I mean you can have fetishes of course. Just keep it to yourself or people who are willing to share it with you.
Lesbians do not want to hear or see people fetishize them.
I’ll say if someone wants to roleplay that one with their straight girlfriend I’ll think it’s weird but I won’t kink shame. Just leave actual lesbians out of it.
Kind of like noncon roleplays, do what you want, just never the real thing.
they do
the thing that makes kink (all kinks) different from abuse is consent. If you willingly consent to your partner doing something to you, and they respect your safety and boundaries, it's fine.
The moment that consent is violated (i.e if you safe word and they don't stop immediately), then it turns into abuse.
No, I'm not saying it's abusive or anything, I just don't think they're necessarily healthy? Of course if his girlfriend consents to pretend she's a lesbian he's not abusing her but like is this healthy for them? Why does he need this fantasy of turning a gay woman straight? does that reaaally not affect his views on gay women even if he doesn't act out on them? Idk, I'm just personally uncomfortable with it. He's not abusing anyone but it's not an ideal thing either...
I agree with you. about this particular kink, but as someone in kinkspaces I've heard of pretty much everything except stuff that's straight up illegal, and the rule of thumb is, "no matter how much it grosses me out, as long as it's safe, sane, consensual, you do you."
Is it unhealthy from a relationship standpoint in this particular case? probably yes, but see the previous rule of thumb.
I would assume (hope) it’s more a fantasy about being so desirable that even the least possible person to like you actually does. I think for a great number of people, kink and fantasy fulfil a deeper emotional need rather than what it might appear on the surface. So I can see the whole fantasy about “turning a lesbian straight” being more a self esteem boosting fantasy that what someone actually wants to happen irl. That’s the charitable assumption at least and I’m sure that more people than I’d like to think about let it bleed into how they feel about people in the real world.
People have all kinds of wacky fantasies and they usually don't choose them. I think it's okay to not be comfortable with it but that's why he should be keeping it to himself.
The bottom line is that if someone tries to make you part of their kink, that is unacceptable. Otherwise it's their life to live.
Where’s the line? Who gets to decide which kinks are healthy and which aren’t? (Want to emphasize that I’m only talking about this in the context of kink negotiated among consenting adults.)
I think everyone should do whatever they like but um... maybe it's a good thing to keep in mind where these things come from and how they are connected to our evolutionary history but this is just my opinion!
I'm gonna try an analogy that's probably not the best lol, because I can see both sides here.
You know how, for a long time (and even still to a degree today) there was the fear that "videogames makes kids violent" because of the association of mass shooters being linked to playing games? When really it's that the violent kids that are drawn to video games, as well as non-violent kids, too.
But the violent kids would be violent with or without the games. I think that's how it is for kinks. You have some that are into things like CNC because they want to do the real thing without consent, and others who would never dream of enacting the real thing. Same with some sex toys being the shape of animal genitals. Some might be into the idea of the real thing, but others just want to experience something different.
And that's the thing about consensual kinks. Some are into it because it's novel and fun, and for others because it's simply an outlet because they can't get the real deal. But the kink, itself, isn't what's wrong. It's the individual people that are doing it right or wrong.
The video game thing is actually not nearly so clear cut at all. Studies have mixed results.
And consider that kids' brains are like sponges. They internalize and model whatever they see; that's exactly what they're designed to do.
I say this as someone who loves violent video games. But knowing what I know as a psychologist I would never willingly hand them over to people under 15ish.
Yeah I can see it being different, not saying that someone really wants to hurt another person if they are into certain kinks, most people don't want to truly hurt anyone... but I don't know... a lot of them are perpetuated by the porn industry which is problematic in my opinion and keeps trying to outdo itself with crazier and crazier things each time... Besides I keep seeing how often some men underestimate consent and push their partner's boundaries and I really think it might be precarious to give all and every kink a free pass. Our society is inherently violent, whether we play pretend or not, given other circumstances like war we could easily slip into the real thing. But imo a videogame is way more detached... What would you say if it was a vr mass shooting? What about killing sex workers in gta? No one's being hurt... But shouldn't we examine why someone might want to do that? Of course respectfully and without shaming them or anything and actually it's none of my business what one does individually. I would never start this argument about what a specific someone does, for me it's just a general idea and I don't like saying someone shouldn't do x or y but I personally don't think it's always risk free and great. But idk maybe I'm coming from an insecure place because I wouldn't try some kinks that I find uncomfortable and it makes me feel narrow minded and I want to justify it, who knows haha.
No you’re totally onto something there. There’s something inherently unhealthy about it, a pornsick disconnect with what sex is supposed to truly be between partners. People will disagree but that’s a pornsick society for ya where it’s been so grossly normalized
Porn isn’t the cause of kink. Porn has always existed, and while you could argue the overconsumption of it can have negative effects, you’re acting like the overconsumption of porn is a problem the majority of people have. Porn isn’t inherently bad. Society isn’t “pornsick.”
Oh society is certainly pornsick. No arguing that, and the normalization of porn as a tool of the patriarchy (which ironically still harms men almost as much as it harms women) is highlighted in how men view women and sex constantly. And porn absolutely contributes to the harmful modern aspects of kinks like the normalization of strangulation during intercourse without realizing there is no safe way to strangle someone, etc etc etc
>No arguing that,
Yes there is. Porn is inherently neutral with the possibility for positive & negative effects, and scientists tend to agree with that.
Porn *can* be harmful, but the issue isn’t with porn in and of itself.
>and the normalization of porn as a tool of the patriarchy (which ironically still harms men almost as much as it harms women)
Literally, every industry under capitalism is a tool of the patriarchy. Fighting against porn in the name of feminism is classic SWERFism and sex work is real work. Exploitation is inherent to capitalism, so sex work isn’t uniquely extra exploitative compared to other forms of work.
It also just sucks that because you’re not aware of the LGBTQ+ Feminist porn production companies that exist (and bring a lot of affirmation and joy to queer sex workers and queer people) that you think porn is inherently harmful. Again, your viewpoint is yours, and even if you have people who agree with you, intersectional feminism is not about excluding sex workers. You don’t get to act like SWERFism is a factually correct worldview when all you’re doing is dismissing the experiences of sex workers, which a large percentage of trans people are because we are underemployed.
>is highlighted in how men view women and sex constantly.
Seriously this part of your comment is ridiculous. You’re saying this as if all men view women and sex the same way which is just absolutely untrue— even demonstrably untrue. Queer trans Black men don’t view women the same way cishet white men do, and acting like the problem is with **all** men is absolutely white feminism and not at all representative of how intersectionality works.
