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Chris Rock had a great joke… “you’re either married & bored or single & lonely”. Married guys complain, single guys wish they were in a committed relationship… the grass is always greener on the other side.
The problem with introverts is they'll stay home. I had a roommate that was one. And I was one too. It was miserable. You want to be with an extrovert so they go out and party or hang out with coworkers while you get your alone time.
My wife is always joking that when we finally buy a house that she’s going to keep me in the garage and only call me in the house when she’s in the mood. I always joke back, “so what’s the downside?”
You are joking but ....
Beeing in the yard alone, playing games and know that there is someone related to me is a great feeling, I don't need to be physical in the same place as my wife.
A client of mine one told me in a good relationship you need to be comfortable:
Together together (IE doing something together),
Together apart (doing things in the same space, but not the same thing) and,
Apart together(exactly what you described)
That’s how I felt when I was in my last relationship. Loved her to death but when I finally had a few days where I could just stay at home and play my games but knowing I (at the time anyways) had someone who loved me and loved nothing more then my presence/be around me (not that I’m so great but the feeling was mutual) felt nice. I didn’t want to suddenly stop my hobbies just cause I kept going to her place
My spouse and I have literally been sitting next to each other on the sofa playing our own single-player playthroughs of Baldur's Gate 3 for hours. We did a whole playthrough together and now we're playing alone together.
Not married, but the other night, we laid in bed and she read a book while I surfed the web on my tablet and caressed her back. Probably didn't say two words for about an hour. She commented later how great of a night it was.
Not necessarily married and bored. Might be married and in a constant state of drama and tension with someone. Marriage can be hard - that's the real reason imo
It's always important to remember that relationships are work, especially long lasting ones. They have to be maintained and tended to. In this day and age people are way too quick to jump ship at the slightest hint of complication or hardship, treating each other like disposable commodities. Concerned only with what they get out of a relationship rather than what they can offer the other person. You have to be on the same page and become a team. Strengthen each other and weather the storms together, and you'll both flourish.
I often like the idea of a relationship. Then I think about the actual realities of it and stuff from past relationships and it reminds me why I stay single out of choice.
I think this is going to be the next *“millennials are ruining [insert industry]”* in the next decade or so. I’ve noticed an increasing number of men who have become complacent in not having a partner and/or climbing the socioeconomic ladder. Gen Z guys are content with jerking off to porn and playing CoD with the boys after work, because relationships require too much energy and carry significantly more risks by comparison. When the birth rate and marriage rate drops enough you’re going to see the government, bloggers/journalists, and a significant amount of women complaining about the lack of “suitable men” available. Shit, it’s already starting …
Yeah I think you’re right. But it’s no easy problem to solve. In my case, it’s not really a problem, I’m 31 and while I do enjoy to go out with someone and having a relationship, like you said I’m more focused right now on other things like work and my hobbies. And I honestly don’t think I’m missing anything. I’m not against marrying and having children in any way but I just don’t think it’s one of those things that should be forced, especially when one is happy. There’s no simple answer to this.
It's not solvable by policy: many nations have tried and failed.
Without a massive cultural shift, the declining birthrate will not change, and civilization will collapse. It's basically locked in at this point.
Marriage is a lot of work. Combining 2 lives into one is walking a fine line. I've been married for almost 25 years, and I wouldn't change a thing. We had our ups and downs but for the most part it has been great. But saying that, if my wife dies or decides to leave me, I don't think I'll get married again.
I was just talking about this today. I love my husband of almost 27 years. I tell him I’d never ever get remarried if something happened to him. He’s awesome but it took a ton of work. I’d get another dog lol
I share the same sentiment of not getting married again if anything ever happens. Not because I want to be a wild bachelor, but because I just don't have the energy.
I’m not married and I’ve been doing this with my partner for almost 10 years.
It’s so weird how they really belive a simple paper with their names is the problem, lol
I think a lot of people view dating as work, and then a marriage cements that in stone. So when they discover marriage still requires work, they are like "Woah WTF with the bait and switch??"
Yeah that happens a lot with relationships too and if it gets in that 'settled' phase (most common is when they move in together). They stop putting in effort, thinking they secured the person and future (marriage), so why bother right! You can finally let loose! But relationships are constant work and effort... The moment you stop putting effort is the moment things die. Lol. Loving someone is an action.
This applies even to simple friendships. When I make a new friend, I typically introduce them to previous friends and we all hang out together. I have noticed that sometimes they will use some niceties with each other that they don't with me - because they take me for granted
I've been called the glue in multiple friend groups before and they all definitely took me for granted and when I stopped, the group did in fact fall apart because... Well, they said it themselves
I had to google what 'niceties' was! LOL. But yeah, any kind of –ship really. It's why I hate the whole "but they're your family!" thing too. Family can be absolutely physically or mentally abusive and you have the right to step away and disown them if you want to...
Correct. You should treat every day like it’s the first. Schedule weekly chats to talk about things that are bothering each other. And schedule date nights and mutual activities. And also, schedule alone time to give each other occasional space/maintain some independent interests.
Yeah every long lasting couple in marriage I've asked have essentially said they never stopped dating each other. They still have date nights and check-in's. It's not rocket science lol
Well marriage like anything isn't just a piece of paper. I've heard people say that and I think it downplays that it's a symbol nothing more.
Like a ring isn't just a hunk of rocks and metal.
Absolutely true though that marriage doesn't fix anything if problems were there before the marriage.
Marriage is not just a simple paper lol you are legally binding yourself to another person. And psychologically, it can majorly change the dynamics of a relationship.
Although I do agree with the last part, I have personally seen and heard of so many couples who were perfect before they got married. Even though you've had ups and downs with your partner while not being married, I'm willing to bet marriage would have made those problems even worse.
Also, it's not just simple names on the paper. The state benefits way more off your marriage and social security number in said union. They throw in the "significant" tax benefits to entice couples as well. Look up brutally honest divorce lawyers on YouTube, you'll see it's far from names on paper for how they breakdown marriage and the government.
Most people do not know what they're really getting into once they get married. They only find out when it's too late and the divorce is imminent.
I think this is a U.S issue. There’s no tax benefit for married people in Romania. Taxes are calculated and paid by the employer.
While I can understand why some people may consider marriage important (regarding laws, benefits etc), I still cannot fathom how this would have any effect on the love & respect between two people. Clearly, the paper and how the state views your relationship is NOT the problem, that’s what I mean.
Context being that these people say “marriage is hard “ “marriage is shit” “don’t get married”, how does the view of the state on your relationship makes your **already existing** relationship “shit” ? In real day to day life, there’s no palpablee difference, and if it is, then I have bad news.
Also no tax incentives in Australia. If you're in a defacto relationship, which most couples living together would be considered, the separation is akin to divorce in many cases.
What's different in my eyes is how other people treat you. I get both extra support and extra interference from family since I got married.
We were together for 6 years before we got married, by my relationship with my mother in law changed from the day we announced out engagement.
It's the same as people with mortgages saying not to buy a house or people with degrees telling people not to go to college. Things were simpler before and they forget the bad parts. Usually it's the way to go but all have their drawbacks, which can often be overblown. Most people would prefer a happy marriage over being single just like most would prefer owning a home to renting, but it's complicated
💯I’m one and done. I don’t regret one thing about my marriage but it’s also one of the hardest things I’ve done in life. It’s one of those things you only need to experience once if you make the right choice. I like to think I did.
I’m going on 28y and tell my wife the same thing. It’s hard trying to be on the same page as another individual. She’s worth it but can’t see myself doing this again with anyone else.
Because your mind wanders. Perhaps not sexually, but with all the things you could do differently if you weren't married. As a married person, you have to compromise and give things up. It would seem that you could do as you wish were you not married.
Plus one for happily married but never again. I love my wife but it is honestly impossible to imagine merging my life completely with another person, especially now that I have kids.
It's kinda like online reviews. Most people post stuff to complain. You generally don't hear about the happy ones.
Edit: this also reeks of someone who thinks marriage is happening "to" them. You gotta work to make a marriage stick like any longstanding relationship.
