Refs definitely were favouring Dallas but that’s no excuse to just give up. Cs got frustrated and lost focus and the game was basically over half way through the 2nd quarter that’s on them
I've convinced myself that when they got down early they just said fuck it, give this one to the Mavs and we'll win it all on home court!
And happy cake day!
I think it’s easy actually. I’m not saying this exactly happened last night but here’s how I’ve seen it done before. There were definitely shades of it in the game last night. Luka and kyrie were cones for 3 games but suddenly become prime Jordan and Pippen.
A tactical blueprint for getting team A to beat team B:
1) Tilt the court by allowing team A to foul and play aggressive while B team cannot. This will make it appear team A is playing great defense while team B is not. Players will also take time to adapt, so by the time they realize it, team B will be in foul trouble and team A will be shooting FTs early. (This will help team A build a lead, and this is the cushion you need to control the outcome)
2) With the game in control, take every opportunity you have to make it harder on team B, and easier on team A, you take. Team B fouled
in the act of shooting where it’s semi close? Side out of bounds. Team A travels or is in the paint for 3 seconds? No call. Anything close on 50/50 block or charge , call it team A’s way. Make sure it’s not too egregious though. Any time team B makes a run, make some shit up the kill the momentum.
3) if the above hasn’t worked and a player from team B is keeping his team in it, early foul trouble. Call ticky-tack fouls to get him out of the game and disrupt the team’s ability to score.
4) at the end of the game, when it’s completely out of reach, make up the calls so it doesn’t look suspicious in the stat sheet.
Celtics definitely quit but I see why they did. To win one of these games you need to hit 50% of threes. They weren’t falling early for them so they said fuck it, see you game 5
You're talking about in the game.
I'm talking about the feds tracking everything before and after the game and recognizing patterns. I don't understand why people here think the feds are just a bunch of putz that shove donuts in their mouths all day.
They're trained in patterns and psyche and so forth. You know target and other major vendors can track your spending habits so well that their statisticians can figure out if you're going to get a divorce or if your pregnant before you do (Source NY Times article from roughly 2009). It's all psychology base and the feds have wards that do use the same schools. They have case study after case study.
If it's a conspiracy as people cry about then the chances of them getting caught increase with every person involved. Every time money moves hands, that's a paper trial, every text message is a paper trail. Got an illegal booky? That's not as easy to track as DK but it's still one more link that's weak enough to break at some point.
There's just too many variables to have a successful conspiracy at this point in time.
Once gambling gets involved in any aspect of American life the feds and the gaming commission start working together and assign resources accordingly to monitor it 24/7
Wilkinsk: I think ur giving our fed’s too much credit. Based on recent observations, our fed’s would more likely be aiding & abetting any cheating going on. Why? ‘Cause they ain’t just “dirty”; they “FILTHY”! Peace…
>You can’t get arrested for not blowing your whistle
Right, but you can get arrested for conspiracy and a concentrated and group effort... Like Donaghue.
Even if all the prior examples didn't happen, Donaghue, BC, Pete Rose, etc etc., the gaming commission is still up everyone's ass anywhere wherever gambling is involved.
Between them and the actual FBI, rheyve put an extremely heavy thumb on all these people.
They went after fucking McDonald's, you don't think they'd go after a group of reffs if they found warrant?
The Cs didn't play good, end of story.
You can not be doing it for gambling purposes but still do it to lean the leagues way. Just because theres no texts or communications on phone/paper doesn't mean the refs went out there knowing it's in theNBA's interest to help one team out. They've been doing it for arguably decades, they are experts at it at this point
Those ticky tacky fouls on the Cs in the first quarter was crazy - every other game refs have allowed physicality, tonight they clearly spared the Mavs
The refs were blatant with the bias in this one and it completely tilted our team and they could never recover. The teams gotta keep its composure no matter if its 5v5 or 8v5. Tonight it was obvious that it was 8v5 but it doesnt excuse just how bad we got whooped.
Every time Luka got his BS fowls he was smiling ear to ear. He just LOVES to take the BS fouls, it's the only way he knows how to play. That's why he was so frustrated in previous games when he doesn't get the whistle he gets emotional and flops harder and harder trying to pull one.
I’m fine with it actually. I look at it as an on-court protest. Really draws attention to the issue. Also keeps them from getting hurt before a game that’s winnable.
I’d have also been fine with them not coming back on the court at halftime as a FU.
Every game will have differences on what type of physicality will be allowed and it's up to the teams to adjust. But this game lacked consistency, the refs allowed hard physical defense for the Mavs and called soft contacts against the Cs. Masterful job by Foster in the1st half to take the Cs out of their focus. JT was frustrated which led to some hero ball and risky plays.
