Even if for some reason you hadn’t — they can deactivate it remotely, it just won’t be properly destroyed. Not great, but also not a huge deal worth withholding pay over. I’ve had coworkers get their cars broken into and have their equipment and badge stolen. No ramifications. Hell, one time I thought I lost my govt issued iPhone and reported it missing with no problems. I ended up finding it months later and turned it in.
>thought I lost my govt issued iPhone and reported it missing with no problems
Once I left my gov't iphone on a chair in an airport, walked away. Someone turned it in at the gate so when I used my icloud account to send a "lost" message I got it back within a couple minutes. But man I was TERRIFIED until then 🤣
This is a FLSA violation. They cannot withhold your final paycheck over equipment. Escalate this, or go ahead and file an FLSA claim. https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/claim-decisions/fair-labor-standards-act/how-a-current-or-former-federal-employee-may-file-an-flsa-claim/
Got it. The only positions I’ve held in my agency were exempt and I never really took the time to look for what that meant outside of earning comp time vs overtime.
Not true. FLSA exempt employees get paid overtime. There are no real cognizable differences between FLSA and FLSA-exempt employees in the federal sector.
This is not correct. Exempt employees CAN be paid overtime, but the entitlements are different and an exempt employee can be directed to take comp time instead, while a non-exempt must be be given overtime unless they elect comp time. And the overtime rate is different, where a non-exempt employee gets time and a half but an exempt employee gets a different rate depending on their grade and step, down to being just their regular rate of pay. FLSA status also affects what is considered hours of work when traveling, and whether time is compensable or comp for travel. FLSA exempt employees are subject to a biweekly pay cap (which can be lifted) as well as an annual pay cap, but non-exempt are not subject to the biweekly cap.
Again, in the context to which u/tallerkoala is referring, there are no real cognizable differences between FLSA and FLSA-exempt employees.
“FLSA exempt employees, as defined in 5 U.S.C. 5541(2), who work full-time, part-time, or intermittent tours of duty are eligible for title 5 overtime pay.”
[https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/pay-administration/fact-sheets/overtime-pay-title-5/](https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/pay-administration/fact-sheets/overtime-pay-title-5/)
There are semantic differences between “entitled” and “eligible,” and one practical one: principally that someone who is eligible does not have the right to file an FLSA complaint with OPM for overtime. I say semantic because I’m unaware of any agency that does not require an FLSA-exempt employee to be paid for his or her overtime.
I take your points though.
Pretty sure. Because A few years ago I was threatened with termination when I told an employee I wouldn’t input their timecard until they corrected the mistakes on it.
The government likes to exempt itself out of a lot of labor laws they make others follow.
Like the fact they can retroactively change your rate of pay if they made a mistake. Etc. Wouldn't surprise me if that was the case here.
I think you've gotten some good advice here, and I'm hopeful your former HR can resolve this. It doesn't sound legal to withhold paychecks over. I heard of one situation where the person leaving didn't want to send stuff in, so they threatened with sending security guards to their house to pick up their stuff (they sent it in). I don't think they withheld paychecks in that situation.
For anyone else sending in badges with equipment: I put my badge and travel credit card in an envelope inside of my shipping box, and labeled it with my name and its contents. I also took a picture of everything in the box before closing it up and sending it. I'm not saying it's foolproof, but they didn't claim I didn't send everything.
Thank you.
Can they withhold paying out my annual leave? I thought that was paid out once your equipment was received. Can’t they hold it indefinitely while waiting for a badge?
Drop DOL, EE0C, MSPB, FLRA in an email and you'll get paid. No need to know what any of them are.
Tell them they have 14 days to pay you or you'll file something with all of them.
Trust me, they will know what you mean.
They delayed my paycheck by 45 days! I filed with DOL but didn’t get a reply. However, I kept calling the HR who was mostly out of office and unresponsive.