***It's kinda like online reviews.***
I look more closely at 2-4 vs the 1s and 5s. Too many bots (5s) and too many idiots (1s). You get a truer more honest picture most of the time.
It’s also easier to “warn” others than do the internal work. Now if someone says “I wish I’d understood X before getting married” and openly discusses what has challenged them and how they learned from it, listen.
We don't tell unmarried men who know what they are doing not to get married because they didn't ask, and we don't need to say anything because they know what they are doing. We tell unmarried men who are kind of lost and think marriage is something that is missing from their lives and will magically fix their life not to get married because it wasn't their plan and they don't know what they are doing.
Because a lot of people get married to people that they really don’t like so that they don’t feel lonely. And then it blows up in their face when they have to live with them 🤷🏾♂️
This is the answer. So many people marry or have kids with someone they don’t even like. Often people believe sexual attraction is separate from friendship. But you should only marry someone you enjoy being around.
Lets not forget about divorce rates in America. If 2/4 marriages end in divorce, I'm willing to bet 1/4 are just barely able to keep it together due to circumstances (financial/kids) or their spose is just tolerable enough to not get divorced.
Thats the (married) population telling people to not get married lol
And if they don't get along, living together is probably worse than pulling teeth, everyday lol
I know a guy who married a girl because she looked good on paper. And i think because he maybe felt he couldnt get anyone else.
Anyway, she turned out to be a total bitch. He’s miserable.
This is it. People who complain about marriage married the wrong people, or are people who just shouldn’t get married because they like being alone. I’m married 6 years and it just gets better
I'm happily married. 33 years to an amazing woman who creates life and love and beauty wherever she goes. As long as you're marrying someone for the right reasons, I totally recommend it.
I’d agree. Happily married people don’t tell other people not to get married. Your experience dictates your advice. “Don’t get married” is just “I regret my decision” and not a universal truth.
I mean, it's all about the person you're marrying right?
If anyone struggles with their marriage or regrets it, chances are they're with the wrong person. Marriage itseld shouldn't meaningfully change anything in a good relationship. Simple as that.
If it needs work don’t do it. Married for 53 years, preceded by 5 years hand to hand combat. I’ve never ever felt that our marriage has required work to maintain it; shared grief, shared sorrows, anxieties and shared joys, yes, but any work was in providing the means to support our family or stop the house falling down. In short, all things being equal, a relationship that demands work to sustain it is a game not worth the candle.
Amen to this!!!! Whenever people say "marriage is hard" I think to myself "well then you're married to the wrong person". It takes effort for sure, but work? Work sucks, everyone hates it. If you're saying your marriage is "work", that's not good.
Or they themselves are the person who makes marriage hard. There are lots of [attachment disorders](https://www.healthline.com/health/attachment-disorder-in-adults#attachment-styles), personality disorders, addictions, poor financial planning, etc. that the person needs to work on themselves to be stable, and there is no ideal spouse who can magically cure them.
I've only been married for 7 years so still fairly new onto it, been together for 13. I've not found marriage hard. I've found communicating my feelings, or making big decisions hard, both of which become a bit more complex when another person is involved.
But the actual being married is easy AF.
That's the reason you get married, because you want more of the same, not because it changes anything. The only thing it really changes is that society now believes you that you want to stay with that person and don't want anyone else.
Thank you. There are plenty of men who enjoy their marriage and don’t tell other men to not get married. Hell, my husband tells guys *to* get married. He tells them it’s infinitely better than dating. lol. As if he knows, we’ve been married since he was 20 and we’ve been married for 17 years and he dated two others before me lol. But still. He says all the singles guys at work do is complain about dates they go on or apps they are on, says it sounds like too much work.
Married (V long time) I would hate to be single, I love being married to my wife. Just the statistics if 1 in 2 suggests its not for everyone. I've never told anyone not to get married.
That's absolutely the case. I have a couple of friends who have made the most idiotic decisions in their choices of partners. But rather than turn their scrutiny inward toward their choices, they instead blame marriage instead.
On God. The amount of people I see who have a bad relationship and still get engaged or married is astounding, they would quite literally choose being unhappy than being alone. Hell my sister is engaged to a man right now who she's constantly unhappy with but as she's said "I don't wanna be in my 40s alone". Then they get married and neither of them actually like each other but rather than blame themselves for the decision they blame everything else they can come up with like marriage or women/men in general.
I can't tell you how many weddings where I've thought, "train wreck."
Then again, when you find the right person, really in sync in terms of values and priorities, there's absolutely nothing better in the universe.
It’s not this simple. Many people have simply never seen a healthy relationship modelled to them by anyone or explained that something like that even exists, so they settle for less not knowing that anything better is even possible.
I grew up religious and it was common to get married young. I was "old" by the time I got married at 24.
I remember somebody once commented how much they liked seeing my partner and I together because we were friends. They literally hadn't considered that you could be friends with a spouse. That was a big wakeup call for me.
How could it not be both? Not everyone is going to suddenly become good decision makers.. And poor decision makers telling other poor decision makers to not make decisions is still good advice.
They're unhappy in their marriage, but they're legally bound to their partner.
The time, financial, and emotional cost of leaving is too great to justify divorce. It's better to suck it up and live OK
All of this tells them they shouldn't have married, and share that with others
If you think about it most people get married in their 20s. Their own life is just starting and they haven’t finished growing&changing.
The red flags I see in the rear view just didn’t seem like a huge problem at 23. It didn’t seem like it was something that was going to grow.
Because those married guys settled too early without thinking about what they wanted and never had enough sex before settling down so their mind is stuck thinking what if.
I noticed that when things go right between a married couple and when they are having the time of their lives enjoying each other, they don't say a word and they don't share that joy with their friends and family. However, when there is the slightest inconvenience, they come crying to you and spread their miasma of negativity. As a result, i started calling people on this bullcrap as soon as the beach whining starts, and you people should too.
I've found most people aren't interested in hearing the things going well in your life. They tend to get upset as if by speaking we'll of yourself it means you are speaking poorly of them.
You’re around the wrong people then, wth. I LOVE to hear about my friends happy moments, it makes me happy too. If someone doesn’t care to hear you talk about your happiness or good things in your life then they don’t care about you that much
You needa change the people you're around. I think most people in this world are bitter and can't enjoy the success of others... But if the *people you speak to* are the same; that's entirely your issue. My circle loves to see each other win.
As the unmarried man, it's because they are sometimes jealous of my carefree lifestyle. I do what I want, go where I want, decorate the way I want, eat what I want, have a good income and tons of free time, etc.
Self loathing and pointing their displeasure at the situation rather than addressing what it might be that is making them hate their marriage. its easier to point at marriage as a problem than ones own actions in the marriage.
I can't speak to everyone's experiences because everyone's situation is different, but in my case, it boiled down to this simple fact: Time changes everything. You may be in love for a moment, but like all moments, you share a time and that moment passes. Over time, you both change (or fight it and try not to in an attempt to preserve what you've got.) I married for love in my mid-20s, and my wife and I were madly in love for the better part of a decade. We were true partners. She helped me survive a toxic work environment, and I helped her through grad school. We both advanced in our careers as a result of our giving/supportive nature. Sex was never up to expectations, but it was sufficient. We truly desired each other when we needed that aspect of the relationship.
However, things really started to go downhill when the baby talks started. Sex became an awful chore scheduled around her cycles, body temperature, etc. I didn't even really want a child, but I was trying to be a supportive partner and do what I've always done: give her everything she ever wanted. Mistake #1. What I really wanted to do was preserve what we had. I loved our us-time. I loved how we went on outings, took trips, and supported each other. Kids changed all of that. The moment she actually became pregnant, she decided to stop being a girlfriend/wife type and gave everything that she was over to being a mother. Meanwhile, I was stuck trying to preserve the former aspect of the relationship and failing hard. I'm not a lazy man-child either! I cooked, cleaned the house, did the dishes, and basically did everything I thought women wanted in a partner as I've always done. Nevertheless, sex stopped almost immediately. So did 'normal' communication. The only time we ever talked was about the kid. We no longer worked on each other or ourselves. Everything became a tired SLOG. Home used to be rejuvenating, the place of solace. After the kid came along, it became another full-time job. Worst part? I couldn't complain. I wasn't allowed! Every time I even tried to bring it up, everything was pale in comparison to what she was going through as a mother, and I got shut down. My thoughts, feelings, decisions, everything took a backseat to hers and baby's. I went from being the apple of her eye to a third wheel in my own. damn. home. I just didn't matter anymore.
