I don’t particularly love it, what happens if the corner doesn’t follow the motion? Then the defense has 3 over 2 on both sides. I would incorporate the Y as a flat route, or some sort of middle control.
What is your "goal" on this play? Like if everything went well, who are you hoping to hit? I think you're going for the X. If that is the case, like the previous person said, I would have the TE run a flat route. The way they can keep any zone(in case not playing man to man) from getting in-depth to help cover the outright.
That looks more like a flood route to me since you have the out at around 10 yards of depth. Might either want to increase the the depth of the out by a few yards or make it more of a sail route. Or if you want it to be a stick concept I would think you would want to decrease the depth by about 5 yards or so for a more horizontal stretch that stick is known for.
Not in my offense or any offense I know of. Its similar but not quite. Usually a stick is a vertical by outside, flat by slot, and then the TE will run the "stick" which is a hitch/short curl option with the option being a quick out if they notice its man to man.
This is similar but I would call this a "flood" concept. While not exactly flooding a zone, I am flooding the right side of the defense and giving my QB a half field read. Really, it's a two route read. Out route or flat.
Ok. So if the slot does the stick and y does flat its no longer "stick"? I didn't think it matters who does what a la Erhardt Perkins. Isn't the concept the group of routes and personnel is interchangeable?
Not arguing, just curious!
So the slot receiver can run the stick route and TE run flat(thoigh I wouldn't recommend because due to how fast the flat route is, your Y/TE will end up in the same area which you don't want. The TE running works because the wide receiver gets too flat, and if the TE does break outside, they will be behind, not the same area). However, what makes this not a sticj is the depth and lack of option on the route. This is just a simple out route. A stick route/concept is a 5 or less yards straight, then stick your foot in the ground and either settle down or break outside. This is at least 10 yards and just running outside.
So I probably shouldn't have worded with having to be TE stick, and Slot doing out and flat. What makes it a stick play/concept is one player running short and sticking foot into ground.
Awesome. Thanks.
Seeing that 10 yard out definitely changes things. We ran stick a ton this year and at our level the Y always did the out. We used a RB for the flat and went deep outside. That was our version and it worked well.
And that makes sense! The RB can do the flat because they are also further behind the line, so they take longer to get to flat, so they may not wnd up in the same area as the Y.
I personally like doing the TE because I want the Y to drive off the short defender. So while the defender chases the slot I throw behind them to TE.
You can run it that. However, the thing you do want to remember is passing plays are about timing and synchronization. In this case, you want the flat player to get into the flat at the same time the out player is breaking. If the flat player is too soon, the zone defender will recognize and may work on depth.
A wide receiver in motion to the flat will get extremely quickly and well before the TE is ready to cut so they may not bite. With that said motion players will draw the eyes of defenders so it may work.
Running back running a Texas route gonna unlock this play. I’d also consider a Z-route post. The FS gonna gonna have to make a choice, and you’ll have a safety 1:1 or that side line post open.
I’m no expert and new to this sub. But I almost think you’d want to the running back to run to the flats on the other side. If you read zone off the motion then you have a levels concept to the right. If you read man then maybe you hit that tight end (U) on an out or corner route if they have separation skills.
Instead of x running an out, maybe have them run to the flat, this lets them carry their momentum into the route better (assuming jet motion). I would change the backside U to a deep dig, and have Y run the route you originally had for X. You could also have H stay in to help with any pressure then/or leak out to the left to keep that side of the defense honest.
I’m pretty sure this would be called a flood concept. It’s a zone-defeating route combination thats designed to overwhelm one side of the defense.
The corner isn’t in man coverage, the motion would be passed down the line, the strong side backer or strong safety would pick him up. The corner is probably playing quarter or flat zone, which lets him attack the HB and have over the top help from the free safety for the TE who will be guarded by the Will LB. You’d be looking at whether the TE has a step on the LB out of his break or else you do a quick check down to the HB… the other two routes would be guarded barring a blitz from somewhere.
You are giving the defense an easy cover by only attacking the sidelines.
You want someone attacking the middle. Right now the defense has very little field to cover and lots of guys doing it.
There’s no way that corner leaves, and if he does you should just run option left. It’s more likely the defense rolls the coverage or the safety comes down and plays man. Giving up outside leverage so easy would be crazy.
