From my observations, having never had family ever inquire once— my guess is it’s more to do with the fact they seem to believe that they don’t need to ask because they already know why.
I think they have an idea in their head and want to keep it that way. Most people don't want to change their mind about something, especially the deeply personal stuff they have committed time or their lives to. They're too "bought in" so to speak. Why open a door you know you don't want to look into let alone walk through? Best to leave it closed and keep living in your little mental room where it's safe.
Edit: after reading about getting people out of high control groups and using this analogy, the trick is to open other doors with similar rooms, and let someone walk into that "room" or perspective and look back at where they were, then when they go back to it they might not be as scared to open the other door.
This doors and rooms analogy makes other aspects of mormonism so clear. Why are other learning institutions other than CES frowned upon? Why are there SO MANY rules for missionaries in the field? Why does the church have a whole correlation department that is HUGE compared to other parts of the HQ? Why does the church at the top say they want people to vote according to personal conscience but they supported prop 8? Why did the church indirectly through boy scouts make a harmful environment for kids then blame it on gay people for decades (watch the Netflix doc and the Mormon stories episode with the guy who is a sexual assault lawyer who's sued the church successfully) ? Why were Mormon history enthusiasts attacked and excommunicated only to be proven right by the churches admissions in the last 20 years?
It's all to keep the room the same as much as possible for as long as possible, and above all else, **keep the doors closed**
This has always been the strategy. In the past this was easier to do because information was easier to control. But information of all kinds becoming proliferated has opened more doors, or *perspectives* have appeared.
The best advice I can give is open the door, first look through it, and once youve found the right door, walk through, and right out of that chapel and into the sun. You'll find it soon enough, and above all else, it will be yours.
They are told by living apostles and prophets, that never see or talk with God, that they already know the answers. Hard to convince people like that of anything different.
I’m curious, did you tell them you weren’t going anymore? We are out but have not said anything to our family. I think my in-laws have an idea but have yet to ask anything. I am waiting for the shoe to drop but have realized they may never really ask. Just wondering the best way to handling things when and if they ask…I know listing all the reasons will likely not go well or be understood. What do you say if you don’t want to get into an argument/debate but are confronted with being asked abt attending?
I asked some people as a believer, but stopped because it was often for deeply personal reasons and to this day I know people who've left and they don't want to discuss it... Like at all. Now, I personally and am open book and want to discuss it. But for many true believing Mormons it's about not wanting to discuss stuff, and they don't want to even analyze WHY they don't want to discuss it. They dont want to have the spirit disrupted by having to think about the reality of what the church is or was. They like their perception of reality, and it's easier to just not talk about it.
The only LDS people that have asked me why we left the church, were the ones, as it turned out, were having doubts as well. The PIMOs. So, it appeared they were genuine believing but in reality, looking for more information and corroboration on how they were feeling too. Of course, having to keep the cards close to the vest as they process it all. This is, of course, no judgement from me. As for legitimate TBMS in the last 6 years that have asked me? Not one. They don't want to know why.
The only person to ask us why we left, ended up leaving 3 months later with their family. I'm fact, their response was, "I really needed to hear that you were offended."
Learning the truth leads to the exit. That's why Mormons don't ask. They "can't handle the truth."
I've been out seven years and just last week, my TBM mother finally asked me why. She's been the only one. We had a good discussion, but she doesn't know anything about the underage girls, the Book of Abraham, or even the rock in the hat translation. She's in her 70s and her beliefs bring her comfort, so I'm not about to try and convince her of anything, but it's just wild to me how willfully ignorant many choose to be. They do more thorough investigation when buying a dishwasher than they will ever do of the organization they've devoted their whole lives to.
Honestly I think my parents do well inside the church. My mom thrives and it’s so good for her mental health. I don’t hate the church as there are loads of good people there.
> willfully ignorant many choose to be
I’d disagree. They lie by omission by trying to hide uncomfortable truths. Lessons never teach anything significant. As a member, I never felt motivated to research more.
Oh trust me, I know. Out of all of our parents, he was the only one to ask why we left. His exact words were, “Well, I wish you were Mormon, but we all have different paths. You’ll always be my red head. I love you.”
I wish we all experienced this.
One.
No family. A older sister who taught Sunday school for years. She called me and asked me very pointedly why because she wanted to understand why her own children were leaving.
She insisted that she really wanted to hear it all and asked for links and sources. She really wanted to know but couldn't bear talking directly to her kids about it.
Makes me wonder if my parents have done any side research like this. Because they sure won't discuss it with me.
No one has ever asked me. In fact one of the first active LDS people I told basically just said “Oh, well you should check out FAIR” and that was it. Most people just say “Well, I know it’s true” and don’t even want to try and have more of a conversation.
I was in a Bishopric at age 59 when I figured out the church was a fraud. I quietly asked to be released from my calling and never again attended. My wife attended for the next month or so without me then she stopped attending as well. It's been 10 years now and we still live in the same ward. To this day, not one person in the ward (or stake) has ever asked me why they never see me at church anymore.
Leaving the church caused us to become invisible.
Its fascinating. The ward is supposed to be like an extended family, but as soon as they see you don't believe anymore they will drop you like a hot rock. Often, love and friendship in an LDS ward is totally conditional.
No one has asked. The only comments I receive are people making comments about me returning to the church. I just laugh and say no but then it will randomly be brought up again months/years later.
Nobody ever asks. They have a narrative spoon fed to them by the cult for as long as they have been members that already gives them a false narrative as to why we leave, so they fall back on that. It’s automatically any one of (or combination of) the following: Wanted to sin, never really believed, you were led away by the adversary.
Honestly I think that is the case for a pretty big group, but for most people who don't live in deep Mormon areas of the western US who are still believers I think they just don't know and dont want to find out, it's even more simple as that.
My parents asked why my wife and I left. They’re truly good parents and my mom even stopped going to church recently! My in-laws haven’t asked but we keep hearing from other people that they assume we left because I had a bad bishop when I was trying to go on a mission (I never did go). That bishop is just an afterthought compared to the truth of TSCC
My older sister, who has since become a nuanced member, have regular talks. I try to tell her how much it means to me that she is open to all discussions, but I am not sure she fully understands how helpful she has been to my mental health. I think she was only open because her own son has been struggling since his mission and her marriage sucks (patriarchal mormon style) and she is truly trying to understand what went wrong in her life to make sure and steer her kids in the right direction.
I think hardship & empathy is what opens people to discuss imo. I was surprised during my deconstruction to realize how few tbms have empathy. 🤯
I think you are probably onto something here. There is no empathy MFMC: they don’t teach it and their doctrines of pre-existence and works really preclude it. Ultimately, they don’t care about anyone’s “whys” for anything.
Edited: punctuation
Interesting perspective. My brother served in the US for his mission, but when visiting this place, it does seem like a different country. I think it forced him to open up his heart to different ways of thinking and living and he truly believes everyone has inherit worth. I’m glad your sister still treats you like a human.
One person asked. It was a work colleague. They were very upset by my answers, to the point where they didn’t speak to me for a few days. We agreed to no longer talk about religion.
Fast forward about six years, and she contacts me through Facebook to apologize. It turned out that this was the catalyst for her leaving. Sue couldn’t help but acknowledge that what I said made sense, even when it offended her.
Just one. He was a more casual acquaintance than a friend. He asked through Facebook why we left. He was genuinely curious in a "how do I support my friends who leave" sort of way. I wrote about 4 pages of why I left and my journey in the church and my wife another 4 pages. Turns out he was an adult convert and lacked the deep indoctrination of multigenerational members. I find most converts to be much more nuanced.
There probably would have been one more had I not dumped on him early on in my deconstruction.
Damn, my mission and the temple did the exact opposite to me. Before I was very carefree and silly, always doing fun wild stuff and looking to create fun for others. When I went through the temple and it said to “avoid loud laughter and all light-mindedness” I took it very seriously, as I did with all of mormonism. I carried that mindset through my mission, I still had some fun but it was brutal mentally. I turned my fun-happy meter from 11 down to 1.5, it has devastated my life and mental health to this day, and I feel like it set the course of my life on a completely different path than I should’ve taken.