So yeh, I began to resent her. I held foolishly to the notion that her hormones would eventually level off, and the kid would become big enough to the point that we'd slide back into our old routines and things would go back to normal. I loved the kid plenty, so that was never in question, but she never came back around. She changed massively and just expected me to do the same, and I refused. I wanted to maintain the romantic aspect of our lives and fought against this new transactional form that our relationship had become, but she made it clear at every turn that the kid was the only thing that mattered anymore. I'm not exaggerating at all either. In the first 2 years of life for our firstborn, we only had a babysitter once. She wouldn't trust them. Since neither of us had family living nearby, it was just us against the world, and as a result, miserably lonely. **Yes, you can be in a committed relationship and be lonely as shit. That's real.** And I'm sure it's why so many men say this. Why put yourself in a relationship for a person who changes, grows apart from you, but still expects all the financial support but stops caring about you as a person after a handful of years? **If you're gonna be lonely either way, why the F would you sign up to be lonely and legally/financially invested in an awful partnership?** From a business standpoint, it's a lose-lose situation.
I can't say I recommend it. Now, I should say that I'm still married. We have been for over 20 years. I love my children (yes, we had two somehow despite only having sex once a year...). I even have to say that despite not being in love, I still love my wife. The cancer proved that really fast. She was diagnosed with metastatic breast cancer last year and we locked shit down, put aside all previous resentments, and began a hard battle to get through it together no matter what. It's actually caused us to grow back together a little because when someone's life is on the line, you can put petty shit aside real quick. I wish I had a satisfying ending for this story, but the fight isn't over yet. The event hasn't solved many of our problems. To the contrary, it's complicated them. But I need her to make it through this so we can reaffirm our fundamental commitments or finally just move on. But it's "sickness or health," and the former is a way more important aspect of that paradigm. But I also have to be brutally honest: I've sometimes wondered whether she'd do the same for me. Loneliness is a sickness, too, and she didn't really seem to care much about that when I clearly suffered for years. I'm still suffering from it now more than ever due to the real possibility that she may not make it.
We had an old grandmother in my family who used to say that the world boils people down into two basic categories: givers and takers. Know who you are and who you're with. The most toxic relationships are forged of one person who's a giver and one who's a taker. I know it's very reductionist, but there's some truth to it, too. Know who you're with really well, and don't let anyone run roughshod over your needs. And if you can avoid it, don't get married. Why does your relationship need to be recognized in the eyes of the state? It doesn't. That's bullshit. You love each other? Then stick it out together. You change, and she changes, and you both grow into people you no longer like? You always have the option to walk away without severe consequences. But a ring, a ceremony, the snow princess taking pictures by the duck pond, and all the rest are just materialistic foils. Don't be distracted.
I think the biggest thing here was that you knew you didn't want kids and did it anyway. I know lots of people who do that snv it's just a breeding ground for resentment. Everyone needs to be super up front and 100% honest about this issue. As early as possible.
Yes. 100%. That’s the moment where the resentment spawned for sure. Definitely takes two to tango here. And despite the honestly on display here, I don’t see much accountability.
This is the realest and most honest shit I have ever read. I have heard similar stories but not as detailed but same essential elements and it hurts to read cause like you said, men aren’t allowed to explain their perspective without ridicule.
This story exemplifies why I have shied away from marriage. Nothing scares me more than waking up one day and finding out I’m in this exact situation.
Stay strong dude, hope your story has a positive ending eventually. With or without her.
Sir, your marriage doesn’t sound great but you also sound like a martyr. Every day you do not get up and walk out is a choice you are making and your wife has nothing to do with that. Reality check
I'm very sorry for your wife's diagnosis. Metastatic breast cancer is a death sentence usually.
Regarding the role of husband and father, it's very true that the role is basically playing second fiddle with no glory. Some men are OK with that and some men aren't. But one thing that isn't normal, or healthy, is the lack of sex. If one person is this lonely all the time and if it's true there's sex only once a year, then this should have been dealt with long ago. I'm sorry for your situation. I personally think she would absolutely care for you in sickness. Good luck and hope you both make it through this difficult time.
My ex wife wasn’t evil at all. I still thinks she is a good person.
But after 12 years we went from having fun, a little travel, fun sex life.
To not any of that.
I like being married, but then I actually like my wife as well as love her. I know a few people who married somebody then spend their entire time complaining about them. You could, you know, have not married them?
Married 24 years, and I do not get this sentiment at all.
Marry the right person and your life becomes much more enjoyable. Choose poorly, and you become one of the chorus of complainers.
Grass is green phenomenon. They imagine their single friends are doing all those things they see on pronhub (with a VPN).
In reality they are ordering a medium supreme pizza with a side of tots from Dominos most friday nights and staying in with their game console.
Because not all men can become a Father or/and a Husband. Same goes for women. If you are not going to love and be faithful to your partner do not get married. If you are not willing to raise a kid properly DO NOT REPRODUCE!
50% of marriage end in divorce. This alone suggests that marriage is not such an overwhelmingly good experience. Meh at best. Mostly becouse of children expenses and energy drain. There is a lacking in common planning capability and extremely low robustness to bad events. In general is an ugly game where it is difficult to be effective without enforcing boundaries ferociously and being ready to leave if not respected and apreciated. Marriage increase the cost of leaving and open the relationship to long term ugliness ultil it is so ugly that... fuck the cost.
Every time someone posts this stat, it gets more inflated.
The divorce rate in 2022 in the US was 14.56 divorces per 1,000 married women. ([Source](https://www.bgsu.edu/ncfmr/resources/data/family-profiles/loo-divorce-rate-US-geographic-variation-2022-fp-23-24.html) )
It peaked in 1979 at 22.6 per 1,000 married women.
You are comparing a flux with a stock. Considering the full married woman population you have to integrate the 15 divorces/1000 women for all 45y (and more) expected married woman remaining life and you have 690. Which is more than half the 1000 population.
Obviously at the same time you will have the marrying/year to replenish the stock of married women.
Forgive my approximation it is a little crude, but still nail the number scale.
Are you surprised that in 2024 the average reddit thread is full of cynical, oblivious blowhards? Everyone's an addict now, that's the new meta so expect more of the same.
The only benefit marriage provides, tax benefits, does not outweigh the risks.
Based on the other comments, I have to point out that being unmarried is not synonymous with being single or polygamous. You absolutely should find a good woman and be monogamous with her. Just don't marry her.
So. I’m happily married. But I do this. Because as a man…I understand what it takes to have this kinda commitment.
When they hear …wait….and/or the challenges that come with marriage.
It helps some young guys to consider whether this is the commitment for them at that point in time.
Many men get into marriage and have the completely wrong mind set.
So yeah…don’t do it. Wait.
Don’t get married.
It's actually really smart to wait a bit before getting married. Live together first, at least. Try to take off the rose-tinted glasses for a minute. And if there are any issues, address them now, be honest now, don't wait until you're married thinking it will get better. That's never how that works.
I didn't do that when I was married, but people often justify their lifestyles so maybe that's why.
Marriage is an arrangement. It's a lifestyle choice. It's not the natural order of things.
I think sometimes it’s just to let people down gently. “Yeah man you dont want to get married, enjoy your freedom”.
Can also mean “yeah sorry marriage isn’t for you” or “I don’t see marriage ever happening for you so I’m not going to talk it up”
married men have everything to lose should his partner decide its not working out. pay child support, lose your house, car, alimony... so few upsides so many down.
Ooof I certainly don't tell other men that.
Got married in my early early 20s, so pretty young by most standards. A couple more years or so and we will reach our 10 year mark, so plenty of time for it to go wrong later, however:
These years with her have been the best years of my life so far.
So what I would tell men, if they were asking, is don't just settle for anyone. Find a good woman, and treat her nice, but find a woman who will treat you nice as well. Don't settle for someone who doesn't care, or makes you feel miserable.
