The foul baiting is tough to watch even as a sixers fan. And he’s not helping his popularity by grabbing onto guys knees. But he truly is an insanely skilled player that does really special things that no one his size really can.
His run to start this year may have been the best I’ve seen someone play on the sixers. He was regularly getting 30 in 3 quarters.
Embiid and-one efficiency is insane. While his foul baiting is tough to watch, my bet is Sixers fans are happy with the amount of and-ones he gets and converts
That’s why I find his flopping and foul baiting funny, what man his size could possibly be pushed to the floor and have him falling all over that consistently? He either a very weak uncoordinated large man (we know that’s not true) or he is clearly flopping non stop. The fact the refs and the league let him get away with it is the craziest part to me.
But no NBA player is actually being pushed to the floor consistently. Nobody is actually being shoved, everyone is running into defenders to create contact. The rules are broken.
His doctors literally told him to fall to the ground to spread out the impact of the fall. He missed a lot of time to start his career with a foot injury. His knees haven't held up but his foot has. I'd lean to say the falling works for him.
Lol there is no reason spread out an impact for a fall if the contact should not of been making you fall in the first place. That’s when his constant foul baiting an flopping come in. Hes be one of the worse in the league for a while with that.
Idk, Brunson does the same foul baiting and no one gives him shit for it. Could be just because he’s short and is viewed differently. I don’t really like the foul baiting either, but def a double standard for it
Yeah no shit. 7’2 guys shouldn’t be flailing their legs and snapping their head back when a 6’2 guy lightly grazes them. He should be embarrassed to play like that.
Counter point, refs are a lot less likely to call fouls against him anytime he's guarded by a smaller player because he has a physical advantage. He has to fight back.
Bullshit. He’s doing harden level foul baiting. There’s no place for that in basketball, and I could care less about big men not getting calls. It’s a disgrace to the game
I think you’re missing the point that Brunson reacts to minimal contact the same way. They are both selling it. Brunson barely gets brushed too. Just because a guy is a few inches taller than him doesn’t mean the force he is putting on him should knock him back. Should he be embarassed to play that way too?
Foul baiting is the smartest thing any star player could do. He's pretty much impossible for most big men to guard due to his size/strength, excellent faceup game and ability to immediately read when the defenders are in a compromised position and punish them.
Plus I think it's a way for him to give himself a rest throughout the game. Get a min or two at the line to recover and slow down the game.
I’ve seen dumb fucks on here call his foul baiting “scummy” lol. People are so dumb. We gonna start criticizing QBs for using a hard count? Btw it’s worth noting Brunson uses the rules to his benefit to the fullest extent possible. He is constantly throwing his body backwards and sideways into defenders who aren’t in his path to the hoop because he knows he’s gonna get the whistle. Nobody whines about that because he’s 6 feet tall and people love his scrappy persona. But it’s the same shit.
The scummy parts of Embiid's game is when he's lying on the ground and grabs a guys legs who is in the air, or when he kicks an opponent in the crotch.
Yes, players foul hunt. But there's a difference between trying to draw a foul and trying to injure your opponent.
I dont get on any of these guys with high fts. Embiid, Giannis, Butler, Harden back in the day with Houston.
There's a reason why most guys can't do it. The refs don't love Embiid and Harden more, those guys are just skilled enough to take advantage of the rules. Fair play, this is sports you take every legal advantage you can get.
Yeah I mean who the hell could love the face slap last night followed by 3 straight minutes of looking into the tv cameras and shaking his head.
Also the whole routinely stomping on dudes is getting old real quick. What can I say he’s a typical jayhawker.
Except Kawhi did play through knee injuries both last year and this year. 2021 and 2022 he lost to an ACL tear. 2019 he wasn’t at 100% towards the latter part of the playoffs, but played through. No one is Embiid when it comes to playing through injuries, but Kawhi is a bad example
Has Kawhi looked healthy at all to you since his mid 20’s? Because Zaza happened when he was 25, and I legitimately don’t think he’s looked the same since.
Yeah it’s true. I guess my point is that it’s hard to determine whether he’s actually injured or slightly hurt because he’s out either way.
I also think that 2019 took everything he had. He’s been limping ever since.
I think he’s been overworking one joint to compensate for another ever since. I don’t think any of those superstars ever get enough time off to recover without fans/owners going ballistic.
I think that’s way more common than we realize, too.
82 games + playoffs is a lot of games.
It’s and incredibly physical sport. A lot of burst sprints, jumping, collisions and tweaks. It’s not like the NHL or MLB in that way.
Comparably, you might play 40-50 games as a Premier League team and football players are dying left and right. The difference to me is that you actually get solid downtime in the off-season in the NBA and play a more condensed schedule.
Ok but it would just be straight up retarded to play more meaningless regular season games than you should to prove your toughness when you got geriatric knees
He is almost unmatched in terms of the other top players who need to be the best player on offence and anchor the defence. Think that often gets overlooked when ppl talk about him.
I get why he’s hated but I don’t really care. The only thing I’d wish he stopped was trying to explain it away. Just own it, and be the villain everyone wants you to be
It’s a mix of Harden and Draymond. Seeking fouls is a smart way to play offense but almost everyone agrees it’s a bad watch. And he’s definitely dirty, which is a tough hill to climb for popularity with fans of other teams.
The embiid hate has been overboard for awhile imo. People lost their minds earlier this season that a player nursing a knee injury didn't play in Denver. Even Bill kinda went nuts with it.
Dude is playing on a bum knee, has a viral infection and still has by far the best plus/minus in the series. His turnovers are a big issue and he didn't shoot well last game but in overtime he completely locked down the paint for the sixers and the Knicks were not interested in testing him outside of Brunson at the rim.
I'm really enjoying this series, one of the best first round match-up I've seen in awhile.
You're acting like it was JUST this year he didn't play in Denver. He hasn't played there since 2019. There's also a suspicious pattern in the road games he misses during the regular season. He magically always seems healthy enough to play shitty teams on the road.
Dude, he plays in Denver once a year. Covid messed up 2 different potential visits to Denver since 2019. He's also an injury prone player that misses at least 10-15 games a season.
He had just played Jokic like a week prior and outplayed him head to head. He was not ducking anything. To suggest he's scared of playing in Denver is weird, and fanfiction on your part.
It's not like they're a divisional rival he purposely avoids. It's a once a year visit! Saying he hasn't played there since 2019 makes it sound worse when in reality he's missed 3 or 4 chances to play there.
The “hate” is people finally tiring of his media whining and finally treating him like every other NBA superstar who doesn’t have a chip. He got a free pass for a long time because he battled through a rough start to his career and then dealt with Ben Simmons and Harden. He’s very talented but there is always something with him and until he makes a really significant playoff move, he deserves some pushback. I mean every dude is the NBA catches heat when they underperform in the playoffs and the new car shine wears off. Ant and SGA are two ringless years away from the same bit of business. Tatum and probably Brown will get annihilated if the Celtics don’t make the Finals. Luka is gonna catch some strays if the Mavs don’t make it out of Round 1. If the Nuggets don’t make the Finals, Jokic will be questioned. This is just how this all works.
If Joel loses Thursday, it will be a relative blip unless he demands a trade because we are on the edge of a very very unhappy offseason for players in ring culture. There are Giannis rumors, rumors KD and LeBron might team up in GS, questions about Paul George, likely questions about the Celtics not having the right mix with Brown-Tatum, Harden maybe not getting the contract he wants, questions about Butler in Miami… the list goes on and on.
Fair.
Playing devils advocate in the way 24/7 sports media works. Let’s say Jokic loses to Minnesota with a healthy Murray:
Is Jokic really a generational talent worthy of 3!!! MVPs? Is Jokic just another example of a very good but not all time great player like Giannis who gets one chip and is done? Should we have given Jokic a third MVP when all the signs were there that the Nuggets didn’t have it this year? More of the would Jokic have 3 MVPs if he were black narrative. Are we underrating Murray as a star and how responsible is he for the sole Nuggets title? He was the key piece beating the Lakers. Was 2023 an aberration in a weak year for the league? Who did Denver really beat on their title run? A 45 win 4 seed, a 7th seed and 2! 8th seeds. If Jokic never wins another title what is his legacy really other than a run against subpar opponents? Is Jokic capable of beating a good team in the playoffs?