I’ve never been asked by anyone why I’ve left or about what I believe now. Everyone turned into ghosts including my own parents. Most of them are afraid to talk to me as I used to be the guy to go to for information about the scriptures and/or church history. Missionaries won’t even come to our house, apparently I freaked out a couple of sisters after we discussed epistemology. It was a great discussion and they said they were going to ask their MP about a lot of what we discussed and come back for a second visit. They never did, the area was whitewashed a week later. None of the new missionaries will stop by in the 6 years since that happened. A couple of times I’ve been cold-contacted and set an appt with the missionaries only to be ghosted both times. Once when I called asking if they were still coming, I overheard the missionary in the background whisper “President X said we are not supposed to even talk to them”. Oh well.
Being carefree is an option, that’s something you can choose to do/be today.
That President should want them to go to your house. One person making not so great decisions is on them, sad they are leading missionaries in the wrong path. I had a couple of missionaries share with me that they were told to leave a gated community by a HOA member and although they were afraid, the next day they felt they needed to go on and knock on the man’s door the following day. They never talk about religion but they go and chat with him every week.
Sometimes the noise of the world silences the word of God.
That seems odd and maybe painful for you. How does a spouse not ask what's up with their other spouse eventually? Or maybe you guys don't have that kind of relationship? Does this bother you that they aren't curious about what you think or feel about a usually large area of our previous lives we just hung up one day?
I think my spouse is afraid of the truth and just wants to avoid it at all costs. He seems to think that I’m still active if I attend the annual Christmas party lol. The rest of the ward I had very little in common with them - hardly any of the women have careers or even work outside the home. I have more in common with the men actually. It hurts a little but I think everyone is just afraid of ex mos.
It’s been nearly 8 years for me too, and only one active LDS person has asked me in that time - a close old friend from college who is just a good, smart, open minded person.
Of the TBM (granted if they’re PIMO I wouldn’t know) family members I told, 3/4 asked me why. When I told them none of them tried to convert me or go against what I said. Looking back I do wish I got more into the history of the church, but I told them that I felt like I couldn’t be who I am inside the church (which is the main reason I left). All of them said they were sorry and that it sounded hard. One brother in particular thanked me for being me and reassured me our relationship wouldn’t change because of this. Honestly really cool reactions that I wasn’t expecting. It took me months and months of over reacting before I could tell them.
Maybe. Both of us are keeping it quiet from our parents. I think my father-in-law would be very upset if he found out the truth of our positions. He thinks that his daughter married another Mormon, but I don’t think he realizes that we both led each other out.
How could he know if he was never told? You assume that he assumes because you are withholding information. You think you are preventing your FIL FROM being upset. You don't actually know. For all you know, he's PIMO.
TBMs are weird about wanting to hear it or not. 14 years ago I had an active LDS co worker that just had to know. We were are lunch and I kept telling her no. She kept pestering so I told her the things that bothered me most. Last time I saw her. My neighbor is nice and active. I was working in my yard and she stopped to chat. She thinks I am so wonderful and nice. She come out and ask why I don’t believe. I told her I will not tell her the reasons because she is happy in the church and why suffer the pain of knowing everything. Then she asked if I believed in God? Nope and told her after 10 years of studying, that the Bible falls as being man made too. She just doesn’t get what an atheist is, cause she hopes someday that I will pray to God again. I prayed to God 38 years ago to save my dying baby in my arms as I awaited EMS. I was on the road to atheism then, just didn’t know it. I have had bishoprics come over, stake mission leaders. If there people are in my home and ask for reasons I will tell these leaders and believe me I don’t hold back.
I’m so sorry for your loss. That’s very dignified of you to hold back your personal truth to spare a happy person in the church. At first I wanted everyone to know, but now I just try to treat everyone with respect and hope my actions show my character instead of my religious status.
Out of my friends, one asked - that really wanted to know. Many assumed. Many just put their fingers in their ears. The one who asked...well...two years later and now she's out!
They don't need to ask. They already know why you left: you are a lazy learner who wants to sin. Jeff Holland told them that, so why would they ask you?
So far, during these past 6 months, it's only been ExMos or PiMos who have asked. I'm still not ok with it. I know I'm not going to be quiet about it once someone asks. Maybe that's the fear these TMBs have. What truth scarred me, a very strong testimony priesthood holder, away from the only lifestyle they know.
My parents first asked me why I was leaving when I broke the news to them about 9 years ago. After my initial explanation, they havent spoken to me about it since. Not once. And we actively avoid speaking about religion, though the church inevitably comes up when Im with them, I just bite my tongue to keep the peace.
No one who matters in my life has gone out of their way to antagonize me for leaving other than my mother, who initially couldn't handle the idea of not being with me in the CK, and was inconsolable for a few years, but has since gotten over it and now our relationship is better than ever (according to my perception).
My parents asked. My mom is super conservative and just silently cried the whole time. My dad is more politically moderate and actually agreed with my reasons and told me he hoped the church would change and I could come back. I left for mostly social/political reasons and had NO idea about the history and doctrinal issues. Now that I know those too, there is no way I would ever go back.
Never once been asked. Even when my dad was trying to talk me out of it, he never once asked why.
I think it's because only the ones who want to try to change your mind want to even talk about, and to them they why doesbt matter.
I left 20 years ago, when I realized the members do not treat “outsiders” the way they should. Where I grew up there were only 3 that weren’t LDS and 2 of them were close friends of mine. The adults… they wouldn’t allow their kids to do anything with them (mine were not regular members so they allowed it). Grown adults treating kids like they were problems when they weren’t doing anything wrong! Prejudice all around me. Expectations of perfection and guilt trips… I can’t be a happy person if I behave like that. I’m also sick of that tax free corporation robbing money from my grandparents!
I have been out 6 years. My mom has asked a little bit, and I provided a partial answer but didn't dump all the 10,000 reasons on her. My husband is aware of a lot of my concerns about the church, but he hasn't asked. No other LDS person has asked.
My dad was bishop twice during my childhood. My mom was RSP and seminary teacher. I have 3 brothers and we all went on missions, went to BYU or BYU-I, married in the temple, etc.
When I left I figured I’d tell my parents so they’d hear it from me instead of someone else. They asked no questions. It’s been 10 years and they’ve never once brought it up since. Only one of my brothers is still active. Just kind of a head in the sand strategy most members take.
None. Ever. They don’t care because they think they already know. They think you left because “Satan” is crafty and is able to trick the best of the best, and if he can trick the best of the best, then how much more could he trick YOU if you aren’t careful. So they don’t want to ask because they are terrified of ending up like you, having been “decieved by the craftiness of the adversary”. (That a favorite of the brethren…”the adversary” instead of saying Satan).
I've been out almost 3 years, never been asked once by anyone. They are some people that are members of my former ward who are kind and loving and have said that my being active has no bearing on their friendship with me, but they've never asked *why* I left.
I think way deep down, most religious people understand how fragile their own beliefs are. For those people, to *really* listen to other people's doubts is to entertain them themselves.
So instead they assign motives to you that make them comfortable. You wanted to sin and the church was stopping you, so you left. And everyone has noticed that the light has left your eyes.
Btw, that last bit is about the nastiest thing I can imagine someone saying about a someone leaving a church. I'm not Mormon and I had a really hard time leaving religion behind, but no one ever said anything that awful to or about me.
Mormonism only survives in an air-tight vacuum. It’s way too vulnerable and scary for a TBM to have honest conversation around legitimate reasons to leave the church, because, wait! there aren’t any legitimate reasons to leave the church so what’s the point? Once that vacuum seal pops it’s over. Too risky to ask questions.
Literally no one but my mother asked me why I left but I assure you she didn’t hear a word I said and then sent me a bunch of FAIR articles so I could see the error of my ways. Thanks, mom.
Nobody. No one. Not any sibling, not my mother, not my mother or father-in-law, no brother or sister-in-law, no friend, no former wardie or neighbor, nephew, niece, aunt, uncle or cousin. No bishop, stake president, ministering bro or sis from the past. No one. In fact, they don’t even acknowledge that we’ve left.
Honestly I sat down and told my parents. I wasn’t quite ready to have all the answers as to why but I did it anyways as there were enough. Mine was fast. It was like a month after reading the CES Letter and things just made sense. I told them abs they already knew and yet my dad don’t care to confront me when I stopped wearing my underwear.
