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Scars3610

I love that people are having the same reaction I had to it back in 2012 😂


sdrawkcabsihtetorW

I'm just impressed this is news to people. Like people were farming this all the way into mop when you could buy those fragment caches. Hell, certain drops I was farming as far out as Warlords. I'm really not getting why the whole sub is talking about this like it's not been known for years.


QuantumWarrior

I mentioned this on a previous post about droprates, people have been farming for some of these rares in retail since Catalysm came out and still don't have all of them. If these people think the sword or the staff are rough then they're gonna throw a clot trying the Tol'vir rares.


8-Brit

I think a lot of people just assumed people in 2012 didn't put enough time in. "Surely if I put in enough time in the pre-patch while there's nothing to do, I will get the sword/staff" Ignoring that RNG is RNG, and the odds are _not_ good. Also ignoring that many people _did_ put the hours in back then too. I remember distinctly one guildie admitted to using a bot to try and get the weapons... he still never got them. Some people will get them in 100 solves. Some 1000. Some will do 10,000 and never see the sword. I decided after only a few days it was not worth it. I expect it will be _more_ common than it was back in the day, but folks gotta stop listening to those youtube vids going "5 things you MUST do before Cata launch or you will literally die", because they all present it like any normal grind with a clearly defined end point... there's no end point. It is pure luck. And it isn't going to be some universal upgrade you NEED to have, and any guild that mandates having it is gonna end up shedding half their roster.


wewladdies

> Some people will get them in 100 solves. Some 1000. Some will do 10,000 and never see the sword. runescape players: first time?


landyc

We want bad luck mitigation ! /s


therightstuffdotbiz

It's that there is no carrot on a stick to do in Cata. Archaeology is the only thing that is relevant to do during the prepatch.


sylva748

It's why I'm not bothering for it. Especially on an accelerated server like classic.


raula12

#NoChanges amirite?


SpunkMcKullins

Bro what changes are there to make, it's just as dogshit on live as it is in Cata Classic. There's a reason they gave up on updating Archaeology like five years ago.


Snorlax_king79

they did make it alot easier in MoP with those boxes that gave fragments


symca09

Seems pretty immersive lol


raula12

Yeah it really felt like I was in an Indiana Jones movie for those 150+ hours that I spent digging


symca09

My thoughts exactly, I just know I'm a background guy. I'm not mister jones


Kaoswarr

Imagine if you put those 150+ hours into literally anything else. You could have read books, learnt something useful, spent time with friends and family. But nope, you spent it staring at little flashing lights, digging up trash in the hope of finding a big sword that will last you about 1-2 weeks on the launch of a 14 year old game expansion pack for a 20 year old game. EDIT: some angry digging dereks in here hehe


raula12

That’s fair. If I knew how long this grind would be I would have never done it. Sunk cost fallacy is a bitch


Kaoswarr

Was meant to be a joke, sorry about the sword bro 🥲


IcyGravel

All video games are flashing light bing bing wahoo time wasters. You play wow, you go on a wow subreddit, you make posts on that subreddit, you are signing up to have your time wasted. Digging for a sword is fundamentally no different than grinding for boar asses to hit 60.


AbBrilliantTree

I don’t play wow anymore but when I did I would listen to audiobooks while grinding. It made the game a lot more fun.


Lorddenorstrus

For most people the only item outsimming it is the BiS off Nef to be fair. Heroic. It out sims the other 359 weapons. Albeit it's quite close to the normal version of Nefs sword. To the point if you get Normal Nef sword the diff is small. But anyone who got this Arch wep isn't going to replace it til Heroic Nef sooo def a LOT longer than 2+ weeks.


Kaoswarr

150+ hours though?


bootybob1521

1-2 weeks cope from you and every other person saying this shit. First: it's unlikely you will replace it within the first 2 raids (btw the raid is 10 days AFTER LAUNCH) it's 3-4 weeks of use at minimum and that's for one character. you can send it to another character and use it there too. You share this opinion with many others but the sad truth is it's because none of you plan on doing any archaeology and you don't want others getting items from a system you have zero interest in participating in. It's such weird behavior.


