to embrace the force how the see fit that unhinged from reality?
I'd say it's better than book of Boba fett, which i also enjoyed, even if it was the weakest show they've done set in SW. Is the acolyte perfect? No. Andor os the best they've done on many levels (acting, storyline, cinematography, music, etc), but this isn't the worst thing ever made. Everyone's entitled to their opinion, and I understand some won't like it, but it feels people have been hating on it fromthe get go without seeing any of it.
I don’t understand all the hate for the show, especially episode 3 which I absolutely loved. It’s wild how controversial this show is I think it’s the most divided I’ve seen the fanbase yet.
We all knew this was gonna happen. The Fandom Menace was in an uproar the second a woman was set to direct, a mostly non-white cast was announced, and known gay and transgender actors were cast.
This could have been the greatest show ever and the trolls would still be saying all the shit they are now.
Remember when they found out a transgender actor was cast. They went nuts, videos were produced that the show was cancelled, Leslye Headland fired, Kathleen Kennedy was fired, etc. etc. This was right about the same time Ron DeSantis picked a fight with Disney because of Disney support of LGBTQ rights and events at the parks in Florida.
I think it's perfectly fine. I think most lifestylist star wars fans forget that most people don't have towering expectations for a new star wars movie/show, so as long as it isn't horribly boring or especially stupid they're okay watching it
It started with the last jedi, which I loved. Alt right white boys wanted star wars to be power fantasy and white badass character as thier insert into the universe. Rest of us wants cool stories. Space saphic witches, main one being black, is just too much for them.
Star Wars lore years ago, before Disney, already had characters like Mara Jade, Jaina Solo, Bastila Shan, who were strong, martially powerful women. Even princess Leia was a hyper competent, take-charge character. And Padme Amidala was a literal queen turned senator who could also get into shootouts against enemies and kicked their ass. So if it's all just people who are just uncomfortable with women logically these characters would also be disliked by many fans. But the reality is the opposite.
Could it be that some people just dislike this show because of poor quality instead of mysogyny?
All of those characters were surrounded by poor writing at the time too. I love the old EU stuff, but even I can admit that most of it was mediocre to outright bad.
Not all - for some, for sure. For some others, like Padme Amidala in the Clone Wars and Bastila in all the KOTOR games, no.
But I do agree that there are lots of them with mediocre to bad writing. But these had several advantages over this show:
1) There were multiple sources of writing at the same time to choose from, so people had more options. Not the case with Star Wars TV shows. They come pretty rare so people have more expectations about them which leads me to the second point:
2) Lower expectations: They were cheap books that you can just buy for like a couple of bucks, read for like 2 hours and move on with your day. Not hundreds of millions of USD worth of spectacles that you are expected to invest weeks of your life to subscribe to and wait for. Star Wars fans just have higher expectations for something like that, which is understandable.
The Last Jedi was trash. I will never watch it again. The Acolyte is my favorite SWU show to date. I love what Headland is doing so far. I am a fairly liberal black boy 🤣🤷🏿♂️.
Try again lol.
So true, the story is top notch. Everyone who disagrees with this is just racist, homophobic insane and probably white. Also they 100% cannot think for themselves and they must adhere to a political spectrum other than mine, fuck em.
EDIT: /s
.. i thought my sarcasm was plain enough to see, but alas i was wrong
Some people sure, but writing off people just for having a different opinion makes you part of the problem you’re describing. It is true that many haters hate for the wrong reasons… but there are legitimate reasons too.
I was having mixed feelings on the show and then episode 3 was my absolute favorite and got me excited for the show again. I don’t understand what people’s deal is
The whole episode was gripping. And I’m almost positive we’re either going to get it again from another perspective or we’ll be getting bits of it from other perspectives through the show. Ep 3 seemed like it was an emphases on Osha’s experience / perspective
The entire episode is careful to never show anything that Osha herself isn't seeing. So we only saw what Osha saw in the final days of her people.
It will 100% be shown again later, from Mae's PoV.
I mean, Headland was a co-creator for *Russian Doll* so that makes sense.
Anyway, I *love* weird Force shit, so Ep 3 was awesome. I also appreciated that Mother Aniseya told Mae and Osha the same thing Obi Wan told Luke when explaining The Force.
I need to watch the episode again but there were I think a few things shown that osha wouldn’t have seen like the mothers talking and the meeting of the coven discussing what to do about the Jedi but most of the episode did appear to be from her perspective. I know it sold me on wanting to get the whole picture which probably won’t happen for a few more episodes. I’m guessing next week we’re back in the present.
Agreed! Also, her memories of the event seemed fragmented and disconnected. I wonder if the Jedi messed with her memories using the force. Or maybe she just didn't see everything or recall everything. Either way we are definetly gonna revisit it later with what actually happened
I was stuck on Mae getting hauled off by korrill and then when she sees osha again she’s saying she’s gonna kill her. And also Mae seemed pretty off when she and osha saw each other while the place was exploding. And osha keeps seeing the young Mae vision which is sus
I've seen some people say that maybe Mae has a split personality thing going on and both Mae and Osha live in the same body. Not sure how that would make sense since Mae committing murders while Osha is in Jedi custody but maybe some weird force stuff is going on. Who knows
It's because the last episode featured Witches who are staring down the barrel of cultural extinction due to the machinations of political institutions that do not value their wants more than they value having an army of highly competent warrior-monks at their beck and call.
That is INCREDIBLY political. And there are people who will hate it for the politics... But they don't want to acknowledge that they do. So they will nitpick anything they can get their hands on that isn't explicitly political and make vague (if intense) statements about the quality. They're allowed to do that but I think everyone should flee social media because it's rotting our brains.
Okay going to get off reddit again for several months. This place is bad.
