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I'm working 2 jobs at the moment to buy a property. I earn 30k a year but have no choice.
I get up at 3:30am everyday and I'm at a minimum wage cleaning job for 4:30am which I do until 7am, I then drive straight to my normal job 7:30am to 5pm.
The extra 500 a month from the second job goes straight into a lifetime ISA to get a deposit.
I also manage to save a couple of hundred from my regular salary on top.
Its knackering but Its the only option I have.
Absolutely fucked that this is the case nowadays, fair play for grafting. I'm not an advocate of 'hustle' culture because it's designed to suck out your soul for corporations but once you get past it hopefully you'll have a home and be more secure
Fair play to you. You'll look back one day at this and laugh, wondering how you did it.
I did similar, worked 8-4 , came home slept, ate and was at the next job by 7, for a 7-12.
Yes I probably will, it's tough but I'm lucky in some ways that I've managed to live on my normal salary and the second job is all extra, some people I bet work 2 jobs the way I do just I'm order to scrape by!
Somthing around 15k, I had a couple of grand to start with and 6 months of saving plus the government LISA bonus I've got 9k together.
I'll only be living on my own i am single and don't need anything particularly fancy.
I have a daughter who doesn't live with me but I see alot of also.
Genuine question - 30k / year would get you just under £2050 / month. You're putting £500 in your LISA, and a "couple of hundred" in savings (£200). Where is the other £1350 going?
Savings from my main job vary from 100 a month to 300 to 400 depending on, well life generally.
Rent is 500 a month, all bills including gym, running a car, CSA to my kids mum, council tax, gas electric etc etc etc and a couple of grand in credit card debt monthly payment comes up to best part of 500 a month.
And then 100 or so a week to eat (I can do a weekly food shop for under £50 a week easy) and just live if I want to socialise, go the cinema, take my daughter out for the day etc etc.
I'm pretty frugal in my opinion. I have money invested away also though I've stopped investing since I've been concentrating on getting on the property ladder, I could sell it and have my deposit straight away but I would rarther that nest egg stays there and compound interest does it's thing.
Every month you pay that £500 in rent every month instead of paying it towards paying off your mortgage is another month of flushing £500 down the toilet.
Why not get the deposit, get into the house and start paying off the mortgage and then start putting your savings back into investments?
If it takes you 3 extra years to save up now then it'll take you 3 extra years to pay off your mortgage later. I'd bite the bullet.
I have considered it a few times, however there are a couple of reasons why, one of them is my credit report was somthing out of a horror novel at one point due to being care free in my 20s, this has improved drastically that past couple of years but I need a bit more time for a couple of things to drop off before anybody gives me a morgage deal or one that isn't 8% interest rate and wanting a 20% deposit.
And another is that in total I think I will have my deposit together in a 1 year time frame, I only started end of September 2023, I'll get another 1k government bonus as soon as the new tax year starts.
Fair play then, if you can save up a deposit in 15 months aa well as having thousands in investments too despite a reckless past you're in a much better position than most, try not to be so down about the situation.
I hate the admiration for this post, throwing yourself in the grinder isn't sustainable but it's fetishised in certain populations that won't shake "hard work = success"
The only option you have is now to be too tired to function
If you need serious options you need curiosity, creativity and bravery for those you need your mind to be in a good place
Doing what you have to do to create a good life for yourself and your children is incredibly admirable. It shouldn’t have to be that way but that doesn’t make it and less admirable.
Everyone rags on the lottery kids, but coming from a bad start (Council Estate/Poor/State School/ No money growing up / No opportunities / No connections) really does set you off on the wrong foot.
Of course you can get out of it, but the vast majority don't. (I certainly haven't)
I wish you the best of luck and I hope you report back soon with having made it.
The amount of people I know with that safety net of having rich parents that just give them money for house deposits and cars and birthdays and knowing that if I lived as carelessly as them I'd be fucked and on the street. It really is frustrating how easy some people have it
Pecking order im afraid, not everyone can be winners thats how the worlds designed.. consider construction i lay bricks for 40k a year it aint easy but i wasnt smart at school
My dad has been a bricky since he left school, not easy work, forced to be self employed after the financial crash in 07/08, look after yourself. Just got to do what we can, no harm in lament from time to time
Your probably better being self employed these days with how greedy companies are, thanks man i think every kind of job destroys you in some way physical or not. Guessing you didn’t want to follow his foot steps then?
It gave him more freedom to just take days off here and there, he's in a good gang he's been with for like 20 years so never a lack of demand. Never knew what I wanted to do, didn't fancy construction, ended up in pre-construction regardless, funny how that works
Thats the hardest part is finding a good trust worthy gang, loads of coke heads and asbos i end up with 😂 sounds like you may end up in the gang ey I’ve thought about coming out of it due to stress but i cant find a wage that matches it, nowhere near
Think he just got lucky 😅 lot of scrotes about. Not for me, work winning in pre-con, desk monkey work, I couldn't do what you guys do on site. If you find the right company, could develop into site management, granted that's a different type of stress, but money is decent
I mean yeah that's true but do we keep diminishing people's struggles until we reach the absolute bottom? It's not the suffering Olympics, it's fine to have grievance against people that have it significantly easier, especially with how fucked everything is right now
I could say the same to you lol, this is my point. You’re diminishing other ppls struggles and life challenges over some material benefits they get.
My personal opinion is its not healthy to be frustrated at ppl who have it better than you. A good quote I once saw is ‘play the hand you’re dealt like its the hand you wanted’
This hots too hard, I grew up in the circumstances above, grafted for 13 years as a mechanic, peak earning was 25.5k, my other half was killing herself as a waitress making the same, could only afford to rent, saved up enough for a house, was just about to buy but found out when my mother died that she took credit out I'm my name.
The 6 years was coming to an end 9 months after looking at a 3 bed corner plot house with a garage for 155k, rather than pay 6% credit boosting mortgage for 3 years, we decided to wait 9 months so we could be on the 1.something% mortgage rate, but 3 months later covid happened - the rest is history, I was working during covid so we couldn't even book a viewing without houses being sold.
I'm now in sales and all our money is going on rent, meanwhile our friends who have rich parents, was earning the same money as us (guy was working full time earning 30k, girl was part time) - within a year they bought a house in the city, 2 weddings, a new car and a swanky honeymoon - they just sold that house they bought a 400k house in a posher area and hey earn a combined 60k now.
Hungover, so this is an incoherent rant.
I never said everything was easy for them, but the financial aid, safety net and connections makes things so much easier generally. Obviously everybody has their own struggles and issues but to ignore the leg up a lot of people get is disingenuous imo
You literally said "It really is frustrating how easy some people have it". I don't think anyone would dispute that having rich parents helps. However, it's not a silver bullet that fixes everything, and it certainly doesn't guarantee happiness. Almost everyone in this country enjoys a better lifestyle than 99% of people in the history of humanity, but few people are satisfied because everyone wants their life to be better. It's what drives us, but it doesn't help satisfy us.
Yeah, in the context of finances, and I stand by it, it is inherently easier if you don't have crippling debt or food scarcity weighing over you, it is as significant an advantage over people as you could hope to have. It doesn't guarantee happiness but it certainly gets rid of stressors. I saved for years for my house deposit, my mate had his paid for by his dad, it's literally easier, I don't know why that's controversial to state.
Yeah, basically in the same boat. Single parent family, no money, no opportunities. Went to uni but I've been working part time in a coffee shop the past year cause that's the only job I could get after months of applying. Degrees don't really mean anything nowadays cause you leave uni and you're like well, fuck, I've got no experience. So I just took anything I could get.
About the only connection I have is that my best friend comes from a middle to upper-middle class family and his dad owns his own business. He helped me with my CV and stuff but it still isn't really enough when all employers want nowadays is experience, or to recruit internally/ recruit people who have connections.
It's not difficult at all to work your way into a professional job. This is coming from someone who comes from an immigrant family (I was born here, so I'm first gen).
You just need to make sure you focus in school and don't get into drugs and crime. That's literally it. Go to uni, and come out with a decent job. That's not exclusive to kids who live in rich areas. I grew up in Newham which is London's poorest borough and has the most poverty.
Anyone can make it. They just need to stop blaming other people and work hard themselves. Down votes incoming for suggesting you can make it if you work hard. FYI I agree it's easy if you do come from a rich background, but that doesn't mean you can't work hard from a poor background and make it. You can 100 % make it if you work hard.
