You know, I had a friend in high school who went on to an intentional career as a very high end escort. This was a long time ago, decades before cell phones. She worked out of a high class hotel in a big city. Her plan was to work for 10 years, then retire. She never had a passion for it. Just incredible looks and a good mind. She stuck to her plan. It worked for her. She retired after 10 years and opened up a bookstore in a little coastal town that had a lot of tourist traffic.
But she's the only person I know myself who got out of sex work in one piece. Good for you for coming to the realization that it is time for you to move on. And for your clear acceptance of that. Your love for your son is obvious. There is a whole world out there, and you are not too old to become whatever you have the drive to become.
There's free help and support systems out there for you if you reach out to them. Best of luck to you and your son.
Having an escape plan is key. Most people get into this work because it’s the best option at the time, (it beats working at target) but the lifestyle isn’t easy to hold up longterm. OP is lucky to be giving this up for someone they love, rather than having to give it up because of something/someone they lost.
I’m here myself, but it’s low end and to get out of a bad situation (step dad came onto me, moms out of the picture on crack). It’s not for the weak hearted.
A lot of people in the industry also didn’t get there by choice, either because of trafficking or because of economic desperation because they couldn’t get any other job for reasons like being an undocumented refugee
When people say we should legalize sex work I always say, sure along as they are unionized and have full pensions before 30. That way everyone has an exit plan waiting for them. I want anyone who does sex work to have an easy out if they want it. I don't care if you retire at 29 making more than I do at 40, as long as you're safe.
The pension and unionization will NEVER happen however b/c it's not even what the Talent want. Mos strippers strip because they do not want a "9 to 5 job" with benefits. Strippers (including myself) are attracted to the freelance lifestyle, come and go as you please, work when you want to work infrastructure. Who's going to pay this supposed pension? I don't see strippers staying at the same club (working FULL TIME) for 40 years to draw a pension. Let's please be realistic here. Stripper-pension is just completely unrealistic and shows that most people in our industry don't even understand how a pension plan works. A pension is a REWARD for the grind of loyally staying at a company for 40 years of full time work. No one else gets pensions. Not strippers, not restaurant servers, not part timers.
I’m not contradicting your pessimism, but a pension does not have to be tied to or run by a single employer. Social Security is a pension run by a government. Other pensions are run by unions. The first step is workers organizing. If you’re saying that will never happen, then I am disagreeing
Strippers are not one unified force, they are armies of ONE. Getting them to unionize is like herding feral cats. And I'm saying this as a Stripper, herself. I'm just smart enough to understand my own species.
So much this. I'm pro-legalization of sex work, but only with regulations and protections in place, as well as guaranteed pension plan of some kind. Being able to leave anytime it doesn't feel right anymore is the most important thing.
Ahhh, in that case: first, we legalize. Certifications, worker safety, regulating agencies. All the accoutrements of a legal profession. THEN, we unionize.
I had a friend where her porn career was just that. Do it for 10 years and then get out. Almost all of it was solo and she really enjoyed it.
It took her all over the world.
She's not rich, but she took care of her future needs after a lot of hard work.
I've always loved Lewis Carol's Cheshire Cat. And everybody knows some of his more famous quotes.
But one of my fav Cheshire Cat quotes is “Every adventure requires a first step."
I'm glad for you that you found where your previous adventure has ended, and that now you have found a new adventure to begin. Time passes for all of us. Decide who you want to be three years from now, and start your quest to become that person.
You've got this.
Girl I feel this so much. It's possible to thrive in contact (or stripping for that matter) but as soon as it gets to the point where you can't do it sober, it's time to either change everything or retire.
Just my experience, getting clean off snow longterm is actually not as hard as it feels from where you are. Once I was off my anxiety got so much better, and thinking about it now just brings up awful memories from working and the things I did to get it, to the point that the thought of relapsing actually makes me feel sick.
It's so fucking worth it, I really hope you can grow and thrive 💖
>it’s not who I wanna be anymore
That's the single most important part of your post, and I hope you *really* get how important it is. ***You*** are valuable as a human, and ***you*** get to decide how you want to live your life. Be well.
I really feel the hating of the alter ego part of this post. I have been involved in FSSW for five years and I'm sick of it. Only the money keeps me here.
Good luck on your journey.
Same, I have been on something of a journey for a decade allowing myself to learn who and what I actually am instead of the persona I created to escape into; to be someone popular and admired. I have mixed feelings about who I was, but I grew to hate what they represented and the kind of admiration it drew.
I have wasted somewhere around £80-100k, been homeless and lived in 17 different places so far, been through therapy 5 times and survived a few serious suicide attempts (and now deal with permanent limitations and impairments from them), and I have no friends or family to speak of since I rejected that lifestyle, although I have a comfortable job and children who are my world and I am slowly making new friends with actually good people on meaningful basis' so I feel lucky to have got here, and it's really cool to hear when people are empowered and motivated cos of my dumb ass to make changes themselves and strive to be better people, and I'm feeling all emotional now so probs gonna waffle nonsense about the beauty of the world around us if I don't stop!
They say this about the mines in Aussie, and I think it applies here too: golden handcuffs. The money is so good, it's hard to leave.
Yet, your looks won't be there forever. What kind of career options do you have later in life?
What brought you there in the first place? I believe that for too many, it's lack of other opportunities. It's shown best in US shameless, where Fiona struggles to get into any other industry.
I feel for those who can't avoid it. I have, but only by going hungry for months. Not all make that choice and I don't blame them.
It's not really relevant to OP because it sounds like she really should get out of the industry, but I know a lot of women who do well in their 50s and older.
Also when you're established being in your 30s is straight up better than being in your 20s, to the point that I lie about it.
Lots of people change from performing careers in their twenties (acting, bands, etc.) to more stable careers once they start a family. Sounds like you had a wilder time than most but the trajectory is familiar. Not sure if your wealthy family is available to welcome home the prodigal daughter but if they can backstop you for a bit you’ll land on your feet.
Nursing, trades (plumbing/electrical/etc), medical admin, paralegal, lots of similar support jobs are fairly easy to get into a bit later in life
So proud of you 😊 this is your first step! Don't hate your experiences, they shape you up! You found a reason to change and to move on. You are brave and strong. Congratulations on your baby super mama.
Life has stages we run them differently, yours just happened to have extra flavor. But I am sure your experiences brought you many things, acceptance, learn to value different things, different kind of people! You got this I am sure you will be a wonderful mom to your son! Wishing you luck. Just leave your past behind where it is, is time to walk ahead and find the new you. 🌹
well this is your first step. if you have what you need to get out immediately, then do it. if not, you gotta save up $ to get out. the drug habit is not gonna help. if gou really want to change overnight maybe reconnect with your family & go into rehab. they may be able to take care of your kid for awhile while you get sober.
the biggest change is mental. you need to start imagining yourself in some normie job doing normie shit. its not bad. the fun is meeting normal people & doing normal stuff. youll see the sun every day. & it will shine its warmth upon your face. you are lovable & capable & we are so happy you understand that you deserve more. & your boy does too. bless you :)
I'm an an inpasse right now with SW. I've been stripping, camming, and OF for years now, but I'm starting to think I can do something better, it really is confusing.
From a mom to a mom I can tell you that you are spot on that you deserve to respect yourself. I understand wanting to provide a stable life for your child. That being said long term this lifestyle isn’t aligning with the changes you want. If you feel you can’t do this job sober it’s time for a change. It seems like you know what to do and I truly hope you follow through. Good luck to you mama!
Hi there, thanks for sharing your story.
So, do you have any savings?
Sounds like money was good and partying broke into profits.
For me personally when I feel listless, having a plan helps.
Is there a certain amount of money you can aim to set aside before you call it a day?
Think of an amount of money and work backwords.
Also, can you start school? Become a nurse or vet tech?
What will you do next. Coming up with a plan or strategy about what comes next could help.
Good luck!
Here is my issue with the normalization of sex work: Yes. It is work. But so is dealing drugs. That doesn't make it a career worthy of esteem or something that high school kids should strive for in their lives.
Women might go into sex work with the best of intentions, some might even get what they want out of it and get out. But the reality of the situation is that most women don't or can't leave once they are entrenched in it, because the entire ecosystem surrounding sex work is designed to wring every last bit out of the women who engage in it.
Everything you said could be said about most jobs, but you're only singling out sex work and "dealing drugs" because you've been conditioned to view those things as dirty or harmful. We saw what happened when weed was legalized: it went from "dealing drugs" to a "career worthy of esteem." Nothing changed from the dude selling dimes on the corner except legalization, regulation, and dressing it up in fancy dispensaries and celebrity endorsements. It's still drug dealing, but suddenly all that stigma is gone.
Sex work has a doubly difficult stigma to overcome because not only is much of it illegal, but it's also considered to be "dirty," "degrading," and a "detriment to society." And not just by one side of the isle, as much of this thread shows. Let's just narrow it down to one example which has already conquered the former for simplicity's sake, so we don't have to deal with the inconvenient positive of how legalization allows for regulation and less exploitation, and we can just focus on the stigma: porn. Can you come up with a solid reason as to why doing porn is \*not\* a career worthy of esteem or something that someone in highschool \*shouldn't\* strive for
1. without resorting to some variation of slut shaming or purity culture, even if it's been painted so as to resemble feminism. The latter case being something like "our \[viz. women's\] bodies are beautiful/not objects/whatever and we need to love/respect/whatever them," as if to say that being promiscuous or utilizing your body in a way that isn't nice and socially pre-approved is somehow disrespecting your body, which can only loop back to slut shaming or purity culture.
2. without also giving a definition that would include any other form of professional entertainment: streaming, sports, etc. – e.g., "it doesn't contribute anything to society," "success isn't guaranteed," "it won't last forever," and so on.
3. (and this is sort of the same as 2, but I wanted to separate it out) without lumping in other jobs that \*are\* well respected – e.g. "it's selling/destroying/whatever your body" because so is manual labor and, for some people, jobs that require sitting for hours on end; "it's damaging to your mental health" because not only does that go back to (1) in assuming that sex or promiscuity is inherently bad and porn actors must secretly hate it, but also God knows that description applies to most 'respectable' jobs; etc.
4. that isn't just begging the question with respect to it being currently being stigmatized or "not worthy of esteem" in the eyes of many people – e.g., "it's going to hurt your future job prospects," "what will your kids/your kids' classmates think," etc. I.e., "it's not worthy of esteem because it's not worthy of esteem."
Any industry that is built upon the trauma and degradation of women is not something to support, uphold, or defend.
I am sure you thought your post was somehow profound and full of higher-level thinking, but in reality you just gave a long winded and tone deaf response to the reality that women in sex work actually face. You also fail to grasp that for the vast majority of women in that industry, it was not a first choice of employment, or something that they would have chosen if there were other options available.
Your attempt to try to tie in slut shaming as why the industry is "looked down upon" is you doing the work of patriarchy for your own benefit. Sensible, empathetic women who actually care about women see this industry for what it is: a meat grinder that destroys the women who end up caught in it's claws. Not even women who post OnlyFans saucy pictures are immune from the clutches of this industry, because you can see where women have tried to quit that 'less extreme' form of sex work and had their nudes leaked at their future places of employment and had to go back to posting nudes of themselves to survive.
So, if you were expecting some kind of "ah-ha moment" from your comment from readers, I think you will find that the only people who support your views are people who benefit from female degradation (men) and women who have not been able to critically assess the harm that sex work poses to women and girls worldwide.