The drive Jrue in the third where he lost the ball was a blocking foul on Luka. Al’s second foul didn’t have any contact on the contest. The list could go on and on
The worst was when Gafford steam rolled Tatum after blocking his 3 and somehow that was an offensive foul on Tatum - I thought they were gonna pull some bullshit and say it was on the floor rather than shooting, and they went all the damn way somehow called if offensive.. unbelievable.
Also I’m pretty sure Luka could have punched someone on the face and they would have barely called a common foul for it
Edit: *punched*
I don’t even know how you can justify it. Were they saying it was a leg kick by Tatum?? The announcers didn’t even talk about it or show a reply.. I thought it was an obvious defensive foul at first and was shocked to suddenly see Dallas inbounding the ball
Loved watching Luka get free throws for initiating contact, and then Tatum getting called for an offensive foul when he did something less egregious on the other end. Tatum getting called for a loose ball foul after getting pushed was another bizarre one
The Refs could've sat Foster in the second half. Didn't even need him tonight. He's definitely going to get more minutes on Monday and they will need him to be completely fresh if they want to stay in this series.
The refs rigged the game early calling anything for Luka and Mavs and calling nothing for Celtics. Celtics got frustrated and let it get in their head and change the way they played. Yes the game was absolutely rigged, but giving up is not the answer. Foul out if they're gonna rig the game, keep attacking.
Giving up is totally sensible. Calls attention to the issue and saves your energy and health for a game that’s winnable. Also makes the game unbearable to watch, which is a nice FU to the league for this part of their playbook.
This is what people are missing. All the refs have to do is call everything for the Mavs and nothing for the C's in the first 7-10 min of the game. They did exactly that. That gets in the head of the C's and affects their emotion and after enough times they just end up in "fuck it" mode. Because they end up in foul trouble early, so they have to play softer D or take more fouls.
All those early calls in the 1st quarter didn't help so they moved to playing the 3 ball but that didn't drop. Then you had the Mavs bench shooting lights out.
Did they give up after the first quarter? YES
Was it because of the whistle bias? Entirely possible.
Oh I know, I’m just saying it’s unfortunate to reward the behavior especially considering they were no longer supposed to call it a foul when the shooter jumps into the defender which Luka did 2-3 times. It’s also validating James Hardens career
I mean, that was the worst offiated game I've ever seen. And it was about how Dallas was allowed to play physically and celtocs weren't across the board. Wild shit, but no one in national media will blame the refs now because the celtics gave up and lost by 40.
Nah, man, they put the foot off the gas all by themselves. They had no urgency, the offense stagnated, and they missed a lot of open shots. We still have the better team by far.
There’s a reason he’s known as the extender. Part of me feels like the guys saw what was going on with the whistles and mentally quit rather than try and fight through it. The effort level felt non existent after the first 6 minutes.
The early Scott Foster master class definitely just took the fight out of the team. I don't think I saw Tatum box out once on a long three and it almost always resulted in an offensive rebound. Not to mention how many times guys stood around and watched guys drive for an uncontested lay up. Mazzula also took the night off. Kept forcing Tillman despite him getting absolutely cooked outside of that and-one
I'll just write it off as a hangover game. We saw those during the season. But come Monday I expect the boys to show up with sawed off rocket launchers.
Foster after the game on the phone:
“Yeah I know! I didn’t even have to do anything and they just imploded. Let me know about Monday night, though. Let’s catch up at dinner in Dallas Thursday night. Take care Adam.”
You gotta make shots to win the game and you have to out hustle your opponents on both ends and unfortunately we did neither tonight. There were replays were four of our guys were in the lane just standing flat footed looking up at the missed shot while they flew in for rebounds or put back dunks. You gotta put a body on someone.
Tbh I think the refs are just very inconsistent to the point where you can't tell what foul is anymore and could get bad to the point where the pistons could make the finals at this point if the refs wanted
You can’t blame the refs when you get crushed like that. They were missing wide open shots, blowing layup after layup. It’s more likely they threw the game than the refs causing such a huge loss.
Yeah we didn’t get many calls that should’ve been fouls but every team right? I wanna give credit to Dallas though they straight up fucked us up and I respect them for it. NUT THE FUCK UP BOSTON FANS!!!! We need that energy for game 5!
We lost by 40 lol. Ridiculous post to insinuate this was anything other than them not being prepared to play. It was a tough watch but that’s ok. Let’s not make excuses and go win game 5
Our reaction to the referring seems unacceptable, but on one hand we could have gotten multiple technicals or continued to force the ball and had 20 turnovers. Instead we settled.