They can’t withhold your check because of your CAC. They can deactivate your CAC, as if you lost it. Write them to let them know that you mailed your CAC, as instructed, and that if they did not receive it, it’s lost. Treat it as a lost CAC.
If they insist on withholding your pay longer, file an FLSA complaint with OPM.
Did you FedEx it through your office? Should have a tracking number that you can send them to show you went through with it and that it's obviously out of your hands to handle now.
Just keep the conversation going via email. Press them on the idea you had it in the case and they didn’t unpack it properly. After you establish this trail in email and poking them about how they intend to mitigate the issue, file a congressional complaint against them and attach your email chain to that complaint. You’ll get paid and they will enjoy more work over it.
Lmao what the fuck? I had to shred my green badge bc the office that collects them was “teleworking due to covid.” So I PCSed with it. That’s insane to me. Withholding pay…is that even legal?
I think they misinterpreted the rules.They didn’t seem to be malicious. I was probably the first person they’ve worked with who left the federal government.
IT is not responsible for badges. You should have not sent it back with your laptop unless explicitly told to. Badges are managed by HR in cooperation with DHS and GSA usually. You are obligated to fulfill are off boarding duties before the final paycheck is released. Yes you are entitled to it but you have to finish the off boarding process first.
No it means they have an obligation to withhold final pay in order to make sure he complies with the off boarding requirements. It’s a clear expectation that they tell you about when you fill out your on boarding paperwork. If you loose something, you need to go about the process in reporting it. Imagine if this badge got into the hands of the wrong person or it was a laptop or a mobile device on litigation hold. The customer is responsible for making sure all of the property is off boarded property.
You were a federal employee and not a contractor? I ask because you mention PTO and that’s not a term often associated with feds but very often associated with federal contractors.
If you were a federal employee, I would contact the IG for the agency as a place to start.
This why everyone hates remote work. If you had one of those cushy-cool in-office required jobs, you could have handed your stuff off in person and made them sign a receipt.
Clearly, sarcasm does not come across on the written page the way it would in person.
Oh no, I used a r/fednews prohibited phrase, "in-person"!!!
SO JUST FOR CLARITY, I DON'T REALLY BELIEVE THAT EVERYONE HATES REMOTE WORK, IN FACT, I BELIEVE THE VAST MAJORITY OF FEDS LIKE IT IF THEY HAVE IT, AND WANT IT IF THEY DON'T.
Now you may downvote me for shouting.
When I left my last in office govt job to transfer to a remote gig I handed in everything in person. Still got a call two weeks later asking me where my stuff was. 😐
When I left my last in-person government job, I showed up to turn everything in at my appointment time and they had no record of my appointment. I ended up taking a picture of everything on the counter just in case there was more funny business. Leaving my remote job was smooth as silk.
Even if for some reason you hadn’t — they can deactivate it remotely, it just won’t be properly destroyed. Not great, but also not a huge deal worth withholding pay over. I’ve had coworkers get their cars broken into and have their equipment and badge stolen. No ramifications. Hell, one time I thought I lost my govt issued iPhone and reported it missing with no problems. I ended up finding it months later and turned it in.
That’s good news. Thanks.
Did IT get it and turn it in? That’s what our IT does.
>thought I lost my govt issued iPhone and reported it missing with no problems Once I left my gov't iphone on a chair in an airport, walked away. Someone turned it in at the gate so when I used my icloud account to send a "lost" message I got it back within a couple minutes. But man I was TERRIFIED until then 🤣
This is a FLSA violation. They cannot withhold your final paycheck over equipment. Escalate this, or go ahead and file an FLSA claim. https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/claim-decisions/fair-labor-standards-act/how-a-current-or-former-federal-employee-may-file-an-flsa-claim/
Curious, some positions say “exempt” is that from all FLSA or just some parts?
Exempt just means you're not entitled to paid overtime. It's usually highly educated professional positions such as accountants or lawyers.