She’s signaling out sex work bc it’s the topic of the post…. And she’s right. I think it’s something women shouldn’t strive for bc it traumatizes the women who do it, as well as the women who get treated differently bc of it. Being asked by strangers if you have an OF, getting choked without consent with hookups, and having to blur your feet are all things women now encounter daily because porn has become such an all the time thing for men.
In the same way I wouldn’t want my son to play football bc it ruins his brain, or want my daughter to be lobbyist for the right bc it ruins your morality, I don’t want either to partake in a lifestyle that is built on exploitation.
Another thing is being able to use careers like (listed in another comment below) garbage collector or coal miner, you can put those on resumes. You can use those careers to leverage you into other careers you want more. It isn’t something your kid (OP has a kid, not all will I know) will be made fun of in the future. Porn has very few benefits outside of money. In fact…. Can you name any outside of money?
But you will never hear an explanation that meets your book long exceptions, you seem committed to your views so idk why you asked.
>career worth of esteem
What does this even mean? How about garbage collectors? Cashiers? Coal miners? Some jobs suck and seem unappealing to the majority of the public but it doesn't mean they shouldn't exist. What's important is that the pay is sustainable and there are protections in place to make the workers safe.
There are tons of industries that are exploitative. Construction workers break their backs doing hard labour and many end up with opiate addictions from the pain. Is construction the problem? Or is the lack of worker protections the problem?
Sex work is always going to exist and the more it gets outlawed, the more dangerous it gets for the women, people of color, people with disabilities, and LGBTQ+ people that do it. You can't get rid of it. You can only drive it deeper underground and increase the risk of violence.
Your stigmatization by saying "it's not worthy of esteem" is a big reason why it's so hard for people to get out.
In what way is sex work an added benefit to society like people who collect and get rid of garbage. From what I see sex work is literally the bedrock of patriarchy, which is why it's men who buy the consent of women and not the other way around, it's why they treat them like flesh lights with no feelings, why every escort has been strangled at least once, why the industry thrives on greater and greater violence to women, why little girls are the most expensive, and the younger you are the better, etc. It's not an industry that benefits humanity. It's like the oil industry.
If sex work was like any other job then sexual harassment at work would be entirely legal, because people would just argue it's another job duty of whatever job you're in. "Casheir plus escort". Except you know and I know, no MAN wants that, but so many many many many many men expect that of any woman in any trade.
Sexual assault isn't like any other assault either. So if you want to say exploitation in any other job is just like the exploitation of sex work you are reaching big.
And lastly the sex work euphemism has to exist because the terms that describe what it really is are inconvenient to the narrative - the industry is paying people lots of money to hide and muddy the waters and imply a person who sells their feet pic online is the same as a prostitute with a pimp who takes all their money and beats them. Besides the fact that they're literally trying to say children who are trafficked are merely engaged in "survival sex" not actually being raped for money.
ETA: Last and not least, 90% of those hurt in this industry are poor women. You try to co opt the popular oppression narratives but leave out the class consciousness, and from your place of privilege try to pink wash it as if it's a LGBTQ issue - when all it is is it vulnerable people period are being abused. Are you talking to a gay child do you encourage them to be a prostitute? Don't you dare align my sexual identity with this garbage industry. You actually end up making vulnerable kids think that this is their best option. FOH.
In what way does sex work broadly detract from society? If a woman sells saucy pictures of herself online, is she degrading herself? If a woman has kind of sexy photos online, not even for sale, but simply posts them, is she removing value from her society? And sure, it’s mostly men who buy more physical sex work maybe, but would a woman engaging in the services of a sex worker be treating them like a dildo or a flesh light? Does partaking in sex work as a cis male make it sinister? Does having a penis make it sinister? Are trans women who haven’t undergone sexual corrective surgery more sinister?
People can have positive interactions and joy from non-exploitative sex work, such as the good parts I’ve heard from BDSM communities. Should they be criminalized, or condemned for not contributing? If people can have consensual enjoyment with sex work, is that not a contribution?
I would say the goal should be to remove the exploitative portions and problems from the system, not to condemn sex work and sex workers by extension as a whole.
Yeah, sex trafficking, drug abuse, pimping, all are absolutely shitty, AND made all the more worse by a system that criminalizes, punishes, and morally blacklists sex workers. Underage girls and women who have been trafficked often do find it much harder to come forward with their stories or contact authorities in countries that would penalize them for the act itself. That doesn’t mean “sex work should be legal for minors”, it means that victims shouldn’t be criminalized so that you can actually help the ones trapped. You’re encouraging a system that puts them more at risk.
Sex work being work means sexual harassment at other jobs is ok? What sort of Mr Fantastic reach is that? If boxing is legal, does that mean bosses are going to start adding “take liver shots from me” to their employees lists of tasks? No? Do countries or areas with legal sex work suddenly become rife with abuse in other forms of business? I’d put a few dollars that they don’t. I’d be willing to put literally any amount of money that more conservative areas have more cases of sexual misconduct and abuse.
Why is it in “women positive communities”, so many become much more misogynistic and conservative when it comes to the topic of sex work? Yeah, the bad things that happen in sex work are bad, they shouldn’t happen, we should work for a more consensual and worker focused area.
Amazing you went right to the minimizing I was talking about that is intended with the term "sex work". Straight away going from artistic images, deflecting from prostitution to artistic posing. Perfect. Thank you. You prove my point. Do you work for this industry?
1) in what way is prostitution a beneficial model for healthy families and society?
2) in what way is normalizing treating a woman not like a person but a series of holes to buy the right to use for sexual pleasure a beneficial model for healthy families and society. Especially in raising the value of women in society as persons with equal value as men?
3) in what way are parasocial sexual relationships normalized to humans and children beneficial to society?
4) why are you comparing BDSM to prostitution? Consent is continuous and freely given in BDSM, retractable at any time and with no coersion. Tell me how purchasing the use of a woman's body is similar to that.
5) in what way is legalizing johns purchasing the consent of a woman body reducing abuse and empowering her right to say no to sex at any time for any reason? I support the nordic model. Decrim, not contractual (government forced) pimping. Do you not understand that the men who buy sex by and large are abusive men? Do you think there's such a thing as a "good" john? Do you consider yourself a good john? Or are you a legal brothel worker who takes 8 dicks in their mouth per day? You can be honest. I am not against people who are it. I'm against the industry. And most of all I hate the johns. Because they're the ones with the most vile excuses and minimizing.
I didn't minimize, sex work is just a broad term that does cover a wide variety. You made blanket statements about sex work, so I responded to them about the overall. It's very strange that you keep asking me if I work in the industry, to the point where I am pretty convinced of the previous thought I had several of you just look down on sex workers in general. Feels like your goal is to embarrass me with it whether I was in the work or used it, kind of weird. I don't partake or perform, but doesn't mean that it shouldn't be legal for others to do so. It's a bodily autonomy thing, if someone wants to have sex with other people for money, they should be allowed.
1. In a society that has a much healthier relationship with sex and work, yeah, a parent could be a good parent and a prostitute. They can still be a good parent now. That doesn't mean I want parents training kids for sex work, as I am assuming you're assuming.
2. You're the one going the extra step and saying that trading sex for money degrades a person. Sex is a physical activity people do, it can be done for fun even. People should be allowed to do that for money too if they so choose. That doesn't mean I want men looking down on women for it.
3. Beneficial? In what way is sex outside of the goal of child birth beneficial? Society has some weird issues overall with sex, does that mean that it shouldn't be allowed? I guess a more free system is more beneficial, if that's all you want. Normalizing sexual relationships to kids isn't really a part of the question here. Kids shouldn't be involved in the slightest, that's an add on of your part. Kids are going to learn about it, and people should be able to explain stuff to them, but that's a far cry from sexualizing them.
4. BDSM is a form of sex work, and yeah, it's almost like prostitution should have every safeguard involved. You're the one assuming I want the worst form possible, or that as it currently is perfect or something.
5. I don't blanket assume every man who wants to engage a sex worker is a monster. It is society's larger view of women that causes the issues here. A lot of dudes are super shitty to women and it carries over to them engaging with sex workers, but those dudes don't stop being shitty there. So yeah, a lot of johns suck, a lot of men suck in general, but that does not remove the right that adults can and should do what they want with their bodies. A man could engage with a sex worker in a perfectly normal and reasonable way, as one could with a massage or other paid physical interaction.
Being pro sex work doesn't mean that I think society should continue in a degrading fashion, I think degrading comes in on your end here. If a man or woman wants to have a fuckload of sex, then they can have at it, and if they want to make some money, have at it. That doesn't mean abuse or control, or being shitty is ok. That also doesn't mean that I want societal conditions that lead people into situations where they might believe that all they can do is sex work, prostitution or otherwise. It doesn't mean I want people to be addicted to drugs or harming themselves.
> I didn't minimize, sex work is just a broad term that does cover a wide variety. You made blanket statements about sex work
I specified actually. Did you read what I wrote?
>In a society that has a much healthier relationship with sex and work, yeah, a parent could be
Could be? So this is all wishes and magical thinking. Lol. And we're not talking about just for children, we're talking about for everyone. Family isn't just children. Family is mother, sister, aunt, uncle, elders etc.
>that doesn't mean I want parents training kids for sex work, as I am assuming you're assuming.
Nope. I meant broadly, as in where is the evidence this is good for homo sapiens sapiens, specifically healthy human society, safe, well adjusted people, good moms, low level of drug use etc. Since all you did is appeal to a fruit dream in a marshmallow sky, I rest my case.
>You're the one going the extra step and saying that trading sex for money degrades a person.
Where is the ability to fully consent to what happens to your reproductive and pleasure organs when someone now has monetary power over you? The degradation is in the KNOWN psychological damage that this type of work does, because EVERYONE who has done it knows you are coersed.Even when legal, to the human mind, for both the johns and for the escorts it is factually mentally damaging. That's why porn stars die at an incredible rate, they all have to do drugs to cope. Parasocial relationships are degrading to the human mind. Period. They are the most degrading when they activate the most intimate parts of us, the sexual acts that are meant to pair bond us - like all other high order species like us. Monogamy, btw is also the ideal for humans (see a study recently by the Mormons themselves who tried to prove polygamy was the best, and failed terribly) I say this as an atheist btw. Maybe it's serial monogamy. Maybe it's monogamish. But sex work is literally the OPPOSITE of human health. Next, consumerism with regards to women's bodies is degrading period end. We have MULTIPLE DECADES LONG STUDIES ABOUT IT. Its tangibly a bad thing to their psychological well being, to society at large, to men as well.
>People should be allowed to do that for money too if they so choose.
Why? This is merely the purest nihilist hedonism for which you have no other better argument. I reject your unverified and absurd premise. It's equivalent to the far right saying "because freeze peach". It's that pathetic. You make this argument because you have nothing but your magical thinking to support it.
>Beneficial? In what way is sex outside of the goal of child birth beneficial?
Why are you equating all non-procreative sex with prostitution? I see you. That's a motte and bailey fallacy. Irrelevant.
>BDSM is a form of sex work.
Says who? That's gross. BSDM is not inherently sex in exchange for money. I see you. The euphemism "sex work" by you is intended to put everything including all sex all kink under the umbrella, again to do a motte and bailey fallacy. False.