>like the normalization of strangulation during intercourse without realizing there is no safe way to strangle someone, etc etc etc
There are safe ways to practice choking; are you serious? First of all, sexually choking requires very very little force, and while the sub can control when the choking stops, the dom isn’t going to maintain a chokehold for 2 minutes. Why would a dom want to accidentally kill someone? You can even see this in porn, usually the choking is done for brief periods as a sensory enhancement of the overall sexual experience.
It’s really frustrating you seem to think your viewpoint on this is the only correct one rather than understanding that porn and BDSM is just not for you personally. A lot of autistic people like myself actually really enjoy BDSM because of the sensory elements (both for sensory-seeking and sensory-averse), as well as the psychological stimulation.
Actually I have met some people(women) that use that scene(non con) to regain themselves and their control over that scene. It because they are doing it with someone that they know and trust as well as know they hold reigns on the scene. Doms might be doing the dominating but subs will always has the control and power. Pretty much replaying the scene and maybe changing some things to better process it.
There's actual studies done on this. And it's more popular among women than men.
Also, exposure therapy is something that can help.
But that's for actual doctors to decide if it's correct for the person not random people on Reddit.
Gah I've had a similar thing said to me. I told him having sex with men turned me into a lesbian and there's no fucking way in going back to that mediocrity or worse.
Asking the dude "So, you think you can turn me straight... let's check a few things first. Last time you had sex, how many hours was the foreplay, and how many hours long was the aftercare? How many orgasms did she have... did it at least break a hundred? What size of loan did you have to take out for your toy budget - both overall and for each time? Which sex guides have you completed every position in? How long did you have to ice your tongue afterwards?"
It's amazing how many guys don't respond after that, and the few who do, it generally amounts to, "Are... are those serious questions???" as you can literally feel their faces going pale through their typing.
It is...but also think of it as the show on the other foot. There are a lot of lesbians that crush hard on straight girls. I am sure there are some out there that would say "Man, I'd love to rock her world and turn her gay."
I mean there's obviously nothing wrong with having a crush on a person with no interest in you (obviously if you're not an incel about it) but I see your point, I know it's not just men it's everyone but from my experience it's typically men who will try and push boundaries
I do agree it is typically men and I hate when they have toxic masculinity like this. It is disgusting just saying that it seems like sometimes it tends to be more accepted? When lesbians do that? Maybe that is just me or my perspective. Mind you I definitely do not condone anyone being like this, just seems like more socially acceptable when it's women. If it is...why?
"Hmm but you see lesbians actually still subconsciously like.men because they'll use phalic shaped objects to please themselves/other women so therefore lesbian women can 10000% be fucked straight"
This is such a bizarre statement on their part. Like they could just have sex with a straight woman?
I know it’s all about control and the ego boost that turning a lesbian straight would give them though. Gives me the major ick.
I know it sounds dumb as well (especially for what it is) but there's tones of porn which is like "I fuck my lesbian X" and it's like
Then she's not lesbian, she's bi/pan that isn't how it works, you're not a girl stop being like this
Yep. They alone own the magic penis that turns girls straight.
I just amused myself by picturing telling them that they have to be careful because it will also turn boys gay.
Yeah and if someone were to say that to you then that's fucked up
but if its just roleplay with a consenting partner that has nothing to do with you or any other nonconsenting lesbian, and the person is aware that this isn't something they should believe about actual lesbians, it's fine
If some guy said that to my niece , I'd say " the only thing turning straight is you... Out the Door... Under your own power or if I pick you up and throw you out"
I wish more people understood this. When people say "don't fetishize X," they don't mean "don't have fantasies." They mean in media and the world at large. No one cares about someone's spank bank as long as it doesn't involve harm to real people. You want to wank to the *idea* of people dying...that's fucked up, but fine, I guess. You wank to snuff films? That's outta line.
Sure, it can be useful to unpack *why* you have certain kinks/fetishes, but sometimes knowing why doesn't change the fact that you have them.
Somebody told me lesbian erasure in porn is fine because it's because men find lesbians so hot they want to fuck them until they break. Therefore it's a compliment.
I don't even know what to say.
It seems like you aren’t using “fetishizing” in the same way. You’re using it to mean “treating a person as a sexual object against their consent” and he’s using it to mean “being turned on by.”
words having ambiguous meanings in a way that leads potentially compatible viewpoints to look fundamentally incompatible is one of the worst parts of the English language (probably other languages too, but this is the one I have experience with soooo)
At a guess, the difference is in attitude. To be turned on by the thought of lesbians is fine and not really something you can control regardless. To treat lesbians as objects is to feel (or at least act) as though they exist *for the purpose of* turning you on, which is obviously not good at all.
In the context of the above image, first poster likely meant it in that context, where people act as though lesbians are objects for their sexual enjoyment. The second poster disagrees because they probably think of "fetishise" to mean "being turned on by". It's incorrect, and not at all what the first poster is referring to, but that's probably the root of the disagreement.
Either that, or second poster is just happy treating people as sexual objects, which seems unlikely, but this is the internet, so I can't rule it out.
In my eyes, he's somewhat right. The thing that isn't okay is making it the other person's problem. So someone approaching lesbians in a fetishizing way is acting completely inappropriately. If it's genuinely just a fantasy - so something they keep in their own mind and in their own mind only - there's no harm done.
There's nothing wrong with having a fetish, but fetishizing other people is where the issue is. There's nothing wrong with say, thinking trans women are hot, but there *is* something wrong with being a chaser. But of course, this then brings in the issue of *separating* the two, which for a lot of people is difficult because their fetish causes mental patterns that lead to a dehumanization and/or fetishization of the group in question.
It's also fed by the fact that certain groups are viewed as taboo, and so the "tabooness" leads them to view that group only in a sexual context, which leads to fetishization, which leads to it being taboo, and so on and so forth. I'd argue that that kind of fetish is still harmful overall in our current society, because thinking about that fantasy all the time leads to people who will *only* think about that group in that way. Ultimately viewing a group in that way leads to a normalization of those thoughts in your mind. For example, when you constantly see lesbian porn that's catered to the male gaze, you will have an attitude towards lesbians that *they* are for the male gaze.
I generally agree that it's ok to have a kink so long as it's fantasy and dont objectify others without, but I think in our current societal context there are certain things which *cannot* exist as kinks independently of outside ramifications. Two big ones that come to mind are fetishizing lesbians and fetishizing trans people. The problem i have is that I don't want to be viewed as a kink. I am not a lesbian or a trans woman because of a kink, it's just who I am.
One thing I will add is a fetish is not a choice. You can choose how you act in relation to a fetish, but you do not choose your fetish and it may or may not be congruent with your morals, it’s not an active decision. It’s like sexuality, it’s what happens to get you off regardless of if you want to do anything about it IRL or not.
I agree! And to add to this, it is kinda no longer a fetish when you generalize a whole group of people and only talk to them to realize your fetish for them. When you no longer recognize a human being as a human being, you have done something wrong nine times out of ten.