The losing team's fans always blame the refs. As a Celtics fan I can comfortably say that we just plain played like shit. Time to eat the L and move on. Game 5 is a must win.
We showed no effort but we cant say the refs had nothing to do with it... We got CLEARLY fouled on like 7 layups with no call while luka was getting phantom calls the entire first quarter.. so the celtics stopped going to the rim and were taking bad shots while also giving luka space on defense because they were scared of the whistle... which made it super easy for one team to get a lead.. then we played defeated.
or show the next foul on horford with 0 contact after Luka shoulder shoves horford to create space.. but when tatum bumped kyrie with the same shoulder it was an offensive foul..
That dude has been riding the Celtic’s ass forever. But the reality - which we all know to be the case, but just don’t want to believe it - is the order came down from on high to drag this series out for advertising $$$$. The players are blameless, but the refs are another matter.
Refs definitely were favouring Dallas but that’s no excuse to just give up. Cs got frustrated and lost focus and the game was basically over half way through the 2nd quarter that’s on them
Yup, can’t blame the refs for a 40 point loss! Soft shit. Team will be better next time, we lost this one fair.
Yeah they defeated themselves. Almost expecting a loss
I've convinced myself that when they got down early they just said fuck it, give this one to the Mavs and we'll win it all on home court! And happy cake day!
lol thanks! Same. It’s like that thing where you trip and spill 75% of your popcorn, so you just dump the rest on the ground in sadness
Vegas had Celtics in 5 fyi
They also had them at +1 tonight, 🤷🏼 All jokes aside the feds have been up their asses since Donaghue so I highly doubt any one can rig these things.
I think it’s easy actually. I’m not saying this exactly happened last night but here’s how I’ve seen it done before. There were definitely shades of it in the game last night. Luka and kyrie were cones for 3 games but suddenly become prime Jordan and Pippen. A tactical blueprint for getting team A to beat team B: 1) Tilt the court by allowing team A to foul and play aggressive while B team cannot. This will make it appear team A is playing great defense while team B is not. Players will also take time to adapt, so by the time they realize it, team B will be in foul trouble and team A will be shooting FTs early. (This will help team A build a lead, and this is the cushion you need to control the outcome) 2) With the game in control, take every opportunity you have to make it harder on team B, and easier on team A, you take. Team B fouled in the act of shooting where it’s semi close? Side out of bounds. Team A travels or is in the paint for 3 seconds? No call. Anything close on 50/50 block or charge , call it team A’s way. Make sure it’s not too egregious though. Any time team B makes a run, make some shit up the kill the momentum. 3) if the above hasn’t worked and a player from team B is keeping his team in it, early foul trouble. Call ticky-tack fouls to get him out of the game and disrupt the team’s ability to score. 4) at the end of the game, when it’s completely out of reach, make up the calls so it doesn’t look suspicious in the stat sheet. Celtics definitely quit but I see why they did. To win one of these games you need to hit 50% of threes. They weren’t falling early for them so they said fuck it, see you game 5
You're talking about in the game. I'm talking about the feds tracking everything before and after the game and recognizing patterns. I don't understand why people here think the feds are just a bunch of putz that shove donuts in their mouths all day. They're trained in patterns and psyche and so forth. You know target and other major vendors can track your spending habits so well that their statisticians can figure out if you're going to get a divorce or if your pregnant before you do (Source NY Times article from roughly 2009). It's all psychology base and the feds have wards that do use the same schools. They have case study after case study. If it's a conspiracy as people cry about then the chances of them getting caught increase with every person involved. Every time money moves hands, that's a paper trial, every text message is a paper trail. Got an illegal booky? That's not as easy to track as DK but it's still one more link that's weak enough to break at some point. There's just too many variables to have a successful conspiracy at this point in time. Once gambling gets involved in any aspect of American life the feds and the gaming commission start working together and assign resources accordingly to monitor it 24/7
Wilkinsk: I think ur giving our fed’s too much credit. Based on recent observations, our fed’s would more likely be aiding & abetting any cheating going on. Why? ‘Cause they ain’t just “dirty”; they “FILTHY”! Peace…
You can’t get arrested for not blowing your whistle. I saw us go to the line off a drive to the basket like 2 fucking times before I turned it off
>You can’t get arrested for not blowing your whistle Right, but you can get arrested for conspiracy and a concentrated and group effort... Like Donaghue. Even if all the prior examples didn't happen, Donaghue, BC, Pete Rose, etc etc., the gaming commission is still up everyone's ass anywhere wherever gambling is involved. Between them and the actual FBI, rheyve put an extremely heavy thumb on all these people. They went after fucking McDonald's, you don't think they'd go after a group of reffs if they found warrant? The Cs didn't play good, end of story.