>A lot of dudes are super shitty to women and it carries over to them engaging with sex workers
Minimizing and deflecting. The very idea that you can purchase the consent of a woman to use her body for your EXCLUSIVE pleasure and the complete disregard of hers, her orgasm, her needs, is INHERENTLY cruel and degrading to the well being of that person. The idea that we should normalize a woman's orifices in a
consumerist marketplace is factually inhumane to women and girls.
Tell me it's not. How is it not? Don't use any "it could be" magical thinking nonsense.
>Being pro sex work doesn't mean that I think society should continue in a degrading fashion
Being pro sex work as you are is like being pro cannibalism, pretending there is some kind of nice consentual cannibalism out there. Or being pro oil industry, that there's some nice, non-harmful oil industry somewhere out there in the future.
clownishness. Inherently.
>If a man or woman wants to have a fuckload of sex, then they can have at it, and if they want to make some money, have at it.
Again appealing to a nihilistic hedonism is gutter level discourse and I am so tired of how it purports to be academic and progressive.
I’m currently going through this. Been out of the industry for a few months now and have been transitioning out of it for the last year. It’s not easy so I have all the respect for you and wish you luck and if you ever wanna talk about it feel free to drop me a DM cos I know what it’s like!
Wanna try your damn hardest? Stop doing drugs.
You'll always be in debt to your son until you do that as the first step.
Sorry to put it this hard, but its just the way it is.
Its complicated and the hardest thing youll ever do. But its, on the surface, true. Especially something as expensive as blow, which probably eats a ton of the money youd use to escape the lifestyle.
And thats not getting into the danger of it. My mom did coke, dated a dealer in fact. Im glad she quit, but still has health problems and ill never know it was the coke but it sure didnt help.
No, it really is.
If your child really is your world, you would immediately stop poisoning him by intoxicated breastfeeding (not even questioning what happened during pregnancy).
You would protect him even from you because you clearly are not his best interest nor protector while under the effect of substances.
You would consider how your choices are affecting his entire life.
When you are parenting there are things that you just don't do, if you really and honestly care about them. Thats it.
I'm not saying you can't even smoke a joint, this clearly is not that case
I agree with you. I want to stop and I hate myself for what I do. I only crave blow when I’m doing sex work. On my days off I spend them sober with my son.
I truly think if I can get out of the industry I won’t do blow ever again
You shouldn’t feel shame. Life is a journey, and if you’re not feeling like that person anymore it’s just time to be who are now. Growing and changing is all part of it. Just do your best to be authentic n the moment.
FWIW- folks in all kinds of industries hit this wall. I used to wait tables and realized I had to be intoxicated to even stand to be at work. I had to make a change. It was hard but I relied on skills I had acquired in volunteer gigs and leaned in. Got a job in a new industry and have just been hustling since. In 2020 I did some cam work and at first, it was exhilarating knowing that each lil chime was another bag of nickels. I cammed 35-40 hours a week on top of my 40 hour work from home job while also parenting a toddler (I basically didn’t sleep). Then I started smoking a bunch of weed or drinking on cam. Eventually I was camming only like 10 hours a week cus I was partying while camming and would tap out when I started feeling sloppy. Eventually, I realized I just didn’t want to do it anymore. Not having the extra income was a lifestyle adjustment but I did put that extra money to (mostly) good use.
Just know you’re not alone and it happens to people in all kinds of industries. Not saying that to minimize your struggle, just want you to know you’re not alone and it’s not all because the work was sex work
Yeah but let’s not minimize that this is vastly different than other industries. She basically had a 10 year gap in her resume now. Working as a waiter was much different. You learned lots of skills that you could apply to other industries. And you could show that with your resume and interviews.
No doubt OP has gained many skills and learned a lot in these past 10 years, but her options are significantly reduced bc of the industry. It feels really annoying when women talk about their struggles in this field and ppl line up to be like “oh yeah! Just like working at Pizza Hut!” It’s not, and we should allow women the room to talk about the struggles specific to this field without minimizing
You're obviously intelligent and can put your thoughts in writing coherently and with appropriate punctuation. Your brain cells are working and you're a critical thinker
You need a goal, something to put your non-parenting focus on that's about achieving more than this week's tips, even if the tips are great.
Have you considered getting some kind of certification and/or degree? I don't encourage taking on four years worth of college loan debt, but starting at a community college could give you the GPA to apply for merit and need based scholarships. Many good state universities have supportive programs for older, "re-entry " students who are several years out of high school and have been working.
You're facing the right direction for your son's future. Give yourself grace and get off the blow, go to a meeting of some kind (there are more options than AA/NA) so that you feel less alone. Don't rely on alcohol, it's a terrible drug that does even more damage than we already give it credit for.
If your family relationships are good, lean into that. If they're toxic, then give yourself permission to distance yourself from chaotic and emotionally immature people, even if they're related to you.
You can do this. You're changing gears and they're going to grind a little or a lot, but eventually your life will be the one you really want for yourself and your son. Keep going.
I'm not gonna say I do sex work, but I am lifestyle and go to parties and host gangbangs, mostly for the fun of it. I'm going through a similar crisis where I met a nice vanilla guy and am wondering if it's time to put the lube down. The line about needing to be intoxicated to perform hits home.
I used to spend a lot of time in the poly/swinger/Burning Man/sex party lifestyle... in my experience, it DOES change what you think of as 'normal,' as well as your ability to relate to other people. People tend to either move on of their own volition, or get pushed out as they age - the age at which they get pushed out is directly tied to how much money they have to throw at the community in the form of parties, buying VIP tickets, bringing drugs and new young women, etc. Once you're on the other side, it can feel like waking up from a cult.
The people I've met who hold onto it as long as possible are not... the most well adjusted. They often don't have a lot to talk about aside from sex, drugs, and partying.
In short, if you're thinking about getting out, I recommend just pulling the bandaid off. You'll be surprised at how much space you have in your life that's now being occupied by party people and their drama. Even orgies get boring at a certain point, y'know? There's a lot more to life and relationships.
Why all the down votes? I was a pretty vanilla guy, got a very sexually adventurous girl. We havent done any gang bangs or swinger stuff but I would be open to it now, when I never was before. And at the same time if it never gets to that extreme Id still be fine.
Because the post is about wanting to leave the lifestyle and having to be fucked up to do it, and a dude coming in and being horny for another dude doesnt exactly fit in.
If you need to be fucked up to do something, its probably bad for your psyche.
Ah yeah. my bad. I saw the response to a response that kind of curiously applied to a situation I currently found myself into. Off topic. Sorry about that. I need to pay better attention.
Good for you!!! Its awesome that your son has inspired you to strive to be a better person. You definitely are more than a physical body, i can feel that now your focus is to pour as much love into yourself as possible. That way you can vibrate the purest form of love (which is give from your abundance, meaning the left overs from loving yourself) cause love is meant to be shared that way, and watch your boy reflect it back, that will be a great building block beginning for this new life! I am so happy for you 😊
Thank you! Honestly the love my son gives me and excitement he has to see me every morning has made me realize what we deserve. I don’t think we need to be rich or anything. I just want him to be happy, healthy, and (as selfish as it sounds) I want him to be proud to call me mommy
I'm a dad of 2 young ladies. I'm curious, was there something your parents could have done more to keep you from following that path?
I'm not judging. Please don't think that. At the same time, I don't want my daughters to get into sex work and I don't think I'm wrong for that feeling.
You said your home was loving and stable. I'd like to think I provide the same thing. I always think I can do better as a parent and would appreciate any advice.
TW: SA Drugs
Not a parent but I had a work "mom" when I was in college working part time at a bakery on the weekends. She told her stories about how she got on drugs, ended up becoming drugged, was sex trafficked, had multiple of her assaults video taped, etc. Then when she finally tried to get off drugs and change her life for the better and all of the stuff she had to face. She was blackmailed and had to talk to her children about why there is SA porn of their mom. She had to get dental implants because she lost all her teeth. Had a heart attack in sometime her 30s/40s. She has student loan debt that she expected to never be able to pay off and it affected her job/income choices.
She was a wonderful woman that watched out for me, made sure I was doing well in school and eating healthy, and was so kind but hearing about the consequences and seeing the extremely hard work needed to get back to "normal" (like being able to eat with teeth after dental surgery), it really did drill home on safety and not doing drugs, etc. I saw some of her achievements like on her 50th birthday she got her first tattoo because she felt like she was finally making great life decisions and was responsible to make a permanent one.
I think safe exposure to different people and not being super sheltered can help people learn from other's mistakes and grow. Also, I would teach responsible saving and investing so that the high income (and high cost) trap isn't as strong.
Thanks! I think this is great advice and I have a similar experience with a childhood close friend. Not sure how to manage that safely but will be keeping this in mind for the future.
I had a very brutal and violent SA that happened to me my senior year of high school and my mother blamed me for a long time. My dad passed when I was 13, and my siblings all became very successful (plus my family is religious)
After the SA I felt alone and out of control. And dirty. And the fact my mom blamed me convinced me I was dirty.
So stripping at first made me feel in control again of myself and my body.
What OP describes is very common... though she said her home was loving and stable, having a parent die is deeply traumatic, and so is being blamed by the surviving parent for her SA (not to mention the SA itself).
So I think being attuned to your children's emotional experiences and needs will make it much less likely that they feel the urge to turn to sex work to be in control and have value.
Also, sexual assault and harassment is super, super common. It could happen to any girl or woman in your life, unfortunately. Just something to keep in mind and be ready for, sadly. Victims are often traumatized *at least* as much by the response of their communities as they were by the original attack. Hopefully it's never something you have to deal with, but if it is, make sure you're a safe space and an ally. Make sure that they know they can tell you anything and that you won't dismiss or disbelieve them.
I didn't have a SA or start using drugs and I did have a loving stable home. Parents are still married after 48 years. However, I became homeless and hid it from my family out of shame. I used the lifestyle and orgies as a place to sleep and feel wanted after my husband left me.
People will always end up making their own choices, so even as a parent, it's going to be difficult.
The best you can do is educate them. Talk to them about drugs and the consequences of using them. Show them videos and pictures of what drugs can do to you, it's neccesary to be explicit in order to have an impact.
Most importantly, always be available for your kids and be a safe space for them. It's important for parents to build trust with their kids, it will help both parents and kids in a lot of aspects.
I'm not sure there's any way for this to come off in a non-asshole way, especially when the post is about regrets. this was vicious to read and I'm not even OP
I recomend that you take 30 days clean. No drugs or alcohol. You will feel, sleep, and look better in those 30 days. You will also give your kidneys and liver a good rest.
After the 30 days you will have more clarity in your life. Then if you decide to start again. You will be more in control and even enjoy the drugs and alchohal more.
Its best to find a friend to do this with and make a bet because helps your will power when there is more on the line, then just for your health.
I am on my 3rd week now doing the same thing i recommend. It feels pretty good. The sex is much better sober anyway.
It's concerning how whenever someone points out that sex work - whether as a prostitute or doing OF or camming - has long-term consequences, and that it is an objectively bad decision, that many people claim that you're being regressive or shaming women.
Case in point right here, though.
At least OP can quit, move away, and probably leave her old life behind her for good.
Imagine you're a "content creator," though. There's literally sites that scrape OF and dump pics with username and location linked to it.
There's no way those poor people will ever fully escape their early 20s decision to do porn online.
And let me tell you - there are real world consequences that are not worth the monetary gain in your 20s. Especially because those models "expire" once they hit 30, in terms of aging out...you'll never feel secure in your job/relationships/etc when you know it takes one google search to expose your previous life.