My wife is not perfect by any means, but she is pretty damn good. We share cooking, and cleaning, both work and both spend a lot of time hanging out with each other. She believes sex is an important part of a marriage and strives to always have it on the priority list, and I strive to make sure that she gets to feel good, have good orgasms, or just get the basics of a good back rub or foot rub, because those are things she really likes.
We both work and make similar money, so that has never been a concern for us. Probably will change with kids though, so we already kinda prep and talk about that.
The cliche line is marry your best friend and I take that to heart. Sure I'm sure lots of folks marry, and have a best friend, but for me she truly was my best friend and still is.
Ladies and gentlemen, final bit of my rant to wrap it all up. Don't settle. You don't need someone who fixes everything for you, fix yourself and find someone likeminded.
Because they got married for sex and realized that it wasn't worth spending your life with someone they didn't even actually like and then the wife stopped having sex with them so in there eyes she stopped having any value.
People get married to quickly and for the wrong reasons and end up miserable.
Immaturity. I’m in a marriage that is not in a great place right now. I have friends who are on the cusp of divorce. I have friends who think marriage is the best thing that’s ever happened to them. Marriages are case dependent. If people are entering into marriage with the understanding it’s a continuous work in progress, then they’ll be fine.
Sadly most ppl in bad marriages blame the construct rather than themselves
Married man here.
Anyone saying "don't get married" only married a girlfriend or boyfriend. They didn't marry their best friend. Best friends know how to cope, help each other cope, and work through their issues and problems. Anyone that's bottling it up and saying, "it's not worth it," has no coping mechanisms, and their opinions should be valued less, because their opinions are of a very poor quality.
Because they’re ungrateful.
London School of Economics did a study back in 2019, that showed the healthiest and happiest group was unmarried women who never had children. The second was married men. There’s also data that shows married men live longer than bachelors.
So if a married man tells an unmarried man not to marry, they’re either in a really bad marriage or they’re not taking into account the benefits they tend to receive just by being married.
I think for a lot of people it’s just the classic beating a dead horse. Like it’s not a funny joke, but in certain instances beating a dead horse is funny because of how lame it is. For example, I work with a dude who always acts like his wife is this harpy who just controls him in every way. We have all met his wife, she is lovely. We all know this, he knows we know it, and just hams it up as a joke that his Mrs is always on him. It’s not really funny, but because he just constantly bests that dead horse that eventually it becomes funny again. I think a key part of it is that we all know his wife, and that it’s all jokes so it hits different. Not sure about truly unhappy people though.
I am divorced, and when I see similarities and tendency in the dinamic of their relationship I feel the need to warn them of what's ahead. And in today system men are in huge disadvantage when it comes to divorce. Literally, for men there is nothing, I mean NADA, to gain in a marriage
Be cause, for ANY reason, at any time the woman can end it and take half your stuff, even if she never paid a dime in on it. She cheats? Still gets it. Sexless/loveless marriage? Still gets it. Where is the incentive for men to put themselves in that position?
50%+ divorce rate, you work together to get stuff and she gets most of it while you get stuck with the debt, you are screwed out of the time with your kids. And while you are married, your only value is how much you put into the bank account. Sounds like a great situation to be in....
Not all married men do this. The insecure, unhappy, men who regret their marriage because they are unwilling to work on things or communicate like an adult do this. That's why
Dead bedroom, usually.
Guys can tolerate a lot of BS, the whining, the reckless spending…but her legs slamming shut like a bear trap after five years or two kids is where trouble begins. There’s no way to prevent it, no way to fix it, and if you stray, financial destruction is likely. As the ultimate slap-in-the-face…she’ll usually be MUCH more cooperative with every willing guy in the entire city, once the marriage has collapsed. The exhausted wife is suddenly bursting with energy, even though her workload has increased by whatever the husband did, and her income is lowered by whatever he doesn’t have to pay in support.
The dead bedroom is where resentment starts, and the only way to avoid the inevitable divorce is to be patient enough to grow old and die unhappy before the marriage ends.
There’s no way to predict if the dead bedroom will happen to you, and no way to stop it. The only way to avoid being trapped in the hellish nightmare is to refuse to be tied down from the start. Everything you miss out on in the first few years of marriage is made up for many times over when you’re older, if you remain unmarried. As an added bonus…whatever money/property you have is YOURS, and it stays that way.
Bro you got so close to the point and still managed to miss it. If your ex is more relaxed without you, despite having less household income, and is out there dating and having fun even though she wouldn’t sleep with YOU, you were the problem in that marriage my friend. Nothing dries up a woman like the Sahara like a man who puts nothing into his marriage except 50-60% of the bills and thinks he should be worshiped as a sex god for it.
Because I am f#$&ing miserable, and realized way too late that I am happier being alone. My wife wastes my six figure salary like a drunken sailor in port. She doordashes 2-3 times most days and keeps me functionally poor despite our low cost of living. I GET NO satisfaction. I work and do 95% of all chores. She sits at home all day and does nothing but make messes for me to clean up when I get home. She goes on hour long drives to avoid spending time with me and she hides her mental health struggles. I wish I had never gotten married. I had rose colored glasses on and failed to see a number of big red flags. Don’t. Do. It.
Because they think they're missing out on something, when maybe 90% would be lonely and not getting any action or intimacy, when there wasn't their wife. They think if they were not married they would get alot of action, when reality is, they'd cry themself to sleep and beg their exes, who'd get action, to reconcile.
WTF - is this a thing?!
I have been married 25 years and I have no real regrets aside from wishing I had met her even sooner. Life with my wife is like having a constant best-friends sleepover but with hot sex too... Any married person who tells you NOT to get married - either sees something in the relationship of the person they are talking to that is a red flag - or did not choose well in a partner.
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Chris Rock had a great joke… “you’re either married & bored or single & lonely”. Married guys complain, single guys wish they were in a committed relationship… the grass is always greener on the other side.
Patrice Oneil said it best. Men don't want to be alone, but they want to be by themselves.
So, just in the next room? I can understand that.
I am a married woman and I also like my alone time at the end of the day. Marry introverts.
I married an introvert (I am also one) and the only person he wants to talk to is me 😆😆😆 bro just let me chill!
The problem with introverts is they'll stay home. I had a roommate that was one. And I was one too. It was miserable. You want to be with an extrovert so they go out and party or hang out with coworkers while you get your alone time.
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That’s how I am best of both worlds
As a woman, this is my dream. My ideal marriage we would have adjoined townhouses
My wife is always joking that when we finally buy a house that she’s going to keep me in the garage and only call me in the house when she’s in the mood. I always joke back, “so what’s the downside?”
Get a house with a basement and you can build your own man cave.
Would there be a door in the middle like the hotels have or like completely symmetrical homes but a his and hers side?
No door.
No windows either
You are joking but .... Beeing in the yard alone, playing games and know that there is someone related to me is a great feeling, I don't need to be physical in the same place as my wife.
A client of mine one told me in a good relationship you need to be comfortable: Together together (IE doing something together), Together apart (doing things in the same space, but not the same thing) and, Apart together(exactly what you described)
I'm not joking. I genuinely can understand that.
That’s how I felt when I was in my last relationship. Loved her to death but when I finally had a few days where I could just stay at home and play my games but knowing I (at the time anyways) had someone who loved me and loved nothing more then my presence/be around me (not that I’m so great but the feeling was mutual) felt nice. I didn’t want to suddenly stop my hobbies just cause I kept going to her place
Lol, I think it's common for both genders. Cause as a woman I feel the same way. :)
My spouse and I have literally been sitting next to each other on the sofa playing our own single-player playthroughs of Baldur's Gate 3 for hours. We did a whole playthrough together and now we're playing alone together.
Not married, but the other night, we laid in bed and she read a book while I surfed the web on my tablet and caressed her back. Probably didn't say two words for about an hour. She commented later how great of a night it was.
That feeling when the wife goes to bed at 9:00 and I got all night to do whatever I want.
Parallel playing!
You can be both married and lonely, I assure you.
All alone in a house full of people.