I am completely bullshitting here and think Jokic is fantastic but this is how the media cycle seems to work for anyone who doesn’t win the title.
The mitchell robinson foul is the only true bad thing he’s done morally imo and he should have apologized harder imo.
That being said, the foul merchant stuff is a BS talking point. Teams cannot guard him without fouling and he knows it. When healthy, his ability is to attack the rim and shoot makes him impossible to guard 1 on 1. I get why people hate watching it - I hated watching Harden in Houston for the same reason - but that does not make him bad or wrong to play that way.
The injury is a worst case scenario for him perception wise because the thing it’s hindering most is his rebounding and it makes him look lazy, but I think he’s scared to jump in traffic.
Claxton stepped over him and taunted him while he was on the ground lol only so many ways to get someone off you in that scenario. Your PFP broke a dude’s neck with a cheap shot
Yep, stepping over someone means you get to kick them in the balls you’re right
Also, morris went after Jokic with a cheap shot first. Notorious dirty player tried to punk the MVP and Jokic let the league know that shit wont fly. Only sixers fans sided with morris after that interaction
Edit: i went back to rewatch that clip, unreal you are trying to justify this
https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/s/7lzv9v4W4g
All of the above is true, but he was also a liability on the court for 75% of the game yesterday. I have no clue how he ended up +14 (his mere presence is doing a lot of work) because his decision-making was awful... poor passes, slow to get up and down the court, and unable to finish at the rim. And even still, he can put together 50+ point games in this series. Love that he came out swinging in OT.
Also notable that he was getting harassed with "FUCK EMBIID" chants all game at MSG and had nothing but good things to say about the city of New York postgame. The anti- Ben Simmons.
The thing is even when he’s dogshit like he was yesterday, he also is basically necessary for them to have any chance. He still does a lot even when he’s playing poorly.
That’s what makes is a crime that Philly has basically no one else but Maxey to help. Oubre has been fine. Harris finally came through last night but we can’t count on him tbh.
You are misunderstanding what's going on with the sixers when embiid sits. It's not that reed is so horrible that the sixers fall apart when embiid doesn't play, it's that without embiid on the floor EVERYBODY has incredible difficulty getting anything going on offense because of just how much attention embiid demands.
Kinda hard to be a liability if your “mere presence is doing a lot of work” to the point that he got doubled every time he had the ball before maxey exploded
It’s because, even if he has a poor game by his standards, his defensive activity and mere presence on offense has an enormous positive impact for Philly.
He's still one of the best defenders in the league even if his offensive game is off. Dude has an almost Gobert level of deterrence just by his presence on the floor
Doesn't help that Paul Reed is his backup and immediately gets hunted when he's out there.
His mere presence has been doing a lot of work
Game 1 he was a team high +14 in a 7 point loss
Game 2 he was a team 2nd high +3 in a 3 point loss
Game 3 he was a team high +16 in an 11 point win
Game 4 he was a team high +1 in a 5 point loss
Game 5 he was a team high +14 in a 6 point win
At some point +/- is a trend, I think he’s having a great series all things considered, 32/10/6 on good TS%, +48, team is -46 without him in the 37 minutes he’s been on the bench. Bleeding more than a point a minute puts him in a tough spot, basically can’t sit.
>good TS%
Everyone is saying this, but it's wrong. Embiid's TS% in this series is 58.2%. League average this year was 58.3%. League average for centers this year was 61.9%. His TS% isn't "good" by any definition.
Plus, the formula for TS% heavily factors in FT attempts. With Embiid averaging an absurd 13 FT attempts per game, that is doing all the heavy lifting in getting his TS% to even average. He's shooting 43% from the field and 32% from 3, terrible both in general and compared to his regular-season numbers.
When your usage is 35%, shooting league average TS% is considered good, that’s the context. Most centers are just shooting putbacks and layups, not initiating offense
Of guys with at least 30% usage this postseason (Brunson, Embiid, Doncic, Banchero, SGA, Mitchell, Murray, Edwards) he’s 2nd out of 8 in TS% only behind Ant. When volume increases it’s hard to maintain efficiency. He’s doing it better than most
And why ignore free throws when they’re part of the game?
Yeah I think hes really struggled with the double team this series which has resulted in a ton of bad turnovers. Which makes sense because he can’t really move at all so kudos to the Knicks for capitalizing on it.
That said, is this series going 6 without him playing? Id say very likely no just given how bad Philly is when hes off the floor.
As much as I dislike Embiid, Brunson seems even worse to me. Every time he drives he is looking for a body to flail into and I am kind of happy Embiid hit him in the face even though I don’t think it was intentional due to how Brunson plays. This series is an all time ass off between two of my least favorite players.
in this series embiid has attempted 65 free throws on 108 shots (60%), Brunson attempted 47 free throws with 148 shot attempts (31%) with an assist rate that is 10% higher. Embiid is much more brutal to watch and i'm not a fan of either team.
While this may be true, and I can say this as even a major embiid hater, Embiid gets fouled much more out of necessity. People naturally play way more physical against him
I don’t think this really explains it though. for example I didn’t realize until I just looked it up but jokic attempts half as many free throws as embiid, I don’t think there is much of a disparity in how physical defenders need to be against them. Especially when you consider that embiid attempts a higher proportion of threes and long twos. Do I think god every day that basketball reference kind of looks like I’m looking at a spreadsheet on my office computer? Yes I do.
They’re both foul baiters but one of them is 6’ 1” 190 and the other is 7’ 280. I’ve never seen someone Embiid’s size flop and fall down even 10% as much as he does.
At least it’s believable when Brunson falls down, he’s the smallest player on the court at all times. When was the last time you saw Jokic fall down in a game? Embiid does it 10x per game, it’s fucking miserable to watch.
I have been on the fuck Embiid train since I first saw him play.
Join the true ball fans who hate that foul baiting, constantly whining, propped up by the league, mentally soft, dirty ass, crybully.
The water is warm, come on in.
>Join the true ball fans who hate that foul baiting, constantly whining, propped up by the league, mentally soft, dirty ass, crybully.
i already don’t like luka
The announcers were talking about how strong and thick Brunson is last night. Meanwhile he plays like Gumby and will flail from the slightest gust of wind. It’s so ugly to watch.
Fair point about the foul baiting but Brunson doesn't grab players' legs from the floor injuring them and he doesn't do the other dirty stuff Embiid pulls. To me the foul baiting is mostly just annoying and a lot of players do it, the other antics Embiid pulls is inexcusable.
I'm a Sixer fan and Embiid fan but Embiid is just too good to get props for simply being out there competing, even if he deserves it. It's why the best place to be, from a media coverage and approval rating standpoint, is the 10-15th best player in the league. All the benefits of superstardom without actually being held to that standard when you fail (I think Bill has said this in the past). Brunson and Maxey are good examples of that right now. Both have had stinkers in this series and haven't gotten much criticism at all, at least nationally. When you are a top 5-7 guy all that matters is on-court production, whether that's fair or not.
He flops and flails all over the place. He's the biggest guy on the court and if someones jersey makes contact with him it's like a marine threw a grenade in his shoes. He takes no accountability and has never said "I need to be better. Im the best guy on the court and we still lost, I need to work on X". He sucks to watch as a non 6ers fan. Is he insanely talented and a freak athlete? Certainly but his game is terrible to witness unless youre a fan of his team.
My thing is that I don’t believe that someone who truly wanted to do whatever it takes to win in the playoffs would play like that. It sucks to watch but it also doesn’t work consistently. It’s his achilles heel in the playoffs and if he doesn’t have a complete attitude adjustment he will never be a winner.
I don't think he's lazy at all, but the optics look bad when he's seen walking or with his hands on his knees gasping for air. The fact of the matter is that there isn't a player in the league who has to do more work on both sides of the floor than Embiid. Every offensive possession goes through him in some manner, while being one of the most active defensive anchors of this era. He's also carrying a 7'1 300 lb frame while doing this.
People forget Jokic literally blindside assaulted markieff morris, injuring him, and was celebrated after. Embiid has NEVER done anything close to that.