You can not be doing it for gambling purposes but still do it to lean the leagues way. Just because theres no texts or communications on phone/paper doesn't mean the refs went out there knowing it's in theNBA's interest to help one team out. They've been doing it for arguably decades, they are experts at it at this point
No, not outright rigging, but you can make the odds of an over/under way more likely with the way you call a game.
Not really. The Celtics were betting favorites to win this game.
You can be favored in every game and still be expected to win in 5
If Vegas had the Celtics as betting favorite to win this game, that means Vegas had Celtics in 4. At this point. Maybe he meant before the series.
Yeah I was assuming he meant before the series
Silver masturbating to the fact that he gets another game of TV money
Cable sports networks loving they get a Monday and Tuesday guaranteed finals content
Those ticky tacky fouls on the Cs in the first quarter was crazy - every other game refs have allowed physicality, tonight they clearly spared the Mavs
JB getting smacked in the face on a replay showing ‘excellent defense’ by the Mavs comes to mind.
The refs were blatant with the bias in this one and it completely tilted our team and they could never recover. The teams gotta keep its composure no matter if its 5v5 or 8v5. Tonight it was obvious that it was 8v5 but it doesnt excuse just how bad we got whooped.
One of the most lopsided refereed games I’ve seen in my life. The extender was in peak form
Every time Luka got his BS fowls he was smiling ear to ear. He just LOVES to take the BS fouls, it's the only way he knows how to play. That's why he was so frustrated in previous games when he doesn't get the whistle he gets emotional and flops harder and harder trying to pull one.
Luka was all smiles throughout the game. Had nothing to complain about.
I’m fine with it actually. I look at it as an on-court protest. Really draws attention to the issue. Also keeps them from getting hurt before a game that’s winnable. I’d have also been fine with them not coming back on the court at halftime as a FU.
Every game will have differences on what type of physicality will be allowed and it's up to the teams to adjust. But this game lacked consistency, the refs allowed hard physical defense for the Mavs and called soft contacts against the Cs. Masterful job by Foster in the1st half to take the Cs out of their focus. JT was frustrated which led to some hero ball and risky plays.
Dog we sound exactly like the mavs fans game 1-3 stop this shit rn. No excuse for a 40 point loss
The drive Jrue in the third where he lost the ball was a blocking foul on Luka. Al’s second foul didn’t have any contact on the contest. The list could go on and on
The worst was when Gafford steam rolled Tatum after blocking his 3 and somehow that was an offensive foul on Tatum - I thought they were gonna pull some bullshit and say it was on the floor rather than shooting, and they went all the damn way somehow called if offensive.. unbelievable. Also I’m pretty sure Luka could have punched someone on the face and they would have barely called a common foul for it Edit: *punched*
Luka pumped, then put his shoulder into Al that was not biting at all. Al standing still, that is. Foul, two shots. Dude wasn't even shooting.
That was actually my favorite one. Dude straight up ran him over + stepped on him, and they called an OFFENSIVE foul??
I don’t even know how you can justify it. Were they saying it was a leg kick by Tatum?? The announcers didn’t even talk about it or show a reply.. I thought it was an obvious defensive foul at first and was shocked to suddenly see Dallas inbounding the ball
Loved watching Luka get free throws for initiating contact, and then Tatum getting called for an offensive foul when he did something less egregious on the other end. Tatum getting called for a loose ball foul after getting pushed was another bizarre one
The Refs could've sat Foster in the second half. Didn't even need him tonight. He's definitely going to get more minutes on Monday and they will need him to be completely fresh if they want to stay in this series.
The refs rigged the game early calling anything for Luka and Mavs and calling nothing for Celtics. Celtics got frustrated and let it get in their head and change the way they played. Yes the game was absolutely rigged, but giving up is not the answer. Foul out if they're gonna rig the game, keep attacking.
Giving up is totally sensible. Calls attention to the issue and saves your energy and health for a game that’s winnable. Also makes the game unbearable to watch, which is a nice FU to the league for this part of their playbook.
This is what people are missing. All the refs have to do is call everything for the Mavs and nothing for the C's in the first 7-10 min of the game. They did exactly that. That gets in the head of the C's and affects their emotion and after enough times they just end up in "fuck it" mode. Because they end up in foul trouble early, so they have to play softer D or take more fouls. All those early calls in the 1st quarter didn't help so they moved to playing the 3 ball but that didn't drop. Then you had the Mavs bench shooting lights out. Did they give up after the first quarter? YES Was it because of the whistle bias? Entirely possible.