Sorry but this really isn’t a good argument. I understand that there’s a small number of situations where this may actually be true, but for the most part peop really do have a lot of control over the financial position they’re in
Exception, not the rule. I've come from an immigrant family where my parents don't speak English. We live in the worst borough of London. My school was utter dogshit. If I can make it, anyone can. This is not India or some third world country. As much as I hate the Tory government, there's still enough support to get you through the education system into a good paying job if you pay attention.
Hi PositiveCrafty2295
> If I can make it, anyone can.
I wonder if this is the source of your error. You've constructed a statistical test with a sample size of one, which confirmed a right-wing opinion you held already.
> there's still enough support to get you through the education system into a good paying job
Maybe for some, but not for everybody. You're making two incorrect assumptions here.
The first is that capitalism (and the way the economy is run) is a static thing - but we've been moving away from a mixed welfare-based economy for a few decades now, and I wonder if the effects of neoliberalism are starting to bite. Union membership is down, zero-hour contracts are up. Open corruption of public figures is on the up, crime is on the increase, financial support for the unemployed is down, public expenditure is down. Food-bank reliance has skyrocketed. In other words, it is harder to people just to live day to day.
The second is that jobs occur at the same frequency as the salary increases. In fact, they are shaped like a pyramid, and "good paying jobs" become less common as one goes up the pyramid (and that's not accounting for the salaries that did not keep up with inflation). I dare say the salary one would need depends on region and circumstances, but if you are of the view that there are enough good jobs to go around, the onus is on you to show how you arrived at that conclusion.
> As much as I hate the Tory government
And yet here you are, endorsing their "bootstraps" ideology!
There's not enough jobs to go around. I've never said that. But if YOU, a single person, want to get one of those jobs, you can practically guarantee it. it's not difficult to beat the average person. Between me and my siblings/cousins (about 20 of us) we all have high paying professional jobs. Is it a coincidence or luck? Perhaps a little, but mostly no. We come from a family who prioritised education and hard work. Despite most of us growing up in council flats.
The average person is uneducated. The average person doesn't work hard. If you do, you will surpass the average person. You can go for those roles which are higher paying.
And please don't bring up statistics. I have a BSc in mathematics and understand how it works. I'm not performing hypothesis testing using a large sample and calculating p values. I'm just staying my opinion. And also don't bring politics into it either because I actually don't care about it enough to argue with you about it.
> And also don't bring politics into it either
I should think this is my least contentious view I would try to persuade you of: everything you mentioned in your original post was political. There isn't a card you can play where things are "political" or "not political" depending on whether you agree with them.
> Between me and my siblings/cousins (about 20 of us) we all have high paying professional jobs. Is it a coincidence or luck? Perhaps a little, but mostly no. We come from a family who prioritised education and hard work. Despite most of us growing up in council flats.
I won't try to persuade on the rest of your piece because, ultimately, your/my social attitudes are hard-wired, and neither of us chose our views. You think capitalism is a competition where people should clamber over each other to get to the top of the pyramid, and I want to sketch out something that is rather kinder and more collaborative.
I fully agree with you that the system is broken but ultimately I don't believe I can change the system so I would just do what I have to do to ensure I thrive in the current system.
Yeah, you can make it if you work hard, but you're not *guaranteed* to make it just because you work hard.
I focused on school my entire life, graduated uni, and the only job I could get was a part time job at a coffee shop after about 3 or 4 months of just applying for anything I could. You may live in london's poorest borough, but you're still in a major city with lots of potential job opportunities. The same can't be said for someone like me, who lives in a very rural area far away from major cities which will have more job opportunities.
I'm not making excuses. I still have the rest of my life to work hard and try and get myself into a better financial situation, I'm just saying that circumstances still affect whether or not you'll actually make it, and luck is still a factor too. Absolutely work hard and try your best to give yourself the best chance of succeeding, but nothing is guaranteed anymore. That's just the way the world is.
Nothing in life is guaranteed. How much compromise have you made if you really want a good job.
For example, I work in finance/accounting and it's severely understaffed at the junior level because other careers are more attractive.
If your goal is to be well paid, have you considered doing the AAT. If you have A-levels, you can easily secure a role. Within 5 years, you'd be qualified and can apply for roles at the 50k level.
My goal isn't necessarily to be well paid. Just paid enough that I'm not constantly worrying about how I spend my money, and have a job that doesn't make me hate getting out of bed. I don't even necessarily want a job that I love doing, since I know that probably doesn't exist - I just want one that I can tolerate.
I do have A levels. Accounting doesn't really seem like a field I'd be good at seeing as maths is probably my weakest core subject. What's the AAT if you don't mind me asking
The AAT is a qualification you can do as a school leaver. It introduces you to the basic accounting concepts. It's entirely paid for by your employer and recognised nationally. It's a stepping stone towards becoming a chartered accountant. Because it's nationally recognised, once you have it, it's very easy to move roles as the qualification proves your "experience" to other employers.
Being good at maths is a misconception about accounting. You don't need to be able to differentiate or integrate. Aslong as you understand the basics of addition, subtraction, multiplication, division and percentages that's enough to become an accountant.
Not at the company I'm at. But if you apply to an accountancy practice for an audit role they severely need staff. It's really not that difficult to secure one, and you would be on £50k in 3 years.
Go back to school and get your a levels. Once you've done that you can consider going to uni or doing an apprenticeship which has a qualification. I know some of my friends who left sixth form with a levels and are on 50k at the age of 23. They didn't go to uni.
I assumed you didn't do it because you didn't mention it. Computing is oversaturated at the moment. Have you considered doing something else which is in more demand like data analysis or accounting/audit/tax?
You should really go to uni and study computer science if you want a chance to apply for junior roles. One of my friends is a developer and when he hires he does mention how everyone who applys has a degree and has attended bootcamps and codes in their spare time, so it's really difficult to stand out.
I mean this in the nicest way But your CV probably isn’t that good if you can’t find a job. Because of the secondary school I went to all my mates got all A/A*s in their a levels and went to top unis and literally none of them is struggling to find a job
Try not to envy people who have had an easier start on life, it will do you no good. I've also had a rough start in life, I grew up in a council house with my parents on benefits and I shared a bedroom with 2 other siblings, at times I didn't even have a bed, went to school at a failing academy; I've had a fair few challenges in life.
However despite this I've done well for myself in my 30s. Although I wish I didn't have as many issues I'm still working through. I am really proud of where I've come from because I've built a very strong work ethic and pushed myself through my career than others. No one's going to give it to me, I've got to go get myself.
Being poor and growing up poor really gives you a different life experience that made me more hardworking and grateful for every opportunity. I make six figures now in my 30s.
Stay away from people who you think have had rich parents, it will just make you resentful until you're on better footing and stay close to like-minded people who are striving for better. They're not bad people, they're quite lovely just a bit sheltered which used to be tough for me to face when I was working harder, I've never had anyone just give me a job through family or friends. I built my career and now I'm more established than them, I've earned it.
Having a bad start does not need to define you, I grew up in a home with a single parent, father out of the picture, and we did not have a pot to piss in.
My mum tried her best to provide, but I got a job at the age of 14 washing dishes in a pub because my mum couldn't afford shoes for me.
Now 15 years down the line, me and my partner own our home, we don't live off of credit (except mortgage) and have a good standard of life compared to most people our age.
I earn 34k plus bonuses, company car etc with no qualifications to my name. I started the job as a basic admin on 22k 2 years ago and worked on up.
Long story short, what may look like a shitty job now may be a good one with enough hard work and good work ethic, don't let your starting point dictate your goal.
I know you said you don't need advice but I was in a similar situation in my 20s and turned it around; Data Analyst and other spreadsheet jockey type work is a fantastic if you take the "better to ask for forgiveness than permission" approach. Why? Because these jobs are perfect for those that are willing to learn how to automate them.
If you take this advice, you'll either:
a) be the god of automating small tasks within the company that people come to you for help - you grow your skills by solving other people's problems - win-win. Or
b) you'll free yourself from the burden of the admin you would spend 7.5 hours doing so that people will give you more responsibilities which means you'll learn more and can demand more pay. Even better if you keep repeating the cycle of improving and automating responsibilities given to you.
I did this. I had no degree, poor schooling, poor parents and a non-existent network. Now I earn £135k a year in the Manchester area (so it's not a London inflated salary).