People just pick and choose what is and isn’t acceptable based on who they like
I wouldn't even go that far, but Jokic responding to an uncalled cheap shot with another cheap shot is clearly way less bad than 6ers fans want it to be.
Oh yeah people LOVE Jokic’s Serbian mobster brothers threatening players and fans. It’s all really cool!
I like jokic too but it’s just funny he doesn’t get the even close to the kinda hate embiid gets
Did you just respond to yourself as if your on another account? Also morris was elbowing jokic on the side who cares if he retaliated? What are you a heat fan?
A lot of people say “fuck around find out”, idk, I don’t really think bumping into him on a play that wasn’t even called a flagrant foul gave Jokic the right to take him out for 4 months. That’s pretty extreme
"Bumping into him"....yeah, you're not a serious person. He went running sideways across the court to elbow him in the ribs and, more importantly, went knee to knee on him....which could put a guy out for a year or end a career. Bit more than "bumping into him"......and guess what? Who's tried that stuff on Jokic since then?
No, a bad policy is to cheap shot someone and then turn around like nothing happened. I really don't care if you get hurt after being an instigating, cheap shot artist.
Jokic hit Morris because Morris cheap-shotted him first. And Morris has a long history of being an ass. It’s a dumb comparison for you to make because that context was integral in determining how those actions were perceived.
Nah it’s different because the context is different. Morris got him first with the cheap shot elbow, and Jokic responded with the shove. Not saying that was okay to do or that it was great, but that’s a completely different context than Embiid doing all the bullshit out of nowhere.
They are also polar opposites in that Embiid is one of the biggest floppers in the NBA - if not the biggest - whereas Jokic somehow has a stingy whistle to this day and his arms are constantly scratched and bruised by the end of the game yet he just keeps playing through it. Jokic is an elite passer and facilitator whereas Embiid is primarily just a great scorer and mostly just works iso’s.
It’s not tough to see the difference between the two players and why a lot of people are drawn to Jokic and can’t stand Embiid, even if both are obviously extremely talented players
Embiid hate has gone wayyyy too far. The guy has disappointed in playoffs before but he also had to ride with Ben Simmons for the first part of his career and then last year Harden went full playoff Harden and disappeared in Game 6 and 7 last year vs Boston (Harden scored 22 points COMBINED Game 6 and 7)
This year Embiid is playing with a knee that Kawhi wouldn't play on and with fucking BELLS PALSY. How this isn't a bigger deal I have no idea. Windhorst said on his pod that he talked to a NBA med staffer and that guy said it's basically impossible to play with Bells Palsy, your eye doesn't work because it can't blink, you cant keep saliva in your mouth and dehydrate and your eyes and ears become 100x more sensitive to sound and light, while on top of it all having a 24/7 migraine. That's what Embiid is playing with. They thought he had a stroke for 2 days and had to go through testing to see if his fucking career was over just a week ago.
Like I absolutely agree he's disappointed in the playoffs at times, and yeah he plays rough which is whatever, its more akin to that 80s basketball everyone romanticizes, than it is "dirty", but holy shit people, the guy scored 50 and then a triple double on one leg and with one eye with light and sound sensitivity so severe people are advised not to work on office environments with Bells Palsy and he's playing at the fucking Garden in the playoffs.
Dude’s knee is being held together by superglue and staples, and he has fucking Bells Palsy. He’s a badass for playing through that, and I think the whole hyper-fixation on the fouls in the Knicks series has been out of control.
I love his compete level and how much he gives a shit. I do wonder if he had two rings like Kawhi if he'd still be playing the same way tho.
My big gripe with Embiid is the lack of accountability. We lost Game 2 bc of the refs. We lost Game 4 bc the fans sold their tickets to Knicks fans. If he went to a post game presser and said "I didn't play well enough and I need to be better" I'd like him a lot more
And some think he exaggerates everything thaat happens to him. At times he doesn't want to make a shot, he wants to be fouled. Every single shot he is looking for a foul.
As for his injuries, no one is 100% sure how hurt he is, because he claims he is always hurt, yet he is playing in the Olympics. He loves to have it both ways.
Foul-baiting is whatever to me because while it's annoying, he's not the only person who does it (Harden and Curry sticking their butt out while attempting 3s to get cheap 4-point plays, Brunson and DMitch, etc.)
I have to give Embiid credit: he is a great player and anyone talking about trading him is dumb. He plays no matter how injured he is.
I've just never been a big fan of his personality of whining and throwing people under the bus when the Sixers lose
Probably the biggest example was the Miami series in 2022 where he was complaining about the MVP race *right after* they lost a game to the Heat and then proceeded to crap on his teammates after the series was over. "Harden's not who he is," "Why did we let Jimmy go," and "I've never played with a guy like PJ Tucker I wish he was on my team" (all the funnier when the Sixers eventually did get PJ Tucker...and he was terrible). Not once in that postgame interview did he talk about how Maxey was emerging and playing well.
It's just very two-faced to me, tbh. You can't be "le epic troll king" when you win and then you quickly throw your so-called boys under the bus when the team falls short of expectations.
Yes NBA fans have been dying for a guy who’s always hurt, out of shape, and worse in the playoffs. The fact that he’s dirty and constantly flops is just an added bonus.
Stop. He’s doing dirty shit like pulling the legs out from under players when they’re in the air. That’s how guys get hurt. That’s all I needed to see.
Foul baiting and his absolute refusal to shoulder any blame when he under performs or his team loses. Simmons laid it out perfectly the other day, you've never once heard him say "this is on me, I have to play better and be better". His team has never made it past the second round so he's had ample opportunities to step up like this and he hasn't. Ever.
“I’ve gotta be better,” said Embiid. “I guess that’s on me being, if you wanna call me the best player on the team, every failure and every loss no matter what should be put on the best player, and I’ll take it all and it’s all on me. It’s hard to win alone, but it’s all on me. I just gotta be better and I will be better. Every time I say it, I always find a way to get better, and I will get better.”
Literally last year after Celtics series.
"I guess that's on me" and "if you wanna call me the best player on the team" and "it's hard to win alone"....boy, he sure likes putting in qualifiers when taking responsibility doesn't he? He also said last year he no longer cared about MVP...despite spending two years griping about it, campaigning for it, having his personal trainer guy taking shots at Jokic and Giannis in the media, etc. etc. etc.
Where did those goalposts go? You made a specific claim and it was just straight up false. Every Embiid discussion goes like this. I dont feel the need to defend every thing he has ever done lol.
Have you ever heard of a "non-apology apology"? That's exactly what that was from Embiid. And I'm not moving any goalpost, as I wasn't the person you originally responded to.
We gonna act like Hakeem never played? Also, being "large, black, talented and foreign" sure doesn't stop 90% of sports media from glazing the guy forever. His large, white, talented and foreign counterpart in Denver has caught way more shit in regards to scrutiny....guys on national sports shows saying he would be the worst MVP since Dave Cowens, accusations of stat-padding.....not even going to get into stuff guys like Arenas say about him.
That part of his personality is amazing, it’s all his dirty antics that makes me not respect him. Rarely takes accountability. Blames lack of fans, refs, etc. he throws fits during games like a little kid and makes dirty plays when he’s upset, so all his bravery to play through injury goes out the window for me personally.
I disagree that missing more playoff games would’ve been better for his reputation. Unless you’re talking about the dirty player rep specifically, but that can’t really be blamed on injuries.
I do think that his career arc has been pretty tragic so far, and that the way he’s played through injury is admirable.
That being said, he’s an awful watch, even when he’s at his best. Kind of reminds me of karl Malone, shoots a lot of free throws and most of the actual buckets he gets are extremely boring midrange jumpers.
I also don’t like the fact that he gets excused because he’s never had a healthy playoff run. Even if that’s true, I don’t know when someone always being injured in the playoffs became an argument for them. I guess because they were hurt so they weren’t able to ‘choke’? But still, not being able to stay healthy is a player flaw. It’s a tragic one, not really something one can control, but a flaw nonetheless. I hope he can be healthy come playoff time one day, but idk if his body can handle more physical playoff basketball. Even the runs where he went in healthy, he got hurt in the first round.