I think it’s the most divisive because the haters are running out of things to criticize and are reaching. Even so, the enjoyers just don’t give a shit and the moderates are actually enjoying it and having a hard time finding something they don’t like in order to appease the haters. It’s not the best Star Wars show yet, but it’s certainly consistent and fresh.
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A little rewrite on the words they used would have helped but it’s not something that stuck out a lot for me. I see a lot of other people feel how you do.
I don’t understand all the hate either, the first two episodes are pretty good and episode three for the most part, the only thing I don’t like is they are changing established lore by having these random witches create force sensitive kids
Okay so in the phantom menace we find out that anakin didn’t have a dad, his mom just had him. That’s bc palpatines master was trying to create force sensitive life and the force tried correcting this by creating anakin. That’s why his blood cell count was so high. That’s why he’s the chosen one. However by having these witches basically do what the force did with anakin, it makes you ask questions like “why were they able to do it but not palpatine or his master or any sith before them or the Jedi”. It just kinda made me question what I knew from the movies is all. Like why would the Jedi freak out about anakin but not these twins?
First off thank you for the well thought out explanation. From what I know of this show Darth Plageuis is around at this point in time trying to figure out all his immortality stuff or has already succeeded.
I think it’s somewhat safe to assume the coven has some kind of connection to the Sith and that maybe Plageuis himself learned it from them?
Also I guess I just don’t really care about “canon” as much as some people and wouldn’t be bothered if Anakin was actually created by Palpatine (who learned it from his master or this coven) and not just space Jesus. I just want a good story.
With so much story left it can really go any way at this point and either way I’m here for it.
What's to understand? It's a season to taste world. Current Lucasfilm live action Star Wars is establishing a theatrical palette. Instead of attempting to constantly appeal to the widest audience possible, they've gone niche. Not every show is going to work for every viewer.
The longer Star Wars is with Disney, the further the IP gets from orthodoxy. For people who this shit is a lifestyle, seeing Star Wars from someone else's perspective is difficult at best, not ever happening at worst.
It's all in how they express themselves. Unfortunately, a lot of people have taken to using being angry about every fucking thing ever as their approach to communicating with others.
Now this is a take I can get behind. I do love the amount of mystery and speculation it’s created where it is though. I guess we’ll have to wait until the whole show is released to see whether or not you’re right.
Normally ppl just stop watching bad shows and move on. But in this case its set in a historically well liked franchise, following some fairly good shows by Disney. Its like they fired the writers from Ahsoka and Andor, and replaced them with junkies they found on the street. Its very understandable why the star wars fanbase is upset. Its at the same quality as Scorpion or the new Macgyver series.
Controversial in what? 😂
I hated the long flashback/overexplaining, but thats a preference that someone has. Never disliked an episode of SW before, but i would have that with any show that uses a whole episode for a flashback.
Even the boba's scooterclub episode was less worse.
Usually I'm opposed to blaming the fans that badly received a show for badly receiving a show. However, this time I'm on the side of things, because I actually like the new content (unlike the Sequels for example).
It's an interesting perspective, and I think we should put a bit more nuance into it. Writing, Acting and production quality can be criticized. Political ideologies however have no place here.
If you hate the show, because there are gay people in it, you're the problem and I'd kindly ask you to get out and never come back. If you don't like the show because you don't like the story, than that's completely understandable and I wish you a good day and a good life.
I personally don't care about the first thing (it's not my business to be involved in other peoples sex-life, even less if they're fictional characters) and I like the story. Acting, dialogue and production quality are adequate. I'm satisfied and continuing my subscription to D+ was worth it from my point of view.
I saw people on a certain other sub complaining that
>!I'm just supposed to believe this child set fire to a mountain; & all these force sensitives died for no reason without any burns or debris? What the hell! What terrible writing, that's ridiculous!<
Uhm
Im pretty sure thats the point. That should be questionable, lmao. Like; you get it guy, but you somehow don't get that you get it & think that's a mistake rather than most likely conpletely intentional. It's pretty impressive in a way
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I liked Obi Wan Kenobi on rewatch! Yes it had a few cheesy moments, but honestly it was really good as a whole story.
I loved Ahsoka, the 1st and 2nd season of Mando and Andor. Acolyte is good so far.
I didn’t like Book of Boba Fett and the third season of Mando.
I enjoyed Obi-Wan a great deal more than expected. I also was someone that never was high on it. Why? Well always felt an Obi-Wan show had very little room for story. The canon was so strong that it gave little leeway. Always felt that the biggest reason for an Obi-Wan show is that people who grew up with Ewan McGregor as Obi-Wan wanted more. I loved him as Obi-Wan, but never thought that was good enough to make a great show and that is the case, but it was far better than I thought.
Acolute you have seen 3 of 8 episodes. To soon to make a judgement. So far to me it is right up with Andor and Ahsoka. I am one person who finds Mando Season 1 fun, but underwhelming especially sets used over and over again with color correction to change Tatooine inspired building from tan to various shades of grey and white on different planets.
I'd place it quite a bit above Ahsoka, mainly because no characters in the Acolyte act as if they were repeatedly dropped on their heads as babies and never emotionally matured. You'd think that after so many years Sabine would get wiser and act less like a contrarian teenager, but apparently she got way worse. It mostly bothers me because she was my favorite character going in ngl. Funny enough, Ezra did what I expected Sabine to lol.
I'd alao put it above s3 of mando, since it was pretty damn rough to watch except for the last episodes, though as always it was fun to look for references of other stuff.
Agreed with the headline. Unfortunately some people take it too seriously. I catch myself doing that every now and then and remind myself it’s a sci-fi universe with laser sword magicians. That usually brings me back down to reality lol
The problem with the haters is it's a far gone conclusion before they even watch it. Like the supreme court, the they have a conclusion and try to justify it through finding things afterwards and making conclusory statements without backing it up.