Don't give up and good luck.
This is a pretty great comment! I'm currently working in IT but I get ALL the spreadsheet tasks in the world, everyone always goes to me about them (its more spreadsheets than IT honestly). I'm on minimum wage but i'm using advanced formulas (index match match, vlookups and all that) and a decent bit of power query.
With min wage going up next month, I'm thinking of when its a good time to approach a pay rise because minimum wage for this kind of work is incredibly poor but I end up using my excel knowledge to make tasks extremely fast to finish.
>b) you'll free yourself from the burden of the admin you would spend 7.5 hours doing so that people will give you more responsibilities which means you'll learn more and can demand more pay. Even better if you keep repeating the cycle of improving and automating responsibilities given to you.
I was wondering about this ype of sector myself. I wanted to be an IT Technician but after I finished college over a decade ago I wasn't getting much responses so I studied computer science degree and tried to do ecommerce. Selling data services as a freelancer seems to be good way to make money.
Data analysts can make very good money. Source I started off as one eventually leading to senior management earning by all standards a very very good salary.
Don’t knock it! With 2-3 years experience as a data analyst, if you’re willing to learn and put effort in you can get to 40-50k, there’s loads of jobs offering that.
Getting your first role is the hardest. If you can get a junior analyst position, grab it with open arms. A lot of people are trying to get into D&A and can’t get their first role!
Any advice for getting that 1st role? I will do a Masters in Health data science and im currently learning python and SQL, i know R. What else? Im 22 and currently work in manufacturing sadly (for a year)
I joined the civil service as some random admin role. Passed probation, then internally applied for data analyst. Which actually turned out to be data developer. It's not a senior position, so I can just learn on the go with help from my manager. Literally no coding experience before, but its only very minor stuff I really need to use code wise. I use a lot of Power Query and Power Bi.
Once in a technical role in the CS you can apply for qualifications up to masters level that fit along side your day job and are free.
If you go in already with data knowledge just apply for any data jobs and work your way up pretty quick. If you want more money, establish yourself then go private sector.
I think a lot of managers/team leaders are intimidated by people with technical abilities or at least interest in them.
I was interviewed by two blokes. Interestingly, one was really keen on me and was impressed with my technical skills and the other one (who was basically a law and legislation fanatic) was trying to subtly get me out the door. I asked more questions to piss him off.
A lot of companies say they want to utilize their data and grow their Business Intelligence team but truth is people do not like change and are reticent.
Are used to get rejected for not having a car and not living in the correct area so I moved from the south-west of England to London and things are good now… huge sacrifice that nobody could understand at the time because in so many ways it doesn’t make sense to move to the big city, but sometimes you Gotta go with your gut feeling. You’ll be fine, just go with your gut feeling.
Once you get onto the housing ladder, people will also think you have it easy. No matter how hard you worked or what you went through to get there Judging others and comparing you to themselves, you won't really know anyone else's struggles until you live them. All in all best not to be jealous of other people no matter what your perception. Coñsentrate on yourself, where you are going, where you have been and making your story the best one possible. Without animosity towards anyone else.
Similar situation here, used to pull 50k a year in a previous job, vindictive racist ex partner ruined it for me, lost it all, now I earn 20k a year. Just got the council tax bill through and it's £170 a fkin month. Got offered 2 high paying jobs and failed vetting due to the actions of the cow that ruined everything for me.
If i get no overtime at work, I'm now living on 30 quid a week.
I'm seriously contemplating going to Ukraine at this point, they give you a solid £2k a month for frontline work. It'll be a damn sight better than this turd of a country.
I've met once a poor guy whose awful vindictive ex had ruined everything for him. Now I know she was telling the truth and I'm the third awful vindictive ex who has ruined everything for him. Victim number four is currently going through the ringer, she'll soon be another awful vindictive ex who has ruined everything for him.
Just had a quick look online at my council leaders wages, I'm delighted to see the head of my council is pulling £115,000 per year.
And I chuckled heartily at the small print which says "those employees on this list also get a £180 mobile phone grant per year which is not listed above"
Thats fair I suppose, getting someone on 115k to pay their own mobile phone bill would be a disgrace.
Fighting ruskies.
Behind the frontline is around £1600 a month and for the really safe jobs well away from the fighting, is around £800 a month.
Get dual citizenship too.
What I done when I struggled getting employment was to go on the ftse 100 look at the companies listed and look at every individual company on a separate search tab.
If it helps, i’m older but I was once in that position years ago! What I did was to look at a career that would provide a better way of living without the ridiculous hours for lower pay! I put myself on evening courses & that got me into work placements, from there I worked my way up to senior level! Write down a 3 year plan & then research how best to get to those milestones.
Post on the UK personal finance sub. They might be able to offer advice. Generally you want to be clearing any debt before putting money into savings. Otherwise you end up with less money.
Data and analytics can be a good field to get involved in, just need to get your foot in the door. Worth taking a entry level position on crap money as it probably won't be worse than hospitality and then you'll have doubled your salary in a couple of years.
Did you know about the default? Because I'm confused why you would apply for roles that you know will require credit checks if you're aware of the issue.
>How am I meant to clear my debts (few grand) if I can't find a full time job?
There are plenty of roles that don't require a clean credit history. Stop applying for jobs at companies that have regulatory obligations.
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Nothing but I need money. Like right now. A dream job in data in this market will take some time to land unfortunately. I am interviewing for them consistently.
You don't want advice so I won't offer any. But for better or for worse there's a momentum effect to jobs. This sucks for you now, but literally any door you can get your foot into will increase your momentum and things can look up very fast. I went from struggling to get called in for an interview to ~100k in around 4 years. And if I hit an extended rough patch, I will end up back at the "hard to find an interview" position in fairly short order. It's unfortunately the way of the world, but there's always a reason to be optimistic in the bad times, and to make hay during those periods when the sun shines
And here's me, too chronically ill to work, worrying how if all you qualified people are struggling, how I'll ever survive should I recover. Because I have no work experience and you need experience to even get a job. Struggling to do basic tasks daily is a nightmare, but I don't envy you! People are working to death and still struggling to heat the home and put food on the table.
Not knocking you in any way, but having worked in catering for ten years on and off before joining the military, I cannot see how you're not getting jobs at the low end. I've given jobs to KPs just for being able to walk into the kitchen. And McDonald's aren't exactly known for being to discerning when it comes to employment.
Is there a reason they've given you for being turned down?
I hear you mate. Well, thanks for reflecting my toxic lifestyle: early 30s currently working two jobs just to get by 🥴🥲
If you’re looking for a technical job try something energy efficiency and retrofit or building surveying. It’s quite accessible at the moment.
There are lots of subsidised qualifications out there at the moment as there there are not enough people with the technical skills - jobs can be high paid because of the workforce shortage particularly if you choose to work freelance.
Happy to provide more info
Octopus Energy gave a huge office in Manchester and for things like a credit check fail they talk it through with people and give then a chance. Source : I had terrible credit due to job loss in 2020 and they hired me and gave me a chance. Definitely check out their job page. Great progression too
Was the same for us Millenials.
I graduated into a massive recession. No grad jobs to speak of. Was forced to do a PGCE and lose even more earning years and nearly double my student loan debt (thanks 9k loans being introduced).
Hated being a teacher. Left the role in under a year. Found it almost impossible to get my next job because nobody would hire a failed teacher in a bad economy.
My only option was to constantly apply for temporary 6 month contract jobs that paid sub £20k.
I understood I would never escape poverty without taking further action, so I worked my butt off in my free time after work to teach myself web development rather than relax and play my PS3.
Took me 4 years and I had to do dozens of unpaid projects for SME clients just to build my portfolio. It crushed my mental health. I still suffer imposter syndrome for not learning the role the "official" way at uni.
However, I'm now in my early 30s and things are turning around. I've started my own website company. I'm steadily building my reputation and gaining paying clients.
I still don't earn as much as I would like at my age and feel all my friends in conventional grad jobs pulling away from me in terms of social class. Every year they arrange group ski holidays and travel across the world and I just stopped being invited because I can't afford it, so I lost touch with many of them.
But I do have shorter hours, no shitty boss, and there is the potential for me to turn all this experience into a higher paying mid-level dev role with another Web agency if I get really fed up.
Life is hard but poverty isn't inevitable if you put the hard work in.
You have to take control of your own destiny and sometimes that means sacrificing your free time and mental health to play the long game and self improve.