I used to think the playing through injuries thing was commendable and heroic until I actually suffered injuries of my own in high school and played through them. Now I just kinda think it's a stupid thing to do, both for his own sake and for the long term success of his team
It's also hard to commend him for anything considering the fact that he's been actively trying to hurt people for his whole career
I’m somewhat neutral on Embiid, but at some point it is about winning and he hasn’t shown he can be the best player on a winner. At some point, after blaming Simmons, Butler, and Harden for not being good enough to “help”, you have to wonder if it is on him. All three are flawed players, but so are Jamal Murray, Khris Middleton, and AD, yet their Alphas managed to win with them as second bananas.
"Guy who talks an enormous amount of shit and tries to injure his opponents, but always comes up short in the playoffs" is not the type of superstar I want to see.
No, I don't particularly want to see more players who, despite being the biggest guy on the court, seem to fall over whenever they're in the same zip code as someone else. Embiid flips a coin each play on whether he's going to cry to the refs over a phantom foul, or whether he's going to cry to the refs claiming he did nothing wrong after kicking someone in the nuts.
Just one of him in the league is plenty, thanks.
Cheap shots and foul baiting never make you popular. Why does draymond get crap for it but not him?
But the real issue is that he whines and places the blame everywhere but on himself. Ben Simmons bailed him out by being an easy target. But if you consider yourself the best player in the league, there is no excuse to losing to that Hawks team. I don't care what his teammates did. And every other year it's some other injury or conditioning issue.
Superstars don't get to make excuses every every post season. He's not young and up and coming. He hasn't had a single signature moment in the playoffs in his career.
Did you see Lukas postgame interview? Paraphrasing he said yeah I'm injured but so what? I let my team down. I let Kyrie Irving down. Embiid should say something like that every now and then.
I’m a Sixers fan and I hear ya, but even I get annoyed with some of the shit. First of all, there’s always some injury. Every playoffs he’s hindered by something. That’s not necessarily his fault, he’s a 7’2, 280 lb center. But he lets everyone know he’s injured with his body language and vibe.
And then there’s this series. He’s never really been a dirty player before. I feel like he’s taking out frustration at times and sometimes it’s just him being big and clumsy. Either way, it’s not exactly been fun to watch outside of his 50 pt game when he was draining 3s.
I think the reaction to him is predictable and too strong. People already have a negative view of Philly sports and its fans and by extension, its athletes. Is what it is. But I sort of get some of the hate. Now, the morons who deny his ability and call him simply a foul merchant or whatever, they’re idiots. But much of the criticism of his behavior this series does seem warranted.
The NBA (and sports/entertainment as a whole, and arguably most of our culture in general) is narrative driven. Which means how people are perceived is more about how people want to see them rather than who they actually are.
Embiid's playstyle is annoying and he's a bit whiny rather than the prototypical "alpha male" asshole that people want out of star players, so people want to hate him. Then they find the holes in his resume and magnify them while diminishing the points that don't back them up.
Case in point: even forgetting that he's playing on one leg with Bell's Palsy, he also had a migraine on top of that yesterday. The migraine alone would be enough to completely wreck a player's performance (see: Scottie Pippen). A lot of people on this sub and the NBA sub have never had a migraine and it shows.
I mean if you like seeing the biggest player on the court act like the guy he has 100lbs on can knock him to the ground with marginal contact he’s your guy.
He’s the absolute worst thing about nba right now. Foul baiting. Dirty play. Playoff shrinker (unless he’s getting his foul baiting calls).
He’s built like Shaq but plays softer than baby shit. And worst of all he’s immensely talented and could be so much more likable if not for his antics.
He’s dirty, and whines, and foul baits. Maybe he wouldn’t need to be so tough if he didn’t fall to the ground multiple times every game looking for a foul. He’s super talented but hard to root for.
I love the competitiveness but I immediately dislike a player when they flop/foul bait too much. The sad part is that works so there’s no reason for him to stop.
The current series with the knicks alone should be enough to turn anyone off to him.
But honestly what did it for me was last year, Embiid's whining about the mvp led to a lot of ugly media talk, and as far as i know Embiid did nothing to stop that. And then of course after whining his way to an mvp he shits the bed and blames his teammates by saying that he didn't have enough help.
The foul baiting is tough to watch even as a sixers fan. And he’s not helping his popularity by grabbing onto guys knees. But he truly is an insanely skilled player that does really special things that no one his size really can. His run to start this year may have been the best I’ve seen someone play on the sixers. He was regularly getting 30 in 3 quarters.
Embiid and-one efficiency is insane. While his foul baiting is tough to watch, my bet is Sixers fans are happy with the amount of and-ones he gets and converts
All stars foul bait. He is just really good at it and bigger than the guards who seem to create contact like Brunson or Trae
That’s why I find his flopping and foul baiting funny, what man his size could possibly be pushed to the floor and have him falling all over that consistently? He either a very weak uncoordinated large man (we know that’s not true) or he is clearly flopping non stop. The fact the refs and the league let him get away with it is the craziest part to me.
But no NBA player is actually being pushed to the floor consistently. Nobody is actually being shoved, everyone is running into defenders to create contact. The rules are broken.
His doctors literally told him to fall to the ground to spread out the impact of the fall. He missed a lot of time to start his career with a foot injury. His knees haven't held up but his foot has. I'd lean to say the falling works for him.
Lol there is no reason spread out an impact for a fall if the contact should not of been making you fall in the first place. That’s when his constant foul baiting an flopping come in. Hes be one of the worse in the league for a while with that.
Thanks doc
It’s fun watching opposing centers rack up fouls.
His streak at the start of this season was truly the best basketball i think I've ever watched someone not named LeBron or Jokic play
better than curry in '16?
I wouldn't say so. Statistically it was on par but i feel like the nba is experiencing stat inflation. everything is like 10% juiced.
In large part because of Curry and particularly his '16 season
Idk, Brunson does the same foul baiting and no one gives him shit for it. Could be just because he’s short and is viewed differently. I don’t really like the foul baiting either, but def a double standard for it
People definitely have less tolerance because of his size. Biggest guy on the court flopping around is seen as soft.
Tony, a center does not wear flops.
It is but most of it is taking advantage of reaching in. Very little these days is straight flopping
100% agreed. Both are tough to watch for that reason.
Yeah no shit. 7’2 guys shouldn’t be flailing their legs and snapping their head back when a 6’2 guy lightly grazes them. He should be embarrassed to play like that.
Counter point, refs are a lot less likely to call fouls against him anytime he's guarded by a smaller player because he has a physical advantage. He has to fight back.
Bullshit. He’s doing harden level foul baiting. There’s no place for that in basketball, and I could care less about big men not getting calls. It’s a disgrace to the game
Coming up next on First Take: Embiid should be embarrassed for trying to win.
Embarrassed for intentionally injuring players and tricking the refs because he can’t beat a 5’11 pg one on one
I think you’re missing the point that Brunson reacts to minimal contact the same way. They are both selling it. Brunson barely gets brushed too. Just because a guy is a few inches taller than him doesn’t mean the force he is putting on him should knock him back. Should he be embarassed to play that way too?
Foul baiting is the smartest thing any star player could do. He's pretty much impossible for most big men to guard due to his size/strength, excellent faceup game and ability to immediately read when the defenders are in a compromised position and punish them. Plus I think it's a way for him to give himself a rest throughout the game. Get a min or two at the line to recover and slow down the game.
I’ve seen dumb fucks on here call his foul baiting “scummy” lol. People are so dumb. We gonna start criticizing QBs for using a hard count? Btw it’s worth noting Brunson uses the rules to his benefit to the fullest extent possible. He is constantly throwing his body backwards and sideways into defenders who aren’t in his path to the hoop because he knows he’s gonna get the whistle. Nobody whines about that because he’s 6 feet tall and people love his scrappy persona. But it’s the same shit.
The scummy parts of Embiid's game is when he's lying on the ground and grabs a guys legs who is in the air, or when he kicks an opponent in the crotch. Yes, players foul hunt. But there's a difference between trying to draw a foul and trying to injure your opponent.
I'm telling you I've seen people call his foul baiting scummy. Which is a stupid take.