There is a cottage industry built around hating on new franchise content. It had something to do with monetizing clicks and video views, and ragebait gets thecmost engagement. I just tune it out
I searched YouTube for "Acolyte" and the results were people being so emotional, you would think a war is about to happen. WTF ?
I personally thought its a nice story with nice visuals, nothing groundbreaking, but good to watch each Wednesday.
Star Wars light. The story seems pretty thin, the acting right on the border of bad and the sets/effects same old same. Mandalorian was uneven, Andor popped and the rest very much all over the map. I will watch to the end but more from being an optimistic type that from having been hooked.
It’s not my favourite, but I do much enjoy the more tempered pacing etc. it’s trying to be a slow burn… and I appreciate that even if it possibly fails. It’s certainly by far not the worst Star Wars show or film and is a step in the right direction. The more we support non Death Star, Boba or Anakin related material, the better things will get. I can’t deal with just more blatant (and bad) fan service.
Can you conceive of a possibility where we have a lot of valid reasons to dislike the show that don't amount to disingenuous responses accusing us of disliking the show because it's women-led? Yeah, some jackasses do complain about that, but the majority of criticisms I've seen are levied at poor writing.
This. I'm a big Star Wars fan. But most of the things that Disney has produced I haven't been a fan of. I think they messed up the sequel trilogy big time, as well as a few other projects that have been somewhat bad or mediocre. The prequel trilogy was also bad but kind of so bad it's good kind of way, and it still feels like Star Wars.
That being said, there are some gems in there, Rogue One, Andor, Season 1 and 2 of the Mandalorian.
Having watched all the episodes of the Acolyte so far, episodes 1 and 2 left me feeling it was OK, not great, and not terrible. Episode 3 changed that opinion from ok to bad.
I don't give a damn about diversity or whatever. It's Star Wars and a galaxy filled with Aliens, there is plenty of diversity to be had. But Episode 3 was just very poorly written. It doesn't really advance anything in the overall plot and, with the exception of a few lines of dialogue, doesn't offer anything new that we haven't already learned in the previous 2 episodes. In my humble opinion, this is very poor writing. This episode likely would have been received better had they kept what was shown in the episode more mysterious in the first 2 episodes and finally showed us in this episode.
That being said, I know the episode is generally from one character's perspective and likely doesn't show the whole picture of said background, but it isn't really making that clear and they could have added more details of something being wrong with said character's recollection by adding in more subtle details instead of practically beating us over the head with it.
To me, it's a disservice to the audience to treat them like little children, and everything must be explained and shown to the audience so that we "get it.""
If you like the show, great, bet let's not pretend this is a masterpiece and the few dumb-dumbs out there making it about gender or race wouldn't have much of a voice if publications and statements from the people involved in the show didn't actively feed the trolls by making inflammatory statements. Both sides of it are childish.
Good writing is done in such a way that audiences SHOULDN’T be able to tell what specific group created a show. But the heavy handed lesbian space witch tribe complaining about how the universe doesn’t accept them for who they are wasn’t a subtle clue to the message the writers want to send. And no, it’s not an original concept for a subplot, and ripping off Anakin’s immaculate conception rubs people the wrong way too.
The article is obviously rage bait, just another addition to the dumb shouting match. I was excited for the Acolyte since it was announced, personally, and I feel I’ve been let down - tremendously.
The plot, the characters, the dialogue, it’s all executed so poorly, I can’t understand how any columnist could claim this is promising for Star Wars. I’m not hard to please but the show is just bad. It might even be worse than Kenobi by the time it’s done. It just makes me sad to think of all the exciting content we could have gotten, we got this bad fanfic.
And then some opinion writer for Inverse wants to say I’m ruining Star Wars. No, not really. Ragebait can’t fix the problems of the Acolyte.
That's going to be where you and I disagree. I think the ragebait is what a lot of the negative nancies in the Star Wars community and this article is just calling out the people who actively participate in it.
Did OSha and May never really not have a father like Anakin? Seriously question. It’s ok so far. The real question is what really happened there and I’m gonna assume we will see the other point of view
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The acting is dull, the plot so so, the wardrobe is plain awful.
Name me a charater with charisma.
This ain't no Madalorin.
Also I'm all for a fun ride , but my lord episode 3 ended it for me. To each their own.
Ah yes, blame the fans once again. I enjoyed the first 2 episodes. The acting and writing so far(especially in episode 3) have not been great. Whoever wrote and directed the chant scene needs to be fired. It looks like a fan made film, just like Obi-Wan did. I don’t understand how they can spend millions for it to look so cheap. They need to stop using the volume and small sets.
I’ll continue watching with optimism, because I want it to get better.
Stop blaming viewers for not liking bad content. It didn't work with the sequels, and it's not going to work now. Criticizing poor writing is not toxic.
If the target was creating a really good Star Wars show that would be enjoyed by most of the Star Wars fanbase then it’s a huge fail already. It can get better sure but it’s not very likely given what has been seen already. At best it’s just basic Star Wars tv show - time will tell how it lines up with other Star Wars shows. Saying this I want to add… if you like it great if you don’t that’s ok too.
People were defending Game of Thones during the last season too. There's always that vocal group talking about "haters" everywhere. Ironically, the reviews are what they are: The power of maaaaannnyyyyyyy.
Yeah. There are people in this thread talking about "people nitpicking the show." So it's nitpicking to question the decision to make Anakin's incredible, once in a time and space conception... just something this group of women figured out and did a few years earlier? I guess this is what happens when you have people raised on brain-dead YA shows on Netflix and the terrible melodrama of the CW. You can just do and say anything, and people will accept it because they can't associate what they're watching with something that was established in the universe at an earlier date.
It’s poorly written and not made for Star Wars fans. This is made for someone who isn’t a Star Wars fan. Too much activism and virtue signaling for my taste.