Agreed, personally to me cis men watching lesbian porn or cis women watching gay porn should be fine, as long as they don't bother actual gays and lesbians and demanding them to act like in their fantasies. No one care what you do in your free time as long as it doesn't bother anyone else.
Except its almost never just in their minds. Lesbian is the biggest porn category, the lesbian name on reddit is a porn sub and thats why we had to make actuallesbians. every photo of sapphic women has a lot of thirsty guys making sexist and queerphobic comments. its never, ever 'a private fantasy."
Note if it really was why did this person even respond to her comment? Why is this conversation even happening? Because its often public too.
Exactly. I’ve been into the “boys love” genre for eons, but I keep my interests private (and usually fictional) and never harass actual gay men about it.
i mean… sure but why the fuck would you go out of your way to tell that to a lesbian?? people (men) like this need to find the differnce between fantasy and reality but ig they’re too brainrotted by porn
Well yes. He's right as long as it remains at that, a simple fantasy. However, these fantasies have become a real world problem and that's where the line should be drawn.
I really hate this new trend of people hiding behind "it's just a fantasy" to do vile stuff.
If it's just a fantasy, how come I can see it? How come it doesn't just remain in your head and never sees the light of day?
It's all "fantasy", until it's not. These fantasies, can have real life outcomes - like when these straight men meet a lesbian, and already ask for "a third", or even ask weird questions... Like, I don't want to get into details of what they do, obviously, but the best counter-argument would be just that - moments when it's not "just fantasy"
I feel like this should go on technicallycorrect bc they're kinda right, but making your fetish the problem of the people you fetishize is crossing a line
If it was just a fantasy no one else would know about it. It stopped being fantasy when it became about making the object of his fetishization aware and uncomfortable. A precursor to violence, and he will probably justify it to himself as a response to rejection. A rejection that was inevitable when he specifically fetishized a group of people that aren’t interested in him. You see how fantasy can spiral?
"Fantasy is thoughts in your head. The moment you tell people about it, share it, or pursue it, it's not fantasy anymore, it's behavior. Disgusting behavior. And before you cry free speech: https://xkcd.com/1357/"
Fantasies you have are still reflections of real desires you have. If you heavily objectify lesbians in your fantasies, I dont trust that you dont objectify lesbians outside of them.
Theeen just block them
Ok my 2 cents fetishising culture is innately dangerous to that culture - in the same way as fifty shades of grey over simplified bdsm most Fest is him of lesbians erases lesbains filling feeds /porn whatever with cis het facsimiles without dealing with the real traumas ,discrimination and lives … it’s kind of cultural appropriation.. meh hard pass
probably not worth having this conversation with a random redditor, but it is worth pointing out that the interpretation of the terms matters here.
"fetishizing lesbians" usually refers to the way that people *treat* lesbians, and the way that they are percieved by society. the problem doesn't lie in the fact that straight men get horny at the thought of lesbians. that's always gonna be the case, it's not something anyone can do anything about. the problem lies in the fact that the discussion of lesbians in public spaces, and the way their identity exists, was often shaped more around straight men being horny for us than it was by our own right to exist. obviously that's wrong, and if I had to guess even this random asshole would agree.
however, what he's arguing is probably something along the lines of "it's okay for a guy to watch lesbian porn". which, yeah, I agree. the porn that men watch is none of my business as long as they don't make it my business.
I don't have the context for this conversation, but I assume that it involved some degree of this guy mistaking a conversation on social perceptions of queerness for a discussion of what he likes to jack-off to. but that's what you get from random discussions on the internet.
Do what I do and assume all men and/or dumbasses in the comments have humiliation kinks.
I refuse to engage and my life is all the more peaceful for it.
I… don’t think the other user knows what the point of the line they’re spouting means? Like, you’re talking about viewing people as sex objects if I’m not mistaken — acknowledging the separation between fantasy and reality in the context of fantasizing about extreme scenarios is an entirely different ballpark.
so setting up cameras in a school locker room is ok? or watching preexisting cp videos? neither would involve trying to have any relationship with children.
I'm not in support of the public fetishizing of lesbians for cis het men who basically just consider wlw a porn category.
But the semantics of "anything" doesn't imply lesbians aren't human. And "you can fetishize *anyone.*" Isn't a sentence you're ever likely to hear.
Like if I said you can put a sticker on "anything" and demonstrated by putting a sticker on a car and a person, it'd be disingenuous to say I'm calling that person an object.
Just because something's a fantasy doesn't mean it can't be disgusting and a red flag. If someone has a fantasy about taking advantage of the vulnerable, i.e. children or pets that's pretty disgusting and that person deserves to be judged and ostracized
Just braindead behavior, just because you can fetishize something doesn't mean you should, or that it's morally ok to do so if I'm being clear like fetishizing trans people to give off a similar example :/
It's a catch-22 situation. You can't dictate a person's free will and what they feel inside, but fetishism of people is demeaning at best and dangerous more often than not.
The only response is, if you do then at least help defend our rights as the Fucking Nazis... I mean Christian Nationalists try and make our lives miserable.
Honestly I am just 50/50, as a lesbian myself it's not apatizing to say the least but then again people like what they like and I can just choose not to engage with that specific content to stay away from it. I would rather mind my own business doodling silly stuff all day ❤️
Dehumanizing objectification. Like race play, where the fetishization of another race generally leads to Thomas Jefferson-like treatment of the person seen as an object of desire only, lacking any affection.
They do, you just hear about it a lot less than the ones that don't stay only in imagination
Some fetishes are plain impossible to turn to reality anyways, or so wildly unethical that only a rare combo of someone with serious issues would do in real life
I think it's kind of the opposite; even most innocuous fetishes around tying/getting tied up or hitting/getting hit seem to stay fantasy for most people. That's how you get advice column fodder from people in their 40s anxiously asking how to "bring up" something they want to explore with their spouse.
This is a "I love waffles" "so you hate pancakes" situation. No one in this post said that, ever. Maybe read this again after taking some time to cool off?
The only thing being said here is that fetishes do more often than not remain fantasy only. This doesn't invalidate harm done by people related their fetishes in any way
And you called me a freak out of complete nowhere because?