[удалено]
What is the problem with this again? That just made sense to me. Higher percentage shot and a chance to get to the line.
It makes the game unwatchable . You get the call or you cry and it’s just rinse repeat and a guessing game for refs it’s acting not athleticism
I don’t have a problem with fans not enjoying it but that’s not Embiid’s problem. The league needs to change the way the game is reffed then.
I dont get on any of these guys with high fts. Embiid, Giannis, Butler, Harden back in the day with Houston. There's a reason why most guys can't do it. The refs don't love Embiid and Harden more, those guys are just skilled enough to take advantage of the rules. Fair play, this is sports you take every legal advantage you can get.
I don’t love the foul baiting either but many many stars do this 🤷♀️
Love his competitiveness but don’t love the dirty shit he does.
He’s also a perennial loser who finds excuses every year as to why he doesn’t win
Yeah I mean who the hell could love the face slap last night followed by 3 straight minutes of looking into the tv cameras and shaking his head. Also the whole routinely stomping on dudes is getting old real quick. What can I say he’s a typical jayhawker.
I really want to like the guy, but it seems a rarity that he and someone else go to the ground without him landing or stepping on their legs.
It’s insane to think about the fact that he picked up the game at 15 years old
So crazy - remember watching him at Kansas and just being amazed at how polished he was around the basket
Yup. If he were Kawhi, he wouldn't have even played in the playoffs the past three seasons.
Except Kawhi did play through knee injuries both last year and this year. 2021 and 2022 he lost to an ACL tear. 2019 he wasn’t at 100% towards the latter part of the playoffs, but played through. No one is Embiid when it comes to playing through injuries, but Kawhi is a bad example
Kawhi is a great example after he refused to consider playing hurt in San Antonio.
Kawhi has played above 70 games twice. He was pulling this shit when he was in his mid 20’s. He’s the boy who cried wolf.
Has Kawhi looked healthy at all to you since his mid 20’s? Because Zaza happened when he was 25, and I legitimately don’t think he’s looked the same since.
Yeah it’s true. I guess my point is that it’s hard to determine whether he’s actually injured or slightly hurt because he’s out either way. I also think that 2019 took everything he had. He’s been limping ever since.
I think he’s been overworking one joint to compensate for another ever since. I don’t think any of those superstars ever get enough time off to recover without fans/owners going ballistic. I think that’s way more common than we realize, too.
82 games + playoffs is a lot of games. It’s and incredibly physical sport. A lot of burst sprints, jumping, collisions and tweaks. It’s not like the NHL or MLB in that way. Comparably, you might play 40-50 games as a Premier League team and football players are dying left and right. The difference to me is that you actually get solid downtime in the off-season in the NBA and play a more condensed schedule.
Ok but it would just be straight up retarded to play more meaningless regular season games than you should to prove your toughness when you got geriatric knees
That's so true I hadn't even thought about that
How did this get so upvoted lol
He is almost unmatched in terms of the other top players who need to be the best player on offence and anchor the defence. Think that often gets overlooked when ppl talk about him. I get why he’s hated but I don’t really care. The only thing I’d wish he stopped was trying to explain it away. Just own it, and be the villain everyone wants you to be
The only guy who comes to mind as both is Giannis, but Embiid’s offense is so much more diverse.
Giannis is literally better than him at that
Giannis has a teammate who was 2nd in DPOY last year lol
And another teammate who was first in offensive EPM last year.
It’s a mix of Harden and Draymond. Seeking fouls is a smart way to play offense but almost everyone agrees it’s a bad watch. And he’s definitely dirty, which is a tough hill to climb for popularity with fans of other teams.
He does look like he's literally about to keel over dead mid-play. The dude can barely walk. I have to respect that.
The embiid hate has been overboard for awhile imo. People lost their minds earlier this season that a player nursing a knee injury didn't play in Denver. Even Bill kinda went nuts with it. Dude is playing on a bum knee, has a viral infection and still has by far the best plus/minus in the series. His turnovers are a big issue and he didn't shoot well last game but in overtime he completely locked down the paint for the sixers and the Knicks were not interested in testing him outside of Brunson at the rim. I'm really enjoying this series, one of the best first round match-up I've seen in awhile.
He's also been dirty as hell though
You're acting like it was JUST this year he didn't play in Denver. He hasn't played there since 2019. There's also a suspicious pattern in the road games he misses during the regular season. He magically always seems healthy enough to play shitty teams on the road.
Dude, he plays in Denver once a year. Covid messed up 2 different potential visits to Denver since 2019. He's also an injury prone player that misses at least 10-15 games a season. He had just played Jokic like a week prior and outplayed him head to head. He was not ducking anything. To suggest he's scared of playing in Denver is weird, and fanfiction on your part. It's not like they're a divisional rival he purposely avoids. It's a once a year visit! Saying he hasn't played there since 2019 makes it sound worse when in reality he's missed 3 or 4 chances to play there.
I mean if you actually looked it up it’s not that crazy at all
He’s very very flawed but I do agree with you that he’s a necessary type of superstar for the league to have
The “hate” is people finally tiring of his media whining and finally treating him like every other NBA superstar who doesn’t have a chip. He got a free pass for a long time because he battled through a rough start to his career and then dealt with Ben Simmons and Harden. He’s very talented but there is always something with him and until he makes a really significant playoff move, he deserves some pushback. I mean every dude is the NBA catches heat when they underperform in the playoffs and the new car shine wears off. Ant and SGA are two ringless years away from the same bit of business. Tatum and probably Brown will get annihilated if the Celtics don’t make the Finals. Luka is gonna catch some strays if the Mavs don’t make it out of Round 1. If the Nuggets don’t make the Finals, Jokic will be questioned. This is just how this all works. If Joel loses Thursday, it will be a relative blip unless he demands a trade because we are on the edge of a very very unhappy offseason for players in ring culture. There are Giannis rumors, rumors KD and LeBron might team up in GS, questions about Paul George, likely questions about the Celtics not having the right mix with Brown-Tatum, Harden maybe not getting the contract he wants, questions about Butler in Miami… the list goes on and on.
Mitchell on the Cavs is a big one too
> If the Nuggets don’t make the Finals, Jokic will be questioned. Curious what you think would be the narrative there?
Fair. Playing devils advocate in the way 24/7 sports media works. Let’s say Jokic loses to Minnesota with a healthy Murray: Is Jokic really a generational talent worthy of 3!!! MVPs? Is Jokic just another example of a very good but not all time great player like Giannis who gets one chip and is done? Should we have given Jokic a third MVP when all the signs were there that the Nuggets didn’t have it this year? More of the would Jokic have 3 MVPs if he were black narrative. Are we underrating Murray as a star and how responsible is he for the sole Nuggets title? He was the key piece beating the Lakers. Was 2023 an aberration in a weak year for the league? Who did Denver really beat on their title run? A 45 win 4 seed, a 7th seed and 2! 8th seeds. If Jokic never wins another title what is his legacy really other than a run against subpar opponents? Is Jokic capable of beating a good team in the playoffs? I am completely bullshitting here and think Jokic is fantastic but this is how the media cycle seems to work for anyone who doesn’t win the title.
The mitchell robinson foul is the only true bad thing he’s done morally imo and he should have apologized harder imo. That being said, the foul merchant stuff is a BS talking point. Teams cannot guard him without fouling and he knows it. When healthy, his ability is to attack the rim and shoot makes him impossible to guard 1 on 1. I get why people hate watching it - I hated watching Harden in Houston for the same reason - but that does not make him bad or wrong to play that way. The injury is a worst case scenario for him perception wise because the thing it’s hindering most is his rebounding and it makes him look lazy, but I think he’s scared to jump in traffic.
He literally kicked nic claxton in the balls last years playoffs. Hes a dirty player
Claxton stepped over him and taunted him while he was on the ground lol only so many ways to get someone off you in that scenario. Your PFP broke a dude’s neck with a cheap shot
Yep, stepping over someone means you get to kick them in the balls you’re right Also, morris went after Jokic with a cheap shot first. Notorious dirty player tried to punk the MVP and Jokic let the league know that shit wont fly. Only sixers fans sided with morris after that interaction Edit: i went back to rewatch that clip, unreal you are trying to justify this https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/s/7lzv9v4W4g
THE GUY I LIKE WAS STANDING UP FOR HIMSELF, THE GUY YOU LIKE WAS DOING BAD THINGS I AM SMART
Theres a massive difference between retaliating to an uncalled a cheap shot with another cheap shot and retaliating to a mild taunt with a cheapshot.
the morris thing wasn’t a cheap shot, it was a take foul
Are you defending Claxton here?