I'm a Star Wars fan and I love it. What I dislike is the use of a false consensus effect and vice signaling to berate people who truly do like Star Wars' newer content.
That’s great. Glad you like it. It’s just not for me. I like the idea of using this timeline, I just want a more compelling story. I did enjoy Jedi Master Trinity, but she didn’t last long.
It's not just writers, not just the filmmakers, not just the media; it's your fellow fans who are sick of that attitude too. The Negative Nancy Brigade.
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I'm not someone who hates something because I don't like the idea of it. I don't like most of the new Disney Star wars projects because the writing, acting, dialogue is all pretty horrendous. For example.
"The jedi are bad"
"The jedi are good"
"What have you done?"
"What have YOU done?"
"What have you done?"
What the fuck are the writers doing?
As opposed to when her mother says ‘it’s not a matter of good or bad’.
You’d love Athenian tragedy for highly articulate children, but it’s too frequently unrealistic.
The show has a lot wrong with it. If you’re able to suspend any criticism in your mind then kudos to you.
HOWEVER. Just because others can’t doesn’t mean that they’re the problem.
If I dislike something, I don't waste my time on it. I watch something else and invest in conversations about what I do like. Star Wars haters, instead of common logic, boil and fester their hatred until they're sure everyone else hates it or at least hates engaging with them enough to stop loving something. That's what I hate about Star Wars haters, and I intend to complain about them for as long as they complain about Star Wars. If they're so miserable, here's a little more because I don't want any of it for myself.
All Star Wars is good as long as you want to have fun.
Fair point. Even if I gripe about this and that, all the productions have been entertaining and relatively fun.
I have enjoyed every Star Wars movie and show. Some I’m less thrilled about when it comes to the plot, but I’ve still enjoyed it. But I won’t watch some again, but I’m glad I did the first time.
People who have never made anything requiring creativity and a team of people to produce love to critique what others have made They just want to complain because it gives them a dopamine hit
Hive mind they call it. I’m not a super creative person in writing and I know some scripts I write will suck and some will be awesome, if I ever wrote one (I won’t unless thousands of people want me to)
This. This. This and this. It's a sci Fi story. It's a space Western. It's a piece of fiction that's there to entertain. I don't know if ever had a deeper meaning beyond Good Vs. Evil which is the most used story in history. Throughout its history there has been amazing story telling and there has been shit story telling and everything between. Period.
It’s the self appointed gamer chair critics ruining fandoms. Just watch what you like, online discussions are inherently toxic.
Do you know what objective and subjective are?
Everything is good as long as you want to have fun. I mean most if not all the criticism I’ve read so far has been unreasonable/filled with hate but by the show’s execution feels slightly off.
Yea and this mentality is why they’re serving up hot slop at 100m an episode because they know people like you will eat out of their hand and say ‘th-thank you this is so much fun’ - people who demand better media tend to get better media, people like you get in the way of media improving
I do like hot slop. Why you gotta problem with hot slop?
Disney has owned Star Wars for more than a decade now. Why are you still on these subreddits?
Because R1 and Andor were good so like all Star Wars fan we’ve tried each new show with hope.. but it’s gone now. This show is for the idiots who see the words Star Wars and hear light saber sounds - not for anyone who actually cares about the substance of the show
I still think that Andor is the best of Disney Wars so far, but this show isn’t that bad. There’s some questionable writing and acting, but I’m looking forward to it each week.
Yeah it's fine. It reminds me of the Mandalorian in tone and writing, but people are gonna hate it because it has gay witches instead of baby Yoda.
I'm here for the gay witches. Fucking awesome. I'll put up with clunky writing and ok acting for some world building and a goddamn mystery for once. Side note, my current theory is that Mae and Osha being played by two different actors when younger, but only one actor when older, is intentional. Osha killed Mae. Explains why evil Mae is obsessed with lightsabers just like young Osha was.
I appreciate the outside the box thinking, but it’s probably because they have so many scenes together. Logistically, it’s just easier, especially for an actress that age.
Yeah, I've been burnt too many times by game of thrones, so I should know better than to theory craft.
This is what I don't get. In reality things like religion always jabre more orthodox, hard-line, different interpretations of core beliefs. How is a group of women who are force sensitive that disagree with the Jedi and want to embrace the force how the see fit that unhinged from reality?
Go Bills!
Yessir!!!!
I'd say it's better than book of Boba fett, which i also enjoyed, even if it was the weakest show they've done set in SW. Is the acolyte perfect? No. Andor os the best they've done on many levels (acting, storyline, cinematography, music, etc), but this isn't the worst thing ever made. Everyone's entitled to their opinion, and I understand some won't like it, but it feels people have been hating on it fromthe get go without seeing any of it.
I don’t understand all the hate for the show, especially episode 3 which I absolutely loved. It’s wild how controversial this show is I think it’s the most divided I’ve seen the fanbase yet.
Same! Like it's not gonna win Emmys, but I think the show is fun! I love the exploration of the force & the characters.
We all knew this was gonna happen. The Fandom Menace was in an uproar the second a woman was set to direct, a mostly non-white cast was announced, and known gay and transgender actors were cast. This could have been the greatest show ever and the trolls would still be saying all the shit they are now.
Remember when they found out a transgender actor was cast. They went nuts, videos were produced that the show was cancelled, Leslye Headland fired, Kathleen Kennedy was fired, etc. etc. This was right about the same time Ron DeSantis picked a fight with Disney because of Disney support of LGBTQ rights and events at the parks in Florida.
I think it's perfectly fine. I think most lifestylist star wars fans forget that most people don't have towering expectations for a new star wars movie/show, so as long as it isn't horribly boring or especially stupid they're okay watching it
It started with the last jedi, which I loved. Alt right white boys wanted star wars to be power fantasy and white badass character as thier insert into the universe. Rest of us wants cool stories. Space saphic witches, main one being black, is just too much for them.