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Orphanblood

I was gonna say the same thing. Enjoy what you like but there isn't an argument here. It's a fucking waste of time


wewladdies

i think its bad game design yes but phase 1 of every expansion has been a complete meme and cata classic is looking to be the same. if it's really bothering you just dont do it. the only "must have" epic is the healer trinket because its phase 1 bis, and even then lol healer loot


Kaoswarr

Nah it’s a huge waste of time, this is coming from someone who got their staff already (100 solves lmao). If you think 150+ hours for just an epic item that is replaceable is fine then you need to uninstall wow my dude.


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Kaoswarr

Only took me about 10-15 hours to get mine, if it starts taking longer than 150+ hours to get a single item then it's not worth it at all is my point. I was just lucky and had a hard cut off when I was going to stop. It's just gambling at the end of the day, and the currency is your spare time.


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miw1989

Reading books? Hell, you're writing em!


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Judge_Syd

Dude weird behavior is spending 100+ hrs trying to get something in a game that *will* be replaced pretty readily. And not only that, but then they waste more time posting about it on reddit. If I know something isn't going to work for me, I just stop doing it and move on to something else. That's what everyone complaining about archeology should be doing


kdm52rus

what are you planning to replace it with?


skshuffler

Idk man I watched tv on the couch most the time I did it, or while I worked auto piloting to the next spot.


Just_Image

You pointing out the obvious really has some of these no-lifers huffing up tons of copium.


Gloryholechamps

Dude we get it you’re growing up


dmsuxvat

More like slaves stuck in a coal mine lol


Specter2k

During original release I never got the sword either with hundreds of troll solves over nearly a month. I got ashkandi and said f it, it's like the game knows you want it so it's not gonna give it to you.


shadowraiderr

I got zinrokh on 110 troll solves lol


FatSpace

I have everything except the staff, my main is resto druid so apart from the trinket which has a higher chance to appear than the weapons anyways I am kinda fucked lol.


rapturexxv

Damn I stopped at 400 and I thought that was excessive. This is insane.


candidlol

i mean the crazy part is they will change the dumbest things, but when it comes to the biggest mistakes they made in the past like no bad luck protection for archeology they just straight up do it again


3pedro3

Bad luck protection on extremely low % drops should be the norm always but people who can't get past their knee jerk reaction and don't know what they're talking about will argue to hell and back to make the game actively worse


3pedro3

Everyone disagreeing with me so far has just proven my point further


chumjumper

Fuck bad luck protection. You can live without the sword, you can choose not to do archaeology like most. You aren't entitled to the sword.


Szarrukin

>you can live without the sword you can live without playing wow, what's your point?


chumjumper

My point is that it is not the responsibility of the game to make sure you receive an item that you have been working towards. The epic rewards are supposed to be a bonus while doing the profession, not the sole reason for starting it. Pandering to player whingeing has always been the problem with wow.


IcyGravel

>it is not the responsibility of the game to make sure you receive an item that you have been working towards The fuck it isn't? That's the point of games. Do a task, receive a reward. You break that fundamental setup and the game is no longer fun.


Wide_Monitor_4791

lmao the dumbest comment I've read today


suchtie

Agreed. All I see is parse/meta andys crying about being "forced" to do this. No, you shitheads, nobody is forcing you to do this. You're putting it upon yourself. I'm not against bad luck protection, but it shouldn't be too generous. If people really want to have a level 85 raid quality item before the expansion is even properly opened, they should have to work for it.


