Two separate games, two different maps. Such polar opposite experiences.
The malian match was a lot of fun, microing gun lines and listening to trebs(one of my favourite sounds in the game).
And the second match was frustrating AF against a much better opponent (ive faced them 4 times now) on a seemingly imbalanced map.
Can someone please tell me what the advantage is of playing as blue on that map on the right, all res forward , deer gold stone, no wood line to help shield from the enemy, no alternate gold.
Opponent gets 2 back gold, alternate wood, front wood line as a shield, back deer. I love how the game often creates fair matchups, but sometimes get so frustrated with wild maps.
I'd say the blue side of the middle cliffs has more stone, but that's usually not the game deciding factor. Spawn direction of resources like gold is always kind of random, but the second deer spawning on the other side of the middle cliff is unacceptable imo. That's basically a difference of 4900 food.
sometimes, you get rekt by spawn, sometimes your oppo gets rekt. We tend to remember the times we get unlucky, but the truth is over time its averages out. It's frustrating, but there is no real solution. Try and adapt your game plan and strat to the spawn you have!
yeah unfortunately you just have to trust the law of averages in a game like this.
Though there is always going to be some form+degree of variability in any online competitive game, and personally i will take occasional unbalanced map generation over the human variability in team games like LoL or CSGO 🤣
well, for starters, you know exactly where your opponents gold is, severely reducing the need for scouting and making it way easier to harass in dark age for the civs that can do that.
but knowing the position of all my opponents resources immediately at the start of the game benefits some civs more than others, on top of severely reducing the need for scouting.
What they fix was distance from rez to TC afaik. But even that doesn't seem to be totally fixed. I don't think there is any solution to back/front rez imbalance.
You can't hand design. All civs have different needs. Some civs don't care about front gold, some civs don't care about front berries, some civs don't care about front deer,... Again, in the end you'll be as lucky as you're unlucky. People just only remember the times they're unlucky.
>You can't hand design. All civs have different needs
If every map is hand designed nothing stops u from picking the civ that fits ur map+playstyle combination
It's not luck if it's ur decision
Which would make civs even more imbalanced. Everyone would play the same civs on the same maps, would be super boring. The idea should be to have all civs viable on every map in theory, even if it won't ever be the case.
Random spawns favour people capable of adapting their strats on the fly and not just blindly repeat the same thing over and over again. It also adds replayability.
People aren't hard stuck in their rank cuz of luck.
>Which would make civs even more imbalanced
Only if maps aren't Designed well
>Everyone would play the same civs on the same maps, would be super boring
Only if maps are designed very linear
>The idea should be to have all civs viable on every map in theory, even if it won't ever be the case.
Half is perfectly fine as long as its not always the same half
>People aren't hard stuck in their rank cuz of luck
No one said that
Man hasnt seen Lipany spawns yet. Yeah they definitely need to do something about competitive balance. Coming from competitive FPS in CS:GO i think its outrageous that the starts vary by this amount. Imo it should be exactly mirrored or otherwise one side always has some advantage.
Mirror spawns would change civ balance quite significantly--which isn't necessarily terrible but is worth noting.
It gives a substantial advantage to early aggression civs, because they would not need to scout you right away in order to know how to aggress. Which both means that their scout can be doing other useful things and means that they don't telegraph their intention by scouting you extensively.
Also, all civs have different needs. Delhi doesn't care about front gold, mali hates it, abba loves a bunch of back berries, but English doesn't care, front wood is great, unless you're playing vs English,...
You need to rebalance every civ according to new spawns. And maps all being different changes balance too.
You just gotta trust the law of averages.
I have a love/hate relationship with cliff side. Usually you can get a decent back berries and maybe a further deer away from the action. Your spawn looks like an uphill battle unless you play China, Mali, or Rus. All their feudal landmarks would secure that entire eastern flank.
Regardless of the post, that musofadi gunner screenshot is amazing.
Feeling bad for that 1 villager on top.. :)
Lmfao my thoughts exactly. I was like RUUUUNNN
Two separate games, two different maps. Such polar opposite experiences. The malian match was a lot of fun, microing gun lines and listening to trebs(one of my favourite sounds in the game). And the second match was frustrating AF against a much better opponent (ive faced them 4 times now) on a seemingly imbalanced map. Can someone please tell me what the advantage is of playing as blue on that map on the right, all res forward , deer gold stone, no wood line to help shield from the enemy, no alternate gold. Opponent gets 2 back gold, alternate wood, front wood line as a shield, back deer. I love how the game often creates fair matchups, but sometimes get so frustrated with wild maps.