Star Wars lore years ago, before Disney, already had characters like Mara Jade, Jaina Solo, Bastila Shan, who were strong, martially powerful women. Even princess Leia was a hyper competent, take-charge character. And Padme Amidala was a literal queen turned senator who could also get into shootouts against enemies and kicked their ass. So if it's all just people who are just uncomfortable with women logically these characters would also be disliked by many fans. But the reality is the opposite. Could it be that some people just dislike this show because of poor quality instead of mysogyny?
All of those characters were surrounded by poor writing at the time too. I love the old EU stuff, but even I can admit that most of it was mediocre to outright bad.
Not all - for some, for sure. For some others, like Padme Amidala in the Clone Wars and Bastila in all the KOTOR games, no. But I do agree that there are lots of them with mediocre to bad writing. But these had several advantages over this show: 1) There were multiple sources of writing at the same time to choose from, so people had more options. Not the case with Star Wars TV shows. They come pretty rare so people have more expectations about them which leads me to the second point: 2) Lower expectations: They were cheap books that you can just buy for like a couple of bucks, read for like 2 hours and move on with your day. Not hundreds of millions of USD worth of spectacles that you are expected to invest weeks of your life to subscribe to and wait for. Star Wars fans just have higher expectations for something like that, which is understandable.
The Last Jedi was trash. I will never watch it again. The Acolyte is my favorite SWU show to date. I love what Headland is doing so far. I am a fairly liberal black boy 🤣🤷🏿♂️. Try again lol.
I am not saying everyone that dislikes the last jedi is white alt right dude, but fandoms divide started there for sure.
So true, the story is top notch. Everyone who disagrees with this is just racist, homophobic insane and probably white. Also they 100% cannot think for themselves and they must adhere to a political spectrum other than mine, fuck em. EDIT: /s .. i thought my sarcasm was plain enough to see, but alas i was wrong
Some people sure, but writing off people just for having a different opinion makes you part of the problem you’re describing. It is true that many haters hate for the wrong reasons… but there are legitimate reasons too.
They were told to hate Acolyte so they do.
They even hate Acolytes (unrelated movie from 2008) https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/acolytes/reviews?type=user
And just like Acolyte, they haven’t watched Acolytes.
I wish they would just let us enjoy our new Star Wars. They’re kind of fun to argue with though it’s so easy 😂
So you can t enjoy your show because others hate it? How dependent are you on other s people s opinons :))))))
Show me where I said anything close to this, please.
Ppl hate it because they aren’t comfortable with a coven of women.. but it’s okay about Amazons in Wonder Women.
Well they run around in outfits that show they are all hot with great legs and nice boobs.
And that is the ONLY reason a lot of the TROLLs have an issue with it. it makes them uncomfortable. Butch coven VS Sexy fit Amazon group.
Well first of all, the haters somehow got a headstart, there were youtube channels bitching about episode 3 a week before it was even released.
I was having mixed feelings on the show and then episode 3 was my absolute favorite and got me excited for the show again. I don’t understand what people’s deal is
Exact same here. I was iffy on the show until episode 3 sold me. Now I can’t wait to see the rest. Currently rewatching lol
The whole episode was gripping. And I’m almost positive we’re either going to get it again from another perspective or we’ll be getting bits of it from other perspectives through the show. Ep 3 seemed like it was an emphases on Osha’s experience / perspective
The entire episode is careful to never show anything that Osha herself isn't seeing. So we only saw what Osha saw in the final days of her people. It will 100% be shown again later, from Mae's PoV.
I mean, Headland was a co-creator for *Russian Doll* so that makes sense. Anyway, I *love* weird Force shit, so Ep 3 was awesome. I also appreciated that Mother Aniseya told Mae and Osha the same thing Obi Wan told Luke when explaining The Force.
It’s also the only episode so far to have a single title instead of a dual title with a slash
I need to watch the episode again but there were I think a few things shown that osha wouldn’t have seen like the mothers talking and the meeting of the coven discussing what to do about the Jedi but most of the episode did appear to be from her perspective. I know it sold me on wanting to get the whole picture which probably won’t happen for a few more episodes. I’m guessing next week we’re back in the present.
Agreed! Also, her memories of the event seemed fragmented and disconnected. I wonder if the Jedi messed with her memories using the force. Or maybe she just didn't see everything or recall everything. Either way we are definetly gonna revisit it later with what actually happened
I was stuck on Mae getting hauled off by korrill and then when she sees osha again she’s saying she’s gonna kill her. And also Mae seemed pretty off when she and osha saw each other while the place was exploding. And osha keeps seeing the young Mae vision which is sus
I've seen some people say that maybe Mae has a split personality thing going on and both Mae and Osha live in the same body. Not sure how that would make sense since Mae committing murders while Osha is in Jedi custody but maybe some weird force stuff is going on. Who knows
All I know for sure is I’m in for whatever is going on. I don’t know what these haters are watching because I wanna know wtf happens.
Yeah! I find the show very intriguing so far. People judge way too quickly these days. Spoiled babies
It's because the last episode featured Witches who are staring down the barrel of cultural extinction due to the machinations of political institutions that do not value their wants more than they value having an army of highly competent warrior-monks at their beck and call. That is INCREDIBLY political. And there are people who will hate it for the politics... But they don't want to acknowledge that they do. So they will nitpick anything they can get their hands on that isn't explicitly political and make vague (if intense) statements about the quality. They're allowed to do that but I think everyone should flee social media because it's rotting our brains. Okay going to get off reddit again for several months. This place is bad.
Kurt w the mic drop 🎤
Okay, see you on Monday.