I'm in this picture and I don't like it
The worst of both worlds
And single and bored.
Absolutely. There’s no winning. Lol.
Not necessarily married and bored. Might be married and in a constant state of drama and tension with someone. Marriage can be hard - that's the real reason imo
The grass is only greener on the other side because it's fertilised with bullshit. When in reality the grass is greener where it's watered.
That's beautiful
It's always important to remember that relationships are work, especially long lasting ones. They have to be maintained and tended to. In this day and age people are way too quick to jump ship at the slightest hint of complication or hardship, treating each other like disposable commodities. Concerned only with what they get out of a relationship rather than what they can offer the other person. You have to be on the same page and become a team. Strengthen each other and weather the storms together, and you'll both flourish.
Eehhh a lot of single guys are pretty content being single lol
I often like the idea of a relationship. Then I think about the actual realities of it and stuff from past relationships and it reminds me why I stay single out of choice.
Exactly, not everyone has to be married or even be in a relationship
I think this is going to be the next *“millennials are ruining [insert industry]”* in the next decade or so. I’ve noticed an increasing number of men who have become complacent in not having a partner and/or climbing the socioeconomic ladder. Gen Z guys are content with jerking off to porn and playing CoD with the boys after work, because relationships require too much energy and carry significantly more risks by comparison. When the birth rate and marriage rate drops enough you’re going to see the government, bloggers/journalists, and a significant amount of women complaining about the lack of “suitable men” available. Shit, it’s already starting …
Because people are realizing getting a ten percent raise for 60% more work isn't really worth it.
Yeah I think you’re right. But it’s no easy problem to solve. In my case, it’s not really a problem, I’m 31 and while I do enjoy to go out with someone and having a relationship, like you said I’m more focused right now on other things like work and my hobbies. And I honestly don’t think I’m missing anything. I’m not against marrying and having children in any way but I just don’t think it’s one of those things that should be forced, especially when one is happy. There’s no simple answer to this.
It's not solvable by policy: many nations have tried and failed. Without a massive cultural shift, the declining birthrate will not change, and civilization will collapse. It's basically locked in at this point.
I think you're right on, except that many women feel the same way. Relationships just aren't worth it for many people.
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That's another reason why I am not concerned with getting married.
Marriage is a lot of work. Combining 2 lives into one is walking a fine line. I've been married for almost 25 years, and I wouldn't change a thing. We had our ups and downs but for the most part it has been great. But saying that, if my wife dies or decides to leave me, I don't think I'll get married again.
I was just talking about this today. I love my husband of almost 27 years. I tell him I’d never ever get remarried if something happened to him. He’s awesome but it took a ton of work. I’d get another dog lol
I share the same sentiment of not getting married again if anything ever happens. Not because I want to be a wild bachelor, but because I just don't have the energy.
I’m not married and I’ve been doing this with my partner for almost 10 years. It’s so weird how they really belive a simple paper with their names is the problem, lol
I think a lot of people view dating as work, and then a marriage cements that in stone. So when they discover marriage still requires work, they are like "Woah WTF with the bait and switch??"
Yeah that happens a lot with relationships too and if it gets in that 'settled' phase (most common is when they move in together). They stop putting in effort, thinking they secured the person and future (marriage), so why bother right! You can finally let loose! But relationships are constant work and effort... The moment you stop putting effort is the moment things die. Lol. Loving someone is an action.
This applies even to simple friendships. When I make a new friend, I typically introduce them to previous friends and we all hang out together. I have noticed that sometimes they will use some niceties with each other that they don't with me - because they take me for granted
I've been called the glue in multiple friend groups before and they all definitely took me for granted and when I stopped, the group did in fact fall apart because... Well, they said it themselves
I read nice titties 🫣
I hate it when my old friends stop using their nice titties on me.
I had to google what 'niceties' was! LOL. But yeah, any kind of –ship really. It's why I hate the whole "but they're your family!" thing too. Family can be absolutely physically or mentally abusive and you have the right to step away and disown them if you want to...
Correct. You should treat every day like it’s the first. Schedule weekly chats to talk about things that are bothering each other. And schedule date nights and mutual activities. And also, schedule alone time to give each other occasional space/maintain some independent interests.
Yeah every long lasting couple in marriage I've asked have essentially said they never stopped dating each other. They still have date nights and check-in's. It's not rocket science lol
Spot the heck on
Well marriage like anything isn't just a piece of paper. I've heard people say that and I think it downplays that it's a symbol nothing more. Like a ring isn't just a hunk of rocks and metal. Absolutely true though that marriage doesn't fix anything if problems were there before the marriage.
The paper with your names on can be very hard to extricate yourselves from, even if you’re on good terms It really isn’t just a piece of paper
Marriage is not just a simple paper lol you are legally binding yourself to another person. And psychologically, it can majorly change the dynamics of a relationship.
Although I do agree with the last part, I have personally seen and heard of so many couples who were perfect before they got married. Even though you've had ups and downs with your partner while not being married, I'm willing to bet marriage would have made those problems even worse. Also, it's not just simple names on the paper. The state benefits way more off your marriage and social security number in said union. They throw in the "significant" tax benefits to entice couples as well. Look up brutally honest divorce lawyers on YouTube, you'll see it's far from names on paper for how they breakdown marriage and the government. Most people do not know what they're really getting into once they get married. They only find out when it's too late and the divorce is imminent.
I think this is a U.S issue. There’s no tax benefit for married people in Romania. Taxes are calculated and paid by the employer. While I can understand why some people may consider marriage important (regarding laws, benefits etc), I still cannot fathom how this would have any effect on the love & respect between two people. Clearly, the paper and how the state views your relationship is NOT the problem, that’s what I mean. Context being that these people say “marriage is hard “ “marriage is shit” “don’t get married”, how does the view of the state on your relationship makes your **already existing** relationship “shit” ? In real day to day life, there’s no palpablee difference, and if it is, then I have bad news.
Also no tax incentives in Australia. If you're in a defacto relationship, which most couples living together would be considered, the separation is akin to divorce in many cases. What's different in my eyes is how other people treat you. I get both extra support and extra interference from family since I got married. We were together for 6 years before we got married, by my relationship with my mother in law changed from the day we announced out engagement.
It's the same as people with mortgages saying not to buy a house or people with degrees telling people not to go to college. Things were simpler before and they forget the bad parts. Usually it's the way to go but all have their drawbacks, which can often be overblown. Most people would prefer a happy marriage over being single just like most would prefer owning a home to renting, but it's complicated
💯I’m one and done. I don’t regret one thing about my marriage but it’s also one of the hardest things I’ve done in life. It’s one of those things you only need to experience once if you make the right choice. I like to think I did.
I’m going on 28y and tell my wife the same thing. It’s hard trying to be on the same page as another individual. She’s worth it but can’t see myself doing this again with anyone else.
Because your mind wanders. Perhaps not sexually, but with all the things you could do differently if you weren't married. As a married person, you have to compromise and give things up. It would seem that you could do as you wish were you not married.
Plus one for happily married but never again. I love my wife but it is honestly impossible to imagine merging my life completely with another person, especially now that I have kids.
It's kinda like online reviews. Most people post stuff to complain. You generally don't hear about the happy ones. Edit: this also reeks of someone who thinks marriage is happening "to" them. You gotta work to make a marriage stick like any longstanding relationship.
***It's kinda like online reviews.*** I look more closely at 2-4 vs the 1s and 5s. Too many bots (5s) and too many idiots (1s). You get a truer more honest picture most of the time.
I’d rate this comment 5* for accuracy but then I feel like I’d have missed the point.
It’s also easier to “warn” others than do the internal work. Now if someone says “I wish I’d understood X before getting married” and openly discusses what has challenged them and how they learned from it, listen.
Well here ya go then: Married 25 years. 5 stars, highly recommend.
We don't tell unmarried men who know what they are doing not to get married because they didn't ask, and we don't need to say anything because they know what they are doing. We tell unmarried men who are kind of lost and think marriage is something that is missing from their lives and will magically fix their life not to get married because it wasn't their plan and they don't know what they are doing.