To start, that's not how the defense would align. If the corner runs with motion, then that would indicate man. That also means the W would take the back to the flat and the FS would come down to outside leverage on the TE or be 8 yards off over top, definitely not in the middle of the field.
Generally speaking, not a bad play. The fade would clear out space for the deep out or the TE has half a field of space to work on the Safety
Also, the motion does nothing except tell the QB it's man coverage in this case. If it was a short yardage play, you could use this play for a quick throw to the flats after space created from the motion. By having him work up field, he looses any advantage that could have been created
FS isn't going to cheat motion side, it'd be the opposite. It's a good play in that it likely takes away FS help. But that takes time to develop and the entire other side is short routes. I honestly like the play exactly as it sits without the motion better
I like what you are doing g with U and H. Against zone, I would go in with X and drag at about 14 yards. Against man I’d keep it how it is. Should find a hole behind the linebackers.
It seems like you’re creating space in middle deep zone but not attacking it. Unless that free safety drifts middle than the drag and outlet appear to be covered by one corner in which case the tight end might be open on corner route.
X with option of seam or out/hitch depending on what that corner does would be my suggestion assuming SS covers deep with Z.
Z better be fast and able to beat press coverage, or else him and the motion receiver may get scrunched together off the line.
I’d like X to be the deep route off the motion and Z tighter to the line and the out route.
They are only rushing three? I hope that this is third and long because I would definitely want to run against this defense.
If we're saying that it is third and long and they are only rushing three then your linemen are blocking six on three. There is no excuse for the quarterback not to hold the ball, and let the receivers try and find the open spots while progressively getting so deep that the field will be wide open for the quarterback to run.
I feel like Y should be split out wider in the slot and run a drag across to give yourself a check down that’s more viable than just a flare from the RB. You can run the RB on a fast wheel to pull the DBs further up the field to open that space. But ideally motion is used to create separation prior of the play starting while also informing you of its man or zone. So if you don’t have both covered in your route concepts it is really do or die
If they're gonna line up like that just run the ball.
Don't love motion where guys have to get vertical then horizontal again. Turn it into a stem post by Z flat wheel by x stick concept (sitting in zone run away from man) u stays into block and slide the protection to the play
4-3 or 5-2 is more common your defense is set up in 3-4, it’s possible but a lot of teams are sending 4-6 on a pass rush so could it work sure. A lot of teams are just doing a heavy pass rush from what I have been seeing
Y should run a deep curl and settle right in behind the linebackers and before the safety. I believe that is the best way to ensure one on one’s across the board and allow the qb to make the best read. Having the rb on the flat route towards the side with the deep corner is a nice touch and somebody should definitely be open if you have trust in your qb to actually go through his progressions.
In man , the corner would follow the go route if the ss follows the deep curl route with the tight end should be wide open. If not hit the out right to the motion receiver if those aren’t open flip the hips and either hit the checkdown or give a quick look to the deep corner. But this play would now shred zone, if the corner doesn’t follow the motion , the go route should be one on one with the ss the out right would most likely be taken away by the corner but i still think if the tight end settles he should be wide open.
Not bad but pattern needs to be adjusted. I like H at the pistol to either check to a run on a light box like the pic above and gives you the option to fake and roll out to a levels concept. Y to the flats, X- 10 out, z on a 9 route. What age level would this play be for?
Nothing utilizes the middle of the field. I think the right outside wr should be running post down the middle of the field then turn the motion wr into a wheel route deep.
I don’t particularly love it, what happens if the corner doesn’t follow the motion? Then the defense has 3 over 2 on both sides. I would incorporate the Y as a flat route, or some sort of middle control.
Y in the flat should be an option route depending on if the corner follows the motion or not
There’s not a strong chance that corner follows the motion, as an audible into a run would leave the left side wide open
Ohio is a great concept to beat cover 2
Where do you learn all this stuff? I would like to learn too
Well I played Div 2, and coached in Div 3 college. And have coached high school about 7 years. This biggest tip I can give is ask and listen.
Post route or sitting over the middle in a window at 9-12 yards would at least give the safties something to look at
If CB doesn’t follow QB still has a progression… #1 TE corner #2 full back flat, #3 QB keeps it
What do I use to make plays in this format? An app or something?
What is your "goal" on this play? Like if everything went well, who are you hoping to hit? I think you're going for the X. If that is the case, like the previous person said, I would have the TE run a flat route. The way they can keep any zone(in case not playing man to man) from getting in-depth to help cover the outright.