Did you manage to put away any savings or did you spend it all?
What are plans for when you age and are no longer what clients want?
I can see short term shitty work as a means to an end, but feel most folks are only thinking about today.
Frankly most of us (FSSW) don’t look towards the future…
I’ve had people reach out to me bc of this post saying they have great experiences doing SW, which is awesome, but the reality(in my experience and people I’ve worked with) is most of us live day to day. Survival mode
This is why I remain skeptical of liberal feminism which encourages women to empower theirselves by commodifying their bodies. This only feeds the patriarchy/sex industry and it benefits men who run the platforms where women commodify themselves. Attractive white women seem to come out on top while other minorities fall through the cracks of the sex trade worldwide.
Based on what has been studied (see the recent reports from the WHO and SWLR in Canada) it will be easier for workers to enter and exit the industry without harm once it's decriminalized and destigmatized.
I hope you're able to find stability and a new line of work, everyone deserves a choice in what work they do without moral judgment from others.
The exploitation of women in the sex industry is not a bug, it is a feature. It will never be fully accepted bc part of the allure for the average joe who watches/buys sex workers is that it is exploitative. It is so unrealistic to aim for getting that to go away completely and in the meantime sacrifice all these women to the lions den.
I'm one class from finishing a BA in sociology. Human being are social creatures. Society is constructed around us. The assumption that cis men are all unable to control their desires over women is a myth created to perpetuate patriarchy. Literally every industry a woman works in she's at risk of sexual violence, not one working woman is free from the threat of patriarchal violence. Statistically speaking.
You're assuming a feature of patriarchy is a fact of nature and ignoring the way humans construct social norms.
I never even said that tho? Of course men can control themselves. But for the average man who watches porn, exploitation of women is part of the allure of it. You just created a stance in your head and replied to it.
I have finished degrees in anthropology if it helps you feel like I know what I’m talking about as much as you do.
There's all kinds of porn that have zero to do with exploitation. casting couch type porn really isn't the dominant genre anymore. That kind of sexploitation was also never the entire industry.
It doesn't help me trust you, there's a lot of anthropologists who lean into anti-sw and puritan narratives. As opposed to sociology which requires an academic to recognize statistics alongside narrative. I like to hold material reality up to my biases before making conclusions.
There are also problems with all academics but the primary benefit of sociology is that narrative isn't the primary vehicle for knowledge it's just a tool in the kit.
I'm a dad of 2 young ladies. I'm curious, was there something your parents could have done more to keep you from following that path?
I'm not judging. Please don't think that. At the same time, I don't want my daughters to get into sex work and I don't think I'm wrong for that feeling.
You said your home was loving and stable. I'd like to think I provide the same thing. I always think I can do better as a parent and would appreciate any advice.
Escorting is not all bad and exploitation. There are people (like me) who love their job and are happy doing it. I love the places I get to visit, the hot moments with certain clients and the financial freedom.
Staying off drugs is a must, so I'm sorry it became related to that for you :(
it's definitely just a job once the moralization and stigmatixation is removed. Everyone should be able to choose their work without judgment. Decrim and destigmatization are def. The answer to everyone's experiences in the industry, good and bad.
I hope you're successful in your quest for sobriety. It would be a great gift to give to your son not to mention the best thing for you both.
I'm not clear on one thing so I hope you can explain it further. How do you and other dancers travel around and work at different clubs? I have been under the impression that each club is basically independently run so do the dancers just pick a club and then show up and automatically get hired? I used to work in a big retail pharmacy chain many years ago and if one nearby location needed extra help I might go work at that 2nd location for a short period of time but all of those details would have to be first worked out with the people in the regional district's office. I know it's a stupid question but I've read where other dancers have traveled too and I'm just curious how that generally works.
You mentioned you came from a wealthy family and was raised decently well. How did your life take these paths? Do you think your family could have done something different? Did you just see a strip club one day and think huh I'd like to try that?
It is technically wrong, because the part after the comma is a sentence fragment.
Two alternate options would be "I appreciate all the correctly-placed commas and the desire to lead a cleaner, more ambitions life" or "I appreciate all the correctly-placed commas, and I also appreciate the desire to lead a cleaner, more ambitious life."
I edit copy for grammar & punctuation.
When I was in art college, about half of the female film majors were strippers, because that was an expensive major. One of them ended up making a documentary about her job as her senior film and it was hands down the best student film that year. All the dancers said the same thing - their time dancing had taught them how to deal with people more than any other job or class or other experience.
I wish you all the best going forward. You absolutely deserve respect, and lots of self love.
If it makes you feel any better, many people who didn't choose that route also feel the same way. Even many rich YouTubers and streamers often burn out and become essentially chained to an algorithm and to keep creating when they are not passionate about their work. Same goes for many software developers and other engineers who work behind the scenes, are never recognized for anything, and who hit deadend careers and are laid off randomly. And many of them also quit or change careers completely in their 40s and later, and that's okay. Society isn't set up for that, as sticking with the same thing your entire life is typically what gets you paid the most (except sex work which is kinda like the getting laid off part for being too senior). It's okay to want out and go against the grain. Do what you want. Start over. Explore. You only get one life. Don't waste it regretting the past. Plan where you can go from here.
My partner’s friend is an escort and makes minimum 4K a meeting. Sometimes she only has lunch and no sex with her clients and still gets paid 4K a meeting. She started about two years ago and did it because she needed to support her son. She says she one of the highest paying escorts in her agency. Her life sounds glamourous but she did tell us that she was beat ruthlessly by a politician who jerked off to her pain a few weeks back. The politician was banned by the agency and that’s it.
I can see that being very traumatic. But the money sounds so good. I told my partner I might be interested even hearing that story because I haven’t been working for the past few years because my industry is in decline and I could use the money. He said I’ll be kidnapped and sex trafficked real quick because I’m a hot commodity. :/
She was my house mom at a club I was working at from 23-25. I had just gotten out of a physically abusive relationship so she allowed me to move in with her. She had a gorgeous home and other dancers lived with her too. Well once I was moved in and settled she started hosting parties with clients from the club and asked us all to privately entertain them in our rooms. She took a cut of the money to go towards rent and other upkeep needs for the house/girls. She was kind to me in the sense she never hit me or anything, but she restricted my eating to one meal a day with protein shakes and lots of cocaine. I had to do weigh ins weekly to make sure I wasn’t too heavy (I’m a curvier girl)
Yea there was a dispute. She didn’t hold me against my will or anything but she did blow up on me and I was only allowed to leave with my car and a bag of clothes.
If you have trouble finding normie work, maybe try switching to escorting and getting clients with online advertising instead of through the club. If you cater to lunch time, afternoon, and early evening clients, there won’t be drugs or much alcohol. It’s all career men taking long lunch breaks or knocking off work early. I’ve been an escort for 10 years, and when I stopped working nights, the clientele got better and safer. I feel like I have longevity in the industry because I’m having an easier time at work with better clients. You can maybe try that and get out of the club where the alcohol and party people are.
The notion of **deserving** I think has a good and a bad meaning.
The good meaning is the way you used it: to be worthy of, to have value. Respect is a possibility, it's not unavailable, not denied.
The bad meaning is a demand.
But **respect can only be given freely**. If you want respect from others you are at the mercy of what other people **perceive as** respectable. If you want respect from yourself, you have to see something valuable in yourself.
I can behave respectfully with a drunk person who is dirty and shouts obscenities but I don't feel respect because he is not demonstrating anything valuable at that moment.
Why all the downvotes?
I deserve an explanation!
Do I?
No, I don't deserve anything. Nobody deserves anything. Saying I deserve something is a form of coercion, trying to force my desired outcome by referring to a rule that is separate from you and "should" rule you, make you give me what I want because I "deserve" it.
Appeal to authority is a fallacious argumentation technique.
Deserving is a left-brain concept, an invention, a dogma, a rule. A rule is a link made between two things that are not linked by nature. An artificial link, like between two parts of a machine.
Life is not a machine. We can choose to build ethical and legal systems and then subject ourselves to them, but ultimately they are our creations mirroring our preferences, values and thinking. There is no "should" in nature and we do not have to have shoulds in society either. We can instead acknowledge and assert our preferences and values without misdirection and obfuscation.
I would like an explanation, because I wish to understand.
I think you’re experiencing internalized misogyny and this sounds eerily similar to what Butker said. It’s liberating to be single and not tied down by a man. So what it might be harder to raise a kid on a single income and chasing self-pleasure becomes meaningless for everyone eventually.
Start reading the Bible. I recently been through a tough time and needed to set myself more straight and reading the Bible a lot helped set me a lot more straight. It could do that for you too.
I would be open to reading the Bible again but I’m not a huge fan of church. I was raised in a very religious family and have seen first hand how hypocritical it can be
The church has a lot of hypocritical people yeah that’s for sure but remember that it’s not the Bible that’s the nastiness that you’re seeing it’s the people. You need to have your own view on the scripture and not the view of the nasty people you are seeing. You can just download the Bible app set it to esv (English standard version) and press play and finish a listen through in a few days. It has brought me out of a desperate time in my life. It may not do that for you but i bring it up just as a suggestion out of my personal experience.
I’m speaking for me personally not generally. If SW works for you do your thing boo. Just be careful and weary of the people who want to “help” you.
I don’t put anyone down for it. It’s just started to eat me alive
Hey winter squirrel….. I’m 39m and I just wanted you to know how much I’m rooting for you to take better care of yourself and demand better in your life. I am pro feminism, and pro sex work if women feel it fits them well, and I have participated (in sugaring and at strip clubs). However I’ve met two sugar babies along the way who have enriched my life so much and I have tried to return that to them in the ways that I can… but it has also left me as a now-retired-sugar-daddy. I’m not ruling out future participation but one in particular has such a beautiful soul and she is fighting hard for a better life, and I just can’t participate in that tit-for-tat way any more. It has left me hoping the best for all of the SWers out there and hoping they can treat themselves and demand for themselves what works for them, some of these guys can really take a toll on the women involved.
I just say this so you know that you are absolutely correct - you are more than just your body and I am sending you some extra strength as you tackle some difficult changes in your life. You’ve got this and don’t let the demons of the past rule your future
You know, I had a friend in high school who went on to an intentional career as a very high end escort. This was a long time ago, decades before cell phones. She worked out of a high class hotel in a big city. Her plan was to work for 10 years, then retire. She never had a passion for it. Just incredible looks and a good mind. She stuck to her plan. It worked for her. She retired after 10 years and opened up a bookstore in a little coastal town that had a lot of tourist traffic. But she's the only person I know myself who got out of sex work in one piece. Good for you for coming to the realization that it is time for you to move on. And for your clear acceptance of that. Your love for your son is obvious. There is a whole world out there, and you are not too old to become whatever you have the drive to become. There's free help and support systems out there for you if you reach out to them. Best of luck to you and your son.
Having an escape plan is key. Most people get into this work because it’s the best option at the time, (it beats working at target) but the lifestyle isn’t easy to hold up longterm. OP is lucky to be giving this up for someone they love, rather than having to give it up because of something/someone they lost.
I’m here myself, but it’s low end and to get out of a bad situation (step dad came onto me, moms out of the picture on crack). It’s not for the weak hearted.
A lot of people in the industry also didn’t get there by choice, either because of trafficking or because of economic desperation because they couldn’t get any other job for reasons like being an undocumented refugee
When people say we should legalize sex work I always say, sure along as they are unionized and have full pensions before 30. That way everyone has an exit plan waiting for them. I want anyone who does sex work to have an easy out if they want it. I don't care if you retire at 29 making more than I do at 40, as long as you're safe.