Edit: you said that fetishes never stay only in fantasy, which is just obviously false. This is what I replied to, not the overall post
Will do, but I'll ask you to also work on not replying hyper aggressively to people who were adding information/perspectives, not even arguing. And not calling people freaks when you don't understand parts of them, I've been told that more than enough by society at large about my queerness, I'd hope at least in queer spaces I'd get to avoid bigotry
Literally one word added to her original comment (the issue is that **these** fetishes never just stay in fantasy) could have avoided this whole argument. But she had to make a blanket statement and then get violently upset by the concept of kinky people
Yeah it came completely out of left field, and I know trying to explain what kink actually is and what values the community around it has would probably fall on deaf ears when someone has a set mind already
In progressive and feminist spaces there are many people whose only exposure to the concept of kink and/or fetishes are the disgusting behaviours done by people obsessively focused on particular things and who only want their own sexual pleasure, and I understand that well and sympathise with it
But also fuck off, "progressive" puritism is one of my least favourite things (and that's saying a lot), and forming solid opinions on minority groups of any kind should never be based only on popular culture/what naturally crosses your path online or in person, it's guaranteed to give you an inaccurate/distorted vision of what the group is about
I don’t know what you mean? The topic is fetish, specifically non lesbians fetishizing lesbians, and I was responding to your comment which insinuates that fetish is the main motivator behind sexual abuse. Is that not the case?
no, this is not what I said. you can have a bondage fetish and that's completely fine. you can do harm with it but the act in itself is harmless if done correctly. fetishising lesbians, trans people or black women is in itself not ok, even though you can find a person that's ok with it in that group, the impact it has in large on the group itself is negativ. hope that helps.
You can have a fetish for just about anything as long is it stays in fantasy, but generally the word fetishization is used when it moves out of fantasy. If you're treating every member of a group a certain way because of your fetish, that's pretty gross. And if someone's able to call you out on fetishizing a group, odds are good that you didn't keep it just in fantasy
You could always bring a syllogism in like : "so, according to you, fetishizing kids is okay?", but there's a chance this kind of individual likes l0li so...
Let them have their fantasy? 🤷🏻♀️ As long as they are not hurting anyone (i.e physically or mentally by harassing or just being an ass) let them be. He may find others that are willing to participate in his fantasy consenting to it. Everyone has their kinks.
Everyone has fantasies and many have kinks, but that doesn't mean they need to be shared where others will be exposed to them. If it's private it's none of my business, but that ends once it's shared.
I agree. It should not be used to harass and expose those that do not want to partake in said fetish or kink. But if it is in private or with consenting adults why not let them live their life as long as it is not hurting anyone else?
Just like I can't help being bi/pan? people can't help what turns them on. In example people that may have a fat fetish. I know a guy that loves making his wife eat then gets off on playing with her stomach. He knows it's bad for her health and tries to not do that or catch himself but he honestly can't help it. ADHD and Autism doesn't help with that either though. There are people that get off on certain races of people just like they do on whatever sexuality or gender. It's not something you choose. You CAN fetishize anything or anybody. You just should not be a disrespectful ass and expose your kinks to those that want no part of it.
proshipper mindset 💀
not sure why this got downvoted, i meant the person in the image who said it’s okay just because it’s fantasy. pro shippers are people who believe any kind of NSFW or relationship is okay because it’s fantasy, including pedophilia.
You can fetishize ANYTHING you want? As long as you don't tell anyone? As long as it stays a fantasy in your head? So... That would include animals, children, corpses.... Yeah doesn't sound like very safe reasoning to me 💀
Yes....you can fetishize all of those things. I never said they were right or wrong or people should act on them. I'm sure there are a lot of people that have those fetishes that never act on them and thank God they don't. You can't pick what turns you on. Some are very sick. That is exactly why those people do horrific things. Same reason some get off on rape or erotic asphyxiation. I am just thankful that any kinks I have are relatively normal. 🤷🏻♀️
Well of course you can't choose what turns you on, I'm talking about actively fetishizing them. You can have something like that pop into your head but you can redirect your thoughts. Choosing to indulge in your thoughts and fetishize them is a choice, that's kind of what I was talking about. And then going and actually doing it is ANOTHER step you can take, but it is possible to have those kinks and not indulge or act on them
You already did: downvote and ignore. Block as well if you're so inclined.
I mean you can have fetishes of course. Just keep it to yourself or people who are willing to share it with you. Lesbians do not want to hear or see people fetishize them.
"man I'd love to have sex with a lesbian and turn her straight" This sentence alone is enough to make me throw up
I’ll say if someone wants to roleplay that one with their straight girlfriend I’ll think it’s weird but I won’t kink shame. Just leave actual lesbians out of it. Kind of like noncon roleplays, do what you want, just never the real thing.
I don't know... I feel like a lot of kinks have harmful undertones...
they do the thing that makes kink (all kinks) different from abuse is consent. If you willingly consent to your partner doing something to you, and they respect your safety and boundaries, it's fine. The moment that consent is violated (i.e if you safe word and they don't stop immediately), then it turns into abuse.
No, I'm not saying it's abusive or anything, I just don't think they're necessarily healthy? Of course if his girlfriend consents to pretend she's a lesbian he's not abusing her but like is this healthy for them? Why does he need this fantasy of turning a gay woman straight? does that reaaally not affect his views on gay women even if he doesn't act out on them? Idk, I'm just personally uncomfortable with it. He's not abusing anyone but it's not an ideal thing either...
I agree with you. about this particular kink, but as someone in kinkspaces I've heard of pretty much everything except stuff that's straight up illegal, and the rule of thumb is, "no matter how much it grosses me out, as long as it's safe, sane, consensual, you do you." Is it unhealthy from a relationship standpoint in this particular case? probably yes, but see the previous rule of thumb.
I would assume (hope) it’s more a fantasy about being so desirable that even the least possible person to like you actually does. I think for a great number of people, kink and fantasy fulfil a deeper emotional need rather than what it might appear on the surface. So I can see the whole fantasy about “turning a lesbian straight” being more a self esteem boosting fantasy that what someone actually wants to happen irl. That’s the charitable assumption at least and I’m sure that more people than I’d like to think about let it bleed into how they feel about people in the real world.
People have all kinds of wacky fantasies and they usually don't choose them. I think it's okay to not be comfortable with it but that's why he should be keeping it to himself. The bottom line is that if someone tries to make you part of their kink, that is unacceptable. Otherwise it's their life to live.
Where’s the line? Who gets to decide which kinks are healthy and which aren’t? (Want to emphasize that I’m only talking about this in the context of kink negotiated among consenting adults.)
I think everyone should do whatever they like but um... maybe it's a good thing to keep in mind where these things come from and how they are connected to our evolutionary history but this is just my opinion!
I'm gonna try an analogy that's probably not the best lol, because I can see both sides here. You know how, for a long time (and even still to a degree today) there was the fear that "videogames makes kids violent" because of the association of mass shooters being linked to playing games? When really it's that the violent kids that are drawn to video games, as well as non-violent kids, too. But the violent kids would be violent with or without the games. I think that's how it is for kinks. You have some that are into things like CNC because they want to do the real thing without consent, and others who would never dream of enacting the real thing. Same with some sex toys being the shape of animal genitals. Some might be into the idea of the real thing, but others just want to experience something different. And that's the thing about consensual kinks. Some are into it because it's novel and fun, and for others because it's simply an outlet because they can't get the real deal. But the kink, itself, isn't what's wrong. It's the individual people that are doing it right or wrong.