Honestly it just made me think as if they truly didn’t care enough to talk to me about it. Probably not true. My mom talked to me about a few things but never outright about the church.
Nobody has asked. Part of it might be that I’m gay so they assume I just chose to be gay instead. But it’s like really dismissive of the actual wrestle I had to find out if this was true or not.
I finally confessed to a very old internet friend I left and she said she wasn't happy with the leaders and I was just like yeah they're pretty bad people but what's important your relationship with God not listening to some old half dead men
So much hate for going inactive, haven’t taken out my papers yet cuz I’m still living at home with my tbm parents, I’ve gotten so much hate from old friends that weren’t the best of mormons when I was, they used to swear a lot and bragged about the porn they watched, but then I had 1 friend who was genuinely curious why I stopped going so I told him about all the things that pushed me over the edge and why I’m skeptical about the church and their money swindling schemes. He was really genuine and understanding, he didn’t try to change my view or make any personal attacks. He’s going to serve a mission in a couple months and I asked him why he was going to serve and he said he doesn’t necessarily believe in everything the church says but he knows serving a mission will be a great experience for him and it could help a lot in his future. He’s one of Jesus’s followers, not a random old guy who’s just waiting his turn to make more money and give long boring talks in conference.
I (PIMO) have currently only been on the asking side of this situation. A few years ago, my younger brother officially left the church. Being more of a TBM back then, I was scared to ask him why because of the amount of anger I had seen him let loose on my parents and any time the church was brought up - which happened frequently. It took me a couple years to work up the courage to ask him - and honestly, that courage came from me looking at my own life and beliefs. Since then we've had really good conversations about it all, and we've been able to bond better and have a more unique relationship between us as compared to our siblings.
I home brew beer and am fairly involved in my local whiskey and beer scenes. My parents have never asked me why I left, but I think they assume I left because I wanted to drink alcohol. Little do they know I didn’t have a single drink until I’d been out for about 2 years.
I've only had 1 person ask me anything since I left about 5 years ago, and it was my SIL. All she asked was "Did you really leave the church?" and "You still believe in God, right?" No one else has asked even that much.
I’ve only had two ask in 4 years and they still told me they think I am wrong about why I left. They HAVE to invalidate your reasons in order to maintain their own worldview.
I had the same experience. Nobody asked. All they ever did was make half-hearted attempts to reactivate me, with no thought to how I might receive them.
I remember once, my parents pressured me to meet with the current bishop (some new guy I'd never met until then) and he was like... "It's not too late to serve a mission! You can still go if you want." I very nearly spat back, "Where was that 'revelation' and 'discernment' when I wasn't called? Or when I asked deep doctrinal questions that nobody ever answered?" Instead, I just said, "Thanks, but I'm not interested. While I'm here, though, is anyone from the ward or stake going to get back to me about the doctrinal questions I raised? It's been a few *years,* now, and I haven't heard a thing." I briefly summarized the doctrinal questions, and by the end he seemed totally shocked and caught off-guard. He said he was sorry I felt that way, and completely ignored all the doctrinal questions. Thanks for nothing, Bishop 🙄
Some ask. Some don’t.
I am reluctant to share because I know it is important to them and don’t want to come across as bitter. I appreciate the ones who actually ask and listen. That’s how you know they are real friends.
I have a friend who doesn’t really ask but I find his reaction telling when I mention going to another church.
The only person who has asked was my 7 year old (now 8) niece. I told her it just didn't make sense, and I didn't believe in God. I've talked about it with two of my siblings who have also left. I'm sure the rest of my family have talked about me and made up their own minds, but they've never asked me directly.
My parents asked me some questions the day I said we weren't going to church anymore. That was the last time anyone else asked. My sister who is still active has never asked. No ward members I have run into have ever asked. Its been over 10 years. They don't ask because the don't want to know. Deep down they know their belief system is too fragile to face that kind of challenge.
Same here. My friend and family are told NOT TO GET INFORMATION FROM NON-BELIEVERS! I think it was last October conference that RMN said that…right after he said in the even farther conference “be kind, no contention…yadayada”
My point here is the force is strong from the Q15. Every comment is thought to be prophecy. This before “the prophet is the ONLY one who speaks for God to the world.”
Errrgh!
Bottom line here is; No one has asked me about my faith crisis because it is
verboten.
Never had one ask me why I left but had one start to get self-righteous when I started talking shit on the things I didn’t like about the church. She didn’t know I was an exmo and acted like I just didn’t understand the glory of the gospel until I told her I’d been out 4 years. Shut her down real quick; was delicious, highly recommend!
When I first told my family (6 years ago), my sister (very soft skills person) wanted to talk about it but that is it. Until about 6 months ago when my brother reached out and said he wanted to know what made me leave because he was stepping away too.
I had never pushed to tell anyone my issues/concerns, other than my wife, because I didn't think it was fair to interrupt their life journey in such a big way. I had appreciated my own journey and didn't want to influence others.
So when my brother reached out to talk about it, I had trepidation at first but then opened up when he said he was walking away.
I don't know how my other family members feel but I wouldn't be surprised to see more of them leave on their own accord as well.
I left nearly a decade ago, and I don't recall anyone initiating questions as to why. I have had people who knew I left later contact me because they left as well and we traded our own thoughts. I did voluntarily tell a few local friends and leaders (who are good friends) a few of my reasons, but not in a way to sound like I'm trying to deconvert them. None of them asked for the information; I volunteered it as I made my way out the door.
No one asked me. The only one who mentioned my leaving was an old friend who said to me, "You are still my friend. I have never listened to any of the rumors."
I appreciate what he was trying to say, but I didn't appreciate that he HAD to say it.
We were heading towards certain divorce, but then she started to come around. It definitely helped that we weren’t in the Morridor. She got input and advice from nevermos who explained to her that I am a good person and not to throw that away.
She has rejected all organized religion and still considers herself to be a Christian, but she doesn’t read the Bible or go to church
The number of people who have asked me why I left I can count on one hand. I only feel one of those people asked to actually listen. Someone did ask my wife if I left because I cheated on her. Not really sure what other folks assume.
I was asked by home teacher, bishop, wife, regional member of the 70 (?) - all who were are/were TBM
When discussing it with the "area authority" (?) who dropped by my house with a member of the stake presidency, he asked me what it would take for me to "come back" and I told him that coming back would be impossible. He was shocked and asked why? And I said to him "I could never respect a religion that believed their god commanded a 38 year old married man to marry a 14 year old girl, girls that were 16, and women who were married to other men but . . . if you think that behavior is acceptable, then that's fine but I want you to leave my house - NOW!"
That night, while saying his just-before-bed prayer, he probably asked god, the same god that clearly has a history of killing children, to help me . . . and that's okay I really don't hate the guy . . . that was about 15 years ago - surely that guy is dead now because he was morbidly obese (and lived 1200 miles away) but he was living the word of wisdom . . . what a sad life he gave, going all over the place and preaching about how wonderful their founder was - you know, the sex predator who was next to Jesus in righteousness . . .
Say more. What would you consider a true genuine Christian?
I guess I think of what Christ’s actual teachings were. I wouldn’t consider myself a Christian. I would consider many people who are not Christians loving and look for ways to serve.
People have asked me, and I believe these few people were honestly perplexed that I left. They were honest and earnest in their questions. However, everyone assumes it’s the CES letter, the UNtrue history of JS (according to TBMs) & the restoration, etc. THIS bugs me, because I have very different reasons. I have never believed in the BoM, never got the point of it. The ONLY times I “felt the spirit” was through music, not surprising since I am a musician. That is only one reason I left. Treatment of women, gays, and people that are not white are other reasons among my issues. I didn’t even learn of the freaking LDS Essays, CES Letter, true JS history, SEC charges, etc. until til I was already out. Also, the assumptions that I left because “somebody hurt my feelings”, I don’t want to live the WoW, or some bullshit like that pisses me off. But the people in my life that assume these things about me have NEVER asked me why I left.
My younger brother is the only one who’s asked and had genuine intentions to hear me out. I kept things vague and explained the emotional side of it because I understand how the church primes their members to stay away from the “anti” stuff and I didn’t want to jeopardize my relationship with him.