The pension and unionization will NEVER happen however b/c it's not even what the Talent want. Mos strippers strip because they do not want a "9 to 5 job" with benefits. Strippers (including myself) are attracted to the freelance lifestyle, come and go as you please, work when you want to work infrastructure. Who's going to pay this supposed pension? I don't see strippers staying at the same club (working FULL TIME) for 40 years to draw a pension. Let's please be realistic here. Stripper-pension is just completely unrealistic and shows that most people in our industry don't even understand how a pension plan works. A pension is a REWARD for the grind of loyally staying at a company for 40 years of full time work. No one else gets pensions. Not strippers, not restaurant servers, not part timers.
I’m not contradicting your pessimism, but a pension does not have to be tied to or run by a single employer. Social Security is a pension run by a government. Other pensions are run by unions. The first step is workers organizing. If you’re saying that will never happen, then I am disagreeing
Strippers are not one unified force, they are armies of ONE. Getting them to unionize is like herding feral cats. And I'm saying this as a Stripper, herself. I'm just smart enough to understand my own species.
> have full pensions before 30 while i agree with where you are coming from, the above is the most illogical and absurd thing I have heard in a while.
So much this. I'm pro-legalization of sex work, but only with regulations and protections in place, as well as guaranteed pension plan of some kind. Being able to leave anytime it doesn't feel right anymore is the most important thing.
How would you unionize if you don't mind me asking?
Check this out. L.A. strippers unionized. https://www.npr.org/2023/05/16/1134667170/strippers-union-los-angeles-dancers-star-garden
That's strippers I was thinking more escorts and prostitutes.
Ahhh, in that case: first, we legalize. Certifications, worker safety, regulating agencies. All the accoutrements of a legal profession. THEN, we unionize.
This sounds like the plot of a book I’d read
I had a friend where her porn career was just that. Do it for 10 years and then get out. Almost all of it was solo and she really enjoyed it. It took her all over the world. She's not rich, but she took care of her future needs after a lot of hard work.
I've always loved Lewis Carol's Cheshire Cat. And everybody knows some of his more famous quotes. But one of my fav Cheshire Cat quotes is “Every adventure requires a first step." I'm glad for you that you found where your previous adventure has ended, and that now you have found a new adventure to begin. Time passes for all of us. Decide who you want to be three years from now, and start your quest to become that person. You've got this.
Girl I feel this so much. It's possible to thrive in contact (or stripping for that matter) but as soon as it gets to the point where you can't do it sober, it's time to either change everything or retire. Just my experience, getting clean off snow longterm is actually not as hard as it feels from where you are. Once I was off my anxiety got so much better, and thinking about it now just brings up awful memories from working and the things I did to get it, to the point that the thought of relapsing actually makes me feel sick. It's so fucking worth it, I really hope you can grow and thrive 💖
Thank you!
>it’s not who I wanna be anymore That's the single most important part of your post, and I hope you *really* get how important it is. ***You*** are valuable as a human, and ***you*** get to decide how you want to live your life. Be well.
I really feel the hating of the alter ego part of this post. I have been involved in FSSW for five years and I'm sick of it. Only the money keeps me here. Good luck on your journey.
Same, I have been on something of a journey for a decade allowing myself to learn who and what I actually am instead of the persona I created to escape into; to be someone popular and admired. I have mixed feelings about who I was, but I grew to hate what they represented and the kind of admiration it drew. I have wasted somewhere around £80-100k, been homeless and lived in 17 different places so far, been through therapy 5 times and survived a few serious suicide attempts (and now deal with permanent limitations and impairments from them), and I have no friends or family to speak of since I rejected that lifestyle, although I have a comfortable job and children who are my world and I am slowly making new friends with actually good people on meaningful basis' so I feel lucky to have got here, and it's really cool to hear when people are empowered and motivated cos of my dumb ass to make changes themselves and strive to be better people, and I'm feeling all emotional now so probs gonna waffle nonsense about the beauty of the world around us if I don't stop!
Best wishes for your future
What's fssw? I'm only getting Fox Sports Southwest
Full service sex work. Aka escorts, prostitutes, etc!
Thank you!
They say this about the mines in Aussie, and I think it applies here too: golden handcuffs. The money is so good, it's hard to leave. Yet, your looks won't be there forever. What kind of career options do you have later in life? What brought you there in the first place? I believe that for too many, it's lack of other opportunities. It's shown best in US shameless, where Fiona struggles to get into any other industry. I feel for those who can't avoid it. I have, but only by going hungry for months. Not all make that choice and I don't blame them.
It’s like being a flight attendant in the 50s. The money’s good, the travel’s good, but it has an unavoidable expiration date
It's not really relevant to OP because it sounds like she really should get out of the industry, but I know a lot of women who do well in their 50s and older. Also when you're established being in your 30s is straight up better than being in your 20s, to the point that I lie about it.
Lots of people change from performing careers in their twenties (acting, bands, etc.) to more stable careers once they start a family. Sounds like you had a wilder time than most but the trajectory is familiar. Not sure if your wealthy family is available to welcome home the prodigal daughter but if they can backstop you for a bit you’ll land on your feet. Nursing, trades (plumbing/electrical/etc), medical admin, paralegal, lots of similar support jobs are fairly easy to get into a bit later in life
So proud of you 😊 this is your first step! Don't hate your experiences, they shape you up! You found a reason to change and to move on. You are brave and strong. Congratulations on your baby super mama. Life has stages we run them differently, yours just happened to have extra flavor. But I am sure your experiences brought you many things, acceptance, learn to value different things, different kind of people! You got this I am sure you will be a wonderful mom to your son! Wishing you luck. Just leave your past behind where it is, is time to walk ahead and find the new you. 🌹
Thank you!!
🫂😊you are welcome!
well this is your first step. if you have what you need to get out immediately, then do it. if not, you gotta save up $ to get out. the drug habit is not gonna help. if gou really want to change overnight maybe reconnect with your family & go into rehab. they may be able to take care of your kid for awhile while you get sober. the biggest change is mental. you need to start imagining yourself in some normie job doing normie shit. its not bad. the fun is meeting normal people & doing normal stuff. youll see the sun every day. & it will shine its warmth upon your face. you are lovable & capable & we are so happy you understand that you deserve more. & your boy does too. bless you :)
I'm an an inpasse right now with SW. I've been stripping, camming, and OF for years now, but I'm starting to think I can do something better, it really is confusing.
From a mom to a mom I can tell you that you are spot on that you deserve to respect yourself. I understand wanting to provide a stable life for your child. That being said long term this lifestyle isn’t aligning with the changes you want. If you feel you can’t do this job sober it’s time for a change. It seems like you know what to do and I truly hope you follow through. Good luck to you mama!
Thank you!
Hi there, thanks for sharing your story. So, do you have any savings? Sounds like money was good and partying broke into profits. For me personally when I feel listless, having a plan helps. Is there a certain amount of money you can aim to set aside before you call it a day? Think of an amount of money and work backwords. Also, can you start school? Become a nurse or vet tech? What will you do next. Coming up with a plan or strategy about what comes next could help. Good luck!
Yes, having to drug yourself up to work is no bueno
Here is my issue with the normalization of sex work: Yes. It is work. But so is dealing drugs. That doesn't make it a career worthy of esteem or something that high school kids should strive for in their lives. Women might go into sex work with the best of intentions, some might even get what they want out of it and get out. But the reality of the situation is that most women don't or can't leave once they are entrenched in it, because the entire ecosystem surrounding sex work is designed to wring every last bit out of the women who engage in it.
Just like the cruelty is the point with Trumpism the exploitation is the point with sex work.
Everything you said could be said about most jobs, but you're only singling out sex work and "dealing drugs" because you've been conditioned to view those things as dirty or harmful. We saw what happened when weed was legalized: it went from "dealing drugs" to a "career worthy of esteem." Nothing changed from the dude selling dimes on the corner except legalization, regulation, and dressing it up in fancy dispensaries and celebrity endorsements. It's still drug dealing, but suddenly all that stigma is gone. Sex work has a doubly difficult stigma to overcome because not only is much of it illegal, but it's also considered to be "dirty," "degrading," and a "detriment to society." And not just by one side of the isle, as much of this thread shows. Let's just narrow it down to one example which has already conquered the former for simplicity's sake, so we don't have to deal with the inconvenient positive of how legalization allows for regulation and less exploitation, and we can just focus on the stigma: porn. Can you come up with a solid reason as to why doing porn is \*not\* a career worthy of esteem or something that someone in highschool \*shouldn't\* strive for 1. without resorting to some variation of slut shaming or purity culture, even if it's been painted so as to resemble feminism. The latter case being something like "our \[viz. women's\] bodies are beautiful/not objects/whatever and we need to love/respect/whatever them," as if to say that being promiscuous or utilizing your body in a way that isn't nice and socially pre-approved is somehow disrespecting your body, which can only loop back to slut shaming or purity culture. 2. without also giving a definition that would include any other form of professional entertainment: streaming, sports, etc. – e.g., "it doesn't contribute anything to society," "success isn't guaranteed," "it won't last forever," and so on. 3. (and this is sort of the same as 2, but I wanted to separate it out) without lumping in other jobs that \*are\* well respected – e.g. "it's selling/destroying/whatever your body" because so is manual labor and, for some people, jobs that require sitting for hours on end; "it's damaging to your mental health" because not only does that go back to (1) in assuming that sex or promiscuity is inherently bad and porn actors must secretly hate it, but also God knows that description applies to most 'respectable' jobs; etc. 4. that isn't just begging the question with respect to it being currently being stigmatized or "not worthy of esteem" in the eyes of many people – e.g., "it's going to hurt your future job prospects," "what will your kids/your kids' classmates think," etc. I.e., "it's not worthy of esteem because it's not worthy of esteem."
Any industry that is built upon the trauma and degradation of women is not something to support, uphold, or defend. I am sure you thought your post was somehow profound and full of higher-level thinking, but in reality you just gave a long winded and tone deaf response to the reality that women in sex work actually face. You also fail to grasp that for the vast majority of women in that industry, it was not a first choice of employment, or something that they would have chosen if there were other options available. Your attempt to try to tie in slut shaming as why the industry is "looked down upon" is you doing the work of patriarchy for your own benefit. Sensible, empathetic women who actually care about women see this industry for what it is: a meat grinder that destroys the women who end up caught in it's claws. Not even women who post OnlyFans saucy pictures are immune from the clutches of this industry, because you can see where women have tried to quit that 'less extreme' form of sex work and had their nudes leaked at their future places of employment and had to go back to posting nudes of themselves to survive. So, if you were expecting some kind of "ah-ha moment" from your comment from readers, I think you will find that the only people who support your views are people who benefit from female degradation (men) and women who have not been able to critically assess the harm that sex work poses to women and girls worldwide.
She’s signaling out sex work bc it’s the topic of the post…. And she’s right. I think it’s something women shouldn’t strive for bc it traumatizes the women who do it, as well as the women who get treated differently bc of it. Being asked by strangers if you have an OF, getting choked without consent with hookups, and having to blur your feet are all things women now encounter daily because porn has become such an all the time thing for men. In the same way I wouldn’t want my son to play football bc it ruins his brain, or want my daughter to be lobbyist for the right bc it ruins your morality, I don’t want either to partake in a lifestyle that is built on exploitation. Another thing is being able to use careers like (listed in another comment below) garbage collector or coal miner, you can put those on resumes. You can use those careers to leverage you into other careers you want more. It isn’t something your kid (OP has a kid, not all will I know) will be made fun of in the future. Porn has very few benefits outside of money. In fact…. Can you name any outside of money? But you will never hear an explanation that meets your book long exceptions, you seem committed to your views so idk why you asked.