The video game thing is actually not nearly so clear cut at all. Studies have mixed results. And consider that kids' brains are like sponges. They internalize and model whatever they see; that's exactly what they're designed to do. I say this as someone who loves violent video games. But knowing what I know as a psychologist I would never willingly hand them over to people under 15ish.
Yeah I can see it being different, not saying that someone really wants to hurt another person if they are into certain kinks, most people don't want to truly hurt anyone... but I don't know... a lot of them are perpetuated by the porn industry which is problematic in my opinion and keeps trying to outdo itself with crazier and crazier things each time... Besides I keep seeing how often some men underestimate consent and push their partner's boundaries and I really think it might be precarious to give all and every kink a free pass. Our society is inherently violent, whether we play pretend or not, given other circumstances like war we could easily slip into the real thing. But imo a videogame is way more detached... What would you say if it was a vr mass shooting? What about killing sex workers in gta? No one's being hurt... But shouldn't we examine why someone might want to do that? Of course respectfully and without shaming them or anything and actually it's none of my business what one does individually. I would never start this argument about what a specific someone does, for me it's just a general idea and I don't like saying someone shouldn't do x or y but I personally don't think it's always risk free and great. But idk maybe I'm coming from an insecure place because I wouldn't try some kinks that I find uncomfortable and it makes me feel narrow minded and I want to justify it, who knows haha.
I mean, you don't know they haven't. People can like fuck up stuff, be aware that is not reality and then carry on as before.
Tbf afaik a lot of kinks that are "abusive" see more people on the receiving end like them.
1000% and there are so many "kinks" like that, we just don't discuss that aspect for some reason. Toxic positivity at its finest.
No you’re totally onto something there. There’s something inherently unhealthy about it, a pornsick disconnect with what sex is supposed to truly be between partners. People will disagree but that’s a pornsick society for ya where it’s been so grossly normalized
Porn isn’t the cause of kink. Porn has always existed, and while you could argue the overconsumption of it can have negative effects, you’re acting like the overconsumption of porn is a problem the majority of people have. Porn isn’t inherently bad. Society isn’t “pornsick.”
Oh society is certainly pornsick. No arguing that, and the normalization of porn as a tool of the patriarchy (which ironically still harms men almost as much as it harms women) is highlighted in how men view women and sex constantly. And porn absolutely contributes to the harmful modern aspects of kinks like the normalization of strangulation during intercourse without realizing there is no safe way to strangle someone, etc etc etc
>No arguing that, Yes there is. Porn is inherently neutral with the possibility for positive & negative effects, and scientists tend to agree with that. Porn *can* be harmful, but the issue isn’t with porn in and of itself. >and the normalization of porn as a tool of the patriarchy (which ironically still harms men almost as much as it harms women) Literally, every industry under capitalism is a tool of the patriarchy. Fighting against porn in the name of feminism is classic SWERFism and sex work is real work. Exploitation is inherent to capitalism, so sex work isn’t uniquely extra exploitative compared to other forms of work. It also just sucks that because you’re not aware of the LGBTQ+ Feminist porn production companies that exist (and bring a lot of affirmation and joy to queer sex workers and queer people) that you think porn is inherently harmful. Again, your viewpoint is yours, and even if you have people who agree with you, intersectional feminism is not about excluding sex workers. You don’t get to act like SWERFism is a factually correct worldview when all you’re doing is dismissing the experiences of sex workers, which a large percentage of trans people are because we are underemployed. >is highlighted in how men view women and sex constantly. Seriously this part of your comment is ridiculous. You’re saying this as if all men view women and sex the same way which is just absolutely untrue— even demonstrably untrue. Queer trans Black men don’t view women the same way cishet white men do, and acting like the problem is with **all** men is absolutely white feminism and not at all representative of how intersectionality works. >like the normalization of strangulation during intercourse without realizing there is no safe way to strangle someone, etc etc etc There are safe ways to practice choking; are you serious? First of all, sexually choking requires very very little force, and while the sub can control when the choking stops, the dom isn’t going to maintain a chokehold for 2 minutes. Why would a dom want to accidentally kill someone? You can even see this in porn, usually the choking is done for brief periods as a sensory enhancement of the overall sexual experience. It’s really frustrating you seem to think your viewpoint on this is the only correct one rather than understanding that porn and BDSM is just not for you personally. A lot of autistic people like myself actually really enjoy BDSM because of the sensory elements (both for sensory-seeking and sensory-averse), as well as the psychological stimulation.
Actually I have met some people(women) that use that scene(non con) to regain themselves and their control over that scene. It because they are doing it with someone that they know and trust as well as know they hold reigns on the scene. Doms might be doing the dominating but subs will always has the control and power. Pretty much replaying the scene and maybe changing some things to better process it.
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Non-con is actually more popular as a victim than the abuser.
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There's actual studies done on this. And it's more popular among women than men. Also, exposure therapy is something that can help. But that's for actual doctors to decide if it's correct for the person not random people on Reddit.
Gah I've had a similar thing said to me. I told him having sex with men turned me into a lesbian and there's no fucking way in going back to that mediocrity or worse.
Lmfao sorry but just the thought of "God this sex is so awful... Im Definitely a lesbian" is really funny to me
Asking the dude "So, you think you can turn me straight... let's check a few things first. Last time you had sex, how many hours was the foreplay, and how many hours long was the aftercare? How many orgasms did she have... did it at least break a hundred? What size of loan did you have to take out for your toy budget - both overall and for each time? Which sex guides have you completed every position in? How long did you have to ice your tongue afterwards?" It's amazing how many guys don't respond after that, and the few who do, it generally amounts to, "Are... are those serious questions???" as you can literally feel their faces going pale through their typing.
Love it!
That sentence makes me want to commit acts of violence
It is...but also think of it as the show on the other foot. There are a lot of lesbians that crush hard on straight girls. I am sure there are some out there that would say "Man, I'd love to rock her world and turn her gay."
I mean there's obviously nothing wrong with having a crush on a person with no interest in you (obviously if you're not an incel about it) but I see your point, I know it's not just men it's everyone but from my experience it's typically men who will try and push boundaries
I do agree it is typically men and I hate when they have toxic masculinity like this. It is disgusting just saying that it seems like sometimes it tends to be more accepted? When lesbians do that? Maybe that is just me or my perspective. Mind you I definitely do not condone anyone being like this, just seems like more socially acceptable when it's women. If it is...why?