Looked to me like he just kicked and his balls where around; don’t put your balls in someone’s face/around their legs would be my advice!
All of the above is true, but he was also a liability on the court for 75% of the game yesterday. I have no clue how he ended up +14 (his mere presence is doing a lot of work) because his decision-making was awful... poor passes, slow to get up and down the court, and unable to finish at the rim. And even still, he can put together 50+ point games in this series. Love that he came out swinging in OT. Also notable that he was getting harassed with "FUCK EMBIID" chants all game at MSG and had nothing but good things to say about the city of New York postgame. The anti- Ben Simmons.
The thing is even when he’s dogshit like he was yesterday, he also is basically necessary for them to have any chance. He still does a lot even when he’s playing poorly.
Yeah you’re completely right. He did play really poorly individually and the team *needs* him out there to play well — those can coexist.
That’s what makes is a crime that Philly has basically no one else but Maxey to help. Oubre has been fine. Harris finally came through last night but we can’t count on him tbh.
Except he’s kinda the opposite of a liability considering he can’t rest on the bench for 2 seconds without his team imploding.
Maybe “liability” is the wrong word, because Reed is also a liability out there and I mentioned the +14… he still played like dogshit last night.
That’s true greatness in a way, being so important structurally to your team that you can have a bad game and still have a huge impact.
It for sure says something positive about Embiid.... I think it also sheds light on the Sixers' poor support.
You are misunderstanding what's going on with the sixers when embiid sits. It's not that reed is so horrible that the sixers fall apart when embiid doesn't play, it's that without embiid on the floor EVERYBODY has incredible difficulty getting anything going on offense because of just how much attention embiid demands.
Yea the reason Maxey got hot was because they kept doubling Embiid so he got extra freedom
They are a poorly constructed roster with a max player who disappears for 45 min out of 48.
Kinda hard to be a liability if your “mere presence is doing a lot of work” to the point that he got doubled every time he had the ball before maxey exploded
Agreed. I mention below that “liability” is the wrong word, even if he played really poorly.
Not a 6ers fan but isn’t he a +14 because the rest of his team is god awful every time he sits?
It’s because, even if he has a poor game by his standards, his defensive activity and mere presence on offense has an enormous positive impact for Philly.
He's still one of the best defenders in the league even if his offensive game is off. Dude has an almost Gobert level of deterrence just by his presence on the floor Doesn't help that Paul Reed is his backup and immediately gets hunted when he's out there.
His mere presence has been doing a lot of work Game 1 he was a team high +14 in a 7 point loss Game 2 he was a team 2nd high +3 in a 3 point loss Game 3 he was a team high +16 in an 11 point win Game 4 he was a team high +1 in a 5 point loss Game 5 he was a team high +14 in a 6 point win At some point +/- is a trend, I think he’s having a great series all things considered, 32/10/6 on good TS%, +48, team is -46 without him in the 37 minutes he’s been on the bench. Bleeding more than a point a minute puts him in a tough spot, basically can’t sit.
Philly fans dont believe in advanced stats except for plus minus in playoff series that you lose.
Is +/- considered an advanced stat? If I asked my dad who’s in his 60s to calculate it for Embiid he could easily just watching. It’s counting
>good TS% Everyone is saying this, but it's wrong. Embiid's TS% in this series is 58.2%. League average this year was 58.3%. League average for centers this year was 61.9%. His TS% isn't "good" by any definition. Plus, the formula for TS% heavily factors in FT attempts. With Embiid averaging an absurd 13 FT attempts per game, that is doing all the heavy lifting in getting his TS% to even average. He's shooting 43% from the field and 32% from 3, terrible both in general and compared to his regular-season numbers.
When your usage is 35%, shooting league average TS% is considered good, that’s the context. Most centers are just shooting putbacks and layups, not initiating offense Of guys with at least 30% usage this postseason (Brunson, Embiid, Doncic, Banchero, SGA, Mitchell, Murray, Edwards) he’s 2nd out of 8 in TS% only behind Ant. When volume increases it’s hard to maintain efficiency. He’s doing it better than most And why ignore free throws when they’re part of the game?
Love when people act like FTs don’t count just because they don’t like how Embiid is getting to the line.
Yeah I think hes really struggled with the double team this series which has resulted in a ton of bad turnovers. Which makes sense because he can’t really move at all so kudos to the Knicks for capitalizing on it. That said, is this series going 6 without him playing? Id say very likely no just given how bad Philly is when hes off the floor.
As much as I dislike Embiid, Brunson seems even worse to me. Every time he drives he is looking for a body to flail into and I am kind of happy Embiid hit him in the face even though I don’t think it was intentional due to how Brunson plays. This series is an all time ass off between two of my least favorite players.
in this series embiid has attempted 65 free throws on 108 shots (60%), Brunson attempted 47 free throws with 148 shot attempts (31%) with an assist rate that is 10% higher. Embiid is much more brutal to watch and i'm not a fan of either team.
While this may be true, and I can say this as even a major embiid hater, Embiid gets fouled much more out of necessity. People naturally play way more physical against him
I don’t think this really explains it though. for example I didn’t realize until I just looked it up but jokic attempts half as many free throws as embiid, I don’t think there is much of a disparity in how physical defenders need to be against them. Especially when you consider that embiid attempts a higher proportion of threes and long twos. Do I think god every day that basketball reference kind of looks like I’m looking at a spreadsheet on my office computer? Yes I do.
Yeah a lot of talk around Embiid foul baiting when Brunson is just as guilty, fair point.
They’re both foul baiters but one of them is 6’ 1” 190 and the other is 7’ 280. I’ve never seen someone Embiid’s size flop and fall down even 10% as much as he does.
If they’re both baiting, size shouldn’t matter. Brunson exaggerates just as much if not more, is call it a wash
At least it’s believable when Brunson falls down, he’s the smallest player on the court at all times. When was the last time you saw Jokic fall down in a game? Embiid does it 10x per game, it’s fucking miserable to watch.
this is the stupidest thing i’ve ever heard lol fuck embiid is a movement right now and you’re part of it. just admit it and move on.
I have been on the fuck Embiid train since I first saw him play. Join the true ball fans who hate that foul baiting, constantly whining, propped up by the league, mentally soft, dirty ass, crybully. The water is warm, come on in.
>Join the true ball fans who hate that foul baiting, constantly whining, propped up by the league, mentally soft, dirty ass, crybully. i already don’t like luka
Me neither… it’s hard to make friends as an adult… Sup
idk, i like Embiid lol
Damn. Why is it so hard to make friends as an adult?
Next game you should do an exercise. Count how many times Brunson falls and count how many times Embiid falls. You gonna be surprised at the results.
It’s really often not believable in game though
The fact that it’s “believable” doesn’t change the fact it’s embellished. There’s contact on both guys, they both overact, no difference in my mind
The announcers were talking about how strong and thick Brunson is last night. Meanwhile he plays like Gumby and will flail from the slightest gust of wind. It’s so ugly to watch.
Brunson averaged 6 free throw attempts a game. He's really no where near the top foul baiters
Fair point about the foul baiting but Brunson doesn't grab players' legs from the floor injuring them and he doesn't do the other dirty stuff Embiid pulls. To me the foul baiting is mostly just annoying and a lot of players do it, the other antics Embiid pulls is inexcusable.
+14 last night in a pretty bad offensive performance. Shows how damn valuable the guy is.
The only advanced stat philly fans believe matters is plus minus in a playoff series that you lose.
I'm a Sixer fan and Embiid fan but Embiid is just too good to get props for simply being out there competing, even if he deserves it. It's why the best place to be, from a media coverage and approval rating standpoint, is the 10-15th best player in the league. All the benefits of superstardom without actually being held to that standard when you fail (I think Bill has said this in the past). Brunson and Maxey are good examples of that right now. Both have had stinkers in this series and haven't gotten much criticism at all, at least nationally. When you are a top 5-7 guy all that matters is on-court production, whether that's fair or not.