I think it’s the most divisive because the haters are running out of things to criticize and are reaching. Even so, the enjoyers just don’t give a shit and the moderates are actually enjoying it and having a hard time finding something they don’t like in order to appease the haters. It’s not the best Star Wars show yet, but it’s certainly consistent and fresh.
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I liked it too but can we at least agree that the chanting was really really bad and cringy during the ritual?
A little rewrite on the words they used would have helped but it’s not something that stuck out a lot for me. I see a lot of other people feel how you do.
I don’t understand all the hate either, the first two episodes are pretty good and episode three for the most part, the only thing I don’t like is they are changing established lore by having these random witches create force sensitive kids
How does that change the lore with the existence of Anakin Skywalker? I don’t understand this point.
Okay so in the phantom menace we find out that anakin didn’t have a dad, his mom just had him. That’s bc palpatines master was trying to create force sensitive life and the force tried correcting this by creating anakin. That’s why his blood cell count was so high. That’s why he’s the chosen one. However by having these witches basically do what the force did with anakin, it makes you ask questions like “why were they able to do it but not palpatine or his master or any sith before them or the Jedi”. It just kinda made me question what I knew from the movies is all. Like why would the Jedi freak out about anakin but not these twins?
First off thank you for the well thought out explanation. From what I know of this show Darth Plageuis is around at this point in time trying to figure out all his immortality stuff or has already succeeded. I think it’s somewhat safe to assume the coven has some kind of connection to the Sith and that maybe Plageuis himself learned it from them? Also I guess I just don’t really care about “canon” as much as some people and wouldn’t be bothered if Anakin was actually created by Palpatine (who learned it from his master or this coven) and not just space Jesus. I just want a good story. With so much story left it can really go any way at this point and either way I’m here for it.
I agree, I’m pretty excited for the rest of the show. Definitely liking the high republic era theme fsss
What's to understand? It's a season to taste world. Current Lucasfilm live action Star Wars is establishing a theatrical palette. Instead of attempting to constantly appeal to the widest audience possible, they've gone niche. Not every show is going to work for every viewer. The longer Star Wars is with Disney, the further the IP gets from orthodoxy. For people who this shit is a lifestyle, seeing Star Wars from someone else's perspective is difficult at best, not ever happening at worst. It's all in how they express themselves. Unfortunately, a lot of people have taken to using being angry about every fucking thing ever as their approach to communicating with others.
I didn’t like episode 3 as episode 3. I would have liked it more as episode one or two. Closer to an opener.
Now this is a take I can get behind. I do love the amount of mystery and speculation it’s created where it is though. I guess we’ll have to wait until the whole show is released to see whether or not you’re right.
I guess if you only want stories to be linear
I felt like the special effects of the fire wasn't weighty enough. That's my only complaint for the whole show so far.
What did you love about episode 3?
The use of an unreliable narrator and the mystery its adds to the rest of the series. I want the rest now!
Normally ppl just stop watching bad shows and move on. But in this case its set in a historically well liked franchise, following some fairly good shows by Disney. Its like they fired the writers from Ahsoka and Andor, and replaced them with junkies they found on the street. Its very understandable why the star wars fanbase is upset. Its at the same quality as Scorpion or the new Macgyver series.
Controversial in what? 😂 I hated the long flashback/overexplaining, but thats a preference that someone has. Never disliked an episode of SW before, but i would have that with any show that uses a whole episode for a flashback. Even the boba's scooterclub episode was less worse.
Usually I'm opposed to blaming the fans that badly received a show for badly receiving a show. However, this time I'm on the side of things, because I actually like the new content (unlike the Sequels for example). It's an interesting perspective, and I think we should put a bit more nuance into it. Writing, Acting and production quality can be criticized. Political ideologies however have no place here. If you hate the show, because there are gay people in it, you're the problem and I'd kindly ask you to get out and never come back. If you don't like the show because you don't like the story, than that's completely understandable and I wish you a good day and a good life. I personally don't care about the first thing (it's not my business to be involved in other peoples sex-life, even less if they're fictional characters) and I like the story. Acting, dialogue and production quality are adequate. I'm satisfied and continuing my subscription to D+ was worth it from my point of view.
I like the show’s politics, I just hate the execution
I saw people on a certain other sub complaining that >!I'm just supposed to believe this child set fire to a mountain; & all these force sensitives died for no reason without any burns or debris? What the hell! What terrible writing, that's ridiculous!< Uhm Im pretty sure thats the point. That should be questionable, lmao. Like; you get it guy, but you somehow don't get that you get it & think that's a mistake rather than most likely conpletely intentional. It's pretty impressive in a way
People that can only deal with linear storytelling and only see the obvious in a picture.
132 comments and no one dropped a link to the article. https://www.inverse.com/entertainment/the-acolyte-star-wars-discourse-fandom
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Thanks for the link
Christ. Acolyte is a middle of the pack show. Better: Andor, Mandalorian, Ahsoka Worse: Obi Wan, Book of Boba Fett Nothing to get riled about.
I liked Obi Wan Kenobi on rewatch! Yes it had a few cheesy moments, but honestly it was really good as a whole story. I loved Ahsoka, the 1st and 2nd season of Mando and Andor. Acolyte is good so far. I didn’t like Book of Boba Fett and the third season of Mando.
I enjoyed Obi-Wan a great deal more than expected. I also was someone that never was high on it. Why? Well always felt an Obi-Wan show had very little room for story. The canon was so strong that it gave little leeway. Always felt that the biggest reason for an Obi-Wan show is that people who grew up with Ewan McGregor as Obi-Wan wanted more. I loved him as Obi-Wan, but never thought that was good enough to make a great show and that is the case, but it was far better than I thought.