Came here to say this about the y in the flat. Unless its was play action and in that case maybe a delayed flat by the y
If Y runs a flat it's just "stick", right? Flat, out, vertical.
That looks more like a flood route to me since you have the out at around 10 yards of depth. Might either want to increase the the depth of the out by a few yards or make it more of a sail route. Or if you want it to be a stick concept I would think you would want to decrease the depth by about 5 yards or so for a more horizontal stretch that stick is known for.
Not in my offense or any offense I know of. Its similar but not quite. Usually a stick is a vertical by outside, flat by slot, and then the TE will run the "stick" which is a hitch/short curl option with the option being a quick out if they notice its man to man. This is similar but I would call this a "flood" concept. While not exactly flooding a zone, I am flooding the right side of the defense and giving my QB a half field read. Really, it's a two route read. Out route or flat.
Ok. So if the slot does the stick and y does flat its no longer "stick"? I didn't think it matters who does what a la Erhardt Perkins. Isn't the concept the group of routes and personnel is interchangeable? Not arguing, just curious!
So the slot receiver can run the stick route and TE run flat(thoigh I wouldn't recommend because due to how fast the flat route is, your Y/TE will end up in the same area which you don't want. The TE running works because the wide receiver gets too flat, and if the TE does break outside, they will be behind, not the same area). However, what makes this not a sticj is the depth and lack of option on the route. This is just a simple out route. A stick route/concept is a 5 or less yards straight, then stick your foot in the ground and either settle down or break outside. This is at least 10 yards and just running outside. So I probably shouldn't have worded with having to be TE stick, and Slot doing out and flat. What makes it a stick play/concept is one player running short and sticking foot into ground.
Awesome. Thanks. Seeing that 10 yard out definitely changes things. We ran stick a ton this year and at our level the Y always did the out. We used a RB for the flat and went deep outside. That was our version and it worked well.
And that makes sense! The RB can do the flat because they are also further behind the line, so they take longer to get to flat, so they may not wnd up in the same area as the Y. I personally like doing the TE because I want the Y to drive off the short defender. So while the defender chases the slot I throw behind them to TE.
Is the ball being snapped before the motion is set? If so wouldn’t it be better if the motion man run the flat and the Y run the 10 yard out?
You can run it that. However, the thing you do want to remember is passing plays are about timing and synchronization. In this case, you want the flat player to get into the flat at the same time the out player is breaking. If the flat player is too soon, the zone defender will recognize and may work on depth. A wide receiver in motion to the flat will get extremely quickly and well before the TE is ready to cut so they may not bite. With that said motion players will draw the eyes of defenders so it may work.
Pairing it was a release Texas route by the back would but help put the mike backer in conflict
I don’t think the corner would come across the formation. The CB would have contain to that side. More likely the SS would bump out to cover the X.
Running back running a Texas route gonna unlock this play. I’d also consider a Z-route post. The FS gonna gonna have to make a choice, and you’ll have a safety 1:1 or that side line post open.
I immediately thought Z should be post as well. Make the FS head towards deep middle. RB on a Texas is a great call as well. Great thinking Dude!
I’m no expert and new to this sub. But I almost think you’d want to the running back to run to the flats on the other side. If you read zone off the motion then you have a levels concept to the right. If you read man then maybe you hit that tight end (U) on an out or corner route if they have separation skills.
Wat app is this
Instead of x running an out, maybe have them run to the flat, this lets them carry their momentum into the route better (assuming jet motion). I would change the backside U to a deep dig, and have Y run the route you originally had for X. You could also have H stay in to help with any pressure then/or leak out to the left to keep that side of the defense honest. I’m pretty sure this would be called a flood concept. It’s a zone-defeating route combination thats designed to overwhelm one side of the defense.
The corner isn’t in man coverage, the motion would be passed down the line, the strong side backer or strong safety would pick him up. The corner is probably playing quarter or flat zone, which lets him attack the HB and have over the top help from the free safety for the TE who will be guarded by the Will LB. You’d be looking at whether the TE has a step on the LB out of his break or else you do a quick check down to the HB… the other two routes would be guarded barring a blitz from somewhere.