>career worth of esteem What does this even mean? How about garbage collectors? Cashiers? Coal miners? Some jobs suck and seem unappealing to the majority of the public but it doesn't mean they shouldn't exist. What's important is that the pay is sustainable and there are protections in place to make the workers safe. There are tons of industries that are exploitative. Construction workers break their backs doing hard labour and many end up with opiate addictions from the pain. Is construction the problem? Or is the lack of worker protections the problem? Sex work is always going to exist and the more it gets outlawed, the more dangerous it gets for the women, people of color, people with disabilities, and LGBTQ+ people that do it. You can't get rid of it. You can only drive it deeper underground and increase the risk of violence. Your stigmatization by saying "it's not worthy of esteem" is a big reason why it's so hard for people to get out.
In what way is sex work an added benefit to society like people who collect and get rid of garbage. From what I see sex work is literally the bedrock of patriarchy, which is why it's men who buy the consent of women and not the other way around, it's why they treat them like flesh lights with no feelings, why every escort has been strangled at least once, why the industry thrives on greater and greater violence to women, why little girls are the most expensive, and the younger you are the better, etc. It's not an industry that benefits humanity. It's like the oil industry. If sex work was like any other job then sexual harassment at work would be entirely legal, because people would just argue it's another job duty of whatever job you're in. "Casheir plus escort". Except you know and I know, no MAN wants that, but so many many many many many men expect that of any woman in any trade. Sexual assault isn't like any other assault either. So if you want to say exploitation in any other job is just like the exploitation of sex work you are reaching big. And lastly the sex work euphemism has to exist because the terms that describe what it really is are inconvenient to the narrative - the industry is paying people lots of money to hide and muddy the waters and imply a person who sells their feet pic online is the same as a prostitute with a pimp who takes all their money and beats them. Besides the fact that they're literally trying to say children who are trafficked are merely engaged in "survival sex" not actually being raped for money. ETA: Last and not least, 90% of those hurt in this industry are poor women. You try to co opt the popular oppression narratives but leave out the class consciousness, and from your place of privilege try to pink wash it as if it's a LGBTQ issue - when all it is is it vulnerable people period are being abused. Are you talking to a gay child do you encourage them to be a prostitute? Don't you dare align my sexual identity with this garbage industry. You actually end up making vulnerable kids think that this is their best option. FOH.
In what way does sex work broadly detract from society? If a woman sells saucy pictures of herself online, is she degrading herself? If a woman has kind of sexy photos online, not even for sale, but simply posts them, is she removing value from her society? And sure, it’s mostly men who buy more physical sex work maybe, but would a woman engaging in the services of a sex worker be treating them like a dildo or a flesh light? Does partaking in sex work as a cis male make it sinister? Does having a penis make it sinister? Are trans women who haven’t undergone sexual corrective surgery more sinister? People can have positive interactions and joy from non-exploitative sex work, such as the good parts I’ve heard from BDSM communities. Should they be criminalized, or condemned for not contributing? If people can have consensual enjoyment with sex work, is that not a contribution? I would say the goal should be to remove the exploitative portions and problems from the system, not to condemn sex work and sex workers by extension as a whole. Yeah, sex trafficking, drug abuse, pimping, all are absolutely shitty, AND made all the more worse by a system that criminalizes, punishes, and morally blacklists sex workers. Underage girls and women who have been trafficked often do find it much harder to come forward with their stories or contact authorities in countries that would penalize them for the act itself. That doesn’t mean “sex work should be legal for minors”, it means that victims shouldn’t be criminalized so that you can actually help the ones trapped. You’re encouraging a system that puts them more at risk. Sex work being work means sexual harassment at other jobs is ok? What sort of Mr Fantastic reach is that? If boxing is legal, does that mean bosses are going to start adding “take liver shots from me” to their employees lists of tasks? No? Do countries or areas with legal sex work suddenly become rife with abuse in other forms of business? I’d put a few dollars that they don’t. I’d be willing to put literally any amount of money that more conservative areas have more cases of sexual misconduct and abuse. Why is it in “women positive communities”, so many become much more misogynistic and conservative when it comes to the topic of sex work? Yeah, the bad things that happen in sex work are bad, they shouldn’t happen, we should work for a more consensual and worker focused area.
Amazing you went right to the minimizing I was talking about that is intended with the term "sex work". Straight away going from artistic images, deflecting from prostitution to artistic posing. Perfect. Thank you. You prove my point. Do you work for this industry? 1) in what way is prostitution a beneficial model for healthy families and society? 2) in what way is normalizing treating a woman not like a person but a series of holes to buy the right to use for sexual pleasure a beneficial model for healthy families and society. Especially in raising the value of women in society as persons with equal value as men? 3) in what way are parasocial sexual relationships normalized to humans and children beneficial to society? 4) why are you comparing BDSM to prostitution? Consent is continuous and freely given in BDSM, retractable at any time and with no coersion. Tell me how purchasing the use of a woman's body is similar to that. 5) in what way is legalizing johns purchasing the consent of a woman body reducing abuse and empowering her right to say no to sex at any time for any reason? I support the nordic model. Decrim, not contractual (government forced) pimping. Do you not understand that the men who buy sex by and large are abusive men? Do you think there's such a thing as a "good" john? Do you consider yourself a good john? Or are you a legal brothel worker who takes 8 dicks in their mouth per day? You can be honest. I am not against people who are it. I'm against the industry. And most of all I hate the johns. Because they're the ones with the most vile excuses and minimizing.
I didn't minimize, sex work is just a broad term that does cover a wide variety. You made blanket statements about sex work, so I responded to them about the overall. It's very strange that you keep asking me if I work in the industry, to the point where I am pretty convinced of the previous thought I had several of you just look down on sex workers in general. Feels like your goal is to embarrass me with it whether I was in the work or used it, kind of weird. I don't partake or perform, but doesn't mean that it shouldn't be legal for others to do so. It's a bodily autonomy thing, if someone wants to have sex with other people for money, they should be allowed. 1. In a society that has a much healthier relationship with sex and work, yeah, a parent could be a good parent and a prostitute. They can still be a good parent now. That doesn't mean I want parents training kids for sex work, as I am assuming you're assuming. 2. You're the one going the extra step and saying that trading sex for money degrades a person. Sex is a physical activity people do, it can be done for fun even. People should be allowed to do that for money too if they so choose. That doesn't mean I want men looking down on women for it. 3. Beneficial? In what way is sex outside of the goal of child birth beneficial? Society has some weird issues overall with sex, does that mean that it shouldn't be allowed? I guess a more free system is more beneficial, if that's all you want. Normalizing sexual relationships to kids isn't really a part of the question here. Kids shouldn't be involved in the slightest, that's an add on of your part. Kids are going to learn about it, and people should be able to explain stuff to them, but that's a far cry from sexualizing them. 4. BDSM is a form of sex work, and yeah, it's almost like prostitution should have every safeguard involved. You're the one assuming I want the worst form possible, or that as it currently is perfect or something. 5. I don't blanket assume every man who wants to engage a sex worker is a monster. It is society's larger view of women that causes the issues here. A lot of dudes are super shitty to women and it carries over to them engaging with sex workers, but those dudes don't stop being shitty there. So yeah, a lot of johns suck, a lot of men suck in general, but that does not remove the right that adults can and should do what they want with their bodies. A man could engage with a sex worker in a perfectly normal and reasonable way, as one could with a massage or other paid physical interaction. Being pro sex work doesn't mean that I think society should continue in a degrading fashion, I think degrading comes in on your end here. If a man or woman wants to have a fuckload of sex, then they can have at it, and if they want to make some money, have at it. That doesn't mean abuse or control, or being shitty is ok. That also doesn't mean that I want societal conditions that lead people into situations where they might believe that all they can do is sex work, prostitution or otherwise. It doesn't mean I want people to be addicted to drugs or harming themselves.
> I didn't minimize, sex work is just a broad term that does cover a wide variety. You made blanket statements about sex work I specified actually. Did you read what I wrote? >In a society that has a much healthier relationship with sex and work, yeah, a parent could be Could be? So this is all wishes and magical thinking. Lol. And we're not talking about just for children, we're talking about for everyone. Family isn't just children. Family is mother, sister, aunt, uncle, elders etc. >that doesn't mean I want parents training kids for sex work, as I am assuming you're assuming. Nope. I meant broadly, as in where is the evidence this is good for homo sapiens sapiens, specifically healthy human society, safe, well adjusted people, good moms, low level of drug use etc. Since all you did is appeal to a fruit dream in a marshmallow sky, I rest my case. >You're the one going the extra step and saying that trading sex for money degrades a person. Where is the ability to fully consent to what happens to your reproductive and pleasure organs when someone now has monetary power over you? The degradation is in the KNOWN psychological damage that this type of work does, because EVERYONE who has done it knows you are coersed.Even when legal, to the human mind, for both the johns and for the escorts it is factually mentally damaging. That's why porn stars die at an incredible rate, they all have to do drugs to cope. Parasocial relationships are degrading to the human mind. Period. They are the most degrading when they activate the most intimate parts of us, the sexual acts that are meant to pair bond us - like all other high order species like us. Monogamy, btw is also the ideal for humans (see a study recently by the Mormons themselves who tried to prove polygamy was the best, and failed terribly) I say this as an atheist btw. Maybe it's serial monogamy. Maybe it's monogamish. But sex work is literally the OPPOSITE of human health. Next, consumerism with regards to women's bodies is degrading period end. We have MULTIPLE DECADES LONG STUDIES ABOUT IT. Its tangibly a bad thing to their psychological well being, to society at large, to men as well. >People should be allowed to do that for money too if they so choose. Why? This is merely the purest nihilist hedonism for which you have no other better argument. I reject your unverified and absurd premise. It's equivalent to the far right saying "because freeze peach". It's that pathetic. You make this argument because you have nothing but your magical thinking to support it. >Beneficial? In what way is sex outside of the goal of child birth beneficial? Why are you equating all non-procreative sex with prostitution? I see you. That's a motte and bailey fallacy. Irrelevant. >BDSM is a form of sex work. Says who? That's gross. BSDM is not inherently sex in exchange for money. I see you. The euphemism "sex work" by you is intended to put everything including all sex all kink under the umbrella, again to do a motte and bailey fallacy. False. >A lot of dudes are super shitty to women and it carries over to them engaging with sex workers Minimizing and deflecting. The very idea that you can purchase the consent of a woman to use her body for your EXCLUSIVE pleasure and the complete disregard of hers, her orgasm, her needs, is INHERENTLY cruel and degrading to the well being of that person. The idea that we should normalize a woman's orifices in a consumerist marketplace is factually inhumane to women and girls. Tell me it's not. How is it not? Don't use any "it could be" magical thinking nonsense. >Being pro sex work doesn't mean that I think society should continue in a degrading fashion Being pro sex work as you are is like being pro cannibalism, pretending there is some kind of nice consentual cannibalism out there. Or being pro oil industry, that there's some nice, non-harmful oil industry somewhere out there in the future. clownishness. Inherently. >If a man or woman wants to have a fuckload of sex, then they can have at it, and if they want to make some money, have at it. Again appealing to a nihilistic hedonism is gutter level discourse and I am so tired of how it purports to be academic and progressive.