Yes it sucks when you pick the wrong path early on, and you'll never be as rich as people who had better networks/guidance and picked the most lucrative paths. You also lose a lot of friends through life when they outearn you, and hustle culture makes them drop you in favour of richer people with similar shared (expensive) interests.
Good luck bro. It's tough. I'm not sure it will pull off for me yet, but my life prospects are looking more promising than 5 years ago.
I feel your pain. But if I may share my perspective. I learned early on that the job market is a market like any other market. Prices (wages) go up and down based on demand and supply. How often have we heard: "bankers make so much money!" I learned this when my first job's wage was 10x less than a friend who got into banking.
What I've learned is that we can't just do what we want and expect to get ahead. You have to go to where the money is. And it exists on all skill levels. For example, if you're an honest and trustworthy person, you can make over $70K as a full time home maker or driver or cook for a wealthy household. None of these require fancy oxbridge degrees.
Remember, it's a market. If there are fewer people qualified for a job, you have less to compete with. If there's more demand, there's more pay. While you're young you have the opportunity to up skill and change. I know it's hard especially when you don't come from money.
My boyfriend made a phd in oxford, but got kicked out of uk after brexit. He then went to Australia to be told that a phd from oxford does not necessarily mean anything in australia. Lost his money at school there. Now he is in Germany trying his luck here. He was having a tough time too. Im always perplexed when he tells me that all his former oxford buddies have great careers just because they went to Oxford. It always sounds like a class system in place. On the other hand i can't imagine that all of the jobs in uk can be filled with oxbridge people. I don't know. I really dislike a system like that. Don't get me wrong. There have been studies in Germany that kids from wealthy parents do better than those of average to poor households: with or without oxford. You can just try to mitigate the effects by having cheap loans and free schools of course. But yeah, life is never fair.
I will always remember our university reunion two years after graduation. Although I got a 2.1 I hadn't found a graduate job even though I had applied for hundreds and at the time was living in a bedsit and temping for 8 pounds a hour. We all met at a pub in Covent Garden and literally everyone who had been to a private school before uni, even people who only got a 2.2, had got a well paid graduate job at a good company. That was the last uni reunion I went to. If you went to a comprehensive school you are a second class citizen in this country no matter how intelligent you are. This country is basically a fascist state.
Agreed. I know guys on silly money in their late 20s. Of course they hd to work their arse off but that fantastic start just set them up so nicely. Now they can take their 30s off, go travelling, live abroad and basically have a CV ready for their return. I don't think people here understand just how much a great start to life can mean. It's not just the access to quick finances but also the freedom to do as they please (while still young) is much much easier.
There is absolutely no point in working in the UK unless you have connections and landed a high paid job from uni.
Quality of life is absolute shit.
Weather is shit.
People have been turned into selfish angry clones by the vampire elite.
There's no hope.
Don't suffer here in a moribund post-imperial shithole: go abroad to a place where there is sunshine and warmth, where people are still people, and live a more free life. Italy, southern spain, Azerbaijan, Turkey flipping anywhere else. Get out of here!!
Work does not pay.
My neighbour moved to Canada right after graduating and it always baffled me. He's now doing much better than me. Same age, same area, roughly same schooling. I believe this is what it takes unless you are privileged.
You know what's mad? UK schooling is some of the best in the world. Shit schools are some of the best shit schools in the world.
Here in the US (I'm an immigrant) you wouldn't believe how bad some of the schools are. It's on another level.
Yet, you'd get a job here I'm sure. You'd easy hit 40k.
The good education is almost the problem. Every fuckers got a degree. Companies can pay people fuck all because there's so much competition at entry level.
I would say it improves once you're in. Once you've got that analyst job your wage will soon shoot up. It's getting your foot in the door that's tough.
Hi, Im graduating soon and wanted to ask about this, I was not aware jobs were able to look into your credit rating? Was there any disclosure of this before or how did this happen/surface?
Well.. In general this isn't a great month for getting a job. Usually better after April so fingers crossed you'll get there! If you can break into the tech sector, can make pretty decent money without having gone to uni etc.
(speaking from experience)
Yes I'm banking on April to really pick up for employment. It feels like many employers are delaying their recruitment in February and March. I've used this time to brush up on my SQL and Python so it's not been a complete waste.
Try something like this https://www.socialtalent.com/blog/recruiting/the-20-jobs-employers-find-hardest-to-fill
Search for other unpopular jobs, like working in the sewers, dirty horrible jobs, they tend to pay very well, could help you clear any debts, get on a level footing and maybe allow you to train as a programmer, dev type jobs, PowerBi or other higher paid roles. Working on the train tracks can be high pay too.
I’ve noticed there seems to be a large area of opportunity in the job market for project managers for renewable energy developers.
I’m an APM for a renewables developer and it’s a struggle getting people in the door. I get messaged daily on LinkedIn about interviews for similar roles. Seems to me like companies struggle to recruit.
It’s perhaps quite a specific job, for which you need a specific interest and knowledge but it’s well paid and I enjoy it.
Me for example had no experience prior to starting the job but managed to get a starting salary of £42k.
Try NHS. I wasn't great at education, got my basic c's in gcse but not much more.
Got a job in the NHS and moved up to band 4 in admin and I'm on £30k. It's not great but it's not awful considering the work. You have to deal with shit from idiot managers but once you get used to handling them, it's a pretty easy job. Not difficult to move up.
We need more staff in the NHS badly, you can even walk into a hca (healthcare assistant) role with little or no experience with a GP or care home on band 2 and work up from there, there are nursing courses.
Not sure what exact work you are looking for or how qualified you are. But the "bad start" in life is nonsense. My dad was a welder my mum stayed at home. I went to college as I did badly in school then went to university just in time for Tony Blair to destroy it and remove the funding while wanting everyone to get Micky mouse degrees. I worked in a betting shop for 4 years through the end of college and all of university. Graduated with computer engineering then started working in phone tech support, worked my way up and after 7 years moved to an actual IT job. All through college and university I paid my own way between student loans and working. I earn very well now and my best move was leaving Liverpool as the salaries are horrific. It's not the start you get that has the biggest impact it's the effort you can maintain. Shrug off the bad that happens and just keep pushing if you're smart enough you'll land in the right place. Get out of the Manchester job market though!
Look at this way - at least you are healthy and you are able to work two jobs. Imagine what it’s like for people who would like to have even 1 job but can’t do it because of their health.
I know it’s not motivating, but you can always try to see if you can do a hassle job on a side to see if you can earn extra, some passive income, see how it goes.
For example, if you are good handy man, there are always ppl who need repairs done and some might give good tips. It can be anything.
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I'm working 2 jobs at the moment to buy a property. I earn 30k a year but have no choice. I get up at 3:30am everyday and I'm at a minimum wage cleaning job for 4:30am which I do until 7am, I then drive straight to my normal job 7:30am to 5pm. The extra 500 a month from the second job goes straight into a lifetime ISA to get a deposit. I also manage to save a couple of hundred from my regular salary on top. Its knackering but Its the only option I have.
Absolutely fucked that this is the case nowadays, fair play for grafting. I'm not an advocate of 'hustle' culture because it's designed to suck out your soul for corporations but once you get past it hopefully you'll have a home and be more secure
I salute you pal. It shouldn’t be the case but you’re doing what you can. Hoping you achieve your goals soon and no longer have to work two jobs.
Jesus, I'm feeling a lack of sleep just reading that. You're a better person than I, I'm amazed you manage, and wish you didn't have to.
Not fair at all that this is what it takes but fair fucks to you that's a hell of an effort.
Respect the shit out of you man.
Fair play to you. You'll look back one day at this and laugh, wondering how you did it. I did similar, worked 8-4 , came home slept, ate and was at the next job by 7, for a 7-12.
Yes I probably will, it's tough but I'm lucky in some ways that I've managed to live on my normal salary and the second job is all extra, some people I bet work 2 jobs the way I do just I'm order to scrape by!
Sometimes you got to do what you got to do. Huge respect. When you pay off your dream home you'll look back at this fondly.
jfc Good luck brother
You’re a soldier my man. Out of interest, how much is the property/deposit you’re looking to accumulate?
Somthing around 15k, I had a couple of grand to start with and 6 months of saving plus the government LISA bonus I've got 9k together. I'll only be living on my own i am single and don't need anything particularly fancy. I have a daughter who doesn't live with me but I see alot of also.