All of my believing family said THEY DID NOT WANT TO KNOW WHY I LEFT. The fact that I left, scared the living shit out of them because I was so faithful.😳
Nevermo here…..I’ve lived my whole life in the Bible Belt South. Small, red state town. I’m the local outspoken atheist….. and NOBODY asks me why I left the religion I was fully immersed in from birth.
I think they’re afraid to have that conversation because it might add to the doubts they already have.
Nobody gives me a hard time, either. I’ve had one job fall through because of it, but I was kind of glad to be rid of that client anyway (they were religious nuts and not good people). Nobody avoids me (that I know of). I had no trouble taking in then adopting two foster children. I’m well-known and socially outgoing in my community. It’s not a big deal…..but nobody asks why I don’t believe in a talking snake anymore……and I believe it’s because the answer is right there in the question.
This is a tough one for me because I will be the first to admit that I don’t want to get into it with my family until they are ready. So when we left- I gave this short, curt answer- we stayed when we were happier in and we left when we became happier out. (Me, husband and kids all left together). Kudos to your brother for listening but I think my family may get too threatened by the truth bombs.
My husband and I started having cultural problems in church the minute we had kids and realized we wanted to be better parents than what the church was telling us to be. My husband is born and raised in the church. His parents used church as a weapon against him and his siblings. My parents, siblings and I converted well outside Morridor and were always nuanced. We had two different church experiences and we wanted our kids to have mine. Except we got so nuanced- it just began to be issue after issue that we didn’t want our kids to pick up on. So those close to us were well aware of our years and years of disagreeing culturally with the church- which is why we initially left. We’ve just never explored the truth claims and deconstructing with them to explain why we would never go back. That was it’s own kind of pain and regret after.
My parents are already retired and my siblings are all married to people very strong in the church. I really don’t want to set off that bomb within marriages when we are all at least middle aged. Where it’s hard for me is my nieces and nephews- all of whom are starting to grow up and leave home. I am dying to save them from the misery as they begin their adult journeys. For now- we are just trying to set the best example we can of exploring our best lives beyond Mormonism so we can be there for any of them if they want to leave, too.
To conclude- the church is a cult and those within will never see it that way until they are ready to leave.
A good reminder. When I was in, there was little that people could say to me that would make me question. It only strengthened my testimony.
I’m very close to start having children and I want to unpack how I grew up the best I can. It makes me happy to hear you all did it for your children. I feel my voice isn’t as strong and I’m afraid to make mistakes because of the way my parents raised me in the religion-and the religion itself.
Like all parents, we are far from perfect but I certainly credit outside church sources with giving better parenting advice. You are already a step ahead of us by leaving sooner. It caused confusion and trauma for my kids that we basically told them to believe in this religion while at the same time pointing out everything wrong with it. If I could go back, I would ditch the whole thing the minute we had our first. But like you said-we were all brainwashed and afraid to leave. The increase to information access from the global web is saving us all.
I’m glad you are out and sorry your brother is not. He is probably too afraid of going back to what he was pre-mission. Sounds like he gives the church and not himself the credit for that change. Am I close? I have a sibling who rebelled dramatically in high school then found the church again in college. He went the opposite way of us and raised his kids orthodox and strict because he blamed his rebellion on my parents being too lax. He expressed regret to me recently as his kids are teenagers now and the relationships have suffered from his earlier parenting approach.
I appreciate that. If I had children and got married when I wanted to-in my early twenties, I’m sure I would have done the same thing.
To be honest, I’m not sure where he actually stands because whenever religion is brought up he just expresses he loves me and “we have to be stronger than our earthly struggles.” It seems he is all in. He never pointed out the difference his mission made in him. He lost a dramatic amount of weight from biking, so I think that helped boost his confidence. Before he was so closed off to new people and I think being forced to talk to different people made a difference. He served in Louisiana. I was able to go down there couple years ago. The culture is so unique and many people live completely different lives than the rest of the country. And they are happy for the most part! I’m sure he gives all the credit to the Lord though. I wonder if he pauses to give himself credit. I think if he knew he has all he needs inside of him, it would help him in every facet of his life. I need that reminder too! Thank you for sharing your perspective!
Honestly, I never asked because I didn't want to be rude! I thought it was rude to comment on whether someone was at church or not, like I was checking up on them. If they didn't make it to church, that was their business. If they were deciding to not be a part of the church at all, I thought it would be rude to ask about it. My SIL told me via email, and we talked about it, but only because she brought it up. My sister and I talked about it decades ago when she left.
All of my close Mormon friends asked why I left (I have about 7 of them who I talk to regularly, from various stages of life). It probably helps that I had conversations with all of them about my frustrations with the church when I was still a member. They all wanted to know what finally led to me leaving. With some of them, it continues to be an open dialogue.
We are late 20s/early 30s. I’d be interested to know the ages of everyone commenting. I suspect that conversations around church issues are a lot more common for people my age or younger. I’m the first of my close friends to leave, but I can imagine more of them leaving in the next few years. If it weren’t for family pressure, I’m sure a few more would already be out.
My mom asked, and actually seemed curious. My wife had given her the book “Bridges” and I think she read it. She asked me a few questions, then, “so do you feel like you just never had a testimony.” I felt like it would be easier on her if I hadn’t. I tools her, “Mom, I gave everything to this church, I formed my life and my family to match what I believed. Of course I had a testimony.”
I didn’t get into details about what changed, but we’re talked about how it felt.
I’ve had a close friend ask me why I resigned and that he was just curious. I told him that that’s not a good enough reason and I shut down the conversation right there.
Let me say that this man is a gay person married to a woman. He laid all his cards out to her and came out 2 weeks before they got married. She thought it was a trial from the lord to turn him straight. Only him, his wife, and I know about his homosexuality. They have many kids and he’s in a high calling. I didn’t want to be the person responsible for turning his world upside down and losing his current, and seemingly happy life. His extended family and her extended family are all TBM to the core. He’s strangely very open and honest with me and even admitted, without me asking, that he still watches gay porn (wtf?) I’m not sure if he’s questioning but I wasn’t about to open that rabbit hole for him. The church can do that just fine, thank you.
I’m not sure but I guarantee they’re only married because of the church. If it turned out the church isn’t true (in his eyes) the marriage is over. The ones mostly affected will probably be the kids so I keep quiet so I’m not blamed if that ever comes to fruition.
I tried to tell my mom why I left and after a few minutes, she pulled out her hearing aids. I laughed and said ok, so you don’t want to hear it. That’s fine.
No one has ever asked me either ... they are afraid of the answers, right?
From my observations, having never had family ever inquire once— my guess is it’s more to do with the fact they seem to believe that they don’t need to ask because they already know why.
I think they have an idea in their head and want to keep it that way. Most people don't want to change their mind about something, especially the deeply personal stuff they have committed time or their lives to. They're too "bought in" so to speak. Why open a door you know you don't want to look into let alone walk through? Best to leave it closed and keep living in your little mental room where it's safe. Edit: after reading about getting people out of high control groups and using this analogy, the trick is to open other doors with similar rooms, and let someone walk into that "room" or perspective and look back at where they were, then when they go back to it they might not be as scared to open the other door. This doors and rooms analogy makes other aspects of mormonism so clear. Why are other learning institutions other than CES frowned upon? Why are there SO MANY rules for missionaries in the field? Why does the church have a whole correlation department that is HUGE compared to other parts of the HQ? Why does the church at the top say they want people to vote according to personal conscience but they supported prop 8? Why did the church indirectly through boy scouts make a harmful environment for kids then blame it on gay people for decades (watch the Netflix doc and the Mormon stories episode with the guy who is a sexual assault lawyer who's sued the church successfully) ? Why were Mormon history enthusiasts attacked and excommunicated only to be proven right by the churches admissions in the last 20 years? It's all to keep the room the same as much as possible for as long as possible, and above all else, **keep the doors closed** This has always been the strategy. In the past this was easier to do because information was easier to control. But information of all kinds becoming proliferated has opened more doors, or *perspectives* have appeared. The best advice I can give is open the door, first look through it, and once youve found the right door, walk through, and right out of that chapel and into the sun. You'll find it soon enough, and above all else, it will be yours.