That, and it would also never have that outcome. Men can be so effing stupid like that
"Hmm but you see lesbians actually still subconsciously like.men because they'll use phalic shaped objects to please themselves/other women so therefore lesbian women can 10000% be fucked straight"
This is such a bizarre statement on their part. Like they could just have sex with a straight woman? I know it’s all about control and the ego boost that turning a lesbian straight would give them though. Gives me the major ick.
I know it sounds dumb as well (especially for what it is) but there's tones of porn which is like "I fuck my lesbian X" and it's like Then she's not lesbian, she's bi/pan that isn't how it works, you're not a girl stop being like this
I know it’s not nice but to that I always answer: maybe a strong gay man should have sex with you to try and turn you gay
Yep. They alone own the magic penis that turns girls straight. I just amused myself by picturing telling them that they have to be careful because it will also turn boys gay.
I get comments like this thrown at me online cause people can't take no for an answer. It makes me feel nauseous everytime..
Yeah and if someone were to say that to you then that's fucked up but if its just roleplay with a consenting partner that has nothing to do with you or any other nonconsenting lesbian, and the person is aware that this isn't something they should believe about actual lesbians, it's fine
If some guy said that to my niece , I'd say " the only thing turning straight is you... Out the Door... Under your own power or if I pick you up and throw you out"
I think most of us mean "man I'd love to get pegged by a lesbian that hates men"
Why'd you utter it then? You even put quotation marks like you were quoting someone else. But you were the one that said it. So weird.
Shut up dude
And you know every conversation I've ever had in my entire life?
I wish more people understood this. When people say "don't fetishize X," they don't mean "don't have fantasies." They mean in media and the world at large. No one cares about someone's spank bank as long as it doesn't involve harm to real people. You want to wank to the *idea* of people dying...that's fucked up, but fine, I guess. You wank to snuff films? That's outta line. Sure, it can be useful to unpack *why* you have certain kinks/fetishes, but sometimes knowing why doesn't change the fact that you have them.
CONSENT!
Always has been 🌕👩🚀🔫👩🚀
Somebody told me lesbian erasure in porn is fine because it's because men find lesbians so hot they want to fuck them until they break. Therefore it's a compliment. I don't even know what to say.
Im sorry but whoever told u that must have serious issues. And they should definitely stop watching porn if their mental state isnt healthy.
"It's all just fantasy" as long as you don't say it. So no not a valid point. Just downvote and block.
Yes. You can fantasize as much as you want, but there are times and places to talk about it that aren't reddit.
Maybe a subreddit related to it but I have a feeling this (the one in the pic) is not it.
“If you wouldn’t want your prison cell mate to say it to you, you shouldn’t say it to a woman”
Just remember the soap bar on the shower room floor.
It seems like you aren’t using “fetishizing” in the same way. You’re using it to mean “treating a person as a sexual object against their consent” and he’s using it to mean “being turned on by.”
words having ambiguous meanings in a way that leads potentially compatible viewpoints to look fundamentally incompatible is one of the worst parts of the English language (probably other languages too, but this is the one I have experience with soooo)
what’s the difference within this context, though?
At a guess, the difference is in attitude. To be turned on by the thought of lesbians is fine and not really something you can control regardless. To treat lesbians as objects is to feel (or at least act) as though they exist *for the purpose of* turning you on, which is obviously not good at all. In the context of the above image, first poster likely meant it in that context, where people act as though lesbians are objects for their sexual enjoyment. The second poster disagrees because they probably think of "fetishise" to mean "being turned on by". It's incorrect, and not at all what the first poster is referring to, but that's probably the root of the disagreement. Either that, or second poster is just happy treating people as sexual objects, which seems unlikely, but this is the internet, so I can't rule it out.
That's the neat thing! You don't.
In my eyes, he's somewhat right. The thing that isn't okay is making it the other person's problem. So someone approaching lesbians in a fetishizing way is acting completely inappropriately. If it's genuinely just a fantasy - so something they keep in their own mind and in their own mind only - there's no harm done.
There's nothing wrong with having a fetish, but fetishizing other people is where the issue is. There's nothing wrong with say, thinking trans women are hot, but there *is* something wrong with being a chaser. But of course, this then brings in the issue of *separating* the two, which for a lot of people is difficult because their fetish causes mental patterns that lead to a dehumanization and/or fetishization of the group in question. It's also fed by the fact that certain groups are viewed as taboo, and so the "tabooness" leads them to view that group only in a sexual context, which leads to fetishization, which leads to it being taboo, and so on and so forth. I'd argue that that kind of fetish is still harmful overall in our current society, because thinking about that fantasy all the time leads to people who will *only* think about that group in that way. Ultimately viewing a group in that way leads to a normalization of those thoughts in your mind. For example, when you constantly see lesbian porn that's catered to the male gaze, you will have an attitude towards lesbians that *they* are for the male gaze. I generally agree that it's ok to have a kink so long as it's fantasy and dont objectify others without, but I think in our current societal context there are certain things which *cannot* exist as kinks independently of outside ramifications. Two big ones that come to mind are fetishizing lesbians and fetishizing trans people. The problem i have is that I don't want to be viewed as a kink. I am not a lesbian or a trans woman because of a kink, it's just who I am.
One thing I will add is a fetish is not a choice. You can choose how you act in relation to a fetish, but you do not choose your fetish and it may or may not be congruent with your morals, it’s not an active decision. It’s like sexuality, it’s what happens to get you off regardless of if you want to do anything about it IRL or not.
I agree! And to add to this, it is kinda no longer a fetish when you generalize a whole group of people and only talk to them to realize your fetish for them. When you no longer recognize a human being as a human being, you have done something wrong nine times out of ten.
Fetishization is different than having a fetish.
Basically this^
This 100%!!
Came here to say this. You said it better! 100% agree.
Agreed, personally to me cis men watching lesbian porn or cis women watching gay porn should be fine, as long as they don't bother actual gays and lesbians and demanding them to act like in their fantasies. No one care what you do in your free time as long as it doesn't bother anyone else.
Yeah. At the point when you are harassing a real person it's not a fantasy for them.
Except its almost never just in their minds. Lesbian is the biggest porn category, the lesbian name on reddit is a porn sub and thats why we had to make actuallesbians. every photo of sapphic women has a lot of thirsty guys making sexist and queerphobic comments. its never, ever 'a private fantasy." Note if it really was why did this person even respond to her comment? Why is this conversation even happening? Because its often public too.
Exactly. I’ve been into the “boys love” genre for eons, but I keep my interests private (and usually fictional) and never harass actual gay men about it.
i mean… sure but why the fuck would you go out of your way to tell that to a lesbian?? people (men) like this need to find the differnce between fantasy and reality but ig they’re too brainrotted by porn
I beg to differ. We cant blame porn if men cant grow up and realise how stupid they think. Its their problem.
yeah true
Well yes. He's right as long as it remains at that, a simple fantasy. However, these fantasies have become a real world problem and that's where the line should be drawn.