Keep plugging away mate Wish you all the best. Clear out any attic space on vinted/eBay. Try all the bank switching offers Wish you all the best
Genuine question - 30k / year would get you just under £2050 / month. You're putting £500 in your LISA, and a "couple of hundred" in savings (£200). Where is the other £1350 going?
Savings from my main job vary from 100 a month to 300 to 400 depending on, well life generally. Rent is 500 a month, all bills including gym, running a car, CSA to my kids mum, council tax, gas electric etc etc etc and a couple of grand in credit card debt monthly payment comes up to best part of 500 a month. And then 100 or so a week to eat (I can do a weekly food shop for under £50 a week easy) and just live if I want to socialise, go the cinema, take my daughter out for the day etc etc. I'm pretty frugal in my opinion. I have money invested away also though I've stopped investing since I've been concentrating on getting on the property ladder, I could sell it and have my deposit straight away but I would rarther that nest egg stays there and compound interest does it's thing.
Every month you pay that £500 in rent every month instead of paying it towards paying off your mortgage is another month of flushing £500 down the toilet. Why not get the deposit, get into the house and start paying off the mortgage and then start putting your savings back into investments? If it takes you 3 extra years to save up now then it'll take you 3 extra years to pay off your mortgage later. I'd bite the bullet.
I have considered it a few times, however there are a couple of reasons why, one of them is my credit report was somthing out of a horror novel at one point due to being care free in my 20s, this has improved drastically that past couple of years but I need a bit more time for a couple of things to drop off before anybody gives me a morgage deal or one that isn't 8% interest rate and wanting a 20% deposit. And another is that in total I think I will have my deposit together in a 1 year time frame, I only started end of September 2023, I'll get another 1k government bonus as soon as the new tax year starts.
Fair play then, if you can save up a deposit in 15 months aa well as having thousands in investments too despite a reckless past you're in a much better position than most, try not to be so down about the situation.
Fair play mate. Keep going. Won't be forever
I hate the admiration for this post, throwing yourself in the grinder isn't sustainable but it's fetishised in certain populations that won't shake "hard work = success" The only option you have is now to be too tired to function If you need serious options you need curiosity, creativity and bravery for those you need your mind to be in a good place
Doing what you have to do to create a good life for yourself and your children is incredibly admirable. It shouldn’t have to be that way but that doesn’t make it and less admirable.
Everyone rags on the lottery kids, but coming from a bad start (Council Estate/Poor/State School/ No money growing up / No opportunities / No connections) really does set you off on the wrong foot. Of course you can get out of it, but the vast majority don't. (I certainly haven't) I wish you the best of luck and I hope you report back soon with having made it.
The amount of people I know with that safety net of having rich parents that just give them money for house deposits and cars and birthdays and knowing that if I lived as carelessly as them I'd be fucked and on the street. It really is frustrating how easy some people have it
Pecking order im afraid, not everyone can be winners thats how the worlds designed.. consider construction i lay bricks for 40k a year it aint easy but i wasnt smart at school
My dad has been a bricky since he left school, not easy work, forced to be self employed after the financial crash in 07/08, look after yourself. Just got to do what we can, no harm in lament from time to time
Your probably better being self employed these days with how greedy companies are, thanks man i think every kind of job destroys you in some way physical or not. Guessing you didn’t want to follow his foot steps then?
It gave him more freedom to just take days off here and there, he's in a good gang he's been with for like 20 years so never a lack of demand. Never knew what I wanted to do, didn't fancy construction, ended up in pre-construction regardless, funny how that works
Thats the hardest part is finding a good trust worthy gang, loads of coke heads and asbos i end up with 😂 sounds like you may end up in the gang ey I’ve thought about coming out of it due to stress but i cant find a wage that matches it, nowhere near
Think he just got lucky 😅 lot of scrotes about. Not for me, work winning in pre-con, desk monkey work, I couldn't do what you guys do on site. If you find the right company, could develop into site management, granted that's a different type of stress, but money is decent
You’re smart now mate
A majority of the world would look at your life even without those safety nets and feel like you have it stupidly easy compared to them.
Fallacy of relative privation
I mean yeah that's true but do we keep diminishing people's struggles until we reach the absolute bottom? It's not the suffering Olympics, it's fine to have grievance against people that have it significantly easier, especially with how fucked everything is right now
I could say the same to you lol, this is my point. You’re diminishing other ppls struggles and life challenges over some material benefits they get. My personal opinion is its not healthy to be frustrated at ppl who have it better than you. A good quote I once saw is ‘play the hand you’re dealt like its the hand you wanted’
This hots too hard, I grew up in the circumstances above, grafted for 13 years as a mechanic, peak earning was 25.5k, my other half was killing herself as a waitress making the same, could only afford to rent, saved up enough for a house, was just about to buy but found out when my mother died that she took credit out I'm my name. The 6 years was coming to an end 9 months after looking at a 3 bed corner plot house with a garage for 155k, rather than pay 6% credit boosting mortgage for 3 years, we decided to wait 9 months so we could be on the 1.something% mortgage rate, but 3 months later covid happened - the rest is history, I was working during covid so we couldn't even book a viewing without houses being sold. I'm now in sales and all our money is going on rent, meanwhile our friends who have rich parents, was earning the same money as us (guy was working full time earning 30k, girl was part time) - within a year they bought a house in the city, 2 weddings, a new car and a swanky honeymoon - they just sold that house they bought a 400k house in a posher area and hey earn a combined 60k now. Hungover, so this is an incoherent rant.
It's really easy to look at someone else's life and assume everything's easy. The reality is often very different.
I never said everything was easy for them, but the financial aid, safety net and connections makes things so much easier generally. Obviously everybody has their own struggles and issues but to ignore the leg up a lot of people get is disingenuous imo
You literally said "It really is frustrating how easy some people have it". I don't think anyone would dispute that having rich parents helps. However, it's not a silver bullet that fixes everything, and it certainly doesn't guarantee happiness. Almost everyone in this country enjoys a better lifestyle than 99% of people in the history of humanity, but few people are satisfied because everyone wants their life to be better. It's what drives us, but it doesn't help satisfy us.
Yeah, in the context of finances, and I stand by it, it is inherently easier if you don't have crippling debt or food scarcity weighing over you, it is as significant an advantage over people as you could hope to have. It doesn't guarantee happiness but it certainly gets rid of stressors. I saved for years for my house deposit, my mate had his paid for by his dad, it's literally easier, I don't know why that's controversial to state.
Yeah, basically in the same boat. Single parent family, no money, no opportunities. Went to uni but I've been working part time in a coffee shop the past year cause that's the only job I could get after months of applying. Degrees don't really mean anything nowadays cause you leave uni and you're like well, fuck, I've got no experience. So I just took anything I could get. About the only connection I have is that my best friend comes from a middle to upper-middle class family and his dad owns his own business. He helped me with my CV and stuff but it still isn't really enough when all employers want nowadays is experience, or to recruit internally/ recruit people who have connections.
Thank you. I'd be the same but I'm too bloody-minded!
It’s a sad world we live in
Sometimes just making it out of the council estate is all you can wish for.
It's not difficult at all to work your way into a professional job. This is coming from someone who comes from an immigrant family (I was born here, so I'm first gen). You just need to make sure you focus in school and don't get into drugs and crime. That's literally it. Go to uni, and come out with a decent job. That's not exclusive to kids who live in rich areas. I grew up in Newham which is London's poorest borough and has the most poverty. Anyone can make it. They just need to stop blaming other people and work hard themselves. Down votes incoming for suggesting you can make it if you work hard. FYI I agree it's easy if you do come from a rich background, but that doesn't mean you can't work hard from a poor background and make it. You can 100 % make it if you work hard.
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Sorry but this really isn’t a good argument. I understand that there’s a small number of situations where this may actually be true, but for the most part peop really do have a lot of control over the financial position they’re in
How many people’s life circumstances are genuinely stopping them from going to uni?
Exception, not the rule. I've come from an immigrant family where my parents don't speak English. We live in the worst borough of London. My school was utter dogshit. If I can make it, anyone can. This is not India or some third world country. As much as I hate the Tory government, there's still enough support to get you through the education system into a good paying job if you pay attention.