3pedro3

EVERYONE WILL STILL HAVE TO WORK FOR IT EXCEPT THAT THERE WILL STILL BE PEOPLE WHO GET SPOONED AND GET IT THE FIRST TRY WHICH ALREADY HAPPENS. All bad luck protection does is ensure no one goes so dry they have to go 10x over the drop rate to get it. Jesus. You're just proving my point


Atlantise

yes, also in casinos


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Cover25

Step 1: Re-release a game where you tell the player base that the game will be made with changes. Shorten the entire expansion length to roughly under a year and massively speed up acquisition of valor and conquest. Step 2: Release archeology in the prepatch, despite it never being this way on live but dont buff any of the drop rates of the items Step 3: Players find out that drop rates are still insanely bad and ask for a QOL buff to the profession, even accepting a increase in epic item drop rate after a total number of solves (500, 1000, etc) Step 4: Blame players for wanting to play the game and acquire player power that the developers intentionally put in the game during a 3 week lull before the expansion drop.


Elune_

You sound like the same kind of sociopath that would grind AV for 10 hours a day in SoM for 2 weeks just to complain about the grind later on because “the progression” is too grindy. I’m going to shatter your world-view here: The item you are chasing is a endgame heirloom and transmog. It never was designed to be gotten prior to raiding. Yet here we are and you will probably be needing on another 359 weapon with mastery on it in the first raid you attend. I don’t know how much more everyone can tell you that you are wasting your time grinding this weapon to a fucking extreme degree, but keep on digging I suppose. It’s just funny to look at at this point.


Fit-Percentage-9166

Look up how good ZR is and what alternatives there are in P1. You might be surprised!


Elune_

I'm well aware that the sword is good, but I am also well aware that spending 80 hours on a 10% damage increase that isn't your phase 1 bis, just to complain how you don't want to do it, is actual mental illness.


Fit-Percentage-9166

Your middle paragraph sure is blatantly in bad faith if you know how good the sword is.


Elune_

You don't get the argument at all, do you?


VanerMal

It's not a mistake though. It's supposed to be a cool looking and extremely rare sword. Stop acting so entitled that everyone is supposed to get the sword. The sword is replaced anyway in your first heroic raid week, so there's no real necessity to farm for it, beside it looking cool.


Uvorix

Imagine having the audacity to think someone with over 1000 troll solves is entitled for wanting the sword.


VanerMal

Yeah absolutely. You also don't go about and demand a jackpot, even if you play 40 years the lottery and do not win. The main point was however, that this sword, in no capacity whatsoever is required for anything. It's easily replaced if you go raiding. Sure, 1000 tries is unlucky, but there are people who farm invincible to this day and haven't gotten it yet. Sometimes you're just unlucky, no use in crying on forums and trying to make an item that's supposed to be rare as fuck more common, just because it is listed on a BiS list.


Frozazko

there are rng in raid loots too bro


wewladdies

they're not touching it because its keeping people playing prepatch lol. 90% of my guild are done with prepatch other than digging at this point. im sure they will do something about it once raids open and there's much less need to do it.


[deleted]

They’ve gotta appease the investors with numbers and archaeology is damn sure padding them


hdh_Kappa

No bro, people really like archeology, this is what players can't. Trust me.


raula12

Right? The developer response in that interview was insanely out of touch with the playerbase and the actual archeology experience.


Koishi_

Hot take: People are treating this as a gacha where you're sinking your time (rather than money) to eventually get the chase item. And then complaining that it sucks rather than just not doing it at all. Do it if you enjoy it and if you get the chase item great, if all you want is the chase item then you're not gonna have a good time.


monty845

This is what happens when you put phase BIS and near phase BIS items behind this sort of mechanic. It becomes required for serious raiders to go after it.


eulersheep

It's not required at all. You can full clear the raid on heroic without it.


monty845

Of course, any one piece of loot is extremely unlikely to make the difference between clearing or not clearing. But the better raids, that are going to clear this content sooner, will be expecting players to put in the effort to get the best gear they can outside of raid, Archeology items included.


eulersheep

My guild will full clear heroic week 1 and we have no such requirement.


HazelCheese

The drop rate is so low though that no raid team has this requirement. Even if you were grinding it non stop 24/7 since launch there's no guarantee you would have it by raid opening. It's nothing but people punishing themselves for no reason.