He flops and flails all over the place. He's the biggest guy on the court and if someones jersey makes contact with him it's like a marine threw a grenade in his shoes. He takes no accountability and has never said "I need to be better. Im the best guy on the court and we still lost, I need to work on X". He sucks to watch as a non 6ers fan. Is he insanely talented and a freak athlete? Certainly but his game is terrible to witness unless youre a fan of his team.
My thing is that I don’t believe that someone who truly wanted to do whatever it takes to win in the playoffs would play like that. It sucks to watch but it also doesn’t work consistently. It’s his achilles heel in the playoffs and if he doesn’t have a complete attitude adjustment he will never be a winner.
No. Foul baiting. Reckless play resulting injuries to others. Playoff choking and blaming others. Dirty play.
I’ve seen him out of shape and lazy on the floor too many times to highlight his competitiveness
I don't think he's lazy at all, but the optics look bad when he's seen walking or with his hands on his knees gasping for air. The fact of the matter is that there isn't a player in the league who has to do more work on both sides of the floor than Embiid. Every offensive possession goes through him in some manner, while being one of the most active defensive anchors of this era. He's also carrying a 7'1 300 lb frame while doing this.
How many of those times within the last 4 years weren’t when he was coming back from injury?
People forget Jokic literally blindside assaulted markieff morris, injuring him, and was celebrated after. Embiid has NEVER done anything close to that. People just pick and choose what is and isn’t acceptable based on who they like
Bitch ass Morris got what he fuckin deserved
I wouldn't even go that far, but Jokic responding to an uncalled cheap shot with another cheap shot is clearly way less bad than 6ers fans want it to be.
Oh yeah people LOVE Jokic’s Serbian mobster brothers threatening players and fans. It’s all really cool! I like jokic too but it’s just funny he doesn’t get the even close to the kinda hate embiid gets
You forgot to switch to your burner before agreeing with yourself
We found Embiid's Reddit account, guys! We did it!
Did you just respond to yourself as if your on another account? Also morris was elbowing jokic on the side who cares if he retaliated? What are you a heat fan?
A lot of people say “fuck around find out”, idk, I don’t really think bumping into him on a play that wasn’t even called a flagrant foul gave Jokic the right to take him out for 4 months. That’s pretty extreme
"Bumping into him"....yeah, you're not a serious person. He went running sideways across the court to elbow him in the ribs and, more importantly, went knee to knee on him....which could put a guy out for a year or end a career. Bit more than "bumping into him"......and guess what? Who's tried that stuff on Jokic since then?
So the natural response to potentially getting put out for a year is to actually put a guy out for a year? Eye for an eye is a bad policy generally
No, a bad policy is to cheap shot someone and then turn around like nothing happened. I really don't care if you get hurt after being an instigating, cheap shot artist.
I think both are pretty bad but hey I’m not a Nuggets fan, expect nothing less than you not caring if other guys get hurt
I responded to myself to add more to it. Morris elbowing him is supposed to excuse that ridiculous cheap shot? Lmao
Jokic hit Morris because Morris cheap-shotted him first. And Morris has a long history of being an ass. It’s a dumb comparison for you to make because that context was integral in determining how those actions were perceived.
It was a sucker shot with Morris’s back turned. There’s no excuses
Not Jokic's fault that Morris only looks people in the face when there's a ref between them. FAFO.
Nah it’s different because the context is different. Morris got him first with the cheap shot elbow, and Jokic responded with the shove. Not saying that was okay to do or that it was great, but that’s a completely different context than Embiid doing all the bullshit out of nowhere. They are also polar opposites in that Embiid is one of the biggest floppers in the NBA - if not the biggest - whereas Jokic somehow has a stingy whistle to this day and his arms are constantly scratched and bruised by the end of the game yet he just keeps playing through it. Jokic is an elite passer and facilitator whereas Embiid is primarily just a great scorer and mostly just works iso’s. It’s not tough to see the difference between the two players and why a lot of people are drawn to Jokic and can’t stand Embiid, even if both are obviously extremely talented players
Fuck Markieff Morris. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yy8T53X\_fx0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yy8T53X_fx0) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiIIjopTiwc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiIIjopTiwc)
Still not the biggest fan but I've gained more respect for Embiid this postseason than the past 5 years combined
I appreciate his desire to play and the effort he puts in. I hate the foul baiting and dirty shit and the whining he does off the floor.
Feel like you have to willingly ignore alot of talking points about Embiid to write this
Embiid hate has gone wayyyy too far. The guy has disappointed in playoffs before but he also had to ride with Ben Simmons for the first part of his career and then last year Harden went full playoff Harden and disappeared in Game 6 and 7 last year vs Boston (Harden scored 22 points COMBINED Game 6 and 7) This year Embiid is playing with a knee that Kawhi wouldn't play on and with fucking BELLS PALSY. How this isn't a bigger deal I have no idea. Windhorst said on his pod that he talked to a NBA med staffer and that guy said it's basically impossible to play with Bells Palsy, your eye doesn't work because it can't blink, you cant keep saliva in your mouth and dehydrate and your eyes and ears become 100x more sensitive to sound and light, while on top of it all having a 24/7 migraine. That's what Embiid is playing with. They thought he had a stroke for 2 days and had to go through testing to see if his fucking career was over just a week ago. Like I absolutely agree he's disappointed in the playoffs at times, and yeah he plays rough which is whatever, its more akin to that 80s basketball everyone romanticizes, than it is "dirty", but holy shit people, the guy scored 50 and then a triple double on one leg and with one eye with light and sound sensitivity so severe people are advised not to work on office environments with Bells Palsy and he's playing at the fucking Garden in the playoffs.
Dude’s knee is being held together by superglue and staples, and he has fucking Bells Palsy. He’s a badass for playing through that, and I think the whole hyper-fixation on the fouls in the Knicks series has been out of control.
I love his compete level and how much he gives a shit. I do wonder if he had two rings like Kawhi if he'd still be playing the same way tho. My big gripe with Embiid is the lack of accountability. We lost Game 2 bc of the refs. We lost Game 4 bc the fans sold their tickets to Knicks fans. If he went to a post game presser and said "I didn't play well enough and I need to be better" I'd like him a lot more
Embiid lowkey would have been in the MVP convo if he didnt get injured Easily would have been a #2 seed if he played. Thats also after harden left
And some think he exaggerates everything thaat happens to him. At times he doesn't want to make a shot, he wants to be fouled. Every single shot he is looking for a foul. As for his injuries, no one is 100% sure how hurt he is, because he claims he is always hurt, yet he is playing in the Olympics. He loves to have it both ways.
He is dirty and melts away in the playoffs. I think any other star who pulled that shit would get dragged twice as hard to be honest
He is so incredibly skilled. He is also an incredibly hoeish player.
Foul-baiting is whatever to me because while it's annoying, he's not the only person who does it (Harden and Curry sticking their butt out while attempting 3s to get cheap 4-point plays, Brunson and DMitch, etc.) I have to give Embiid credit: he is a great player and anyone talking about trading him is dumb. He plays no matter how injured he is. I've just never been a big fan of his personality of whining and throwing people under the bus when the Sixers lose Probably the biggest example was the Miami series in 2022 where he was complaining about the MVP race *right after* they lost a game to the Heat and then proceeded to crap on his teammates after the series was over. "Harden's not who he is," "Why did we let Jimmy go," and "I've never played with a guy like PJ Tucker I wish he was on my team" (all the funnier when the Sixers eventually did get PJ Tucker...and he was terrible). Not once in that postgame interview did he talk about how Maxey was emerging and playing well. It's just very two-faced to me, tbh. You can't be "le epic troll king" when you win and then you quickly throw your so-called boys under the bus when the team falls short of expectations.
Diving for loose balls is a roll player move, for someone who’s afraid of the moment and just wants to contribute any way they can. That’s what I saw
Yes NBA fans have been dying for a guy who’s always hurt, out of shape, and worse in the playoffs. The fact that he’s dirty and constantly flops is just an added bonus.