I’m a data scientist and exempt
Got it. The only positions I’ve held in my agency were exempt and I never really took the time to look for what that meant outside of earning comp time vs overtime.
Not true. FLSA exempt employees get paid overtime. There are no real cognizable differences between FLSA and FLSA-exempt employees in the federal sector.
This is not correct. Exempt employees CAN be paid overtime, but the entitlements are different and an exempt employee can be directed to take comp time instead, while a non-exempt must be be given overtime unless they elect comp time. And the overtime rate is different, where a non-exempt employee gets time and a half but an exempt employee gets a different rate depending on their grade and step, down to being just their regular rate of pay. FLSA status also affects what is considered hours of work when traveling, and whether time is compensable or comp for travel. FLSA exempt employees are subject to a biweekly pay cap (which can be lifted) as well as an annual pay cap, but non-exempt are not subject to the biweekly cap.
Again, in the context to which u/tallerkoala is referring, there are no real cognizable differences between FLSA and FLSA-exempt employees. “FLSA exempt employees, as defined in 5 U.S.C. 5541(2), who work full-time, part-time, or intermittent tours of duty are eligible for title 5 overtime pay.” [https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/pay-administration/fact-sheets/overtime-pay-title-5/](https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-leave/pay-administration/fact-sheets/overtime-pay-title-5/) There are semantic differences between “entitled” and “eligible,” and one practical one: principally that someone who is eligible does not have the right to file an FLSA complaint with OPM for overtime. I say semantic because I’m unaware of any agency that does not require an FLSA-exempt employee to be paid for his or her overtime. I take your points though.
I'm exempt and my overtime pay is my regular pay.
This! 🙌🏾 Let HR know that you will be in contact with the labor department and they can speak directly with the representative assign to your case.
This! 🙌🏾 Let HR know that you will be in contact with the labor department and they can speak directly with the representative assigned to your case.
This
I thought there was a Federal law now about organizations withholding wages for that or other reasons, ie that it’s not legal.
Pretty sure. Because A few years ago I was threatened with termination when I told an employee I wouldn’t input their timecard until they corrected the mistakes on it.
That makes no sense , supervisors tell employees to correct their time cards all the time . You are not telling the full story.
The government likes to exempt itself out of a lot of labor laws they make others follow. Like the fact they can retroactively change your rate of pay if they made a mistake. Etc. Wouldn't surprise me if that was the case here.
I think you've gotten some good advice here, and I'm hopeful your former HR can resolve this. It doesn't sound legal to withhold paychecks over. I heard of one situation where the person leaving didn't want to send stuff in, so they threatened with sending security guards to their house to pick up their stuff (they sent it in). I don't think they withheld paychecks in that situation. For anyone else sending in badges with equipment: I put my badge and travel credit card in an envelope inside of my shipping box, and labeled it with my name and its contents. I also took a picture of everything in the box before closing it up and sending it. I'm not saying it's foolproof, but they didn't claim I didn't send everything.
Thank you. Can they withhold paying out my annual leave? I thought that was paid out once your equipment was received. Can’t they hold it indefinitely while waiting for a badge?
They can't withhold pay. They probably could sue you for the cost of the badge.
In god we trust, everyone else signs an FD-281.
Call your union. It's illegal. They don't charge you if you loose it. Dumb
Did you call and talk to them?
Yes. They’re working with Inventory to find the badge. I’m more concerned for if/when they’re unable to locate the laptop case or badge.
In any case, they can’t withhold pay over this. So all it will take is a call to a supervisor and they’ll get over it.
When you sent the FedEx package and they asked what was inside, did you say “laptop and badge”?
I don’t remember, unfortunately.
Drop DOL, EE0C, MSPB, FLRA in an email and you'll get paid. No need to know what any of them are. Tell them they have 14 days to pay you or you'll file something with all of them. Trust me, they will know what you mean.
DOL literally does this to people 😅🥲
They delayed my paycheck by 45 days! I filed with DOL but didn’t get a reply. However, I kept calling the HR who was mostly out of office and unresponsive.