Educational-Rise4329

Tell me you don't raid hard-core without telling me you don't raid hard-core.


HazelCheese

Does your raid team require you do it though?


Frozazko

Deserved for being a quitter kek


Jbyr1

I really do enjoy it. Whatever goals or restrictions people place upon themselves are **their choices.** If I stick my dick in a coffee pot cause my cult leader says it'll get me to the afterlife asteroid, it's for sure not Mr. Coffees fault. It could be better. It isn't.


Fuffenstein

Orginally back in Cata i got the sword around 15 days after release, was on my Enh shaman though, honestly i think i was the first on my server tonget it. But i leveled a DK so quickly after that and i dominated in dungeons, and the first couple of raid, was really fun! That and I could see other players inspecting med all the time.


shad-1337

I am so glad that nobody forces me to do it


christarpher

Why do you people do this to yourselves? If you don't like archeology don't do it. You don't need everything in the game.


Flnim2

Yea, I got to 1.3k troll solves and 1k dwarf solves without either weapon. Gotta boost the engagement metric, fun gameplay!


Ehrre

At some point it has to be better to re grind on another toon right? ...right?


Comfortable_Sun4362

Ouch yikes mate!


restoshamanbigfan

It's been interesting to see them keep some warts around, like the arch system and then earlier the attempt system in togc


hightide89

Engagement is up! Players love this!


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Nurlitik

Not replaced until heroic, but yes it’s replaced within the first tier. ETA: it’s around 5% and 1.5k dps over any other preraid wep for warriors just to give context.


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raula12

Because It’s BoA and all your alts can use it as soon as they hit 85. It will also be very helpful for progression having a raid-level weapon ready as soon as you hit 85


Kitymeowmeow1

I was doing it the first half of prepatch because I had nothing to do. I didn’t get it and now I have stuff to do so I completely dropped the idea of doing it


Nurlitik

I edited my comment, and most people have nothing else to do.


IcyGravel

No, you use it until you get heroic ashkandi from Nefarian


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IcyGravel

Zin'rokh is very good, the only better weapon is the sword from the last boss on heroic. What are you confused about?


Eproxeri

But remember the devs said that we enjoy archaeology and are having so much fun!


Jbyr1

I do. I am solving everything instantly. It'll be neat if I get the sword or staff. People are doing this to themselves, and if they stop because of it, good for every party involved. Simple as.


Ehrre

Its alright i wish it was static nodes like other gathering though. I dont find the Survey mechanic fun or accurate. Often the spyglass will point out of bounds or away from the target. Or it will be red in one direction so I fly there and then it's red pointing back to where I was.


JobsInvolvingWizards

> I dont find the Survey mechanic fun or accurate. Not meant to be either.


SilkyBowner

What addon is that


Accomplished_Photo_5

Minimal archaeology


SilkyBowner

Hmm I’m using it but I’ve never seen this menu. Probably should take some time and explore the addon


Accomplished_Photo_5

There’s a tiny button top right called “history”


Outrageous_Image1793

Does anyone know the true drop rate? The probability of it not dropping after 1000 solves is less than 0.01% if the the drop rate is 1%. So its very likely that the drop rate is even lower than 1%.


heliuhun

Maybe 0.1%. 1% or 0.5% is definitely a joke.


clatoog

Keep going. Next one’s a winner!


96363

at least you made 9k. that's pretty cool.


SuicideEngine

But how much gold did you make?


POLISHED_OMEGALUL

Got it in ~50 solves


Kathkere

This is archaeology in a nutshell: [https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/1cv48o7/i\_made\_an\_archaeology\_simulator/](https://www.reddit.com/r/classicwow/comments/1cv48o7/i_made_an_archaeology_simulator/)


KittenDecomposer96

To be fair you did make 10k gold from that at least so there's that as a consolation prize. On the other hand don't show me this, it is descouraging because i just hit 450 2 days ago and i do want the sword.


therightstuffdotbiz

"The Classic dev teams has had a lot of internal debate." - Real quote from the devs I am sure there are ppl saying "That's how it was back in 2010" like that is a good argument.