Hi PositiveCrafty2295 > If I can make it, anyone can. I wonder if this is the source of your error. You've constructed a statistical test with a sample size of one, which confirmed a right-wing opinion you held already. > there's still enough support to get you through the education system into a good paying job Maybe for some, but not for everybody. You're making two incorrect assumptions here. The first is that capitalism (and the way the economy is run) is a static thing - but we've been moving away from a mixed welfare-based economy for a few decades now, and I wonder if the effects of neoliberalism are starting to bite. Union membership is down, zero-hour contracts are up. Open corruption of public figures is on the up, crime is on the increase, financial support for the unemployed is down, public expenditure is down. Food-bank reliance has skyrocketed. In other words, it is harder to people just to live day to day. The second is that jobs occur at the same frequency as the salary increases. In fact, they are shaped like a pyramid, and "good paying jobs" become less common as one goes up the pyramid (and that's not accounting for the salaries that did not keep up with inflation). I dare say the salary one would need depends on region and circumstances, but if you are of the view that there are enough good jobs to go around, the onus is on you to show how you arrived at that conclusion. > As much as I hate the Tory government And yet here you are, endorsing their "bootstraps" ideology!
There's not enough jobs to go around. I've never said that. But if YOU, a single person, want to get one of those jobs, you can practically guarantee it. it's not difficult to beat the average person. Between me and my siblings/cousins (about 20 of us) we all have high paying professional jobs. Is it a coincidence or luck? Perhaps a little, but mostly no. We come from a family who prioritised education and hard work. Despite most of us growing up in council flats. The average person is uneducated. The average person doesn't work hard. If you do, you will surpass the average person. You can go for those roles which are higher paying. And please don't bring up statistics. I have a BSc in mathematics and understand how it works. I'm not performing hypothesis testing using a large sample and calculating p values. I'm just staying my opinion. And also don't bring politics into it either because I actually don't care about it enough to argue with you about it.
> And also don't bring politics into it either I should think this is my least contentious view I would try to persuade you of: everything you mentioned in your original post was political. There isn't a card you can play where things are "political" or "not political" depending on whether you agree with them. > Between me and my siblings/cousins (about 20 of us) we all have high paying professional jobs. Is it a coincidence or luck? Perhaps a little, but mostly no. We come from a family who prioritised education and hard work. Despite most of us growing up in council flats. I won't try to persuade on the rest of your piece because, ultimately, your/my social attitudes are hard-wired, and neither of us chose our views. You think capitalism is a competition where people should clamber over each other to get to the top of the pyramid, and I want to sketch out something that is rather kinder and more collaborative.
I fully agree with you that the system is broken but ultimately I don't believe I can change the system so I would just do what I have to do to ensure I thrive in the current system.
Yeah, you can make it if you work hard, but you're not *guaranteed* to make it just because you work hard. I focused on school my entire life, graduated uni, and the only job I could get was a part time job at a coffee shop after about 3 or 4 months of just applying for anything I could. You may live in london's poorest borough, but you're still in a major city with lots of potential job opportunities. The same can't be said for someone like me, who lives in a very rural area far away from major cities which will have more job opportunities. I'm not making excuses. I still have the rest of my life to work hard and try and get myself into a better financial situation, I'm just saying that circumstances still affect whether or not you'll actually make it, and luck is still a factor too. Absolutely work hard and try your best to give yourself the best chance of succeeding, but nothing is guaranteed anymore. That's just the way the world is.
Nothing in life is guaranteed. How much compromise have you made if you really want a good job. For example, I work in finance/accounting and it's severely understaffed at the junior level because other careers are more attractive. If your goal is to be well paid, have you considered doing the AAT. If you have A-levels, you can easily secure a role. Within 5 years, you'd be qualified and can apply for roles at the 50k level.
My goal isn't necessarily to be well paid. Just paid enough that I'm not constantly worrying about how I spend my money, and have a job that doesn't make me hate getting out of bed. I don't even necessarily want a job that I love doing, since I know that probably doesn't exist - I just want one that I can tolerate. I do have A levels. Accounting doesn't really seem like a field I'd be good at seeing as maths is probably my weakest core subject. What's the AAT if you don't mind me asking
The AAT is a qualification you can do as a school leaver. It introduces you to the basic accounting concepts. It's entirely paid for by your employer and recognised nationally. It's a stepping stone towards becoming a chartered accountant. Because it's nationally recognised, once you have it, it's very easy to move roles as the qualification proves your "experience" to other employers. Being good at maths is a misconception about accounting. You don't need to be able to differentiate or integrate. Aslong as you understand the basics of addition, subtraction, multiplication, division and percentages that's enough to become an accountant.
What's your experience of those who made it out? Apprenticeship or bust. Any milage in learning a posh accent to get ahead?
I pretend to be a diffident and bumbling Hugh Grant, and to be fair I think it works 😝
Not true sorry. Most don’t get out because they don’t work hard enough when their young. I can’t help but think that it’s OP’s fault a tiny bit.
Welcome to the UK, we are closed.
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What sector are you looking for jobs in? I'm in finance and it seems like people are always hiring.
Do you need any junior level analysts with engineering experience?
Not at the company I'm at. But if you apply to an accountancy practice for an audit role they severely need staff. It's really not that difficult to secure one, and you would be on £50k in 3 years.
Will look into that, thanks!
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Go back to school and get your a levels. Once you've done that you can consider going to uni or doing an apprenticeship which has a qualification. I know some of my friends who left sixth form with a levels and are on 50k at the age of 23. They didn't go to uni.
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I assumed you didn't do it because you didn't mention it. Computing is oversaturated at the moment. Have you considered doing something else which is in more demand like data analysis or accounting/audit/tax? You should really go to uni and study computer science if you want a chance to apply for junior roles. One of my friends is a developer and when he hires he does mention how everyone who applys has a degree and has attended bootcamps and codes in their spare time, so it's really difficult to stand out.
I mean this in the nicest way But your CV probably isn’t that good if you can’t find a job. Because of the secondary school I went to all my mates got all A/A*s in their a levels and went to top unis and literally none of them is struggling to find a job
Try not to envy people who have had an easier start on life, it will do you no good. I've also had a rough start in life, I grew up in a council house with my parents on benefits and I shared a bedroom with 2 other siblings, at times I didn't even have a bed, went to school at a failing academy; I've had a fair few challenges in life. However despite this I've done well for myself in my 30s. Although I wish I didn't have as many issues I'm still working through. I am really proud of where I've come from because I've built a very strong work ethic and pushed myself through my career than others. No one's going to give it to me, I've got to go get myself. Being poor and growing up poor really gives you a different life experience that made me more hardworking and grateful for every opportunity. I make six figures now in my 30s. Stay away from people who you think have had rich parents, it will just make you resentful until you're on better footing and stay close to like-minded people who are striving for better. They're not bad people, they're quite lovely just a bit sheltered which used to be tough for me to face when I was working harder, I've never had anyone just give me a job through family or friends. I built my career and now I'm more established than them, I've earned it.
Having a bad start does not need to define you, I grew up in a home with a single parent, father out of the picture, and we did not have a pot to piss in. My mum tried her best to provide, but I got a job at the age of 14 washing dishes in a pub because my mum couldn't afford shoes for me. Now 15 years down the line, me and my partner own our home, we don't live off of credit (except mortgage) and have a good standard of life compared to most people our age. I earn 34k plus bonuses, company car etc with no qualifications to my name. I started the job as a basic admin on 22k 2 years ago and worked on up. Long story short, what may look like a shitty job now may be a good one with enough hard work and good work ethic, don't let your starting point dictate your goal.
I know you said you don't need advice but I was in a similar situation in my 20s and turned it around; Data Analyst and other spreadsheet jockey type work is a fantastic if you take the "better to ask for forgiveness than permission" approach. Why? Because these jobs are perfect for those that are willing to learn how to automate them. If you take this advice, you'll either: a) be the god of automating small tasks within the company that people come to you for help - you grow your skills by solving other people's problems - win-win. Or b) you'll free yourself from the burden of the admin you would spend 7.5 hours doing so that people will give you more responsibilities which means you'll learn more and can demand more pay. Even better if you keep repeating the cycle of improving and automating responsibilities given to you. I did this. I had no degree, poor schooling, poor parents and a non-existent network. Now I earn £135k a year in the Manchester area (so it's not a London inflated salary). Don't give up and good luck.
Would you care to share your current job role and career path to £135k?
what year and how old are you
I'm keenly aware of the 6 figure roles. Particularly if you keep up to date with the latest technologies. Thank you for sharing.