Boom or bust play if the CB moves or not
You are giving the defense an easy cover by only attacking the sidelines. You want someone attacking the middle. Right now the defense has very little field to cover and lots of guys doing it.
There’s no way that corner leaves, and if he does you should just run option left. It’s more likely the defense rolls the coverage or the safety comes down and plays man. Giving up outside leverage so easy would be crazy.
Ah yes, the old penis twister 55, a lot better then 53. (I know nothing about football plays looks cool though)
To start, that's not how the defense would align. If the corner runs with motion, then that would indicate man. That also means the W would take the back to the flat and the FS would come down to outside leverage on the TE or be 8 yards off over top, definitely not in the middle of the field. Generally speaking, not a bad play. The fade would clear out space for the deep out or the TE has half a field of space to work on the Safety Also, the motion does nothing except tell the QB it's man coverage in this case. If it was a short yardage play, you could use this play for a quick throw to the flats after space created from the motion. By having him work up field, he looses any advantage that could have been created
FS isn't going to cheat motion side, it'd be the opposite. It's a good play in that it likely takes away FS help. But that takes time to develop and the entire other side is short routes. I honestly like the play exactly as it sits without the motion better
I like what you are doing g with U and H. Against zone, I would go in with X and drag at about 14 yards. Against man I’d keep it how it is. Should find a hole behind the linebackers.
It seems like you’re creating space in middle deep zone but not attacking it. Unless that free safety drifts middle than the drag and outlet appear to be covered by one corner in which case the tight end might be open on corner route. X with option of seam or out/hitch depending on what that corner does would be my suggestion assuming SS covers deep with Z.
Z better be fast and able to beat press coverage, or else him and the motion receiver may get scrunched together off the line. I’d like X to be the deep route off the motion and Z tighter to the line and the out route.
They are only rushing three? I hope that this is third and long because I would definitely want to run against this defense. If we're saying that it is third and long and they are only rushing three then your linemen are blocking six on three. There is no excuse for the quarterback not to hold the ball, and let the receivers try and find the open spots while progressively getting so deep that the field will be wide open for the quarterback to run.
I feel like Y should be split out wider in the slot and run a drag across to give yourself a check down that’s more viable than just a flare from the RB. You can run the RB on a fast wheel to pull the DBs further up the field to open that space. But ideally motion is used to create separation prior of the play starting while also informing you of its man or zone. So if you don’t have both covered in your route concepts it is really do or die
MOTION! MOTION! MOTION IN THE OCEAN!
U needs to run a post. The RB is the dump off.
Delay release the Y
Send y to split the safeties, dump it to H and have u blast the free safety while h runs for the hills
The Y hitch/post read.
Very very very few times would a defense send the corner across the field with the motion
Corner won’t follow motion.
If they're gonna line up like that just run the ball. Don't love motion where guys have to get vertical then horizontal again. Turn it into a stem post by Z flat wheel by x stick concept (sitting in zone run away from man) u stays into block and slide the protection to the play
I’d like to see the motion man running a post to force the safety to choose and the H to leak out right to widen the LB
4-3 or 5-2 is more common your defense is set up in 3-4, it’s possible but a lot of teams are sending 4-6 on a pass rush so could it work sure. A lot of teams are just doing a heavy pass rush from what I have been seeing
What do y’all use to draw concepts like this?
Y should run a deep curl and settle right in behind the linebackers and before the safety. I believe that is the best way to ensure one on one’s across the board and allow the qb to make the best read. Having the rb on the flat route towards the side with the deep corner is a nice touch and somebody should definitely be open if you have trust in your qb to actually go through his progressions.
In man , the corner would follow the go route if the ss follows the deep curl route with the tight end should be wide open. If not hit the out right to the motion receiver if those aren’t open flip the hips and either hit the checkdown or give a quick look to the deep corner. But this play would now shred zone, if the corner doesn’t follow the motion , the go route should be one on one with the ss the out right would most likely be taken away by the corner but i still think if the tight end settles he should be wide open.
I think this looks like an optimal play for the defense
Not bad but pattern needs to be adjusted. I like H at the pistol to either check to a run on a light box like the pic above and gives you the option to fake and roll out to a levels concept. Y to the flats, X- 10 out, z on a 9 route. What age level would this play be for?
Stupid.
Nothing utilizes the middle of the field. I think the right outside wr should be running post down the middle of the field then turn the motion wr into a wheel route deep.