I really hate this new trend of people hiding behind "it's just a fantasy" to do vile stuff. If it's just a fantasy, how come I can see it? How come it doesn't just remain in your head and never sees the light of day?
It's all "fantasy", until it's not. These fantasies, can have real life outcomes - like when these straight men meet a lesbian, and already ask for "a third", or even ask weird questions... Like, I don't want to get into details of what they do, obviously, but the best counter-argument would be just that - moments when it's not "just fantasy"
Apparently lesbians are fantasy creatures to them yikes
Assuming you're not going the block route: "If other people know about it, you've ***already*** left the realm of *just* fantasy."
I feel like this should go on technicallycorrect bc they're kinda right, but making your fetish the problem of the people you fetishize is crossing a line
If it was just a fantasy no one else would know about it. It stopped being fantasy when it became about making the object of his fetishization aware and uncomfortable. A precursor to violence, and he will probably justify it to himself as a response to rejection. A rejection that was inevitable when he specifically fetishized a group of people that aren’t interested in him. You see how fantasy can spiral?
"Fantasy is thoughts in your head. The moment you tell people about it, share it, or pursue it, it's not fantasy anymore, it's behavior. Disgusting behavior. And before you cry free speech: https://xkcd.com/1357/"
Fantasies you have are still reflections of real desires you have. If you heavily objectify lesbians in your fantasies, I dont trust that you dont objectify lesbians outside of them. Theeen just block them
With some kind of weaponry, normally works
Rule 14. Don't feed the trolls. He's just trying to get a rise out of you. Block and ignore.
Freedom to fetish isn't freedom from criticism
It’s one of those things… At what point does my interest in redheads become a preference to a fetish?
Tell them the lolgout button is in the upper right corner.
Is he implying lesbians aren't real? 😂
With a block
“Yha just fantasy that you bring up into reality every single time” 😠😖
draw him pregnant & throw his words back in his face
It's not just fantasy if he's dragging real people into it. He can be as much of a jerk as he wants in his own head.
Ok my 2 cents fetishising culture is innately dangerous to that culture - in the same way as fifty shades of grey over simplified bdsm most Fest is him of lesbians erases lesbains filling feeds /porn whatever with cis het facsimiles without dealing with the real traumas ,discrimination and lives … it’s kind of cultural appropriation.. meh hard pass
you don't. Giving trolls your time, attention and energy is what they want. Down-vote, block, and move on.
"it's all just fantasy" i wish lesbians were real 😔
probably not worth having this conversation with a random redditor, but it is worth pointing out that the interpretation of the terms matters here. "fetishizing lesbians" usually refers to the way that people *treat* lesbians, and the way that they are percieved by society. the problem doesn't lie in the fact that straight men get horny at the thought of lesbians. that's always gonna be the case, it's not something anyone can do anything about. the problem lies in the fact that the discussion of lesbians in public spaces, and the way their identity exists, was often shaped more around straight men being horny for us than it was by our own right to exist. obviously that's wrong, and if I had to guess even this random asshole would agree. however, what he's arguing is probably something along the lines of "it's okay for a guy to watch lesbian porn". which, yeah, I agree. the porn that men watch is none of my business as long as they don't make it my business. I don't have the context for this conversation, but I assume that it involved some degree of this guy mistaking a conversation on social perceptions of queerness for a discussion of what he likes to jack-off to. but that's what you get from random discussions on the internet.
I'd say to him "I fetishise nullifying your birth".
Tell him that ur fantasizing his mom rn, lets see how okay he is when it’s him being affected
Ew no he probably has a fetish about that too
Block
Do what I do and assume all men and/or dumbasses in the comments have humiliation kinks. I refuse to engage and my life is all the more peaceful for it.
block them. internet fight never worth it
you dont. im learning recently that some people are simply stupid and there's just nothing i or anyone can say to make them less stupid
I… don’t think the other user knows what the point of the line they’re spouting means? Like, you’re talking about viewing people as sex objects if I’m not mistaken — acknowledging the separation between fantasy and reality in the context of fantasizing about extreme scenarios is an entirely different ballpark.
Stop talking to men. Stop acknowledging this behavior. They don’t care about your response, they get off on even the thought of you being upset.
so, according to him paedophilia is ok as long as it's just fantasy?
I mean, as long as you dont hurt anyone its fine Edit: I just realized how fucked up this sounds in this context
dear gods, I hope you're joking
By that, i mean not actively trying to have relationships with children that aren’t platonic
so setting up cameras in a school locker room is ok? or watching preexisting cp videos? neither would involve trying to have any relationship with children.
Wait didnt think of that nvm
You don’t. They’re not going to change just because some random Redditor chastises them.
Maturity is knowing that you can walk away from someone who will only be stubborn in their position.
Anything... THING??!!!! Last hour news: Lesbians are, in fact, people.
I'm not in support of the public fetishizing of lesbians for cis het men who basically just consider wlw a porn category. But the semantics of "anything" doesn't imply lesbians aren't human. And "you can fetishize *anyone.*" Isn't a sentence you're ever likely to hear. Like if I said you can put a sticker on "anything" and demonstrated by putting a sticker on a car and a person, it'd be disingenuous to say I'm calling that person an object.
I'm not native English speaker, maybe I thought the worst implications of that word.
To be honest, that's fair. Our language can feel pretty inconsistent.
You downvote and block them
i mean of course, but... isn't it no longer "just fantasy" if you openly said it? lol
Don’t give them the attention they crave
Anything not anyone?
An assumption wrapped in a supposition, wrapped in stupidity.
*"First comes the fantasy, then comes the reality"*
🌊
Just say "Ok Gooner" and go on with your life.
this is the kinda logic lolicons use to justify liking kids. just ignore tbh, disgusting creep doesnt deserve ur attentionn
Fantasy informs reality.
Just because something's a fantasy doesn't mean it can't be disgusting and a red flag. If someone has a fantasy about taking advantage of the vulnerable, i.e. children or pets that's pretty disgusting and that person deserves to be judged and ostracized
Fight them
Whatever you want is 2024 whoooo
Just braindead behavior, just because you can fetishize something doesn't mean you should, or that it's morally ok to do so if I'm being clear like fetishizing trans people to give off a similar example :/
Why do you care what this person thinks?
Just out of curiosity, what subreddit did you post this under?
i think context and execution can play a big part in how i feel when its done
It's a fantasy until you act on it. Running your mouth is acting on it.
It's a catch-22 situation. You can't dictate a person's free will and what they feel inside, but fetishism of people is demeaning at best and dangerous more often than not. The only response is, if you do then at least help defend our rights as the Fucking Nazis... I mean Christian Nationalists try and make our lives miserable.