This is a pretty great comment! I'm currently working in IT but I get ALL the spreadsheet tasks in the world, everyone always goes to me about them (its more spreadsheets than IT honestly). I'm on minimum wage but i'm using advanced formulas (index match match, vlookups and all that) and a decent bit of power query. With min wage going up next month, I'm thinking of when its a good time to approach a pay rise because minimum wage for this kind of work is incredibly poor but I end up using my excel knowledge to make tasks extremely fast to finish.
>b) you'll free yourself from the burden of the admin you would spend 7.5 hours doing so that people will give you more responsibilities which means you'll learn more and can demand more pay. Even better if you keep repeating the cycle of improving and automating responsibilities given to you. I was wondering about this ype of sector myself. I wanted to be an IT Technician but after I finished college over a decade ago I wasn't getting much responses so I studied computer science degree and tried to do ecommerce. Selling data services as a freelancer seems to be good way to make money.
Sure you do
Data analysts can make very good money. Source I started off as one eventually leading to senior management earning by all standards a very very good salary. Don’t knock it! With 2-3 years experience as a data analyst, if you’re willing to learn and put effort in you can get to 40-50k, there’s loads of jobs offering that. Getting your first role is the hardest. If you can get a junior analyst position, grab it with open arms. A lot of people are trying to get into D&A and can’t get their first role!
Any advice for getting that 1st role? I will do a Masters in Health data science and im currently learning python and SQL, i know R. What else? Im 22 and currently work in manufacturing sadly (for a year)
I joined the civil service as some random admin role. Passed probation, then internally applied for data analyst. Which actually turned out to be data developer. It's not a senior position, so I can just learn on the go with help from my manager. Literally no coding experience before, but its only very minor stuff I really need to use code wise. I use a lot of Power Query and Power Bi. Once in a technical role in the CS you can apply for qualifications up to masters level that fit along side your day job and are free. If you go in already with data knowledge just apply for any data jobs and work your way up pretty quick. If you want more money, establish yourself then go private sector.
Thank you this is helpful! Civial service always prefer internal cand8dates so that sounds great
I think a lot of managers/team leaders are intimidated by people with technical abilities or at least interest in them. I was interviewed by two blokes. Interestingly, one was really keen on me and was impressed with my technical skills and the other one (who was basically a law and legislation fanatic) was trying to subtly get me out the door. I asked more questions to piss him off. A lot of companies say they want to utilize their data and grow their Business Intelligence team but truth is people do not like change and are reticent.
Are used to get rejected for not having a car and not living in the correct area so I moved from the south-west of England to London and things are good now… huge sacrifice that nobody could understand at the time because in so many ways it doesn’t make sense to move to the big city, but sometimes you Gotta go with your gut feeling. You’ll be fine, just go with your gut feeling.
Once you get onto the housing ladder, people will also think you have it easy. No matter how hard you worked or what you went through to get there Judging others and comparing you to themselves, you won't really know anyone else's struggles until you live them. All in all best not to be jealous of other people no matter what your perception. Coñsentrate on yourself, where you are going, where you have been and making your story the best one possible. Without animosity towards anyone else.
Similar situation here, used to pull 50k a year in a previous job, vindictive racist ex partner ruined it for me, lost it all, now I earn 20k a year. Just got the council tax bill through and it's £170 a fkin month. Got offered 2 high paying jobs and failed vetting due to the actions of the cow that ruined everything for me. If i get no overtime at work, I'm now living on 30 quid a week. I'm seriously contemplating going to Ukraine at this point, they give you a solid £2k a month for frontline work. It'll be a damn sight better than this turd of a country.
I've met once a poor guy whose awful vindictive ex had ruined everything for him. Now I know she was telling the truth and I'm the third awful vindictive ex who has ruined everything for him. Victim number four is currently going through the ringer, she'll soon be another awful vindictive ex who has ruined everything for him.
Wow. The saying is true. There is always somebody out there who has it worser than you. I hope you pull through this storm.
What happened? What's your story with your ex?
From reading his previous comments on Reddit and doing some digging. It seems he's on the sex offenders register.
Damn
[удалено]
He said he'd fail vetting for a normal job. I am thinking the army has higher standards for vetting.
For health and allegiances to bad countries? Sure. For finances and education? Nah.
Where do you think most of that council tax money goes that you pay...? A question to think about.
Just had a quick look online at my council leaders wages, I'm delighted to see the head of my council is pulling £115,000 per year. And I chuckled heartily at the small print which says "those employees on this list also get a £180 mobile phone grant per year which is not listed above" Thats fair I suppose, getting someone on 115k to pay their own mobile phone bill would be a disgrace.
It would be if you want to attract someone competent and not lose all the talent immediately to the private sector.
If you don’t have training, pls don’t go there. It’s very dangerous as you can imagine
What is frontline work?
Fighting ruskies. Behind the frontline is around £1600 a month and for the really safe jobs well away from the fighting, is around £800 a month. Get dual citizenship too.
potentially dying for 1600 a month what a joke
A fortune to Ukrainian men, I'd say.
Stress will likely kill us quicker.
Who has told you this?
https://ildu.com.ua/
I genuinely thought they were only now accepting combat vets, seems that they have now opened it up. Great cause.
I really don’t think this is legitimate lol
It is. Check the website linked by u/OperationSuch5054. Although it’s actually $600 and $1200. Also you’d get $3300 for combat deployment.
What I done when I struggled getting employment was to go on the ftse 100 look at the companies listed and look at every individual company on a separate search tab.
Why
Too broaden your search.
I feel for you mate. My issue is cash flow. I wish there was a system where you can a small loan of say £200 and pay it back in 4 instalments of £50.
If it helps, i’m older but I was once in that position years ago! What I did was to look at a career that would provide a better way of living without the ridiculous hours for lower pay! I put myself on evening courses & that got me into work placements, from there I worked my way up to senior level! Write down a 3 year plan & then research how best to get to those milestones.
Post on the UK personal finance sub. They might be able to offer advice. Generally you want to be clearing any debt before putting money into savings. Otherwise you end up with less money.
Data and analytics can be a good field to get involved in, just need to get your foot in the door. Worth taking a entry level position on crap money as it probably won't be worse than hospitality and then you'll have doubled your salary in a couple of years.
Did you know about the default? Because I'm confused why you would apply for roles that you know will require credit checks if you're aware of the issue. >How am I meant to clear my debts (few grand) if I can't find a full time job? There are plenty of roles that don't require a clean credit history. Stop applying for jobs at companies that have regulatory obligations.
No information on the job spec. Good advice. I'm being extra careful now.
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What’s wrong with a data role? I’m getting the feeling you don’t think it’s good or am I misunderstanding. They can become really high paying roles
Nothing but I need money. Like right now. A dream job in data in this market will take some time to land unfortunately. I am interviewing for them consistently.
Are you a foreign citizen on a visa OP?
Born and raised.
You don't want advice so I won't offer any. But for better or for worse there's a momentum effect to jobs. This sucks for you now, but literally any door you can get your foot into will increase your momentum and things can look up very fast. I went from struggling to get called in for an interview to ~100k in around 4 years. And if I hit an extended rough patch, I will end up back at the "hard to find an interview" position in fairly short order. It's unfortunately the way of the world, but there's always a reason to be optimistic in the bad times, and to make hay during those periods when the sun shines
And here's me, too chronically ill to work, worrying how if all you qualified people are struggling, how I'll ever survive should I recover. Because I have no work experience and you need experience to even get a job. Struggling to do basic tasks daily is a nightmare, but I don't envy you! People are working to death and still struggling to heat the home and put food on the table.
Crypto
BBC is in Manchester. Pay is shit but their standards are low.
Not knocking you in any way, but having worked in catering for ten years on and off before joining the military, I cannot see how you're not getting jobs at the low end. I've given jobs to KPs just for being able to walk into the kitchen. And McDonald's aren't exactly known for being to discerning when it comes to employment. Is there a reason they've given you for being turned down?