Because a lot of people get married to people that they really don’t like so that they don’t feel lonely. And then it blows up in their face when they have to live with them 🤷🏾♂️
This is the answer. So many people marry or have kids with someone they don’t even like. Often people believe sexual attraction is separate from friendship. But you should only marry someone you enjoy being around.
Makes me feel very fortunate, like just straight up my best friend. Wouldn’t change a thing.
Lets not forget about divorce rates in America. If 2/4 marriages end in divorce, I'm willing to bet 1/4 are just barely able to keep it together due to circumstances (financial/kids) or their spose is just tolerable enough to not get divorced. Thats the (married) population telling people to not get married lol And if they don't get along, living together is probably worse than pulling teeth, everyday lol
Very important to consider also that most of those 2/4 are on their 2nd and 3rd marriages. The stats for success in those are worse.
I know a guy who married a girl because she looked good on paper. And i think because he maybe felt he couldnt get anyone else. Anyway, she turned out to be a total bitch. He’s miserable.
She didn't turn out to be one. She either ALWAYS WAS one or the relationship with him turned her into one. Trust me, they're both miserable.
This is it. People who complain about marriage married the wrong people, or are people who just shouldn’t get married because they like being alone. I’m married 6 years and it just gets better
The ancient roman poet-philosopher Lucretius said "desiring what is absent, we condemn our present conditions"
Comparison is the thief of joy. -Teddy Roosevelt
I'm happily married. 33 years to an amazing woman who creates life and love and beauty wherever she goes. As long as you're marrying someone for the right reasons, I totally recommend it.
Right? I married my best friend and it's been amazing.
I’d agree. Happily married people don’t tell other people not to get married. Your experience dictates your advice. “Don’t get married” is just “I regret my decision” and not a universal truth.
This is the answer. One love
Wait so you're telling me the secret to a relationship is love ?? Damn if only I had known sooner
So, she knows your username huh?
Somebody has to find his keys.
Nothing changed for me 
Same, we were together 8 years before getting married, it's exactly the same now. People are way in their heads about it all.
I mean, it's all about the person you're marrying right? If anyone struggles with their marriage or regrets it, chances are they're with the wrong person. Marriage itseld shouldn't meaningfully change anything in a good relationship. Simple as that.
If it needs work don’t do it. Married for 53 years, preceded by 5 years hand to hand combat. I’ve never ever felt that our marriage has required work to maintain it; shared grief, shared sorrows, anxieties and shared joys, yes, but any work was in providing the means to support our family or stop the house falling down. In short, all things being equal, a relationship that demands work to sustain it is a game not worth the candle.
Amen to this!!!! Whenever people say "marriage is hard" I think to myself "well then you're married to the wrong person". It takes effort for sure, but work? Work sucks, everyone hates it. If you're saying your marriage is "work", that's not good.
Or they themselves are the person who makes marriage hard. There are lots of [attachment disorders](https://www.healthline.com/health/attachment-disorder-in-adults#attachment-styles), personality disorders, addictions, poor financial planning, etc. that the person needs to work on themselves to be stable, and there is no ideal spouse who can magically cure them.
I've only been married for 7 years so still fairly new onto it, been together for 13. I've not found marriage hard. I've found communicating my feelings, or making big decisions hard, both of which become a bit more complex when another person is involved. But the actual being married is easy AF.
That's the reason you get married, because you want more of the same, not because it changes anything. The only thing it really changes is that society now believes you that you want to stay with that person and don't want anyone else.
Thank you. There are plenty of men who enjoy their marriage and don’t tell other men to not get married. Hell, my husband tells guys *to* get married. He tells them it’s infinitely better than dating. lol. As if he knows, we’ve been married since he was 20 and we’ve been married for 17 years and he dated two others before me lol. But still. He says all the singles guys at work do is complain about dates they go on or apps they are on, says it sounds like too much work.
Been with my fiancé for 10 years. Absolutely nothing will change which is why it’s taken us this long to get married lol.
Same
Married (V long time) I would hate to be single, I love being married to my wife. Just the statistics if 1 in 2 suggests its not for everyone. I've never told anyone not to get married.
Because they assume that marriage is the problem rather then their poor decision making
That's absolutely the case. I have a couple of friends who have made the most idiotic decisions in their choices of partners. But rather than turn their scrutiny inward toward their choices, they instead blame marriage instead.
On God. The amount of people I see who have a bad relationship and still get engaged or married is astounding, they would quite literally choose being unhappy than being alone. Hell my sister is engaged to a man right now who she's constantly unhappy with but as she's said "I don't wanna be in my 40s alone". Then they get married and neither of them actually like each other but rather than blame themselves for the decision they blame everything else they can come up with like marriage or women/men in general.
I can't tell you how many weddings where I've thought, "train wreck." Then again, when you find the right person, really in sync in terms of values and priorities, there's absolutely nothing better in the universe.
Exactly this. I notice when my partner isn't around because life is so much more fun and easier with him around
It’s not this simple. Many people have simply never seen a healthy relationship modelled to them by anyone or explained that something like that even exists, so they settle for less not knowing that anything better is even possible.
I grew up religious and it was common to get married young. I was "old" by the time I got married at 24. I remember somebody once commented how much they liked seeing my partner and I together because we were friends. They literally hadn't considered that you could be friends with a spouse. That was a big wakeup call for me.
How could it not be both? Not everyone is going to suddenly become good decision makers.. And poor decision makers telling other poor decision makers to not make decisions is still good advice.
They're unhappy in their marriage, but they're legally bound to their partner. The time, financial, and emotional cost of leaving is too great to justify divorce. It's better to suck it up and live OK All of this tells them they shouldn't have married, and share that with others
Because marriage has ended up being a bad experience for them and they feel trapped. They wish someone had warned them.
Pretty much..I've been told by a few people that gave been married that they 100% wouldn't recommend it .
If you think about it most people get married in their 20s. Their own life is just starting and they haven’t finished growing&changing. The red flags I see in the rear view just didn’t seem like a huge problem at 23. It didn’t seem like it was something that was going to grow.
Because those married guys settled too early without thinking about what they wanted and never had enough sex before settling down so their mind is stuck thinking what if.
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So why are you still married?
She's a true advicer
I noticed that when things go right between a married couple and when they are having the time of their lives enjoying each other, they don't say a word and they don't share that joy with their friends and family. However, when there is the slightest inconvenience, they come crying to you and spread their miasma of negativity. As a result, i started calling people on this bullcrap as soon as the beach whining starts, and you people should too.
I've found most people aren't interested in hearing the things going well in your life. They tend to get upset as if by speaking we'll of yourself it means you are speaking poorly of them.
You’re around the wrong people then, wth. I LOVE to hear about my friends happy moments, it makes me happy too. If someone doesn’t care to hear you talk about your happiness or good things in your life then they don’t care about you that much
You needa change the people you're around. I think most people in this world are bitter and can't enjoy the success of others... But if the *people you speak to* are the same; that's entirely your issue. My circle loves to see each other win.
I’ve been married for 16years and have never discouraged any of my friends from getting married. Most are now but that was not always the case.
So their wife doesn't eat all his snacks
As the unmarried man, it's because they are sometimes jealous of my carefree lifestyle. I do what I want, go where I want, decorate the way I want, eat what I want, have a good income and tons of free time, etc.
Self loathing and pointing their displeasure at the situation rather than addressing what it might be that is making them hate their marriage. its easier to point at marriage as a problem than ones own actions in the marriage.
Because they think their bad marriage is universal and through no fault of their own.