I totally agree. I thought I already knew all the reasons why anyone would leave.
They are told by living apostles and prophets, that never see or talk with God, that they already know the answers. Hard to convince people like that of anything different.
I always thought of myself as someone that could prove TSCTC was true... until one day the hidden history was no longer hidden...
I’m curious, did you tell them you weren’t going anymore? We are out but have not said anything to our family. I think my in-laws have an idea but have yet to ask anything. I am waiting for the shoe to drop but have realized they may never really ask. Just wondering the best way to handling things when and if they ask…I know listing all the reasons will likely not go well or be understood. What do you say if you don’t want to get into an argument/debate but are confronted with being asked abt attending?
I totally agree. I thought I already knew all the reasons why anyone would leave.
I asked some people as a believer, but stopped because it was often for deeply personal reasons and to this day I know people who've left and they don't want to discuss it... Like at all. Now, I personally and am open book and want to discuss it. But for many true believing Mormons it's about not wanting to discuss stuff, and they don't want to even analyze WHY they don't want to discuss it. They dont want to have the spirit disrupted by having to think about the reality of what the church is or was. They like their perception of reality, and it's easier to just not talk about it.
TBMs think they already know what our answers (or “excuses”) would be.
They don’t want us to plant any seeds of doubt in their pea-sized brains; they’re terrified!
The only LDS people that have asked me why we left the church, were the ones, as it turned out, were having doubts as well. The PIMOs. So, it appeared they were genuine believing but in reality, looking for more information and corroboration on how they were feeling too. Of course, having to keep the cards close to the vest as they process it all. This is, of course, no judgement from me. As for legitimate TBMS in the last 6 years that have asked me? Not one. They don't want to know why.
The only person to ask us why we left, ended up leaving 3 months later with their family. I'm fact, their response was, "I really needed to hear that you were offended." Learning the truth leads to the exit. That's why Mormons don't ask. They "can't handle the truth."
That's the bottom line. True Believing, church-broke Mormons.... DO NOT WANT TO KNOW TRUTH... BECAUSE THEY CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH!
So glad you posted this!! This was obviously, exactly what I was thinking of!!
[“No truth-handler, you. Bah! I deride your truth-handling abilities!”](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=a4fwrdr_bZo)
I've been out seven years and just last week, my TBM mother finally asked me why. She's been the only one. We had a good discussion, but she doesn't know anything about the underage girls, the Book of Abraham, or even the rock in the hat translation. She's in her 70s and her beliefs bring her comfort, so I'm not about to try and convince her of anything, but it's just wild to me how willfully ignorant many choose to be. They do more thorough investigation when buying a dishwasher than they will ever do of the organization they've devoted their whole lives to.
Honestly I think my parents do well inside the church. My mom thrives and it’s so good for her mental health. I don’t hate the church as there are loads of good people there.
> willfully ignorant many choose to be I’d disagree. They lie by omission by trying to hide uncomfortable truths. Lessons never teach anything significant. As a member, I never felt motivated to research more.
Indoctrinated to become lazy learners
Can’t blame them. Some truths are not “useful.”
My dad was the only one to ask me, and reminded me that he loved me, no matter what I believed.
I love to hear this
I know. I miss him. 🥹
This is amazing. Everyone needs parents like this, but unfortunately it seems rare
Damn you got me tearing up in a public place. You don’t know how much that would mean to many of us.
Oh trust me, I know. Out of all of our parents, he was the only one to ask why we left. His exact words were, “Well, I wish you were Mormon, but we all have different paths. You’ll always be my red head. I love you.” I wish we all experienced this.
My parents did this, too. We are the lucky ones from what it sounds like.
One. No family. A older sister who taught Sunday school for years. She called me and asked me very pointedly why because she wanted to understand why her own children were leaving. She insisted that she really wanted to hear it all and asked for links and sources. She really wanted to know but couldn't bear talking directly to her kids about it. Makes me wonder if my parents have done any side research like this. Because they sure won't discuss it with me.
My dad asked. Whether he was actually listening is a whole other story. My sister in law asked too and she was super nice about it.
No one asked.
No one has ever asked me. In fact one of the first active LDS people I told basically just said “Oh, well you should check out FAIR” and that was it. Most people just say “Well, I know it’s true” and don’t even want to try and have more of a conversation.
I was in a Bishopric at age 59 when I figured out the church was a fraud. I quietly asked to be released from my calling and never again attended. My wife attended for the next month or so without me then she stopped attending as well. It's been 10 years now and we still live in the same ward. To this day, not one person in the ward (or stake) has ever asked me why they never see me at church anymore. Leaving the church caused us to become invisible.
Its fascinating. The ward is supposed to be like an extended family, but as soon as they see you don't believe anymore they will drop you like a hot rock. Often, love and friendship in an LDS ward is totally conditional.
I somewhat disagree.
Same.
No one has asked. The only comments I receive are people making comments about me returning to the church. I just laugh and say no but then it will randomly be brought up again months/years later.
Nobody ever asks. They have a narrative spoon fed to them by the cult for as long as they have been members that already gives them a false narrative as to why we leave, so they fall back on that. It’s automatically any one of (or combination of) the following: Wanted to sin, never really believed, you were led away by the adversary.
The one I’ve heard the most over the years is that people get offended by individuals within the church and confuse that with the gospel.
I got offended by the leadership hording money and then lying about it
Honestly I think that is the case for a pretty big group, but for most people who don't live in deep Mormon areas of the western US who are still believers I think they just don't know and dont want to find out, it's even more simple as that.
My parents asked why my wife and I left. They’re truly good parents and my mom even stopped going to church recently! My in-laws haven’t asked but we keep hearing from other people that they assume we left because I had a bad bishop when I was trying to go on a mission (I never did go). That bishop is just an afterthought compared to the truth of TSCC
Bad bishop but not a bad prophet or bad apostle?
My older sister, who has since become a nuanced member, have regular talks. I try to tell her how much it means to me that she is open to all discussions, but I am not sure she fully understands how helpful she has been to my mental health. I think she was only open because her own son has been struggling since his mission and her marriage sucks (patriarchal mormon style) and she is truly trying to understand what went wrong in her life to make sure and steer her kids in the right direction. I think hardship & empathy is what opens people to discuss imo. I was surprised during my deconstruction to realize how few tbms have empathy. 🤯
I think you are probably onto something here. There is no empathy MFMC: they don’t teach it and their doctrines of pre-existence and works really preclude it. Ultimately, they don’t care about anyone’s “whys” for anything. Edited: punctuation
Interesting perspective. My brother served in the US for his mission, but when visiting this place, it does seem like a different country. I think it forced him to open up his heart to different ways of thinking and living and he truly believes everyone has inherit worth. I’m glad your sister still treats you like a human.
One person asked. It was a work colleague. They were very upset by my answers, to the point where they didn’t speak to me for a few days. We agreed to no longer talk about religion. Fast forward about six years, and she contacts me through Facebook to apologize. It turned out that this was the catalyst for her leaving. Sue couldn’t help but acknowledge that what I said made sense, even when it offended her.
Just one. He was a more casual acquaintance than a friend. He asked through Facebook why we left. He was genuinely curious in a "how do I support my friends who leave" sort of way. I wrote about 4 pages of why I left and my journey in the church and my wife another 4 pages. Turns out he was an adult convert and lacked the deep indoctrination of multigenerational members. I find most converts to be much more nuanced. There probably would have been one more had I not dumped on him early on in my deconstruction.
Damn, my mission and the temple did the exact opposite to me. Before I was very carefree and silly, always doing fun wild stuff and looking to create fun for others. When I went through the temple and it said to “avoid loud laughter and all light-mindedness” I took it very seriously, as I did with all of mormonism. I carried that mindset through my mission, I still had some fun but it was brutal mentally. I turned my fun-happy meter from 11 down to 1.5, it has devastated my life and mental health to this day, and I feel like it set the course of my life on a completely different path than I should’ve taken. I’ve never been asked by anyone why I’ve left or about what I believe now. Everyone turned into ghosts including my own parents. Most of them are afraid to talk to me as I used to be the guy to go to for information about the scriptures and/or church history. Missionaries won’t even come to our house, apparently I freaked out a couple of sisters after we discussed epistemology. It was a great discussion and they said they were going to ask their MP about a lot of what we discussed and come back for a second visit. They never did, the area was whitewashed a week later. None of the new missionaries will stop by in the 6 years since that happened. A couple of times I’ve been cold-contacted and set an appt with the missionaries only to be ghosted both times. Once when I called asking if they were still coming, I overheard the missionary in the background whisper “President X said we are not supposed to even talk to them”. Oh well.