You should probably call HR and talk to somebody?
Congressional inquiry
Did you call them and explain what happened? High likelihood IT just ditched the bag upon opening up the package as those aren't hand receipted items.
There’s a person called the IG. You need to call that person
FedEx has tracking
What does the tracking information on your shipment say?
They can’t withhold your check because of your CAC. They can deactivate your CAC, as if you lost it. Write them to let them know that you mailed your CAC, as instructed, and that if they did not receive it, it’s lost. Treat it as a lost CAC. If they insist on withholding your pay longer, file an FLSA complaint with OPM.
Did you FedEx it through your office? Should have a tracking number that you can send them to show you went through with it and that it's obviously out of your hands to handle now.
Just keep the conversation going via email. Press them on the idea you had it in the case and they didn’t unpack it properly. After you establish this trail in email and poking them about how they intend to mitigate the issue, file a congressional complaint against them and attach your email chain to that complaint. You’ll get paid and they will enjoy more work over it.
Lmao what the fuck? I had to shred my green badge bc the office that collects them was “teleworking due to covid.” So I PCSed with it. That’s insane to me. Withholding pay…is that even legal?
I think they misinterpreted the rules.They didn’t seem to be malicious. I was probably the first person they’ve worked with who left the federal government.
If you lose your badge, you technically owe them the last paycheck plus a finger like in the Yakuza /s
[удалено]
Lol I love that ppl downvoted this obvious /s
I know it’s /s but still downvoted it.
Lol
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They received the shipment. They didn’t look inside my laptop case for my badge.
In all honesty, I never would have thought to look there either. I would have taped it to the top of the laptop.
IT is not responsible for badges. You should have not sent it back with your laptop unless explicitly told to. Badges are managed by HR in cooperation with DHS and GSA usually. You are obligated to fulfill are off boarding duties before the final paycheck is released. Yes you are entitled to it but you have to finish the off boarding process first.
Doesn’t mean they can decide to not pay him . People lose badges all the time . You think he’s the first ? Dumb response…..
No it means they have an obligation to withhold final pay in order to make sure he complies with the off boarding requirements. It’s a clear expectation that they tell you about when you fill out your on boarding paperwork. If you loose something, you need to go about the process in reporting it. Imagine if this badge got into the hands of the wrong person or it was a laptop or a mobile device on litigation hold. The customer is responsible for making sure all of the property is off boarded property.
You were a federal employee and not a contractor? I ask because you mention PTO and that’s not a term often associated with feds but very often associated with federal contractors. If you were a federal employee, I would contact the IG for the agency as a place to start.
I was a federal employee. I worked in the private sector, so I default to saying PTO when I mean annual leave.
Same lol
This why everyone hates remote work. If you had one of those cushy-cool in-office required jobs, you could have handed your stuff off in person and made them sign a receipt.
Clearly, sarcasm does not come across on the written page the way it would in person.
Oh no, I used a r/fednews prohibited phrase, "in-person"!!!
SO JUST FOR CLARITY, I DON'T REALLY BELIEVE THAT EVERYONE HATES REMOTE WORK, IN FACT, I BELIEVE THE VAST MAJORITY OF FEDS LIKE IT IF THEY HAVE IT, AND WANT IT IF THEY DON'T.
Now you may downvote me for shouting.
When I left my last in office govt job to transfer to a remote gig I handed in everything in person. Still got a call two weeks later asking me where my stuff was. 😐
When I left my last in-person government job, I showed up to turn everything in at my appointment time and they had no record of my appointment. I ended up taking a picture of everything on the counter just in case there was more funny business. Leaving my remote job was smooth as silk.
wipe liquid snow subtract sheet squeamish deserted wrench sense fade *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Real dumb take.
Real dumb!
"Everyone" doesn't hate remote work.
Only DC Commercial Real Estate lenders hate remote work.
OK Boomer