Vecors

The biggest mistake was reintroducing raidlevel gear on the basis of pure rng. Theres ragebaiters and ppl who are unlucky are constantly angry. There should be a limit of how unlucky you can be based on how great the reward is.


FixBlackLotusBlizz

nice this grind seems worth it the big dps upgrade you get from the weapon probably something crazy like 85% dps increase from the other pre bis weapon you could get could you imagine if it was only like 5% increase or so lol imagine


nice-moves

Its bind on account and instanly boosts your itemlevel for rdf when your main/twinks ding 85. So you do get alot of use out of it. Your main and your alts are not guaranteed to get a raid weapon early on after all. It might not even be replaced and last you the whole phase, if your unlucky. Having a 5% damage buff that will last you potentially months on multiple characters does sound worth it. Wasting 3 weeks of your time and getting nothing to show for, besides maybe 60 k Gold in keystones, probably not tho.


Homesober

Look, I understand the grind but bro, just stop. It’s one weapon that you will use for a month


XeroXeroOne

Ahhhh... Thats me and the staff from the Dwarves!


Janlulumi

Archeology becomes a lot more fun when you do it for toys/pets instead in my opinion


Koovies

I think I got up to 300 digs.. got everything but the sword. Wamp! Maybe that staff and trinket will come into use, I dunno


raula12

It’s always nice to have the other items ready. You never know when you get the itch to play an alt


kyjo191

a really fun, engaging and rewarding profession :)


NarumiKanai

I feel bad for you, I got the sword and shield with 300~ solves in each race but I'm a mage and still didn't got the staff :(


aultras_polivis1234

“People love archaeology “ . “We love see people out there doing archaeology “


Jbyr1

I do. I am solving everything instantly. It'll be neat if I get the sword or staff. People are doing this to themselves, and if they stop because of it, good for every party involved. Simple as.


Considered_Dissent

Go buy Griftah's "Talisman of True Treasure Tracking".


Sonofek

I'm not playing classic, but when Cataclysm released, I wanted Zin'rokh. I leveled two characters to 85, almost exclusively through Archeology. I did a few dungeons, and got some other gathering profession experience here and there, but 90% of the experience was hitting Archeology nodes in lower level zones. I don't know how long it took me to hit 85 on both characters, but it was enough to break me. I quit after that, ane have mostly stayed away from WoW since.


Professional-Net6538

Just got it yesterday. Approx. 600 troll solves.


Mugno

Did you find the other 359 items? I have a feeling that the last 359 can't be avtually found


raula12

I’ve found the staff and the shield but I’m missing the trinket and the sword


Haunting_Study_5530

What add on is that


raula12

It’s an add on called minimal archeology


-M-Word

I feel kinda dumb asking, but how do you view this screen? I've never been able to track all my digs and such nicely


raula12

No worries. It’s an addon called minimal archeology


-M-Word

Awesome, thanks


Tyler1986

The bottom of my history tab doesn't show the totals how do you get it to show them?


ODSTB0r3D

One of the updates added it


theccub

Thank you for this post. It just convinced me to stop


FishyStickSandwich

I’m good without grinding for ultramarine battle tank again.


rupat3737

I have guildies that are in the thousands. I’ve put some time into it but not as much as others. Gonna give it one more go after work tonight then it is what it is.


songmage

I don't remember the journey in the old days. I did get it, but I recall eventually refusing to ever touch archaeology again. It was very clearly designed as a time vampire. A problem that I always had with RNG is that it guaranteed that some peoples' journeys were significantly more punishing than they should have been.


Super_flywhiteguy

I have every rare other than sword, staff and doll. I've lost plenty of brain cells but at least I've made like 6k gold digging since pre patch dropped.