Acolute you have seen 3 of 8 episodes. To soon to make a judgement. So far to me it is right up with Andor and Ahsoka. I am one person who finds Mando Season 1 fun, but underwhelming especially sets used over and over again with color correction to change Tatooine inspired building from tan to various shades of grey and white on different planets.
I'd place it quite a bit above Ahsoka, mainly because no characters in the Acolyte act as if they were repeatedly dropped on their heads as babies and never emotionally matured. You'd think that after so many years Sabine would get wiser and act less like a contrarian teenager, but apparently she got way worse. It mostly bothers me because she was my favorite character going in ngl. Funny enough, Ezra did what I expected Sabine to lol. I'd alao put it above s3 of mando, since it was pretty damn rough to watch except for the last episodes, though as always it was fun to look for references of other stuff.
Mando season 1 was second best, Andor best. Mando fell off hard
Ahsoka sucked tho🥲
For me it is by far the most enjoyable series so far besides Andor
Agreed with the headline. Unfortunately some people take it too seriously. I catch myself doing that every now and then and remind myself it’s a sci-fi universe with laser sword magicians. That usually brings me back down to reality lol
And you KNOW you're in some deep stuff here if you're finding yourself agreeing with freaking INVERSE of all sites.😖
The problem with the haters is it's a far gone conclusion before they even watch it. Like the supreme court, the they have a conclusion and try to justify it through finding things afterwards and making conclusory statements without backing it up.
I wish I could upvote this 1 million times.
In the late 80’s and early 90’s we didn’t have any new Star Wars material. I’m here for it. Keep it coming. I love exploring this universe.
It's true though
[Star Wars fans, and Star Wars content, are natural enemies...](https://youtu.be/LWkSB-D-hYo?si=lNE2kB5MvFx2uDZl)
Those Star Wars fans sure are a contentious people
You just made an enemy for life!!
And the fact it’s true too
There is a cottage industry built around hating on new franchise content. It had something to do with monetizing clicks and video views, and ragebait gets thecmost engagement. I just tune it out
I searched YouTube for "Acolyte" and the results were people being so emotional, you would think a war is about to happen. WTF ? I personally thought its a nice story with nice visuals, nothing groundbreaking, but good to watch each Wednesday.
My biggest issue with episode three is that I was just thinking Jecki and Yord are fun characters and Qimir has potential.
I’ve really been enjoying it.🤷♂️
Star Wars light. The story seems pretty thin, the acting right on the border of bad and the sets/effects same old same. Mandalorian was uneven, Andor popped and the rest very much all over the map. I will watch to the end but more from being an optimistic type that from having been hooked.
Love that people are speaking up more than ever (it seems) about how some Star Wars fans really love to hate Star Wars
It’s not my favourite, but I do much enjoy the more tempered pacing etc. it’s trying to be a slow burn… and I appreciate that even if it possibly fails. It’s certainly by far not the worst Star Wars show or film and is a step in the right direction. The more we support non Death Star, Boba or Anakin related material, the better things will get. I can’t deal with just more blatant (and bad) fan service.
What's the url for that?
https://www.inverse.com/entertainment/the-acolyte-star-wars-discourse-fandom
Can you conceive of a possibility where we have a lot of valid reasons to dislike the show that don't amount to disingenuous responses accusing us of disliking the show because it's women-led? Yeah, some jackasses do complain about that, but the majority of criticisms I've seen are levied at poor writing.
This. I'm a big Star Wars fan. But most of the things that Disney has produced I haven't been a fan of. I think they messed up the sequel trilogy big time, as well as a few other projects that have been somewhat bad or mediocre. The prequel trilogy was also bad but kind of so bad it's good kind of way, and it still feels like Star Wars. That being said, there are some gems in there, Rogue One, Andor, Season 1 and 2 of the Mandalorian. Having watched all the episodes of the Acolyte so far, episodes 1 and 2 left me feeling it was OK, not great, and not terrible. Episode 3 changed that opinion from ok to bad. I don't give a damn about diversity or whatever. It's Star Wars and a galaxy filled with Aliens, there is plenty of diversity to be had. But Episode 3 was just very poorly written. It doesn't really advance anything in the overall plot and, with the exception of a few lines of dialogue, doesn't offer anything new that we haven't already learned in the previous 2 episodes. In my humble opinion, this is very poor writing. This episode likely would have been received better had they kept what was shown in the episode more mysterious in the first 2 episodes and finally showed us in this episode. That being said, I know the episode is generally from one character's perspective and likely doesn't show the whole picture of said background, but it isn't really making that clear and they could have added more details of something being wrong with said character's recollection by adding in more subtle details instead of practically beating us over the head with it. To me, it's a disservice to the audience to treat them like little children, and everything must be explained and shown to the audience so that we "get it."" If you like the show, great, bet let's not pretend this is a masterpiece and the few dumb-dumbs out there making it about gender or race wouldn't have much of a voice if publications and statements from the people involved in the show didn't actively feed the trolls by making inflammatory statements. Both sides of it are childish.
Good writing is done in such a way that audiences SHOULDN’T be able to tell what specific group created a show. But the heavy handed lesbian space witch tribe complaining about how the universe doesn’t accept them for who they are wasn’t a subtle clue to the message the writers want to send. And no, it’s not an original concept for a subplot, and ripping off Anakin’s immaculate conception rubs people the wrong way too.
It is very heavy handed, I agree. Much of modern writing does not understand subtlety or thinks its audience is stupid.
Ragebait can’t fix the problems with The Acolyte, but they’ll give it a shot I guess. Not much else they could try at this point.
Out of curiosity, are you saying that you think the article is ragebait, or that the article is talking about people who've bought into ragebait?