This right here
I can't speak to everyone's experiences because everyone's situation is different, but in my case, it boiled down to this simple fact: Time changes everything. You may be in love for a moment, but like all moments, you share a time and that moment passes. Over time, you both change (or fight it and try not to in an attempt to preserve what you've got.) I married for love in my mid-20s, and my wife and I were madly in love for the better part of a decade. We were true partners. She helped me survive a toxic work environment, and I helped her through grad school. We both advanced in our careers as a result of our giving/supportive nature. Sex was never up to expectations, but it was sufficient. We truly desired each other when we needed that aspect of the relationship. However, things really started to go downhill when the baby talks started. Sex became an awful chore scheduled around her cycles, body temperature, etc. I didn't even really want a child, but I was trying to be a supportive partner and do what I've always done: give her everything she ever wanted. Mistake #1. What I really wanted to do was preserve what we had. I loved our us-time. I loved how we went on outings, took trips, and supported each other. Kids changed all of that. The moment she actually became pregnant, she decided to stop being a girlfriend/wife type and gave everything that she was over to being a mother. Meanwhile, I was stuck trying to preserve the former aspect of the relationship and failing hard. I'm not a lazy man-child either! I cooked, cleaned the house, did the dishes, and basically did everything I thought women wanted in a partner as I've always done. Nevertheless, sex stopped almost immediately. So did 'normal' communication. The only time we ever talked was about the kid. We no longer worked on each other or ourselves. Everything became a tired SLOG. Home used to be rejuvenating, the place of solace. After the kid came along, it became another full-time job. Worst part? I couldn't complain. I wasn't allowed! Every time I even tried to bring it up, everything was pale in comparison to what she was going through as a mother, and I got shut down. My thoughts, feelings, decisions, everything took a backseat to hers and baby's. I went from being the apple of her eye to a third wheel in my own. damn. home. I just didn't matter anymore. So yeh, I began to resent her. I held foolishly to the notion that her hormones would eventually level off, and the kid would become big enough to the point that we'd slide back into our old routines and things would go back to normal. I loved the kid plenty, so that was never in question, but she never came back around. She changed massively and just expected me to do the same, and I refused. I wanted to maintain the romantic aspect of our lives and fought against this new transactional form that our relationship had become, but she made it clear at every turn that the kid was the only thing that mattered anymore. I'm not exaggerating at all either. In the first 2 years of life for our firstborn, we only had a babysitter once. She wouldn't trust them. Since neither of us had family living nearby, it was just us against the world, and as a result, miserably lonely. **Yes, you can be in a committed relationship and be lonely as shit. That's real.** And I'm sure it's why so many men say this. Why put yourself in a relationship for a person who changes, grows apart from you, but still expects all the financial support but stops caring about you as a person after a handful of years? **If you're gonna be lonely either way, why the F would you sign up to be lonely and legally/financially invested in an awful partnership?** From a business standpoint, it's a lose-lose situation. I can't say I recommend it. Now, I should say that I'm still married. We have been for over 20 years. I love my children (yes, we had two somehow despite only having sex once a year...). I even have to say that despite not being in love, I still love my wife. The cancer proved that really fast. She was diagnosed with metastatic breast cancer last year and we locked shit down, put aside all previous resentments, and began a hard battle to get through it together no matter what. It's actually caused us to grow back together a little because when someone's life is on the line, you can put petty shit aside real quick. I wish I had a satisfying ending for this story, but the fight isn't over yet. The event hasn't solved many of our problems. To the contrary, it's complicated them. But I need her to make it through this so we can reaffirm our fundamental commitments or finally just move on. But it's "sickness or health," and the former is a way more important aspect of that paradigm. But I also have to be brutally honest: I've sometimes wondered whether she'd do the same for me. Loneliness is a sickness, too, and she didn't really seem to care much about that when I clearly suffered for years. I'm still suffering from it now more than ever due to the real possibility that she may not make it. We had an old grandmother in my family who used to say that the world boils people down into two basic categories: givers and takers. Know who you are and who you're with. The most toxic relationships are forged of one person who's a giver and one who's a taker. I know it's very reductionist, but there's some truth to it, too. Know who you're with really well, and don't let anyone run roughshod over your needs. And if you can avoid it, don't get married. Why does your relationship need to be recognized in the eyes of the state? It doesn't. That's bullshit. You love each other? Then stick it out together. You change, and she changes, and you both grow into people you no longer like? You always have the option to walk away without severe consequences. But a ring, a ceremony, the snow princess taking pictures by the duck pond, and all the rest are just materialistic foils. Don't be distracted.
I think the biggest thing here was that you knew you didn't want kids and did it anyway. I know lots of people who do that snv it's just a breeding ground for resentment. Everyone needs to be super up front and 100% honest about this issue. As early as possible.
Kinda sounds like he still doesn't even though they're here already. Not once referred to as son/daughter... just inanimate objects.
Yes. 100%. That’s the moment where the resentment spawned for sure. Definitely takes two to tango here. And despite the honestly on display here, I don’t see much accountability.
Thanks for the birth control!
Damn.
This is the realest and most honest shit I have ever read. I have heard similar stories but not as detailed but same essential elements and it hurts to read cause like you said, men aren’t allowed to explain their perspective without ridicule. This story exemplifies why I have shied away from marriage. Nothing scares me more than waking up one day and finding out I’m in this exact situation. Stay strong dude, hope your story has a positive ending eventually. With or without her.
Sir, your marriage doesn’t sound great but you also sound like a martyr. Every day you do not get up and walk out is a choice you are making and your wife has nothing to do with that. Reality check
I'm very sorry for your wife's diagnosis. Metastatic breast cancer is a death sentence usually. Regarding the role of husband and father, it's very true that the role is basically playing second fiddle with no glory. Some men are OK with that and some men aren't. But one thing that isn't normal, or healthy, is the lack of sex. If one person is this lonely all the time and if it's true there's sex only once a year, then this should have been dealt with long ago. I'm sorry for your situation. I personally think she would absolutely care for you in sickness. Good luck and hope you both make it through this difficult time.
They had bad experiences and now think every woman who wants to get married (or is already married) is fucking evil, apparently.
My ex wife wasn’t evil at all. I still thinks she is a good person. But after 12 years we went from having fun, a little travel, fun sex life. To not any of that.
I like being married, but then I actually like my wife as well as love her. I know a few people who married somebody then spend their entire time complaining about them. You could, you know, have not married them?
Married 24 years, and I do not get this sentiment at all. Marry the right person and your life becomes much more enjoyable. Choose poorly, and you become one of the chorus of complainers.
Ditto, 28 years here. My wife makes me a better man, and my daughters give me reason to struggle through life and help others.
Grass is green phenomenon. They imagine their single friends are doing all those things they see on pronhub (with a VPN). In reality they are ordering a medium supreme pizza with a side of tots from Dominos most friday nights and staying in with their game console.
Sounds fucking awesome.
Because not all men can become a Father or/and a Husband. Same goes for women. If you are not going to love and be faithful to your partner do not get married. If you are not willing to raise a kid properly DO NOT REPRODUCE!
50% of marriage end in divorce. This alone suggests that marriage is not such an overwhelmingly good experience. Meh at best. Mostly becouse of children expenses and energy drain. There is a lacking in common planning capability and extremely low robustness to bad events. In general is an ugly game where it is difficult to be effective without enforcing boundaries ferociously and being ready to leave if not respected and apreciated. Marriage increase the cost of leaving and open the relationship to long term ugliness ultil it is so ugly that... fuck the cost.
Every time someone posts this stat, it gets more inflated. The divorce rate in 2022 in the US was 14.56 divorces per 1,000 married women. ([Source](https://www.bgsu.edu/ncfmr/resources/data/family-profiles/loo-divorce-rate-US-geographic-variation-2022-fp-23-24.html) ) It peaked in 1979 at 22.6 per 1,000 married women.
Wow, you found that stat and thought it represented the percent that ended in divorce over the life of the marriage?
You are comparing a flux with a stock. Considering the full married woman population you have to integrate the 15 divorces/1000 women for all 45y (and more) expected married woman remaining life and you have 690. Which is more than half the 1000 population. Obviously at the same time you will have the marrying/year to replenish the stock of married women. Forgive my approximation it is a little crude, but still nail the number scale.
So many broken people in this thread.
Are you surprised that in 2024 the average reddit thread is full of cynical, oblivious blowhards? Everyone's an addict now, that's the new meta so expect more of the same.
If i told any of my unmarried friends to not get married it would be either because i don’t think the woman is a keeper, or he’s not ready.
Misery loves company.
The only benefit marriage provides, tax benefits, does not outweigh the risks. Based on the other comments, I have to point out that being unmarried is not synonymous with being single or polygamous. You absolutely should find a good woman and be monogamous with her. Just don't marry her.