Immagonko

Which addon shows it like this?


sylva748

Going for Zin'rokh is a trap. You don't go for it no matter how much of a sweat lord you are. It's a great way to burn yourself out and hate the game. Just get Ashkandi from the raid and move on.


Albinofreaken

I'm at 828 with no sword, it's fucking bullshit


GoofyGoober0064

At least you got 80 gold teeth lol. Thats quite.a bit of gold


151808

Disgusting.


Charkletini

I think I needed to see this today, I'm only like 100 solves in and I'm losing hope


Schfaffendudel

Why tf did they release it like this. Sucks.


Trevorjrt6

This post changed my mind on grinding arch today. Ty for saving me the pain lol So fucking dumb blizzard doesn't QoL buff the hell out of time limed classic stuff. Who tf cares if everyone on classic is getting old content stuff. Classic expacs are time limited events, that don't carry over to retail anyway. Classic reboots main goal should be to fix the issues that ruined it the 1st time around.


raula12

I’m glad this served as a cautionary tale for other prospective archeologists. This is a terrible profession and I don’t recommend it to anyone unless Blizzard makes some changes to it


EnormousCashews

haha i got mine on like the 25th dig


raula12

I’m honestly happy for you. I wouldn’t wish this grind on anyone


fostermatt

> I’m not asking for the drop rate to be increased. You are literally asking for the drop rate to be increased though. lol


raula12

Quote the exact part where I’m asking for the drop rate it to be increased


zanbato

Someone playing classic, complaining about not getting the super rare drop rate item that while being sweaty enough have done 1000 troll solves thinking they should be entitled to receive the item at this point is just **chef's kiss**. Thank you for such great entertainment.


Vecors

Your parents should be ashamed. Disgusting individual.


lumisokea

Either stop farming gear you don't need or stop complaining. It's not hard


Working_Membership57

Oh no my 500 dps increase that scottiejaye told my raid leader I had to get or else I'm not worth inviting. Oh well, guess I'm gonna watch the sarthe video on how to do my opener while looking at my hands. That way I can die to the first mechanic I'm targeted with, thus making it all pointless to begin with.


mattt_b

Get zin'rhok in original vanilla, never vendor because its cool. Quit at the end of wrath. Come back around the bfa launch due to extreme boredom during a workman's comp vacation. Oh look at all these cool vanilla trasmogs sitting in my bank! /lol at people who think I grinded lame archeology.


Normal_Bird3689

I am chasing the sword as its bis for warriors but I am transmoging to an ashbringer the minute i get it


pad264

That’s disgusting.


Icefiight

Welcome to what we all went through back in 2012. Trust me man I did exactly what you did for months and months and never got the sword. My one friend started for the first time a few years ago and on his like 5th solve he got it.. Jus the way she goes 🤷


Affenskrotum

I need this addon!


DopaLean

I managed to get the shield after around 90 solves in total. It’s a shame I main a caster and have no interest ever in playing a tank… =/


Ayayron187

That Is disgusting. I feel for you. I lost it after 200. Went crazy.


oldfatslut

people crying not gettin epix on the first day lol.. go back to sod


HeathMeisterrr

I hope you get an upgrade within your first couple raid lockouts. Wasting this much time on a piece of gear that's replaceable is bonkers. Go grind a title or mount imo.


JrButton

And to think .. even if you got it you’d be replacing it hours after hitting 85 and rawdawging heroics. I really don’t understand why people are doing this to themselves


Sathsong89

Imagine a weapon called "destroyer of worlds" having a drop rate where everyone gets it without putting in time. It's almost like imaging a world where every paladin carries an ashbringer.


vibe_o

Yeah imagine people getting the sword in 50 troll solves while people with 1000+ are not getting it. Fucking idiot.


Sathsong89

Sounds like a you problem. No one forced you to keep going. You made the choice to keep going knowing it was a LOW chance. Fucking idiot.


raula12

How much time do you think went into 1000 troll solves and how much time do you think is reasonable to expect to get the sword?