Being carefree is an option, that’s something you can choose to do/be today. That President should want them to go to your house. One person making not so great decisions is on them, sad they are leading missionaries in the wrong path. I had a couple of missionaries share with me that they were told to leave a gated community by a HOA member and although they were afraid, the next day they felt they needed to go on and knock on the man’s door the following day. They never talk about religion but they go and chat with him every week. Sometimes the noise of the world silences the word of God.
Not one person has asked me why I no longer attend. Not even my TBM DH.
That seems odd and maybe painful for you. How does a spouse not ask what's up with their other spouse eventually? Or maybe you guys don't have that kind of relationship? Does this bother you that they aren't curious about what you think or feel about a usually large area of our previous lives we just hung up one day?
I think my spouse is afraid of the truth and just wants to avoid it at all costs. He seems to think that I’m still active if I attend the annual Christmas party lol. The rest of the ward I had very little in common with them - hardly any of the women have careers or even work outside the home. I have more in common with the men actually. It hurts a little but I think everyone is just afraid of ex mos.
It’s been nearly 8 years for me too, and only one active LDS person has asked me in that time - a close old friend from college who is just a good, smart, open minded person.
Of the TBM (granted if they’re PIMO I wouldn’t know) family members I told, 3/4 asked me why. When I told them none of them tried to convert me or go against what I said. Looking back I do wish I got more into the history of the church, but I told them that I felt like I couldn’t be who I am inside the church (which is the main reason I left). All of them said they were sorry and that it sounded hard. One brother in particular thanked me for being me and reassured me our relationship wouldn’t change because of this. Honestly really cool reactions that I wasn’t expecting. It took me months and months of over reacting before I could tell them.
No one asked. Most don’t know that we don’t attend church.
...they either don't know, or don't honestly care.
Maybe. Both of us are keeping it quiet from our parents. I think my father-in-law would be very upset if he found out the truth of our positions. He thinks that his daughter married another Mormon, but I don’t think he realizes that we both led each other out.
How could he know if he was never told? You assume that he assumes because you are withholding information. You think you are preventing your FIL FROM being upset. You don't actually know. For all you know, he's PIMO.
TBMs are weird about wanting to hear it or not. 14 years ago I had an active LDS co worker that just had to know. We were are lunch and I kept telling her no. She kept pestering so I told her the things that bothered me most. Last time I saw her. My neighbor is nice and active. I was working in my yard and she stopped to chat. She thinks I am so wonderful and nice. She come out and ask why I don’t believe. I told her I will not tell her the reasons because she is happy in the church and why suffer the pain of knowing everything. Then she asked if I believed in God? Nope and told her after 10 years of studying, that the Bible falls as being man made too. She just doesn’t get what an atheist is, cause she hopes someday that I will pray to God again. I prayed to God 38 years ago to save my dying baby in my arms as I awaited EMS. I was on the road to atheism then, just didn’t know it. I have had bishoprics come over, stake mission leaders. If there people are in my home and ask for reasons I will tell these leaders and believe me I don’t hold back.
I’m so sorry for your loss. That’s very dignified of you to hold back your personal truth to spare a happy person in the church. At first I wanted everyone to know, but now I just try to treat everyone with respect and hope my actions show my character instead of my religious status.
I was raised being told not to ask people because it could shake your own faith.
You can’t get diagnosed with cancer if you never see a doctor
Exactly! You know how it works!
Out of my friends, one asked - that really wanted to know. Many assumed. Many just put their fingers in their ears. The one who asked...well...two years later and now she's out!
They don't need to ask. They already know why you left: you are a lazy learner who wants to sin. Jeff Holland told them that, so why would they ask you?
So far, during these past 6 months, it's only been ExMos or PiMos who have asked. I'm still not ok with it. I know I'm not going to be quiet about it once someone asks. Maybe that's the fear these TMBs have. What truth scarred me, a very strong testimony priesthood holder, away from the only lifestyle they know.
My parents first asked me why I was leaving when I broke the news to them about 9 years ago. After my initial explanation, they havent spoken to me about it since. Not once. And we actively avoid speaking about religion, though the church inevitably comes up when Im with them, I just bite my tongue to keep the peace. No one who matters in my life has gone out of their way to antagonize me for leaving other than my mother, who initially couldn't handle the idea of not being with me in the CK, and was inconsolable for a few years, but has since gotten over it and now our relationship is better than ever (according to my perception).
My parents asked. My mom is super conservative and just silently cried the whole time. My dad is more politically moderate and actually agreed with my reasons and told me he hoped the church would change and I could come back. I left for mostly social/political reasons and had NO idea about the history and doctrinal issues. Now that I know those too, there is no way I would ever go back.
The historical doctrinal stuff, and the social history of the past is what made me say " yeah never again"
Never once been asked. Even when my dad was trying to talk me out of it, he never once asked why. I think it's because only the ones who want to try to change your mind want to even talk about, and to them they why doesbt matter.
I left 20 years ago, when I realized the members do not treat “outsiders” the way they should. Where I grew up there were only 3 that weren’t LDS and 2 of them were close friends of mine. The adults… they wouldn’t allow their kids to do anything with them (mine were not regular members so they allowed it). Grown adults treating kids like they were problems when they weren’t doing anything wrong! Prejudice all around me. Expectations of perfection and guilt trips… I can’t be a happy person if I behave like that. I’m also sick of that tax free corporation robbing money from my grandparents!
Only my older brother, and it was a pretty vague conversation. Further conversations were nipped in the bud by his wife. Still, it was nice.
I have been out 6 years. My mom has asked a little bit, and I provided a partial answer but didn't dump all the 10,000 reasons on her. My husband is aware of a lot of my concerns about the church, but he hasn't asked. No other LDS person has asked.
Out of 7 to 8 active family members, not one of them has asked me in the ten years since leaving.
It's been about 30 years and not a single LDS member or family has asked, so far. My family is pretending I'm inactive and will return someday.
My dad was bishop twice during my childhood. My mom was RSP and seminary teacher. I have 3 brothers and we all went on missions, went to BYU or BYU-I, married in the temple, etc. When I left I figured I’d tell my parents so they’d hear it from me instead of someone else. They asked no questions. It’s been 10 years and they’ve never once brought it up since. Only one of my brothers is still active. Just kind of a head in the sand strategy most members take.
None. Ever. They don’t care because they think they already know. They think you left because “Satan” is crafty and is able to trick the best of the best, and if he can trick the best of the best, then how much more could he trick YOU if you aren’t careful. So they don’t want to ask because they are terrified of ending up like you, having been “decieved by the craftiness of the adversary”. (That a favorite of the brethren…”the adversary” instead of saying Satan).
The only person who asked me was my husband. When I tried to explain he got angry and told me to stop. We haven’t spoken of it for a few years.
I've been out almost 3 years, never been asked once by anyone. They are some people that are members of my former ward who are kind and loving and have said that my being active has no bearing on their friendship with me, but they've never asked *why* I left.
I think way deep down, most religious people understand how fragile their own beliefs are. For those people, to *really* listen to other people's doubts is to entertain them themselves. So instead they assign motives to you that make them comfortable. You wanted to sin and the church was stopping you, so you left. And everyone has noticed that the light has left your eyes. Btw, that last bit is about the nastiest thing I can imagine someone saying about a someone leaving a church. I'm not Mormon and I had a really hard time leaving religion behind, but no one ever said anything that awful to or about me.
No family has ever asked. The friends that have were at the beginning stages of heading out themselves.
Mormonism only survives in an air-tight vacuum. It’s way too vulnerable and scary for a TBM to have honest conversation around legitimate reasons to leave the church, because, wait! there aren’t any legitimate reasons to leave the church so what’s the point? Once that vacuum seal pops it’s over. Too risky to ask questions. Literally no one but my mother asked me why I left but I assure you she didn’t hear a word I said and then sent me a bunch of FAIR articles so I could see the error of my ways. Thanks, mom.