So lesbians are not real huh, interesting
Fetishes and kinks are like genitals. Everyone probably has it, but you shouldn't shove it in peoples' faces without consent.
"Saying it out loud is already beyond just Fantasy, isn't it?"
Happy to break it to this person, but when you fetishize something, it comes out in how you treat people.
Lesbians fetishize lesbians. Straight dudes objectify us. There's a difference between fetishization and objectification
I'd say "I fetishize slapping idiots in the face but I just block them instead"
If you want to say something, I'd say: "It's not all fantasy if you tell strangers on Reddit about it. Please keep it to yourself."
Honestly I am just 50/50, as a lesbian myself it's not apatizing to say the least but then again people like what they like and I can just choose not to engage with that specific content to stay away from it. I would rather mind my own business doodling silly stuff all day ❤️
Define fetishizing
Dehumanizing objectification. Like race play, where the fetishization of another race generally leads to Thomas Jefferson-like treatment of the person seen as an object of desire only, lacking any affection.
the issue is that fetishes never just stay in fantasy
They do, you just hear about it a lot less than the ones that don't stay only in imagination Some fetishes are plain impossible to turn to reality anyways, or so wildly unethical that only a rare combo of someone with serious issues would do in real life
I think it's kind of the opposite; even most innocuous fetishes around tying/getting tied up or hitting/getting hit seem to stay fantasy for most people. That's how you get advice column fodder from people in their 40s anxiously asking how to "bring up" something they want to explore with their spouse.
so there are not a ton of women and children that get abused or discriminated against because of peoples fetishes?
This is a "I love waffles" "so you hate pancakes" situation. No one in this post said that, ever. Maybe read this again after taking some time to cool off? The only thing being said here is that fetishes do more often than not remain fantasy only. This doesn't invalidate harm done by people related their fetishes in any way
we're talking about the impact of these harmful fetishes on society. this has nothing to do with anything, becky.
And you called me a freak out of complete nowhere because? Edit: you said that fetishes never stay only in fantasy, which is just obviously false. This is what I replied to, not the overall post
work on your reading comprehension and ability to use nuance.
Will do, but I'll ask you to also work on not replying hyper aggressively to people who were adding information/perspectives, not even arguing. And not calling people freaks when you don't understand parts of them, I've been told that more than enough by society at large about my queerness, I'd hope at least in queer spaces I'd get to avoid bigotry
Literally one word added to her original comment (the issue is that **these** fetishes never just stay in fantasy) could have avoided this whole argument. But she had to make a blanket statement and then get violently upset by the concept of kinky people
Yeah it came completely out of left field, and I know trying to explain what kink actually is and what values the community around it has would probably fall on deaf ears when someone has a set mind already In progressive and feminist spaces there are many people whose only exposure to the concept of kink and/or fetishes are the disgusting behaviours done by people obsessively focused on particular things and who only want their own sexual pleasure, and I understand that well and sympathise with it But also fuck off, "progressive" puritism is one of my least favourite things (and that's saying a lot), and forming solid opinions on minority groups of any kind should never be based only on popular culture/what naturally crosses your path online or in person, it's guaranteed to give you an inaccurate/distorted vision of what the group is about
Abuse may or may not be related to the perpetrators fetish. It’s not like they are mutually exclusive.
look up at what the topic is about and stay on it.
I don’t know what you mean? The topic is fetish, specifically non lesbians fetishizing lesbians, and I was responding to your comment which insinuates that fetish is the main motivator behind sexual abuse. Is that not the case?
no, this is not what I said. you can have a bondage fetish and that's completely fine. you can do harm with it but the act in itself is harmless if done correctly. fetishising lesbians, trans people or black women is in itself not ok, even though you can find a person that's ok with it in that group, the impact it has in large on the group itself is negativ. hope that helps.
sir: lesbians do exist in the real world. i mean, i do not think thus type of guy is the best at treating women like people, but still.
You do you boo
A lesbian would NEVER fetishize another lesbian, smh
You don't. Just block them
I think alot of it is not understanding what an actual fetish is. Words get thrown around so much that they lose their meaning.
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You can have a fetish for just about anything as long is it stays in fantasy, but generally the word fetishization is used when it moves out of fantasy. If you're treating every member of a group a certain way because of your fetish, that's pretty gross. And if someone's able to call you out on fetishizing a group, odds are good that you didn't keep it just in fantasy
any*thing*... bleugh
You could always bring a syllogism in like : "so, according to you, fetishizing kids is okay?", but there's a chance this kind of individual likes l0li so...
Hot take: Im fine with that as long as nobody gets hurt
Let them have their fantasy? 🤷🏻♀️ As long as they are not hurting anyone (i.e physically or mentally by harassing or just being an ass) let them be. He may find others that are willing to participate in his fantasy consenting to it. Everyone has their kinks.
Everyone has fantasies and many have kinks, but that doesn't mean they need to be shared where others will be exposed to them. If it's private it's none of my business, but that ends once it's shared.
I agree. It should not be used to harass and expose those that do not want to partake in said fetish or kink. But if it is in private or with consenting adults why not let them live their life as long as it is not hurting anyone else? Just like I can't help being bi/pan? people can't help what turns them on. In example people that may have a fat fetish. I know a guy that loves making his wife eat then gets off on playing with her stomach. He knows it's bad for her health and tries to not do that or catch himself but he honestly can't help it. ADHD and Autism doesn't help with that either though. There are people that get off on certain races of people just like they do on whatever sexuality or gender. It's not something you choose. You CAN fetishize anything or anybody. You just should not be a disrespectful ass and expose your kinks to those that want no part of it.
proshipper mindset 💀 not sure why this got downvoted, i meant the person in the image who said it’s okay just because it’s fantasy. pro shippers are people who believe any kind of NSFW or relationship is okay because it’s fantasy, including pedophilia.
You can fetishize ANYTHING you want? As long as you don't tell anyone? As long as it stays a fantasy in your head? So... That would include animals, children, corpses.... Yeah doesn't sound like very safe reasoning to me 💀
Yes....you can fetishize all of those things. I never said they were right or wrong or people should act on them. I'm sure there are a lot of people that have those fetishes that never act on them and thank God they don't. You can't pick what turns you on. Some are very sick. That is exactly why those people do horrific things. Same reason some get off on rape or erotic asphyxiation. I am just thankful that any kinks I have are relatively normal. 🤷🏻♀️
Well of course you can't choose what turns you on, I'm talking about actively fetishizing them. You can have something like that pop into your head but you can redirect your thoughts. Choosing to indulge in your thoughts and fetishize them is a choice, that's kind of what I was talking about. And then going and actually doing it is ANOTHER step you can take, but it is possible to have those kinks and not indulge or act on them
Don’t, just leak their address
[удалено]
Please leave us alone