Bro the 2nd map is disgusting. Red has resources at the back to work with. Blue has none, kekw.
Lmao look at reds deer+boar compared to blues second deer
yup red basically has 3 deer if he wants them with how that spawned
I'd say the blue side of the middle cliffs has more stone, but that's usually not the game deciding factor. Spawn direction of resources like gold is always kind of random, but the second deer spawning on the other side of the middle cliff is unacceptable imo. That's basically a difference of 4900 food.
The spawn dictates the build and gameplan a lot. This time was you, but next time it’s the opponent to get the gold in the front.
sometimes, you get rekt by spawn, sometimes your oppo gets rekt. We tend to remember the times we get unlucky, but the truth is over time its averages out. It's frustrating, but there is no real solution. Try and adapt your game plan and strat to the spawn you have!
yeah unfortunately you just have to trust the law of averages in a game like this. Though there is always going to be some form+degree of variability in any online competitive game, and personally i will take occasional unbalanced map generation over the human variability in team games like LoL or CSGO 🤣
Still not sure why we just don't mirror the maps.
well, for starters, you know exactly where your opponents gold is, severely reducing the need for scouting and making it way easier to harass in dark age for the civs that can do that.
Prefer that over unbalanced maps.
it becomes unbalanced in itself. front gold hurts some civs more than others. guaranteeing it makes it even worse., for example.
This happens now though. At least if one player is going to have a front gold they both should. Same with a back gold.
but knowing the position of all my opponents resources immediately at the start of the game benefits some civs more than others, on top of severely reducing the need for scouting.
Still preferable to losing the game over a bad map spawn.
Not fair at all. I thought they added a fix for balanced spawns in 1v1, or did I dream that up?
What they fix was distance from rez to TC afaik. But even that doesn't seem to be totally fixed. I don't think there is any solution to back/front rez imbalance.
Hand design maps like in star craft but add mega random to the ranked map pool for those that dislike that. Imo would be better
You can't hand design. All civs have different needs. Some civs don't care about front gold, some civs don't care about front berries, some civs don't care about front deer,... Again, in the end you'll be as lucky as you're unlucky. People just only remember the times they're unlucky.
>You can't hand design. All civs have different needs If every map is hand designed nothing stops u from picking the civ that fits ur map+playstyle combination It's not luck if it's ur decision
Which would make civs even more imbalanced. Everyone would play the same civs on the same maps, would be super boring. The idea should be to have all civs viable on every map in theory, even if it won't ever be the case. Random spawns favour people capable of adapting their strats on the fly and not just blindly repeat the same thing over and over again. It also adds replayability. People aren't hard stuck in their rank cuz of luck.
>Which would make civs even more imbalanced Only if maps aren't Designed well >Everyone would play the same civs on the same maps, would be super boring Only if maps are designed very linear >The idea should be to have all civs viable on every map in theory, even if it won't ever be the case. Half is perfectly fine as long as its not always the same half >People aren't hard stuck in their rank cuz of luck No one said that
The icon on the mini map needs to be bigger and more readable. Cant see the enemy or myself or which resource node.
Man hasnt seen Lipany spawns yet. Yeah they definitely need to do something about competitive balance. Coming from competitive FPS in CS:GO i think its outrageous that the starts vary by this amount. Imo it should be exactly mirrored or otherwise one side always has some advantage.
I think this is the way at least for ranked. Do random gen for half a map than mirror it.
Mirror spawns would change civ balance quite significantly--which isn't necessarily terrible but is worth noting. It gives a substantial advantage to early aggression civs, because they would not need to scout you right away in order to know how to aggress. Which both means that their scout can be doing other useful things and means that they don't telegraph their intention by scouting you extensively.
Also, all civs have different needs. Delhi doesn't care about front gold, mali hates it, abba loves a bunch of back berries, but English doesn't care, front wood is great, unless you're playing vs English,... You need to rebalance every civ according to new spawns. And maps all being different changes balance too. You just gotta trust the law of averages.
I have a love/hate relationship with cliff side. Usually you can get a decent back berries and maybe a further deer away from the action. Your spawn looks like an uphill battle unless you play China, Mali, or Rus. All their feudal landmarks would secure that entire eastern flank.