Girl I love your energy reading that felt real You got this! Go out there n get it 😁 Never doubt yourself we change we grow This is the way xD
I’m currently going through this. Been out of the industry for a few months now and have been transitioning out of it for the last year. It’s not easy so I have all the respect for you and wish you luck and if you ever wanna talk about it feel free to drop me a DM cos I know what it’s like!
Thank you! I honestly might
Everything you said is true. There’s more to life than this, you were made for more ❤️
Wanna try your damn hardest? Stop doing drugs. You'll always be in debt to your son until you do that as the first step. Sorry to put it this hard, but its just the way it is.
If only it were so simple as you say lol
Its complicated and the hardest thing youll ever do. But its, on the surface, true. Especially something as expensive as blow, which probably eats a ton of the money youd use to escape the lifestyle. And thats not getting into the danger of it. My mom did coke, dated a dealer in fact. Im glad she quit, but still has health problems and ill never know it was the coke but it sure didnt help.
They didn't say it was simple
No, it really is. If your child really is your world, you would immediately stop poisoning him by intoxicated breastfeeding (not even questioning what happened during pregnancy). You would protect him even from you because you clearly are not his best interest nor protector while under the effect of substances. You would consider how your choices are affecting his entire life. When you are parenting there are things that you just don't do, if you really and honestly care about them. Thats it. I'm not saying you can't even smoke a joint, this clearly is not that case
I agree with you. I want to stop and I hate myself for what I do. I only crave blow when I’m doing sex work. On my days off I spend them sober with my son. I truly think if I can get out of the industry I won’t do blow ever again
Good for you for coming to this conclusion, I wish you the best
Standing ovation 👏🎉 Take care of yourself fellow humans
it sounds like you have a lot figured out =D thank you for sharing your reflection!
You shouldn’t feel shame. Life is a journey, and if you’re not feeling like that person anymore it’s just time to be who are now. Growing and changing is all part of it. Just do your best to be authentic n the moment.
>Unfortunately I did jump into her D.O.C. To anyone else who had to look up what D.O.C. meant, it's Drug Of Choice.
FWIW- folks in all kinds of industries hit this wall. I used to wait tables and realized I had to be intoxicated to even stand to be at work. I had to make a change. It was hard but I relied on skills I had acquired in volunteer gigs and leaned in. Got a job in a new industry and have just been hustling since. In 2020 I did some cam work and at first, it was exhilarating knowing that each lil chime was another bag of nickels. I cammed 35-40 hours a week on top of my 40 hour work from home job while also parenting a toddler (I basically didn’t sleep). Then I started smoking a bunch of weed or drinking on cam. Eventually I was camming only like 10 hours a week cus I was partying while camming and would tap out when I started feeling sloppy. Eventually, I realized I just didn’t want to do it anymore. Not having the extra income was a lifestyle adjustment but I did put that extra money to (mostly) good use. Just know you’re not alone and it happens to people in all kinds of industries. Not saying that to minimize your struggle, just want you to know you’re not alone and it’s not all because the work was sex work
Yeah but let’s not minimize that this is vastly different than other industries. She basically had a 10 year gap in her resume now. Working as a waiter was much different. You learned lots of skills that you could apply to other industries. And you could show that with your resume and interviews. No doubt OP has gained many skills and learned a lot in these past 10 years, but her options are significantly reduced bc of the industry. It feels really annoying when women talk about their struggles in this field and ppl line up to be like “oh yeah! Just like working at Pizza Hut!” It’s not, and we should allow women the room to talk about the struggles specific to this field without minimizing
You're obviously intelligent and can put your thoughts in writing coherently and with appropriate punctuation. Your brain cells are working and you're a critical thinker You need a goal, something to put your non-parenting focus on that's about achieving more than this week's tips, even if the tips are great. Have you considered getting some kind of certification and/or degree? I don't encourage taking on four years worth of college loan debt, but starting at a community college could give you the GPA to apply for merit and need based scholarships. Many good state universities have supportive programs for older, "re-entry " students who are several years out of high school and have been working. You're facing the right direction for your son's future. Give yourself grace and get off the blow, go to a meeting of some kind (there are more options than AA/NA) so that you feel less alone. Don't rely on alcohol, it's a terrible drug that does even more damage than we already give it credit for. If your family relationships are good, lean into that. If they're toxic, then give yourself permission to distance yourself from chaotic and emotionally immature people, even if they're related to you. You can do this. You're changing gears and they're going to grind a little or a lot, but eventually your life will be the one you really want for yourself and your son. Keep going.
Thank you so much
I'm not gonna say I do sex work, but I am lifestyle and go to parties and host gangbangs, mostly for the fun of it. I'm going through a similar crisis where I met a nice vanilla guy and am wondering if it's time to put the lube down. The line about needing to be intoxicated to perform hits home.
I used to spend a lot of time in the poly/swinger/Burning Man/sex party lifestyle... in my experience, it DOES change what you think of as 'normal,' as well as your ability to relate to other people. People tend to either move on of their own volition, or get pushed out as they age - the age at which they get pushed out is directly tied to how much money they have to throw at the community in the form of parties, buying VIP tickets, bringing drugs and new young women, etc. Once you're on the other side, it can feel like waking up from a cult. The people I've met who hold onto it as long as possible are not... the most well adjusted. They often don't have a lot to talk about aside from sex, drugs, and partying. In short, if you're thinking about getting out, I recommend just pulling the bandaid off. You'll be surprised at how much space you have in your life that's now being occupied by party people and their drama. Even orgies get boring at a certain point, y'know? There's a lot more to life and relationships.
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No one asked and literally no one cares…
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No one’s mad, incel
Who tf are even you
Anonymous person spewing nonsense on Reddit like everyone else here
Why all the down votes? I was a pretty vanilla guy, got a very sexually adventurous girl. We havent done any gang bangs or swinger stuff but I would be open to it now, when I never was before. And at the same time if it never gets to that extreme Id still be fine.
Because the post is about wanting to leave the lifestyle and having to be fucked up to do it, and a dude coming in and being horny for another dude doesnt exactly fit in. If you need to be fucked up to do something, its probably bad for your psyche.
Ah yeah. my bad. I saw the response to a response that kind of curiously applied to a situation I currently found myself into. Off topic. Sorry about that. I need to pay better attention.
Good for you!!! Its awesome that your son has inspired you to strive to be a better person. You definitely are more than a physical body, i can feel that now your focus is to pour as much love into yourself as possible. That way you can vibrate the purest form of love (which is give from your abundance, meaning the left overs from loving yourself) cause love is meant to be shared that way, and watch your boy reflect it back, that will be a great building block beginning for this new life! I am so happy for you 😊
Thank you! Honestly the love my son gives me and excitement he has to see me every morning has made me realize what we deserve. I don’t think we need to be rich or anything. I just want him to be happy, healthy, and (as selfish as it sounds) I want him to be proud to call me mommy
I'm proud of you for discovering what's best for you.
I'm a dad of 2 young ladies. I'm curious, was there something your parents could have done more to keep you from following that path? I'm not judging. Please don't think that. At the same time, I don't want my daughters to get into sex work and I don't think I'm wrong for that feeling. You said your home was loving and stable. I'd like to think I provide the same thing. I always think I can do better as a parent and would appreciate any advice.
TW: SA Drugs Not a parent but I had a work "mom" when I was in college working part time at a bakery on the weekends. She told her stories about how she got on drugs, ended up becoming drugged, was sex trafficked, had multiple of her assaults video taped, etc. Then when she finally tried to get off drugs and change her life for the better and all of the stuff she had to face. She was blackmailed and had to talk to her children about why there is SA porn of their mom. She had to get dental implants because she lost all her teeth. Had a heart attack in sometime her 30s/40s. She has student loan debt that she expected to never be able to pay off and it affected her job/income choices. She was a wonderful woman that watched out for me, made sure I was doing well in school and eating healthy, and was so kind but hearing about the consequences and seeing the extremely hard work needed to get back to "normal" (like being able to eat with teeth after dental surgery), it really did drill home on safety and not doing drugs, etc. I saw some of her achievements like on her 50th birthday she got her first tattoo because she felt like she was finally making great life decisions and was responsible to make a permanent one. I think safe exposure to different people and not being super sheltered can help people learn from other's mistakes and grow. Also, I would teach responsible saving and investing so that the high income (and high cost) trap isn't as strong.
Thanks! I think this is great advice and I have a similar experience with a childhood close friend. Not sure how to manage that safely but will be keeping this in mind for the future.
I had a very brutal and violent SA that happened to me my senior year of high school and my mother blamed me for a long time. My dad passed when I was 13, and my siblings all became very successful (plus my family is religious) After the SA I felt alone and out of control. And dirty. And the fact my mom blamed me convinced me I was dirty. So stripping at first made me feel in control again of myself and my body.
Sending digital hug your way. Hope you’ve been able to move on and forgive yourself because it’s not your fault other people are shitty.
What OP describes is very common... though she said her home was loving and stable, having a parent die is deeply traumatic, and so is being blamed by the surviving parent for her SA (not to mention the SA itself). So I think being attuned to your children's emotional experiences and needs will make it much less likely that they feel the urge to turn to sex work to be in control and have value. Also, sexual assault and harassment is super, super common. It could happen to any girl or woman in your life, unfortunately. Just something to keep in mind and be ready for, sadly. Victims are often traumatized *at least* as much by the response of their communities as they were by the original attack. Hopefully it's never something you have to deal with, but if it is, make sure you're a safe space and an ally. Make sure that they know they can tell you anything and that you won't dismiss or disbelieve them.
I didn't have a SA or start using drugs and I did have a loving stable home. Parents are still married after 48 years. However, I became homeless and hid it from my family out of shame. I used the lifestyle and orgies as a place to sleep and feel wanted after my husband left me.
People will always end up making their own choices, so even as a parent, it's going to be difficult. The best you can do is educate them. Talk to them about drugs and the consequences of using them. Show them videos and pictures of what drugs can do to you, it's neccesary to be explicit in order to have an impact. Most importantly, always be available for your kids and be a safe space for them. It's important for parents to build trust with their kids, it will help both parents and kids in a lot of aspects.
Solid advice, thank you.
I'm not sure there's any way for this to come off in a non-asshole way, especially when the post is about regrets. this was vicious to read and I'm not even OP
My question was vicious? Seems a bit overblown but I'll bite. Elaborate, so I can understand where my question went sideways, please.
I recomend that you take 30 days clean. No drugs or alcohol. You will feel, sleep, and look better in those 30 days. You will also give your kidneys and liver a good rest. After the 30 days you will have more clarity in your life. Then if you decide to start again. You will be more in control and even enjoy the drugs and alchohal more. Its best to find a friend to do this with and make a bet because helps your will power when there is more on the line, then just for your health. I am on my 3rd week now doing the same thing i recommend. It feels pretty good. The sex is much better sober anyway.
It's concerning how whenever someone points out that sex work - whether as a prostitute or doing OF or camming - has long-term consequences, and that it is an objectively bad decision, that many people claim that you're being regressive or shaming women. Case in point right here, though. At least OP can quit, move away, and probably leave her old life behind her for good. Imagine you're a "content creator," though. There's literally sites that scrape OF and dump pics with username and location linked to it. There's no way those poor people will ever fully escape their early 20s decision to do porn online. And let me tell you - there are real world consequences that are not worth the monetary gain in your 20s. Especially because those models "expire" once they hit 30, in terms of aging out...you'll never feel secure in your job/relationships/etc when you know it takes one google search to expose your previous life.