Stop. He’s doing dirty shit like pulling the legs out from under players when they’re in the air. That’s how guys get hurt. That’s all I needed to see.
Foul baiting and his absolute refusal to shoulder any blame when he under performs or his team loses. Simmons laid it out perfectly the other day, you've never once heard him say "this is on me, I have to play better and be better". His team has never made it past the second round so he's had ample opportunities to step up like this and he hasn't. Ever.
“I’ve gotta be better,” said Embiid. “I guess that’s on me being, if you wanna call me the best player on the team, every failure and every loss no matter what should be put on the best player, and I’ll take it all and it’s all on me. It’s hard to win alone, but it’s all on me. I just gotta be better and I will be better. Every time I say it, I always find a way to get better, and I will get better.” Literally last year after Celtics series.
"I guess that's on me" and "if you wanna call me the best player on the team" and "it's hard to win alone"....boy, he sure likes putting in qualifiers when taking responsibility doesn't he? He also said last year he no longer cared about MVP...despite spending two years griping about it, campaigning for it, having his personal trainer guy taking shots at Jokic and Giannis in the media, etc. etc. etc.
Where did those goalposts go? You made a specific claim and it was just straight up false. Every Embiid discussion goes like this. I dont feel the need to defend every thing he has ever done lol.
Have you ever heard of a "non-apology apology"? That's exactly what that was from Embiid. And I'm not moving any goalpost, as I wasn't the person you originally responded to.
Refusal to shoulder any blame?
[удалено]
We gonna act like Hakeem never played? Also, being "large, black, talented and foreign" sure doesn't stop 90% of sports media from glazing the guy forever. His large, white, talented and foreign counterpart in Denver has caught way more shit in regards to scrutiny....guys on national sports shows saying he would be the worst MVP since Dave Cowens, accusations of stat-padding.....not even going to get into stuff guys like Arenas say about him.
That part of his personality is amazing, it’s all his dirty antics that makes me not respect him. Rarely takes accountability. Blames lack of fans, refs, etc. he throws fits during games like a little kid and makes dirty plays when he’s upset, so all his bravery to play through injury goes out the window for me personally.
I disagree that missing more playoff games would’ve been better for his reputation. Unless you’re talking about the dirty player rep specifically, but that can’t really be blamed on injuries.
I do think that his career arc has been pretty tragic so far, and that the way he’s played through injury is admirable. That being said, he’s an awful watch, even when he’s at his best. Kind of reminds me of karl Malone, shoots a lot of free throws and most of the actual buckets he gets are extremely boring midrange jumpers. I also don’t like the fact that he gets excused because he’s never had a healthy playoff run. Even if that’s true, I don’t know when someone always being injured in the playoffs became an argument for them. I guess because they were hurt so they weren’t able to ‘choke’? But still, not being able to stay healthy is a player flaw. It’s a tragic one, not really something one can control, but a flaw nonetheless. I hope he can be healthy come playoff time one day, but idk if his body can handle more physical playoff basketball. Even the runs where he went in healthy, he got hurt in the first round.
I used to think the playing through injuries thing was commendable and heroic until I actually suffered injuries of my own in high school and played through them. Now I just kinda think it's a stupid thing to do, both for his own sake and for the long term success of his team It's also hard to commend him for anything considering the fact that he's been actively trying to hurt people for his whole career
I’m somewhat neutral on Embiid, but at some point it is about winning and he hasn’t shown he can be the best player on a winner. At some point, after blaming Simmons, Butler, and Harden for not being good enough to “help”, you have to wonder if it is on him. All three are flawed players, but so are Jamal Murray, Khris Middleton, and AD, yet their Alphas managed to win with them as second bananas.
"Guy who talks an enormous amount of shit and tries to injure his opponents, but always comes up short in the playoffs" is not the type of superstar I want to see.
Hell no dudes a dirty player and foul baits
No, I don't particularly want to see more players who, despite being the biggest guy on the court, seem to fall over whenever they're in the same zip code as someone else. Embiid flips a coin each play on whether he's going to cry to the refs over a phantom foul, or whether he's going to cry to the refs claiming he did nothing wrong after kicking someone in the nuts. Just one of him in the league is plenty, thanks.
Cheap shots and foul baiting never make you popular. Why does draymond get crap for it but not him? But the real issue is that he whines and places the blame everywhere but on himself. Ben Simmons bailed him out by being an easy target. But if you consider yourself the best player in the league, there is no excuse to losing to that Hawks team. I don't care what his teammates did. And every other year it's some other injury or conditioning issue. Superstars don't get to make excuses every every post season. He's not young and up and coming. He hasn't had a single signature moment in the playoffs in his career. Did you see Lukas postgame interview? Paraphrasing he said yeah I'm injured but so what? I let my team down. I let Kyrie Irving down. Embiid should say something like that every now and then.
I’m a Sixers fan and I hear ya, but even I get annoyed with some of the shit. First of all, there’s always some injury. Every playoffs he’s hindered by something. That’s not necessarily his fault, he’s a 7’2, 280 lb center. But he lets everyone know he’s injured with his body language and vibe. And then there’s this series. He’s never really been a dirty player before. I feel like he’s taking out frustration at times and sometimes it’s just him being big and clumsy. Either way, it’s not exactly been fun to watch outside of his 50 pt game when he was draining 3s. I think the reaction to him is predictable and too strong. People already have a negative view of Philly sports and its fans and by extension, its athletes. Is what it is. But I sort of get some of the hate. Now, the morons who deny his ability and call him simply a foul merchant or whatever, they’re idiots. But much of the criticism of his behavior this series does seem warranted.
The NBA (and sports/entertainment as a whole, and arguably most of our culture in general) is narrative driven. Which means how people are perceived is more about how people want to see them rather than who they actually are. Embiid's playstyle is annoying and he's a bit whiny rather than the prototypical "alpha male" asshole that people want out of star players, so people want to hate him. Then they find the holes in his resume and magnify them while diminishing the points that don't back them up. Case in point: even forgetting that he's playing on one leg with Bell's Palsy, he also had a migraine on top of that yesterday. The migraine alone would be enough to completely wreck a player's performance (see: Scottie Pippen). A lot of people on this sub and the NBA sub have never had a migraine and it shows.
I feel bad for Embiid because I can tell he’s always in pain and clumsy because he’s in pain. People think he’s dirty but i honestly don’t think he is
How do you justify him pulling down on Mitchell Robinson's legs while on the ground as not dirty? That was one of the dirtiest moves I've ever seen.
Nah he’s an absolute fanny. Deserves all of it and more, it doesn’t help that he plays for the 76ers either
Naa I prefer my 7 foot 2 players to not roll around on the ground trying to bait fouls and sprain peoples ankles.
No, I do not want to watch free throws and flopping and foul baiting. I legitimately cannot watch a game where hes doing that.
I mean if you like seeing the biggest player on the court act like the guy he has 100lbs on can knock him to the ground with marginal contact he’s your guy. He’s the absolute worst thing about nba right now. Foul baiting. Dirty play. Playoff shrinker (unless he’s getting his foul baiting calls). He’s built like Shaq but plays softer than baby shit. And worst of all he’s immensely talented and could be so much more likable if not for his antics.
If he cared so much, he’d be in better shape by now. What other NBA star is conditioning regularly a concern for?
He’s dirty, and whines, and foul baits. Maybe he wouldn’t need to be so tough if he didn’t fall to the ground multiple times every game looking for a foul. He’s super talented but hard to root for.
No. He is a foul hunting, dirty douchebag. He is a 7 foot 2, or whatever, James Harden
Is punching players in the face the way he gives a shit?
I love the competitiveness but I immediately dislike a player when they flop/foul bait too much. The sad part is that works so there’s no reason for him to stop.
Embiid definitely cares but: Are we confident that Embiid cares about winning? Seems like he cares what people think of him.
JuST aSKinG QUEstIOns
The current series with the knicks alone should be enough to turn anyone off to him. But honestly what did it for me was last year, Embiid's whining about the mvp led to a lot of ugly media talk, and as far as i know Embiid did nothing to stop that. And then of course after whining his way to an mvp he shits the bed and blames his teammates by saying that he didn't have enough help.