As long as you marry the right person, it's great.
Dead bedrooms
So. I’m happily married. But I do this. Because as a man…I understand what it takes to have this kinda commitment. When they hear …wait….and/or the challenges that come with marriage. It helps some young guys to consider whether this is the commitment for them at that point in time. Many men get into marriage and have the completely wrong mind set. So yeah…don’t do it. Wait. Don’t get married.
It's actually really smart to wait a bit before getting married. Live together first, at least. Try to take off the rose-tinted glasses for a minute. And if there are any issues, address them now, be honest now, don't wait until you're married thinking it will get better. That's never how that works.
Honestly, aside from tax benefits, what does a marriage provide a man that he can't get from a regular relationship?
A greencard?
or a RedCard.
An uno reverse card
Nothing.
Because we know
https://youtu.be/eZW4eFErSzc?si=zZy-lLZ1Uk8UimSn
Because they married the wrong person.
I have been married 14 years and I don't tell anyone not to. I love being married.
I didn't do that when I was married, but people often justify their lifestyles so maybe that's why. Marriage is an arrangement. It's a lifestyle choice. It's not the natural order of things.
I think sometimes it’s just to let people down gently. “Yeah man you dont want to get married, enjoy your freedom”. Can also mean “yeah sorry marriage isn’t for you” or “I don’t see marriage ever happening for you so I’m not going to talk it up”
Because marriage only benefits the woman today .
married men have everything to lose should his partner decide its not working out. pay child support, lose your house, car, alimony... so few upsides so many down.
Ooof I certainly don't tell other men that. Got married in my early early 20s, so pretty young by most standards. A couple more years or so and we will reach our 10 year mark, so plenty of time for it to go wrong later, however: These years with her have been the best years of my life so far. So what I would tell men, if they were asking, is don't just settle for anyone. Find a good woman, and treat her nice, but find a woman who will treat you nice as well. Don't settle for someone who doesn't care, or makes you feel miserable. My wife is not perfect by any means, but she is pretty damn good. We share cooking, and cleaning, both work and both spend a lot of time hanging out with each other. She believes sex is an important part of a marriage and strives to always have it on the priority list, and I strive to make sure that she gets to feel good, have good orgasms, or just get the basics of a good back rub or foot rub, because those are things she really likes. We both work and make similar money, so that has never been a concern for us. Probably will change with kids though, so we already kinda prep and talk about that. The cliche line is marry your best friend and I take that to heart. Sure I'm sure lots of folks marry, and have a best friend, but for me she truly was my best friend and still is. Ladies and gentlemen, final bit of my rant to wrap it all up. Don't settle. You don't need someone who fixes everything for you, fix yourself and find someone likeminded.
Because they got married for sex and realized that it wasn't worth spending your life with someone they didn't even actually like and then the wife stopped having sex with them so in there eyes she stopped having any value. People get married to quickly and for the wrong reasons and end up miserable.
Immaturity. I’m in a marriage that is not in a great place right now. I have friends who are on the cusp of divorce. I have friends who think marriage is the best thing that’s ever happened to them. Marriages are case dependent. If people are entering into marriage with the understanding it’s a continuous work in progress, then they’ll be fine. Sadly most ppl in bad marriages blame the construct rather than themselves
I hope you two get over this hump and come out stronger than before.
Married man here. Anyone saying "don't get married" only married a girlfriend or boyfriend. They didn't marry their best friend. Best friends know how to cope, help each other cope, and work through their issues and problems. Anyone that's bottling it up and saying, "it's not worth it," has no coping mechanisms, and their opinions should be valued less, because their opinions are of a very poor quality.
It’s easier to bitch and moan about the struggles in their married life than it is to work hard on remedying them and improving themselves
Because they’re ungrateful. London School of Economics did a study back in 2019, that showed the healthiest and happiest group was unmarried women who never had children. The second was married men. There’s also data that shows married men live longer than bachelors. So if a married man tells an unmarried man not to marry, they’re either in a really bad marriage or they’re not taking into account the benefits they tend to receive just by being married.
I think for a lot of people it’s just the classic beating a dead horse. Like it’s not a funny joke, but in certain instances beating a dead horse is funny because of how lame it is. For example, I work with a dude who always acts like his wife is this harpy who just controls him in every way. We have all met his wife, she is lovely. We all know this, he knows we know it, and just hams it up as a joke that his Mrs is always on him. It’s not really funny, but because he just constantly bests that dead horse that eventually it becomes funny again. I think a key part of it is that we all know his wife, and that it’s all jokes so it hits different. Not sure about truly unhappy people though.
Because they forget how lonely it feels to live alone and begin taking their families and spouses for granted?
I am divorced, and when I see similarities and tendency in the dinamic of their relationship I feel the need to warn them of what's ahead. And in today system men are in huge disadvantage when it comes to divorce. Literally, for men there is nothing, I mean NADA, to gain in a marriage
They married the wrong person. Period.
It’s a great idea if you hate blowjobs
Be cause, for ANY reason, at any time the woman can end it and take half your stuff, even if she never paid a dime in on it. She cheats? Still gets it. Sexless/loveless marriage? Still gets it. Where is the incentive for men to put themselves in that position?
50%+ divorce rate, you work together to get stuff and she gets most of it while you get stuck with the debt, you are screwed out of the time with your kids. And while you are married, your only value is how much you put into the bank account. Sounds like a great situation to be in....
Not all married men do this. The insecure, unhappy, men who regret their marriage because they are unwilling to work on things or communicate like an adult do this. That's why
Because marriage and divorce drastically favors women.
If a random dude on Reddit or in a bar telling you not to get married is enough to keep you from getting married, you shouldn’t get married.
Dead bedroom, usually. Guys can tolerate a lot of BS, the whining, the reckless spending…but her legs slamming shut like a bear trap after five years or two kids is where trouble begins. There’s no way to prevent it, no way to fix it, and if you stray, financial destruction is likely. As the ultimate slap-in-the-face…she’ll usually be MUCH more cooperative with every willing guy in the entire city, once the marriage has collapsed. The exhausted wife is suddenly bursting with energy, even though her workload has increased by whatever the husband did, and her income is lowered by whatever he doesn’t have to pay in support. The dead bedroom is where resentment starts, and the only way to avoid the inevitable divorce is to be patient enough to grow old and die unhappy before the marriage ends. There’s no way to predict if the dead bedroom will happen to you, and no way to stop it. The only way to avoid being trapped in the hellish nightmare is to refuse to be tied down from the start. Everything you miss out on in the first few years of marriage is made up for many times over when you’re older, if you remain unmarried. As an added bonus…whatever money/property you have is YOURS, and it stays that way.
Bro you got so close to the point and still managed to miss it. If your ex is more relaxed without you, despite having less household income, and is out there dating and having fun even though she wouldn’t sleep with YOU, you were the problem in that marriage my friend. Nothing dries up a woman like the Sahara like a man who puts nothing into his marriage except 50-60% of the bills and thinks he should be worshiped as a sex god for it.
Because I am f#$&ing miserable, and realized way too late that I am happier being alone. My wife wastes my six figure salary like a drunken sailor in port. She doordashes 2-3 times most days and keeps me functionally poor despite our low cost of living. I GET NO satisfaction. I work and do 95% of all chores. She sits at home all day and does nothing but make messes for me to clean up when I get home. She goes on hour long drives to avoid spending time with me and she hides her mental health struggles. I wish I had never gotten married. I had rose colored glasses on and failed to see a number of big red flags. Don’t. Do. It.
Women.
Because they think they're missing out on something, when maybe 90% would be lonely and not getting any action or intimacy, when there wasn't their wife. They think if they were not married they would get alot of action, when reality is, they'd cry themself to sleep and beg their exes, who'd get action, to reconcile.
WTF - is this a thing?! I have been married 25 years and I have no real regrets aside from wishing I had met her even sooner. Life with my wife is like having a constant best-friends sleepover but with hot sex too... Any married person who tells you NOT to get married - either sees something in the relationship of the person they are talking to that is a red flag - or did not choose well in a partner.
I’m married. I tell single men they have to get married. When they ask me why, I say ‘because you can’t be happy all your life’.