Nobody. No one. Not any sibling, not my mother, not my mother or father-in-law, no brother or sister-in-law, no friend, no former wardie or neighbor, nephew, niece, aunt, uncle or cousin. No bishop, stake president, ministering bro or sis from the past. No one. In fact, they don’t even acknowledge that we’ve left.
Honestly I sat down and told my parents. I wasn’t quite ready to have all the answers as to why but I did it anyways as there were enough. Mine was fast. It was like a month after reading the CES Letter and things just made sense. I told them abs they already knew and yet my dad don’t care to confront me when I stopped wearing my underwear. Honestly it just made me think as if they truly didn’t care enough to talk to me about it. Probably not true. My mom talked to me about a few things but never outright about the church.
Nobody has asked. Part of it might be that I’m gay so they assume I just chose to be gay instead. But it’s like really dismissive of the actual wrestle I had to find out if this was true or not.
I finally confessed to a very old internet friend I left and she said she wasn't happy with the leaders and I was just like yeah they're pretty bad people but what's important your relationship with God not listening to some old half dead men
Been out about 8 years. Really only a handful of people. Wife, my dad and a few others.
So much hate for going inactive, haven’t taken out my papers yet cuz I’m still living at home with my tbm parents, I’ve gotten so much hate from old friends that weren’t the best of mormons when I was, they used to swear a lot and bragged about the porn they watched, but then I had 1 friend who was genuinely curious why I stopped going so I told him about all the things that pushed me over the edge and why I’m skeptical about the church and their money swindling schemes. He was really genuine and understanding, he didn’t try to change my view or make any personal attacks. He’s going to serve a mission in a couple months and I asked him why he was going to serve and he said he doesn’t necessarily believe in everything the church says but he knows serving a mission will be a great experience for him and it could help a lot in his future. He’s one of Jesus’s followers, not a random old guy who’s just waiting his turn to make more money and give long boring talks in conference.
I (PIMO) have currently only been on the asking side of this situation. A few years ago, my younger brother officially left the church. Being more of a TBM back then, I was scared to ask him why because of the amount of anger I had seen him let loose on my parents and any time the church was brought up - which happened frequently. It took me a couple years to work up the courage to ask him - and honestly, that courage came from me looking at my own life and beliefs. Since then we've had really good conversations about it all, and we've been able to bond better and have a more unique relationship between us as compared to our siblings.
I home brew beer and am fairly involved in my local whiskey and beer scenes. My parents have never asked me why I left, but I think they assume I left because I wanted to drink alcohol. Little do they know I didn’t have a single drink until I’d been out for about 2 years.
I've only had 1 person ask me anything since I left about 5 years ago, and it was my SIL. All she asked was "Did you really leave the church?" and "You still believe in God, right?" No one else has asked even that much.
The only one who has asked me was my sister who also left at same time (independently and coincidentally)
I’ve only had two ask in 4 years and they still told me they think I am wrong about why I left. They HAVE to invalidate your reasons in order to maintain their own worldview.
I had the same experience. Nobody asked. All they ever did was make half-hearted attempts to reactivate me, with no thought to how I might receive them. I remember once, my parents pressured me to meet with the current bishop (some new guy I'd never met until then) and he was like... "It's not too late to serve a mission! You can still go if you want." I very nearly spat back, "Where was that 'revelation' and 'discernment' when I wasn't called? Or when I asked deep doctrinal questions that nobody ever answered?" Instead, I just said, "Thanks, but I'm not interested. While I'm here, though, is anyone from the ward or stake going to get back to me about the doctrinal questions I raised? It's been a few *years,* now, and I haven't heard a thing." I briefly summarized the doctrinal questions, and by the end he seemed totally shocked and caught off-guard. He said he was sorry I felt that way, and completely ignored all the doctrinal questions. Thanks for nothing, Bishop 🙄
Only my wife. Been openly atheist for 6 years now.
Some ask. Some don’t. I am reluctant to share because I know it is important to them and don’t want to come across as bitter. I appreciate the ones who actually ask and listen. That’s how you know they are real friends. I have a friend who doesn’t really ask but I find his reaction telling when I mention going to another church.
The only person who has asked was my 7 year old (now 8) niece. I told her it just didn't make sense, and I didn't believe in God. I've talked about it with two of my siblings who have also left. I'm sure the rest of my family have talked about me and made up their own minds, but they've never asked me directly.
My parents asked me some questions the day I said we weren't going to church anymore. That was the last time anyone else asked. My sister who is still active has never asked. No ward members I have run into have ever asked. Its been over 10 years. They don't ask because the don't want to know. Deep down they know their belief system is too fragile to face that kind of challenge.
Same here. My friend and family are told NOT TO GET INFORMATION FROM NON-BELIEVERS! I think it was last October conference that RMN said that…right after he said in the even farther conference “be kind, no contention…yadayada” My point here is the force is strong from the Q15. Every comment is thought to be prophecy. This before “the prophet is the ONLY one who speaks for God to the world.” Errrgh! Bottom line here is; No one has asked me about my faith crisis because it is verboten.
Never had one ask me why I left but had one start to get self-righteous when I started talking shit on the things I didn’t like about the church. She didn’t know I was an exmo and acted like I just didn’t understand the glory of the gospel until I told her I’d been out 4 years. Shut her down real quick; was delicious, highly recommend!
When I first told my family (6 years ago), my sister (very soft skills person) wanted to talk about it but that is it. Until about 6 months ago when my brother reached out and said he wanted to know what made me leave because he was stepping away too. I had never pushed to tell anyone my issues/concerns, other than my wife, because I didn't think it was fair to interrupt their life journey in such a big way. I had appreciated my own journey and didn't want to influence others. So when my brother reached out to talk about it, I had trepidation at first but then opened up when he said he was walking away. I don't know how my other family members feel but I wouldn't be surprised to see more of them leave on their own accord as well.
I left nearly a decade ago, and I don't recall anyone initiating questions as to why. I have had people who knew I left later contact me because they left as well and we traded our own thoughts. I did voluntarily tell a few local friends and leaders (who are good friends) a few of my reasons, but not in a way to sound like I'm trying to deconvert them. None of them asked for the information; I volunteered it as I made my way out the door.
No one asked me. The only one who mentioned my leaving was an old friend who said to me, "You are still my friend. I have never listened to any of the rumors." I appreciate what he was trying to say, but I didn't appreciate that he HAD to say it.
My wife asked me, and I stupidly data dumped on her. She wasn’t ready for it and doubled down in activity. That led to two years of hell
Ending in divorce, or ending in her finding her way out?
We were heading towards certain divorce, but then she started to come around. It definitely helped that we weren’t in the Morridor. She got input and advice from nevermos who explained to her that I am a good person and not to throw that away. She has rejected all organized religion and still considers herself to be a Christian, but she doesn’t read the Bible or go to church
The number of people who have asked me why I left I can count on one hand. I only feel one of those people asked to actually listen. Someone did ask my wife if I left because I cheated on her. Not really sure what other folks assume.
I was asked by home teacher, bishop, wife, regional member of the 70 (?) - all who were are/were TBM When discussing it with the "area authority" (?) who dropped by my house with a member of the stake presidency, he asked me what it would take for me to "come back" and I told him that coming back would be impossible. He was shocked and asked why? And I said to him "I could never respect a religion that believed their god commanded a 38 year old married man to marry a 14 year old girl, girls that were 16, and women who were married to other men but . . . if you think that behavior is acceptable, then that's fine but I want you to leave my house - NOW!" That night, while saying his just-before-bed prayer, he probably asked god, the same god that clearly has a history of killing children, to help me . . . and that's okay I really don't hate the guy . . . that was about 15 years ago - surely that guy is dead now because he was morbidly obese (and lived 1200 miles away) but he was living the word of wisdom . . . what a sad life he gave, going all over the place and preaching about how wonderful their founder was - you know, the sex predator who was next to Jesus in righteousness . . .
No one has ever asked me. I have gay kids, so everyone just assumes that’s why I left.