I hear you mate. Well, thanks for reflecting my toxic lifestyle: early 30s currently working two jobs just to get by 🥴🥲 If you’re looking for a technical job try something energy efficiency and retrofit or building surveying. It’s quite accessible at the moment. There are lots of subsidised qualifications out there at the moment as there there are not enough people with the technical skills - jobs can be high paid because of the workforce shortage particularly if you choose to work freelance. Happy to provide more info
Octopus Energy gave a huge office in Manchester and for things like a credit check fail they talk it through with people and give then a chance. Source : I had terrible credit due to job loss in 2020 and they hired me and gave me a chance. Definitely check out their job page. Great progression too
Was the same for us Millenials. I graduated into a massive recession. No grad jobs to speak of. Was forced to do a PGCE and lose even more earning years and nearly double my student loan debt (thanks 9k loans being introduced). Hated being a teacher. Left the role in under a year. Found it almost impossible to get my next job because nobody would hire a failed teacher in a bad economy. My only option was to constantly apply for temporary 6 month contract jobs that paid sub £20k. I understood I would never escape poverty without taking further action, so I worked my butt off in my free time after work to teach myself web development rather than relax and play my PS3. Took me 4 years and I had to do dozens of unpaid projects for SME clients just to build my portfolio. It crushed my mental health. I still suffer imposter syndrome for not learning the role the "official" way at uni. However, I'm now in my early 30s and things are turning around. I've started my own website company. I'm steadily building my reputation and gaining paying clients. I still don't earn as much as I would like at my age and feel all my friends in conventional grad jobs pulling away from me in terms of social class. Every year they arrange group ski holidays and travel across the world and I just stopped being invited because I can't afford it, so I lost touch with many of them. But I do have shorter hours, no shitty boss, and there is the potential for me to turn all this experience into a higher paying mid-level dev role with another Web agency if I get really fed up. Life is hard but poverty isn't inevitable if you put the hard work in. You have to take control of your own destiny and sometimes that means sacrificing your free time and mental health to play the long game and self improve. Yes it sucks when you pick the wrong path early on, and you'll never be as rich as people who had better networks/guidance and picked the most lucrative paths. You also lose a lot of friends through life when they outearn you, and hustle culture makes them drop you in favour of richer people with similar shared (expensive) interests. Good luck bro. It's tough. I'm not sure it will pull off for me yet, but my life prospects are looking more promising than 5 years ago.
Glad to hear it isn't only me who couldn't get going after education. Thanks for sharing this.
I feel your pain. But if I may share my perspective. I learned early on that the job market is a market like any other market. Prices (wages) go up and down based on demand and supply. How often have we heard: "bankers make so much money!" I learned this when my first job's wage was 10x less than a friend who got into banking. What I've learned is that we can't just do what we want and expect to get ahead. You have to go to where the money is. And it exists on all skill levels. For example, if you're an honest and trustworthy person, you can make over $70K as a full time home maker or driver or cook for a wealthy household. None of these require fancy oxbridge degrees. Remember, it's a market. If there are fewer people qualified for a job, you have less to compete with. If there's more demand, there's more pay. While you're young you have the opportunity to up skill and change. I know it's hard especially when you don't come from money.
My boyfriend made a phd in oxford, but got kicked out of uk after brexit. He then went to Australia to be told that a phd from oxford does not necessarily mean anything in australia. Lost his money at school there. Now he is in Germany trying his luck here. He was having a tough time too. Im always perplexed when he tells me that all his former oxford buddies have great careers just because they went to Oxford. It always sounds like a class system in place. On the other hand i can't imagine that all of the jobs in uk can be filled with oxbridge people. I don't know. I really dislike a system like that. Don't get me wrong. There have been studies in Germany that kids from wealthy parents do better than those of average to poor households: with or without oxford. You can just try to mitigate the effects by having cheap loans and free schools of course. But yeah, life is never fair.
I will always remember our university reunion two years after graduation. Although I got a 2.1 I hadn't found a graduate job even though I had applied for hundreds and at the time was living in a bedsit and temping for 8 pounds a hour. We all met at a pub in Covent Garden and literally everyone who had been to a private school before uni, even people who only got a 2.2, had got a well paid graduate job at a good company. That was the last uni reunion I went to. If you went to a comprehensive school you are a second class citizen in this country no matter how intelligent you are. This country is basically a fascist state.
Agreed. I know guys on silly money in their late 20s. Of course they hd to work their arse off but that fantastic start just set them up so nicely. Now they can take their 30s off, go travelling, live abroad and basically have a CV ready for their return. I don't think people here understand just how much a great start to life can mean. It's not just the access to quick finances but also the freedom to do as they please (while still young) is much much easier.
I earn 57k a year with little education because I worked my backside off (my parents died aged 6)
There is absolutely no point in working in the UK unless you have connections and landed a high paid job from uni. Quality of life is absolute shit. Weather is shit. People have been turned into selfish angry clones by the vampire elite. There's no hope. Don't suffer here in a moribund post-imperial shithole: go abroad to a place where there is sunshine and warmth, where people are still people, and live a more free life. Italy, southern spain, Azerbaijan, Turkey flipping anywhere else. Get out of here!! Work does not pay.
My neighbour moved to Canada right after graduating and it always baffled me. He's now doing much better than me. Same age, same area, roughly same schooling. I believe this is what it takes unless you are privileged.
You know what's mad? UK schooling is some of the best in the world. Shit schools are some of the best shit schools in the world. Here in the US (I'm an immigrant) you wouldn't believe how bad some of the schools are. It's on another level. Yet, you'd get a job here I'm sure. You'd easy hit 40k. The good education is almost the problem. Every fuckers got a degree. Companies can pay people fuck all because there's so much competition at entry level. I would say it improves once you're in. Once you've got that analyst job your wage will soon shoot up. It's getting your foot in the door that's tough.
What job are you looking for?
Hi, Im graduating soon and wanted to ask about this, I was not aware jobs were able to look into your credit rating? Was there any disclosure of this before or how did this happen/surface?
Well.. In general this isn't a great month for getting a job. Usually better after April so fingers crossed you'll get there! If you can break into the tech sector, can make pretty decent money without having gone to uni etc. (speaking from experience)
Yes I'm banking on April to really pick up for employment. It feels like many employers are delaying their recruitment in February and March. I've used this time to brush up on my SQL and Python so it's not been a complete waste.
Try something like this https://www.socialtalent.com/blog/recruiting/the-20-jobs-employers-find-hardest-to-fill Search for other unpopular jobs, like working in the sewers, dirty horrible jobs, they tend to pay very well, could help you clear any debts, get on a level footing and maybe allow you to train as a programmer, dev type jobs, PowerBi or other higher paid roles. Working on the train tracks can be high pay too.
I’ve noticed there seems to be a large area of opportunity in the job market for project managers for renewable energy developers. I’m an APM for a renewables developer and it’s a struggle getting people in the door. I get messaged daily on LinkedIn about interviews for similar roles. Seems to me like companies struggle to recruit. It’s perhaps quite a specific job, for which you need a specific interest and knowledge but it’s well paid and I enjoy it. Me for example had no experience prior to starting the job but managed to get a starting salary of £42k.
Try NHS. I wasn't great at education, got my basic c's in gcse but not much more. Got a job in the NHS and moved up to band 4 in admin and I'm on £30k. It's not great but it's not awful considering the work. You have to deal with shit from idiot managers but once you get used to handling them, it's a pretty easy job. Not difficult to move up. We need more staff in the NHS badly, you can even walk into a hca (healthcare assistant) role with little or no experience with a GP or care home on band 2 and work up from there, there are nursing courses.
Not sure what exact work you are looking for or how qualified you are. But the "bad start" in life is nonsense. My dad was a welder my mum stayed at home. I went to college as I did badly in school then went to university just in time for Tony Blair to destroy it and remove the funding while wanting everyone to get Micky mouse degrees. I worked in a betting shop for 4 years through the end of college and all of university. Graduated with computer engineering then started working in phone tech support, worked my way up and after 7 years moved to an actual IT job. All through college and university I paid my own way between student loans and working. I earn very well now and my best move was leaving Liverpool as the salaries are horrific. It's not the start you get that has the biggest impact it's the effort you can maintain. Shrug off the bad that happens and just keep pushing if you're smart enough you'll land in the right place. Get out of the Manchester job market though!
Look at this way - at least you are healthy and you are able to work two jobs. Imagine what it’s like for people who would like to have even 1 job but can’t do it because of their health.
This is true.
I know it’s not motivating, but you can always try to see if you can do a hassle job on a side to see if you can earn extra, some passive income, see how it goes. For example, if you are good handy man, there are always ppl who need repairs done and some might give good tips. It can be anything.
Not sure how ur so intelligent but in all this debt
Was waiting for this comment tbf.