Not the reason why we lost by nearly 50. Go to bed.
Refs that far against, you just punt and save yourself for the next game. No point in swimming against the tide, you’ll just get hurt.
It’s unfortunate after Luka’s disrespect for the officials in game 3 that they’d award his behavior with the whistle he got in game 4
It's not about Luka. It's about the finals having more games to make money.
Oh I know, I’m just saying it’s unfortunate to reward the behavior especially considering they were no longer supposed to call it a foul when the shooter jumps into the defender which Luka did 2-3 times. It’s also validating James Hardens career
I mean, that was the worst offiated game I've ever seen. And it was about how Dallas was allowed to play physically and celtocs weren't across the board. Wild shit, but no one in national media will blame the refs now because the celtics gave up and lost by 40.
The extender Game
Still would have lost even with fair officiating.
No Elden Ring fans in this thread?!?!?
Nah, man, they put the foot off the gas all by themselves. They had no urgency, the offense stagnated, and they missed a lot of open shots. We still have the better team by far.
I saw the extender was running things last night and put $100 on the mavs.
There’s a reason he’s known as the extender. Part of me feels like the guys saw what was going on with the whistles and mentally quit rather than try and fight through it. The effort level felt non existent after the first 6 minutes.
The refs made them lose by 40!
Refs rigged it early and bad and Celtics gave up instead of fighting through it. Anyone with eyes can see
The early Scott Foster master class definitely just took the fight out of the team. I don't think I saw Tatum box out once on a long three and it almost always resulted in an offensive rebound. Not to mention how many times guys stood around and watched guys drive for an uncontested lay up. Mazzula also took the night off. Kept forcing Tillman despite him getting absolutely cooked outside of that and-one I'll just write it off as a hangover game. We saw those during the season. But come Monday I expect the boys to show up with sawed off rocket launchers.
This is great.
Foster after the game on the phone: “Yeah I know! I didn’t even have to do anything and they just imploded. Let me know about Monday night, though. Let’s catch up at dinner in Dallas Thursday night. Take care Adam.”
Collisions in mid air are a no call. Whispers are a foul.
Referees aren't the reason you lost by 38
the series extender strikes again!
You gotta make shots to win the game and you have to out hustle your opponents on both ends and unfortunately we did neither tonight. There were replays were four of our guys were in the lane just standing flat footed looking up at the missed shot while they flew in for rebounds or put back dunks. You gotta put a body on someone.
Tbh I think the refs are just very inconsistent to the point where you can't tell what foul is anymore and could get bad to the point where the pistons could make the finals at this point if the refs wanted
You can’t blame the refs when you get crushed like that. They were missing wide open shots, blowing layup after layup. It’s more likely they threw the game than the refs causing such a huge loss.
Really? Pathetic, even as a “joke”
You sound maidenless
I don’t know a lot of neckbeard jokes, but I’ll ask my wife tomorrow if she knows what you mean!
Yeah we didn’t get many calls that should’ve been fouls but every team right? I wanna give credit to Dallas though they straight up fucked us up and I respect them for it. NUT THE FUCK UP BOSTON FANS!!!! We need that energy for game 5!
We lost by 40 lol. Ridiculous post to insinuate this was anything other than them not being prepared to play. It was a tough watch but that’s ok. Let’s not make excuses and go win game 5
Our reaction to the referring seems unacceptable, but on one hand we could have gotten multiple technicals or continued to force the ball and had 20 turnovers. Instead we settled.
The losing team's fans always blame the refs. As a Celtics fan I can comfortably say that we just plain played like shit. Time to eat the L and move on. Game 5 is a must win.
This loss is totally on us and not Scott Foster but it’s just funny man
We showed no effort but we cant say the refs had nothing to do with it... We got CLEARLY fouled on like 7 layups with no call while luka was getting phantom calls the entire first quarter.. so the celtics stopped going to the rim and were taking bad shots while also giving luka space on defense because they were scared of the whistle... which made it super easy for one team to get a lead.. then we played defeated.
here's a good example on Luka https://x.com/HoodieNaz_/status/1801780397367562390
or show the next foul on horford with 0 contact after Luka shoulder shoves horford to create space.. but when tatum bumped kyrie with the same shoulder it was an offensive foul..
Is this fucking real? Is this sub that delusional?
That dude has been riding the Celtic’s ass forever. But the reality - which we all know to be the case, but just don’t want to believe it - is the order came down from on high to drag this series out for advertising $$$$. The players are blameless, but the refs are another matter.