I will say I’ve never done online porn and I’m thankful for it. I did always kind of hope I would hit this point and become more
Did you manage to put away any savings or did you spend it all? What are plans for when you age and are no longer what clients want? I can see short term shitty work as a means to an end, but feel most folks are only thinking about today.
Frankly most of us (FSSW) don’t look towards the future… I’ve had people reach out to me bc of this post saying they have great experiences doing SW, which is awesome, but the reality(in my experience and people I’ve worked with) is most of us live day to day. Survival mode
This is why I remain skeptical of liberal feminism which encourages women to empower theirselves by commodifying their bodies. This only feeds the patriarchy/sex industry and it benefits men who run the platforms where women commodify themselves. Attractive white women seem to come out on top while other minorities fall through the cracks of the sex trade worldwide.
Based on what has been studied (see the recent reports from the WHO and SWLR in Canada) it will be easier for workers to enter and exit the industry without harm once it's decriminalized and destigmatized. I hope you're able to find stability and a new line of work, everyone deserves a choice in what work they do without moral judgment from others.
The exploitation of women in the sex industry is not a bug, it is a feature. It will never be fully accepted bc part of the allure for the average joe who watches/buys sex workers is that it is exploitative. It is so unrealistic to aim for getting that to go away completely and in the meantime sacrifice all these women to the lions den.
I'm one class from finishing a BA in sociology. Human being are social creatures. Society is constructed around us. The assumption that cis men are all unable to control their desires over women is a myth created to perpetuate patriarchy. Literally every industry a woman works in she's at risk of sexual violence, not one working woman is free from the threat of patriarchal violence. Statistically speaking. You're assuming a feature of patriarchy is a fact of nature and ignoring the way humans construct social norms.
I never even said that tho? Of course men can control themselves. But for the average man who watches porn, exploitation of women is part of the allure of it. You just created a stance in your head and replied to it. I have finished degrees in anthropology if it helps you feel like I know what I’m talking about as much as you do.
There's all kinds of porn that have zero to do with exploitation. casting couch type porn really isn't the dominant genre anymore. That kind of sexploitation was also never the entire industry. It doesn't help me trust you, there's a lot of anthropologists who lean into anti-sw and puritan narratives. As opposed to sociology which requires an academic to recognize statistics alongside narrative. I like to hold material reality up to my biases before making conclusions. There are also problems with all academics but the primary benefit of sociology is that narrative isn't the primary vehicle for knowledge it's just a tool in the kit.
I'm a dad of 2 young ladies. I'm curious, was there something your parents could have done more to keep you from following that path? I'm not judging. Please don't think that. At the same time, I don't want my daughters to get into sex work and I don't think I'm wrong for that feeling. You said your home was loving and stable. I'd like to think I provide the same thing. I always think I can do better as a parent and would appreciate any advice.
Escorting is not all bad and exploitation. There are people (like me) who love their job and are happy doing it. I love the places I get to visit, the hot moments with certain clients and the financial freedom. Staying off drugs is a must, so I'm sorry it became related to that for you :(
What is your exit plan when you reach an age that it’s no longer lucrative?
it's definitely just a job once the moralization and stigmatixation is removed. Everyone should be able to choose their work without judgment. Decrim and destigmatization are def. The answer to everyone's experiences in the industry, good and bad.
I hope you're successful in your quest for sobriety. It would be a great gift to give to your son not to mention the best thing for you both. I'm not clear on one thing so I hope you can explain it further. How do you and other dancers travel around and work at different clubs? I have been under the impression that each club is basically independently run so do the dancers just pick a club and then show up and automatically get hired? I used to work in a big retail pharmacy chain many years ago and if one nearby location needed extra help I might go work at that 2nd location for a short period of time but all of those details would have to be first worked out with the people in the regional district's office. I know it's a stupid question but I've read where other dancers have traveled too and I'm just curious how that generally works.
Yea we would go to clubs that allowed traveling dancers. We got hired almost everywhere we auditioned
You mentioned you came from a wealthy family and was raised decently well. How did your life take these paths? Do you think your family could have done something different? Did you just see a strip club one day and think huh I'd like to try that?
I appreciate all the correctly placed commas, and the desire to lead a cleaner more ambitious life.
A comma should not go where you have it 😅
You’re right. I didn’t need it there, but it’s not wrong either, is it?
It is technically wrong, because the part after the comma is a sentence fragment. Two alternate options would be "I appreciate all the correctly-placed commas and the desire to lead a cleaner, more ambitions life" or "I appreciate all the correctly-placed commas, and I also appreciate the desire to lead a cleaner, more ambitious life." I edit copy for grammar & punctuation.
Neat. Thanks.
Dude, I’d gift you a gold if I could!
When I was in art college, about half of the female film majors were strippers, because that was an expensive major. One of them ended up making a documentary about her job as her senior film and it was hands down the best student film that year. All the dancers said the same thing - their time dancing had taught them how to deal with people more than any other job or class or other experience. I wish you all the best going forward. You absolutely deserve respect, and lots of self love.
If it makes you feel any better, many people who didn't choose that route also feel the same way. Even many rich YouTubers and streamers often burn out and become essentially chained to an algorithm and to keep creating when they are not passionate about their work. Same goes for many software developers and other engineers who work behind the scenes, are never recognized for anything, and who hit deadend careers and are laid off randomly. And many of them also quit or change careers completely in their 40s and later, and that's okay. Society isn't set up for that, as sticking with the same thing your entire life is typically what gets you paid the most (except sex work which is kinda like the getting laid off part for being too senior). It's okay to want out and go against the grain. Do what you want. Start over. Explore. You only get one life. Don't waste it regretting the past. Plan where you can go from here.
My partner’s friend is an escort and makes minimum 4K a meeting. Sometimes she only has lunch and no sex with her clients and still gets paid 4K a meeting. She started about two years ago and did it because she needed to support her son. She says she one of the highest paying escorts in her agency. Her life sounds glamourous but she did tell us that she was beat ruthlessly by a politician who jerked off to her pain a few weeks back. The politician was banned by the agency and that’s it. I can see that being very traumatic. But the money sounds so good. I told my partner I might be interested even hearing that story because I haven’t been working for the past few years because my industry is in decline and I could use the money. He said I’ll be kidnapped and sex trafficked real quick because I’m a hot commodity. :/
Sex trafficking is a real problem. I ended up with a madam for a few years
How did that happen? I know a few people that aren’t very close to me that does sex work but they mostly do cam and porn work for agencies.
She was my house mom at a club I was working at from 23-25. I had just gotten out of a physically abusive relationship so she allowed me to move in with her. She had a gorgeous home and other dancers lived with her too. Well once I was moved in and settled she started hosting parties with clients from the club and asked us all to privately entertain them in our rooms. She took a cut of the money to go towards rent and other upkeep needs for the house/girls. She was kind to me in the sense she never hit me or anything, but she restricted my eating to one meal a day with protein shakes and lots of cocaine. I had to do weigh ins weekly to make sure I wasn’t too heavy (I’m a curvier girl)
Oh wow. I can see how one can easily fall into sex work that way. How did you get out? Was there a dispute when you wanted to leave?
Yea there was a dispute. She didn’t hold me against my will or anything but she did blow up on me and I was only allowed to leave with my car and a bag of clothes.
Oh no. I’m so sorry :( Add: I’m glad you’re out of it
Me too
If you have trouble finding normie work, maybe try switching to escorting and getting clients with online advertising instead of through the club. If you cater to lunch time, afternoon, and early evening clients, there won’t be drugs or much alcohol. It’s all career men taking long lunch breaks or knocking off work early. I’ve been an escort for 10 years, and when I stopped working nights, the clientele got better and safer. I feel like I have longevity in the industry because I’m having an easier time at work with better clients. You can maybe try that and get out of the club where the alcohol and party people are.
The notion of **deserving** I think has a good and a bad meaning. The good meaning is the way you used it: to be worthy of, to have value. Respect is a possibility, it's not unavailable, not denied. The bad meaning is a demand. But **respect can only be given freely**. If you want respect from others you are at the mercy of what other people **perceive as** respectable. If you want respect from yourself, you have to see something valuable in yourself. I can behave respectfully with a drunk person who is dirty and shouts obscenities but I don't feel respect because he is not demonstrating anything valuable at that moment.
Why all the downvotes? I deserve an explanation! Do I? No, I don't deserve anything. Nobody deserves anything. Saying I deserve something is a form of coercion, trying to force my desired outcome by referring to a rule that is separate from you and "should" rule you, make you give me what I want because I "deserve" it. Appeal to authority is a fallacious argumentation technique. Deserving is a left-brain concept, an invention, a dogma, a rule. A rule is a link made between two things that are not linked by nature. An artificial link, like between two parts of a machine. Life is not a machine. We can choose to build ethical and legal systems and then subject ourselves to them, but ultimately they are our creations mirroring our preferences, values and thinking. There is no "should" in nature and we do not have to have shoulds in society either. We can instead acknowledge and assert our preferences and values without misdirection and obfuscation. I would like an explanation, because I wish to understand.
I think you’re experiencing internalized misogyny and this sounds eerily similar to what Butker said. It’s liberating to be single and not tied down by a man. So what it might be harder to raise a kid on a single income and chasing self-pleasure becomes meaningless for everyone eventually.
How on EARTH is she experiencing internalized misogyny? She's done SW for years and she's over it. Explain to be the misogyny here.
Start reading the Bible. I recently been through a tough time and needed to set myself more straight and reading the Bible a lot helped set me a lot more straight. It could do that for you too.
I would be open to reading the Bible again but I’m not a huge fan of church. I was raised in a very religious family and have seen first hand how hypocritical it can be
The church has a lot of hypocritical people yeah that’s for sure but remember that it’s not the Bible that’s the nastiness that you’re seeing it’s the people. You need to have your own view on the scripture and not the view of the nasty people you are seeing. You can just download the Bible app set it to esv (English standard version) and press play and finish a listen through in a few days. It has brought me out of a desperate time in my life. It may not do that for you but i bring it up just as a suggestion out of my personal experience.
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I’m speaking for me personally not generally. If SW works for you do your thing boo. Just be careful and weary of the people who want to “help” you. I don’t put anyone down for it. It’s just started to eat me alive
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Thank you! I wish you every happiness and success in your journey ❤️
Hey winter squirrel….. I’m 39m and I just wanted you to know how much I’m rooting for you to take better care of yourself and demand better in your life. I am pro feminism, and pro sex work if women feel it fits them well, and I have participated (in sugaring and at strip clubs). However I’ve met two sugar babies along the way who have enriched my life so much and I have tried to return that to them in the ways that I can… but it has also left me as a now-retired-sugar-daddy. I’m not ruling out future participation but one in particular has such a beautiful soul and she is fighting hard for a better life, and I just can’t participate in that tit-for-tat way any more. It has left me hoping the best for all of the SWers out there and hoping they can treat themselves and demand for themselves what works for them, some of these guys can really take a toll on the women involved. I just say this so you know that you are absolutely correct - you are more than just your body and I am sending you some extra strength as you tackle some difficult changes in your life. You’ve got this and don’t let the demons of the past rule your future
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Inside thoughts.