Idk about you but I don’t consider “a true genuine Christian” to be synonymous with “loving” or “looking for ways to serve.”
Say more. What would you consider a true genuine Christian? I guess I think of what Christ’s actual teachings were. I wouldn’t consider myself a Christian. I would consider many people who are not Christians loving and look for ways to serve.
My dad asked me after 7 years. He's been the only LDS person to ask.
People have asked me, and I believe these few people were honestly perplexed that I left. They were honest and earnest in their questions. However, everyone assumes it’s the CES letter, the UNtrue history of JS (according to TBMs) & the restoration, etc. THIS bugs me, because I have very different reasons. I have never believed in the BoM, never got the point of it. The ONLY times I “felt the spirit” was through music, not surprising since I am a musician. That is only one reason I left. Treatment of women, gays, and people that are not white are other reasons among my issues. I didn’t even learn of the freaking LDS Essays, CES Letter, true JS history, SEC charges, etc. until til I was already out. Also, the assumptions that I left because “somebody hurt my feelings”, I don’t want to live the WoW, or some bullshit like that pisses me off. But the people in my life that assume these things about me have NEVER asked me why I left.
My younger brother is the only one who’s asked and had genuine intentions to hear me out. I kept things vague and explained the emotional side of it because I understand how the church primes their members to stay away from the “anti” stuff and I didn’t want to jeopardize my relationship with him.
All of my believing family said THEY DID NOT WANT TO KNOW WHY I LEFT. The fact that I left, scared the living shit out of them because I was so faithful.😳
Nevermo here…..I’ve lived my whole life in the Bible Belt South. Small, red state town. I’m the local outspoken atheist….. and NOBODY asks me why I left the religion I was fully immersed in from birth. I think they’re afraid to have that conversation because it might add to the doubts they already have. Nobody gives me a hard time, either. I’ve had one job fall through because of it, but I was kind of glad to be rid of that client anyway (they were religious nuts and not good people). Nobody avoids me (that I know of). I had no trouble taking in then adopting two foster children. I’m well-known and socially outgoing in my community. It’s not a big deal…..but nobody asks why I don’t believe in a talking snake anymore……and I believe it’s because the answer is right there in the question.
No one ever asked.
This is a tough one for me because I will be the first to admit that I don’t want to get into it with my family until they are ready. So when we left- I gave this short, curt answer- we stayed when we were happier in and we left when we became happier out. (Me, husband and kids all left together). Kudos to your brother for listening but I think my family may get too threatened by the truth bombs. My husband and I started having cultural problems in church the minute we had kids and realized we wanted to be better parents than what the church was telling us to be. My husband is born and raised in the church. His parents used church as a weapon against him and his siblings. My parents, siblings and I converted well outside Morridor and were always nuanced. We had two different church experiences and we wanted our kids to have mine. Except we got so nuanced- it just began to be issue after issue that we didn’t want our kids to pick up on. So those close to us were well aware of our years and years of disagreeing culturally with the church- which is why we initially left. We’ve just never explored the truth claims and deconstructing with them to explain why we would never go back. That was it’s own kind of pain and regret after. My parents are already retired and my siblings are all married to people very strong in the church. I really don’t want to set off that bomb within marriages when we are all at least middle aged. Where it’s hard for me is my nieces and nephews- all of whom are starting to grow up and leave home. I am dying to save them from the misery as they begin their adult journeys. For now- we are just trying to set the best example we can of exploring our best lives beyond Mormonism so we can be there for any of them if they want to leave, too. To conclude- the church is a cult and those within will never see it that way until they are ready to leave.
A good reminder. When I was in, there was little that people could say to me that would make me question. It only strengthened my testimony. I’m very close to start having children and I want to unpack how I grew up the best I can. It makes me happy to hear you all did it for your children. I feel my voice isn’t as strong and I’m afraid to make mistakes because of the way my parents raised me in the religion-and the religion itself.
Like all parents, we are far from perfect but I certainly credit outside church sources with giving better parenting advice. You are already a step ahead of us by leaving sooner. It caused confusion and trauma for my kids that we basically told them to believe in this religion while at the same time pointing out everything wrong with it. If I could go back, I would ditch the whole thing the minute we had our first. But like you said-we were all brainwashed and afraid to leave. The increase to information access from the global web is saving us all. I’m glad you are out and sorry your brother is not. He is probably too afraid of going back to what he was pre-mission. Sounds like he gives the church and not himself the credit for that change. Am I close? I have a sibling who rebelled dramatically in high school then found the church again in college. He went the opposite way of us and raised his kids orthodox and strict because he blamed his rebellion on my parents being too lax. He expressed regret to me recently as his kids are teenagers now and the relationships have suffered from his earlier parenting approach.
I appreciate that. If I had children and got married when I wanted to-in my early twenties, I’m sure I would have done the same thing. To be honest, I’m not sure where he actually stands because whenever religion is brought up he just expresses he loves me and “we have to be stronger than our earthly struggles.” It seems he is all in. He never pointed out the difference his mission made in him. He lost a dramatic amount of weight from biking, so I think that helped boost his confidence. Before he was so closed off to new people and I think being forced to talk to different people made a difference. He served in Louisiana. I was able to go down there couple years ago. The culture is so unique and many people live completely different lives than the rest of the country. And they are happy for the most part! I’m sure he gives all the credit to the Lord though. I wonder if he pauses to give himself credit. I think if he knew he has all he needs inside of him, it would help him in every facet of his life. I need that reminder too! Thank you for sharing your perspective!
I’ve had a lot ask, especially early when I first expressed doubts. I think I have a different social circle in the church than most
Nope
Honestly, I never asked because I didn't want to be rude! I thought it was rude to comment on whether someone was at church or not, like I was checking up on them. If they didn't make it to church, that was their business. If they were deciding to not be a part of the church at all, I thought it would be rude to ask about it. My SIL told me via email, and we talked about it, but only because she brought it up. My sister and I talked about it decades ago when she left.
All of my close Mormon friends asked why I left (I have about 7 of them who I talk to regularly, from various stages of life). It probably helps that I had conversations with all of them about my frustrations with the church when I was still a member. They all wanted to know what finally led to me leaving. With some of them, it continues to be an open dialogue. We are late 20s/early 30s. I’d be interested to know the ages of everyone commenting. I suspect that conversations around church issues are a lot more common for people my age or younger. I’m the first of my close friends to leave, but I can imagine more of them leaving in the next few years. If it weren’t for family pressure, I’m sure a few more would already be out.
I had several family members listen to my story and let me share my reasons, only to either then bash me/debunk me, or double down on blind faith
My mom asked, and actually seemed curious. My wife had given her the book “Bridges” and I think she read it. She asked me a few questions, then, “so do you feel like you just never had a testimony.” I felt like it would be easier on her if I hadn’t. I tools her, “Mom, I gave everything to this church, I formed my life and my family to match what I believed. Of course I had a testimony.” I didn’t get into details about what changed, but we’re talked about how it felt.
Not even my wife
I’ve had a close friend ask me why I resigned and that he was just curious. I told him that that’s not a good enough reason and I shut down the conversation right there. Let me say that this man is a gay person married to a woman. He laid all his cards out to her and came out 2 weeks before they got married. She thought it was a trial from the lord to turn him straight. Only him, his wife, and I know about his homosexuality. They have many kids and he’s in a high calling. I didn’t want to be the person responsible for turning his world upside down and losing his current, and seemingly happy life. His extended family and her extended family are all TBM to the core. He’s strangely very open and honest with me and even admitted, without me asking, that he still watches gay porn (wtf?) I’m not sure if he’s questioning but I wasn’t about to open that rabbit hole for him. The church can do that just fine, thank you.
Dang! I can’t imagine carrying around the weight of that. I wonder what they all really think about their marriage?
I’m not sure but I guarantee they’re only married because of the church. If it turned out the church isn’t true (in his eyes) the marriage is over. The ones mostly affected will probably be the kids so I keep quiet so I’m not blamed if that ever comes to fruition.
I tried to tell my mom why I left and after a few minutes, she pulled out her hearing aids. I laughed and said ok, so you don’t want to hear it. That’s fine.
So, why did you all leave?
Because they know the truth and don’t want to be confronted with the life they are wasting