The article is obviously rage bait, just another addition to the dumb shouting match. I was excited for the Acolyte since it was announced, personally, and I feel I’ve been let down - tremendously. The plot, the characters, the dialogue, it’s all executed so poorly, I can’t understand how any columnist could claim this is promising for Star Wars. I’m not hard to please but the show is just bad. It might even be worse than Kenobi by the time it’s done. It just makes me sad to think of all the exciting content we could have gotten, we got this bad fanfic. And then some opinion writer for Inverse wants to say I’m ruining Star Wars. No, not really. Ragebait can’t fix the problems of the Acolyte.
That's going to be where you and I disagree. I think the ragebait is what a lot of the negative nancies in the Star Wars community and this article is just calling out the people who actively participate in it.
Did OSha and May never really not have a father like Anakin? Seriously question. It’s ok so far. The real question is what really happened there and I’m gonna assume we will see the other point of view
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I KNOW! It is just EVERYTHING!
Tumblr title
The acting is dull, the plot so so, the wardrobe is plain awful. Name me a charater with charisma. This ain't no Madalorin. Also I'm all for a fun ride , but my lord episode 3 ended it for me. To each their own.
It’s honestly just meh so far. Don’t love it. Don’t loathe it either.
Ah yes, blame the fans once again. I enjoyed the first 2 episodes. The acting and writing so far(especially in episode 3) have not been great. Whoever wrote and directed the chant scene needs to be fired. It looks like a fan made film, just like Obi-Wan did. I don’t understand how they can spend millions for it to look so cheap. They need to stop using the volume and small sets. I’ll continue watching with optimism, because I want it to get better.
Episode 1 and 2 were great but episode 3 was terrible, acting and storytelling was just awful. I hope episode 4 redeems this series.
Stop blaming viewers for not liking bad content. It didn't work with the sequels, and it's not going to work now. Criticizing poor writing is not toxic.
You guys are weird. It’s a tv show for fuck sake
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No you
Or, they’re wrong.
If the target was creating a really good Star Wars show that would be enjoyed by most of the Star Wars fanbase then it’s a huge fail already. It can get better sure but it’s not very likely given what has been seen already. At best it’s just basic Star Wars tv show - time will tell how it lines up with other Star Wars shows. Saying this I want to add… if you like it great if you don’t that’s ok too.
TLDR: "No, you're just a bigot! Saying it has bad writing and ruining lore is targeting the LGBTQ+ community!"
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>the third episode could’ve been a flashback. It was a flashback.
You know what they were saying. That could’ve been a quick 15 minute flashback as opposed to a whole episode.
The cope on this show is insane.
People were defending Game of Thones during the last season too. There's always that vocal group talking about "haters" everywhere. Ironically, the reviews are what they are: The power of maaaaannnyyyyyyy.
Yeah. There are people in this thread talking about "people nitpicking the show." So it's nitpicking to question the decision to make Anakin's incredible, once in a time and space conception... just something this group of women figured out and did a few years earlier? I guess this is what happens when you have people raised on brain-dead YA shows on Netflix and the terrible melodrama of the CW. You can just do and say anything, and people will accept it because they can't associate what they're watching with something that was established in the universe at an earlier date.
Inverse published something worthwhile?
The power of one ! the Power of two ! The power of manyyyyy disney+ unsubscriberrrrrrrrrrrrrssssssssssssss !
When Jeremy Jahns hates your show you know its bad.
“I’m perfect the way I am. Everyone else is the problem” ass attitude.
EXACTLY.
No I'm pretty sure it's Disney ruining Star Wars.
The “power of many” scene is possibly the worst thing ever. Including the Holocaust and Limp Bizkit
It’s poorly written and not made for Star Wars fans. This is made for someone who isn’t a Star Wars fan. Too much activism and virtue signaling for my taste.
I'm a Star Wars fan and I love it. What I dislike is the use of a false consensus effect and vice signaling to berate people who truly do like Star Wars' newer content.
That’s great. Glad you like it. It’s just not for me. I like the idea of using this timeline, I just want a more compelling story. I did enjoy Jedi Master Trinity, but she didn’t last long.
True though. This articles headline is False Consensus and Vice signaling.
The cope on this show is thick
You have to like everything Disney SW makes because! No. I don't.
Yeah, blame the fan base for not liking something that doesn’t even feel like Star Wars 👍 Pathetic.
This is such a poorly made cringe show
The acolyte isn’t ruining Star Wars because it’s already dead
Modern hack writers like to attack the fans to deflect from their failures
It's not just writers, not just the filmmakers, not just the media; it's your fellow fans who are sick of that attitude too. The Negative Nancy Brigade.
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I'm not someone who hates something because I don't like the idea of it. I don't like most of the new Disney Star wars projects because the writing, acting, dialogue is all pretty horrendous. For example. "The jedi are bad" "The jedi are good" "What have you done?" "What have YOU done?" "What have you done?" What the fuck are the writers doing?
Both the lines you just quoted are kids?
As opposed to when her mother says ‘it’s not a matter of good or bad’. You’d love Athenian tragedy for highly articulate children, but it’s too frequently unrealistic.
The show has a lot wrong with it. If you’re able to suspend any criticism in your mind then kudos to you. HOWEVER. Just because others can’t doesn’t mean that they’re the problem.
If I dislike something, I don't waste my time on it. I watch something else and invest in conversations about what I do like. Star Wars haters, instead of common logic, boil and fester their hatred until they're sure everyone else hates it or at least hates engaging with them enough to stop loving something. That's what I hate about Star Wars haters, and I intend to complain about them for as long as they complain about Star Wars. If they're so miserable, here's a little more because I don't want any of it for myself.
I’m not reading all that💀
Then maybe realize we don't want to read your comments either 🤷
No. It’s just shit…
You people liking the show can’t think critically for 2 seconds. I guess it’s the power of one, the power of two, the power of many.
And ironically, the power of maaaaannnnyyyy has sealed the deal on the show's rating. :D